#is theoi.com a bad resource

[geoclapicus]

Imagine the Fates already existing in Hesiod's Theogony, then just, they decide to be born again from Zeus and Themis.

Hah, hah, that would be so funn-

👀

[khaire-traveler]

New Hellenistic Polytheist here (sorry for the spelling)

Two questions:

Is it possible to ask people like Telemachus or Antinous for guidance?

I've heard people can have conversations with gods and goddesses like Athena or Hermes, or basically anyone, and I have no idea how to do that?

Thanks

Asher

Khaire, Asher! I hope you're well.

1. Yes! This is referred to as "hero worship". The sources on hero worship can be far and few between at times, and I personally recommend feeling it out for yourself. Research is an extremely important part of any worship that's lesser known, in my opinion, so I highly recommend reading The Odyssey for yourself, if you haven't already. Try looking up if either heroes had a cult worship as well; typically, Theoi.com will have good commentary on this. I'm not sure that either of the heroes you mentioned have cult worship, but they might. If you're speaking about the actual youth Antinous, who was a lover of Hadrian the Roman emperor, he might have had cult worship due to his status. I'm not sure, though.

2. Regarding having conversations, what you're referring to is likely the "god phone", although this isn't typically what people mean when they say they're having conversations (from what I've seen). Some people claim to have the ability to hear the gods, sometimes as if having a conversation with another human person or sometimes in other forms. This is honestly not as common of an ability as what the internet might make you think. I only really see it popularized on sites like TikTok, and TikTok is VERY well-known within the community on Tumblr to be incredibly untrustworthy as a source of information. Don't feel bad if you don't have this ability; most people don't. I've also met quite a few people who claim to have this ability and are actively lying about it, so please remember to use your critical judgement, and know that you are never obligated to take "advice" someone who claims to have this ability is giving.

There are, however, other ways of having a conversation with deities. The use of "divination" is an extremely common one and is typically what people who refer to "speaking to the gods" are talking about. I highly recommend looking at my pinned post and going to the section titled "Deities & Entities". I have a TON of resources there, specifically for beginners. In the "Divination" section of my pinned post, you can find various methods of divination. It's more than normal to not be immediately perfect at divination, so don't sweat it if you make some mistakes. There's absolutely nothing wrong with messing up, especially since you're still learning! Try not to be hard on yourself about it, ok?

I hope this was helpful. Take care, and best wishes to you on your journey! 🧡

[seasaltdevotion]

Khaire! (hello/be well)

Never feel bad about asking!

The gods will not ever really dislike an offering. They know when you offer something you mean well and they appreciate anything you’d give them. They’d send some very obvious signs if you somehow managed to upset them, but honestly? Don’t worry about it. They’re not going to be upset by an offering, at least not that I’ve ever heard of.

Yes! You can always stop working with a god. The gods know that this is a polytheistic religion, and sometimes you don’t need the help they can provide you anymore. And sometimes even they will tell you, that they have given you what you need and the rest is up to you. They won’t be upset at you for changing your practice.

They’re not going to be upset about altar space. Many people are unable to create a physical altar space in general. They’ll just be happy you’re dedicating things to them, sending them prayers etc. if anything, I use a shared altar space for all of my gods and offer everything there, and tell the gods if it’s for all of them or if it’s specifically for one god that I need to offer it to at the time.

You don’t *need* anything to worship. I can’t recall who said this but, a Helpol I learned this stuff from said something along the lines of, “all you need to worship is your own body”

Basically as long as you dedicate your time to praying, or dedicating things you do to the gods, or just straight up talking to them/thanking them, that’s enough. I’ve literally gone outside and collected rocks and flowers and put them on my altar space because it reminded me of them. Also, gaining more knowledge on the gods themselves is a devotional act. Theoi.com is a great resource

TLDR;

the gods will usually love your offerings

Your practice will change, the gods will not be upset with any of these changes

You don’t need a physical altar for all the gods you worship (digital altars like Pinterest boards are also an option)

All you need to worship is yourself, no physical resources required

Sorry this post is so long, I wanted to hit on everything! I’m also not the end all be all on this stuff, I’m not a veteran Hellenic polytheist or anything, but this is just my two sense.

Good luck on your journey, and never feel bad for asking questions.

Blessed be! 🌊

yes that previous post was a lead in to this post so!!!!! a list of stupid helpol questions I have that I feel stupid for asking!!!! - how do the gods tell you they don't like your offering? do they send signs? can you say sorry to them if they don't like it? - are you allowed to stop working with a god? is that mean? will they feel bad? - I know you don't have to give physical offerings but does it make the gods feel bitter if you only have an alter dedicated to one god? I have an Apollo alter, yet I worship Apollo, Zeus, Hermes and Demeter. is that favoritism? will they be mean to me? - do you have to own lots of books and stuff to be a worshipper? are you allowed to give the gods smaller offerings like giving your friend a rock? is that inadequate? sorry but more experienced helpols pls adopt me and teach me and answer if you can :(

[screeching-0wl]

Hi I saw you are devotee to Ares and Apollo. If personal feel like I would get so much growth from Ares but for me the way I associate him is kind of intense, rage, and like my father(stern and easily tempered) not that any of those things are bad because I’m the same way. I feel like he would help no be so intense but at time I feel like working with him would be so intense because of everything he would teach and unpack (sorry for the rambling). I just don’t know where to start or learn more about him before reaching out. Any tips, advices, or anything.

Hi there!

Ares is quite helpful when it comes to things of that kind. He's helped me a lot with managing my emotions (especially anger), accepting and expressing them, etc.

He can be stern when it comes to certain things but I don't think he's as quick-tempered as the media portrays him to be. Funny enough, I'd say he's one of the most patient, understanding and gentle gods I've worked with. I found it quite surprising, especially in the beginning because of all the media portrayals, the fact that he's the god of war and often war can be all but that and because I just didn't know him enough. Overall, although he has some associations with such strong emotions as anger, I think that his passion might sometimes be mistaken for a quick temper, but that's just my personal opinion.

Ares can be pretty intense to work with and as you said, working on such things, unpacking all of that can also be quite intense and challenging in and of itself but that doesn't mean it's worthless. Just remember to adjust the work for yourself depending on what you need, set boundaries, communicate (just casual talking is fine, it doesn't always have to be divination or prayer; he can hear you) and if it gets too intense with all the emotions take a break if you need it. It's also fine to stop if you need that. Don't forget about self-care and your own personal needs.

Theoi.com is always a good resource to learn about the gods and their mythology. The website has a library where you can find plenty of classical texts which might be helpful as well. Hymns (e.g. Homeric Hymns) are also good.

You could do research about his lovers, children (divine and mortal) and companions. He's a family guy, so he would defo appreciate it.

You could also learn about how and where he was worshipped in ancient times. There's plenty of information about that in the cult sections on Theoi.com.

I have some info about Ares on already my blog and I'm working on writing some more posts about him. I made some cheat sheets for the Hellenic Gods so maybe this cheat sheet could be also useful.

Hope this helps!

[breathed-full]

POSEIDON EPITHETS / SURNAMES

Poseidon Gaienokhos - Holder of the earth.

Poseidon Ennosigaios (Ἐννοσίγ��ιος) - Earth Shaker

Poseidon Soter - “Savior”; Savior of Sailors, for when people wanted to be protected at sea.

Poseidon Aspha’lius/Asphaleius - “Of safety” ; He who grants safety to ports and navigation

Poseidon Prosbaterios - “Of Approaches” ; For safe approaches at harbor

Poseidon Prosklystios - “The Flooder”

Poseidon Gene’sius - The Father

Poseidon Pontomedon - Lord of the Sea

Poseidon Anax - King, Lord, Master

Poseidon Basileus - “The Lord, King” ; Aboard ships or in his cities

Zeus Einalios - Zeus of the Seas

Poseidon Aglaotriaina - He of the bright trident

Poseidon Eutriaina - Of godly trident

Poseidon Asphaleios (ασφάλεια) - “Of safety/security”; Protector/Averter of the earthquakes, for those on dry land.

Poseidon Hedraios - “with a Firm Base” ; Protection from earthquakes

Poseidon Themelioukhos - “Holder of Foundations”

Poseidon Hippios (ἲππειος) - “Of the horses” ; Creator and tamer of horses, for those having trouble taming horses, or if your horses were sick or in danger.  Also for protection of horses during storms, warfare, droughts, etc, as well as perform in competitions or when the distance to travel is long.

Poseidon Hippokourios - “Horse-tender”

Poseidon Nymphayaetis - Leader of the nymphs, for those asking for help to influence the behavior of nymphs.

Poseidon Tau’reus - The divinity that gave great pasture to bulls on the sea-cost, and/or it is to him that the bulls were sacrificed.

Poseidon Epoptes - “Watcher, Overseer” ; For he saw everything that happened at sea

Kyanochetis (κυανοχαίτης) - "Dark (or Blue) -Haired", like the sea

Phykios (φύκιος) - “full of seaweed"

Poseidon Epilimnios - He of all lakes

Poseidon Kymothalis - Abounding with waves

Poseidon Prosklystios - “Who Dashes Against”

Poseidon Phytalmius - “Nurturer of Plants” ; likely due to the fact that Poseidon’s trident created the springs that provided water to vegetation.

Poseidon Khamaizelos - “Seeking the Ground” 

Poseidon Baructupos - Loud thundering, Heavy sounding (also of Zeus)

Poseidon Tropaios - “Of Route” ; (Poseidon receives that title, normal in the cult of Zeus, by Sarpedon’s troops to perhaps celebrate the paradoxical routing of an army on land by the god of the sea)

Poseidon Pater - “Father”

Poseidon Patroios - “Of the Forefathers”

Poseidon Laoites - “Of the People”

Epithets/Names of Poseidon Based on Location:

Poseidon Pelagios (Πελάγιος) -  "belonging to the sea" in Ionia

Poseidon Petraeus - He who separated the rocks, between which the river Peneius flows into the sea. Among the Thessalians.

Poseidon I’sthmius - The god worshipped on the Isthmus (of Corinth), in honour of whom the Isthmian games were celebrated.

Poseidon Pelagios - “of the Sea”, at the southern tip of the peninsula of Sinai

RESOURCES (in no particular order):

Greek Gods Abroad - Names, Natures, and Transformations by Robert Parker Oakland, CA

The Gods of Ancient Greece - Identities and Transformations by Jan N Bremmer and Andrew Erskine

theoi.com * Please be careful with theoi.com, latest updates are more on the clickbait-y type; however has pretty good information for starters- just remember to fact check everything!

Hellenicgods.org * It has come to my attention that this site is like an actual dumpster fire lmao so I wanted to come here with an edit/update to say to not use this site!! I used this briefly, only to scan over the spellings to check for consistencies, and everything else in this post was checked majorly from the books mentioned and the other resources. Thank you so much to @thegrapeandthefig​ for pointing this out!

wikipedia.com * Wikipedia just looks bad, man.. but their page on Poseidon is pretty good- Just fact check everything ! 

study.com * You need to pay, which SUCKS but is pretty good from what I was able to read

polytheistramblings.wordpress.com * Be careful with blogs - always fact check!

[coyoteskies]

Um I'm a baby pagan and I wanted to ask about Aphrodite as I want to contact her and worship her and wanted tips on how to do that and how to speak to her. Thank you for your time and I love your witchblr.

Hello!! Thank you. 💜

Well for a general get to know vibe -- read some mythology about her! But keep in mind that the myths can be interpreted a number of different ways. theoi.com is a good resource.

Another way is to use tarot - or any type of divination you do/have access to - and ask what aspect of herself she is presenting to you, her goals for you, how she sees you, how she'd feel about working with you, etc. Like a little interview. I would act like this is a conversation tho. If you don't like something, say it, then pull another card to see if she can adapt to that. This is a relationship you're building so don't forget you have input too. (If you want I can make a full list of suggested questions to ask)

If you're good at meditating you can use meditation to try and connect with her energy and see if you vibe with it. I didn't fully know what Aphrodite was going to mean to me until I felt her energy for the first time. Please ward yourself and your space first though because sometimes mean to connect with a certain deity or spirit and end up with someone else.

Don't feel bad if you do research and/or get to know her and decide this isn't the path for you. I bounced off of at least 5 different gods before I came to Aphrodite. There is no time limit for how long your getting comfortable period should take, and no requirement to devote yourself. Some people worship, some people devote themselves, etc.

It took me I think...3 months before I had my "ah ha" moment. And then I took a year break at one point.

So, yeah, my point is; make sure you're comfortable and know that your path is unique to you and no one else.

I kinda forgot if there was a specific question the second sentence in (bad memory 😅) so I hope this helps!

[embervoices]

If you wrote a “missing scene” in your fics, what would it be? I write a lot of those scenes, actually. They're just sitting in a file somewhere, and may or may not get shared later. I still want to write a version of the Winter Palace chapter from Canticle of Dreams from the perspectives of the other characters. EmberQuizzy's angle on it is extremely limited.

Who is your favorite character in Subsequent Shenanigans and why? Oh, probably Lai, who is, of course, based directly on @laikiirnodel with their active help whenever possible. I am similarly very fond of Raven in I Meant To Do That: The Inquisitor Coyote Story, because my friend SeabhacMhor does a great job writing them.

What’s a trope, AU, or concept you’ve never written, but would like to? I would love to try my hand at Sex Pollen sometime, but I fear I'd just fail to make it interesting, and it's an easy trope to do poorly.

Are there any easter eggs in your fic, and if so, what are they? Generally, my self-insert fics are going to be much, much funner to people who actually know me. One fic, from the EmberQuizzy Chronicles, Execution, is full of references to other settings, which are tagged. That much is obvious enough. But if you look closely at the wording, there are pun references to the specifics. e.g. "the waters closed in time with the last notes of an ocarina fading on the breeze" "Gasping wildly for breath" and "The caves were dank in the twilight," for the Legend of Zelda section, referencing Ocarina of Time, Breath of the Wild, and Twilight Princess, respectively. The cheesiest is probably "dizzily landing on one knee" for when she gets to Disneyland.

What other websites or resources do you use most often when you write? Fandom wikis to look up specific bits of canon. YouTube videos to remind me of specific scenes visuals or dialogue. Wikipedia, IMDB, etc. to remind myself of basic facts of reality Thesaurus, RhymeZone, TVTropes to remind myself how writing works. And, because I tend to write religious themes: Sacred-Texts.com, Theoi.com, BibleGateway.com, etc.

Would you rather write a fic that had no dialogue or one that was only dialogue? I'm pretty sure I've tried both, though I can't say I've posted them anywhere. I'm probably more likely to do all dialogue.

How long did it take to write Canticle of Dreams? Describe the process. Uhhhhh… 3 years, plus a few months? I wrote the first 100k words of the 324+k words currently posted in the Emberquizzy Chronicles in 6 weeks, and then proceeded to spend the next few years writing the rest whenever my brain would cooperate, basically.

Does anyone read your fics before you post them? If so, who?Hopefully several people! It varies who, but the most common is @auntieashleydark who happens to be a pretty darned good story editor, as well as my girlfriend.

What songs would be (or are) on a playlist for your fics? Explain your choices if you want! Ngh, I don't tend to do playlists for fics this way, so I don't have an answer handy, sorry.

Have you ever written something that was out of your comfort zone? If so, what was it, and how did it affect your approach to writing fic thereafter? I mean, writing fic at all was initially out of my comfort zone. The first few times I tried to write fiction, the bad parts kinda came true for the real people I'd written them about. So I got scared off. That's also why I don't write realistically bad stuff happening to any real people even now - just in case. But the next up were sex scenes, and a seriously fucked up, angsty headspace, both of which went well enough when I got help!

Questions for Fic Writers

from @clumsyclifford

(Note: All my fics are accessible to AO3 members only, sorry!)

What fic of yours would you recommend to someone who had never read any of your work? (In other words, what do you think is the best introduction to your fics?) Probably CHEESE! or Initial Summoning for Dragon Age and Good Omens, respectively.

Go to your AO3 “Works” page, to the sidebar with all the filters, and click the drop-down arrow for “Additional Tags.” What are your top 3-5 most used tags? Do you think they accurately represent your writing habits? Unsurprisingly: Self-Insert (12), Humor (10), Alternate Universe - Canon Divergence (10), Fluff (8), There's also: Modern Girl in Thedas (12) but that's because 11 of them are from one series. I'm bemused that "Silly" only has 4 entries. It really should probably apply to almost all of them. To be honest, I think I'm spotty at best at tagging.

What are some tropes or details that you think are very characteristic of your fics? Religious themes, especially polytheism and spirit work. Unapologetic self-insert. Silly humor.

What detail in your fic are you really proud of? I'll have to think about it. I'm often surprised what lands well despite my thinking it would be horrible… The two things that come immediately to mind I don't think I've shared yet. First is that I experimented with writing the same paragraph of Solas' thoughts, first in prose, then Iambic Pentameter, and to scan with Leonard Cohen's Halleluia. That was because people were conflating the ballad meter of Halleluia with "Iambic Pentameter" because they noticed the Iambic part. But I just thought it was really pretty. I haven't had any reason to share it, though. Maybe on Tumblr now I'm back, I dunno. Second is in a self-indulgent fic I was writing with my co-writer Cowoline. If we ever get around to posting any of it remains to be seen, but there's one scene where one character is reading to another character some terrible purple prose, translating out of Orlesian on the fly. To get that text, I took some of my own romance scene writing from an earlier story and shoved it through at least French, and then back to English via Google Translate. The results were indeed appropriately terrible.

What do you wish someone would ask you about your fics? Answer it now! Nothing comes to mind. I am not sure I'm reticent enough for this to be a big problem. LOL

What’s one fact about the universe of The Canticle of Dreams that you didn’t get a chance to mention in the fic itself? EmberQuizzy isn't actually human. Her soul/spirit is made of Vanic material, not human material. She only appears human because it's what she expected to look like. Thus it's quite possible her and Solas' children will indeed have pointed ears.

Any worldbuilding you’re particularly proud of? Mostly whenever it catches me by surprise that some arbitrary decision early on actually clicks perfectly info place later.

What song would make a great fic (to either write or read)? I have a whole series of images in my head for making a Good Omens comic out of Ghost by the Indigo Girls, but I don't have the artistic chops, nor the patience to do it myself, and it's too much to commission another artist to do. So it'll have to wait until/unless I can find someone who will do it as a collaboration rather than a commission, which seems… unlikely, and possibly unfair. Mind you, if I had the spare money lying around, there are several GO Fan artists I'd commission to do it in a heartbeat!

How do you find new fic to read? Mostly, by filtering AO3 searches. Occasionally one or another fan group I'm in will post a rec that gets my attention, or a friend will ask me to read their thing.

How do you decide what to write? It attacks me in my sleep!

[oracleofapollo]

Where do I Start? Where did you start?

So I get this question a lot and I want to go into more details and have a longer post for everyone to reference. You are just starting out as a Hellenic or you are still on the fence and you have no idea where to start. Hopefully this post will help get you on the right path.

For many of us we came from families devote to a single god and in a community much the same with very few readily available resources except one. The internet. However it’s large and full of bad information and peoples opinions and you never know what’s what and it takes forever to figure it all out. I’ve been navigating it for 3 years specifically looking up the most accurate websites and resources and finding ways to use it’s easily accessed tools to explore my beliefs. So o start here are places I go when I need more information or just want some light reading and the tools I use to connect to the ancients who set the foundations of this religion.

*Google Maps

So there are no temples or places I can go to worship. So I often find myself on Google maps using the street view to get up close to the temples I am most drawn to and will often use this during rituals to feel closer to the gods I am worshiping. My favorite to oogle at is the temple of Hephaestus in Athens and the Parthenon. There is even a beautiful hill you can find on the maps not far from Hephaestus’s temple that you can see both from beautifully. 

*Theoi.com

This site has been my best friend. I’ve been a Hellenic for 14 years and yet just 3 years ago there was still much I didn’t know simply because all I had was a few small books from my local library that barely told me anything. Theoi.com really changed that. It gave a lot of information on gods, heroes, nymphs, and myths. They give you their sources, quotes from literature, and do their best to tell everything they can. 

*Hellenicgods.org

I just recently found this and am still exploring it, but it’s value is great. It gives so much detail. It’s written very much essay style so if that’s hard for you to learn from keep that in mind, but I personally have found it to explain things so thoroughly that I have little to no questions after reading whatever I have looked into on it. 

* Hellenion.org

This site is a two folder. It’s a great resource and has rituals and a Attic Calendar with festivals and holidays on it. It is also a community. Once a year, if I recall correctly, they take applications and for a yearly fee you become part of the community and are able to take classes and work towards goals like becoming a clergy and opening temples with them. I haven’t joined the community yet but I hope to someday when I can. 

*Greekgodsandoddesses.net

This one is’t the best resource for learning things but it is good to go to for a quick list of most if not all the gods and goddesses. It also has lists of the ancient heroes, creatures, and some of the myths. So it’s a good place to go when looking for quick looks and very basic information.

*Hellenion Calender

As I said in Hellenion’s blurb it has a calender. This is such a useful tool so I will link it right Here. I use it often to keep track of which festivals I need to prepare for each month.

*chs.harvard.edu

This may seem weird but as their little logo on the site says they are the center of Hellenic studies. I often look up information on the Homeric hymns on it. Remember that this site is a college and information will be more essay like and written most likely from professors or students and not from other Hellenics persay. Still an amazing resource

Books are also a great place to start and there are so many out there that weren’t when I was starting out. Now sadly I have been unable to read all of them, I’ve been limited by money to the bare basics for now, but here are ones that I have read and ones that I have gotten recommended by good sources

* Oracle of Apollo

I am currently reading this. It’s amazing and details different divination styles and how divination came to be even before Apollon. Wonderful read.

*The Iliad and the Odyssey

Where better to start than from an ancient writer who lived during the golden days of the gods. 

*Hellenic Polytheism: Household Worship

This is personally on my “read next” list. You can find this and the rest of this list on Amazon. 

* Komos: Celebrating Festivals in Contemporary Hellenic Polytheism

* Kharis: Hellenic Polytheism Explored

*Hellenic Polytheism: A Personal Guide for Ancient Greek Practitioners

* Harnessing Fire: A Devotional Anthology in Honor of Hephaestus

* From Cave to Sky: A Devotional Anthology in Honor of Zeus

*Ok I could keep copy and pasting these devotional anthologies by name, but let’s make this simplier. The author Bibliotheca Alexandrina writes these you can find them all on Amazon and she has a ton. Check her out. Harnessing fire, Unbound, and With Lyre and Bow are in my cart waiting for me o buy them. She has ones for Hecate, Persephone, and more.

Community is also a great place to start. Like here on Tumblr. Don’t be afraid to ask questions, find friends, and interact. Talking to others, both already deep into it and just starting out, can help you majorly. You’ll get to see what others think of the different gods and get a glimpse of the theoi’s other sides through others who worship them. This beautiful religion is blooming in this modern time and has roots in the ancient world. It brings together people of all walks and ties together old and new. Everyone is welcomed and everyone is accepted. So feel free to reach out when you need it. If by chance you find someone not so ideal remember they aren’t the spokesperson of the religion. Try again. There are people, like myself, with their doors always open to help. Enjoy this journey you’re on. Whether this is your life long path or a temporary stroll enjoy it. This religion has so much to offer for worshipers and those who are just curious. 

[eyesinawe]

🕊 30 Days of Aphrodite: Days 17-21 🕊

Based on @thepastelpriestess’ questionnaire

Where do you most find/feel Aphrodite?

Seeing pictures of sunlight on water. Passing rose bushes on my way to the gym. Hanging around naked in my house, when I’m indulging in my own confidence and feeling gorgeous. Hanging at her altar, when all lights are off but my pink salt lamp and I’m basking in the glow of her light and love.

What are some resources that you used to help you get closer to Aphrodite?

I’ve used Theoi.com and just perused a lot of devotee blogs on Tumblr!

Plan a special ritual in honor of Aphrodite and your love for her

I was planning on just sitting with her and writing out some intentions/things to her.

Full Moon Time! Do the ritual and share how it went!

I went out to be in the light of the moon and wrote out a letter in my devotional journal, as well as devotional intentions and some (bad, unfortunately) poetry.

Share some movies you associate with Aphrodite

I strangely can’t think of movies I really associate with her! There are movies that feel like they should be obvious choices but they don’t actually feel right.

If I had to choose, I think I’d say Lost In Translation and Her. They’re both so beautiful and soft and melancholic and make me feel the beautiful ache of love. They were there when I was alone and wondering if I’d ever find love. They were there after I found love, and felt the hard parts of having found my person. I love also that they’re a dialogue between two directors who loved each other but could ‘t work it out.

[breathing-in-gilded-dust]

Khaire Amaranta! I just read your post about Hellenismos and depression, and I really loved the part that said "It takes time to heal, and the gods, millenias old, know that. They do, and they have waited to hear from you long before you were even born. Heck, before you discovered them." Would you care to speak more about the idea of... I don't know how to word it... destiny? to find the gods eventually? Thank you!

Khaire! Thanks for the compliment, I really appreciate it. I’m always happy to help, and I’d love to talk about destiny/fate and how I view its place in Hellenic Polytheism! Keep in mind that I am not in school for classics or research (yet... muhahahaha) and I may be off on some things. My friends, @sisterofiris  and @honorthegods are amazing with it, though, and definitely have resource pages if you want to explore this particular topic some more. I believe both of them are classics majors? I know for sure that @sisterofiris is, and I really think @honorthegods is, too, but I don’t remember. Sorry for the rambling/excess info, maybe? I have had a long week lol. Anywho, this is how I view it!

I look to plays, epics, mythos, hymns, and the different cults of the gods when looking for information on historical viewpoints, which I tend to agree with most often. For example, we can see that Xenia (a hospitable, pleasant, caring and respectful guest-host and host-guest relationship) has a really heavy influence on Odysseus in The Odyssey. A few sources I am pulling for this belief of mine are:

Oedipus Rex

the presence of the oracles (Delphi, Dodona, etc)

the existence and acknowledgement of the Moirai (fates) & Ananke

I personally believe that we have free will, and can make our own decisions, but our fates are known before we are born (at least, in part). We each have an undeniable destiny, however, how we reach it is entirely up to you... along a certain set of lines. We have a set of resources that will get us to a vague endpoint, whatever that may be. But (this is where I don’t know the historical viewpoint on my opinion), I think the future is malleable in regards to which destiny we follow. Which may be the wrong word at this point. 

Let’s take Oedipus for example. Oedipus’ parents did some questionable things, which set him off on the wrong foot, according to Tiresias (an oracle/prophet). However (and this is just my belief), he could have overcome that through following and finding the will of the gods. Instead, he let his tragic flaw (his anger and violence) rule him, and his ‘bad’ destiny path was followed. After a certain point, he couldn’t turn back, and the number of paths quickly narrowed to one. The way Oedipus lived determined his final destination. 

Another thing that supports the existence of some kind of fixed destiny is the presence of the oracles all throughout ancient Hellas. For example, if someone were to visit the oracle at Delphi, they would seek answers that are very fixed. They believed that what Apollon shared with the oracles, who in turn shared with the querent, was the truth. This is significant. However, the answers the oracles gave were oftentimes vague, and sometimes warned against doing certain things. For example, an oracle once advised King Croesus on whether or not to attack a certain area. She responded with “a great empire shall fall”, and he attacked. unfortunately, it was his empire that was destined to fall. If he had chosen to steer away from this attack, his destiny would be very different. He had free will, even after hearing what could happen if he followed his original path of destiny.

Besides these examples, there are a couple of deities that I feel are worth mentioning under this discussion. First, the Moirai, the Fates, are goddesses who are said to spin, measure, and cut the lives of all mortals. Obviously, the have some kind of control, yes? I’ve never been too sure how much, but I doubt they control our will. They hold the threads of life, the breath, blood, and body of who we are. Ananke, a more obscure primordial goddess, was said to be the driving force of “necessity, compulsion and inevitability. In the Orphic cosmogony she emerged self-formed at the dawn of creation--an incorporeal, serpentine being whose outstretched arms encompassed the breadth of the cosmos” (theoi.com page for Ananke). The simple fact that she is tied both to necessity and inevitability tells me she has some hold on the force that comprises destiny. 

The reason I believe free will exists is partially due to the fact that we are urged to do certain things to please the gods and be more virtuous. pursuing excellence, being polite and hospitable, pursuing wisdom... It’s all something we are asked--not forced--to do. The Delphic maxims are another example that shows we are asked to do things, not forced. The fact that they come from the dwelling place of my belief in destiny really helps me corral everything into one piece of personal truth. 

I hope this is helpful, and makes sense despite my terrible rambling! Let me know if you need anything else or just want to chat! :)

[ad-ciu]

Of Gods and Dice: Conclusions

The depiction of the ‘Celtic’ Pantheon in Dungeons and Dragons, Fifth Edition is a good example of the general failings to make resources on ‘Celtic’ religions and mythology accessible to the general public. There are several notable issues, and challenges that the presentation of these Deities illustrates rather clearly to us.

For people who are not particularly bothered about my thoughts on this matter, I’ll start this post off with a collection of updated or revised information for the ‘Celtic’ Pantheon if anyone wants to look at that specifically. If you would like to read my rationalizations for any of these, check out the individual posts linked below. 

The Dagda - The Good God - Link

Alignment: Neutral Good.

Domains: Knowledge, and War.

Holy Symbol: A Cauldron.

Arawn - Lord of Annwn - Link

Alignment: Lawful Good or Lawful Evil.

Domains: Trickery, Grave (XGtE).

Holy Symbol: Head of a Hound with Red-Gold Ears.

Belenus - The Defender of Aquileia - Link

Alignment: Neutral Good. (No Evidence Remains)

Domains: Light.

Holy Symbols: Six Spoked Solar Wheel.

Brigantia - Teutates of the Brigantia - Link

Alignment: Neutral Good. (No Evidence Remains)

Domains: War.

Holy Symbols: Spear in a River.

Dian Cécht - The God-Physician - Link

Alignment: Neutral Evil.

Domains: Life.

Holy Symbols: Medicine Bag.

Dunatis - The Bulwark Upon The Mount - Link

Alignment: Neutral Good. (No Evidence Remains)

Domains: War or Protection (Unearthed Arcana).

Holy Symbols: A single stone taken from a hillfort.

Goibhniu - The God-Smith - Link

Alignment: Lawful Good.

Domains: Forge (XGtE).

Holy Symbol: Spearhead with three small hammers around it.

Lugh - The God of Upper Social Classes - Link

Alignment: Chaotic Neutral.

Domains: War, Trickster.

Holy Symbol: Spearhead.

Manannan mac Lir - God of the Sea - Link

Alignment: Chaotic Good.

Domains: Tempest, Trickery.

Holy Symbol: Ship with no sail.

Math Mathonwy - God of Judgement - Link

Alignment: Lawful Good.

Domains: Nature, Life.

Holy Symbol: Staff.

The Morrígan - The Great Queen - Link

Alignment: Chaotic Neutral.

Domains: War, Trickery.

Holy Symbol: Raven’s head in profile.

Nuadu - The Lost King - Link

Alignment: Lawful Good.

Domains: Protection (Unearthed Arcana).

Holy Symbol: A silver hand.

Oghma - The Champion - Link

Alignment: Neutral Good. (Not Really Established)

Domains: War, Knowledge

Holy Symbol: Ogam Stone.

Silvanus - Why Is He Here? - Link

Totally Got Uninvited.

I think they meant to invite Cernunnos.

But someone mixed up the address.

There are a few things I would like to spend some time looking at in relation to what we can learn about the accessibility of ‘Celtic’ Mythology to the general public from this. Firstly, the notion of a ‘Celtic’ Pantheon existing.

So, there is no such thing as a ‘Celtic’ Pantheon, at all. I discuss this here, my very first post from this collection. I find this to be a very interesting common misconception, but it makes sense. We, and by ‘we’ I mean ‘the modern Western World’ ‘get’ several Pantheons. The Greco-Romans, the Norse, and the Egyptians in descending order of how much we ‘get’ them. The differentiation between Greek and Roman Deities is something I am seeing more of online, people are getting that these entities are very different in several cases. Ares-Mars being the biggest in my mind. This is, I suspect, due to the massive presence classical texts still have in our world. The Song of Achilles (which I find problematic in a few ways, but it’s popularity interests me), the Percy Jackson series, all that. The Classical world still has a big presence in our pop culture, and the information out there with exceptions made to Persephone and Hecate, tend to be fairly good.

Comparatively to this, the resources out there for the ‘Celts’ is utter trash. I did a little experiment a few days ago and checked out the first page of results of ‘Celtic Mythology’ on Amazon. Utterly terrifying. Some good stuff! Some horrifically bad stuff, and the horrifically bad stuff is way more alluring, sweetly scented rot. Celtic Mythology: A Concise Guide to the Gods, Sagas and Beliefs by Hourly History is uncomfortably bad. Celtic Mythology: A Captivating Guide to the Gods, Sagas and Beliefs (I literally only just now noticed the similarities in names... strange) by Matt Clayton at Captivating History is even worse with a splash of climate change denial. And that’s just from the first three results.

The notion that there was a ‘Celtic’ Pantheon is perpetuated by works like these, accessible, sweet smelling, rot that is peddled to the general public in a more accessible way than Celtic Studies is managing to produce. This is what consider the ‘First Hurdle’ for the field to deal with, to educate the general public enough to realize that just as the Romans and Greeks are rather different, so too are the Irish, Gauls, Brythonic Britain, Manx, Welsh, Picts, Cornish, and Galatians. 

The second important note I think we can see with the presentation is that the the author was using some sort of dictionary of Celtic Mythology to write the Deities here. As I discussed in several of my posts, the authors got just enough points about the Deities to make an okay guess at their details, but lacked the details of the culture that spawned them, or the actual features of their character to properly develop an alignment or holy symbol.

Further, I suspect that this was not the best dictionary due to the depictions of Math Mathowny, The Morrigan, Oghma, Brigantia, and Lugh. They have some telltale marks of curious depictions, such as Math being a horrible evil person, Lugh just being Lug, Brigantia and Oghma having their military functions filed off, and The Morrigan just being depicted oddly. 

This again comes back to the utter proliferation of bad resources, bad money drives out good. The abundance of dodgy resources creates a level of ‘noise’ that accurate depictions can’t pierce. Honestly, I think the only way to resolve this well is to take a lesson from the creator of Theoi.com, and put an enormous amount of effort into forging something as brilliant as that for the general public. It would be really hard... maybe a good PhD project... hm. Anyways, yeah.

Oh, and, I still don’t know why Silvanus was invited. And someone should write on the notion of Dungeons and Dragons that nature is a non-morally aligned thing.

Until I can get my hands on Deities and Demigods, I’m going to look at Smite probably. I will sort something out.

[khaire-traveler]

Hey friend! I'm new to HelPol, and I'm working on learning more about it after coming out of some pretty rough views stemming from a bad Wiccan group I was in. (Very transphobic and not good for my mental health, seeing as it actually turns out I'm nonbinary myself)

Anyway, I was always drawn to the aspects very much taken from HelPol, and so I felt this would be a wonderful direction to go in, if not only temporarily. I'm wanting to be recon over revivalist, and I'm wondering if you have good resources for reading about the culture and life & times of ancient hellas? Thank you so much x

Hey, Nonny, thanks for the ask!

I'm sorry you had such a shitty experience. I hope you find a better experience within the helpol community. 🫂

I recommend checking out @theoi-crow 's blog and some of the links @crazycatsiren has on their pinned post (they have some great links in their Hellenic Polytheism Tag). If you're looking for books, The Iliad by Homer, Theogony by Hesiod, The Histories by Herodotus, and The Odyssey by Homer are pretty great in getting a feel for the way the ancient Greeks thought, spoke, and seeing values they held. The ancient authors are always a great place to start! Some websites I've also found helpful are Theoi.com and Hellion.org - the first specializes more in mythology, while the second specializes more on the modern Hellenic practices.

In all honesty, I've mostly been learning about things as I go, picking up information from educational articles and well-sourced Tumblr posts. I've been told Ancient Greek Cults by Jennifer Larson, Understanding Greek Religion by Jennifer Larson, and Polytheism And Society At Athens by Robert Parker are good books to check out, but truly, I would read translated versions of ancient authors first and foremost. They're the most direct sources you can get your hands on, imo.

I hope this helps you and that you're able to gain the knowledge you seek. May the light of Apollon guide you, friend! ☺️🧡

[will-o-the-witch]

Hi! I've been following you for a while now, and I've seen you post stuff about different gods and goddesess? I'm not sure where to start learning, but I've always felt drawn to forests and the wilderness: feeling like It's partially my job to help protect the plants and creatures that live there? I guess I'm asking if you have any tips / know of any gods or goddesses that are heavily nature based? ( thanks in advance!! Your blog is lovely! )

Heya! So I'm a Hellenic Polytheist so my knowledge is going to lie mostly with the Greek gods, but I do know there are nature-based deities basically everywhere! Some of the more popular Greek nature deities would be Gaea (literally the planet earth,) Pan (god of the Wild and forests,) Dionysos (god of wild greenery,) and Artemis (goddess of wild creatures and the hunt.) Theoi.com is an excellent resource for all of them! Perhaps some of my followers or other people viewing this can help with deities from other pantheons? Also, you could always look into spirit work and befriend the local spirits of your area and work directly with them as a protector and benefactor! They may not be deities but they can still range from very small to extremely powerful. Might not be a bad thing to do anyway if you decide to go down this path.

[adanaknowsbest]

Spiritual Influences

If you read my post addressing my plans for the upcoming year, you’ll remember that I want to be more active within the pagan tumblr community.  Well, this is the first step!  

I thought that before I post stuff out of my BoS, I would go over some of my biggest influences, so that you guys can get a feel of where I come from and the sort of energy I align myself with.  The only reason I’m sharing this without a BoS page is that I don’t have one addressing this... it’s something that has happened organically over the years, and can be found scattered throughout several of my journals.  

Christianity & Atheism

My introduction to spirituality was not part of my upbringing.  My parents didn’t practice any specific religion (though my Mom said we were Protestants and my Dad’s side were Southern Baptists).  My Mom in particular grew up in a very strict household and had memories of being forced to go to church, whether or not the kids in her family wanted to or believed in their faith.  She decided that her own children should have the freedom to choose.  

My sister, for example, became involved in a local Christian church, and my Mom had no problems whatsoever with sending her (with a friend and her friend’s family) to church.  She did this starting in junior high school (around 11/12 or so) and continued this on through most of high school (up until the latter half of junior year, when she started to get a bit rebellious and wild on the weekends).  

When we were young, my great-aunt (who raised my father after his parents died and acted very much like a grandmother to us) would take my sister and I on vacations to Virginia and Tennessee to visit extended family.  While she didn’t attend church up in Ohio (where we live), she did attend - and loved it! - down south.  Maybe it’s because there aren’t a lot of Baptists where she lived.  Maybe it’s because she was born in raised in Virginia and felt a connection there that was absent in Ohio.  I’m not sure.  But what I do remember is being forced to wear uncomfortable shoes, a dress I hated (all floral and hand-made by my cousin), and forced to sit for hours on an uncomfortable pew and being bored to tears.  Then we were all banished to the basement for more preaching, but this time in in uncomfortable plastic chairs.  

Sure, we were given Precious Moments bibles - which were, admittedly, adorable.  And yes, I even read the bible a time or two (or at least Genesis).  But I never felt that connection.  I didn’t feel drawn to Christianity.  It felt stifling to me, strict, and close-minded.  It squashed individuality and forced everyone to conform to a single world view.  If you were any different, you were welcoming the Devil into your life, arms wide open.  Everything bad was the Devil.  Everything good was the Devil.  My experience was all fear-based and highly misogynistic.  I was to marry and serve my husband, because that’s what God wanted.  I’ll have to go through the pain of childbirth because that’s the result of Eve’s sin.  I just didn’t get what drew people in.  It wasn’t for me.  

Because I felt nothing, I became convinced there was nothing to feel.  I was an atheist for all of a few months to a year.  

Wicca

When I was 13-ish, I pretty much lived at the library after school.  I devoured comics, read like crazy, and engaged in InvisionFree forums (because I didn’t have a computer at my own house).  The day I wandered around my library and found a section on religion was a profound day, because I found Scott Cunningham’s Wicca.  

Everything in that book just felt... right.  It featured very simple explanations (over-simplified in my current view, and some explanations completely lacking in depth) on the basics of Wicca.  The balance and duality felt right.  The fact that you relied on yourself - and not a clergy member - to connect with the divine felt right.  I loved that there was equality among genders, and that it felt so free.  It just hit home for me.  

After that, I identified as Wiccan, though it took many years for me to practice regularly.  

YouTube

But it wasn’t until about 7 years that I discovered the YouTube pagan community.  Once I did, my practice suddenly flourished in leaps and bounds.  People shared experiences, how-to videos, different methods and techniques, correspondences, rituals - even Book of Shadows flip throughs.  I was able to look up videos on different paths within Wicca specifically, and paganism as a whole.  It was wonderful.  I even made a few videos, although the quality was really horrid.  But from that moment on, YouTube claimed a very special place in my heart for sharing spiritual experiences.  

This is when I realized that I aligned far more with the old school thoughts on Wicca than many of the new.  If there was a traditional Wiccan group in my area, you can bet that I would have spent no time in making contact and considering whether or not I would be a good fit for their group.  

Don’t get me wrong; my path is rather eclectic, and I do take ideas from new age and modern Wicca/paganism, as well as a few things I pick up here and there from other magickal systems and paths.  But the core basis of my spirituality always comes back to Wicca, specifically Traditional Wicca (or as much as I can be traditional without formal training through a coven).  

I began doing (very light) research on Celtic and Norse systems, and touched on some Native American practices (mostly stuff like medicine wheels and smudging).  Watching YT videos of those who followed a path more aligned to Voudoun, Hoodoo and Voodoo were interesting - I picked up stuff like Hot Foot Powder and different methods of petitioning.  

When I started following LadyGravedancer, this part of my path opened up wide.  

Paganism (In General)

Back when I first discovered Wicca, it wasn’t as widely discussed or known as it is today (but far better than in the 70s, 80s and 90s).  It was right around the time that Charmed came out (maybe a few years before).  There was a lot of crap on the internet, so there wasn’t really a reliable source of research.  My local library had a very limited selection of books on the subject (other than Scott Cunningham’s Wicca and Living Wicca, and maybe a few mythology books; the rest was all aimed toward Judaism and Christianity), and since I had to go to the counter to request books not in the library, I was too shy and self-conscious to do it.  

But over time, I discovered small pocket communities of pagans that openly shared prayers, invocations, and methods of spellcrafting.  Once I realized that there were more options than just Wicca, it opened a whole new door for me.  

I began doing (very light) research on Celtic and Norse systems, and touched on some Native American practices (mostly stuff like medicine wheels and smudging).  Watching YT videos of those who followed a path more aligned to Voudoun, Hoodoo and Voodoo were interesting - I picked up stuff like Hot Foot Powder and different methods of petitioning.  

When I started following LadyGravedancer (now known as TheLadyGravedancer), among many others, this part of my path opened up wide.  

Hellenic Reconstruction/Hellenismos

This is something of a new influence for me.  I’ve always felt drawn to Ancient Greece.  I loved the mythology of it - I had several books of world and Greek mythology when I was young, and we covered several myths when I was in high school.  Something about the nature of Greek culture and religion really sparked something within.  

But following - or at least researching this path - really began when I found Elani Temperance on YouTube.  From there, I followed a link to her blog, and from there, links to other blogs with a Greek recon or revivalist bent.  I discovered theoi.com, which had TONS of historically accurate information about the culture and cults of various deities.  

I’m the sort of person who doesn’t enter into a new path lightly.  I do a ton of research, and preferably have the opportunity to talk to others who are already on that path about their experiences and practices.  While everything I’ve found thus far rings true to me - except, perhaps, the extensive idea miasma, which I’m still on the fence about, and the fact that Hellenes don’t practice witchcraft/magick - I have yet to actively practice this on a daily basis.  This is due mostly because the books I want that explore Ancient Greek culture and modern worship practices of Hellenismos tend to be a little on the more expensive side.  I have to take financial priorities into consideration before investing money into some of the books on my wishlist.  While $30 (including shipping and handling) may not seem a lot to some people, it’s a lot to me.  Many of the books that I’ve seen recommended as incredibly useful are out of print - some range in the $100s, especially when it’s dry research-based (which, as far as I can tell, tend to be the best resources). 

I have found an incredible Hellenic community on tumblr that offers a range of free information, though!  I’m at a point where I’ve spent the better part of a year reading and mulling over this path - it’s time I just stop with the excuses and dive in.  

Buddhism

Right around the time that I discovered how expensive Hellenismos would be, I decided to look into a path that had always interested me, but one that I had yet to really learn about:  Buddhism.  

It was mentioned as a formative part of CharmingPixieFlora’s channel (now Flora Sage), Kat Taylor’s channel (which I don’t remember the name of now, but it had a fair amount of discussion of how Buddhism was a formative part of her own practice) and a lot of more experienced pagans seemed to cross paths with Buddhism at some point in their spiritual exploration.  I downloaded a few free ebooks and began listening to lectures by Buddhist Monks on YouTube.  

What I found was a beautiful spiritual path, and one that would be compatible with virtually any religion I chose to follow, since it was more of a lifestyle than a religious system.  Ethics and morals - subjects already important and prevalent in my spiritual path - were emphasized and aligned with everything I already believed.  Many tenents of this path were already things that I had worked on, or things I acknowledged that I needed to continue working on (like not gossiping - I can’t help it, my family is crazy, and they’re always up to some hilariously scandalous stuff).  

What are your own personal influences on your spiritual path?  I’d love to know more about it!  Also, feel free to ask me anything - I’m an open book! 

[indornaga]

unfortunately not. since every culture and religion has different ways of going about teaching, there's no one-size-fits-all.

sometimes you can find a really helpful, indepth wiki like theoi.com, but the greek religion has a LOT of reconstructionists and a LOT of open practitioners.

plus, due to the nature of xenophobia, a lot of cultures closely guard their religious practices from people who dont seem serious about wanting to actually practice their religion. this is especially true for eastern religions in the west, where they're fetishised and appropriated to hell. (i have yet to find a good online resource for hinduism in english, since i dont trust Westernification and i'm really bad at learning new languages, so i know your pain.)

Alright, this may be a bit weird, but I’ve been kind of trying to figure out what I believe spiritually? Basically ever since I discovered my identity, it’s made me realize I don’t entirely know what belief system to subscribe to. 

Does anyone have any like, resources, to help me figure this stuff out?