#i was going to go over how much i HATE that this fandom loves to reduce his character to this 'lovable dumbass' trope but

[hobbitkiller]

I feel the same. I genuinely love all the characters in some way and feel they were all very interestingly and dynamically written.

I just really hate hypocrisy and misrepresenting what happened in the show because both strike me as intellectual dishonesty, which really riles me. That’s what so much anti Cait, anti Vi, and anti CaitVi stuff comes down to, which is why I always feel the need to point out the double standards people have.

Now, the Arcane fandom certainly didn’t invent this sort of bad take circus. I’m going to go a little off topic here, but wanted to put some thoughts down.

Part of what makes this problem acute in Arcane is that fandom has increasingly become a stand-in for culture war issues. Sometimes, this had been a benefit as we have learned to actively reflect on our media consumption as both a reflection of and contributor to the values and norms of our society. All art is, arguably, political. However, some people have, I believe, abused this to instead try to “win” the fandom.

When I say “win the fandom” what I’m talking about is a large number of people throughout fandoms who want to control how the show/movie/book is interpreted/enjoyed. They want their way to be the “right way.” This is most obvious in shipping wars, but extends throughout discourse. It also extends to what characters, episodes, etc. people like. Again, not necessarily a new thing, possessive and controlling behavior have always been pretty common in fandom. Morality policing is also not new.

But, the ease and vehemence with which so many people want to apply black and white labels to often complex and nuanced stories in order to lend their ships/characters/etc the clout of moral superiority has led to many fandoms becoming pits of negativity, self-righteousness, and point scoring. Arcane, having much more overtly political themes, unfortunately plays into this mentality. Add to that the proliferation of poorly understood therapy speak and political theory, and we find ourselves where we are.

TLDR: Over the last decade or so, people have tried to “win” fandoms by claiming an artificial moral high ground, often through intellectually dishonest takes and abuse of complex ideas of mental health, politics, and justice. This is especially true, and exhausting, in Arcane, a show that went out of its way to challenge the idea of a moral high ground or black and white thinking.

You know a character is overhated when people have to make up shit that didn't happen on order to justify that hatred.

"Caitlyn gassed the whole city of Zaun" wrong. She uses the grey as a weapon to incapacitate the chembarons in their hideouts, specifically. The montage SHOWS us this. She does this in a strike team she creates as a means to avoid an all out invasion led by the Noxian forces, which would have meant the deaths of several innocents. Even if the grey might have spread minutely to affect civilians, the chances are slim, and the grey is nothing more than factory smaug. Objectively, a handful of civilians breathing factory smaug for a brief amount of time is worlds better than numerous innocent people dying. Even in her rage, Caitlyn knows mercy.

And I guess these same people falsely overstating Caitlyn's actions don't want to talk about Jinx using gas bombs indiscriminately on the entirety of Piltover, intentionally harming innocent civilians. Or that her fishbones blast ALSO killed innocents.

No, I guess we only want to talk about the intentional harming of innocent people if it's Caitlyn doing it, and you have to outright lie about her intentions and the severity of which she acts in order to do so.

And the thing is, when you do shit like this, it makes it impossible to talk about other characters, like Jinx, their faults, their good and bad, without then making others assume that their character deserves hate the way you hate Caitlyn. I love Jinx. She's a fantastically written character. But I call out her actions and the way she harms others and you assume I'm calling her a bad character undeserving of an audience's love, right? The way you are with Caitlyn?

Arcane is supposed to be a show where we're able to discuss the spectrum of morality. And it's actually done phenomenally well, but people like you want to look at things in a very black and white way. You're looking at it on a class based system. If someone is from Piltover, no good deeds they do can be considered if they do something bad. If they're from Zaun, every evil thing they do must be defended in some way. Because privilege and oppression are the ultimate markers of good and evil to you. There's no complexity to be had there for you. People of privilege can't feel pain. Oppressed people can't cause pain.

It's narrow minded.

I love Arcane because we CAN discuss this complexity that exists. And I guess it makes sense why you hate season 2, because it made it impossible for you to stay with your narrow minded way of thinking.

[khevras]

Golden Wind/Vento Aureo Spoilers

Video Transcript

Bruno: I'll be forced to cut ties with you. A traitor stands alone on an island of isolation. Your failure will be yours and yours alone.

So recently I've decided I really wanted to rewatch golden wind after reading the rest of the parts, and since this time I wanted to give more focus to the animation, I decided to watch it in dub. As a result, when I got to this part in ep3, I realised the dub had elected to change what exactly Bruno had said, stating the words above instead.

This struck me as a bit of a wierd change until I then realised how much this moment foreshadows Fugos 'betrayal' at San Giorgio Maggiore; by having the only one not betraying the boss being the one who suffers what Bruno predicted.

I feel like this foreshadowing is honestly amazing, and also hits home at how Fugo feels later on in phf when thinking back to his actions as the pier. I feel like he really does think of his lack of movement as a failure towards Bucciarati, one he has to atone for and I think it's really interesting.

On top of that, I find it really fun how accurate Brunos words are to the situation as a whole, and I find it quite ironic that the one who suffers them isn't even betraying the boss like Bruno is describing, but rather Bruno himself.

Overall, I really like how this singular line foreshadows a moment episodes later, and how I can bring up how Fugo's opinions and feelings on the event are reflected in Bucciarati's words.

[wingedshadowfan]

the arcane fandom will hate me for this one but i have to speak my truth !

i don't think vi is the "not jealous type":

i think ppl are just misreading her reactions in two (2) particular scenes and that's why they think so! so i'll talk abt those briefly in a sec

i think ppl have this impression of her having so little self-worth that she wouldn't care if her partned flirted w/ someone or someone flirted w/ them, which i personally hate to see! (and yes, she does have issues w/ putting her own needs first and taking what she needs sometimes, she's been shown to self-destruct in dire situations, and she'd put everything on the line to protect her loved ones but that! does! not! translate! into potentially being okay w/ your partner breaking boundaries)

the scene where she learns caitlyn is into women: first of all, caitlyn and vi are still practically strangers at this point so it's very early to say vi has any feelings for (let alone romantic relationship to) caitlyn that would warrant her feeling jealous!! there's perhaps attraction there ("you're hot, cupcake") but no possessiveness, for reasons other than "vi isn't a jealous partner"! everything in vi's behavior shows this entire sequence is power play to her and she's just toying w/ her food ("the undercity will eat you alive") - she's putting a piltover girl of status, an enforcer, in a situation where she has to do something she deems unbefitting ("i will not!" ) if she wants to achieve her goal, because vi finds it entertaining! piltovians getting their hands dirty, being desparate (think of sevika's glee when she's choking caitlyn in s2 and caitlyn bites her hand, resorting to behavior that's beneath her). vi doesn't expect caitlyn to actually do it - so when she sees her flirting with a girl, this is the first time she's proven wrong abt caitlyn! she thinks, "wow, so she's for real/she's got it in her". not only is caitlyn willing to put her pride aside for more important things, she also seems to be enjoying herself - a contrast to her previous uptight and nervous demeanor, and a sign she's going out of her shell and that this place might grow on her, as well as proof she's into women, which to vi is at least smth they have in common. (and no, i won't get into social psychology and theories of homosociality rn but we are all likely to like ppl similar to us/to what we know, esp when we're unsure of someone's personality, views or values)

the scene where caitlyn pulls away from vi mid-makeout - after vi has forgiven her and decided to ultimately take what she wants for once instead of just running after her loved ones and carrying the responsibility of their safety - to tell her she "saw someone": i wrote a separate post a while ago explaining why to me her simple wording is brilliant in making it very apparent that whatever her fling was, she was not only willing to be upfront abt it but it was also shortlived, she thought of it as a mistake, and it was now over. crucial knowledge, although it can be argued vi didn't process it that extensively at all. which, fair. but it also very much happened when vi was gone and likely hadn't forgiven caitlyn yet (despite having had feelings for caitlyn at the time, and caitlyn for her, which she was obv aware of). so her reaction (cait, i don't fucking care) was completely understandable. they'd only kissed once, before having a huge fight/fallout, and this was before they'd put (at least on screen lol) a label on their relationship - and while we don't see them do that after their sex scene either, we see them basically living together almost domestically after the war and i believe that's confirmation enough. i've also talked before abt how/why caitvi have never doubted their love for each other so i'm willing to bet vi understood the insignificance of caitlyn's relationship in her absence - vi also did some questionable shit in the meantime

so, do i think vi is the jealous type then?

short answer is: yes, at least the normal amount. (so less than caitlyn). because to me, it makes total sense that she would be!

she was so madly in love she was hallucinating caitlyn after their fight, which lead to her descend into alcoholism, pit fighting, style change, madness and anguish. and during that time she'd kept the enforcers badge and used the kiramman house banner as a blanket, like?? do you seriously think she'd let caitlyn flirt w/ others once they're in a relationship (not that caitlyn would) or wouldn't mind someone else trying to flirt w/ caitlyn?? bffr vi is not sharing

idk how relevant this is since it's not exactly jealousy but i thought it's worth mentioning that since vi has been shown physically using her body to defend or shield others (both defensively and offensively): she's definitely the type of gf to tell caitlyn "wear whatever you want babe, i can fight"

[redbreastedbird]

Is smut allowed to be written about the mmu characters seeing as in the canon of the books they're now all over 18? A prominent person in the fandom has smut fics up and it's causing debates so I thought I'd ask

I am going to answer this in the same way I’ve answered other asks like this in the past: to tell you that in this case, what I think doesn’t matter. I know what I think as an individual human being, but Robin Stevens the Author does not have a single opinion on the subject, because nothing she has to say matters in this case.

The joy of fandom and fan response is that it happens completely separately to the author or creator of a story. We can engage with fans if we want - I do like to, it delights me to see that you care so much about my books - but we literally can’t guide fan response because we cannot get inside your brains. If your soul moves you to see my characters a particular way, or imagine them doing a particular thing, I can’t stop you. I can think what I think on a personal level - again, I definitely do, there are some fanons and takes that I like more than others - but as Robin the Author it’s not my place to comment publicly on that. I have personally been in fandom for enough years to see other creators try to do that, and see that it always goes horribly wrong for them.

So I could tell you that there are Right Ways and Wrong Ways to interrogate my texts, but it wouldn’t be useful or productive and it would only lead to people getting (correctly!) angry with me. What I am going to do is as always refuse to read fanfics based on my characters (because it feels a bit invasive of the fic authors’ privacy, and also because it keeps me away from any potential legal challenges from fans who feel like a story I write is excessively similar to their fanfic). Then I am going to tell every single one of my fans who gets in contact with me that I think they’re great and valid and brilliant.

I will say that fandom arguments are absolutely soul-destroying when you are part of them. I sympathise entirely! It is hard to disagree about something you love, and hard to realise that the way you see a thing is not the way that other people see it. What I have learned after many years of arguing on the internet is that you can only control your own response to a thing. Other people will be out there having responses you absolutely hate! The only productive thing you can do in this situation is send your friend a private message complaining about it, and then have a really long and satisfying private discussion with them about how right you both are and how wrong everyone else is.

[pearlofthewoods]

I’ve seen so many videos like this too, both about ships (particularly jegulus) and about specific fics people believe have ‘ruined’ the fandom.

To be honest, I think it’s particularly an HP/marauders phenomenon. Not that this doesn’t happen in other fandoms, but so many of the fanfic scandals (like fic binding for profit, AI in fanfilms) and now this, happen here. And I’m so tired of it.

It’s probably a result of being such a large fandom- people are used to choice and to so much fic to read that they can treat it like ‘content’- whereas in a smaller fandom you might just have to treasure what few small fics for your ship/fandom you have.

I think people on Tiktok are slowly becoming more aware that critiquing fics directly isn’t ok, but instead I’m just seeing it replaced with negativity about certain ships that people dislike.

And I understand, I’m not the biggest jegulus fan in the world, but I wouldn’t go into the comments section of someone’s video about jegulus or their fic hating on the ship and its portrayal.

I think this is even more crucial when we get to ships that have no basis in canon (such as jegulus) because the entire basis of the ship that you’re hating on is fanfiction.

That ship doesn’t exist outside of a fanfiction context and outside of the fic writers who built that relationship dynamic from the ground up.

So when you dunk on a ship that’s entirely fan created, you can only be dunking on the labour of love by the fic writers who write for that ship and for the fandom as a whole.

Since there is no interaction in canon, the only ‘dynamic’ between those characters that you’re criticising consists solely of the fic versions that you’ve read.

Obviously it’s different when we come to discussing preferences in ships that both have a basis in canon.

For example, another fandom I’m in is Buffy the Vampire Slayer. In BTVS, Buffy has 2 big canonical ships within the source material, so when I discuss why I prefer one ship over another, I only ever reference the dynamics of the characters in canon to make my point. Never fanfiction.

Of course there’s validity in saying you don’t read jegulus because there’s no canon basis or canonical interaction, but I find that’s not what people do. They never leave it there.

They say ‘I hate jegulus and what it’s done to the fandom’ or ‘I hate how y’all make james fall in love with a death-eater, he would never’ etc.

My brother in Christ, Jegulus doesn’t exist in canon. You don’t have to read it.

When you ‘hate’ on jegulus and their dynamic, you’re hating fanfic writers’ portrayals of jegulus. That’s the only jegulus content there is to hate.

I will say it now. I don’t personally read jegulus, I like my ships to have some basis in canon if I can. That’s just my preference. But that’s no reason to hate on the work of other fic writers. Click away, there’s always something else to read.

And if you can’t find precisely the ship and characterisation you’re looking for? Then congratulations, it’s time to get writing my friend.

we are incredibly blesseddddd in the harry potter fandom. no matter what era you are reading, there is such a wide array of fics for you to enjoy - such a multitudeeee of long-fics, aus, ships, tropes etc etc. we are so blessed to have this much to engage with.

but with that comes a lot of entitlement i feel. because there's more to "compare", there's more to call "the big fics" or "the best fics" and suddenly we're no longer blessed, because people don't appreciate fandom for what it is - a bunch of losers (affectionate) sitting in their rooms, writing fanfiction about wizards in their spare time, and sharing it with strangers online. rather it starts becoming competitive.

and 99.99% of the time, it's not the people writing these fics that start the comparisons and the competitions, it's those reading it. they'll publicly question why a fic has so many hits, they'll assume that fandom etiquette no longer applies just because a fic is popular, and they'll forget that these are people writing them, not just ao3 pseudonyms. they'll critique writing styles, get hung up on typos or grammatical errors etc etc. they'll start saying which piece of creative writing done by a person in their free time as a hobby is "worth it" and which ones aren't. and it's wild because they're the ones that have put these fics at the top. they're the ones that have decided these fics are the most worthy,,, and then they critique them?

and most of this is because of the hierarchy, absolutely. there's been a mass separation of readers-writers because people refuse to engage, and they start viewing themselves as "customers" receiving a "product" and they complain when it doesn't fit their standards. some of it is also the changing face of fandom spaces as they get big on more traction-based platforms like tiktok. all of it comes down to entitlement.

they start enforcing standards for fanfictions to live up to and start dictating what "good" writing is, as if that doesn't go against the very nature of a fandom space. a space where everybody's voice is heard and everybody has the same opportunity to create things (side tangent: this is not the time to be dictating what voices/experiences/talents deserve to be heard. free and open sources of literature are incredibly important right now. we often talk about the fact we hold fanfiction to the same standard as publit, which yes we do and that is not what we should be doing. but now we're starting to police it the same way publit is, and now is not the time. there is never a time tbh, but now when book bans are running rampant across the world? you want to decide which fics deserve to be read and which ones don't? hm).

and the worst thing is that not only are people critiquing the works we already have, but they demand more.

they'll say there's no more long-fics getting written, and then they won't go and engage with WIPs and encourage authors to continue, they won't start a fic until it's complete and then complain that nothing is complete. they'll say there's not enough fics for a certain ship, and instead of engaging with those producing them or encouraging love and engagement for them with others, they'll go into comment sections and hate on another ship. they'll say there's not enough of a certain trope and then they'll read one and go "hm. not like that" or not enough of a certain character and then go "actually i don't see them like this so this is written awfully".

most of all, they'll say that certain fics or ships have a ruined a fandom, and then they'll post things that go sooooo against what a fandom is, and just add to what is actually ruining wider fandom spaces - entitlement.

you are not entitled to long-fics, these are being written by people in their free time, and you refuse to engage with them as they're being written. you are not entitled to perfect grammar and presentation, fanfiction is for everybody and it is not a profession, it's a hobby. you are not entitled to the characterisations that you deem to be best, everything is malleable and you engage with what you like (better yet, write it yourself if you're so open to shitting on others. you do it then). you are not entitled to regular and consistent updates, you do not get a monopoly over this person's time. and you're going to see a lot less works over time if this is the way you treat them.

you are not entitled to any content in a fandom space, and no one is required to provide it for you. and most of all, your opinions and your characterisations and things you enjoy are not more worthy than anyone elses' - reading is subjective, we learnt this in primary school.

fandom is for self-exploration and it is self-curated. it's so self-curated and if you are having such a negative time in fandom because you can't find anything "good" or "worth it"? maybe there's some self-reflection to do as well. maybe you should sit and wonder why you feel entitled to things and why you feel the need to pit authors against each other or critique free works publicly, instead of wondering why other people are reading them.

we are so incredibly blessed to be in a fandom as diverse as this one with such an array of interpretations and such a wide spread of fics to choose from, but let's return to our roots and remember that - despite how many there are - everything is written by a Human Being. in their Free Time. For Fun.

and it's not fun to watch videos calling works bad get thousands of views and likes. you are not owed anything. and it is not okay to say these things just because "they'll never see it" - it says a lotttt about you as a person that there has to be some kind of impact for you to be kind.

it's like,,, would you go to a free bake sale and go "god i fucking hate red velvet!!!" and tell them they're doing a bad job, or would you pick up the chocolate cupcake you like instead and move on with your day whilst acknowledging that someone, not you but someone elseee, might like red velvet??? ykkkk??? you get me????

[prettygoododds]

Thank you so much @rimeswithpurple @emeryhall @roomwithanopenfire @monbons @nausikaaa @artsyunderstudy and @martsonmars for the tags! You can definitely tell everyone is done digging themselves out of the holidays and countdown. I'm loving all the content I'm seeing.

I've particularly liked seeing some people's fandom's resolutions. It made me think of my own.

I spent a lot of last year trying to find a good balance between the things I'm obligated to do and the things I want to do. By the time the COC hit, I was in the mindset that the things I needed to do were too much and I had to skip COC this year. This made me incredibly angry and resentful. I hated that the thing I wanted to do was the thing I gave up. So, with spite fueling me forward, I did the COC and I'm so glad I did. But that did make me reflect on how I proceed.

I'm not going to overthink things. I'm going to do the things that make me happy. And what makes me happy is this fandom, the supportive people in it and writing. I need to lean on other folks for the things that are obligations. I don't have to do all the things, but I should at least do the things that bring me joy.

That being said, who wants to see a little of that joy?

Picket Fence blurb:

This happens again and again.  An almost blowie in his kitchen, a hot and heavy grind on his sofa that came to an abrupt halt when his aunt stopped by, and one unfortunate tumble in his garden that ended with both of us thorny and grumpy. And look, I’m all for edging, but not like this. Not spread out over days and days and with no actual end in sight.  I’m ready to explode. Literally.

A non-Carry On blurb (A Power Unbound Jack/Alan) :

“Apologies my lord,” Alan says back, breathing heavily into neck. “I wasn’t expecting you.” “Am I to understand you are always entertaining handsome men at your desk then?” “There was a handsome man at my desk?” Alan says cheekily. “I only saw you, my lord. Who could see anyone else once you’re in the room.” “You do not have to placate me,” Jack growls, frustrated by his own insecurities. “I know a younger, better man when I see one.” “You’ll have to point them out to me next time,” Alan says, catching Jack’s chin in his fingers and forcing him to look him in the eyes. “For I saw no one who could hold a candle to my stubborn aristocrat.” Jack has to close his eyes and absorb that last sentence.

I have something else that I'll be posting soon, but I don't want to spoil it so just know you'll see something soon-ish.

I've also got to start work shopping something for the COBB. If anyone has an idea I would not be opposed to a little jump start because I am stuck.

Ok, well, I feel this got wordy. Thanks if you stayed to the end. Here's some very non-pressure tags:

@ic3-que3n @dohrnaira @thewholelemon @facewithoutheart @imagineacoolusername

@shemakesmeforget @ivelovedhimthroughworse @wellbelesbian @aristocratic-otter @cutestkilla

@blackberrysummerblog @supercutedinosaurs @nightimedreamersworld @valeffelees @iamamythologicalcreature

@shrekgogurt @ileadacharmedlife @you-remind-me-of-the-babe @hushed-chorus @youarenevertooold

@noblecorgi @talentpiper11 @bookish-bogwitch

[musette22]

I don't know why, but I keep seeing fans who say they're stucky fans but they seem to like one guy and hate the other. Like some Bucky fans complain about how Steve abandoned Bucky and wasn't nice to him, and some Steve fans complain every time you talk about Bucky and his trauma, going 'What about Steve!?' It feels like you have to pick one or the other. It feels almost weird that I love about care about both of them. Why is that so difficult? Why can't you just enjoy the characters and how much they love each other?

Oh no, I'm so sorry to hear you'be been struggling with this! That sounds very tiring and a bit upsetting. First of all, I have to admit that I don't really share your experience, which might have something to do with the people I follow and the fandom bubble I'm in, in which most people share my own mindset and preferences. I almost exclusively know and follow people on here who, like me, love both Steve AND Bucky equally, and who either ship Stucky or at least care a lot about their relationship. So in my experience, everyone is just enjoying the characters and how much they love each other! I'm not saying this to be like "what are you talking about", by the way, but more to show you that it is possible to enjoy both characters and how much they love each other, without people coming at you from all sides <3

Having said that though, I am of course aware of the widespread Steve criticism (if not to say hate) that got a lottt of traction after Endgame (which, fuck Endgame), but I am personally of the opinion that if someone really thinks Steve would abandon Bucky like he did in Endgame, and you blame the character for that decision rather than the writers etc, then you don't know Steve at all, ergo your opinion on him is void, as far as I'm concerned. If I see people saying nonsense like that on here, I will either roll my eyes or just block them outright, to protect my peace. And that works really well, generally speaking.

As for Steve fans going "What about Steve!?" when you want to talk about Bucky - Although I'm sure there are some Steve fans who prefer Steve over Bucky or even don't really care about Bucky (which is wiiiiiiild to me, because how can you say you care about a character but not care about what that character cares about most at all??), generally speaking, I don't know that I see people asking "But what about Steve" as an inherent dismissal of Bucky, or people expecting others to choose sides? It may well be the case sometimes, but I doubt that's always what it means, you know? Perhaps that helps?

I think that in the fandom spaces we're in, Bucky is a lot more popular and loved as a character (especially these days, post EG) than Steve is, which makes sense considering Bucky's kind of the perfect blorbo, and there is still new Bucky content coming out, and, of course, he is just really fucking amazing and loveable. But yeah, there is no shortage of Bucky love or discussion in this fandom, which I am personally delighted about and will always do my best to contribute to as well because he is my forever blorbo too. But I guess I can see why people would sometimes feel like Steve is not quite getting the love he deserves, you know? Still though, if someone goes "But what about Steve!?" on a post that is about Bucky, that is just very annoying and unnecessary, I totally agree. If people feel that way, they should make their own post about it, not hinder others in their Bucky loving!

I do get hate sometimes from people who say I don't appreciate the characters enough on their own because I always discuss them as a package deal, but frankly, I don't really give a damn about that. I am a Stucky shipper first and foremost, and for me, these characters ARE just inextricably connected. A Steve without Bucky by his side, or a Bucky without Steve by his side, just doesn't feel right to me, which is one of the reasons why I choose not to watch any post-Endgame content. And if others have an issue with that, well, then that's their issue, not mine.

So perhaps you could try and apply that kind of mindset to your situation as well, anon? Focus on loving our boys, equally, and together, and don't let anyone get in your way! The block button and tag filters are your best friends, and following the right people - people who are kind and reasonable and who share your mindset - is essential. I don't know if this helps at all, and do let me know if you want to talk about this some more, but I hope this is useful in some way! Sending love and hugs, and ALLLLL of the love for both our beautiful boys ❤️

[bambooswordwielder]

So funny to see the different demographics that each MXTX book series attracts and how that affects the way the fandom interacts with each other and themselves.

SVSSS is a Fandom full of people who embody the 'dont-like-dont-read-it' mindset I believe we need more in fandoms. You wanna ship Shen Qingqiu with Tianlang-jun, Luo Binghe's father? Go ahead. Wanna write a 300k fic about Shen Qingqiu as a bird that follows Luo Binghe around during his childhood? Where's the bloody link. Wanna make memes about Skinzun? Me too, send me all the memes and drawings.

The nature of SVSSS being a meta-retelling of stereotypical Male fantasy harem novels means it references and is heavily influenced by Fandom Culture, especially during Airplane's Extras of his past life.

It's because of that fact it means to read and finish the books, you automatically just have to be a person who's been dealing with fandom culture for a long time. You've learnt to accept that other people ship other ships, you've learned to love the random rare pairs that show up on your homepage that you never would've thought of but now will be hunting for on AO3, you've just learned to have fun with the source material.

This mentality is further pushed by the fact SVSSS doesn't have alot of Canon Material being produced, meaning a majority of content is fanmade for fan consumption. This builds a level of community that means there's not that much discourse, and any discourse there is is usually shut down with a simple "Oh hey Shen Yuan, nice to see you here."

MDZS has a bit more diversity in the people it can attract. It has a well-written love story between WangXian, it has Sibling Angst in the form of the Yunmeng Siblings, Nie brothers, Lan Twin Jades, and the entirety of the Jin Family, and it has deep political intrigue and discusses/dissects discrimination of your birth status (Sexism, Classism, Merit VS Blood). MDZS is also the novel with the most adaptations (The OG Novels, a Donghua, a manwha, audio drama, Life Action in the Untamed, and a manga), meaning more people can consume it in their preferred style.

However, it's due to these reasons that MDZS tends to have a lot of fights/debates in it in terms of interpretations of the characters/plot. Someone who watched the Untamed primarily is going to have a vastly different interpretation of Jiang Cheng’s character than say someone who read the original novels, and someone who watched the Donghua will have different scenes than in the Novel. People who came primarily for the Sibling Angst might wish for Jiang Cheng and Wei Wuxian to reconcile, while someone else for came for something else might be happy they don't interact.

There's also the fact the story deals with a lot of characters going through extreme circumstances over a long period of time, meaning characters make decisions that might make some fans hate them and some fans want to defend them for it. This overall just causes a lot of debate.

Love the works, love the Fandom, but 99% of fighting is caused by people reading/watching different adaptations which has different portrayals of characters (I'm staring directly at you Jiang Cheng).

I will update this when I finally finish TGCF and can get a glimpse of the Fandom, though would love to see any statements about it or the other fandoms.

[the-real-sasuke-uchiha]

It's been, like, a decade since the story has completely ended (... I don't acknowledge that spin off with the kids or the weird novels), but I still don't understand what people mean when they say Sasuke has a lot to apologize/repent for. What exactly does he have to apologize for? The only thing he ever did wrong was attack Karin to get to Danzo, and he already apologized to her for that. His desire for vengeance was completely selfless and motivated by love and respect for his clan. He didn't attack innocents. He didn't involve anyone else in his problems. Yet, so many fans love how Shikamaru got revenge on Hidan when, to me, it just emphasizes how selfless and justified Sasuke is in contrast. Shikamaru wants to avenge Asuma who died fairly in battle on a mission because he wasn't strong enough. He even tells Tsunade he would leave the village regardless of if she allowed it or not. He involved Ino and Chouji, rushed in without knowledge of Kakuzu, and almost got them killed immediately. And Asuma is just a teacher! not even a fmily or clan member! They all would've died if it weren't for Kakashi being there to help them. Whereas Sasuke takes on his burden alone.

And for all that the fandom likes to critique Kishimoto on his writing choices, he's not a horrible writer. This sequence is purposeful. Shikamaru was the one who led the Sasuke retrieval mission. And shortly after Hidan's death, Sasuke kills Itachi. It was a well-structured sequence showing the validity of Sasuke's motivations compared to Shikamaru's whose motives weren't as justified in comparison, despite the validity of his feelings.

So, it's not that no one in the story can understand Sasuke--they can! All the characters just want to project things onto Sasuke. Naruto wants Sasuke to be a surrogate/prerequisite for the village to validate his sense of self and carry the burden of Naruto's loneliness. Sakura wants him to return her empty "love." Kakashi wants to right his wrongs vicariously through Sasuke and making him return Sakura's affection like he wished he could have for Rin, be a present friend for Naruto like he wishes he could have for Obito, not seek revenge because Kakashi is a mediator meant to to maintain the status quo in the village (a guard dog/"Hound" lol). Itachi wants Sasuke to be a blank slate anyone can impress whatever upon: he wants Sasuke to value the village over their clan and family (which itself is incomprehensible with the feudal structure the setting is based on). The village, and Naruto once he becomes Hokage, wants Sasuke to be a tool to use for the village's benefit. Maybe the only thing Sasuke has to apologize for is being a the protagonist of a revenge-based seinen but forced to be the deuteragonist in a battle shounen 🤷🏽‍♀️.

Dear anon, thank you for this gem. I don't know what else to add, because this is so perfect on its own.

For the record, I dislike Shikamaru, but I think he was right to want to avenge his sensei and go after Hidan. What is totally enraging is that he gets sympathy and assistance for doing all the things that Sasuke is trashed for. He is hateful and vengeful, and nobody tells him to just let go and not get consumed by revenge. He risks his friend's lives and gets zero reproaches, while Sasuke gets emotionally blackmailed by Naruto for all the kids that risked his life trying to forcefully bring him back, even when Sasuke had zero control over that. Kakashi goes far and beyond to help him, when he had tied Sasuke to a tree to lecture him about revenge. There is just so much hypocrisy that it hurts.

I am tired of reading all the ridiculously absurd "wrongs" that Sasuke supposedly did. This is a freaking show about murderer ninjas, but nobody seems to have a body count except for Sasuke. Which gets inflated to ridiculous levels, because Sasuke is apparently to blame not only for the crimes he committed, but also for the ones he imagined. He has no right to be angry and upset, he has no right to fight for his justice, because, in a world where the end justify the means and shinobi are meant to behave as tools that sacrifice everything for a mission, Sasuke is the only ninja that is demanded to find his way without even scratching a fly.

Sasuke has nothing to apologise for. He is the one being owned serious apologies and reparations. From everyone. From Sakura, for sexually harassing and trying to murder him. From Kakashi, for being the shittiest and most biased sensei, for being a hypocrite hokage that never attempted to make justice and for never prosecuting the surviving instigators of the Uchiha massacre. And from Naruto, for glorifying Hiruzen and for the same reasons as hokage Kakashi, because he too swept everything under the rug and never even tried to make justice.

Sasuke did nothing wrong. He grew just too magnificent for an antagonist, and they had to murder his character and his soul to make main character shine in his dumbness.

[s1ck-pupp3t]

I love, Ms Paint. CHEERS!

OK real art dump over. Click MORE for Real dumb stuff

something something They faces killing me why nobody gaf. Its a Transparent .PNg! You can put them any where to Not Care About.

[lilithofpenandbook]

Seriously how can M*r*uders stans like random Slytherins (who tf are Evan Rosier, Pandora (is that Luna's mum and why tf is she Evan Rosier's twin in half of these), and I don't even want to discuss Regulus) and make them Actually Misunderstood Good People Who Were Forced Down That Path when at least one of them *coughreguluscough* was obsessed with Voldemort

And then turn around and make Snape an awful person?

[marimbles]

i miss carpisuns sometimes </3

[lyril]

lumpus is a fascinating specimen glad theres other people also fond of him

HE SURE IS i will be honest i almost like him a Little Too Much because i Also live in my fantasy world of make believe where camp lazlo is a little more than a 6.4/10 show (I STILL LOVE YOU SWEETHEART!) and instead also includes all my insane 20k spiels of backstory stringing and talks about character writing but

(also. i do think it's funny how popular slinkman is in comparison, i love him just as much, but i actually see people mention really liking slinkman pretty frequently if someone happens to posts about camp lazlo which is GOOD because he DESERVES IT MAJORLY but the lumpus bug has Also caught me something awful even though i hate him and he sucks so i'm alone adrift in the world out here...)

edited this just for him

[zukkaoru]

so then talk about them instead of whining that other people are having fun with what they like. if those other ones are so interesting than make that content in place of behaving like a child because someone else is actually enjoying themselves.

omg guys look my first bsd fandom anon hate ask 🥰🥰🥰

[ratsword]

internet not big enough...saw what is unmistakably his art style and felt like vomiting. it's crazy how someone can continue to poison you even after years of being blocked.

[silverselfshippingchaos]

I fucking HATE how the fandom treats m.ine. it's so bad 😭