#i think women should ‘get in the way of popular yaoi ships’

[scarlet-moonlight]

This is gonna be a LONG ass post but

I got around to watching Arcane s1 (I watched s2 without finishing s1 because I didn't want to worry about getting spoiled for all the stuff that will inevitably flood the league tags so I just said fuck it, I did know a little bit about what happened during s1) and now that I did, I think I like s2...less?

Like I thought I was confused while watching s2 because I skipped s1 so I might not have known about what was happening (And I did on some, like I didn't know Silco and Vander were close at one point when I saw the flashback with them and Felicia, or that Singed used to be a mentor for Viktor) but..no. Looking at s1 then back at s2 it really does feel night and day. I think the problem is that s1 is great in how down-to earth and realistic the world, the characters and problems they have, but then in s2, suddenly everything became so much more..bigger. And not in a good way. suddenly everything became so much more bloated with too many characters, conflicts that started/showed up that they needed to end in the same season cause they had to make it 2 seasons even though it could've benefitted from another one or at least anotehr act. The animation is great, the music is great, but even that just feels like well.. spectacle for the sake of it. Especially when it comes to the music, because compared to s1 and s2, s2 is just too music heavy. And I was watching s1 with my sister (who is blind reacting to all of arcane from the start) and I feel like if we finish s1 and get to s2 she might not think of it as good as s1 for the same reasons.

MORE IMPORTANTLY THO I realize how oddly ooc Jayce became from s1 to s2, mostly for his relationship between him and Mel that got sidelined in s2 for viktor. And apparently that was intended by the writers because they liked jayvik more (I used to watch Star vs the forces of evil so this is giving me serious flashbacks to the writers hell that became) Yes Jayce and Mel started off as more or less fuck buddies but there were scenes that showed that they cared about each other that they just..kinda threw away in favor of Jayik. I don't hate jayvik and I liked the memes and all but I also dont like just sidelining a woman (A black, woman no less) in favor of a yaoi ship in the grand year of 2024. Like knowing their relationship in s1 it makes me realize how ooc Jayce and Mel were acting towards each other in s2. I don’t care if they ended up canon or not, but they just acted toxic and indifferent to each other for no reason when they did have scwnes in s1 that showed they cared about each other and now I think they just did this just so they could make Jayvik look better and because of how Mel was done dirty despite me loving her character I am now actively going to ship Meljay out of spite (Also fuck you they both look sexy) (and I also like Viktor by himself away from Jayce, preferably him in s1 because of how cute he was and I want to keep him for myself)

For any arcane only fans, I happen to be a selfship/yumeship blog who's favorite charater happens to be in a really popular yaoi ship (made partially implied by canon and making him all thats ever used for when theres so much else that they can do with his lore instead of just making him an accessory to please fandom, huh doesn't that sound familar?) and I know people would hate on me for also being a girl "getting in the way" if i was in any other part of league fandom (at least tumblr is pretty chill) so don't worry we're at two for two here

Again, I like s2, I think they've done a great job but knowing what happened in s1 and then seeing s2 it just made me feel like there was so much missed potential outside of the already confusing plots and pacing issues I experienced on my first watching

and ykw Im gonna repeat what I said in a previous post in that; fuck yall, I wanted the Mel being pregnant rumors to be true just to spite yall (and that the kid would be Rell)

[yukishirostar]

So people are talking about a post in the Zolu tag by a certain tumblr user in regards to their issues with Zolu as a ship. They shall be unnamed because i dont wish to bring attention to them and instead just want to focus on their arguments because they're not the first people to make some of these points and so this is also an opportunity for me to talk about these things (a tweet is going around on Twitter containing these screenshots with the username so you can find it there if you need to anyway).

The way this person dismisses the relationship between Zoro and Luffy as a result of needing to pair gay Zoro with someone is too laughable, they must be very fit in order to be able to do these mental gymnastics. I believe that many people who are going on about the Zolu scenes in the OPLA were already Zolu shippers who were familiar with the original story and are enjoying the moments because they were well, really good Zolu moments? And there is actually, shockingly, many good Zolu moments in the original story too which is why many people ship them. Wild, I know.

Then there's 'straight-washed Sanji'. Equally if not more of a bizarre thing to believe. I might make some people mad especially the Sanji stans out there who constantly insist on the 'repressed queer' narrative with his character, but Sanji is written pretty explicitly to be seen as a cisgender and heterosexual character. The way you say with your whole chest that Luffy is 'canonically' aroace but don't acknowledge that Sanji is 'canonically' cishet is beyond hypocritical. If you believe Sanji looking like a 'misogynistic straight man' is different from the way he is written in canon then maybe you should go back and reread/rewatch series with your eyes open this time. If you wish to headcanon him with the frankly offensive repressed bisexual/transgender cliché then go ahead, but that is clearly not the intention Oda has with his character.

There's also the fact that aroace people can uh. Be in relationships. Get married. Have children. Did it occur to you that many people who ship Zolu ship them as an ace couple or-

First thing I want to say here, as a trans man who is 'mlm', can other dudes stop with this idea that women or fem-aligned individuals enjoying homosexual relationships between two men is inherently fetishising or that as a masc-aligned individual your enjoyment of a ship is morally superior in some way. Stop pulling out your 'mlm/ transmasc / cis gay' card in order to justify why your ship is superior. Its cringe af.

But if we are to insist that 'cishet female gaze fetishising mlm' is going on then ironically Zosan fits that the better than any ship in the fandom. It being by far the most popular mlm ship means there is likely a higher proportion of people who identify as cishet women who ship it. Its also the classic 'two men who dislike/hate eachother and have a toxic relationship but hot sexual tension' slash/yaoi stereotype. Majority of Zosan I've come across is depicting Zoro as the masculine male man in the relationship while Sanji the effeminate twink that Sanji stans project themselves onto and they go crazy for the bickering that is apparently reminiscent to them of a toxic heterosexual marriage. Meanwhile every Zolu/Luzo shipper I've interacted with has been some flavour of queer and Zolu is closest to the 'falling in love with your same sex bestie' narrative that the majority if not every non-heterosexual person has experienced at least once in their lifetime. This is just my personal view of course, but I think noting a difference in perspective on this topic is interesting and reveals that at the end of the day this is totally subjective and based purely on anecdotes.

Also it's just a very weird point here that apparently OP has 'plenty of varied queer rep' (it actually doesn't have that many canonical queer characters in relation to its cast size but anyway) and other media doesn't so shipping aroace characters in gay relationships is valid in those but not in One Piece … HUH???? So you're saying if One Piece had 'less' queer rep, then Zolu would be fine to ship? Idek my brain hurts.

"I have black friends so I'll speak for the black community and get offended for them" (btw this person then proceeded to block aroace people who had issues with their depiction of aroace people).

Also if we're talking canonical depictions, the only thing Zoro has been canonically depicted as is also aroace, equally if not moreso than Luffy. So by your own rules, you can't ship a cishet (sanji) with an aroace (zoro), therefore Zosan is now invalid. Stop erasing Zoro's aroace identity bigot.

'Categorically wrong' makes me laugh. I don't ship Zoro and Nami but like, people can ship what they want to??

'The general public is aware enough of gay people and how to spot them these days' uh... firstly this sounds very homophobic. Secondly the general public (cishet ppl) are famously bad at recognising queerness even when its in flashing lights before them. Thirdly you make it sound like Zoro was going around on roller skates and booty shorts listening to YMCA and Madonna in the show. I do agree he was gay-coded but it was mostly because he had sexual tension with every man he interacted with, not for the strange reasons you pointed out...

Its kinda the elephant in the room too but like. These are just headcanons. You can have multiple headcanons and interpretations of a character's sexuality. I can see Zoro as aroace virgin one day and a gay h*e the next. I'm actually allowed, legally, to do that.

The way they think shipping Zolu is harmful to aroace representation when BOTH characters are closest to being canonically aroace than anything yet ship Zosan, label being anti-Zolu as some kind of pro-ace activism, and then proceeded to block aroace people for criticising their incorrect depiction of what being aroace is...

This was a lot of words to say that you don't like a ship. Just say you don't like it, and it gets in the way of the ship you like, instead of writing a virtue signalling essay to justify your reasoning. Please.

They had some more to say on future posts I'll just pick my favourite bits

They really have this narrative that Zolu is only popular because of OPLA and can't fathom that its just a popular ship in general and always has been huh. And they couldn't make it more obvious that they're totally salty about it ranking in the top 100 most popular tumblr ships, lmao.

Your classic case of 'self-identifying ally who speaks over the people they are supposed allies of'. Its a general rule that you feel the need to declare yourself an ally you're probably not an ally, actual allies know they need to just shut up and do the work. Saying 'this character's aroace' and 'I have aroace friends' actually isn't what allyship is, thats just accepting that ace people exist which is like... the baseline.

Calling a wholesome loving ship like Zolu an icky ship is a severe consequence of online brain (this person is 26 years old btw)

[victimsofyaoipoll]

Round 3

Propaganda Under Cut

Kairi

kairi is the third protagonist of the kingdom hearts series and the third member of the destiny trio, alongside fan favorites sora and riku. sora/riku shippers HATE kairi, and will go out of their way to discount her at every turn. the hate for her ranges from typical "she's a boring bitch" to fans of soriku making five-hour long video essays reassuring their fellow shippers that the big bad kairi won't show up in the next installment – to quote one video, "she's in a box. she's on the shelf. four walls, no door." kairi is the greatest bogeyman the soriku fandom has ever known, to the point where most of said video essays and fanon meta posts focus not on why sora and riku should get together, but rather on why they don't like kairi.

Literally has a 100+ page Google doc fan theory writing her out of the narrative and putting all of her (few) canonical accomplishments onto half of the popular m/m ship (soriku). Don't even get me started on how her memory was completely written out of the canon plot of re:coded. KH is a nightmare to explain so dude trust me she is THE victim of yaoi

She is so fundamental to the plot and themes and narratives of game and yet it is near impossible to find anything about her thats not ship bashing pre-mlm with the other two characters. I dont even care if she ends up with one of the main characters i just want fans to see her as a cool character to love or like, anything other than “annoying comphet girl.” You can write your mlm but pleaae stop inventing comphet where it doesnt exist. She does not even get to spend time with sora ever?? Why does everyone see her as a threat and a thing to destroy?? Let her have friends so help me

Misa Amane

she gets treated in-canon the way fandoms treat female characters that Threaten an m/m ship. it's like, "oh why don't you go sit in the corner and be pretty, misa, while the Men have intelligent conversation and pretend they aren't ten seconds from fucking each other, doesn't that sound nice?" it's infuriating. and MAYBE it's better now but i remember her getting treated the same way in fanfiction too, like we all need to do just as badly by our female secondary characters as fucking tsugumi ohba, but with the added insult of making her be alternately oblivious of the relationship between light and L or actively trying to sabotage it—incompetently, of course, because god forbid misa be allowed dignity or moments of cleverness.

she's one of the first characters I think of when I consider old school fandom misogyny. The annoying bitch and clingy crazy gf allegations were AFTER HER ASS. She's also a lot more intelligent than people gave her credit for, but most seem inclined to take the Very Biased word of our unreliable, narcissistic narrator and his homoerotic arch nemesis and claim that just because she's bubbly and into romance that she's also a complete moron. Which is blatantly untrue. Everyone was afraid of Misa girlbossing too hard. Killing people and devoting yourself to the deranged twink of your dreams even though you know he'll never love you back??? Having a hardcore goth aesthetic and being so Hot even literal Death Gods are into you?? God forbid women do ANYTHING!

Not only is she the victim of yaoi culture, she is the victim of early 2000s misogyny by an author that wanted to introduce a girl character because he knew his male rivals were getting too homoerotic. She is a goth bimbo icon who portrays what I think is one of the few callouts for stan culture and what parasocial relationships can do to both the stan and the idol. The fact that she is a toxic fan of Kira and also hot, funny, sociable is tragic in its own way, which I think the author did try to touch on but was too misogynistic too really get through. Of course, she was reduced to villain status by the fandom and anime alike because she got in the way of the supposed romance in their psychological horror anime.

[tithe2hell]

an amusing thing to me about the Yuri vs yaoi forever war fandom struggle discourse is that for the f/f fans mad about yaoi popularity and making lots of extremely funny (to me) Song-of-Roland-esque posts that make it sound like "we are going to WAR against the evil man-centering fujos terrorizing and colonizing our yuriship spaces!!!" Is that I never see the loudest trumpeters actually go to "war" or do any work organizing or strategizing to "win" their cause.

The only tactic they have is trying to do a "win hearts and minds by telling yaoi shippers they should feel Bad for Centering Men and being "dick-obsessed" (hmmm!) and "interrogate your kinks"-ass rhetoric (double hmmm!!!) which ok, let's take that at face value....that's a purely INTERNAL process. You're asking someone to sit down and Correct Their Thoughts and Soul, with hopefully ending towards the End Product of "After they've been Corrected, they will make More Content I Like, and the Big Number or AO3 stat will go up and surpass the Content I don't Like"

Which ok fine...but very hilariously ineffective, a very passive activism. Vague steps to take (be aware!!) It doesn't even really make or give people any steps to reach the supposed goal of Surpassing in Number for the Sake of the Number. The loudest ppl who seem to freak out whenever the stats number is down, I never see working to build connections of support and love for the people who make the stuff you want.

Like even framing as a matter of representation for real life women and wlw, we've had discussions for ages re: media industry how the conditions of ppl who create behind the scenes so that they have freedom of expression and control of their stories is essential to having "good representation." Even if the marginalized ppl in general end up making stuff that is maybe "gross" or "trashy" or Sexual in a Way You don't Like*, that support of the actual real creators and enthusiasts is what's important.

For fujos, I feel most of us are used to getting shit on so we don't really care what people say and will continue to toil in the posting mines make what we make, even if it's rare and gross so someone trying to simply make an Hearts and Minds "war" move is not very effective. We have our own work to do, the work (of play) is what makes things meaningful, bc if is done for its own sake. The best f/f fans and creators I've seen, the ones I see be lambasted for being "weird and gross" are the ones who are passionate and who commission and discuss and have relationships, don't need to bother with the Hearts and Mind because they are building castles and fortifications And making discoveries themselves, rather than worrying what other ppl think of them or if their ships or themselves are "approvable" or defined by a general public. The tactics that fujos use to boost and celebrate THEIR rarepairs etc are certainly not exclusive.

When I think Abt cool projects and esp stuff that has contributed to say, communities and celebration of media and creatives especially re: f/f fandom stuff, I think of stuff like Empty Movement and their massive decades-long archiving of utena materials, of people making zines and creative works around ships I wouldn't even consider until I see the cool ideas, or my friends who review and write and talk extensively about the novels and works they are reading both to reflect their tastes and raise interest. That builds foundations and connections between people . That is how you fight. That is how you wage your proper war...it does not have to be fruitless...

*I have maintained that if people REALLY wanted their numbers to go up they'd support the people making siscon and momdaughter stuff bc there's a sheer lack esp of the latter...a big part of yaoisms popularity is bc everyone loves Dadson, which imo is basically a very big fantasy even for heteros and pops up gratuitously in like every mainstream movie ever. Now that we are getting really mom generational trauma narratives it's time for momdaughter to shine. But unfortunately every time I check up on a false loud war trumpeter wondering where all the femslash is they're also recoiling with disgust about incest And agegap and other problematic tropes so like maybe they really don't care about the Number Going Up-just acceptability, and of things they personally can relate to? One can never know.

[biopanik]

The Morality of Fandom Activities

This might as well be an essay, so apologies for my long asf post. Just a few heads up: this is in no way talking about people who support incest irl and MAPS. Those are extreme cases that I'm not qualified myself to talk about, I only know that I don't want them on my page 😭

I stopped having a very active social media presence when I was finishing high school. For me, this was a huge deal, because as the token weird queer kid all my life, Tumblr and fandom culture provided a safe space for self-expression, developing my writing skills and exploring myself. Fandoms usually play a huge role for teens, since their interactions and their experiences shape their mindsets into the primary form their adult brain takes. Whenever I look at my old posts, I can see the points where I was maturing, I could see my opinions change very clearly without always connecting old posts to significant life events.

What is very important to take into account is that I was in ALL the "red flag" fandoms, even some niche ones. BNHA, Homestuck, RWBY, Okegom, Voltron, you name it. I was into it, I had Instagram edits of it saved on my phone. As a result, I am familiar with all kinds of fujoshi, yuri bros, proshippers, etc. I'm not here to inform you about my entire digital footprint though. I'm here to discuss fandom morality. Fair warning, I will be referring to a bunch of dark themes vaguely.

I want to start by saying I understand the appeal of a toxic ship. A ship that is straight-up problematic given the context of the story. Be it because the characters are abusive to each other, a very big age gap or them being blood relatives - I get it, even if I'm one of the people who's easily repelled by this shit. I get why Junjou Romantica, for example, became so popular. The big body proportions, the "forbidden romance" trope, the guilty pleasure, I get it. I understand how nerdy young women would fawn over yaoi because they craved a soft male touch. I understand the south park proshippers because they inserted their younger selves into the characters and imagined scenarios where their own fucked-up childhoods would make sense.

My experience with Funamusea helped me understand that things that are taboo can be appealing in a fictional form. There were a lot of issues because the horror used in Funa's games was centered around sexual battery and assault. To me, that made perfect sense. Funa games are packed to the brim with gore, war, mental abuse, and disturbing characters. Of course, there would be SA in such a fucked up setting. Rape is a horrifying thing that no one should face because it is a subcategory of violence. VIOLENCE IS SOMETHING NO ONE SHOULD EVER COME ACROSS. Therefore, why is it that people who write stories containing this trope receive so much hate, but 1940s war aus for example get praised? Why is FMA a pacifist masterpiece and not torture porn?

For "glorifying" real-life horrors? Triggering people? Let's broaden this.

Think of your favorite slasher film. Your favorite best-seller horror book. Do you think that the people behind these stories are freaks and murderers? Psychopaths are capable of fitting in anywhere they want, even fucking churches. So it is useless to assume creators are moral instigators for their VILLAINS. Now let's think about Colleen Hoover and Sara J Maas (or as I like to call her, Sara J Ass). Their "love" stories are super popular because of the immense marketing that they have received, despite profiting off romanticized harmful content. Backlash is still minimized in contrast to anime niche, because they are backed by million-dollar industries and the fact that they conform to the norms of a straight story. Although that, is a topic for another discussion - how problematic characteristics are "musts" in irl relationships.

Lastly, I want to talk about the so-called community saviors who want to protect these platforms. Those who want to build a safe environment so that no predators infiltrate our sacred grounds where we discuss Persona 5 ABO dynamics. A lot of them are oftentimes victims of this sort of abuse. I myself have come across groomers. But tbh 15yo kids who reblog Shiro X Keith are not really the enemy? Anyway, that's a little besides the point. I want to directly talk to these people right now, hear me out: you are hypocrites. You only pretend to care about Tumblr communities but do not hesitate to accuse someone of abuse (any kind) and tell them to end their life. How are you protecting anyone like this? How are you a positive role model for the children partaking in fandom activities when you show clearly that you wish death upon someone. VIOLENCE IS SOMETHING NO ONE SHOULD EVER COME ACROSS, I re-iterate and you possibly agree, but YOU ARE STILL VIOLENT, and justify it by being "virtuous". How are you any different from @\hivliving? Her actions will forever be engraved in her victims' heads, even if she was humiliated in the end. Then again, it would have been better for her to write a shitty low-quality fic about Hamilton having HIV or whatever the fuck, if looking up basic things about HIV was so difficult. After 7 years in & out of fandoms, there's one thing I'm fine with, and that's bad fics.

Ultimately there is so much more I want to say. I might cover this topic on my bestie and I's podcast sometime (soz it's in Greek). The bottom line here though is not about keeping a neutral stance on problematic media. It is to enjoy whatever the fuck you want just because it makes you happy. It is to differentiate what's a wolf in sheep's clothing from what's a sheep. It is to accept that kids will ALWAYS lie about their age to access all sorts of NSFW. God knows I did so. It is to recognize them and realize that their creators and fans are most likely not going to act out every bad thing that occurs in said story. Because if that were the case, with the rise of all the Yeagerists, we'd have so many bitchless college students trying to start little rumblings of their own, and the world would be a much funnier place.

Now go outside and spread your moral philosophies to people outside your Discord server

[jaxinvasion]

davekat for the ship I hate thing. haha.

kinda bullshit 2 squares to get a bingo but whatever. do i need to elaborate? crazy overrated pair the spares ship that only got popular cuz it has dave, it has karkat, and it has 2 boys. modern davekat is awful, no sauce and deviates from their original characters so much it should be a crime.

thats not even mentioning the rampant misogyny everpresent with davekat fans, the way they reduce jade, rose, and kanaya into fodder for shitty yaoi plots. it will never cease to irritate me how davekat does not fail to overshadow every other character and dynamic they could ever be adjacent to. special shoutouts to how davekat fans would rather call them women than care about, you know, preexisting women, gotta love that.

fanon davekat is just fucking communism (as in johnkat. not the political theory LOL). like ok sure at first davekat is actually its own substantial thing, but over time you can see it just turns into communism, espcially during post retcon (when hussie stopped caring and just wanted to finish his 7 year long story).

dont even get me started on the "beyond the quadrants" bullshit that davekat fans preach their ship as representing. like they are very clearly defined by a range from flushedrom to pitchrom. tbf i was talking abt this to my davekat fan of a friend and he clarified that the definition works better if you see "beyond the quadrants" as just unlabelled/dynamic which. sure. they def are not static in their current quadrant. but i hardly think their dynamic pacifies each other at all, which is the defining feature of concillatory quadrants, <> & o8<. (if you want a dynamic that goes beyond the quadrants, here's my hint since i dont wanna derail too much: it'd be platonic in some sense.)

[yuripira4e]

ur points are fine but do you really have to put an obnoxious anon in the mgs tag talking shit abt one of the few games with gay male rep "made up yaoi" and claiming bb/eva is like a Real Canon pairing and not they fucked one bc eva was trying to get something from him and if you want to talk about women her feelings towards him were clearly a lot more complicated than it just being a ship. virtue signaling is also acting like you have to publicly blog about female characters to show that you care and respect them. also strangeboss WAS very popular, more so when the game came out for what its worth. if you really want to get into the nitty gritty im always pretty disappointed that ppl interpret their relationship as cute mutual attraction and ignore that strangelove has an obsession with the boss that likely makes her an unreliable narrator, which imo isnt a bad thing!! i legit think thats really interesting, zero and bb talk a lot about the boss and her will from the pov of soldiers but strangelove equally puts her on a pedestal imo. yeah thats not a good trope for a lesbian character but again! if you want to get nitty gritty. theres a really clear pattern in the mgs series where only villains are CANONICALLY bi/gay, but theres a lot of heavy handed queer coding among the "good guys"

I agree with you too. I’m sorry for putting discourse in the tag. 1. strange boss is a complex dynamic and as much as I love it it is ultimately from Strangelove’s pov. I think that’s just a reoccurring theme with the boss in general. I mean the entire game is centered around the misinterpretation of her will and everyone taking what they thought she meant from it and warping it to for their own perception. I do think strangeboss was mutual but Strangelove was definitely not healthily crushing on the boss either. I haven’t been in the fandom that long so I actually didn’t know the ship was that popular at one point but you have to admit it does get overshadowed as do a lot of female pairings (straight or queer) in the fanbase

2. I already said I don’t ship bb ships. I love Eva and I think her complex relationship with bb and other characters should absolutely be talked about and I enjoy their dynamic so that’s why I said I liked their relationship but not endgame

3. I do think the made up yaoi thing was kind of rude bc I don’t think it was made up at all (I should have said that on that but I don’t really feel like starting arguments or defending shit). I think the mlm representation in the game is honestly really groundbreaking even if it does adhere to a lot of stereotypes and unfortunately villainize it a lot. But it has multiple relationships and single characters in queer or queer coded mlm relationships that differ in age, ethnicity, dynamic, and backstory which is just insanely cool. From like canonically queer characters like volgin and vamp and I’m gonna say ocelot bc I think pw put him past queer coded and into fully implied queer territory to deep, healthy, interesting queer coded relationships like otasune and even liquidmantis I think it’s amazing and should not be minimized even if it could be improved or there are faults in the way other characters are treated because of it at times which is something every fanbase has. Even other ships that I don’t like have a lot of really interesting dynamics and feelings that are undeniably queer coded and I think we should just look at all of it and enjoy the queer media we’ve been given while being able to critique it and not turn on each other

[lachithenonbinary]

It's my project on anime, and yes i took a lot from wiki

Sexualization of children and teenagers in anime:-

Before i come to this topic, i would like to tell you my view on art.

A art is is piece of creativity where you render your expressions. It's speech, your actions influences many groups. And with the coming of internet, your art could be seen by millions of people. And like how we say in speech :

Freedom of speech is not

Not a licence to abuse

It's a responsibility

I think same should be applied to art.

Anime has a long history of sexualizing children and teenagers, and even the many organisations tried to balk this, but they were put down.

Lolicon Is a Japanese popular culture, lolicon  also romanized as rorikon or lolicom) is a genre of fictional media in which young (or young-looking) girl characters appear in sexual or suggestive contexts. The term, a portmanteau of the English phrase "Lolita complex", also refers to desire and affection for such characters , and fans of such characters and works.

The main thing on how the authors and fans defend this genre is children depicted here are not real.Writing in The Book of Otaku (1989), feminist Chizuko Ueno argued that lolicon, as an orientation towards fictional bishōjo, is "completely different from pedophilia", and characterized it as a desire to "be part of the 'cute' world of shōjo" for male fans of shōjo manga who "find it too much to be a man

Most scholars also identify lolicon as a form of self-expression on the part of its male creators and consumers.Sociologist Sharon Kinsella suggests that for lolicon fans, "the infantilized female object of desire has crossed over to become an aspect of their own self image and sexuality". Akira Akagi argues that lolicon manga represented a notable shift in reader identification from the "hero" penetrator common to pornographic gekiga: "Lolicon readers do not need a penis for pleasure, but rather they need the ecstasy of the girl. They identify with the girl, and get caught up in a masochistic pleasure.

Manga critic Gō Itō views this as an "abstract desire", quoting lolicon artist who told him that "he was the girl who is raped in his manga", reflecting a feeling of being "raped by society, or by the world"

Cultural historian Mark McLelland identifies lolicon and yaoi as "self-consciously anti-realist" genres, given a rejection by fans and creators of "three-dimensionality" in favor of "two-dimensionality",and compares lolicon to the yaoi fandom( yaoi, is gay relationship mostly written by women), in which largely female and heterosexual fans consume depictions of male homosexuality which "lack any correspondent in the real world". This statement might have been true to one extend, but, is it the case nowdays? This yaoi genre Became so big and popular to an extent that people started using real Life men who may or may not be homosexual, are both shipped together, and Stories are written. People even started bring their own sexuality called "quasisexual", which basically girls getting attracted to gay men

And I think we have to consider the fact these lolicon are not just read by one person, it's published to a wide public. So even if the author just tried to show themself as a little girl getting raped, there might be a others who won't see that way. It's just like saying you created a movie based on your friend where you encouraged your friend to leave his so called "girlish" behaviour and "be man up", the other audience who will see this ,wouldn't just see it as 2 friends, they will see it as a message that it's important to "man up"

Several scholars identify the emergence of lolicon with changes in Japanese gender relations. Sociologist Kimio Itō attributes the rise of lolicon manga to a shift in the 1970s and 1980s, when boys, driven by a feeling that girls were "surpassing them in terms of willpower and action", turned to the "world of imagination", in which young girl characters are "easy to control". Kinsella interprets lolicon as part of a "gaze of both fear and desire" stimulated by the growing power of women in society, and as a reactive desire to see the shōjo "infantilized, undressed, and subordinate". Media scholar Chizuko Naitō views lolicon as reflecting a "societal desire in a broader sense" for young girls as sex symbols in Japan (which she calls a "loliconized society"). Christine Yano argues that eroticized imagery of the shõjo, "real or fictive", reflects "heteronormative pedophilia" in which emphasis is placed on the ephemerality of childhood: "it is as child that [the shōjo] becomes precious as a transitory figure threatened by impending adulthood"

As for the sexualization of teenager in anime, people just consider it as a normal thing as teenagers startes to develop sexual parts.

It may or may not be related to anime but groping of teenage girl in trains and buses are quite high.

Hiroko Goto, a feminist and vice president at japanese headquarter  NGO Human Rights Now, believes many people do not consider groping to be a crime. “[For] society at large, it’s not a big problem; that’s the kind of double standard [between] the victims’ viewpoint and the social viewpoint.”

In Ogawa’s opinion, society normalises groping as something that just happens.

So in society, where groping is kind of normalised, can we say is it ok sexualize teenagers in anime where many times show adult male harrassing a 'Naughty girl" as sexy and does not cause permanent harm

[adorpheus]

on fujoshi and fetishization

Lately, more and more, both here on tumblr and on other sites, I keep seeing people spew unfiltered hatred at fujoshi - that is, women who like mlm content such as gay fanfic and fanart featuring men with other men. And I don’t mean like a specific type of fujoshi, like the ones who are genuinely being weird about it, but just like a general hatred for girls (but especially straight identifying girls) who express love for gay romance.

I hate to break this to you all, but women (including straight women!) actually are allowed to like mlm fanfiction and fanart, even enthusiastically so. A woman simply expressing her love of gay fanfic, even if it is in kind of a cringey way or a way that you personally don’t like, is NOT automatically fetishization.

I’ve been on the receiving end of fetishization for my entire life, from a very young age, as many black and brown folx have, so I consider myself pretty well acquainted with how it works. Fetishization isn’t just like, being really into drawings of boys kissing, or whatever the fuck y’all are trying to imply on this god forsaken site. 

Fetishization is complicated imo, and can encompass a lot of things, such as (but not limited to):

1 - dehumanization, e.g. viewing a group of people as sexual objects who exist purely for entertainment purposes, rather than acknowledging them as actual people who deserve respect and rights

and

2 - projecting certain assumptions onto said people based on their race/sexuality/whatever is being fetishized. These assumptions are often, but not always, sexual in nature (like the idea that black people in general are more sexual than other races, etc etc etc).

I’m going to use myself as an example to illustrate my point. Please note this isn’t the best or most nuanced example, but it is the most simplistic. A white person finding me attractive and respectfully appreciating my black features as part of what makes me beautiful is not, on its own, fetishization. A white person finding me attractive solely or mostly because I’m a PoC is now in fetishization territory. Similarly, assuming I’m dominant because of my blackness (like saying “step on me mommy” and shit like that) is hella fetishistic. 

That being said, theres definitely a difference between how fetishization works in real life with real people, and how it shows up in fandom. 

Fetishization manifests in many different ways in fandom, but most commonly on the mlm side of things, I personally see it appear as conservative (or centrist) women who love the idea of two men together, but don’t actually like gay people, and don’t necessarily think LGBT+ people deserve rights (or “special treatment” as its sometimes dog whistled). These women view queer men as sexual objects for entertainment rather than an actual group of people who deserve to be protected from systemic oppression. I’ve noticed that they often don’t even think of the men they “ship” together as actually being gay, and may even express disgust at the idea of a character in an mlm ship being headcanon’d gay. In case its not obvious, this is pretty much exactly the same way a lot of cishet men fetishize lesbians (they see “lesbian” as a porn category, rather than like, what actual LGBT people think of when we read the word lesbian). There’s a pretty popular viral tweet thread going around where someone explains seeing this trend of conservative women who like mlm stuff, and I have also personally witnessed this phenomenon myself in more than one fandom. 

The funny thing is, maybe its just me buuuut.... The place I see this particular kind of fetishization happen most is not in the anime/BL fandom, from which the term fujoshi originates - I actually see these type of women way way more in western fandom spaces like Supernatural, Harry Potter, and Hannibal. I can’t stress this enough, there’s a shocking amount of people who are like, straight up trump supporters in these fandoms. If you want to experience it, try joining a Hannigram or Destiel group on facebook and you will probably encounter one eventually especially if you happen to be living through a major historical event. Like these women probably wouldn’t even be considered “fujoshi”, because that term doesn’t really apply to them given they aren’t in the BL/anime fandom, yet they’re the ones I personally see actually doing the most harm.

Of course this isn’t the ONLY kind of fetishizing woman in the mlm/BL world, there are other ways fetishization shows up, but this is the most toxic kind that I see.

A girl just being really into BL or whatever may be “cringe” to you, or she may be expressing her love for BL in a “cringey” way, but a straight woman really enjoying BL is not, on its own, somehow inherently fetishization. Yes, sometimes teenage girls act kind of cringe about how much they like BL and that might be annoying to you, but its not necessarily ~problematic~. 

That being said, IT NEEDS BE REMARKED that a lot of the “fujoshi” that you all hate so deeply, are actually closeted trans men or nonbinary people who haven’t yet come to terms with their gender identity, or are otherwise just NOT cishet. I know because I was one of these closeted people for years, and I honestly think tumblr and the cultural obsession around purity is one of the many reasons I was closeted so deeply for so long. STORYTIME LOL!!! In my early adolescence, I was a sort of proto “fujoshi”. I identified as a bi girl who was mostly attracted to men, or as most (biphobic) people called it, “practically straight”. I wrote and read “slash” fanfic and looked at as well as drew my own fanart. We didn’t use the term fujoshi back then, but that’s definitely how I could have been described. I was obsessed with yaoi, BL, whatever you want to call it, to a cringe-inducing degree. I really struggled to relate to most het romances, so when I first discovered yaoi fanfics (as we called them at the time), I fell in love and felt like I finally found the type of romance content that was made for me. I didn’t know exactly why, I just knew it hit different. LGBT+ fanart and fanfiction brought me an immense amount of joy, and I didn’t really think too hard about why.

At some point, in my early 20s, after reading lots of discourse™ here on tumblr and other places like twitter, I started to get the sinking feeling that my passion for gay fanfiction was ~problematic~. I had always felt a sense of guilt for being into mlm content, because literally anyone who found out I liked BL (especially the men I dated) shamed me for liking it all the fucking time (which btw is literally just homophobic, like can we talk about that?). In addition to THAT bullshit, now I’m seeing posts telling me that girls who like BL are cringey gross fetishists who inspire rage and should go die? 

Let me tell you, I internalized the fuck out of messages like this. I desperately wanted to avoid being ~problematic~. At the time, I thought being problematic was like the worst thing you could be. I was terrified of being ��cancelled”, before canceling was even really a thing. I thought to myself, “oh my god, I’m gross for liking this stuff? I should stop.” I beat myself up over this. I wanted so badly to be accepted, and to be deemed a Good Person by the internet and society at large.

I tried to shape up and become a good ally (lmfao). I stopped writing fanfic and deleted all the ones I was working on at the time. I made a concerted effort to assimilate into cishet culture, including trying to indulge myself more deeply in the few fandoms I could find that had het content I did enjoy (Buffy, True Blood, Pretty Little Liars, etc). I would occasionally look at BL/fanfic/etc in private, but then I would repress my interest in it and not look for a while. Instead I would look at women in straight relationships, and create extremely heterosexual Couple Goals pinterest boards, and try to figure out how I could become more like these women, so I, too, could be loved someday. 

This cycle of repression lasted like eight years. Throughout it all, I was performing womanhood to the best of my ability and trying to become a woman that was worthy of being in a relationship. I went in and out of several “straight” relationships, wondering why they didn’t make me feel the way reading fanfic did. Most of all, I couldn’t figure out why straight intimacy didn’t work for me. I just didn’t enjoy it. I always preferred looking at or making gay fanfiction/fanart over actual intimacy with men in real life. 

Eventually, I stumbled upon a trans coming out video that someone I was following posted online, my egg started to crack, and to make an extremely long story short, after like 3 years of introspection and many gender panic attacks that I still experience to this day, I realized that I’m uh... MAYBE... NOT CIS..!? :|

I truly believe if I had just been ALLOWED TO LIKE GAY STUFF WITHOUT BEING SHAMED FOR IT, I probably would have realized I was trans way way sooner. Because for me, indulging in my love of gay romance and writing gay fanfic wasn’t me being a weirdo fetishist, it was actually me exploring my own gender identity. It is what helped me come to terms with being a nonbinary trans boy.

Not everyone realizes they are trans at age 2 or whatever the fuck. Sometimes you have to go through a cringey fujoshi phase and multiple existential crises to realize how fucking gay you are AND THATS FINE.

And one more thing - can we just be real here? 

A lot of anti-fujoshi sentiment is literally just misogyny. omg please realize this. Its “women aren’t allowed to enjoy things” but, like... with gay fanfics. Some of the anti-fujoshi posts I see come across my dash are clearly ppl projecting a caricature they invented in their head of a demonic fujoshi fetishist onto any woman who expresses what they consider to be a little too much enthusiasm for gay content and then using their perception of that individual as an excuse to justify their disdain for any women, especially straight women, ‘invading’ their ~oh so exclusive~ queer fandom spaces.

 god get over yrselfs this is gatekeeping by another name

idk why i spent so long writing this no one is even going to read it, does anyone even still use this site

*EDIT: HOLY SHIT WHEN DOING RESEARCH FOR THIS POST I FOUND OUT THAT Y-GALLERY IS BACK OMG!!! 

[doberbutts]

She's doing the "pornsick male vs straight girls fetishizing gay men" thing. Only fujoshi like yaoi and superwholock and (I think OFMD but could be Black Sails, both of which are pretty tumblr popular and both of which have qctual queer representation) and shipping and focus on straight male characters in gay relationships. Only pornsick men fetishizing lesbians like yuri and catgirls and sexualized young anime girls and furry art that is unapologetically fetish fuel.

It's pretty typical terfary.

Dogwhistles in her initial reply are:

Comparing gender to race. Man people with bad radfem logic do this all the fucking time. Since race is not something you can really change about yourself (barring discoveries made in your own journey of learning your family history, which doesn't change your race but does change your understanding of your racial background), sex has to be too, and sex = gender, so whatever sex you are is whatever sex you will stay. There are people who've unlearned the sex = gender part of it but believe the rest and it is very annoying to inform people over and over again that that is terf influence in their theory.

Anti sex work. While some feminists aren't terfs and still are anti sex work, it's usually combined. She's also anti kink, but not on this post, and again that's pretty typical. Also it's interesting that she accused me of being pro sex work despite me not really ever talking about my feelings on sex work primarily because I think sex workers should lead that conversation and I am not nor have I ever been one.

Definitions are unchangeable and will never shift- once defined a certain way it will never be different than how it is currently defined. Ties into a lot of the logic on whether it is possible to trans one's gender.

"When is a label a lie if we allow self-determination" is a big one- because the next step would be to say that men who claim to be women are thus lying assholes and not people with some sort of connection or proximity to womanhood. There's a reason I answered the question on race the way I did- I'd assume there was some sort of connection there even if I can't see it myself and then continue to not care. But you sort of have to play 5D chess with this logic and identify dogwhistles as they happen because they're trying to get you to agree with them that trans woman are just lying men and trans men are just lying women.

I didn't engage much with the sex work portion of the second respond because A: I've already pegged her as a terf I'm not going to change her mind B: she talks like a former sex worker and when I looked into her blog I discovered that she is. I don't claim to know much about the way sex work works in this country let alone hers (Germany) so I'm not going to argue these points. But I can tell immediately that she doesn't spend a lot of time in kink spaces and probably does not like kink (correct) because I used to be in that puppy server and I can tell you that people have made absolute bank doing sex work they very much enjoy with only a handful of partners. It's not a common situation but I've literally seen it happen. Her experience is different, but it tells me a lot about her beliefs and how she shaped them.

"Female homosexuality" is a big one, as well as "person identified as a woman". Making the distinction between the two is what matters.

Lastly the erasure of men in sex work and as trafficking victims as well as the through-gritted-teeth allowance of adjacency to womanhood for trans women sex workers (and *only* adjacency and not full womanhood, mind) as well as forcibly grouping gay men into that same adjacency, *and* the erasure of WOMEN who serve as paying customers and the part WOMEN play in trafficking as well... again, I don't know how it works in Germany, even as an outsider looking in I know that this isn't quite truthful representation of what's actually happening. Similarly, the focus on sex work specifically when discussing human trafficking, ignoring all the other reasons trafficking happens because then she would have to admit that while gender plays a role in how this happens, trafficking is a universal and widespread problem that affects more than just women for sale as sex slaves.

Genuinely, I believe the best way of protecting yourself from this type of ideology is education and living your life with the compassion and grace afforded to others as I described in my OP. She stopped responding because I took the wind out of her sails so much that she herself had to admit that although we disagree strongly on an ideological standpoint, what I'm saying still tackles the problems that she's concerned about even if it's not the way she wants them to be tackled.

"Well are you a [controversial identity] supporter???"

My friend I do not know what to tell you here. My rule is and remains "I don't care what you call yourself because your actions and who you are as a person is more valuable to me" and "as long as everyone in the situation is an adult and is giving enthusiastic consent I genuinely do not give a fuck what you do" and "words are stupid and people are complicated so it doesn't matter if The Words Are Wrong as long as it makes you happy"

I'm a longer tables not higher walls kind of guy. Have a seat. Break bread with me. Tell me a story over dinner. I think that'll be better for the both of us.

[savnofilter]

no nuance november!

a/n: which is basically you have a bunch of opinions and dont explain any of em' and let your followers discuss them (much more suited for tiktok sjsnj). i'll be doing it since it compiles with many topics like fandom, racism, lgbtq+, politics and etc. i highly encourage people to do this simply because why not? feel free to send your own opinions n stuff, i wanna know what my followers think!!

disclaimer!! ⚠️ all of these are broad, not pin pointing certain people or situations. even though these are my opinions these were all in fun and have been collected over the years and will change as time goes on. nothing is sugar-coated so thread carefully. feel free to agree or disagree. :)

warning(s): mentions of racism, p*do micro aggression, fetishizing, toxicity, abuse, politics, labelling, mental health, cancelling, fandoms, ages.

key:

iswis = i said what i said, no explanation to that one.

whe = will happily explain.

stop sexualizing gay/m|m/yaoi relationships. it's not only demonizing to the males, it's also very fetishizing. (iswis)

most times /10 yall root for "feminine men" when you really mean white boys and fetishised asian men on social media. (whe)

bullying someone isnt educating. you either cant cope with the fact people have different opinions from you or you have a struggle with things either always never going your way or the opposite. (iswis)

straight people will never have a say in lgbtq+ issues. stop inserting yourself. (iswis)

white people will never have a say in poc issues. stop inserting yourself. (iswis)

poc will never have a say in black people issues. stop inserting yourself. (vice versa but im black and it happens more often to us lol) (iswis)

using the defense, "but black lives matter, right?" when one black person does something bad isnt facts, youre racist. (iswis)

fandom adults need to stop gatekeeping the target audience (demographics) to animes/shows. (iswis)

poc people can be racist. (whe)

even if a certain site was adult doesnt mean that every adult wants to see your porn. either keep it to yourself or tag properly. (iswis)

saying shit like, "im more xyz than you and im not even xyz" is not only disrespectful but disgusting. just because you believe in a popular opinion of a group does NOT suddenly make you a person in it, get over yourself. (iswis)

dont hate on people for the same things you have done at a young age. (ex: writing fanfic, seggs, etc) (iswis)

blaming a minor/someone mentally unstable for being abused is not only victim blaming, but it enables the notion that people who go those things that they wanted it. (iswis)

going off of that last point, if you do victim blame for situations and been in them yourself you either still havent coped with what you went through and still think it was your fault when it wasnt. (whe)

it's stupid people hate minors for being undeveloped when adults are the reason as to why people get traumas, abused and quite literally are destroying the world right now. (iswis)

gen z is white as fuck. (iswis)

early 2000s kids are equivalent to 90s kids who use to post, "only 90s kids under this" and post something that 2000-5 experienced. (iswis)

dear 2005+ kids, abusing harmful substances and having sex doesnt make you grown. stop it. (iswis)

adults, being able to post porn doesnt make you grown or mature, stop believing that it does. (iswis)

just because it's a coping mechanism doesnt mean it's healthy. (iswis)

avoiding conflict doesnt mean youre mature. if there is an active problem and you know ignoring it will only benefit you and not the actual problem at hand that is selfish. (iswis)

black women generate clout for everyone. when we're hated the person gets patted on the back, someone appreciates black girls they are praised, and people of many groups repeatedly steal from our culture. (iswis)

YES THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN BEING BLACK AND AFRICAN AMERICAN. (whe)

if youre black you do not have to be democrat OR republican, there are many other parties. (whe)

i do not trust either parties, no minority should. (whe)

this 2020 election was not a win for poc people no matter who won. (iswis)

we do not decide whether or not what to do on columbus day. it is up to the natives themselves. (whe)

pointing out other countries (current) faults is not racist. although the issue can be misconstrued, if proper research is done it safe to say it's an educated observation or opinion. (whe)

privilege heavily varies; ex, americans are seen as privileged, while the people who live in it experience a disadvantage because of the societal standards. within the country itself. (whe)

americans, stop saying that america is the worst country and there are other countries who are suffering much worse than we are. yes sometimes it sucks but do not label it as the worst. (iswis + whe)

white people are privileged and will always be until we break the racist issues deep rooted in EVERY community. (iswis)

9/10 when marginalized groups like (women, lgbt) are mostly focused on white people and never address the poc counter parts. using the excuse "well idk much about that" is not good enough and just promotes pseudo-white supremecy. (iswis + whe)

do not use aave. (iswis)

aave is not gen z language, stop calling it that. (iswis)

gay men (white especially) use black women and get praised for the things we do that are called ghetto. (iswis)

yes it is offensive if you touch a black persons hair with or without permission. we are not your pets nor zoo animals. (iswis)

and yes it is offensive if you see a black women with beautiful hair and assume it's fake or ask, "is it yours?" "is it real?" (iswis)

using jailbait as an excuse to lewd minors is just as disgusting. (iswis)

beauty standards for women is rooted from pedophilia. (iswis)

using other pedophilic relationships as an excuse to ship yours is disturbing and you shouldnt be near children at any capacity. (iswis)

everything doesnt need a label. (iswis)

the fact that gangs have been criminalized while mafias havent is racist and feeds the stereotypes that poc are criminals. (iswis)

people are more forgiving to white predators than to poc (neither are good but people let white off the hook more often). (iswis)

if youre okay with your friends being racists, creeps, abusers you are just as bad. (iswis)

although you can like what you like, making dark content shouldnt be as glorified as much as it is. (iswis)

some kinks do deserve to be kink shamed. (iswis)

adults need to be more held accountable when held in situations with minors. (iswis + whe)

everyone perceives the world differently, many people will see the same things you see differently. (iswis)

calling people crazy for questioning the things around them doesnt make them crazy, youre just asleep. (iswis)

the human body can function without a soul. (iswis)

stop disrespecting christianity. you wouldnt do the same with hinduism, islam and etc. (iswis)

the bible was altered by white men and the true meanings have been misconstrued. (iswis + whe)

bullying someone who you THINK is problematic is not excuse to be hateful. youre just scum and feel the need to justify your actions. (iswis)

not everyone has to like you and dont need a reason. (iswis)

just because you dont like someone doesnt mean you have to make a show of it. be mature and move along. (iswis)

yes callouts/cancelling has its place but it's never done right. (iswis)

"cancel culture" wasnt a thing till white people joined in. (iswis)

dont cancel someone for stuff they did years ago. bringing it up is important but not allowing them to understand, reflect, and apologize is not only bullying it defeats the purpose of bringing awareness. (iswis)

big writers need to stop complaining when one fic or a few dont do good. not only does it rub in small writers faces, it shows that if you need people's validation to write you probably shouldnt be writing. some works will be popular and some will flop, get over it. (iswis)

stop witch hunting & crucifying people for shit you have done or your friends have done and going "uwu sorry" when you get caught. (iswis)

90% people believe content creators with bigger audiences. (iswis)

people spontaneously posting, "uwu take care of your mental health" doesnt mean that they actually care. (iswis)

people are always quick to judge people with real mental health such as depression, anxiety, adhd, and etc are always the one to turn and pretend to be exactly what they just mocked. (iswis)

dont have kids if youre not going to take care of them. (iswis)

stop baiting baby otakus (people freshly getting into anime) into watching cp like yarichin bitch club or boku no pico. they are minors, it's not funny, stop it. (iswis)

stop being protective & toxic over anime characters. if they were real they probably wouldnt even like you. (iswis)

just because someone is your friend doesnt mean that they arent toxic or abusive. (iswis)

start believing when people show their true traits. (iswis)

trauma happens in different forms, stop saying something didnt happen because it didnt go the way that has commonly happened or the way it occurred to you. (iswis)

stop saying minors should "know" while also being the loudest to say that our brains arent even developed till 25. (iswis)

the adult age should be raised to 20 years old. (iswis + whe)

tos should be raised to 16 years old. (iswis + whe)

minors take "18+" & "minors dni" out of your bio. (iswis)

yelling at minors for finding the content you freely put out without any care is your fault not theirs. (iswis)

there are plenty of adult sites that are more confined for adults but you guys ignore them because youd rather get popular on writing erotica on a popular social media platform. (iswis)

trying to cancel someone over one mistake and or blowing said things out of proportion is toxic and stupid. (iswis)

if you take someone saying they need to distance themselves for mental health reasons personally and make them feel bad for it youre an actual shitty person. (iswis)

if someone disrespects you, you have the right to say whatever you want in response. (iswis + whe)

stop hypersexualizing everything (adults especially). (iswis)

the excuses of, "they look grown" "i mentally think xyz" "theyre fake" is creepy and weird and yall should come up with a better excuse. (iswis)

yes i do believe minors should be writing for minors only, but i will not give a shit if an adult does if said characters are aged up in every work sfw or not. (iswis)

stop saying teens cant go through traumatic things and cant experience mental illnesses. it just shows that you werent cared for as a child and never get the therapy for it. (iswis)

gen z has a very colonized idea of activism. (iswis)

feminism was never for all women until the rest of us forced ourselves in. and even now it's still an issue whether or not people realize it or not. (iswis)

poc solidarity doesnt exist as much as we try to make it happen. (iswis)

colorism is an issue, and no you will not tell me otherwise. (iswis)

the hot cheeto girl is offensive and demeans black & hispanic culture. (iswis)

stop bashing minors for breathing, just say youre mad youre not young anymore and move on. (iswis)

black men are the white people of black people. (iswis)

there is no reason as to why you anyone would refer to black people as "blacks". nor should you (non-black people) be arguing whether or not to say nigga even with the hard r. (iswis)

if you (pertains to white people) think white privilege doesnt exist but go on to make fun of or ignore minority problems you are the living and breathing example of what we are talking about. (iswis)

loli/shotas are fucking disgusting and people who like it deserve to be tortured for eternity. (iswis)

seriously, stop using theyre "fake" as an excuse. (iswis)

if youre comfortable with being hateful to someone but still consider yourself a nice person because you do the hate minimum to be a decent human, youre either a narcissist or have a god complex. (iswis)

coons have no say in black issues. (iswis)

people need to stop blaming the "home wrecker" for ruining the relationship when it was the s/o's fault as well. there is no home to enter without an owner. (iswis)

stop saying any asian man yo see reminds you of a haikyuu character and or any anime character. it's racist. (iswis)

stop saying any asian person looks like a kpop idol, it's racist. (iswis)

stop downplaying and invalidating when black women go through traumatic things. not only does it promote that we have to be strong and save everyone else's problems, it says that we dont have emotions and cant be a victim which is disgusting. (iswis)

if you say shit like "minors curate your own experience" then go and turn around to say you REFUSE TO TAG YOUR SHIT YOU ARE LITERALLY MAKING THE PROCESS OF CENSORING HARD! (iswis)

white women are just as much of a problem as white men. only difference is sex keeping them apart. (iswis)

stop saying kpop is racist. expecting artists from a different political progression to understand that things can be offensive is bland. (iswis)

people accept boy groups fuck-ups more than they accept girl groups. and most times out of ten, the males are worse. (iswis)

if you engage in nsfw conversation with a minor, it is your fault they responded. (iswis)

anyone can be abused. (iswis)

stop coddling adults and bullying minors. (iswis)

most of you females have internalized misogyny and dont even know it. (iswis)

you can callout issues without having to drag a group of people. same with uplifting. (iswis)

if youre fine with being a sheep unfollow me. (iswis)

seven deadly sins is not a good anime. (iswis)

there is a difference between boku no hero academia fans based on if they call it "bnha" or "mha". (iswis)

ships literally are not serious stop harassing people over ships. (iswis)

do not harass creators of series because they do something with THEIR story. make your own. (iswis)

stop saying horikoshi sexualizes his women too much/mineta is the worst when you guys enjoy shows like one piece, hunter x hunter, naruto and etc. (iswis)

minors often or not are sheeps (heres your sign you dont have to agree with everything other people say). (iswis)

just because minors can be mature doesnt mean that they are adults. stop treating them as such. (iswis)

we should give more voice actors in the asmr (idk what to call it) community more recognition instead of just one. (iswis)

writers are the ones that send hate to other writers. anon hate is so corny and if you do it that goes to show that you are truly a toxic person wearing a fake mask of kindness when youre not on anonymous. (iswis)

stop being mean to smaller writers because they did not have as much luck as you. (iswis)

stop blaming your readers because one story flopped. (iswis)

ignoring someone's shitty actions encourages them to do it more. (iswis)

going to school and getting a job is much harder now than it was before. (iswis)

being an adult doesnt automatically make you mature. just because youre older doesnt mean youre better or you opinion is more valuable. it just shows that you werent heard when you were younger. (iswis)

there should be no reason as to why someone of the age of 18 should be having any romantic relationship with someone who is a minor. (iswis)

hawks is a shitty character. (iswis)

bakudeku isnt toxic. (iswis)

just because bakugo is in a ship, doesnt mean it's toxic. (iswis)

stop shipping male characters together simply because they have screen time together. it's creepy. (iswis)

almost all of 1-a students have ptsd and anything close to the after effects of being traumatized. (iswis)

no, editing characters to be poc is not racist. youre just mad they arent "white" when they never were. theyre asian and come in many colors as well. (iswis)

wanting to only be with a different race to get a mixed baby is fucking disgusting. (iswis)

stop ignoring pedo relationships between older women and younger boys and or with older women in general. (iswis)

males can be abused, stop telling them to suck it up or that they cant go through things. (iswis)

shaming young females about things they cant control is misogynistic and is damaging to their identity and shouldnt be excused. (iswis + whe)

not all females have to shave. (iswis)

what you dont like in someone is the projections you see of yourself on other people that you dont like about yourself. (whe)

popular bl stories extremely misrepresent gay relationships and frankly it's disgusting that theyre boosted as much as they are. (iswis)

jjba isnt ugly, you just watch animes to sexualize the characters. (iswis)

it's shitty that anime and kpop only became cool once white people stated to like it and made it mainstream. go gatekeep family guy or something. (iswis)

if you have been anime fan for a long time you were with bullied/teased for just generally liking it or you were a weirdo who recreated shit from it. (iswis)

weaboo and weeb were bad terms till we made them positive?? literally otaku is the word for it but we use weeb instead lol. (whe)

normalize and promote educating someone without going straight to bullying them. (whe)

haikyuu isnt really a good manga/anime nor is the art style the best but the characters make up for it. (iswis)

stop misusing terms and stop nitpicking definitions to manipulate your narrative. (iswis)

toxic positivity is manipulative and if you have to make it back handed you are not as nice as you like to make it seem. (iswis)

studying a major doesnt mean youre actually good in the subject. (iswis)

normalize people realizing their past mistakes and growing from it. (iswis)

do not self diagnos unless you actually feel like you may have that issue and would like to seek help. mental health is not a personality trait. (iswis)

stop projecting onto people. (iswis)

stop misusing terms and stop nitpicking definitions to fit your narrative. (iswis)

stealing any type of work should not be tolerated. (iswis)

constantly trying to trigger someone to go back to their old ways (being toxic, abusive, addiction, suicidal etc) after changing is toxic and manipulative. (iswis)

if you make jokes about hurting kids and or feel the need speak badly about them i do not want to speak to you. (iswis)

the human brain wasnt developed to understand complex ideas such as death or the universe. (iswis)

we will never truly know what is beyond our skies. (iswis)

thats all, thanks for sifting!

[la-carcassa-famiglia]

IDGI.. I mean you said no yaoi but you ship gay couples and do you just call it BL? (It makes sense to just call them gay couples though, I get this part.) I'm confused. Also, I am relieved to find someone else who is normal and doesn't ship D18 or any minor with an adult. Like.. this shit was perhaps the most popular ship in the entire fandom (at least the gay male ships, I didn't ship anything else but 6918 tbh, maaaybe 8018 but 1869 and SakuHina are my all-time anime OTPs.. I have others but not in anime.) back in the day and it's disgusting. For this exact reason I am glad the KHR! fandom is long dead and buried. Thank you again for the 6918 fic. I would also come off anon but alas, I fit into the dni category of "terf" simply because I'm a lesbian, therefore will never have sex with males (yes, trans women are men). Happy New Year!

I put this in a readmore since it got a bit long, but I find it to be something really important to explain

I just call them gay ships, mlm ships, or ships on its own. The issue with calling them yaoi is that the genre has long a long history of being catered to women and meant to fetishize gay men. A lot of these characters are riddled with abuse, romanticized internalized homophobia, emphasis on age gaps as a fetish/one party being drawn like a child, etc. I don’t doubt gay men have written for the genre, but for the most part, the content has been made by (tbh very likely) homophobic women for other women, not actual gay people. It also makes mlm relationships out to be a sexy “taboo” thing. This contributes to the really harmful mindset of fetishizing gay people, which is already bad aside from yaoi. 

Its bad reputation also undermines actual LGBT rep in anime, where the characters just happen to be gay. People are either gonna shy away from from a decent show with good rep because it has “yaoi” or you’re gonna have yaoi fans fetishize good representation

BL has less of a bad reputation but it still rubs me the wrong way for similar reasons. But basically calling a gay ship “yaoi” or even BL can be dehumanizing to gay people, especially if it’s a comfort thing for them. I certainly feel this way myself and and I can say the same for my friends

As for the terf part, why the fuck did you think it was okay to interact with me if you saw you were on the list? I literally don't respect you, I think you give shame to lesbian label, and that you should learn to be a decent person. Like, I have friends who are trans women, and they are women, no fucking questions asked. It’s basic respect. Have a shit new year and don’t touch my content ever again

And just wanna end of this ask by saying: to any trans women reading this, just know I will never agree with people like this, and this is a safe space for you. I love and respect you all, and the fact that you exist is amazing.

[orionsangel86]

I agree with the overly fetished views that fandom seems to have of gay men. As a gay man who’s really short, it’s soooo fuckin weird to have people assume I’m a bottom??? Like, I don’t even know you enough to disclose my sexual life and you’re making? weird? assumptions?? Also, there’s a certain fan artist who shan’t be named who makes a certain shorter character super feminine and it kills me every time

EXACTLY

Urgh I’m sorry fandom makes you feel that way.

I’m gonna put this under a cut as I am about to rant about this topic because it is my biggest gripe within fandom. Don’t read on if you are here for fun happy positive things. Beware fair readers, there be strong potentially offensive opinions and plenty of fandom wank down below...

Fandom is unfortunately filled with CIS het women who like to stereotype and force men into their preconceived internalised misogynistic perceptions that to be short or slender means you are the weak dainty “girl” in the relationship and that’s why whichever character they deem the “girl” is also ALWAYS the “bottom”. It also is the same way fandom tends to muddy the waters between sexual positions top/bottom and BSDM terms dom/sub, where bottoms MUST be submissive as well. Half the time you will see posts talking about character traits which perhaps might indicate a submissive streak, and people will take that to mean that a character is a bottom, when the two do not correlate and it is highly problematic to assume that they do.

It’s so fucking problematic and I don’t think that these (mostly straight cis female) fans realise that by encouraging these harmful stereotypes, they are actually also being totally misogynistic and anti feminist. Women are not all bloody Anastasia Steel’s for christs sake (and don’t get me started on that god awful book/movie series). A women can be tall, broad, muscular, she can be dominant and strong and she can damn well top a man if she wants to.

When it comes to shipping male characters in gay/queer relationships, fandom MUST stop inflicting outdated heterosexual stereotypes on them. It seems like fans find a pairing they like (for instance Dean and Cas) and then immediately have to decide which one of them plays the female role. They then twist and change the characters, their traits, the way they look etc, so that one of them is basically a woman. That character then MUST be the submissive bottom and URGH I HATE IT.

(Making a quick note to say that whilst these particular common stereotypes within fandom are very much a problem, this is not to be confused in any way with fans taking their fave characters and headcanoning them as trans or nb or anything else genderwise which reflects an even more marginalised group and is usually a type of fanwork created by fans who are in fact trans or nb themselves.)

I’m not gonna comment on specific artists, but I tend to block urls of bloggers whose stuff I feel is particularly problematic and I also now have the WONDERFUL post blocker xkit extension OMG it is a GODSEND I highly recommend it. If you keep seeing a post on your dash because everyone is reblogging it even though it is super squicky to you (like for instance an obviously feminised Cas or Dean is squicky for me) you can use the extension to block that particular post so you never have to see it again regardless of how many of your mutuals reblog it. Its amazing!

I know that on this hellsite we like to encourage everyone to be as creative as possible and that everyone is valid and we don’t kinkshame and everything etc etc, and I’m all for that, whatever floats your boat and all that. But there is a line, and the line is when what you are doing becomes offensive to the marginalised groups you are supposedly supporting. Like I really don’t care if you are into tentacle sex or hell, even a furry, but I do care if the only way you can comfortably support a gay ship is to force either of the male characters into a “female” template and give them a “self lubricating asshole”. Like... come on. This is why I hate A/B/O. If you have to force gay men to fit a hetero model, you aren’t supporting gay men, you are fetishising them. You are also probably kinda homophobic.

What I really hate about this stuff is how it always seems to be the problematic stuff like this that blows up and becomes a trend and suddenly everyone is jumping on board and no one is given a second thought to how fucked up it is. WHY IS A/B/O EVEN A THING?!? It started as a J2 beastiality fic like WHY DID IT BECOME SO POPULAR?!

Why is Twist & Shout so bloody popular too? Its not even in character. They aren’t even Dean and Cas! Cas is a pale skinny little TWINK?! WHHHHYYYY? I don’t understand it if you ship Destiel wouldn’t you at least want the characters you are reading about to BE Dean and Cas?!? Don’t get me wrong I love AU fics, but I still want to be able to picture and hear Dean and Cas in the characters being described.

Why was it such a thing in the early seasons to make Cas a girl? (that’s hyperbole obviously but he might as well have been based on some of the early fanfics/fanart I’ve seen and immediately noped out of.) Misha Collins has never looked anything like that! He’s never been feminine looking and just because the dude can pull off a dress doesn’t mean you can force him to suddenly be the cute tiny pale perfect curvy pretty submissive beauty you can’t help but imagine Dean with. If you want that for Dean, ship him with Lisa. Stop forcing Cas into a model that just doesn’t make sense for the character.

This goes for Dean as well of course. The dude may have a thing for pink panties and ballet shoes and taylor swift sure, but can we not feminise him to the point he is unrecognisable as the character please?

I know that a lot of this has routes in YAOI. Something I have generally avoided because quite frankly it disgusts me. I find the whole thing just super uncomfortable and messed up and see it purely as a straight womans fetish. So much of fandom shipping behaviour comes from YAOI and its caused a lot of the toxicity we have seen over the years. I think it has got a lot better in recent years though because the queer community is slowly gaining a monopoly in fandom (imo) and as they (we, I should say, as my bisexual ass has quite clearly had enough of this) become more interested in shipping and fandom culture, we can also start educating those straight fans who might be willing to listen and learn. Maybe one day we can say goodbye to the problematic trends of today, or at least, keep them on the fringes of fandom as more and more people wake up to the fact that they are harmful.

And if that means I never have to look at an image of a short pale “pretty” Cas with womanly hips again, I’ll crack open the prosecco and consider it a win.

[notthatiwilleverwriteit]

Yo I'm sorry but I read your answer to that one ask about nsfw stuff in one day/19 days. And for the most part I agree, exept for one thing. Please, for the love of god, don't say this is a comic "for" women. Yes it's bl BUT Old Xian is not a god damn fujoshi. He is male and uses he/him pronouns. This is not a story focused to please female viewers. This is a story about boys in love by a man not some god damn fetish for women. Just because it has a "manga style" doesn't mean it's a "Yaoi" :')

Good afternoon, dear anon-san!

And thank you for your comment regarding my earlier answer about 19 Days being NSFW. I’m glad to hear you felt like you could agree with most of it even though there was something that rubbed you the wrong way. I have no problem with people disagreeing with me or coming forward if they take issue with whatever I have said. But I would be lying if I said answering your comment doesn’t make me nervous. BL and fujoshis are quite controversial topics that I’m sure will divide people reading this or following me. But I don’t think I would be doing anyone a favor if I wasn’t honest even if what I have to say is controversial. I would like to think I have always tried to be open to all kinds of opinions and perspectives even if they differ from mine, and I hope people will extend me the courtesy. 

“Yes it’s bl BUT Old Xian is not a god damn fujoshi. He is male and uses he/him pronouns.”

I don’t think I said OldXian was a fujoshi, but I can see how that might have been implied by me saying 19 Days is a work of BL. As a genre, BL is typically targeted at a female audience by female authors. However, that is just how it usually goes. BL has plenty of male fans, too, and they’re called fudanshi. I’m not saying OX is a fudanshi but rather that all kinds of people can be fans of BL. It’s not tied to one’s gender.

Also, while males writing BL certainly isn’t typical, it’s not unheard of, either. Sadly, the author’s gender is somehow considered relevant even these days which has resulted in many male BL authors using female aliases (and vice versa when it comes to females writing genres that are typically written by male authors). But there are some BL authors who are openly males, too. For example, D. Jun – the author of Guang Xiang and Here U Are – is apparently a male.

“This is not a story focused to please female viewers. This is a story about boys in love by a man not some god damn fetish for women. Just because it has a “manga style” doesn’t mean it’s a ‘Yaoi’”

No, having “manga style” doesn’t make 19 Days a yaoi. The fact that one of its major themes is gay love makes it a BL, though. Especially in the context of it being an Asian publication. Are there other kinds of relationships and themes included, too? Yes, most definitely! And they’re all intriguing and essential to the story. The comic is also about friendship, families, and coming of age, to name a few. But it can’t be denied a pretty significant part of it revolves around homoerotic love, and that kind of theme is mainly consumed by a prominently female audience. They are also more often than not heavily targeted at female readers and to appeal to their tastes.

Case in point, the good-looking male protagonists with lean muscles and the author not exactly shying away from drawing them at least half-naked. You could also say He Tian’s character is the kind that typically appeals to females – a dark bad boy with a hot bod and vulnerable, tragic past. And what do you know, he’s at least the second fan favorite - if not the most liked, even. Are we really going to pretend these aspects aren’t attracting and appealing to female readers? Am I really the only one seeing readers drool and squeal whenever OX publishes chapters featuring shirtless HT, moments of tender gay affection, or illustrations of suggestive poses (homoerotic or otherwise)? Is OX doing it intentionally to appeal to female readers? No one but OX can answer to that, but does it really matter? I don’t think it changes the end result; it attracts largely females and I’m sure many of them are avid consumers of BL, too.

I don’t think this has escaped OX, either. A couple of times by now, the comic has made references to BL genre, girls being fans of cute guys together and how that kind of material attracts the female attention (ch. 151, 295, and 296):

(Sorry for the cencor, but Tumblr wouldn’t let me post this otherwise...)

Those moments can basically be taken both as OX making light of the genre and the comic being self-aware. 19 Days makes funny metafictional references while also utilizing the BL conventions itself. It’s also a clever way if the author wants to take a stand on how their work is different from its predecessors in the same genre. Because I think 19 Days is quite one of a kind compared to other BL publications. And it has sparked conversations regarding the BL conventions, for example, ukes vs. semes. It can do all that and still be a BL as such that it appeals to females or fans of the genre in general.

Now, does any of that mean 19 Days can’t appeal to other kinds of fans, too? Of course, not! In fact, you yourself dear anon-san, are an excellent example of that. I think 19 Days is one of the few Asian BL comics that has attracted countless of Western fans, too, who are perhaps not that familiar with Asian BL. It should also be noted that m/m ships are hugely popular in the Western fandoms, too. They are just more tied to the original works and not really separated to become a genre of its own as has happened with BL in Asia, especially in Japan. As it happens, the stats of the Top 100 Ships on AO3 in 2019 were just published the other day, and whopping 69 of them are slash aka m/m. Do you think that is completely unrelated to the fact that fanfiction is mostly written and read by females? I’m not saying it’s the only reason because it’s more complicated than that, but it certainly indicates Western female audiences are also big fans of homoerotic content. And they, too, are often accused of “making everything gay”.

I also don’t have a problem admitting this: If 19 Days didn’t have homoerotic themes whatsoever and the boys were having crushes on females, I doubt I would have been interested in the comic. The other themes I mentioned above are interesting to me, but on their own and paired up with m/f endgame relationships they wouldn’t be enough for me. I don’t read 19 Days just for the gay content, but it is a significant reason why I originally checked it out and why I keep loving it. Personally, I don’t think being attracted to the gay aspect and loving the story and characters, too, has to be an either-or kind of deal. You can very well do both. Does saying this somehow make me less of a fan of 19 Days? I’m sure it does in some people’s eyes but frankly, I don’t need other’s approval to love and be interested in something.

So far, I have pretty much disagreed with everything you said, but allow me to offer you an olive branch, dear anon-san. I get why my BL-related notions may have upset you. I get where you are coming from with saying 19 Days isn’t a “fetish for women”. You don’t want something you love to be associated with something you clearly despise. Yaoi and fujoshis have a bad rep, and I’m not trying to pretend like it’s completely underserved. I read a lot of BL but don’t really agree with the hardcore fujoshi mentality or identify with them as a group. I also think BL works have many tropes and conventions that do not represent realistic gay relationships and are highly problematic. However, BL is a fictional genre with its own history, development, conventions, and target audience. And as an avid BL reader, I think just because something appeals to me in a fictional setting it doesn’t mean I’m advocating the same things in real life.

To be honest, talking about this kind of makes my stomach twist with dread and nerves because I realize many people might get upset over this. And putting yourself in this kind of position on Tumblr especially can be a bit risky. So, let me say it once again: People are welcome to disagree with me or think I’m as wrong as humanly possible. And I would most probably understand where they are coming from. However, I would also like to remind anyone feeling angry with me that this is just me coming from a different point of view. Just like you are, dear anon-san. As far as I’m concerned, you are free to enjoy 19 Days from your own perspective and me from mine without it having to mean we’re somehow robbing each other of something.

[kob131]

https://itsclydebitches.tumblr.com/post/618318137188876288/1-one-of-the-biggest-draws-of-rwby-to-me-was-its

One of the biggest draws of RWBY to me was its reputation. “Excellent plot and great LGBT rep.” As you’ve discussed there’s issues with the former. I now doubt the latter. I don’t have a stake in LGBT rep personally but I really wanted to cheer on a show that provided that. But this volume touched on IronQrow and Fair Game - without actually delivering. The Bees might be a slow burn, but it’s been seven years for those watching from the beginning and they haven’t kissed.

“Touched on” AKA “I decided to take platonic gestures of affection as romantic now the creators have to do as I say or else”. There was nothing explictedly romantic.

“Fiona/Robyn interaction” What interaction?

“Nora is literally wearing the flag” No she has a similar color scheme, that does NOT translate to ‘wearing the flag.’

“Penny has a great trans story” No, you just see an interpretation. Penny was not built to be trans and should not be used as such.

“She’s a fascinating character to have in the background-” She’s a background character. Her being LGBT does not give the character the right to become a major player.

“Illa has her own issues” Let me guess. “Psycho Lesbian” right?

This whole bullshit of the main cast needing an LGBT character is a perfect example of demands of the show. First it was just a background character then it was a minor character then it was a supporting character now it’s a major character. All while you try to act like you never get what you want.

“It comes off as-” No, you want to see it that way. ‘It comes off as-’ is just a way of shifting the blame.

I don’t think you’re wrong and this is all precisely what I’ve messily attempted to point out for a while. It’s 2020 and it’s no longer enough to simply stand by the statement, “We have LGBTQIA characters.” Because “have characters” can mean anything. Characters who speak two lines. Characters who are written out of the plot. Characters who only exist in side stories. Characters who were never an integral part of this tale to begin with. At this point I feel like it’s easy to emphasize RWBY’s seemingly impressive numbers - Ilia! Coco! Saphron! Terra! May! Scarlet! Blake! Yang! Omg that’s so many!! - and ignore the context of each character. Ilia is gone. Coco is gone and her queer identity only exists outside of the web series. Saphron is gone. Terra is gone. May’s identity only exists in a tweet. Scarlet is gone. Blake and Yang aren’t canon, no matter how obvious the intentions might seem. None of that reads as particularly good when you’ve got a cast of ten main characters last volume - not including Winter, Ironwood, and Penny - and conveniently none of them are confirmed as queer. So far (and “so far” is all we have to work from) queerness has been regulated to minor characters, background characters, and characters who were never meant to stick around. That might be “good” by other shows’ standards, but not for a show that hangs its hat on that supposedly excellent rep. I might not like that most shows don’t include queer characters, but I have more respect for a show that straight up doesn’t engage with that than I do a show like RWBY that’s constantly talking it up in tweets, cons, etc. with the expectation of praise and then delivers something remarkably subpar. 

Yeah, thing is-

That ‘hat’ was given by the fucking fandom. It was never given by the actual creators and makers of the show. It’s not their responsibility to give you something tat other people promised.

And no, two voice actors having a gay ship does not promise you anything beyond jackshit.

Given that Scarlet is the only “canon” (I use that term incredibly loosely) queer man in this list, we have that additional problem of how the show’s writing intersects with the desire for m/m rep. In many ways RWBY was meant to be a “strong female character” show, but they’ve taken that in such an extreme direction that at this point we barely have any characters to get that rep from and what few we do are having their relationships with other men obliterated. Everyone currently hates Ozpin, most notably Qrow. Qrow helped get Clover killed. Qrow now hates Ironwood. Oscar is a kid. Who else is left to provide that rep? Jaune and Ren? Both have relationships with women and, to be frank, I can’t see RT choosing to write one of them as bi, pan, demi, or ace. It could happen! But I doubt it. 

And Ozpin is kind of shown to be sympathetic. Qrow’s most popular gay ship isn’t even with Ironwood or Clover, it’s Taiyang. So? puberty. 

And to be frank- You fuckers have made it perfectly clear a penis cannot exist on screen for too long or else the writers (read: Miles Luna) get pipe bombs in the mail. Anyone defending Ironwood is called a bootlicker, people demand Ozpin be treated as the bad guy over Salem, fucking all the hate around Jaune- You guys set the standard. It’s YOUR fault.

RWBY has queer rep, but it’s incredibly flimsy, insubstantial queer rep. Worse, every time we get a hint of something more substantial it’s snatched away. It’s not RT’s fault that the fandom blew up with the trans Nora theory, but they are responsible for not thinking through the implications of her new outfit and failing to provide a backstory that was promised. It’s not RT’s fault that the fandom fell in love with Qrow/Clover, but they are responsible for their animators making their relationship deliberately flirty and various members egging the fandom on through social media. RT is indeed allowed to write a slow-burn queer relationship, but they’re still responsible for prioritizing that during a time when there are no other queer characters to engage with, during a time period where fans are still terrified of queer baiting. And if the response to that is, “But there’s May too” then we need to acknowledge how making a background character with two lines in an otherwise MASSIVE cast the only trans character, and the currently only confirmed queer character on screen, feels like receiving insulting crumbs at an overstuffed buffet. 

By ‘snatched away’ you mean’ give me my yaoi or else’ right?

‘It’s not RT’s fault-’ That’s it. When you started saying that, you should have ENDED it there.

The Nora thing shouldn’t have implications: it’s got all the colors she usually has on her ever since Volume 4. It’s just matching character desisgn. The Qrow/Clover thing was not flirty, it was just bonding. 

And really, you guys don’t even deserve the ‘crumps’ you get. You constantly push back your standards to demand more and more. You stick an obligation for rep on a show that never advertised it aside A SINGLE character. You throw fits if the LGBT character HAS a character (Illa) then throw fits when they don’t (May). And frankly, I’m certain most of you aren’t even LGBT: you’re just fetshists or activists.

You want to make it fucking impossible to give you food? Fine, starve then. It’s what you deserve.

[no-longer-tainted]

Soukoku not having any love interest for one another was always interesting to me. Like it seems like the possibly of having Soukoku canon isn’t far fetched. Just reading that one ask about the Atsushi pairings I read that Kunikida (the real writer) was married to some women for 5 months but the anime never got into that pairings even though it happened in real life.

I always thought the same with Soukoku having no love interest like Shin-Soukoku has- especially after Asagiri telling that Chuuya was created to be a counterpart for Dazai! (I’m not exactly sure about the wording anymore but it was something like that)

So yes, with that it isn’t that far fetched- to use your words! Tho- with that I also always wonder if Soukoku would be as popular as it is right now as a hetero couple (or yuri) because I love them for their dynamics and not for being “yaoi” 

But dear anon-san, do you really want to split the fandom? The only two outcomings I can see with Soukoku becoming official/canon in a romantic way is the happy (read: dying) Soukoku Fanbase vs the “it got canon only because it’s popular and makes money” guys :c 

And this makes me really sad. 

Everyone should enjoy the story because of the plot and not judging it by a couple. I always have to think about the Tokyo Ghoul Mangaka who got threats because of making a hetero couple canon and not the popular yaoi shipping (getting called homophobic for it) 

However, like I already mentioned in the Atsushi post, I think - be it Soukoku or any other couple, we will only get it hinted. (At least with the flow of the story right now! ^^ We will never know what they plan with future arcs)

With Kunikida- Asagiri isn’t following their lives exactly! He changes relationships and takes characteristics but doesn’t copy them completely. You could say, he makes a fanfiction of the authours. 

I’m not sure if I could bring my thoughts down right but to finish this little post with positivity:

There is nothing I would love more than to get them canon but I do love the story completely- I love the characters, the good and bad ones, I love the arcs and how they develop, BSD is my favorite series and I’m happy I can enjoy it through my blog- even it’s heavily Soukoku invested! ^3^