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afrotunada · 3 months ago

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incomplete list of fun and interesting things I've learned about Jason Todd through my scattered readings and late night googling

One time, he was sooo desperate for affection and validation, he was willing to risk it all after an accidental, spur of the moment kiss with Barbara Gordon in Three Jokers Issue #2. Alas, he was thwarted by a janitor, the poor bastard...(much to everyone's relief I'm sure) (Batman: Three Jokers)

Batman: Three Jokers Issue #3

In addition to statuesque amazons (Artemis), blonde bombshells (Isabel Ardila), white-haired beauties (Essence and Rose Wilson), and Dick's ex-girlfriends, Jason also likes smart, curvy ladies ;) selfshippers rejoice! (although I myself am not so curvy, his love of normal girls is a positive in my book<3) (Red Hood: The Hill)

Jason hooking up with Dana's friend and employee Carmen Ortega while Dana herself (as Strike) gets her shit rocked by her other (former) friend and employee Omar (as Slayer) on the other side of town - as one does. Red Hood: The Hill Issue #2

One of Jason's first overtures at rejoining the Batfam was made in the New 52 relaunch of the 2011 comic Batman Incorporated, where he takes on the persona of Wingman at the behest of Bruce. He even teams up with Damian Wayne (going by Redbird at the time), forming their own very brief Batman & Robin-esque pair! Also, they both looked kind of ridiculous... [apparently, takes place sometime during Red Hood and the Outlaws Vol. 1 (2011-2015), around issues 17 and 18 and Death of A Family, but before Damian's death and his own Joker-induced gas coma. weird ass timeline!] (Batman Incorporated (2012))

Yes, that is, in fact, Jason in that getup. It's giving Cybercop Owlman. Peak fashion, actually. Batman Incorporated (2012) Issue #4

(as an additional aside, post New 52 and into the Rebirth era, Jay and Bruce start patching things up (kinda) and enter a truce of sorts starting in the Red Hood and the Outlaws: Rebirth one-shot from 2016. Yay!)

In the Elseworld of Batman: White Knight (also known as the Murphyverse for it's creator - Sean Murphy), Jason Todd is the eldest son instead of Dick Grayson, meaning that he was actually both the first Robin, and Bruce's first adopted son! He was still captured and tortured by the Joker tho....he escaped alive, but was presumed dead and given a burial and tombstone - as in the main universe - and Dick was taken on as Robin in his "absence." Poor guy! He can't catch a break even in AUs! BUT!! He does gets his own Robin sidekick in this universe - Gan! (also known as Robin IV, a young woman of Mongolian descent who took up the mantel herself with a homemade costume (similar to Stephanie Brown)). In fact, she's the one who encourages him to become Red Hood in the first place! (Batman: White Knight)

Harley Quinn is a primary protagonist of this universe, btw, and pretty much saves Jason from being killed Batman: White Knight Issue #2

Gan is my adorable daughter and Jason (the messy bitch as she calls him) deserves his own chaos gremlin apprentice<3 Panel 1 - Batman: White Knight Presents: Red Hood Issue #1 Panels 2 & 3 - Batman: White Knight Presents: Red Hood Issue #2

Speaking of AUs and elseworlds, in 2002's World Without Young Justice, Jason Todd was a circus acrobat, as per his original pre-crisis origin (minus the red hair). In this AU, he's dating fellow circus member Anita Fite (normally Empress, but here known as Voodoo Princess), but she ends up assassinating him at the behest of his step-mom, Catherine Todd, because he discovered his parents dirty business dealings with Killer Croc. What the hell Catherine? (Young Justice Vol. 1 - World Without Young Justice, Part 1: The World What Once We Knew)

Young Justice (1998) Issue #44 - World Without Young Justice, Part 1: The world What Once We Knew

Anyway! This isn't comprehensive or anything, just a post made in fun to put together some things about Jason that I think were funny/interesting that the fandom doesn't know/talk about much. Might add more later if I come across other stuff during my readings (maybe not for a while tho; I am currently consumed by World's Finest and following the Absolute Power event).

But yeah! Feel free to add on if you like! :)

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trashlie · 1 year ago

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Alyssa Cho: Sexuality and Fitting In

It’s been six months since we finished the Shinlyssa Flashback arc, can you believe that? And it’s taken me all these months to finally start putting together this post lol.

During the flashback arc, one of the hotly contested theories was: Did Alyssa have a crush on Shinae? It’s easy to think we’re reading into things, especially in a story like ILY where we can’t always, in the moment, see something for what it is, or rather what it will become. It’s easy to overthink things, and sometimes we get focused on things that are red herrings. But, in this case, I think it’s not far from the truth at all. In fact, I think the possibility of Alyssa’s sexuality is a part of why she is so desperate to fit in at all. Especially in middle school, society isn’t always kind to lgbtq folks, and there’s a couple hints that it might be something her family is against, as well.

Now I want to make it clear from the start: I don’t think we can specifically speculate on what Alyssa’s sexuality is, firstly because there’s a good chance even she isn’t sure and secondly because sexuality is certainly a part of a spectrum and it isn’t something that necessarily stays unwavering. I will also up front state that while my suspicions are that Alyssa leans more towards lesbian, that doesn’t negate the possibility of bi/pan/something less specific. But what I DO want to speculate is how her relationship with her possible sexuality, and thus her relationship with Shinae, heavily factors into her need to conform and fit in.

I think the beginning of the flashback arc is where we see Alyssa at her happiest, and perhaps her most honest. She has a great time in math club with Alyssa, the teacher gets her excited about the math competitions and the chance to prove herself. But it also is where everything starts to go downhill.

It doesn’t really need reiterated, because the story has made it very clear, but Alyssa is very driven by attention and praise. But I don’t think it’s blind praise she wants, because she often refutes it from Alyssa. It’s not anything special to her that she can play instruments because anyone can do that; writing music though? That’s special. Alyssa talks about wanting to be liked and popular, but what I suspect she really want is acceptance for who she is, and she quickly learns that it won’t be found here unless she starts faking it.

She’s an intellectual girl, advanced beyond probably most of her peers, who has no favor for kpop and much prefers the classics, is heavily invested in STEM with a favor for bio engineering. It’s made immediately apparent to her that all of her interests will make her a target. It’s not simply that she won’t fit in - it’s that she sticks out in a way that will make people think her weird and outcast her, and it’s really clear that being ostracized is something she fears. I think it’s important to emphasize that this is a fear; it’s not simply being a preteen and wanting to be liked because you don’t know how to be alone but a fear that drives her to do really rash things and lash out. This fear is compounded by her anxiety. When confronted about the missing science project, when it gets out of her hand before she has a chance to stop it, when confrontation comes to a head, Alyssa goes home, feeling sick and miserable.

She simply could not handle the confrontation or the ramifications it yielded.

For Alyssa, fitting in a necessity.

Early in, Alyssa admits to Shinae that she begged her parents to let her go to public school because she wanted to make friends her own age. I imagine she must have been lonely. I don’t think she was homeschooled with other kids - just her sister, and from the sounds of it, she probably didn’t have friends in her dance lessons. I’m willing to bet they were personal, one-on-one lessons, or else maybe she would have been more focused on making friends with the kids in her class rather than dancing? As it is, dance sounds like it was a passing interest of hers that she didn’t really come to love but was stuck continuing, because the alternative was to tell her parents and that doesn’t seem something she’s capable of. But she also admits to Shinae that she has seen what happens to kids who are outcast and ostracized. She doesn’t want that; it goes against the whole reason she came to public school! Why would she endure that if she could just go back to homeschooling and her loneliness?

Another thing Alyssa notes, though, is this.

It doesn’t seem like much, in the moment. Alyssa has already talked about how overbearing her parents are, how she expresses interest in something and they shower in it, even it was just a fleeting idea. She seems to feel overwhelmed by them and wants an escape from them, lest they take another thing that interests her and put her through it in a way that makes her lose any fancy she possessed for it.

But it’s a mantra that comes up again, later.

For a while during the flashback, I waffled a lot on Alyssa’s sexuality. Was it, I wondered, just a red herring, meant to make us THINK Alyssa had a crush, but it was really more about her internal conflict with her feelings about hurting Shinae and trying to do what she wants? Alyssa (much like Nol does) struggled a lot with her relationship with Shinae vs what she wanted more than anything. She tried to make it worked - tried to find a way to be both Shinae’s friend AND to be popular and well-liked, and when it miserably back-fired on her, she made a choice.

It was here, though, that I began believe that yes, Alyssa probably did have a crush on Shinae, that Alyssa may, in fact, like girls.

Alyssa has a secret so deep that she doesn’t want anyone to know, not even Shinae. (Also, note the way she says she didn’t want anyone to find out, not even you, as if maybe, Shinae could have been separate person, who maybe she could tell her OTHER secrets to, if they ever got so far.) She especially doesn’t want the teachers involved, because that will get her parents involved - and they won’t be happy, because they’ll ask things and they won’t like what she has to say. That is, the truth was something that would upset them.

It’s really important, too, to reiterate that Alyssa’s home life is far from perfect, too. We’ve seen just enough to start to wonder about them. Alyssa’s response to her dad was the most telling - the way she completely changed her whole personality and mood in response to him coming home speaks volumes.

Shinae doesn’t seem to register what she overheard, but the jagged speech bubbles suggest yelling, Meg and her dad probably arguing loudly. We don’t see anything, so it’s hard to completely read the body language - is Meg just covering hear ear because her father is yelling? Is she holding her hand up because he slapped the side of her face?

Moreso, when Shinae asks if everything is good at home, and finally brings up the complete 180 change of Alyssa’s, she lashes out again.

Hiding an angry, controlling, potentially abusive father is probably first nature to Alyssa. She’s learning - she knows what kinds of things will ostracize you, what will make you weird to the others. Isn’t it better to not let them see that side of you? But honestly, further? It reads even more like she’s just not allowed to bring kids around, period, because of him. When Shinae called to check up on Alyssa after checking on her, she asked if she could go over and visit Alyssa again, and her mom told her that she couldn’t. Whether her dad is actually strict about people coming over or Alyssa is just using it as a line to not allow anyone else (and frankly, it feels more like the latter, since she’s still feeling out what is “normal”), the point is: they’re hiding something.

So Alyssa has a secret she’s so desperate to keep, that she absolutely does not want anyone, not even Shinae, and especially not her parents to find out.

The other thing that made me start to feel more confidently about this possibility was the language used by the boys bullying Alyssa. It’s language that is very pointedly anti-gay.

It’s not just simple bullying - it’s not (completely) about the stolen project, it’s not about who she hangs out with or her socio-economic status or who her paents are, or anything like Shinae is bullied for.

“You’re really cute, you know that? Such a shame it’s going to waste though... Nasty.”

What else could they mean by “going to waste” if not that it’s a shame that she, a cute girl, would never date them/some guy, that it’s “wasted” on her going “against the natural order of things” or something equally gross.

“You know they say people like you have brains that are damaged, right? That’s why you’re the way you are.”

Homosexuality being written off as a mental illness, as something wrong with the brain, as something that can be converted out of them, as though it’s a defect still remains an argument even in this day and age. Anti-gay hate speech still tries to convince queer folk and especially those who hate or fear them that there is something wrong with them, that they’re defective, that it goes against all that is natural (a man should only lie with a woman).

These boys are echoing explicit hate speech, and I think it must be tied to the notes in Alyssa’s locker. If they were the same things Shinae is being bullied for, why would she refused so adamantly to tell her about it? If they were bullying her about the same thing, wouldn’t she maybe instead just blame Shinae? But instead, she doubles down on it, because this thing, this thing she’s hiding that she doesn’t want anyone to know about, would ruin everything. Her parents would hate her, and if she were forced to tell them the truth about it, perhaps she’d face even worse consequences with her family.

Alyssa reiterates that she just wanted to be liked and to fit in. And now, there’s no easy way out of her current situation. She’s conflicted about the choice she has to make. She doesn’t tell Shinae what she’s conflicted about - but I think it’s pretty easy to guess what it is.

Alyssa’s conflict is: does she remain friends with Shinae who has been nice to her and has treated her so well and probably made her feel special, but also whose relationship has brought Alyssa strife and made others think she might be a weirdo thief in association; or does she do what she set out to and forsake Shinae in favor of the other kids’ approval, to fit in and blend in just the way she wanted?

We know what choice she made, but despite how things go, I don’t think it was the easiest choice, either. When Shinae calls out Alyssa on things like ignoring her, Alyssa deflects, though not well, and she looks nervous or anxious. When the awful girls are messing with Shinae’s belongings, Alyssa (unsuccessfully) tries to stop them. The whole altercation leading up to Alyssa recoiling and accidentally pushing Shinae out the window seems very much like a battle for Alyssa of what she wants and what she knows is right.

Shinae had a big impact on Alyssa! She was Alyssa’s first friend, and probably one of the only real, true friends she ever had. Shinae liked Alyssa completely for who she was - for her love for math and science, for her cool trips to cool exhibits, for her ability to play so many instruments. The things that made Alyssa weird to people, Shinae accepted her for. Most importantly, Shinae was a bright beam in her life. She was radiant and seemed so confident and strong and tough - things that Alyssa admired but did not herself possess.

Sure, it could have just been admiration. After all, when Alyssa began blushing with Shinae, it came off the back of compliments, right?

Alyssa seems so taken aback by Shinae’s very earnest compliment, by the idea of impressing someone with one of her skills, with the idea of being able to play something for her. But if it was simply about compliments, wouldn’t all compliments make her flush?

Minhyuk’s compliment doesn’t get much of a reaction from Alyssa. If anyone, she looks a little wary, a little put on the spot. But when Shinae backs him up and reiterates it, she’s back to being flustered, mumbling something Shinae doesn’t catch.

Something I think is worth mentioning is that quimchee definitely differentiates these kinds of reactions. Blushes are colored red and usually use the lines, but there’s a LOT more cases of the lines being used without a blush. I’ve always thought of that as being flustered - similar to when you embarrass, but perhaps not to the same degree.

We’ve seen it many times between Shinae with Dieter (compared to Dieter very often going red with the lines). We saw it when Shinae pointed out that Nol’s face had healed by getting very close to him and he got flustered, and even far earlier in the story, when Shinae ran into him in the Hirahara Corp. lobby and he fell out of the chair he was spinning in.

We even see a small version of the lines on Shinae’s face when she watches Minhyuk at taekwondo and she finds him really cool.

Now, I’m not trying to say red blush = romantic feelings, although I do think they tend to trend that way. I just want to reiterate that when the red color enters, it feels like more of a flush, a deeply blushing, than just flustered. Blushing can be embarrassment - but we also see it often with the lines (see Nol) or sometimes a sweatdrop. Perhaps quimchee does have a more specific set of rules about this that we’ll one day hear about, but it’s something I try to keep in mind.

That said, Alyssa blushing A LOT in a black and white flashback where her sexuality has come in to play feels very, very pointed. The flashback has selective color, so Alyssa’s flush stands out. I think it’s meant to. I think we’re meant to infer this.

Her blushing isn’t simply limited to Shinae praising her, either.

When Alyssa finds out Shinae was bullied at her old school, she apologizes, and tells her she never would have guessed, asks how she can be so strong. Shinae is nothing but honest, but it’s her brilliant smile that sways Alyssa.

I think there’s something even more specific about this blush, too. The close up on her face, how we don’t see it all, her eyes withheld, her mouth quivering. Alyssa is so affected by this. It’s not Shinae paying her compliments or praising her. It’s Shinae. Her warmth and radiance and strength and positivity and the way she just shines.

And that smile GETS to Alyssa!

Alyssa can’t run away this time, so she looks away, but the blush still happens. Shinae’s smile just seems to be so disarming to Alyssa!

For a while, when I was trying to decide if I thought this was a crush or a red herring, I considered: maybe every time Shinae is so bright and positive, she feels bad because she’s lying to Shinae. She feels bad because she knows Shinae is a better friend than she is. And sure, I suppose that could be. Alyssa doesn’t like when she looks like she’s in the wrong. But given the context of the explicit things the boys said, the bullying that Alyssa wouldn’t open up about, the thing that she absolutely adamantly does not want anyone to know about, that she can’t speak of?

It feels like it’s exactly what it looks like: Alyssa has a crush on the nice, tough, confident, weird, boisterous girl who is so nice to her and sees something in her.

Alyssa is so affected by Shinae’s concern, by her expression of actual care. Telling her she misses her, going all the way to her place to check on her, her relief that she’s okay. Alyssa is so touched by the effort Shinae puts forth, so moved to be on the receiving end of it. She just can’t reconcile herself with it.

Because Shinae represents the thing Alyssa is hiding, that she wants to run away from. She knows the other students think Shinae is weird, and that association with her only pulls down her own reputation. She’s in conflict over what she wants (popularity, so many friends, people to like her to) vs what her heart wants - Shinae’s affection and unabashed confidence and the way she looks in Shinae’s eyes.

But she can’t admit this to herself. She can’t let her heart, her feelings, rule this conflict.

I think Shinae hit the nail right on the head - just not in a way she realizes. I think Alyssa IS lying to herself. I think she IS in denial. I think her sexuality is something she’s yet to reconcile, that at this point in time she cannot make peace with. Because people think it’s weird, because they think it’s unnatural, because it’s “wrong”, because they think people like her perverts are monsters. There’s a part of her that she recognizes is not “normal”, in that it doesn’t suit the status quo, what society generally believes to be true, so she hides it. She stuffs it deep down and tries to repress it, to pretend it’s not there, pretend that’s not her, pretend she’s the very picture of “normal” middle school girl.

She pretends to like the things other “normal” kids do. She starts to feel uncomfortable about the things she DOES like. She’s not embarrassed about math club - she’s just self-conscious. Because being weird makes you stick out. It makes people look differently at you. If you’re “weird” enough, it makes them bully you, ostracize you.

Alyssa is so lonely and she just wants to fill that void. She thinks fitting in will make it better. She thinks fitting in will protect her. Look how quickly the bully girls change their beliefs about Alyssa, as soon as she pushes all suspicion from her. No longer is she the weird one, suddenly they wall want to be her friend, they think she’s so cool. Just like that.

Fitting in will afford her protection, because if she’s “normal” enough, no one will suspect her, no one will find her weird, and no one will find out about her darkest secret. It will keep her safe.

Obviously, this is a naïve belief. Especially in middle school, kids will turn on you for whatever reason. Alyssa is clearly rich, eager to please, and wants to fit in. She’s sold one project and suddenly kids wanted her to do all their work, to benefit from her. It wasn’t real friendship - they just liked her for what she could do to them. But Alyssa is convinced that popularity - that being surrounded by people, by being liked, will protect her. She’ll fit in. She’ll have friends. That aching loneliness that has eaten her up won’t be a problem.

Except none of it is real. The real friendship was Shinae. Shinae was the one who liked her for who she is, not just what she can do for her. Shinae was the one she didn’t have to fake it for, who saw her at her worst and still tried to be her friend. It was the price she paid to protect herself, and her secret.

But for Alyssa, who may see a part of herself as “wrong” because it won’t be accepted, who is so lonely and just wanted to be liked and to make friends, maybe she hopes that being liked will make up for that “wrongness”. Maybe, if enough people like her, it will make her feel loved in the way she wants, but won’t allow. If she thinks something is wrong with her, couldn’t the love and adoration of the masses, make her feel like it’s not true, cover it up, make it feel like it doesn’t matter?

I think even now, in the present, it’s possible that Alyssa’s sexuality may be a thing she hasn’t reconciled with. Is she still hiding from it? Is she still fighting to be seen as “normal”? Who was she, before Yui made an idol of her, when she was friends with Nol, Dieter, and Soushi. Did she crave that faux normalcy even then?

I’ve considered, too, that perhaps Nol provides another benefit he’s unaware of. Again, as I’ve said, we can only speculate on Alyssa’s sexuality, so it doesn’t rule out that she could also like men. But could it be that Nol provides her the protection that she needn’t deal with her sexuality? She has a boyfriend, case closed. It doesn’t matter then, who she’s interested in. It doesn’t matter, because who is going to question anything?

(Also, tangential, but fake-dating someone who so-very-much resembles young Shinae, with that bright, radiant smile that had a way of always undoing Alyssa? Listen. You can’t tell me that’s a coincidence. Even if she’s never had feelings for Nol, I still think she was drawn to him because of how Yeonggi reminded her of Shinae, how he was like an echo of the only real friendship she’d had, and I think that was a big part of the draw. Shinae had such an impact on her that years later, she was shaken to her core by someone whose smile was just as radiant as hers.)

I don’t think this is the last we’ve seen of Alyssa’s sexuality, either. It wouldn’t have been repeated so many episodes if not. I always thought that Alyssa’s career will fail at some point, because the whole point of her character is that she is constantly trying to chase love and affection in places she won’t find it, and her fans’ love for her is only conditional. It used to be I thought that bullying allegations would arise and that would cause her call. Claims that Alyssa was involved with a girl who got pushed out of her school window, that she turned on her. It’s so easy to take the truth and twist it up a little. Shinae saw her first bully again when she was buying comics. Who’s to say Sarah Lee won’t show up again to bring down Alyssa. As a former trainee, wouldn’t Sarah have the most jealousy towards Alyssa? But now I do worry that it could be rumors of her sexuality that could be her undoing. After all, how did the boys targeting Alyssa know what they did? Where did they glean the information they used against her?

I know Alyssa isn’t a popular character with a lot of the choices she has made. But I do think it’s worth acknowledging how her potential sexuality ties into those choices she made, and the kind of pressure she felt to fit in, to be seen as “normal”. A lonely girl who wanted nothing more than to have lots of friends, who probably felt so empty despite her parents’ overbearing interest in her, but who also knew that there was something about her that is considered Not Right, and that it was something that could threaten the very thing she covets - being adored. Idk, I think in that context, her choices make sense. They’re still selfish, she still can’t face conflict, she still doesn’t get that being loved is not about a role but who you are. But I think if she could feel that part of her accepted, if she didn’t fear what her parents would think, if she knew she’d be supported no matter what, maybe she wouldn’t have made those choices.

Like everyone in ILY, Alyssa has to contend with who she really is and she really wants. Now that she’s an idol, she’s come to realize that even this love is conditional. That it doesn’t fill that lonely void, that it doesn’t replace whatever it is she’s seeking - it just makes it worse.

#I Love Yoo #ILY Brainrot #Alyssa Cho #Shinae Yoo #I KNOW FANDOM HAS FEELINGS ABOUT HER BUT #idk i've come to love Alyssa lmaoooooooooo #I don't like her choices but i get it #she is a mess and i really hope we get to see her try to clean up those messes one day because it's the least the people she's hurt deserve #but once again just like everyone in ILY lmao i think Alyssa is a victim of her circumstances #or rather in her case i think she has felt for her whole life boxed into a corner #i think she's probably been heavily at war with herself #supposing it's true and she isn't completely straight then she has lived with something that scares her for so long #i think it absolutely compounds her need to be liked #i don't think that the latter is caused by the former as much it just exacerbates it #whether or not she likes girls she still wants to be popular and well liked by the masses #but liking girls means it's more important it's more of a NEED than a want #and it's not something she could come out and tell Shinae because i don't think it's something she can admit to herself #at least not comfortably anyway. not with pride. not without feeling like a mistake

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