#that's just laudna I don't know what to tell you

[utilitycaster]

On the heels of your critique of C3's pacing and the sludginess of it all—something I have been contemplating lately is how the perceived need (certainly ICly and seemingly OOCly) for BH to move at a breakneck speed from event to event has had an effect on inter-party discussions and bonding that I find really pretty tragic. I can't help but wonder, would we be dealing with the indecision and rehashed circular debates we're seeing now if the party had been able to take the downtime they needed to really get to know themselves and each other, and to better define what's important to them? I often see people expressing frustration about how badly certain characters "need to TALK to each other!!!" but to date, I just don't know if the pace of the campaign has created many opportunities for that. And that's the thing I miss the most about the previous campaigns, just having more breathing room to let the characters and their relationships develop organically. I dunno. Increasingly I feel like these are interconnected issues.

I think I've talked about this before so I don't want to get too in the weeds but: yes. I think at this point Matt is like...making space deliberately for them to talk in-game, but at this point the party has spent so long not really talking and we're so late in the game that no one really takes him up on it or when they do it's the old Gods Debate again.

I really think the problem is once again what I've been saying for like, well over a year now. I don't think the cast was given as much direction as they were for campaign 2, nor was the campaign deliberately tailored to this party, so it has always been ill-fitting. Even some of the pre-planned elements have fallen flat (I have innumerable reservations about the Laudna book, but I do want to read it if only because I still could tell you basically nothing about her and Imogen's time together pre-campaign - it's one incident in Gelvaan, helping Zhudanna one time in Jrusar which wasn't even pre-planned but rather their "session zero", and apparently they saw someone with boob tassels one time). Things like Ashton and Imogen's relationships with the gods feel tacked on after Taliesin and Laura realized that having some sort of pre-existing opinion on the gods was in fact deeply relevant to this campaign; I do genuinely want an answer from both of them of whether "I had prayed to the gods and they never answered" existed in their backstories more than 5 minutes before it came up in game because I'd bet good money it was "no, I threw that in on the fly." So you have characters that are a little more broadly sketched, which would normally be fine (I mean, I don't think most of Vox Machina in the original birthday party one-shot had a terribly deep backstory to start), except for the fact that they never had to take watch, they had a patron giving them jobs and a generous stipend from the start of episode 2 until his demise in episode 38, and both Imogen and Laudna; and FCG and Ashton already had apartments in the city so no one needed to bunk up with anyone they didn't already know. The party did not need to take watches; they did not need to decide on a direction; and they didn't have to learn to resolve conflicts and make choices as a collective group. And yes, the pace has been pretty breakneck throughout, so there wasn't space early on for the cast to feel out their characters and what motivated them and how they'd act. I think the first time I saw a large number of people in the fandom going "MAKE A FUCKING DECISION ALREADY I DON'T CARE WHICH ONE" was with the party doing a similar endless handwringing about Dusk in episode 29, and I don't think they've really gotten better. Like, I do think episode 29 is already on the late side anyway, even for a long-running campaign with a lot of wiggle-room; for a long-running campaign with some very specific plot beats planned, this really needed to be done in character creation.

So now that there is more room to debrief and talk, because in-character they're still on a deadline and the world's been ending all campaign, and because that groundwork wasn't laid, they don't talk about anything except the task at hand. Like...I think a defense I've seen of this campaign is that it's about a group of people who really aren't suited for what has been laid before them, but the problem is that's kind of every D&D campaign that starts from a low level and this is a particularly weak example thereof. Vox Machina didn't show up ready to kill dragons nor Vecna, and the Mighty Nein are still Wildemount's best kept secret; both of them grew into their current hypercompetence. Bells Hells don't really belong to their story, nor does it to them, so yeah, hard to talk within that framework.

[distant--shadow]

Do you have any favorite imogearne moments you'd like to share? Could be big moments or small moments, anything that stands out to you. Love your art btw!!!

ohhh, off the top of my head? okaaayyy-

Imogen telling fearne to not go to wondering round the back area by herself, fearne pulling a face at her and Imogen being instantly weakened, "she's so charming!" the gay panic is so real

when Imogen looks for the "bubble bead" thinking she has it after laudna asking who does, and in fact fearne had it hidden away under her ear, just love the playfulness that's something Imogen needed/needs so much

on that note, fearne rocking the cable cars, of course.

them bonding over shitty parents and both letting their violent tendencies show

all that bonding over both being ruidis born. period talks and kissing. yes.

when laura/Imogen gets confirmation for the first time that her circlet blocks out all of the background static, and everyone's so happy for her and fearne is all "you don't even know what I'm thinking now" and wiggling her eyebrows and Imogen is like "I can probably guess..."

the two of em rolling Nat 20s to buy smut. my women.

Imogen sharing her apple with fearne whilst they're on their witchy bitch Whitestone mission

"FEARNE. SIT ON ME." "OKAY!"

uhmmm fearne as the leaf sheep sea slug and Imogen fucking losing it at the thought of kissing her/eating her ass once she remembers she is a sea slug, and then feeding her a good berry afterwards caus she feels guilty for siphoning power from a lil guy.

fearne sticking up for Imogen that time ludinus crashed their meeting in the office at the University. the two of them in their chairs interrogation style with fearne being all sassy was 2 much 4 me.

[SPOILERS] just a lot of episode 108, for me, dragon riding goes without saying but also more trauma bonding and looks etc etc. them navigating their feelings on possibly being the vessel and potentially together is actively killing me, fearne ignoring ashtons set up of "I've got my pillow and blanket and I'm heading to the meadow" to instead reach for Imogen and ask for her to dream...

I know I will have forgot some things here, but they're my women. I love their dynamic so much.

(thank you! always happy to read that people like my drawings and also enabling me to chat)

I also have intentions of clipping a bunch of these, life's just been busy!

[batwingsandblackcats]

Tunes for Laudna's bad days. Don't worry, she'll come out the other side.

01. Crazy - Bridge City Sinners Voices tell you what you want to hear / Give into the darkness my dear / No room for the light  / When the darkness feels so right / Demons whisper in your ear / Cold sweat so full of fear / Let go you’ll never come back / Watch the lights all fade to black / And every time I think I’m fine / The darkness creeps back into my mind / Reminds me that nothing will ever be okay / I’ll never be okay / Hey maybe that’s okay! 02. Shadow - Amigo the Devil We drag around a shadow with every step we take  / And every bad decision, now also theirs to make  / The thief that only borrows, in a sea without the shark  / But who protects the shadow from the dark? / A thousand different angles say the circle's name in vain  / Are we crucifying the savior or a masochist in pain  / The knife without the handle, a shark without the sea  / But who will give the shadow everything it needs? 03. Withered - Beggar’s Canyon Lord  child have you done no wrong / This world has left you bitter, broken, and alone / Hey  now babe can’t you see what you’ve done / A broken heart left bleeding, and it’s not the only one 04. Rock Bottom - Bridge City Sinners Guilty, I know you blame me  / It's a weight that I carry  / Too heavy for your back to hold  / Regret, some things you can't forget  / So light up that cigarette  / We're all wasting time til we die  / And no, no matter how low  / There ain't no rock bottom for me 05. Shame - Bridge City Sinners It fills my mind, the thoughts consume me / Hoping for a change that will never come / I don’t blame anyone for wanting to leave me / I’ve been staring down the barrel of a loaded gun 06. Cocytus - Pawns or Kings Can you feel me in the fog? / Pull me from this epilogue / My hands are frozen in the snow / The eyes of corpses have no glow / Made these chains for just myself / Rambling about my mental health / Demons on this hazy hill / Only my soul is left to kill  07. Break the Chain - Bridge City Sinners Days get longer, nights get shorter / The chain gets tighter, not getting younger / Live your life while the world’s still turning / Soon the seas will all be burning / Hold fast, go down with the ship / Letting go gets the crack of the whip / The only constant now is change / Break the chain, break the chain 08. Doubt - Bridge City Sinners Just get through today / There’s hope for tomorrow / You’ll feel better soon / Just outlive the sorrow / You feel hopeless now / But you’re not alone / A heart that’s rotten, dead and numb

[caeslxys]

Something I think is extremely interesting thematically when it comes to connecting what Downfall and the ideas it tackled to the overarching narrative of campaign three is that the things Downfall made a point to showcase of Aeor—Cassida, Hallis, the visual of an aeormaton proposing to her partner, the specific and intentional decision to shed light on a far from insignificant amount of the population being civilians or refugees—is that it plays in perfect parallel across from what is happening (and, really, has been happening) to the ruidusborn on Exandria in present.

Bear with me for a moment. Aeor is ultimately a city that was collectively punished for the decisions of its leadership. We could (and, judging by the amount of discourse around this particular topic already, probably will) argue about what the Gods’ motivation for all of this was—whether it be that they could not, in the end, bear to kill their siblings or that they were terrified at the prospect of mortality—for me it is a very healthy dose of both—but for this I am much more interested in the latter. They were scared. That, really, is the driving force behind both this arc and their role in c3 as a whole.

Why I point this out is: It is far more interesting to me, especially as we go back to Bells Hells this week, to dissect the Gods and their decisions not purely on sympathetic motivation alone but as beings in the highest seat of power in the highest social class in Exandria.

So, having established that the Gods (in relation to mortals) are more a higher social class than anything we could compare to our real life understanding of divinity and that Aeor was eviscerated largely because of their fear—what is the difference between those innocents in Aeor caught in the trappings of their autocratic government leadership and a divine war on the ground, and those of the ruidusborn being manipulated both by Ludinus and by the very thing that inspired such visceral fear in the Gods to start with. I would argue very little.

I think of Cassida, doing what she genuinely thought was right and good and would save people, her son, and the object of her worship—and how that did not matter enough to any of them to spare her because of the fear they held at the very concept of mortality. I think of Liliana and Imogen, one of which we know begged for the gods to help her or send her a sign for years on years, and how every single one of their largest struggles could have been avoided had the gods loved them, their supposed children, as much as they feared what they could be. I think of how the thing that did save Imogen, in the end, was a woman who herself existed in direct defiance of the gods will. I think of that young boy, sixteen years old, that Laudna exalted on Ruidus.

I think it’s completely fair to judge Aeor’s overall society as deeply corrupt—it was!—but its leadership and police force are not a reflection of every one of its citizens. Similarly, it is fair to judge the Ruby Vanguard as corrupt—it is!—but its multiple heads of leadership and even the god-eater further are not a reflection of every one of its members.

Notably, and what I think the Hells will latch onto, this did not matter to the Gods. It did not matter that Cassida was trying to help. She was still too much of a risk. Will it matter, what Imogen does? Will it matter, if that young boy is in the blast radius when they decide to take no further chances?

I’ve seen a lot of people say that the Hells will side with the gods and I don’t think I agree. Especially as Imogen has been scolded and villainized over and over for daring to try and save her mother—who herself has been seen by some as an irredeemable evil in spite of her drive being the exact same—her family—but when it’s the Gods it’s justified? When it’s the Gods, it’s sympathetic? Too sympathetic to criticize further than “they’re family”?

I obviously do not think the Gods should die or be eaten or what have you, and I certainly don’t agree with Ludinus (though I find him much more compelling than just a variation of hubris wizard), but when talking about the Gods in Aeor and in present it isn’t really at all about their motivation or their family. It can’t be. Too many people, including our active protagonists, lives have been effected for it to be as cut and dry as “they’re family”. These are your children. They are your family, too.

[southern-gothic-comic]

Page 75

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(Author Notes)

Panel 1: Imogen looks up at her in distress, her eyes full of tears. She takes her face in her hands, gently holding her ears.

Imogen: Oh, Laudna . . .

Laudna: I'm sorry.

Imogen: Don't. Don't you apologize for what they did to you. You . . . you died.

Laudna: I did. I'd meant to tell you sooner, really I did, but to be honest I was afraid of what you'd think of me if you knew I was, you know. A bit dead. I understand if you . . .

Imogen: Who was it? Who's Lady Briarwood?

Laudna: Oh . . . she was the ruler of Whitestone, for a time. But she's long dead now.

Imogen: For her sake, it's probably for the best. 'Cause if I ever crossed paths with her . . .

Panel 2: Laudna’s posture remains hunched and uncomfortable while Imogen looks up at her, not yet quite parsing that she isn’t the target of the anger in her eyes.

Laudna: It . . . really doesn't bother you? That I'm . . . not all alive?

Imogen: The only thing that's botherin' me is how you got that way.

Laudna: I just feel that you deserve so much more in a friend than . . . this.

Panel 3: Laudna gestures dismissively to herself.

Imogen: Than what?

Laudna: This! This cold and creaking husk in bed beside you. This body that's more bone than flesh. This sluggish heart pumping ooze through it. I understand I can be . . . off-putting. I can't even offer you the comfort of a warm hug when you're upset.

Panel 4: Imogen presses her hand over Laudna's heart and looks up at her earnestly.

Imogen: Listen to me. You've got a heart that loves, Laudna. That makes you more alive than havin’ one that beats. You have more warmth and life in you than any other fully live person I've ever known. And don't worry about being cold. I've got more'n enough heat for both of us.

Panel 5: They go back to bed. Imogen's arms are around Laudna, who is awake, but smiling up into the darkness. Her hand is resting over her heart where Imogen had laid hers.

[fluidstatick]

FCG's sacrifice | Critical Role - Bells Hells ep 91

If you've not seen Sam's video on the Crit Role channel, It's Been Awhile, go watch it now. Then come back and watch this again. Then bear with me, I need to talk about this for a bit.

When I saw this the first time I thought it was odd that everyone was crying so much. Laudna's death gave everyone focus, and Molly's was met with solemnity, but few tears. Why did Sam's decision rock the table so much harder this time?

Everyone is crying when FCG decides to sign off. Matt cries harder than we've seen since the C2 signoff. Taliesin hides his face. Liam is visibly crushed, and then snarling with rage, and then numb. Marisha is bargaining, Ashley is protesting, Laura is speechless. At the time I wrote it off as the cast being tired, frustrated by the Otohan battle, disappointed by a rough run of ineffective strategies.

Most of all, I thought Travis' body language and quiet remark were so strange. He's smiling throughout this death scene, eyes sparkling, awed, and he says in a level, sincere voice - "I'm so proud of you." We all know Travis laughs when he's panicking, so I thought he was just enjoying the symmetry of FCG's character arc. But now that we know why the table was so broken up at this, I understand Travis' amazement and pride, too.

Everyone is in tears because they don't know if Sam is going to come back. They don't know if he'll make it. They know they can't make their fear and hurt explicit, because it'll breach Sam's privacy at a very dark and frightening time. But he takes this poetically timed opportunity to allow Bell's Hells to endure. He removes himself narratively, preserves his privacy, and lays a plot point that will allow the others to channel their grief and fear into the game in his absence. Travis sees what this decision does not just for the narrative, but for the health of the brand. That's CEO Travis telling Sam how proud he is. And when FCG bolts for Otohan at a full dash, thinking about Bertrand, and Dorian, and Frida -- That's Sam, squaring up to cancer, thinking of his predecessors in the fight, his comrades in his own battle, and the people who most need him to win.

When Matt said "The stakes are higher than ever", he wasn't talking about Exandria. He was talking about Sam, the table's one of a kind friendship, and the joyful soul of CR. And nobody knew when or how they'd come out the other side.

At the Greek, When Ashton failed his wisdom save against Dominox and it used FCG's voice to accuse them of letting him die, I was thrown a little by Tal's performance. If Ashton failed the wisdom save, why is he so strong in the face of this accusation? But now I see it's Taliesin asking cancer, how dare you try to make us feel guilty while our best friend kicks your ass? How dare you tell us that we've fucked up, when we've all done everything in our power to protect this man that we love?

I didn't like Braius when he debuted. I thought he was too vain, too brash, too pushy. I thought he was a goofy swing and an ill fit for the party. But now, in context with everything we didn't see before, he's perfect. He's a husky-voiced warrior of few words, a jittery fanboy, a wounded jester, a powerful healing force of darkness, a joyful slut with a slit throat, so alive, alive, alive.

I could say so much more but I'm emotionally exhausted. Get your HPV vaccine. If your body needs pelvic exams, get them, every year, no slacking. If your body tells you something is weird, listen to it, and find a doctor who will also listen to it.

If you're reading this, I love you. Go tell someone who needs to know that you love them.

Fuck Cancer.

[sassy-cass-16]

Oh god I promised myself no bell’s hells meta until c3 ends but my brain is turning the “can she be trusted?” line over and over like chicken at the shawarma shop. because there are layers to that.

more under the cut because i let this run away from me:

so first off, there's the obvious: dorian initially seems to start to address the whole group, everyone who's left in the inn room, but turns and just locks eyes with orym when he asks. orym, who of everyone has the most reason to be biased against laudna right now. orym, who just got into a fight with laudna over the sword that killed both of them and orym's husband and father-in-law. that's who dorian thinks to ask, because he trusts orym not to let his judgment be clouded.

dorian first saw orym again after months of being separated, like, three days ago, and despite how much orym has visibly changed in those months, dorian doesn't hesitate to believe that orym will still be objective. he trusts that orym will be the one to look at this situation and tell him the truth.

because dorian has experience with orym telling him the truth. dorian knows firsthand how willing orym is to shuck his personal feelings in favour of what's true. dorian just saw what he could have become, had orym not stepped in to stop him taking the circlet of barbed vision. he owes the fact that he's alive and beholden to no gods to orym's willingness to be rational and objective in a situation involving a powerful magical item. by his own admission, "i wouldn't be here without you."

so of course dorian trusts him right now.

and there's something to the exclusion of the others, with that. dorian doesn't look to fearne and orym, although that would make sense because he's known the two of them the longest. he doesn't look to chetney, who's proven to be able to get a handle on this with the scream needle compromise. he doesn't look to ashton, who's been extremely levelheaded through this whole mess. he looks at orym, exclusively. he is asking orym, exclusively. not the group, although everyone decides to jump in to answer and then imogen comes through the window to complicate the matter. just orym.

dorian is the kind of person with a lot of potential for darkness in him. he hides it well because he's also deeply kind and friendly, but it's always been there. he's just been through something massively traumatic, and that was after the original circlet conflict back in exu prime. he had his alignment forcibly changed from good to neutral. but even after all he's gone though, orym's alignment is still good.

as much as orym doesn't want to be a leader and prefers to be a protector and follower, he does very well in situations where he takes on an amount of responsibility. when he's in some level of control over a situation, he takes to it naturally. he's a very good babysitter to his gaggle of weirdos. the "can she be trusted?" might have been an attempt on dorian's part to give orym a bit more control here. to reassure him that regardless of anyone else's feelings—regardless of how laudna's reaction might have affected him—orym deserves to be trusted, and he can make a decision that dorian will trust.

back in exu and all the way into early c3, dorian and orym slotted into a sort of parental position in their groups. watching over the crownkeepers' clothes when they went skinny dipping in exu. orym repeatedly steering everybody away from bad ideas. matt even described dorian leaving dariax in zephrah in 4sd as "dad just going out to get cigarettes." there's always been that underlying sense of "we are two of a pair" with dorian and orym. not to say that either of them don't see the others as adults, but they do have that rapport of being the babysitters in the gaggle of weirdos.

that kind of bond is just part of their dynamic. but especially in light of what's been happening while they were separated, and then what happened between them earlier that evening, "can she be trusted?" is a reminder of that bond. orym's been lonely, by his own admission, and one of the secrets he divulged at nana morri's was "i really miss dorian." he broke down crying during his last message through the sending stone, and then again on the bench not a few hours before this whole incident went down.

dorian came to comfort him. he flat-out said to orym's face "i'm here now." he reminded orym that he needs to rely on other people, that he can't always be the one saving everybody else. he gave orym the room to not be the strong one, and told him he has that room because dorian's there to support him. they can be two of a pair again.

he knows orym's been feeling like he can't do anything, like he had to resort to what he stopped dorian from doing with the circlet. and so dorian both gives him a choice to make, something to do, and shows him that he still trusts him unconditionally. "can she be trusted?" also means "i trust you" and "i'm here with you" and "this is how we've always been."

we know from liam in 4sd that orym has feelings for dorian that he's not sure are reciprocated. but even regardless of the romantic element here, dorian and orym have always had a partnership. they have always been two of a pair. the sequence of events leading to "can she be trusted?" is a perfect microcosm of he relationship between the two of them. it's just incredible.

[overnighttosunflowers]

I've been thinking a lot about that interaction between Laudna and Orym in episode 102. How it starts with Orym saying "I'm so sorry that the world is moving so fast that we couldn't take the time to help you."

There's a certainty to that framing that is very typical of Orym. Not "I'm sorry the world is moving so fast that we didn't take the time to help you." They couldn't take the time. The mission comes first, second, and third until they've seen it through. 

Now, it's hardly a revolutionary observation that Orym's worldview comes from a particular combination of military training, survivor's guilt, and calcified grief that is ultimately self-destructive. It's also not a revolutionary observation that the party has not quite realized this, or not in so many words. They tend to treat his perspective as the only one unshakeable by personal failing. Later in that conversation in 102, Laudna even tells Orym that if someone needed to "finish the job, put me down," she'd wanted it to be him, because she knows he has the ability to do what's right.

His friends think of him as the only one who isn't a powder keg waiting to go off, but it has gone off, with Orym secretly and self-destructively pledging himself to Nana Morri in order to keep his friends alive. Betraying his friends' trust in favor of the mission. And in the end it didn't accomplish anything.

I think of Orym as someone who holds multiple truths at once. First and foremost there's a soldier's truth, the grim relentlessness that's all that keeps him going sometimes. But we've seen Orym be soft, too. He's gentle. He loves his friends. It's there underneath the grim layers of suppression. We saw it more early campaign. I don't think that he was lying in 49 when he told Imogen that he wasn't worried about her just hours after conspiring with Fearne to take her out if necessary. I think he wanted so, so badly to discount that soldier POV and buy all the way into trusting Imogen. But he couldn't. And I don't know if he was able to reconcile that. I think he genuinely believed both. Liam has said that before the events of this campaign reactivated Orym's trauma, he was legitimately on a path to healing his grief. I think that a healthier Orym would have been able to set down the soldier's truth to simply trust Imogen.

But that's not where the campaign took us. At the Malleus Key in episode 51, Orym collected a locket from a dead Vanguard soldier to remind himself that the enemy are still human. And then after Bor'dor died, in episode 63, he dropped it. Locking in on that soldier's truth. Making that deal with Morri. Not letting his friends stop and rest when they need it badly. Pressuring Imogen to give in to Predathos on the moon so that they could learn more.  

There's a grim run of episodes where Orym is stuck like that, prioritizing his soldier's truth and suppressing the part of him that is his heart. Now, I'm not someone who needs to always feel warmly towards a character or agree with their choices to appreciate their depth and role in the story, and I respect what Liam was doing there. The willingness of the CR cast to have their characters make messy and unpopular choices is one of the things I appreciate most about the show, and one of the things that leads us to the richest and most meaningful moments of character arc resolution. 

But that's where I've been frustrated with Orym: by and large, resolution has not been coming. He's been driving deeper and deeper into his traumatized worldview, clinging to it and stubbornly refusing to hear challenges to it. Repeatedly shutting down arguments by mentioning his dead family. I get it, and I feel for him, and I don't know how else Liam could be playing it given the story that Orym is in and the character that he is—not least a soldier whose training tells him never to question the mission. But, god, I'm ready for the growth. Ready for the story to prod Orym in directions that change. Ideally a shift towards a healthier perspective, but even hitting such a low that the Hells can't help but recognize that Orym's rigid morality is as destructive as it is sustaining. That will make them push back on him.

Because telling Orym he's the good one reinforces his worst instincts, increases the pressure he puts on himself, makes him double down. What he needs is someone to push back. He needs that increasingly brittle sense of his own lens as morally superior and righteous to shatter. 

And I am so, so excited for it to happen—because we're starting to see it starting to crack, just a little. In episode 92, he acknowledged to Imogen that his lens is a lens and not simple objective truth, and even implied it's one he wishes he knew how to set down: 

And now, when Laudna tells him he knows best of all how to do what's right, he admits it again: not a lot of his choices have panned out.

And it's true. They haven't. And I hope he keeps on saying it.

I'm glad to have Dorian back and on a revenge quest against the gods, because Orym trusts Dorian and Dorian is not going to let him sit unchallenged in his own convictions the way the rest of the Hells have been. I'm excited to see more of Braius, who not only disagrees with Orym about the Primes, but also doesn't have the same vested interest as the rest of the party in seeing Orym as good. I hope they both push back on him. I hope it unsettles him and confuses him and breaks his worldview and soldier identity enough that when the pieces come back together, instead of scarring over a second time, they can simply finally heal.

[song-of-baldy-ron]

I'm honestly not Anti-Prime Deities but I do get frustrated when I see how hard Matt and the Players try to present this new perspective in C3- that of people who've lived their lives mostly ignored by the gods- only to have their backstories get brushed aside by a lot of the fandom with excuses of "well you didn't try/pray hard enough to get an answer!" Because no matter how much of a good force they've been on Exandria, there are absolutely some things they need to answer for.

Before the Predathos threat was even at large, why didn't any of the gods reach out to Ruidusborn to try and explain what they were? Why is Imogen only hearing from the Stormlord now that he needs her help? Why was Laudna being chased out of towns by clerics for most of her life post-Sun Tree? Why hasn't Ashton received even a hint of the gods listening to their prayers? Maybe all three of them rolled super low on religion/perception checks their entire lives but at some point you'd think one of the gods would answer for one of them.

There isn't a black and white answer to this question but that doesn't mean the question isn't a valid one to ask.

It gets even worse when viewers don't even want to engage with the various perspectives Exandrians have with the Primes, and how they can't all be positive or Ludinus wouldn't have anyone to manipulate/bring to his side. Cults rely on charismatic/convincing leaders but they also need to tap into societal tensions that those leaders can twist in their favor.

This doesn't even touch on the Colonialism of it all (as sympathetically presented as it's been) of the Gods just rocking up on Exandria and changing things to their liking (as ignorant to the consequences as I assume they were).

I get that C1 and to some extent C2 presented very different views on the gods than what C3 is telling us, but it really feels like people are writing off the C3 characters' views on divinity and their relationships with the gods as "Matt retconning the lore he established"/ setting up for some nebulous post-WOTC world where none of the gods exist even though literally no one has mentioned that would be the next step.

Again- I would be upset if Exandria got rid of their gods because I love how complicated they can be especially given what we know now.

But please be willing to engage with the narratives that C3 is bringing to life without relying on what was established in C1 or C2 (when the gods' existence wasn't directly being threatened) as the "true lore" of Critical Role.

[lilpandrea]

You know what's sad? I bet if the opposite happened in which Dorian threw Orym's husband and father's death straight to his face like that, much more of the fandom would've been enraged. Tbh as someone who is a Dorian fan first before a Dorym shipper, some of the reactions to this interaction in the episode has been so frustrating. The downplaying, the invalidating, the hypocrisy of how Laudna/Orym fans are allowed to feel indignant for things because of their favorite character's trauma, but Dorian fans are being too much. (Props to those who have been actually objective and/or are excited to see where these two flawed characters go from here).

Now, as a Dorym shipper it really sucks to see Dorian come back, do many things for Orym: gave all (what happened to the money they got from the heist?) his money for the armor, reassured Orym before Swordgate happened, stood by Orym during Swordgate, gave Orym a piggyback ride (he wanted to princess carry gdi lol), saved Orym's life twice in one fight...only to have Orym throw his brother's death to his face like that...sure it's nice when a ship has complications but really? When his brother just died not too long ago??? Please don't compare this to Imodna divorce arcs, it's not the same. Oh gosh and then Dorian checking out of the conversation afterwards.

God, if his parents are in Vasselheim right now and sees him in gold too would that be his final breaking point until it all finally comes out? (I would love it if Robbie is waiting for the perfect moment for Dorian to finally boil over. Give me that tasteful angst)

No, Dorian Storm isn't stupid and needs to be re-educated, he is a complex character like the others and has his own reasons for thinking certain ways, just because you don't like or agree with his opinions doesn't make him a suddenly bad character, he is his own character and isn't there to prop up another character, he isn't the team's therapist, just because Robbie is newer to d&d than the others doesn't mean he doesn't know what to do with his character, Dorian didn't have to tell all the details of his brother's death for Orym to not throw it to his face like that...

Anyways, kudos to anyone who even reads this since it could've been organized better and written more eloquently but it was a frustrating itch that wouldn't go away until I threw it all up 😅 (and no, I don't hate Orym, I get it, just frustrated w/ fandom reactions)

[dadrielle]

@overnighttosunflowers and I were talking about how much we want Ashton to have an opportunity to talk to Laudna about the Delilah of it all, and since neither of us has the time to make a proper fic of it, here's the raw dialogue we were bandying back and forth:

"Don't be so arrogant as to think you're the thing that's going to make the fucking difference, that whatever scrap of power you trade your soul for is what the world hinges on."

"Excuse me?"

"If the world depends on us, it depends on us TOGETHER, so stop fucking trying to leave. You think any of the rest of us will be able to give it our all if we're grieving you? You think IMOGEN will be able to? Fuck off."

"It’s not a matter of arrogance, Ashton, the opposite really. It’s that there are things Delilah can provide that I just simply cannot. Because let's be honest, in the grand scheme of things, I’m not worth much."

"Oh fuck off. Do NOT talk to me about low self worth. Do you know what I was telling myself when I took that fucking shard? That it was what was going to help. You know, I told Imogen once that every hit I take is one someone else doesn’t have to. And I wanted to take the hit. And it just about fucked us all."

"Ashton-"

"And I don’t even care that it fucked me and almost fucked me worse, so don’t talk to me about that. What I fucking hate is that all of you had to watch. That Fearne had to watch.

"You want to self immolate? It's not like anyone but you can stop you. But don't you for a second think there's not going to be collateral damage. If you care about what any of us think, do not throw yourself away the way he did. Because yeah I guess it saved us or whatever, but not one of us would’ve chosen that shit."

[utilitycaster]

You mentioned it briefly a few months ago (but it lives rent free in my head sorry!) that the most popular ship from this campaign has almost only AU fanfics and it's really telling me something about the characters from c3, that there is just really nothing to explore about them.

So here's the thing. I do not think the characters aren't worth exploring! There's been good character work (a lot of which gets ignored, actually, because it's not what many of the people who insist that C3 is their favorite as they slowly turn into a corncob want*; see basically anyone on Twitter about Orym), it's just not central to the plot.

I stand by what I originally said and which was validated at a recent Q&A panel: the cast wasn't told that this was going to be the Moon Plot Campaign (they were just told pulpier and deadlier) and Laura wasn't told that Imogen would be as central a character as she was. So I think we have characters who could have, for the most part, had a character-driven campaign around them, but it became clear relatively early on that this was the Moon Plot campaign and that wouldn't be the focus; and because to get all of his ducks in a row for the Moon Plot Matt had to take a heavier hand with the rails and as a result the party didn't have a ton of bonding time early on because they were always taking NPC missions/being ferried around in an airship with no need for watch conversations, and it's hard to go back and fill in those interactions later, which is why they've sort of fallen out of the habit.

With respect to the ship...the thing is, I genuinely believe it could have been good. The reason I'm not a fan of imo/dna isn't because I think the characters aren't good (well, my feelings on Laudna are documented but I do think Imogen is a great character). It's because, ironically enough, every barrier between them did get removed all too quickly in the service of Cottage Endgame and as a result I think many of the people who wanted that are like "wait...that's it?" Like, the gnarlrock fight fizzled out only for the same conflict to come up briefly with Ishta (swordgate) 70 episodes later and be resolved a day later in-game. When they reunited I was like you know what would have made this good? If Laudna had remained angry in episode 65 and turned Imogen down which Laura 100% expected to happen, because they hadn't talked about this and they were awkwardly trying to deal with unresolved feelings for 30+ episodes and perhaps Laudna actually leaned into Delilah wholeheartedly during that time and realized she had feelings for Imogen after all, while Imogen was simultaneously struggling with that rejection and realizing Laudna was going into a dark place but didn't feel like she could get involved, and they both leaned more (platonically) on other characters and Swordgate was the point where Laudna said "oh no, I'm becoming too much of a problem and I do want Imogen to like me" and the soul anchor felt like a culmination of a deeply felt struggle instead of a quick fix for something that had only inconvenienced her a few times and led to a 20 hour long minor spat at best? If we actually got a fucking slowburn? It would have been great! Turns out if you always go for the instant gratification, it makes for a story without any tension! And now we're watching people who were always clamoring for skipping to the good part realizing that in doing so we skipped all the buildup that makes it the good part. There could have been something to explore. It was not explored.

*I think that there are people who for whatever reason do legitimately prefer Campaign 3 for whatever reasons and are in earnest and this isn't about them. While I don't share their tastes I support them and their feelings; we all have our preferences. This is about the people who are already visibly setting up the groundwork for a dramatic rage quit that will make copious, wildly incorrect use of the term "neoliberal" if the campaign ends with the gods still in place while still insisting this is definitely the best campaign and making absolutely brainless statements about prior campaigns not being as political even though this is the least politically inclined or aware group by a country mile. I think the lesson from the above and from here is that you really cannot have your cake and eat it too.

[tangent101]

Laudna and Apologies

It was quite telling that Laudna did not apologize during the events of the last game. But there is also a certain... how to put it? I understand the mindset of Laudna in not apologizing... and that is the mindset of the addict and on not wanting to admit fault for her actions.

However, there are two things that happened that I think are going to change things. First, Laudna got her hit. She was given the dagger and sucked it in and sated Delilah's hunger. She gave in. And now the need is... lessened. Delilah will want more, don't doubt that for one moment. She will continue to try and erode Laudna's will. (I have to wonder if the next Will save will be a 19 or 20 to resist, seeing she empowered Delilah.)

Much more importantly, Imogen confronted her. She confronted Laudna not with accusations... but with love. And the look on Imogen's face even as she told Laudna "I love you" just shocked Laudna so immensely because this isn't the first time Imogen has watched Laudna succumb to her addiction. And the first time it happened, Imogen said "You lied!" and fled from Laudna, leaving her alone on the deck of the airship.

Look at what happens in that scene. You see Laudna go from defensive and hostile to panicked and scared at Imogen's actions. She was truly scared she had just lost Imogen. (And Imogen's words... when Laudna asked, almost plaintively, "Do you still love me?" and she responds with "I'll always love you, Laudna. I just don't know what to do with it." Ouch. This was just so... tragic and beautiful and delicious.)

She tries to... downplay it a bit. She tries to... handwave things away, saying "I've always been a lot." Imogen says "Fun scary" and after a tiny bit... I think Laudna caught something in the tone. Or Imogen's facial expression. "Still more fun than scary though, right?" And Imogen's "uh huh" just... didn't quite hold true. Laudna had to ask "Yeah?" and that pause before Imogen said "Yeah." Not supportive. Not handwaving away Laudna's scarying. No. There was thought there. There was the fact Laudna scared Imogen.

That's when Laudna broke. "I didn't mean it. I didn't mean it." Imogen doesn't respond, just holding her close... one last "I didn't mean it" with Imogen finally responding "I know." The desperation. The need. I think this broke through to Laudna. This was the moment she truly realized what she has to lose.

People comment on Laudna hitting the bottom before she can start to climb out. I think she just did. I think that she's realized at this moment the complete betrayal she did. She was so angry at Ashton for what he and Fearne did. (She wanted that Shard. She needed that Shard. And she was refused it.) She felt he betrayed them all. And then what does Laudna do but steal the blade that she herself stated was Orym's to do with. She hurt him in her hunger. She acted as a thief and refused to accept responsibility, she blamed Orym for what happened rather than her own actions.

And Imogen just broke through that denial, that need. She did this with her love. She did by supporting her and in doing so reminding her what she could truly lose if she followed this path.

Something in me suspects that Laudna's going to apologize at the start of the next game. It's needed. But it's not needed for Orym. It's not even needed for the Hells. It's needed for Laudna herself. It's said that an addict cannot start to recover until they realize they have a problem. (I know this from personal experience with a spouse who was a high-functioning alcoholic.) And while an apology won't be what fixes everything, while Laudna is going to continue to struggle with Delilah... she just had a huge scare here. Imogen never threatened to leave. But Laudna was suddenly petrified that every time Imogen said "I love you" that there was a "but" attached, that Imogen was going to leave.

(Orym made a Pact with the Fatestitcher. He openly admitted to this to everyone. Might not Imogen be the next to make a Pact, to have Nana Morri replace Delilah as her Patron... but not as a selfish and greedy Patron, but one that is perhaps more... whimsical and less demanding? I was quite surprised Laura didn't approach Nana Morri or ask her what could be done. Then again, she might very well have felt Laudna could handle it.)

tl;dr - Laudna's likely going to apologize at the start of the next episode thanks to Imogen just loving her and not pushing her away while also not condoning her actions.

[lavendertheys]

Hi sorry if this is weird but I’m a big critical role fan, I’m on campaign 3 but I’m not caught up. I love imogen and Laudna they have my whole heart but I saw a spoiler saying they might not be together anymore? So I’m trying to find someone who would tell me without plot spoilers why and if you think they will get back together?

Not weird at all @flytheplane-maddie!

So listen. They Did Not Break Up.

They had a really rough (not cruel, just difficult) conversation where Imogen acknowledged they might not have a future together if Laudna continues to pursue Delilah for the means of power.

During the live show someone asked Imogen if she's single and she said "I don't know," all agonized and conflicted.

Both Laura and Marisha said on 4SD that it's all just murky and complicated right now and they don't really know what's going on, but have very clearly not given up on the relationship.

Most importantly, we've seen an immediate pivot in how Laudna speaks about herself and her future. In the last episode she made explicit plans with Imogen for when they have "unlimited free time," which already sounds healthier than all her Dead End talk.

IN THIS HOUSE WE BELIEVE IN IMODNA ENDGAME.

[southern-gothic-comic]

Page 77

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(Author Notes)

Panel 1: Flashback. Sitting beneath a willow tree, Laudna is cutting twigs with her scissors to collect in a basket.

Laudna: (past, singing) ♪ Lady Mouse, will you give me your hand? Tickety-tum, tickety tum . . . ♪

Laudna: (VO) She's just . . . with me. A voice in my head. A presence at my side. A face in my dreams. She has guided me,

Panel 2: She is curled up asleep by a feeble campfire. By its light her shadow is in another woman's shape, watching over her while she sleeps. In the surrounding woods there is the glow of eyes, but nothing comes closer.

Laudna: (VO) and protected me,

Panel 3: She is crying out in terror of what seems to be the first horrifying transformation into her Form of Dread, her bones cracking and contorting grotesquely, her fingers elongating and dripping with ichor.

Laudna: (past) WhAt diD yoUu dO to meEe?!

Lady D: Shh. Don't be afraid, dear heart. I have made you so much more than what you were.

Laudna: (VO) and taught me a great many things I wouldn't have known otherwise.

Panel 4: Back in the present. Laudna is starting to fidget uncomfortably under Imogen's questions.

Laudna: She's made me so much more than what I was.

Imogen: Is she . . . here now?

Laudna: Oh, I don't know. Maybe? She sort of comes and goes. Sometimes she's very chatty and sometimes I'll go weeks without hearing from her. Have you ever been able to hear her?

Imogen: No, I haven't. Which is weird, 'cause I can hear everyone else. What kinda things does she say to you?

Laudna: Oh, it depends on her mood. Unwarranted advice, words of encouragement, confirmation of my deepest doubts. That sort of thing.

Panel 5: Imogen looks at her closely, trying to read the deeper meaning behind her airy tone.

Imogen: Is she mean to you?

Laudna: Mm. No more than anyone else.

Imogen: Do you want her in your head? It kinda seems like you got a raw deal there.

Laudna: Well, there's not a lot I can do about it, so it doesn't matter what I want.

Panel 6: She looks away unhappily. Imogen stands and approaches her, looking up at her earnestly.

Imogen: Hey. It's all right. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to make you upset. I can tell she's . . . important to you. . . . But you're not alone anymore. I'm here with you, and I'm not goin' anywhere, for as long as you'll have me.

Imogen: All right?

Laudna: All right.

[aurora771]

Thoughts after the c3e96 Imodna conversation. Laudna is set on having an impact, making a difference, saving Imogen in particular. More so than perhaps her 30years undead she feels her purpose is to actually die in order for her loved ones to live. She feels she has to give all of herself because thats all she has, and it upsets me greatly. She has so much to live for.

Laudna doesn't realise that it's her capacity for love and kindness that has saved her all these years. Yes let's utilise Delilah but I also feel if she just realised she can survive and do both we'd all be a lot happier. I know this is an addiction parallel- but I don't think Laudna is too far gone yet to change things.

Imogen is so set on not telling Laudna what to do, she has always given Laudna her own agency because of Delilah. However there comes a time where Imogen need to shake some sense in Laudna and remind her who is in control of her future and it isn't Delilah. Imogen's missing the cottage line was her most gentle way of saying to Laudna: you're choosing this and you don't need to, this will be the consequence. At this stage of things I do think it's still a choice on Laudna's part.

Laudna probably thinks that she's blown it with Imogen, but Imogen isn't letting go. She's just reminding Laudna that she doesn't really want to die. Perhaps that's the wake up Laudna needed, but I hope Imogen pushes back on Laudna's self sacrifice notions more.