#ml syren

[theerurishipper]

So, as a child abuse survivor and someone who has been sexually assaulted by men who think they're entitled to take what they want Adrien is canonically a god damned dick.

He sexually harrasses Ladybug. When told NO he once let 2.161 million people drown because he was busy throwing a tantrum

Being a victim of abuse does not excuse the abuse of others.

He might not mean any harm but you know who else doesn't mean any harm? Gabriel. My goddamned mother.

Not meaning harm- lacking malice- does not mean harm is not caused.

People are going on about him being a rich white guy because anyone else acting like that in public would be considered an antagonist (in fiction), in jail, or have an active warrant for their arrest. And that's assuming they aren't killed for it.

First off, I am truly very sorry for your experience. No one should have to go through that.

But I still do disagree.

Adrien's pushiness when it comes to expressing his affections for Ladybug are in the same boat as Marinette being a stalker or Chloe being pushy with Adrien: it's a joke. You may find it to be a poor one, certainly, but it's a joke nonetheless. Miraculous relies on this kind of humor, it's not meant to be taken seriously. You can have issues with it, but imho acting like it's any kind of legitimate criticism of his character probably makes people like me less inclined to listen to any actual criticisms you may have.

I don't say this to trivialize your experiences, and if the joke is hurtful to you, you are well within your rights to dislike it or talk about how it's in poor taste to make jokes about these things, but that's all it is, a joke. It's absurdist humor. It's not meant to be taken at face value. It would be creepy if Marinette seriously had Adrien's schedule mapped out, tried to break into his house, or stole his personal items, but it's not supposed to be that way because it's a joke.

And as for your complaint about Adrien leaving people to drown, you can go ahead and blame Master Fu for that one. It's stated quite clearly in the show that the heroes couldn't do anything because everything is underwater. And he's staying there because he's waiting for Ladybug. Making up imaginary civilians who are drowning now isn't a good criticism. Ladybug spends a good amount of time underwater, but there's no-one there. There's no civilian begging for Chat Noir's help as they drown while he ignores them, so suffice to say that we're supposed to assume everyone is safe and sound. This is a kids show, so unless we're shown that people are in danger, we aren't supposed to assume they are.

And then let's talk about Adrien almost quitting.

I'll say it straight: he has every right to quit. He's a 14-year-old kid. This isn't his job. He's well within his rights to quit if he feels like this is detrimental to him. And it isn't about Ladybug not returning his feelings like you seem to be implying. This is about Ladybug keeping secrets from him and leaving him in the dark even though he's supposedly her partner. It took a situation like this for Master Fu to pull his head out of his ass and come give Adrien the tools he needed to do the damn job you're accusing him of not doing. How is he supposed to do anything if he isn't given then necessary tools and knowledge to do it? Should he just accept that he's being ignored and left in the dark? Accept his new role as Ladybug's unquestioning lapdog?

This is not Ladybug salt btw, this is Master Fu salt only, in this house we don't like Master Fu.

Anyway.

Literally look at why he tries to quit.

Adrien:(grimly) If you don't tell me what Ladybug is hiding from me, I'm done! Plagg: You can't do that! Adrien:(bitterly) Why not? No one'll know if I quit. No one'll care!

He doesn't think he's needed. He doesn't think anyone would care if he quits.

This isn't because of any entitlement. It's because he's being cast aside and left in the dark. It's because his partner (it's not her fault either, to be clear, it's Master Fu's fault) is keeping secrets from him even in this time, so he assumes he isn't needed and decides to quit because he feels like he's unnecessary and unwanted, and that no one will care if he quits. Adrien already has very low self-worth, and this is just adding onto all that already. If it is detrimental to his mental health, then he definitely has the right to step aside and quit.

So yeah. If this ask was to get me to change my mind, I'm sorry, but it didn't. You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but I think I've made my opinion on the matter clear.

[bittersweetresilience]

Adrien Agreste and Borderline Personality Disorder

DISCLAIMER: I've been a bit low on spoons this week, so I haven't gathered as much evidence as I probably could have. Also, I am but a humble student in clinical psychology. This is mainly a thought compilation for @moonieratty!

To introduce the topic, without going into it too much, personality is described by features and behavioral patterns, or traits, consistent across situations and across time. Personality disorders are therefore enduring patterns of highly maladaptive traits evaluated in personal and sociocultural context (Dozois, 2019, p. 290).

Like other disorders, personality disorders have diagnostic criteria. The DSM is used primarily for diagnosis in the US and Canada while the ICD is used more widely in Europe and other places. I'm more familiar with the DSM, but I've included a brief section on the ICD to be comprehensive. It ended up a bit longer than anticipated, so let's go below the cut. Warning for discussions of abuse, self harm, and suicide, and a brief mention of substance use.

Overview of Borderline Personality Disorder

BPD is prevalent in a small percentage of the population, about 1-2% by varying estimates, and is characterized by instability across domains of emotions, identity, interpersonal relationships, and behavior. Its onset is usually in late adolescence or early adulthood and symptoms may diminish with age, after one's thirties or forties, especially with therapeutic intervention. Along with ASPD, it has been the focus of a lot of clinical research; it is unfortunately associated with high rates of non-suicidal self-injury and suicide (APA, 2022, pp. 754–755; Dozois, 2019, pp. 308–309).

Etiological factors for BPD include both biological and environmental disturbances. Of note to our discussion is the heightened risk for BPD in cases of child abuse or neglect, as well as growing up with another family member with a serious mental health condition (NHS, 2022). It's been well established that Gabriel is emotionally neglectful if not outright abusive toward Adrien in multiple ways, so this is a clear risk factor. In addition, although I won't argue definitively for Gabriel having a psychological condition, he did keep Emilie's body in the basement, so there is clearly some kind of disturbance going on.

From a cognitive-behavioral perspective, Linehan argues that BPD stems from families who consistently invalidate childhood emotional experiences and "oversimplify the ease with which life's problems can be solved," which may cause children to learn to seek attention and communicate with others through emotional outbursts (Dozois, 2019, p. 297). This rings true for Adrien and Gabriel as well.

I have to apologize for my son, Ladybug, he's like his mother. Way too overly dramatic. (Jackady)

It doesn't seem like this is the first time Gabriel has thought this, and labeling an emotional reaction as being overly dramatic is very much invalidation of it. As for emotional outbursts, Adrien has had quite a few, mostly as Chat Noir. More on this later.

To round out this first section, attachment theory proposes a connection between poor parent-child attachments and BPD relationship difficulties. Specifically, maladaptive behavior in relationships may stem from childhood development of an anxious-ambivalent attachment style, where intense fears of abandonment interfere with a strong desire for intimacy (Dozois, 2019, p. 310). You can clearly see this in Chat Noir's relationship with Ladybug, and I'm sure other people have discussed Adrien's attachment style more in depth, but suffice to say I think this is an apt description.

Argument from DSM-5-TR

In the DSM, personality disorders are primarily diagnosed on a categorical model. There are a few general criteria which I won't be going into, but I will highlight that personality disorders are stable and pervasive, and would be diagnosed only if they were leading to significant distress or dysfunction. Adrien's mental state is not great, so the latter shouldn't be a problem, but this show does not always pay attention to consistency, so I'm going to be speculating some. Everything in this section is cited to the relevant DSM entry unless otherwise stated.

The DSM characterizes BPD with instability in relationships, self image, and affects, as well as marked impulsivity. It has no exclusion criteria, so BPD can be and frequently is comorbid with other disorders like mood disorders, PTSD, and ADHD. Of the below criteria, five need to be met in order for a diagnosis to be made.

Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment

Hey, where're you going? . . . So you're allowed to know her true identity, but I'm not? (Syren)

You're not really replacing me with a turtle, are you? (Anansi)

A lot of people have delved into Adrien's abandonment issues, which feature most prominently in his relationship with Ladybug. His fears of being replaced result in him seeking reassurance from Ladybug, and he can lash out if he does not receive the response he hopes for. Ladybug is his world, and he wants to be hers, so anything infringing on that feels to him like a threat of being abandoned, and he does not like it very much.

Impulsive behaviors like giving up his ring can be interpreted under this lens: he can avoid abandonment by doing the abandoning first. Then it will be him leaving, and not the other way around.

I also interpret Adrien's nightmare (Le Marchand de Sable) as being a fear of being alone as much as it is a fear of being trapped.

Unstable and intense interpersonal relationships alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation

We'll be united, more powerful and free. We'll defeat Hawk Moth, then we can both run away to an island! Far away from everything. We will live off nothing but fruits, and we will have a little pet hamster and we will name it— (Le Patineur)

I just can't do this anymore. I give up… on everything. Even you . . . If I become Chat Noir again, Ladybug will just end up rejecting me, over and over. (Kuro Neko)

Even though Adrien mostly keeps his head on straight regarding what he's owed and not owed by other people, his relationship with Ladybug is full of highs and lows. He thinks Ladybug is the most amazing girl, but this can recoil quickly into feeling as though Ladybug doesn't care about him enough or isn't meeting his needs.

Furthermore, he developed this idealization of Ladybug as a potential lover or caregiver at one of their first meetings (Cœur de Pierre), and continually sought to spend time together and share the intimate details of their secret identities early on. These are all common to individuals with BPD, as is the switch from idealization to feeling as if the other person "does not care enough, does not give enough, or is not 'there' enough." Ladybug is the only person Adrien consistently projects this instability and intensity on, which might be something interesting to explore.

Identity disturbance: unstable self image or sense of self

When I was a kid, I always wanted to be what my parents wanted me to be! (Exauceur)

But, does that mean Chat Noir is who I really am? Deep down inside? (Kuro Neko)

With all the secret identities, it isn't surprising that Adrien fits this criterion, but canon even explicitly draws a link between Adrien's unstable sense of self and his childhood experiences. He doesn't know who he is, and he distracts from this by being Chat Noir, only to struggle even more when he feels useless and underlooked as his hero self. His behavior shifts dramatically between trying to prove himself with grand gestures and refusing to participate or lashing out. There is definitely something to discuss on this front.

Impulsivity in at least two potentially self-damaging areas

Giving you some extra time . . . I trust you to bring me back, m'lady. (Gamer 2.0)

There are only two liars left in Paris and one of them knows the ultimate way to catch her attention . . . Crazy about you, m'lady. (Mensonge)

This is walking a thin line between impulsivity and suicidal behavior, which would be excluded from this criterion, but I'll list self sacrifice here because I can see an argument for Chat Noir's impulsive behaviors being out of love or the desire to be useful. There may still be some self injurious intent or euphoria, but Chat Noir does have faith in Ladybug to bring him back eventually. Nevertheless, this is impulsive and unhealthy. Chat Noir jumps too quickly to this option to have thought it through.

I can't think of another area, because Adrien isn't old enough for reckless driving, spending, substance use, or sex. This is also a kids' show. Just presenting these options for fanfiction writers out there.

Recurrent suicidal or self mutilating behavior, gestures, or threats

I... I don't know what to do! (Chat Blanc)

This is all our fault . . . Cataclysm. (Culpabysse)

By itself, what happened in Chat Blanc would not be solid evidence, as that was an unprecedentedly traumatic situation. Combined with Culpabysse, though, there is a strong case to be made for at least passive suicidality for this to be able to come up as an option.

You could also interpret the self sacrifice in this category. Suicidal behavior in individuals with BPD is often preempted by fears of rejection or abandonment, so an interesting analysis could be made on this front.

Affective instability due to marked reactivity of mood

He's still only thinking of himself! I just want this terrible day to be over and done with! I hate Christmas! (Pire Noël)

Sorry! Sorry! I didn't mean to make you so mad. I get it. You're sick of me . . . No one can help me, Kagami. (Glaciator 2)

Adrien's prolonged episodes of anger and despair reflect a high reactivity to emotional stressors, especially interpersonal ones. In general, he just doesn't feel very well unless something is actively bringing him joy. Most of his outbursts are brief, though, and I will discuss them as part of a later criterion.

Chronic feelings of emptiness

I'm not Adrien, so I wouldn't know if this is the case, but I can say he has experienced at least one depressive episode (Kuro Neko) and emptiness would not be unfamiliar. You can look at him and decide.

Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger

How was your amazing evening with your "friends"? . . . What do you think? (Glaciator)

Why not? No one'll know if I quit. No one'll care! (Syren)

A two-person plan?! There's only one two-person plan, and that's Ladybug and me! (Sentibulleur)

Give me a break, Miss "I can't even come up with a superhero name"! (Hack-San)

Anger in individuals with BPD can manifest as bitterness, sarcasm, or recurrent verbal outbursts, which Chat Noir absolutely exemplifies. These outbursts are often followed by feelings of shame or guilt and contribute to a feeling of being bad. Chat Noir apologizes after being harsh in Glaciator, and I wouldn't be surprised if he felt badly about the other times. Again, these outbursts are often precipitated by interpersonal fears and perceived threats of abandonment. Unlike other symptoms, this specific one tends to be unique to BPD.

Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociation

I cannot recall any evidence for this but headcanon away, my friends.

All in all, I think Adrien has a strong case for BPD presentation according to the DSM. Canon is not always consistent, but I think it presents an interesting and mostly coherent narrative for this lens. From this perspective, Adrien's behavior reflects a deep intolerance of being alone and a dependence on other people to define the self.

As a corollary, BPD behavioral patterns are frequently linked to self sabotage and self undermining right when a goal is about to be realized, which could manifest as dropping out of school right before graduating or ending a relationship when it seems to be going well. Food for thought. Individuals with BPD may also feel more secure with transitional objects like pets than with interpersonal relationships, which could reflect in Adrien's relationship with Plagg.

To add some subjective understanding to this clinical mumbo jumbo, I've added a source of genuine BPD experiences below (Mind, 2022).

Argument from ICD-11

With the release of the ICD-11, a dimensional model for diagnosis of personality disorders became the new standard. What this means is that individuals are no longer labeled as having 'histrionic' or 'dependent' or, indeed, 'borderline' personality disorders, but are rather assessed as having any form of personality disorder on a sliding scale of severity and with trait domain specifiers (Swales, 2022). To put it more simply, people are diagnosed only with a general personality disorder or personality difficulty which can be optionally specified as deviating on one of the personality traits in the Big Five model, which is well established in personality psychology.

This move has several benefits. Stigmatization related to particular personality disorders can be reduced, and differential diagnosis and comorbidity between personality disorders becomes irrelevant. However, people retain access to treatment and support. Evidence-based treatments like dialectical behavior therapy are particularly well established and crucial for BPD; for this pragmatic purpose, the ICD contains one additional specifier for borderline pattern personality disorder (Bach et al., 2022; Swales, 2022).

The DSM and ICD are designed to be compatible with each other in many ways, and in this case, the borderline specifier in the ICD is directly lifted from the criterion of the DSM (WHO, 2023, 6D11.5). Based on our previous discussion, Adrien would be equally qualified for a diagnosis in France. I would likely describe his personality disorder with moderate severity, where multiple areas of functioning are affected and self harming behaviors may be present, but not all areas or relationships may be equally impacted and traits are not as rigid and inflexible (WHO, 2023, 6D10.0–6D10.2).

Interestingly, the ICD includes three additional manifestations of borderline pattern which are optional and may vary across time (WHO, 2023, 6D11.5).

A view of the self as inadequate, bad, guilty, disgusting, and contemptible

An experience of the self as profoundly different and isolated from other people; a painful sense of alienation and pervasive loneliness

Proneness to rejection hypersensitivity; problems in establishing and maintaining appropriate levels of trust in relationships; frequent misinterpretation of social signals

I'm fascinated by the number of adjectives in here. I simplified very slightly, as I did with the DSM criteria, but I had to keep all these adjectives. Anyway, I won't elaborate for too many more paragraphs, so let's say sentimonster moment and leave it at that. I will spare you my mirrored Félix essay. For now.

Qualifications and Limitations

First of all, Adrien is a teenager. The distinguishing factor between a personality disorder and regular adolescent difficulties would be longevity and identity concerns beyond his developmental phase (APA, 2022, p. 758). Second of all, Adrien has a uniquely terrible home life and magical problems. Some of his behaviors could be normal considering his experiences and sociocultural context, and this matters when it comes to psychological evaluation. Take everything with a grain of salt!

More generally, the categorical model of the DSM has several issues, not to mention diagnostic issues related to culture, gender, and stigma. Some but not all of these issues are addressed by the dimensional model it includes in a later section, which shares theoretical foundations with the model of personality disorders in the ICD. Even so, issues remain. Diagnosis, access to treatment, and political statements are intrinsically linked in complex ways. I won't get into all of the nuances, but be safe, remember this is a fictional character, and keep an open mind.

REFERENCES:

American Psychiatric Association. (2022). Diagnostic and statistical manual of mental disorders (5th ed., text rev.). https://doi.org/10.1176/appi.books.9780890425787

Bach, B., Kramer, U., Doering, S., di Giacomo, E., Hutsebaut, J., Kaera, A., De Panfilis, C., Schmahl, C., Swales, M., Taubner, S., & Renneberg, B. (2022). The ICD-11 classification of personality disorders: A European perspective on challenges and opportunities. Borderline Personality Disorder and Emotion Dysregulation, 9(1). https://doi.org/10.1186/s40479-022-00182-0

Dozois, D. J. A. (2019). Abnormal psychology: Perspectives (6th ed.). Pearson.

Mind. (2022, September). What does BPD feel like? https://www.mind.org.uk/information-support/types-of-mental-health-problems/borderline-personality-disorder-bpd/experiences-of-bpd/

National Health Service. (2022, November 4). Causes - Borderline personality disorder. https://www.nhs.uk/mental-health/conditions/borderline-personality-disorder/causes/

Swales, M. A. (2022). Personality disorder diagnoses in ICD-11: Transforming conceptualisations and practice. Clinical Psychology in Europe, 4(Special Issue). https://doi.org/10.32872/cpe.9635

World Health Organization. (2023). International statistical classification of diseases and related health problems (11th ed.). https://icd.who.int/

[halfahelix]

In this particular Lies screenshot it does look like his stripes got transferred from his shirt to the cabinet 😂 However, they have always matched (although with opposite orders)!

From the wiki gallery: Simon Says, The Collector, Syren, Oni-chan, Felix

Sorry about the reflection on the screen but everybody please look at this animation glitch in Lies where the stripes on Adrien's shirt disappeared and ended up on the cabinet in the background

[gee-arid]

Syrens awesome i love her. Old sketch digitally coloured cus i remembered my sketchbook existed.

The original sketch, from a loooong time ago.

[clawsoutspotsoff]

Spooktober: Cabin On The Lake

"Are you okay, Kim?" "Yeah I just, uh... did you guys just see something at the window?"

bonus isolated/still Syrens because the gif lost a lot of quality:

[celestiall0tus]

Syren Notes - All That Remained

And here we go with another egregious example of bad writing decisions.

So, this is very much a double edged sword. On one hand, I agree with naturegreen that the secret of Master Fu wasn't hers to tell. She was told basically to keep her piehole shut until he was ready. But this really was just to create unnecessary drama and boy does it hurt.

I do agree that Chat should have been in the loop since the moment Lady learned of Master Fu. He is a hero and should know about the other hero bullshit as Lady does. There really is no benefit to keeping him in the dark other than basic ass fucking drama. And that shit is so surface level that it hurts.

Then there is Adrien. So, I see more of the entitlement here. Feeling that he deserves to know. Which, yes, he does. However, there was no need to push Plagg to reveal such things. He honestly does need to learn that no means no and to deal with it.

And, fuck, I hate to get into this because of what we see in later seasons, but I just need to say it now. Adrien doesn't feel like a victim of abuse with how the writers are portraying him. Yes, he has moments in later seasons where we see moments of that. However, all I'm seeing (in season 2) is a whiny average teen with a mildly average life. And I know that people react to abuse and trauma differently, but fucks sakes. This doesn't feel like that in the slightest. And it's bothering the ever living hell out of me.

I know the writers are inconsistent with their characters and having them act certain ways for the plot, but come on! Abuse is something serious and needs to be written well from the very fucking beginning to be believable. In later seasons, taking out these earlier ones, I could possibly believe it. Here? Fuck no.

Personal notes. Ondine is... a far cry from what I remembered her as. I still think she's too good for Kim. Kim is... well, Kim.

SIGH Getting to the end of these. Well, Kuro Neko will be next. Get ready for that dumpster fire.

[therealtrashpanda]

So.. I gave derision another chance.

And... I still hate it so much.

[ilikekidsshows]

In retrospect do you think there were any major red flags in writing up to the S3 finale of ML that foreshadowed its downfall in future seasons or do you think it all started in what you call the retool era (S4&5).

I’d say we’re dealing with a lot of “recurring issues” and some actual red flags. As I’ve stated repeatedly, the New York Special basically has the same Ladynoir break up and get back together plot as season four, and it was bad in the New York Special and absolutely horrid in season four. Also, the show’s worst episodes, ‘Reflekdoll’ and ‘Kwamibuster’ reflect a lot of the writers’ more asinine writing decisions in the future. The New York Special and some season three episodes are, therefore, definitive red flags.

But yeah, the earlier seasons had some warning signs too. Adrien/Cat Noir is presented first and foremost as a lust object of Marinette’s. We don’t see Marinette appreciating Adrien as a person until ‘Origins’; before that point she’s only literally staring slack-jawed and drooling at Adrien’s photoshoots and ads. Marinette is also destructively jealous of Adrien from the point Lila is introduced, and she only escalates with the introduction of Kagami. Marinette’s objectification of Adrien has been in the show since its inception, considering that the original Adrien, thePV Félix, is presented in promotional materials as sullen, rude and unpleasant, meaning Marinette’s infatuation was most likely purely based on his looks. So, like, the sexism of heterosexual romance but the genders are just reversed is part of the show’s DNA.

Another important thing to note about the series is that our only Adrien-focused episodes, that focus on Adrien having some kind of a development arc with his feelings where he gets to be proactive about them instead of the show just showing the audience “oh, he’s upset now” or “oh, he’s happy now” and don’t still give Marinette a lion’s share of the focus and emotional weight, are ‘Copycat’ and ‘Santa Claws’, maybe arguably ‘Gorizilla’, though I suspect the Marinette trying to score a date segment takes up far more time than the important reveal of Adrien’s family problems. The writers have always prioritized Marinette’s feelings over Adrien’s.

Adrien’s contributions on the superhero side of things have also been getting downplayed since the start. He’s the more likely target of slapstick, with the show pilot ‘Stormy Weather’ having him get treated like a ping pong ball. He’s the one getting brainwashed or taken out by the Akumas frequently. And he’s the one the heroes’ shared mentor ignores completely. In ‘Syren’, Fu had to be strongarmed into meeting Adrien once, and then he never made an effort again. This is also the episode where the idea that Adrien shouldn’t complain about being treated as less than and should just patiently wait for whatever scraps he gets as a member of a team is first introduced. However, this episode was easily overlooked at the time, because the episode, in the end, had Fu meeting with Adrien, seemingly setting up Adrien being treated more equally, a promise that was never followed up on.

Now, though, I’d like to say why these things went unnoticed as red flags and just being some recurring issues. The thing about Adrien’s objectification was this: the people watching thought it was a joke and a sign of Marinette’s immaturity. It was presented humorously, and Marinette started being less creepy at Adrien once she became more able to talk to him. This, coupled with other lessons Marinette had about clear communication with her loved ones, like ‘Weredad’ and ‘Befana’, made people believe Marinette was going to have a character arc to grow into a more mature person who’s able to treat Adrien like a human being. This is another promise the writers never followed up on when they then retconned Adrien into a RealDoll and made him Marinette’s therapist to make sure Marinette never has to treat Adrien normally.

As for the lack of Adrien focus, the reason it went unnoticed was actually the lesser focus on other heroes, and the deeper emphasis on the superhero action than in S4-5. There were less heroes and more time spent on Akuma fights, which meant more screen time for Adrien as Cat Noir at least. When Cat Noir is the primary character Ladybug can interact with, he gets to give plenty of input on things and when he’s Ladybug’s only backup, he gets to do more things in battles. And then we add to that the bigger time the earlier seasons spent on Akuma fights, we get more of both of those things. It’s simple math. So, while Adrien didn’t get to contribute decisively a lot, he did get to contribute. Also, they had this thing where Adrien’s eclectic studies would be used to have Cat Noir give Ladybug highly specific but useful information.

Basically, yeah, there were some red flags and other lesser but still worrying stuff too.

[aurorarose2112]

Let’s include a few more examples:

Chat Blanc’s destruction of Paris (Mega Cataclysm, insta-kill)

Syren’s flooding (drowning, leading to asphyxiation and cardiac arrest, leading to death)

Frozer’s encapsulation of people in ice (frozen and stuck in low temperatures, leading to heart and respiratory problems plus hypothermia, leading to death)

Stormy Weather 2.0’s volcanic eruption (volcanic blasts, which include hot and dangerous gases, ash, lava and rock; which can also lead to threats to health merely by inhaling it in the general vicinity or trauma or even drowning in lava, leading to death)

And somehow, Thanos-snapping them out of existence made him worse than all that.

WOW. Why am I not surprised.

(For the record, it is all the same in my eyes; all of them threatened lives)

A legitimate comparison would be that these examples listed were akumatised, so their acts included a (very minuscule) external influence, while Argos!Félix did it of his own accord.

MLB Félix antis be like "He committed genocide!"

So when Bubbler!Nino makes all adults float to their deaths, it's okay.

But when Argos!Félix Thanos snaps people, a less terrifying and more ethical death, it's not okay.

I see where the line stands.

[princess-of-the-corner]

Saw the Mime/Eiffel tower comment and it made me think of a very nicely written crossover of Marvel Cinematic Universe and M.L (Black Widow, Hawkeye and Ironman talk about the Mime fight). The author in the comments even said they try to keep things even, if a villain is a threat in one setting, then in the combined that villain is a threat still. Even talked about the glamour disguising the heroes a bit.

It's called: What The Cat Dragged In by Kryal on AO3

Oh yeah like.

I was actually thinking low-key about some ML/Batman crossovers where they'd write ML's threats to be on the level of Batman ratings.

Like events like Syren, instead of just 'haha city is flooded' it's 'oh god a million people are dead!!!'.

Which is. Interesting. I can't say it's the wrong move, but it is interesting.

[gale-gentlepenguin]

ML au: Lady of Second Chances (Season 2)

(Season 1)

-So Fu introduces himself and Marinette greets him.

-Marinette had thought about this before this meeting. How much she should tell him? Should she tell him.

-After some thought, she decided she should tell him, since she never finished her training and there is more she doesn’t know.

-She tells him that she was his student and that she knows a lot, explaining the cliff notes of what happened to him and what he taught her.

-Fu was surprised and believed her because what she knew about feast and Marianne. She had to be telling the truth.

-Marinette even explained how she made the akuma charms.

-Fu asks how much if the timeline she already altered?

-Marinette explained that she is trying to keep the core events the same, but certain things that were disastrous she can change.

-Fu decides to trust her judgement, but warns her that this could be dangerous, all this knowledge. So be sure that using this knowledge it is for the betterment. Which Ladybug agrees

-First thing Marinette does is tell Fu he should go introduce himself to chat noir and explain his story.

-“he’s trust worthy and all the waiting only causes issues.”

-Fu nods that he will make time after he decides the book.

__________________________________________

-Gabriel still gets akumatized because he wanted to ensure ladybug and chat noir were off his trail.

-Gabriel never pulls adrien out of school since he had no reason to. But he makes up some bs to be mad about it.

-Ladybug tells Chat noir of her theory and just like in canon they beat collector.

-Ladybug gives Gabriel a charm so no akumatizations.

-Gabriel finds out how what the thing he gave her is and now realizes things will be tough since he can’t akumatize the same person 2 times in a row.

-Prime queen happens,but ladybug doesn’t let herself get flustered by the images this time. Ladybug leaves with much more tact and chat noir agrees that it wasn’t cool for this to be sprung on them. Though chat noir does mention he wishes he remembered the kiss.

-“Akuma involved kisses don’t count kitty.” Which Chat noir agreed that next kiss they have it will be unrelated to the akuma. Ladybug smiles and says that she agrees with that.

-Chat noir doesn’t suggest kissing plans, since after his talk with Ladybug, why would he jeopardize that? But ladybug suggests it though just like in canon, it was a fake out.

- despair bear, Gigatitan, Befana, and Frightningale are all the same. Marinette taking Fu’s advice and not altering things too much.

-Riposte has Marinette determine that Kagami won. Since she is a bit more measured around Adrien. Which prevents the akuma, but also does shift how Kagami views Adrien and Marinette. Kagami still has her confidence and doesn’t view Adrien as a flirty rival. Marinette wonders if that correction was for the right call.

-Troublemaker changes. Marinette remembers the live show and hides all her pictures in advance. Also locking her door. Troublemaker happens but Marinette doesn’t end up humiliated. Adrien does check on Marinette because her home was attacked, but it’s less embarrassing for her. Though Adrien knows cause chat noir knows.

-Gorizilla is the same but Marinette is not in her pj’s she actually bothered to change

-Sapotis, Anansi are both the same cause hero debuts

-Syren changed. Chat noir met Fu much earlier so he doesn’t have the hang up he had. Ladybug and chat noir already had the potions thanks to Marinette knowing half the recipes. Syren was beat easy

-Reverser was avoided because Marinette handled the exchange better. No misunderstandings

-Captain hardrock still happened because the reason the akuma happened was stupid. Marinette meets Luka, but after everything she remembered, she thinks just keeping him as a friend is better in the long run, plus mentally she got over him already. So it’s still awkward for her. She manages.

-Glaciator is actually avoided. So Ladybug remembered the confusion that happened over this and tells chat noir she couldn’t make it, but that they could schedule another time. Which Chat noir agrees with. So no miscommunication to be had. Adrien sneaks out to get ice cream with his friends instead of prepping the romantic dinner. Which means Adrien is there and he has ice cream with Marinette. Which also adds more to Adrien’s muddled feelings.

-Frozer doesn’t happen because After riposte, Kagami and Adrien never get that close. They fence but it’s the event of riposte that made it happen.

-Zombizou happens because it’s important for Chloé’s growth. And Marinette still thinks what bustier said was dumb. Robostus and dark owl both happen.

-So Marinette gets to the day of the fashion week. And she had to contemplate if she lets things happen as is or if she fixes it. Marinette decides to alter course. By giving the bee to Chloe. Seeing if this would help change some things.

-Bee Chloe helps and thanks to her they beat style queen. The problem this time was that Chloé didn’t want to give up the bee. Resulting in queen wasp. Just a slight alteration to the plot.

-Gabriel doesn’t give up because he picks up on the fact that the super heroine bee is going against ladybug. He could use that.

-Chloe had ditched her akuma charm as she felt she didn’t need it with her powers. And things took a turn.

-Queen wasp ends up happening and Chloe realizes ladybug is right. Apologizing, saying she just wanted to be exceptional… to make her mom proud.

-So Maledikator doesn’t happen because, due to the events of Queen wasp. Chloe never exposed herself and doesn’t try to gloat she was queen bee. So her presentation was different.

-Sandboy was basically unchanged but Marinette warned the kwami that Hawkmoth was in control and nixed the plan. So less struggle of finding the kwamis

-So this is where things shift. So Volpina didn’t happen, because Marinette intercepted early. Also, it should be noted that Marinette did tell Alya that Hawkmoth might go after Lila if he saw that interview. Which Alya agreed and took it down.

-Marinette is still annoyed with Lila’s lies. But right now she’s harmless.

-Lila never got akumatized and has no hatred for ladybug or chat noir. The only person she isn’t stoked on is Marinette. But like it was only one interruption. So Lila doesn’t think much of it. I guess she sees how popular the heroes are and gets jealous. So Hawkmoth akumatizes her. To get the events going. (And for the sake of laziness, I say sure)

-Hawkmoth had Catalyst make it so he could akumatize a bunch of people. AND ignore the charm. Which because work arounds. It worked.

-Ladybug does assemble her team. But here is the big question. (Which I leave up to you all)

[goofygoldengirl]

How I Would Reorganize The Agreste Plotline If Miraculous Ladybug Were For An Older Audience

NOTE: Contains Season 5 Spoilers, Leak References, and Discussion of Mature Topics

I say reorganize instead of rewrite since I’m working with canon and embellish only on a few plot points that haven’t fully been touched upon yet. If you want to see how I reorganize the agreste plot for the show as is check out this post.

Season 1

Show in universe that everyone is aware of Emilie’s disappearance. In Origins, passing news blurb that it has been X amount of days and there are no leads into the Agreste case. This in turn, affects how his peers at school treat him, with some fawning over him like we see in the show, and the more sensitive ones reluctant to approach him due to his situation.

Ladybug is Adrien’s first ever crush. Show instead of implying on twitter that he takes romance hints from anime.

Plagg is aware of Adrien’s situation with wanting more independence and about mom’s disappearance. While he displays a lazy, go lucky attitude, he worries over Adrien. He encourages him to find himself as Chat Noir.

Show that even before Gabriel starts using the butterfly miraculous to get his wife back, he has unhealthy coping mechanisms. In the first few weeks after Emilie falls into a coma, he turns to drinking. Nathalie frequently joins him on his binges since she harbors guilt about Emilie’s illness. One night, they both get drunk and share a heated kiss.

Due to the kiss, and the stress of losing Emilie, there is a heavy tension between them. One day Nathalie snaps.

“What else could we have done? Emilie is gone! There’s no way we can bring her back! And if there was a possibly that we could, she’d hate us for it! Especially if she found out---I’m sorry I should have never brought that up. I’ll be on my way sir.”

Show that both Nathalie and The Gorilla care about Adrien despite their cold exteriors. With the next couple of seasons, he begins to open up to them, and they in turn.

Have Hawkmoth’s reveal that he is Gabriel take place at end of season 1 instead of beginning of season 2 in ML proper 

Flashback 1: It is 2014 and Adrien is six years old. He asks his mother why he can’t go out and play with other kids and go to school like his cousin Felix and Chloe. Emile smiles, cradles his face, and tells him that he can’t because he is a very special boy.

Season 2

Introduce Kagami and Adrien’s crush on her. Tease Ms. Tusguri and Gabriel Agreste’s connection earlier than presented in ML Proper with a business call.

The in universe news about Emilie’s disappearance dies down due to a lack of leads.

Show how Adrien is still naive when it comes to interacting with the world, and why he may not pick up on the fact that Marinette has a crush on him due to the fact that everyone fawns over him.

Show one of Master Fu’s tutoring sessions with Adrien post Syren. Master Fu plants a seed of doubt in Adrien’s head that all is well with his family.

Highlight early on that while Gabriel does love his son, he loves the idea of Adrien the perfect, obedient child more than Adrien the trying adolescent. Make it clear that Adrien is Emilie’s child and that Gabriel found it difficult to connect to Adrien even before Emilie’s disappearance.

Start of Gabriel’s slippery slope into madness due to the constant losses.

Nathalie’s infatuation with Gabriel is teased early on in season 2, then confirmed with the events of Style Queen. She becomes more bold with her feelings. At the end of season 2, they almost kiss but Gabriel hesitates.

The events of Heroes Day play out like in ML proper . However, have Gabriel explicitly mention that it was the peacock miraculous that made Emilie ill. 

Flashback 2: Takes place post Emilie’s “disappearance” but prior to season 1. Amelie and Felix visit. Amelie asks Gabriel for the Graham de Vanilly ring. Adrien and Felix interact. Felix has a mean streak. He asks how Adrien can deal “with such insufferable people.”

Season 3

Adrien and Kagami get together earlier. As a result their break up plays out a season earlier.

Nathalie takes up her role as Mayura. Her health worsens. Gabriel worries, and their relationship deepens to the point where they begin an affair. Gabriel is shown to feel guilty at first, but as he becomes more hellbent on being Hawkmoth, that guilt subsides.

Introduce sentimonsters like in ML proper. Place a hint that Adrien could be one.

Adrien mentions to Plagg that his mother used to have dizzy spells/ coughing fits like Nathalie. Plagg asks what disease she had. Adrien doesn’t know. He then asks Gabriel what type of illness Emilie had. Gabriel tells Adrien to mind his own business.

People drop hints that Marinette likes Adrien. Show that Adrien is in denial of his own feelings for her because of his feelings for Ladybug.

Show how Adrien gets stressed because of his modeling job. He is exposed to the underbelly of the fashion industry where his modeling peers have eating disorders, have drug/alcohol addictions, or are sexually preyed upon or exploited by their managers. Adrien wants out. He pleads with his father to stop modeling but is denied.

Introduce Felix like in ML proper. Show that Felix is knowledgeable about the miraculouses. Have him eye Gabriel’s brooch before leaving.

Have Chat Blanc and Ephemeral take place in this season. Keep plot and outcomes the same.

Gabriel starts to act more like Hawkmoth in real life and less like himself.

Flashback 3: Takes place when Gabriel, Emilie, and Nathalie are twenty years old. In the summer of 2000, they travel the world, in search of adventures and the miraculouses. The three of them have a close but complicated relationship due to the fact that Gabriel and Emilie are dating, Nathalie has feelings for him, and that she is friends with them both. This tension accumulates one night where they engage in a menage a tois. It is an event they vow to never speak of again. At the end of the summer, they have not found any miraculouses. Gabriel reaffirms his feelings for Emilie and rejects Nathalie completely.

Season 4

Love Square reversal. Adrien falls for Marinette. Slowly, they become closer and start dating. Gabriel finds out about Adrien’s feelings for Marinette. He forbids them to date, but they defy him. Gabriel tries to push Kagami onto Adrien.

Keep Felix’s discovery of Emlie’s body in Gabriel Agreste and trade with Gabriel at end of season 4 the same as ML proper.

Have Gabriel’s moral horizon event take place here along with Evolution in ML season 5 proper.

Nathalie and Gabriel’s relationship begins to crumble as he dives headfirst into madness and when she begins to question his decisions. The breaking point is when he does not leave the USB drive in the past like in ML Evolution. Nathalie declares that she will no longer help him, and states that she did everything for him because she loved him.

Adrien starts to look into his mother’s disappearance with Plagg and Ladybug’s encouragement. He discovers that his mother knew about the miraculouses.

The hints that Adrien could be a sentimonster intensify.

At the end of the season the alias rings are introduced.

Gabriel allows Adrien to stop modeling.

Flashback 4: Flashback of Gabriel and Emilie falling in love. Amelie and Colton’s rocky marriage. Same as the leaks. In 2006, Nathalie and Gabriel meet again. He says that he wants to try to find the miraculouses again, in particular the peacock miraculous. When Nathalie asks why, Gabriel answers “because it can create life”.

Season 5 

The cataclysm happens. Gabriel’s subsequent illness is explicitly shown. He loses weight due a loss of appetite and vomiting. His skin becomes pale and gangrened sores on his arm weeps black pus. By the end of the season, he has to rely on IV fluids to keep him alive.

Nathalie actively goes against Gabriel and helps Adrien in any way she can.

Felix is Argos. Events of Emotion take place. It is made clear that he is a sentimonster. It is only hinted that Kagami is one too. In addition, he leads Adrien to Emilie’s body.

Adrien find out his father is Hawkmoth,that his mother is dead, then the final truth that he himself is not human. He wrestles with the guilt of catacylsming his father. However, he does not fall into despair as predicted in Chat Blanc and Ephemeral.

Adrien makes his stand against Gabriel. Gabriel is forced to confront the fact that Adrien is no longer his perfect child.

The final battle and the reveal happens. During the final battle, Adrien pleads with his father to see reason. Gabriel is too far gone and tries to kill Adrien. Gabriel uses the miraculouses to make his wish. As mentioned in the leaks, Nathalie is sacrificed. Gabriel is shocked. This forces him to come to terms that due to his selfishness, he has lost the two most important women in his life. He makes one final wish: to sacrifice himself to bring back balance. He dies. Emilie is still dead, but Nathalie lives.

Adrien obtains his amok. Completely orphaned, he faces an uncertain future.

Flashback 5: It is 2007, Emilie has gone through three years of fertility treatments that have brought nothing but disappointment. Clinging onto her last hope, she, Gabriel, and Nathalie travel to Tibet to find the miraculouses one last time. They find the peacock and butterfly miraculous and find out that in order to create a fully functional human sentimonster, a piece of the wearer’s DNA must be bound to the amok. Emilie allows Amelie to test out the peacock miraculous first with Colt. Their son, Felix, is born healthy. Emilie binds a piece of her hair to a photograph of herself as a baby for the amok, and creates the sentibryo that will become Adrien. She magically implants it in herself to carry out a natural pregnancy. However not long after, she begins to miscarry. Desperate, she dons the peacock miraculous. The power she uses saves the pregnancy, but causes the miraculous to become damaged. Adrien is born in 2008. As the years pass, Emilie grows ill and falls into a coma.

[chaoticlovingdreamer]

Jesus, I'm so glad I'm not in this fandom anymore. It really sounds like it's gotten so toxic.

Not really directed at anything specifically, more just based on things I’ve heard from friends and what they say others are talking about. Just needed to get this off my chest.

So… “Syren” airs, and Chat Noir gets upset by a secret that is neither Plagg’s nor Ladybug’s to tell. Both the fandom and the show/writers think he is right for doing this, even as he threatens to quit while Paris drowns if not told the secret. He is ultimately rewarded in the end with the secret because, according to one of the writers, “Chat was correct and deserved to know.”

Later down the line, “Truth” gets a synopsis.

It hasn’t aired, it simply gets a synopsis (I must also add that a previous synopsis in the same season had been wrong).

Based on said synopsis, the fandom gets riled up about Luka supposedly being upset by a secret Marinette is keeping (her identity), going on about how he “doesn’t have a right to Marinette’s secret,” “is being extremely entitled,” and “doesn’t deserve to know Marinette’s identity,” as it is “Marinette’s right” to tell whoever she wants.

In truth, the actual episode features Luka struggling and fighting against the akuma, because he actually believes that he is not, in fact, entitled to Marinette’s secret, wanting her to share it rather than it being forced out of her. He is then “punished” for this when the show has the couple break up due to Marinette believing that she’s not allowed to have a boyfriend, all thanks to her secrets. Nevertheless, Luka maintains his previous stance and wants Marinette to tell him things whenever she’s ready to do so.

“Gang of Secrets” airs two episodes later, featuring the exact opposite philosophy. Over the phone, Marinette’s friends claim that they want her to talk with them when she’s ready, only to barrel into her room minutes later and insist that she talk to them. She refuses, kicking them out, and they get akumatized without resistance in order to force her to tell them her secret. After the fact, without so much as an on-screen apology from them, Marinette folds and talks about (some of) her problems. This also features another “whenever you’re ready” from Alix that may or may not be a simple joke given how the group laughs at it. Once all but Alya and Marinette are left in the room, Marinette has a mental breakdown and gives Alya her most precious secret: her identity as Ladybug.

Upon this episode airing, the fandom is upset at Marinette, not for telling her secret, but for not telling Chat Noir her secret instead of Alya, because Chat deserved her secret. This is also after “Chat Blanc,” where Marinette is aware that “her love with Chat” and Chat knowing her identity nearly led to the end of the world, and it is later confirmed in “Sentibubbler” that Marinette has actual trauma over the moment, never made aware of the specific mistake Chat made (i.e: keeping his knowledge of her identity a secret) that caused the issue in the first place, thus leaving her with all of the blame as the timeline is scrubbed away and Adrien is left with no actual lesson, even from Bunnix who could’ve chided him for his priority on love over safety. Chat received no consequences for this (not remembering his time as an akuma) and was even rewarded for his erased-from-time decisions as Ladybug laid her head on his shoulder, happy to have him back after the nightmare she’d lived where everyone was dead because her partner prioritized dating her over telling her that he knew her identity, despite her repeated stressing that no one must know.

(”Glaciator” also follows this formula, forcing Ladybug to apologize first and then having her blush when Chat kisses her cheek after he’d put up a huff mid-battle, while Marinette is blamed both for Andre’s akumatization and not going to a date that she didn’t promise to go to.)

Cut to some time later, when “Crocoduel” airs. Marinette, believing that she only causes problems for Luka and that he would rather be away from his own birthday party than be around the girl who “broke his heart” and “got him akumatized twice” (the first time being Silencer, something that apparently she, Alya, and the show blame her for), asks Juleka in private to make sure Luka isn’t present at the party. She later apologizes for this, admitting that she was unreasonable in her request.

The fandom proceeds to go off on Marinette, stating that she is selfish and that Luka “deserves better.” This is in direct contrast to episodes that feature Marinette/Ladybug apparently slighting Adrien/Chat (according to the fandom), where rejection is not wished on the ship itself, but rather a desire that Marinette/Ladybug apologize to Adrien/Chat and repent for her sins so that he can be happy and they can get together.

Interestingly enough, complete radio silence is given on the friends who had forced Marinette to go to the event in the first place (and also had supposed “whenever you’re ready” development in “Gang of Secrets”), not consulting with Luka on the matter nor considering what either would want, and only asking for Juleka’s permission in what is essentially an afterthought (having made plans without her input first). This is made doubly “interesting” by the fact that the action of said friends is what leads to the supposed “end of Lukanette,” with them officially confirming becoming friends.

Finally, cut to the most recent episode (at the time of writing this), “Wishmaker.” In this episode, through two different instances of Second Chance, Luka discovers the identities of both Ladybug and Chat Noir, shocked and later saddened by both revelations. When asked by Ladybug, he makes the decision to not tell her that he knows anything, though the current reason for this is unknown.

The fandom, once again, goes up in arms. They are upset by Luka’s lie (to a hero who he now knows is extremely stressed about her future and needs little else to worry about) regardless of whatever the reason may or may not be revealed to be. This is a far cry from the “golden boy” Adrien Agreste, who has not only lied (whether by omission or otherwise) on multiple occasions (”Copycat,” “Miraculous New York,” and “Chat Blanc”), but when Ladybug’s identity was put into his hands (the hands of a permanent hero who has one of the two exact miraculouses wanted by Hawk Moth), he chose not to say anything so he could date her.

Neither had a magical charm to protect them while one of them had a rabbit hero to erase his actions as if that removes what he would’ve done if given the chance, while Ladybug is left with the guilt and trauma. Both were told that identities are precious, and one lies for reasons riddled with ambiguity while the other lies in order to date the person who has already rejected one side of himself. One is a “threat” to the endgame ship and is either sympathized with or criticized depending on what will make his own ship look worse (and whose likeability seems to coincide by how “threatening” he is and what importance he receives in comparison to his “competition”), while the other is part of the endgame ship and is treated accordingly by the show and fanbase, his actions defended and validated while the blame falls on the other side of his ship.

In the end, Marinette and Luka are dealt an equally bad hand, and both are dealing with consequences of Adrien’s actions. Adrien had gotten to peacefully date “Ladybug” in a removed timeline because he selfishly kept a secret (and, again, was ultimately rewarded for it), while Marinette suffered dating Luka because she selflessly kept a secret (leading to him being akuamtized and her to nearly have a mental breakdown). Luka, meanwhile, who has had a track record of being incredibly selfless and having a history of always keeping Marinette’s feelings/best interests in mind, now knows both Ladybug and Chat Noir’s identities, and the latter being because Chat Noir let himself get hit by the akuma’s powers in the first place.

Yet it’s Luka who gets heat, and Marinette who gets heat, while Adrien isn’t even so much as on the back burner.

Isn’t history fun?

[twisted-art-wounders]

If you could have your YGO/ML AU character reenact an episode of Miraculous, which would it be?

I got a few: Syren, Reflekdol, Oni-chan, Silencer, Chat Blanc, Hack-san, Wishmaker to name a few.

[acuteobserv4tion]

Did they really write Luka out of the show so they wouldn't have to deal with him knowing the main characters' secret identities? Please tell me that's not what happened. It seems like they're wasting Alya. Please don't tell me they fully wasted snake boy. He wasn't my favorite, but his position holds so much potential for drama as well as comedy.

Update:

I just watched the episode. That's exactly what they did. What is even the point of the magical charms? Why can't Luka be the one for our heroes to confide in? Especially since they're messing up Alya. She's such a flip-flop now, only there to push what the writers want on a whim instead of what the situation demands of her character.

Luka could be the one Adrien confides in, too. Especially since Fu didn't do diddly squat with talking to Adrien in Syren or Party Crasher. Does this count as ml writing salt? Now I'm sad. I wanna play minecraft

On the bright side, Penny's back! Woohoo

You're too good for them.

[heidi891]

Rewatching ML Season 2

The Collector: When Ladybug says she thinks Gabriel is Hawk Moth, Chat Noir is taken aback, but rather calm. Ladybug is shocked when Chat Noir suggests that the Collector could make Adrien disappear, while Chat’s expression says that he believes it’s totally possible. Gabriel lets Adrien go to school again and Adrien hugs him.

Prime Queen: Chat Noir purrs when Ladybug is close.

Glaciator: Poor Adrien, his father makes him wait for him at that big table and then doesn’t let him leave the house. Marichat on the balcony! I believed Marinette didn’t take Chat Noir’s declarations of love seriously, so it’s nice to have it confirmed. She must have thought he’s like that with many girls and now she knows he’s really in love with her. I like how sincere they are with each other at the end.

Despair Bear: Adrien stands up for Marinette when Chloé accuses her of being responsible for the false alarm. He is again annoyed with Chloé and threatens to end their friendship. Chloé does something good, but for the wrong reasons. Marinette and Adrien are dancing. Chat Noir is AGAIN possessed by the villain.

Troublemaker: Adrien is so happy to see Marinette on TV. Poor Marinette, everyone can see her hundreds of photos of Adrien and he’s so shocked. Chat Noir again uses his good hearing. Marinette friendzoned herself.

Gigantitan: Gabriel tries to reason with a baby, he couldn’t have been an involved father when Adrien was little. Chat Noir says he’s a great singer and promises to sing Ladybug a song.

Riposte: Hi, Kagami! Was she sent to the fencing class to impress Adrien? Ladrien scenes. Adrien saves Ladybug, forgetting that he isn’t invincible when he isn’t transformed. He says he doesn’t like being locked.

Befana: Marinette resorts to lies when she’s afraid the truth might hurt someone. Short Marichat scene. Chat Noir says Marinette must be a very cool girl. Ladybug joins Chat Noir in singing. Adrien says he’s always carrying Marinette’s lucky bracelet and gives her one that he made himself. I wonder what the chicken bead is supposed to mean.

Frightningale: Adrien tells Chloé that everyone in the queue should have a chance. He’s impressed with her skills, but is not thrilled to work with her.

Gorizilla: Gabriel again suspects that Adrien is Chat Noir. (Gabriel, haven’t you heard him yell ‘PLAGG, CLAWS OUT!’ every now and then?) Adrien wants to ask his father if he could go to the cinema, but Gabriel doesn’t have time for him. Adrien hates being famous and is still carrying Marinette’s lucky bracelet. Adrienette and Ladrien scenes. Adrien notices that Marinette repeats words from the perfume advertisment and isn’t sure what to make of it. Adrien’s falling from the skyscraper and Gabriel in the last moment orders Gorizilla to release Ladybug to save Adrien (though his first impulse was to wait until Adrien transforms, risking his death). Ladybug says she trusts Chat Noir and Adrien is happy. Gabriel watches the film with Adrien. At the end for the first time we see dead Emilie in the glass coffin from afar.

Robostus: Adrien knows Morse code. Master Fu explains that when you have both Ladybug earrings and Cat ring, you can make a wish, but comes with a price—you exchange your wish for something opposite.

Sapotis: Marinette has a DVD with “Ladybug PV”. Chat Noir flirts with Rena Rouge.

Syren: Chat Noir is fed up with being left in the dark. Ladybug not trusting him seems to be his biggest concern. He threatens to give up the ring for the first time. He finally meets Master Fu.

Dark Owl: Ladybug and Chat Noir trust each other so much that they can detransform in front of each other, having their eyes closed.

Zombizou: Chat Noir sacrifices himself AND is possessed by the villain. Chloé sacrifices herself fo Ladybug, but without Ladybug she would be caught, so it isn’t entirely selfless. Later she is vulnerable and sincere with Ms Bustier.

Captain Hardrock: Gabriel wants Adrien to play the piano perfectly. No one is surprised that he is grounded again. Hi, Luka! Adrien asks his father to play the piano with him, Gabriel lets him go to his friends, Adrien hugs him.

Frozer: Chat Noir has a romantic fantasy involving Ladybug and a hamster and later Marinette has a similar fantasy about Adrien. Adrien thinks about asking Gorilla, Nathalie and his father about girls, but ends up asking Marinette about Kagami. Kagami and Plagg think Adrien cares about Marinette romantically. When Marinette tells him they should go ice-skating again, he thinks she means just the two of them. She almost confesses her feelings to him, but ends up friendzoning herself again.

Reverser: Terrified Chat Noir is hilarious.

Style Queen: Gabriel, why are you surprised that Adrien fell victim to your Akumatised villain? Have you thought it through? Nathalie is not happy about it at the end. Chloé is worried about Adrien. Short Ladrien scene.

Queen Wasp: Gabriel has some regrets about putting Adrien at risk. Nathalie hugs Gabriel. Gabriel hugs Adrien publically. It’s the first time he appears publically after Emilie’s death. Chloé is abused, but it doesn’t excuse her acting like a villain and pretending to be a hero.

Malediktator: Chloé gives a ridiculous presentation, but the class shouldn’t bully her for that. Adrien is the only one who doesn’t laugh and later isn’t happy when Chloé’s leaving Paris. Adrien says that she was his only friend when he was little and didn’t leave the house. (When exactly did problems in his family start?) Thanks to Adrien Marinette decides to give the Bee Miraculous to Chloé and give her a second chance. Chloé admits that she hurt her father. Chat Noir is AGAIN possessed by the villain. My Disney+ must have a wrong order of the episodes, because Alya mentions Carapace.

Anansi: Adrien says his father is overprotective and hopes it’ll change. Hi, Carapace, here you are. Chat Noir is a bit worried about being replaced by other superheroes, but Ladybug reassures him he’s irreplaceable.

Sandboy: Nightmare Adrien is both scary and funny. Poor Adrien’s nightmare is being locked out without escape. Chat Noir saves Ladybug, how romantic. I love that bad Ladybug always gets this crazy, enormous weapon.

Catalyst: Lila returns! I think that Alya can’t see through Lila’s lies, because she’s too focused on Marinette’s crush on Adrien.

Mayura: I must agree with Chloé that Hawk Moth’s outfit is ridiculous. Nathalie wants to help Gabriel so much that not only does she let herself be Akumatised, but also she risks her life by using the Peacock Miraculous. Gabriel is shocked by this. At this point he still seems to care about Adrien and Nathalie to some extent. Adrien says that Marinette is their school Ladybug. (Will Adrien ever be called their local Chat Noir?)

A Christmas Special: Snow, songs and that terrible old man in a red suit. Gabriel’s gone mad and thrown a Christmas party. More serious observation: Adrien openly talks sings about his pain and anger.

Miraculous World: Shanghai: ‘Did Jet just die?’ moment, Hawk Moth edition. Chat Noir too, but it isn’t as surprising.

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