#like helen or aphrodite or someone

[bananonbinary]

a weird association ive started making is terfs and old ass greek poetry. that sounds insane but it's because when i find a blog i suspect is transphobic, i naturally search it for the term "trans," and the only thing that comes up is dozens of lines of poetry or theater or literature that have been translated and thus have a little (trans [author]) note at the end.

the weird thing is, its like. a LOT of poetry. like wayyy more than you'd usually expect to see, even on an aesthetic blog. and before anyone comes in saying its a lesbian thing, no it's not all sappho fragments either. its just...tons of really really horny but really generic like single lines from random-ass greek plays like "her lips were honey" or something with no other context or commentary.

and like, obviously an interest in greek poetry/literature isn't an actual red flag; it's a perfectly normal thing to like. but it reminds me of those guys that are REALLY into the roman empire, but in a really boring and ahistorical way where they wax poetic about an imagined utopia where everyone was exactly the way they want them to be. men were masculine and women were submissive and everyone was white.

and i just feel like, without actually saying it directly, terfs tend to do the same thing. in some mythological past that only existed between lines of fictional dialogue here and there, women were all cherished (but weirdly hyper-sexualized) tradwives, and men and trans people never interacted with them ever.

[theoi-crow]

The humans in Greek Mythology are the mega rich and powerful:

In my college classes people are often shocked when I tell them my favorite part of Greek mythology is the gods themselves and I'm not a big fan of the humans.

99% of my classmates prefer the humans in mythos, especially the ones that stick it to the gods like Sisyphus and feel bad for humans like Kassandra and Helen who have been wronged by the gods because "they're just like us." My classmates and teachers hate the gods and don't understand why anyone in modern times would want to worship such violent and selfish beings whenever I point out there are still people who worship them. They hold onto the idea that people in mythology embody the human experience of being oppressed by terrible gods and fate and we should feel bad for them because "they're human just like us" but they forget that the people in Greek Mythology are NOT just like us. They are more relatable to medieval royalty, colonizers and ultra rich politicians who make laws and decisions on wars and the fates of others, especially the poor and the very vulnerable.

Every hero or important human in Greek Mythology is either some form of royalty or mega rich politician/priest-priestess (of course this is with the exception of people who are explicitly stated to be poor like the old married couple in the myth where Zeus and Hermes pretend to be panhandlers). All of them have an ancient Greek lifestyle more relatable to Vladimir Putin, Donald Trump, and especially to British royalty during the British empire, than the average person.

All of them.

Odysseus, Patroclus, Theseus, Helen of Troy, Kassandra, Diomedes, Agamemnon, Perseus, Hercules, Aeneas, Paris, Any human who has a divine parent or is related to one, etc. Although sometimes the story omits it, it is heavily implied that these are people who own hundreds or even thousands of slaves, very poor farmers and the tiny barely there working class as royal subjects.

They are the ones who make laws and whose decisions massively affect the fates of so many people. So no, they can't just be forgiven for some little whim, because that little whim affects the literal lives of everyone under their rule. By being spoiled they've just risked the lives of thousands of people and possibly even gotten them killed like when Odysseus' audacity got every single slave and soldier in his ships killed or when Patroclus as a kid got upset and killed another kid for beating him at a game. (A normal person wouldn't kill another person just for winning a game but royalty and those who think they're above the law do it all the time, plus the class status of the child wasn't mentioned but the way he didn't think he'd get in trouble implies the kid was of lower class, possibly the child of a slave or a foreign merchant.)

The gods get a bad reputation for punishing the humans in mythology but, if not them, who else is going to keep them accountable when they are the law?

And whose to say the humans beneath them weren't praying to the gods in order to keep their masters in check?

Apollo is the god in charge of freeing slaves, Zeus is the god of refugees, immigrants and homeless people, Ares is the protector of women, Artemis protects children, Aphrodite is the goddess of the LGBT community, Hephaestus takes care of the disabled, etc. It wouldn't be surprising if the gods are punishing the ultra rich and powerful in these myths because the humans under their rulership prayed and sent them as they did historically.

Every time someone asks me if I feel bad for a human character in a myth, I think about the many lives affected by the decision that one human character made and if I'm being completely honest, I too would pray to the gods and ask them to please punish them so they can make more careful decisions in the future because:

They are not just like us.

We are the farmers, a lot of our ancestors were slaves, we are the vulnerable being eaten by capitalism and destroyed by the violence colonialism created. We are the poor subjects that can only pray and hope the gods will come and correct whatever selfish behavior the royal house and mega rich politicians are doing above us.

And that's why I pray to the gods, because in modern times I'm dealing with modern Agamemnons who would kill whatever family members they have to in order to reach their end goal, I'm dealing with everyday modern Achilles who would rather see their own side die because they couldn't keep their favorite toy and would gladly watch their subjects die if it means they eventually get their way. The ones that let capitalism eat their country and it's citizens alive so long as it makes them more money. These are our modern "demigods," politicians who swear they are so close to God that they know what he wants and so they pass laws that benefit only them and claim these laws are ordained by God due to their close connection just like how Achilles can speak to the gods because of his demigod status via his mother.

Look at the news, these are humans that would be mythical characters getting punished by Greek gods which is why anything Greco-Roman is jealousy guarded by the rich and powerful and is inaccessible to modern worshippers because Ivy League schools like Harvard and Cambridge make sure to keep it that way. That's what we're dealing with. These are the humans these mythical beings would be because:

In our modern times the humans in mythos would be the politicians and mega rich that are currently ruining our society and trying to turn it into a world where only the rich can manipulate wars and laws, just like they do in mythology.

Fuck them.

I literally have so much more to add about my disdain for them and I didn't even touch on the obvious ancient Greek propaganda.

[aphroditelovesu]

Yan!Percy Jackson love letter to Reader who is a daughter of Aphrodite? Pls 🥹❤️

My beloved,

I write these words with an open heart and my thoughts immersed in memories that have only become brighter since I met you. From the moment our paths crossed at Camp Half-Blood, my life changed in ways I never imagined.

Your smile, so full of grace and charm, brightens even the darkest days. Your eyes reflect the beauty of the world in a way that makes me realize that there is always more magic around us than our eyes can capture. Your courage and determination are an inspiration to me, they make me want to be someone better, to be better for you.

You are like a gentle song amidst the chaos, bringing calm to my troubled world. In every battle we fight together, your presence is my lighthouse, my strength to keep fighting. And in the quiet moments, it's the comfort of your presence that makes me feel at home.

I can't help but feel every day that your beauty could be the cause of wars between gods. Maybe like Helen of Troy, but you are a thousand times more beautiful. As if my heart were imprisoned by invisible chains, bound only to you. The way your hair dances with the wind, the way your gaze reflects the very essence of love, takes my breath away.

Know that this affection is more than a simple passion. It's as if my soul is entwined with yours, impossible to separate. I promise to protect you, whatever the cost, even if I have to face the entire Olympus to do so. No demigod, no god or titan could stop the intensity of my love for you.

If someone tries to steal your attention, your eyes, your essence, I will be there, guarding you like a unique treasure. Even if I have to pass through the very gates of Hades to ensure your safety, I will do so. I love you, always remember that.

With eternal love,

Percy Jackson.

[protagaster]

Hi, I don’t know if someone has asked this already but I just wanted to know how everything started in you au?

Why is Penelope the one fighting in war while her husband is at home?

I know is a warrior!penelope au but i would like to know how that works in your story?

I also really like your take in the au it’s so cool!

Hello my friend! Thank you so much for taking the time to ask about the details regarding the AU :)! It makes me very happy to see you interested!

It's recounted with a bit more detail in the prequel (titled 'A King with no Queen') but here is the main gist of it.

Buckle up, it's gonna be quite a ride:

First things first, everything starts off exactly the same as it does in the Iliad. Paris chooses Aphrodite as the most beautiful of the Goddess', leading to Aphrodite taking Helen away from her home and husband (Menelaus) and forcing the mortal woman to be with Paris. From there, just as it goes in Homer's tale, Menelaus and Agamemnon force all of Helen's past suitors to fight with them in the war against Troy; this is because of an oath Odysseus himself proposed in order to keep the peace regardless of who Helen chose to be her husband, quote: "all the suitors should swear a most solemn oath to defend the chosen husband against whoever should quarrel with him".

Everything progresses as it does, with all of our favorite Greek heroes, including Odysseus, fighting in the war. This is where things begin to swerve for the AU.

That first year of war the men actually succeed in sneaking Helen out of Troy's palace thanks to their cunning and spies. They place her on a tiny ship that would sail her back to Sparta as quickly as possible and spend the night celebrating in their hidden camps without a care in the world. Unfortunately, the Trojans were quick to notice Helen's disappearance. While they were unable to keep her from leaving Troy, they decided to settle their seething anger with the next best thing. That night, while the Greek armies were full and drunk with merriment, the Trojans sneak into their camps thanks to the information provided by their [the Trojans] own spies. Right then and there the Trojans attacks.

This leads to the Greek men getting horribly injured, to the point where almost all of them are no longer fit for war. In exchange for Helen, the Trojan armies kidnap most of the Greek heroes (Menelaus, Agamemnon, Diomedes, just to name a few) and keep them alive as a warning and form of ransom against Greece and the Gods who support them. Odysseus, who was speared horribly in his shoulder, was spared from capture only thanks to the relentlessness of his Ithacan men.

Only a small handful of men are both spared from injury and allowed to continue to fight (Achilles and Patroclus to name a couple, that detail is just for you @somereaderinblue). The rest, by order of the Gods themselves, are forced to return home as they are no longer of use for combat.

Odysseus, Eurylochus, and the rest of the Ithacan army that was drafted return to Ithaca. Despite the damage they have received, things look hopeful and the future appears to be bright.

However, Greece still needs an army.

This is a timeline where, by Hera's orders, the Gods slowly work to give the women of Greece more autonomy by allowing them to partake in activities one thought to be only for men. Two of the Gods working hardest to meet this goal are Ares and Artemis, who have collaborated to teach women the art of combat and bearing arms.

Ares, who has never been in his parent's good graces, is in extra trouble now due to agreeing to support the Greeks on Hera's request but then turning around and supporting the Trojans upon Aphrodite's say. Hera declares that the only way to make it up to her is by drafting his eligible female warriors (those of age and with enough skill and experience to survive) to fight in the men's stead.

This includes Penelope, who had passed his trial back when she was still a young Spartan Princess and in turn became Ares' personal pupil (look at Warrior of the Heart if you would like more details). With a combination of Ares' order and Helen's plea, who feels the war is all her fault and wants to learn to fight in order to save her husband, Penelope is forced to leave behind Ody and Tele (a girl in mine and Blue's AU) in order to fulfill her duty.

That's how our version of the Warrior Penelope AU came to be! I'm sure you all know what happens from there ;)

P.S - Here are a few fun facts, not at all relevant to the AU, but still I wanna share em:

Hermione, Helen and Menelaus' daughter, actually snuck herself onto her mother's warship in order to join them in saving her father

The only reason Clytemnestra agrees to save Agamemnon is to kill him herself once they return home, since he still sacrificed their daughter before he and his men headed off for war

Patroclus was surprised when he saw Penelope for the first time. After how much Ody spoke of her, Patroclus had assumed for a time that she was a mere fiction of his imagination, a coping mechanism to keep himself sane (thank Blue for this one!)

On #3's note, Patroclus, Helen, Clytemnestra, and the rest of the Greek army immediately saw the similarities between Penny and Ody when Penny refused to shut up about how amazing her husband is and how much she longed to see him again

[sarafangirlart]

Did Kaos even explain why the three humans “destined to destroy Zeus/the Gods” are specifically Eurydice, Caeneus and Ariadne? Because if they really wanted a “we hate the gods” story shouldn’t the chosen three be. severely wronged or abandoned by the gods / the fates?

Like Oedipus? Lamia? Cassandra? Daphne? Arachne? Callisto? Hell I’d even watch a smackdown of Clytemnestra vs Artemis or Menelaus and Helen vs Aphrodite any time then watch a whole other boring show following the same bad story tropes.

They don’t really explain it no, but I was so eager for it to be over I likely missed it, this show seems surprising hesitant to show the more gruesome side of mythology, if they adapted the story that Caeneus was raped by Poseidon and they show how angry and miserable he is about it I would’ve totally been on board, tho someone mentioned that considering the current social environment is especially hostile towards trans ppl nowadays, having someone transition after assault could be bad “pr” so to speak, tho I don’t think we should bend a knee to transphobes/terfs and make representation that’s more palatable and presentable, human experience is messy and we shouldn’t shy away from that in an attempt to make bigots less hostile towards minorities bc they will always be hostile.

If they show Eurydice being angry about Aristaeus not facing any consequences for trying to assault her I’d understand that too mythology Eurydice has zero beef with Hera, but she could feel resentment towards Aristaeus and by extension Apollo (since he’d likely defend his son), gods rarely face consequences for assaulting mortals, Euripides’s Ion tackles that subject way better than all of these “Gods bad” modern retelling (tho I wish Creusa didn’t forgive Apollo bc that mf didn’t even have the balls to show his face).

Instead of Ariadne, who usually gets a happy ending and becomes a goddess herself, how about going with Apemosyne? Another Cretan princess. Her story is extremely depressing, she’s screwed over by a god and her own family, considering that half the show takes place in the underworld she’d fit right in. Considering she’ll be ��coworkers” with Hermes it would especially suck for her. But considering that Dionysus is made to be one of the “good ones” even tho in mythology he brainwashed women into slaughtering their families, they’d probably portray Hermes as such too, since he’s usually simply the comic relief in adaptations anyway.

That’s another thing, they water down the gods who are supposed to be good guys and make the “bad guy” worse, in this version Hades never kidnapped Persephone that’s just propaganda in universe. The Fates and Furies are goddesses but in this show they’re against the gods bc of that meander water thing? Don’t they drink it too?

I think they realized that their hesitancy means that they won’t be showing us bad things the gods actually did and so they make up random bullshit like Hera owning tongueless priestesses and Zeus killing a kitten. Cassandra is in the show but she’s more of an exposition machine tho it’s hinted she’ll play a bigger role in season 2, but why couldn’t she be one of the three humans destined to destroy Zeus? Why aren’t any of the Trojans destined to destroy Zeus? Why do they have to be saved by Greeks? Sure Zeus in mythology had a soft spot for them but he still planned the destruction of their city (could be a decent metaphor for an abuser who says that they love their victim while still abusing them imo) but Kaos Zeus doesn’t have that goodwill towards the Trojans so why not have them rightfully take him down? In the final episode Andromache and Ariadne team up and agree to fight against Olympus, tho that reminds me of Acrisius in the Clash of the Titans remake being more of a dumb dumb than he is in the myths and started a war against Mount Olympus only to unsurprisingly fail.

I really dislike how the Trojans are portrayed in the show, clearly they are supposed to be allegory for modern middle eastern refugees in Europe yet all the main Trojan characters are played by white actors. They have such a racially diverse cast but they seem uninterested in actually representing the diversity of the Mediterranean and mythology as a whole.

[hermesmoly]

rate all the greek mytho married couples from most to least interesting (or your favorite to least favorite, depends on you!)

For fun I’ve split them into four categories:

The Really Interesting category, made their relationship everyone’s problem:

- Zeus and Hera (duh)

- Helen and Menelaus (happy ending)

- Helen and Paris (oof! ending)

- Odysseus and Penelope (has a whole word dedicated to their like-minded thinking)

- Rhea and Cronus (tragedy and cannibalism)

- Jason and Medea (tragedy and filicide)

- Clytemnestra and Agamemnon (tragedy and filicide and mariticide and matricide and misogyny and and OH gods-)

- Peleus and Thetis (the arranged mortal marriage blues, but in my head Thetis immortalized Peleus somehow by force and keeps him in her attic) (Because gods be damned if she will be the only one doomed to grieve Achilles)

- Orpheus and Eurydice (mf really went to hell for her and still didn’t get her back :<)

- Hector and Andromache (relatively the most normal ones in this category but still very tragic. Like don’t even ask.)

- Hecuba and Priam (them too)

The Really Cute couple category, bonus if it took them long to get there:

- Hephaestus and Aglaia

- Eros and Psyche

- Dionysus and Ariadne

- Perseus and Andromeda (they kinda remind me of Prince Philip and Aurora which is cute)

- Hebe and Heracles (listennn. they’re cute and important to the Heracles-Hera feud ending)

- Hippomenes and Atalanta (RIP Meleager)

- Philemon and Baucis (one of my fave Zeus myths)

- Alcestis and Admetus (Orpheus and Eurydice but with a happy ending thanks to the interference of Apollo)

- Iphis and Ianthe (trans man rep is good someone PLEASE write about them)

- Tethys and Oceanus (placing them here idc they are cute in my head!! The only titan couple who survived rip to Coeus/Phoebe and all the failed marriages thanks to the Titanomachy)

The Uhhh… Okay Category

- Hades and Persephone (placing them here because while I do think their relationship is interesting AND I find good various retellings of them (excluding LO) like Hades Supergiant, Hadestown, etc I long for more neutral/nuanced takes on the kidnapping, not just by their romance (or lack of romance) but Demeter’s role in the story to be more respected. (It also can’t be helped that HxP has the most over saturated greek mythology content everywhere that people get tired of seeing them, especially portrayed as the “only good greek myth couple” like okay get outta here)

- Gaia and Uranus (I like them, their relationship is clearly important for Cronus’ succession story, but their conflict to me seems so.. short lived? Like you have your son castrate your husband for imprisoning your less appealing babies but now the strife is gone and you work together to tell your son he is destined to be overthrown by his son and telling your grandson to cannibalize his wife as good advice??? Like good for them ig but Rhea and Cronus just do it better imo)

- Hypnos and Pasithea (getting ur wife from a deal with her mom that makes you commit treason by inducing your king with sleep… nothing sketchy about this at allll) (but maybe they’re cute and functional besides that who knows)

- Ceyx and Alcyone (in one version they didn’t do it, in the other they’re just… very dumb to call themselves Zeus and Hera.)

- Procris and Cephalus (eos RUINS lives)

- Hephaestus and Aphrodite (lets be glad it ended bc while they are interesting and Hephaestus did make their marital strife public, I just think they had a better relationship after the divorce)

The Kinda Boring category (to me, subjectively, put down the pitchforks)

- Poseidon and Amphitrite (do they have one myth together that isn’t the Delphin seduction myth… Amphitrite is nice to Poseidon’s worst son. That’s. That’s kinda it. I wish we had more, like how they are with their children or literally anything else to depict a dynamic between them. Especially since they ARE supposed to be the king and queen of the sea. But nope. At least with Oceanus and Tethys they’re both obscure in their personalities so headcanoning stuff is fun to me. Poseidon having a well established personality and Amphitrite… oh dear Amphitrite…)

- Cadmus and Harmonia (they’re a couple in order become ascendants of more tragic humans like Actaeon, Semele and that’s it. They become Snakes in the end to repent for Cadmus’ mistake. Nothing really about their relationship with each other)

- Deucalion and Pyrrha (The Greek rendition of Christianity’s Noah’s Ark and yeah. Thats it)

[littlesparklight]

What do you think is Helens most important moment in the Iliad, characterisation wise?

Hmm!

I think it'd be her scene with Aphrodite, if it's possible to pick out a single one at all. It's got a little bit of everything, with the additional bonus of this being in front of someone Helen has no reason not to be honest/mask off with.

She pays for that, yes, but that's part of my reason to pick this scene; Helen still lashes out. This is Helen in the (end of the?) ninth year of the war, and this is Helen still full of fight (she is with Paris, too, which is a similar honesty to the one in Aphrodite's scene).

We've got; "and stirred Helen's heart in her breast;" I'm borrowing Murray's translation (on Perseus.tuft) instead of Butler's or Caroline Alexander's, because both of those insert "anger" in Helen's reaction. I am fully convinced by Kirk's argument in his commentary on the Iliad that it's not about anger; the phrase is formular, as he says, and everywhere else where it appears in full it merely incites the individual to action.

So, Helen and her [unspecified] reaction to Aphrodite's description of Paris, which is meant to be, as Helen herself says, to be "seductive". Allegory has this scene be Helen fighting against her own desires, with the desires winning. I don't like leaning into allegory so much as to remove the gods, but given Helen's initial reaction quoted up there, I feel what we have is a display of Helen's conflicted desire. She doesn't like Paris much any more, but he is still attractive to her and she wants him. (And in the end, desire wins, even if she's ashamed of that.)

"since now Menelaos has vanquished godlike Alexandros and desires that I, loathsome as I am, be taken home." (Alexander's translation) Everywhere else we see Helen self-blame or express a negative opinion of herself, it's in front of people where, even if she absolutely is earnest and honest about that self-blame, it gives her some sort of social capital; pity, sympathy, and ultimately Priam and Hektor's [continued] protection/friendship. With Aphrodite, however, there's no such advantage. Aphrodite has no reason to care - in fact, Helen debasing herself like this in front of her could probably even be counter-productive.

So, since I in general do view her self-blame and related emotions as genuine, this, to me, is the absolute proof of that. It's also a connection to her active language about how she left Sparta elsewhere (she uses "I went/walked/left/sailed"). She did something, acted, and she [now/since a while back/etc] considers that a fault of hers and something she did wrong. Another thread on Helen's past (and continued) desire for Paris.

(Also, peep the "godlike Alexandros" there - Menelaos uses this once of Paris as well when he talks about him. It's generic "godlike"; in Book 24 she uses theoeides, which focuses more on his looks specifically.)

"As for me, I will not go there - it would be shameful - to share the bed of that man. The Trojan women will all blame me afterwards;" (Alexander again) I've read an article (pretty sure it was Nancy Worman's Body As Argument), that suggests that this is a matter of "it would be shameful NOW", because this conversation is happening after Paris and Menelaos' duel, in which Menelaos (technically) won, and thus Helen (technically) now "belongs" to Menelaos again, and thus it would be shameful for her to once again go into the bed of someone not her husband. I like that interpretation, and have adopted it, but the point of this quote is the fact that Helen cares about how she's viewed.

She is so very (self-) conscious of how society, and in particular the women around her, view her. She goes to the wall, but veiled and with two attendant slave women; she here, now that Paris lost the duel, acknowledges that in this instance it would be shameful to frivolously go back - others will judge her. (Whether they actually would for this specific instance or not matters less.)

But again, for this quote and in general for this scene (as well as later, when her and Paris' scene ends; the epics can easily tell us about someone's willingness or lack of thereof, but there is no actual comment about that); Worman points out that at no point does Helen actually say she doesn't want Paris/doesn't want to go back.

It is "I will not [go back/sleep with him (now)]", which of course say something about her feelings, but which in particular? We have many options. Helen's desire/want is woven throughout this and can be separated from, maybe even contrasted against, what she feels she ought to do.

And then, in the end, Helen is cowed into going back, because Aphrodite gets angry. But is that anger because of Helen's refusal to go, or Helen's bold "you go and take care of him as a mortal woman might, until he makes you his wife or his slave"? This is such a massively insulting thing to say to a goddess, and the showcase of Helen's temper and spine is honestly breathtaking.

Helen is no meek thing. Not even in front of a goddess.

(Even if it's perfectly possible Helen is well aware of Aphrodite's favour/fondness of her, and therefore knows she can risk to lash out in this way and "merely" get threatened, not actually punished.) Helen claims as much agency and self-control/power as she can, even against herself and an actual goddess.

[dootznbootz]

Me: Almost done listening to the Iliad on audiobook, and planning to listen to the Odyssey next

Me: Goes on youtube to find a quick summary to listen to before hand

Me: Clicks on a promising video

Video, in the first 30 seconds: Haha he cheats on his wife!

Me, in a bad mood now, even though I should have seen that coming: Never-fucking-mind, then

Yep. ;~;

Quick tip for ya: Honestly don't trust really ANY "Youtube" summary of it. Especially the ones where they are mostly trying to be "entertaining" and/or "funny" instead of educational. Also they mostly likely won't be "respectful".

I'm not saying this as a "don't trust any academic source! Historians are evil!!!" I'm saying this as a "there are very biased and very opinionated folks out there and I recommend going over multiple sources just for you to get your own opinion formed on it as well!".

I mean...Madeline Miller?

And you know what? I'll vent about how much I hate Robert Graves' takes on Greek Myth. >:(

I once got an old used book about mythology by Robert Graves and I was excited to read it! But it was genuinely just...so fucking MEAN. Insulting to stories, calling them stupid, flip-flopping on "Goodhearted" to "malicious". It seems like he was a bit more of a critic and/or thought his "headcanons" as "fact". (I say this as someone who has many headcanons and gets real silly with it. At a certain point though, YOU GOTTA STATE THE FACTSSS)

An example from it: (talking about Menelaus and Helen's marriage) "Yet their marriage was doomed to failure: years before, while sacrificing to the gods, Tyndareus had stupidly overlooked Aphrodite, who took her revenge by swearing to make all three of his daughters--Clytemnestra, Timandra, and Helen--notorious for their adultries"

Very much dislikes Odysseus, (like holy crap, even his good deeds are said mockingly) while he seems to "like" Menelaus, still calls him stupid. Seems to really like Paris?? like "Oh yeah, he needed Aphrodite to help him steal a woman who didn't love him but he's just a guyyy~"

"Athen now inspired Prylis, son of Hermes, to suggest that entry should be gained into Troy by means of a wooden horse; Epeius, son of Panopeus, a Phocian from Parnassus, volunteered to build one under Athene's supervision. Afterwards, of course, Odysseus claimed all the credit for the Stratagem"

He implies Helen and Odysseus possibly having romantics when he sneaks into Troy to steal the Palladium. Implies Odysseus made up Cassandra's rape by Lesser Ajax, as "Cassandra did not support the charge".

"Little Ajax's alleged violation of Cassandra was dismissed by reputable mythographers as an Odyssean lie"

Implies that Odysseus was only angry about Pallamedes embarrassing him, NOT BECAUSE HE NEARLY KILLED HIS BABY AND MADE HIM GO TO WAR. He implies "Icarius' daughter (Penelope)" to be another "victim" (???) of Odysseus? He also kissed poor Calypso goodbye and seems determined to never talk about how much Odysseus cares about his family. only that he wants to go home, Penelope being an afterthought.

This is a "Greek Mythology book"...and yet it's biased as fuck. :/

And ofc, people deny Odysseus being a victim.. Obviously there is sexism at play here, with the "Oh Odysseus loved it! He was getting laid!" despite being held at PigPoint and literally getting fucking raped and crying everyday. ;~; it's very disheartening and honestly disturbing.

Honestly I recommend reading/listening to at least 2 (or more) to try and get a "full picture" as just like Madeline Miller and Robert Graves, there are biases in each one. (Emily Wilson is very biased for example) Some of them while favorable toward Odysseus, also favor Circe and Calypso. Some mock Menelaus and Helen. It depends.

Like I've read 8 translations of the Odyssey (I like it :3 you don't have to be insane like me though. <3 ) and all basically say the same thing with the Goddesses as "It was not a good time. He adores Penelope."

Two or three is probably enough, and that's also if you just wanna know if there's any differences between events based on the translator. so sometimes if you wanna know the differences in wording (as some translations have very cute wording) you can just find that part in the Odyssey that you are curious to see if there are differences. :)

I hope you have fun!

[mylittleversaille]

Every day I see more and more pop myth takes that make me want to pull my eyelashes out. No, Ares was not a protector of women. No, Aphrodite was not a war goddess (and you know what, being the goddess of sex and lust and beaut is okay!). No, Hera is not an irredeemable villain. No, Zeus is not evil incarnate. No Achilles isn’t without fault or some ‘gay softboi’ icon (he’s literally presented in the Iliad as someone who is proud to a fault. You’re supposed to recognize that he’s selfish and arrogant). No, Demeter was not an overbearing mother nor was Hades some sort of misunderstood, brooding knight in shining armour. Medea is allowed to commit heinous crimes and still be a sympathetic character. Jason… deserves all the hate he gets, respectfully.

Off the top of my head, I think Helen is one of the few people who gets complex, interesting characterization in modern retellings and discourse, ironically enough. She’s allowed to be vain and aware of her own beauty while also often having a great deal of agency. At the same time, she is frequently depicted as both victim and as offender. She’s allowed to want to be in Troy, but also to miss her husband and daughter.

Some days I feel like I could write essays about pop mythology and the way people reduce mythological figures to one dimensional caricatures. And how these retellings are never as progressive as people think, fixing some issues but exacerbating others. I do think retellings end up being an excellent resource for identifying what social issues bother us and how we would like to address them.

For example, we see a lot of feminist retellings that want to show women as capable of the same things as men, and in so doing they reject or deride their own femininity. But a retelling that is ultimately saying that masculinity is more interesting or valuable than femininity isn’t a truly feminist retelling, but it does show us that our society struggles to find femininity compatible with strength or courage.

[gotstabbedbyapen]

What are your top ten Greek Mythology headcanons?

Ooooh I have a lot of Greek mythology headcanons, so it took me a while to select the top ten 😅 But I've finally done it!

Here is the final list:

10. There is an Eurotas River "tradition" for all the couples in the Spartan royal family.

I like to think it's "tradition" for all members of the Spartan royal family to find the love of their lives at the Eurotas River (Lacedaemon & Sparta, Amyclas & Diomede, Hyacinthus & Apollo, Helen & Menelaus, etc.)

The idea came to me because of the role and presence of this river in Apollo and Hyacinthus' myth (Ovid's version) and Menelaus and Helen's story (Euripides' play). HyaPollo had frequent river dates and MeLen swore fidelity with one another by the same river, so it's fun to think that the other Spartan couples also meet and spend their time together here.

9. Persephone is everyone's childhood friend.

This is also true in the mythos! Persephone grew up with Athena and Artemis in Sicily, her domains overlapped with her other siblings, the Homeric hymn to Demeter has a list of her nymph friends, and every once in a while someone is said to be Persephone's playmate.

She's a true social butterfly lol

8. The second generation Olympians also share traits with their grandparents.

I love to think that the younger Olympians inherit something from their Titan grandparents, you know? Here are some of the ideas:

Ares is loving and protective over his children like Rhea.

Persephone is intimidating and wield her scythe like Kronos.

Hermes is crafty and cunning like his great-grandfather Iapetus.

Apollo has Coeus' deep, intelligent gaze and Artemis has Phoebe's radiant smile.

Athena is unconsciously attracted to the ocean, the kingdom of Oceanus and Tethys.

7. All of Zeus' children, mortal or immortal, inherit his fury.

They can be calm like Apollo or have anger issues like Heracles, but once a child of Zeus get really pissed off, their act of wrath can be as destructive as their father's.

This explains why Artemis shot down Coronis and her family and Persephone inflicted a plague on Thebes.

6. The second generation Olympians (plus Persephone and Aphrodite) love each other in their own ways.

I really dislike depictions of Olympian siblings always at each other's throat. Yes, their history is complicated and dynamics aren't perfect but that doesn't mean they only have bad tension! Where is the nuance in their relationship???

Artemis and Apollo have seen the worst of one another and ridiculed each other for that. But if someone were to talk crap about their twin, it's on sight.

Ares is torn between following his mother and accepting his illegitimate siblings. He had persecuted the twins before they were born but later joined them in the Trojan war.

Athena might be distant from others at times due to her personality and domains, but there are moments she enjoyed dancing and playing music with her siblings.

And Persephone's case is the worse. She might not be an Olympian and stays in Underworld for half a year, but she had never expressed hatred for her non-chthonic family. Let Persephone have good relationship with her upper world family, too!!!

5. Hyacinthus has purple eyes.

Or, in elaborative words, the eyes ever so gentle like flower petals drifting on a calm lake in early spring, hand-painted by the finest of brushes with a meticulous shade of softly vibrant purple that could not be easily sought out in the tapestry of nature.

Sorry for the sudden poetic wax XDDD

Basically, I want Hyacinthus to have pretty purple eyes as one of his signature traits. It makes him stand out from the crowd due to the "divinity" it brings to him (because of the forth headcanon)

4. Hyacinthus' mother is Clio, the Muse of History.

The second-popular parentage of Hyacinthus in the myths, but I have lots of ideas and interpretations with this mother and son relationship:

- The son of the history Muse dating the god of prophecy. Past and future intertwine!

- Their domain and attribute! We study history to learn from the past mistakes and avoid repeating them. The hyacinth flower represents forgiveness, and I like to think it includes self-forgiveness as well. So Clio being Hyacinthus' mother can symbolize accepting and learning from your mistakes to forgive yourself.

- Family angst! Clio knows every way something can go wrong and result in her son's tragic end. So throughout Hyacinthus' life, she will do her best to prevent all possible demises that can happen to him, only to still end up losing him.

- It will give Aphrodite another reason to aid Hyacinthus' resurrection. Since Aphrodite is the one cursing Clio to fall in love with a mortal man and have Hyacinthus, she might feel guilty later when Clio was grieving her son, so she decided to help the mother and son reunite as repentance.

3. Polyboea becomes a huntress of Artemis.

We actually don't have any clear indication that Polyboea became a huntress of Artemis in the myths, but hey, it's not a bad headcanon! Polyboea died a maiden, and Artemis was fond of her enough to help bring her back from death. So it wouldn't be a stretch of the goddess recruit her into the hunter pack.

I have a lot of ideas for a Polyboea-centric fic after she became a virgin huntress, just her journey in perfecting the art of archery, making friends with the other huntresses, and learning to be her own person than just "the youngest princess of Sparta".

2. Apollo and Hyacinthus raise children together.

This heacanon definitely didn't come to me after reading a certain fanfic series hehehe...

The title said all, I like to thing after Hyacinthus' deification, he and Apollo are happily "married" and raise a bunch of kids together, adopted or from another lover (and they may or may not have a child together). Those kids will have the best childhood!

1. Hyacinthus and Polyboea undergo many trials in the Underworld before being granted resurrection and immortality.

As much as I love Hyacinthus and want him to have a happy ending with his loved ones, he's a potential package for physiological and psychological torture :)

There isn't much that we know of about Hyacinthus' resurrection in the myths other than him and his sister, Polyboea, being taken to the Heavens by a parade of deities. But I don't think the Underworld will allow two of their residents to go easily, so Hades and Persephone must have given Hyacinthus and Polyboea a trial like they did to Orpheus and Eurydice, but it will be 1000x worse because love me some blood-choking angst :D

For what the Underworld trials are and how Hyacinthus and Polyboea overcome them, they are will remain for now as ideas and concepts in the making for my Hyapollo fanfic

[asha-mage]

WoT Meta: Prophecies, Fated Lovers, and Robert Jordan's knack for finding the nuance underneath the myth

One complaint I've never understood about the way Jordan writes romances is the persistent claim that he over uses the 'prophesied love' trope.

In part for me, I think it's a little bit folks not seeing the forest for the trees. WoT is fundamentally about the relationship between myth and reality: the place where the fallen angel meets the disgruntled academic, the bitter accountant, and the man who never got over being too short. It's a story where the messiah is real and dealing with chronic pain and PTSD from his stigmata. Where a legendary High Queen has to deal with both marching armies to the apocalypse, and the irritating banal realities of being pregnant at the same time. Of course Jordan digs into the idea of prophesied love- it's a huge theme in folklore and mythologies the world over. Jordan wants to dig into what it really means for there to be a person out there that you are destined to be with: that is a match for you, decreed so by the universe itself....and that you get absolutely no agency and choice in choosing. If anything Tumblr, which adores the 'red string of fate'/'soulmark'/'soulmates share pain'/'world is black until you look into your soulmates eyes' (to name a few of the more prevalent ones- some of which Tumblr practically invented), should be super on board for the parade of fated lovers to be found in WoT. It's nothing short of baffling to me that their not more fondly viewed.

And I think that is tied to the follow up complaint: the criticism that Jordan 'uses prophecy love as a replacement for a romance arc'. But that is something that is just. Patently untrue.

Cause the thing is that is how soulmates are often used...in the majority of soulmate au fanfics you find here and on AO3- an excuse to get the really hard part (two characters realizing they are right for each other and love each other, then having the communication skills to articulate that so they can start a relationship) out of the way, so the author can focus on the fluff or angst or other part they and the audience want to get to. And that's fine! But that's not at all what Jordan does. Just like he does with the Prophecies of the Dragon, or Elaida's fortellings, or even just most of Min's viewings- Jordan takes the idea of the prophecy soulmate, this person decreed by some higher power to be Perfect For You and being right about it, and digs deeper, shining it in different lights and attacking it from different angles. Jordan gives the concept of the soulmate teeth, explores the spines and the sharp points of it: is it real love if it's fated and not your choice? Can you trust your own feelings, or are they fate's design working against you as surely as Aphrodite worked against Helen or Eros against Apollo? What is it like, to see someone one day, and know, beyond a shadow of a doubt that you would love this stranger? This question mark? This wildcard?

Rand's relationships with Min and Aviendha, as well as Mat and Tuon's courtship are great examples of this conundrum. Min and Aviendha have completely opposite reactions to the same information that demonstrates their unique strengths and weaknesses as characters and people, while Tuon and Mat's courtship is all about two people who know they will marry trying to figure out what that means, without ever confronting the reality of those prophecies directly.

Min, as befits a Seer who has learned time and time again that her viewings can not be changed, has resigned herself in an almost fatalistic fashion to all of them, and to loving Rand no less. Min knows that she, and two others, will love him, and she accepts its inevitability the same way she accepts Colavere's death, or Logain's glory, or the shattering of the White Tower. What is, is, and there is no sense or point in struggling against it. What concerns her a great deal more is what she doesn't know- she doesn't know if Rand will love her in return, she doesn't know the identity of the other two women who will love him, and she doesn't know if he will fall in love with one or both of the others but not her. Add to that Min's own insecurities about how she stands out and doesn't fit what her society deems 'proper', between her crossdressing, and her offputting manners, and it makes perfect sense that she's worried about making Rand love her. She doesn't mind sharing him- she hates the idea of being in love with a man who doesn't love her in return, of being stuck like 'Elmindreda' of the stories, sighing and pining endlessly for a man instead of being able to act, to take control of her own fate. 

So she takes control: she learns to flirt from Leane, works hard at making herself desirable, and also indispensable: with her visions, her advice, even just her emotional support to Rand when he otherwise has no one else. The irony is that whenever Rand thinks of Min prior to her return to his side in LoC, it's about how much he liked her earthy honesty and lack of wiles: how she was earnest and made him feel at ease, and didn't 'spin his head like a top'- and that's still what he loves about her after they get together: the fact that she isn't fooled by his front, that she sees him clearly and refuses to be driven away the way so many others are so easily. The point is that Min never had to change, and in the ways that matter she didn't- she only thought she did because of her own fatalism.

Contrast that with Aviendha, who, after learning about being destined to fall in love with Rand, does everything in her power to prevent that outcome- because she is a warrior, a soldier, who has never yet met a problem that could not be killed, endured, or retreated from. Aviendha values nothing so much as her honor and her word- she has promised to keep Rand safe for Elayne and what greater act of dishonor could there be in that situation then not just failing in that promise, but despoiling (and she does view it that way) said man herself? So she is awful to him in the hopes of poisoning the well of affection or at least keeping him far enough away that she is never tempted. Aviendha hurls contempt and anger at him, berates him, does everything short of trying to stab him in an effort to make him hate her, and it doesn't work. Despite all her efforts to keep her thorny wall up, they are literally made for each other and can not help but be drawn together time and again. Despite all her efforts to insist, to him and herself, that she hates him, she can not hide entirely that the opposite is true: that she likes him, sees his strength and courage and resilience, and is a little in awe of his generous kindness. 

This is why she vacillates wildly between wanting desperately to get away from him in The Fires of Heaven, to not wanting to leave his side: they are two planets caught in each other's gravity, with about as much chance of escaping each other. When she resorts to the last recourse of a soldier- retreat- and runs headlong into a blizzard that would surely kill her, Rand follows to try and save her life and she can deny the truth that she loves him no longer, nor can she resist taking him, even knowing that to redress that balance, she will one day have to offer her life to Elayne (as she attempts to do in LoC)- though fate still has other plans in store.

But in many ways the apex of this, the relationship that really shows Jordan's deconstruction of this trope, is Mat and Tuon. Before they ever lay eyes on each other, each is given a prophecy that they will marry the other: not that they'll love each other, not that they will be able to trust each other, not even that that will like each other: just that they will marry. And their strange courtship is a result of this knowledge, as each attempts to suss out the other, to try and understand them without ever overplaying their own hand. Each believes that the moment they admit their prophecy they will destroy any chance of real connection or understanding.

To Tuon, if Mat learns he is destined to wed her he gains something she can not abide: power over her, leverage that could be used to subvert her own plans and visions- because nothing matters more to Tuon than control, especially over herself. So she keeps her 'fortune' secret and tries to figure out: What will it mean to be married to Mat? Will he be a pretty trophy? A liability? A threat to her Empire? Will she have to kill him once she gets her heirs?

To Mat, if Tuon learns of his prophecy, she gains the power to take away his freedom, to snare and collar him and bind him to her, because that's how Mat deep down views marriage: as a binding cord, a loss of freedom, and nothing matters to Mat more than freedom. So he keeps his *Finn gained knowledge secret and tries to figure out: What will it mean to be collared by Tuon? Will she she treat him as a pretty and plaything the way Tylin did? Will she try to use him against Rand and the Westlands? Will she make him a slave and sent him to be beaten anytime he disobeys her? Will he have no choice but to fight her one day, this woman he is going to swear to spend his life with? Will he have to kill her the way he did Melindhra, and carry that guilt of mariticide on top of all else?

So the two stay in their strange limbo, because as long as they don't admit it out loud to the other, they can pretend they are still two people forced together by happenstance, and (each thinks) they can continue to try and understand and figure out the other, to find out where this inevitability of their marriage will really leave them, and if there can be even the faintest possibility of love in such circumstances. And that limbo- that protracted refusal to act as if they are under fate's direction- is what allows them to build a genuine bond of trust and respect for each other, and to start seeing the other person with the clarity that love requires. All this, so that when Tuon finally does play her hand, and reveal the truth....it's obvious they've long since fallen in love with each other (even though Tuon won't admit that to herself), and come to trust each other (even though Mat won't admit that to himself).

And the thing is- all of Jordan’s prophecy romances are written like this: from Egwene seeing that loving Gawyn might be both their downfalls in LoC and seeking him out anyways, to Perrin misinterpreting the 'falcon and hawk' viewing and thinking Faile is a danger to him when she's the love of his life, to Galad and Berelain not even being AWARE they’re fated to fall in love and just....do, at wild first sight (Another classic folklore/mythology trope). They also never find out:  always remaining unaware that the Pattern had long since decreed that they would be together and being incredibly funny/annoying about it. The prophesied love is an example of classic Jordan: taking a common, maybe even ubiquitous premise, and asking those complicating questions that allow him to write it as something much more nuanced and interesting and fascinating. And he gets no credit for it, send tumble.

[babyrdie]

Some of your posts gave me the impression that you don't post about characters even though you are interested in them!! Is there a reason for that?

Okay

Because even though my account is small, Tumblr is still a very public site. It's not like I can make my account private like I can on Twitter (I think Instagram has that option too). And honestly, there are some things that are better left unsaid to avoid headaches. Sure, I have the option to just not post here if I have a problem with attention, but I like the posting system and I like running a blog, so the most I can do is avoid drawing attention to myself. That is, avoid using popular tags (e.g. tagamemnon) and, in general, avoid interacting too much. I certainly respond to people who start a conversation with me (whether it's in the comments, reblogs, asks, DMs, or by tagging me in a game post), but it's less common for me to go to someone else's post.

For example, I've already received about 4 really annoying asks from Odysseus fans (which is part of the reason why I currently don't allow anon asks). So, no matter how much I like the character, I prefer not to interact with posts about him or even post much about him. Yes, I still post, but not as often as I could. And that's because his fandom has given me a headache. In fact, when I see that an account is 100% Odysseus, I block it even if there's nothing that displeases me. Tumblr's tag blocking system is practically useless, so blocking his tag would be ineffective. The only thing I can do to avoid this headache again is to avoid as much as possible profiles that are very passionate about this character and, since there's no option to mute profiles like on Twitter, the only thing left for me to do is block them.

I don't interact much with Patrochilles posts, even though I'm part of the fandom. And that's because I simply don't fit into the "proposal" off this fandom. Not because I felt bad there, we just don't have the same interests most of the time. For example, they usually have no interest in Antilochus, Teucer, Deidamia, etc. Talking about the couple itself is nice, but I would also like to have the opportunity to talk about their other relationships. And I don't really get to do that in the fandom.

There are certain characters that I don't give much of an opinion on because there's potential for unnecessary arguments. For example, I believe that Helen chose to go with Paris, since I rarely see anything in the ancient sources that explicitly states that she was kidnapped. And no, "Aphrodite influenced" isn't really a convincing argument, many times Aphrodite and Eros were used to represent the feeling and not necessarily to state that the person has total 0 agency. Medea also only fell in love with Jason because of divine interference (Eros), so why doesn't anyone claim that she has no responsibility whatsoever for what her feelings for Jason made her do? And yes, Medea certainly did much worse than Helen, but I used an extreme example precisely to illustrate the situation better. So, for me, Helen chose to cheat on Menelaus and chose to leave her daughter behind. I'm not saying that she WANTED to hurt them, but she certainly hurt them by not thinking better. And by "thinking better" I don't even mean sleeping with someone else (Menelaus did the same thing, after all. He's really not one to talk about fidelity), I'm talking about leaving Sparta. And I don't think Paris is worse than her, I think they were both irresponsible. It doesn't make them the worst people in the world, especially when there are examples of people with worse attitudes in the Trojan War (i.e. Patroclus and Hector wanted to dishonor a corpse, Odysseus and Achilles have countless attitudes on the list, Agamemnon made the people suffer twice because of his hubris… once with Artemis in Aulis, once with Apollo in Troy), but they aren't little silly saints without any flaw. I don't think Helen is a poor thing like the rest of the people think, sorry.

But yeah, you can be sure I've had thoughts about characters I don't post about. Hell, I've even had thoughts about Philoctetes. Like, who thinks about Philoctetes? And you can't imagine how many times I think about Penthesilea and just don't post about it. Even characters that have no relation to the Trojan War, like Medea, Jason, Theseus, Antigone, Cadmus. So yeah, I think about a fair amount of characters even if I don't post about them.

I've had unbearable experiences with fandom on fic sites (deleted accounts), Amino (deleted account), and Twitter (now a private account). I don't want the same for Tumblr, so I'm in this situation. If someone wants to be my moot and wants to interact with me, I'm more than willing! But no, I don't think I really want to draw attention.

[a-d-nox]

Hello Nox

How are you? I hope you're fine

Could you talk about Peitho 118? if you haven't made any posts related to this. I think she named after one of Aphrodite's companion Peitho? So, I'm curious about this goddess and her role in astrology too

Thank you, have a nice day 💜💜

peitho, goddess of persuasion (asteroid 118)

The origin of Peitho is rather unclear in the classics - she doesn't originate from Homer or Ovid. Hesiod only briefly mentions her. It was Sappho who gave her a bit of definition and shape. Sappho stated that Peitho was an attendant of Aphrodite; she held the secret to divine love and thusly knew how to persuade and seduce someone. Some say that she was the one who married the tragic lovers Cadmus and Harmonia... Frequently, she is depicted in art at the weddings of significant lovers like Dionysus and Ariadne, Thetis and Peleus, Aphrodite and Adonis, etc. Infamously, Peitho was at the abduction of Helen by Paris because her divine magic was needed for Paris to convince Helen to leave with him per the promise of Aphrodite. IN MY OPINION Peitho in your chart can indicate a) where your origin is unclear, b) where you facilitate romances for others, c) where you convince couples to stay together, and/or d) your abilities to romantically persuade others and seduce them.

i encourage you to look into the aspects of peitho along with the sign, degree, and house placement. for the more advanced astrologers, take a look at the persona chart of peitho AND/OR add the other characters involved to see how they support or impede peitho!

OTHER RELATED ASTEROIDS: homerus (5700), hesiodos (8550), ovidius (2800), cadmus (7092), sappho (80), aphrodite (1388), harmonia (40), ariadne (43), dionysus (3671), adonis (2101), helene (101), and paris (3317)!

like what you read? leave a tip and state what post it is for! please use my “suggest a post topic” button if you want to see a specific post or mythical asteroid next! 

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[summonademon]

Some chaotic concepts for a "Percy x everyone" fanfic

What if Poseidon suddenly becomes overprotective over Percy and asks Apollo how to make Percy immortal and his prophetic answer is basically "the ONLY way that will EVER happen is through a marriage to another immortal, coz he'd do it out of love"

The rumor spreads like wildfire and suddenly it's another Helen of Sparta situation because every other major AND minor deity is wooing Percy. The gods are showing up left and right, he wakes up to a pile of gifts on his desk, even the nymphs are shooting their shot with him. He becomes paranoid of every other plant or animal that catches his eye because it might just be a god/goddess/nymph in disguise

It is absolute chaos and Percy has to stay at Poseidon's palace for a long while to avoid all the unwanted attention. He is (rightfully) very concerned that Hera, the goddess of marriage, will find a way to kidnap him or maybe Aphrodite or Eros is gonna force him to fall in love with someone else entirely. He probably can't even die in peace because then the underworld Gods might make a move on him in the afterlife.

~

The endgame ship is up to you and the lengths that the Gods will go to is up for interpretation. This can be Percy x God where they slowly manage to woo him despite the drama. Or it's Percy x Demigod wherein he rejects literally everyone for the sake of his mortal lover. Or hey, maybe he falls in love with a naiad or nereid, that's still pretty sweet. Or you can be angsty and make it dubcon or unrequited love or something.

~

What if this is an AU where Annabeth and Percy already broke up months ago so that's why Poseidon was so concerned for Percy's happiness.

What if Percy's current lover (a demigod probably) breaks up with him over all this, or at least it puts a huge strain on their relationship.

What if Eris, goddess of discord, was the one who nudged Poseidon into becoming so worried about Percy's mortality, and now she's just sipping tea watching the chaos unfold.

What if Apollo doesn't even tell Poseidon about the prophecy so just he can woo Percy himself without any competition.

What if Hermes is the only god that has access to Percy at Atlantis because he's the Messenger god.

What if Thanatos shows up unannouned coz death is inescapable and he makes Percy super flustered

What if one of the Olympians offers to make Percy his/her cupbearer.

What if one of the Gods literally tries to fly away with Percy and it almost causes WWIII.

What if Poseidon tries to play matchmaker for a while but when things get out if control he becomes super apologetic coz Percy is miserable.

What if this causes and irreparable rift between Percy and his dad because this is literally all his fault

What if Percy is still in love with someone who is already dead, and now he's super depressed because he'll probably never be able to reunite with them in Elysium

What if Percy spends his last few days of mortality with his current mortal lover, savoring this chance to give them his heart from his own free will

What if Percy's demigod lover goes on an epic quest to earn immortality and then asks for Percy's hand in marriage immediately after.

~

Whatever the result, Percy's marriage becomes the #1 topic everywhere and if/when he does marry an Immortal it will be THE marriage of the Century.

[etymology-of-the-emblem]

Marth / マルス and Elice / エリス

Marth (JP: マルス;  rōmaji: marusu) is the prince of Altea who defeats the Shadow Dragon Medeus in Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon and the Blade of Light, Fire Emblem: Mystery of the Emblem, and their remakes. The surname Marth is of German origin, seemingly taken from a municipality that stemmed from its local market, called Markt in the native language. All things considered, this likely was not an intended connection.

More likely, Marth is intended as a corruption of the name of the Roman war god Mars; in Japanese, the deity's name is typically rendered as マールス (rōmaji: mārusu), but how Marth's name is written is also common. Unlike his Greek counterpart of Ares, who was commonly portrayed as boorish and savage, Mars was greatly revered as both the symbol and defender of Rome, and used warfare as a means to attain peace, rather than out of a desire for destruction. Even the more questionable elements of Mars' character—namely, his relationship with Rhea Silvia and his affair with Venus—are generally painted in a positive light, as it is through Mars that Rhea Silvia gave birth to Rome's founder Romulus and his brother Remus, and he is artistically depicted with Venus as being in a happy, tranquil state.

Marth reflects the prevalent depictions of Mars well. His foremost goal is to bring peace to his homeland of Altea and her people, much like Mars to Rome. But he also isn't someone hungry for battle; Marth is happy to forgo combat when able, but is rarely given the option.

Though of dubious canonicity, the surname of the Altean royal family found in the Mystery of the Emblem OVA series ties into Marth's namesake. Lowell (JP: ローウェル; rōmaji: rōweru) is a English surname meaning "wolf". In Roman culture, the wolf was one of the most sacred symbols of Mars, right behind the woodpecker.

Elice (JP: エリス;  rōmaji: erisu) is the princess of Altea and older sister of Marth. The name Elice is a variant of Elise, which in turn is a diminutive form of Elizabeth, a name carried by many queens and princesses. However, considering her brother's name, her name is most likely a corruption of the Greek goddess of strife, Eris. According to Homer, Eris was "sister and comrade" to Ares; though this phase was likely more symbolic of the two gods' relation to conflict, it fed the conception Ares and Eris (and their Roman counterparts Mars and Discordia) were siblings.

Eris is best known for her role in inadvertently starting the Trojan War. After not being invited to the wedding of Peleus and Thetis, parents of the hero Achilles, she decided to cause trouble amongst the goddesses that were. She cast into the event a golden apple, with the words "for the fairest" written on it. This brought about a disturbance between Hera, Athena, and Aphrodite. It was Zeus who selected the Trojan hero Paris as the judge of their beauty. Though each goddess had proposed tempting bribes to the man, it was Aphrodite's bargain that took Paris: the most beautiful woman on earth, Helen, queen of Sparta and wife of Menelaus. However, when the King of Sparta took a woman of such beauty for a wife, it was agreed by all of the kingdoms of Greece to go to war against any who spirit away Helen. As such, Troy's fate was sealed the moment made his deal with the goddess of love.

It seems that allusion to Eris is not to directly connect the princess of Altea to the character of the goddess, but rather to the consequences of her Apple of Discord. Elice remains in the kingdom for its fall—an inevitable fall based on the tensions between Altea and Gra. One could interpret Altea as being a stand-in for Troy. Elice could then simultaneously represent Helen's abduction, with both women serving as motivation for their family to fight. That is, at least, a favorable interpretation; Elice's name may have simply been chosen because the main character is named after Mars and one man said that Eris was his Greek equivalent's sister.

[hermesmoly]

I just realized that Kaos tried so hard to turn Orpheus and Eurydice into Helen and Menelaus.

That reminds me of how ppl also try to write Hephaestus and Aphrodite as Helen and Menelaus.

(Again, is true love really a boring plot line nowadays? Man, Let Eurydice like her husband.)

Yeah the uh. “Sacrificing Loyal Boyfriend /Evil Cheating Girlfriend Who Doesn’t Deserve it” trope. Done to a couple who in the myths just really loved each other. Boo 👎👎👎

The thing is the premise was a bit promising at the start; Orpheus going to the Underworld for a Eurydice that has fallen out of love for him. While watching them I found myself asking questions like: Would you fight death itself for someone even if you knew they wouldn’t do the same for you? If they didn’t love you the way you love them? The answer being yes is essentially Menelaus’ drive, because to Menelaus, especially to Menelaus, Helen was worth fighting for. It’s why he (all heavily morally questionable aspects of it aside) wages war and all its consequences to get Helen back home. Love is a strong motivator, thorns and all. The only difference between Menelaus and Orpheus is Menelaus wielding a spear and a thousand men to prove it while Orpheus had only his lyre and his words as a great poet.

AND THE POINT, THE POINT of the Orpheus Eurydice myth is even if their love was doomed, even if he knew the ending, Orpheus would have still loved her, he still would have tried to traversed the Underworld for her, and he still would have looked back, because he loved her. Most accounts have Eurydice die shortly after their wedding— they never even had a chance to settle down, to have a family, to grow old together. The grief of that pain to be translated through song was enough to melt a King’s heart.

Eurydice in the myths was worth fighting for. Eurydice in the show however? Didn’t even seem to care about Orpheus at all. Like not even as a friend. The two episodes I’ve watched had Eurydice being so good at faking being in love Orpheus dedicates songs to her. Despite what we see that she never makes an actual effort for Orpheus. How do you sing your heart out for a woman who doesn’t even remember your favorite cereal? It’s just so laughably bad and written with no care.

As for Hephaestus/Aphrodite… I can see the temptation to make them Like That but it just isn’t comparable. Helen leaving Troy (either via force or willingness) leaving Menelaus and Hermione behind is too different from Hephaestus learning of Aphrodite's infidelity by lying to him about Eros’ (and seemingly Harmonia’s) parentage. Helen could have made an impulsive decision, could have agreed to it only to regret it or maybe she wasn’t given a choice, but it's leagues better than Aphrodite lying straight to Hephaestus’ face, even if she regrets it. Just let them divorce!!!