#ruby has shown character flaws

[rowanthestrange]

I like Martha, I do, but people complaining Ruby hasn’t shown enough character flaws in the first two episodes like if you took “was willing to put up with his shit for way too long grrl” away from Martha she wouldn’t be so flat that she’d disappear if you looked at her side-on.

[anthurak]

Taiyang Xiao Long: The Latest in a Long Line of Fuckups

So there’s been quite a bit of discussion by this point from a number of people, myself included, about the idea that Taiyang Xiao Long isn’t actually the ‘Good Dad’ that much of the RWBY fandom has long seen him as. That he is in fact just as much of a dysfunctional fuck-up parent as Qrow, Summer, and yes, even Raven. There are a few different factors to this that others have gone into more detail on, but for me it really comes down to one core point in particular:

If you have checked out of parenting to the point where the two girls under your care can both state overtly and matter-of-factly that the older of the two raised the younger, then it frankly doesn’t matter WHAT your reasons were for checking out or how hard you may have been grieving. You have unequivocally, massively, FUCKED UP as a parent. The fact that the show has made it clear that Ruby considers Yang, her SISTER, to be her primary parent-figure does not speak well to ANY of Team STRQ’s parenting, Tai included.

However, with that said, I thought it would be worth talking about what all this discussion could actually mean in practice, ie; how might all this end up being actually explored in the story of RWBY itself?

After all, it’s not like Tai’s failings as a father have really been directly focused on or confronted or even overtly spelled out in the show thus far. The most direct we’ve gotten was during Yang’s talk with Weiss in the episode Alone Together, and even that wasn’t so much directed at Tai himself so much as describing how Yang was forced to take up so much slack in the family after Summer’s apparent death. Right now, discussion of Tai’s failings as a father is still very much ‘reading between the lines’.

And I believe that is all deliberate on the part of the writers. Thus far, the references to Tai’s failings as a parent haven’t meant to be overt and obvious to the audience. But rather they are meant to be hints and foreshadowing hiding in the margins and not immediately obvious to the viewer.

At least until it’s time to MAKE them obvious.

You see, I believe that Taiyang as a character is going to turn out to be all too similar to the likes of Qrow, Ozpin and Ironwood.

Men who are introduced appearing to represent noble and good-natured archetypes, but who wind up being revealed to have DEEP and extensive personal failings and flaws that wind up hurting themselves and all those around them. The warning signs of which turn out to have been floating around the margins, between the lines and just outside the audience’s field of view since practically their first appearances.

Consider for a moment just how characters like Ozpin, Qrow, Ironwood and Tai were/have been overtly presented in their early appearances. In other words, how the story at first wants us to view them:

The Wise Teacher

The Quirky Mentor

The Heroic Soldier

The Good Dad

And now let’s remember just how the first three wound up failing our heroines. And all of the hints we got that FORESHADOWED that failing:

All of the ‘Shady Oz’ behavior that people were noticing as early as Volume 2, and which only compiled and built over the subsequent volumes until being finally dragged into the light at the start of Volume 6.

Qrow’s rampant alcoholism, which he was outright introduced with in Volume 3 and later noted by Glynda to ALWAYS to be drunk. And shown later in Volume 5 when Ruby doesn’t bat an eye at Qrow showing up at their house near-passed out drunk.

And of course, ALL of the red flags that Ironwood was on the fast-track to fascism right from his first appearance when he showed up for the preparations of a festival celebrating peace and unity with a fleet of giant warships.

Now we have Tai, a character who turns out to have all kinds of indicators pointing to him actually being a complete dysfunctional fuck-up as a father once you start looking closely. From Yang’s multiple recountings of how Tai shut down and left HER to care for Ruby, to his shall we say QUESTIONABLE mentoring advice to Yang, to Ruby outright stating that it was YANG who raised her…

Really if you just start taking a closer look at Tai’s actions and behavior across the show, you can start finding plenty of hints and red-flags to his dysfunctional parenting hiding under a thin veneer of ‘expected’ character-archetype behavior, just like what happened with Ozpin, Qrow and Ironwood.

For example, just look at Tai’s ‘mentoring’ of Yang in Volume 4. At first glance, this scene is framed like a typical ‘hero gets tough-love advice and help from their wise and experienced parent’ situation, which is the takeaway most of us probably got on first viewing. Yet the moment you take a closer look and start unpacking what Tai is actually saying in this scene, it becomes clear, particularly in hindsight, that Tai is FULL OF SHIT. To the point of seemingly not even understanding how Yang’s semblance even works.

Or how about his claim that Raven ‘did a number of this family’, which if you actually take a minute to analyze, ESPECIALLY now in hindsight, makes no goddamn sense. How exactly can Raven have ‘done a number’ on the family when she’s been GONE from said family for the past 18 years? Particularly now that it seems like if any member is guilty of ‘doing a number’ on the STRQ, it’s actually SUMMER for going off on her super-secret suicide/martyr mission. We can’t even say that Tai can blame Raven for what happened to Summer because as Ruby’s Tree Vision made clear, Tai doesn’t even know Raven was involved. What this statement REALLY feels like is a shitload of projection and Tai blaming Raven for all of HIS fuckups as a parent.

HOWEVER, because none of this is directly framed by the show as being explicitly ‘bad’ and doesn’t present Tai with traditional/obvious ‘bad dad’ traits (see Jacques, and more on him in just a bit…) and generally couches his behavior with a veneer of ‘feeling baseline care and affection’, it’s easy to overlook on a first viewing.

Really, it feels all too much like how Volume 4 also presented Ironwood on the surface as the noble, heroic ‘only sane man’ among the authority in Atlas, all while slipping in NUMEROUS red-flags of him being on the fast track to fascism.

Speaking of Jimmy the Child Shooter, it’s been noted by a few people at this point that in hindsight, it’s pretty clear that Jacques Schnee effectively served as a red-herring villain to distract the audience from the growing red-flags surrounding Ironwood, both in Volume 4 and again in Volume 7.

Well, what if Jacques was also being used to distract the audience from TAI’s own parenting red flags in Volume 4? After all, it’s easy to be more forgiving of Tai’s sketchy parenting choices when the show keeps cutting back to Jacques’ brand of ‘parenting’.

Really, I think in hindsight Volume 4 is giving us three different looks at fatherhood: We’ve got the caring, nurturing father in Ghira, the abusive villainous father in Jacques, and the dysfunctional fuckup in Tai. A real ‘the Good, the Bad and the Ugly’ situation.

And finally, the simple fact that Yang raised Ruby. The biggest indicator of Tai’s, as well as the rest of Team STRQ’s, MASSIVE fuckups as parents which goes all the way back to Volume 1 when Gold framed Yang as a motherly figure to Ruby, outright comparing her to Summer.

It all points to Tai being set up for the same kind of big, subversive narrative rug-pull as Ozpin, Qrow and Ironwood. Men who are introduced as these strong, capable, ‘good-guy’ archetypes, only for it to be later revealed to both the heroines and the audience that these adults that they trusted are actually massive fuck-ups who have been making a mess of everything.

The only difference with Tai is that the story simply hasn’t decided to shine the light of narrative focus ON all of his numerous problems and fuckups and force our heroines to confront them like it already has with Ozpin and Qrow in Volume 6, and Ironwood in Volumes 7 and 8.

At least, not YET.

And wouldn’t you know it, the last RWBY Beyond episode set up what could be the PERFECT opportunity for that with Yang’s line about Tai being on ‘special assignment’.

Sure, people have been saying stuff like ‘Oh he’s gotta be doing something super important like guarding the Relic of Choice’, but this is RWBY we’re talking about. The show that ALREADY made a big point about how the ‘Daddy had a good reason for abandoning you’ trope is utter bullshit.

So frankly, I’d say there is NO WAY IN HELL that Tai has an actual ‘good reason’ for not having come to Vacuo to see his daughters.

And that this is instead the setup for Ruby and Yang to finally have to DEAL with all of their parents’ dysfunctional bullshit.

[oshinohoshi]

Oshi no Ko Chapter 165 thoughts

At this point we're just suffering.

I cannot get on board with Hikaru as a villainous mastermind. The fuck were we doing for the entire movie arc where he was shown in a sympathetic light? Why in ch 155 did he supposedly have a change of heart only for a plot twist to wreck everything?

It's not that Hikaru would have been absolved of responsibility for Yura's murder because he was abused. It's just that before the stupid Nino twist he wasn't an undeniable monster

Akasaka created someone more interesting, human, and who was flawed in a way that wasn't over the top, and then yanked it away

You're telling me that sad boy Hikaru who blamed himself for Ai leaving him began to manipulate Ryosuke and Nino mere months after the breakup? Please

Anyway... grief is terrible. This chapter was miserable to read

Some people are using this as an opportunity to shit on Kana which is ridiculous. Is slapping a corpse in front of his family not great? Yeah. Does she have every damn reason to? I'd say so

Heartbreak is not just a phrase. It actually hurts. It can cause chest pain, headaches, shortness of breath. There's something called broken heart syndrome which can be caused by grief or stress. It affects the heart's ability to pump blood effectively

Point being that grief is physically and emotionally painful and a breakdown is totally normal

I agree with Gotanda's reasoning about releasing 15 YRL, however the film is now inextricably tied to Aqua's death

Where is Ai in all this? Why isn't she on this poster??? I thought this was a film about her life

Her name may very well never be mentioned again despite being the backbone of this story

This is why cult leader Hikaru is the best character. He's the only person who has remembered her since ch 155

Judging by her white stars, Ruby is probably going to pull through. While I don't want a nihilistic end, we have ONE chapter left. Can this really be earned?

And can it be done in a way that doesn't accidentally portray Aqua's murder-suicide in a positive light in the sense that Ruby living on and achieving her dreams reinforces what Aqua died for?

Next chapter: So here we are, very nearly at the end of all things. I am glad you are here with me, OnK fan community. It's been a journey.

Send your good vibes to marillust, a super talented fanartist, who is really sad about losing Aqua. They're cycling between depression and denial and I really get that.

I feel like I have to defend my dislike of this ending by talking about previously established themes, bad twists, etc. in order to not be shouted down by the "what did you expect? This was always a tragedy" crowd, but I'm just gonna say it.

I wanted Aqua to move on and be happy! I wanted Ai's wish for her kids to grow up healthy to be fulfilled. I wanted Aqua to call both his mothers "mom." I wanted him to value his life and see that the people around him loved him and needed him.

I didn't want Ai's death to be meaningless. I didn't want Ruby to lose her most important person. I didn't want Miyako to lose her son, Kana to never get to say "I love you," and Akane to never rebuild her relationship with Aqua.

I wish we'd gotten this and this and a spinoff manga about this.

All right, it's fine. Deep breaths. Time to stare at Ai art until I feel better. Here's a sketch Mengo did of her riding a dragon. Isn't that cute?

[enigma2meagain]

RWBY Relic Pieces in Volume 1, Symbolism of the Pieces, and How It Ties To the Broader Narrative.

Did a quick searchup on the symbolism of chess pieces, and taking what I saw into consideration (note that this is very abridged, and possibly not entirely correct):

CRDL and the Black Bishop

Bishops are representative of religion, as well as spirituality, morality, and wisdom, and a direct reference to Cardin's mythological reference, the Cardinal of Winchester. In regards to the broader narrative that RWBY sets up, he can be considered V1's partial representation of the institution of Huntsmen, more specifically the deeply flawed and darker side standing opposite to the better/neutral aspects of Huntsmen that RWBY/JNPR represent, due to being a racist bully who stands against Grimm, yet also willfully persecutes and harms the people he's supposed to fight for, such as minority groups like Faunus and (given Jaune at this point is basically a civilian in huntsmen's clothing and training wheels) the people depending on the circumstances. Also acts as a form of foreshadowing to the other deeply flawed or outright bad huntsmen we'd come to see later in the series, as well as highlighting the lack of wisdom and morality that can blight the institutions that Huntsmen are supposed to be, represent and protect.

The Black pieces in chess always move second, which highlights how the Huntsmen are a highly reactive organization, and how this severely limits their ability to truly tackle the bigger problems regarding threats like the Grimm, Salem, society's deep internal problems, and in the bigger picture, Ozpin's divine mission.

JNPR and the White Rook

Rooks are representative of the land, being symbolic of the fortress that guards a city or land and its royalty, and how they essentially "guard" the other pieces, as well as representing stability. The majority of JNPR come from civilians compared to the likes of RWBY, with this becoming completely the case after Pyrrha's death and Oscar's inclusion, and they're shown consistently throughout the series as having the strongest connections to civilians on a personal level. They also frequently as the bedrock and stabilizing influence, through Jaune, Nora and Ren's friendships and roles as supporting characters. Being white pieces also highlights how as time goes on, they would develop an increasingly proactive role through the questioning of the narrative told to them by the metaphorical "royals" (in this case, Ozpin's secret circle) and the latter's failure to actually protect them.

This is especially notable in regards to Jaune, Nora, and from a story perspective Ren, given how the former consistently questions Ozpin and his inner circle's shadier actions throughout most of V4 - V8, and Nora and Ren were failed miserably and made orphans due to the lack of huntsmen and the society around them failing to protect them, while putting them into a situation where their only recourse is to become part of the system that failed them.

RWBY and the White Knight

Knight pieces are representative of the medieval military, fitting given the status of Huntsmen, as well as being considered adventurous, valorous, and unpredictable due to their unique fighting style allowing them a level of unpredictability that other pieces don't have, fitting of how RWBY are the main proactive force to pushing Ozpin and the true nature of the secret war against Salem out into uncharted territory, forcing them to actually change and grow.

Knights are also often historically drawn from nobility, much like how every major character in RWBY has some kind of tie to Remnant's most illustrious groups or some kind of major player (Ruby and Yang being part of major Huntsmen lineages, Weiss being a rich heiress to the most powerful corporation in the world, and Blake being effectively the Princess of the Faunus, as well as having ties to the most prominent civil rights activists and movements in all iterations of the White Fang).

Much like JNPR, they are far more proactive compared to the royals they serve, actively pushing the latter outside their comfort zone in a two-pronged attack alongside JNPR, but the series also strives to highlight and deconstruct the messier aspects of their relationship as huntsmen (and thus a form of warrior caste/mercenary, with the following tension in that relationship with the people they are trying to protect) and how the unpredictable nature of their changes results in as much positive and messier forms of change, for better or worse.

This got way longer than I thought it would.

[pruneunfair]

"My feelings on" part 5. How to get my husband on my side and how it properly tackles abuse, eating disorders, and relationships.

Another super popular manhwa that I can understand why it's so beloved. The Borgias were actual people in history that inspired characters like the protagonist Ruby, and the title itself already feels different since the world of OI is all about being a perfect badass woman, funnily enough, HTGMHOMS does this better than most.

Rudbeckia/Ruby starts off with the behavior of the og fls that a lot of OI make fun of. She is surrounded by what appears to be loving family members and is already being prepped to be married of to Izek, she looks excited and ready to do whatever her family wants until her inner monolog reveals how she really feels about them especially her older brother Cezar. She hates almost all of them and her real reason for being excited for marriage is so she can get away from her abusive household and avoid death which shouldn't be hard since the transmigrator doesn't plan on poisoning her sister in law like og Ruby did. She's a master of hiding her feelings already which is attributed to her past life in a similarly abusive adoptive household.

Right off bat, Ruby is shown to be strong in the mental sense. Not only is she walking on eggshells she also suffers from an ED (likely bulimia), there a quite a few scenes where she's throwing up, refusing to eat a lot, or in later chapters, eating a lot more out of stress. Her family too is whole new level of psychological horror. They aren't cartoonist evil, for example Pope Borgia is usually kind to his daughter and treats her with respect until he feels like she's defying him, all of a sudden that kind caring nature is gone, then he becomes threatening, or her older brother Cezar who has been abusing her for years both physically and sexually, he keeps her in place through fear, intimidation, and attacking her on occasion which is only enhanced after he kills Rubys bird and feeds it to his turtle which gives Ruby a phobia of turtles. It's actually heartbreaking with how eerily realistic it is when these types of people are easily placed like normal family members in certain scenes, because that's often how abusive family members blend in, almost no one knows what they are really like and if you looked at a first glance without context, you'd think "Ah yes, that's just a brother next to his siblings." They're never truly gone, they just know how to hide their true colors so well.

This is why Ruby is so much stronger than a lot of people give her credit for, she's dealing with all of this at the same time and her only hope of respite is being as far as possible from her home country. It's easy to jump to the conclusion that Ruby is just a weak stereotypical protagonist everytime you see her pretend to fawn over Izeks presence but if you read further, you'd know that Ruby doesn't like it any better but she thinks she's doing what's right to avoid Izeks Wrath since she's the only one who knows what he is the one who kills the og Ruby in the novel.

Speaking of which, while Izek isn't my favorite ML ever, I still was shocked to find that I liked the typical cold nobleman persona on him. Unlike a lot of ML's Izek is allowed to be flawed and his negative traits and moments aren't brushed aside, they cause some issues like Ruby going out of her way to appear dainty and sweet so Izek won't kill her. He acknowledges how he has hurt her and grows from it and doesn't push her boundaries. It's possible for the cold Duke archetype to work but a lot of the time, the whole war hero past gets thrown to the side for baseless fan service or they're just unapologetically abusive. Izek however is in the in between. His cold and dangerous persona stays consistent but that doesn't make him one note and he gets to have geninue moments of care for those in his life rendering Izek to still be likeable.

Ive noticed that the narrative also makes sense instead of twisting itself for a stupid chance at a fan service plot. An example is Ellen and Freya.

An unfortunate sideffects from the fandom was on and off hatred of Ellen for considering what Freya had to say, taking her side or not even choosing a side at all. The readers know that Freya tried to get Ruby killed by tricking her into going into a monster infested forest or when she tried to frame Ruby for poisoning her, but does Ellen know that? Realistically she's not going to immediately turn her back on Freya since they were childhood friends along eith Izek but that doesn't mean she screams at Ruby either. Ellen does care about Ruby but she knew Freya longer than she knew Ruby. From her perspective, it' makes sense that Freya would be innocent.

But perhaps the best part about Ellen that makes her my favorite character is how she notices the little details on others. She's the first to find out that Ruby has an eating disorder and it's not out of nowhere either, Ellen and Izeks late mother also suffered from a eating disorder that Ellen witnessed more than once so it gives an explanation on how she can tell what Ruby is going through.

Side characters are treated just as well as the main cast too. From the other guards to the friendly monsters to minor antagonist and even the children are all given attention to be their own beings, it doesn't have to be a lot since most of what I mentioned are minor characters but then you got characters like Ivan who has a life outside of just being by Izeks side.

Out of all the side characters I gotta say the monsters are my favorites. It makes me wish there was a side story where Ruby successfully runs away forever and lives as a little witch with monster companions.

Of course like all media, HTGMHOMS has its flaws but I think I'll chill on this one since the flaws aren't large enough to ruin it and I want to stay positive on something I like for once.

Conclusion: This is a story that does such an amazing job with its commentary. Instead of just saying "Cezar abused Ruby in the past! Feel bad for her now!" For example, we are given actual flashbacks to respect the show don't tell rule. Other characters besides Ruby suffer from their own traumas and they get their own arcs on their hardships and how they recover from it, it handles eating disorders and trauma responses in a respectful way that has an actual effect on the plot. Most of all, it does all of this with the type of protagonist that has been deemed as "weak" before in the manhwa community. Ruby isn't a boss girl who is always successful and smart. She makes reckless decisions, she cries, she isn't always able to one-up her enemies like Freya. She's a human woman stuck in a world that's not her own but she still rises to the task at hand even with all her blunders. Ironically making her more feminist then many of the female leads before her.

[tumblingxelian]

I have to admit I'm impressed with how awful a father CRWBY made Taiyang while giving him a veneer of reasonability.

To the point that his ability to just spout off things reminds me of an Aunt and Uncle who have no idea just how badly they are painting themselves.

As in - when he makes a judgement call about how Yang lost her arm that fits it into his "Over dependence on his semblance" it's incredibly telling about him not ever actually asking anyone about what happened.

It means he never talked to Yang about it, or even you know offered because while Yang wouldn't have said everything she'd probably have said a little.

Or talked to any of the students who probably got information about what happened from Blake when she dragged Yang to safety. Which wouldn't have been much but probably included the fact that Blake was attacked by someone, Yang intervened.

Given that students presumably died when Beacon fell and that Yang was a first year student... Like by itself, Yang being alive enough for a teammate to save her is a victory.

Nevermind context of her going up against someone that fought Blake, who came back injured herself, and Adam probably did get ID as going around killing students. So the fact that Yang was vastly outclassed would have been known, you know if Taiyang asked at all about "What happenend". Or worse - he did and still blames Yang. Like what did he expect her to do - leave Blake to die? Yang got Blake enough room to run, Blake used the opportunity to get both of them out of there but Yang bought that opportunity for Blake.

Meanwhile I'm looking forward to the Belladonnas actually talking to Yang. Because I don't think it's an accident that we didn't see said interaction before we started being shown in detail the grease fire of the Xialong Rose family.

From my perspective Tai is a rather interesting execution on the archetypical father on these fronts. IE, he's not a classic bad father the way Jac is, or the classic emotionally distant husk archetype. Yet to me, he is still 100% a big problem and done a lot of harm to Ruby & Yang with lackluster parenting & 'teaching'.

As outlined here.

I think this is one of the reasons why a lot of people struggle to actually see him as flawed even when e gets basic facts wrong.

Another reason is just how much undue credit men are given by default that women have to earn. Hence lots of people shrugging off Qrow's drinking or Ozpin's manipulation, or Ironwood's authoritarianism until they couldn't anymore.

Though being more charitable, I would also note how CRWBY often play these characters against their more traditional archetypes to help offset the audiences presumptions.

For instance,

Ozpin is a mysterious headmaster of an adventurers school but he's the 'fun' headmaster who both helps the kids go on adventures but unlike certain other headmasters sends an adult escort with them.

Or Ironwood, he's a big military hard liner who wants more tech, bigger weapons and to throw his military around. But he asks about the kids, he jokes casually, he's not just some General Ripper.

& Qrow of course is the bitter veteran and mentor, who is super badass & drinks/smokes, but in contras, he's also seemingly functional, friendly and clearly has a good rapport with his nieces.

Its easy to see why people saw those aspects and were willing to ignore things like:

Ozpin sending teenagers into terrorist dens, Ironwood backstabbing his allies while making himself out to be the victim, and Qrow's blatant dependence on alcohol to function.

Cos CRWBY made them characters & not archetypes.

So when the shit hit the fan and subtext became text, subtly problematic behavior became blatantly problematic and festering problems once seen as comedic now had real weight.

I feel Tai fits the same mold, he's on the surface 'functional', he definitely cares, and even seems to do some 'fun dad' stuff. He just also as no idea how Yang's Semblance works, & was absent or otherwise none functional for so long its left deep scars on Yang having to keep the family together & Ruby outright says Yang raised her.

He's in many ways a more realistic and nuanced portrayal of a dysfunctional or toxic parent who may not obviously have issues the way an open abuser like Jac, or an absentia parent like Raven might but can still do harm.

Also excellent breakdown on how the surrounding context of the Fall of Beacon. Team RWBY are first years, Blake is an incredibly experienced combatant, Yang had been put through the ringer. Literally everything was on fire and even people like Ozpin died.

The fact the whole team made it out at all is nothing short of a miracle. But accepting that "Sometimes bad things happen" is a surrender of power, its an admission that there was nothing to be done and that is terrifying. Especially for a man whose had two of the most important people in his life vanish on him without a trace.

He wants there to be something in Yang to blame because then there is something that can be done about it. Add in his clear and overtly stated projection of Raven onto her, and hos incoherent his reads on her personality are given Yang's addressed stuff like stubbornness & strategy well before this.

& you get a parent making being dismembers in a no win situation against a more powerful opponent the victims fault while giving vague, generalist advice to feel like they're doing something.

Gosh I want them to just adore her, and her to adore the Belladonna's.

Thanks for the ask, and good luck on that essay you mentioned, remember to tag me ;)

[kindheart525]

unpopular opinions on the fim show?

I’m not entirely sure how many of these opinions are unpopular in the fandom as a whole, but they seem kind of uncommon compared to what shows up in my feed so here goes

Pinkie’s family is not abusive or toxic. I know they are portrayed as extremely old-fashioned and strict in their lifestyle, based on what is probably a surface-level understanding of Amish communities. This makes it easy to compare them to similar communities irl who engage in practices like shunning. But the Pies’ behavior in the show and especially Pinkie’s attitude towards them seems to make clear that they have not shunned or abused her despite her “leaving the community.” In other words, I think there are key differences between the Pies and some of the real-life people they were meant to emulate, so it’s inaccurate to say that abusive Pie headcanons have any real basis in the show. I wrote more on this opinion here.

Zephyr Breeze is not nearly as likely to be a deadbeat dad as some might think. He was shown to be on the road to being more responsible by the end of his own debut episode, so I highly doubt he’d be the same pony he was at the beginning of the episode by the time he would become a father. Not that I don’t think he could be at least a little bit irresponsible as a dad; I just don’t think he’d leave his child or not love them. I wrote more on this opinion here.

Amending Fences was a missed opportunity for a very important friendship lesson, one that the show never dared to touch. Which is that sometimes people are incompatible and sometimes your old friends won’t forgive you. Instead, Moondancer was written in an extremely exaggerated way (her whole life was ruined by one rejection??) yet this wasn’t regarded as an overreaction at all. It was weirdly handled at best. I wrote more on this opinion here.

Rarity gets a bad rap from the fandom. I don’t know if it’s her mediocre taste in stallions or if there’s something about her ultra-feminine nature that some people don’t care for, but I think her maturity and intelligence are severely underrated. Of course she can be a drama queen, but so can Twilight and Pinkie and pretty much every other member of the main cast. Rarity had a breakdown over getting a fashion piece critiqued, but Twilight blew up at her friends over having a late paper; the two scenarios really aren’t that different.

Just because Rarity has multiple crushes on mediocre stallions (Blueblood, Trenderhoof) doesn’t mean that she would sleep around or have a tumultuous love life. Haven’t most people had celebrity crushes? Multiple celebrity crushes, in fact, and also multiple crushes and relationships involving people they actually know before finding “the one”? I’m sure a lot of people have also been disappointed to find out the celebrity they fancied is actually a terrible person, like Rarity has. It’s part of the human experience for many, and Rarity’s TWO moments of poor judgment are not a reflection of her whole character or even her full palate of romantic taste.

Along with being a drama queen, Rarity can have moments where she’s materialistic and selfish, like the time she convinced Spike to give her his fire ruby. That was not a good moment for her. But on a bigger picture, materialistic and selfish is not her usual state. She is literally the element of generosity!!! She made Gala dresses for all of her friends FOR FREE! She has also shown herself to be a leader among her friends, at times taking charge and coming up with plans in Twilight’s absence much like Applejack does sometimes. One example is Castle Sweet Castle; the whole premise of the episode was Rarity’s idea! To help Twilight feel more at home! It’s clear that her generous spirit informs her actions through most of the show, unlike Rainbow Dash who’s only truly loyal when the plot needs her to be.

Yes Rarity is flawed, but all her friends are too. Her flaws are not objectively worse than the others. In fact, Rarity was literally under mind control once and still regarded Spike as a genuine friend, while Rainbow Dash sold one of her best friends into indentured servitude completely sober (among a long list of other things). Twilight yelled at her friends that she didn’t need them, also with an unaltered mind. Rarity has had her own hurtful blowups ofc but hers aren’t any worse than the others. Give her more credit y’all.

Speaking of Rainbow Dash, I’ve seen a number of opinion posts about how she and Applejack should switch their elements (so RD is honesty and AJ is loyalty), but as I started rewatching the show myself I’ve come to disagree. Rainbow Dash may be honest, but her brand of honesty is extremely rude. There’s no integrity behind it, not like AJ’s honesty. Rainbow Dash in general is extremely rude. There are a lot of points where I’ve wondered if she even likes her friends. There was also that Secrets and Pies episode which establishes that Rainbow Dash has lied prolifically to Pinkie over something that meant a lot to the latter, so RD really isn’t that honest either. I do agree that AJ would deserve the element of loyalty if she didn’t already have honesty. But you know who else is loyal? Spike. The elements of harmony would honestly make more sense if RD were just removed from the group entirely and Spike replaced her as loyalty /hj

I promise I don’t actually want to remove Rainbow Dash from the show, I just really wish she was written better. That’s what fan fiction is for I guess 😂

I have mixed feelings about AppleDash as a ship. I really like the fandom portrayals of it which is why I reblog quite a bit of AppleDash art, but canon alone doesn’t seem to show the good side of their dynamic very much. All they do is argue. Applejack is normally mature and levelheaded, but around Rainbow Dash she’s much less so. Dash really brings out the worst in her sometimes. It’s much different from the loving bickering that people write for them in fan works, which I think is a better spin on the dynamic. If I went off their canon interactions alone, I could see them being exes or on-and-off lovers at most, not a stable, long-term married couple.

This would only be unpopular in very specific circles, but I think it’s pretty stereotypical to insist that Rainbow Dash and Applejack are lesbians primarily based on their tomboy interests and the former’s rainbow mane. It’s one thing to headcanon them as such just because you want to, and that’s perfectly fine! I write Applejack as a lesbian too. It’s another to insist that it’s canon based on xyz evidence from the show or think it’s wrong for anyone to ship them with stallions. Even if you consider AppleDash canon, one or both of them could be bi or pan for all we know. Canon tells us very little about their sexualities so there’s a lot of room for different headcanons. I wrote more on this opinion here.

(More specific to the next gen community) Just because Fluttershy is good with animals does not automatically mean she would be a good mother. There was a whole episode (Stare Master) about how she couldn’t handle babysitting even though she thought her animal caretaking skills made her qualified. Obviously she was shown to be much better with kids later in the show (becoming very popular among the School of Friendship students), but again that’s teaching, not parenting. This isn’t to say that I think Fluttershy would definitely be a bad mom, just that her being good with animals is not a solid reason for her being a good mom.

I definitely have more opinions about the show, characters, and fandom of mlp, but I don’t think many of them are so unpopular. Like for example:

I don’t think the Apples would be queerphobic just because they value tradition and are coded as Southern US Americans. The word “tradition” doesn’t automatically equate to conservative politics, and even if it did, these ponies have been shown to learn new things all the time. But all the trans Big Mac positivity I’ve been seeing tells me that a lot of people agree with that sentiment.

I don’t think most of the popular/generic ships of the fandom (like FlutterCord, FlashLight, and SoarinDash) are necessarily bad or devoid of positive chemistry, they’re just way too often written in extremely boring and generic ways. But I’ve also seen such ships written in unique and interesting ways so I think there a lot of people who also understand that sometimes all they need is a more creative approach.

Episodes like Over A Barrel, Bridle Gossip, and She’s All Yak (among others) were horribly handled and should not have been written. I don’t even consider them canon. I don’t know about the larger fandom, but most of the next gen community that I interact with feels the same way.

I think Starlight’s backstory was stupid and contrived, but it seems like the whole fandom thinks so too. We’re all rewriting it lmao

[chaikachi]

Grief, Guilt, and Bloodied Hands

cross posted from twitter I want to talk about this episode's use of 'bloodied hands' and how it ties into Ruby as well as Rosegarden. This post does get *dark* tho & includes shots from some of the more distressing scenes of v9e8 so please tread with caution.

I don't really have to get into detail with how this episode was framed with saving Oscar until last being what pushed Ruby over the edge and why that's important. It's very clear to everyone that saw it. But let's talk about how we get there.

Ruby's aura broke when she fell from the chandelier and then she was tossed around by a few of Neo's puppets while Oz is left out of frame until the very end. It is only then that she starts to show welts and bruises, at the other end of Long Memory. Before vs After:

We can see she's got her own blood on her hands here. The way they use this particular visual cue is threefold.

The first thing it's symbolic of is her own inner wounds. How much they've hurt her, how they've led her here, & where they're leading her next. Also in the most literal meaning of the metaphor, this is emphasized by Ruby's 'death' being on her own hands by the end of the episode.

The second is that those 'inner wounds' of hers are partially the lives of all the people she couldn't save. Her grief and her guilt.

And the third association is being symbolic of the people she hasn't lost yet. Specifically Oscar. Which we can tell because immediately after that last image (the first time we're shown the blood), we see her hand grabs her weapon before she defends herself.

This is followed by the cane falling before we're shown that the blood on her hands is now Oscar's. The first time she's able to use Crescent Rose all volume and this is how she's rewarded for it.

At the beginning of this episode, she pushes Little away because she's convinced that if they stay with her, they'll end up dead too. I will get to them next, but first this confirms something very strongly:

That Ruby is afraid to move forward. Not just because of her past, but also because of her fear for the future.

In her monologue in the v4 finale, she says the following:

"Believe me when I say I know it can feel impossible. Like every single day is a struggle against some unstoppable monster we can never hope to beat... but we have to try. If not for us, then for the people we've already-... for the people we haven't lost yet."

This sequence is literally all of Ruby's motivations and fears combined into one torturous nightmare.

"If you stay with me, you're going to end up dead too."

She is being tricked into believing that if she stays with her friends, with Oscar, the same will happen to them.

That idea is what breaks her for the first time this episode before she's interrupted by the cat.

Brief sidestep to mention that the way they frame this particular shot implies that Yang is of similar if not equal importance to Ruby here. Cause yes I'm looking at this specifically through an RG lens, but it is very important to acknowledge this scene included more than just 'shipping fuel' in how much Oscar means to her. This is her character arc, her fatal flaws, and the importance of multiple relationships she has. It started with her grief toward Pyrrha & co., an emphasis on her grief and closeness to Penny, wrapped up with the fear of losing Oscar, and then everyone else.

Ruby first reaches for the tea after watching Oscar fall & is interrupted by the cat. But even when she later comes back to her choice, we are not allowed to forget just how much that scene hurt her. Because as Little is begging her to get up and run, they are holding onto that bloodied left hand that pulled the trigger.

When Neo... does what she does to them, the narrative is telling us that Little as well as the blood on Ruby's hands (and all the things it's associated with) combined together to steal all her remaining light away.

"The light of hope is taken."

"If you stay with me, you're going to end up dead too."

She is proven right twofold.

First, with the illusion of Oscar.

Then again with Little who is very much not a mirage. "If I stay or go back home, my friends will die. I stayed here, and another did die."

And she, quite literally, can't live with that thought.

-

I don't thinkg Oscar's very loud absence or the similarities between him and Little as I've mentioned in other posts, compounded with both of them being used by Neo as the last piece to get Ruby to 'break' are a coincidence. And while I'll admit this episode was flawlessly executed, I am manifesting that this show never gets that dark again because I don't think I can take it.

Thank you for reading, and pls manifest that reunion hug. 😭 🌹🌲

[ceriseisland]

Who do you think is the most well written character in pokespe (consistent characterization, effective thematic throughline, etc)

I mean it's Ruby hands down. He's one of the only dexholders who actually has a want/need setup, let alone one who follows through on it. Most dexholders who do have a want/need get their arcs half-assed, like Crystal just telling Silver to share his life with people in HGSS. Most change arc dexholders also don't follow through with showing how their flaw hurts the people around them. Platina's "I lied and hurt you" speech is like a jumpscare because she spent five volumes lying to her friends without any negative impact, until suddenly we're told (not shown) that it's been a problem the whole time. When Ruby hurts someone, he hurts them. Relationships get ruined, people get hurt, and the impacts of his bad decisions have major effects on the plot. That's a well-written change arc. It's the same thing with creating immersion in a story: giving actions and plot beats real, lasting consequences is your fastest ticket to an engaging story. (Btw read creating character arcs by km weiland)

Ruby is solid thematically too, especially in RS. RS's main theme revolves around the idea that the past is a tangled mess that can fuck people up irredeemably, but love is still strong enough to save them. You see it in Ruby and Courtney and Wallace and Winona and even Norman. I could talk forever about this so I won't go into it here, but things like Ruby's relationship with Sapphire being about love transcending the way the past messed everything up, Feebas's loyalty, and Courtney's speech about how bad people do crazy things to protect the ones they love all leads into this, and I'm fully in the camp that the Celebi reveal isn't deus ex machina. Ruby realized that real beauty comes from love and not the shallowness his trauma led him to believe (among other things that happened in the climax I don't have time to write out) and his reward is turning back the clock. In a story about how the past messes people up so badly it can lead to the end of the world, I think the time diety gifting them with a second chance is a good resolution.

As for consistency Ruby's mostly good, though past RS it's less character arc-focused and more realistic about how fast a teenage boy can unlearn hardwired trauma responses. I know some people think he's ooc in the beginning of ORAS, but I don't think that's true. Another looming disaster scares him back into his old coping methods, and he lies to control Sapphire's (and his) reality while he searches for someone who will tell him the meteor isn't real. When he learns it's actually happening he has another breakdown that sloughs off the acting he armors himself in. Ruby is his truest self when the threat of annihilation hammers desperation and fear into him, and that hasn't changed since his first appearance

[invested-in-your-future]

Looking back, its interesting that everything you mentioned about the kingdoms are their flaws, or at least they seemed so from the way that you described them (I could be misinterpreting). Is there any kingdom you've created where you would say their virtues outweigh their flaws?

In a way, so far, the worldbuilding serves as Salem's argument in a metaphorical debate of sorts - as she says, those flaws are the nature of humanity - a cyclical conclusion to civilization's progress.

Each Kingdom faces different issues brought upon by its history - held together by tough decisions and secrets. With communications down and uncertainty creeping upon them all, the Kingdoms are tumbling towards their darkest moments.

Technically, I'd say every Kingdom has good and bad aspects to them. Just like how the first three Volumes had shown this bright and colorful Vale only to tear it apart, there's also good beneath the surface of Mistral.

To me, humanity and the finite time we have within our lives have always been at the core of the show - do a person's actions matter in the face of the inevitable? Can one person's beliefs and convictions make a difference within the larger, mostly indifferent world?

For me, Volume 2 soundtrack, "Die", has always been the epitome of the world post Fall of Beacon. (Even if the show never really does anything with that)

Vale is a mess, the worldwide communications have gone down, uncertainty reigns, and past wounds reopen as a multitude of eyes gaze at the power vacuum, seeing their chance within the decaying status quo.

Till now, the boundaries of safety that the setting of Vale provides had sheltered the four leads(and the audience), but that was torn away, revealing a darker world beneath childhood naivety that Roman spoke of to Ruby, in turn tying the worldbuilding to the character conflict within her.

The four leads all long for simpler days of their youth when it was clear what they were fighting for - something that had been torn away from them as the world around them grew darker and more confusing.

But that doesn't mean that's all there is.

Vale has been shown as an epitome of peace and order, but it's a Kingdom enamored with the said status quo - to a fault. The Kingdom was powerless in the face of oncoming tragedy it desperately tried to avoid noticing. There's hate and anger and all the other ugly parts of humanity boiling beneath the surface, but that doesn't erase all the genuinely well-meaning people the place harbors, too. It's a Kingdom that had committed terrible crimes in its past and had its fair share of tyrants, but no matter how flawed, there's a genuine effort to be better too. Some people genuinely buy into the idea of never repeating the past, while others look to other Kingdoms for an example of what theirs should be. The question is - when the façade of peace is torn apart, which instinct would prevail?

Mistral is mired in class division, obsession with traditions, and bygone days, but beneath that, it's also a place that has weathered terrible tragedies and rebuilt itself again and again. If only the Kingdom were to overcome its obsession with titles and past grievances, it could reach great heights.

Atlas is a rigid society that had shackled itself with rules as it attempted to separate from the shadow of Mantle looming over them. Great minds have dedicated themselves to the betterment of humanity - the kingdom of progress and innovation. And if not for the folly that comes with that progress, lots of what the Kingdom of Atlas is doing could indeed make the world a better place.

Vacuo is a destroyed, scarred wasteland - its government torn apart, never having rebuilt after the Great War. The population is scattered amongst a few fortified cities as it struggles to survive with limited resources and rebuild. Even against the harshest conditions and anarchy, humanity still survives and thrives, and Vacuo's citizens have developed a pretty unique worldview when it comes to the issues prevalent in other Kingdoms.

I don't think there are "bad" and "good" Kingdoms - just like humanity as a whole, it's an ongoing conflict between the self-destructive ugly nature that Salem believes defines humanity and that flicker of hope and progress that Ozpin clings to.

For now, the world is on the brink of collapse, though. And the darker, flawed aspects of each Kingdom become more prevalent as order falls apart.

Will the better, more positive sides of those Kingdoms shine through? That remains to be seen.

[dragynkeep]

I genuinely could have excused the whole lying to Ironwood cheap subplot if the show had done two things;

1 - Replaced those scenes in which RWB sip tea at the manor feeling sorry for themselves with the scenes where the two of them (not all three because I admit that someone physically capable has to protect Nora and the others who for whatever reason didn't evacuate to the underground IIRC) with scenes in which they either join the Atlesian army and actually fight Salem and the grimm or went to Mantle to kill the grimm there, or they split forces to help both. This at least would've shown that the heroes' actions match their words. "This is my home. And I'm not giving it up without a fight", my ass.

2 - In the Ever After they continued to elaborate on the heroes' despair and have them think that it's their actions that led to so many deaths and destruction. And the narrative wouldn't brush off Ruby's doubts and regrets as a flaw like "If you as much as presume that we didn't do everything less than perfect then there must be something wrong with you, don't listen to that demon on your shoulder whispering that evil shit to you"

It may not have been enouch to "save" the show from the clownery it proudly presents as a mOrAlY gRaY cONfLicT, but at least there would've been a good theme about how sometimes even with one's utmost benevolent intentions, they can still end up making horrible mistakes, good intentions don't necessarily make you a good person. And the characters wouldn't have been such blatant hypocrites lmao. I mean that manor scene proves that these characters have no idea who they are and what they've gotten into.

It's so annoying because these are simple ways to not make me wanna pull my own teeth out whenever the show tries to do anything interesting with the plot. The whole lying to Ironwood plotline could've been good, and in V7 it WAS good because it was setting everything up for Ruby to realise that, like Ozpin, it's hard to know when to trust when you've been betrayed and hurt before.

But the show doesn't want Ruby to be wrong. Every time it's brought up that she, and Team RWBY as a whole, fucked up, they just hide behind sad eyes and that they tried so that's all that matters. When no, just because you had good intentions doesn't mean you're washed of the consequences of those actions you made.

And while Ruby was slightly saved in V9 with how she was actually reacting to everything she did, WBY are just horrible people and horrible characters.

Who cares about the people that died in our plan, or the lives displaced or the impoverished kingdom forced to clean up our mistakes? We did our best so that's that, and anyone who still calls us out is like the comically evil Ironwood who wanted to bomb the poor.

No wonder the FNDM has a poor comprehension of grey morality and actual good writing if this is the show they stan so hard.

[cdevill]

I don't own Rwby and spoilers ahead for Volume 1. This will be a review/impression of the first volume.

The story in this volume could have been done better.

I feel like the team was trying to do too much but with very little time. In my opinion, they only should have focused on the girl's because they're the main characters and how they've been marketed to be the four leads. Sure, we could have Pyrrha, Jaune especially during the exam process. It shows we have other people that we can come back to but later when we have more resources to make episodes longer. We do have to sacrifice Jaune's arc for the moment but in exchange, we get more screen time for the girls. Ruby and Weiss could have had more time to flesh out their relationship instead of wrapping everything up in a few minutes. Yang can also get some development or even have her and Blake warm up to each other. It felt like they were trying to cover too much. When in reality, they should have been more picky.

Now, I'll give a pass to the animation because it is fairly back in the day and while it's rough. I can understand their restraints on animation.

I do like how Ruby is trying to prove herself and show off because she is two years younger than everyone else. We know it's because no one can take her seriously. Which is why she does her best to impress Weiss. Whom she already annoyed and had a bad first impression earlier in the volume. It's a nice touch that I can understand. Even if it caused more problems, it's an understandable fault.

However, I don't like what they did with Jaune nor with Cardin. I'll get into them both in another post because that's quite the explanation.

Blake does get some development with how she is so quiet and off putting because of her past. It's justified and it helps with her goal to improve Fanus stance in the world. Speaking of the Human and Faunus relationship, Blake's and Sun's past actions only further Weiss's negative stance on the Faunus. Blake being secretive and Sun evading the law. We know Weiss doesn't like the Fanus and let's use it to make her have a character flaw. She's racist, because all her life. She has heard nothing but bad things about the Fanus. It doesn't help that they stole from her Family's Business.

It could be a fault that Weiss has to acknowledge and work on, she has many reasons to not like the faunus but she needs to learn that the actions of a few does not represent the whole. Therefore working on her racism.

Weiss just going, "I don't care." Is not an adequate reasoning to openly accept Blake with such open arms. Weiss has been shown to dislike Ruby for quite a while and Blake should not be exempt from the rule.

If we had more time, Ruby and Yang would try to convince Weiss to give Blake a chance. Weiss obviously refuses because of her negative experiences with the faunus and doesnt search for Blake. Weiss is alone at school while she let's Yang and Ruby search for Blake. Weiss is questioned by Ozpin on why she is alone and Weiss speaks about Blake. She expects Ozpin to discharge Blake but he doesn't before explaining to Weiss on Blake's perspective. If all you do is say that someone is a monster and keep hurting them. They will become that monster. He tells Weiss to think it over and she begrudgingly does. Weiss, doesn't want too but she has to do it because of her own selfish reason. Thus, it's not a, "I don't care" but, "I need to be the best and that requires my team to be the best. I'll give you a chance but only because of what I want."

This helps to let Weiss have character development and motivation. She may not trust Blake or any faunus but we have seeds be planted for that eventual dynamic.

Weiss is not buddy buddy with any faunus including Blake. Indicating that Weiss still has a cold outlook about the faunus. This tells the audience. That despite working on her flaw, not everyone can be perfect. That they will still have issues in the future. It will take time for Weiss to work through this flaw.

Yet we lose something like this because of...Jaune and his arc.

Heck, we can even have Ruby and Yang have development. Yang trying to get Ruby to not only rely on her big sister is trying too hard to push Ruby away. This can further their relationship as Ruby realizes that the job she wants, will not always allow Yang to be by her side. It'll help Ruby become more independent and realize that as the leader. She can't look to other people for help or for comfort.

Yet the plot has to keep being pulled back to Jaune's unnecessary long arc.

I do like Sun, as to show that Im not all up in arms about new people. His introduction and screentime is where Blake screen time is and doesn't take away from Blake. Sun tries to get Blake to accept help and contributes to her arc. If Jaune could have been used like this more often than I wouldn't hate his character as much.

For example, when Ruby is looking for Blake. Jaune comes to Ruby's aid this time and says being a leader is tough. As everyone relies on them to fix their problems and the problems with the team. The two can mutually bond about the situation and Ruby knows that she can rely on Jaune. As a emotional pillar and they can be good friends because of their circumstances. This helps establish Jaune as a kind individual willing to help or even just hear his friends out. It didn't take four episodes to establish him but just two minutes of screen time. As someone Ruby can relate too and vice-versa.

Instead, Jaune serves to just take time away from the girls with 4 episodes dedicated to him. Who still need development and to be fleshed out a lot more.

Blake is quite enjoyable at least in my opinion. I might be in the few who do like her but I can see why others don't like her.

Ruby and Yang need more time dedicated to their sibling relationship. As it would develop both characters, two birds, one stone and mentioning of possible Weiss development is above. This would help to improve the first volume somewhat as Jaune and the side characters would be sidelined. However, since Ruby, Weiss, Blake and Yang are the main characters. It is imperative that the entire first volume be focused on those four. We can add other characters later.

Overall, I'll give this volume a 5/10. It's not the worst I have seen but the unfocused nature of the volume with its characters does drag it down. Dubbing down Jaune and Cardin to a simple bully relationship also hurts the show. However, Blake and The Fanus situation serve to add life to the world. At least in my opinion, and Ruby is a pretty nice character for this volume. However, more could have been done with her.

[novankenn]

2am - General Response to Complaints

FIRSTLY, again, I will APOLOGIZE for not correcting the story tags when I chose to let the story evolve in the way it has. That is my fault and there is no excuse for this mistake.

Characters - Sorry to break everyone’s bubble… but characters are plot devices… it is their reactions, actions and lack there of, to external and internal situations that push a plot forward.

Portrayal of Pyrrha - Yes, I have Pyrrha as recovering Alcoholic/Addict… which why her actions as I portray them are to quite a few readers horrendous, they are also portrayed in the light that she was severely under the influence…

 Alcohol/Drugs alter and lower inhibitions, often changing personalities in the process. A meek person who over indulges can turn violent.

I have seen this, and actually been a victim of this…

I also knew a couple that because of alcohol lead to a man kicking in the head of the mother of his children, killing her.

Additional point in case it was missed, though it is implicitly stated in the summary… Pyrrha’s fame finally crushed her, and she took up an unhealthy coping mechanism…

SOMETHING TO CONSIDER : It hasn’t been addressed yet… but there is a strong possibility/implication that Pyrrha has been repeatedly raped due to her addiction (you can’t give consent if you’re blacked outed/incapacitated by alcohol)

Cheating - Jaune and Pyrrha were ONLY a couple in the loosest sense of the word until just after Azalea’s third birthday. So anything that happened from that point forward isn’t cheating, it is Pyrrha, caught in a self-destructive downward spiral because of her addiction(s).

Pyrrha Not feeling like Pyrrha - Sorry to burst any bubbles here, but ANYONE who uses Pyrrha past Volume 3 (where she dies as a plot device to give Jaune justification to chase after Cinder/assist Ruby) has to make her “feel” less like cannon Pyrrha. RT/Monty made her one dimensional… she was just wholly a plot device She had no growth, she was just there to train Jaune and then die. Giving her any growth means interpreting what she would be like if she had lived through vol 3. This story happens after GRADUATION.

Azalea - again a plot device as all characters are, and as in RL children of broken relationship are often a point of conflict for the parents.

Azalea wanting her parents back together - is not a conflict between Jaune-Pyrrha…is actually a conflict between Azalea-Jaune, neither Jaune nor Pyrrha control what their daughter wants/thinks.

She’s only there to give Jaune/Pyrrha a reason to still be in each other’s lives, and that is correct to a point, but she is also there to show that originally Jaune x Pyrrha had a good relationship that fell apart.

She is also a lynch/influence for Jaune and Pyrrha to deal with the baggage between them.  Could this lead to a romantic reconciliation? I do not know.

Pyrrha Character Assassination - sorry, but that’s not happening. I am at no time/place simply stating Pyrrha is a terrible person. The “She’s a Disaster” comment is another character stating their opinion… it’s not a fact.

Shitting on Arkos/Pyrrha - Sorry, I know it looks that way, but it is not happening, and regardless of your opinion if you read carefully you will see a fair bit of the “conflict” after the breakdown of the relationship is because of other people’s actions, and abuse of Pyrrha when she was under the influence.

Jaune has no flaws - He does… they're just not as obvious… Pyrrha’s flaw is right in everyone’s face (Alcoholism/Addiction)...

He’s not over Pyrrha (still holds a torch for her), he has a mental illness (Severe Depression) that leads him to self-harming behaviors

Prior to others forcing him to get help (which will be shown in a flashback) he attempts to commit suicide… this loving father who was denying to seek treatment was about to abandon the daughter he loves in the most permanent way possible. Yes, Depression is an illness, but choosing not to seek help/ignoring the need to get help is selfish.

I know this from personal experience - because I deal with this daily and now have to take mood stabilizers, anti-psychotics, and anti-depressants for the rest of my life.

He’s a coward… he has been avoiding/unable to follow through with having a complete separation from Pyrrha (hence others being able to torment him through their own malicious intent, through Pyrrha’s unlocked scroll)

He’s a COWARD… he has been avoiding coming out to his own daughter about the nature of his and Reese’s relationship. Azalea only sees Reese as “Daddy’s Special Friend”... he’s been avoiding for at least a year the conflict of a young child feeling that one of their parents was trying to replace the other parent

Support Structures -

Jaune - his family, his doctor, people from his gym, and Reese

Pyrrha - Her mother, her sponsor (David Scarlet), and her friends (Yang is implicitly named, but others are implied)

End Game/Story Arc - Pyrrha if you hadn’t noticed is going through a redemption arc. While pretty much all the prose is focused on Jaune and his struggles (so far) Pyrrha is getting herself out of the pit she had fallen into. It is obvious now that I have to show this fact in more explicit/obvious detail.

Some final notes… Alcoholism is a disease that compels you to drink to feel normal, but as a consequence it often leads to over indulgence as those afflicted continue to chase that feeling. It is NOT a choice 1.4% of the word’s population (that’s 1.1 million people) have alcohol addiction/dependency issues. SO it is not unreasonable for Pyrrha to suffer from this disease.

So this could be considered a long “rant” though it is not intended as such. It is a breakdown of what I was trying to portray in this story. Can I do better? Definitely. Should I have changed the tags once the end game evolved from an ARKOS relationship, YES I should have.

This will be the last time I discuss “complaints” with this story. If you don't like the story, that is totally acceptable. If you think it is terrible, again, that is perfectly reasonable. Personal tastes differ.

However, if you wish to discuss the story… consider instead of just complaining about why you don't like it, maybe offer some feed back on HOW it could be IMPROVED, or how I can correct flaws in my technique, writing style, or characterizations for future stories.

[swapauanon]

"Ozpin lied to Hazel about Salem's plans to trick him into sacrificing himself."

I find it amazing how people can say this and then get shocked when I ask them to tag their Ozpin bashing.

Besides, Hazel was murdering innocent people just to get back at Ozpin, over something his twin sister he constantly infantalizes chose to do.

Like, yes, Ozpin is a self-loathing wreck who blames himself for everything that's gone wrong, but in the end he didn't say ANYTHING about Salem he didn't believe was true.

Remember, what Salem said was: "Why redeem these humans when we can simply replace them with what they can never be?" meaning she was either plotting eugenics and genocide or had horrible grammar. Given that Salem's shown to be EXTREMELY careful and deliberate with her word choice, I'm going to assume it was the former, because it would be REALLY frustrating for the entire conflict of the show to be based on bad grammar.

But NO!!! We need Ozma to be an evil baby-stealing monster who tried to kidnap Salem's children because she wasn't religious enough! Even though, y'know, one of the first things Oz did after coming back to life was disobey Light by seeking out Salem.

But sure! It TOTALLY isn't bashing Ozpin to suggest he just tried to kidnap his daughter's from Salem, let's just ignore the ACTUAL grammatical structure behind Salem's words to make Oz look as evil as possible!

And besides, even if Ozpin DID lie to Hazel, SALEM WAS COMMITTING GENOCIDE IN ATLAS!!! She was siccing her Grimm on civilians at that point! And Hazel was complicit in it, and blaming Ozpin for his choices, claiming it was all in the honor of someone Salem had killed for trying to oppose the "Grimm eating children" party. But sure! Let's erase Hazel's misogyny in order to paint HIM as a poor, helpless victim of Ozpin's manipulations when he desecrated his sister's memory by helping the monster she died fighting destroy even more families!

"No more Gretchens, boy!" said the man who robbed a child of her mother JUST to "stick it to Ozpin", and has left countless Gretchens in his own wake.

Hazel even ADMITS that the only reason he's going after Ozpin is that he can't hurt Salem! So I don't think the show is going to be resolved by Team RWBY deciding "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em!" when it comes to the whole "How do we deal with Salem?" thing, because every character who's done that has been treated as being IN THE WRONG with no exceptions!

And let's not ignore the fact that, y'know, Oz had just gone through an entire character arc about being more open and honest. Him lying to Hazel to get him to dance to his whims would, from a narrative standpoint, be like if Ilia had joined forces with Salem to get back at Atlas. It would have rendered all of his prior development a waste of time!

So, rather than Salem plotting against the gods, i just think she's learned she CAN'T hurt them and so is doing what so many people (such as Hazel) have chosen to do when coming face-to-face with her, lash out at the people she CAN hurt because she thinks fighting the Brothers is a fruitless endeavor. The show isn't going to close out on vindicating Salem's methods, and she's not a fucking "anti-hero" as I've seen some people unironically call her: She's an unrepentant villain who lashes out at people she believes have no chance of fighting back, because she can't hurt the people who actually wronged her. That is what makes her Ruby's evil counterpart: She gave up while Ruby is still looking for a new solution!

But sure, let's just ignore the structure of the narrative and paint Ozma as a baby-stealing monster who abused his wife for religious reasons and drove her to villainy. Even though, y'know, his rhetoric is completely antithetical to Light's idea of a perfect world and he went out of his way to disobey him at the first opportunity he had.

The narrative has laid out who Oz and Salem are countless times now: Oz is a flawed-yet-well-intentioned man who blames himself for all of the world's ills (regardless of how responsible for them he actually is), and Salem an unrepentant monster who lashes out at the world around her due to being unable to harm those who actually wronged her.

Trying to paint Ozpin as being just as bad as, if not WORSE than Salem ever was is disingenuous at best.

[utilitycaster]

not to be all “only i like my blorbo correctly”, but i’m fully convinced that certain people would hate Imogen as a character if they actually engaged with her outside of “conventionally attractive sadgirl that’s one half of an aesthetically pleasing queer ship”. fully believe that if she looked like Chetney or Ashton or even Fearne, and didn’t come with a prepackaged ship, people would be forced to look at her as the complex, unique loose cannon that she is

Hey anon, I agree with much of this and I hope you don't mind if I go on what might be one of my weirder tangents/theories but this has been percolating for a few weeks and I think I've cracked the secret to one of the more toxic segments of the fandom.

I definitely think that if Imogen were not a woman, a lot of people would hate her (granted, a different group of people who hate her now would probably like her more if she were a man, because misogyny is extremely extant outside of the bubble, and even a little bit within the bubble, that is Tumblr). However, they'd be fine if she looked like Fearne...but many wouldn't be fine if she were also played by Ashley. Or yeah, if she weren't easily shipped with Marisha's character.

Here's the deal. When I and a number of other people were like "oh hey! Imogen is not really taking other people's feelings into consideration and is being rather insensitive about the Ruby Vanguard, given that they've killed half the party, particularly since she's literally known Laudna like 10 times longer than she's know her mother was alive" the attitude was "wow, you hate Imogen, you hate women, you're so unfair" and yet now, at a table that is half women (and a group of characters that literally has only one man) everyone who thought I hate Imogen and how if she were a man everyone would care is now literally just mostly ignoring her (and honestly like, everything) and instead constantly whining about how they miss Laudna. Which is frankly weak as hell, like, anyone who's loved Pike or Yasha is like "oh you must be new here", and at least people talking about Travis being missing during the gap between Bertrand's death and Chetney's arrival were making good memes. But I digress.

My theory, which I do admit is the most tin-foil hat I think I've gone, comes from some polls I've seen circulating complaining about queerbaiting in past shows, and also my recent interest in Glee as ground zero of really horrible fandom behaviors (thanks to people who have provided insight into that!) Anyway. I recently learned that apparently Quinn and Rachel was a really popular ship, for reasons I cannot, for the sake of what little decorum and kindness I am maintaining here, speculate on. Setting aside that this is not queerbaiting and it's wildly inappropriate and damaging to say it was, given that this show was full of queer characters and Quinn was shown hooking up with a woman, this has in fact clicked into place for me why people constantly ship Marisha and Laura's characters despite chemistry that is inconsistent at best and tepid on average. It's not terribly hard to draw lines from Quinn to Vex and Rachel to Keyleth, especially if you consider how fanon tends to handle these archetypes. Then they transferred this to just Laura and Marisha's characters in general, and here we are, and man if it hasn't gotten even more flavorless with every transfer.

So anyway yeah a lot of people really don't like Imogen much as a character unless they can project onto her, but because she's half of The Ship, they also will not tolerate any exploration of her flaws that could threaten The Ship and so they need to remove her agency and blame it on various rocks instead of Imogen being cranky and impatient as a person (like, again, if you want to interpret her powers as chronic pain, why are you not allowed to grant her the same complexity as Ashton, who is also cranky and impulsive?) But really the kicker is that if Marisha isn't physically onscreen, they start acting like a cat you locked out of the bathroom and simultaneously forget they're supposed to care about or enjoy Imogen as an individual.

[hamliet]

While I agree that since the 2000s, anti-hero/villain MCs have become more of a thing on TV and that nowadays anti-hero/villain MCs seem to have become more popular (not necessarily the majority, there are still plenty of good/heroic protagonists out there). I think it's important to point out that these characters most of the time still need to have some redeeming qualities for the majority of the audience to connect and get attached to them. I don't know if I'm the best person to explain my own thoughts, but let's try… For example, when I look at Eren and Tony (protagonists that were mentioned before).

Eren is caring, loves his friends, wants to protect them at all costs and wishes them to have happy lives.

Tony, despite everything, has shown to truly love his family and wants himself to live a happy live together with them. Tony also doesn't want his son to inherit the criminal activities that Tony inherited from his own father, he wants his son to have a clean life (and despite being a sociopath, we see Tony in therapy trying to understand his problems and inner demons to improve, be a better father and husband).

That said, I'll be fair here and say that none of these qualities change or justify the crimes and mistakes of both them. Eren Yeager destroyed lands and cruelly murdered thousands of people, In this process he pushed his own father to commit horrible acts and sacrificed his own mother. Not to mention how he betrays and hurts his friends. It is no wonder that at the end of the story it is undeniable that HE is the villain of his universe. Tony Soprano is a bad guy from the very beginning. He's a murderer and manipulator, he feels no remorse in doing any of these things. He's a bad husband who constantly cheats on his wife and rarely give her the emotional support she needs. He is also a bad father, especially to his youngest son. He has difficulty showing the love he feels for his son because he himself grew up in an environment where he was mistreated and rarely received demonstrations of love. Mostly due to Tony's bad parenting, his son grew up to be a depressed adult who attempted suicide.

Ultimately, while I think it's important for these characters to still have redeeming qualities so that the audience can connect with them, what I think that can make these kind of characters so captivating is their complexity. Is the need to dive deeper into these characters to understand them. Why they have those qualities, but at the same time have flaws that can be so contradictory to their qualities. How does this all relate?

I'm not familiar with The Sopranos, but yeah, from what you say I agree. I enjoy complexity in characters and I think it's also very important when writing a serious story--again, genre matters here.

Because as much as we want to "otherize" people who do atrocious, evil, horrific things... they are people. And the irony is that accepting this and seeing ourselves as not fundamentally "better" or "different" is a huge part of not ending up committing or supporting atrocities.

And that said, yeah, superhero stories and fairy tales and many shonens are not aiming to be that heavy, and that's okay. Genre does like... matter here. But there are ways to do complexity and a morally "good" protagonist in genre-appropriate ways too. Ruby Rose from RWBY, Charlie from Hazbin, etc.