#in a way that clearly really upsets lestat

[pynkhues]

I am very very curious about that tower scene because Sam said in an interview that he didn't think Lestat was at the tower voluntarily--so if Armand put him there, how much of Louis' memory of that scene is accurate? Lestat looks very well put-together for a prisoner, and how is he being kept there? So much about that scene felt intentionally odd (even, and you touched on this in your fic, that Lestat says that he wasn't kept in the room with the corpses/"disappointments", whereas he'd told Louis and Claudia that he was kept in a room with corpses).

I'm really curious too, anon! It definitely feels like one that's going to be revisited, probably in more ways than one given Magnus' tower is such a vital location across The Vampire Lestat, and it makes sense that Sam would say that too given Lestat's not there by choice in the book. Like you said, Armand takes him there after the trial (and pushes him out the window to debilitate him further) and I'm curious as to how much of that the show keeps. They've changed a few elements of that sequence already that I don't think can be reversed - like Claudia's dress ending up with Louis for instance, not Lestat - and the bigger fact of Louis seeing Lestat then at all when in the book Armand tells him Lestat died in the theatre fire even though he knows he didn't).

You're right though that it's an odd scene, both between how good Lestat looked (but then Louis' memories of how he looked at the trial too were coloured by other emotions given the revisited scenes at the end showed how unwell he actually looked) and that change in what Lestat tells Louis about where he was kept in Magnus' tower feels pointed given 2.08 spends quite a bit of time pointing out its own deliberate inconsistencies with s1 moments.

I think like a lot of these scenes, Louis' memory of it will be a partial truth, but it lacks the context that we have (and he now, at least, has some of). I also kiiind of imagine Lestat and Armand are probably talking to each other too with the mind link in that scene, but obviously we're not privvy to if that's happening or what it might entail yet.

I can't wait to see what they do with it.

[shesnake]

I wanted to know your thoughts on this but do you think it's fair to say either Louis or Armand are abusive in their relationship? Idek if this is a valid angle to view the characters from because I guess they're all monsters or whatever but a part of me thinks that it's kinda lukewarm to refuse to engage with the complicated themes of the show, which abuse is featured heavily and pretty clearly imo. This isn't aimed at you btw. Something I noticed is people tend to use some of Louis's less favorable moments to justify the violence he experiences. Like that post about Armand just matching Louis energy in ep 5, most of the notes are taking the stance that Louis is a cold, unempathic pimp who doesn't care about sa victims, that Armand genuinely is completely right when he says he is always cleaning up after Louis that he was only worried and tenderhearted and Louis escalated in the worst way and that after Louis said that he deserved everything that happened after. And I may be biased but to me that is so fucking crazy. To me it seems like fans, specially nonblack fans, have zero empathy for black abuse victims, actively enacting abuse culture even. But idk if that is a too reactive view. I don't want to say Louis isn't flawed because he is. But I mean we are watching the season about Armand getting Claudia killed on purpose and somehow people are still like Maybe Armand didn't do it, maybe it was all Louis, maybe Louis really asked for it. All of it. I think there's a problem there but idk I kinda feel a little crazy too. Btw disclaimer I fuckin hate Lestat this is not about comparing Loumand/Loustat lol

hi! and wow there is so much to discuss here...

I think it is fair to describe the actions of both Louis and Armand towards each other as abusive by definition but it's always important to remember that it is Armand in the position of greater power over him. Armand is older, stronger, owns dominion. He can walk in the sun, manipulate memories, and live without constant debilitating hunger for blood - all of which are things that impede Louis from being his own person outside of Armand.

Louis also faced this same predicament when he was with Lestat, but unlike Armand who uses his own innate powers against Louis, Lestat mostly used his social advantages of whiteness, wealth etc in addition to withholding key knowledge about vampirism to keep himself in control and Louis dependent on him.

and sure Louis can lash out all he wants! He can mock Armand's sexual trauma (trauma which Armand himself already gets them both to fetishise... but that's a whole different conversation...) he can hit back when Lestat hits him but when he's with either of those guys he is always going to be the victim. Nothing shitty he does to his partners, or to Claudia, or to Daniel, justifies what is being done to him by these men.

There absolutely has to be anti-blackness involved in any argument that says Louis deserves any of this. (Of course Armand as a brown South Asian man is not immune from fandom racism but his treatment is racialised in a different way that is also a different conversation). Any negative behaviour from a Black man is going to be seen by racists as exponentially more aggressive than it is, especially the cross-section with those you mentioned who aren't engaging with the complicated themes of this show exploring abuse.

They can see that Louis yelling at Armand is bad, but don't notice that Armand is being manipulative. They can see that Louis stabbing Lestat that one time during sex is bad (and still sexualise it), but don't notice that Louis is disassociating in every sex scene he has with Lestat afterwards (because they're too busy sexualising it). They can see that Louis making Daniel upset is bad, but don't notice that Daniel has been leveling dozens of racist and homophobic micro-aggressions at him since episode 1.

Armand got a few minutes to tell his tragic backstory in Louvre, Lestat had 2 or 3 different scenes in season 1 to recall his own. It's just been words. Meanwhile racists erase Louis' experiences with trauma because they never had enough fucking empathy for him to begin with to even register it happening to him! on screen! in real time! right in front of us!

And yeah Louis and Armand and Loumand are incredibly complex and compelling, and I do enjoy seeing Louis' moments of cruelty towards Armand! But he's never going to win against him in the game Armand built for him.

And in terms of Claudia, I do think that Louis failed her, as he has always failed her. And is responsible for her death in that regard. But that failure involved letting those other two fucking sharks eat her!!! I personally haven't seen anyone pushing the blame completely off Armand and onto Louis but I wouldn't be surprised. This week I've more pissed off about people levelling it all on Armand and think of Lestat as an unwilling participant.... this is of course the blonde white vampire show....

anyways sorry this is so long! thanks for the message this was really interesting to think about.

[cordyceph]

one big thing about iwtv i like is that Every character has flaws. even characters we're meant to unapologetically sympathize with in other medias

paul, for example, is a very clearly sick man whos sickness weighs on his family. in any other media, hed'd be virtually untouched by any flaw other than being tragically sick. in iwtv, the first time we see him he's harassing louis' prostitutes (and we Know its harrasment because she tells louis he wont leave and paul isnt listening when she tells him she isnt interested.) we also see paul detest levi- who he views as having taken away his sister- and then act borderline hostile to lestat- some weird white man who's come to take his last sibling away, by attacking something he Knows he can win (religion, implying that lestat is either a blasphemer or gay) (either way, living in sin)

i think the only character who is like not an asshole without reason to be is grace? because shes generally kind and understanding until louis endangers her kids, literally disappears for months, years, until their mother dies, until she has to 'kill' him in her mind. sure, she was aggressive and insulting at their mother's funeral, but like... i would be too. if my brother fucked off for who knows how long, comes back Wrong and more of an asshole than before, literally breaks a door down, threatens me? id be way more upset than she was. like shes kind of a saint compared to literally everyone else. armand? armand. need i say more. louis? half the show is 'look at louis be unnecessarily cruel to those around him' (claudia, daniel, armand, lestat) lestat. oh my god lestat. i want to study his brain and be like brother how do you have every disease.

claudia is kind of a special case because for as much as she acts grown shes permanently stuck in that fourteen year old era. i know i, when i was an unsupported mentally ill teenager, said horrible things i deeply regretted later on. claudia goes through that too, just by like... a hundred or so years more. its not until madeline really treats her like another adult woman that she acts more like. well. an adult. louis didn't treat her like an adult ever (as much as lestat did wrong by her specifically, i do think he treated her like an adult, but never a child. but thats for another ramble) anyway, claudia says awful things and does awful things because shes fourteen and being treated like a child, but shes an adult, but no one treats her like one. like babydoll from batman animated

daniel . daniellllllll. olllllld man. i lost my steam thinking about that old man im gonna be real. hes just really funny and pretty and smart and cool okay im gonna jackhammer that guys pelvis

[leslutdepointedulac]

Did Nicki really love Lestat?

I feel like there's sometimes a question in this fandom as to whether or not Nicki truly loved Lestat, or if it was all a 'ruse' of sorts. Some people will say that there was no love there, either at points, or just overall. But personally, I'm inclined to disagree. The way I see it, Nicki did genuinely love Lestat, especially at the beginning of their relationship.

They knew each other as children and, to an extent, they grew up together. This already puts them in a relatively close relationship with each other. This relationship between them starts out as just a friendship, but of course this evolves into something more.

When Nicki presents Lestat with the cloak, it's him who is acting rather flirty towards Lestat, not the other way around with him leaning into him and saying

"Only the impossible can do the impossible."

A week later when they're in the room at the inn, Nicki is the one who leans in and initiates that first show of intimacy, by kissing Lestat. Granted they were drunk at the time, but Nicki doesn't give me the impression he goes around kissing just anyone, even while intoxicated. I think the fact that they were drunk was just the perfect excuse/opportunity for Nicki to act on his feelings towards Lestat.

Further down the line, when they're in Paris - and at this point have been together for several months - Lestat returns to the theatre after his 'disappearance'. One of the first things the other actors do when Lestat initially arrives, is call Nicki to tell him that Lestat is back. And once he turns up to join the others in greeting Lestat, the actors immediately part to make way for Nicki to come through. I think they all knew there was a deeper level of connection between them. They share a very long and tender moment together, which the troupe allows without disturbance. Personally, I see that hug between them as coming from a place of love, heartbreak that they had been separated, and relief that they're back together again. Yes, Nicki had previously been, and still was angry and hurt that Lestat had supposedly left him, and without any warning. Especially considering Lestat was - as far as everyone else was concerned - perfectly fine during that time, only for him to turn up out of the blue with little to no explanation as to his whereabouts. I think Nicki's anger at this was partially down to Nicki being terrified at the thought he had lost his lover, and he couldn't hold his upset in.

Skipping forward to Nicki's turning, in my opinion, his very recently experienced trauma, combined with his already fragile mental state, were both amped up x100 by said turning.

The way I see it, Nicki got overwhelmed by the recent events and his mental condition clouded his mind causing him to lash out at the one person who he loved the most. Lestat. The reasoning for him lashing out at Lestat specifically, being because he was so immensely hurt by Lestat's disappearance, with him returning acting as though nothing had happened. This understandably angered Nicki, and mixed with his strong feelings for Lestat, it all bubbled up and exploded in their faces.

I think Nicki said what he said to Lestat during their last proper interaction, because he was deeply hurt and quite frankly, he just wasn't well. I don't think he was seeing/thinking clearly, and was probably also confused by the very sudden and drastic changes in his life. This led to him taking it all out on Lestat out of a need to blame someone for everything that had happened. Lestat just so happened to be the easiest and most obvious target for Nicki to let his anger out on.

Eleni tells Lestat in her letters to him, that even the mention of his name in Nicki's presence is enough to send Nicki over the edge. But I think this was down to his mental instability, along with his lingering hurt that had festered in his mind for so many years at that point; he wasn't in his right mind and so wasn't able to give appropriate reactions to his former lover.

Before Nicki goes into the fire, he gives his violin to Eleni, with the instruction to send it to Lestat. He also says how he had originally intended to give it to him the last time they saw each other, before Lestat left Paris. In my opinion, I don't see why Nicki would've had his violin that Lestat bought him, sent to Lestat, right before taking his own life. And there is a chance that he did this with malicious intent, as a way to taunt Lestat, but in my mind, I feel as though there was some lingering care left for him. I don't know that there was any love remaining on Nicki's part, I'll be honest, but I do there was some semblance of care left in him. I don't think this is something Nicki would admit to anyone, even himself, and I also don't know that he was aware of this - that it was more of a subconscious feeling. But I still think, regardless, there was something still in Nicki that cared even just a little bit for Lestat, albeit buried beneath the darkness in his mind.

Re: Nicki's interest in the violin and his comment about wanting to 'go down' in Paris, I think his initial interest in the violin was genuine. But when people around him *cough his father cough* told him to abandon the idea, that's when it turned into a thing of spite. However, I do believe there was still an honest love for playing. Even after Nicki had gone mad, playing the violin was something he turned to as a source of familiar comfort through his dark times.

As for Paris, it was Nicki's idea in the first place for both him and Lestat to run off (although, yes, it was more of a joke when he said it.) But I think he genuinely wanted him and Lestat to get away from the village that had been suffocating them both for so many years. When Nicki said he wanted them to 'go down', I think that was also as a result of his unstable mind, and his hurt at the recent events being taken out on Lestat. There may very well have been elements of truth in what he said, but overall, I think it's just yet another example of his inability to contain his pain.

Of course, none of this excuses the way Nicki treated Lestat in the end, but I think to simply say it was all because he didn't love Lestat is missing out on taking a deeper look into the reasons why he did and said those things. To denounce the love Nicki felt for Lestat seems unfair to me given his situation.

[cbrownjc]

Could you explain why you are ok with ep 5? I hated seeing, yet again, the battered body of a black character beaten to a pulp by his white partner, especially since such violence never happened between Louis and Lestat in the books. While I know white people can't understand and probably couldn't care less, I'm genuinely curious about your take on this.

Hi Anon!

Okay, first I'm sorry this reply back took the long time it did for me to answer it but, aside from wanting to think on it, RL things got in the way too. And then I also got caught up with some other writing I'm doing. And, as I said, I wanted to think this out before I wrote on it.

Now, first of all, it's actually not true wrt the books that Lestat and Louis never fought before. Someone other than myself has taken screenshots of passages in the book ITWV where such fights have happened. So I do not believe that it was out of character at all for them to have even had a fight in such a way, as such things did happen in the books. (And honestly, I didn't think it was OOC for Lestat at the time it happened before people started posting screenshots of the passages in the book that showed them fighting).

What has upset people is how visceral and beaten Louis looked by the end of that fight. (And no one is wrong for feeling that way if they do/did). It is disturbing to see a black man beaten in such a way by his white partner. And I actually don't think the writers were completely unaware of that imagery when they did this either. Not when you take into account the other pointed underlying racial dynamics the show did and highlighted throughout the season, before and after that episode. (From basically all of EP3, to Claudia mocking Louis telepathically with the "massa" talk in EP6.) So no, I do not think they were at all ignorant of the loaded racial imagery in EP5 after that fight.

And whether some views can forgive Lestat for it will be an individual thing, at the end of it all IMO. Some views may never forgive it, and I think that is completely okay. However, for me - and why I not only wasn't that shocked by the fight itself but feel I understand what is going on with it is - is 1.) as said, they did have knock-down fights in the first book, 2.) knowing Lestat does have that level of violence-ability in him as I noted when the episode first aired and 3.) and this is the main point - that there, strategically, some clear missing context going on here wrt that fight.

Because the entirety of that fight never once was told from Louis' POV. Until that moment when Lestat took Louis out into the courtyard and then up into the air, the actual fight itself was all told from Claudia's POV.

And that was clearly a deliberate choice. Not just to highlight what it must have been like for Claudia to witness this but because there is clearly something about that fight that Louis is holding back about. And no, not because he's lying about the fight having happened at all, and him being beaten in such a way. The fight did happen, and Louis did get beaten in the way we saw at the end. Because, again, what we saw of the actual fight was all from Claudia's POV, and Claudia would have no reason to lie about such a thing in her diary, where the account of the fight was clearly taken from.

No, it's because I strongly feel that something was going on during it that I don't think Louis can - even now - really process. And I have a huge suspicion about what it is.

We're now headed into book spoiler territory and I don't know how much you might want those, so I'm going to stop with that here. All I will say is that the pauses in the fight when we heard Lestat's voice talking are very, very important, particularly when it comes to what he's saying.

Part of this, and that fight, has to do with the very nature of what Lestat and Louis, and Claudia all are as vampires. Again, I'm really trying not to spoil anything here, because I suspect the show might reveal some of this in Season 2, particularly wrt Paris and the Theater Coven.

Though I don't think the majority of it will be talked about until Season 3 when we finally get Lestat's POV. And it might even be something that carries on over into multiple seasons.

I understand the POV of people who will never be okay with the fight and the imagery it left wrt Louis. But I really do feel the writers didn't do it without one, knowing how it would look, and two, that there is a larger, overall, story arc point going on here which ties into the fact that we are not dealing with human beings here.

This isn't a story about vampires seeking redemption or a way back to humanity. With Rice's vampires, the longer they live, the more apart from humanity they become. That is, overall, one of the things the VC explores here. And they are all going to continue to do some really inhuman things, at least during these earlier parts of the story, towards people they love.

Over time, even as many of them, especially Lestat, learn better how to deal with that nature, particularly towards those they care about and love, those inhuman things about their nature will still be there.

So I think also having that view, understanding that about these characters, as well as everything else I talked about, (including something I strongly feel they are setting up as to why Lestat acted the way he did), goes into my few of that fight and why, when it happened, I honestly wasn't either surprised by it and am okay and want to see where they go from here with it. This is just all, personally, where I'm coming from it with it of course.

[romanticizingmurder]

One last thing on Benji and Sybelle - you don't even need the draft of the unfinished novel for the "turning them was probably inevitable" idea to be at floated in canon.

From Armand, in TVA:

And then from Lestat's POV, in TPL:

Given that she was apparently inclined to have Marius think something similar from his POV in a draft, and given that after massive blowout fight, Armand isn't too upset to just Cuddle and Chill with Marius (who we establish in the first chapter of TVA is generally very careful about not pushing physical touch boundaries with Armand, Armand describes him as a perfect gentleman about it):

And that when Marius & Armand fight or express resentment in the final trilogy, turning Benji and Sybelle is not a topic of argument (aliens, violence, maturity, and abandoment *are*), I feel like canon was clearly leaning one way with this, and it's not really one of particular strife - and characters doing things we might consider terrible morally that get brushed under the rug without being particularly significant in long term canon is practically a trope in TVC, so it's not really unusual.

[ca-suffit]

not sure if you’re blocked and also it’s long but: https://www.tumblr.com/virginiaisforvampires/754230384624107520/hello-you-can-just-delete-this-if-you-think-it any thoughts on this post? i really don’t know where any of this is going…

Virginia is a known racist and Lestat apologist who will dig up any crumb of "evidence" from the show to fit her own version of anything. She's attached to Lestat and the story bcuz of personal trauma and doesn't seem to have any self-awareness about that. She's able to play a professional victim about anything, particularly for the way she always has to throw in this kind of shit into every post:

And that element is where the dissociation between the writers/characters and the fandom begins. The fandom wants to view this through the lens of domestic abuse with one partner being 100% the victim and the other partner being 100% the abuser. If anyone disagrees, it gets into the territory of bullying, name-calling, harassment, labeled an abuse apologist, labeled a racist, constant policing of opinions, and so on and so forth.

A show like this doesn't happen by accident and the stuff we're told at various levels of the show are not the writers themselves. Things are being intentionally put into these stories to be noticed the way they are. A lot of ppl hate this adaptation but pretend they don't bcuz they're waiting for Lestat's season, cuz they think race won't matter anymore and it's time for fun, sexy, sassy bitch shit!! They think none of this will rly matter and it's something to tolerate rn.

None of these ppl has an understanding of Lestat as a character the way that Anne Rice actually wrote him. They'll praise his "honesty" and then ignore the ways he tells u himself how he's killed ppl sometimes bcuz he was just moody, or how he knocks Nicki across a room into a mirror during an argument. Louis and him physically fight all the time. This reliance on "he'd never do this to Louis" is bs bcuz this is a logical escalation of the character from Anne Rice herself.

These ppl don't see Lestat objectively and they don't understand how to navigate the reality of what abuse looks like, they don't know how to navigate interracial abuse, and everything they're looking for is a reason that Lestat is the real victim, which is why nothing makes sense to them.

We didn't revisit murder night at the trial bcuz the trial is fake and that is meant to highlight why it's fake. "Why aren't we focused on the actual crime?" Bcuz the point was to assassinate the characters of everyone through a lot of antiblack tropes, not carry out any "real" justice. As Claudia says, Lestat is clearly still alive. It's meant to feel disorienting and fucked bcuz it is! The revisits to the fight and everything else are to make Lestat look like a bigger victim. The point of the show is never to reveal one "true" version of anything. The truth of any of it lies somewhere in between *all* of it. Ppl waiting for this "perfect" moment of clarity, usually where Lestat can stop being seen as such a bad guy, are going to wait forever.

Anne Rice never rly confronted any topics or had characters grow so her book stans don't know what that looks like and can't see where any of these stories are going. Ppl upset about the drop, saying it ruined a beautiful loustat book moment, can't seem to comprehend that they will prbly fly into the sky again at a later time, when Louis' trust has been restored more. There's no ability to think long term into stories, I've noticed. it's all a rush of soothing panicked feelings at "why does this fandom hate my favorite character." IWTV has *always* made Lestat out to be a piece of shit. The only difference here is that his white privilege is brought to attention more and the characters he's hurting and who hate him are now black and brown. that gives ppl a lot of feelings and so now the point of fandom has been to keep reminding everyone he's actually a great guy and all of this is from trauma and vampire laws, he's innocent under it all!

That is what many people in this fandom seem to be doing. They are viewing this show through their own lens of personal experiences, viewpoints, credos, and humanistic morality standards.

And that will simply not work with this show. From what I’ve seen and heard, I think that is the detached approach the writers are taking. They are creating this gothic love story adapted from books about vampires. They add in meta levels of commentary about racism, homophobia, xenophobia, etc. They just never meant for that to be what the show was truly about.

She can't even describe book scenes accurately or ever talk about race or racism but let's all trust her to tell us what the show is rly trying to say lol. suuuuuuure.

[goayda]

Not My Place to Say - Part 3/3

Third (and last, I think) part of a Stizzy fic. Second part can be found here:

(As usual, set some time after 2x07, Ed is happy being a fisherman somewhere and there was no Zheng fight and no Prince Ricky attack. As usual too, no warnings needed, except for the fluffiest fluff.)

Bonnet had politely waved him in and Izzy had walked into the cabin more confused than he had ever been before. Besides having just noticed the now painfully obvious similarities between Lestat and Bonnet, his mind was still reeling from Sprigg’s stupid words.

Because it was just a stupid idea, clearly, Bonnet being jealous? He was annoyed, that much was obvious, but that must be all. Izzy just had to discover what exactly had bothered the captain and then try to fix it before it could mess their relationship even more.

Bonnet was his captain now, but surely he didn’t expect to have a say in the first mate’s dalliances. Not even Edward had- no, better not go there, Izzy thought, because the truth was that Edward had never been bothered by who Izzy spent the night with because he had never cared. It was surprising and silly that this thought could hurt him, even after everything-

“…Izzy?”

Bonnet’s voice startled him and Izzy realized the captain had been talking to him, but he had been too wrapped up in his own thoughts to hear a thing.

“I was saying if you would want to have some tea with me,” Bonnet repeated with a soft smile that faltered when Izzy simply stared at him without answering. “Unless you’ve already had breakfast, of course,” he added then, looking slightly uncomfortable. “And I know you’d probably prefer a cup of coffee anyway, tea is probably not your thing-“

“It’s fine,” Izzy finally found himself saying. “Tea is fine. Thank you.”

Bonnet nodded, smiling lightly again and poured two cups of tea and Izzy sat there at the table, looking at his cup while thinking how the hell he was going to start that conversation when Bonnet cleared his throat and squared his shoulders as he looked straight at him.

“I wanted to apologize, Izzy,” he started, seriously. “I’ve been rude to you for no good reason and I was bringing the mood down when this shore leave was supposed to be a good time for everybody.”

Izzy stared wide-eyed at him, not used to a captain apologizing, especially for something as trivial as this, but before he could open his mouth to reply, Bonnet continued.

“I’m glad that-that you found somebody- well,… it looked like that man at the tavern was… nice,” he added, looking as if uttering those words was actually painful to him. “We’re still going to be here for two more days, maybe you could invite him here to have some drinks and meet the crew…”

“I don’t even know where he’s now, Bonnet,” Izzy replied flatly. “And I don’t care.”

The way Bonnet tried and failed to hide his relief almost made Izzy laugh out loud, but even as tired as he was after a sleepless night, Izzy had a reputation to uphold so he resisted the urge to even smile while he tried not to think about how Bonnet’s reaction had warmed him inside.

“We said goodbye, I don’t expect to see him again. He was just… some guy,” Izzy added after a pause, not really knowing why he felt the need to explain himself now. “I just felt lonely, I guess. And he was good company for a night.”

Bonnet’s face softened and he nodded in understanding with a sad, little smile, but then he turned serious once again.

“I guess I must be honest, Izzy. I was a bit upset last night when you left the tavern because…”

Bonnet hesitated then, looking slightly embarrassed and Izzy’s heart started thrumming in his chest wildly.

“I was worried that you weren’t going to come back,” Bonnet finally said, lowering his gaze. “I think deep down I’ve always been worried that one day you’re going to leave us for another ship, for a better crew,… for a better captain.”

Izzy gaped at him, bewildered. He hadn’t seen that coming at all.

“That’s-that’s absurd,” he blurted out, making Bonnet flinch. “I mean… leaving without a proper resignation would be totally unprofessional,” he added quite lamely.

“Well, actually, I never officially asked you to be my first mate,” Bonnet replied with a playful smirk.

That was true, Izzy realized in dismay. After Edward left he had simply kept going as usual, doing the first mate’s tasks, training Bonnet and the crew, but nobody had really asked him to be the first mate. What if they had simply let him stay out of pity? Why would they have chosen him anyway? It was not as if Oluwande couldn’t do the job, or Jim, maybe. What if he was just… tolerated on board as some old ratter dogs are because they are still useful?

Izzy’s tired mind was starting to panic, but then Bonnet, who must have noticed his inner turmoil, reached for Izzy’s ungloved hand over the table, stopping all his thoughts from spiraling any further.

“But that’s a mistake I’d like to fix right now,” Bonnet said determinedly as he squeezed Izzy’s hand briefly. “Would you want to be my first mate, Israel Hands? It would mean a lot to me if you said yes. And to the crew, it would mean a lot to all of us,” he added quickly.

Izzy stared at Bonnet’s kind eyes and wished he was better with words in situations like this. He was going to have to try, he guessed.

“Yes,” he said firmly and then he squeezed Bonnet’s hand tightly.

Bonnet’s smile was blinding.

“And you don’t have to worry about me leaving,” he added, forcing himself to be brave. “This is a good crew and you… you’re a good captain, Stede.”

The look on the captain’s eyes, so soft and so caring, was almost too much for Izzy so he lowered his gaze to look at their intertwined hands instead.

“The tea must be getting cold,” Stede said lightly, after a few seconds of silence. “We shouldn’t let it spoil after Roach took the time to make it for us.”

And he started drinking it without letting go of Izzy’s hand. The first mate hesitated for only a moment and then took his cup with his free hand to take a sip while he tried to hide a smile.

The tea was awfully bland, of course, but Izzy couldn’t care less.

XOX

[cosmicjoke]

Okay, I started “Merrick”, and Louis is breakin’ my heart into a thousand and one pieces.  These guys’ have got to stop doing this to me, lol.

The part where he show’s David the daguerreotype of Claudia and tells him the story about it had me in shambles man.  His pain, how much he misses her, how much he just wants to make sure she’s not in torment, and the way you can just tell, from the things he says to David here, that once he can know that, once he knows she’s alright and has moved on, that he’s planning on killing himself, ugh, I can’t hardly take it.

Louis really is like the perfect opposite of Lestat, and I think, ultimately, that’s why the two of them are really made for each other, why they so deeply love each other.  Louis is so withdrawn and quiet and introspective.  All of his pain is sort of aimed inward, dealt with silently and unobtrusively, while of course Lestat is very much an extrovert, very open and blunt with his emotions, very loudly expressive.  I think they each feel their pain as keenly as the other, but their ways of coping with it is totally opposite.  And there’s just something about the quiet manner in which Louis suffers that cuts you to the quick.  Almost like he doesn’t think enough of himself to feel like he has any right to express his pain aloud. 

This part too, when David says Lestat never told him the story about Claudia being upset at them not being able to have their photographs taken, because the sunlight was necessary for it,

“Lestat forgets many things,” he said thoughtfully and without judgment.  “He had other portraits of her painted after that.  There was a large one here, very beautiful.  We took it with us to Europe.  We took trunks of our belongings, but that time I don’t want to remember.  I don’t want to remember how she tried to hurt Lestat.”

Like just kill me now.  Ugh.  Louis so clearly has so much love for BOTH Claudia and Lestat.  You can just hear the pain in his voice, thinking about how one of the people dearest to him tried to hurt the other.  You can hear how much the reality of that torments Louis.  He probably felt like he failed both of them, in allowing things to get to that point. 

And then this part, talking about the picture of Claudia

“Wasn’t she beautiful?” he asked.  “Tell me.  It’s past a matter of opinion, isn’t it?  She was beautiful.  One cannot deny that simple fact.”

Like he’s sharing this deeply intimate and guarded part of himself with David, asking for confirmation from him on Claudia’s beauty.  Just something about this struck me as so sad.  Like he wants someone else to also remember Claudia and how beautiful she was.

And then finally this last part of this chapter, when he talks about visiting Lestat in the orphanage, wanting to check in on him, even though both he and David know Lestat doesn’t really need protecting.  Really, Louis’ love for Lestat is always just so moving, and comes through as so genuine.  You can see how Louis’ even tempered calm and quiet is kind of like the perfect treatment for Lestat’s more manic and broad emotional turmoil and intensity.  I don’t get when people just write these two off as “toxic” for each other.  I don’t think their love is toxic at all.  Their situation might have been, at one point, but their love is genuine and pure.  And that’s why it worked out, in the end.

[enigmaticdiary]

episode 14

I dont have a lot of thoughts right now if im being honest because I'm still. frankly in shock about everything that occured in that episode. Just want to get these out while Im still awake and still feel this all extremely fresh. This isn't an episode analysis or anything. Just my feelings.

My feelings, right now. um. I won't say catatonic because I have gripped desperately onto my will to continue functioning but I certainly feel close to it. Felt far closer to that right after the episode ended (25 minutes ago as of me typing this sentence).

Is it embarrassing to admit that this episode left me like... physically affected? beyond crying and heart hurting. Like. I felt physically Numb. I still kind of do. Like i got ejected out of my body and i didn't realize it until I made the move to get out of my chair. I don't want to get into that further. But aside from that, i cried too. More than I thought i might.

I dont really cry at stuff! I haven't cried this season at all. (Edit: Sorry I lied i absolutely have cried this season. During ep 10 i believe) I think I cried once when I was watching season 1. I cried once while reading tvl. Like a single tear each, probably. I get really upset and emotionally invested when I'm engaged with things but I don't... cry. I was on the verge of tears for most of the episode if I'm being honest, but once claudia spoke up after Lestat's apology, the first tear fell.. And I kept crying until the end of the episode.

I was fucking mad. I was real fuckin mad. And thinking about it all is making me really mad again. It was hard for me to not feel like i was also up there on the stage with them. The psin of the trial hits differently when you're a black viewer. That shit was racist. to the core. Up and down fuckin racism and i was seething through the whole thing watching this. Essentially public lynching. I'm crying again!

I can't even think about it all clearly it's all so much to think about and trying to put my thoughts together so soon after the episode is making me confused because all my thoughts are just flooded with how horrifically angry i am.

It's a show yeah and I'm always embarrassed to be upfront with how deeply fiction can impact me but when claudia and madeleine died. I didn't feel like i was sitting in my chair in my room watching an episode of a tv show. i felt like i was in that theatre, helpless, watching a part of me die up there!!! it feels like something died in me!! and it's so fucked up because I knew what was coming i was preparing myself the whole season and i feel like me trying to brace myself just made it all the worse because there was no way I would have ever come out of this episode feeling any different to how i currently do. blind, unbraced, it don't matter.

God fuck this show, man

[illiadofrecollection]

Thinking about how Lestat's narration in TVL really isn't that kind to Gabrielle, whose actions (hiding the parcel from Roget!) show the opposite of what he thinks is true. Lestat assumes she doesn't really want him with her when she asks. That she's asking out of politeness. But her actions make it very clear she desperately wanted him to come, to the point of concealing an urgent letter from his lawyer asking him to help his father. Announcing his two brothers and their wives have not survived the Revolution.

And she buries it! She buries something that important because she fears that Lestat will feel duty-bound to go to his father if he finds out about it. Which is exactly what he does once she reveals it. For all his talk about how much he loves his mother this is clearly a betrayal of sorts to her. Lestat's father is the cause of Gabrielle's unhappiness in life. He is the one who stopped Lestat from being educated in the convent yes, but he's also the reason why his mother was trapped in an environment she clearly hated. There are very good reasons for her anti-civilisation rants. She was a woman in 18th century France, and not one who lived in a particularly enviable position either despite her status. She does love Lestat and him choosing to go to his father of all people is deeply painful to her.

And the oddest thing seems to be that Lestat doesn't seem to realise it. He's so upset about her burying the package and keeping important information from him. But it doesn't occurr to him to see the gesture for what it is-- the kind of betrayal done by someone who loves and wants to keep you. He continues to see Gabrielle as happier without him, wanting him to let her go.

Part of it can be blamed on Armand's lies about Gabrielle's mind, who (aside from already having revealed he wants Lestat to kill his loved ones so Armand can have him to himself) Gabrielle herself says doesn't understand her because she is a real adult, full of contradicting desires in a way an eternal 17 year old will never understand. Lestat knows about his motivations and he has caught him lying before. And yet it seems he feels so abandonned by being shut out of Gabrielle's mind he believes him on some level.

But the crazy thing about that is-- well you couldn't read minds when you were human either could you! This much mourned loss was something you experienced for minutes as Gabrielle was turned only. And words suffice for the rest of us, if you still value and use them. The silence between maker and fledgling only exists if you don't talk. And going by Garbrielle's words to Armand being able to peek into someone's head doesn't mean you understand them at all. It's not the magical solution that makes it so that you're never lonely or misunderstood Lestat thinks it is.

It's just -- Lestat clearly has abandonment issues because of his mother's behaviour when she was alive, but in the end he's the one who chooses not to go with her. And he never really seems to realise that someone who just wanted to leave without you would never have gone to such lengths to keep you.

[sideeffx]

Sorry this concerns ep 5 and #that scene. Had a few stray thoughts regarding it. The sentiment seems to be the entire scene was out to paint Lestat as “abusive,” which I put in quotes because I feel as if the tip over the line had happened long ago. Maybe somewhere around the time he turned Claudia but it was brewing much earlier. But I was kind of ruminating on how maybe part of it was also to establish how Louis can’t ever fully run away from his victimhood? It’s easy to justify Lestat’s gaslighting, repeated actions to get a rise out of Louis etc but it’s not easy to justify something that quite literally leaves you bedridden for an indeterminate amount of time right? And we see that this is around the time Louis becomes even more of an unreliable narrator. “Unreliable” in the sense that he makes Lestat look better than he actually is. Daniel’s snarky comments compare Louis to someone who is still in love with their abuser but I’m kind of thinking part of the retelling while it comes from a place of still loving Lestat also comes from Louis all these years still being upset at his perceived emotional weakness.

He contradicts himself multiple times in his explanation of the way he and Lestat’s relationship unravels where it seems like it was a case of him not being able to fully let go of his human nature and thus not living up to what Lestat wants but at the same time Lestat’s role as “the monster” bleeds into his interpersonal relationships so hard that his two spawn are utterly terrified of him. Notably, a lot of his lack of tiptoeing around Lestat’s more deplorable actions is specifically when Claudia is in the picture because she makes her opinions of Lestat clear and even by the end he tries to play an “ultimately she loved him too” card on Daniel. Only for it to be refuted immediately because none of that is at all consistent with Claudia’s own thoughts written on paper. Louis is still somewhat trapped in the prison of his masculinity and pride where he simply can’t admit to himself he was in a situation that left him powerless emotionally and mentally. Thus the only real “abusive” action is when he gets in a fight with Lestat that he loses miserably. The physical pain a reminder of what transpired compared to the emotional rollercoaster that Louis can choose to forget about the next day. “I am not a victim,” only said clearly once, but reminded to you through his own biased storytelling. Really he means “this was all partially my fault, for being weak.”

[serpentarius]

some observations about IWTV after my third rewatch - a working doc

S1 spoilers for AMC's Interview with the Vampire (2022) below!

In 1x07, Louis slits Lestat's throat with the very same blade that drew Lestat to him in 1x01 ("It was not until a few nights later, when I watched a man pull a knife out of his walking stick and pressed the blade of it to his brother's breast bone, that I said to myself, 'Lestat, unpack your trunks. You're home!" )

When Loustat have their final dance in 1x07, they're dancing to an instrumental version of Lestat's "Come to Me" 🙃💔

Rashid/Armand says something in Latin to Louis in 1x06, when Daniel is asleep. Turbidus rebus ad infinitum, is what I heard. I'm no Latin expert, but a quick Google search showed something along the lines of "cloudy/troubled things forever". There are so many ways to interpret what he means by that.

Armand doesn't approve of Louis doing this interview, this much we know. He's convinced that, if the book gets published, the vampire masses will seek him out and kill him. But it's not ‘til he says this line, "You are chronicling a suicide," to Daniel, that made me think perhaps Armand isn't controlling Louis quite as much as I originally thought. Of course he's still toxic af, he's still Louis' captor and something weird is definitely going on, but Louis clearly pushed for this hard enough that he got his way. And it makes sense that Armand wants to keep his own identity hidden - he must be scared, right? Scared for Louis' life as well as his own?

Armand's microexpressions give away so much. After Louis says "I'd give it to you now," to Daniel, Armand looks kinda upset? Angry? Confused? Hurt? And then he immediately excuses himself. Clearly this has struck a nerve, and clearly there's history between him and Daniel. YOU CAN'T TELL ME OTHERWISE

After Lestat says "I have a capacity for enduring" in 1x06, the word "endure/endured" is used a handful more times throughout the rest the episode, by both Louis and Claudia. I really like that they resonated with and related to that word, and continue to use it to describe their experiences.

Claudia's question about Nicki must have cut Lestat deep. "Did Nicki kill himself like your maker, Magnus?" Cause, um, if the show is going by book canon? Then, yeah. That's pretty much what happened, more or less.

[persepinas]

I feel like there’s a fundamental misunderstanding of sam reid from many sides. Some people hate him for being more twunk than twink, some that he did the job he was paid to do (ep5), some that he didn’t denigrate his work and get himself fired, and some for just for some imagined racism on his part. It’s so unbelievably stupid. In all ways as an actor he plays his cards pretty close to his chest. All we really know is that he’s good friends with jacob, that he was a farm kid who escaped by being a goth theater kid and that he’s trying his best at a role he’s always wanted and finally has. I hate hearing about non existent sources and imagined slights and personality traits. It reminds me of what went down with the outlander fandom. Another lead actor named sam people got obsessed with to an unhealthy degree and invented whole narratives both positive and negative about to the point he was getting stalked and sent death threats.

Oh. Wow. Outlander. That’s really bringing me back! I had to back away from that random because it was so toxic and delusional. The fact that they were literally harassing Caitriona Balfe was not okay. Fandom thinks they have a right to actor’s personal lives. The parasocial relationships are frightening. Also the fans people so upset when Sam Heughan was clearly dating women and so they were all upset with him. Lol. It’s so embarrassing.

I know I love Sam and I know I love Jacob as actors and also their friendship and what they choose to reveal about it is very wholesome and positive.

But people hate on Sam for NO REASON. Or because he is Lestat. And they hate Lestat so they hate Sam. Or Sam defends his character and they hate him. It’s tiring. Or they say Sam is racist. Stop it. He’s an actor just like the rest of the cast, playing a part. Let the man live.

[gildatheplant]

I totally understand the concern here, as I became a huge Devil's Minion shipper over the course of the show, but I do think the turning 'out of spite' thing is intentionally misleading. Rolin loves to play with his wording and the more I look at what he said and the context... the way he says "clearly made him out of spite,” and “It looks like it was really not a great moment" (emphasis mine) to me is a major hint that appearances are deceiving. There's also the time jump to consider. We don't yet know when or why Armand turned Daniel. We also don't know when or why Armand seemingly left him. It's all purposely kept in the dark at the moment.

I believe they're currently trying to imply that Armand turned Daniel in Dubai, shortly after Louis left. However, based on what the cast has said in other interviews, particularly Assad and Eric's hints at future romance/sexy times, and Rolin's wording in the above quotes, I truly believe that's not actually the case. I can only imagine the exact details of what goes down, but I strongly suspect that Armand will actually let Daniel leave Dubai...and will only turn him when Daniel is on his death bed. Perhaps we won't see the turning because it will be obscured somehow (I can picture shadows behind hospital curtains for instance). Or perhaps when Rolin said we won't see 'that moment' of turning he means the 'that' literally, as in it won't look like the books or it won't be in Dubai, but we'll see a twist to it.

Also, to address the Raglan James stuff, it's obvious that when Daniel outs Armand's lies to Louis, Raglan assumes one of the vampires is going to kill him. He tells Daniel to "GET OUT OF THERE", yet his fear is seemingly for nothing as Louis takes out his rage only on Armand. Raglan has mentioned before that other interviewers have been killed, the Talamasca has a huge list of both Louis and Armand's victims, yet Daniel is spared. This proves to Raglan that Daniel is special and someone to watch.

That said, I fully believe that the vampire Daniel we see at the end is Daniel. His personality and relationship with Louis seems too genuine to be anyone else. I actually think his eyes are violet but change colour when he gets emotional. Because the lighting is dark, it's hard to see a difference between blue and violet, especially when his eyes changing is so much more dramatic. Armand's eyes vibrate when he's upset/using powers, Louis and Lestat's pupils grow huge when they're upset/using powers, so there's some precedence for Daniel's eyes changing.

Maybe I'm just an optimist, but I hope this all makes sense and is maybe even a bit comforting for those who are concerned. I truly trust the actors and writers, especially Assad and Eric when it comes to Devil's Minion.

My thoughts about Devil's Minion right now after Rolin Jones' comments (spoilers):

A meta so thorough, that I first wrote in a post/reply elsewhere, I'm putting it into a separate post, (with some more added to it), just because. And especially since I know I've gotten a lot of followers over the course of Season 2 because of my Devil's Minion posts as well, and I want this all in a separate, individual post for quick reference, just in case.

Fair warning: if you are totally happy and fine about what happened -- i.e. how Armand turned Daniel -- then yeah, what I am going to say here isn't for you. I'm not trying to harsh anyone's vibe, especially if you are just happy that Daniel is a vampire now, okay? This is just about how I feel and see things about it at the moment (particularly regarding RJs comments about it). So if you're not up for criticism, critique, as well as speculation about Devil's Minion right now, then yeah. IMO, just skip this post, please.

Okay. So. Rolin Jones just gave an interview with The Hollywood Reporter and this is what he said about Daniel's turning by Armand:

Jones confirms that, just like in Rice’s books, Armand is the one who turns Daniel into a vampire. “Will we see that moment of turning? No, but Armand finally made a vampire and clearly made him out of spite,” he says with a laugh. “It looks like it was really not a great moment [between him and Daniel], but that connects those two characters. They will have scenes going forward, obviously.”

-- Rolin Jones, Hollywood Reporter, 06/30/24

Okay so, to start. For me, someone who has been waiting since 1995 (when I was 17) for Devil's Minion, for Armand and Daniel's relationship to finally be adapted in some way, I'll be honest. There are only two ways this can go now that I can see at the moment: either Rolin is lying/trolling to hide the truth about all of this, or he is telling the truth and this is truly the way they are going with this.

If Rolin is lying/trolling to hide something about all of this, then I'll forgive that lying/trolling instantly once it's revealed that he was. (Put a pin in this.) Having to flat-out lie or troll is sometimes par for the course when it comes to running a show and not wanting to spoil anything about what might be coming up in it. So honestly, if that's what's going on with what he said here? Meh. No skin off my nose.

If he is telling the truth, however? Then I'll have zero desire to watch the show anymore, once I see it 100% confirmed in some way with my own two eyes in some way on screen somehow. (Again, pin in this.) Because I have very much learned my lesson when it comes to TV shows and lazy writing/bad adaptations after Game of Thrones.

Because Armand turning Daniel out of spite is the antithesis of what Devil's Minion is supposed to be for both characters. It is an utter and complete misunderstanding of both characters and their relationship together. It's an utter downgrade of their relationship from the books, and I am not here for it. I literally do not care what "romance" they might later have planned for them if this is how Daniel was turned.

Look. If you are someone who only ever cared about Daniel just being a vampire, then this is all likely fine for you, and that's okay. But not me. Because Daniel being a vampire never was, or has been, the important part of Armand and Daniel's relationship. Not in my eyes and, frankly, not when it comes to the original story. Daniel becoming a vampire is not the important part of the Devil's Minion story. The actual love and romance before Daniel is turned is because it is during that part of it that the actual character development and growth both of them go through from it takes place. Especially for Armand's character.

And that only has any depth when Daniel is human and Armand is forever refusing to turn him because of his hangups about making another vampire.

And Armand finally turning Daniel out of love was a huge step that showed Armand beginning to move forward and heal -- from not only his time in the Children of Darkness cult, but begin his healing when it comes to his Marius issues as well.

Armand turning Daniel out of spite undercuts all of that. It undercuts the whole story. And flat-out guts some of the major depth of the relationship and Armand's character development overall.

Not to mention it makes Daniel no better than someone like Claudia wrt Armand turning him now. Maybe even less than her since at least Claudia got turned out of Lestat's love for someone else. Daniel doesn't even get that? The person who is supposed to be his eternal companion doesn't even get turned by him out of love, an important point to the bond between such Maker and Fledgling eternal companions, but out of hate and spite instead?

Yeah, no thank you.

This is not what I've waited since 1995 to see with these two and the fact their relationship may have gotten treated like this -- if this is true -- utterly astounds me how this show could get Loustat so right (and even upgrade them so beautifully in so many ways such as with Louis' turning) and utterly fail Devil's Minion so badly. Because yes, it's failing them. It's a terrible and, moreover, just a shallow adaptation of Devil's Minion if this is how it really all goes down.

Because there is way more to Armand and Daniel than them just Daniel being a vampire and them finally "getting together." Or at least there is supposed to be. And this ain't it.

(Pin!) Now, with that all said? The fact that Rolin flat out says that we'll never see Armand turning Daniel? Yeah okay, I'm sus on that one. Because really. The only reason not to show Armand turning Daniel next season -- and visually confirm that Armand did it -- is if because . . . Armand never actually turned Daniel in the first damn place.

Or, if he did, it maybe was not fully Daniel.

I mean, you're not going to ever actually show Armand turning his first-ever fledgling (who he's supposed to go on to have a romantic relationship with at some point) after making a big ass deal out of the fact that Armand has never turned anyone before? Ever?

See I know damn well that Armand is being framed as a villain right now. He very much has to be given how the end of the book IWTV and how the upcoming book The Vampire Lestat, goes. Armand is the main villain/antagonist in it. Even in the present day, it is clear Armand hasn't gone yet gone through all of the growth that he does from Queen of the Damned on. So he's still back in his villain-era mode right now. And his post-breakup with Louis mode in the present day. Which is fine, it's how his story -- and the story where it is right now -- goes. I am thoroughly okay with that.

And the very idea that Armand turned Daniel out of spite? Very much plays into that framing-him-as-a-villian state where Armand's character is right now. And will be for the majority of Season 3, which I've already before now suspected and said.

So here is where the speculation on my end of things comes in. Because yeah, not only can I not help myself but because -- until I see this play out with my own eyes -- I'm willing to be reasonable and look at the various ways this all could still play out that doesn't completely gut out the very heart of Armand and Daniel -- as characters and their relationship together. (Or at least not have it be so damn shallow by the end when they inevitably get and stay together.)

So as @nalyra-dreaming can confirm, I gave her a few scenarios that could be behind Daniel's turning weeks ago, when I first suspected it was going to happen (before the screener leaks about it started). In one of the scenarios, I said that if Daniel's vampire eyes are any color other than violet, then that is NOT Daniel's spirit/soul/consciousness in Daniel's body that has been made a vampire.

As the saying goes, "The eyes are the window into the soul." And am I really supposed to think this show got Lestat and Louis' eye color dead on correct but just missed Daniel's iconic eye color? Really? (Because no, I do not find it romantic that Daniel has his Maker's eye color, or whatever. Besides, vampire eye color doesn't even work like that -- the show didn't even do that with Louis and Lestat who are the main, grand romantic couple of the damn show.)

As I said here in this reblog, I stand by my opinion/theory that no way this show gets Daniel's iconic violet eye color wrong, even on accident. I said so weeks ago, before even seeing Daniel's eyes in that final shot in the season finale, and just predicting that he was going to get turned.

No way this show got Daniel's iconic eye color wrong when he became a vampire, not when they went to all the damn trouble creating those vampire contacts and gave Jacob's Louis green eyes to match book-Louis.

And yes I damn well know they could just have Daniel pop up with violet vampire eyes in the Season 3 premiere and there goes all of that, and it really was all just laziness, incompetence, and a mistake when it came to the color of Daniel's eyes in the finale. But right now? I'm treating Daniel's eye color as the equivalent of Rolin saying "Lelio is so boring!" as to the question of why Sam's Lestat was playing Harlequin and not Lelio in the Season 2 theater flashbacks. Something the show changed on purpose and for a reason.

Because we all damn well know that we are going to see Sam's Lestat as Lelio in Season 3, correct? Because we are.

And yes. I know some people really hate the idea of a body swap scenario regarding Daniel, but I'm sorry. At this point, it really is the only scenario out of this whole storyline that I can see right now, that will keep it anywhere close to retaining the heart of the Devil's Minion storyline, especially if Armand really did turn Daniel out of spite here (even though, again, we'll apparently never see that turning to confirm that in full. Uh-huh, okay.).

And two things that I think do set up the possibility are:

1.) Louis says Daniel was turned after he left Armand alone with him. But Louis actually wouldn't know something like that unless he was told since he wasn't there. All we can really assume at the moment is that Daniel told Louis what happened after Louis left the room. And as RJ and Assad said, we'll never see the actual turning. So who knows when the hell it happened.

2.) Raglan James, via those direct messages asking Daniel for "reciprocation" for getting him a copy of the script, with Armand's handwritten notes, of the trial-play. Between that request and the Talamasca publishing Daniel's book, that loops Daniel into the James orbit very much. And ties Daniel very close to any Talamasca going on even more.

And, quite frankly, I've thought since Season 1 that David Talbot's character was out and would be merged with both Louis and Daniel on the show. And Sam pretty much confirmed in his interview with Autumn Brown that some characters from the books will be merged together with others in the show. So, yeah. David's character is very much a character I always thought they were doing that with, and I know I'm not the only one who's thought it before now as well.

And honestly, I can much better deal with some type of scenario in which Armand maybe ends up turning two versions of "Daniel" -- and therefore technically having two fledglings, even though they are kind of the same person -- over what is being put forth about this right now. One turning -- in spite -- of Daniel's body without his true spirit/soul/consciousness in it, and the other turning -- out of love -- of Daniel's spirit/soul/consciousness inside a different body of some kind. (Which I won't go into now, as that is a whole separate long meta if I did.)

Because at least with that scenario then, in a weird way, Daniel being Armand's only fledgling would still hold. 🤷🏾‍♀️ Along with a few other things that can happen regarding Armand's character growth in between each turning.

But that is it. Because there is no way they can have Armand turn Daniel (as fully Daniel) out of spite -- as Rolin directly says he does in this interview -- and actually keep the heart of the Devil's Minion story and romance now. Not even if the Devil's Minion chase and parts of the relationship happened in the past IMO . . . another thing they are clearly avoiding talking about, btw. Which, at least right now, just tells me that, if we're lucky, we'll only -- once again -- get one episode that flashes back to that time in Season 3. Can't really be helped, since Season 3's primary focus will be regarding Lestat and Lestat's backstory. (As I've said before Daniel isn't even in that book. So whatever we get with him in Season 3 really will just be extra, added stuff.)

Oh, and something else I very much recognize is that Loustat shippers -- particularly book ones -- have gone through it these past two seasons, but now seem to be coming out of that darkness. Maybe now it's time for Devil's Minion shippers like me and others to face the same damn thing now. Because of something Assad let slip a few weeks ago about not getting Armand's full story until Season 4, I think that is how long we're going to have to wait to see the full of this play out.

But I advise right now that if some of you think you can't handle that and would just rather quit the show and binge things later, I totally get it. Waiting two seasons -- basically 4 years minimum -- is going to be a pain in the ass. I already know right now that there are some things I'm not going to have the patience for during the hiatus times in between, particularly this one. (One thing I can already say, at least right now, is that I'm not inspired to write any show-based Devil's Minion fanfic this hiatus like I did during the last hiatus).

But quitting the show altogether? No, I'm not there yet. Because yes Rolin does like to troll. Plus Hannah's tweet. Plus what was said about Devil's Minion at ATX Festival. Plus my thinking, long before now, that David Talbot was always out wrt the show, and the fact that Raglan James is here and Daniel's character has been heavily tied into The Talamasca plotline of the show.

And given everything I've seen this show do wrt it's writing up until now, I just can't fully believe they would really make Devil's Minion this damn shallow and devoid of its depth and heart. And just have Armand turn his one and only canon fledgling and immortal companion out of nothing but spite. When Armand loving Daniel and finally having to trust in Daniel's love for him, as well as his own love for Daniel over his own fear was a major point and culmination of the Devil's Minion storyline.

After everything I've seen these first two seasons wrt this show, I can't think these writers would miss such an important heart and point of the Devil's Minion storyline and romance so completely.

Not yet at any rate.