#the SW sequels suck

[skywalker-thoughts]

Still can't believe we're in 2023 and we're going to get another SW movie with Rey instead of the Thrawn trilogy

[short-wooloo]

People gripe about new SW shows contradicting/retconning lower canon material (not a new thing, this is how it's always been), but you gotta understand it'll be worth it

Because one day something will wipe away that stupid Rise of Kylo Ren comic and its idiotic "akshully Ben Solo didn't kill Luke's students like the last two movies said he did, it was a magic lightening strike that instantly killed them all" thing

[varpusvaras]

Okay, you know what? No. I will not accept any supplemental materials for the sequel trilogy ever. I will not. I do not care if some book or comic or show or whatever is trying to explain anything about them. That's not how this is supposed to work. The prequel trilogy and the original trilogy worked as coherent stories in on themselves. Did the supplemental material make them even better? Yes. But you don't need to go through any of those to be able to understand what the hell is going on. So no, I will not accept any explanation for anything that comes from any material outside the movies. Absolutely not.

[computers-best-friend]

Watched the last Jedi for the first time since it came out and for psychological reasons I have convinced myself that it is a good movie and everything went exactly as I wanted it to 😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁

[traewilson]

Saw Quinton Reviews' side video talking about Star Wars and how the brand's strict dedication to continuity leads to past "mistaken" continuity gets snipped off, like Sebastian Shaw as Anakin Skywalker. It got me thinking: Star Wars, deep to its most primordial basic structure, isn't actually myth - that's the bones of the body of Star Wars. In its proverbial genes, its history, and even cursory knowledge of how George Lucas tells stories shows this. American Graffiti is the most obvious example of this, being a dramatization of Lucas' childhood experiences. Indiana Jones is another example (until the last one, anyway, but we don't talk about Dial of Destiny). The first three films are defined by the pop culture trends of the time they were set. The villains in 1940s serials were, naturally, Nazis, so the villains are Nazis in the Indy films set in the 40s. This commitment to historical accuracy does lead to problems, however - namely, another source of villainy in the 40s were racial stereotypes of tribal peoples. Cue Temple of Doom, and the cartoonishly bigoted portrayal of Indian people in that film. This is why Kingdom of the Crystal Skull is the way it is. In the 50s and 60s, the villains of American serials were the Soviets, so the villains are Russians. A chief obsession of that time was with aliens, so, like how religion was a big obsession in the 40s, aliens are a focus on Crystal Skull. Dial of Destiny partially failed because the filmmakers didn't engage with the series' formula, or rather, the executives didn't want Indiana Jones to deviate any further from what fans were nostalgic for. This results in a sort of bizarre feedback loop, where Indiana Jones is now referring back to ITS OWN PAST, ITS OWN HISTORY, rather than the actual history of the pop culture of the real world. The villains in the Indiana Jones films everybody likes are Nazis, so we're doing Nazis again.

Indiana Jones was on a trajectory where it would mirror the pop culture of the time period its set in. In the end, it abandoned this and gazed down its own navel, harkening back to the history of its own series, nonsensically contradicting the pop culture of the late 60s going into the 70s. Star Wars ran into a variant on this issue with continuity - with history.

Star Wars, of course, is obsessed with its own history. George Lucas himself was obsessed with the history of the Star Wars universe, at least the continuity of the films he made. The creators involved in the Expanded Universe were allowed to do their own thing, provided they didn't contradict his films, and with full knowledge their stories are only as canon as Lucas wanted them to be - which resulted in situations where stories about the Clone Wars pre-Prequels were essentially erased from existence because they, inadvertently, were inconvenient to a constantly revised history. To be clear, this isn't adjusting actual real life history, where it is a good idea to keep its narrative as accurate as possible. These are stories, fiction. And yet, creators and fanbase alike are as obsessed with the minutiae of Star Wars' history as the preacher is obsessed with the minutiae of the Bible and Biblical narratives.

This obsession with historical revisionism for a history that does not actually exist is resulting in the eradication of elements that are no longer convenient to its narrative. Sebastian Shaw as Anakin Skywalker, Clive Revill as the Emperor, all performances destined to become pop culture relics, only known by the most devoted of acolytes at the altar of Star Wars. I'd argue this started all the way back with Splinter of the Mind's Eye, the novel that was essentially George Lucas' backup concept for a Star Wars sequel if the first underperformed, realized. This novel is meaningless to the grand Star Wars continuity. An odd little curio; a peek into a future of the faith that could've been. I only know about it because I was obsessed with Star Wars as a kid. Less and less will know of it as time goes on, because it's basically a heretical text written in unwitting defiance of a constantly rewritten history. This eradication is deeply unfortunate, and actively works against Lucas' undeniable mythical inspirations for Star Wars. Myths are fluid, dynamic, ever-changing. Star Wars only changes as nostalgia and continuity so allow. This will be a BIG problem with Star Wars going forward - both the religious fanaticism of the fandom's strict devotion to their particular denomination of fandom faith (the Prequels are the best! The Originals are best! The Sequels are best! If you don't think that'll happen, I wouldn't bet on it.) and the strict devotion of the creators to the constantly changing, constantly eradicating, timeline of a world that is entirely fictional. Star Wars confines itself like this to its own detriment. Luke Skywalker won't be nostalgic for people forever. Anakin Skywalker won't be nostalgic forever, and in time, Rey won't be either. They will, gradually, over the course of time, become confined to the dustbin of history, along with Sebastian Shaw's Anakin, of Clive Revill's Emperor, as Splinter of the Mind's Eye, or Gennady Tartakovsky's Clone Wars miniseries. Some of this, of course, is the relentless march of time's fault, I get that. But the structure of Star Wars has grown to such an extent that stories are becoming harder and harder to write for it. You can't do too much; you absolutely cannot change Anakin's fate, or a different end for Luke that contradicts Last Jedi, or a British guy as Darth Vader's true self.

All this buildup to say George Miller and how he's handled the structure of the Mad Max franchise will give it a longer life, I feel, once its originator has passed on. George Miller is, frankly, a much better mythical storyteller than George Lucas. Anyone can be Max. Anyone can be Furiosa, or Immortan Joe, or Dementus, or Lord Humungus or the Doof Warrior or Aunty Entity. That's the beauty of this series; since anyone can be anyone, and hard facts are few and far between, this allows much more room for creative experimentation.

Anyway that's my ramble for tonight. I'm sure this will be a mess to get through, but it is a somewhat accurate picture of how I think. I'm a natural rambler. This is why Xwitter and I are not getting along lately.

[inquisitor-apologist]

Been getting back into my sequel trilogy bullshit (so many good Finn leads a Stormtrooper Rebellion fics out there) and honestly I don’t even think it’s that bad anymore? When I was younger I remember seeing so many videos about how the st was ‘the end of Star Wars’ and ‘the worst thing ever made’ but it’s just. Not that bad?

Like obviously the last Jedi was weird and very confused and more than a little racist in how it treated Finn and Poe but there were some decent ideas in there and Rose as a character was great. The force awakens was the same way—was it a good movie? Arguable. But was it a fun callback to a new hope with interesting new characters? Yeah. Even rise of skywalker, which thoroughly sucked, was somewhat entertaining, and I’m one of the sickos who actually liked the Rey Palpatine reveal.

Like obviously it could have been WAY better if they’d actually used some legends inspiration and had an actual idea for the story but it is what it is and I’m ok with it.

[servethelight]

There are certain parts of the Star Wars franchise I don’t like. It just doesn’t bring me the same kind of joy other projects do. I normally don’t comment on that online, because I’d rather like to discuss and connect with people about the things that bring me joy. However sometimes when I read the takes of some people who dislike the same things I wanna like those things out of pure spite because GODDAMN

[xxcringeizdead666xx]

I think I found out why I hate Rey so much.

it's cuz she's a bad charcater in a movie that claims to be a sequel to some movies that I love, and it has a huge budget, and like actual actors and sets and stuff, and adult people wrote it.

I swear, had Rise of Skywalker been a fanfiction written by an angsty preeteen crying under the covers at two AM because she's not liek other grills, it would either drown in better written fanfic or become a staple of society and have people fangirling over it like people do with My Immortal.

Rey's problem isn't that she's a Mary Sue. it's that she was written my adults.

[kaxtwenty]

Being a SW fan who prefers Rebels over TCW sucks because even when we get stuff it’s entirely filtered through projects that appeal mainly to TCW fans.

I mean for fuck’s sake a TCW character got to be the main character of the Rebels sequel.

[the-far-bright-center]

Disney SW fans who claim to love Anakin but think the Prequels suck, you're part of the problem. And the OT purists who hate the Prequels and then turn around and blame them for why Disney SW sucks...yeah, you're part of the problem too.

One of the many reasons the Disney SW 'Sequels' were so terrible and destructive was because the people making them decided to completely ignore the importance of the Prequels and reject them as an intrinsic part of the saga. And they seemed to believe they were pandering to 'what the fans wanted' by doing this. But the Prequels are half the entire story as Lucas told it, and they just threw it out the window. The Prequels COMPLETED the saga. But Disney pretended that the saga wasn't complete yet and that it was up to them to do so. Instead of just making 'interquel' material from the beginning (like Rogue One, etc), they arrogantly took it upon themselves to 'finish' a story that was already completed back in 2005. And in doing so, Disney also decided to reframe the saga into something decidedly lesser (a repetitive grimdark story where the cycle 'wasn't broken ackshually', instead of an uplifting and transcendent mythic fairytale), but one which would allow them to continue making 'new canon' material indefinitely (cause that is more lucrative for them). But the Prequels had already reframed the saga and given it a very specific meaning. Without the Prequels, ALL of Star Wars loses that meaning. And without a happy ending for the OT characters and an unequivocally positive resolution to the their storyline, the entire saga is rendered into a perpetual tragedy. So, unless and until so-called 'Star Wars fans' can acknowledge and embrace just how intrinsic the Prequels are to the fictional story they supposedly 'like', they will be running around in circles trying to blame Disney's failures on the very thing that Disney so carelessly ignored and discarded in the first place.

[grumfield]

Do u have a take of the sequel movies (besides that they just suck lol)

I have mannnnny thoughts and all of them chalk up to just being missed potential. Especially given that I was one of the people who saw an original test screening for Rise of Skywalker and that was…very…special… LFMAO. But without going too deep into “this would be a completely different story at this point” my main thoughts are like.

Everyone has a great setup to do something interesting with the story. The main thing they seemed to want to do in both Force Awakens and TLJ is was subvert expectations about what Star Wars is by using familiar aesthetics and I think that could’ve really been achieved if they weren’t Abrams Mystery Box’d. And really the way to do this specifically has to do with Rey and Finn.

Rey should have been nobody daughter of no one (obvious) and her story should NOT have been centered around becoming a jedi in the end but paving her own path to keep with the theme of not needing to be a Skywalker or a Jedi to be a hero in the galaxy to subvert the narrative demands that the Skywalker brand demands. She also should have gone off with Kylo at the end of the Last Jedi because his speech was really good for someone who’d been continually denied at the thing she was trying to get, and the third movie should have been dealing with the repercussions of that and have her eventually realize she doesn’t need to be a larger part of the myth narrative to make an impact. She is an incredibly powerful Force user but that wouldn’t decide her fate.

Secondly, Finn should have been a Jedi instead. Another obvious statement, but I think, again, playing into that subversion of expectations while still holding true to the themes of SW, having a storm trooper—someone faceless and in the background and narratively evil—become a Jedi is just SUCH a good choice and hammers home that again ANYONE can be a hero, but doing so in a way that supports his character and adds dimension to everything.

A theme of Star Wars has always been like, everyone is a hero, but it’s been culturally co-opted by the Skywalkers. I had naively assumed that they were going to push against this with how TLJ ended but imo if they’d even just, done these two things and not touched the otherwise mess of a plot, a lot things would’ve felt more satisfying even if they were crappy. But I guess it’s a tall order to ask them to both give a female character agency and intrigue and make a Black man a main character with good development

Also, they should’ve had the original trilogy cast all in the same room at least once + get together in the Falcon.

[asocial-skye]

This is in no way an endorsement of Palpatine, but the premise of his crimes is so weird to me.

Like, the most evil guy in existence's crimes are:

Using the power of his negative emotions to practice a cult religion

Puppeteering a war between two factions in the galaxy to install a takeover

Committing genocide

Installing himself as a monarch/dictator (they call him an Emperor, and he rules an empire; wouldn't he be a monarch?)

Assorted war crimes (i can't remember them all)

None of these things, except the first one, are things that literally any government on this planet hasn't done.

The US government? Puppeteered plenty of wars.

The US government? Has committed genocide.

The US government? Has committed plenty of war crimes in other wars with state approval.

The US may not have become an empire, but there are plenty of regimes in other countries and throughout history where rulers seize power and declare themselves rulers: Napoleon, Caesar, even more recently like the Kims of North Korea.

It's just so tragic. Modern government is the bad guy in the Star Wars prequels; the embodiment of modern government is literally cartoon evil. Isn't that lovely?

palpatine is just an embodiment of modern government.

[stellanslashgeode]

I feel there's a lot I love about the SW Sequel Trilogy, but I don't think I'll ever love it as much as the other eras. And I think it's because (besides Episode 8) it doesn't have as much to say. I eventually fell in love with the Prequel era, for instance, because there's so much stuff to unpack in that era. I think in their rush to hit that nostalgia spot they forgot to be about something. Episode 8 tries to course correct, but I think the original sin is what they did to the New Republic.

It's so frustrating to come to this series knowing how much the OT heroes had to sacrifice and how many died just to have the New Republic get unceremoniously blown up from the jump. I'm okay with the New Republic struggling at maintaining the peace but make that part of the drama. Make you care about its health, don't just unceremoniously murder it without much screen time.

The drama should be the New Republic being founded by a group of progressive leftist infighters who barely got along if it wasn't for a totalitarian enemy. They now find themselves are in power. Make it about how passionate they are about species rights but hesitant to enforce those rights with military force. Make it about bringing democracy to conquered worlds that have known only repressive colonization for a generation, gaining their trust. It's okay for the New Republic to struggle and sometimes suck, often relying on being a consensus neoliberal compromise. Just make that interesting. Remember, they always have the ghosts of Alderaan haunting them.

DON'T make the First Order as slick and clean as the Empire. They're the insurgents now, always on their back foot. Make them punk. Make them Neo-Nazi inspired. They're mostly angry young human men who are resentful they didn't have their time on top, backed up by the old guard that avoided getting swept up in the Truth & Reconciliation trials. Their appeal is niche, but some are swayed.

All the while in the background Luke is struggling to start his school which even in Legends was an incubator for Dark Jedi. He's trying to recreate this religion almost from scratch, half remembered folktales and a few scraps of original sources. Again, don't have it fail off screen and in flashbacks. Make the audience care about its failure.

[tathrin]

wip folder game!

tagged by @lordgrimwing thank you very much!

Rules: Post the names of all the files in your WIP folder, regardless of how non-descriptive or ridiculous. Let people send you an ask with the title that most intrigues them, and then post a little snippet or tell them something about it! and then tag as many people as you have WIPs.

Oh jeeze, okay here we go...

An Elvish Lure

Arwen and Éowyn

Blindfolded in Lórien

Boba Fett vs Alien

Boromir, Legolas, and Gimli in Lothlórien

Bounty Rescue

Celebrimbor in the Fellowship

Coming Home Under the Shadows

Cooking With JediStormPilot

Dead Faces In The Water; Dead Faces Everywhere

Death of Nellglind

Defending Dwarven Honor

Disarmed (Tiraran)

Dwarven Ring (Not Like This)

Echoes Through Stone

Elven Compass (Fellowship)

Episode VIII

Fett and Ailyn

Gimleaf: As A Lie

Lord of the Star Ring Wars

Not A Healer's Hands

On Why Legolas Joined the Fellowship

Oropher: A History

Oropher's Return

Quick Enough to Trust the Elves

Rise of the Jedi

Sea-Longing and Songs

Shadows Creeping

SW Sequels: Meeting Mirta

The Last Jedi Without The Suck

Thranduil: A Crown of Silver and Blood

To Live In Undying Lands

To Sleep With The Dead

Twin Faces of Destruction

Two Fell Into Shadow

Undying Lands

Whumptober 5 + 7: Pray I Don't Get Up

Wraith Squadron - Enemy Ally

This isn't everything I've got, it's just the LotR and Star Wars stuff, because it was already just so damn long already, I wasn't going to peek into the other folders and make it worse shhhh.

So we definitely aren't tagging that many people, because that's ridiculous. However, if you haven't been tagged in this yet and you see this, you can absolutely assume that you have been tagged by me, because holy kest that is a lot of stories lmao. So instead we'll go with nine specific tags, because that's a good number to choose for groups of people, don't you think? Not for any reason...

tagging: @roselightfairy @bifuriouswaterbender @estel-of-the-eyrie @babybat98 @rosalui @aroace-moron @storytellingdreamer @sallysavestheday @curiouselleth

[jessequinnfirstofhername]

Hi! So, I saw your post about controversial opinions about star wars and I wanted to try this.

I liked "the last Jedi". I think is a good film, I really enjoyed it. I think Ryan Johnson is a really good director. And the scene in silence is... You can't tell me it's bad. I was on the verge of tears when I saw it in the cinema. And episode 9 is bad. Really bad. It sucks. The only thing I liked was that they didn't overuse previous material of Carrie Fisher, I was a bit scared of that but that's the only thing I think they did good in that movie.

There, I said it. Feel so good.

I do enjoy stirring up poodoo ;)

But seriously, I love seeing contentious SW opinions! This is a good one, too.

I've said it before, but I'll say it again; I love The Last Jedi. It's probably one of my favorite Star Wars films, and it's my favorite of The Sequels. The silence in the Holdo Maneuver scene is just... *Chef's kiss*

Good take!

I wouldn't say Episode IX is bad. I enjoyed it! But I will admit it is deserving of criticism.

I certainly take issue with a lot of the ways we see technology being used to resurrect dead celebrities, but how they brought back Leia one last time was good, and respectful of Carrie and her legacy. I certainly got a bit misty-eyed over it.

Yes! Confess, confess all your SW hot takes! It gives me life!

[betasuppe]

And good for Harrison Ford finally getting a chance to play Han Solo dying - I think that might have been a dream come true for him lmaooo

But also, Luke & Rey's awkward stare down as the film ends. & turns into Luke sucking alien udders for blue milk with him being such a weirdo freak like...

Obi-Wan rocked the "strange wise old man living as a hobo in the middle of nowhere" but Luke's personification in the sequel triology is fucking embarrassing & sad.

I read a lot of the EU. Dude had been through so so much & to see the films just wet shit all over my favorite SW character??? And make him just a grumpy hateful old man??? It could've been so much better smhhhhhhh