#if viserys has no haters i’m dead

[ophelieverse]

all i want to see in this scene is aegon bringing out a baseball bat and destroy that fuckass lego toy table that his father had spent more time making that being with him instead

[alicentswife1]

ASOIAF is basically just vile men and complex women.

(Exceptions: podrick)

[bi-bi-bi-notanotherfool]

What begun this dance of dragons was Viserys being the weak selfish king he was. He knew what would’ve been expected when he married, that should his new wife (courtesy of butchering his last one open) birthed a son he would inherit the crown and throne.

Yet he only stalled the inevitable by keeping Rhaenyra as his heir.

That’s where this started. With him.

[maryonaccross]

Dear fellow team green fans, I’ve finally managed to make a list of fanfictions on AO3 that every team green fan should read;

(Most of these aren’t aggressively team green but focus on team green characters and explore them in interesting and respectful ways )

Fist we have the holy trilogy:

1. Burning Jasmine by our national treasure @scalyfreaks and literally anything else that she writes (BJ is a beautifully written Aegon centric alteration of the dance of the dragons)

2. See, what happened was by @daylander1000 / Daylander on AO3 (the best Aemond centric fanfic I have ever read. If you dislike the strong boys and how Baela and Rhaena were done dirty in the show and love angsty preteens and “dark fluff” as the author herself describes it this is the jam)

3. All of @dulcewrites fanfictions are an absolute must for any team green fans (she handles the characters with such care and the humor is amazing)

Then we have the category that I like to call JUSTICE FOR ALICENT:

1. Springs end by Navree (long one shot that explores Alicent’s feelings at the beginning of her marriage to Viserys, beautifully written, I cried)

2. Give me back my girlhood it was mine first by JustA_Person (beautiful multi-chaptered fic that dives headfirst into Alicent’s depression at the beginning of her marriage and does not shy away from roasting the fuck out of Viserys and is currently heading towards a rekindling of the relationship between Alicent and Rhaenyra)

3. In your grave by 136108 (short but brilliant one shot on what Alicent should have told Viserys on his death bed)

Then we have Daemon and Viserys haters must read section staring;

1. Sins of the father by SelfProclaimedUnicorn ( ABSOLUTE MUST for any Daemon haters out there, this is the best there is. This fanfiction centers around two children Daemon has with Rhea Royce at the beginning of his marriage and follows them in their childhood and teenage years (the children are the same age as Rhaenyra and Alicent). This is one of the best written team green fanfictions I have ever read and it tells the story in such an intelligent and thought out way with some perfectly seasoned Daemon bashing sprinkled all over it. It also holds up so well considering that its plot is unlike any other team Green fanfiction out there and centers around characters that aren’t really explored enough. Oh and it also addresses the suffering Aemma went through trapped in marriage with Viserys which is always a great touch)

2. Out of the mouth of Babes by UnknownEnigma ( beautiful six chapter fanfiction exploring Aemonds relationships with Viserys that shows Viserys’ neglect and cruelty in all its glory and ends in a very satisfying way)

And then we have a few more brilliant fan fictions that I don’t really know how to sort into a category:

1. Lose your Ego by Fjlh (this series just started and is about Aegon USING HIS BRAIN and fighting for his claim. Very promising so far)

2. The sky is always red above Valyria au by Aifsaath (beautiful series of one shots about Aegon x Baela that explores the trauma of growing up with a father that maritally rapes your mother)

3. Lady Dreamfrye by Ai_Megurine (story about Sansa Stark being reborn as Helaena)

4. I’m never gonna love ( again ) by @crescenthoax (very interesting Aegon x oc fanfic )

5. My hand was the one you reached for by haught_hightower ( explores Alicent’s relationships with Criston and her children )

6. a poison tree by Juliet_Capulet ( very detailed and well written story about the younger brother of Daemon and Viserys returning to the capital with his daughter, after the death of his wife and witnessing Viserys’ brain dead decisions unraveling while forming a bond with his nieces and nephews. Full of Daemon and Viserys Bashing)

I hope you enjoy, it took me a real long while to find some of these gems

[moonflower91]

Viserys knew Alicent did not want to have sex with him and here’s how I know.

Viserys wed and bed Aemma when she was 11 years old. But, by all accounts, they really loved each other. Part of a healthy marriage is a healthy sex life.

He and Aemma were married a long time, and Viserys loved and respected Aemma far more than he loved or respected Alicent, so he probably actually cared if she wanted to go to bed with him, and cared if she was enjoying herself.

Alicent had no such courtesy. The most the old lecher ever did was make sure he wasn’t hurting her.

So while Alicent just laid there in bed, staring at the ceiling, picking at her nails with anxiety and panic, and waiting for it to be over, Viserys knew damn well she wasn’t enjoying herself, knew she didn’t want to be there, and knowing all that, he still ordered her to his bed and raped her.

If Viserys has no haters, I’m dead.

[meanqueens]

Hi! Sorry for the rant but as an hater of the Rhaenys speech in episode nine to another I felt like you could understand .

In my personal experience ,it’s not only the Targaryen Exceptionalism that bothers me ,it’s also the not so subtle victim blaiming .

The whole window things to me was Rhaenys telling Alicent that she’s a loser for not having ambitions other than to see her family safe ,and the fact that Alicent didn’t girlboss her way out of her problems ( read :abuse)

It’s not only Rhaenys hypocrisy here that makes me go nuts,but the way the show constantly acts like Alicent is stupid for not fighting back against her abusers is sickening .This is a feudal society and their concept of abuse was different then ours ,so what was done to Alicent by Otto and Viserys (and Larys but in this case his behavior would never be normalized) will never get called out ,and Alicent as a woman is considered a property ,first of her father then her husband .She has power and wealth as long as these men give it to her .So she’s already in a bad situation societally and one hard ti escape.

On an emotional level ,Alicent is also really scared of both Otto and Viserys .And abuse victims feel trapped ,like they can’t escape . (and Alicent is trapped ).

The fact that Rhaenys shaming Alicent for being a victim is seen as a wise girlboss moment is something so fucked up .

Sorry for the rant ,and have a good day/night !

thank u for your ask and your thoughts, and i hope u enjoy me ranting some more about (probably) my least favorite exchange of dialogue in hotd!

i’m gonna go kinda line by line with my thoughts so this might get long.

Rhaenys: And you are usurping the throne.

subjective, i think, like a lot of the dance is. who’s the usurper depends on who believes who has the rightful claim. and let’s be real: if the greens didn’t have a leg to stand on, there wouldn’t be a dance. also, let’s recall that part of rhaenys’ stance in the great council was not only that she had a claim, but that her male child laenor had a claim. he, not rhaenys, was the main contender alongside viserys i. i think hotd really messed up important details in trying to simplify everything. anyway.

Alicent: It was my husband's dying wish. Believe it or no, it is of no consequence. Aegon will be king. I came here to ask your support.

Rhaenys: Well, I must credit you for your boldness.

hey, now that’s a take i can agree on, rhaenys! while not the most powerful member of the greens, without alicent’s boldness they would not have survived long.

Alicent: House Velaryon has long allied itself with the Princess Rhaenyra and what has it gained you? Your daughter dead, alone in Pentos. Your son cuckolded. Rhaenyra's heirs are none of yours. It is your husband who grasps so heedlessly for the throne. And even he has abandoned you. Gone these six long years to fight a desperate battle, returning grievously, if not mortally, wounded, leaving the Lady of Driftmark to chart her course alone.

(going by show canon) is alicent wrong though? is she wrong????? it might not be nice but it’s the truth as she sees it.

Rhaenys: The word of my house is not fickle.

Alicent: No. But, dear cousin, you more than any soul alive understand what I say now. Princess Rhaenys, I loved my husband, but I will speak the truth we both know. You should've been queen.

Rhaenys: I little thought to hear those words from you.

but why, rhaenys, did you not expect alicent to say those words to you? what on-screen interaction have you had with her in the past that led to this conclusion? or is that the internalized misogyny talking???

see, this little quip reeks of narrative fuckery. everybody just inherently hates alicent bc *checks notes* she’s a “bad feminist”… in a medieval patriarchal society. if rhaenys doesn’t think alicent would say that, show me why she doesn’t think alicent would say that based on something other than “vibes”.

doesn’t make sense that it’s bc alicent married viserys instead of laena; doesn’t make sense that it’s bc alicent and rhaenyra fought after aemond lost his eye; doesn’t make sense that it’s bc alicent rules in viserys’ stead (if anything, that’d make it more likely she’d say it bc she and rhaenys are/were in similar positions, able to rule when their husbands couldn’t); doesn’t make sense that it’s bc alicent worked with vaemond so he could inherit driftmark (and not lucerys, another male).

so where?

Alicent: The Iron Throne was yours by blood and by temperament. Viserys would've lived his days a country lord, content to hunt and study his histories, but here we are. We do not rule, but we may guide the men that do. Gently. Away from violence and sure destruction and instead toward peace.

the “we do not rule, but…” lines are actually so important to me, because it’s alicent speaking as a woman who understands her position in society to another woman (maybe one who she hopes can feel the same). it’s alicent have a very firm grasp on what her limitations are and thus what is reasonably possible for her to do. here, i think, she underestimates rhaenys’ pride and concept of her own privilege, bc rhaenys does not view herself as a “mere woman”, she’s a targ, and she couldn’t nor wouldn’t visualize anything else.

Rhaenys: Is it in the name of peace that you've imprisoned me? And what of my dragon?

Alicent: If we are overmatched, Rhaenyra will be tempted to strike us, and war will ensue. Without your dragon, she may be persuaded to negotiate. If it's Driftmark you want, you shall have it for you and your granddaughters to pass on as you see fit.

excellent point from alicent. it’s a smart political move to keep rhaenys confined while her loyalties are uncertain. again, it’s not a “nice” thing to do to someone, but it’s not the time to be nice; it’s time to survive. giving rhaenys free reign would give her free reign to use a WMD on whoever she chooses. so, yeah, it is kind of in the name of peace to keep the user away from the weapon, because meleys is a weapon of MASS DESTRUCTION that could destroy the city and kill many.

and guess what happens later at the coronation? alicent is proven right. you let rhaenys out, you let the carnage out.

Rhaenys: You are wiser than I believed you to be, Alicent Hightower.

Alicent: A true queen counts the cost to her people.

Rhaenys: And yet you toil still in service to men. Your father, your husband, your son. You desire not to be free, but to make a window in the wall of your prison. Have you never imagined yourself on the Iron Throne?

i will stand by the post i made back when this episode aired, that some people can only hope to make windows.

if you can see a door, that’s great, but some people can’t and can only visualize fresh air. maybe you could help her find the door, rhaenys, but you’re more interested in shaming her.

rhaenys’ hypocrisy comes out here in full force in how she views alicent’s actions vs. her own, when she has done similar if not exactly what alicent has. but rhaenys is a targ/aryen, she’s got the dynasty and the dragonfire to back her up; alicent has to work with what your typical noble lady has. so, no, alicent can’t just do whatever she wants, bc, like you said redroses, her power is what others allow her. looks like rhaenys doesn’t have a window in the wall of her prison of privilege, and instead bricked herself up with her hypocrisy.

now. while i have ranted for quite a bit now, i do think it’s okay that rhaenys does not agree with alicent and does not see her as she is. that’s character conflict! that makes a great story! i can disagree with rhaenys’ perspective (and i do), but that she has it isn’t entirely the issue. what hammers in the frustration i have is that the narrative is siding with her, not allowing for these two women to have different points of view in shades of grey. the narrative doesn’t push for any interpretation other than rhaenys is correct, and that alicent is a bigoted, self-righteous fool, bc how dare she defend her son’s claim? “that’s not very girlboss of you, alicent, so we don’t care about your reasons for doing so and how they just might be valid from your POV.”

the scene ends without a retort more from alicent, again signaling how the narrative intends this as a “gotcha!” mic drop moment. but since i’ve gone this far, i might as well argue that the following could be considered one, bc she does at least get the final word:

Alicent: I'll leave you with your thoughts.

go ahead and have your thoughts, rhaenys. see how far you go, and if you won’t end up just like the mere mortals after all.

[dragon-of-the-soutn]

‘Why didn’t Viserys punish Alicent for stabbing the royal heir?’

Idk man, Viserys is about as useful and effective as a wet pice of tissue paper on a rainy day who couldn’t dole out punishment if you paid him. Like he’s genuinely useless, up to this point he has done nothing of note to help Rhaenyra in her role as heir leaving her to figure all this shit out on her own. Like he is the reason the Dance happens because he can’t do shit.

Like the scene just before the stabbing where Alicent is justifiably like ‘hey our twelve year old son’s eye is now out of his body. Can you help me get justice for it?’

And Viserys is just like ‘What would you have me do?!?’

Idk man, you’re the King. You have limitless authority to do anything you want. It’s kind of the whole benefit of the job. You could do anything to diffuse or prevent the situation from becoming worse and yet you chose to do nothing because making hard decisions is just too much for you. Again this man is as useful as a limp noodle. Cannot stress enough that everything can be blamed on his not decisions and you should blame him.

If Viserys has not haters I’m dead in the ground and I stand by that.

[atopvisenyashill]

i have to watch everything at least twice to understand it but preliminary thoughts

wigs look good so far even tho aegon’s looks dumb. i get they want to go for like “greasy sadboy” here but it looks like they plopped it on his head 10 minutes before they started filming. crazy bc little jaehaerys looked adorable, helaena looked very nice, and rhaenyra’s fucked up wig was divine.

baela and rhaena crumbs were nice and while i think the dresses on the whole looked better, i’m still genuinely annoyed that they consistently choose to put baela in these random no character targaryen style dresses instead of her trousers. it’s fine at least they were at the funeral up close this time, given that luke is their literal brothercousin.

we could have gotten a wall scene AND the cregan tells jace about luke reveal. imo there was time in this episode to have jace at some sort of small dinner where cregan introduces him to some people, talk about the long night, and see jace Relaxed, Funny, And Politicking like the aegon & jaehaerys scenes.

that said, him crying as he tried to report to rhaenyra was well done, and picking up joffrey actually made me yell out loud. i will take these crumbs thanks.

aliotto fatherhusband and daughterwife scene was really really excellent. i might turn into an alicole hater bc i think those scenes were a waste of time and i want alicent to fuck several relatives And larys before that man, if she must fuck a man. we’ll see going forward.

b&c was kinda disappointing? not married to the idea of helaena picking maelor/jaehaera to die over jaehaerys so much as blood or cheese making sure to get in that “hear that your mommy wants you dead” line. THATS what makes it the tragedy, that helaena chooses a child over the other and has to live with it. i Kind Of get the change here, the continued themes of helaena being ignored, the idea that helaena almost wants to spare jaehaerys from ever being king by letting him die (i mean that’s what i was getting from the earlier convo + “they killed the boy” - spare her boy by letting him die, try to protect her girl by ensuring she lives). but then they should have found a way to work in an extra level of psychological torture there with the choice she made.

i DO like that they chose jaehaerys to kill bc they were kinda rushed. they’re doing this for the money, bc they don’t like the hightowers, there’s a different rat catcher for different floors, they’re not thinking about the politics of whether it’s better to risk killing aemond in a messy way or settle for jaehaerys, they’re just trying to get the job done. i think there needed to be a little more oomph in that decision though - either more gore/sadism during the moment of killing jaehaerys or a longer scene with daemon about what to do if they can’t bag aemond that makes the viewer a bit unsettled by daemon.

rhys looked infinitely sexier to me. he dumped his annoying deadbeat husband (viserys) and glowed the fuck up. i respect the game.

in general, it’s the same issue as last season which is too much plot heavy tb scenes whereas tg has a good mix of character & plot driven scenes. it’s so frustrating that they can get the same information across but in a scene that has more character analysis & humor but seem determined to Only do this for the greens. the only one we really got for tb in that regard is maybe the corlys/alyn one.

i don’t want to end on bitching let’s end these with MY FAVORITE PARTS: ✨🖤jace’s fire new look🖤✨ and every aegon scene!

[bohemian-nights]

If nettles was a white girl like Alys, dumbyra fans wouldn’t say shit. Look at laena and daemon regardless of them being married in the books they hated the fact of them being together in the show and how they did there relationship was disgusting. I was really irked on how daemon and Rhaenyra had sex in the most disrespectful way like Laena was just laid to rest and she found if a way to get with her uncle!! Then disappeared for 6 years from court and act’s surprised that the hightowers and vaemond are plotting against them like YOU’VE DONE NOTHING BUT POP OUT BABIES FOR THE PAST 6 YEARS!!!!! I can’t stress how much I hate the whole Daemon loves Rhaenyra more than anything, if he loves her sooo much why did he do the following

1) steal her dead baby brother’s egg

2)called himself the “rightful heir” to the throne after she was named heir

3)called her dead brother “heir for a day”

4) left her to fight in the stepstones and ignored her for years

5) almost ruined her reputation by taking her to a brothel

6)left her alone at night in the most dangerous place in kings landing

7)left her again during her wedding where she almost got trampled

8)undermines her during the plot to take kings landing

9) ignores her calls during her labor

10) ignores her call to come back to kings landing

11) he literally chokes her when he finds out that Viserys never thought of him as heir

Like they gaslight themselves into believing that this is okay, it’s not

Now I do understand the age difference between nettles and daemon is very important she’s 17 and he’s 49 but I think that they are more healthier relationship. I feel that nettles is more patient with daemon and they have better communication, she’s not afraid to tell daemon like “hey you do realize that this is fucked up” and he grows more as a person with her. Nettles isn’t spoiled and doesn’t like to be spoiled much and daemon likes that. Rhaenyra can act like a baby sometimes and it annoys him when she gets like that.

Sorry for the big rant but I know when nettles is casted and when we see her actor she’s gonna get hate from people WHO SHIP AN UNCLE WHO GROOMED HIS FUCKING NIECE. I’m going to war for my girl Nettles.

This wasn’t a rant, this was a read👏🏽 I honestly think that if Nettles were white(hell if she were actually non-Black like how they try to insist she is because they don’t want a Negro with Daemon) then a good portion of these racist stans would have jumped ship already.

Dumbnyra has always been a disaster of a ship(in the show and the books which 99% weren’t shipping this trash until said show).

There were glaring red flags from the get-go (the 1st “romantic moment” Rhaenyra is underage), but because they are self-inserting (this includes the weirdo self-haters who are fine with throwing other “WOC” under the bus to live out their Aryan obey me or I’ll nuke you fantasies) into her and can’t relate to anyone who isn’t white they are holding onto this Titanic of a ship for dear life.

I'm glad you mentioned Alys. People may hate her now, but the moment she shows up on screen and interacts with Aemond I can guarantee that most of that hate(which is mostly from Hellmann's shippers who only like their insane crackship that they pretend is canon because it’s a self insert ship) will fade away.

With Alys there, who’s also white and is Aemond’s actual love interest, Helaena won’t be needed anymore. So they’ll drop her faster than a hot cake, do a 180, say who’s Helaena, and ole girl will become the new self-insert.

That’s not going to be the case for Nettles(and yeah sadly her actress is going to get a lot of hate so prayers to her).

If you guys don’t believe us literally go pull up any fandom with a Black woman as a love interest and see the bullsh*t and excuses that are written.

Every single time the actresses get verbally attacked(they get called literal racial slurs see Candice Patton-The Flash), the showrunners do them, and their characters(Kat Graham-Vampire Diaries and Nicole Beharie-Sleepy Hollow), the fans of said characters and ships get attacked(this fandom is already starting it), and there are a million and one think pieces on how her character “doesn’t need a man” or how the ship she’s in isn’t “good for her”(all while these same people excuse actual abusive relationships like Dumbnyra).

People always say oh it isn’t about race it’s actually about xyz, but if every time you are complaining when you see a Black woman as the love interest, yeah it’s about race🤷🏽‍♀️ You guys don’t like seeing Black women in romantic relationships especially with your faves. It’s the same song and dance and now they are doing it with Nettles under the guise of “caring.”

If you ship Dumbnyra(and I’ve seen several of these shippers drawing art that’s supposed to be romantic where Rhaenyra is a literal child) and then fix your mouth to say Daemon and Nettles relationship is somehow bad for Nettles and that people promoting it want Netty to be abused (translation: I don’t want my self insert to be left for a Black girl, but I can’t come out and say that so I’ll just pretend to care about this Black girl when I’m actually cheering on for her to be axed or played by a white woman, yes I’ve seen some of these ignorant people want Nettles to be white because the Velaryons were made Black🙃).

The dynamic between Daemon and Nettles isn’t anything like Daemon and Rhaenyra. The only thing they’ve got in common is that Nettles is young and even then she’s technically an adult and she’s probably going to be aged up to be Laena’s book age in the show. The moment that happens they’ll find some new excuse(I don’t want Nettles to look like a ho knowing damn well their self insert was out their chasing after a freshly widowed man and they cheered it on) why Daemon and Nettles shouldn’t happen.

Yeah, they did have a much healthier relationship and Daemon grows from his time with her(something he never did with Rhaenyra). He grows enough to put her ahead of everyone including his wife’s rule and his own safety(which is what Nettles deserves), but we are lost in the sauce. 100% it’s protect Nettles over here 🙌🏽

[undertheorangetree]

Okay I’m the WORST ride or die for not getting to this sooner because admittedly I am not an Aegon girly (I love you short kings you’re just not tall enough to ride this ride) BUT the promo video of TGC (🥵) combined with my Canadian heritage (🫡) FINALLY made me read this AND THANK GOD I DID!!!! BESTIE THIS IS SO MUCH FUN!!! Every time you write a series I know I’m in for a good times romcom (full of finger licking porn) and this was no different.

Chapter six changed me fundamentally as a person I cannot lie. Your smut always hits so hard but unfortunately that hit a little different

Anyway Aemond’s little “hardly a loss” and Helaena’s “he really only had one daughter” viserys slander I will always love you if viserys has no haters I’m dead BUT ALSO the ANGST IN CHAPTER 8 AFTER HE DIED POOR AEGON

This could be a full length academic review but I REFUSE to give anymore spoilers cuz everyone needs to plz read this right now that’s an order I’m in charge let the TGC lust fuel you and think of him with this hair as you read plz and thank you

Thin Ice Series Masterlist

modern!HOTD & college AU & hockey AU

pairing: Aegon x Reader & Cregan Stark x Reader

summary: Aegon Targaryen is a hockey-playing, party-loving, self-centered player. You've sworn off guys like that. But fate intervenes and suddenly you're thrown into a partnership with him, a quid pro quo of sorts. But nothing is ever that simple. And all's fair in love and hockey, right?

tropes: faking dating, best friend’s brother

status: completed (11/11)

Chapter 1: The Deal

Chapter 2: Party Girl

Chapter 3: Breakfast of Champions

Chapter 4: Hole in One

Chapter 5: Formal

Chapter 6: Consequences

Chapter 7: Superstitious

Chapter 8: Runaway

Chapter 9: Mirrors

Chapter 10: Confessions

Chapter 11: Worth It

Moodboard

Moodboard AGAIN

[secondgenerationnerd]

Alicent dismissing Dyana after what aegon did to her? I expected her to raise more a stink considering what she went through with viserys . If alicent has haters I’m dead

That’s why I said I can sympathize with her to a point

[humanpurposes]

🍬 ⇢ post an unpopular opinion about a popular fandom character

🦋 ⇢ share something that has been on your heart and mind lately 

Hi Karina!! Thanks for the asks 🥰

🍬, If Viserys has no haters I’m dead. Sure I feel for him when he’s old and rotting and he just wants everyone to get along, but really the rift between Rhaenyra and Alicent is his fault. Not to mention this guy got one wife killed then married a teenager.

🦋, ooo good question! Lately what’s been on my heart and mind is that patience is a virtue.

[aerltarg]

Maybe this is a stupid question, buuuuut:

I just can't imagine a world that Rhaegar comes back from the Trident, wins the war and becomes king. No, I'm not a anti Rhaegar, matter of fact I like him very much, I'm just can imagine how would Lya, little Jon, this whole affair, would settle in the capital. The norm that fics (at least those I read) tend to follow is to make Rhaegar:

1. A douche, paranoid and destiny-obessed king.

2. Completely incompetent, aloof monarch, that deep down has a heart of gold, but can't really be understood.

I mean, isn't he supposed to be a scholar since he was a kid? What's are your thoughts about it?

oh, yeah, i can totally understand this! it's is the whole point in canon actually, "the wrong man came back from the trident". you would expect a hero win against his antagonist and have a happy ending w his lady love but it doesn't happen. instead the subversion happens to them with rhaegar being killed by robert who becomes obviously a shitty king and lyanna dying after him. they were never supposed to have happy ending, they were created as tragic and doomed and dead from the beginning for the whole plot to start, jon to have his parentage mystery and dany to take the passed baton as the last dragon, prophesied savoir and the heir who has to carry entire house on her back now.

as for the realistic rhaegar wins aus that's the difficult question. tbh we just don't know enough abt their situation, plans and wishes. you see, e.g. in agot we can be right in ned's head and see his motivations, what he was thinking abt, what he was planning, what he was hoping to do. but if his story was told the way rhaegar's was i bet he would have his own crowd of haters and ~intellectuals~ jumping out every two seconds w their "hot takes" how actually all hints abt what rlly happened (ned being a good man w his own sense of honour, justice and experiences affecting him and the deal w cersei's children) doesn't matter and he was an ambitious prick, planned to grasp the power by being joffrey's regent and make his daughter sansa queen. (you can actually insert there any bullshit and still don't reach the level of stupidity of such "hot takes" this fandom loves so much lmao). also he would be blamed to the hell and beyond for being too stupid and not foreseeing the future and actions of other ppl bc ofc after everything happened it's so easy to say what was so obvious to notice. also they would say that the deaths of his men and horrible fates of his kids are 100% his fault and even straight up say he killed them lmao. i can rant abt it for hours so yeah. this is a situation w too many unknown variables bc it depends too much on actions of too many characters we don't know enough abt. the only thing it's possible to tell for sure is the fact that there couldn't be any perfect solutions since things got too complicated at this point.

such fics as you've mentioned tho are just a part of this dumb fanon where rhaegar is "too prophecy obsessed"/"incapable of love"/shrodinger's rhaegar both smart and stupid at the same time/whatever/all of this combined lmfao. the man was notably intelligent from the early age as you've absolutely rightly mentioned, his guesses abt himself being tptwp have nothing to do w egocentrism as some parts of the fandom would want us all to believe unless he wouldn't be so reasonable abt it and later on, after so many years, wouldn't have changed his mind and thought his son could be tptwp.

and literally fuck all antis that think you shouldn't consider prophecies that hold real power in this fantasy world lol. you know, aegon the conqueror was said to be motivated (or at least partly) to unify westeros by the prophecy and still got the treatment of perfect/maximum close to perfect figure of a leader everyone should look up to from the narrative and grrm. prophecy obsessed much, huh? i don't even talk abt all these parallels between him and rhaegar grrm put there not for bitches to ignore them completely! and i will never get tired of reminding that dismissing prophecies is UNWISE for targaryens of all people. the house whose story is built on the dream of young daenys and her father aenar that listened to her despite common sense (or what local "anti magic"/"anti prophecies" clowns consider to be common sense). targs would be as dead as the rest of dragonlords if not for daenys the dreamer. who else in the world has as many reasons to take prophecies seriously as them?

yet antis out there act as if rhaegar is one dimensional weirdo whose every character trait is abt mf ~prophecy obsession~. like how can they miss one of the main points so badly?? the game of thrones distracts ppl from the real danger beyond the wall, yk, the one rhaegar was aware of and meant to deal with. there wouldn't be such a problem if he became king and had as many years of head start before ice zombies apocalypse as ignorant bobby b did. rhaegar had to die just for westeros to sink in shit and our main heroes to save everyone to make this story more epic LMAO

so yeah, too many ppl portray rhaegar as this one dimensional robotic creature without any knowledge of what feelings are idk even for what reason. it seems these ppl can't read for real bc rhaegar was not only intelligent af as well as dutiful ("it seems i must be a warrior" but "he loved his harp more than his lance") but also. ugh emotional?? my boy had constant emo sessions w brooding at ruins of summerhall, sleeping out there beneath the stars all alone and writing songs that made all women cry. does it sound as someone who "isn't capable of love" lol? folks act as if he was completely heartless from the day he was born (bc he didnt play w other kids ig??) but in reality their emotional range is less than the one of a spoon in comparison to rhaegar's lol. i'm not even gonna address the horrible attitude of demonizing him for his implied depression, vile clowns never listen to themselves when they talk abt targaryens and their "madness".

tldr; these fics are mostly lame af and suck at characterization if they're making rhaegar like that lol. anyway his character isn't abt being a good or a bad king, it's abt being a would-be-king for characters in books and readers in reality to sigh over his tragic aura and pretty aesthetic abt how it could've been. however, grrm clearly doesn't write rhaegar as evil or incapable as some parts of the fandom would want to try to persuade others. realistically speaking in the scenario where he wins there couldn't be any perfect decisions but it's a territory of speculations on thin air and lit nothing more since canon doesn't provide us with enough information to rlly theorize anything instead of building biased headcanons some ppl call "analysis".

but remember what barristan said about rhaegar while practically watching him all his life, from a literal baby to the man grown:

“I know little of Rhaegar. Only the tales Viserys told, and he was a little boy when our brother died. What was he truly like?”

The old man considered a moment. “Able. That above all. Determined, deliberate, dutiful, single-minded.” (ASOS, Daenerys I)

“Prince Rhaegar’s prowess was unquestioned, but he seldom entered the lists. He never loved the song of swords the way that Robert did, or Jaime Lannister. It was something he had to do, a task the world had set him. He did it well, for he did everything well. That was his nature. But he took no joy in it. Men said that he loved his harp much better than his lance.” (ASOS, Daenerys IV)

[yennefers-geralt]

What do you think about the Rhaenys and Daenerys plot switch discourse antis throw around? I get a little bit of where they are coming from, sure WOC deserve badass characters, but to have other female characters arcs recycled for them, absolutely not, they deserve original and befitting arcs that work for them properly. I've never seen such hate for a character such as Dany, that haters resort to reviving a dead character whose plot would be completely different from hers, like what the hell?!

I haven’t seen that wank, so I’m not sure how helpful my input would be. But here goes...

Just based on this ask, I would say that it’s completely impossible for Rhaenys and Dany to have a “plot switch”. If Rhaenys, Aegon, and Elia had been sent to Dragonstone instead of Viserys and a pregnant Rhaella, their story couldn’t have ended in the same place. Tywin still would have had the Targs inside the Red Keep killed, so Rhaella, Viserys, and Dany would be dead. But that’s where the similarities end. Elia would still have all of Dorne to turn to for support. If she was able to escape Dragonstone before Stannis arrived, she probably would have gone to the safety of Sunspear rather than Braavos. Here are a few possibilities from there:

Robert extends the war to Dorne. This would lose him a lot of support. His rebellion against the Iron Throne was about saving his own life, Ned’s life, and Lyanna. It could also be said to be about removing an insane king and heir from the throne, which has already been achieved through the deaths of Rhaegar and Aerys. Extending the war to Dorne in order to kill two children would turn him from a hero into a tyrant in the eyes of many. Ned wouldn’t continue his allegiance to him and I’m doubtful Hoster Tully would either. It would also mean going to war against the only region that defied the dragons and only came into the realm through negotiation and peaceful marriage. Robert would die in Dorne and the Targs would be restored, probably with Aegon as king and Margaery as his betrothed. If Ned joined Dorne’s side rather than simply marching home, Rhaenys might be engaged to Robb.

The remaining lords call a Great Council to decide how to heal the realm resulting in a) the regions becoming individual kingdoms, b) Robert becoming king with some kind of marriage agreement between Rhaenys and him or his future heir, or c) Aegon being named king with a council of regents chosen by the assembled lords.

Robert would keep the throne and fume for years about the existence of Aegon and Rhaenys in Dorne, insisting that they were threats. He would be right, eventually, but the closer threat to him personally would still be his wife killing him. Unless Illyrio and Varys found a way to kill Aegon and arrange a marriage between Rhaenys  and Aegon Mopatis Blackfyre so they could be king and queen, I can’t see a reason why they would give her dragon eggs.

Long story short, Rhaenys surviving would be a completely different story than Dany’s. She wouldn’t have to suffer on the streets or be sold for an army or creeped on by J0rah. She would spend her early years in the Water Gardens with the safety of being one among many children.

Again, I haven’t seen that wank. But if the participants are the ones I suspect, I don’t believe for a single second that they care about women of color or Rhaenys. If Rhaenys had survived and was the mother of dragons, regarded as the most beautiful woman in the world, and gaining a power base that could win her the Iron Throne as well as Jon Snow’s dick, those people would HATE her. They would probably HATE her even more than they HATE Dany right now. Those people despise anyone who isn’t their self insert. Discussing Rhaenys as a hypothetical as a way of hating on Dany is meaningless. They know she is dead in the series and no threat to the status they want for their fav.

[gotarcher94]

Jonerys questionnaire

Tagged by: @daenerysstormbornstark

Trivial Q and A’ s

a) Who will die first?

If one of them is gonna die, then I’m guessing that it’ll be Dany. I don’t know if they’ll make Jon die twice!

b) Who loves who more than the other?

Well, judging by the looks they gave each other all season, they both clearly fell for each other ages ago and are both as deeply in love as the other.

c) Will anyone of them sit the Iron Throne?

If the Iron Throne even survives, then I am positive that they will rule together. So unless one of the sits on the other’s lap (smutty fanfic inspiration anyone?) then I'm sure they will have their own thrones made (which would be pretty cool!)

d) Will they marry?

Of course!

e) Will they have a child?

See D)

f) How will Daenerys react to Jon being her nephew?

It won’t bother her that much, as she grew up thinking that she would marry Viserys. 

g) How will Daenerys find out?

Westerosi Wikipedia, aka Bran Stark (Can you tell that I’m still salty about D&Ds direction with Bran?) 

h) How will Jon’s siblings treat Daenerys?

I imagine that while they will be initially be distrustful of her(being a Targaryen) they will begin to warm to her, like Jon did. I imagine that both Arya and Sansa especially will be close to her, as they could sympathise with her in the struggles that she has gone through.  

i) Will Jon find out Daenerys is pregnant before he finds out they are related?

I’m torn on this, as I can see it going either way tbh. But either way, Jon’s honor, his love for Dany and his desire for his child to not be a bastard will keep them both together

j) Will they both survive?

God I hope so! I dunno if I could handle both of my favorite characters dying

k) How will they die, if they were to die?

Dany: More than likely it will be with the Nissa Nissa route if they decide to go for it (which I really hope not)

Jon: Dying in combat with the Night King

l) Will Daenerys rival Jon for the throne?

Fuck no!

m) What do they have in common?

How long do you have? The short version: their compassion, their desire to make the world a better place for their subjects, their outsider status while growing up, their parallels as potential Azor Ahai.  

n) What will their first real argument be like?

It will likely be over battle strategy, with Jon probably suggesting that he go on another potential suicide mission. Dany will appeal to his sense of self preservation, while also mentioning their child, while Jon will be his usual moping self 

o) What will happen if they were to break up ? 

Jon would probably brood around Winterfell, while thinking up some stupid mission to go to distract himself, while Dany would be trying to smack some sense into him

p) Who will wear the pants in the relationship?

I don't think either of them will do, as I have always seen them as being presented as equals

q) Will their relationship be boring?

Errr.... nooooo.

r) Who will be more jealous or emotional insecure?

Jon definitely!

s) Will they still be together after they find out they are related?

Yes. As I said Jon’s love for Dany and his child, as well as his fear since his teens of fathering a bastard child will win out over his identity crisis over his parentage asm despite what the haters want, Jon will NOT abandon the mother of his child.

t) Will they publicly express their emotions?

God I hope so. It would be so great to see the salty looks on the faces of the Northern lords, many of whom will have wanted to set up their daughters as a match for the KitN. Serve them right for turning their backs on Jon ten minutes after he left!

u) Will they have more sexy time at Winterfell?

Yes! On every available surface.

v) If they were to marry, where would Jon propose?

I have three possible headcanons. 

1) In the godswood

2) On the Winterfell batttlements where Dany goes to find him after he has been brooding over his parentage (not knowing that he has gotten over it)

3) On the battlefield after he has believed Dany is dead

(They’re a bit cliche I know, but sue me!)

x) If they had a child, what will it be called?

Daeron for a boy and Rhaenyra for a girl

y) If Jon made Daenerys choose between him and power, what will she want more?

Jon. Her desire for the Iron Throne is based on the fact that it was her family’s throne, and she craves a connection to her family. Jon, as both her nephew and the potential (but likely) father of her child) is her best hope of that.

z) What is their bitter sweet ending?

After the war, where they are both weary from the fighting, they have to retain control of the throne, to make sure that the people of Westeros have the best chance of recovery. Despite all of the losses that they have both suffered, losing many friends and loved ones along the way, they put their own wants and desires to one side, as they have both done before. However they do so, knowing that they are together and have their remaining family and friends alongside them.  (Sorry, I’m not great at bittersweet, I like happy endings!)

Tagging: @mpaty1475 @maberogers @foreigninvader-northernfool @bookofthestranger @winelover1989