#they are also against non-binary/trans/gay people of course

[screwderia]

i don’t really post about politicis but tomorrow we have elections here in argentina, and its very likely that a far right misogynistic asshole who just wants to sell our country away will win. i’m so fucking nervous

[johannestevans]

A Transphobe Ruined His Own Night Because I Was Existing Next to Him

Hate is a miserable business — but in this case, not for me!

Originally published here in Prism & Pen.

My partner and I went to DILF Leeds for the first time this week — DILF, which obviously stands for Dad I’d Like To Fuck, is a regular gay dance night that runs here in the UK. It runs all over, in Manchester and London and a bunch of other cities, as well as more locally to us in Leeds.

I will be the first to say that dance music is not my vibe as a rule, and a lot of the DJing unfortunately struck me as closer to noise than music — we’d meant to go before but had to miss the event, so we were really excited to go this week. I did have a significant moment of doubt when I realised that the event started at ten o’clock, because despite the night being aimed at older men particularly, I am in my heart much more tired and crotchety than any of them could be, but we went along.

We arrived just as the night opened, and a few guys were stripping out of their day gear into their club gear underneath, or were changing into it.

We logged all our stuff in the cloakroom, and to begin with I didn’t strip down too much — my partner stripped down to his Christmas suspenders and jock strap earlier on, and once it was a good deal busier (and thus a lot warmer), I stripped down to my colourful flared trousers and my leather vest.

There’s honestly so few nights and spaces that are so beautifully liberated as nights like these. There were some men that stayed fully-clothed the whole of the time, either in colourful Christmas or holiday jumpers, or in their jeans and their novelty t-shirts — with basic but emphatic slogans like SLUT, or a good favourite of ours for the evening, FEED ME TO THE BEARS — but a lot of people were dressed in fetish and clubbing gear.

Rubber suits, leather and latex harnesses, jockstraps, lingerie, beautiful underwear and bodysuits, leather collars and fetish gear — and even more exciting than the diversity of the outfits (including those in just their birthday suits) was the diversity of the bodies in the room.

A reason we were interested in DILF rather than a random gay club night was that it focuses explicitly and specifically on celebrating different men’s bodies beyond the twink and the twunk — DILFs and daddies and older men; bears and and otters and bulls, fat men and big muscle men, and all the men in between.

They also have a very explicitly inclusive policy when it comes to trans men:

1. DILF creates events for like-minded queer men (including gay, bi + trans men) and male presenting non-binary people over 18 years old to celebrate + express themselves. 2. There’s no room for racism, homophobia, biphobia, transphobia, body shaming or any other kind of hate speech and intolerance at DILF’s events. — (From their website.)

And I saw other trans men too, not to mention that apart from having a wider variety of weights and sizes in the men in attendance, there were a lot more brown and Black men than I often see at events in Bradford and Leeds, and it’s obvious that DILF does more than just pay lip service to the idea of diversity, in their organisers and staff, in their promo photos, and in their target audience for attendees.

I also brought my cane with me and spent a good part of the night either sitting down or leaning against a wall or surface, and I got no comments on it, nor even any funny looks, honestly. I cannot readily recollect a night where I’ve gone out and danced with my cane to hand, where no one’s been a dick about it, but also where I’ve genuinely let myself rest enough through the course of the night that I’m in less pain at the end of the night than I am at the beginning.

The night was good.

It was a busy night, it was a busy night full of sexy men, while the music was not my thing one could mostly dance along to it, and it was sexy as Hell. People were grinding on one another, making out, but obviously it was a cruising night as much as a dance night, so while no one was getting bent over and reamed over a bar table — not that I saw, anyway, but perhaps we left too early to enjoy it — but people were giving and receiving blowjobs, handjobs, and frotting a good bit, which one does love to see.

I don’t know what it was that made this dude clock me — I haven’t had top surgery and was only in a leather vest worn open, but my tits are fairly small and given that he was a much bigger man than I am, his were far bigger than mine are. It might have been my chest, it might have been that I had short hair, it might have been that because I was wearing eyeliner and colourful trousers he thought I was nonbinary — who knows? Who cares?

But this fella turns to me and says something to the effect of, “You know this is an event for gay men, right?”

And my partner and I were like, “Uh… Yeah? Duh?”

“Men who are GAY.” And I didn’t initially understand what his problem was, and just sort of looked at him very blankly, whereupon he very snottily said, “Hmph, good luck!” and turned away.

What followed was an interesting exercise in creating one’s own misery.

My partner and I sort of looked at one another with the typical, “What’s her problem?” look one often witnesses in gay clubs like this one when someone’s being a bit of a prick without an apparent reason, and then as we sort of half-observed, we watch this guy go to the friends he was with and complain whilst pointing in my direction. We obviously couldn’t hear what he was saying over the music, but he started with his friends, and then spoke to a few others… and then a few other random guys after that.

All of them, to a man, glanced in my direction, and then gave their mate a look like, “Um… okay? So?”

Thus adding to his frustration and apparently spurring him on to complain to the next man at the audacity of a gay man at this gay men’s event that he didn’t personally approve of.

Several of his mates continued to chat and make small talk with us here and there throughout the night, exchanged horny and admiring looks, et cetera and so on — and this guy’s temper tantrum obviously made no significant change to my night whatsoever.

No one gave a fuck that I was trans — they might have thought my outfit was a bit odd because I wasn’t in nicer fetish gear because I just don’t have any yet beyond some sexy assless underwear and I haven’t yet gotten hold of a harness for myself, but like I said, there were other trans men present, other effete and effeminate men, other guys who were on the skinnier side. On no point was I unique in the room — and people still flirted here and there, had conversations, and so on.

The only night this guy really impacted for himself was his own — focusing on some dude he didn’t want to be present rather than being flirty and having genuine fun with other men, and also embarrassing himself to all his friends, who all kept glancing at him with the same glance of, “Girl, what?” whenever he apparently worked himself up again.

The thing about the anti-trans obsession in recent years is that it’s a fixation on other people’s existence and behaviour that doesn’t impact you in any way — until this guy had made that comment to me, I hadn’t even said hello to him. We were just sitting on the same bench against the wall, and one of his friends had been laughing while helping my partner off with his skinny jeans, all in good fun.

He didn’t get everyone baying for my removal, or complaining about it to staff, or anything else. He didn’t get any of them to get out pitchforks or start burning trans effigies.

He got secondhand embarrassment on his behalf, because he was making himself look ridiculous to his friends because of his obsession with trans people, actively lowering their opinion of him and for what? The one trans dude he noticed vibing nearby, with no direct interaction with him at all that he hadn’t started?

If I was going to be cruising and fucking anybody, it’s not like he had to partake with me! There were plenty of guys to choose from!

This man was in his fifties or so, I would estimate, so by the time he was old enough to be exploring his own sexuality, being gay would have been legal, but he would have been living through the worst of the AIDs crisis, and certainly, a night like DILF would never have been able to be so openly advertised, nor I doubt as well attended or put on as often as it can be today. It’s always funny when I see such silly and self-sabotaging bigotry from men who are old enough and more than experienced enough to know better, but in the meantime, like…

I’m glad I still had a good night, and I’m honestly so pleased to have attended an event where the common consensus was very obviously at this dude’s problem rather than against the trans minority, especially when the world so often feels like it’s the other way around.

It’s a nice reminder that as vocal as they can be with their whinging and complaining, the bigots aren’t the majority they’d like us to believe they are.

[election2024-2028]

Project 2025: Basics

What is Project 2025? Who wrote it? And who is it intended to help? And who is this going to hurt?

Let's get into it. First, what is Project 2025, and who wrote it? Project 2025, also known as the Presidential Transition Project is a project started by the Heritage Foundation for the transition from Biden to Trump. Of course, that is their assuming that former (and failed) president Trump is going to become president again. I believe most people hope that no such thing will happen. If all goes well, we will have President Kamala Harris come January of 2025. The Heritage Foundation and about 200 other people grouped together to create a book called Mandate for Leadership: A Conservative Promise. Kind of sounds like a weird dystopian novel, doesn't it? But, no, it's worse than a dystopia. This is a real book written by the ultra-conservative group called the Heritage Foundation and a large number of other far-right people, including lawyers for firms that boast about arguing against equity and inclusion laws, economists who believe in getting rich instead of protecting the environment, people with no organization to speak of, well-known conspiracy theorists, and politicians. The Heritage Foundation calls this collection of people "experts", but you can tell from their organizations that they are mainly a group of extremely biased conservatives.

This book is intended as a starting point for Donald Trump if he gets back into the White House. It is "by conservatives, for conservatives." This basically means that this is meant for extremist conservatives or Trump cultists, conservatives who believe:

Gay marriage should be illegal.

Abortion should be completely banned.

We need nuclear families only.

Queer history shouldn't be taught.

Children aren't allowed to be trans.

Interracial marriage should be banned.

Liberals aren't real Americans.

Immigrants shouldn't be allowed into the country without having to jump through extreme hurtles.

Illegal immigrants should be in internment camps*.

Conservatives are the only real Americans.

Trump is the best person to have as president.

Joe Biden is evil and has completely mismanaged the country.

Equity is wrong.

Inclusion is wrong.

DEI is a bad thing.

Gay marriage is sinful.

Racial inequity and racism shouldn't be talked about in school.

Books about queer people should be banned.

Feminism is a bad thing.

The men should be in control of the heterosexual home (which should be the only kind of home).

Families without fathers are severely damaging to the children, no matter the other circumstances.

Guns should be completely legal, no matter the kind of gun or any other details.

Trans people are inherently inappropriate.

Children shouldn't be exposed to LGBTQ people.

Drag is inherently sexual.

Trans women are dangerous.

Gender and sex are the same thing.

Gender and sex are binary.

People can't change their gender.

In other words, this is for homophobic, transphobic, racist, "Christian" misogynistic gunnies who are on the far right.

And who does this hurt? This hurts many people, of all different politics and beliefs. Chances are, it hurts you or someone you care about. This project affects this (non-exhaustive) list of people:

LGBTQ people

Women

Trans men

Trans people in general

People in communities with high risk of violence

BIPOC people

Single parents

Interracial couples

Liberals

People who do drag

Accepting parents of trans children

Fatherless families

Immigrants

Feminists

Who or what else might be harmed by this project?

The environment

Relationships with other countries

Freedom of speech

Schools

Diversity and equity

Remember: This isn't an exhaustive list. This is only part of the people who could be hurt by this project.

I know it is possible that someone may point out to me that Trump has denied being involved with Project 2025. Therefore, I believe it is necessary that I point out that Agenda 47, which Trump is for sure involved with is very close to, if not the same as Project 2025, just with a different name.

*Internment camp basically means a concentration camp. That's what they want. Concentration camps for "illegal" immigrants. This is like what happened to Japanese Americans during World War II. *

Conclusion

Be aware of who you're voting for this election. This blog will contain more details about the 2024 election. Chances are you know at least a few people who are close to you who would be affected by Project 2025 policies if Donald Trump becomes president, and I hope you care enough about them to want to protect them from gun violence, forced pregnancy, forced submission, prison sentences, censorship, and a dead Earth.

I know it's hard to believe that your vote could mean anything when it seems like Trump is going to win. Maybe you think that your vote doesn't count, but I assure you that the only way that you will protect your and your loved ones' rights is to vote. Please vote.

[redditreceipts]

I’ve been closed to getting peaked and checking out radblr for a while but something gets me about how much a lot of radblr hates ftms idk. There’s a lot of emphasis about how even if sex is otherwise consensual, lying to get consent you wouldn’t have otherwise gotten is rape by deception, which I agree with. However, on a post talking about straight men admitting they claim to be gay just to get sex from ftms “desperate for validation” I didn’t see a single radfem calling this out as rape by deception??? Just honestly people making fun of “delusional straight women” and how them getting manipulated by straight men into believing gay men want them “makes dating life harder for real gay men” and something just irks me about it. There’s a lot of talk about how feminism needs to fight for even female people who disagree and fight against our own rights but it feels like some radfems have no sense of solidarity for ftms, and can only conceive of us as tragic self hating lesbians or manipulative homophobic straight women. And it’s just frustrating because anyone who’s been ftm/some kind of transmasculine in trans communities know how much we don’t get to say fucking anything if it might remotely offend mtfs. I think claims of solidarity for women you disagree with is bullshit if you can’t find solidarity for female people who identify as trans.

hey :) sorry for the late answer

I think that this impression comes because of three reasons:

a lot of feminists receive insane amounts of harassment from ftms. like, death threats on a regular basis. especially on tumblr, where there are a lot more of trans men than trans women, it's just statistically more likely to get harassed by a trans man. but because of this, many have this kind of reaction towards trans men when they really shouldn't. I get that it's kinda hard to fight for the right of a person when they have just sent you death threats, but at the end, you are of course right and we have to fight for every female person, no matter their opinions. also, not all trans men engage in that kind of behaviour.

a lot of people here are detransitioners or desisters (people who have identified as transgender, but now have decided to not take the medical route). I myself have been identifying as non-binary for some time, but now I know that this came from internalised misogyny. I'm sometimes scared about what would have happened if I had listened to many ftm activists and taken the medical route. it's hard to not get bitter when I see people on here telling women just like me to start testosterone and maybe make the biggest mistake of their life. and there's always the thought of "that could have been me". but well, in the end, we can't act as if all trans men did that kind of thing. it's just a portion, even though they are the most vocal ones oftentimes. (also, there probably are some people for whom medical transition is the best option. we talk a lot about how internalised misogyny influences gender dysphoria, but there might as well be cases of gender dysphoria that people are just born with, or that are so ingrained that they can't be healed. these people deserve compassion and acceptance too)

for the thing with trans men in gay male dating spaces - that's probably where we disagree the most. I have been on lesbian events where there have been "trans lesbians", and there has been an insane amount of guilt-tripping, incel behaviour, and I have been sexually harassed by a "trans lesbian" who later went on to rape a lesbian (and yes, this weren't some internet people, all of that was in person). a lot of us have been exposed to this kind of predatory behaviour, and I think that there is no excuse for a straight person to go to a gay event and expect people to date you. full stop. is it shitty to trick trans men into sex by pretending to be a gay man? yes. is it sex under false pretenses? yes. are both of the involved parties engaging in a similar behaviour (i. e. acting as something you're not to have sex with members of a marginalised demographic)? yes. should we fight for and try to protect trans men? also yes. is it hard to have sympathy for a person that went into a space trying to do conversion therapy on gay men so they can have sex with them and got tricked themselves? at least for me, it is. but should we try to get over that feeling and help these trans men as well? definetly.

but well, I actually think that you yourself can add some interesting perspectives. being a feminist is not a religion, and you can find your own opinion. you don't have to agree with everything that is said here, and we are not like certain other online groups where everyone has to be in line or they're a traitor (or at least I hope not). if there are things you think people on here are wrong about, speak about it! tell us how to better support trans men and even better if it's from your own experience :) if you think that there is a voice missing, you yourself can be that voice. :)

[alpaca-clouds]

Respectability Politics suck

Okay, let me talk about respectibility politics and why they suck. The face eating tiger party is gonna eat your face, believe it or not.

And hey, this is a topic that even concerns fanwork and shipping and all of that.

I understand that to many Respectability Politics is a word that gets thrown around a lot, but from what I see a lot of people are not quite sure of the exact meaning.

So, basically Respectability Politics is when a marginalized group tries to police parts of their own culture to be more accepted by the majority culture of whatever country they life in. While not the origin of this, the most classical example of this is queer folks trying to push other queer folks into going into more normative, nuclear families. To further the narrative of "we are not so different from you, love is love!" As such quite a few aspects of queer culture (like cruising, for example, but also ballroom culture and such) were socially frowned upon from those queer folks who were trying to seek acceptance by the majority culture.

Which is exactly also what is happening with those queer folks, who try to exclude trans people. and Those trans people trying to exclude non-binary folks. And trans medicalists, and so on and so forth.

It is also seen within general feminism - where this always has been a big thing. "Sure, I want voting rights, but do you really have to wear trousers?!"

Of course this extends to every other marginalized group. My white ass does not have the right to talk about Black civil rights for the most part, but just think of those people who would go "that is not how you ask for it" when it comes to Black Lives Matter and the like.

Or, for example, in the Disability Rights groups, where some people are trying to exclude some other folks. Or are pushing for a "everybody should want to be healed" narrative.

It really is all around.

We see it within fandom culture, too. The entire "proshipping"/"antishipping" thing expesically nothing but Respectability Politics. Be it respectability politics for fandom culture - or for queer culture, because both things are so closely related.

But the thing is this: No matter how much those people pushing for Respectability Politics do that... they will never be accapted by majority culture. They will be used as pawns for those more right leaning folks on the side of the majority culture to go: "See, even the XY agree with us. It is just XY extremists who see it differently and extremism is bad actually!" But make no mistakes: If those right leaning folks manage to push for laws against any minority group, those laws will be acted out against EVERYONE within that minority group, not just the "deviants".

Because here is the thing: the people who think of queerness as something bad and unnatural, will not leave you alone just because you and your gay husband/wife mime a nuclear family perfectly. They will still hate you, vandalize your house and what not. They might just go for the more "deviant" queers, first.

So, yeah. Fuck Respectability Politics. They do not get you anywhere. And when you need to give up part of yourself and your culture to be accepted, you are not accepted at all.

[arliedraws]

Did anyone ever send you spicy takes for literary analysis? If not, here's one: I wanna know where in the books people are getting the idea that in a boarding school in the UK in the '70s, MWPP and their classmates would ALL be some flavor of queer and also have the modern vocabulary to go with it.

I am still taking spicy takes! My week at work has been absolute chaos, so I haven’t had a chance to tackle some of these prompts yet.

But I’m going to push back a bit on ya (with love and respect, of course). Below the cut are some mentions of violence against LGBTQ+ folks, fyi.

No, I don’t think that the 1970s would have been a magical place full of openly queer teens with modern vocabulary (and weirdly cell phones?). But I do understand where it comes from. Imagine you’re a teen in 2024 where LGBTQ+ rights are being stripped away one by one in many western countries. Then imagine you’re a teen from the United States: you’re not 18 yet, you can’t vote, yet you are directly affected (or have friends who are) by anti-LGBTQ+ laws. Maybe you aren’t allowed to use a public restroom because you’re trans or maybe you have ultra-religious parents who would kick you out of the house if they found out you were gay or maybe there was a story circulating about a non-binary kid who was murdered by their peers in a bathroom at school…

So these things are all around you. You’re fifteen, and you feel absolutely powerless. Maybe you’re cut off from the queer community. Maybe you just wish there were a place where you could be around other queer teens who just GET you, who know what you’re going through. Okay, maybe you read Harry Potter when you were younger, and you find that there’s this fantasy world within the world of HP where the kids are cool and hot and wear whatever they want and say “fuck you, parents!” and they’re all in love with each other and at school, it’s all okay! The parents will never find out! This is the safe place!

While I have MANY critiques of this corner of fandom (the reinvention of heterosexuality with the hyperfeminization of Sirius and the hypermasculinization of Lupin, the blatant mischaracterization of MOST characters, etc.), I understand a young person’s hunger for it. It’s a fantasy. Plain and simple.

Do I personally find it more interesting to see what would happen if James and Sirius hooked up in an ultra-conservative pureblood society and were forced to confront internalized homophobia? YEAH. Is that an appealing story to someone who has to live that reality everyday? Ehhh…Maybe? Maybe not? It’s appealing to me because I like to explore human suffering lol. I love drama! I love complicated relationships. I love when fictional people love two people at once—I love MESSINESS (I love when they cheat! I love when they have miscommunication!). But here’s the difference—I am a thirty-something person who has a solid support system and acceptance within their community. I have the emotional space to accept complexities. Most teenagers do not have these things.

We have to remember that for everything an artist or writer creates, there’s an intent. Who is the audience? What is the effect on the reader of your stylistic choices? Is historical accuracy important to the overall message of the work? Does it detract from meaning/understanding?

My point is, sweet and beautiful Anon, you are probably right! There is plenty to critique (and I have complained about this side of the fandom before), but I accept that many young people are looking for community, and apparently this fandom created by a transphobic millionaire is where they found it.

[roadhogsbigbelly]

she did NOT say that fictional csa is fine though, that’s the thing that everyone is very expressly telling you. and IM not defending ““people who jack off to fictional children”” either, where the fuck are you getting that, do you just say this shit to every trans woman you see? you can’t argue by putting shit in people’s mouths. the “standards” you are describing are the same standards that the people you’re smearing agree with. im not saying its all or nothing at all, you just can’t take anything we’re saying seriously

when you read "stopping being mean to sex freaks who like ageplay and incest shipping" why do you think that suddenly stops at loliporn or fictional csa when that's part of the package? do you think "ageplay and incest shipping" only applied to game and thrones fanfiction and mild "daddy" play? like of course those posts saying "don't be say you love sex freaks if you don't include ALL sex freaks" is also including fictional csa, like fucking cailou porn or whatever. because the posts those are response to are like "stop being mean about people with weird fetishes that make you uncomfortable! (except fictional csa fuck you you can die)" if she's not supporting fictional csa great, but why did she reblog the fucking post than?

and again the fact that i criticized her has nothing to do with her being a trans woman, that didn't even cross my mind, and i've criticized cis men, cis women, trans men, non binary people and people of all genders and sexuality that have been dismissive of concerns over this shit. i've criticized cis women on twitter for publicly posting their weird underaged boy rape fantaties and i got accused of "hating women's fantasies", i've also critcized other cis gay men for drawing actual "toddlercon" and got accused of being a "pick me" gay, and other variations of "stop criticizing grown adults for what they do in private even if they post in publicly actually oops"

i don't actually care what people do in the privacy of their own homes, but the only reason people on tumblr make posts about how "you should stop being mean to people about their age play, incest porn" is because most people don't actually keep it private actually, or else other people wouldn't be seeing it and complain about it. like if you go into someone's dms or a locked private space to "out them" for being into scooby doo or even some actually more harmful fantasy than that's still kind of gross and intruding and they shouldn't do that, but if said person is doing it in a PUBLIC FORUM than yeah they're not above criticism because it's their own "private fantasies" when it's clearly not.

(and before you take words out of my mouth i am not inherently against public displays of sexuality or even kink, i don't think a child seeing a man in a pup mask and harness is going to tramatize them, i think they'll be fine, and in general i think try to hide the fact "sex" like. exists from children does not nothing to deter grooming and kind of causes it in some cases. i've seen people insisting that people who don't lock their nsfw twitter accounts of adults have regular but explicit sex that they're are personally grooming children who might have to figure out porn exists, and i think that's an unhealthy attitude to have. my point is more that the entire argument that noone can criticize or have a negative opinion on "ageplay" or "incest kink" because "it only exists between two private consenting adults" is just. not true.)

[coochiequeens]

Happy Pride month to the……Non-men, Gays and Bi-sexuals. 🤦🏻‍♀️ But of course gay men are still men. 🤦🏻‍♀️

Outrage has been expressed online at Johns Hopkins University over its non-binary-inclusive definition of "lesbian" in its glossary of LGBTQ+ terms.

The Baltimore-based university, a major hub of medical research in the U.S., maintains an extensive glossary of definitions for terms relevant to the broad LGBTQ+ community, which is updated as the subject of gender and sexual identity changes.

On Monday, the glossary's new definition of "lesbian" came under attack as the university defined the term as "a non-man attracted to non-men." The update is meant to be inclusive of non-binary individuals who might still identify as lesbians.

Social media users accused Johns Hopkins of attempting to "erase" women. They also pointed to the glossary's listing for "gay man," which does not use similarly non-binary-inclusive language.

The flare-up comes amid a broader backlash to LGBTQ+ rights and the embrace of queer communities by society. Numerous state legislatures across the U.S. have begun passing laws that target transgender communities, taking particular aim at the ability to get gender-affirming care for trans children. There has also been a vocal, if not definitively widespread, lashing out against companies and brands that market to LGBTQ+ communities or hold Pride Month events.

Newsweek has reached out to Johns Hopkins via email for comment.

The definition prompted a backlash on social media. LGBTQ+ influencer and lesbian vlogger Arielle Scarcella tweeted: "Why is a lesbian a non-man but a gay person isn't a non-woman? Progressive misogyny."

Twitter user Amy Curtis added: "What is this absolute nonsense... We are women."

Oli London, who is a critic of "gender ideology," also waded in, as did British TV talk show presenter Julia Hartley-Brewer, who tweeted: "What the actual f....? So now we're not just reduced to being body parts or bleeders or a mere subset of women, we're now 'non-men'."

Gay rights activist Fred Sargeant added: "Inarguably, modern times are now the stupidest time and universities are leading the way.."

The definition provided by Johns Hopkins is notably distinct from those in similar LGBTQ+ glossaries maintained by the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) and the Human Rights Campaign (HRC).

The HRC's first sentence in its definition of lesbian reads: "A woman who is emotionally, romantically or sexually attracted to other women." There is a second sentence adding that non-binary people may use the term to describe themselves.

The ADL's glossary defines lesbian as a "woman who is emotionally, physically and/or romantically attracted to some other women."

[fuckedupheadtotail]

Survey results

First of all, I'd like to thank all 37 people who took this survey for trusting me with such sensitive information, I take this trust very seriously and my lips remain sealed.

To clarify things, I'd like to explain why I use the word interest in survey questions. Some people would call it their kink, some their fetish, and some neither (but still think it's of a kink- or fetish-aligned nature), and just defaulting to calling it an interest just made sentences flow more smoothly than just going "kink/fetish/whatever you'd call it" ad nauseam.

In the questions with freeform answers, my commentary will be in red to distinguish from quoted survey answers

Q1: What is your gender identity?

I expected this, as well as the two following questions, to mostly line up with general tumblr demographics, which they for the most part did, but with some exceptions. The largest demographic here was cis women (41%), followed by unaligned non-binary (24%), cis men (16%) trans men or transmasculines (14%) and others (6%). I was expecting slightly more trans men & mascs and I certainly expected a handful of trans women & fems but other than that this checks out. Additionally, the cis to non-cis ratio is 57% cis and 43% non-cis.

Q2: What is your sexuality?

The largest demographic here was bisexuals (30%), followed by straights (22%), asexuals (19%), pansexuals (16%), tie between gay and lesbian (5% each) and others (3%). Surprised with the number of straights, especially since all straight respondents were also cis - certainly more cishets than I would expect. This isn't a bad thing of course.

Q3: Where do you live?

78% of respondents were from North America, 14% from Europe, 5% from South America and 3% from Oceania. No respondents from Africa or Asia. This lines up with what I expected, except that I did expect more from Oceania.

Q4: At which age did you discover or realize your interest?

This was a very even distribution trending toward younger ages. 35% responded tweenhood (8-12), 27% early childhood (7 or under) and 24% it's been with me for as long as I can remember. 8% responded adolescence (13-17) and 5% adulthood (18 and over).

Q5: Which of the following options would you say factor into your interest?

The four options I had here are things I personally default to when an outsider asks me why I'm into this. 36% responded vulnerability, 33% intimacy, 14% shame and 13% taboo. The respondents who chose other responded embarassment, control/dominance and the noise itself.

Q6: If you'd like, elaborate on the appeal you personally see with your interest

"I don’t consciously see an appeal, other than it’s cute sometimes? I do have a thing for vulnerability to be fair so that’s probably the main factor."

"The vulnerability of knowing that you're hungry bc your belly is rumbling. Also just love to lift up my top and let my tummy growl whilst I'm alone and in bed lol"

"desperation. an aftercare aspect is also important"  

"Just the concept of your body having its own alert system telling you when something is or isn’t inside it is really cute to me, plus I’m a sucker for ‘unusual’ things causing people physical arousal, and the idea of a belly rumbling giving someone that feeling is very nice"

"Always thought bellies were cute, liked to role-playing stomach issues as a kid and wrote sic fics as a preteen. Still into that stuff - primarily as hurt/comfort- but also became about it sexually. Stomach noises aren't my main but I like them as an indicator of discomfort."

"The sound, especially when it's persistent and loud (which is why hunger works so well). The feel of it growling against my or someone else's hand or body. The empty feeling right before it growls"

"90% of the time for me, I only enjoy this kink in more soft and fluffy scenarios. Torture and stuff like that is too intense for me personally, but I will occaaaasionally dabble in whump. Hurt/comfort with hunger is my favorite thing ever. Teasing and embarrassment are a big part of it for me, not sure why. Personal fave scenario is when it involves typically stoic and/or prideful characters. Takes 'em down a peg to have such a basic human need to embarrass them."

"The last one said vulnerability and I very much agree with that. But it's hunger it's soooo hunger"

"Noises and various round/roundish stomach shapes. Calming to hear"

"I just really like the noises, and how unique they all are :)"

"I enjoy the variety of sounds a stomach can make, though my main interest lies in hunger sounds. I love the different reactions stomach growls can get out of the people who hear/experience them, from embarrassment, shame, arousal, and even disgust (in the case of someone being degraded for the sounds their stomach makes). A major appeal for me is that it’s something the body does on its own, completely outside of your control. You may be the most composed businessperson but you’re never safe from the embarrassment of a growling stomach in the middle of a conference. I enjoy how stomach sounds can sound hollow and sad, or loud, or borderline cartoony. Personifying the stomach by describing its sounds as representing emotions is also enjoyable to me."

"It's honestly very hard to explain. I just like it a lot and I'm not too sure why. I definitely like the fact that people will feel embarrassed and try to hide it. I also like when people act stoic and try to pretend that nothing is happening x3"

"Just feeling the rumbles themselves always feels so exhilarating and sensual. I want to share that kind of fun and intimacy with someone with the same kink or someone who would be willing to indulge irl someday."

Q7: If you can clearly pinpoint a single moment that awakened your interest, which of the following best describes it?

72% responded media exposure, and 8% each on trauma and non-traumatic real life experience. The respondents in the other category were primarily concerning having no clear memory.

Q8: If you'd like, elaborate on this awakening moment

"It was always cartoon characters stomach growling when I first discovered this kink"

"I found a post on IsItNormal asking about the interest, which is what made me realize that it was something I was into."

"Courage the cowardly dog, flan episode"

"The interest had already been culminating ever since I was young through stomach growling scenes from various shows but one of the ones that really sealed it for me was an episode from Hannah Montana where Miley sneaks out and her friends Lily and Oliver pretend to be her through the door when the dad asks what’s up. All of a sudden a super loud growl emitted from Oliver’s tummy and he whispered in a panic to Lily that he hadn’t eaten all day. I definitely remember feeling quite hot and flustered during the whole thing."

"I liked the idea of stomachaches even younger but around 10-11 I read a lot of young adult novels centered around illness ? So not an awakening bc I already knew to choose those books. I also read the part of Stephen King's It where Ritchie pukes until the page fell out."

"Thinking it was "weird" and being in denial most of my life, then embracing it"

"I was watching cartoons with a family member. A character’s stomach growled onscreen, and I immediately felt embarrassed and hot in the face, almost uncomfortable. I got squirmy and felt the need to leave the room."

"It had to be when I was 3-5? Because I was watching Wonder Pets. There was an episode where they were by a geyser and it was about to go off and Tuck the Turtle said something about thinking it was his stomach growling. Or maybe the other guys said "hey was that you" I don't know. But I thought about that so much afterwards and then it bled into every child interest I had. I was embarrassed by it even though I didn't see it as taboo, it just felt really personal to me"

"I don't think I had a particular awakening moment, but I do remember several times when watching TV with my family, how I'd get really embarrassed whenever a character's stomach growled. I remember one specific time where I saw the title screen for an episode quite literally about stomach growling, which I had already seen, and I had to physically leave the room bc I knew I could not handle it lmao (side note the episode in question was like. good god man. tbh I refuse to believe that not a single writer for that episode didn't also have this fetish bc it was so over the top and in your face. [If anyone's curious the episode is Rabbid Tummy Rumble from Rabbids Invasion. Shit was wild.])"

"I think it was when I joined the internet and I saw other people engaging in similar topics to what I was interested in, and when I found out they were doing it because of a ‘fetish’, I was like “Whoaaa I didn’t know I had that.”"

"I don't remember the exact moment, but I remember watching a cartoon where a character's stomach growled multiple times in a scene, and I was ENAMORED. I kept rewinding the scene back and back to listen to the character's stomach :)"

"I was in 2nd grade when I first became exposed to vore content through Youtube. Even at the time, I knew there was something about it that appealed to me, but I didn't know what exactly it was until I was older. I realized that me discovering those videos ended up leading me down a rabbit hole where I also discovered that it wasn't just vore I was into, but rather bellies in general. I still feel shameful about it since I doubt I'd be into this kind of stuff had I not come across those videos, but I also feel that I've become more accepting of myself over this now that I am an adult. Looking back on it, I am also a little bit disappointed that it was Kphoria videos of all things that exposed me to this kind of stuff instead of something of better quality. I am also a bit mortified of the fact that my dad has caught my 2nd grade self watching those videos not long after I've discovered them. I just hope he doesn't remember that moment."

I'd say there's no right or wrong way to develop a kink or fetish, it's not like you can help it, so no need to beat yourself up about it.

"i wouldn't necessarily say it's a single moment so much as i experienced neglect growing up and the brain does strange things"

"Caught my siblings watching something they shouldnt have and got stuck watching it before I remember that it wasn’t appropriate for them. It was an animated vore video on YouTube."

"I think i can recall in very early childhood having a lot of weird feelings around this interest. Being very young and feeling like ‘hungry’ was a dirty word to say and things like that. Feeling kind of scandalized when something involving it would happen, the way I now feel as an adult if someone were to speak about sex way too casually. It was around when I was 12 that I saw a compilation on youtube of anime characters stomachs growling and that was when I realized my confusion around the subject was sexual in nature."

I can definitely relate to feeling weird and scandalized as a kid! I hear a lot of people say they as kids would always rewind kink-suggestive scenes to watch over and over but as for me, I wanted nothing to do with rumbling bellies, because they just made me feel a very strong emotion I could not understand (arousal) and being confused like that just made me angry.

Q9: Do you have any related interests?

41% of responses included hunger, 25% stuffing/feedism, 14% vore, 6% eructophilia, 5% eproctophilia and 10% others, including (most to least picked) emetophilia, cardiophilia and scat. Overall, 95% of respondents had at least one related interest.

Q10: If you have related interest(s), would you consider it a chicken-or-the-egg situation?

83% of respondents answered yes, with 50% saying their interest in stomach noises inspired them to develop their related interest(s) and 33% vice versa. 17% responded no, that they arose independently of one another.

Q11: Which cause(s) of stomach noises interest(s) you the most?

56% of responses included hunger, 27% digestion, 12% indigestion, 3% nausea and 1% no preference. I was surprised to see hunger be more popular than digestion, I was under the impression that it was the other way around given that a lot of YouTube content leans more digestion than hunger. Then again, this may be sampling bias at play since I did post the survey in the hunger kink tag.

Q12: How noisy is your own stomach?

49% of respondents answered only in certain circumstances (example: only if I'm hungry), 27% somewhat, 14% not at all :( and 11% very.

Q13: Do you have any bowel issues or food intolerances that manifest with a noisy belly?

This is a question I was particularily curious about because on the rare occasions I've seen kink negative people try to justify hating this interest in a way that makes them seem righteous about it, they'll often go for the angle of "fetishizing chronic illness". As a certified lead belly this has embedded some insecurities in me, namely that I'll meet a potential partner who happens to have a bowel issue and would feel fetishized should I divulge this part of myself, and if I fumble particularily badly that my ass will be spread wide open on r/relationships or r/AITA. I'm sorry if I just gave y'all a brand new fear. But I digress, I was curious if there were people in the community with pathologically noisy bellies who may or may not have this interest in part to cope.

62% of responses included no, 23% yes, bowel issue(s) and 15% yes, food intolerance(s).

Q14: If you have partner(s), do they know?

72% of respondents answered no, with the remainder tied between yes, they share my interest and yes, but they don't share my interest, at 14% each.

Q15: If your partner(s) know(s) but don't share your interest, how do they feel about it?

"he likes teasing me about it in a good-natured way. i am still processing too much shame to bring it up or be particularly responsive much"

"They like that I'm into it so he'll purposely make his belly noisy typically with digestion but sometimes hunger"

"Currently broken up, but when we dated we were actually both into the same things, they leaned more into the feederism side of things while I did more so the hunger. But we both enjoyed both overall, so it played a huge role in our intimacy"

"I'm single now but ex didn't mind and was happy that it could turn me on"

"I don’t have a partner at the moment but I like to imagine if I did then they’d be perfectly fine with it, but I wouldn’t mind if they didn’t indulge. I wouldn’t want to make them if they weren’t into it"

"This is my first time sharing this stuff w a partner (We met on Tumblr!) and it's a fucking dream. I never explicitly told exes. Most recent ex actually discovered my tumblr and was loud about his disgust but who knows if he would have acted differently had we been together at that time. (That ex was v normie and told me he didn't understand how anyone could get sexual satisfaction from anything non-sexual. How boring)"

I think you could have a partner indulge even if they weren't personally into it, many are prepared to indulge in things they don't necessarily like because just knowing it gets their partner off is enough reward for them. YMMV though, and obviously consent still matters.

Q16: Do you prefer to listen to somebody else's stomach, or to have your own stomach making noises?

46% of respondents answered no preference, 43% prefer noises from somebody else's stomach and 11% prefer to have my own stomach make noises.

Q17: How do you explore and manifest your interest?

I totally forgor to add an option for listening to belly recordings other people have uploaded, when I totally should've. Shout out to the people who added this through the "Other" option. 19% responded consuming fiction, 16% consuming art, 15% consuming prompts, then a tie between creating fiction and fasting at 11% each, then 28% other entries which include (most to least picked) creating art, recording my stomach, creating prompts, listening to partner's stomach and eating things my stomach tends to digest loudly.

Q18: How do you tend to react if you hear a stomach growling in public, or if it's mentioned in public?

"I feel a little embarrassed. I don’t tend to enjoy fiending over people unless I know it’s consensual- or rather if its in a context where people are aware that theyre being viewed in a sexual way, if that makes sense- but that isn’t to say I dont sometimes take inspiration from real life scenarios if they interest me. Usually if my body has a physical reaction to hearing someones stomach growl i feel a little ashamed."

"Embarrassed"

"Well the rational part of me takes over thank god. I usually will just stay silent to not embarrass whoever it was, but if it's bad for them I might tease them but probably suggest they eat or offer anything if I had it. I Will Not Lie I do find these situations very attractive though. In the back of my head I am not normal at all. Like I'll start tapping my fingers or shift in my seat probably."

"I try not to react; I'll sit there still faced and if someone addresses it in front of me, I'll kinda nod and laugh to clear up the tension."

"i ignore it as much as possible"

"If it's regarding someone else I just try to act as normal as possible while keeping a straight face. If it's regarding me, I'd easily get embarrassed about it and quickly try to change the subject."

"I'm good at hiding my kink, so I'm able to just ignore it."

"My body reacts involuntarily, I’ll squirm a little and sometimes get aroused because of it. I also get embarrassed, though I put effort into not showing any visible reaction. If it’s mentioned, I secretly wish the conversation would stay on the topic of it, so I could listen in."

"Would act like it was no big deal but internally trying not to over enthuse about the moment."

"It actually makes me uncomfortable because my brain is hardwired into thinking it's sexual."

"Immediate embarrassment. The same way a normal person would react if someone started talking about something sexual next to you. Like I know that to them its just 'omg my stomach was growling so loud today I'm starving ahah.' but to me its like your describing your last hookup like dude are you not ashamed?? why're you saying this so casually-"

"I usually get very flustered."

"Don't really respond or acknowledge it, but internally it depends. Usually it makes me uncomfortable when ppl mention it, oddly enough."

"Try to ignore it and might feel awkward/embarrassed but turned on and flustered if it's someone I'm attracted to"

"Interested/attentive to the details"

"Depends on the person. If it’s someone I know personally, especially relatives, I get uncomfortable. If it’s a person I barely know, I feel a mix of excitement and embarrassment"

I can definitely relate to feeling uncomfortable when it's relatives!

"Growling isn't my main thing but visible/obvious bellies get me"

"I'd probably blush and try not to get aroused by it >w<"

"I’d normally feel awkward and try to ignore it but if someone I was attracted to had their stomach growling or mention being hungry or whatever I’d secretly be really turned on."

"Silent on the outside but intrigued on the inside"

"I don't react. Weirdly, it's only hot when it's my belly rumbling whilst I'm alone. I think it's bc I've seen too many creepy comments from cis men sexualising other people's growling bellies without their knowledge e.g. a man talking about a "young lady" with a hungry tummy in the library and how he found it hot, but the poor thing was probably just trying to study and could have been embarrassed."

This was the main outlier in this question. I definitely understand feeling creeped out by cis men - no offense to the cis men who responded to this survey, y'all seem to have good heads on your shoulders - but my two cents is that hiring a cop inside your head about it isn't very productive, it won't stop the actual creeps and you'll just feel guilty over thought crimes. Maybe I feel this way because I see more of people swinging in the opposite direction - thinking the best way to combat fetish mining is to assume every kinky person is out to assault you if you happen to do something that turns them on. As I've put it in a post on my personal blog, it's beginning to approach "I don't mind gay people as long as they don't hit on ME ;)" territory with a dash of white woman human trafficking posting. I can't dictate how you personally feel of course, but I think it's important to emphasize that merely the act of getting a boner over a stranger isn't a moral failing.

Q19: How do you think your interest is viewed by outsiders, generally speaking?

46% of respondents answered unsure, 32% there's significant stigma, 16% split down the middle and 5% most people would accept it.

Q20: If you've experienced stigma over your interest, feel free to elaborate on what was said and how it made you feel

Before getting into the answers, I'm gonna drop one comment in particular I've seen a couple of times, namely that there was a very infamous murderer who appeared to harbor borborygmophilic desires. Even putting aside the fact that we all should understand that guilt by association is a logical fallacy by like, age 11, I do find it curious that this exact same person also seemed to hold cardiophilic desires, yet that's never mentioned when the topic of cardiophilia is brought up. I'm not saying this to gatekeep cardiophiles or whatever, you're awesome and I'm sure you have to deal with shit too, but it's curious when outsiders have this cognitive dissonance, the layman just has an easier time understanding the appeal and intimacy of listening to heartbeats because we put a lot of emphasis on the heart in many cultures, while the digestive system is considered more "unclean". I consider it similar to how hand fetish is usually seen as more "inoffensive" than foot fetish by outsiders.

"i don't tell anyone but i've seen people's disgusted comments on content"

"I'm not really sure? My besties know but after I told them I try to keep it downplayed as much as possible, especially since my main focus is hunger and that is such a normal every day thing. So it's a little awkward basically alienating one of my main needs as a human being and delegating it to some Weird Methods just to avoid saying the words "I'm hungry" but you know how it is"

"I have not personally experienced stigma due to this fetish but I have seen comments about it in a derogatory way, which has lead me to feel insecure at times (I understand most of the negative reaction comes from the more pushy side of the community but it still reaches the calmer side which is how I managed to see it)"

"I constantly hear how the feederism community is promoting obesity and how the hunger fetish community is promoting anorexia. I do get it in all honesty, theres obviously the people that take it too far sometimes, and I'm not for that. I honestly still struggle to be attracted to these things if its outside of fiction because my rational brain kicks in and I worry about their safety. I honestly see it as every kink has its dark side, but you just gotta know when too much is too much and if this part should just stay fiction. Like BDSM is a much more popular and accepted kink, and you could also argue that its promoting dark subjects, but if done right with safety in mind, its fine and great for everyone."

Yeah, it really grinds my gears when people assume hunger kink by default means starvation and disordered eating. Like grow up most of us just like "whoops I forgor to eat and now my tummy's bothering me about it" type of scenarios followed by a well deserved meal, and those who like more intense scenarios than that either keep it in fiction or take long breaks between play sessions and make sure to do adequate aftercare. If you can understand that people who like say, impact play, don't want to literally beat the shit out of people, they just want to inflict mild and fleeting pain to a partner who derives pleasure that by far outweighs the pain, you should be able to understand this too

"I think some people who do not understand the nature of how fetishes work may be quick to label this one as gross or degenerate. I also fear the stigma coming from the eating disorder community, and being misunderstood as supporting that kind of behavior."

"I've seen people call it weird online, never personally but that alone makes me feel ashamed"

"Not quite stigma, but my friend (the only person who knows about me being into this thing) sometimes teases me about it, but only bc I'm okay with it and they've never mentioned it around anyone else."

Q21: Pick a favorite onomatopoeia

This was mostly just for fun, but I was also curious if there were preference patterns between say, people who prefer hunger and people who prefer digestion. 30% of respondents answered growl, 16% rumble, 14% gurgle, then a tie between grumble and groan at 11% each and 19% other entries, including (most to least picked) howl, roar, whine, moan, churn and borborygmus. Squelch was an option but was not picked by anybody.

The strongest preference patterns I saw was the correlation between growl and hunger, rumble and hunger, rumble and digestion and gurgle and digestion.

Q22: Do you consent to your freeform answers being quoted in a summary of the results of this survey?

Just so we're on the same page, by freeform answers I mean answers to questions 6, 8, 15, 18, 20 and 23. I don't think the results of this question are super relevant to my analysis though.

Q23: Any closing thoughts?

"i feel like it's telling how stigmatized and shamed having any kind of kink is that i can barely even discuss it with my own partner who has no problem with it in private because i've internalized so much shame just from seeing how other people are treated"

"Sorry if I'm not exactly your demographic but this was fun"

"Hehe tummy go grr"

Co signed!

"Not entirely relevant, but I think I might be one of the only people to have both borborygmophilia but also emetophobia. Haven't heard of anyone else in the same situation, so I thought I'd mention it."

"This quiz felt very thought through and welcoming, and it was very interesting exploring my fetish outside of the little scenarios I make up in my head haha. Thank you for creating this, it was fun to do <3"

"I used to think my interest was a fetish, and theres a potential that it still is. Because I used to only be able to experience arousal when listening to stomach noises or imagining them. However I’ve found that in doing trauma processing in therapy, I am now able to experience arousal from ‘normal things’, like porn or erotic fiction (even if its vanilla). The arousal is not as strong, consistent or frequent as the arousal I experience due to my stomach kink, but it is real all the same. 

I think it may also be worth noting that I noticed growing up that a lot of people on tumblr with the same interests as me (who were also fem, female or woman adjacent in any way) were lesbian and/or ace, but had a preference for male stomach noises over female stomach noises, myself included."

I feel really reluctant to share this ‘kink’ with anyone in my life, even including my partner, because I feel a lot of shame and like I’m weird for having this interest. As a result, I typically only ever want to read about fictional scenarios and have little to no interest of incorporating real life instances of my kink into my love life. I’m only just now beginning to consider telling my partner about it. 

I haven't noticed the pattern of lesbian/ace women and fems, but that's interesting! Maybe it's a matter of trying to avoid objectifying women, similar to how some male musicians get homoerotic on stage seemingly as an outlet to be horny without objectifying women. Idk, I'm just spitballing here.

"This was honestly a pretty cool survey. Thank you for the opportunity! ^^"

"Thank you for this survey! It makes me feel less alone in my experiences when people openly discuss things like this that are normally considered taboo."

"I really appreciate you making this survey. I’ve always found it strange that other belly related kinks like vore and feederism are fairly well known (though are often made fun of) yet the stomach growling kink which goes hand in hand with the others is seemingly quite uncommon and under the radar. I can’t wait to see the final results and know the full scope of this community."

I think one reason we fly under the radar is because there's no widely used term. This is why I throw around borborygmophilia a lot, once it sticks maybe more people will realize this is a thing that exists, and in the meantime it's just a fun way for me to be pretentious and namedrop my vice while having it fly over the heads of most people.

[rotationalsymmetry]

Ayyy.

So I got a little into the tags on this one. And it's wild. (Transphobia discourse ahead including brief mentions of sexual violence, physical violence, and police and prisons. feel free to scroll past if you don't want to see it.) (btw I'm talking trans fem and trans masc a lot and I realize some non-binary people don't think either term is really applicable to them and...I think that's legit I just don't know what to say about it. Apart from yeah exorsexism is also its own thing. Sorry.)

Here look. Do trans women and trans femmes have some pretty epic issues that are much more a thing they face than a thing that trans mascs face? Of course. If I walk down the street in a short haircut and a binder, I'm not going to be especially worried that a cop will decide to harass me because they think I'm a sex worker. I'm not at especially high risk of a lover murdering me because he's so freaked out at the idea of maybe being a little bit gay because the woman he fucked turned out to not have been born in a body the doctors recognized as female. If I get arrested, well, a lack of hearing about transmasc prison horror stories does not mean they don't exist, but I have heard transfem prison horror stories and they are horrific.

Plus the extra layer of some feminists (terfs) being utterly convinced that trans women are a unique and terrifying threat to feminism and should not be allowed in women's spaces or to even, like...work for feminist organizations? Anyways. It's a whole thing.

And I've known about at least some of this stuff for as long as I've known about any trans issues. And it's horrifying and very much worth talking about and doing stuff about. And it also as far as I can tell does get talked about extensively when people talk about trans issues at all. Which I mean. They often don't.

At the same time, I have also seen a sort of overcorrection, more from cis people than trans people I think, to go "well ok clearly we have to draw the line somewhere, if feminism can include trans fems we have to exclude someone so I guess that means feminism does not apply to trans mascs."

Which is ludicrous.

Misogyny affects trans fems. Street harassment and job discrimination and a million other feminist issues affect trans women. (In fact, trans fems often offer a uniquely valuable perspective on these things, as they can compare how people treat them at different stages of how other people see them.) Misogyny affects trans fems, again not surprisingly because is there any group of women that misogyny does not affect, so feminism should include trans fems.

And misogyny affects trans mascs. Abortion access and contraception access affects us. The restrictions placed on girls affect us, since most of us didn't transition at age two. Clothes without pockets often affect us. Sexual harassment and sexual assault and unfortunately in some cases corrective rape affect us. And here look, I pretty much look like a cis woman who doesn't shave her body hair, but trans masc who look like guys have this really unpleasant problem where often they still need "women's health care", Pap smears and whatnot, because "women" need a lot of health care, while looking like guys, where the worst scenario is getting refused care and the next worst one is getting care but being misgendered the entire time and the best case scenario of getting appropriate care and not being misgendered and also not being slammed by dysphoria or the psychological residue of past health care experiences too hard, is hard to find. Ok?

If misogyny affects trans mascs, and again it does, then trans mascs belong in feminism, ie the struggle against misogyny.

If misogyny affects trans mascs in a way that intersects with transphobia -- if trans mascs get special experiences that are much more common for them than for either cis women or trans fems or cis men -- then there should be a word for that. And in theory you could talk about transmisogyny to cover both, because hey intersection of transphobia and misogyny what else are you going to call it, but a lot of people are deeply convinced that transmisogyny means specifically the oppression that trans fems expeiences so it's almost less effort to just coin a new term than to fight over what transmisogyny should mean. So. Here we are.

It's really wild that any of this is controversial. Let alone that people will get so intensely angry about it.

[mxjackparker]

JKR retweeted this. It's titled "The Witch Trials of J.K. Rowling" and has a picture of a bunch of trans people with one holding a sign protesting her as the image for it. Rowling is clearly framing herself as the victim of a witch hunt by trans people.

She has also, of course, engaged in a huge amount of transphobia.

She did so in this piece she wrote, where she repeatedly misgenders the trans people she's discussing and suggests it should be harder for us to access healthcare and there should be more gatekeeping in place. She mentions autistic trans boys and men, calling them "girls", and brings them up to suggest that their overrepresentation is the result of something nefarious. She brings them up and immediately follows with conspiratorial ideas about social contagion from someone else, quoting as if she can get away with saying they're not her own words even though she obviously chose to share them.

Only days ago she retweeted this, which calls the black and brown and trans stripes on the Pride flag "shit" and argues against use of the word queer by queer people.

Rowling opposes self-ID for trans people. Rowling opposes Gender Recognition Reform. Rowling complains about accurate language like "people who menstruate" when discussing periods, out of a desire to exclude trans men and non-binary people who experience periods and to call us women.

Rowling frames affirmative trans healthcare as "conversion therapy for young gay people".

She's transphobic and she's well aware that she is, and the immediate request for examples and exact quotes (of which there are many) is designed to try and get people to phrase themselves imperfectly because she wants to sue them. Even though it would never hold up in court, if she goes after someone for replying to her asking for a "direct quote" or "example" by paraphrasing, she is able to scare them into shutting up.

J. K. Rowling is a transphobe and I won't be bulled into not saying it.

[poopscooplala]

(psa this is mostly referring to the movies)

ive seen a few posts that have bothered me. i searched "remadora bad" on google to see what people were saying and it came up eith tumblrs and reddits etc and they were all really weird.

i recently got into the marauders fandom after reading atyd and being a fan of harry potter since i was a child, this fandom made me really happy because of the escapism it provided. many of us have loved hp and then realised its problematic aspects and seen jkr being the worst and no longer can escape with hp.. and marauders fandom is a much more inclusive and feels safe space. i do ship wolfstar and i want to get this straight because one post mentioned wolfstar shippers and it was definitely a weird take.

the post was about how women who ship two men together hate women because if theres a woman in the picture its always a crime against her i guess? they also touched on fetishisation of gay men in a way that seemed to be encapsulating all of these people into that message.

1. not everyone who ships two men hates women. i mean this is absurd 😭 it seemed much more like this poster was more anti fanon, which is odd. anyone who defends jkr instantly puts me off, i understand if someone is confused by not following canon when talking abt media.. but it shouldnt go so far as to licking jkrs ass saying "shes the author she knows best🤓🤓" we know shes the author, thats half the problem. anyway, i understand this point but it didnt work in the context they were using it for (remadora/wolfstar). the marauders fandom has been criticised for misogyny, but the generalisation of shippers all having that belief is just untrue.

2. fetishisation of gay men is most definitely prevelant in shipping spaces but it goes eithout saying that an entire community of people wont all have the same views and opinions. from personal experience, i have always been wary of fetishising gay men and recently realised that my special interests being shipping different gay relationships has been involved in my gender identity. im not really sure of anything yet but i am exploring being actually a man or gener fluid or non binary.. as i said i dont know yet but i have realised that i have always put myself in these ships, wanting to be one of the men in them (of course this hasnt been the sole reason im questioning my gender). generally, i think shipping is very fun and just a great way of exploring romance in your favourite medias that represent you - which is what many people in the marauders fandom express. i do understand this concern though - fetishisation is a real thing and these ships shouldnt be objectified to be apart of that. i just dont think we should automstically assume every shipper is fetishising gay ppl.

nothing ive talked abt has rlly been abt marauders so far but i just wanted to set up some context and rant abt that post tbh.

as ive grown, ive realised how forced remadora was in the movies. i always felt like it came out of nowhere but i was a kid and i didnt care enough to think abt it like i just wanted to see harry running through the grass and shit. anyway, ive watched a few viedos abt the marauders fandom and about jk rowlings problematic writing and i have a few points to make about remadora and tonks' and remus' characters respectively.

in ootp, tonks is introduced as a fun, independent, and rebellious person. they arent afraid to speak out abt their name to someone more experienced in the field (mad-eye) and they have bright purple hair so obviously they r cool and awesome. they are a metamorphagus(?) meaning they can change some parts of how they look. i, and many others, see this as a symbol of trans teens. correcting the feminine "nymphadora" to a more unisex "tonks", the fact they can literally change how they look (perhaps showing their desire to change themselves ehich many trans people relate to), and their overrall childlike attitude. i think rowling makes tonks young and fun to show immaturity, therefore the transcoded character is sort of displayed as an immature teen that doesnt know any better (insert jkrs transphobic tweets here).

THEN in hbp the newly called "dora" is married. not only is tonks feminised by heteronormativity (a big aspect of stereotypical femininity is marriage) but their general appearance and attitude has changed. her hair is now like a light brown, and this natural colour i feel may allude to the natural order of womanhood is to maybe go through a rebellious gender non conformity teenhood, but eventually we all "mature" into our "natural" womanhood.. may be a reach buut?? anyway, their dialogue in this movie is very small - i assume its different in the book, but i feel like either way their dialogue would be similarly all focusing on remus (way to fail the bechdel test) which ironically is more represantative of jkr hating woman soo the ship they r saying is the anti "gay shippers who hate women" is one of the many symbols of misogyny in jkrs books.. i mean idk if i need to say this but a woman isnt defined by being married/with a man and i feel like jkr is trying to present it that way.

jkr seems to have unintentionally presented her transphobic views in the character of tonks. many people related to tonks because of their gender fluidity and hbp disappointed many with this character development.

now, the age gap between remus and tonks is 13 years which is gross. especially when you think about the more childish representation of tonks in ootp, like theyve been matured in hbp for the purpose of making the relationship less weird? idk but this is a point that really irks me because many ppl ignore this and always conclude that ppl who dont like remadora are just wolfstar shippers and also hate tonks because they r a woman. even if i hated wolfstar id still hate remadora because of this gross age gap😭😭

another post was from like 10 yrs ago so, perhaps the opinions are just outdated considering jkrs problematic behaviour has become more of general knowledge in recent years but they basically were the common "he not gay jkr mad ehim be with woman he cant be gay 🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓" .. jkr has made lots of promises she couldnt keep.. like the whole can of worms that is the time turners (no cedric diggory would not become a death eater please go back to bed omg) so it really isnt unheard of that she could make a gay character and then just.. ruin it?

she definitely didnt intentionally make anyone gay, because she ahtes gay ppl, but remus and sirius are very commonly interpreted to be queer coded. loads of ppl mention this, but even david thewlis (remus lupin actor) read the characters as lovers. many people saw them as lovers so thought remus was gay, then saw him marry tonks and felt confused. of course he could just be bi but jkr wasnt writing that i dont think lolz EVEN if that was the case, remus is meant to be a good character so why is he getting with tonks who is so much younger than him, to me it makes no sense. which is why many people think remadora doesnt make sense, why many marauders fans, including myself, dont see remadora as what would happen. like im not saying that sirius would be a live and blah blah because im referring to a still canon compliant story, it just would not include remadora and its weird energy.

also, jkr said once that lycanthropy was a symbol for rhe aids crisis (thats not a gay allusion at all 🤗). and hootsyoutube makes a great point about how this is problematic. remus lupin is not the only werewolf in the series, greyback is another one that is apart of the wizard nazis and was the one who bit little 5 yr old baby remus lupin. so.. this is very predatory behaviour, i mean he sliterally biting people (like a lion eating a gazelle or sumn idk r u getting what im putting down 😭😭). now, what is a harmful and highly perpetuated stereotype against gay people.. you got it - predatory behaviour. jkr connects the aids crisis to werewolves who are (except remus) presented as predators who prey on little children 😝😝 amazing!!! SO jkr does allude to gay/bi remus buuut its also in a very evil very malevolent light because shes a witch cackling in the night

i hate canon dick riders because not only is the canon problemstic and jkr is evil BUT its literally a made up story... why do you care abt whats canon and ehats not? some may not get it but i love the feeling of being in the marauders fandom, where everything is just made up by us like its so whimsy so fun.

another post that rlly grinded my gears was saying "yall will complain abt remadora age gap but then ship snarry and snermione" which if ur referring to only ppl who ship this then yes you ate down very demure very mindful.. but it wasnt. why ar eppl generalising so hard like i know for a fact I do not ship that... thats pedofilia guys!! and i know most in marauders fandom dont either because most marauders fans i see rnt disgusting monster people? but they also used this to undermine the age gap in remadora, like no they r both bad both weird and the fact that one is by the author of hp is very telling

okay thats the end of my rant uhhh 🥸

[hurts4maya]

I don't know why some Christians are homophobic and transphobic. It makes me sad, and it makes no sense! They say the excuses 'God says homosexuality is bad' and 'its Adam and Eve, not Adam and steve' when those excuses don't even make sense?

First of, Adam and Eve were banished from God's Garden of Eden for being tempted by the Devil and disobeying God. They were the ones who introduced Original Sin and evil into our world. Why are you saying all relationships should be based on the one which disobeyed God? If anything, Christians should strive not to be like Adam and Eve. I'm definitely not saying that everyone should be gay, but shouldn't be like Adam and Eve in personality and dedication.

The second thing is the bible excuse. Unfortunately, there are lines in the bible which are against homosexuality however, there is nothing about it in the ten commandments which all Christians should live their life by. Also, in the new testament Jesus made a new commandment. It didn't abolish the old ones but more of a an overview on all of them. It was to love one another.

This is the most important thing of all. Christians and other people of religion should be caring for all of the creatures on God's earth, including humans. God made all animals, created the power of free will for Adam and Eve so all of us do have it as well. ( I will explain more about free will in another post). We should use that power for good. It doesn't seem like a power but the choice to be compassionate is a vital power.

We wouldn't be humans without free will. All humans are born the way they are born and we should all love each other for who we are. Christians who hate anyone from a minority can't claim to be true Christians. Gay, trans, non binary, genderfluid, bisexual, pansexual, asexuals and cis gendered and hetrosexual people are all people. There are no races apart from the human race. There are of course different nationalities and cultures but we all are one race. We should stand together and love each other.

This is why I dislike Christians who hide behind their religion for an excuse to spread evil.

[makorays]

Why are the red people winning?

Australia has gone fully labor party (conservative) and now anyone you talk to from Australia is anti LGBTQIA+

The east Is against LGBTQIA+

America is being converted rapidly to anti LGBTQIA+

Online if your struggling with gender or masculinity or non binary or any of those things your more likely to have someone tell you to "suck it up" or "do some pushups get a 6 pack" then actually tell you about new stuff

Femboys are now seen as evil for some reason

When ever I do anything remotely against the masculine code of conduct I get people calling me slurs and telling me to kill myself or yelling haram at me

Even long time people who were supportive now have converted

And I see no future for people like myself in a world like this

I know our generate will likely see the end of the world but THIS? Why does everyone hate progress all of a sudden?

Last month there was an incident in our school where a group of boys attacked a group of gay kids and the teachers took the side of "they shouldn't flaunt their sexuality" but they weren't flaunting anything

You know about politics mako pls explain?

pessimism is a cuck's mindset. what are you, a bottom? you're just gonna sit there and SUBMIT to your perception of the tides of history? the world is probably not going to end in our lifetime, and even if it does, humanity will probably find a way to keep going through the ashes.

i don't think you truly grasp just how fucking AWFUL things used to be for people like us. you think it's bad now because conservatives are rallying super hard all of a sudden, but imagine being gay or trans back when openly admitting to either of those things could get you straight-up arrested. and those people existed just as much back then; they just had to suck it up because they were cursed to be born in a time in which open hostility to them was such a norm that they couldn't even THINK of living as their true selves. trans people throughout all of human history have had to endure incurable body dysphoria because the medicine wasn't there to help them. things are SO much better now. (and for the record, everyone back then thought the world was gonna end too; ask any old-enough american what living in the cold war was like.)

that is not to say things aren't looking scary right now. conservatives had a wake-up call and realized they're losing harder than they've ever lost before, so they're lashing out and trying to do everything they can to push us back into the dark ages. it is important to be vigilant, to vote them out, to do what you can to make sure their mind virus infects as few people as possible. but their ideology is entirely based around losing. they're literally openly and proudly anti-progress, which is self-evidently fucking stupid, and the conservative party has spent its entire existence taking L after L after L as we gain more civil rights.

they're doing some serious damage right now, a lot of peoples' lives are going to be worse for a while. but it's a downward spike in an overall upward trend. do you really think they're gonna win this time after they lost the previous 99 times? even the nazis ended up ultimately losing after they "won".

this is all from an american perspective, of course; a lot of other countries still have a long way to go. 99% of human history has been spent with minority groups not having basic human rights, and america has only just recently begun clawing its way out of that tribalism and into something actually civilized. i think countries like china and russia are gonna remain fucked for quite some time, unfortunately. but they'll probably get there too, one day. once the progress has been made, all you can do to go backwards is flail like an infant and complain about the woke mob being too compassionate towards their fellow man. not super effective at causing lasting damage.

oh also you need to either develop some keen debate skills to convert your friends or find better ones because that shit cannot be good for you

[cyrusstarchaser]

Like most trans people, and queer people in general, my idea about 'being trans/queer' has changed a lot over the course of my life. I started transitioning in my late 20s/earlier 30s. I went through the "it's a medical thing" phase, I also said "I prefer 'transsexual' because I am only changing my sex not my gender". And those are all fine stances, but they sat ill with me cause I had always been so loud and proud queer. Why would I refuse a 'gay cure' and yet would want a 'trans cure'? Why was I, someone who beamed with pride when they called themselves a dyke, so afraid of being trans? Why would I wish to magically be cis? And why did it seem like transitioning would mean I was no longer queer? Why did I feel this feeling of 'Straight Man Doom"?...and why did it seem like so many other trans mascs though the same?

Meanwhile, I was also having to speed run working through my complicated thoughts on Men - especially if I was supposed to want to be one after all. Yeah I was 'jealous', ya know, "blah blah boyhood" and "being cis is free fuck you!" and all that, but why did I hate the idea of people seeing ME as a man? Ok yes I did double down a bit on being a 'man-hating' dyke - but WHY did it feel like I was losing something by transitioning?

Well turns out the short answer was that the first step to queer joy was overcoming my internalized toxic masculinity, because the thing I felt like I was losing was 'freedom'. All my life I have felt this overwhelming feeling of coming up short when measured to a man. This pressure to compete, to be the best. Cause if I lose then it was because I was a Girl. When I got my disability diagnosis, there was a sense of relief because surly THIS was why I was losing. Of course being a man would seem terrifying, now I would constantly have to compete in order to keep my gender. And of course I wouldn't want to be a man, I had heard from women EXACTLY what men were like! Of course I was going to have to stop being queer - I only liked women after all (LMAO) and if people knew I was trans/queer then I would seem more feminine and more "Really a Girl" to them. Of course I didn't want people to see me as a man, they were dangerous! Every woman I know has told me that! But if I was non-binary, then I was really just a girl right? And a disabled trans man is just a man that 's Losing, why would I want to be that? What if I transitioned and looked like a Creep?

At the end of the day being a dyke allowed more freedom then being a straight man - because at least when I was seen as a dyke I was never seen as dangerous to my allies, and I was still a dyke regardless of any "feminine hobbies or preferences". And look, of course some people have insinuated that I wasn't really a lesbian but it was far less frequent and way easier to wave off. It's one thing when once in a blue moon a guy who clearly wants to sleep with you goes "are you sure you're really a lesbian?" and it's another thing entirely when everyone around you INCLUDING YOURSELF starts holding you to the Male Norm and pointing out when you Lack.. And not for nothing but men were just straight up more vilified to me by everyone around me then dykes were.

Now obviously I came to an epiphany about this at some point, otherwise we wouldn't be 5 paragraphs deep into a blog post. Now I just Do What I Want Forever. I wish I could concisely describe the feeling to people. I wish I could meaningfully convey how much joy and freedom I gained when it felt like I could finally see my chains. But all I feel is frustration. How do I tell people that it's not just that will live in a sterile, white-centrist, binary obsessed gated community - it's that we live in a gender panopticon that everyone gleefully takes part in? It really is a bio-essentialist matrix: I can't point out that "Men have it bad" because they are in charge and have power, women can't be cruel to men because they are just fighting back against patriarchy. "They hate me because I'm a man" says the young white boy about to be recruited into the alt right. "I know what it's like to be a minority" says the white woman about to preach respectability politics. "You're less of a man if you are losing, you must always be working hard and earning! Don't talk about weakness or emotion, men are supposed to struggle and be hard!" says capitalism. "Yeah you're non-binary...but what are you really?" says someone who cares too deeply about 'gendered solicitation' - but not to fix it cause it's working as intended.

"There are just natural differences between men and women" says a system that has a vested interest in you believing that the people around you are inherently different from you in ways you can not comprehend - despite being your neighbor. When I say I'm trans what I mean is that I am a huddled mass yearning to be free, allowed dignity and agency. When I say I am a fag it is because I am a man that loves men radically, queer pride replacing patriarchal shame. And when I say I'm old it's because I'm exhausted from participating in this waking nightmare known as capitalism - despite having a note from my doctor saying I'm excused!

[coochiequeens]

Another male suing a woman for speaking the truth

By Nuria Muíña García September 30, 2023

A Spanish writer is being sued after misgendering a “non-binary” male on social media. Lucía Etxebarria, a Premio Nadal award-winning novelist and women’s rights advocate, may have to pay 11,000 Euros (approx. $11,600 USD) to LGBT activist Marcos Ventura Armas if the suit is successful.

Etxebarria first came to the attention of Ventura after posting about him on X (formerly Twitter) in 2020. In the post, which is now the primary matter of complaint in the lawsuit, Etxebarria stated that she “saw a man” when looking at photos of Ventura, who had gained some notoriety on Spanish-language X for his claim to being “non-binary” despite looking overtly masculine.

After receiving backlash for posting some photos of Ventura, Etxebarria wrote:

“I have just been told that it is ‘disgusting’ for me to show these PUBLIC photos of a PUBLIC office holder in a PUBLIC organization, and say that I see a man here. I would love to hear back from you: How many of you see a woman here? It is important to me,” she wrote.

Notably, claiming to be non-binary and taking offense to women referring to him as “male,” Ventura was officially introduced with “he/him” pronouns just weeks after Etxebarria’s post while accepting his position as the “municipal secretary” of La Guancha.

The 500-page lawsuit filed against Etxebarria also highlights other tweets she’s made about Ventura over the years, including one from May of 2022 in which she referred to him as having a “beard, penis, and testicles.”

In a sarcastic thread Etxebarria posted to X, she said: “Marcos Ventura Armas, who belongs to the FELGTBI, wanted to denounce me when I mistakenly stated that he was a man. Because, of course, she is a young non-binary trans woman.”

Ventura is known for being an active “militant” for the Spanish Socialist Party (PSOE) and, over the course of 10 years, has held various positions within the party and its branches.

He currently defines himself as a “political activist and for the rights of LGTBI people,” and has participated in working groups for the State Federation of Lesbians, Gays, Trans, Bisexuals and Intersexuals (FELGTBI). He has also held various positions in Gamá, a trans activist association based in Las Palmas de Gran Canaria.

In the lawsuit, Ventura says that Etxebarria referring to him as a “trans woman” was a “false claim” due to his non-binary status, also highlighting her repeat “misgendering.”

Ventura, who was diagnosed with “gender dysphoria” in 2021, states that he rejects “he/him” pronouns, and says he feels “diminished” when he is treated as a male.

Describing himself as “a non-binary trans person who uses feminine pronouns and grammatical gender to refer to himself,” Ventura also accuses Etxebarria of having damaged his “professional prestige as an activist” by repeatedly referring to him as a “trans woman.”

Etxebarria is now being called to appear at a court in Las Palmas de Gran Canaria, about 2,000 km from where she resides, to answer to the legal complaint. On September 29, Etxebarria launched a crowdfunding campaign to assist her with her immense legal costs, exceeding her goal in less than 24 hours after receiving a flood of international support.

Speaking to Reduxx, sources close to Etxebarria revealed that Ventura appears to have deliberately sought out a long-term, long-distance lawsuit with the intention of making the situation as expensive and difficult for Etxebarria as possible.

The sources also state that Ventura’s legal team appear to have combed through years of Etxebarria’s social media history, and have presented additional social media posts and videos from years ago in an effort to portray her as a bigot.

Ventura’s lawyer is known for taking on trans activist cases, and was previously involved in the Health Council case against psychologist Carola López Moya after she stated “trans women are male.” The Health Council sought to disqualify López from practicing for five years, and demanded a fine of 120,000 Euros (approx. $120,000 USD), but the case was ultimately dropped.

Reduxx approached López for comment on the lawsuit against Etxebarria, to which she stated that the author had her unequivocal support.

“We cannot let this doctrine cloud the reason of society,” López said. “We cannot renounce the truth to welcome lies under duress. All my support to Lucía Etxebarria.”