#jonry

[father-of-all-motherfuckers]

day one of drawing random bandom ships kissing in my notebook during class until someones notices !

today i spun a wheel with all the ships i could draw of and it landed on...

wentzross (pete wentz x ryan ross ) !

now i dont wanna have to spin this wheel everyday during class so,

choose what i should draw next!

(i'll release both todays and tmrws tommorow! !!)

[esther-dot]

I'm sorry, that's gonna be a really weird ask from one jonsa stan to another but I'm genuinely curious - is there any anti jonsa argument/claim that actually made sense to you? I'm really asking for the sake of, well, civilised discussion - because if there are arguments there ought to be reasonable counterarguments. And all that I see is the same tired old crap - "she's not his favourite sister" and "but they are relatives!" and all the other stuff. Given, of course I'm not hanging around jonry@ and jon@erys side of this fandom (dark things happen to any sansa and jonsa stans there) and have no idea if they have any reasonable metas. Or maybe if there was a moment that made you actually question possibility of jonsa happening in books? (once again - because I'm anxious like that - I'm not asking this to disprove something or make people question jonsa but because I wonder if you personally had this sort of experience).

Thank you and hope you're having a nice day!

No worries! I enjoy looking at things from different angles, so I don’t mind at all. Unfortunately, I haven’t read anti jonsa stuff that isn’t exactly what you described, so I can’t actually have the convo you want about this. I tried to go to some jonerys blogs but their anti tags weren’t what we’re looking for. There’s a blogger people view as neutral who other Sansa fans/Jonsas put on my dash, and a BNF who people I follow also reblog from, so I went over to their blogs to look around and they’re less rabid, but I can’t say they offered though-provoking pushback. I’ll share some snippets though, in case you’re interested.

There was the old "but their siblings" argument:

I, ah, I do not think Jon marries Sansa in any scenario. Regardless of biological relationship, they think of themselves as siblings. The people around them are also quite likely to consider them siblings or as good as, having been raised as such (see also Theon being accused of kinslaying over his apparent murder of Bran and Rickon). Nor do I think either would be in a rush to go back to the traditional “but the Targaryens practiced incest,” again considering that their society is strongly anti-incest. Jon and Sansa were raised together, in the same house, as brother and sister, and that makes a material difference.

But you know, raised as siblings and please nobody try the “but they weren’t close” with me, that’s so not true.

It’s interesting to see someone say they were close, that’s not something I’ve seen before. I suppose my biggest issue with this line of thought is that it feels true for a generic fantasy maybe, but hardly convincing when talking about ASOIAF? Martin wants to talk about incest. So far, we have all the bad, abusive variations covered. I think he’s gonna work some shades of grey into it the same way he tries to do with everything he discusses, and to pretend like he would never feels disingenuous to me. Even if he ultimately abandoned the initial draft, from the author’s mind came the idea of a Jon / Stark girl romance. He has entertained it. Secondly, Jon is a Targ and it’s reasonable to expect that to manifest somehow, or at least, for Jon to experience the fear that there’s something latent there. And third, if we’re gonna get a romance, I think Martin would write it with the complexity and inner struggle that he writes everything and fauxcest offers him that opportunity, not to mention all the parallels it would allow as well.

Let's see...I also saw that they object to the Beauty and the Beast reading of Jonsa:

And I've been searching but apparently I never posted the rest of my "Bear and the Maiden Fair" thoughts, but that's the in-world Beauty and the Beast story. Through that and looking at bears elsewhere in the story, you can track this idea of the beast not being a monster, but being perceived as one by society, an outcast, which is why the Hound, Tyrion, and Jon all fit the role/are related (in a way), and why Jon will be the final suitor or real bear/beast.

The next one, I’m just gonna post the whole thing:

I’m not sure if the best part is the implication that Jon/Dany (which they believe is inevitable) have what’s required to allow for “quick deep emotional connections” or if it’s reading the Hound insult and threaten and then finally put a knife to Sansa’s throat and deciding “romance! chivalry!” The Hound may be disillusioned, but the fandom has got to stop pretending like some of his espoused beliefs aren’t self-serving, a defense because he is a monster. We have Brienne and Jon showing us different versions of knights, true knights, so acting like the Hound is in the right is just bizarre.

Anyway, no, I’ve not read an anti argument that made me doubt it. I do doubt what Martin is aiming for at times, so I’ve vacillated between potential paths/endgames for them over the years, but the anti arguments generally are coming from a reading of characters and dynamics that’s disturbing to me which means I’m usually alienated, not compelled.

[horndoghoursposts]

I mm so jonry

Crossed yayyyy

[thebisexualdogdad]

Jonrys for the ship thing

Had google who this was and sorry I don't watch game of thrones!

[jackoshadows]

where Martin has ever stated Joner* is canon in the books. - Um, why should he? They have not even met yet in the books 😂

Where it says the whole story is about them. - More gaslighting and lies. Which fans are saying that the whole story is about Jon and Daenerys?

Jonry* literally came from an old outline and now people use it to connect it to their close sibling relationship as they are “secretly in love canon.” - ngl, this is hilarious coming from the same people who use the old outline to make the argument that their obnoxious crackship is canon 🤣🤣🤣🤣. And no, neither the original outline or Jonrya fans are saying that they are secretly in love - another lie. It's them who come up with the most absurd sexist nonsense like -'pre-canon crush', not other shippers. Rather, as the OG outline clearly states, Jon and Arya's platonic love turns to romantic love when they meet again, they are horrified by it and R+L=J was a solution. After all, GRRM send off that OG outline to his editor along with the first 13 chapters of AGoT where Jon loves Arya dearly and gives her Needle.

Jonery* literally comes from sporadic lines throughout chapters - which again coming from Jonsa shippers who ship Jon and Sansa because SNOW FELL ON HER FACE THAT ONE TIME and side history book family trees is bloody hilarious 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

You want to know what are facts though? Lyanna was a Stark, not a dragon. Jons first love and Sansas first love looked a like. In the very first few chapters in AGOT it’s all centered around Jon and Sansa being married off to a king!

I love how they proclaim as fact that Ygritte looks like Sansa when in the books Jon keeps comparing Ygritte to Arya in terms of her looks and personality and refers to her uncombed hair and gap toothed smile with affection and GRRM has talked about how that comparison is about Jon's type regarding the girls he loves and admires.

6.  Jon’s mother is strongly connected to the winter rose story, which only one other person fits that story. Give you a hint.. It’s not D or A. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Right, Arya with her several in text comparisons to Lyanna and Mance trying to steal 'Arya' out of WF as Abel the Bard and Daenerys seeing the blue rose at the Wall in the house of the Undying has no connection to the winter rose story you guys! It's all about the character not referenced AT ALL with regard to this subplot.

7. When it actually comes to love, Jon follows Sansa, and not just love but marriage and having children. No other character does this happen to. - More idiotic fanfiction. Tyrion wants marriage and children. In fact he wanted that with Sansa!! Theon wanted marriage and children. The adolescents Jon and Dany want marriage and children. It's only the pre-teens like Arya and Bran who don't think of that yet because when the story started they were little kids and then have been subjected to a lot of trauma, loss of family and have focused on survival. Pretty much every character in the books wants love, marriage and children. That's the bloody theme of the books - Wind and words. Wind and words. We are only human, and the gods have fashioned us for love. That is our great glory, and our great tragedy.

8.  Sansa becomes a bastard, and so does. Oh wait, no one else does! 

"In Pentos I am Yollo," he said quickly, to make what amends he could, "but my mother named me Hugor Hill." - Tyrion, ADwD

Well, look at that! Tyrion also pretending to be bastard, the parallels are writing themselves. All this Sanrion foreshadowing!

9. Every Stark child thinks about Winterfell but only Sansa and Jon think of rebuilding it. - More fanfiction. Sansa has never thought of rebuilding Winterfell because she is a 13 year old hiding away in the Vale under LF's tutelage with not much agency. Jon only thinks of rebuilding Winterfell because he is considering Stannis' offer to legitimize him as Lord of Winterfell and he is trying to justify it in his mind as Ned and Robb being happy if he brought Winterfell back to it's original glory. He then refuses the offer because of oaths to the Old Gods and has focused on rebuilding the Wall.

10. Jon-nel and Sansa anyone? - yes that obscure off the book side history books family tree is evidence of this crackship despite nothing being written for it in the books....

11.  Everything I just stated right now is facts. It’s not interviews by whoever saying whatever, it’s not theories, it’s not putting together certain lines just to fit my ship. It’s facts!

Lie after lie after fanfiction after made up fanon and a bunch of sexist headcanons is what that is. Facts? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 There was not one single fact or legitimate theory in that word salad of farcical nonsense.

12. Now, show me where in the books D or A have this with Jon. I’ll wait.

I've been on a bit of a hiatus but I couldn't resist...

Two questions:

Where to start?

What to emphasize?

[444names]

samoan and german forenames

Adiesl Adona Adono Afalle Alalaga Alapa Alaulam Alauliam Alena Aliagi Alialuno Aloise Alphela Altefai Alteph Altruna Aluthel Amagdala Amalber Amalevene Amani Amann Ameine Amuno Angoben Annam Ansga Antoe Apauaivao Apolf Arbas Aritz Arobia Assai Ataus Attoga Auguiona Aumes Axenerd Bardt Barnolf Barolan Basinas Basta Beraitz Beria Bernhele Beromasim Bertrutz Brudolph Caralani Caran Cardt Cariama Cariebke Carloua Chana Chellia Chert Claudwild Colfrea Colph Coreid Corich Daliva Daloa Darie Darne Diannefo Diethalte Dinhomala Disel Dusan Dustene Edegframa Edretel Elafagne Elevi Elhelea Ellmana Ellmasi Elorg Emann Emarl Emiagi Emmeine Emmese Emundala Emuno Eriatja Eriose Esefo Eselisefo Esetheili Esily Eteuilen Evenick Evinasig Fagana Faiann Faivalu Falver Falwil Fanne Fansga Ferstinra Filhein Fiose Fisapiti Fisilin Flomaria Flouid Folaki Foluta Frala Fralevao Frata Freinz Fretau Fretert Fretiu Frian Frick Fricolis Frido Fundren Gebassa Gebke Gelhela Geored Georina Germalafa Germina Giliedy Gisala Gismu Gobia Gotalaga Gotau Gother Gotogate Gotte Gottscard Greatiu Gredmua Gredrina Greteuita Gretharia Halber Handrisi Hanna Hanuanuai Harndrank Heidemase Heidiko Heido Heildel Heina Heleaia Helger Heloifitz Heriedega Herisaleo Hermia Herta Hertric Herwin Hifinrann Hilauliu Hilmirias Holalua Holotoga Hubenefi Huber Hubers Hunth Ildan Ilhermart Inian Ioellenza Irmatau Irmatrikt Isamanna Isandt Isina Istel Istelm Istin Jacola Joand Joanne Johalk Johard Johardt Joharga Joharia Joharl Joharle Jonried Josefi Josemut Josteleni Josti Juloma Jürgarga Karichan Kasapamo Katia Katrikt Katrud Keryl Klaldelua Klama Klamona Klaulouio Klausa Klaust Kuela Kuelk Kuenth Kuricardt Lalud Latertau Lauga Lauita Lausa Lautupola Leata Lemanger Lened Lenestelm Lesterie Lianna Liedmuna Lingrick Lipusig Loacober Lofisin Lolufaild Lomeld Loria Lortauena Lotthia Lottscard Lotutevai Luain Luald Lualdagi Lufana Luitah Lukevin Lundrick Luolai Luoli Lütoe Mafioli Maiane Malade Malda Malemia Malilesl Maltrines Malvena Malwild Manapolte Manne Manua Maran Marcolda Marcusi Marie Marold Marstiaga Mastimarl Matavin Mathene Matofald Matya Melamu Melmaliva Mesevid Mesin Mesthoma Mestia Miana Michria Michrich Milhelen Milianna Mircolby Mirich Mirie Misiva Mogista Monra Moridegar Nahili Nasig Niagi Niamarma Nianth Niedialby Niedra Nikatua Nivai Ofinra Olber Olteuim Oniai Orgert Otupp Panne Papette Paudinz Petahifi Petefola Pheinie Philald Philiana Philma Pisama Pitama Pitao Pitingren Pitober Polafil Polatya Poldaga Polenz Railina Ramarndel Richelia Robellis Roberia Rogilto Rolinge Rollia Rolphild Romanne Romard Romisla Rosta Rudinerta Sabruta Saiam Salapai Salix Salke Salouiti Salvich Samonapau Samuta Sanah Sanala Sannesefa Sapauli Sapelmia Saula Sefitz Sepatra Sheleina Silbeala Silhed Silheing Silhene Silipu Sillmund Simelenz Simether Sinama Sinelf Sinhana Sinhella Sinne Siono Sosefer Sosisil Sottaula Stias Stina Suloreten Svene Svenin Sverine Sveta Sylvi Taitoa Talafina Talelie Tasamo Taulrine Taumese Taurs Taustiand Teryl Toloui Tuimia Tuioelas Tuloisild Tupama Tupandt Tupata Tupeti Tutoberma Tutua Ufaner Uisald Ulamalamo Ulona Uloto Uluasin Urise Urster Urstin Utuiona Vaalmueld Vaeaevin Vaiagi Vaialle Vailia Valagi Valupp Vasiona Vesifund Vichrite Volfga Volga Walingo Wenivai Wentharl Werndt Werobina Wigilhand Wigisber Wigmuth Wilin Wiliu Winanna Wolgatya Wolgena Wolie Xelia Xento Yvermirko

[appri-dot]

Thera and Jonry

[incorrect-starkid]

john: what do we say when we’re feeling sad?

henry: my depression is chronic, but my ass is iconic

john, sighing: no.

[thelustybraavosimaid]

Some additional information, since they're pulling from the Balticon Report SSM:

Martin has stated that he has changed things.

Hmm.

a. Friend: Ok, if you foreshadowed something in the first book, like, really cleverly hidden, would you then follow through on that hint? For sure?.. GRRM: Well, this goes with what I said before, the story changes and expands as I write. I wish I was able to go back and make revised drafts, but that's not giong to happen. (He said way more than this, but this summarizes it. )

The story changes and expands, but what he did not change was the importance of Jon and Arya's relationship. They have been very close in the original outline as well, as she has Needle in it. I'd even say he significantly expounded on their relationship.

Martin doesn't think much of Jonry*

Uh?

"You know, I don't think it's a reference for that [for romance]. It's a reference to a certain physical type, and a certain indication of what Jon finds admirable. It's like someone who reminds you of, you know... Other people might be put off by this, you know, hair that looks like small rodents have been living in there."

He literally has Jon compare Ygritte to Arya several times, some very strangely. If Jon has thought this way about Ygritte but with Sansa, you'd lose your fucking minds. He never said he hadn't thought much about Jonrya. This is what was mentioned in the SSM:

My con friend asked about the Jon/Arya relationship again and brought her (impressive) Game book that had all of her references marked out with little flags. She brought up the Ygritte connections to Arya that Jon saw in her. George did not directly answer yes or no if there would be anything romantic between the two. He did say, despite what readers see as clues to a romantic relationship between Jon/Arya in the books themselves, he did not confirm this so easily but inferred that what Jon saw in Ygritte was a comfort level of femininity.

Sorry but that's pretty fucking important. If he sees Ygritte as a comfort level of femininity, why in the fuck would he fall in love with Sansa?

[question about Jon/Arya] GRRM: "Alright, you've thought about this more than I have. I mean it's simple, Jon is very fond of Arya. They were the two odd birds in the Stark family nest, here. They didn't quite fit in with the others, they look like each other, they both had the brown hair, you know, as opposed to the auburn hair of Sansa and Bran and Rickon and Robb. So there was always that closeness between them. And, you know, Arya didn't mind that Jon was a bastard, and Jon didn't mind that Arya was a tomboy, so there is that closeness there." [question about Jon comparing his lover to his sister] GRRM: "If he did it, uhm...

The man rambled afterwards about the beginning of his writing process to the outline he was writing for paragraphs, continuing with, "I was pretty pissed the outline came out." Honestly the knowledge that Jon has a type and a preference for girls like Arya should kill Jonsa but I guess that's the author lying to his own characters now.

Let's also not pretend like he hasn't played around with close siblings being involved in some way or another with each other.

Diminishing Jon and Arya's bond because you want Jon to have that with Sansa is not a good look. Read something else because these books are clearly not for you since you cannot even comprehend a fucking SSM.

[esther-dot]

Me: The A*ya tag can't be that bad. It can't be. I like A*ya too I should go to her tags and see what other fans that's not from my usual circle has to say about her! I can't take what other people say at face value! I should decide for myself how bad something actually is!

(the first post in her tags: literally about how OP is a 'stark sisters enemies truther' and how ar*a should never forgive sansa for the 'trauma' she inflicted on ar*a and how OP wants them to fight with ar*a winning and killing sansa)

me: *crying sobbing* I'm never venturing outside my circle ever again

Sorry to kind of vent in your inbox but man. That was AWFUL. I feel like a little kid in a cliche movie who ventured out into the wild despite their parents warning them not to do so because the outside world is dangerous, only to find out that yes the outside world IS dangerous and they learned the hard way

Why is it that the one thing I wish Sansa fans to be wrong about is actually right. Yall always right but at what cost

'stark sisters enemies truther' Wtf. 😂

I'm sorry you saw that anon. I encourage people to filter and block because the ASOIAF fandom can be pretty disturbing, and in my experience, that corner is the worst about looking for things to be angry about and then sending anon hate.

I’m not sure what happened there, if at any point their corner of the fandom was better, but they hate Sansa more than I have ever hated a fictional character. The seething rage they experience every day that Sansa exists and is loved (in-world and by her own fandom here) is extreme. I remember one of their more popular bloggers saying they’d be ok with Arya dying if it meant they got to watch Sansa die too.

I didn’t know they wanted Arya to kill her (for me, her threatening Sansa in s7 was the most traumatizing thing the show did ), but many of them were hoping Sansa would die in the show, and this one fan was commenting on other people’s posts fantasizing about show Jon killing her.

I’m guessing there are lots and lots of calmer Arya fans, but the active bloggers tend to be jonry@s and I’m gonna guess they’re resentful of how popular jonsa became in comparison. I mean, I love the Jon and Arya relationship, I was disappointed by how they were handled in s8, but that must have been a really bitter pill for their fandom.

Jon: Come visit me.

Arya: I’d rather go to sea and never set foot in Westeros again.✌🏻

ANYWAY, I wrote a little fic (show verse) about Arya and Sansa’s relationship, and in Healing I have some moments between them as well because I think Arya needs love and understanding, not kinslaying?? 😳 Where the Shadow Ends does a beautiful job working through post canon (show) Arya's issues/reconciling her relationships. I don't have any recs for book verse, but some of us did attempt some wish-fulfillment that's a little less horrifying!

[damaged-dollie]

What are you gonna to do?

[queenofdarkwhispers]

#jonsa #anti jonrys stans #anti sansan stans

girl you need to get back to the psychward. what do you mean you have an entire sideblog dedicated to talking abt the theories of the ship you hate

[alinaastarkov]

@anon who said "honestly so disgusting and sick in the head". One of the themes in ASOIAF is incest. If you are to sensitive, then why are you reading the books. Have a look at GRRM original storyline, Jonrya is the paring. Even throughout all the books, there are hints of Jonrya. If you call GRRM " Disgusting and sick in the head", he will also say "Don't read the books then". BTW we all know you are a Jonsa shipper, since so MANY JONSA shippers harass Jonrya and Jonerys shippers 1/2.

2/2 You guys think your ship is "Not incest" because Jon and Sansa never referred to each other as siblings. LMFAO at you, stop harassing Jonrya and Jonerys shippers.

Yep.

[landeskogingwhovian]

Theory Love Triangle

GRRM originally planned an Arya/Tyrion/Jon love triangle...

I think it can now be Sansa/Tyrion/Jon

OR

Dany/Tyrion/Jon

[they-stare-i-ship]

Let's talk about GoT s8e2

1. Okay so Brienne defending Jamie and Sansa trusting her. Amazing. Beautiful. Loved that scene. Sansa remains wise.

2. Moving on to that Sansa and Danny scene. They were cute. But I'm very glad that Sansa was like "Men do stupid things for women." I'm glad she has her priorities straight. I'm glad she's thinking about the north bc no one else is.

3. JAMIE ASKING TO FIGHT UNDER BRIENNE

4. Gendry high-key getting turned on seeing Arya throw those knives.

5. Every 👏 single 👏 Lannister 👏 bros 👏 scene

6. The odd group of people sitting in front of the fire.

7. Podrick fighting and singing

8. Arya probably being the first girl in this god damn show to have first time with consent. How she was in control. How gentle Gendry was.

9. Jorah asking Danny to forgive Tyrion. He's basically her impulse control.

10. Samwell Tarley being man enough to realize he's gonna stay with his family.

11. Bran's conversation with Jamie. I felt like that was foreshadowing bc of how he said if there is gonna be an afterwards.

12. Theon and Sansa reunion. It was wholesome and beautiful. It was well deserved. Theon also volunteering to protect Bran. All these family feels man.

13. WHY IS JON SO FUCKING DUMB? WHY DID HE TELL DANNY BEFORE HIS ENTIRE FUCKING FAMILY? WHERE IS POLITICAL JON?

14. With that, I hated Danny's thinking about the throne even before the fact that (according to her conversation with Sansa) she's "in love" with her nephew.

15. Greyworm and Missande

16. The story of how tormurd (or whatever his name) with the giant woman made me incredibly uncomfortable. It was disgusting and I lost a lot of respect for him. But good on him saying about the fuck the tradition about women not being knights.

17. Saved the best for the last. Brienne's knighting. Thank you Sir Jamie. I will be forever grateful. You made her so happy. HE HAD TEARS IN HIS EYES. SHE HAD TEARS IN HER EYES. this was the most intense scene. It was beautiful. I almost cried. She full on smiled and I loved every second of it.

[jonriedesigns-blog]

#independenceday #jonriedesigns #ncosfriends #customclubhouse #coloradoclubhousebuilder #coloradosprings #denverclubhouses #goldencolorado #denvercolorado #justforkids #swingset #playscape #fort #jonrie #kidsbuilder (at Colorado) https://www.instagram.com/p/CCOVSH7H2Q2/?igshid=1muoi1quj3quy