#good omens blowing up a halo

[251-dmr]

Unable to Reconcile

So, looking for any help. There are a couple of things that "bother" me that I can't reconcile. Well, there are others but I'll start with these two.

First, in E1, the tiny, surreptitious half-miracle-each to hide Jim that results in flashing red lights, and loud klaxons sounding off in heaven.

Compared to E6, when Aziraphale blows up his halo. This we are told is perceived as very nearly an act of starting a war, and all we get is a bright flash of light in heaven?

And second, in E1, Crowley initially refuses to help Azi with Jim and storms out. Returns after the chat with Beez, and he has to do the apology dance.

Then in E5/E6, Crowley tells Azi that he won't leave him on his own to deal with the demons attacking the friggin' bookshop, but then Crowley does just that, does not return to help. And apparently that's not egregious enough to warrant an apology dance? In fact, Azi never brings it up in any way. [Granted things got a little bit busy and emotional, but still.]

It feels like the consequences are mixed up with the actions. Or something. But I can't reconcile them, time-wise, chronologically, to match them up with how -- in my brain -- they "should" have been. For example: The miracle=bright flash of light. The "thing with the halo"=red flashing lights and klaxons.

I know that the idea is that Azi and Crowley working together are very powerful. So much more powerful than blowing up one's halo? I suppose it's possible, but it just still bothers me. Along with what warrants an apology dance.

Any ideas? Is it just me?

UPDATE: For a good laugh, follow up with this one about how ridiculous it sounds to swap things around.

[limeykaa]

A beautiful halo for my favorite character ever, to replace the one he blew up in s2.

[grinchwrapsupreme]

it's the militarization of heaven. the weaponization of the halos. the strict levels of hierarchy. the constant preparation for war. the flaming swords. the need to prove unwavering loyalty. the lack of care for the human cost. the black and white morality that only matters when it suits their needs. the ineffable bureaucracy yes but also the ineffable violence inherent to the system.

[1neffability]

my issue is that good omens s2 was clearly written with a third season containing 6 episodes in mind. i haven't rewatched good omens in a hot minute so i'm probably forgetting some things but random things that have no payoff are constantly brought up, i.e. the 1941 apology dance, bookshop gun, crowley being a high ranking angel, maggie misspelling a word, the whole coffee thing, the blowing-up-halo thing, and a whole bunch of other things i'm probably forgetting.

there are so many of these that with how constrained 90 minutes is, so many of them are going to have to be left unresolved (or resolved quickly and unsatisfyingly) so that the second coming/supreme archangel aziraphale plot can move forwards 💔 i've already kissed my dreams of seeing another 1941 flashback goodbye

[cobragardens]

My VERY FAVORITE THING about Good Omens fanart is how fans and artists are generating iconographies for Crowley and Aziraphale.

Amazon in its advertising has suggested the wine glass for Crowley and the teacup for Aziraphale. My fellow ineffables, followers of the true religion, have largely ignored these as potential symbols.

Instead Crowley is associated with the apple, the snake tattoo, sunglasses, and tropical plant leaves, in addition to the more traditional horns. He is always pictured in black and red with yellow eyes.

Aziraphale is associated with books, scrolls, a flaming sword abandoned, a halo, pairs of white feathered wings, and blue eyes. He is always pictured in white and gold. Often in the less stylized portraits he is depicted with a light-blue plaid.

Religious iconography built up over hundreds or even thousands of years for the saints, angels, and demons of Christianity, and it is blowing my mind to see that cultural and artistic evolution happening in a matter of months thanks to digital tools and communication.

Fanartists: Bless you in your holy work. ❤️

[doinkexe]

Good Omens theory since I cannot be alone with this information:

Everyone's curious as to how Aziraphale went from being a Cherub to a Principality, I'm always hearing "what bad thing did he do that caused him to become such a lower rank of angel?" "How did he lose his status as a Cherub?" Etc. Etc..

I don't think he did anything, sort of, in the scene where he removed his halo in s2 to rid the demons of the bookshop he says "I haven't done this since the war" (not exact but I can't recall exactly what he said.) One can assume he was a Cherub during the war, so possibly he blew up his halo which caused him to go down in the ranks.

What confuses me however, if blowing up a halo caused the demons to discorporate, why did he do it during the war? What did he gain from doing that? Did this lead the Metatron to contact him? This could explain the Cherub -> Principality situation but I want to know why he blew it up in the first place, thoughts? 👀

My own theory is maybe it was to protect Crowley (prefall) in some way or another, maybe to try and keep him from falling? 👁️👁️

[procrastiel]

I have this headcanon of s3 where it opens by playing Only You by The Platters and we see Aziraphale finding the flaming sword and slaughtering everyone in heaven

Aziraphale was wrong this. He’ll come crawling back that. I want him to do the apology dance blah blah blah.

You know what I want? I want him to succeed.

I want him to give Heaven hell.

I want him to be a problem of the Metatron’s own making.

I keep seeing a take floating around that the Metatron was obviously lying when calling Aziraphale a natural leader and a good choice for Supreme Archangel and just trying to butter Aziraphale up so he’ll be more open to the idea of rejoining Heaven, but I think there is an important distinction to be made in this regard.

Aziraphale IS those things. He IS a natural leader. He was the first being to ever wield a weapon on earth. He is a high ranking member of Heaven’s army and was in charge of a platoon in the first war EVER. HE WAS FULLY EXPECTED TO DO SO AGAIN IN ARMAGEDDON. We can see this leadership both in Season 1 when he insists to Crowley that they don’t run away and in Season 2 when facing the demons. And if Heaven actually was everything it was meant to be, everything it still proclaims that it is, Aziraphale WOULD be the obvious choice for Supreme Archangel, because when faced between making the right choice or making the obedient one, or even between making the right choice or the comfortable choice, he has always picked the right one.

Give up the sword and lie to God or let the humans suffer? Welp, there goes the sword.

Lie on my word as an Angel or allow three human children to be killed? Guess who’s lying again!

Go back to my abusers in order to make things better for everyone or run away with the love of my life who just confessed his feelings for me? Up I go.

Here’s the kicker. The Metatron ALSO thinks he was lying to Aziraphale. In the Metatron’s eyes, Aziraphale is none of those things. The Metatron and the Archangels are nothing but condescending pricks to the Angel they see as a bumbling, incompetent, slightly insane fool who chose Earth over Heaven.

I don’t want Aziraphale to come crawling back. I don’t want him to realize it’s a lost cause. I don’t want him to give up.

What I want is to see the Metatron’s face as he watches Aziraphale succeed.

[et-in-arkadia]

We saw in Good Omens 2 that Crowley may be extremely powerful. How does this affect your mind and your future fic Situations? Please and thank you

this is a neat question, thanks for asking. to be honest the main thing that caught my attention was the revelation of how powerful crowley and aziraphale are together, when they aren’t even trying. when they are in fact explicitly trying to fly under the radar. that felt like too big of a tease of something vital not to come up again; i can imagine some scene in s3 where the odds are against them and all hope seems lost, and then aziraphale takes crowley’s hand and says “do you remember? like with gabriel. we can do this together.” and then they blow shit up or bring everyone back from the dead or what have you. i’ll give that move to aziraphale because he’s the one who was interrogated by the angels about their miracle and was told just how powerful they (accidentally) were, united. also he really needs to be the one to take crowley’s hand and say it’s up to the pair of them.

i know some folks think their super-miracle was because of gabriel, that he somehow amplified it, but i’m not so sure. technically at that point gabriel had been cast out of heaven and was no longer supreme archangel. maybe he acted like a superconductor, but i’d like to think we were being shown the power of love and the amplification that results when such disparate halves come together. i think this enormous potential that they have is also why it was important for heaven to separate them. they’re a threat to the order of things.

we do see that crowley likely occupied a higher rank in the angelic staff directory than aziraphale—he was creating stars, had access to sensitive information, etc. if he were a throne or dominion, he’d have been a bureaucratic rank or two above aziraphale. we also see him create a rainstorm and possibly bring mr. brown back from the dead (was he dead? or taken down to hell where he didn’t belong? injured?) but i’m not sure that indicates that he has more power, raw power-wise, than aziraphale. aziraphale casually manipulates an entire room of humans to act like they’re at a regency-era dance and later uses a war halo to get rid of a whole bunch of demons. personally, i love the idea that they are equally matched in the strength of their abilities, that they’re perfect counterparts and counterbalances.

so re: fic, i’d likely be thinking about all of the above. it’s also fun to consider how combustive they potentially are together and the sexy ways that could manifest. and of course, if you’re into the superpowered crowley line of thought, i could also imagine some stimulating ways he might use that on aziraphale. i don’t think aziraphale would have any complaints.

[ok-sims]

Things in Good Omens 2 I still find weird after maaaaany rewatches - Part II

Hey everyone! First of all, sorry for my spelling mistakes in the first post 🙈 Somehow I was able to misspell the misspelled word, but I give my word as an angel that am I not a demon. Also, I loved to hear yout thoughts on some of the topics! There were quite some things I hadn't noticed, like Miss Cheng's resturant on Aziraphale's list. Now that I had some more time to think and rewatched the show 2 more times there are some other things I still don't quite understand:

👩Nina and Maggie being immune to Aziraphale's miracles🛡️

Obviously they aren't immune to the miracle he put on the bookshop during the Jane Austen ball, since we can see they are being made to dance, despite their will, and Nina herself comments that something is forcing her to feel different emotions (she was sad after her breakup, but suddendly didn't feel sad anymore). But when Shax's legion of demons tries to break into the bookshop, Aziraphale tries do do some miracle on Nina and Maggie so they agree to leave the bookshop with the rest of the humans (Maggie is acting like her weird self again and wants to stand there and fight????, which falls into Maggie acting off the whole season), but the miracle does not work. It is clearly intended to show that Aziraphale is casting a miracle (he does the hand gesture and the miracle sound effect plays). But it is also made clear that it did not work (including Nina's comment, "are you trying to hypnotize us?"). Another scene that corroborates with their "immunity" is when Crowley scorts out of the bookshop, when the Hell and Heaven gangs arrive after Aziphale blow up his halo. When they are outside, Crowley says that Nina and Maggie should forget everything that happened that night (he told the same to the others humans who attented the ball, and it apparently worked - check Mr Brown's quick convo with Mutt outside of the café). What the feck is going on with Maggie and Nina?

📙A.Z. Fell's diaries✒️

While it is pretty clear to me now that all the flashbacks in this season (officialy called "minisodes") are told from Aziraphale's perspective. In episode 2, the minisode seens to be Aziraphale remembering his and Crowley's encounter with Job, and getting so lost in this memory, that Gabriel points out that a long time has passed and Crowley even had left the bookshop by the time Aziraphale is done, making it clear we are getting Aziraphale's take of the Job story. In episode 4, the minisode starts right after Shax is able to "trick" Aziraphale, and the minisode storyline revolves around an incident she mentions during their conversation. Crowley is not even in this scene, despite being a central topic of their talk, and of the minisode itself, so it is safe to say we are getting Aziraphale's take again.

But the other minisode is "triggered" in a different way: it starts with Aziraphale writing in his diary (btw it is the first time he having a diary is ever mentioned!), and he states that there many volumes of these diaries. Funnily enough, his diaries are not mentioned again. Of course, once again we can clearly see the minisode is from Aziraphale's perspective (it could not get any more "in your nose" than that). But the fact that these diaries are not brought up again, even if it would have made sense in context (for example, the other two minisodes could have used the diary as a narrative device as well) is kind of odd to me. My best guess is that the diaries will be important in S3, while Aziraphale is way in Heaven, and Crowley/Muriel/a secret third character happens to find them/needs to find them for some reason.

🍷The toast after Wee Morag's death 🪦

This one might be a little silly, but I can't really wrap my head around it. In The Resurrectionist's minisode (as told by Aziraphale in his diary), Crowley and Aziraphale are having a date in a graveyard happen to stumble on Elspeth stealing buried bodies to make some money. We see the minisode unfold until Wee Morag tragically dies, and Elspeth can finally get some cash (albeit less than expected), so she steals some laudanum, buys wine and, for some reason, returns to the mausoleum were Wee Morag died to have a toast with Crowley and Aziraphale.

Why is she meeting with them again? How did they know how/where/when to find her? Since only Elspeth and Mr Dalrymple apper in the scene she steals the laudanum, I'm pretty sure Aziraphale and Crowley weren't there with her, and when the toast scene begins, they are shown entering the mausoleum again (so it is not like they were waiting inside the Mausoleum for Elspeth to come back and make a toast). I'm not sure if the minisode takes place during only one night (Aziraphale explicitly states Crowley wanted to meet him at midnight, so the minisode starts around this time), because it seens like a little too much to be done in such a short time, and when the minisode ends, it is still nightime (when Crowley is dragged to Hell), but the point is: why and how would the angel/demon duo get back to the mausoleum to have a toast with Elspeth? I'm not saying they wouldn't want to do it, but the logistics seen a bit off to me.

Once again, please let me know your insights on it! I was very pleasantly surprised with the interactions with the previous post, I'm glad to not just be shouting into the void, and I loved hearing everyone's perspectives!

[everysongineverykey]

i reread the introduction to the good omens script book recently and it's rather a surprise to me to find out that the blowing up of aziraphale's halo in s2e6 was actually going to be used as a plot device in an unmade good omens movie pratchett and gaiman wrote a script for- the angels were meant to use their halos as "glowing killer discuses" for a fight scene. the details of that script that were shared make it clear that it would've been just awful, and i'm glad it wasn't made, but it's interesting to see how that weird deus ex machina in s2 had its roots in a trashed script from the 90s.

[lauranalanthalasa]

I'm with you. I also believe that the Metatron made Crowley fall.

And if Aziraphale finds out - and he will! - oh boy, he'll set Hell lose in Heaven and I'll sit back, relax and enjoy the show.

Good Omens season 2 Spoilers

about Crowley’s fall

I… suddenly out of nowhere realised the Metatron said about Crowley ‘always wanted to go his own way, always asking questions’…. And oh. OH. OH!!!

Crowley said about Job: ‘he’s talking to God!’ With such wonder. And then Aziraphale went ‘I don’t think he’s getting any answers’ and Crowley goes ‘just to be able to ask the questions though’

Which means Crowley never got to ask his questions to God! He probably tried and probably got the same voice Aziraphale got when he tried in season 1! *points to Metatron*

… that fucker pushed Crowley, didn’t he. He’s the reason Crowley fell. He even walked in the bookshop in that new body of his and made it a point to *check* if Crowley remembered. Which Crowley deflected same as every prod from heaven all season, which Metatron took to mean he didn’t, so he was safe to start up his malicious plan.

… Metatron Aziraphale is going to take you DOWN.

[thingsisayinmyhead]

More thoughts about That scene

So, I've seen so much meta analysis (I love it!) of that last scene in Good Omens season 2, but have you considered . . .

(I'm not sure how long until I feel comfortable not adding the "keep reading" link to spoilers - maybe a month. Though I don't know )

So my latest thought out the final scene in episode is that Aziraphale didn't have enough time to process and Crowley has too much.

I don't know how long Crowley waited between Nina and Maggie's talk and Aziraphale's return, but I do know Crowley's brain works very fast and he has a tendency to overthink. He was probably sitting there going over and over his love confession in his head - to the point where it came out kind of garbled ("we're a group of 2"). Like I totally picture that in his head he said, "Angel, you're so beautiful and intelligent. I love you! Will you be mine forever?" At which point he probably pictured Aziraphale melting into his arms. And that might even have worked better. Aziraphale is an incurable romantic and has a bit of a praise kink. (Seriously - he's so hungry for praise-he calls Crowley whenever he's done something clever, he preens when Crowley says "you did a good job" in episode 4, and remember how he batted his eyes at Crowley after being told he was "just enough of a bastard to be worth knowing" at the end of season 1).

However, even the garbled declaration might have worked except the mess in Crowley's head was nothing compared to the mess in Aziraphale's head.

Aziraphale has just spend an entire night battling demons, including blowing up his halo, which had to have taken a lot of energy. Then come the revelation about Beelzebub and Gabriel, then he sorts out the squabbling Archangels and demons. Then comes the Metatron offering him his dream job. Then comes Crowley's declaration. One revelation after another after another without a break to stop and think and ponder. Not a second to sit and process all that's happened.

And he needs that time - we've seen that over and over again - Aziraphale needs time to think, to process. It took him an entire day to decide what to do about the antichrist - when there were only two days until the end of the world.

So both of the boys were on edge and their nerves were raw before the conversation even began. No wonder it went south so quickly.

[papadablo]

the second coming, jesus and god as a character

as the metatron mentioned the second coming [of christ], it's safe (-ish) to assume that jesus will somehow appear in the next season. this raises a question that good omens has (strategically?) omitted; which, i believe, has been a great choice. nevertheless, change may i come, and it might be for the better.

as of now, the series chose not to depict god in any particular way. this makes sense. each person has a deeply personal version and conception of god. it also makes the situation of the characters more approachable: they might know god exists, but they remain distant from the Almighty. a halo of mystery we are all familiar with. a halo that may be fading away next season, which gives room to one hope: for good omens to choose the hardest depiction of god as a perfect, omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent entity.

let's be honest, it'd feel cheap if all the suffering of crowley and aziraphale was the product of a whimsical and zeus-like or a clumsy and fallible yet well intended divinity. because here we have two different ideas that have a complicated coexistence but required for their journey to be completely meaningful:

their suffering and joy to be the consequence of both their free will and/or the free will others.

their suffering and joy to have been known by god and to be part of the ineffable plan

in other words, there has to be a delicate balance between them being simple pawns in a dictator's chessboard and them being helpless in a universal void. neither them nor god can be pointless, or the story will be. i am no writer, i don't know which would be the best way to portray it, but i know a great example of what not to do: lucifer.

during the first seasons of lucifer, we know there is a god, but we don't have a clue of what are His plans. the viewer is left with delicious crumbs which point in the direction that lucifer's suffering and exile, and god's silence had a meaning and a point. sadly, in the last seasons, this is completely lost. after going silent for millenia, god joins in scene and says 'lol my bad'. it's true that lucifer and good omens, although both religion-themed, neil gaiman-authored stories, are given in radically different situations with vastly contrasting production, the temptation is there (pun intended).

it is true that all this fuss may be unnecessary. they might choose a more human jesus and blow up the concept of the trinity (however i don't think they will want to lose the quite non-denominational christian atmosphere of the show). there might not be jesus at all, or 3rd season whatsoever. pero dicho queda.

[ayyynojam]

[lauranalanthalasa]

There will be a Pietà and Aziraphale will absolutely lose it!

And I'm going to love EVERY! SINGLE! SECOND! of it!

OF COURSE

Just leaving this here in case it wasn’t that obvious for someone non-affiliated with the Catholic Church. Aziraphale’s pose is based on the most popular variant of Madonna Immaculata statue from 1830 Marian apparitions in Paris, France. Crowley’s - well, he’s crucified Jesus

From by /youryurigoddess on Twitter, featuring an attached image of Aziraphale and Crowley on elevators doing the poses mentioned.

the crucified hero shot is already a TV Tropes entry so Michael Sheen doing the Mama Mary hands is the most interesting point here

[sarah-skylark]

I have been so focused on other parts of good omens and fan theories that I missed something one of the kids pointed out.

Aziraphale tempts a bunch of people into going to his party, messes with their minds for selfish reasons, and blows up his halo, all behaviors which aren’t exactly angelic.