#if not mike’s monologue

[chirpsythismorning]

If you allow anger or emotion to invade your thoughts, you will fail. I promise.

My fav prove of Mleven being bones is this:

We were shown in s2 and s4 how El channelled love to boost her powers. That made her slightly levitate and it created a bright light around her. (The pictures are bad but you’ve seen the scenes.)

We were also shown how Henry/001 taught El to channel anger when she needed a power boost. There was no light nor levitating there. It looked like this:

And then we have the season 4 finale, where El fights Vecna right after hearing Mike’s ”love confession”:

No light

No levitating

And she’s using only one hand, unlike in the first two scenes where she channelled love…

El did not feel loved after Mike’s speech. She felt angry. And she only started fighting after Mike told her to fight, not after the dozen i love yous…

Conclusion: Mleven is bones.

[miwiromantics]

I’m so hilarious…

[whynotimtired]

There's something in Finn wolfhard being a breakout star in s1 and humongous names like Steven Spielberg saying that the kids changed the limitations of child acting bc they're so good. And then suddenly Finn wolfhard after S4 being known generally as the worst one, as the guy who can't act, just "not as good" as everyone else. Because of the monologue. The monologue the writers praised and hyped up as his best work, as something they didn't know if he could do bc he hadn't ever done it before, generally something they were really proud of.

So, if his supposed "best work" is something that people come away from feeling like it's his worst? That means there's a disconnect in the way the writers are looking at the scene vs the way the general audience sees it, which is funny bc if we look at that scene at face value, he's confessing his love. So if theres something deeper about the scene that changes the meaning, that changes that scene from bad acting to great acting, from a love confession to...

[chirpsythismorning]

El being *12 hours earlier* than the Cali timeline when she arrives at Nina. Will saying ‘it’s been 9 hrs’ in the scene following his monologue in the van.

We know that at some point their timelines merged when they arrived to save her…

But we don’t know when exactly those alignments took place when they were still apart… which just makes you wonder…

[bangtanthoughts]

"mike and el's love will save the world in s5" the world literally broke in half after mike's monologue. be fr.

[mikeslawyer]

mike needs to tell will that he’s in love with him, not that he loves him. will needs to hear and feel the difference.

[emblazons]

That's why we're doing this. Yeah. Right. Its for the promotion.

Mike Wheeler & Will Byers in S04E06 - The Dive aka my favorite tag team liars problem-solvers

[thranduel]

how was this monologue real

[teambyler]

Mike was saying "I love you" to Will

Most people see Mike's monologue and think of it as "proof" that he and El are an endgame couple, but it's actually one of the strongest hints of a Byler conclusion.

Because Mike was saying "I love you" to Will.

Sounds crazy? Of course! He was speaking directly to El, after all. What the hell am I talking about?

Some have focused on contradictions and other issues with what Mike says, including listing El's superpowers instead of the full person she wants to be loved for being. Plus he had to do it (and was pushed by Will), or else El and their friends in Hawkins might have died. It does seem like El sensed something off in what he said, which would explain why she hardly talked to him afterward. But I actually disagree about Mike's "I love you" being a total lie. In the official script it's written that it had a positive effect on El (although the way it was ultimately shot and edited made it more ambiguous). (I got this screencap from a TikTok video):

And so, in the van, Will DID make Mike love El. Mike MIGHT have wondered whether Will was talking about himself too, but one thing he was convinced of was that that El loved him because "he's the heart." Feeling like she loved him for who he was made him love her. I think it's more accurate to say that, while Mike's monologue may have had issues, he DID feel something genuine... BUT the logic of events leads more toward a BYLER conclusion than away from one.

The problem for Mike and El is that Mike was saying "I love you" to the idea of El that WILL put in his head:

Will said that El felt like a mistake, and that Mike made her feel like she was better for being different. She was terrified of losing him and so that's why she pushed him away.

So Mike came out of that conversation with new feelings for El: he thought that SHE needed HIM to love her, not because of "dumb luck," but because of his unique qualities. Who HE is helps her be a superhero.

But El's journey in Season 4 was to LEAVE Mike to "be a superhero." When she left a note for Mike, she tellingly signed it "From El." When she realized he couldn't say he loved her, she chose to let go of their romantic relationship. Her journey in Season 4 was about finding who she was independently from others in her life (most importantly her "papa" Dr. Brenner). El went through her own journey that REQUIRED separating from Mike.

By the time they reunite, she has grown. Instead of Mike coming up with the plan (like so many times before), EL came up with the piggyback plan. While she was piggybacking, Mike said "I love you" -- but having her self-image rely on how Mike sees her was something she was moving away from.

She had felt like a monster. What liberated her from feeling that was NOT Mike and not an elusive "normal life" (with a relationship) -- let alone something as token and symbolic as saying "I love you." She had to realize this on her own:

There were clues in Mike's monologue for her to pick up on that he wasn't fully telling the truth, first and foremost him saying that he "knew, in that moment, that I loved you." (He couldn't have, when he was openly scheming in s1 to get her sent away, possibly to a mental hospital, loud enough for her to hear.)

But Mike DID love El when he said "I love you." Mike saw someone who desperately needed him, someone whom MIKE was a hero to and not just the other away around.

That person he was thinking of, of course, was WILL.

It wasn't like it was news to Mike that El needed his love: El confronted him earlier in the season for not saying he loved her. We all saw that El's heartbreak didn't convince Mike that he loved El.

Ironically, it was WILL'S heartbreak, HIS emotions, and HIS words that did. And Mike felt something real this time, because it came from WILL.

Will's words affected Mike deeply. Deep down, Mike wants to be someone's hero. He's the leader; he's "the heart." When dealing with a superhero like El, he can admire and love her, sure... but does it make MIKE feel loved for who HE is? Does a romantic relationship with El COMPLETE him? Mike doesn't want to be a discount Lois Lane. He wants be loved because who HE is makes him THEIR hero, too.

Mike has always been bullied, misunderstood, and angry. He rambled just before Will's speech about being "some random nerd" and feeling like he didn't deserve El. He felt inadequate, and this affected him ("leader Mike" recedes when he's in a relationship with El, and comes forward when someone -- usually Will -- needs him). Will's point "You make them feel better because they're different" doesn't just describe El + Will; this is what Mike is looking for, too.

Being "some random nerd" is part of why Will loves him so much. Will's painting was the perfect gift; Will knows and understands his best friend better than anyone. The D&D theme was a tribute to Mike the nerd -- he sees everything he is, the "good" and the "bad" -- AND he sees the hero and the leader. WILL's love for WHO MIKE IS made him feel like he's a good person.

(Here's an angelwithnightmares video that shows this about Mike exactly)

Mike's journey in s4 was him rediscovering that he is a hero. And this required separating from El and hearing this from Will. Will said that he's the leader of the group: "You keep the party together." And earlier in the season he reminded Mike "you guys saved me" (with a proud "I did, didn't I" reaction from Mike that was super cute lol).

Will's love gave Mike the strength to be a hero again. Mike pretty much used Will's words in his monologue to El. Two scenes at the end of Season 4 foreshadowed "leader Mike" coming back; his speech to El, and his "We will" shoulder grab with Will. Whatever issues there were in his monologue, this was THE callback to "leader Mike" of s1 and s2. He didn't help El beat Vecna, but he helped them survive. Mike spoke of his genuine platonic love for El, while thinking it was romantic love. And it was WILL's romantic love that helped him be this hero, to say "I love you" to the person he thought made him feel that way, who as it turns out was WILL.

So we'll have a final season where there is this hugest of loose ends when it comes to Byler: Mike will somehow realize that Will in the van was describing himself and not El. Mike will realize that the first time he felt romantic love, was because of Will, and that Will more than anyone helps him be the hero he wants to be. (It's the perfect formula, writing-wise, to make a closeted boy confused about his romantic feelings!)

AND Mike will learn that Will sacrificed his own happiness for him and El. How does that NOT lead to Mike loving Will even more than he already does?

Finn Wolfhard himself said about the van scene:

How is he this clueless right now? What with the Will scene... I remember asking the Duffers, "Why would he not know all this?" And they were like, "Don't worry, kid, it'll pay off in the end."

I think it will.

-teambyler

[star-41306]

ARCHIVE WAKE UP. WAKE UP ARCHIVE. AO3 CAN YOU HEAR ME?? AO3?? AO3?!?! CAN YOU HEAR ME?? ARCHIVE OF OUR OWN. ao3?? I don't know if you can hear this but, but if you can, I want you to know I'm here, okay? I'm right here. and, I LOVE YOU. ao3, do you hear me? I love you. I'm sorry I don't say it more, it's not because I'm scared of you. I'm not. I've never felt that way! never! *lightning crash as a reminder that some of the most immoral fics ever created reside on ao3* but I am scared that one day you'll realize that you don't need me anymore. and I thought that if I said how I felt it would somehow make that day, hurt more. *camera pans to wattpad and tumblr* but the truth is ao3, I DONT KNOW HOW TO LIVE WITHOUT YOU. I feel like my life started that day I searched you up on Google Chrome. you were still in light mode, and it burned my eyes. and I knew right there and then, in that moment, that I loved you. and I've loved you everyday since. I love you on my good days, I love you on my bad days, I love you on dark mode, I love you on light mode. I love you even when you're under attack. YOU'RE MY SUPER HERO!!! and, I can't lose you!!! okay? I CANT LOSE YOU. YOU CAN DO ANYTHING. you can make people laugh and sob uncontrollably, you can get through this. I believe that, I really do. but right now, you just have to fight. okay? ao3, do you hear me. you need to fight. you have to fight. fight!! FIGHT!!!

[willbyersabyss]

Firm believer that Mike was trying to ask Will for different advice in s4 but Will didn’t understand. The last time Mike talked to Will about relationships was in s3 so what if he was expecting Will to react the same way? What if he wanted Will to encourage a breakup? Mike kept asking for the same advice because Will wasn’t giving Mike what he wanted to hear.

This is the first time he turns to Will for advice. “Whatever it is you didn’t say, you can say it to her then.” He smiles but then he drops it once Will looks away. Mike looks conflicted as if that’s not the response he was expecting.

Then when Will says something that resonated with Mike more, they were interrupted before we could see his response. “Sometimes it’s scary to open up like that. What if they don’t like the truth?” So Will is getting closer to the point Mike is trying to make but the truth is still being hidden from us here.

Mike tries one final time in the van and it seems like Will gets it at first, that Mike is scared of losing El. It goes downhill once Will starts talking about how much El needs Mike. He looks conflicted again. But this scene ends more hopeful! Mike is smiling and feels reassured! Maybe Will understood after all?

And finally, Mike realizes that Will didn’t understand what he was hinting at. Will wasn’t reassuring Mike that El would still be friends with him if they weren’t together. He meant it in a romantic context. Mike has lost all hope.

[apocalyptic-byler]

thought about mike wheeler again

[will80sbyers]

The difference between these monologues is obvious imo

Mike's monologue to Will:

Shot like a love monologue

Mike starts talking on his own because he wants to save Will

Will is flooded by light, personal close up with emotions of love behind his eyes even when he can't respond

It feels like Mike and Will are the only two in the room even if other people are there

The moment is delicate so it has no music and distractions

Will and Mike are looking at each other in the eyes

They don't lose anybody of the party in season 2 and they win against the bad guy

Simple and well written without clichés

Mike's monologue to El:

Shot like a tragic moment, harsh ugly light, El is literally in a red light and being suffocated

Prompted by Will after a lie he told Mike that Mike believed

Will is framed purposefully behind Mike in the most important parts of the monologue

There are shots of Will and Jonathan in the middle of the monologue making it feel like Mike and El are not alone at all

Full of distractions and with a score called "the Heart" ... From Will's speech and feelings... And we are in the middle of the action with people dying feeling the anxiety from the fear

Even if it gave a bit of strength to El it's not enough to win, they lose Max in the end

When El revives Max they put in the words "there's more to life than stupid boys" right after the love monologue from Mike

It feels impersonal, they don't look at each other face to face really

Full of old ugly romantic clichés instead of being good quality writing that they did with other couples like they didn't really care for it to be good

Finn literally improvised some lines and made it more ugly than the script that was already ugly and they decided it was okay to show to people

No romantic flashbacks of Mike and El, just a platonic one even if they do have romantic scenes that could have conveyed the feelings of love to the fans... They decided to not use them

??????????? This is supposed to be romantic???? To make us feel the romantic feelings between them and make us like this ship ??? I just can't believe this sorry lmao it completely goes against everything I know about cinematography and I do not believe the Duffers suddenly lost their minds

[chirpsythismorning]

Welcome to a series I'm calling:

Yes, that scene did foreshadow Mike's monologue was disingenuous

Because you'd be surprised how many times the show (even prior to s4) has poked fun at Mike's monologue in the most random ways.

The Bingham's Beautiful Performance

First we have Suzie's sister on the floor, bedazzled and sporting a veil all while her brother is filming. This is basically the kids attempting to present a tale of a romance ending in gruesome tragedy.

Our bride here is El. The edition of the veil could be a nod to the loud majority's series long assumption that Mike and El are going to end the show together, preferably getting married.

Unfortunately, this is the closest thing they'll ever get to it, with the acknowledgement of that possibility in and of itself being mocked.

This next shot makes the likelihood that these scenes are connected pretty much indisputable, that being the edition of the record player behind the bride's head.

The only reason they made a point of having Will push the radio out of El's way, was to subtly connect this moment in Surfer boy to the beautiful performance we saw at the Bingham's only a few episodes prior (scenes that are widely known to be filled with foreshadowing for the season's ending).

A few bylers have already talked about these parallels, so this isn't new knowledge per say. But I do know some have dropped it altogether as possible foreshadowing for whatever reason, while most fans outside of the byler fandom insist it only foreshadowed Eddie's death. However, I think there are too many details that equally, if not more connect it to Mike's monologue than to Eddie's death.

Some fans have also noticed how Will was missing in quite a few shots at the Bingham's, which is interesting, but not all that surprising. Especially in this case...

Will. Will is the director

Director Will: GET THAT RADIO OUT OF MY SHOT!

Will directed the monologue when he used his feelings to inspire Mike, with the reminder of it (literally in the moment) directing Mike to confess to El, just like Suzie's brother directed that beautiful performance. Both performances convincingly left its audience thinking that the performers feelings in that moment were believable and...

genuine...

[robynrocksforbrains]

I love you ×9

Ok so I am probably not the first person to notice this or point it out since I've only been a byler for like six months... BUT I did maybe go a little crazy about this. So I'm gonna talk about it.

So a few days ago I was thinking about the mlvn endgame argument "well Mike said 'I love you' nine times". And like, first of all, saying "I love you" doesn't undo a year's worth of deliberate lying and miscommunication. That's not how relationships work. Their issues are still very much real and very much not going anywhere because they're not even TRYING to do anything about them. But also... I was thinking: why nine times? Why that number specifically? Was it just random? Is there maybe anything to indicate that nine is significant? Is there maybe a scene in the first episode of s4 that tells us how we should react to the monologue?

So, the DND basketball montage. Great stuff. Amazing foreshadowing. Everyone loved it.

I got to thinking about it. Decided I needed to know what Mike's roll was. I kinda spiraled about it on twitter because I could not see it clearly and I couldn't tell if it was an eight or nine. Desperate times called for desperate measures so I recorded my tablet with my phone and found the perfect frame.

IT'S A NINE

CLEAR AS DAY! IT'S A NINE! GREATEST DAY OF MY LIFE!!

Anyway, I don't know how DND works. I don't know why this roll evoked the reaction it did from the party - most significantly, Mike's very disgruntled reaction (I don't mean The Party™ I just mean literally the party that is playing this campaign) I genuinely don't know what the fuck is going on in this game. But what I do know is they wanted us to associate this roll with failure. That's why it corresponds with a missed basket in the basketball game. That's why Eddie gets this ooo that sucks for you guys look on his face. That's why we hear a chorus of "nooo" from the party. That's why Mike says "no no no" and looks extremely upset. I don't know anything about DND, but I can read context clues.

So I'm not going to try to understand what's going on in the game, I'm just gonna go off what I think they wanted us to subconsciously pick up on.

So they show us all of this. They associate Mike with the number nine in the first episode and then that number shows up AGAIN in the last episode.

The monologue cannot be associated with anything but failure. Whether that be mlvns failing relationship, or their very real failure to save Max (at least before El revived her), and their failure to save Hawkins. The monologue does not stand apart from that. It is completely interwoven with these failures. If you have average media literacy, you know that. Even before I was aware of just how important byler is to this entire story, before I was aware that they've been setting up byler endgame since day one, you would never catch me thinking that the monologue was supposed to be received positively by the audience. You would never catch me saying mlvns love saved the world. (Although that's because I genuinely forgot about mlvn a few weeks after I watched s4). I think I received the monologue in the way it was intended to be received. I didn't fully understand it, or why they would execute it the way they did, but I still received it in the way I believe it was intended to be.

So I know the general agreement among bylers is that the monologue kinda sealed the deal for mlvn bones. Like I'm not saying anything new really. But I genuinely do think that Mike's roll in episode one, the reactions to it, and the missed shot it corresponds with were meant to foreshadow the monologue and how they wanted the audience to receive it.

This is fiction, everything means something. Everything is thought of. The timer (and maybe scores, I genuinely can't remember) in the basketball game had significance. Other rolls in the DND game had significance. Why would that be any different for Mike? Especially when his roll was a nine and that number shows up for him again when he says "I love you" nine times. And both of these things are associated with failure.

Not that we need any other reason to interpret the monologue as a less than good thing. It's just the way that it is, it's pretty easy to figure out how they wanted us to take it. But they still did give us a hint. I think it's really cool.

[strawberrybyers]

STOP IF WILL IS WITH MIKE AND EL AT THE RADIO STATION PLACE AND THE STRANGER THINGS BROADCAST CHANNEL POSTED BOOKS ABOUT ELECTRICITY AND LIGHTS AND RADIOS WHICH I WROTE IN A POST ABOUT HERE AND ONE OF THE BUILDINGS THEY’RE FILMING AT IS CALLED 5000 WATTS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT WHICH HAS TO DO WITH LIGHTING AND WILL WAS ABLE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO COMMUNICATE FROM THE UPSIDE DOWN WITH LIGHTS AND GOING BACK TO S2 THEY USED THE RADIO TO PLAY MUSIC TO COMMUNICATE WITH WILL AND WE KNOW MUSIC PLAYS A BIG ROLE IN BEING PROTECTED BY VECNA AND EL CAN ALSO COMMUNICATE WITH RADIO FREQUENCIES AND SOMEHOW ALL THIS TIES INTO MIKE BEING THERE TO SAVE WILL ONCE AGAIN AND THAT LEADS TO BYLER ENDGAME