#like she is so very clearly being manipulated by ambessa

[lion-eva61]

Nah you guys just really see a beautiful person and brush all of the politics of them aside.

Before Mel talks about the weapons Jayce has not even thought of using hextech for weapons.

He tells Mel that if they would built they weapons it would shatter the peace with zhaun heimerdinger was building with the city.

What does Mel say : that heimerdingers inaction cause all of this „like you said yourself Jayce „ and that peace is already broken. We want you to protect your city and if we are lucky we don’t need to use the weapons.

Now tell me that is not a conning and manipulative politician. Using Jayce’s own action and words to consider building weapons . And saying that when we don’t actually use them it is fine to at least build them.

Yes this is decently totally a good moral politician and good influence for Jayce. Not even considering building towards peaceful solutions. Also at this point the undercity doesn’t have any weapons, jinx didn’t build one yet. (If I am not mistaken ) like their is only the slight chance the zhaunits could use hextech to revolt and she just jumps the gun. Jayce even asked her if their is proof and Mel said that she doesn’t want to find out.THERE WASNT EVEN PROPER PROOF THAT THE UNDERCITY MIGHT HAVE HEXWEAPONS. Jinxes bomb has no hextech technology and even Viktor said it is a leap to say they could copy hextech.

Man obsessed is harsh since my post is 90% about Mel and only Jayce to make a point in her character journey and struggles. I focus more about Mel as a politician with a merdada upbringing, and that upbringing is constantly fighting with her morals. Which is very well shown in the series with her relationship with Jayce.

But I am not contradicting anything you said, like you are just summarizing my post. I just 1.include Mel’s probable initial goal that bringing Jayce into the council gave her power too over hextech and was probably her plan. Her game began before she warmed up to Jayce. So yes it didn’t happen because the story unfolds but why is it offensive to say that the richest politician from a war family wants to have somecontrol over hextech too?

With hextech weapon : I said she is a catalyst, not that she carries all the fault. Maybe I should have written that more clearly because that is not my intention.

yes it was Jayce’s decision to make them,I actually talked a lot about Jayce in the past and his broken promises to Viktor and building the weapons was one of them. That Mel brought him to politics but he made decisions that put a rift to his and victors relationship and literally killed a child.I never freed Jayce from his faults I just didn’t focus on them in this post.

But I take critism because I got the order wrong : the bridge scene and Jayce’s : „theyAre dangerous!“ is first and then Mel talks to Jayce about weapons and that he needs to protect the city from zhaunits. She wasn’t the first one to say : it’s them vs us.Jayce was thinking that already. So there I made a mistake.

Still she said that, in response to the uproars of the under city. You can even argue that makes her politics even more bad: instead of working a solution with the under cities rightful anger she approaches the topic of weapons. She is literally on the same side as Markus and ambessa at that point, it is only viktor being his voice of reason right now.

Like she is so smart with the hextech weapons that she tells Jayce not to worry because as long as they don’t actually use the weapons, it is not bad to make them. How is that not a cunning and slightly manipulative politician? Make the people killing weapons with magic but don’t worry I am not saying to use them immediately.

AND SHE SAID THAT PEACE IS ALREADY BROKEN WITH ZHAUNITS.

Another mistake I made is that Ambessa actually didn’t put pressure on Mel to talk about weapons. She arrived after Mel came into the lab to talk about weapons with Jayce .She ist still only a catalyst, to bring that topic and that seed of thought into Jayce. And I didn’t say she carries all the fault. I said she is a catalyst.

But since Mel is his girlfriend and cares about Jayce and gave him all the power I criticize her because she should have helped Jayce not to spiral more into becoming a violent politician, instead she is like Markus and ambessa another influence for Jayce to make bad decisions. Literally like you said.

Not manipulating him into any decision but still influencing him enough to make bad decisions.

If Mel is such a morally good character why did she actually talks about weapons with Jayce instead of negotiating with zhaunits and their struggle ? Like a good politician . Because she is not one yet.

Like it was Viktor reminding Jayce that they wanted hextech to help people not take their lives. Again I already said that in my post.

This is her journey after all, her personal struggle in the story and that is why I mean you guys just can’t handle a woman in stories struggling with her true morals , because you want to even ignore her personal struggles : rejecting the merdada upbringing vs giving into them

Mel talking about weapons is her fall into becoming like her mom. That’s why I am no brushing that under the rug.

And I also mentioned that yes, it is Jayce who at the end surprises everyone with the peace deal and catches Mel by surprise. Like the tables turned.

Another critism I take is not mentioning that it is interesting that Jayce is the one who profits more that Mel is in the council than Mel having Jayce in the council. Because Jayce managed to kick heimedinger out because Mel gave him his vote first and the other council members followed.

But how does that make Mel look better ? It even makes her look worse because she brought a guy in the council she can’t control, has no political prowess, makes bad decisions and she still gives him her vote.

It looks like her affection for Jayce is blinding her. But it doesn’t free her from the fault at the escalation with the undercity.

Saw that tweet on twitter and hated it. Because 1. people seem always to gaslight Jayce , saying : oh, you are saying Mel manipulated him? Well his fault for being so easy to be manipulated. He is a himbo ! He is like a leaf in the wind so don’t you dare point out Mel’s grey morality. Instead make more jokes about Jayce!

Even half serios only half joking : Jayce actually wanted to be manipulated by a beautiful woman!

Here is my take:

First : Mel is deep down a good moral leader who is empathetic and cares about all people. But her true potential is buried and need to get out.

Second, Mel should have teamed up with ekko in season 2. Her journey to a good moral leader was not in season 1, her vote for independence of zhaun is not enough to make me say: her dream is to help people just like Jayce and Viktor. But her journey (right at the bombing of the council )should have began to become that person.

With ekko there was so much potential for her to learn about zhaunits and make her finally believe that they are HER people too, that all that gold she wears is like blood gold when all the zhaunits suffer.

Here is why:

First I want to establish Mel’s very grey character by her interactions with Jayce:

Jayce was easily pushed into all kinds of decisions (Markus and ambessa ) and into a political position by Mel, were she gave him full power over the future of hextech, BUT, the council gave no room for him to even have time to think about it. People often say: why didn’t he just say :No actually I don’t want it!

Well watch episode 4 again : Mel IMMEDIATELY began with the voting for creating a house Talis. The council was already 3 steps ahead before Jayce could even utter a word and talking over him. No one even asked him : hey do you even want this Jayce? It shows that the council, once they have something in their minds, they will have it reinstated. In this case :Mel wanted Jayce in the council , and she got that.

Not to mention that Mel already put the seeds in his head (same episode I think but earlier) that he could be a good leader to spread hextech to the world. She made sure to put that idea in his head to achieve his hextech dream.

Also it is not altruism that Mel gave him so much power, because she actually gave herself power over hextech. With Jayce in the council she has one vote more for whatever she wants to be reinstated, because it is easy for her to convince Jayce of her opinions(for example hextech weapons).

Mel used Jayce’s lack of political and tactical understanding. I mean, she was smart enough to approach Jayce and not Viktor, because getting a say of the future of hextech would be impossible through Viktor, a zhaunits who distrust the upper piltover class.

Her journey in s1 is that she moved and used tactics like a Merdada but learns to open up to Jayce and reject her upbringing. But that journey is rocky. To remind everyone : she was(under the pressure of her mother ) the catalyst for the hextech weapons, she brought that idea into Jayce’s and victors lab and brought another dilemma into Jayce’s life : is it morally correct to use his dream to fight other people to protect your own people. At that moment she didn’t consider the zhaunits her people, planting another seed into Jayce’s mind : it’s them vs us.

Meanwhile Viktor was defusing Jinx’s bomb and reminding Jayce , that there is choice for not using violence against people. A deliberate contrast to what Mel said.

And even the final vote for independence for zhaun is rocky : she was taking by surprise with the peace deal and looked worried and unsure. It looks like a mirror how Jayce felt when she took him by surprise and made him council. Now Jayce surprised her with the decision where her morals finally really stands, and she votes for peace.

Problem is, the council already overlooked so much of the issues in zhaun, that their voting is way to late. The pain of zhaunits expressed by jinx is boiling over and the rocket hits.

A final and very good conclusion, a middle finger to the council and their half asses morality.

And that was Mel’s journey : she was just not quick enough to realize, where her morals stands. She was not fast enough to let go of her merdada tactics and work for peace instead of wealth for piltover.

She is not a villain but also not an ally to zhaun. YET

Now season 2:

In season 2 she should have cooperate with ekko, learning the people of zhaun and become the person she really is deep down but is buried under the pressure of her mom and all the years of accumulation wealth for her and piltover, ignoring zhaun.

Her journey was not over to become a true good leader, she was barely a good moral leader in season 1. she should have become one in season 2.

The symbolism to throw away the gold to help the tree of the firelight’s, make it bloom and shine again like she wanted as a child, a city beautiful that it’s shines bright: THAT IS LIERALLY THE FIRELIGHTS HIDEOUT

That’s why it is so so disappointing that Mel Stan’s never talk about her in greater depth, brush her decisions and tactics with a moral white brush, ignore all the so obvious wealth symbolism around her that point out how far away she is from the pain of zhaunits , gaslight Jayce and ignore her journey.

And make stupid tweets.

You guys should not be angry why she didn’t end up with Jayce , but why she never had the chance to show us , that of all people in piltover, she is actually the most caring. That she would have the biggest heart for zhaun. Why didn’t we see that? When it was established how much she actually cares that people don’t suffer? Why didn’t Mel not have a single chance to interact with zhaunits ? To see their suffering ? To make actual changes ?

[ideologyofone]

I am begging some of yall to put your thinking caps on this season Caitlyn is NOT THE BAD GUY

[avelera]

Arcane's Jayce & Viktor: A Tech Industry Perspective

I've been wrestling with whether to make a short and sweet post about these points or to just have another long-winded meta and clearly since I'm incapable of being brief, I guess we'll just dive in.

I work in tech. What I see in this industry colors a lot of how I see Jayce and Viktor in Arcane. I'll try to be brief about a few of the things that stand out to me the most and that I think are intentional.

1 ) Jayce and Viktor are references to Alfred Nobel - This is a historical reference so direct I genuinely don't know how people grasp Jayce and Viktor's characters if you don't know about it.

Alfred Nobel is known for two things: inventing dynamite and bequeathing his subsequent fortune to founding the Nobel Peace Prize. These things are very much related.

Nobel was brilliant but socially naive. When he invented dynamite, he intended it to make life easier and safer for working in mines. Sound familiar? That is literally what the Atlas Gauntlets and Hex Claw Jayce and Viktor invented with Hextech was posed to be. It is a direct reference to Alfred Nobel and dynamite, there is no question about it in my mind whatsoever that they pose the benefit to society as specifically being useful to miners.

Nobel also believed that the awesome destructive power of dynamite would mean the end of warfare. Literally. He thought it was so disgusting and unthinkable that people would use explosives on each other that it would grind violence to a halt. He was very, very wrong about this. So wrong, in fact, that he spent the rest of his life in horror and remorse at how explosives were being used to kill people and created the Nobel Peace Prize to promote innovations aimed at peace, a prize which annually recognizes those who "conferred the greatest benefit to humankind".

Likewise with Jayce and Viktor, they are both horrified to imagine Hextech used for warfare and we think they're incredibly socially naive for thinking this, because they are. Maybe in another universe, there'd be the Talis Peace Prize to try to make up for what they unleashed on the world. Which brings me to my next point:

2 ) Jayce and Viktor have typical engineer blindspots to society's ills - As I've discussed in-depth in another meta, Jayce and Viktor both desperately needed some non-STEM or scientific classes in their life because their worldview is so naive and stunted as a result that it's the source of a dizzying number of their problems. Neither of them could even consider that Hextech, like dynamite, would be weaponized immediately. But they have other huge gaps too as a result of their narrow focus on science, and I do believe this is intentional by the writers as a commentary on engineers and tech people in general.

Short version, Jayce desperately needs some understanding of history and of rhetoric. When Ambessa asks him if his school teaches military history, he doesn't even know if they offer it. She was testing him with that question and as a canny manipulator and general, she clearly takes that to mean she can run circles around him, and she is right. Because with incredibly simplistic plays to his male ego, like calling his leadership "impotent", Ambessa immediately gets Jayce riled up and not thinking clearly. She blindfolds him, spins him around, and shoves him headlong into taking violent military action in exactly the direction she wanted him to go in to kick the nest and set off a war.

Jayce is also easily manipulated by Mel for more benevolent but still self-serving reasons with appeals to his life's work with flattery, his male ego with sex, and his dreams for a better world to make him fall quickly into step with the city's corruption with only a little nudging because he has no strong civic understanding of his own to fall back on. As Cait notes, he's never taken an interest in the Council or politics before until he becomes a Councilor himself.

Short version for Viktor, he wants to make the world a better place but he's never actually had to think through human nature before. He's literally never bothered. We know this because of his blindspot towards Hextech weaponry where he truly believed they could avoid it being used for warfare, and the fact that later in his cult, he's somehow shocked to learn that people will do bad things for the ones they love and won't just slice pieces of their own nature and personality off to fit into his little Utopian commune.

Literally cracking any kind of history or sociology book or heck, a Pratchett Discworld book, would have told him that there's a straight fucking line between deciding people are the problem when it comes to fixing society's ills and eugenics. He falls headlong into that trap and it requires his older, wiser self to beat him over the head with the truth of the horrors of his own simplistic worldview would lead to before he literally annihilates all life in his home city in his attempt to save it.

Which brings me to my next point:

3 ) Jayce and Viktor as oblivious tech nerds who have never cracked a book open but suddenly thinking that because they're great engineers, they have the solution to all of life's problems.

This is a somewhat shorter point, but I think in modern society we all know about the proverbial tech bro who keeps reinventing things like public transportation and taxes because they've never read a book in their life that doesn't have equations in it.

To be clear, they aren't bad people! I'd even hazard to say that young tech bros trying to make public good-based startups with a laughable lack of social awareness aren't bad people either! If anything, the education system has failed them, and they're pouring their intellect and earnest, human desire to help others into endeavors with the narrowest possible world perspective, which happens to be their field of expertise and thus it makes sense they'd see that as the greatest value that can offer, it's just too limited a view so they end up reinventing things that already exist or making worse, more dangerous versions of things that already exist. Tragically, their naive but well-meaning worldview often leads to:

4 ) Viktor and Jayce, but mostly Jayce, as tech bros being beholden to billionaire interests to make their dream come true:

Like Jayce, we see how these tech bros have their vision co-opted by people with a broader vision and understanding of the world, by billionaire investors who turn their inventions into making a quick buck for themselves, to warmongers and dictators who turn the creations of their mind into surveillance state horror stories. Some of that is a lack of wisdom on their parts when it comes to building in safeguards, sure, but part of that is there is a class divide too between the powerful and bright-eyed young inventors who just want to improve the world. As Singed notes, no one in power is ever innocent. And those in power have the capital to make a young inventor's dream come true and thus, tie them to their demands and interests. As Jayce said, they built the Hexgates, "Like [the Councilors] asked." Specifically this indicates that their vision has already been co-opted to serve financial interests. It also, again, makes it almost laughable how naive they are that they didn't realize warfare was next after trade.

Like many tech bros with billionaire investors, Jayce relied on the Kirammans, who were one of the wealthiest people in the city and literally on the Council that represents the State, and on Mel who is also part of the State, who is the wealthiest woman in Piltover, and who comes from a family of world-conquering warmongers, to make his dream come true from the very start.

From the beginning, Jayce was at a losing disadvantage when it came to keeping his dream ideologically pure and free of the influence of the wealthy and powerful.

And finally, just to point out that I'm not making this up, that these parallels are in fact intentional and built into the story:

4 ) Jayce and Viktor as parallels to Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak, founders of Apple. Christian Linke, co-creator of Arcane, specifically noted them as inspirations for Jayce and Viktor's relationship, with Jayce (Jobs) as the face of the company and Viktor (Woz) as the real brains behind the invention.

This caused a lot of sturm and drang on Twitter with people misinterpreting that he means Jayce isn't the actual inventor of Hextech, which I think is an overreaction. Jobs, unlike many tech bros who have earned society's ire lately like Musk, was actually an engineer too. It's completely common in tech spaces for partnerships to be made up of one partner who is able to handle being the public face of the company, and one introverted and socially awkward genius who prefers to sit in a dark room and actually tinker with the problem and who would literally rather set themselves on fire than talk to a non-technical human being. I know because I've been in such partnerships before myself as the public face.

Where Jayce and Viktor rather charmingly buck the stereotypes of that relationship and so in turn actually make it more like what I've seen in the real world, is the fact there isn't resentment between the two as a result. Viktor is glad that Jayce is willing to be the public face and doesn't want to get in the way. This is actually very common with the engineers I know! It's not seen as glory stealing, it's seen as sparing them awful, painful work they don't want to do, like networking.

Yes it means Jayce needs to sacrifice some time in the lab, but it's a simple division of labor that he's happy to do, especially if it frees Viktor from the responsibility so he can focus on what he loves, because Jayce loves him. And you'll note that Jayce is very above-board academically speaking on this front, he always cites Viktor as his partner and is scrupulous in giving Viktor credit, in conversation at least, even if he doesn't forcibly drag Viktor on stage to take credit there.

Anyway, when I write meta or even fic for these two, this sort of background is always on my mind, and I thought it might be valuable for others who maybe aren't as familiar with the tech space as I am.

[epitaph-of-rebirth]

Doing this post to explain what lots of people missed on the Cait x Maddie thing and are just angry and freaking out about the character and not understanding WHY and also show that they already broke up and will not be danger on act 3 (srly I really believe on this and feel like we all missed because is a small scene).

So here is a explanation on WHY, because I'm going crazy that you'll missed lots of things.

Some of the explanation that I'll put here we got from Amanda Overton itself (you know, one of the writers of the show) on the epi4 watchalong party (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgpWJl1NuTE) the rest is showed on the episode 4 itself so here we go (Also SPOILERS FOR ACT2 here):

First, Amanda told us that the time skip from Act 1 to Act 2 is between 3 and 6 months, is not bigger than that like some you are saying. What is very helpful to know that Cait x Maddie affair also isn't happening for so long and we get this information from Ambessa herself when meeting them on Cait's office:

Caitlyn didn't rebound imediatly after the breakup, her thing with Maddie is recent, a few weeks at maximum or one or two night stands. Yes guys, you can stop being mad thinking that she fucking Maddie for months.

Also a important piece of information that again, Amanda shared, is Caitlyn's mentality about this relationship:

She is not after Maddie because she felt for another person, Caitlyn is struggling to live up to the ghost of Cassandra, she is trying to be the daughter she never was and this affect's even who she dates.

Amanda literally told that in Cait's mind she is thinking: "What if I dated someone my mom would approve of?"

Lot's of people think that Cassandra approved Vi because of the council scene but in Caitlyn's mind that's not the truth. Maddie is someone who would be approved, she is from piltover, probably has some family name and has a good job.

With all that, why a sex scene ? Well is very clear that Caitlyn is not able to be vulnerable anymore, the only one she let's under her wall's after her mom's death is Vi and it was already hinted that for Caitlyn's flirting with woman casually was a natural thing.

The only way for her to "date" someone without being able to be vulnerable, is by the thing she knows she can separate her feelings and don't need to be vulnerable to do it: sex. And we can in this case considerate that sex is also a way for her to cope with all like Vi does with alcohol.

Also even after having sex with Maddie, Cait clearly don't want the girl touching her and this is show not only by her expressions:

But also on the way both are dressed, Caitlyn's is untouched and clothed while Maddie is basically naked under her shirt and messy, giving a subtext of Cait being a top on this encounter so she can evade Maddie's touch.

And right after the scene we can see that Maddie herself KNOWS that Cait is evading her and not wanting to be touched, she KNOWS something is wrong and that Cait seems to not listen to her.

Other information that is given by Amanda, is that Ambessa is supposed to be the devil on Caitlyn's shoulder while Maddie is to make the position of a angel. The character exists to show that Caitlyn wasn't alone against Ambessa manipulation and make clear that she has some foot herself to be able to see what is right and wrong and later realize her wrong doings and fix that.

And now comes the part I feel like most people missed and are worried about in act3.

Maddie and Cait already ended their relationship, how I know? the statue scene:

Here we can see again Maddie looking up for Cait but Cait not acknowledging the girl existence until last minute when seems like Maddie told something.

Caitlyn's expression again is cold and then we can see Maddie's:

She is thinking and ready to cry and also show some hurt. She probably is ending things with Cait because the next time we see Cait. Is from Maddies eyes, something that fortiche does a lot and did on that very famous CaitVi bed scene. And this time is done again but we are looking at Caitlyn from Maddie's eyes:

The upper and low corner's are blurry, as if Maddie is almost crying. Also we can see Cait looking the ground and thinking on the next frames, as if reacting to something said to her.

And here is their breakup.

Yes is not a spoken scene, but considering how small her relationship is to Caitlyn, makes sense for things to end and Cait not really give much thought about it.

After that we NEVER see Maddie anymore, she is not on the side of Caitlyn for the rest of the act, and also Cait is always using her Commander cape after this scene, what makes clear: She is totally on the side of Ambessa, the devil won and the angel left.

And this cape is another thing that is used to reflect Caitlyn's mental state and choices, because we only see her back to her uniform without the cape, when she decided to ally with Vi by the end of the Act 2

I understand people who got annoyed by having "another one" in the middle of CaitVi ship and yes I know everybody worry about this making messy their reunion, but I feel like most people forgot that in Arcane, and on this season mainly, lots of things are being show by the art and animation and not by text, like the statue one.

Srly guys CaitVi will be alright, Maddie is not a horrible characters and this was not a bad choice to show Caitlyn mental state and character development. I understand being bitter with the angst but also let ourselves enjoy it a little.

[hexite-nightmares]

My very unorganized thoughts on S2 of Arcane but only about Viktor

Alright I finally had time to think and write everything down so here we go. I want to preface that I have been weary about this season ever since I watched the act 1 leaks. Mainly because it was very clear he was never going to be a machine, and they didn't give him enough screen time to develop his motivations into ACT 3 Viktor being convincing enough

LET'S START WITH THE FALSE PROPHET VIKTOR

Alright so he has about 11 minutes ish of screentime. Aside from the glaring issue of Jayce reviving him and not destroying the hexcore, taking away agency from a disabled character. It was clearly a false prophet situation, but it was so fucking confusing on whether he could feel like a regular human, if he was under the Hexcore's control which makes the agency issue worse or just jaded. He all of a sudden starts speaking like he's reading Deuteronomy passages ?? We don't know for sure if he's aware that he's basically creating a hive mind now, did he start his plans of making everyone into one right here? Sky seems to encourage him to do this, what does she know about it since shes been in the hexcore ALONE for a little longer? (writers didnt confirm whether it was the real her or not) . Act 1 Viktor's issues are mostly about agency, and a seeming full abandonment of his identity as a scientist, his personality does a full 180. He doesn’t seem to question that the object that revived him and killed Sky is giving him healing powers, but he’s angry at Jayce so we have no clue if he’s being controlled or not.

The show doesn't seem to care to spend time with him bc Isha and Ambessa I guess.

Anyways lets move on to not even act 2, but ep 6, his only episode in this act.

I had huge gripes with this episode, mainly because whatever the fuck was going on with Viktor trying to "keep" Vander's humanity, when he clearly was taking it away from everyone he touched, does he actually believe what he's saying or is he under the Hexcore's control still?. Obviously the glaring issues of Sky being there without any actual input, they're cosmic friends I guess but with very generic lines, and the fandom has to fill in the blanks with whatever Amanda Overton feels like saying about Sky in the moment(if we don't see it in the show I don't take it as her development, sorry). So Viktor builds Colloidal silver drinking Joshua tree and ppl think it's fucking Eden, Jinx calls him a Machine Herald when there's NO SIGN OF MACHINERY JUST PURPLE MAGICAL METAL LOOKING FLESH. We get a whole ass different realm with no explanation other than, oh yeah Viktor is inside there. Jayce comes in and almost kills him. The only option there is at this point is for Singed to start his MH era. The choice of becoming MH is nonexistent now, other people have to jumpstart things for him. I know some people interprete this commune as Viktor achieving his dreams, thinking he was being himself, that he was in paradise with Sky and.. that wasn’t the case for me.. it was extremely sinister. Worst part of this Act, is that MH was seemingly a damn trial experiment for Orianna.

BONUS:

So it seems that Christian Linke has confirmed Sky was the hexcore using its influence to manipulate viktor into the glorious evolution. He said it was meant to be as a misdirect. So to everyone who got dunked on here for “wanting to be spoonfed” or “not reading into it deep enough” for thinking he was being mind controlled, you were right about it being the hexcore. Viktor has been confirmed to have no agency until episode 9 I guess. He also mentioned Viktor’s goal was getting the most power/influence… we never saw a fucking glimpse of this in season one I’m sorry.

ACT 3

First awful problem here is obviously Singed having to jumpstart things. Viktor is aware for his choice of whatever is happening with the egg thing. Yet....there's still no sign of machinery. We get a scene where Sky fucking dies again, he refers to her as Ms Young, which im guessing is a parallel to the other time he dismissed her in S1. But of course we get the double fridging in the show, cuz making female characters just for the sake of advancing her crush's plot line is sooo amazing. Here lies sky, the character who is barely a character. Well after that we get the sequence of his transformation and we get that butt ugly mask. His personality does another huge change again. So we know the hexcore is not influencing him anymore as the hexcore completed its goal of the glorious evolution.. so I guess viktor really does think this is the right way?

A huge issue I have again, is the lack of agency. In this particular scene Jayce goes "My partner died in this room" yeah..Viktor didn't fully choose to become this right? it all started with Jayce using the hexcore on him, it’s been manipulating him the whole ass season…Kinda wish there was some sort of acknowledgement from Jayce that he’s basically the catalyst of this.

He gets his laser because...fanservice. There's no way he went all the way to the lab and magically attached it to himself just to cut off a wall. He keeps going on that choice is false, but a few minutes before he said he’d evolve all of those willing?

In the cosmos, beautiful sequence. I don’t love Jayce’s dialogue choices(about his disease) here and then it all being about viktor hating himself.. since the hexcore was leading to all of this, his motivation for it all being self hatred feels a bit eh. The sequence is beautiful and Jayce and Viktor destroying the anomaly with the rune shard is nice, that part was cute. But then they kinda disappear and we only know that viktor is alive so far, no clue about Jayce. The sequence is touching towards the end and I’m a sucker for characters finding each other in every timeline/universe but it can’t make up for all the other things that are bothering me. This seems to be the one time Viktor has some sort of agency I guess.

Then obviously the worst part that will bother me forever. The thing that made me almost slam my laptop shut

This retcon is just awful I shouldn’t even have to say why, it makes things fucking weird and it’s frankly stupid. Also viktor can’t rock a beard like that.

Anyways this is very disorganized, fuck you riot I felt like an insane former this whole time but I was right.

[emaline10tothe-9]

Okok maybe someone else has already brought this up, and I don’t really know LOL lore, but I’m stuck at home sick as hell and all I have to do is make Arcane theories.

Arcane Season 2 Act 1 spoilers below!!

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Aight, so that OP though. Let’s talk character outfit colours.

Most of our characters are in white (or off-white), and the clothing is all fairly open, airy, shoulders are uncovered. There is freedom in their dress.

We have Vi

Ekko

And Jayce

Who are all slightly off-white, but largely unaffected by external manipulation (congrats on your character growth Jayce).

Mel is the most clearly in white. She has always been the one trying to prevent war. She is cunning and manipulative, but ALWAYS to prevent more violence, so she is the clearest of all.

And Jinx, the least clear. When she is waving the flag of the undercity, the flag and her top appear black. Perhaps suggesting the influence of something darker, of the Black Rose in her actions.

Viktor is also unclear. He doesn’t appear to be wearing black in the first shot, but the mask is a clear white as opposed to his cloak in an off-white. And later, his cloak appears to have some very distinct white, and some darker shades. Again, implying some darker influence, though I currently feel like Viktor is off on a bit of a side-quest right now and the Black Rose likely isn’t involved.

Then we have Cait, and oh our girl is not well. Cait is very clearly wearing BLACK. And unlike the open and airy designs of the white garments, she is in a tight-fitting turtleneck. Setting aside how good a look it is for her, it implies a level of constraint and control, particularly having her neck covered (think being choked). Black also implying the Black Rose, perhaps pulling the strings even past what Ambessa can see and control.

Speaking of Ambessa, Mama is SLAYING in red. She is the only character who is conscious of the Black Rose’s influence, so she gets the most life-like colour, the red of blood. She is also only seen holding a black rose, as though she is contemplating crushing it.

So in summary, I think the colours of the characters’ garments suggest the level of manipulation by the Black Rose they will be subject to this season.

[s1i9d]

Just Finished Arcane Season 2, Act 1. [Spoilers]

Episode 1 - Heavy is the Crown

A fallout episode. As in like here’s all the repercussions from “The Monster You Created”.

Only four people really died. I mean, I’m counting Viktor as a death here cause he canonically died and Jayce stirring the Hexcore pot was really the only thing that “saved” him.

I think Cait’s mom’s survival was a Schrödinger’s Cat for me. I had a big feeling she was gonna be dead, but I wasn’t 100% sure. But those other two guys dying makes total sense.

The funeral sequence for Cait’s mom was gorgeous, and the fact that it was done all in charcoal (well except for the colour assets) was so good.

Saylo needs to close his mouth. I love how Medarda is just such a classy manipulator.

Vi not wanting to be an enforcer makes sense but also Cait wanting her to be makes sense too. There’s just so much mess here.

The ambush was incredible. Jayce and Vi are the first and only butch lesbian and bisexual man to be absolute failure combo and I love it.

When they said “they must have had help” I was initially like “oh yeah, Ambessa Medarda for sure.”

also, vi when we said “fuck the police” we didn’t mean-

Episode 2 - Watch It All Burn

I do like how this parallels Season 1’s first two episodes. In Season 1, the first episode was about the Undercity with very little focus on Piltover. The second episode was a focus on Piltover with some cuts to the Undercity. In Season 2, the first episode was all about Piltover and the second episode was looking at the Undercity with cuts to Piltover.

Jinx and Silco in the water was so gorgeous. Love how they make it clear that Jinx is still processing killing him.

Undercity in disarray in an attempt to take over power.

Sevika and Jinx having a genuine discussion about their roles and identities without Silco was really unexpected. I thought they would lose control themselves.

Viktor is ✨skinnyyyyy✨

Heimerdinger/Ekko/Jayce meet up was the last group of characters I would have expected to meet up at all.

This horror sequence in the training room was wild. You can really see it from Jinx perspective, now that she’s doesn’t have much mental control over Vi, she can’t escape when she’s breathing in The Grey and trying to sneak around.

Immediately going into the fight with Sevika. Loved the slot machine effects, even if Sevika clearly was annoyed by it which makes it funnier.

Can’t believe Viktor is Jesus Christ now.

Episode 3 - Finally Got the Name Right

We got the CaitVi kiss! And then everything went wrong!!! Yay!!!

Mel got body snatched lol. (I mean… she was snatched anyways.)

The fuck is up with Jayce being an idiot and intelligent and the same time.

I called Ambessa being in charge of the ambush in 201.

I support women’s rights and women’s wrongs.

[cupcait]

saw something dumb on tiktok and now i need to rant about caitlyn under the cut bc it's long and. spoilers yknow.

i rly. hate hate HATE that arcane brought on a certain group who knows nothing abt the characters before arcane & has defaulted to calling people who love caitlyn??? names??? and everyone has just this. absolutely ridiculous view of her because of her actions in s2 and i just.

did we watch the same show? almost every single character has done something that isn't... good?? there's so many who just so grossly misunderstand her character and her arc and it's so incredibly frustrating. yes it's awful seeing her morals falter due to her anger. it's awful seeing her allowing grief consume her and it'll never justify her actions. but like..... it's very human to be blinded by guilt, rage, and especially when mourning.

in act 1 she feels like it's her fault her mom died. like she failed, because she didn't do the one thing in her mind that would have prevented that. she feels her discipline and morals are what led to not only her mother dying, but two other members of the council. the entire point of her arc in the beginning is that cognitive dissonance. she isn't acting herself! she's going against her beliefs! THAT'S THE POINT!!! it doesn't mean they no longer exist in her. the way she behaves in the first two acts are VERY drastically different from the caitlyn we see in league, and in act 1. but she grows from it. she learns from it. & that won't erase the pain she caused during this period, but it is what serves to ground her again, putting her back to dedicating herself to healing.

also... she has not even AMBESSA in her ear, BUT POSSIBLY LEBLANC???? i know it doesn't drop her name but she has leblanc's exact eye makeup, and it's apparently leaked lb is getting a rework (more aligned w her appearance in arcane?) but mel says this line, sorceress/leblanc calls her a sly girl, and then we see ambessa tell her she is the wolf.

also this shot in the opening? ambessa's eyes glowing just like shadow lb?? leblanc's entire thing is being the deceiver it's rly not surprising lb as ambessa would have been able to perfectly pull the strings & make cait act out of character.

regardless of all of that, caitlyn says very clearly hating jinx made her hate herself. we are not supposed to like or side with her during her siding with ambessa, because she doesn't like it either. she doesn't even side with herself. people say she folded the minute vi called her cupcake and like, that's funny, but it's more that seeing vi again was a reminder of what the hell she actually wants to be fighting (or shooting) for. "ambessa" wanted caitlyn to have a distraction from vi for a reason.... it'd bring out her heart, rather than the fear that could be easily manipulated.

ppl saying she kissed vi to manipulate her in act 1 and i just..... i have to laugh..... we're talking about the same caitlyn who had to snap herself out of it to avoid kissing vi after healing her wound w the shimmer.... riiiight..... people acting like she didn't immediately have an expression of regret after hitting vi w the butt of her rifle... RIGHT.... SHE KNOWS SHE FUCKED UP we literally see the shift before she leaves. goes from looking like she cant believe what just happened to looking like she's about to cry out of guilt before she turns and leaves. it's awful seeing her do this to vi, and again, we aren't supposed to like it. i just think it's really clear she doesn't either. 😭

also idk i just think it's weird to call people names over characters they like especially considering the amount of people who will forgive other characters who have. arguably done worse.

[jbk405]

Like I said last night, my read of season 2 of Arcane so far is that they're trying to fit two (or even three) season's worth of content into these nine episodes. I could be wrong, but that's how it comes across.

What I'm guessing was the original plan was for the first episode to actually be spread across the first three (Act 1). They would spend time introducing the three members of the Enforcer Team so that we-the-audience would understand why Caitlyn is drafting them into her personal strike force. This would in turn give the show time to actually introduce them to us (I still can't get past the fact that they literally still haven't even named two of them yet). We'd see them display some unique skills -- any skills -- and also perhaps show some area of unique bravery or honesty.

These episodes would also give time to show Caitlyn buckling under the grief of losing her mother as an ongoing crushing weight instead of a single breakdown. Vi, seeing Caitlyn falling apart and also seeing her try to "soldier on", could grow to accept joining the Enforcers with the rationale that she's supporting Caitlyn in her time of need. Maybe also with having conversations with the other three people where they talk about 'reforming from within' and 'showing that not all Zaunites are bad' or something else along those lines.

So, at the end of Act 1 we have the scene where Caitlyn stomps into the council chambers and 'takes charge' with her team, and instead of wondering 'Who the hell are these people with her and why the hell is Vi an Enforcer now?' we think 'Ah yes, she's going to Kick Ass and Take Names with this badass crew!"

And then we get to the second three episodes (Act 2) and we see that it's not quite working out that way. We can still have the one year timeskip here, and we see that the Enforcer Team is now jaded and cynical. After a year without any real obvious gains, no end (Because these things never end at the barrel of a gun), they're getting violent with civilians in the Undercity and they're using the Gray as chemical warfare. The bubbly Junior Officer who was going to be the cute team sidekick is instead twitchy and trigger-happy, and the other two are...something (We don't know anything about them so I can't guess what kind of angle the show would have gone with). In essence, they're just another crew of Enforcers kicking around the inhabitants of Zaun.

Hence why Vi has the conversation with Caitlyn where she explicitly discusses how everybody is changing, and she begs Caitlyn to stay herself.

Here they would show Caitlyn unraveling most of all. Over the course of these three episodes we see her obsession with Jinx growing and growing. We see at least one operation where they almost catch her, before she gets away (And the Enforcers know she was there, unlike that sequence where she hid in the Gray and they never realized what was going on). She comes very close to crossing 'the line' several times, and always only just stops herself. So when they manage to corner Jinx in the fight with Sevika, to see her get away again, apparently with Vi's "help", it's the climax to an arc we've been following all along of Caitlyn becoming consumed by her hatred instead of just being fueled by it.

This would have let them lay the groundwork for Caitlyn turning on Vi in a moment of anger, instead of it really coming out of nowhere and just being stupid.

The final three episodes of the season (Act 3) are less clearly divided based on what we've already gotten, but I imagine it would have showed Ambessa's manipulations to set the stage for her coup. Perhaps with Caitlyn being installed as the dictator of Piltover in the final episode to set up season three.

Everything that we've gotten so far in the actual Act 2 probably would have been saved for season three, combined with what's still upcoming in Act 3. Although maybe with some of the Viktor stuff still happening now, spread out here-and-there.

In addition to better pacing and groundwork for these stories, spreading this out would have also given them time to actually show Mel Medarda, who has tragically been sidelined for much of the season. We could also follow whatever adventure Jayce, Ekko, and Heimerdinger are on, instead of presumably having the info backfilled in the upcoming last three episodes.

It really feels like that's what they wanted to do, and are just cutting out all the setup for each plotline so that they can squeeze it into the episode count they have.

[rubidimum]

Okay quick (long) rant on a few things partially related to this

Hear me out. I still love Arcane, season 1 was insanely good and season 2 was still---fairly well done.

But the most frustrating part of it was that Vi and Jinx were the heart and soul of the last season, they were the most compelling relationship, the most compelling thematically, their conflict was THE conflict that drove the show, and a lot of nuanced and interesting dynamics between the other characters existed because of it. And then this season Vi was basically a side character? and Jinx and Vi were just immediately are fine with each other after two minutes? It was a dishonor to both their characters honestly.

Vi's erasure as a main character fucked up Jinx's too, because her character arc got basically reduced to something unfinished-- like they started out this very interesting parallel with Jinx and Isha and Vi and Jinx, that basically got reduced to suprise factor? and then Isha is never mentioned again? They set up this super amazing parallel between Silco/Vander and Vi/Jinx, that basically got a line of dialogue in the mining tunnel and that's it?

AND the Vi/Caitlyn conflict is barely expanded on either. Like Vi just becomes a part of Caitlyn's internal strife--- which goes without really having much resolution at all.

I just found it weird---they kept setting up these interesting dynamics and ideas and then not resolving them properly at all. So many things from last season were just kicked out the door. Don't get me started on Piltover and Zaun.

It's also frustrating, because the characters that we see get more screen time-- Viktor, Jayce, Mel also have, in my opinion, half assed character arcs.

AND, unpopular opinion, something that really annoyed me was that the Ekko centric episode was basically about him being Jinx'/Powder's love interest-- which was barely hinted at or developped beforehand. Ekko was sooo interesting in the first season because his character was centered on the Piltover/Zaun conflict-- which also gets absolutely swept under the rug.

The first season is an absolute work of art because of how it set things up and then resolved them. You understood every action of the characters, you saw everything they experienced, you understood deeply why almost every character did the things they did. It was profoundly difficult to dislike any character because you knew why they did that, why they thought that, and even though a lot of the different character's actions led to tragedy-- you couldn't hate them for it, or at worst you felt conflicted about them. This season characters just kind of did things. Viktor just kind of chooses to leave Jayce, but you don't really get what's going on in his head. You kind of understood why Caitlyn succumbs to Ambessa's manipulations but you didn't really feel for her, because her character in the first season just didn't seem set up enough towards that. It felt unnatural. Why does she start sleeping with Maddie? what lead up to that? they basically just put that there for shock value. Like it makes sense that that would happen, but in the first season we would've gotten more explanation. Nothing Vi ever did really seemed like any kind of crazy culmination of her actions, things just sort of happened to her. Viktor's actions don't really make sense either, he just chooses to do stuff seemingly at random. Jinx is clearly having this intense internal conflict all season but it just wasn't expanded on enough.

I just feel like season 2 did not even begin to live up to everything that the first season was. So many things seemed abandoned and everything seemed unfinished. I don't know.

LMAOAOAOAOOO

[roguelemon]

The thing with arcane s2 leaving so much blank space / rushing through plot points means that people have managed to get VASTLY different takes, certain characters especially, from the exact same source material.

Some people are basing their opinions only on what they saw, shallower interpretation but less 'made up'. However 90% of the all the 'anti-character' or 'pro-character' takes are clearly very reliant on what people thought would have happened in between the gaps.

Cait, for example, as a highly controversial character in a season where the political undertones set up in s1 were so blatantly sidelined, is analysed in so many different ways, and I'm yet to see something that I dont agree with at least part of.

She used Vi for her own gain and her rise to dictator was always going to happen given her terrible opinions of people in Zaun. Vi deserves better than being 'one of the good ones'. True. 100% true this analysis is often backed up by legitimate reasoning, but also assumes that what happened off screen did not involve any internal conflict, did not involve anything of her trying to help Zaun but being pushed by Ambessa to be more harsh than she wanted. It assumes that her character is supposed to reflect the oppressor that is both capable and GLADLY WILLING.

Cait acted poorly because of her trauma and upbringing, she learns, though not in a linear fashion, from her mistakes. Also usually backed up by sensible analysis, however assumes what happened offscreen DID involve more manipulation on Ambessas part, and that the offscreen interactions with Vi both pre and post dictatorship were more supportive and understanding than what we saw on screen. An interesting thing I myself thought is, we never find out what Cait does between the end of the fight and the council being reinstated, maybe there's more going on than offering Sevika a (performative and clearly frowned upon) seat at the table. Again, what she did in this mid period could be both '"cait is a bigoted opressor' or 'cait doesn't understand her privelage, but at least now shes TRYING.' In this, she is capable due to her weak moral compass and status, but not gladly willing to cause harm.

Season 2 being so rushed means that almost all of the scenes we see are characters in high pressure scenarios, they are reduced to their worst and most desperate often out of no fault of their own. There is as much reason in saying certain characters are awful people as there is in saying they did awful things but can be better.

S2 is a skeleton of a show, it's what you think happened in the flesh of it all that will affect your view of the characters both as individuals and their relationships.

Next time you see somebody and think 'they've mischaracterised my blorbo' or 'he would NOT fucking say that'. Consider that your blorbo is barley a fully functioning character and that the character you think they are is affected by your OPINION as much as it is fact.

Terrible takes exist, especially when a show gets this popular, but can you really call it a terrible take when the 'good takes' use as much assumption to gapfill as the 'bad' ones?

I have my own takes on the main characters, but I ENJOY seeing ones I completely disagree with because seeing other people thought processes is INTERESTING AS FUCK. We were given the same barebones, stripped down season 2 and we both imagined what could have been in different ways, that's cool.

I have more examples, and more I'd like to talk about but that's aside from the main point of this. Provided you haven't just pulled something out of nowhere and decided to ignore what DID actually happen in the show, your takes and theories are as good as anyone's else's.

[avelera]

What's your take on Jaymel? I've tried understanding and appreciating the pairing, but always end up coming short when I do. Nothing about them seems natural

When Mel first ropes Jayce into the council he gets so close to calling her out for her ways, then almost immediately does a 180 after talking to Amara, flirts with her, then acts surprised and hesitates when she comes onto him.

Mel pressures him to weaponize hextech, but then acts horrified when Jayce gets the same ideals in his head and wants to attack Zaun with their arsenal

There's more that's frustrating and confusing to me, but a lot of it just seems like Mel saw Jayce as a pawn until her mother showed up and then felt guilty he was exposed to Ambessa, and felt forced to protect him as a result

Jayce/Mel is interesting to me because it's a very complex, adult relationship the likes of which you don't always get to see even in live action prestige TV. In that they have come together over politics/manipulation and some attraction, grow closer, part ways to embark on their own adventures and growth, and reunite to hash out their grievances and then part ways amicably.

I think there are a few things that need to be factored into a fair reading of Mel/Jayce.

Mel was initially conceived of as a villain. Or, at the very least, as an antagonist in what I think was meant to be a much more generic story about Jayce being pulled between science/Viktor (his good side) and politics/Mel in a standard corruption story. The bones of that plotline are still there but I'm so, so relieved they made it more complex.

They made it more complex by making Mel a good person with complex motives of her own. She's not just a swanning villain helping the boys break in for selfish ends. She's not even promoting Hextech weaponry for purely selfish reasons, it's entirely practical to pursue given the circumstances (and an oversight by the boys that they didn't recognize the potential if they're against it maybe don't start with CRUSHING GAUNTLETS and a LASER BEAM).

They made Mel the pursuer, which works in a simpler story, but then she seems 1) taken aback by Jayce's physical affection the next day 2) slowly warming to him.

I'd also argue that while I think she always had sex with Jayce on the table as a manipulation tactic, the moment she goes for it is I think based on genuine attraction, when he expresses a desire to help others and she realizes how different he is from the warmongers of her family and home country of Noxus. She is genuinely charmed by him there when she makes her move.

But with all apologies to sincere MelJay shippers, those two were never the fairytale. I mean, do think there's a potential universe where they settle down to be a political power couple with astonishingly unfair good looks, but I think Mel was never seeing him as a long term prospect and Jayce, in my opinion, was actually an innocent who was genuinely responding to someone flirting with him and taking an interest. He's shocked when she kisses him, then clearly thinks about it a bit (IMO, reassessing if he has a chance with Viktor and sadly coming to the conclusion that he doesn't, Viktor isn't interested) so figures, why not? She's beautiful and interested and smart. Maybe they're not forever perfect or long term compatible (I think domestic Mel/Jayce would have led to Jayce driving her crazy with science talk in 2.5 weeks at most, and vice versa with her sincere interest in politics boring Jayce to death), but they can be Mr/Ms Right Now to each other and strengthen their political alliance too.

As for the actual beats of their story: yeah, Mel was manipulating Jayce at first. I wrote a longer meta about why that justifies him breaking up with her later. That manipulation is why they can't be together long term, because once Jayce gets wise to it in the cave, he's furious, and hurt, and he's lost all trust in her even though there's still some affection and care for her as a person. She's not bad but she did hurt him irrevocably with her actions.

I also saw a rather nice point that they're kind of living the relationship in reverse from each other, which is a tragedy. Jayce warms to her right away and then comes around to the fact there was manipulation at play. Mel starts out with intent to manipulate and then slowly warms to him. So when they both come back from their respective ordeals, Mel is looking for comfort from a person she cares for while Jayce has reassessed her role in his personal tragedy of Hextech and is ready for a fight. He eventually realizes it's not all her fault, he and Viktor are to blame too, but the relationship is over.

I hope this addresses your question at least a little?? Thanks for the chance to ramble!

[sapphiresaphics]

Alright let’s do this:

1. Episode 7 provides us with CONTEXT for why Jayce did what he did and what Ekko needs to do going forward. Ekko wouldn’t be able to save Jinx from committing suicide if he didn’t have that experience in the AU world where he was able to see what life could’ve been like. Not only is it a nice bit of character growth for a character that’s been missing in action for a while, but it also gives us the viewers a chance to catch our breath and see the potential two outcomes to the upcoming battle. It’s also where Ekko finally develops his time travel device from the games. Saying it “didn’t do much for the story” is deeply under appreciating its significance.

2. The detour with Vander coming back serves multiple purposes. It sets up the maguffin needed to push Viktor into abandoning his humanity. It allows Jinx and Vi to reconnect. It’s a visual metaphors for the theme of the show in how the cycle of violence hurts those we love. It’s the catalyst that pushes Caitlyn to betray Ambessa and to see Jinx as a person once again. It helps push Jinx towards her decision to leave in the end.

Also what’s this about how they were naturally healing as sisters already? That’s not true. They only start to come back together when Jinx reaches out to Vi to find Vander. Prior to Vander re-surfacing there was NO attempt on either to reconnect or heal. So that’s just a weird interpretation of the events.

3. This assertion never made sense to me. Vi is PIVOTAL to the entire story, and outside of being absent in episode 4 and 7, she’s still one of the main focuses for the story.

4. I’ve written about this hundreds of times already but the short and dirty version is that Caitlyn shows she regrets what she’s doing from Episode 3 onward. It’s shown in her expressions, her actions, and her mannerisms. In episode 8 she has a verbal tantrum that shows she knows very much that what she’s done is terrible. And from that moment onward she tries to fix things with her actions. I do not understand why people think she doesn’t do anything to atone for her crimes, and I do not understand why people think her crimes are glossed over and ignored. They are NOT. You don’t need a “subplot” to address these things, as Vi does so directly in episode 8.

It’s also not a detour? It’s central to the overall theme of the cycle of violence. Caitlyn is caught up in the cycle of violence. Her grief and rage and frustration at not catching Jinx causes her to do terrible things. And her decisions in episode 6 and 8 to betray Ambessa and to work towards resolving her anger and hate is a HIGE PART of the overall theme to the show! It’s showing her choosing to step away and let the hate go. It’s showing her choosing love over violence and suffering.

5. I genuinely don’t understand what people are confused about with the black rose stuff. They’re mages who use illusion and deception to manipulate people. Ambessa tries to subvert them and ends up pissing them off to such a degree they kill her son in retaliation. So she comes to Piltover to use Mel’s connections with Hextech to devise a weapon she can use to destroy them and save herself from accountability. How is that incomprehensible? Seems pretty straightforward to me. All the black rose stuff is is basically context for why Ambessa is behaving the way she is. You don’t need to know much beyond that, and it’s probably going to be expanded upon in a later show anyway.

6. This is such a weird complaint. Silco tells the audience what the theme of the show is, and you’re annoyed? I mean, the fact that you’re confused about what it has to do with the big battle in the end kinda proves that it WAS needed cuz you clearly don’t see the connection.

The cycle of violence starts with “you did this to me, so I will do this to you” and it keeps growing and growing over the course of the 2 seasons. Starting from a break in that goes wrong, up until the final big robot battle. Every step of the way there are chances to end things, but people are stuck in their emotional state and can’t break free. That’s what Viktor was trying to stop, but he went about it in the worst possible way. The big robot battle is a warning. A sign of what can happen if they don’t change their ways.

———

It really bothers me when people say “this plot point happened for no reason” because that’s just not true. For a show like this where they put so much time and energy into every single shot, nothing is done “for no reason.” EVERYTHING has a reason. If something seems off to you you should stop and think about why they could choose to do the things they did rather than dismiss everything as happening “for no reason.”

I agree. There are some structural issues with season 2. But I can at least see why they likely chose to go those routes for the things they want to tell. And when I don’t understand something I try to figure it out.

What's fascinating to me is that for a show where showrunners knew they had only one season left to wrap everything up, Arcane S2 feels filled with weird decisions.

EP7 as appreciated as it was, feels like a weird bottle episode that doesn't do much of anything for the overall story. It's the type of episode I could see in a longer show where it wasn't its final season, but here? Weird.

What does the detour with Vander and bringing him back add to the story exactly? It wasn't used to give Vi development or drama, nor was it used for Jinx. Sure, you could say it was something done to quickly resolve the sisters' feud, but that was already in the works naturally, and there was no need for an entire subplot that dumps a TON of new worldbuilding upon the show that has barely any time left to handle the worldbuilding it already got.

You'd think the final season would have key characters, like Vi, play the pivotal role and develop and grow, but Vi is sidelined for most of the show, despite her characterization being crucial in landing the conclusion of the two sisters subplot.

Caitlyn's classist dictator time feels like literal padding too—there's no follow-up or subplot where Vi has to make her see the reality of her actions or any subplot or characterization where the two reconcile. This subplot would make sense in a show where the class conflict and the possible civil war were front-and-center plot threads, but Arcane S2 is not that show—it refuses to touch upon the core themes Season One established. In fact, the show ends up completely ignoring what she did, so why is the plotline there then?

There are just a lot of additions that do the opposite of resolving plot threads or giving the time needed for the conclusion—everything to do with Noxous, the nigh incomprehensible Black Rose stuff, all the new side characters that appear and then disappear having done nothing, etc. You'd think for THE finale of their story, the writers would condense and connect the plot threads together toward the conclusion, but S2 spends a lot of time doing the opposite for no reason.

The final stretch has Silco basically speaking to the audience, telling them nothing new and just rehashing what's already been shown. What was the point of that? Is it insecurity from the writers that the audience might not have gotten what was being said? And what's more, how does that connect to the whole "main story" of S2 which is the machine god stuff? The monologue, as anvilicious and needless as it is, makes sense in a show about the cycle of violence and human nature, but Arcane Season Two is not that show—it's a show about how The Rich and The Poor will team-up for the common purpose of facing outside enemies, be it the non-descript Evil Country From Afar or Magical Zombies. So why were the writing staff so desperate to get the point "Silco" makes across as to literally break even the basic sense of show-not-tell?

The more I think, the weirder the structure of S2 is.

[linddzz]

Oohh yeah for sure that's why I can't really see Viktor and Mel being together in the hypothetical polycule. He's absolutely got reasons to not like her in canon. It's fair to assume that Mel is the mind behind all the Man Of Progress branding for Jayce, and she likely was all too happy that the less marketable Viktor did not want any extra attention on him. She iced him out of the public image so hard that Ambessa didn't seem to realize she could be looking for a Hextech scientist besides Jayce. The scene where she's trying to propose Hextech weapons always gets me because of how very clearly she's talking over Viktor's head.

Also a lot of the more supportive and kind Mel we see at the end of Season1 and into Season2 is, I think, a result of Jayce being far more sincere and sweet than she anticipated, bringing out more emotional vulnerability in having to face how much she's manipulating this person she was coming to actually care for, packed on by Ambessa's arrival forcing her to see the more brutally direct side of how she uses people and undermining how she likely told herself that she was working for everyone's benefit. (She's still got a bit of that mindset in Season2! When Jayce confronts her about using him and Viktor, she doesn't deny it at all but she also seems taken aback that her calling them investments could be insulting).

Viktor hasn't seen any of that. He's only seen years of her using the man of tomorrow image to get the hexgates that her and the other Piltovan elites wanted. Then she manipulated Jayce out of where he belongs is at his strongest, doing science with Viktor. Her sleeping with Jayce really would be just the final icing decoration at that point.

The jealousy may be insanely one sided to an almost comical degree, but he has reasons to not like her.

I love the theory of JayMelVik. They could be the ultimate power throuple and man Mel would be so good in there. She's already so supportive of her boytoy's weird codependent thing with his lab partner (tbh she's probably like "I didn't realize this was a package deal but I also did not realize that the boytoy Himbo I wanted to politically manipulate is a needy puppy so... sure") Checking in to see how Viktor is doing in the hexcore goo. "He'll come back to us."

It's all there ok! Season2 showed me the wonder that could be Mel going "This is my boyfriend Jayce and this is Jayce's soulmate, Viktor. Jayce and I make out and Viktor and I are frienemies for reasons that don't have anything to do with Jayce and more to do with Viktor's opinions of politicians."

Unfortunately Season 2 also absolutely torpedoed my ability to see Viktor being ok with this. Holy shit this look he shoots between Mel and Jayce when she interrupts them. Holy shit Viktor

This is the angriest he looks in his entire actual villain arc. This is the most murderous he looks. He looks like he just found his man cheating and he's going "actually maybe I will straight up kill his ass" (Viktor she interrupted because you were literally choking him out what is wrong with you)

I think it even goes deeper than just sexual jealousy. I think that codependent nerd labeled her a homewrecker when she made Jayce a councilor and in doing so committed the heinous crime of having Jayce do things outside of the lab more. She took Jayce's attention. She took Jayce's mental energy off the work. The dream. Their dream. At that point banging Jayce was just the sprinkles on top.

But then when I go "I don't think there was as much sexual/romantic jealousy" I remember this. Viktor...my guy...

And it's so one sided. It's so one sided he's so petty with it. Mel is so supportive! she's already viewing them as a pair of brilliant minds! She figured out quick that Jayce comes as a package deal!!

She comes in to ask how he's doing and help support Jayce. she says "he'll come back to us" and worries about what the hexcore is doing to him. and Viktor's stupid little cocoon tries to bite her!! yeah it's likely a reaction to her own latent arcane ability but my take is funnier

He's so petty!! Uncalled for!!! Viktor please you are killing what could be the baddest hottest power triad in Runeterra!

[ex-vespidae]

on another note I absolutely love love love Caitlyn's character its so good especially this season. cause you know her mother dies at the attack at the end of season 1. She's clearly having to deal with intense grief and loss due to that and the fact was she could've stopped it. At the end of season 1 if she had shot Jinx when she got the jump on her mother wouldn't have died. But she stopped because she cared for Vi. Which eventually leads to Jinx blowing up the council.

So she probably has some internalised guilt from the event as well, which maybe she could've been fine if it was just the attack on the council but then there was the attack on the memorial as well. It's this constant cycle of violence. And then she finally snaps and puts all her rage and grief into finding and killing Jinx by any means necessary.

And that by any means necessary is the most important part since it where Caitlyn and Vi breakup lmao. Also there's the line where Vi says "Why are you the one acting like her?!" and shit fuck i like that so much. She's falling so far that she's becoming something that she will hate. and Caitlyn is just so mad and angry so she hits Bi with the end of her rifle, and after Vi falls to the floor crying, because yes her girlfriend did in fact change, there's this look on Caitlyn's face it looks very angry though just for a split second before she turns away her face almost softens? like a sudden thought of like fuck this is bad.

and then she gets I would say elected commander general when Ambessa says to enact martial law, but she really doesn't get elected as much as Ambessa just chooses her. But the choice makes sense especially if she wants a war to create a distraction for whatever she wants. and unfortunately Caitlyn is in the perfect position for manipulation, with personal stakes and also being driven by that anger and grief oh and also the breakup so I'm really excited how they'll continue with this...

also the cape is fucking amazing 10/10 not for symbolic reasons its just pretty lmao (there probably is symbolism there i just can't put it together yet)

ooohhhh watched act 1(??? id ont actually know how it works) of season 2 of Arcane and oh my god 1: pretty as fuck the show looks as incredible as season 1 (maybe better?) 2: oughhh the writing.... its really good...

honestly don't know what else to say show is great can't wait till next Saturday(?) i think its saturday