#look sometimes i feel like the fandom doesnt agree with this

[clockworkcheetah]

gotta start my s2 rewatch

[puppppppppy]

this could just be "gatekeeping but im being really polite abt it" but. its less abt thinking only certain ppl should be allowed in, and more like i dont wanna open a pandoras box that makes it difficult for everyone to have fun. shrugs

i wanna post my skip to loafer art but i cant do it knowing ppl are gonna put it on tiktok and pinterest bc itd be like. bringing an invasive species ykwim

[menofprogress]

Here are some of my hot (or maybe tepid) takes about arcane:

(Under the cut bc i got wordy lol)

-the show could have used another season or like at least 5 more eps per season. Thats not a dig at the creators bc we know they were already forced to cut stuff out, but imho it shows a little, esp in s2. I fully believe Sevika was one of the biggest victims here, i genuinely believe she had an arc in s2 act 3 that was fully cut. And her being one of the biggest defenders of zaunite independence also means that by cutting her they basically gutted that storyline.

-the sheer lack of time with some characters also means that i simply did not connect with some of them, which made their deaths kind of underwhelming. Like i gasped when loris, isha, elora and sky died, but i cant say i was actually sad. That might be a me problem, but i need a little more time and info on a character to feel literally anything about them.

-on the other hand: we need to accept that sometimes background or minor characters are just that. No they werent robbed, no they werent underwritten, theyre simply not that important and thats OK bc theyre characters, not real people. You dont need to give equal attention to all characters for it to be "fair". And i sometimes feel like ppl think they HAVE to bemoan this. esp when its a female character a lot of fans talk about "sidelining" or "theyre using them as a plot device!!" Buddy, sometimes characters are literally just there to move the plot along, thats not inherently a social justice issue. (Ive seen this the most with sky and lest and like.... sorry, they were never gonna be more important than this. They can still be your fave, but just bc you wanted to see more of them doesnt mean they were sidelined for nefarious reasons)

-however sometimes the problem isnt that a character got too little screentime. S2 is a perfect example to show you can do a lot of character work in less time (viktor, ekko) and little character work with a lot of screentime (vi, sorry). Viktor and ekko were missing for entire episodes and managed to have full character arcs and vi was kind of there the whole time, but stuff just happened to her? Like she does do a lot, she looks incredibly cool, i liked watching her scenes, but her motivations, her goals and her values are ALL over the place. I love caitvi, but it did kinda ruin vis integrity when she threw away core beliefs (she becomes an enforcer, she temporarily agrees to kill jinx, she participates in chem warfare against the undercity) for cait. Hmmmmm.....

-i wasnt that deep in the fandom in s1 so i might have simply missed it or i might just not be following assholes, but the "jayvik shippers hate mel" thing never made sense to me. NOT because i dont believe it, bc i sure as hell have seen enough mlm shippers be fully misogynistic or racist, but the way ppl (mainly meljay shippers lbr) talked about jayvik shippers being horrible to mel like it was this HUGE thing confused me bc i personally have seen like 2 fanfics where they horribly mischaracterise mel to be a viktor-hating bitch, but thats it? Like, was that an actual problem or was it ppl deliberately misunderstanding stuff? (One specific example: ive seen someone accuse jayvik shippers of being misogynists bc they accused mel of manipulating jayce and sidelining Viktor. Which is a canonical thing happening in the show. Like ofc you can word it in a way to make mel a horrid evil bitch, im sure there are ppl who DO hate mel and think she is an evil succubus, but this person in particular just seemed upset about the fact that ppl were talking about things that mel canonically did.) This is a genuine question, bc from my pov after s1 mel was one of the fan faves and jayvik wasnt THAT big of a deal until s2. I literally saw a hundred times more jayce hate than i did mel hate, but maybe thats not the universal arcane fandom experience? Like, again, i HAVE seen (for lack of a better term) fujoshis get wildly hateful towards female characters in the vicinity of their ship, i was just pleasantly surprised that the arcane fandom seemingly DIDNT. So the unrestrained resentment and bitterness of some fans after jayvik "went canon" caught me off guard.

-the reason i ask this: i saw a video where someone talked about some rando homophobic timebomb fans who apparently resented caitvi for getting a happy ending instead of jinx and ekko. So i commented "i s2g het-shippers act like theyre an oppressed group sometimes" to which another person responded "well jayvik fans were really shitty about mel, soo...." and i was so fucking confused bc what? The video wasnt even about mel or jayvik?? They just heard me make a snarky comment about het ships and immediately felt called out. But yeah thats what prompted my question.

-i dont get the thirst for the fish man. I get the salo thirst even less. I cheered when jayce bonked him.

-i actually dont want jayce or viktor to appear in future projects. While i love the idea of them being ~not dead~, i think any further canonical storylines about them would devalue the extremely emotional ending they had. Like, imagine if they only bring one of them back?? What then?? No, i actually prefer post-canon fix it fanfics in this case. (Cough cough esp bc this way i can still plausibly delude myself into them being actually canon and yall KNOW it probably would not stay this way if their story continues)

[spacedlexi]

As someone who loves both Kenny and Violet, I feel like I’ve found my calling here 😭😭😭

They’re genuinely so similar, and I do agree that the fandom has male bias, as well as protagonist bias actually

Clementine has the opportunity to befriend/romance Violet and then let her get kidnapped 20 minutes later. And for Violet, that is the most obvious feeling of betrayal! I don’t understand why people in the fandom struggle to realize that their actions have consequences

Lee can basically hate Kenny the entirety of the first season and then the fandom defends Kenny for his actions.

Clearly most of us totally understand Kenny’s response to Lee’s and by extension Clementine’s behavior, so why can’t they understand Violet’s response to Clem’s? Makes no sense to me

honestly i feel like aside from having a male bias the fandom has more of a kenny bias than a protag bias. i see his ass EVERYWHERE. CONSTANTLY. some people act like he raised clem as much as lee did 😭 (and i dont like the way the fandom talks about clem sometimes 😒 ties into the "weird about women" stuff)(and javi? wheres javi? i would like to see more javi. i actually think i see david more than javi)

anyway. i DO find kenny to be a compelling character and understand Why hes popular. its why i initially thought vi would be more popular among those fans! people who like both kenny and vi i can trust to have understood the assignment 💀 because they really do share similarities. but things some people LOVE kenny for they absolutely LOATHE violet for. and its just???? whats not clicking???

i really dont understand why some people act So Shocked by violets reaction in the cells. like hello?? YOU did this to her??? shes done nothing but put herself on the line for clem (even if clem is mean and ungrateful about it), and the One time vi needs clem to have her back, she doesnt (even tho its an impossible choice to make, and deep down vi understands this). and people shock pikachu face when it pushes her back to minnie like no shit??? but i dont think theyre even paying attention to violets character in the first place so 🙄😑 violet settled into that leadership position on her own and not only do you strip her of that role by letting her get taken she also feels discarded by the One Person who was actually influencing her to change for the better in the first place. AND you can do it all 20 minutes after kissing her. of course shes hurt!!! but people act like shes soooo unreasonable for her behavior (and vi would later agree with them! she tries apologizing to clem on the beach actually. thats how quickly she regrets it. but its too late at that point for her i guess 🙄 irredeemable. to the stocks)

kenny will Literally refuse to help lee look for clem if you pissed him off too much like 😭?? if you arent kissing kennys ass 24/7 he is the worlds biggest bitch about it. but endless excuses for kennys behavior for some reason 🤨 him trying to save ben (or christa but its better with ben narratively) is his first Real selfless act and its why its such a compelling conclusion for his S1 arc (only compounded by the fact its BEN of all people hes trying to save, the reason his family is dead). and S2 kenny is all about how his mental health is in sharp decline and hes becoming more violent as he attempts to control what he cannot 💀 kenny defenders out here using up all the oxygen in the room to make excuses for his actions but the minute vi makes One mistake she immediately regrets (after being nothing but loyal), shes an evil bitch deserving of what she got 😐

gee i wonder why 😭😔

[tonati143]

Anders rant

Lowkey, I need to talk about this and Im sure other Anders fans have probably talked this to the ground.

But I feel like Anders suffered so badly at the hands of the creators and its both heartbreaking and the largest reason I love him so much. We see him, easily one of the most hated characters in the fandom, and he is not handled with nuance by either fans or anti’s because the writers never even gave room for that nuance.

You either are hate him or you love him, because there was never an option presented that allowed for a grey area.

Lets talk about easily one of the most popular options (and mirror to Anders), Solas. He easily does so much worse for even less of a reason. What he tries to do in Veilguard, what he did in Inquisition. If I remember correctly, bro gives the anchor to Corypheus bc he couldn’t understand it and thought bro would fix it for him.

If this would have been Anders, there would be outrage.

But because Solas has the benefit of writers that love him in both games, he gets the benefit of getting a grey area. There is not nearly as much hate, no one sits down to talk about how secretly he is the cause of every problem here.

I cant help but wonder what Anders did to lose out on such nuance. Cullen, one of my favorites, receives that nuance, when we are well aware what can happen with his story line if we dont play our cards right in Origins and DA2.

To have a writer that basically wants you dead is so crippling.

There is no nuance, there is no forgiveness. Even the route where your Hawke doesnt stabby stab him is made to look like you made the wrong choice. I was lucky, my Hawke in inquisition does not paint Romanced!Anders as a monster, my Hawke is much more forgiving and speaks of him as someone who needs to be taken care of. But Ive seen other people talk about how their Hawke speaks of Anders.

We lose out on Awakening!Anders in a way that almost doesnt seem natural. It is like we were given a completely different character. One is capable of facing trauma, and I would even say having to give your body to a spirit holds some form of trauma as well, while maintaining core parts of their personality. It wouldnt have hurt to show us bits of that previous Anders once in a while.

Its hard to look at really, because there are things that he says in DA2 that gives us insight to what is going on in the chantry, things that gives us insight to why he is going through such lengths. But because everything is structured around the idea that you are supposed to hate him, no one ever really acknowledges him in game or in the fandom.

I saw on a comment a few days ago that states that Anders tried so hard to be heard, to have his stance listened to but throughout the game almost everyone shrugs him off. No one takes him seriously. And yes, he can be obnoxious about it sometimes, but if I put myself in his shoes, I would also be talking and talking about it until someone acknowledges me. In smaller cases where I would have things to say in places like highschool and everyone would ignore me, I would find myself repeating it again until someone would tell me “yeah, we heard you already”. Its in a way where I understand what it feels like, to have something so important to say and to be pushed to the side, I understand what Anders feels in party banter in a way that cant be said outloud without being questioned if I agree with his decision towards the Chantry.

He could have been perfect, a way to start a conversation where we ask ourselves, at what point are extreme measures acceptable? At what point can we consider what a person did to be necessary or unnecessary? Would anyone have listened to the cause if that measure hadnt been taken?

Unfortunately, its answered for us, it ends the conversation before we can even have it. It tells us what is supposed to be the answer. It tells us it is wrong, it tells us that this is a black and white conversation. What could have been a legitimate substantial conversation cut short because of their efforts to make the fandom hate Anders as much as they do.

And I mourn that ever since 😔

[krispdreemurr]

oh oh i have an interesting discussion/query ! what do u think the meta purpose of making kris act like they do at the end of chapter 1 was? specifically like the imagery of a kid in a green/yellow shirt manipulating a red soul, pulling out a knife, having red eyes and grinning evilly cause like... i feel like deltarune definitely incorporates the memory of undertale throughout? like its advertised as a game for people who finished undertale and theres lots of references and things that are only as impactful if you had an emotional connection to the original game, like spamton neo and gaster saying "have you been looking for me?" and just.. so many things but most interestingly imo being that ralsei almost comes across like a fanonized "cinnamon roll" version of asriel that was so popular way back when? ofc he's more than that but thats like. a Part of him anyways what i mean is like, when chapter 1 released many people (myself included) saw that and instantly assumed that kris was being controlled by chara because of how strongly chara-esque (*especially* to the fandom, like ralsei) the imagery was, only for chapter 2 to come out and many people (myself included^2) completely disregarded chara as having any bearing on the story whatsoever and that kris is just themself trying *not* to be controlled by us. i think we can all agree that the latter is correct, and some people were clearly smarter than me in chapter 1 and deduced the truth even then (e.g. lynxgriffin in their comics), but i am left wondering what the point of that was almost? i thought you might have some interesting thoughts on that, cause like, if kris's frustration with the player is essentially the main plot of the game (give or take), the allusion to chara was a little bit 'distracting' for the fandom i feel like? some ppl are (somehow) still confused & blaming chara even! i guess im just wondering, what if kris had wore a different shirt and menaced the player in a different way at the end of chapter 1? do you think it would have improved the story to eliminate the possibility of confusion, or do u reckon toby fox want us confused? idk LMAO just thinking aloud atp. just been on my mind the past few days bc in retrospect, while the intro to deltarune is obviously trying to trick you into believing this is "undertale 2", post-dark-world the game is unambiguously super different, to the point where it feels a little bizarre that there'd be a red herring *after* deltarune already smashed the notion that it's a prequel or sequel into pieces doesnt it?

i think it's most legible to me as an attempt by Kris to psych us out that they sort of get lucky with thanks to toby helping them!

like, obviously they have no way to know you've been menaced by nonbinary children before - the specific parallels aren't a thing they're reaching for. but they're trying to get the player freaked out, and toby sort of lends them a helping hand by making them coincidentally charalike.

it's not the first time he's had a character freak us out with knowledge they don't have (thinking about sans and the talking flower in grillbys), and it's not the first time in Deltarune alone where a parallel is arguably sheer coincidence in world but happens to echo something to the player. i don't think it's like cheap or anything - toby fox does a really good job building up a language of associations and connections and motifs and then sometimes uses that to trick you just the tiniest bit lmao

but just like Chara, the ways to see thru the trick are there if you're looking. if you pay attention to Chara, you learn their oh so ominous faces and scares were originally just a thing they did to have fun with their brother, and maybe you get an appreciation that they were a child trying to scare you in childish ways. similarly, if you talk to everyone in town, you learn that Kris is a prankster by nature who delights in freaking everyone out (and also someone who would eat an entire midnight pie), and maybe you get the chance to go "oh, they're pranking me, huh?"

a little like Chara, Deltarune ch1 uses Kris to ask if you've been paying attention to the material. did you notice this really, really wasn't Undertale? and if you did, what conclusion do you reach about this new kid?

[trashogram]

frrr its just like bro cmon do something different. I like it when shows explore parental issues and stuff but it just feels overused at this point. and yeah charlie and via’s are def not explored at all.

for charlie, i mean i kinda get it but not really? theres been like foreshadowing of how they were “pulled apart” and its not j like lucifer idk leaving for no reason, but still one lil father daughter duet doesnt erase that yk? and (theory) if lillith or some external thing pried them apart why didnt lucifer just say that to charlie instead of pulling up and being like “lol sorry. caviar mountain anyone?”. i hope we focus on that next season and more of like morningstar family lore instead of backstory stuff. Alastors cool but damn i actually dont want him to be the main focus. sometimes i forget charlie’s the like “main” character of the show.

AND OCTAVIA OMGGG BROOO. WE PHYSICALLY SEE STOLAS BEING SHITTY AND NOBODY FOCUSES ON IT 😭 LIKE HUH?!!??? BRO TALKED ABOUT HIS NASTY SEX LIFE W BLITZO IN FRONT OF HER THATS DISGUSTING OMG. stolas is literally just like- omg bro get ur head out of the gutter. stop focusing on urself for like 5 seconds pls and pay attention to your poor child. he hasnt even like tried to talk to her or anything like imagine ur dad cheats on ur mom and then ghosts u for his boyfriend that he also treats like shit. justice for octavia

Yes, using daddy issues as traumatic backstory for multiple characters is not great. I agree with you. But the thing that really takes the cake for me is one thing in particular. And I wanna say for the record that this is my personal opinion so keep that in mind.

As far as using Daddy Issues as a major theme in Hazbin Hotel —They dropped the ball so fucking hard with Charlie and Lucifer. One of the reason the pilot for Hazbin caught my attention was because it looked like the daughter of the Devil was going to be this optimist that wanted to help people rather than hurt and scare them for all eternity. And in turn, Lucifer (and Lilith) would be disappointed in his only child for turning out that way because Lucifer would be more akin to how he’s normally portrayed (evil).

I was so on board to root for Charlie. And I was excited for the possibility of Lucifer, after practically disowning his daughter for not meeting his expectations, realizing that Charlie is his own reflection: a rebel adamant on changing the status quo.

Y’all know I love Hazbin’s Lucifer. He’s my poor little meow meow. But damn it, we could’ve had something really beautiful!

…Yeah.

And oh god. Honey I could write a 10 page paper on Stolas’s neglect of Octavia and how mistreated she is not only by him but by her own creators and the fandom for Helluva Boss. It’s wild. It’s mystifying. It makes me grip the bars of my cage as I wait for the day when a lot of these younger fans get older and realize how messed up the whole thing is.

[pumpkinsy0]

I personally don’t agree with the universal opinion that a part of the fandom seem to have is that Darry and Soda would despise Curly because of the way that he is, and doesn’t ever want them around Ponyboy because he is a bad influence.

While I do agree with a part of it, I think Darry and Sodapop don’t agree with the lifestyle that Curly has going on, but understand his predicament and situation and the reason he is the way that he is, as well as they wouldn’t prefer Ponyboy to hang around Curly because of the messes they could get into that could cause consequences to their actions, e.g the state taking him away because of their negligence and such.

Along with my Arab American headcanon, as Hospitality is a part of their culture, and respect is always forefront to make their guests feel comfortable and welcomed around their presence, they would still look out for Curly, even if he does insist that he doesn’t need anybody to look out for him because he could handle himself. And while still being around the same age as Ponyboy, they don’t really believe that, so if it was needed, (like patching up injuries and PB wasn’t around,) they’d be more than happy to take care of him if he was ever in trouble.

While Curly still does act the way that he does around the Curtis gang, I think he would grow on them, and vice versa.

While Darry is overprotective and such, he does not have any ill will over anybody, especially a teenager because I don’t think a grown man needs to have beef with a teenager, but he’s not overly affectionate towards Curly either LOL

I do think Darry and Tim have a silent oath of some sort to look after each others family whenever it is necessary, while it is not explicitly said between the two, they both know the similar situations they’re in, and to make it easier it would be good if they both were to take care of one another.

On a less serious note, for my Arab Curtis Hcs, I think whenever there would be guests visiting their homes, (minus the gang,) Darry is keen about body language in order to show respect for that guest, (e.g, putting hands in pockets, leaning on walls, etc.) in which Ponyboy and Sodapop do forget sometimes because they don’t often have many people come over, but they do their best to show off respect.

yea i agree!!! now all jokes ive said aside bc i was just being dramatic for the sake of comedy, but i have talked about this before!!!

for darry ive always imagined that its less to do w curly himself, more to deal w the fact that if pony gets in trouble and curly is found w him, it looks bad on him and he could get taken away, darrys focused on what curly could bring WITH him than just curly himsef, thats kinda y i never understood darry AND soda hating on curly, darrys a grown ass man, i dont think hes going out of his way to full on beef w someone like 5 years younger than him, he has to worry about his family lmao

plus, darry lets pony hang w dally, i dont think he’d mind pony and curly hanging out casually, but all the time??? hes a litttlleeee worried

for soda, i genuinely do disagree w how far i think ppl go w for protective he is w pony and hiw he hates curly, bc i dont think he hates him!!! at the end of the day, i do think soda would look out for curly, theyre greasers after all, theyre in this together, but i do think soda would b the one thats the MOST annoyed w curly and that partially bc curly doesnt rlly respect him (and pony a lil but) which, yea ok understandable, but i dont think he would full on VOCALIZE it 24/7 365, at most i think soda is passive aggressive??? like hes still trying to b nice, but if curly steps out of like he says something small, looks a certain way w his eyes, maybe shifts around a lil more, maybe kinda pushing chrly to leave earlier than pony wants, THAT kind of thing, i dont think hes like “GRRRR GET THE HELL OUT NOW SHEPARD SCUM GRRRR”. however i must say that some of his protectiveness just comes from general fear (?????idk if thats the right word) of pony growing up

anyways ive said it before!!! when it comes to darry and sodas views on papercut, sodas mostly looking at pony while darrys focused on curly!!! but i do personally disagree that they see where curlys coming from bc for my own lore reasons they dont 100%, but i see where ur coming from!!!

ANYWAYS ARAB CURTIS BROS WOOO YEAAA LETS GOOO

when it comes to their hospitality, id say that it plays a HUGE part into y they leave their door unlocked, yes its for the gang, but generally i think theyd try to help anyone they can, u need to b pretty desperate to come into a strangers house after all, theyd feel bad for turning someone away, like yea, i GUESS they could, but doesnt mean that they wont hope that person isnt ok later on and they wouldnt b thinking about em

plus!!! darrys strong as hell, if someone came in to hurt them he could probably literally throw em out like they do in cartoons

and culturally speaking!! when it comes to curly and ponys openness, curlys always telling pony to stop helping everyone bc not everyone will help u, but pony just generally cant help it, its just in his nature, its a bit of a cultural misunderstanding between em

[verysium]

i so so agree w the sae takes!! additionally to what u said i feel like that mf can also be an emotional hypocrite to himself sometimes. especially about the reliability and independence thing. if the relationship is at a stage where thing are not fully figured out i feel like he'd struggle a lot. sae always told himself that he could only be w someone who is as independent as he is and doesn't want anyone slouching on him and you seemed perfect. you are chill and easy to get along with. you dont really expect him to go out of his comfort zone to please you. but sometimes that made him feel frustrated yk. he wants you to rely on him sometimes because he's you're boyfriend after all. he gets mad when u don't want to accept the expensive gift he got you because why wouldn't you he's your boyfriend after all. he gets angry when you dont get mad at him and ignore him for a while like girlfriends usually do for cancelling a plan last minute because of some match ot training. he gets pissed when you dont insist on going to a place you offered to go and he told you he was busy. why won't your anger go beyond an "oh ok" ? he's your boyfriend after all. right? with time all of this makes him feel insecure (he doesnt know he feels insecure, he just has a weird feeling thats all he knows) and all that irritation that he feels, he feels inside and maybe you can tell or maybe you cant but in the end of the day he doesn't communicate his feelings. and that's why he feels like that. also i think sae is not that emotionally mature as the fandom mostly paints him out to be. he's just not visbly reactive and doesn't understand half the shit he's feeling. but when you guys confront each other and he finally communicates -even if its just a little- you guys find a way to balance it. you understand each other. wich of course takes a while w a mf who has the emotional intelligence of a door but it's ok I still love him. btw sorry for rambling my god this is so long 😭🙏

🫡 yup. u hit every single point. tbh your nonchalant attitude is the wake-up call for sae. he finally realizes that he's actually in love with u cus why else would he be so worked up over your reactions? he tries so hard to act like he doesn't care, but then when you do the same, he's like: wait come back i actually do care. his personality is very contradictory largely because he doesn't know what he wants when it comes to love. romantic feelings have always been secondary to him, and it's rather unfamiliar territory compared to football. and we all know how sae tends to stick to what he's innately good at.

i also agree with you on the emotional maturity part. rin can sometimes work out what he's feeling and find ways to address it. with sae, it flies completely over his head. he has no idea what his emotions are. he just knows that he's feeling them, and somehow that pisses him off lol.

honestly, his internal struggle is somewhat endearing to me. he'd complain about how romantic couples do this and that for each other (as if he's not one of them), but then when he's alone, he's the biggest sentimental sap out there. like did u see the soft look in his eyes when he reunited with rin again during the u-20 arc? we get it sae. u missed ur brother and ur not very subtle about it. *sigh* he's so stupid. i love him so much.

[pyrosomatic-metamorphosis]

genuine question but is there any fandom where a character is well written by the majority. im thinking about fandom culture and the spread of frustration when people dont write characters well but. honestly in all the fandoms ive been in there's only like, a Select number of authors who i trust to write Well, let alone write Well AND In Character. character analysis and writing and getting inside characters' heads are all separate skills (all of which are trained by roleplaying fyi can CONFIRM playing pretend with your friends is good for you). there's been more than once where I've disagreed with an interpretation that others agreed with, and then I turned out wrong. or i turned out right. like it doesnt matter WHO is right it just matters that differences in character analysis exist, so even if you DO write well AND write in character, your in character is still going to be someone else's out of character

there's this sort of. vibe. that to play in the sandbox you Need to be able to make a castle, and if you can't make a castle then you shouldn't bother, and it completely dismisses the idea that youre in that sandbox to PLAY in the first place. there's this Weight of disappointing someone if you can't build something that they like, but that forgets that you aren't there to build them a castle. like, be KIND. if you disagree with someone then please make an effort to do so kindly. i dont give a shit about fandom discourse but there is a reason kids get removed from sandboxes if they keep throwing sand in people's eyes. but if they don't like your misshapen sand pile, then youre not obligated to change it. even if you yourself end up hating that same sand pile later- youre not building a legacy. youre playing. and sometimes the result of that play is out of character drivel. theres a reason there are so many authors and so few who i like to consistently read and thats because everyone is Fucking Around in their hobby space. hash tag brag or whatever but i can build castles. ive built several that im v proud of. ive also dug holes in the sand for fun and then tripped on them when trying to get up. I often dug a hole and then got up and fucking- whoops, its a castle now, and i didn't realize i'd made something to be proud of until after the fact. the whole time while creating shit i was Convinced it was bullshit that didn't make sense. and then other times i was Convinced it was bullshit and then i was Right and i can look back and go. huh. ew. but it doesn't matter what the end result was, because i had fun playing in the sandbox

this wasn't meant to turn into a ramble but i have Feelings about bad art and art that's badly perceived and how public perception can screw with your head and how making art youre proud of is fucking. it's so difficult!!! it's hard!! it's really fun, which is why i try to make it, but i promise you it is Okay to not tryhard creativity. even if you CAN, it's okay not to do it all the time. or ever, even. fuck around find out have fun etc

[cannibalismyuri]

coming out as a passive jopper hater bc the insane level of capitalist pandering they did with s3 (with ERICA who is like. one of the worst, stereotyped portrayals of a black girl ive ever seen, bless her heart) was truly crazy. combine that with the copaganda and the general attitude of hopper in s3 which was played off as 'awkward loser guy doesnt know what to do with Feelings more at 8' was a bit .... Eh :/ to me. because it is so obviously a fictional character and show but like. disliking hopper/jopper bc of the ideals st is perpetuating and the fact that they arent compatible at All in s3 (to me, atleast) is valid. some ppl might just think that jopper is unhealthy and/or 'overrated'. because they do sort of pay a disproportionate amount of attention to jopper, compared to the other canon romantic ships (afaik, bc of the screen time counter) and that can be Weird, esp with the... how should i say this? balancer/savior role hopper takes in the relationship (we constantly see him placating joyce, sometimes even being slightly patronizing, and also they place a lot of importance on him saving joyce from a lot of stuff, which is cool and sick if it wasnt for the fact that it directly correlates with him being a cop, yk). and the general power imbalance bc he's a Cop and abuses his position of power constantly, and that is exactly Why anything that joyce does is seen as a #insane girlboss category 5 woman moment because she simply has the short stick in the power race and when she does manage to make an impact DESPITE her economic/social/'general uselessness in say in Major decision-making when it comes to authorities' shortcomings it is seen as an amazing win. hopper on his own is extremely fleshed out as well, because we get to see his arc play out with his relationships with his daughter and ex-wife and el and re-learning how to be a parent and how to not let love allude him, and that is lovely! it's so great to see the adults in the show being focused on! but joyce is absolutely disregarded and underdeveloped as a character of her own right outside of her relationships with hopper or her kids. we see that she is determined and a force to be reckoned with and that she cares very deeply for the people she loves and would go to insane lengths for them but all that doesn't Mean anything, because we never see a backstory for her. we never figure out who she is without her family or hopper, or what her motives and aspirations and emotional shortcomings and stumbles and mistakes are. for a character to be fully fleshed out, they need to be an interesting, refreshing and palatable character On Their Own without their relationships with other characters, and we just don't see that with joyce. like u have Thee winona ryder on ur show, and u forsake developing her character in favor of developing hopper's character with /not the best taste/ and causing her to be a blank slate of a mother, lover, woman and friend, but not a PERSON. all she's been reduced to is a Mother and Hopper's Girlfriend, and honestly, that's the worst decision they could've made in relation to her and her relationship with hopper.

anyway, all this to say; these are my thoughts on the matter, but i'm definitely not hating on people who enjoy jopper passively and DEFINITELY not any by/ler (the most predominant fandom im part of in the parent fandom of st) who enjoys them as a ship with their own dynamic separate from canon. because the by/ler fandom is NOT a monolith and nobody is obligated to agree with me or change their opinion if it doesn't align with mine or be forced to look at my opinion and feel bad for shipping anything. im not going to act Holier Than Thou for expressing my opinion and u should definitely continue shipping jopper if it makes u happy! as long everybody recognizes the copaganda and capitalist mindset grind propaganda shit in st (which is Pretty Obvious) and respects that while shipping what they want, i have no problem with it. all that is to say; peace and fucking love. can we (the by/ler fandom) stop fighting abt jopper we all have our own opinions this is bc we are Not a hivemind or a monolith and not obligated to have the same opinions relating to all aspects of st just because we happen to ship one thing. i am a hater and a lover

[will80sbyers]

One of the things that made me stop reading analyses in the Byler fandom is how people just tend to pick 'parallels' that they like while ignoring or dismissing other parallels that do not suit their takes. Especially the most/more obvious parallels that are put on the show. For example Byler being paralleled to other romantic ships show that byler is also romantic but apparently Mlvn being paralleled to Byler and other romantic ships don't count as a romantic parallel. Mike being paralleled to Vickie apparently isn't a parallel because it doesnt support the intended *parallel meaning*. They literally framed Vickie and Mike in the same way and gave them same lines while paralleling Vickie's ex and El, and Will/Robin.

People will analyze all Byler scenes back and forth to show how it's romantic meanwhile completely ignoring Mlvn's romantic moments on the show. Even when Byler itself literally parallels Mlvn..... And it happens all the time not just with parallels but with other stuff like framing/editing or set design clues.

And these are not even ''minuscule details'' or ''subext'' stuff that you have to analyse. They are like the most obvious parallels that the show put.

Dont get me wrong, i like finding clues and reading analyses but they just kinda feel extremely... disingenuous sometimes when you just pick stuff that you like while ignoring other stuff just bc it doesnt support your argument.

Yeah, I get why you feel like this!!

I don't understand the point of ignoring those parallels too, the existence of byler-minteven parallels is part of why I can't think Matrioska is not romantic, that and like also the framing of their scenes where they are framed with a romantic meaning very very often, especially in the first seasons but also in season 4 they have some moments framed as romantic too!

I didn't stop reading the theories because of that though, I hear people out many times even if I don't personally agree and I like seeing all the little details that maybe could be intentional... But I do stop reading the theories in the posts when they are phrased in a way that sounds pretentious to me or seems like they are saying that if you don't think that then you are stupid, but even in that case I just ignore it as long as there is no biphobic idea involved I'm fine with people ignoring what they want to ignore in the show... I just don't care xD

I think it's also a thing about a different interpretation of stuff, I tend to not be able to ignore the big picture of what I see all together, so stuff like the "boys only" thing or the drawing in El's room etc doesn't seem like a good enough reason to say Mike is gay to me I see it as sort of general queer coding for Mike like saying "from now on for you it's only one boy aka Will"

But I also see him as acting genuine with El and also liking kissing her a lot in s3 and other people watch that and are convinced he hates it because he moves her hands...so I just think it's all about the subject that is watching for some things and it can never be super objective because of that unless you are literally the writers

But you know, I still think they all should be allowed to ignore what they want tbh even if I think taking that into consideration gives the best fair judgement on the show if you try to be the most objective possible by looking at everything... but like I'm not here to police people about what they should talk about in the tag so I just skip it and continue my day lol I get annoyed if the arguments used are clearly born from biphobia, for the rest I don't care much tbh

in the end it's not that important if he's gay or bi or just queer the important thing is that he's happy and kissing Will Byers next season

But I definitely still think he's a messy bisexual until they confirm he's not, because that's what makes sense to me for now 🌈

[deathberi]

wellll since they blocked me and i cant reply, might as well subject them to my few followers 😂 maybe anyone got something like this too? 😛

thing is i know who this content creator is. not know-know them but like i’ve always known their active content creating url (feat. my fbi skills). the so tired and all is so exaggerated bc they have me blocked for like how many years now! (surely at least 3yrs! i got blocked before because i also “just liked” their stuff when i put them on queue too 😭 and they spammed me cold anons then) until recently i saw a post of them somewhere in suggested and i was like woah shit im unblocked now?? so like my usual normal thing, i liked that post (bc i actually love the edit!!!! babe we have a few common fandoms let me rb ur works albeit queued) and put it on my queue because hello i have a queue set up???

“it’s people like you that cause content creator to quit” 🤡🤡🤡 yeah sure tell that to me and my content creating ass who never quit even when i get 20 notes on some sets and 1:10 rb to like ratios on others

i remember their cc url all this time bc its a nice and easy to remember one (cant give too much hint might give them away). and yeah i agree the likers-only club suck and kill the vibe sometimes!!! but why you gotta be too hard on the queue girlies too!!!??? arent we doing good work by getting the posts up again when it has reached downtime? well sorry i have few followers maybe its useless getting rb’d by me 👻 also maybe im just wasting my time typing this bc its really their hobby to block anyone who doesnt instant rb but hahahaha it’s bc im on a happy hour call at work and tumblr’s dumb chat sound played so loudly and they were like what was thaaaat lol

tldr liker-onlies suck to some extent! like look what you make content creators feel! unfortunately we have this extreme case from interesting url-san 😬 but please i never even thought about blocking the likers only club (bc guess what—likes are still notes!!!!!) and im not even one of them so please take this energy away from me HAHA

[luvbug724]

sits next to you :) the thing about kevjeanee housekeeping/accounting is that while kevin is not dyslexic like jeanee i fear that he is not good at math either..... i think he's probably Better at it than jean and renee but he's not of much help i don't think........ last year i overpaid my credit card at least four times because im bad at math so i think kevin would be like that. they trust him and he's basically giving their money for free to the bank. jean (grew up poor in my mind) would be furious. but if they put their three thinking heads together they can surely come up with something!

i like chronic migraines for jean i think he's very bruised bird shot from the sky etc no matter what nothing really works for him........ and he can do something dramatic like drop to the floor like an unwound doll and put his head on kevins or renees lap..... and its ok because puppies do these things....!! in a way i think the most fun of kevjeanee is the potential for hovering + doting for jean it presents because its like two of his biggest supporters. (kicks feet) i also think jean and renee are also two people i can see kevin going easier on/excusing for so its cute to me to think about... renee spacing out in practice and kevin being like well she's trying very hard. or jeremy calling in and saying jean beat up another striker and kevins like he's working on it :) you know? you do know user luvbug724 you have to

also re: kevrenee mass together ITS CUTE... i think sometimes the fandom at large um i guess doesnt really think much about renee's relationship to religion but i feel like another one of the foxes (and especially kevin maybe... in my heart) being there with her would make her very happy. i hope when its ash wednesday she approaches him in practice and puts ash on his gay little forehead :) i hope all the old ladies think they're dating or getting married soon and have no idea of the jezabel in california waiting for them (jean)

kevin fucking up their taxes. HILARIOUS. kevin the loves of your life just want their tax returns please. what the fuck do you mean they owe a million dollars can you do the math again please. this is what jeanee get for trusting a history major with their money.

KEVRENEE DOTING ON JEAN YES YES YES. jean i think will be the type of athlete who is constantly at the trainer bc. you know. the mafia may kill him if he can't play exy ugh i hate when that happens but he has to stay in good shape even though he's dealing with So many longterm injuries. when kevin and jean are pro the moment jean leaves a game renee is already in the med room to hear what the doctor has to say and kevin's there as soon as the game is over.

kevin going easier on jean and renee........ I KNOW I SWEAR I DO. its very cute. how can you blame him? renee looks very cute when she's distracted i'm sure.

kevin and renee walking in late to practice with ashes.... mein gott......................................

the idea of ppl seeing kevrenee and not knowing theres a second european man in the picture is so funny. "renee, darling, when are you and your man going to get hitched?" "oh, i'm already married :)" she's the talk of the next church potluck. martha SWEARS she saw her with a different man with a face tattoo last christmas, but agnes says there's no way renee would cheat on her husband with a face tattoo with ANOTHER man with a face tattoo. kevin must have just gotten a haircut or something. they agree to never talk about it again.

[hellishvxbes]

🔥🔥🔥

Send me a “ 🔥 “ for an unpopular opinion. Bonus points if you include a topic. ( IE. shipping, roleplaying, ect. )

Okay. I struggled to come up with some topics to talk about for a while plus just issues through the entirety of this week. BUT I FIGURED IT OUT.

🔥 - PROMOS. tbh, promo's main use were to help roleplayers find other roleplayers, to spread the word about your blog and find more partners and people to make friends and broaden your experiences with learning about new and exciting fandoms. Now I just find them tedious, and annoying to make. if you aren't a popular blog the odds of your promo being reblogged and spread around is so minimal. it also just feels like clout chasing at this point. and yeah nothing wrong with reblogging your promo and having your friends hype you up, but then ppl wonder why they think the rpc is so alienating? cuz someone else will reblog their promo's expecting the same thing and they don't get it and then they feel left out. but if its just so you can get some nice thrown at you, it just feels like more clutter for my dash especially if I'm already following you. now if you're a NEW blog. if you just joined a fandom, and you want some exposure, I'm down for that because that is what a promo is supposed to be for.

🔥 - Personals. I actually like personals. sometimes personals care more about what I post than my own followers. i get ppl being upset if they reblog their threads, but liking your posts? and maybe reblogging a headcanon or something but idk i guess for me that stuff just doesn't bother me. I love when people reblog my headcanon and they agree. or they add onto it, with their own thoughts. or they tell me how much they love it. makes me feel seen. makes me feel cool. i just think people forget that tumblr is NOT a roleplay site. yes, we found a use to tailor it to our hobby, that doesn't mean everyone who comes across our blogs know that. they arent apart of our community, what makes you think they have to abide our guidelines for it? tbh, roleplayers have just gotten entitled to thinking that tumblr is supposed to bow to our whim. we share a space with non roleplayers. to demand, and just expect ppl are just going to see your rules and read them and respect it rght away?? come on ya'll. we know to look for rules cuz its what we've been doing for years, but you can't expect that from strangers who are likely mobile bound just seeing something you wrote in the tags. its gonna happen. i just dont like the mannerisms some people have with them. you dont gotta be rude about it. if its really bothering you just block them and be done. problem solved. going out of your way to make posts about how annoying they are is just unnecessary.

🔥 - duplicates. this is one is gonna get me fired but oh well. Ya'll we have GOT to love ourselves better. because it is plain and simple insecurity for why people feel they cant talk or write with duplicates. i know it does deeper in some cases, like your current partner leaving you for the shinny new roleplayer of the same muse you write. believe me I've been there. but fuck those people. when are we gonna stop letting others dictate how we feel about ourselves? i hate seeing shit when a new roleplayer pops up with the same muse and suddenly you get the vaguing posts about 'suddenly feeling very doubtful of my portrayal' like its not obvious you are threatened. and in this fandom??? we're i follow like 30 different alastors?? lucifers?? Angels"?? all different, all got something to add and share. i got news for you but your portrayal isnt the only ONE. its not the end all be all. and yes I talk to my ego all the time, cuz there are some muses i write where i'm like I AM THE GOD FATHER OF THIS MUSE. but thats me and my own pride, doesnt mean anyone else who writes this muse is less than me. or i'm suddenly less than them. and there are portrayals i dont fuck with. i simply just do not look their way. but theres always muses i love roleplaying with duplicates cuz its FUN. also being able to talk to people who love this muse as much as you?? learn to stop looking at everything like its a competition and things will not be as stressful. its what makes this hobby unfun when you let those insecurities eat you up. im not saying its not valid, and im not saying you cant be upset, but what does it really do for you? what would happen if you just went and talked to them? imagine it goes well? you make a new friend. dont deny yourself opening a door just because you are scared of what 'might' be behind it. and its something I am learning and teaching myself. our issue is we all wanna be see, and heard. we all wanna be the absolute best. we wanna have the best portrayal like this sort of acknowledgement does anything. cuz while I know ppl love my own portrayals, still doesn't change the fact that i got issues and i cry myself to sleep still. the 'love' i get on here, ain't a fix. and if you think seeking validation on tumblr dot com is gonna fix you? its not. the attention and love we seek on here is just a placeholder, its us using this as a distraction from actually fixing our problems, and turn i still see how so many of us are unhappy. let it go.

[grewlikefancyflowers]

Hi,

Its me again.

I dont know if you have talked about this. But can you please explain the relation between the lan parents, the phoenix mountain kiss and LWJ telling LXC about "he wants to take a person to gusu". I have seen a lot of metas in fandom putting emphasis of LWJs loss of control on QHJ and about how he is not trying to become his father. The novel doesnt give us any evidence if QHJ forced madam lan in doing things nor do i think LWJ is someone who would have judged his father or mother's relationship with the limited information, so him thinking/fearing that he is "following his fathers footsteps" feels ooc to me.

Hello,

I'd say I both agree and disagree with what you say, in the sense that it is my opinion that LWJ was fearful of going down his father's path, but I do also think that fandom often portrays this in a way that seems OOC to me.

I think a problem that often comes up is that people in fandom like to fill in the gaps of the Lan parents' backstory, and have LWJ consider this version of the story they've invented to be the truth. Whereas in the novel I'd say it's important that LWJ knows nothing other than the bare minimum facts, as this is what fuels his conflict and uncertainty about it, and his conflict and uncertainty about his relationship with WWX too (in his first life).

This is all we're told about the Lan parents (sorry for the super long excerpt).

'Lan XiChen continued, “However, the woman did not care for him as much. In addition, she killed one of my father’s teachers. [...] “Why?!”

Lan XiChen, “I do not know. But, I assume that it was something along the lines of ‘grievances’.” [...] “And then,” Lan XiChen explained, “When my father heard of this, of course he was in much pain. But, no matter how he struggled, he still took the woman to his sect in secrecy. Ignoring the objections from his clan, he knelt with her for the Heavens and the Earth without making a sound and told everyone in the clan that she would be his wife for the rest of his life, that whoever wanted to harm her would have to pass through him first.” [...] “After the ceremony was completed, my father found a house and locked my mother inside. He found another house and locked himself inside. It was called secluded meditation, but it was in truth to repent.”

He paused before speaking again, “Young Master Wei, can you understand why he did such a thing?”

Wei WuXian answered after a moment of silence, “He could neither forgive the one who killed his teacher nor watch the death of the woman who he loved. He could only marry her to protect her life and force himself not to see her.”

Lan XiChen, “Do you think that this was right?”

Wei WuXian, “I don’t know.”

Lan XiChen looked somewhat lost, “Then, what do you think would be right?”

Wei WuXian, “I don’t know.”

The recurring theme throughout this whole scene is that both LXC and WWX don't know, they don't know the full facts of what happened, why Lan-furen killed that teacher, they don't know if it was right, they don't know what they would do in this situation, or what a solution would be. And we don't know if Lan-furen willingly went along with the plan so her life would be spared, or if she was forced. Even QHJ doesn't feel his actions were right, because he also locked himself up to repent.

The conflicts at the heart of wangxian's relationship in WWX's first life bares a lot of resemblance to LWJ's parents — LWJ has feelings for WWX, they appear to be unrequited. LWJ thinks WWX is at risk of harm, so LWJ wants to hide him away and keep him safe. But the only way to do so would be to keep him effectively imprisoned, because WWX would never stay voluntarily.

There is plenty of textual evidence that LWJ is fearful (sometimes to an extreme degree) of violating WWX's consent, but I think the primary cause of this fear is actually because of what happened on Phoenix Mountain, not because of his father. (Maaaaybe some of LWJ's conflict is also fuelled by his kinks, but most of the textual evidence comes after the Phoenix Mountain kiss, so I think that's the main factor. Also I just can't stand the LWJ angsting about his kinks trope lol)

Prior to that kiss, there are times when LWJ is actually very inconsiderate of WWX's autonomy, prime example being their confrontation post-burial mound when he simply decides WWX should come to Gusu with him, and grabs at him and fights him without even giving an explanation. When he does give one, its phrased as a command, not a suggestion. In my opinion, it's in this scene that LWJ makes the connection between his father's situation and his own, when WWX makes the assumption that LWJ intends to punish him with seclusion. From the moment WWX said that, LWJ doesn't speak & seems unable to defend his actions, then he leaves. I think it's also relevant that the Wen clan had attacked the Cloud Recesses, supposedly due to QHJ having committed some wrongdoing. Obviously this is just an excuse the Wen clan fabricated, as per their usual modus operandi, but considering this & QHJ's recent death, it's likely that his father, and thoughts of his moral failings, were weighing on LWJ's mind quite heavily at this point in the novel.

I spoke in depth about how the events on phoenix mountain prompted the 'but he is not willing' conversation with LXC in this post so I won't go into again here. In summary, it's because LWJ is confronted with his own fallibility, so he doubts himself and his intentions towards WWX.

While I don't think LWJ after the Phoenix Mountain kiss is thinking anything like 'oh no, I've violated the consent of the person I love, just like my father, an evil man!' as you sometimes see in fandom portrayals, I do think he cannot help but wonder. And because his situation and his father's situation have these similarities, I think he cannot help but compare himself to his father. Especially because he made WWX think he wants to imprison him. But rather than making assumptions about things he doesn't know, the uncertainty is what causes LWJ's internal conflict. For someone like LWJ, who generally places a lot of value of rules, precedent and tradition, the lack of clear answers about what he is supposed to do in this situation is a turmoil that he, at this point is his life, isn't well-equipped to handle.

LWJ's solution is to maintain the distance between him & WWX, to not push into in his affairs, even to take an injured WWX back to the burial mound just because he insisted, in his anguish, that LWJ get lost. But then, WWX dies thinking there is no one left in the world who cares for him.