#i have a lot of thoughts but i hated s3 as a whole

[atlanticsea]

LMFAO. anyways i'm so sorry to sam for being a victim of a hate crime and this storyline not being given the gravity it deserved, i'm so sorry to shandy for being brought in just to be an edwin 2.0 because it's apparently hilaaaarious when characters of colour become unreasonable and make poop jokes i guess, i'm so sorry to edwin who went from being an african man aware of the ridiculousness of his wealth and of the way he could help african players get recognition in their home countries to a man only interested in making white men richer (and a sidenote sorry to sam richardson who is a fantastic actor and deserved a lead actor nomination for his role in the afterparty), i'm so sorry to simi who was seemingly just brought in to make rebecca briefly jealous, i'm so sorry to sharon who was barely present, i'm so sorry to shannon who fully disappeared with one last little cameo where you couldn't even see her face, i'm so sorry to nate's family and lloyd in particular for not being centered in nate's growth because it was apparently better to bring in a manic pixie dream girl to literally force him to go back to richmond, and i'm so, SO sorry to nate who had so much potential and was played by a fantastic actor but did not get to have some of his biggest moments on screen and was forced to go back to richmond not even as a kitman, but as an assistant to the kitman, with none of his concerns ever being addressed, because he doesn't matter here: he's only present to further ted's good guy reputation. i'm so so sorry to every character of colour in this fucking show that got treated so horrendously and i'm so glad they're free now

[toutvatoujoursbien]

A (relatively new-ish) fan’s perspective on Luke Newton

(I wrote my very first Tumblr post last month and now I think I’ve chosen the path of essayist/suffering. I’ve also been writing this on and off for four weeks because it seems like every other day, something new pops up or the fandom has a meltdown of some kind. I’m not even sure if it’s worth posting, but I think, like my first one, I needed to get this out of my system in order to TRY and return to being a normal person - which is still unlikely because Lukola has me in a chokehold. NOTE: I finished the majority of this on July 19, before all the weird-ass stuff happened over the weekend, and haven’t had the chance to post until now. Anyway, this is going to be long, full of ramblings that are hopefully organized in a cohesive manner, and all opinions and observations are my own. I have a lot of thoughts and feelings, okay?)

I’ve really struggled to understand why the whole Bridgerton S3 and Luke Newton PR stunt has embedded itself into my brain the way it has. Like, how could the actions of someone I don’t know still be lingering in my thoughts even now, weeks later? After my first post, I realized that there was more to the entire LN situation than I was previously unaware of - so I started digging. None of this information is hidden or secret, it was publicly available and therefore the fans picked up on it quickly. But I, personally, DID NOT KNOW ANY OF IT, going into S3, and I think that’s why everything has hit me like a ton of bricks. So I thought, surely I’m not the only new(ish) fan who has suffered from this emotional and mental whiplash? 

I really, really, really loved Luke’s portrayal of Colin and I’ve thoroughly enjoyed watching all the interviews and behind-the-scenes from S3. I would also love to continue to support him as he builds his acting career. However, I didn’t have a full picture, which unfortunately includes a history of making - what I think are - poor and questionable decisions in his personal life that he also allowed to bleed into his professional one. And that’s how I find myself struggling with the dichotomy of everything I’ve seen him do during Bridgerton promo vs. lots of other actions he’s taken. So let’s talk about it, okay? (Importantly, I reserve the right to update my current opinions as more information comes to light.)

I want it to be clear that I am in no way hating on Luke. Part of my struggle with writing this post has been because I don’t want this to be misconstrued as more hate being thrown his way. That is not my intention, at all. Seeing “fans” over the past few weeks absolutely rip into him on social media has been heartbreaking and deeply unsettling. This type of behavior is ugly and nasty and no one should be subjected to it. Full stop. As others have said: it’s okay to have thoughts and criticisms (criticism ≠ hate), but please keep it to the appropriate corners of the Internet. I think you can admire/support a famous person, but you should also be able to call them out on their conduct, particularly the stuff that happens in public. Blind love/following and putting people on pedestals is never going to allow any room for reflection and/or growth. I think there is a LOT of nuance in the whole discussion around him, his past actions, his handling of things now, and what’s in store for the future.

Okay, deep breaths & continue after the cut (because this got… wordy).

Some brief background on how I got here: As noted previously, I’ve been a longtime fan of both Polin and Bridgerton, first with the book series and then with the tv show. But, for whatever reason, I never even thought about jumping into the fandom until earlier this year, in anticipation of Season 3. I will say that I have been delighted with Nicola and Luke and their work as Polin from the start, but with the nature of the show being what it is, I just didn’t pay as much attention until it was their turn to lead. I watched some behind the scenes and promos occasionally, but not consistently. It wasn’t until around the February/Valentine’s event that I started to take notice and then I fell down the rabbit hole in April (literally, figuratively, and spiritually 😅). I say all this to illustrate that up until the spring, I was part of the General Audience, though admittedly with a bias towards viewing Bridgerton favorably.  Another factor is that I got most of my fandom content from Twitter (again, I’m never going to call it X), with the occasional peek into Instagram and Tumblr. Yes, Twitter is a hellscape. But I am also lazy and only have so much time to scroll online. And since everything seems to get cross-posted everywhere, it was easiest for me to keep mostly to one social media site to consume all my Bridgerton content. But I point this out because I now see this as an error on my part. Why? Because I wasn’t getting a well-rounded picture of the situation around L, N and S3. Remember my own self-admitted social media bubble? Sigh. The fast pace of tweets meant I could blink-and-miss something on Twitter, unless it trended (or really riled the fans up). It’s a breeding ground for the hyperbolic and for discourse, in general. Twitter also seems to be divided into the Luke Haters (let’s be real, most of their “reasoning” is just uncalled for, vile hate) and the Luke Apologists (who have the tendency to exhibit, imo, some gross-excuse-all-his-behaviors-he-never-does-anything-wrong rhetoric). So it wasn’t until I started noticing chatter of Luke’s past actions that it prompted me to start looking deeper into what others have witnessed and noted online, particularly on this platform. Again, it wasn’t like I was trying to find some sort of hush-hush subject matter. Instead, I rather got the impression that those established in the fandom had a sort of unspoken agreement to keep these discussions to DMs and group chats - mostly as to not detract from Polin’s upcoming season. (But seriously, great of y’all to keep it locked down, however it would have really helped a girl out all the times I was like, “why is everyone so mad?” 🤣) And a lot of things started clicking into place once I knew more of the details. So I’ve put together a list of high-level topics/points that I didn’t know before, being relatively new to the fandom. Perhaps this can help other fans who are trying to wrap their heads around the various discussions occurring now and may feel clueless.

One more thing, HUGE shout-out to @jack4132cf for giving me a concise timeline of… well, everything I apparently missed last year+ when I wasn’t part of the fandom 😆🙌🏼 They’ve really helped me fill in the blanks (of which I had many)! Also, darcytaylor has a great 3-part deep dive, and I’ve read (and backtracked) through most of herejusttosufferalong and allsortsofthingsmpov ’s blogs, among others. They’ve provided a place for differing opinions and perspectives to be voiced in a respectful manner (unless you’re a troll, in which any clap-back is justified). I may not agree with everyone’s take, but I firmly believe that hearing views from others has helped shape my own thought process.

Let’s begin, shall we?

The Hot Fuck Boy Summer™️ (which I’m trademarking as HFBS)

Bridgerton S3 wrapped up filming in March 2023 and then Luke starred in the play The Shape of Things, which was in production from around May-July 2023. At some point prior to all this, Luke and his previous gf broke up - this is reported on by several media outlets in March, as well as “news” that he joined the dating app Raya. This is where, I think, his questionable behavior starts to raise eyebrows. It’s not the fact that he’s dating - I feel like fans gave him a pass since he just ended a long-term relationship (Enter the mentality some had of “let him have his hot boy summer!”). No, I think the issue is that he was not at all private or discreet about it. 

Remember when I said I think he let choices in his personal life bleed over into his professional one? Yeah, there were multiple glaring examples happening in real time last year, and the fandom took notice. He started publicly following certain users on IG and liking their posts, (unfortunately) many of whom were young, female models and dancers, under the age of 23. He (foolishly) followed his private account on his public profile, and then tried to backpedal. He engaged with some online flirtations that didn’t sit well with the fans (cough, E. Bear, cough), and then tried to backpedal. Mind you, all of this occurred and at some point later on, it’s then also decided that he’s going to move (aka, clean up) his social media presence to be more work-related. My point is:

Luke was digitally messy and left a trail (several, really). 

In conjunction with the HFBS, we also have:

& That Friend Group

Ah yes, the “boys.” Look, clearly I don’t know his friend group in real life, so all I can speak on is the image they give off based on their public social media accounts. And I, personally, am very unimpressed with what they’ve chosen to share with the world. My general perception is that L’s group of friends love to have a good time and show it off; seem to have an large amount of influence over him, particularly R; and can been seen as reaping the benefits of his success. He has discussed before how he likes to be generous with his friend group. During HFBS, they posted all about their vacations, on public accounts, and tagged Luke in them. They posted thirst trap photos and tagged Luke in them. They took quite a few boat trips and, once again, tagged Luke in them. Are we sensing a pattern here?

His friend group was also digitally messy and left trails.

I am in no way saying his friends aren’t allowed to post whatever they want on their accounts. It’s totally within their rights to have a good time and capture it on their pages, and I completely understand the desire to only show the “memorable” and “fun” stuff on social media. I just think it was short-sighted to NOT consider that Luke’s fans would be interested in seeing what he was up to with his friends - and you know that people will always, always dig around on the Internet. Maybe this was some kind of fun game to them? Maybe they enjoyed the attention? Maybe they didn’t think it was that big a deal? Who knows? But I think, in hindsight, it would have been safer and smarter to not have all this documented and out in the open, imo. 

My other understanding is that around the time the break up was “officially announced,” Luke’s ex began dating someone who was 22/23 at the time. His childhood friend R also ended a relationship last year and began dating a young woman around 22/23. Do I think R may have encouraged Luke in a certain direction dating-wise, especially considering that A was/is a friend of S, R’s new gf? Do I wonder if this was all to get back at J for starting a relationship with a new young thing, too? It seems likely, but of course this is all conjecture on my part. This is giving “high school drama” vibes, being played out in public, which is very, very  unfortunate.

However, Luke was ultimately the person who did not ask his friends to refrain from posting him on social media, as well as publicly following young women on socials and not being very discreet about his dating life, which is what raises my eyebrows…

The Age Gap Thing

Let’s just address this here and now. Remember, these are my opinions, each individual is entitled to their own, and I hope everyone takes a moment to really think and evaluate how they feel about the matter! I’m going to be very transparent and upfront about this:

I do not like the age gap between L and many of the young women he was showing interest in last year.

I’m viewing this from the lens of someone who is an elder Millennial and female. For me, personally, my dislike has more to do with: 1) A's age when they started dating/the age she is now (22/23); but more specifically 2) the power dynamics at play. 

I don’t have a problem with age gaps overall, because I believe that love can find us at many stages in life. However, I’m also of the opinion that a person 30+ should not be dating a someone in their early 20s. I’m not going to use the whole “the brain hasn’t been fully developed” argument, though valid. My issue has more to do with where an individual is in terms of life experience, emotional and overall maturity, and (this ties in with #2) financial stability within age gaps. In general, I find, say, a 45-year-old dating a 37-year-old to be on more even footing, which becomes even more so as you age. But a 22-year-old, presumably fresh out of college/university and about to embark on their next steps into adulthood, is just not in a position to date someone in their 30s. To me, your early 20s are the time for you to gain all the things I mentioned above (life experience, maturity, financial stability that is independently your own) as well as make plenty of mistakes. And that’s not to say any of that stops once you hit 30, or beyond! I know I’m constantly evolving and learning more about myself and my place in the world as each year passes.

My deeper discomfort comes from the inherent power dynamics and power imbalance between L/A. Of course L has lot more of the power in terms of money, resources and status; they are not equal partners. This article here (https://jill.substack.com/p/the-problem-with-men-who-date-much) illustrates these points much better than I can; I think it’s worth the read. 

Is he allowed to date whomever he so chooses? Yes. Are people allowed to feel the ick with the current choice/choices he made last year? Also yes. Does it entitle anyone to post nasty comments on his social media? Absolutely not. I may not personally like his choice, but it’s ultimately his to make. 

NOTE: I also want to address right here that, to me, his behavior isn’t “predatory” or whatever twisted narrative some folks are trying to push. Honestly, I think he’s gone the complete opposite direction from the type of women his ex and N are because it might be less complex/more simple both in terms of emotions and permanence. But obviously, pure speculation on my part. 

Antagonistic A

At some point during HFBS, L meets A and she becomes a part of That Friend Group. During Fall 2023, there are many trips to Soho Farmhouse and other posts made to R/S/A’s social media accounts. A in particular made quite a few posts that could be interpreted as her wanting to show she was with L, but never actually including him fully (these are the arms/legs photos that fans talk about and side-eye). Some of these types of posts have since been conveniently deleted. L and That Friend Group celebrate NYE24 at Soho Farmhouse, where everyone but him share photos and videos. On Jan 2, a photo of L and A kissing was circulated on social media -  they got caught in the video of the band playing. Also at the beginning of this year, A - for whatever fucking reason - started tagging along on various work trips and had a tendency to post TikTok’s from various hotel bathrooms. Again, insinuating that she’s with L but not outright showing it. 

The “InStyle stunt” - end of March/early April, there is a trip to Los Angeles which A posted stories and photos on IG. It’s later revealed that L was going to be featured in InStyle Magazine’s “This Guy” series, which included an interview, video and photoshoot, as well as an IG post that consisted of several polaroid, “boyfriend-style” pictures. The Instyle polariods were released three weeks after A’s posts, and let’s just say that A’s are a little too on the nose to be coincidence (also cue more hand/leg reveals…) Please note, again, that some of these photos on A’s account have been conveniently deleted/removed.

These are only a few examples of how… messy this all is and how it can be viewed as her antagonizing the fans. There is a lot of back and forth debate between “just leave her alone, she’s allowed to post what she wants” against “she’s clearly using social media to taunt the fandom/get attention/chase clout/etc.” When I finally learned about all the social media games being played, I just felt really unsettled for a few reasons.

Luke has stated that he wishes to keep his private life more private (see: social media clean-up from last fall). But, and this is my big issue here, A and That Friend Group don’t seem to WANT to be private. So to me, that can push people to question how much does he know what’s actually going on (he admits to not being online much) and, more importantly, how complicit is he with all of their postings? I personally feel like the narrative being pushed by his friends is very self-serving, and doesn’t seem like it’s in L’s best interest or protecting his privacy. Because I think we all know and understand that if a celebrity wants to keep certain things private, they have the money and resources to do so - some good examples that come to mind are Ryan Gosling and Eva Mendes, Benedict Cumberbatch, Dolly Parton, and our girl Nicola herself.

A has made it a pattern to post shortly after either Nicola or the main Bridgerton account posts something, usually on IG or TT; there is timely evidence of this. So much so that the fandom jokes about how obsessed she must be with N. And these posts don’t really have much substance - other than to show off her body or her latest vacation. It just all comes off as very insecure and seeking attention, whether it’s from L or from the public in general. Again, why do we feel the need to play social media games? But this does not mean she deserves hateful comments either. I personally don’t care for her or her actions, but as an older female, I also can’t help but be saddened by the fact that she’s making many, many poor choices in a very public forum. I can’t help but wonder if she’s going to have regrets later on when/if she reflects back on this time. 

The PR Stunt/Papgate

This has been dissected by the fandom to death and there are a plethora of theories on who exactly was responsible for calling the paparazzi, who knew what was actually going to happen, WHY did this occur, and how much did this impact the season and the press tour overall. It’s enough to make anyone’s head spin - hell, I’ve changed my opinion at least a dozen times over the past several weeks. Regardless, the thing that aggravates me the most about the whole thing is the absolutely terrible and suspicious timing of it. As stated in my previous post: Here’s my point: I think what should have been a moment of triumph and a joyous occasion for Nic, Luke, and Bridgerton season 3, was sadly overshadowed by the aforementioned shitstorm. And that’s a damn shame. Too many cast and crew put in a lot of time, effort, and blood sweat and tears, to pull this all together.

I’m still personally stuck on a few things: 1) How did paps know when L was leaving the official after party? Additionally, how did they know which hotel L was going to for his after-after party? Because that’s where we got the super awkward handhold attempt photos. 2) Did L know about the first location but not the second one - which ties into was this an attempt by his PR team to distance himself from Bridgerton and Nicola now that promo was almost done? Because the way he looks from location 1 to 2 is vastly different. 3) If paps were there, why was literally NO ONE else from the cast also photographed??? 4) Why has DM double (and tripled) down over the past few weeks on how she got those exclusive photos in the first place? And 5) Who ultimately has benefited the most from this whole PR stunt 🤔??? (Because I sure as hell don’t think it’s Luke…)

The Cinnamon Roll vs The Bad Boy

Luke has stated in several interviews that he’s interested in going for edgier, darker roles. I think that’s great that he wants to try something new and diversify; I would love to see him in whichever type of role interests him! However, he’s also spent 4-5 years playing Colin, a character that is quirky, kind and lovable (much more so on the show, thanks to Luke’s portrayal) and known for being the ultimate “wife guy” amongst the fandom. It’s also been mentioned time and time again that Luke is most like his character (by Luke himself and his Bridgerton cast mates). Nic speaks so highly of him, and the way he presented himself during the 6 months of press was really wonderful; I think he has a deep understanding and love for his role, and he was a genuinely supportive partner to his co-lead during filming. Think golden retriever energy - which is NOT a bad thing, at all!

If there is any truth to the PR stunt being organized by his team (and I’m in no way saying this is fact) as a way to differentiate/disassociate him from Bridgerton/Nicola, then I think this was a miscalculation on their part. We know that Luke did a lot of editorial photoshoots during the promo tour; and looking at the pictures now, it seems like there was definitely a narrative/aesthetic that was trying to be pushed of a more intense, moody and provocative L. Which is also fine! I don’t think he must be one personality or the other; humans are multi-faceted and complex, it’s what makes us so interesting.

The (Ongoing) Fallout

This is really difficult to write about because, honestly, I feel like we’re still witnessing it happening in real time, bit by agonizing bit. What we do know is that at this moment, he hasn’t announced any new projects other than returning for Bridgerton Season 4. He hasn’t announced any major brand deals and we don’t know what his next steps are career-wise. Which is completely baffling to me because I would think he and his team would want to capitalize on the momentum of a very successful season of a Netflix/Shondaland production. However, this is his life and his job, so until he comes forward with literally anything to say (a statement, an announcement, hell, he hasn’t even publicly claimed to have a gf FFS), then everything else is just noise and speculation. As much as I hope he’s not taking another HFBS, I also wouldn’t blame him for wanting to step away from the spotlight. He’s been unfairly dragged and smeared since the Part 2 premiere. Do I think he and his team/friend group have made a some missteps along the way? Yes, but again, no one deserves the nasty comments and vitriol that has been flung his way. 

So How Do We Move Forward?

I keep thinking back to the adage: When someone shows you who they are, believe them.*

And isn’t this the root of my (and perhaps others’) struggle? Because it’s been really difficult to reconcile someone Nicola calls “a true gentleman, the kindest friend, a dream costar” with a man who seemingly (?) goes along with pap walks, Instagram subterfuge, and appears to be distancing himself from the very project and costars that helped propel him into the leading man spotlight. For me personally, I go back to my point that people are multi-faceted and deeply complex. I think Luke can be all of those things; I also think he might be struggling right now to figure out who he is and what he wants next after being scrutinized so heavily.

Also from my first post: We have to remember, though, that what we’re shown is only a fraction of their true selves, carefully and deliberately curated to accommodate their status as actors/celebrities/those in the public eye. 

I choose to believe that we saw glimpses of the real Luke throughout the press tour. (ColinBridgey is a rockstar and compiled everything into a master list for our enjoyment!) I choose to believe Nicola knows Luke a hell of a lot better than almost everyone else yapping in this conversation. I choose to believe that his anxiety and quietness could be perceived as standoffish, and unfortunately he wasn’t able to shine as much as Nicola during the press tour, but they are a team and have each other’s backs - there is genuine love there, after all. I choose to believe that social media posting and likes are not indicative of the actual friendship and relationship between L and N. I would love to see him post more, or be more vocal in publicly thanking Bridgerton and Nicola - however, I realize those are expectations I have/desire and he does not owe me anything. 

I choose to believe that despite the mistakes and missteps, he’s a decent human being who deserves to live his life on his own terms and at his own speed. I really, really hope that whenever he announces his next project, I can be joyful and supportive. There’s a lot of talk about giving him grace, which I agree with. I cannot imagine, nor do I desire to be in the public eye this way; it’s easy for us and others to feel entitled to say things behind our screens and keyboards, but these are real, actual people with lives and feelings.

I do think that it is for the best interest of the fandom to try and ignore A and That Friend Group (and DM) as much as possible. And I will be the first to admit that it is really fucking hard to do so. Like I’ve said before, I try to ignore toxicity and hate, but I am also human and therefore imperfect and capable of pettiness. There is just something about this situation (probably how much Lukola captivated me and how much disdain I have for his friend group) that makes me watch everything play out like it’s a train on fire, careening towards an unfinished bridge, over a ravine. Sometimes I feel bad because I wonder if I’m adding to the entire spectacle with my continued interest. But then I remember that I specifically keep it to this corner of the internet, and I’ve found a nice little community where we can gossip and discuss and dissect it all.

If you’ve made it to the end, thank you. This is just everything I’ve been ruminating over the past month, put into word vomit form. I would looove to hear your thoughts and takes on everything/anything discussed above. Maybe you have a different perspective or noticed something that I missed.

*Fun fact: In my research, I learned that this saying comes from Maya Angelou’s “A Song Flung Up to Heaven” and is actually "Believe people when they tell you who they are. They know themselves better than you.” The more well-known version comes out of an Oprah Winfrey interview with Angelou in 1997, where they were discussing life lessons. Okay, I’ll stop being a nerd now.

[herejusttosufferalong]

I've been a Lukola shipper since last year, and I've been reading all the male POVs. So, I decided to ask the dudes in my life about this whole situation. I talked to some of my male BFFs and my brother. I'll start with what my brother, who's 15 (I'm 19), had to say.

Over the past three days, I showed him most of the interviews, especially the unhinged ones, all the hand-holding clips, Tif's edits, etc. Then I introduced him to the GF and gave him a brief rundown of all the antics - Instyle, NY and London premieres, Deuxmoi, pool pics, Milan, GQ.

Here’s what he thinks:

Luke and Nic LOVE each other. Luke probably loves her more, or maybe she's just better at hiding it. Nic is affectionate towards everyone, so it’s not as apparent. My brother thinks Nic is really funny and obviously beautiful, especially after watching her solo interviews like "9 Things I've Never Tried Before," ASMR, and accents.

Luke is being hot and cold. After I told him about the break after Brasil, he said that makes sense. It seems like whenever Luke goes back to his friends, he comes back acting like a dick. I showed him Luke's hot boy summer phase and the NYE video of them dancing. He said Luke acts like a dick when he's with his friends, especially Rory, who seems like the leader. He even noticed Tom and said Luke should hang out with him more. When I mentioned Rory breaking up with his GF and now dating Sienna (who's 23), he immediately clocked it and said, “Wow, Lukey did the same.” In a very not impressed tone. I couldn't stop laughing.

Nothing happened in Brasil. My brother thinks Nic would never do anything shady. The interviewers and overall vibes of Brasil were super chill, so Luke let himself loose a bit. However Nic seemed the same, maybe a little more giggly.

NY and London premieres:

NY: They looked fine, but Luke seemed pissed for some reason. The hand moment was insane. He thinks the GF blindsided Nic and set up the videos of them hugging, because why aren’t there videos of others?

London: Nic seemed a little wary, and Luke looked downbad. Luke T and Nic either need to work together or date, or both, because they're cute. Simone is definitely a shipper. He also thinks Golda might be a shipper, but she seems to have clocked Luke’s shit and is side-eyeing, which he is too. The Deuxmoi stunt was dumb and embarrassing.

About A, R, and S:

Rory: Luke hangs onto Rory’s every word, so the GF might not be going anywhere as long as she's in the friend group. My brother hates Rory and thinks he's Luke’s constant during the hot boy summer phase. Rory wasn't seen much before that. Other Anons, is this true?

A: A is in the relationship for the perks. The Hailey Bieber cosplay is gross. My brother almost puked when I showed him the thread comparing A and HB’s outfits. A is obviously trolling the fans, which is boring.

S: He doesn’t think there’s anything nefarious going on with S, and it’s good for her that she’s going to Jack M's classes, but it’s weird that it's only happening now.

In conclusion, my brother thinks this whole thing is going to drag on for a lot longer, but that’s a huge maybe since Luke and Nic are coming back for S4. If Luke's friend group manages to infiltrate the sets, it won't matter much because everyone adores Nic and seems protective of her. A is going to stay as long as she can. Right now, my brother hates Luke and thinks he screwed up royally, even as a friend. It’s a bigger deal if there are non-platonic feelings involved. He wants to see Luke make a thank you post for S3, because that's the least he can do. Luke needs to figure his stuff out, and it seems like whenever he's on vacation, things just get worse. Basically, he needs to GET A JOB and things will sort themselves out.

Wow, that was a lot. Never thought my brother would be so mature!

Also can someone clarify if R was still such a huge part of L's life before his HBS?

Damn the 15 yo is smarter than some grown ass folk in the fandom lmao

LOVE x

[i-only-ever-asked-questions]

On the last blow to GO and why we want the 6 episodes

I might get hate for this, I may be completely ignored, I don't know. But I wanted to point out a couple of things.

I have seen a lot of hate towards fans who are sad, disappointed and angry at Amazon for reducing the 3rd season by about 2/3rds (45 min per episode originally) to a home movie. Hate that is unwarranted because you can, in fact, have more than one thought in mind. You can have different feelings about different things at the same time, you can have different feelings about the same thing at the same time, and more importantly you can respect people for having feelings different to yours in response to the same thing. Life is not black and white, humans are not black and white, situations are not black and white, it is more like... shades of gray

So want to remind (or inform) people of why we are so upset and why we want those 6 episodes back

This fandom has been around for 34 years, it has been around since the book came out. It is not 4 years old, it is 34, older than many of the fans have been alive, maybe even you

The fans have known since at least 1991 that there was a sequel planned, that there was a plot and even a title, 668 The Neighbour of the Beast, but nothing happened. The sequel was again brought up in 2005, when a little bit of the plot and the South Downs were revealed, and more hope was built, but again it didn't happen

In 2010 when they decided to make GO a TV show instead of a movie, Terry believed that the whole story could be told at last

In June of 2021, S2 was announced and we learned that since the beginning the idea was to take two seasons to finish the story, where S3 would be the actual plot of the unwritten sequel and S2 would be the bridge between them

S3 is the story that the fandom has been waiting for for 34 years, the story Terry wanted told, the one he had a hand in creating. It was supposed to be the last of his stories to be released into the world

We were told it was bigger than S1 and suddenly it is not. The story that fans have been waiting for 34 years, the one we've been looking forward to see on TV for over 3 years is suddenly taken away. S1 needed 6 episodes to go through it all (5 if you exclude the cold open of Ep3 and the executions in Ep6), S3 was supposed to be bigger than that, the story in S3 was supposed to take a whole 6 episodes to be told and seeing how S1 needed so many hours, a bigger story would need a bit more, not less. So yeah, many of us are upset, many of us have been waiting for a long time, many of us had been hoping for a long time, don't belittle us for that

[cbrownjc]

I'm curious on why do you think Daniel would hate Armand when he recovers his memory... I thought he would resent him or be ashamed of being in love with the guy who tortured him not too long ago (He could maybe even prescribe himself as having Stockholm Syndrome).

I also can't wait to see all the relationships in Dubai in S3, the angst omg

Hi!

So I don't think Daniel is going to recover all of his memories before the start of Season 3. I think he's just going to remember one more thing by the end of the season via one memory, which will reveal that he and Armand -- at some unknown point -- had sex and said "I love you" to each other.

And that is all Daniel is going to remember of his and Armand's relationship -- that they had sex at some point in time and there was an "I love you" exchange (likely during it) and that's it.

And that little bit Daniel remembers is in no way going to tell the whole story of everything. And that is going to be the key as to how and why he'll react the way I think he will.

Because there is no way, IMO, that Daniel would be happy to learn he and Armand were involved with each other like that with only that little bit of info about it all. Especially not after how Daniel has been reacting to just the whole Rashid deception.

Because after learning that Armand might have very well screwed with his mind not just for days, but for who knows how long? And doing so to hide that something like that happened? I think Daniel is going to view it all as Armand lying to him in a HUGE way. No matter what Armand's excuse for it might be.

And now also given the fact that Daniel knows Armand has messed with Louis' mind in the same way too, I don't think that is going to help Armand in any case he might plead about why he did it in Daniel's eyes either. I really do think Daniel going to see it -- at first -- as nothing but manipulation on Armand's part at first. And, as Eric himself said, Daniel doesn't like being bullied.

Now, I'm not saying that Daniel will only see it that way from here on out. But if Season 2 ends with a reveal that they had sex and said "I love you" to each other in the past at some unknown point (and I still think that reveal will be coming in episode 2x08), the first half of Season 3 is going to have Daniel super angry about that, along with some shame too as well of course, I'm sure. Especially because he's not going to have the full context of it all.

But it'll probably take until the middle of Season 3 before Daniel is even willing to hear Armand fully out about it I bet.

And honestly, I think Armand is going to have to deal with a lot of anger coming at him during the first half of Season 3, and not just from Daniel. I fully expect Lestat to be there and, since we know we're getting Lestat's backstory in Season 3 then, if you know that story from The Vampire Lestat, Armand doesn't exactly cover himself in glory during the events there either. Heck, Louis already alluded to the hands thing with Nicki in this very episode.

So yeah, Daniel won't be the only one angry at Armand for a time at the start of Season 3 IMO, but I do think he will be. And what Daniel will very likely hear wrt Lestat's backstory isn't going to help things in that regard either I bet, coupled with the fact that his memory of their time together as lovers will only be remembering one fleeting moment and that's all.

Daniel won't yet have his full memory of everything regarding him and Armand together going into Season 3; not for a (long) while IMO. And so missing a lot of context is going to inform Daniel's first and immediate reaction to learning it, IMO.

[quirkle2]

i'm sad so im gonna talk about dimple in the anime world domination arc and how he makes me a little ill

besides the divine tree arc, bc that's obviously where he rly shines, i think the wd arc is where we see the most Genuine Dimple. we see him just earnestly helping out any way he can during this whole thing, doing his absolute best to keep mob alive and anybody the kid cares about to boot. and Yeah, he has a motive to help the kid bc he's trying to earn his trust to manipulate him, but he Knows mob trusts him already (see mogami arc). he doesn't have to keep this up. i dont think dimple even has any of that on his mind at the time.

there's a couple lines in this arc from dimple that feel like they come straight from his soul and i never stop thinking about them. i'll talk about The Scene in a minute but

when they meet up with reigen and the others in the hideout, dimple does not have to say "let him rest, i'll fill you in," but he does. when mob is unconscious and vulnerable dimple does not have to protect him, but he does. when mob is fighting minegishi dimple does not have to stay—hell, when mogami shows up, somebody that dimple seems very afraid of, he does not have to stay, but he does. and when mob goes up that tower to confront serizawa and toichiro, dimple accompanies him, not rly bc reigen asks him to, but bc he seemed like he was planning on it from the start with that little "i know i know" that sounds so halfheartedly bothered

he doesn't have to do really Anything that he does in wd arc, and yet he's there and helping, and while you can argue that a lot of it might've been done just to keep mob alive and dimple in his favor, i think the majority of it was instinctual and real

mogami arc seemed like a turning point for dimple and mob's relationship, bc mob truly and completely put his life and wellbeing into dimple's hands and dimple's hands alone. dimple cracks some joke abt his uglier intentions and mob simply stares and says "i'm sure it'll be fine," and dimple visibly does not know how to react to this. like reigen says later: this is the first time somebody has put so much trust in him. dimple has No Idea what to do w this, and the sheer kindness of it makes him hesitate to take advantage of the kid

the fact that dimple is able to possess mob at all during wd arc goes against what we've been told before about espers and their mental barriers, which (and i believe this is touched on in the manga w more explanation but i haven't read it) shows just how much trust mob has in dimple. his mental barriers are already off 24/7 for the guy. dimple could probably possess him whenever the fuck he wanted

Something changed in dimple's mind between mogami arc and wd arc, and that's further proven by a line of his in s3. it's been a while since i've watched this part so correct me if i'm wrong but i think dimple says smth about forgetting that his original goal had been to become god. that he lost sight of that somewhere along the way, and just stopped thinking about it. even during divine tree arc, toward the end, he says smth about "has being around the unmotived shigeo caused me to lose sight of my goals and ambitions?" at some point dimple just completely dropped that goal and started being a genuine friend w no ulterior motives. started embracing that trust he's been given, and not letting it go to waste

yes, dimple half-lied to calm him down after the fire, but he tells reigen that he has reason to believe what he said was true. and when reigen comments that mob would hate him if he Knew he lied, dimple's reaction is Genuine Remorse. that face is not one of "damn my evil schemes r falling apart. aw drat" or "ohmy god i'm going to be exorcised" that is the face of a guy who feels real and honest regret and guilt over even the Thought of his friend hating him. that is a guy who shrinks into himself at the idea of mob not calling him a friend anymore

and so.when mob runs to his parents' room and That Scene happens, dimple's first and genuine response is to scream at mob to look away, shigeo! look away! protecting the kid, protecting his innocence, bc no kid should have to look at something so horrible, and dimple Cares about this kid. he doesn't know when he started caring, but he cares now, and in a dire situation like this, dimple's knee-jerk reaction is to comfort and protect this boy, not take advantage of him. do u understand how important this scene is to me.

this rly has nothing to do w the story itself but i am an English Dub Enjoyer and dimple's va is Outstanding, especially when he voices that look away, shigeo! look away! it sounds so panicked, so desperate—there's rly nothing in the rest of the show that sounds quite like it bc it's so horribly despairing and pleading. he just wants shigeo to look away, to not stare at his family's burning faces. it's a devastatingly raw command that burns just like the walls do. that line and its delivery is so haunting to me

[unfortunate17]

Hate how some ppl are saying it shouldn’t have been a big deal for Simon to delete his accounts and lay low for Wille. Yeah sure that’s probably what’s expected for the crown prince’s partner, but wasn’t s3’s whole point ‘why should he have to? Why should Wilhelm have to?’ You want a queer king to revolutionise the monarchy but want that monarchy to operate exactly as it always has?

It’s not even that he hated all the attention! He loved being appreciated for his music, he was so happy that boy in bjarstad looked up to him, he thought that if Wille had to start a foundation, he could do some good for a cause he believed in. Yeah they’ll probably always still be in the public eye, but I think with time and support Simon could make peace with that, if he got to handle it in a way that fits his values and lets both him and Wille thrive (this is how pop star Simon can still win). IMO the issue was the royal court and Wille’s own issues leaving him out in the cold, with no idea how to deal with the hate except to “ignore it”

No you’re so right 👏

Honestly I’ve always felt that Simon and Wilhelm both have very “small” dreams. I actually kind of disagree with the pop star Simon agenda (but I also don’t fully disagree with it I think it can work depending on the context), but yeah he loved the positive attention 😭

I see a lot of people who keep saying that abdication wouldn’t solve all of Wilmon’s problems but they’re kind of missing the point?

Like yes Wilmon will always have to live with scrutiny and probably security, but they’ll be free to live how they choose. Wille can cut his hair how he likes, he can get tattoos, paint his nails, move out of the country, choose not to have children, get married however he likes - or not get married, dress how he likes, develop his own interests without wondering how the public is going to perceive him, etc. Simon can post on social media however he likes - they’ll have no reason to hide behind outdated ideas of respectability or tradition.

They’ll be free in all the ways that matter.

I also want to point out that the last thing Wilhelm says to his parents is that he loves them and the queen lets him go. It’s very much implied that Wille’s going to repair his relationship with his parents and it’s probably going to be a lot healthier now that he can be himself

[the-chessboard-is-personal]

ii s3 liveblog

I'm a bit sad rn so sorry if my reactions are bad this time

1 - I'm not supposed to relate to Balloon am I. y'know. the guy that did something bad in the recent past and now everyone hates them even though they're trying to change.. sigh. wHAT? h. how is he here?? HOW IS SHE HERE??? ...does MePhone look different from how he was in the first half of s2? it's been a bit since I watched that but I swear there's something different about him. oh, new intrthe island is alive. warp pipe.

2 - yup sure :) 👍 right okay BOW is glitching now. something to do with chairs and maybe she lost her memories? she was obsessed with chairs before she died, so..oh fuck I'm taking as many notes as Cabby huh

3 - oh I thought I had something to say about this one. sorry

4 - if the floor gets eliminated, how will that work? .yo WHAT is going on with candleMUMBO JUMBO CATCHPHRASE ... I. I don't think that's what polishing a screen does.?

5 - what if Box wins lol ..oh. wait there was no formal elimination, I guess that got replaced with Box being pulled this episode

6 - them ,,,,,they,both of them,, the cool(s) -> ☯

7 - well call me a camera because [screenshots the auras file]. . . . . . . . . . a. ..nobody knows about this joke yet but if I had a- uh. nickel. for every time a series I know about had a character named Bow with trigger words, I would have two nickels. which isn't a lot, but it's weird that it happened twice what is going on with Bow and chairs. HEY MARSHMALLOW TOO?? yes I will keep doing this strikethrough bit

8 - oh fuck I just realized. "iii" as in Inanimate Insanity Invitational but also as in 3 (roman numeral) because it's season 3. also just based on the title I have a bad feeling about this episode (<-half-right??) wait WHAT. MePhone what the fuck does that rnean. whhaaAAAA- oh. agdjhk s ghdclod damn it the commercial is pLOT RELEVANT. hhhhey quick question. how uh. how do we know that everyone's back in the right body..? like. there were some characters who weren't onscreen after they all died again. uhh

9 - th. this episode is probably not like. actually worse than the other ones or anything. but, with the bias I had already formed because I distrust people with the name of the one this episode is a collab with, some stress I was already feeling today before even starting this liveblog, something Balloon said at around 9:14, said pre-liveblog stress making me associate the whole "animation machine" thing (which is seen as bad) with something I like but everyone else hates, I personally have nothing good to say about it.

10 - why is Cabby gold. oh it's whoever has the Immunity Cookie. wait did Cabby forget about TBD because her file was burned??

11 - bat? pokemon. the game you're thinking of is pokemon. wait did he say backstab HOW DOES HE KNOW CANDLE SAW BETRAYAL?? ..yeah I was wondering how that would work

12 - I knew it. I knew Cabby would forget stuff that isn't in a file! urghhh can they Please vote out silver spoon already. he's not gonna WIN, right?? sorry. but I don't like him.

13 - oh the intro reflected Bot's change in appearance. neat! nononoononoNONOONNO GAUhokay. listen I know it's probably not going to happen but I really want YinYang to win. and holy shit that "for the rest of your life" was foreshadowing.

14 - okay off to a start that makes me want to punch something. okay. okay. it's not a real ad. good. HUH HE GLITCHED holy shit, damn uzumaki lookin rooms what is this /positive(?) ☯ 👈 GRIAN INSTINCT (which. to be fair, mood). p u r p l e . PURPLE ACKNOWLEDGED. WHAT WAS THAT! ohhh what the hell. you fuck off this INSTANT you silver shitface. ohh I hate him. I hate him more than I hate Cobs. ..does Cabby not have parents? SPLRINGY IS FAKE. SPRINGY IS A ROBOT OR SOMETHING MADE BY COBS I'M CALLING IT NOW. please please please kill the spoon kill the spoon plEASE- ARRGHHH

15 - seeing as the next episode has Blueberry in the thumbnail and is called The Great Bluish Bake Off, I have a slight prediction on who will win the rejoin. wait what. yeah I'm gonna be honest I don't think it was murder. NO NONONOONO DON'T NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO WAUGHHH,,,,,

16 - why....why am I finding Nickel so relatable. w h a t . now I've never had oatmeal raisin cookies, but I don't think they're the Number One Cause of global warming. I know it's a cartoon and awHAT THE HELL HE JUST DIED

(between 16 and 17) m. MePhone knows. MePhone knows what's going to happen when the season ends, doesn't he? that's why he doesn't want it to. that's why he's desperate. but the question remains, what does he know that the viewers don't?

17 - wait this episode is from 10 months ago. is- is the series not over? damn it! I prefer to binge watch stuff so I don't forget while waiting for new episodes. oh don't even fucking go there. 14:01 FUCK OFF.

(between 17 and 18) y'know I was trying to watch this to ESCAPE all the drama and discourse everyone hates me for. this just feels personal at this point. but hey, who cares about me, right? onto the next damn episode!

18 - there's another 4 under that 4. are they all 4s. ohhh noooo, what an inteeense moooooment. wow it's really fucking difficult to care right now.

19 - again final episode so I'll break this into sections. kinda

..,.Cabby..I think I understand a bit more about my own..situation because of Cabby. wait wait. "built" to? BUILT to?? HMMMMMM 4S is still here?? what ??? ? well at least the one that YinYang wanted to win won..!

and that's season 3 huh.

well. that was kinda filler? tbh?

and the message in episode 17 sucked- ..eh. hold on. I'm getting too angry over some discourse. I need a break from typing this.

okay after like half an hour I realized something. they were trying to win an award. I like AI art, but I don't think it should ever win any awards in competition with human art. the two are fundamentally different. I don't think there should be any competitions that have both, especially high prestige ones. that line at 14:0whatever was too far though.

my opinion is that human art and AI art are both art. but they're VERY different forms of art, and should probably be kept that way.

overall I liked the season. sure, YinYang didn't win and episodes 9 and 17 are...like that. but it's not that bad tbh.

probably gonna watch the rest of s2 tomorrow, but for now I just want to play minecraft.

[zabala0z]

TMA S3 FINALE (and me screaming)

I don’t know where to start. Maybe the fact that everyone I like in this podcast always dies? Yeah I’ll start there. What the fuck guys. What. Like. What?????

I’m not going into my usual format but holy shit. MAG 119 was like motion sickness but for my ears. The music. I hated it so much. That organ. Tim. Tim. I knew he raised too many death flags, Jesus. Like I’m happy and all for him but GOD NO. AND DAISY??? Though when she started attacking the shit out of Breekon and Hope, I did internally cheer her on. The fact they tried to act as Basira made me wanna scream. Now that I think about it, was Daisy being influenced by one of the entities?? Like The Slaughter?

Basira is so much stronger than me. Like genuinely, I think she got bumped up a couple places just by her sheer logic during 119 and I am so impressed 💀 so much so, I’m wondering if she had like any internal help, y’know??

Orsinov is like one of the most horrifying sounding characters here. The moment she put on Gertrude’s and Leitners voice, I shrieked. Something about the sing-song voice, the way she inflects certain words makes my head spin. Like Michael.

Little backtracking, Martins situation with his mom is like devastating. And the moment Elias started speaking, I knew he was gonna pull out some traumatizing shitty news to give Martin, I hate him.

Fast forwarding: Jon’s dreams

Okay. So. Jon I guess is in some sort of coma and man are his dreams fucked up.

All the people that appeared in there were the people who gave physical statements. Not super hard to figure out but we had Dr Lionel Elliott, Tessa Winters, then Daisy but obviously she’s not there (DAISY 😭), Karolina Górka, Jordan Kennedy, I think the melted woman refers to Jude Perry, the hunters (Julia and Trevor), Naomi Herne and then the pitying figure. The only woman I would think would fit this vague description is Sasha because of course it’s vague, he doesn’t remember her and I’m going to sob.

Bit scared on what Jon is turning into. Whatever it is, it’s not anything good. He’s watching a lot and I guess he’s watching other people’s dreams- or nightmares- and just….watching??? I’d be terrified.

Elias got arrested. Love it. Though, “Be seeing you” I HATE YOU. 🫵🏻

Would be happy but god damn PETER LUKAS has replaced him and I don’t know if that’s worse or better because we at least know Elias’s actions and his limits. We don’t know much on Peter and I don’t like him at all. At least he’s giving them paid leave. And a counselor. I personally need a counselor for this WHOLE SEASON.

When people told me “good luck” when I started getting into TMA, I laughed it off. I should’ve taken it more seriously because I have never felt more distinct and unpredictable emotions than listening to this podcast. I think that’s all my thoughts. Mostly I’m just uhh dying here. I hate everyone and this podcast and I’ll be listening to the beginning of Season 4 tomorrow!

Again, thank you to everyone who has been following my mini rants and crappy theories. Remember when I thought Gertrude was living in the tunnels??? But seriously, thanks to anyone who has been like fully reading through my posts. School has been wack and the people, and just the podcast as a whole has been making my time less stressful 💀 anyways that’s too emotionally vulnerable so thank you!!!

[just-a-toast]

II 17 SPOILERS UNDER CUT

So I have a LOT of thoughts on this episode but there’s one that has been weighing on my soul since watching it.

Mephone is stuck with Cobs. For good.

After telling everyone the truth. They all hated him. Even MePad told everyone to get behind him because he thought mephone just wants to hurt the contestants for amusement.

While what mephone did to them was unfair, mephone admits to not seeing the problem because that’s how HE felt. He never knew how that would affect a person. He’s known NOTHING ELSE

He felt broken. And all of them were broken as a result. It’s like when I kid grows up in an abusive environment, they assume everyone has the same experience.

Kids make up silly gags with basic stereotypes because they don’t think how that could affect someone. Mephone was still mentally a child/had childlike innocence when he first thought of the contestants.

This could also be taken in a meta stand point with Adam, Justin, and Brian making the characters stereotypes for jokes and not seeing how that directly effects the character. They’re characters so why do the childish authors care?

Back to my point, now that everyone knows, why would they help him? They have been helping him every season! 1 4s sacrificed himself for him, marshmallow killed bow to help mephone! S3 balloon, cabby and silver campaigned for his life! And he had to be saved from being thrown into a volcano!

Now that they know their lives weren’t theirs in the beginning, why should they help the person they’ve been saving, but made them broken? (I’m not saying they never had their own lives it’s just they don’t feel like they had any control over their lives. This is a whole post in of its self)

So even if the contestants came back as ghosts, none of them would help him.

Neither would MePad.

After everything MePad has done for Mephone, MePad doesn’t have any good feelings towards him anymore. MePad borderline hates mephone.

So … mephone is.. completely alone. Not a single soul will help him.

The only people would would WILLINGLY help him is toilet or bot but either probably won’t work

We still don’t know if toilet is real or not. We didn’t see him at the end so we could assume he disappeared with everything else. And Bot is in S3. They could come back because everyone there might be disappearing too and needs help but once they find out mephone made the contestants and that test tube and fan died.. it’s really a 50/50. I don’t know they will be coming back to help him.

Another possibility is the shimmers but mephone is still a Meeple product so even if he knew he was a shimmer (which I don’t think mephone even knows he’s a dead shimmer) they wouldn’t trust him enough to help him.

So. Mephone has no choice but to take the one hand that is given to him. He has nothing else.

There’s no where to go, no one to call, nothing. Just him, his abuser, and the cycle of abuse.

Everyone might live, and get a semi happy ending with them being free in the afterlife but mephone.

There’s no happy endings without him, but none for him.

It’s time for him to go home. Start over from the beginning.

[lover-of-mine]

so I saw your earlier post about how Tommy is getting Ali’ed, and I wanted to ask about who you think is the most developed and likeable out of Buck’s love interests? (except Eddie ofc, he’s the best and I can feel it in my bones that he will become endgame.) I’m still in s3, so I’m kinda a new watcher you could say. (I’ve read too many tumblr spoilers and copius amounts of fanfics though, so I’m able to keep up with and watch season 8 live).

I wanted to ask this because I’ve seen so much Tommy hype and promotion on here that I really thought that he was developed as a character and a main. But from what I’ve heard, he’s only worse than Buck’s and Eddie’s actually developed love interests. Before I actually started watching the show, I’ve only heard bits and pieces here and there about 911 and the “gay” firefighters, but that’s about it. I only started watching seriously during season 7, and I’m a pretty slow binge-watcher (hence why I’m only 3x12 lmao). When I went back to season 1, I fully expected to see Tommy (bc honestly, I thought Tommy and Eddie were the same person for a while lmaooo), but then I got to season 2 and saw the begin episodes and I was like wtf? How do people actually like this man? Eddie is literally RIGHT there. Even if Eddie wasn’t endgame or a romantic interest, he’s still a better compliment to Buck platonically than Tommy is romantically. So then I thought “oh maybe he had a redemption arc or like changed for the better like Buck did,” but from what I’ve seen on s8 and on here, it seemed like he didn’t? So that only makes me more confused on why a majority of the fandom seems to love his character. Personally, I don’t really see anything, but I guess everyone has their own opinions 🤷🏻 . Though, I’m scared that I’m basing this on too little info and I missed something because I haven’t watch seasons 4–7.

(this got so long I’m so sorry. it kinda ran away from me a little bit 🫡. Lowkey needed to vent my thoughts)

Hi, darling! I'm gonna ignore Abby, because in the context of season 1, Buck is her love interest, not the other way around, since she is the main character. So most developed is hands down Taylor. Ali was barely there, and Natalia didn't fulfill what they wanted to do with her since the actress couldn't come back to s7. Likable is complicated because Ali and Natalia aren't around enough for you to get attached and, Taylor and Tommy have a past of hurting the 118, so it's hard to be sympathetic at times. Taylor gets a lot of background information, they live together, even though the relationship is clearly wrong, both of them are trying to make it work as best as they can, so it makes sense for Taylor to be around. She tries to love Buck as best as she can, it's just not enough, they are incompatible. And, well, Tommy. Imma be honest, the only thing Tommy has going for him is the fact that he is a man. The bt fandom took that and ran. Basically, they decided that since he is a man and a first responder that meant that the relationship would be super developed and they built it UP based on nothing really (actually based on Lou having a cameo and people paying him to headcanon with them, but that's a whole another you just had to be there), not on the show at least. I don't believe he had a redemption arc, the show kinda makes it seem like being queer excuses his behavior and just doesn't address it. In my opinion, when I try my best to be unbiased and ignore the way I deeply hate the character because of the fandom, I think Tommy is pointedly being written as a bad fit in Buck's life and the relationship will run its course once Buck wakes up and stop just accepting whatever.

And if you think Eddie is the better compliment to Buck and you're still in 312, just wait, they get more intense. It's madness. They are soulmates, I don't care about anything else.

[macabresymphonies]

With the news of cancellation of Good Omens S3 into a 90 minute finale I sort of find myslef reminicing about where does the border between seperating art from the artist lie.

As a preface I'm gonna say I don't have any particular attachment to Gaiman's body of work as a whole. Western comics were never really popular where I'm from outside of extremely niche circles that graduated into standard niche circles only recently, with Gaiman's visual and literary works included. So this opinion does not stem from any particular nostalgic place. As far as I'm aware the situation is currently still under investigation, but there is concrete proof that Gaimain is, by the traditional definition, no longer considered a "good person" or at least not aligning with his previous public persona. I'm not really an authority to speak on the topics involved in the scandal and I'm really here just to ramble on my own personal blog about art and artist relationship, I'll leave the rest to people who know what they are talking about. Good? Good.

I know it's easy for to denounce, degrade or disprove work made by people we find out were some sort of morally corrupt or did awful stuff in their life. This usually stems from the fact it's hard to believe someboy who's in empathetic and introspective enough to write about topics that resonate with many people so well would still choose to hurt vulnerable people around them or to generally engage in activities that mean to do harm to others.

If we take JK Rowling for example, as heartbreaking as it must have been for most fans of her works to find out about her hate campaigns and such, if we look objectively at the body of work in question it was already brought many times it was a bit problematic. Class issues, race issues, character development and morality weren't really well handeled topics in her books and the whole pedestal was really based more on the whimsy of it or mythos that people enjoyed getting immersed into. Even that was put into question with many plagarism allegations, as such, while flabbergasting from a fan's perspective, from outsider's perspective it wasn't really that thought provoking. "Bad person's books turn out to be pretty bad after all" type of situation that's pretty common among people, especially with writing that's generally consider to be "cool", but ultimetly hollow when it comes to emotional stakes.

Another thing is actors that did bad or immoral things. Generally unless an actor doubles as a writer for stuff they star in, it's not hard to imagine that they are actually wicked people behind the curtain. It was a "funny movie trivia" for years that some actors who played the sweetest most innocent characters on screen were awful when the cameras stopped rolling so it's not that hard to detach yourself from their work. Especially when you consider that it's technically not their work to begin with, just because Bratt Pitt plays an important character in Fight Club, does not mean the whole movie should be shunned, because that's just punishing other actors, director, screenwriters even the OG book's author for sins of one person who's personal life was irrelevant to the work in question.

Gaiman is a special case to me, because despite his actions, his work has been universally regarded as very emotional, empathetic and generally very introspective. I was not an avid fan but I did see merit in his work and ideas he helped create. To write stuff like that you need to be in some way selfaware of your own morality and emotions while also being an empathetic enough to be able to imagine how your characters feel. He touched upon a lot of topics, including stuff he's accused of, while also getting praised on how he handled them.

We want to seperate art from the artist and claim it's impossible only when that art relates directly to the artist's immoral deeds (like in Jeepers Creepers), but to me it's just that we don't want to consider the fact that somebody can be so introspective and emapthetic and STILL use their position to hurt people. To write about the emotional damage caused by cruelty and malice of others and then do the same is incomprensible to us and it either speaks really badly about the person or about our understanding of what it means for somebody to be a "bad person".

[ladyorigami]

How do you feel about season 4

Bad. I feel reeeeal bad about season 4. LOL I hate it, actually-hate what they did to my boy.

Yes I'm always focused most on Five as a character, but I will say as a whole, the season is just...just a mess. They took away a lot of particular traits from the characters in order to sort of give this...shock value? Not sure that's the word, but in order for us to see how differently bland and miserable everyone's life is this time around, and to do that, they also just, sucked a ton of their characters out right with it. We also have no catharsis, no proper conclusion to the relationships and events of s3, and even though they carry that over, they don't actually give resolution.

The plot also just-and the ENDING-I...okay I need to round back to Five for a second. I'm going to ramble rant about Five for a bit PASSIONATELY so SPOILER ALERT AHEAD, don't read below this if you don't want to see me lay down a quick wall of text about The Boy:

It's not like I don't understand the 'why' of it.

Imagine spending the majority of your life in an apocalypse, eating bugs and learning how to harden your heart and kill as a child, all for the CHANCE at getting back to your family.

Throwing him back into that scenario is like...the mere THOUGHT of that makes me insane with all of the character exploration we could have had and then DIDN'T GET ANY.

Like I can't even fathom the sheer trauma he was going through once they got lost in that subway for more than a couple weeks. He's essentially in his personal hell all over again and this time it's without that hope of his family he had before. Of course he's going to cling to the one person who is there, of course they both would, it's been years. Trauma bonding exists and they both have a lot of it and yes, they are like with their rough edges and independence. So sure, I can understand the 'why' and 'how' of this happening (even if I hate it and it lowkey gives me the ick)

But we didn't even GET the character parts of that. We didn't get any trauma, didn't get any PTSD, didn't get any look into Five's mind and heart there in the subway. This really would have been a perfect opportunity to finally crack all of that wide open, because it's always been brushed off before. But nope.

Instead, an affair with Lila. A rushed sloppy timelapse and then they're a thing now and that's...it? Like the whole point of that was just for them to have this weird relationship and then they came back??

There's a time that he even SEES a younger version of himself in the same apocalypse and he reacts like he isn't even there.

This character who becomes lost without a purpose and is still searching for it, whose flame is uncharacteristically dimmed of the usual fire? Yes. I would like to explore that.

Like I said it's not even necessarily the issue that it could have happened in the beginning but it's his attitude after that really got to me. The entitlement he had to square up to Diego?? The entitlement he had to continue to cling around her when her family is there and the way he's acting...it's like it's just terrible to me.

When Five loves he loves with his whole heart, he devotes everything he has to the people he cares for but once upon a time that used to be his family and like hell if I think he would fist fight Diego for LILA. Diego his brother...Diego whose eyes warmed with such love and relief in the second season when he saw Five at that hospital. Five who sacrificed himself numerous times over to keep them safe.

I get the point is that Five is lost. That his family clearly can't give him what he needs and he's just in some ways given up trying for it. He's-tired and he just wants to rest and have something or someone that he can call his own...but that's definitely not going to be the wife of his brother???? rihgqoirgoais

I just can't swallow this attitude by him in the after bits-and I definitely can't come to terms with the fact that they basically planted him back into his personal nightmare and all that came from that was a rushed love affair. It puts a bitter bitter taste in my mouth he deserved this character exploration, he deserved to actually have his family go try and save him for once-fight for him-show him that they care as much as he's cared for them.

(There is NO slander being thrown to people who like this ship before or after s4, you guys like what you like and that's fantastic. I just have issues with the way it was all handled and I must rant passionately.)

[yuerikoko]

I think I now get where all the Angela hate (and mischaracterization) came from

(Posting another ramble dedicated to my beloved yay)

I might sound like I’m beating a dead horse here since the Angela hate has died down as of recently but I still can’t help but wonder why she had received that much hate in the first place. What warranted her to get this much hate even until recently, whereas other characters who are written similarly to her, or have done much worse, are not as actively hated? Where did the popular fanon conception of her— one that portrayed her as an abuser, stalker and even r wordist at one point— also come from?

After some thinking and also me having known this fandom for 3 years up to this point, I think(?) I was finally able to trace where all this hate came from and where the infamous fanon version of her came to be.

CW: spoilers for WE and mentions of abuse/stalking/sexual assault and other potentially triggering themes. Please proceed with caution.

Also note: I do not intend to harass or call anyone out with this. Therefore, I will not be naming any names (if any) nor will I mention any works that can be triggering. This is simply a meta analysis trying to dissect a character’s fan reception, and while I may give my own thoughts somewhere down the line, I will also try to be as objective as possible with my observations.

0. Pre-C42

Before C42 came out, Angela did not receive as much hate. She wasn’t as popular as Jack or Elliot either, yet people didn’t have a reason to hate her at all prior to IPS. It was likely because she didn’t have much to remember her by other than being “Lars’s wife” or the S3 coroner, either due to the fact that she doesn’t have as much screen time as compared to other characters, or simply doesn’t have anything that makes her stick out as a character or as iconic as others in the team (e.g. Jack, Elliot and Marina for their designs, Lars, Carmen and Elliot for their attitudes towards the team and other people around them in general).

This, however, will be a topic of discussion again in a while, so please keep this in mind as we move on to the next point in this analysis.

1. The aftermath of C42 and C56

This seems to be the starting point of this whole hullabaloo, and understandably so. Angela had just murdered someone, betrayed us, and tried to frame other people for it (C42) and of course, people were upset about it, yet there were still those who had hope for her and tried to sympathize with her. And then came C56, where she returned, but as a colder, more aggressive version of herself that has pledged loyalty to SOMBRA and was willing to carry out their orders so dutifully that she was willing to plant a bomb. This, of course, likely fueled the hate and people had more of a reason to hate her when she made fun of Dupont’s death. Although one take in particular did stand out to me (and not in a good way):

The idea that she doesn’t genuinely love Lars.

Yes, I do understand that this is a very old take from 2016 and things may change from there, but I would just like to highlight how dangerous it is to perceive characters this way. Takes like these erase the complexities of her writing and essentially reduce her— someone who has had to make a lot of hard decisions to even be with Lars, which became the basis of the person she was up to that point— into a nothing more than a caricature of how people think morally gray characters should be based on whether or not they are deemed “good” or “bad” in the traditional sense.

I also do think certain plot holes in PS’s handling of her character in the final case also contributed to it. It felt ridiculous to see how a character whose most defining trait is being family oriented suddenly turned cold and bitter towards her old team, unhesitatingly claiming that they were enemies now as if their previous friendships did not matter. Maybe this was where the idea that she’s manipulative and/or possessive came from: since she was still clinging onto Lars and the triplets (that her literal last wish was to see them again) while showing this lack of compassion that would be unnatural to her past self.

With that said, the fact that she wasn’t as memorable as a main character but was more iconic as a traitor/antagonist did contribute to mixed opinions from the fandom back then. While a lot of people seemed to be mad at the things she’s done, there were some who thought it made her more interesting as a character. I guess it depends on subjective interpretation in this case, though unfortunately, back when WE first came out, many people fell into the mindset of black-and-white morality, and end up hamfisting complex and nuanced characters into extremes based on whether or not they like them.

2. Fanon/“Yandere” Angela

Following the events of WE, this seems to be a very common fandom perception of her. This subject is somewhat hard to accurately put into words, but I will try my best to give my analysis and thoughts on it, so please correct me if I get something wrong.

For those who don’t know, this is what a yandere is supposedly defined as:

TL;DR: yanderes are known to be violent, possessive and obsessed with a particular love interest. This may even go to the extent of hurting any potential “rivals” or even their love interests themselves.

If you have been in the fandom long enough, and especially if you’re into WE or Angela, you might find that there have been numerous fanfics that described her this way: as an absolutely horrible person who abuses and even stalks Lars in some, along with getting upset when others get close to him.

It may have originated from Wattpad, where there were two fics (afaik) focused on the concept of Angela being a yandere in itself. This, and considering the fact that there is barely any fan material of Angela (most especially fics) and that almost every fic that has her in it at the time either has her play an antagonistic role or use her as a plot device (usually for other ships to happen) may have contributed to the whole idea of her being a “yandere” that was almost universally accepted as the basis of her character in fics.

There is also that perceived manipulation and “sociopathy” from earlier that may have contributed to the idea of yandere Angela. A common fandom perception of her is that Angela has a warped idea of what love is and ends up displaying unhealthy/dangerous behaviors towards Lars as a result of her obsession (which she perceives as “love”). And as a result, she ends up resorting to actual criminal behavior in some of these fics: stalking Lars, physically abusing him and in one extreme case, even raped him. (Disclaimer: I will not be naming any of these fics since I do not condone hate or harassment towards the authors, nor do I want to further trigger anyone reading this by openly naming said content.)

This may have also been a big factor in contributing to Angela hate as the normalization of this depiction of her has led to people almost unanimously accepting this as her actual character.

I would like to say that I very much disagree with this take on her character. While yes, it is true that Angela does have questionable morality (e.g. she understands that what SOMBRA did to children is wrong and actively condemns it, yet was willing to blow up the Bureau hq knowing that Elliot and Sanjay are inside), her love for Lars seems to be genuine and even healthy for the most part. Time and time again, she has shown that she really loves him— hell, her laptop password even has his name on it.

3. Popularization of these misconceptions

As these fics were the only depiction of Angela in the fandom for a time, they are, by far, the most infamous depiction of her. This, along with the “I hate her because she’s a bad person and did bad things” majority, has then led to her getting this much hate from the fandom.

Moreover, there was a time in 2023 where there’s an influx in WE-centered fics, and that also resulted in most of the anti-Angela fics for the most part. This may explain the more recent hate directed towards her as compared to characters from other seasons.

Conclusion

Much of the hate towards Angela in particular stems from both severe misinterpretation of canon events and her character’s actions/intentions, and this version of her being extremely popularized to the point where people treated it like it’s actually her. The former mostly applies to around the time WE was still ongoing to after it ended (2016-2017 ish) while the latter could explain the more recent hate. Fortunately, it seems as though more people have the media literacy to read along the nuances of her character and understand her intentions before forming an opinion.

Anyways this was A LOT— probably even longer than the Carmen/Angela post but I’ve been thinking about this for just as long (there was a time I was afraid to admit I liked her because of how hated she was). Thank you for listening to my TED Talk, I guess.

[quijabored]

OKAY SO I JUST FINISHED WATCHING LIKE THE ENTIRETY OF S3 FOR BSD SO UH SPOILERS FOR A LOT OF IT BUT ESPECIALLY THE ENDING CUZ HOOOLYYY SHIIITTTTT

I JUST

I CANT PUT MY THOUGHTS DOWN INTO COHERANT SENTANCES SO LIVE LAUGH BULLETPOINTS ((o(^∇^)o))

OKAY SO AKUTAGAWA AND ATSUSHI???

THEYRE GONNA WORK TOGETHER ARENT THEY I JUST KNOW DAMN WELL DAZAIS GONNA LIKE MAKE IT SO THEYRE COINCIDENTALLY PAIRED UP TO BEAT THE SHIT OUT OF A GUY

ALSO THE PROMISE ATSUSHI HAD AKUTAGAWA MAKE??? FYM AKUTAGAWA CANT KILL PEOPLE HES IN THE *PORT MAFIA.*

Just realizing I don't know how to do the whole colored text or different font thingy BUT ANYWAYS

STILL I LOVE ATSUSHI FOR THAT AND SINCE IT WAS MADE WITH A GOAL IN MIND, I REALLY HOPE I GET TO SEE AKUTAGAWA DEVELOPMENT

AAAAHHHH HES SO SILLY I LOVE AKUTAGAWA HES MY SON

SPEAKING OF SONS

IVAN??? HES SO ME LIKE HE IS SO ME????

ASAGIRI WAS SPYING ON ME WHEN MAKING IVAN FR

Funny thing when I first started getting into the fandom bit for bsd and I saw Fyodor being simped on I was like "eeehh I mean I guess hes cool but I dont really get it. Like sure hes an interesting character but..." AND THEN I SLOWLY STARTED BECOMING A FYODOR SIMP AND I JUST SKDHKSJD I HATE THAT MAN I HATE THAT MAN HES SUCH AN ASSHOLE

please I love him so much hes such a bitch I hate him I love him so much

"If Fyodor told me to cut my skin off I would" FUCKING SAME

ALSO AAAAAA THE ENTIRE TIME LIKE I WAS JUST STIMMING LIKE IM TELLING YOU IT WAS AJSHSKDJSJ

I HAVENT HYPERFIXATED ON A SERIES LIKE THIS SINCE THE PROMISED NEVERLAND (Specifically the manga. Miss you Yuugo)

AAAAAA ALSO THE FACT THAT CHUUYAS JUST STUCK IN POES STORY??

AND POE BEING LIKE "But if Ranpo were to die what would be my reason for living..." LIKE HELLO??? I LOVE MY OTHER SON (Poe)

AND AND AND FYODOR???? AHHHHHH HES SUCH A BITCH I LOVE HIM

THIS MOTHERFUCKER WAS REALLY COMMUNICATING QITH MUSIC??? ALSO THE SURPRISED AND SHOCKED LOOK AT THE END WHEN DAZAI FOUND HIM??

I KNOW WE SEE MORE OF HIM LATE BUT FUCK

ALSO FYODORS ABILITY?? From what I saw it seems that it's just kill by touch but if Dazais like "welp, idk" then I'm guessing it's a bit more complicated than that AND I AM SO EXCITED TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS AAAA

Also Mori and Fukuzawa did the sskk punchy thingy they did in the end of S2!! I'm not sure if people ship them (I refuse to take in any content about Mori) but if people do then win for them :D

Also Im extremely excited to see Nikolai cuz hes me minus the Ukrainian terrorist bit BUT AAAA I HOPE I GET TO SEE HIM SOON

JUST SEARCHED IT UP ITS S4 EP 5 AND AAAAAA

I can't watch BSD until tommorow now cuz I wanna have a minute to process everything BUT AAAA I CANT WAIT TO WATCH S4

Fyodor made me feel so many ways I love him

AAAAAAA OKAY SO MY FAVORITE BOY (Akutagawa) IS ALSO SUPER SILLY THOUGHOUT THIS WHOLE THING LIKE

THE SCENE WHERE ITS LIKE "Are you sure youre the real Akutagawa?"

"Yeah."

"...And youre not gonna try and kill me?"

"Yeah."

"What did you have for breakfast?"

"Yeah."

LIKE I LOVE HIM SO MUCH

Live laugh love Dazai but FUCK MAN AKUTAGAWAS TRAUMATIZED

Like don't get me wrong I love Aku how he is and I'm gonna love him more when I learn more about his character, but god damn it hurts to watch him seem so reliant on Dazais praise and Dazais approval like akdjkajsdj Ive been there my boy :(

ALSO I FEEL SO BAD FOR KUNIKIDA LIKE HE HAD TO GO THROUGH SO MUCH THIS SEASON

I PROBABLY HAVE OTHER THINGS TO SAY BUT AHDKSJDKWBD I LOVE BSD AND I CANT REMEMBER WHAT ELSE I WANTED TO YAP ABOUT BUT AAAAHHH ASAGIRI WHEN I CATCH YOU ASAGIRI- ASAGIRI WHEN I CATCH YOU-

Twas talking about this scene earlier btw :3

AH ALSO WHEN FYODOR GOT SMASHED WITH A WINE BOTTLE??? HELLO??? I LOVE HIM BUT I STARTED LAUGJING AT THE SCENE

[justeclotilde]

Thoughts on LEGO Monkie Kid, pacing, and season 5

I’m taking this from Twitter, but basically this thread about “Say something BAD about the show Monkie Kid” came up and my biggest gripe so far has been :  The show has way too short episodes. Like, 11min30. And tries to do SO MUCH in those 11min30 that either somethings get scrapped (DBFamily but not just that) or big important elements get solved way too fast (Samadhi fire and broken scroll among other things). And it steams I think from the fact that the show went from episodic to serialised while keeping the same amount of time. 

I ramble :  I see a lot of newcomers say that they jumped s1 and 2 and really started with s3/4, and while everyone has their reasons I think that’s silly Because that format is what made me love the characters and settings in the first place. The episodes are short, so the show can only focus on a tiny thing, but sprinkled LBD being a menace throughout the season, with the spider gang being a menace. And now ? lBD is still reveared as one of the best villains, and Spidergang is still very appreciated. Same thing for DBF : Red Son was slowly developed through s1, and returned on s3 Granted he wasn’t in s2, but since he was a major part of s1, and the spider queen special, we grew to care about him and the family to an extent. Because that’s what the show is good at ! Characters interactions, character personalities, CHARACTERS !! And now, the show is going for serialised, which is great and maintains attention, but it wants to do too much with the same amount of time: - In s2 : LBD took 10 ep to build her mech. MK started slowly to grow, and his relationships were explored one ep at a time. Slowly. - In s4 : we lose SWK, MK meets Azure, we learn about Tang, Pigsy and Sandy through their ancestors, we start to question MK’s existence, Monkey MK, the scroll is a menace, Azure betrays the group, MK loses his mentor and morale, DBF is important but scrolled, the JE is defeated and BAM world explodes we have to kill God in 4 episodes now. 

Granted for the characters as well it feels rushed. We don’t have to see everything either. Of course. They have a life outside the show. And overall they did a good job in those 11 bloody minutes 30.

But

But

But.

Now that we have a bit of breathing room, maybe it’s time to have that character moment by episode we’ve been asking for instead of cramming feelings and heartfelt conversations in an episode while the world is teared apart outside. Especially since we’ve seen the characters go through hell for a whole season. MK needs to breath but he isn’t the only one. We could have an episode on Red Son and his time in the scroll, an episode on MK going monkey a whole episode, an episode on SWK and Macaque in coloc, an episode on Tang Pigsy and Sandy trying to get back to their lives since they’re the most normal of the bunch - technically (cuz apparently having episodes focused on them in s4 wasn’t enough to have conversations about it but that’s a gripe i have with the community for LATER). We could have SWK and DBF reminisce on their time together, since DBK is one of the last friend that doesn’t QUITE hate him anymore, or an episode on how Nezha starts rebuilding Heaven by himself while keeping the JE power safe, or an episode on Mei just being awesome honestly, like just Mei observing MK going insane and being the girlboss she is, especially since she went through the whole “excess power that could kill everyone you love” and is still living with that, in a way. That could answer where the Samadhi fire business went. Cuz like in real life some things are tamed but don’t disappear, she might still be struggling but has learned to live with it. And MK is going through a similar path. We could also have Red Son in this one since he’s honestly the most controlled in a way.

And through all that… discretly… the world starts to break apart again ? Tears appear and with it new monsters and ghosts of the past maybe start seeping from the Underworld ? Maybe an unmasked man tries to prevent Mk’s attemps at coming back to some normal because as long as he’s confused and scared he stays the Harbinger of Chaos ? Idk ! TL:DR A lot of critics I see sum up as « They should show this more, why did THIS disappear out of nowhere, this is wasted potential », which seeps from the show not having time to show all that happens at once. Maybe it’s time to take a breather and tackle the problems one at a time again, ep by ep, like in season 2. And then go back to « We’re all gonna die in 4 episodes » to get the panic back on track.

Anyway Please come talk to me about the show and your theories, or headcanons about what the characters are doing now that the wreck of S4 has rolled past them. I wanna talk about my babies some more...