#this isn't even a big example there are so many others
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Inspired actually by me nonstop thinking about the Young Witch Solving The Disappearance Of Her Neighbor's Cat In The Alps tweet since last night and a number of other unrelated posts I have been thinking about the concept of maturity in media, because I think there's a lot of different dimensions to that. It's a series of spectra, rather than a binary, and if you use the terms "mature" or "immature" you can quickly realize that a lot of our societal metrics for what's adult-appropriate vs. child appropriate are very skewed in specific and in my opinion untrue and unhelpful directions. This could honestly be a 10 page essay and I may very well write that when I'm on break but just to give you my outline here:
Stimulation - is it grabbing your attention with bright lights and loud sounds and fast action, or do you have to actively focus? Action films can be just as "jangly keys" as children's animation despite being an "adult" work, whereas something like Mad Men can have vivid colors but would bore a child to tears in terms of pace and action. However, and this will be an ongoing theme, you can have a very choppy, fast-paced narrative that is complex and a very slow and dull one that is incredibly simple and childish.
"Ratings" Subject Matter: Sex/Violence/Profanity. This is the one I think is most misleading, because you can have an incredibly puerile R-rated film, and you can have an immensely complex narrative without any of the above. [note: I have zero patience for people who act like sex and violence are inherently unnecessary wastes of time; they are merely things within a narrative that can be executed well or poorly, but it is true that something can have a simple plot and constant bright lights and stimulation and essentially be big old jingling mobile for infants but there's a sex scene in it so it's Adult Now. Unfortunately a lot of people are like "and this is why YA is inherently better" which we shall see is not the case.]
Other Difficult Subject Matter (I don't have a good name for it, but to give examples, death, racism, genocide, abuse, serious or chronic illness, etc). This one is tricky because all of the above are topics present in works for quite young children, because they can experience all the above or have someone close to them experience them, and fiction is a powerful teaching tool. Obviously the nature of how this is presented varies, and later points will cover it, but while in my opinion the simple presence of these topics says nothing about the work's level of maturity on its own I'm including it because you do get people who think that children should be shielded from all the above and would consider the mere inclusion of those topics as inappropriate. They're wrong, but it's definitely an axis of judgement/categorization that exists.
Adult-level processing of information (probably a misnomer in that teens can do this but like, teens read adult books all the time, and as Tumblr has shown us, many adults cannot do this): does the narrative require you be able to pick up on subtext? Do you need to understand what is relevant to the story and what isn't? Do you need to be comfortable with or at least able to tolerate not knowing entirely what is going on right away? Do you need to have a sense of irony? Is there an unreliable narrator?
Adult-level processing of moral complexity (in my limited, not a parent or educator experience, I honestly think teens do better with the information processing than this, ie, this is one of the last things to develop; also Tumblr is even worse): does the narrative require you accept that sometimes things are unfair and will never be fair? Do you need to accept a story in which the Quote Unquote Bad Guys walk free without real consequence? Do you need to accept a story in which no one's actions are entirely defensible or in which no choices are easy and clean and harmless? Do you need to attempt to understand an alien perspective? Is there senseless tragedy? This incidentally is how you separate out the children's books from the adult books on topics like illness or catastrophic events; a lot of children's books end with a message of "it's hard and sad, but it will be okay eventually" and focus on very relatable POV characters which is understandable! But, to use an example as someone who went to a Jewish school with a robust Holocaust education, elementary schoolers read Number the Stars in which the (entirely fictional) Jewish family escapes to Sweden; middle schoolers read Night in which Wiesel's (real) father dies painfully in front of him.
None of this is to say that escapism/cozy fiction/whatever you want to call it is bad - I am not interested in a diet entirely made of thorny moral quandaries and no happy endings. I enjoy a stupid turn off your brain action movie, or a fluffy romantasy. But I do think that a demand that every ending be happy and that Justice Be Served in every story is no less immature than saying "ew, there's kissing in this???"
#long post#it truly is wild that someone thought though that the disco elysium system would like. work for a cozy mystery#on a fundamental level this only works for a story where you cannot trust anything including yourself#it is an inherently unease-generating system. like girl WHAT.
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TW Suicide. I talk about suicide from a religious perspective, and religion is not kind with suicide.
I might be reaching but I think religious Asian countries might be more proship-friendly than western countries??
Let's see a few cases. Japan. I'm not sure how religious Japan is, but they have very strict values and traditions. There are so many how-tos and even the language has levels that you can only use to certain people, otherwise it's rude. They can't express queerness so freely that yaoi/yuri is the best outlet they have, and they got called rotten for it.
Japan is notorious for being very proship friendly. There was even a huge "what is proship and why should you block those with 'proship DNI' in their bios" thread over on Twitter and it was so widely shared by Japanese users. At that point, even antis took off the "proship DNI" off their bios (such cowards lol).
The people in my religious (Muslim) country and its neighbor, Malaysia and Indonesia, even the minors, are so proship-oriented that I only ever saw exactly one person with "proship DNI" in their bio. And their posts tell me they're the more "liberal" people of the country. You know, the ones that the older people are using as examples of "Look at that girl. She's been poisoned by the western values, she's showing so much skin. Don't be like her". Now I obviously will just laugh at older people who says such things but hear me out.
The people who are actually practicing religion to the point where nothing sexual is allowed, who WILL screech at sex (both vanilla and kinky) in fanworks should they ever join, won't touch fandom with a ten-foot pole. This leaves us with the absolute freaks who thinks "I'm religious, I believe in God that other people call fiction, but I can't have sex until I'm married and masturbation is haram, so smut fic is actually a great way to let off tension! No one real is having sex so it's a green area. I'm not masturbating, I'm just reading. Sometimes they excite me, most of the time not! Halal mode."
Also, murder and suicide is a sin. A huge sin. If you tell someone to kill themselves and they actually did, the religious guilt would be MASSIVE. I can't imagine an actually correctly-practicing religious sending death threats and not be haunted by the promise of a sin. A sin that involves other people is much harder to forgive (it requires forgiveness from the hurt people, and that's impossible with suicide. They can't forgive you if they're dead) than a sin that involves yourself (masturbation. All you have to do is regret and never do it again. Which is why suicide is seen as unforgiveable. You can't undo it).
So, it sometimes makes me wonder that in the west, MAGA catholic conservatives shares a lot of values with fanpols. But in religious countries, the actually rigid religious ones aren't in fandom, so the fandom is filled with people who aren't evangelical purists.
This incoherent yap might be reaching, but hey, a new perspective to US-Europeans or non-religious people. It's just kinda funny to think about. Since you are very well-spoken and critical (I think so from your replies to the asks!), what do you think?
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Well... I think there are a lot of specifics here that are hilarious in how you've framed them. (The situation with queer people in Japan has evolved a lot over the last couple of decades. That isn't at all how I'd describe politeness levels in language, and I think your assumptions based on how politeness works in Japanese are ludicrous. Catholicism isn't the big, powerful flavor of Christianity in the US, so it's not where the majority of the nutbars ruining politics come from. Etc. Etc.)
But back in the 90s in US fandom in English, slash was the domain of freaks, and the puritywankers were openly homophobic and did not hang out in the same spaces.
Yes, I do think that part of the rise of the current flavor of antis has to do with somewhat wider acceptance of queerness combined with an overall anxiety-inducing and uncertain situation. They're not secure enough to chill the fuck out, but they wrongly believe that our battles for queer rights here are done and/or that they can be won by throwing the freakier members of the community under the bus.
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In support of Sam x Danny
We never got to see what the relationship of the Phantom trio was like before the portal accident but I think it's mostly similar to how we see them in the show. To me, it seems like it's implied that Sam always secretly liked Danny and then one fateful day, she and Tucker witnessed him almost die, don't you think after something traumatic like that, it's harder to keep feelings for another inside? Also, after Danny got his powers and started fighting ghosts, Sam got to witness his bravery and willingness to help people put to extreme tests. She didn't fall in love with him because of cool powers, she genuinely fell in love with who he is. His new life as a halfa, like all trials in life, helped him to become a better person, throughout their adventures virtues were strengthened and vices were weakened and their friendship was matured through its testing. I don't see it but it's a common claim that Sam only started crushing on Danny AFTER he got his powers which paints her in a shallow view. So, I'd like to point out correlation does not necessarily equal causation. Clearly Danny went through big changes from the accident but I betcha Sam and Tucker weren't quite the same themselves and if one of them being a more prominent openness to showing affection then there's nothing wrong with that.
Whether friends or lovers, I think both work but I just wanted to say, Sam doesn't deserve the hate she gets from fans for canonically being the one to end up with Danny in the end. And who's to say it's a forever thing? Teens are constantly growing and changing and so are their romantic interests. It's OK to think you work together at one point and not so much the next. Their identities are still developing and so are their brains. And if they do stay together forever, no matter what happens, then isn't that all the more sweet and wholesome? Even if Sam had an inkling of ghostly bias towards liking him, it's totally the green eyes given how much she likes plants and nature (ironically green is the color of life and health).
The whole episode with Sam falling for the fake foreign exchange guy who looks a lot like Danny's ghost form doesn't help her case. I get it, because of an example like this, fans fear she likes Phantom more than Fenton. But his whole persona WAS all an act for the purpose of targeting what a specific girl likes like telling Sam he was a vegetarian then acted like a jock in front of cheerleaders. Or maybe this is what she needed, to see that like Danny, this guy also had an alter ego but he was using it deceptively for personal gain. Meeting Danny PHANTOM for the first time might have felt like meeting a new person to her, so a stranger from another country symbolizes that. Then the truth about him being a jerk comes out when he metaphorically, "drops his mask." Sam knows both sides of Danny and knows that he isn't like that guy at all, and she's seen for herself that he's still himself no matter what he looks like. He genuinely wants to help people and doesn't put on an act. Perhaps this failed relationship helped her realize how much Danny cares for her both as Fenton AND Phantom and that he's always been a good friend she can trust (he DID spy on her in the episode and of course Sam was offended but it didn't really hurt their relationship).
Disagreeing with them being together is still understandable but c'mon, how many relationships were you in that was also a cringe pairing? Relationships aren't perfect but the people that we were/are with have helped us understand ourselves and each other more. The person you're with now may be who you need to be with for a certain period of your life to help prepare you for the one you'll be with forever. It's important for even awkward and rash relationships to take their course so we can grow from them.
So, I think we can find it in our hearts to be more forgiving to some cartoon kids. Sam and Danny's relationship is an important part of their character development no matter how it turns out or how much the ship is hated.
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Soo..
Are we gonna acknowledge that the director of the (admittedly terribad) Winnie The Pooh slasher movie has been getting death threats because people didn't like that he adapted a public property into a horror movie?
Or are gonna keep saying that harassing people and trying to control what fiction they create is something 'nobody does or cares about off the computer'
#'nobody cares about censorship/harassment over fiction outside of tumblr/fandom' gimme a break#all the peeps who act pretentious and holier-than-thou using that excuse can suck it#this is a CLASSIC example of 'boo hoo i hate how u wrote my fave so imma make it everyone's problem' syndrome#both because a) they wrote it badly and b) because they wrote it rly differently than most people saw it#or wanted to see it#and idk about you but i don't see a word about tumblr or fandom or anything like that anywhere in these articles#this isn't even a big example there are so many others#but i saw this and had to say a lil thing about it ok#i will always defend peoples' right to make shitty movies even if they are really out of the ordinary there is no qualifier w that#harassment ment cw#death threat ment cw#censorship#anti censorship#winnie the pooh
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my favorite thing is ryuu coming face-to-face with a generally intimidating character (v/an z.ieks) and being absolutely terrified like a deer in the headlights bc golly gosh that man (zieks) could absolutely destroy me
only to come to a very important conclusion a couple months later that's basically just
oh. oh, no. honey
i'm going to be destroying you. i see, now. okay. let me change my battle strategy here--okay. i seeyou. i got you. ( ‾́ ◡ ‾́ )
#« headcanon »#i quote this meme a lot but honestly: ryuu is harmless until he isn't#and we're counting this as a hc bc even tho van zieks is a very obvious canonical example#i promise this can and will happen with so many other characters#ryuu out here ready to wear down the big scary men like it's his fckn profession#is2g ryuu ur not a lawyer#ur a Damaged Man handler#this counts for literally all of his boys too i can't
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this might be a hot take... but if you care about disavowing media made by bad people out of fear of looking like a bad person yourself more than you care about actually doing good things... you might have your priorities (and your morals) screwed up a bit :/
(see my tags for more of my thoughts on this topic! please try to avoid making make bad-faith assumptions about what i mean!)
#melonposting#there is a good case for not wanting to associate with something on account of the creator being harmful. sure whatever#but people have talked at length about the sort of moral ocd that it promotes when that idea is fervently preached and enforced#i don't know about you but i think there's a big difference between#a) not wanting people to associate with something because the media itself spouts harmful rhetoric#and because its bigoted creator both benefits from people engaging with the books and is idolized by many of the books' fans#and b) not wanting people to vocally enjoy ANYTHING made by ANYONE who's held any harmful ideology at any point#because doing so 'inherently' supports and spreads those harmful ideologies#it's true that you cannot separate the art from the artist#but good people can make bad art and bad people can make good art. artistic talent is not inherently correlated with the artist's morals#the goodness/badness of a person CAN seep into the art they make. and it often does. and that can affect one's enjoyment of it#but even then there's nuance to be had on how to deal with it#like my hero academia for example. when i started watching it in middle school i didn't know how misogynistic it would be#of course i ended up seeing it in the show (and god it's so misogynistic)#and i ended up learning that the 'joke' sexual-harasser character is a self-insert for the creator#which of course i could never get behind. the creator is undeniably a horrible guy#at the same time though the show means a lot to me and i've gained a lot from watching it#i won't elaborate here on how but believe me it isn't superficial. if you want to ask me about it i'd be happy to share#i can hold both in my mind. the disgust and the enjoyment. i don't think those have to be mutually exclusive#of course not everyone is like that; you could immediately stop liking the show on discovering the gross stuff. and that's your prerogative#i don't know... i agree with the values behind avoiding media made by people known to have moral failings#and in some cases (like harry potter and jkr) i fully endorse the values and the practice. but such cases are very specific#but in most cases i fear the practice is misguided and unnuanced and ultimately unhelpful in fulfilling one's values#it is largely a philosophical matter: about how an individual regards their moral standing in the context of themselves and other people#which is important to discuss - especially in our globalized internet age! speaking of which feel free to disagree with me#if you want to have a civil discussion i'm more than open to it#but no matter how important this matter... there are way more important ones in the world. especially right now#calling out people who watch a youtuber who said something bigoted 5 years ago does little to stop that bigotry overall#just have good morals and practice them! support oppressed people! be thoughtful and understanding and compassionate!#callouts and dni lists rarely make for impactful advocacy!!!
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You know what, I'm going to add to this after all. Ray tracing is a gimmick and infamous for how intensive it is on hardware where it updates in real time, such as in video games. Before it was considered at all feasible outside rendering CGI, there were other methods of simulating light that were far easier for hardware to handle and, honestly, the difference between them (I can't remember what the name of the algorithm is) and ray tracing is minimal.
Adding to the problem is video card manufacturers pushing it while not increasing the VRAM on cards that are now expected to handle ray tracing, NPC scripts/AI, all other graphics, and stream encoding at the same time. GPUs have not seen a meaningful increase in VRAM in years despite the push of 4k graphics and ray tracing.
Oh and handling generating in-between frames to increase FPS/hide poor optimisation and up-scaling from 1080p to 4k or 8k. Sometimes both at the same time (in addition to the rest).
Further compounding it is consoles using stripped down versions of GPUs but not allowing users to upgrade them or other hardware. At least not in an easy way that doesn't void the warranty.
There's only so much that can be off-loaded to other components and it is a Choice™ to decide not to include an option to disable features that minimally improve the graphics (I specify graphics since more than one game has been released where turning off ray tracing wasn't the first thing recommended to turn off if you wanted to hit 30+ FPS) but can and do overwhelm GPUs.
Mandatory Ray Tracing should be banned in games. Genuinely absurd to think the majority of consumers are running high performing RTX graphics cards.
#i have a suspicion that this plus the price increase in gpus is to push people to rent computers a la geforce now#and gpus are one of the main ways developers compensate for having dog shit optimisation#the others being (hoping) the end user has enough ram to hide memory leaks#and high hdd/ssd capacity so compression doesn't need to be optimised#(also a high or no data cap since so much is downloaded rather than coming on a physical disk)#some developers are better at having granular options than others too#some will let you tweak or disable damn near everything so it runs best on your system and so you can choose what looks good to you#while others do the bare minimum and can't even be bothered to let users change things like particle effects or ray tracing#your options are basically play how the developer decided (regardless of your system) or not play at all#if the game runs fine until x or y or z but then starts to stutter/crash and would be fine if you could turn things down/disable things#you're sol if the developer didn't bother to allow changes outside of gamma and anti-aliasing for example#also not everyone has a 4k display or notices minute details#some people don't even see a difference between 30 fps and 60#don't get me started on how so many developers treat colour blindness as something spiteful rather than a medical condition#but more and more developers are forcing large and/or intense graphics/textures rather than giving users (aka customers) an option#or having a separate additional download if someone does want 4k or 8k textures#you know the way so many games operated when <720p displays were common but there was a way to download hd textures#for people who wanted them *and* had a display that could do 1080p#though it goes back to the (usually) aaa publishers and how graphic generations hit their peak a while ago#adding more polygons isn't something big or noticeable anymore unless it results in a performance *drop*#(the team fortress 2 snake immediately comes to mind)#(or the final fantasy 14 grapes)#ray tracing is one of the buzzwords used to sell a remaster (possibly to people who bought the game before)#or indicate a game/console is new and not part of a previous generation
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New AO3 Tag Wrangling Policy and the Transformers Fandom
Edit in the event people come back to the original post: Please do not email AO3 about this issue. See their response about this issue!
(This is a long one, folks, but I think it's important.)
A new tag-wrangling policy on AO3 has the potential to create some massive confusion and chaos in the Transformers fanfic community, with regards to fandom tags. There is a Reddit post about it here with a focus on anime fandoms, but I want to give some concrete examples for the Transformers fandom on why we DO NOT WANT this, and why I think it's a horrible idea.
The Problem
Basically, AO3 is looking to get rid of the "All Media Types" fandom tag across the board, either by dismantling them or just not maintaining them. The Transformers - All Media Types tag has been an all-purpose tag that you could select when your story doesn't fall into any one specific continuity. Additionally, all most (see below) TF continuities on AO3 are considered a subtag of the Transformers - All Media Types tag. For example, if you look at the link above for all works in the All Media Types tag, you will see fics that are also tagged ONLY with Transformers: Animated, because it falls under the All Media Types tag.
One exception: With the upcoming Transformers: One movie coming out imminently, there will likely be a big influx of stories tagged with Transformers: One. In fact, there are several already. However, it hasn't been linked to the larger Transformers - All Media Types tag yet. I wasn't worrying about it though, because I know these things can take time.
With information about this new tagging policy, however, I'm now wondering whether it'll EVER get linked to the All Media Types tag. If that happens, and when more continuities are developed in the coming years (since you know Hasbro loves creating new universes) this has the potential to cause massive confusion when looking for stories to read.
Searching for Stories with the New Tagging System
So let's say the All Media Types fandom tag isn't accurate anymore, because it no longer includes ALL of the continuities (such as TF:One). You will need to include ALL the Transformers continuities when browsing for TF fics.
How many tags is that? Well, here are all of the tags currently listed under the Transformers - All Media Types tag:
Note that this doesn't include Transformers: One since it hasn't been categorized yet.
You will potentially have to have 40 or more different fandom tags in your search, just in case the author tagged their story with something you weren't expecting.
This massively decreases the findability of a story.
Tagging with the New System
The email response from the Tag Wrangling group (see the linked Reddit post above) seems to be a bit flip in the response to the user's concern. "...encourages creators to tag with the media they intend."
While I appreciate what they are attempting to do, this policy change feels like a solution in search of a problem, especially in larger fandoms with multiple continuities, versions, and media types that are all cross-pollinated in both canon and fanon. While I'm focusing on Transformers fandom, imagine a creator in the DC comic universe writing a story that incorporates bits and pieces from a dozen different reboots.
For example, let's say that I am writing a fic about Ratchet. I am using the setting of the original G1 episodes, but I also am using the characterization of him as a bit of an old man grump. That characterization originated in the Animated continuity, but I want to incorporate bits of pieces of his other characterizations as well (old friend of Optimus from TFP, Ratchet ran a faction-free clinic like he did in the War for Cybertron series, he's got a Decepticon boyfriend like in IDW1 - or maybe even Cyberverse, etc.)
With this new tagging structure, I might potentially have to tag the story with ALL of those continuities. So instead of just slapping down the "All Media Types" tag (and maybe one other fandom tag that matches the characters as best I can), I'll have to analyze my story and try to figure out how best to tag for the characters I used.
And what if you're doing a completely AU version of the story? For example, a humanformers story, or merformers? Using the All Media Types tag along with a Alternate Universe - Human or Alternate Universe - Mermaid tag worked perfectly, since you weren't writing the story to fit into one specific continuity. But now, that might not be an option.
What To Do??
The first thing I would suggest is to contact AO3 (using the Feedback and Support page) and let them know (nicely) that you think this is a horrible idea. Give them some examples on how you use the All Media Types tag to find stories to read, or to help you tag a story. People outside of the Transformers fandom don't always appreciate how absolutely tangled the continuities can be with each other, and providing examples might help them see why this would be a really messy change.
Readers: Be aware that when you are looking in the All Media Types tag, it will no longer show newer continuities. And if AO3 starts dismantling that tag like they suggested they are doing, be aware that some stories won't show up in that tag like they used to. You can also create and then bookmark a custom search page that includes all 40+ continuities. REALLY annoying, but it's a workaround.
Writers: Until they start dismantling the All Media Types tag, ALWAYS ALWAYS tag your stories using Transformers - All Media Types... Especially for newer continuities. This will be especially important if you are writing a Transformers: One story. Right now, anyone who is only browsing the All Media Types tag will not see a story tagged only with Transformers: One. Make sure you're aware of how tags work and how they can affect the visibility and findability of your story.
Epilogue
Ugh. That's a lot of words for a long-weekend Saturday. And maybe I'm overreacting a tiny bit. But my work involves information architecture, and this change just absolutely baffles me. It's almost as though they want to make it harder to find stories. Considering that AO3 won a Hugo partially because of its fantastic tagging system, this change seems like AO3 is doing its best to shoot itself in the foot.
When you have a square hole, a round hole, and a rectangular hole… Yeah, you DO want each peg to go in the "right" hole. But if all of the pegs fit in the square hole, who cares? You got the job done.
I love you @ao3org, but please reconsider this change... Especially for IPs that are as old and are as varied as Transformers.
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just finished watching Blue Beetle & the dude who's lines were 90% "my name isn't Sanchez" is listed as "Sanchez" in the credits
#''you see she's racist because she calls him Sanchez even though that's not his name. anyways here's who played Sanchez''#oh also the dude who played him is Guillermo from What We Do In The Shadows#man idk maybe it's just cuz i watched Spiderverse again right before this#but i find superhero movies just don't do it for me anymore. not the modern ones anyway#like yeah it's fun for sure but also. it's 90% CGI & totally ignores the superpower aspect in favour of like. romance & explosions#like i wanna see him learn there's a fucking alien beetle speaking in his head rather than just ''yeah i can hear it. anyways''#i know i know we've seen origin stories a million times. but like. i LOVE origin stories. i'm sure other people do too#it's why i always rewatch the first movie in a series. i love the fucking around & finding out#also the amount of random flashing lights was kind of weird. made me realize how many climaxes just do that instead of actually like#making it visually appealing#man every time i watch a superhero movie that isn't Andrew or Toby's Spider-man or Spiderverse or RPat's Batman i get disappointed#the earlier Marvel & DC movies were alright. i think they still had the magic before Avengers went big#but like. dude. most of them just don't do it for me. there's something fundamental about heroes that they're missing#i think it's the like. actually wanting to help people just because they want to#a lot of them only help because they get the money & tech to do so#i think it worked with Tony because that's his whole character. he's an asshole billionaire who makes weapons#his (& Batman's) character development surrounds the tech & the money#but for friendly neighbourhood Spider-man for example it doesn't. that guy is poor. he defends the people#& they can't really do that when they've got a billionaire who works with the government breathing down their neck can they#idk i feel like a lot of this ''i'm just the little guy look at me i'm just a lil dude with a family who likes helping'' doesn't really wor#when the only reason they're helping at all is because a billionaire showed up & gave them a million dollars like#''i'm doing this out of the goodness of my heart <3 billionaires are people too''#sorry but billionaires need to die if you wanna actually help people. actually i take back that sorry. i'm not sorry#i did get some ideas for DIM though so i guess there's that#anyway yeah Blue Beetle is good as entertainment. i just feel like it could've been more Real ya know?#like. Spiderverse felt Real. New York & Miles's family felt so natural & seamless#''Batman's a fascist'' just didnt really do it for me
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As much as I like Spotify Wrapped, I have to say this year was awful and the nail in the coffin for me.
Firstly, it was later than usual and was all AI. That isn't 100% a bad thing, but it was missing a ton of stats in favor for what AI generated genre description we were listening to through out the year. I wanted to know what my top genres were this year! What my tarot or energy was! But there was none of that, instead an AI podcast that reguritated the wrapped story and got it wrong for me. (Last time I checked by biggest listneing day couldn't have been 12k minutes as there's not even that many minutes in a week).
Spotify isn't even the best music streaming platform by far. It sucks with music quality where it is very noticible even if you aren't an audiophile. Let's compare individual plans. For 11.99 USD the highest streaming is 320kbps and doesn't have high-res. Amazon, Tidal, and Apple Music all have the ability to stream CD quality (for example Tidal is 1,411kbps) for their 10.99 USD each. And they have the same if not bigger catelogs. Oh and Tidal actually pays their artists and is clear about it (Spotify pays $0.00348 per stream, Amazon does $0.00426, Apple $0.00675, and Tidal $0.00876).
The biggest draw to Spotify for me was the statistics. I really enjoyed being able to see what I'm listening to and compare but now every other streaming service has that. I liked that. Except, each service is doing that now. And Every Noise At Once, a website I use to find great new music, is no longer updating cause Spotify laid off a ton of their staff. While it wasn't a Spotify "offical" thing, the person that ran it worked at Spotify and was a part of the daylist creation along with other things.
Another thing is the music recommendations. They suck. Spotify used to introduce me to a lot of new music but I feel like it just gives me the same five same songs. Shuffle is also rigged and anything generated has gone downhill since the layoff. There's no new layout or UI changes that have been asked for years. Like covers for playlist folders or album collections.
Spotify might have podcast integration but it SUCKS. There's so many better free options. I'm a big podcast listener and their podcatcher is the worst I've used. By far.
The only good thing about Spotify right now is the audiobooks for premium users. I liked that. Except the selection is limited you get 15 hours a month. There's other free options like Libby which is integrated with local libraries.
If you were disapointed with Spotify Wrapped this year, maybe look into some other options. Spotify has some nice features but I'm finding it less and less worth it.
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A Simple Guide to Not Being Afraid to Write Comments to Fic You Read
I've seen a lot of posts about the current state of fanfiction comments. Writers, especially writers who have been in fandom for a decade or more, are frustrated by the lack of comments, and have noticed a definite decline in comments (and all other forms of reader interaction) in the past ten years or so. Many readers feel daunted by the expectation of leaving comments, afraid they'll do something wrong. As a fandom old maid, the latter confused me for a while, until I realized that most of the people who feel that way probably have not been taught this form of communication.
But your loving fandom elders are here for you. Come along as your auntie tumblr user icemankazansky makes this shit easy.
The easiest way to think of fanfiction comment etiquette is to compare it to something you likely already know: Gift Receiving Etiquette.
Fanfiction began as largely a gift economy. And a lot of it still is! You'll see authors participate in exchanges like Yuletide and Id Pro Quo; those are ficswaps in which authors write for a specific person to specific prompts. And even outside that, fanfiction is not written for money; authors write and post it simply for the joy of creation and community with fellow fans. Fic is posted free for anyone to enjoy. Is that not a gift?
So. When you as a reader finish the chapter or story you're reading and you are faced with the comment box, try to follow the same etiquette you would when receiving a gift. (And even if you didn't love this gift and it's not your favorite gift ever, we already know that it's more useful than the products from your cousin's MLM that they're passing off as gifts, because you read the story. At the very least, it entertained you for the time you took to read it.)
The big rule of gift receiving etiquette is not to insult the person who gave you the gift, either directly or indirectly. That's it. Full stop.
I've been seeing a lot of comments lately that are just along the lines of, "Thank you for writing this story and sharing it with us." A+, top of the class, full marks, you're doing amazing. If you don't feel comfortable commenting on the story itself, that is perfect feedback. And that's the most basic way you respond to a gift, yes? Thank you for the gift. Thank you for thinking of me. Thank you for sharing.
Does this rule mean that you cannot say anything at all that might be negative about anything? No, absolutely not. What you want to avoid is saying something that is, at its core, a negative evaluation of the author or their work. Let's do some examples.
Character A's obliviousness about Character B's MASSIVE crush on them made me so frustrated! I was tearing my hair out internally screaming, "JUST LET HIM LOVE YOU."
✔️ Excellent comment! You're allowed to have all sorts of feelings about things that happen in the story, and in fact authors LOVE to hear about any emotions they made you feel. Yes, frustration is not a positive emotion, but the thing you are expressing frustration about is not the author themselves or their shortcomings.
Contrast that to:
I was really frustrated that it took you so long to post this chapter. The cliffhanger at the end of the previous chapter had me tearing my hair out, and then you just left us hanging FOREVER!
❌ Nope! Here what you are expressing is frustration with the author and how fast they come out with new chapters. Imagine your sister buys you a gift for your birthday, but she isn't able to give it to you until the next week, and you respond with: "What took you so long?" I think Emily Post would frown on that.
Reframing
The way you say something and the point of view from which you give feedback can have a HUGE impact on the message you're sending. Let's take the last comment (the one about wanting an update) and see what happens when we reframe the same sentiment as a positive:
I was SO EXCITED to see that you updated this story! I have really been looking forward to seeing what happened after the cliffhanger in the last chapter.
✔️ Now it's not an insult. The author will be happy to know that you are happy to see new work from them.
This idea extends beyond the story itself: to the fandom, the characters, the pairing, the tropes, etc. Let's do some examples.
I looooove reading about these sexy boys SO IN LOVE even though the movie you're writing about is SOOOOO problematic.
❌ Nope! Assume that the author enjoys the canon, characters, pairing, etc. in the stories they write. This comment is insulting to the author because it basically says, "That thing you love is not great, and you should probably feel bad for liking it." Imagine your aunt gifts you a sweater from a popular retailer, and you respond with, "This is so cute, I love it! It's a shame that it was made in a sweatshop." Do you have a valid point about the canon or the retailer's business practices? You very well might. Is this the proper time and place to talk about it? Absolutely not.
Let's do a reframing exercise. You should be very careful about how you approach commenting negatively on anything in the story that appears in the tags list, but you can make it a compliment and good feedback if you have the right perspective. See the difference with these two approaches:
I kind of think frottage is disgusting, but I liked it in this story.
❌ Nope! You just told the author you think their kink is disgusting. That's like telling your poor aunt who is just trying to keep you warm this winter that she has awful taste in knitwear. Try again.
Frottage normally isn't my kink, but I love your other stories with this pairing, so I decided to give it a try, and I'm SOOOOO GLAD that I did! This story was 🔥🔥🔥
✔️ "This normally isn't my thing, but you made me expand my horizons!" Authors love to hear that. That's like telling your aunt, "I never thought this color looked good on me, but I look so cute in this sweater! I'm so glad you helped me step outside my comfort zone, because I'm the better for it."
thank u, next
The last thing I want to address is this new trend I've seen in commenting lately: placing an order. If your mom surprises you with new headphones, you don't respond with, "I wanted the white ones 🙁," or, "You should get me a new phone, too." It's easy to see why that isn't appropriate in a gifting situation, and it's also not appropriate when commenting on fanfiction.
Let's do some examples:
This fic was soooo cute, but it would have been a million times better if Character A had been with Character C instead of Character B.
❌ There are a few things going on here. Number one, you're telling your mom you wanted the white headphones, not the ones she actually bought you. You're also disparaging the A/B pairing that the author chose to write about, and as we discussed, we can assume that the author wrote the pairing because they liked it. Even if it's not their favorite and/or they also write A/C, they made a choice for this story to be A/B, and the comments section of a fic is not the place to question choices the author made in their own work.
You should write a story where Character Z who is not even in this story does [thing that is vaguely referenced in the B plot].
❌ "You should get me a new phone, too."
I want a sequel. 😞
❌ "Thank you, next!"
You can reframe this kind of sentiment if you are careful about it, and it's not all you say.
I really loved this story. I would be so interested to see these ideas explored further if you ever decide to write more in this universe.
✔️ Not "gimme." Not "more." This is, "If you build it, I will come." It is a HUGE difference.
You already know how to do this. You know how to graciously accept a gift; just use that same etiquette, and boom! Now you know how to fearlessly write a comment to fic you read. You're doing amazing. Go forth and comment.
#fandom#fanfiction#commenting#fanfiction etiquette#emily post please help me express my feelings about this yaoi
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💀🎃👻Spooky Greetings👻🎃💀
A/n: This literally came to mind when I saw something similar in the actual game event. First time posting twst content here. This may get a sequel. Gonna try to post variety spooky content here cause HAPPY OCTOBER YALL!
SPOILERS for the new Halloween game event going on, somewhat. Also, a bit of Skully x fem!reader and implied fem!reader x the twst bois shown/tagged down below. Short Harem drama, kinda. Not much. But I think it ain't half bad.
*DON'T STEAL, COPY, EDIT, REPOST AND TRANSLATE MY FANFIC WORK. REBLOG, LIKE, FOLLOW PLS N THNX.*
“Hello, my lovely~”
The moment this new strapping figure — “Skully J. Graves at your service~” — appeared holding you in his arms as you awoke, you were awestruck at the spooky strapping young man.
After introducing all of yourselves, watching him kiss the hand of your schoolmates was amusing; seeing their appalled expressions. Guessing they don't get that brand of greeting often, huh?
Him kissing Grim's cheek had his fur stand on end to your delight.
And yet?
The moment he took your hand — only to pull you in and kiss you smack dab on the lips?
You felt the fires of envy and hate turn ablaze as the various pairs of eyes glowed outrageously.
Many hands, gloved or not, snatched him off you.
And all hell broke loose.
“Get your grubby hands off my beloved, you cretin!” Riddle turned red even his paled up Gothic aesthetic; Trey holding the struggling boy back in his arms.
“He means MY herbivore, skeletal bastard.” Leona growled in Skully’s face as he grabbed his collar.
“On the contrary, MY angel isn't up for auction when it comes to kisses from mere worms.” Azul's irked smile gave off unpleasantness.
“Oho? That doesn't seem to be the case, surely.” Jade jested to his boss's ire.
“MY jewel’s already doing so, octo pimp. That goes for you too, street rat.” Jamil hissed them both back and forth.
“Have you no manners of consent, you mongrel? Besides, my darling Y/n has better taste than you all. Me, for example.” Vil flaunted in the others irked faces; Epel looked just about done at this point.
“Don't you dare take away my Otaku goddess, you noob!” Idia gripped dramatically to the others nuisance.
“How dare you lay a finger on my beloved human.” Malleus spoke doom.
The air around them crackled with literal lightning as emerald flames had his hands full.
“My future Queen … prepare yourself … FOR HELL.”
“WAKA-SAMA!” Sebek switched to fanboy mode at his God's might.
“For once, we're on the same page.” Leona's smirk sent his way spoke volumes as he dropped Skully before the dragon prince.
“TSUNATARO, STAND DOWN! ALL OF YOU, PLEASE!” You got in the way to defend the new anime boy from the others' united wrath, especially Malleus's. “One kiss is not that big of a deal.”
You could hear a pin drop now as everyone, even Skully, viewed you as if you had two heads.
“Good grief. Ya sure you're not magical? Cause you're bewitching them into lovestruck fools. And you're not dating any of ‘em. God, you're an idiot.” Grim griped.
Leona, Jamil, and Sebek appeared as glowing eyed phantom monsters ready for the kill. “YOU'RE ONE TO TALK, FUR BALL!!!”
Yet Skully looked unperturbed, his charming toothed smile arised, as Grim got chased by three SSR dressed pissed off mages. “Oya oya … What a lively bunch, you all are. And all because I took a kiss from your sweet lips, lovely Y/n. But if you are single, then may I ask you out?”
“NO!!!” All the former overblot cases now turned bachelors for your token affections shouted in unison.
Trey, Jade and Epel and you hung your head in exasperation.
Ah, quite the Harem dilemma.
Halloween coated, no less.
#twisted wonderland x reader#twisted wonderland#twisted wonderland x you#twisted wonderland x mc#twst x reader#twst x you#twst x y/n#skully j graves#riddle rosehearts x reader#leona kingscholar x reader#azul ashengrotto x reader#jamil viper x reader#vil schoenheit x reader#idia shroud x reader#malleus draconia x reader#various x reader#twst wonderland#twst oneshot#riddle x reader#leona x reader#azul x reader#jamil x reader#vil x reader#idia x reader#malleus x reader#skully x reader#skully j graves x reader#halloween#twst spoilers#twisted wonderland spoilers
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i don't participate in any sort of svsss fandom stuff so my apologies if this has been said already but a HUGE part of the humor of that book comes from how it parodies typical isekai harem tropes and not just in the way you might think. there's the typical "wow so cheaply derived porn trope" humor but part of the humor is also in that despite LBH being the original protag, the book SVSSS itself features SQQ as the protagonist.....
ppl like to joke about SQQ's "harem" but the humor of the harem isn't just in that he has one at all (when normally that would be LBH's role), it's how every "member" of that harem fulfills a typical isekai harem role in an inverted way!!!!!!
most obvious example is LBH. he's an inversion in that he's originally intended to be an all-powerful demon king who's a housewife in SVSSS, but (imo) the humor in his "role" is that he's supposed to fulfill the trope of the young abused battle-hardened "demon" girl who longs for peace and housewifery and latches onto the older man who showed him kindness -- except instead of being a moe anime girl, he's an all-powerful protagonist-style power insert hero. so, not so much an inversion of "this demon king is actually a housewife??" and moreso "this housewife is actually a male demon king" (which might not sound like much of a difference at all, but it's moreso about how the MEN fulfill harem girl tropes and not the other way around.)
another example is YGY - set up as a "big brother" figure and clearly has history with SQQ. he's meant to fulfill the trope of the clingy "older sister" childhood friend who promises marriage to the protagonist and has clear history w/him but is insecure about his role because he's not as "appealing" as the other options. his humor as a "romance option" comes from 1. him being a man (you might notice this is the case for a lot of these LOL) and 2. actually, in fact, being immensely powerful - it's another inversion of the trope of the physically weak "starter" harem girl who agonizes over being unable to do more for her beloved childhood friend in their journey.
my favorite example: LQG is the most obvious "tsundere tomboy" trope ever. physically powerful, out of touch with her emotions, gets flustered and aggressive with her crush, focuses on getting stronger above all else yet somehow extraordinarily beautiful -- all of these are extremely obvious tropes assigned to this "tsundere tomboy" trope, with the humor lying in the contrast of LQG actually being a man. the succubus extra is hilarious not just because of the awkward situation and their reactions, but because it's an EXACT setup of an extremely common scene in isekai harem novels. the cold tsundere beauty gets affected by succubi, doesn't know what to do, goes to the protagonist for help - it's the exact kind of situation that would have the protagonist pushing her down and saying lines like "you shouldn't act like this - i'm a man too, don't you know?" and making her aware that she's a woman and "in danger" around him. it's funny because LQG is very much a man, and indeed SVSSS parodies this directly by having SQQ tell LQG that he's a man too, he'll understand if he needs to jerk off! no worries!
even ZZL falls into the trope of the typical beast-kin girl who's saved by the protagonist and falls into his harem, subverted by his loyalty to someone ELSE besides SQQ and nonchalance as he does it.
it's the main draw of the humor of the novel for me and i surprisingly feel like not enough people talk about just how much SVSSS really leans into being a parody of a harem-collecting isekai....
and if you're curious about my credentials for making this post: if you name a shitty isekai novel, i've almost definitely already read it all. i read too many midsekais. it's like an addiction.
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may I request headcanons of the overblot boys + Adeuce reaction to a younger yuu that tells them that they’re like a big brother to them? Platonic obviously—
thank you!
awww ofc!
*ੈ✩‧₊˚ brotherly (again!)
type of post: headcanons characters: riddle, ace, deuce, leona, azul, jamil, vil, idia, malleus additional info: platonic, reader is gender neutral, reader is yuu, short
Having been torn from your home, separated from your family and friends, and spit back out in a new place with new people, isn't really as fun as it sounds.
After months at NRC, though, you've managed to make yourself a life here. A new home, new friends, even new family.
Now, sitting close to the person you've become fondest of, you let slip that you seem him as a brother.
His reaction?
I am of the (kind of depressing) opinion that Riddle's life would be much better if he had a sibling. he hasn't really thought about it, per se, but he's always had this feeling...
so, when you tell him as much, he just... 🥺🥺 you know?
he's in protective brother mode from this moment on (for better or worse, lol)
*ੈ✩‧₊˚
the bond you have with Ace and Deuce has gone unspoken, but all of you know what it is. you saying it, though, makes it all the more real
as warm and tender of a moment as it is, Ace still feels the need to make a joke about how sappy you're being (affectionately, of course), and Deuce can only hum with excitement at the acceptance and warmth between the three of you
*ੈ✩‧₊˚
admittedly, Leona is a little... put off. at least, he is at first. he doesn't exactly have a great relationship with his own brother, and with no other examples to go off of, it feels kind of like an insult
he... gets what you mean, though
and, reluctant as he is to be so vulnerable, he'll say you're just as much of an annoying little sibling to him
lovingly, of course
*ੈ✩‧₊˚
Azul had friends before you... kind of... but none as near and dear to him. he could never quite explain what this feeling was until you said it
ah... that's it. family. he almost feels embarrassed, being so vulnerable all of a sudden, and he can barely get out that he feels the same way
*ੈ✩‧₊˚
Jamil has younger siblings already, and he could tell the two of you were forming a similar bond before you said as much. he'd caught himself treating you just how he treats his sister on multiple different occasions (for better or worse, lol), and...
he's glad that you're here with him. that's all he'll say... for now
*ੈ✩‧₊˚
many people would think you'd have to hit your head to say something like that to the Vil Schoenheit
he's untouchable! he's godlike! he's... lol. just kidding. he's quite fond of you, too, and hearing those words come from you is better than any amount of likes, any award or role. you're his favorite person, after all
*ੈ✩‧₊˚
dude, are you trying to make Idia cry??? because he will! and then he'll bubble-wrap you and Ortho so you can never go anywhere or get hurt ever
he... has some things to work through. obviously. but, really, he and Ortho have basically adopted you already, so hearing you say it... in a good way... call him cringe, but he could get a little emotional over that
*ੈ✩‧₊˚
you think of Malleus as your brother? then you must also think of Silver the same way. and Sebek... would you be interested in adoption, because Lilia-
yeah. you get it. welcome to the family, lol. Malleus has already decided you're his best friend forever and ever, and hearing you call him family... hohhh that overblot is going to hit hard when you guys get there
#twisted wonderland x reader#twst x reader#queued#riddle rosehearts x reader#ace trappola x reader#deuce spade x reader#leona kingscholar x reader#azul ashengrotto x reader#jamil viper x reader#vil schoenheit x reader#idia shroud x reader#malleus draconia x reader
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PSA: You should question news articles that make you not want to vote
Hey Tumblr friends, but especially young Americans in this, the year of our Lord 2024.
Unfortunately, it is an election year.
Unfortunately, a US election year becomes everyone's problem, and yes everyone else, we are very very sorry that you have to deal with our nonsense.
But in all seriousness, the level of propaganda that's going to be flung around on all sides is going to reach peak levels this year for the English-speaking internet in particular. There's going to be a lot of influence operations, on all sides, and yes including on sides you agree with but they are still influence operations.
Source: I am speaking as a cybersecurity professional who also did a great deal of work in election security.
So, here's what I am going to ask you to do. What I am going to beg you to do: be careful of any article that makes you think there's no point in voting.
That's it. I'm not going to tell you who to vote for, or how to think, or that you should trust or distrust every article out there. I don't care about that. I care about whether or not it makes you think you shouldn't vote.
A lot of influence operations are about making you feel like there's no point. That both sides are just as bad as the other. The the election is falsified. That you can "protest" by not voting (false: you will simply not be counted and your voice will be ignored). All sorts of reasons not to vote.
No matter what you do, what you believe, or who you trust, you really really have to vote this year, and every year, and you need to not listen to articles that say there's no point because among those articles are in fact active foreign influence campaigns trying to promote one side or the other for their own reasons, I am deadly serious right now.
(More context, sources, and examples sources below the cut.)
In 2016, Russian influence operations were focused on tearing down Hillary in order to specifically depress voter turnout among young men of color in the belief that this would help Trump get elected.
From the article: "“Buried literally in the middle of the indictment is a paragraph that should jar every American committed to the long fight for voting rights,” Anders wrote in a statement. “The Russians allegedly masqueraded as African-American and American Muslim activists to urge minority voters to abstain from voting in the 2016 election or to vote for a third-party candidate.”
This is the flavor of influence campaign that has been proven, that does exist, and is the sort of thing that does numbers here on Tumblr.
Things like the situation in Gaza, for example, are incredibly fraught situations. Articles don't even need to lie about facts on the ground there to make people feel hopeless and angry. Again, I am not telling you who to trust or not trust when it comes to news sources. But if an article about this event, for examples, makes you think or even outright tells you, "There's no point to voting, both sides are awful, I just shouldn't bother." You need to pause and at least consider that this might be an influence operation. You need to think critically. You need to check sources. You need to think about the world you want to live in, to vote for, and who might not want that world to happen for any variety of reasons.
Protesting by failing to vote isn't a real thing.
Old politicians ignoring young voters because they famously do not bother to vote is absolutely 100% a real thing. It is why so many policies that are popular with young people are low priority for politicians: they are not afraid of losing the young vote because no one plans on having it in the first place when it's never there in big enough numbers to matter.
So please, please, read what you want. Believe what you want. Follow your heart and your brain and whatever other organ you want to think with. I'm not here to tell you who is right, wrong, trustworthy, good, or bad. I'm just here to tell you that despite all of that, whatever you read, you must vote in your elections, no matter where you are in the world and you must not listen to voices that tell you not to as a protest.
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I feel as though in the past few years it's becoming more common for me to be interrupted while I'm speaking, and I can't help but wonder if more people are losing a sense of conversational rhythm due to communicating more and more digitally and less and less in person.
When you communicate digitally you don't have to worry about finding the natural rhythm of the conversation, you're not taking away someone else's ability to finish their thought or make their point if you send a message to them while they're still typing. I'm not here to scare monger about the kids and their phones, but it's important that you don't let your skill of finding a conversational rhythm, if you have that skill, atrophy, lest you speak over someone and take away their ability to complete their thought and make their point.
But I also realize that it's really important to specify what I mean by interrupting someone.
When someone says that interrupting is really normal and not considered rude in their community or culture, what they're actually talking about is what's known in linguistics as "cooperative overlap", that or simultaneous talking. Here's an example of cooperative overlap and/or simultaneous talking that you might see in a culture where this is normal and acceptable:
Person A: So guess where I went today? I went to the -
Person B: Oh let me take a wild guess! You went to the shoe store again didn't you?
Person A: That's right, and I got a -
Person C: Oh come on, don't tell you got another pair!
Person A: You know it baby!
Now let's compare that to a different style of interruption, what I like to call "steamrolling"
Person A: So guess where I went today? I went to the -
Person B: UGH did you guys catch the game last night?
Person C: Yeah the refs sucked!
Now, what differences can you see between the first example, aka "cooperative overlapping" vs the second "steamrolling" example?
For one, in the first example Person A is still allowed to make their point, tell their story, and finish their thought. They're not being silenced or completely derailed, and most importantly their conversation partners still seem interested and engaged in what they have to say. In the second example, Person A is being completely derailed and stripped of their chance to finish their thought and make their point, which is unfair to Person A, which is what makes "steamrolling" disrespectful even in many cultures and communities where "cooperative overlapping" would be acceptable.
Now, conversational overlap isn't for everyone, and that's okay, but it makes it awkward and tricky when someone from a community or culture that uses conversational overlap talks to someone who is from a culture that doesn't. For example:
Person A: So the other day I went to -
Person B: Oh my god did you go to that one store?
Person A: Um, no, I went to the movies, and I saw -
Person B: OH did you see that new creepy movie about the aliens?
Person A: No, can I please just finish my story?
Person B: Oh, uh, sorry
Neither person will probably feel great after this conversation. And I'm not here to condemn either conversational styles. I understand why some people see cooperative overlap as a more engaging and exciting conversational style, but I also understand why some people find it frustrating. My mother's family has a cultural background big on conversational overlap, but my father's side of the family ehhh not so much, so I personally grew up seeing these two conversational styles clash a lot.
If you're person A in the above conversation who doesn't like conversational overlap, that's totally fine, I'm personally not a big fan of it either only because I have a terrible memory, so when someone disrupts my flow I usually end up completely forgetting what I want to say. Just try to recognize the difference between cooperative overlap vs steamrolling. If someone is just trying to cooperatively overlap with you, patiently and politely tell them something along the lines of "sorry I have a terrible memory so if I don't finish I'll forget what I'm trying to say". But it's generally a good idea to be more patient and understanding with conversational overlap than steamrolling.
If you're someone who cooperatively overlaps and you encounter someone who isn't a fan of it, try not to take it personally, maybe like me they have a horrible memory and will forget what they're trying to say if they get side tracked.
But what I meant earlier about conversational rhythm is that too often a lot of interrupting comes from not realizing the other person wasn't finished speaking.
For example, personal A wants to say "so the other day I went hiking, and I saw a fox" some people might not recognize when person A is actually finished speaking, typically they assume as soon as they've heard a complete clause that means the thought is finished, so the conversation goes like
Person A: So the other day I went hiking -
Person B: OH I went hiking a few weeks ago with my girlfriend but it was so slippery out!
Person C: Oh how is your girlfriend doing by the way?
Person B: She's doing great! How's your partner doing?
Do you see how this style of interruption, unlike cooperative overlap, also derails Person A and deprives Person A of a chance to finish what they want to say? It's not quite steamrolling, and often just comes from a lack of rhythm or understanding. As a general rule, if you want to avoid interrupting someone, pause for a few seconds after you think they're finished in case they aren't actually finished. This way you avoid accidentally depriving someone of the chance to finish what they want to say and completing their thought.
We should never be too eager to assume someone has finished making their point because you never know what someone might actually be trying to say, and if you cut someone off before they make their point you can miss important context. For example:
Person A: I don't think I see stray cats here -
Person B: AHA BULL FUCKING SHIT! I totally saw a stray cat the other day!
Person A: I was going to say as much as in other places if you had let me finish?
Or:
Person A: I hate when it's hot out. When I was a kid it was usually around 25 or 30 degrees Celsius in the summers -
Person B: OH come one don't be such a wimpy little baby! 25-30 degrees isn't even that warm! I've totally seen WAY hotter summers than that!
Person A: Uh, that's what I was going to say if you'd let me finish, the summers were pretty mild when I was a kid, but they're a lot hotter now . .
Do you see how in both conversations Person B was too eager to assume Person A had finished making their point and ended up missing important context? If person B had only paused and waited for Person A to finish making their point, they wouldn't have ended up making an ass of themselves to put it frankly. This style of interruption can make you come across as eager to dominate and "one up" other people, which frankly a lot of people find obnoxious and exhausting. This is different than cooperative overlapping because it comes from a place of wanting to correct or one-up your conversation partner, rather than play and/or build into what they're saying, which is why I'd argue it's closer to steamrolling.
Good conversational rhythm ideally means everyone is allowed to finish their thought and make their point, whether or not that includes overlapping or even simultaneous talking. If you're not sure someone has finished their thought, pause a few seconds to make sure they've had the chance to complete their thought, less you miss important context. OR, if you do interject, it should be about building/playing into what they're saying rather than derailing/steamrolling them.
What's important to keep in mind is that it's often a matter of power and respect when someone is or isn't allowed to finish their thought and make their point. If someone is unable to finish their thought or make their point before getting steamrolled, they're going to feel like their input to the conversation isn't valued or important, and that's never a good feeling.
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