#the characters are all underwritten to shit

[chintzwife]

watching people be 'team black' or 'team green' is so incredibly annoying like this show is literally not about anything. what is this show about? 'teams'??????? guys im team 'hire a new writers room' this shit sucks

[cow-wizard]

well i was trying to explain my thoughts on veilguard but tumblr decided we weren't allowed to finish that post (maybe I'll return to my drafts at some point)

to keep it brief, my issue is that a Lot of the flavor got squeezed out and stripped away in favor of supposedly "new" ideas. but things like the Gloom Howler and the Nadas Dirthalen do have direct parallels in previous games and we're just...not gonna talk about them, for some reason

I don't think "is it a good dragon age game" is a useful question because it either is dragon age or not. To me it doesn't feel like dragon age, and I have plenty of thoughts on why, but I also don't feel like being overly critical because I'd rather think about what I like

[villainvillain]

"literally why do people like the dancestors, all but two of them are boring one-note stereotypes entirely irrelevant to the story" < worlds most boring homestuck fan

[cherrybomb107]

“I like that Arcane doesn’t spoon feed us everything.” “Show don’t tell”. Whenever I see comments like this in response to critiques about this season, I get confused. How much has to happen offscreen or be completely glossed over via music video montage before we call a spade a spade and say certain things were underwritten?

“Show don’t tell” they did neither!!! We weren’t shown any meaningful scenes of Vi’s pit fighter era. We weren’t shown Ekko and Jinx working together to rebuild Jinx’s weapons and make their new outfits. We weren’t shown any hints as to Maddie having been a Noxian spy(no, the fact that y’all hated her from jump means nothing). We weren’t shown Caitlyn showing genuine remorse for her actions and ever growing distrust of Ambessa(micro expressions can only account for so much). We weren’t shown Ekko meaningfully interacting with the Firelights. We weren’t shown Vi and Jinx having a genuine conversation (and they have a LOT of shit to talk about) and I could keep going.

I love the show, I swear I do, but there’s a big difference between subtlety and things happening out of nowhere. It’s not “spoon feeding” for the show to let us SEE characters develop organically, and not via montage. We are watching a television SHOW after all, so yes, I expect certain things to be shown to us rather than told. “Show don’t tell” but they did a hell of a whole lot more telling than they did showing this time around. This is just my opinion of course

[deeplovelydark]

the thing with ds9 is that you have to put in the mental work to really enjoy it. it does a lot of great stuff but it also makes a shit ton of inconsistent bizarre decisions that unfortunately create so much potential that you're sucked into this game of interpretation against your will. like, objectively, what the fuck were they doing with julian's character. jadzia is terribly underwritten. why do sisko and bashir almost never interact. why are there almost no relationships between women that get the screen time and depth they deserve. jadzia being fridged. etc. etc. and yet somehow the things the show actually does well, together will all these loose threads and inconsistencies create a rich and fascinating space for interpretation. like half of what makes ds9 great isn't in the text. it's in the space between words. it's in the possibilities the text generates.

[desecrated-guacamole]

I know I’m *checks watch* twelve years late coming to this realization, and two years late to talking about it when it would’ve been at all relevant, but godDAMN

Young Justice wastes NO time being good after season 1. The producers really just said “hey, y’know all the characters and relationships you’ve loved seeing develop for the past 26 episodes? Well actually, fuck that, fuck them, and fuck you! Everything’s different now, everyone’s developed in new ways that you won’t get to see, but not even in a way that makes sense for a FIVE YEAR TIME-JUMP!”

Take Robin for example; in the five years that take place offscreen, Dick becomes Nightwing, Batman recruits Jason Todd as the new Robin, Jason Todd gets killed, and Batman recruits Tim Drake as the new-new Robin (oh and also Barbara Gordon becomes Batgirl). I love the Batfamily, but I can barely call it the Batfamily when we don’t ever actually see them becoming a fucking family! We don’t get to see Dick struggle with his mentor’s legacy, we don’t see Jason struggle to live up to the Robin that came before, or Barbara picking up crime fighting despite what Bruce tells her to do because fuck that guy. We don’t get to see any of them grieve Jason, we don’t get to see Bruce go off the deep-end, only to be brought back by a young Tim Drake, who shows him what makes Batman, well, Batman; helping those in need, saving people.

INSTEAD, we’re introduced to two characters we knew that are now wildly different with ZERO explanation as to why, and one that we’ve never seen before and is (so far in my watch) severely underwritten, but because they’re the characters we love from the comics we’re supposed to love them here. It’s using the iconography of the characters to get us invested without putting in any of the actual work DEVELOPING them as people. It’d be one thing if this was the first time we met any of them, but we’ve already been introduced to Barbara, and we’ve spent an entire season with Dick, but now both of them have undergone massive development we aren’t made privy to.

I read an interview with Greg Weisman talking about the time jump, and he says this;

“We wanted a big time jump between the first two seasons to truly illustrate what our series was about, i.e. GROWING UP. After that, honestly, it’s more about what feels right. There are always things we want to skip, so that they become reveals.”

Man, I wonder if maybe allowing the audience to actually watch the characters grow and change might illustrate that growing up thing better than just skipping ahead so you can make it a reveal??? Imagine a show where we get to see these characters grow up together, maybe even grow apart, some leave, some stay, some are replaced, some come back. Like, imagine getting to see Dick reckon with the fact that Batman REPLACED HIM, only to watch that replacement die! Imagine getting to see Tim Drake come to Dick for advice, instead of just skipping ahead to the point that they’re already an established team. Imagine getting to see M’gann help Gar learn to use his powers for the first time. Imagine the team throwing a goodbye party for Wally and Artemis! Imagine seeing Wally and Artemis continue to develop their relationship instead of just jumping to them being fully moved in and together! WE WERE ROBBED!!

Like I’m still gonna watch it (not in the least because my roommate’s already seen it) but I need everyone to know I’m doing it under duress. I love these characters, and they did not deserve this lazy bullshit. I do not understand how Greg Weisman made Spectacular Spider-Man because HOLY SHIT the writing decisions made on this show are pissing me off, and don’t even get me STARTED ON CONNOR AND M’GANN BECAUSE WHAT THE FU

[mutalieju]

Finished Paul Jenkins run of Hellblazer on this reread.

It's... Okay? It has some great moments for sure (Constantine shitting out his alcoholism and guilt in a public toilet to make a clone of himself was great, the issue about John being an unreliable narrator was good... in general lot of the single issue stories are good like the one where john spirals because he accidentally killed his girlfriend's pet fish and hallucinates plane crashes etc, catastrophizing about it. )

Sean Phillip's art is good, Warren Pleece's less so, not enough gross and interesting visuals, no trippy disturbing imagery for the most part. Some of the stuff a more... experimental artist could have done more with. I feel like Pleece's caricaturish art style especially really undersold some of the body horror for example with the ghost with a hole in her head etc.

Dani is underutilized and underwritten, unfortunately. Jenkins does approach the racist aspects of british national identity in an earlier issue with the black woman who is not welcome in the fantasyland of british folklore but then it just doesn't come up with Dani at all until they visit her family in the US.

Underutilizing Dani is one of jenkins's main sins in this run tbh...

Just in general Jenkins has the tendency to play it safe so it doesn't take any big swings. Like lot of the time when white writers have talked about racism in Hellblazer it has been Bad but at least it was trying, even if it fell on its face. Jenkins on the other hand loves to play with concepts like royal bloodlines having mythical properties without stopping to consider the implications, all the while having supposedly sympathetic characters throwing slightly racist jokes around.

The same thing with female characters too. Apart from its nasty treatment of Ellie (which is bad!) the misogyny tends to be more subtle and come in the form of sidelining female characters, especially when it revisits older storylines.

It's still certainly better than most new 52 stuff John has been involved in. I liked how Jenkins wrote John's relationships with kids and how his guilt over Astra influences them. I really liked him becoming a godfather and being horrified by the responsibility.

I liked some arcs. I think Critical Mass is still my favourite of his.

It's nice to tie up the Astra stuff for sure and I enjoy the tone of the arc where it's hopeless most of the time including at the end despite handing out John a massive victory and bringing the Newcastle thing to a close.

As far as the supporting cast goes I enjoyed the guy who was addicted to personalities and summoning famous dead people to get possessed by them and also the epileptic grandma.

The run ends pretty weakly with a literal deus ex machina and while I think it works well especially as a setup for the next writer to take over it's not really earned.

[badgalsasuke]

Can we talk about the type of Sasuke stans that are anti naruto/sns and they're always either het self inserts who ships with him with karin/sakura/other made up het rare pair from some variation of Konoha 12 (sasuhina has quite a following, even from Sasuke stans who prided themselves in 'understanding his character' and I cant wrap my head around it bruh) and pulled a nonexistent dynamic out of their ass (usually stealing from sns), or they only like him with taka cause the characters there has no personal motivations/arc beyond just serving him lmao. The second one reminds me of naruto stans who thinks that "only Hinata/Gaara/Shikamaru deserves him" for the exact same reason as those taka stans. They think a good ship is when one character is underdeveloped and is written purely just to assist their favorite characters and nothing exciting ever happens, no challenges whatsoever. SNS constantly butting heads, confronting each other's narrative and perspective and still knowing and understanding each other best despite all of that, which essentially makes them the most significant bond for each other and in the whole anime too is exactly what makes SNS superior.

The character stans who hated this are too wrapped up in their bias to get that the entire point of Kishimoto's writing lies in the power of cooperation, empathy, and understanding each other to move forward. Sure, you may critique that in the end, SNS might make some of the most prominent ideals of sasuke's character became sidelined and not written properly such as the revolution and justice for uchihas (by destroying Konoha). But let's talk about how those ideals were never written clearly in the first place as well? Kishi wrote in great details how the uchihas were receiving injustice all the way from the time of Madara because of the special power that they wield, and how hate, mistrust, bigotry, and lack of empathy and understanding from Konoha's leaders and villagers continues to foster it all the way to the third's era when the clan were considering a coup. The genocide ordered by the state was awful but Kishimoto also never really written what the solutions/alternative system is to this corrupt shinobi system of Konoha. It might uncover all the truths of a hyper millitaristic cop state which might be too bleak for a Shonen, fine. But why does the blame from those pro sasuke only lies on SNS? The VOTE2 fight and confrontation arc only seeks for Sasuke finally reconnect with light and gentleness in him so that he doesn't wallow in darkness for years and became a lone false messiah like Madara. All the failures of promises of justices that came afterwards, in blank era/gaiden/boruto is justified to be criticised. But like you said in your post about the ending, it does fall in line with the theme of farce facade of conformity.

They think a good ship is when one character is underdeveloped and is written purely just to assist their favorite characters and nothing exciting ever happens, no challenges whatsoever.

Yeah, this is basically it. People ship boring underwritten shit in the name of wholesomeness and call anything else toxic & problematic, what a boring shallow way of engaging with characters and their dynamics with each other.

The genocide ordered by the state was awful but Kishimoto also never really written what the solutions/alternative system is to this corrupt shinobi system of Konoha. It might uncover all the truths of a hyper millitaristic cop state which might be too bleak for a Shonen, fine.

Another blog once pointed out that sometimes Kishimoto's seinen proclivities would appear in his writing of Naruto and I think this is one of those cases. He could never delve deeper into the aspects of Konoha being a military state that commits genocide against its own people to keep the rest in line because 1. He had no time 2. Konoha was not established as an evil state at the beginning. Sure, the people of Konoha isolated Naruto but it's not presented as a systemic issue but rather an individual failure of Naruto who later had to prove himself 3. You'd have to change Naruto's dream of becoming hokage if you then want to depict Konoha (and the Shinobi system as a whole) as an oppresive entity and the editors were never gonna allow that, from a marketing point Naruto saying he was going to become Hokage had already turned into an anchor for the series, that's what the audience expected 4. As you said, this is a shonen. Issues presented in the series are presented as individual failures rather than systemic oppression to keep the writing more simple for a young audience, hence why so many don't think of the Uchiha massacre as genocide, so technically Naruto should've been able to solve everything once he becomes hokage because that's what happens in shonen stories, the hero saves the world, period. If the manga was a seinen maybe Kishimoto would've written Naruto trying to combat the webs of corruption in a more complex way. But at the end of the day neither of these scenarios happened because Kishimoto no longer gave a fuck about the series so he just wrote a disillusioned adult Naruto which is surprisingly realistic.

But why does the blame from those pro sasuke only lies on SNS? The VOTE2 fight and confrontation arc only seeks for Sasuke finally reconnect with light and gentleness in him so that he doesn't wallow in darkness for years and became a lone false messiah like Madara

Because those Sasuke stans either self-insert onto Sasuke or ship themselves with Sasuke and expected their fanfictions to be true. They hate Naruto in the same way Sasusaku shippers hate him, he interferes with their fantasies, these particular Sasuke stans just believe they don't self-insert and aren't like the rest of the fandom and instead are more "objective" because they developed a superiority complex. That's why they're always coming up with half-assed "analyses" on Naruto calling him a narcissist and an oppressor and how he is complicit in Sasuke's oppression and that he's selfish and doesn't give a fuck about Sasuke's trauma and just wants to force his ideals on him and all that (mind you, they never acknowledge Naruto's own trauma, grooming and brainwashing from Konoha).

Sasuke stans are completely arbitrary on their morality tests. Sasuke is allowed to be an imperfect victim but Naruto isn't. Sasuke is allowed to have messed up reactions to his own trauma but Naruto isn't. Sasuke is allowed to shove in Naruto's face he's always been an orphan, he's never had anyone and that his kagebunshin jutsu is a coping mechanism for his loneliness (fucked up things to say to an orphan but is understandable because Sasuke himself was having a breakdown) but Naruto is not allowed to say to Sasuke he's gonna break his bones to stop him from going to Orochimaru, mind you, Naruto wanted to stop Sasuke from going to a groomer but Sasuke stans act like he was stopping Sasuke from initiating a communist revolution...

[lurkingshan]

Just saw your tags on turtle’s post and would love to hear more of your thoughts on Cheum

Oh, boy. Okay, I guess we’re doing this. So, when I think about Cheum I am usually making this face.

And embodying Oprah what is the truth.gif, because I think she is incredibly underwritten to the point of incomprehensibility. I think the term I used with @so-much-yet-to-learn to describe the writing for Cheum was "a void of characterization.”

By which I mean, I don't understand anything about her. I don't know what she wants or what she cares about. I don't know anything about her relationship with April. I don't know why she is friends with these guys or which she has real bonds with, if any. I don't know why she does things or whether I am supposed to see her as a neutral observer, a voice of reason, or another chaotic shit stirrer. I've seen some confusing messages from the creators about her that don't track with what I'm seeing on screen, so I find it hard to parse their intent versus the impact of what she is actually doing in the story.

But what I can tell you is that based on what I've seen, I don't like or respect her, and I certainly don't see her as in any way better or above the other characters in this story. Let me sum up what we've seen of Cheum over the course of the story:

She is mean to her friends, making lots of catty, passive aggressive remarks that dig at their sore points and taking sides against each of them on a whim

She pushes Mew to date Top and then to forgive him for cheating, to the point of ignoring Mew's stated wishes to conspire to help Top get back into his space

She somehow makes Ray nearly getting arrested all about her and in general gets overly involved in the boys' drama before turning around and berating them for causing her stress

She is judgmental and shaming about gay sex, making Boston out to be a predator for having a lot of sex and leveling a homophobic attack against him by claiming he took advantage of her "straight" brother

She lacks grace and humility and doesn't admit it or apologize when she is wrong, sticking to her bias against all evidence

And we have seen precious little in terms of positive attributes to balance this. We haven't seen her show up for any of the boys as a true or loyal friend. She seems reasonably good at school and conscientious about the hostel project, but we don’t get much there either. She's not even fun! Her function in the story is to be an antagonist to each of the boys in turn, even as the narrative seems to sometimes be suggesting that she is outside the drama.

It all reads very confused to me, and I can't say with any certainty how much of it is intentional and how much is just failures of writing and editing. She's not getting enough screen time for a confident read on who she is, and what she does get feels half-baked. At this point, I think it's safe to say Cheum is just a poorly executed character who has little purpose besides being the token lesbian in the friend group.

[izziessogay]

I really didn't like how arcane ended and I wasn't going to speak on it, but I have to get it out.

personally I relate to Vi, not only as a butch lesbian, but also as an older sister and as someone who is easily taken advantage of at the promise of comfort.

jinx's death shattered me, and trust me I am familiar with tragic character deaths, this is different. she stood for something. she stood for traumatized and mentally ill people, for survivors of abuse, people with bpd and so on, she was flawed throughout the show but she was not villified (imo). they showed her experience as a real human experience that deserves compassion. killing her reinforced the belief that suicide makes suicidal people happy, it doesn't. death isn't happy, nobody was relieved by this sacrifice, and you would know that if you have ever been in a place like that, known someone or even lost someone, because of this shit. my wife deeply related to jinx, the trauma she had, the things she was battling and all that still not making her irredeemably evil. this character is supposed to show that you can struggle and be alone and miserable and that you can get better despite that, that you deserve to get another go at life, no matter your flaws. arcane did that, up until the last act. my only sister is a teenager, who every day battles with things she gets minimal support for, I live far away and often feel helpless. jinx both represents my wife and my sister to me, the people I love most in this world. her ending feels like a huge fuck you, 'haha, you thought there was hope? actually struggling teens should just kill themselves semi heroically, because we don't want to deal with their antics'. even if they are hinting at her surviving none of this changes, they killed her socially still, when she was meant to be with her community, to build herself up again, to find her family (other people have said more eloquent things about all of this, check them out).

I have more issues with the finale, but over all I think that all the story lines needed more time.

I didn't quite get what happened with Mel and what the black rose even was, but I didn't care much about her character, so maybe I missed some things, I think she turned out the best in the end.

Ekko seemed to only have one purpose, which was to save. other than that he didn't get much character development. people are praising him for being the best, but I fear that might be because he's awfully underwritten and doesn't have much about him, other than him saving the main characters. Even his alternate universe escapade didn't give us an insight on him, more on Powder. His power wasn't explained well, especially when he broke the four second mark without any consequences it seems. in general I can't pick out many flaws, which indicates a poorly written character.

I didn't mind astrally insane Victor to be the enemy of all, however Jayce's and his story took up too much of the final act for me. they didn't seem that relevant to me to be the turning axis of everything and as someone who doesn't care much about their ship I didn't get much out of that arc. it felt out of character for a show that had been about systemic oppression and family feuds and classism to have a conclusion of "imperfection is actually beautiful". that seemed redundant, all characters in the show have flaws and redeeming qualities, even someone like silco or ambessa. everybody who likes the show knows "imperfection is beautiful", it didn't feel like a satisfying conclusion for the viewer, even if victor might have had to hear it. ON TOP OF THAT we never actually got explained anything regarding Victor and his descent to evil and how the fuck that happened.

In the end nothing seemed like it had changed, Piltover is still oppressive, the only reason why they work with Zaun now is because they fought a common enemy once. Sevika (my beloved) gets looked down on in the council and as the only Undercity-member it's impossible for her to overturn a vote in Zauns favour. Cait is still a cop, not having changed anything about herself, Vi has nobody besides her, no family. Mel seems unhappy, Ekko is definitely unhappy and in a worse spot than before. I frankly don't care what happened to Jayce and Viktor, but their ending is the only one that would keep me on my toes for more. Which brings me to a hot take, possibly: I think we might have been queerbaited, hear me out. We got lesbians (which I am eternally grateful for), but thes were a thing since early season 1, after season one people started talking about Jayvik, which wasn't supposed to happen originally, but since it brought engagement they made their relationship a bigger part of the story. Possibly also the reason why Vi and Caits relationship seemed rather rushed and inorganic at the end. you can disagree with me on this.

Lastly I have to talk about Vi, a character that I couldn't relate to for most of season two, because it's been a while since I had to deal with situationships and breakups. All that made me overlook what Vi really stands for. She might seem hard and tough, but mostly she is looking for comfort, she loses people close to her constantly and is therefore constantly in search of another safe space. A safe space that is never really provided. Cait doesn't understand her trauma, her upbringing, her culture or her family, and she never bothers to understand it. She never shows remorse to what she did in the undercity, she never questions Piltover (only ambessa, an outsider). She never sees Jinx as someone who deserves redemption, she never sees why Vi is struggling, she never makes an effort to care about her past and her experiences. You might wonder why Vi still is with her, but it's honestly obvious enough, it's because she doesn't have anyone else left. Cait at least loves her for her personality or her looks or whatever, and that's more than anybody else loves her. I hated that they put her back with Cait in Piltover, it seems very abusive to me, considering what we know of Cait (she might be different now, but we never get to see any of that, so I'm assuming freely). Vi will take anything and everything to make herself get some comfort, however toxic that behaviour may be. I see that as the reason why she folds so easily whenever Cait shows interest and forgives immediately. She didn't find well deserved peace in the end with Jinx (and Cait), she got "good enough for now". Nothing was addressed, nothing changed. AND JUST TO CLARIFY I AM HAPPY ABOUT THE LESBIAN REPRESENTATION AND I AM VERY GLAD WE GOT IT, OVERALL I THINK THEIR RELATIONSHIP WAS VERY INTERESTING TO WATCH. JUST LIKE THE REST OF THE SHOW I DIDN'T LIKE THE END.

For a show that was about the people, we got horrifyingly little people focused resolutions. The last burial we see was Rictus, but dozens of people die after him. We didn't talk about Isha, we didn't talk about Jinx, Ekko wasnt even allowed to get a word in after he deus ex machina saved everything. Sevika didn't get any conclusion. Mel seems on the same path as her mother. Jayce and Viktor are to my knowledge still astral projecting through space. Cait never learned compassion with Zaunites. Vander couldn't be saved. An unsatisfying end.

Tldr:

- Jinx's death was bad, mentally ill people should be saved and their illness shouldn't be glorified over them

- none of the story lines seem finished and rushed to an end

- Viktor and Jayce's story felt overpowering and took away from a story about oppression and sisterhood

- in the end nothing changed

- my butch dyke/older sister heart that can be manipulated quite easily too hurts for Vi

- I didn't like it 🍅🍅🍅

[butchreyes]

911ls tag game!

thanks for the tags @reyesstrand @strandnreyes and @carlossreaders <3

favorite character — i have many loves but carlos is the little bug under my microscope that i poke with sticks <3

character you relate to the most — tk, because i am so small and yet the world is so cruel to me. yet i persevere!!!!

favorite episode(s) — 2.09, 4.11, 3.05, 4.04, 3.08, and 5.07 all jump to mind!

hottest take — i love both the iris reveal and tarlos adopting jonah, and i think they're both great moments for carlos that really highlight his flaws and complexity as well as his growth. to that point: sometimes moments that seem inconsistent are the most human moments of all. we are strange and fickle creatures!

favorite og character — evan buckley owns my heart and soul. #JusticeForBuckTommy

favorite ship — must i even say it?? i'm literally an employee at the tarlos factory. i got my bachelor's in tarlos.

most underrated ship — listen i would say nancymateo because they are special To Me but i'm not delusional, i know they're underwritten and not everyone's cup of tea. however it is a crime that we aren't all clocking in with 30k gracejudd aus and horny essays about judd's massive hands. we have GOT to get weirder about gracejudd!!

one(?) thing you'd love to see — i know it's too late for any of these, but some things i would have liked to see are: more tk flashbacks (i am fascinated by his lore and there's just so much we still don't know), lorraine feature, nancy flashback episode where brianna baker plays kid!nancy but all the other kids are played by children, a waco inspired religious cult arc, and tk and carlos having a real good snuggle.

not this being a literal novel. oh well y'all know me i have shit to say!! you've only scratched the surface of my rich inner world.

leaving an open tag for anyone who wants to do this (YES I AM TALKING TO YOU) because i'm late as usual. (i moved today and have been struggling with the associated horrors.)

[nihiltism]

huh before I continue that ramble I noticed that there Is in fact a genre of character where I do not give much of a shit about them until I look closer and go "oh you were just written terribly and predisposed for me to not give a shit about you. the way you're underwritten could even be thematic if it were at all intentional. okay come here." and nurse them to good characterdom in my own mind like a mangy cat I found on the side of the road. also all three of them right now are from square enix properties. and I have only played 2.5 square enix properties. thanks squenix

[msfbgraves]

I think the reason Terry and Daniel has this insane chemistry in their limited scenes together is because of TIG.

TIG clearly has a certain fondness for the character of Daniel. In multiple interviews he cannot help but bring up Daniel even when Daniel is not being talked about or referenced. TIG also absolutely loves the character of Terry, and has a blast getting to play him. Put these two loves together and bam! It’s like a magic potion.

Let’s be real. TIG never talks about any other character the way he talks about Daniel (and Terry of course). He has chemistry with Kreese too, but it’s no where near the level he has with Daniel. Again, this bleeds over from his fondness for Daniel as a whole. And perhaps even his liking of working with Ralph. The man is like an Irish Wolfhound when talking about cat-coded Ralph and it’s amusing to watch.

For whatever reason, Danny boy is special to TIG. It makes me wonder how much of Terry’s obsession with Daniel was as ad libbed by TIG himself. After all, the man is a screenwriter himself. He knows nuance and subtlety and what tone and gesture and eyes can convey better than many. He knows what he’s doing, I am certain.

I feel as if someone were to ask TIG who his favorite character was (he couldn’t choose Terry)—he would readily say Daniel.

Even though they share a limited number of moments together, it’s interesting how much weight and meaning their interactions have, and why they often steal the show—and TIG himself steals all the scenes he’s in.

Whatever it is, I love it. TIG is just fantastic. No wonder he’s stupid popular.

Is he stupid popular? If so, huzzah - I'm out of the loop on regular popularity of CK characters.

I basically agree with all of it. The Karate Kid part III, Thomas' first ever film role with him as an absolute nobody whose main function was to antagonise Ralph, who was famous enough to have been asked to present Academy Awards, that must mean something to him. And he got to dominate his character, which must be odd as Ralph had quite a lot of clout on set, and could have stopped him, no problem. He was famously unhappy on that set, and could have made life very difficult for Thomas, but he didn't. And he obviously shouldn't have from an interpersonal standpoint, but this was the 80's and he was the lead, he could have Thomas regulated to the back of the room if he wanted to and he did not. That must mean something. Also there was no script, this was all ad libbed. And that makes for... some kids' film, alright, but it really also makes Terry Thomas' character. And he liked him so much he wrote a whole film about him, Excessive Force.

And you see, what I respect so much about TIG as a writer is that he respects what people actually do, not what people fantasise about. I find his girlfriend in Excessive Force rather underwritten, but in a shootout where they both are present they give her a gun. Because even though men like to see the cowering girlfriend they can rescue that is not what people in these situations do. If there's two of you and you have a spare gun you give her a gun too. Because you want to live. And he's kept doing that when he had the chance. If he has to play an action hero he writes one who thinks. If he's going to write a jealous, abusive piece of shit called Gus Travis, he's jealous and abusive because he's notably insecure. Because his girlfriend is actively trying to leave him, because they have a shitty relationship, but there is nonverbal communication and history between them. She's not just there to look scared. Because irl women aren't sexy lamps.

I'm sure he wouldn't have written a miracle cure for Miguel because there are no miracle cures for broken vertibrae. And it doesn't matter to him that the writers don't want to write how hard it would have been for Miguel to learn to walk again, let alone fight. So with Terry, yes, I am quite convinced he does his utmost to keep Terry human and it shows. It makes sense for Terry Silver to channel all his martial arts knowledge into other pursuits. When Kreese is ranting about some teenager "slighting" him, he has zero patience for that nonsense. He's off his rocker, but he's still an adult. He actually gives the Cobra Kai kids some good advice! When he talks to "Sensei Joe", he recognises that the man is teaching Tory well, and later, they have a very measured conversation about them working together. Because that makes the outbursts scarier. And Daniel. Omg. Half their interactions are body language only. But there is an obvious contrast to how Terry is with most people and how he is with Daniel. He is NOT NORMAL around him. Ever. In any interaction. At the very mention of his name he goes from: "FFS, Kreese, get off my balcony, I am so done with your spiel" to "... Danny Boiii?" And given how deeply in love the writers are with Kreese, and how completely different the dynamic between John and Twig is as opposed to Kreese and Silver, that has to be TIG not having any of that. He wrote Terry first, and sure he'll throw in a line about Johnny Lawrence if he must, but that's as far as he'll go. I loved the "WHY...?!" when Johnny stepped in to defend Kreese. Because that doesn't make any sense irl. Kreese tried to kill him over a lost All Valley. Kreese stole his dojo, his business. Kreese nearly killed him again. Also, Terry already beat him to a pulp twice. I'm a decent chess player but with a ranking of 1600 you don't play someone who ranks 2500 you'll get pummeled, and you certainly don't do it again and expect to win, that's insane. Johnny isn't a good enough fighter, going by their last two encounters. So WHY? indeed.

And for TIG to step into a silly karate show that is completely centered on Johnny and Kreese and say "actually, Terry was in a twisted relationship with Daniel and that's what I'm playing, Kreese is simply no longer a factor to him" and to pull that off... and to also say, "btw, I'm going to react like a person would to whatever is put in front of Terry, not how you think the world should be" that's a stupendous achievement. I mean they wrote in a whole subplot where Twig is deeply jealous of Johnny Lawrence and TIG was like: "whatever. This person is so far beneath his notice it's subterranian and will anybody point out he is an awful parent? No. Then I will, and that'll be the end of that storyline" and they let him. That doesn't happen! The whole crew of GOT tried to stage an insurrection and was told: "You're dumb actors, say the lines", Marty and Billy tried to petition the writers about Kreese and Johnny being OOC and got nowhere, Ralph needed 1,5 seasons to be allowed to play Daniel LaRusso, instead of a snivelling charicature and TIG comes in with: "That stuff you've written for my character? I'll take what I want from that, and you'll thank me for it, and that's all you get. BTW, where's Ralph?" and they let him!

Legend.

[sarucane]

This is an under-caffeinated OFMD rant about how awesome I think it is that Ed and Stede aren't obsessed with each other, and aren't particularly protective of each other.

I see this obsession/protectiveness narrative around a lot, and want to state up front that as far as headcanon goes you do you, but I just don't see compelling evidence for this interpretation in the show itself.

People talk about how Stede burned a whole ship of aristocrats because they made Ed sad, but Stede barely pays attention to Ed's reaction when the fire is lit. Stede's hatred of the aristocrats was rooted in how they treated him, which dug up old traumas and frustrations we see rise every time Stede faces people from his old world. And just today I saw someone say that Ned Lowe signed his own death sentence by Stede's hand when he poked Ed with the bow, and it's true that Stede's provoked to start the execution by Ned shit-talking Ed--but Stede kills Ned in spite of Ed, and he lists a bunch of reasons for killing Ned that have nothing at all to do with Ed.

Ed absolutely is sometimes protective of Stede, but it's not a universal thing. He steps in front of the firing squad in Act of Grace, but a few minutes later Chauncey's waving his sword at Stede and Ed steps back. When Ned Lowe attacks and they don't know what's happening, Ed does cover Stede, and he does swear vengeance when Ned hurts Stede--but Ed then point-blank refuses to kill Ned. In the next episode, Ed warns Stede that someone's going to try to kill him, then fucks off.

And as far as obsession goes: there are times when they hyper-focus on each other, like when Ed is thinking about leaving and Stede ignores the oranges problem, and when Ed suggests the run off to China. But there are many more moments throughout the season when the boys choose not to be in one another's company. They spend time together sometimes, and they don't sometimes, and there's nothing suggesting they're "always" obsessively thinking about each other. Often, yes, but not always.

And that "often" is where I get into why I actually love this. Ed and Stede aren't obsessed with each other because they're both fully-realized characters. They have complex motivations related to themselves and to one another, and they exist in a web of relationships, some entirely independent of their significant other. They have rich internal lives of which their romantic connection is one element. One that is extremely important, that is a sometimes overriding and often pivotal element--but still, one.

This love story is really different from just about anything else out there. So many love stories have 1 complex character and 1 love interest; have two characters who are focused only on each other. In a story like that, Ed killing himself would have been "because of Stede," not because of several factors of which Stede was one. Stede would have lost it completely when he found out the Revenge crew had murdered Ed, and again when Ed was voted off the boat. And if they were hyper-protective of each other, they would have been unable to go into battle together. This love story has space in it for two protagonists, and it feels real and honest in a way most TV love stories don't.

At the end of s2, Ed and Stede open an inn. It's not a place where Ed and Stede will be alone together, it's a place where many different people will come and go. Stede is giving up the sea for Ed, but while it's a serious sacrifice (that is very underwritten), his life isn't going to be just about Ed. They're taking steps on the paths of lives where a key pillar will be their relationship with one another, but that will have space for many other stories.

[melrosing]

ngl jace's feelings kinda came out of nowhere cuz like in s1 he seemed to understand harwin was his biodad and reassured luke that it didn't matter what people said about them, but suddenly he's furious with rhaenyra and is insecure? i know the watsonian explanation is they needed him to hate the dragonseeds for whatever reason but there was absolutely nothing indicating jace ever had these insecurities. he had only been frustrated with rhaenyra coddling him. what gives?

I think it would’ve been fine if in peacetime where his inheritance feels like some distant thing he puts it to the back of his mind and yet in wartime it feels urgent and disturbing and consumes his thoughts, but I do feel they failed to show the journey between point A and point B. the problem w hotd s2 for me has been they haven’t really been showing effective character or plot development, there’s a lot of telling and not a lot of showing and it doesn’t make up for all the times the characters have felt static and unresponsive to the situations surrounding them. and Jace is v symptomatic of that imo. they are trying which is more than I can say for D&D who thought skipping over character development was a clever sleight of hand so that when the character did something wildly OOC they could say ‘aren’t you surprised!!’

but I think the hotd team have one thing really working against them here and that is that the source material requires them to make shit up, and so naturally results in audiences drawing contrast with GRRM’s own character craft in his main series. in F&B the characters largely lack arcs or interiority, and it’s meant to read like a history rather than a story, so the hotd team don’t have the character templates that D&D did (and still managed to fuck up lol) and lack a plot with appropriate arcs and beats. so they have to change a lot. but ASOIAF is known for its remarkable character work and plot twists and GRRM is a generational talent and you’d need some pretty strong writers to pull off something that measures up or even comes close. and I think the craft has been way off this season so. now we have characters like Jace who just feel like every interesting thing about them has come too late and underwritten at that

[drsp00n]

Enough time has passed and everyone's wrote their thought pieces about it so I'm gonna chip in with a little bit of my own.

NMH3 is kind of ass in spite of its limitations, not because of them. The priorities are all over the place.

The gameplay loop becomes incredibly repetitive very quickly. I've seen people try to play word games about the semantics of a hallway of enemies across multiple screens being the exact same as a gauntlet in one room, but at least the fucking environment changes instead of being the exact maybe 8 rooms over the course of 100 possible battles.

There's little in the realm of unlocks. You can play the game start to finish without even touching the chip crafting system or the stats tree. No new moves, death glove chips or weapons. All you really need is to raise your attack to deal with the same enemies with just a larger health pool later in the game. Your kit doesn't change from start to finish.

The open world does fucking nothing for me. You could have made one map with less to explore but more to interact with, instead of five barren and flat maps with nothing to do. I know why this is, but I'll get to that in a bit.

The narrative is significantly weaker than TSA which is a huge shame. I'm imagining that they didn't want the characters to be so wordy in fully voice acted cutscenes like they were in TSA, but I would have loved to see more of the IBM style cutscenes if it meant getting to know more about the characters. Everyone just feels so underwritten so you have to fill in the blanks with your own preconceived notions and the stereotypes they're supposed to convey, something people give NMH2 shit for doing with its characters.

Fu and Damon are NOT compelling characters, one's a brat and the other one is a boring evil CEO archetype. They have zero depth, and for the time that they do give them on screen, all they do is bitch about Travis or everyone around them. Travis doesn't seem even interested in either of them beyond killing them for being annoying. Badman was just fridged to establish Fu as a threat, as if fucking killing every single civilian wasn't enough.

The stuff with Henry could have been interesting if the story had given it any kind of significance or time to breathe. I'm with Travis on that one, I really don't fucking care anymore. There's a giant space alien ship up there dude, that seems a little more important right now than our sad crybaby backstory that will go nowhere because NMH4 is never getting made.

And lastly, I think this game is the most suffocated by all the pop culture references. The premise of the game is a reference, the intro of the game is a reference, many of the bosses, side missions and characters are references, the final boss is a reference. All of this is cool in small bits, but it makes me feel like NMH3 has no real identity of it's own. Which leads me to this conclusion:

Suda should really have doubled down and made something weird and different again. Instead we got a game that is flanderizing No More Heroes itself. People like the open world of 1, boom, open world. People hated the combat of TSA, here's 100 fights. Look, it's the mowing grass minigame. Look, it's Destroyman. Look, it's Henry. Look it's a Marvel reference. Look, it's a Miike reference.

It just feels like the weakest of all the games to me. It tries to do a lot, and what it does is not very good. I don't hate it, I've beaten it a couple of times. I just feel like it wasted a lot of it's potential appealing to the loud majority instead of just being a smaller but better experience, but that's just me.