#rewatching s4.....oh beth.

[rejoiceandcomplain]

BETH CHILDS !!!!

[cabeswaterdrowned]

☕️ + crazy ex girlfriend’s 4th season

I think overall I like season 4 as a concluding season for the show, certainly compared to a lot of other concluding seasons of shows I love it does a better job at what it sets out to do and that makes me I think more inclined to be generous with it (I’m used to really really hating the conclusions of things I love tbh because they can go so wrong, so when something is decent I think I’m easier on it than I would be if the same thing was in an earlier installment). I overall like what the season does with concluding Rebecca’s arc, there are places where I think it could be stronger (particularly the aspect of the season that’s supposed to be about Rebecca confronting her own privilege/white feminism doesn’t succeed as much as it thinks it does imo, but that also is part of the largest overall issue I have with the season which I’ll get into later) but other parts I think it succeeds with beautifully (I love the arc with Rebecca and her little brother, the final scenes with her mom this season, the realizations she comes to in the finale etc.), and I think Paula’s arc comes to a basically flawless conclusion. 

My biggest gripe with the season is in the treatment of WoC in the season. Particularly Valencia and Heather’s (who would be my second and third favorite chars on the show after Rebecca respectively) character arcs are so neglected compared to Rebecca Paula’s even Darryl’s even NATHANIEL’s and it makes me sad

:(. I’ve talked about this before but I really don’t care for the writers decision to treat Valencia’s sexuality in such a throwaway way rather than being willing to explore her feelings about it the way they did with Darryl. Her and Beth’s storyline being all about Valencia wanting to get married… it just does not work for me at all. I’ve seen justifications that the reason the writers approach Valencia differently is that she’s a different character who wouldn’t be into coming out with a song the way a character like Darryl would but like, these are written characters the writers are making those decisions… and there are so many ways you can explore a character’s sexuality that are unique to the character, that just seems like such a lame excuse to me. I have more unfavorable things to say about this take but I don’t want to get off topic, basically I feel like Valencia was majorly cheated out of her own arc in s4 and it is my biggest sticking point with the season, ngl partly because Valencia’s a character I actually identified with quite a bit so there’s bias at play there too even if I stand by my reactions. I don’t have a rant for Heather the way I do for Valencia but if I’d rewatched more recently I definitely would, some of the issues with Heather’s storyline do stem from the end of s3 (I sort of wish the surrogacy storyline had never happened). Even though I did like Paula’s storyline re: the women in the prison Rebecca was at those storylines had a lot of problems. And I think seeing how much room the writers were willing to give Nathaniel’s arc and place in the narrative vs Valencia and Heather was also really disheartening to me, and I don’t particularly like Nathaniel so that does effect my relationship with those choices but I think even if I had much more of an affinity for his character than I do, it would still be revealing of the writers priorities to me and not in a good way. 

I don’t mind the meta-ness of the season but that’s probably because I’m more inclined to like that type of humor than a lot of people, I get why others had complaints about it. Idk what else I have to say about the season really? The songs aren’t as good as earlier seasons but the ones that slap (particularly Love’s A Game and Hello Nice To Meet You) were bangers imo. oh and I LOVE the Halloween episode, it actually has many beats designed specifically for my enjoyment and unlike many other episodes I did like Valencia and Heather’s roles in it a lot.

thanks for the ask!

(send me a ☕️ + a topic and I’ll give you my honest opinion of it!)

[nickmillerscaulk]

beth “oh terrific thank you” boland

[twdmusicboxmystery]

TWD 11x21: Outpost 22 - Analysis, Part 2

Morning TD-ers! Hope you all had a fantastic Halloween. Mine was super fun. I have a lot more to say about this episode over the next few days, and I can tell a lot of people are freaking out about the Connie/Daryl interactions. I’ll address that. I promise. But what with the holiday, I’m running a bit behind and catching up on things. Give me a few days.

For now, just know we’re not at all worried about it. No reason you should be. It’s very clear that while tptb are teasing Donnie a bit, such as on TTD, it’s also a massive distraction. I’ll get to that later in the week. 

Here’s a relatively short convo between me and @wdway. We do talk about Donnie somewhat and also the significance of the Ws around the railroad tracks, which we also saw heavily in 4b.

@twdmusicboxmystery:

I watched the episode already. It was awesome. It felt a bit transitional, with lots of action, but there was also TONS of stuff for us to discuss. It was very Maggie-centric (the montage at the beginning was mostly about her) and we finally got that weird scene from the promo where she's lying with that walker (of the purplish pants) next to the tracks. What it is, is interesting. It's really a matter of the perspective of that shot doesn't show what the walker actually is. You'll understand when you watch.

(I sent this before all my pals had watched the episode. What I meant is that the walker was a child, and that wasn’t entirely clear from the shot of her lying with him next to the tracks.)

But there's tons of symbolism and a lot of callbacks to S4/Terminus. Not Terminus itself, but what leads up to it. The end of this episode feels a lot like the end of 4x15. And thinking about that, it just feels like everything is on track for Beth to return. Like, she wasn't at Terminus. She wasn't in 4x15. But if this is a retelling of that, well, then maybe the final three episodes of S11 will parallel 4x16 and 5x01.

And of course, Daryl didn't find Beth until 6-8 episodes later, depending on how you look at it. But of course, we'll be going into the spinoff, so.... Also, the Donnier's are gonna pounce all over this episode. Unfortunately. There's some Daryl/Connie interaction. Nothing that will worry us, but you know the shippers are gonna have a heyday. Oh well. Anyway, it's a great episode. Leaves us on kind of a cliffhanger of what's to come.

@wdway​:

There were a lot of numbers being thrown around in this episode. One of them, near the end, was 301=s3e1. I thought how well placed that was and what it would mean in the story. That number caught my attention because it's part of my address, haha. 

I'm going to mention one thing that if you don't already know you might want to be aware of before you rewatch. I know I certainly am going look for it, or I should say listen to it. Right as the closing credits come on the first credit is.

@twdmusicboxmystery:

Oh weird. I totally didn’t notice that. I wonder who she was. Maybe one of the people may the labor camp? Or a walker, which would be the obvious thing.

@wdway:

It showed immediately as the first end credit and wasn't there for very long. I caught it out of the corner of my eye and had to go back to check it out to see if I actually saw her name. I racked my brain. Where was she? Then thought, we probably did not see her, but heard her. I think you'll know who I'm talking about, and I really don't think that will ruin anything for anyone else.

The scenes with Connie were sweet but I did not at all feel there was any romantic overtones at all. Then again, I also don't see romantic with him and Carol. I really felt that the Carylers were going to have a field day with Carol reaching over and taking Daryl's hand. That one, they will run wild with.

I think YNB is the voice on the radio with Rosita.

@twdmusicboxmystery:

Ah okay. Yeah, I’m sure you’re right. That makes sense.

(This was confirmed on TTD. Yvette Nichole Brown was the voice Rosita talked to on the radio near the end.)

Yeah good point. Daryl interacting with various female characters and the shippers always freak out.

@wdway:

I also thought the writers made a point of showing Carol hug Gabriel. I didn't see a lot of difference in how she hugged him as she does Daryl. But they definitely did not have Daryl hugging Connie, that's for sure.

There's something that AK said and her portion at the end about FG and Rosita's relationship and I thought it's funny that they've never came out and said that about Carol and Ezekiel. If you don't know what I mean, I'll wait and explain maybe tomorrow.

(@wdway has a good point here. This was AK confirming their breakup. While obviously they’ve talked about Zeke and Carol’s separation, because it’s a thing on the show, they’ve never said with finality, “okay they’re broken up, now.” It’s always been a question of whether they’ll get back together again or not.)

@twdmusicboxmystery:

Yeah, I know what you mean. It was actually good to have confirmation about that, but I can't help but wonder what the point of writing it that way was. Maybe it will be clearer when we get to the final episode.

One thing that may help as far as Daryl and Connie (for those who are worried, which isn't us) is something he did with his hand. Google, "Are you alright, sign language." It’s just important to know that his motions were actually him signing to her. Nothing else. I know people *coughs* Donnie shippers *coughs* will read into it.

@wdway:

So true. But the way I saw it after that initial meeting, the writer/director kept a lot of physical space between Daryl and Connie. Enough that I thought it was odd to be so far away from each other.

@twdmusicboxmystery:

Yeah, they did. They even specifically had Carol help her up. And the two of them (Daryl and Connie) didn’t interact individually after he first returned. When she talked, she talked to whole group. And maybe this goes without saying, but I’m seeing SO much Beth proxy in her.

@wdway:

Yes, I thought of Beth several times with Daryl reaction to what happened to Connie. Carol's reaction to Daryl’s too.

I'm going to watch it for a second time probably this afternoon. I think it's going to be an episode that we catch more and more each time it's watched.

twdmusicboxmystery:

Yeah, same. I somehow managed to pull a muscle in my neck this morning. Totally random. Guess that means I gotta lay around and watch TWD all day.  😁

@wdway:

That would definitely be the mature, grown-up thing to do. Being proactive with your health.

I really don't think this is a spoiler but even if it is me pointing it out hopefully sparks some thoughts.

S4e15 US. Daryl with Claimer Joe walking the railroad tracks. Glenn running down the railroad tracks after seeing the sign from Maggie. 

Did we ever determine what this W stands for? Is it an actual Railroad sign?

The garage the Claimers stayed in. Inside the truck with the license tag the same as the car that took Beth away. I was just struck at how much it looks like a railroad platform; I think it might have originally been one.

@twdmusicboxmystery:

Yeah, it does. I noticed the W sign too. I think part of it is that this is a retelling of 4b. So, they might have included it just for that. But the W signs are called "whistle" signs. It's a reminder for the conductor to blow the train's horn as a warning before they get to a particular crossing where cars or people might be. They're not even used by all railroads anymore, what with how technology has changed. But they used to be.

I know people in the fandom have wondered before if they meant wolves, since we had the super obvious sign of the W carved into foreheads. But a whistle is also a type of music. In this case, more a noise. A warning to keep people safe. Tell them to get clear of the tracks before the train arrives. So yeah, not sure what the writers are going for here, but it's definitely interesting!

https://railroad.net/grade-crossing-horns-and-quot-w-quot-signs-t55345.html

@wdway:

Oh My Gosh, a waring of possibly danger ahead. In s4, we saw these signs before Glenn and Tara were almost taken down in the railroad tunnel by walkers. Just before finding the woman he loves, who was missing.

Daryl had the sign behind him and soon after found his missing family and was almost killed helping Rick. In the next episode "A" all of team family except for Beth was found at Terminus. Soon after (in story time not in season time) Daryl found out a clue to finding Beth. I'm loving but the W. Especially since Connie seems to be at Beth proxy.

@twdmusicboxmystery:

Yeah, exactly. And while this episode felt a lot like 4x15, that means we’re coming up on the retelling of 4x16. I can’t help but think about the fact that that episode had flashbacks of Beth. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

This wasn’t part of our initial conversation, but the more I think about these W signs, the more I think they foreshadow the CRM. They could definitely foreshadow bad things in the short term, as @wdway​ said. Like the tunnel Glenn and Tara went into. But overall, because they are on train tracks, I think they foreshadow a bigger baddie. In S4, that was Terminus. It’s where all of TF’s paths converged, and, while we don’t know this for certain yet, we think they might have had ties to the CRM. It might have been in a 6-degrees-of-Kevin-Bacon sort of way, I’ll admit. We just don’t know. But there were cop cars at Terminus, which suggests Grady. And we’re 99% sure Grady was linked to the CRM.

So here, in S11, I think the Ws foreshadow that TF is on the fast track to coming face to face with the CRM, just as in 4b they were on the fast track to running into Terminus/Grady/CRM. And of course with all of this, comes Beth. Hence, the train tracks in this story line are not at all a coincidence. Just wanted to throw that out there! 

@wdway:

Rick and Daryl mentioned Beth by name in 4x16, but I haven't thought about the prison flashbacks and the famous new sheriff in town scene. Great point. And we know sometime in the next couple of episodes, we will see Daryl and Judith together with her in the hat. Next Sunday seems sooo far away.

@twdmusicboxmystery:

Lol. Right? Each time the new episode ends I’m like, “Nooooooo!”

And then before the new one comes on, it’s:

@wdway:

I'm right there with you.

@twdmusicboxmystery​:

I’ll be back with more discussion tomorrow! How did everyone else like the episode?

[hypermania]

I'm sorry that you were disappointed with Outerbanks, but I'm selfishly very happy that you're continuing to work on the amazing GG fic idea! I also love reading your thoughts on the show. I was curious to know your favorite moments of season 4?

bahahaha i actually am kind of glad i was disappointed with it too because i'm so excited about this fic idea, i don't want anything to distract me from it. even if i never actually make enough progress to post anything, just working through what i hypothetically want to happen has helped me find closure in the unresolved ending we got with the unexpected cancellation (but i do want to actually write the damn thing and post it haha).

i'm so glad you're excited about it too! this is such a sweet message and it makes me want to work on it even more : )

as for my favorite moments of s4? jeez, i don't even know. s4 was such a mixed bag for me. there weren't a lot of things i was lukewarm on. i either really hated or really loved what was happening and i'd have to do a rewatch but luckily i've been going through my tag so i've got some ideas. here are some of the stand-outs:

rio looking at beth like she's lost her damn mind when she asks his bartender if they've got anything without caffeine or alcohol

the whole 'mazel tov' exchange

beth putting fitzpatrick in his place with 'oh i'm sorry. was i supposed to enjoy it?'

annie leveling up and doing right by ben because she really truly loves him more than anything in the world

'heroin and hookers?' 'so obvious' and just the entirety of that conversation because it was one of the few times beth was really truly being honest, despite the fact that she was using that honesty to manipulate rio (which is why it worked so well tbh)

ruby thinking stan was cheating on her for all of one day before confronting him and them moving past it in zero point two seconds flat because their relationship is built on trust and respect, even if they've got a boatload of other problems right now

the entirety of 4x06 and the fact that rio was using his family to manipulate beth but he played himself like a damn fool! introduced his crime wife to his family and then got all protective and possessive and !!!!!!! the introduction of nick into the fold is one of the best decisions the show's made in a long time. it gave us so much insight into rio as a person, into his history, into his business operation, and into his feelings for beth. like????? i truly could not ask for more!

i also love that marcus was just sat there quietly the whole time and did not say a single thing about how he already knows beth both from the park and from the rhea situation. kid's already learned snitches get stitches and he ain't saying shit.

and i mean obviously there was another thing that happened in 4x06 that was fine i guess. :)

ruby giving beth shit about her sexual escapades as is her right as a BFF

dean was actually funny this one time

the bench scene in 4x09, my beloved. i love everything about it. it is the perfect brio scene to me. i don't know how to explain what it is about this scene that does it for me but there's just something so... intimate in what they're acknowledging and what they're not saying. 'sometimes it's worth it' should imply that this time it was worth it but when rio admits that he got the black eye by being himself it negates that. sometimes being himself isn't worth it. sometimes being us, doing what we do, isn't worth it. sometimes all of this doesn't feel worth it. it sucks. and this is the first time since 2x09 that he's acknowledged that this shit isn't easy. 'it's lonely at the top.' but this time there's also this undercurrent of resentment and anger between them so he's not nice about it. it's lacking the softness that 2x09 had but i actually think that makes it more authentic? he's not trying to comfort her. he's just... saying it. because he means it. because he's fucking tired and who else is he gonna say it to? there's no one else. there's just her. so he says it and he's a dick about it and he makes a joke about getting her something special that's meant to be snide and he leaves her sitting there on the park bench by herself and still, still, doesn't it feel like they're both a little less alone for it?

stan and beth finally having it out. i actually hate this because i think it's so unfair and yet... that's what makes it so good. stan's words are so cutting. it's the kind of fight you can only have with someone you've known for twenty years and let the resentment build and build and build and now there's nowhere else for it to go except straight to the heart of the other person.

dean walking in on beth and rio being frustrated with each other and maybe realizing for the first time that he understands nothing about what's going on at all because it doesn't seem like they even like each other all that much and somehow he's the intruder. it's not about sex, at all. it's about the fact that this stranger is privy to a part of his wife he didn't even know existed.

the re-centering of the girls' relationship and how when it comes down to it, they would do anything for each other. their lives don't work without each other. they don't all want the same things but they do want each other. they need each other and i think the final stretch of the season demonstrated that.

rio's sad boi hours. never in a million years did i think we would get something so explicitly about his personal feelings??? i don't even have words for this. he was really going through it and i could not be more thrilled.

mick loves the ice capades

diane's a patriot

nick's 'that was before jesus got involved' line was REALLY funny to me and i laugh every time i think about it

you think you'd have her? because beth is the only thing that matters to him in that moment! he's got tunnel vision.

rio! returned! her! furniture! and! told! her! he! believes! in! her! and! he's! ready! to! stop! playing! games! he really was so afraid of losing her that he was like 'okay it's time to get serious i'll get down on one knee if i have to' like homeboy was not playing around.

annie learned how to pick a lock and she did it in character!!!

rio knocked because he listens and he wants her to know that!!!

and he is DELIGHTED to find out that beth isn't in bed professionally or personally with nick

i mean really i think it's safe to say that i'm ecstatic with everything that happened in that last two episodes with beth and rio (and subsequently how quietly the boland marriage actually ended).

so i think i'm going to leave it at that because this list is already pretty long, and it's not exhaustive by any means. it's pretty limited to what existed in my tag, which was admittedly mostly brio, but yeah. lots of good stuff to work with this season! what about you?? what were your favorite moments?

[bourbon-ontherocks]

So I’m not rewatching season 1 (I’m not even finished watching S4 for the first time, guys, give me a breath!!!!!), but I managed to unearth my very early rewatch posts/notes, so I tinkered a rewatch-ish post for the pilot!

Kenny’s SPLEEN hurts??? Interesting. Does someone on that show has spleen problems? How many times in you life have you said the word spleen before GG? Exactly...

God, pre-Rio Beth feels so weird to watch! I want to hug her and be like, “oh honey, you have no idea how your life’s about to get wrecked in a couple of episodes...”

Aaaaah, remember those times when Rio was interacting with people who weren’t Beth?? Like, she’s RIGHT THERE, and our boi is talking to Ruby. Wild, I know.

Annie saying “he’s not my boy” about Boomer is like... ew. Don’t tarnish this epic Brio line, please!

As much a I love season 1, it really feels odd to watch, especially the first episodes, before all the subsequent characterization/headcannon/fanon happened. I don’t know it feels a bit uncomplete.

[gild-and-fire]

4.03 thoughts

finally finished 4.03 and then I came on here to sCrReAM and honestly im so surprised about how much ppl hated the episode?? yes, a lot of the criticism is valid and I agree, but I actually felt like 4.03 episode was really well done. so since the criticism is kinda bringing down my mood imma list what I loved about the episode 

the flashbacks provided a lot of color to Beth’s motivations and made me feel for her. I loved how they emphasized dean throwing money around, beth not having anyone around until dean, and that he was pretty egotistical about being the quarterback, because it highlighted how much Beth was attracted to all that glamour and also fell for the idea of someone, anyone, taking care of her for once

also give CH all the awards. her acting in the visiting room took me outttt

young Annie was everything I could ask for. i loved her 

Stan is getting a verrrrrry meaty storyline that I am looking forward to seeing unfold. So far, Stan has been the most upstanding of everyone and yet has been looped into breaking the law so many times. 

Makes me wonder if S1 Stan would like S4 Stan, let alone recognize him

“sup hill” / “sup hill” I might just cry  

beth going off on Fitz. wowowowowow this might be a top 5 favorite scene.

first of all im astounded by how gorgeous CH looked. The makeup, the dress, the wig-- it was all doing it for me!! I am going to be v sad when they change her wig. tbh I would either like to be her or marry her 🥺 

so the moment with Fitz gave me so much catharsis. One of my favorite parts about S1 was Beth speaking her mind and not giving a fuck about being polite or agreeable. Every time she lashed out at Dean or acted with ambition around Rio, I would fall so much more in love with show, and I feel like I’ve been missing those moments recently. So this scene was so fulfilling to watch and it really cinched the episode for me 

also Mae looked so sosososos pretty this episode. idk what she’s been doing during quarantine but I would like some pls

OH and Phoebe. I love Phoebe. I relate to Phoebe--she’s awkward, she doesn’t fit in, has never fit in. She’s dedicated to doing the right thing, yet she often does that good thing badly. Every scene with her makes me laugh and also feel bad for her. I also find her misguided hatred towards beth so fascinating and I hope we delve into that more. idk controversial or not, I stan Phoebe.

you might have noticed that I didn’t talk about the brio pool scene. that is because i am literally overwhelmed by that scene. I have not truly comprehended what transpired. 

all I know is that I fainted somewhere between rio saying beth might wanna hit it again after dean comes back from prison and beth having one moment of pure joy. then I tried to make sense of Rio being so playful and smiley and sassy and overly confident but some weird noises came out of my mouth and my brain malfunctioned

im going to need at least 5 more rewatches before I can even parse the honey nut feelios on this one

[sunnydaleherald]

The Sunnydale Herald Newsletter - Monday, August 16th

OZ: I'm gonna ask you to go out with me tomorrow night. And I'm kinda nervous about it, actually. It's interesting. WILLOW: Oh. Well, if it helps at all, I'm gonna say yes. OZ: Yeah, it helps. It-it creates a comfort zone. Do you wanna go out with me tomorrow night? WILLOW: Oh! I can't! OZ: Well, see, I like that you're unpredictable.

~~Surprise~~

[Drabbles & Short Fiction]

Has No One Told You She's Not Breathing? (Buffy/Faith, T) by TanithClaraComet_BillPip

Taking A Break From Hell (Gen, T) by yvochrali

Spell-casting (wink wink, nudge nudge) (Jenny&Willow, T) by The_Eclectic_Bookworm

uch Fragile Broken Things, A Memory Remains (Fred/Gunn, T) by TanithClaraComet_BillPip

[Chaptered Fiction]

Landed Chapter 4 (Buffy/Spike, NC-17) by Holly

Dark Release Season 4 Rewrite Chapter 9 (Buffy/Angelus, E) by BangelusLover

Loose Ends Chapter 1 (Buffy/Spike, T) by EllieRose101

Big Bad Girls Chapter 1 (Buffy/Spike, M) by Amina (SimplyStardust)

[Images, Audio & Video]

Artwork: very very rushed doodles of the abysmal picture day photos by gaylonelybitch

Artwork: Giles portrait by flummoxedangel

Podcast: Five by Five Angel Ep S1 E18 (Buffy and the Art of Story S4) by lisalilly

[Reviews & Recaps]

I’m rewatching Buffy the Vampire Slayer, for kicks by azrielrose

More general thoughts on BtVS by geekwithoutafandom

[Fandom Discussions]

Buffy and Xander should have gotten together in S7 by buffysummers

Ranking Epiodes 14 by finitefall

Ranking Epiodes 19 by herinsectreflection

Women of colour in the show by dontwarnthetadpoles

Harsh Light of Day and Chosen parallels by gothic-buffy

When Xander brings up Buffy while Spike is moving out of his basement in A New Man by emmathompsonegot

xander never got closure by warrenworthington3

graveyards & basements: season 4 + the subterranean by chasingfictions

Discussion of 4.10 "Awakening" - Aired 1/29/2003 (WB-US) by Flannen

Is the moment where Oz first asks Willow out one of the best pieces of TV ever made? by sukidovi

Do y'all think Cousin Beth ever got out of that abusive family? by gimmebackmahrupees

Which character is more sympathetic: Dawn or Jonathan? by biscuitscoconut

I'm still shocked and surprised by MostCloud

Always wondered this but after Willow awakened all the potentials... by Kittenpants2007

Buffy/Anya fight in “Selfless” by Excellent-Durian-509

I don’t like Angel (the character) convince me otherwise. by meowpickle666

Lies My Parents Told Me by ToShanshuInUK

Submit a link to be included in the newsletter!

Join the editor team :)

[kinetic-elaboration]

June 15: Orphan Black 1x01

Started my rewatch of Orphan Black today.

I was obsessed with this show when it came out. I think I binged the first season over the course of one weekend (in law school...one of a couple reasons why I stopped binging) and I kept up with several seasons but I remember kind of limping along with S4, and I’m about 95% sure I never watched S5.

I’ve been meaning to do a rewatch for a while but keep putting it off, so it feels exciting to get back into it.

I do not remember a lot of the details. I remember the general gist, especially of S1, and I remember certain random plot points and moments and scenes, but it still felt very much like watching for the first time.

This season is a really good example of how to use POV to make a story like 10x more dramatic. Knowing (or at least semi-remembering) what I know now, it all makes sense and there’s very little really weird going on. I mean, other than clones. But Sarah knows nothing, and we only know what Sarah knows at first. She doesn’t know about the clones, but she also doesn’t know, for example, that Beth is a cop. So in addition to the mysteries of who’s calling the pink phone, why Beth has so much money, etc., there are moments like Art pulling her over and her thinking she’s being arrested--simply because she doesn’t know that Art is her colleague/partner..

I truly love Sarah so much. Allison was the most entertaining clone but if I had to pick a favorite, it would be Sarah. She is such a great hero. Insanely smart. Quick thinking. An obvious redemption journey ahead of her. A rough past but a believable desire to do better, even if her plans are vague or themselves a little suspicious. When she drank from the bottle of soup to make herself sick and get out of a situation she couldn’t fake, I was like oh yeah, that’s my girl. Watching her run this con is supremely entertaining and exciting.

I love that Art followed her and then broke into her car. Oh, Arthur.

Felix is, of course, great, and I remembered that, but I forgot how much I loved his apartment too. Also the little flirtation with the coroner was weirdly cute? It’s scenes like that that gave the show a lot of its entertainment value.

I’m so damn attracted to Sarah, I just paid attention to her during that Paul scene lol. I never liked Paul. Boring city. I wonder if I’ll like him more this time.

Some stuff I forgot: that the other clones aren’t in this ep; that Katja shows up at the end but dies immediately, also whatever the hell was going on with that shooting.

I also really liked Beth. I like that we never got to know her, but we spend so much time learning about her directly. We never see her head-on, only in bits of fragmented mirror images. That she was both the ringleader of the clone group--collecting evidence, the one they looked up to if I remember correctly--and also the most damaged by everything she was finding out, to the point where she ultimately couldn’t live with it all anymore, was really compelling to me. The combination of strength and brokenness. Like... she was Sarah first, and Sarah really did become her. I don’t remember the specifics but I seem to recall some retconning in S4 that I was not so keen on...

She has great style also. Both Sarah’s and Beth’s outfits are my style.

The show is just incredibly entertaining, from its costumes and sets, to its pacing, to its mystery-enhancing structure, and its characters, and its humor, and its set pieces like Sarah transforming into Beth... I’m going to enjoy at least the beginning of this rewatch.

Oh and speaking of humor, I was especially fond of “How did you do on your last charity run?” / “Oh, I don’t know actually” and all of Vic’s eulogy (”She was a person you wanted to hang... out with; “It’s all based on facts.”)

Anyway, I am looking forward to ep 2... I want to see the rest of the clones again!

[mego42]

Writer Asks

Tagged by @sothischickshe, @bourbon-ontherocks and @medievalraven who are all v lovely and for reasons unknown to me, want me to ramble about my fic so like, blame them for this I guess

Tagging @fairhairedkings, @riosnecktattoo, @inyoursheets, @foxmagpie, @pynkhues if you feel like it

ao3 name: ms_scarlet (origin story no one asked for: I came up with it for a creative writing class where we had to submit everything under pseudonyms for anonymous full class critique, which was gr9 and not at all traumatic, and I was deeply obsessed with both the Grateful Dead and Sublime versions of Scarlet Begonias at the time)

fandoms: the only fandoms I’ve written fic for are bellarke/t100 and Good Girls (and Buffy but it was way back in the day, pre-organized archives and has been completely lost to time which is For The Best)

number of fics: 14 (lol, 5 over the course 3 years in t100 fandom and 9 since joining the GG fandom at the beginning of s3, you could say I have been inspired)

fic i spent the most time on: a song inside the halls of the dark for sure, it’s the first multi chapter I’ve ever done and I’m far enough into it that I will be super honest, I was extremely dubious over whether or not I’d actually see it through when I started but huzzah! It’s happening. But yeah, I spend like, a lot of time thinking about it, writing it (lmao obvs), rewatching clips of the show to pick apart characterization and mannerisms, etc, etc. I try to work on it in some capacity every day (sometimes that just means outlining or deleting chunks of my outline and crying about how much I hate myself) to keep up momentum so yeah, def that one.

As far as one shots go, there’s blood in my body (I’m holding on) for bellarke, I think I spent a month, maybe 6 weeks working on that

fic i spent the least amount of time on: as the world turns, the blunt burns, I was doing my usual lazy Saturday morning scroll through Tumblr before I got out of bed and saw a post like I want beth and mick to get high together (I would love to give credit but I haven’t the foggiest notion who said it, I wasn’t intending to write it so I didn’t pay too much attention, I’m the worst, I’m sorry) and then some dialogue popped into my head maybe 10 min later and I think I wrote the whole thing in like, 45 min on my phone. Cannot emphasize enough how little I thought about it (or proofed it tbh, yikes, so many typos) before posting

most hits: overall, I’ve Got You Here my t100 post s3, alt s4 thing. For Good Girls, a song inside the halls of the dark

most kudos: overall, there’s blood in my body (I’m holding on) - bellarke modern au. For GG, still song.

most comment threads:  a song inside the halls of the dark by a M I L E (it twice as many as blood, the next highest), the GG fandom is so lovely and supportive and friendly and I love you guys, I really do

most bookmarks: same as kudos, blood overall and then song for GG

highest total word count: lol song is killing it

favorite fic i wrote: oh man, that’s hard. I love them all for different reasons. Blood was my first ever AU (I am a canon/canon-divergent ho) and it also deals with some stuff that’s important to me so that’s always going to have a special place in my heart. I’ve Got You Here was the first time I tried to tackle something bigger than a missing scene or short one-shot so that’s also significant.

I’m really proud of smoke, fire, it’s all going up because I think I did a p good job with the Rio POV there. I’d give her a HA! And a HI-YA! is special bc it’s my first outside POV and it was based on so little info it was basically OC, so that was a fun challenge.

All of that said, obviously, a song inside the halls in the dark is my fav. It’s been the biggest stretch of my skills (I had NO! IDEA! If I could plot and pace on the level required to sustain the fic I’d originally outlined and it’s only grown from there tbh), it’s also been like, the loveliest experience? I keep saying people’s reaction to it has broken my brain and I’m not actually just saying that. I’m deeply overwhelmed. And last but emphatically not least, it’s how I’ve gotten to know @nickmillerscaulk who, on top of being an incredible editor (seriously y’all, she is Skilled, I’ve learned so much from her), is such an awesome, amazing person and I’m so very glad we’ve become friends.

fic i want to rewrite/expand on: Oh man, idk. Pills N Potions is the easiest because it’s a prompt collection! Send me prompts! I can’t promise I’ll write them right away (my ADHD is so very real and only dubiously under my control during quarantine, so I live in constant terror of losing the thread of song especially this close to the end) but I def want to flex my quick and dirty short fic for funsies skills. I’m super looking forward to @goodgirlsficrecs prompt-a-thon.

share a bit of a wip or story idea you’re working on: ahahaha oh man, my google drive is littered with partially drafted or outlined ideas. I have a bunch of missing scene things I started at various points in s3 that are realistically dead in the water.

In terms of WIP/ideas I’m still intending to work on/finish:

A post 311 Rio POV pwp

A fishing/fencing/flute playing fluff for @medievalraven because I keep taunting her with my tags for song

The Good Guys (Rio, JT and Stan) thing that snowballed in a post way back when from @jazillia007, @nickmillerscaulk, and @inyoursheets

I still low-key want to do the transcripts for the Mick, Annie and Ruby group chat. I might save that for whenever I rewatch and have it running concurrently to s3, idk we’ll see

A Jewel Thief AU that I am wildly hyped about. I outlined the first chapter of it around when I started posting song and haven’t let myself do anything with it because I know once I get started I’m going to abandon whatever else I’m working on

More Annie POV, I don’t have any specific ideas, I just really love writing Annie POV

[daughterofluthien]

Rules: Pick 5 shows, then answer the following questions. Don’t cheat. Tag some people.

Tagged by @brambleberrycottage! Thank you!!

(a note: these are not necessarily my fave shows or anything, but they are the shows that are more on my mind than others :P)

Teen Wolf

Star Wars Rebels

Stargate: SG-1

Leverage

Parks & Recreation

Who is your favorite character in 2? Kanan Jarrus. He has a fantastic character arc, he’s a wonderful mentor and space dad, and he’s probably my fave Jedi (and character) in all of Star Wars. Sorry about it, Obi Wan 

Who is your least favorite character in 1? I mean, I don’t tend to focus on least favorite characters too often. However, I do generally have a vague desire to punch Theo in the face anytime he’s onscreen.... He’s slightly better in 6B with the (incredibly rushed) redemption arc and all that, but like. Also.

What is your favorite episode of 4? Oh man, that’s a really difficult question for this show, actually. But for sheer creativity and memorability, I’d probably say “The Rashomon Job.” That was one of the ones that really stuck in my from when I first watched the show, and it ended up being just as good as I remembered.

What is your favorite season of 5? Hmmm I wanna say either S3 or S5. The harvest festival arc in 3 is great, but all the Leslie/Ben stuff in S5? Beautiful and iconic.

Who is your favorite couple in 3? I was a Jack/Sam shipper way back in the day, and that honestly hasn’t changed.

Who is your favorite couple in 2? Kanan/Hera! They’re just... !!! They care about each other! They’re supportive! They just love each other so much and I have so many feelings

What is your favorite episode of 1? “Frayed” Like !!! The entirety of 3A up to this point has been building up to the idea of Scott being/becoming an Alpha, and, like, throughout the season we see him do little Alpha things -- being a leader, pretty much everything about his relationship w/ Isaac, etc. And then!! Then!! This is the episode where he actually starts to realize it! And where he actively chooses the leadership role!

And I’m sorry, I’m not done talking about this episode yet, because I honestly just have so many feelings?? And it’s got this one moment. One moment in particular. Which may be one of my favorite moments in the entire series. Like the whole set up is really good (it’s also one of the few TW eps where anachronic order actually worked), and there’s this whole moment in the middle where Scott and Isaac have to calm Boyd down and keep him from attacking Ethan, as Boyd thinks the Alpha Pack killed Derek. And then, at the end of the episode, Isaac (who did not get upset about Derek in the same way Boyd did) learns that Scott isn’t healing from the wound he got fighting the Alphas, and he just. Absolutely freaks out and attacks Ethan.

(The show directly parallels Boyd’s reaction about Derek to Isaac’s reaction about Scott, and !!!)

BUT THEN. Then Scott comes out. And he roars.

And it’s not technically a roar, but he yells Isaac’s name and it has power behind it. And everyone (including Boyd) notices.

But Isaac!! Isaac stops! He responds as if it was a roar! And I’m!! Gonna go!! Absolutely!! Feral!!!

Ahem.

Anywho that’s my fave episode of TW, and I really love my Alpha son

What is your favorite episode of 5? Oh man, I don’t actually remember a lot of specific favorite episodes, even though I know there’s a lot of eps that I really like... I’m thinking “Flu Season”? But also that’s just one among many very good episodes.

What is your favorite season of 2? I’m gonna say S4, actually. I thought the show had a really strong ending, and I love the final arcs of all the characters.

How long have you watched 1? So I started watching in... 2012 or 2013 I think? And then watched off and on through at least part of S4. Then I started a rewatch here in the year of our Lord 2020 and uh. Here we are :P

How did you become interested in 3? This was actually one of the first fandoms that tiny!Carolyn was ever involved in! My mom discovered it back in like... 2003 or something, decided it was not inappropriate for her barely nine-year-old daughter, and from then on we were both pretty much hooked. 

Who is your favorite actor in 4? Mmm frick, do I have to pick? Probably either Christian Kane or Aldis Hodge. But also Beth Riesgraf is fantastic, too, the whole show is just so delightful. 

Which do you prefer, 1, 2, or 5? Okay okay okay. So. Rebels is definitely the tighter written and better show, imo, but also I’m having a ton of Teen Wolf feelings right now and I just care so much about this characters. So like, currently and tentatively, Teen Wolf? (Sorry P&R, I love you, but straight sitcoms are probably never going to be my pick, even though it is really good)

Which show have you seen more episodes of - 1 or 3? So like, this is really just a contest of how many episodes each show has, right? Since I can’t imagine picking a show for a game like this if I hadn’t seen all the eps? Anywho, seeing as Teen Wolf has 100 episodes and SG-1 has 213 episodes, I think SG-1 is the clear winner here.

If you could be anyone from 4, who would you be? So like, I wanna say Amy Palavi, the waitress in their Brewpub in S5? She doesn’t have a terribly intense life or tragic backstory, but she also gets to befriend and hang out with Parker -- along with some mild involvement in shenanigans -- so that seems ideal, honestly.

(And yes, I know she gets kidnapped in that one ep, but that works out all right in the end, so I’m still down.)

Would a crossover between 3 and 4 work? Weirdly, absolutely yes. I’ve actually read a few that were pretty good.

In fact, according to Word of God, Leverage and Stargate actually take place in the same universe? Apparently there were going to be a flashback gag with Eliot going through the gate as part of one of his many past jobs, but they weren’t able to do it, due to the sets already have been dismantled.

Pair two characters in 1 who would make an unlikely but strangely okay couple? Huh, oh man. I’m not usually much of rarepair person tbh. And like this is literally something I’m pulling out of absolutely nowhere and haven’t actually thought about before now. But maybe Sydney/Hayden? or Sydney/Lori?

Overall, which show has the better storyline, 3 or 5? Y’know, I was gonna go with Stargate with this one, but actually the big storyarcs were never my favorite part of SG-1. Whereas P&R actually had some really good and emotionally compelling arcs. So I’m actually gonna go with Parks & Rec with this one.

Which has better theme music, 2 or 4? Neither of them really have much theme music to speak of, but if we’re just talking about music, then Rebels is the clear winner here. Like seriously, props to Kevin Kiner et al., it has some seriously fantastic musical cues. Heck, the score for the finale got nominated for an emmy.

Tagging @whitecatgraycatblackcat, @experimentaldata, and @darnitjack! Also, as always, feel free to do this if you feel so inclined, and please tag me and let me know!

[joeycupcakerichter]

Ahh! I love that your a fellow bethyl shipper! I was hardcore into them during S4 and beyond pissed that Beth was killed off. Honestly, her death is one of like maybe 5 character deaths that I have ever full on ugly cried about.

Oh my goooood. I was distraught. I full ass felt punched in the face. 😭😭😭😭

I’m also not ashamed to admit I went full ass #TeamDelusional because I seriously thought they were bringing her back in some way. I went through to like season 7 before I finally accepted that it wasn’t happening because (in my opinion) they weren’t smart enough to pull off a gambit as smart as that. 😒😒😒😒 The salt was REAL. I just remember watching and rewatching S4 over and over waiting for they’re reunion and then when she died, I didn’t even see the scene with Maggie crying over Beth. That still gets me all up in my feels just because I felt that so fucking hard. Cheap ass death was cheap. Sorry. As you can tell I’m still not over it. 😂😂

[twdmusicboxmystery]

TTD for 10x21: Splintered

First of all, they talked about Leah A LOT in TTD. One of the Property Brothers, Drew, was on as a guest, and even he kept mentioning her. Which tells me he was coached because other than one question Chris asked, why else would he? They didn’t confirm she was a hallucination or anything, but they did confirm it was Leah’s knife and that Daryl giving it to Carol was meant to be him letting go of Leah.

So even if we turn out to be wrong about the hallucination (doubtful) people don’t have to worry about a continuing romance between them. From a hallucination standpoint, you could say he’s letting go of the hallucination, and in this episode, I truly do think we see sequences that foreshadow him find Beth, so…

Okay, so they didn’t say how long it would be, but apparently ep 22 is “extended” so it will be a longer than usual episode. I noticed a black and white chess set behind Cooper. And of course, he’s at his home, but I couldn’t help but wonder if that was intentional. They also said that of the 6 bonus episodes, they filmed this one first. I’m not sure why or if we should be reading into that, but it’s kind of interesting.

About the pirate book? They say in the Behind the Dead stuff that it’s important because when Daryl and Carol first talked about leaving in 10x01, she wanted him to come on the boat with him and they could be pirates. So talk about leaving on the bike, which we know they’ll do in the spinoff, and pirates, are all synonymous. Not that I needed it, but that’s just proof to me that this foreshadows those future storylines, especially for how/when they’ll find Beth.

So, the things they talked about and emphasized are all things I’m reading into as TD clues.

They talked a lot about why Dog went with Carol rather than Daryl. At first, I think Chris asked Melissa this. I didn’t take away tons from what MMB said. She talked about how, in 10x18, Carol was spoiling Dog and giving him food, so that may have been why. But also that maybe Carol just needed the company, and Daryl needed some alone time. And dogs are very intuitive about that sort of thing. Then Drew (Property Brother—I had to go look up is name so I wasn’t objectifying him ;D) said he felt like it was the last straw of betrayal for Daryl. Like, everyone in your life had either abandoned or betrayed you, and to add insult to injury, even your dog leaves you.

Now, that’s a weird thing to say about THIS episode. Because here, they make light of it. Daryl says “nice” and then at the end, he goes back and Dog is happy to see him, and everything is okay. So it’s weird for sometime to suggest that based on this episode, Daryl felt like Dog betrayed him, except in a salty, roll-his-eyes sort of way. So that tells me this foreshadows a time when Daryl truly will feel betrayed by everyone and totally alone.

But then, later in the episode, Cooper randomly chimed in about this again. He just went, “oh, you know that thing we were talking about earlier? I have some thoughts.” So it wasn’t something he was asked, but rather something he really wanted people to know.

He basically said that, as far as why Dog went with Carol, we could also ask why Dog went with Daryl when Daryl first met him as a pup. Why did he go with Daryl over Leah so often? And the answer (which is clearly symbolic/thematic) is that Daryl needed him Dog at the time. Here, Carol needs him.

Then Cooper even goes so far as to say the same thing is true of the knife. Daryl kept the knife and had the knife for a long time, because, emotionally, he needed to hang onto it. He doesn’t anymore. But Carol is in a dark place now and she needs it.

It made me think also of Beth and Daryl’s interactions in S4. You could argue that, not from a literal, plot standpoint, but from an emotional/thematic standpoint, Daryl needed her. So the writers put her with Daryl. Of course that’s not the only reason, but Daryl was in such an emotionally distraught place, that he needed Beth to pull him out of it.

So, how do we interpret that? Here’s what I’m thinking. I’ve said before that once Daryl and Carol split up (in the future when they leave together on the bike) Carol will get a reunion with Beth first, right? So I’m wondering if we’ll hit a point where Beth will want to go find Daryl, but she’ll choose to stay with Carol for a short time, because she can see Carol is in such a dark place and needs her. More on this later and some minor things in my timeline that I’m rethinking. Because I think symbolism in the episode supports it.

When they did the “in memoriam,” Chris all of sudden said, “but not the rat! He made it out of there!” *coughs Beth*

They randomly started talking about demolition because of Drew Property Brother. He joked that he wanted to put Carol on his demolition crew because of what she did to the wall. But then (again very random mention) he says that she really ought to go to Leah’s cabin and do work there, because it clearly needed more work than the kitchen did. So, I’m taking that to be their way of showing that both the wall and Leah’s cabin represent the same thing. And we’ve called both of them tombs.

About the stone soup story? Cooper said it represents all the little things Carol has done to keep people alive, when she thought she was doing the right thing. So the person getting all the ingredients eventually results in soup, which is food, which people need to live. And they’ve been talking about not having enough food right now in the show. But then Jerry says, “it doesn’t sound very tasty.” And that’s because all the little things she’s done—like blowing up the cave, letting Negan out, etc—were necessary to defeat the Whisperers and keep everyone alive, but of course it seemed really destructive at the time. So, that’s why Jerry says it doesn’t taste good. Whether the soup tastes good or not, it’s necessary to keep everyone alive.

They also talk about how Daryl isn’t seeing it this way yet. He’s not seeing that some of these things may have been necessary in the long run, even if they sucked at the time.

This is kind of minor, but several of them brought up the idea of Carol using the rat to make soup. I didn’t think of that, but given that she’s wanting for ingredients, it only make sense that she would try to use the rat, but they didn’t do that at all. And the director didn’t really say anything about it. He just kind of laughed and went, “haha, um, no, she didn’t.” And I had to chuckle at that because it really would have been the logical thing for her to. If they didn’t do that, it’s purely for the symbolism of it. We can’t have Carol putting Beth in a pot of soup, now can we? ;D

Back to Leah. When they confirmed it wasn’t her knife, they said it was significant how it passed along the chain (from Leah to Daryl to Carol) and that at the end, Daryl is willing to give it up and let Leah have it. They didn’t say how or why it was significant, just that it was. So yeah. Side-eying that.

Again, the director said Carol probably took the knife as Daryl giving her a peace offering after their fight, but symbolically it represents him letting go of Leah. Melissa also said Daryl and Carol are mirroring each other a lot here.

Another interesting thing they talked about is that Daryl realizes he needs the thing he gave Carol. While obviously this symbolically represents Beth, I’m very curious to see what it is in a more literal sense in the plot when this plays out later. But the point is, he gave Carol the knife, and then he needed it and didn’t have it. And that’s kind of what drove him to the cars and the traintracks and to find the military walkers (CRM). So it’s very interesting from a symbolic/foreshadowing standpoint.

One thing we haven’t discussed is that Daryl falls into a dry riverbed. There’s even a small bridge and a round, water tunnel (like we used to see in the opening credits) behind him. And the director said one thing about it that I thought was weird. Chris was asking him if he ever gets squeamish after being on TWD so long and if walker kills ever bother him. And he said he thought Daryl killing the walker in the ditch was one of the most brutal kills they’d ever done on the show.

Umm? I have to say I disagree. I guess I need to rewatch it. I think he stabs it in the head, but other than the obvious, it didn’t seem particularly gnarly to me. I could name 10 other kills off the top of my head that were way grosser. (Terminus, anyone? Daryl with pipe?) But I wonder if he’s hinting at something symbolic here.

Here’s an interesting thing we’ll probably analyze for a while. They said Carol taking the red bucket out to get ingredients for the soup (and bringing ingredients back in it) is a callback to season 1 when Amy brought fish back to the camp in the same red bucket. Yikes, we could go down a rabbit hole with that!

Both represent bringing food back/feeding everyone/keeping them alive. And as we already discussed, Carol does things to keep the group alive, even if they don’t “taste good.” But I wonder if we could apply that to every instance of the red we’ve seen. I mean, I know we’ve discussed the idea that what happened with Beth in Coda “had to happen” in some way. (It went the way it had to, etc.) I don’t know. But that’s definitely an interesting callback they gave us. Plus the fish symbolism, etc.

Okay, then Drew talked about the army walkers again. He said there were two of them and they were all decked out in their fatigues and Daryl actually finds a lot of supplies on them, but we didn’t see any army vehicles. So Drew said he wondered fi there was some place in the vicinity that we don’t know about yet.

And when he said that, the director, David Boyd, gave him a thumbs up. So they’re definitely confirming and hinting at future storylines here. They also confirmed (inside the dead) that Leah has a military past. So, to be fair, we don’t know if this “unknown place in the vicinity” is still standing. These guys could have come from the same place Leah did, and based on her story and the fact that they’re walkers, it might not be a thing anymore. But then again, it might.

They did talk about the Daryl under the car scene, but they didn’t say much about it. It was like they wanted to draw our attention to it, but couldn’t actually say much. They mostly talked about how the car was on pulleys and it was very safe, with no real chance of Norman getting hurt. But that was pretty much it. I mean, Glenn crawled under the dumpster to live, so maybe Beth crawled under the car? I don’t know. I’m sure that scene is super important, but I haven’t decided what I think about it yet.

They had a SUPER random callback to Lizzie, of all things, and I have no idea why, other than that this was a Carol-heavy episode. They asked Cooper what a Jerry, Nabila, and Kids spinoff would look like. Cooper said it would be a “3-wall comedy” and then started talking about how the kids would want to keep the walkers as pets. And then everyone started going, “don’t name them! Whatever you do, don’t name them!” So, they didn’t actually mention Lizzie by name, but clearly…

Um, and then we got the sneak peek of Here’s Negan. We see him digging in a field outside the walls and he finds Lucille. Then the flashback to 12 years ago starts, and he’s clearly run afoul of some kind of biker gang, but that’s all we get in the peek.

Notice the viper/snake reference on his jacket.

 That’s it for TTD.

Thoughts?

[bourbon-ontherocks]

(Previously, on GG rewatch...)

Phew. So I guess this is it. Season 3 finale, it was ABOUT time.

Is Phoebe naturally awkward or just pretending? Also, Ruby, blabbering around about how you know the ins and outs of real cash is stupid. And do NOT get me started on leaving your purse in plain sight of the customers. Everybody rolls it down their chair, especially since Ruby has her little motorized chair, I'm sure she's got storage space there for her purse.

WHY DOES DEAN KEEP COMPLAINING ABOUT THE UGLY DRESS WHILE HE'S THE ONLY ONE FOR WHOM BETH WEARS THAT KEYHOLE SWEATER??? THIS MAN DOESN'T KNOW HIS LUCK AND I WANT RIO TO SEE THIS SWEATER IN SEASON 4 PLEASE AND THANK YOU

Can we all agree that Beth buying Dean the spa store is the ultimate stage of infantilization for him? Last episode, he asked for it because he sucked at a basic delivery job, then played pretend with his legos, and now mummy's buying it for him??? Cute. See also: Gross.

Oh my Gosh, I love Eric!!

I absolutely love Mick casually mentioning his own hot-tub

OMG Rio is such an asshole!! I love him (and I had completely forgotten about the existence of this scene, but in my defense, those outdoor meetings in the dark all look the same to me...)

I'm with Stan on this one, Ruby is really starting to act like a mini-Beth. And that's not a compliment.

Annie randomly popping technical corporate terms just cracks me up

I would love a S4 reveal that Rio bugged Beth's house when he emptied it because the crime conversations these women have in there, oh lord.

Why is Beth's kitchen suddenly refurbished? I thought she was broke

So let me get this straight. I did research, and this is totally a praying hands emoji. It's called folded hands and stands for prayer, and RARELY a high-five 

DIANNE!!!

"What makes the most sense is couple therapy. Not grand larceny." I don't know you but I find this absolutely hilarious coming from Beth.

Are we supposed to feel happy or sad for the girls that they seem to literally have no other friends than each other?

Oh, a French pop song. It's been a while.

Let me tell you something. When you start basing your criming strategy on your kids' science homework, something's definitely off.

Oh hi, ponytail dude!

FFFS, LET BETH POOP, DEAN!!! #deuceinpeace2021

At this point, the strip-club hustle could have been done with shreded newspapapers, there's no need for fake cash when you're in fact burning it. Sounds like a lot of extra work. Also, there has to be a follow-up inquiry after the bags burned, right? So the club's gonna look suspicious no matter what.

Did Gayle just imply that Dean and she actually fucked???? Also I love that even for the sake of a lie Beth can't bring herself to say something nice about Dean, haha!

"So you steal from me to pay back what you stole?" Why is Stan suddenly sounding like Rio?? Ruby's turning into a mini Beth, I'm telling you...

New theory: Rio stole the battery from the smoke detector when he emptied the house because he's PETTY

Oh God, the perfectly-sized boobs discussion, I can't believe I forgot about that...

Aside from the obviously disgusting context, I find this scene extremely well-acted, from both Matthew and Christina's side.

Is this doing-the-dishes-together frame supposed to show us the distance between Beth and Dean or on the contrary tell us they're a good team?

MICK!!!!

I know that he's probably messing with her, but the idea of Rio going to art class just makes me so gleeful!!!

So, Beth is literally asking someone how one moves out?? After she discovered google last episode?? I'm dead.

OMG, Beth is just so LOUD in wanting to let Gayle know that she's behind the robbery!!! She doesn't even fill in the check!!!!

Ruby wore the ring!!! I'm so happy!!!

Can I just point out that gramatically speaking, Rio is planning on taking a dip in the barbecue accessories??

WANNA JOIN ME

I have SO MANY thoughts about "those things breed diseases". Like, why are you asking Beth to join you in a tub if it's to display disgust for the concept immediately after, you weirdo?? Unless you're trying to imply that you'll take a dip ONLY IF IT'S WITH BETH??? Although again, on a grammatical point of view, "those things" refers to the sales representative, which opens a new can of worms. And bringing up diseases?? When I'm totally headcanoning that Mick told Rio that Beth claimed having herpes??? I'm so ready for an STD-themed season 4!!! I just want Rio to casually bring that up to Beth and Beth having already forgotten about it!!!!

“NEXT TIME EMPTY THE CLIP”!!!!! ONLY DEATH WILL PART THEM IT'S CANON

Alcoholic moms at the park. Everything is normal.

[twdmusicboxmystery]

Revolution Theme, Part 4 - The Governor’s Episodes

What led me to wanting to rewatch the Gov’s episode was a discussion with @galadrieljones. She talked about Lenny from 4b being an anti-Daryl, and that sparked something for me. I totally agree about Len, but it made me remember that, a long time ago, I remembered that Mitch (guy who operated the tank for the Gov and helped bulldoze the prison) was also an anti-parallel to Daryl.

Now, back when I first realized that, I didn’t have anywhere to really go with it. I mean, we had the leader (Governor) pitted against Rick and his right-hand guy (Mitch) pitted against Daryl. Mitch operated the tank, which Daryl blew up. And then of course Daryl ends up shooting Mitch in the heart. The thing that first made me realize Mitch was a Daryl parallel was the fact that he had no sleeves, lol. I know that’s goofy, but I think it’s intentional.

Anyway, I hadn’t thought about it in a long time. And while we’ve talked about Gov parallels to Beth in these two episodes lots of times before (like the stigmata walker in the yellow wheelchair) it suddenly occurred to me that there’s probably a LOT more to it than that.

Recently, especially since the bonus episodes, I’ve been big on looking at entire sequences and multi-episode arcs from a broad, bird’s eye view because I think they’re templates for future story lines. (It’s totally Find Me’s fault. Lol.) Anyway, I just realized I hadn’t done THAT with the Gov’s episodes, and I probably should.

Long story short, I was right.

Long story long, here we go:

So we start by seeing the end of 3x16 again, right after the Gov kills all his own people and takes off with Martinez and that other guy whose name I don’t remember. He doesn’t show up again and Martinez says he pretty much gave up and got eaten by walkers.

(We’ll skip the discussion about how Karen was a Beth proxy at this part in 3x16, because she was left for dead and even pretended like she was. In other words, she played possum. Then she returned to Tyreese and eventually became romantically involved with him. But that’s beside the point, right? ;D)

Okay, so we see the Gov and the two guys at a camp site and a very Beth-ish walker stomps through his fire, trips, and starts burning before Martinez kills it. I’ve always thought that was a Beth hint, and I still do. I think it’s just the writers’ way of signaling that this is a Beth template for the future.

When the Gov wakes up, his guys have abandoned him and he’s alone in this bright yellow tent that stands out against the bleak landscape. (Yellow.)

Then he goes and burns Woodbury. I’ve always tried to connect that to Beth, particularly because of the Moonshine shack. But looking at it now, there’s just something else entirely going on here. Emotionally, I mean.

We know Bethyl burning the moonshine shack symbolized something positive. Letting go of their pasts and moving forward. When the Gov does this, you don’t get that vibe at all. It’s more bitter and resentful. He’s angry and grieving over losing his leadership, the town he built up, and his people. It almost feels like a “if I can’t have it no one can” sort of thing.

So, this is total conjecture on my part, but I feel like there will be a Beth parallel to this. Probably not quite as destructive, but I’ve always had a head canon that somehow, after waking up, she’ll end up at Terminus, find the riot gear and Daryl’s poncho, and assume they all died there. That may be where the bitterness and sadness will come from. Just my head canon, though.

After that, the Gov starts on his long, lone journey (another thing we’ve always theorized Beth would do). Oh, and the song that plays over this part, which I’ve always thought was very pretty, is called The Last Pale LIGHT in the WEST (emphasis mine). I think the Gov goes west when he leaves.

Then we get voice overs, and this part is SUPER interesting and makes me very happy. We heard two women talking to the Gov about where he comes from and where he used to be. We now know those voices to be Tara and Lilly, but at this point in the episode, he hasn’t met them, yet. So, what’s interesting is that neither of them are named in the subtitles. They are just “woman.”

And where have we seen that lately? In 9x05, every voice (like Lori and Abraham, for example) was named, but Beth wasn’t. We immediately recognized her voice, but she wasn’t named in the subtitles as “Beth.” It just said “woman.” So, what does this mean? We wouldn’t have recognized Alanna’s voice yet at this point, unlike Emily’s, but we had yet to meet Tara yet. So, on a basic level, I think it shows that the unnamed “woman” will soon be a character on the show.

And why would they do that with Beth when, like Lori and Abe and the others, we’ve already met her? I think it’s probably in line with the theme about her being a different person when we see her again. In a good way. “Meet the new Beth Greene.”

The next important thing about this part is what is actually said. I’m paraphrasing here, but Tara and Lily ask where the Gov was before and he says something about having been in a town. Tara asks if the monsters were there. He says no. It was a good place, with walls. But “he” lost it. She asks, “who?” And he says, “the man in charge.” So clearly, he’s talking about himself in the third person, and Woodbury.

But.

If this is a Beth template, then Gov = Beth, right? We always wondered why they would use him, being evil and stuff, as a Beth proxy. But keep in mind that Gimple took over as official head honcho and completely reworked a reportedly terrible 3x16. They were basically done with the Woodbury/Gov storyline, and they needed a good sendoff for him. In a way, this was Gimple’s first Sirius arc. Someone who leaves, is presumed dead, but then comes back. We know Daryl (and Michonne) searched for him, but lost the trail (kinda like losing Beth’s body) and the Gov is even down one eye. Siriusly.

So, my point about the voice over is that everything said there could be applied to Rick, especially during the S4/S5. He lost it. He screwed up. Beth was left behind/separated from them.

Okay, now I’ll jump forward a little faster. For the rest of 4x06, there are really only two big things of note. 1) Tara and Lilly = two sisters who eventually lose their father. A foreshadow of the Greene family dynamic. And even though Tara’s father dies of natural causes (lung cancer), the Gov does end up bashing his face in to keep him from biting Tara. I think that was supposed to be kind of like him “killing” the dad, and therefore a foreshadow of him killing Hershel by taking his head.

The second thing, in terms of future Beth arcs, is that he lost everything, was left behind/abandoned by his people, went on a long journey, and eventually found people that he came to care about and protect. And I think the same will happen with Beth. In fact, it actually works in line with the Charleston template I laid out. Just a community of people she cares about and protects/takes care of.

And I’m sure some people will wonder about the fact that the Gov finds a love interest in Lilly, and if that will translate to Beth. Well, it’s possible. She might have had boyfriends over the years. We’ve discussed this. But it’s also important that her *true* love interest, Daryl, is already back with TF. And that wasn’t true of the Gov. He was never going to return to the prison and have some beautiful relationship with…anyone. The closest thing would have been Andrea, and she’d already died by this point.

There are, of course, small clues in 4x06 that I haven’t gone over, and of course I’ve skipped the rest home with the stigmata walker, because we know about that. But a few highlights: At one point, Tara says, “Ray Charles could have seen it” about their truck out front. Blindness mention. Lilly used to be a nurse, which ties to Grady. And she even talks about being bored, which is a direct link to Edwards being bored. 

Pirate theme, of course. I do think Megan represents Beth, though perhaps not directly in the template. She wears a lot of pink and yellow, blond hair, etc. And I think she’s just another way to say that this template is about the blond girl who, apparently, dies.

We should also probably appreciate that the way the Gov’s arc ends (the situation in 4x08) is a prisoner exchange situation where a Greene dies, and both directly ties to and foreshadows Grady.

But let’s move on. The end of 4x06/beginning of 4x07 is where they fall into a pit and meet Martinez. Let’s be real. In the show they call it “the pit” and it’s just used to keep walkers from overrunning their camp, but it’s clearly a grave. So, we have the Gov and Beth—I mean Megan—falling into a grave with a bunch of walkers (death) but surviving and eventually getting out (resurrection). Side note: we also saw the Gov kill one of the walkers that went after Megan by ripping it’s jaw off. (Speak no evil.)

So, here’s where we get to talk about Mitch and Pete a little bit. And it’ll be fun. I promise. :D

Watching this with an eye toward them representing Daryl and Merle, a lot of the symbolism became a lot more obvious. Keep in mind that they’re anti-parallels, not parallels.

See, between the two, Pete, who actually represents Merle, is the more sweet, compassionate one. While Mitch is the more brutal one. But again, they’re anti-parallels, so in this case, Mitch, the brutal one, is Daryl’s antithesis and Pete, the kind one, is Merle’s.

In fact, the first time we meet them, Mitch doesn’t want to let the Gov’s group in because they already had too many mouths to feed, and Pete says, “come on, man. They have a kid.” Just reminded me a lot of Daryl’s “they had a baby” in 3x10 after saving the family on the bridge.

So, they come back to the camp and start living in a trailer. The Hole in the Roof theory is huge here. The roof of the trailer keeps leaking water and, I shit you not, it looks like it’s dripping from a bullet wound. So, clearly….

And while I stand by it being a symbol of Beth being shot in the head, I also think it represents toxicity of a sort. Things that are wrong and it’s just a matter of time before the crap hits the fan. That sort of thing.

Okay, obviously the most important part of this episode is when they go to the cabin, but let me mention a few things that happen along the way.

Mitch, Pete, Martinez, and the Gov go out looking for supplies for the camp. And they had a really interesting conversation that may give some insight into the spearfishing in Find Me.

They walk by the lake and the Gov asks if there are fish in the lake. They reply, no. The lake is totally dead. Mitch then adds that there are rabbits, skunks, and possums. Obviously, some symbolism in those animals. But it occurs to me that fish = life. Something they can eat, subsist and even thrive on. The lake is dead because there are no fish.

Now, clearly this is a foreshadow of the Gov killing Pete and putting him in the lake. And of the Gov already being kind of dead in his soul. And “dead water” might also foreshadow the poisoned water theme. Water that can cause death if you drink it.

But in thinking about Daryl’s reaction to both Leah and Carol finding fish in FM, it’s kind of interesting. Both times, he says, “no way,” and is pleasantly surprised that they caught the fish (life). So, I’m wondering if this is meant to be him being surprised that someone he thought was dead was really alive. And what if all the fish symbols we’ve seen represent life in some way?

Of course, it could also be that a mounted fish, like we saw near Dwight in S8 is technically a dead fish. So, it might have symbolized the death of his and Sherry’s relationship. Or that it would live again. I’m not sure how granular to make this. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Okay, so then they come upon a camp that seems to be doing well. Mitch wants to take all their supplies, but Pete refuses and they leave. Later, they come back to find the camp overrun, most of its people dead, and the supplies gone. Here, Mitch is just pissed that they didn’t take the supplies before someone else got them. (Very anti-Daryl.)

But I do think this points to some future arc. I don’t know for sure what it will be, but again, I think it works with the Charleston template. Like, Beth is in a community. She goes out looking for supplies, and when she comes back, the community has been knocked on its butt by the CRM. And this is one of those things that was never really acknowledged or explained in the show. Who killed off the camp? And why wasn’t anyone in the Gov’s group at all concerned that their camp might be next? Gotta be symbolism for sure. :D

Oh, and the Gov says it must have “just happened.” Just like Daryl said about the wolves and the girl on the tree in 5x15. And again, the wolves are very tangled up in the Native American symbolism.

Then there’s the cabin bit. Again, I’m not at all sure how this will fit into Beth’s arc, but I’m sure it foreshadows SOMEthing. So, we have two headless corpses, one of which says LIAR and the other that says RAPIST. And then a third that still has his head, but killed himself with a shotgun. He is, presumably, the guy who lived in the cabin and killed the first two, and he’s labeled himself MURDERER.

Now, on the one hand, all of these words describe the Governor. He says “Liar” just before taking Hershel’s head, which is what that first one points to. And it’s not too hard to figure out that he’s a murderer. We didn’t actually see him rape anyone in the show, but there were suggestions of it, especially as he attacked Michonne and manipulated Andrea. And I’m pretty sure in the comic books, he does actually rape Michonne. They just didn’t want that to be the case in the show. So, these do all work for his story line.

But I also think these may be things Beth encounters at some point in her arc. Maybe someone will lie to her (or even betray her, Lone Ranger-style) and she’ll have to take them out. We already saw her dealing with rape at Grady, and have long thought that it foreshadows a bigger, potential rape situation that she’ll have to deal with. You get the idea. So, it’s very vague and I don’t have any great inspirations about what these point to, but in general, I’m sure they’ll apply to her.

It's also important to note that all these guys are dressed in military clothing. So, we might be able to tie them to CRM, symbolically if not literally.

I didn’t find anything massive inside the cabin that we haven’t already discussed. You asked me to look for revolution/George Washington pictures, @wdway, and I didn’t notice any. I didn’t try overly hard to see every single picture in the background, but most of them looked too blurry to tell much detail anyway. The major one is of Abraham Lincoln, and I think that’s important. But I’ll come back to it.

Of course, we have all the Native American symbols in this cabin. So, here’s the thing. Because of Tonto in TLR, I feel like whoever the Native American symbolism points to, whatever group that is, good or bad, it represents the group that Beth found after she woke up/lived, who nursed her back to health. And the reason I say good or bad is because the Claimers do theoretically fall under this same symbol theme for Daryl. The first group of people he ran into after he lost Beth. After the big disaster.

And here, I think Martinez’s group works in that regard for the Governor. He wasn’t hurt badly but he was in need of help after falling into the pit. You could say the same of Daryl after losing Beth. He just needed people to pull him out of his slump.

Now, here’s the other thing I’m not entirely sure how to interpret, but it does lend credence to the idea of the guy who lived in the cabin, who took out the two headless corpses, being representative of Beth. Once they’ve cleaned the walkers out of the cabin and are all sitting down talking, the Gov finds a picture of the guy who lived their and his family. The guy’s left eye has been colored over with read. Like red pen or marker. But it’s clearly a Sirius symbol and the red looks like blood.

So, I thought about what must have happened in this cabin. I kind of thing it might have been sort of like what happened with Abraham’s family. We were told after 5x05 that he killed the people who were actually part of his group. People he trusted. That’s because while he was out on a supply run, they raped his family. They just couldn’t show that in the show.

So, for the cabin guy, taking out a rapist and liar who might have harmed his family is straight forward enough. But why would he kill himself if his family still lived? And the Gov’s group found them as walkers in the house. Why would they continue to live there if the husband/father had shot himself on the porch? So, I’m thinking that these two headless corpses not only raped but perhaps murdered his family. So, he beheaded them and, in his grief, took himself out.

Or, because he labeled himself a murderer, maybe something happened where his family went crazy, or just got bitten, and he had to put them down. And that made him feel like a murderer. Because I don’t think justly taking out bad guys would have made him feel that way.

This may feel largely irrelevant, but it’s in the episode for a reason. Once again, I think this probably points to some part of Beth’s future arc. I mean, this sort of thing, the kind of thing Abraham went through, since it happened at the hands of people that were part of his community and that he trusted, is the ultimate betrayal, right? So maybe it will be a matter of someone in her community that she trusts betraying them to the CRM or something. IDK.

I keep saying it’s the west/lone ranger stuff that = betrayal, but the Native American theme always seems to be tangled up with it, doesn’t it?

Some minor details.

They find *beer* in the cabin.

We find out that Mitch and Pete were in the army before the turn happened. And in this case, I don’t necessarily want to link that to the CRM. We could, but given that both of them are now dead, it doesn’t really matter.

But it occurred to me that this is more evidence of them being anti-Daryl and Merle. Daryl and Merle were nobodys and drifters before. So, their opposites were in one of the most disciplined professions one can enter. Daryl started in an unproductive place and evolved. Mitch started in a disciplined place and devolved.

Of course, they’re playing GOLF when he kills Martinez. After doing so, he sits like Daryl at the crossroads. Then when Lilly finds him in the RV, he says he had a bad dream. He doesn’t remember. (Memory loss mention.)

They tell the camp he was hitting golf balls, got drunk, and fell into the grave/pit. *coughs Bethyl*

There were some interesting mushroom mentions. I noticed that before they met up with Martinez’s group, they were talking about Tara’s ex girlfriend (who was named SAM, btw) who lied to her about her feelings for Tara. Lilly says, “Yeah, then you went camping, ate mushrooms, and the rest was history.” Or something like that. I wasn’t sure what to make of that, but then later, we see the same mushrooms on the trees around the Gov that we saw in Still. Hmm.

I’m also a little unsure of what to make of the walker pit they reach when they try to leave the camp. Remember they all take off in a car, including Tara’s girlfriend, but they have to stop because the road is impassible. It’s turned to mud and is full of walkers. I’m sure that’s symbolic of something, but I don’t know what.

Of course, the Gov kills Pete and recruits Mitch. You could say he has a very Negan approach, ruling through fear. He kills Pete specifically BECAUSE he’s the compassionate one and Mitch is the brutal one. Very different to how Rick ever approached things.

Okay, that’s most of what I have for the Gov. Except that at the beginning of 4x08, after he takes Michonne and Hershel prisoner, he says, “they’re the key.” (Key Theory).

[gild-and-fire]

who's your fave minor gg character? fave flavor of ice cream? fave beth line? fave rio line?

Oh, what great questions! thank you!!

Minor character: Can I say Mick? like I know he’s the moment and I don’t mean any disrespect, but he is a side character lol more specifically, I love his energy! He’s tired and serious about most things and overall pretty hardcore (he killed Lucy geez), but then bam! once you get him started on something he loves, he’s so giddy and pure. 

Ice cream: Neapolitan!!! kinda the perfect flavor imo

Fave line: Lauren, you’re basically forcing me to do a complete rewatch tonight lol but off the top of my head

Beth: “Yeah I forgot the milk, and let ted (?) go back to his babies” sorry I cant remember the exact line but s1 confrontation in that dress w dean...we need more of that in s4 tbh

Rio: “Now, let’s go make some money” / “So, who makes your money?” Both of these are god tier, the scenes before are impeccable, Rio (not Manny ahem) looks hot, and quite frankly rio x money is my kink so

Send me:

“would you ever….”

“have you ever….”

your honest opinion of me

assumptions about me and I’ll confirm or deny them

“what’s your favourite….”

confessions

ask for advice

random questions