#don't ask armand he doesn't count

[umulata]

- Babe. My beautiful angel. My darling nightmare on legs. What the fuck. Is that.  - Do you like it, beloved? I designed this myself  - Wow, hm 

((happee birday @hummingbee-o0o) (i hope you'll appreciate the tears and blood that went into this horror))

[whatspastisprologue-blr]

Memnoch the Devil gives me some of my favorite Lesmand interactions, even though, as is the case with all the books, I have to keep Assad Zaman's Armand in my mind because he just *is* Armand and so whenever he's described in the book it's honestly jarring to me.

Like, when they first see each other again and Lestat is genuinely happy to see him? And notes that Armand's voice "had no meanness in it at all". And basically calls him hot and then says he's "good to love". And then they hug each other! Willingly!

"We eyed each other for a moment. And then he surprised me, rising and coming towards me just as I moved to take him in my arms. His gesture wasn't tentative, but it was extremely gentle. I could have backed away. I didn't. We held each other tight for a moment. The cold embracing the cold. The hard embracing the hard."

And then Lestat playfully ruffles Armand's hair! Which Armand doesn't mind. In fact, he smiles! And then playfully shoves Lestat back (actually, it hurt him) to show off a little. After which, we get this:

"I can't remember anything bad between us." I said.

"You will," he responded. "And so will I. But what does it matter what we remember?"

"Yes," I said, "we're both still here."

Armand laughs again and kisses Lestat a couple of paragraphs later, seemingly just for fun. And then, in this chapter (this is all just one chapter, guys), Armand basically gets to play Lestat for Lestat, in the sense that he gets to tell Lestat the exact same arguments that Lestat used to help Armand get free from the CoD. Both of them admit it.

Oh, yeah, and actually, Lestat wasn't expecting to see Armand! That was a surprise. Armand showed up (with David, ew, but maybe it'll be Daniel on the show) because he's worried about Lestat!

And then we get this hilariously petty exchange:

"Around this Dora, I've thrown a protective light. None of us can touch her."

"That goes without saying. I won't hurt your little friend. You wound me." He looked genuinely put out.

"I'm sorry," I said. "I know. But I know what blood is and innocence and how delicious both can be. I know how much the girl tempts me."

"Then you must be the one to give in to that temptation," said Armand crossly. "I never choose my victims anymore, you know this. I can stand before a house as always, and out of the doors will come those who want to be in my arms. Of course I won't hurt her. You do hold old grudges. You think I live in the past. You don't understand that I actually change with every era, I always have as best I can."

(Seriously, AMC, give us this scene! Lestat warning Armand specifically, not David, to not hurt someone he cares about but also entrusting this person to Armand's care despite how it turned out previously. And then Armand being salty about it because jeez, Lestat, that was like, so long ago I can't believe you'd bring that up!)

Also, "I can stand in front of a house as always, and out of the doors will come those who want to be in my arms." Made me think of this:

Anyway, then we get to see this:

"Lestat, if you need me--" Armand said. "If this being tries to take you by force!"

"Why do you care about me?" I asked. "After all the bad things I did to you. Why?"

"Oh, don't be such a fool," he begged gently. "You convinced me long ago that the world was a Savage Garden. Remember your old poetry? You said the only laws that were true were aesthetic laws, that was all you could count on."

"Yes, I remember all that. I fear it's true. I've always feared it was true. I feared it when I was a mortal child. I woke up one morning and believed in nothing."

"Well, then, in the Savage Garden," said Armand, "you shine beautifully, my friend. You walk as if it is your garden to do with as you please. And in my wanderings, I always return to you. I always return to see the colors of the garden in your shadow, or reflected in your eyes, perhaps, or to hear of your latest follies and mad obsessions. Besides, we are brothers, are we not?"

A few paragraphs later, Lestat tells Armand (and David, but hopefully Daniel in the show), "I love you both."

All that in one chapter! I just wanted to share it because I feel like other great Lesmand moments get referenced a lot, such as Armand's line from Blood Communion:

"Fool," he said again. His voice was roughened now by emotion he couldn't suppress. "I have always loved you," he said. "I have loved you more than any being in all the world whim I've ever loved. I have loved you more than Louis. I have loved you more even than Marius. And you have never given me your love. I would be your most faithful counselor, if you allowed it."

And, like, that's an epic quote. I love it. But there's more to their relationship than all the bad things and this one quote!

I want to see Lestat do his part to destroy the CoS, including his "Gentleman Death" speech. I want to see Armand's attack on Lestat, him pleading to Lestat to let him accompany him and Gabrielle (promising to be Lestat's servant if that's what it takes), and Lestat rejecting him, partly because of their past and because he knows Armand needs to figure himself out apart from anyone else. I want to see Lestat entrust Nicki to Armand and then get the letter of how Armand chopped Nicki's hands off. I want to see the torture leading up to the play where Lestat is forced to watch Claudia die. I want to see Armand push Lestat off the tower. Because those are pivotal moments in their relationship, too! In particular, Armand attacking Lestat is basically why Lestat never pursues the sort of relationship that Armand wants, even though I would argue the love and affection is there, and that Lestat himself might wish differently at times.

All that pain and horror and tragedy, and then they both agree they can't remember any of it, and that even if/when they do, it's water under the bridge. "You shine beautifully, my friend." "I love you [.]"

Forgiveness is, for me, one of the most important themes of the Vampire Chronicles and, in my opinion, the Lesmand relationship is one of the best examples.

[nalyra-dreaming]

I know people have a lot of different theories about this, and my apologies if you've already shared your own but do you think it was really Armand that got Louis out of the wall after the trail? Louis said he recognized Armand's blood in the rocks, but Louis has also been wrong about the way a lot of things happened. When he asks if Armand saved him at the trail and Armand says yes, I hear more hesitation there while he is bald face LYING than in his next yes to Louis' question about if he freed him, which makes me think it might be at least some what true? And if it is why save Louis when he'd just tried to have him killed? Maybe some kind of parallel of him counting on Louis to destroy the coven the way he'd manipulated Lestat into doing the same before?

The main thing that bugs me is that obviously Armand's whole "Woe is me I was being punished by the coven for saving Louis" schtick is bullshit, so how much of the following part of that story about how his "reduced status" allowed him to sneak Louis out of the wall is true? There's also the fact that Lestat was still in Paris, and I cannot imagine a reality where Lestat knows Louis is being starved to death in a wall and doesn't try to save him. Like. If he had any control in the matter, he wouldn't let that happen, period. There is of course that we know for sure now (thanks Sam lmao) that Lestat was coerced/controlled into being at the trail in the first place, so he very well could have been in some kind a captive state himself, in addition to probably also being grief mad over Claudia, while Louis was trapped in the coffin that would have stopped him from doing anything about or knowing it was happening in the first place.

I am so excited for s3 I am going to gnaw off my own arm! Anyway, would love your thoughts, thanks!

Okay, so up until yesterday I would have said: well it must have been Armand, Lestat was chained up in the tower after the trial.

However, the writer's room just posted this:

And look, there's a "Lestat's coffin"... that we see Armand close when he tells of how he has been "demoted".

Now, I always thought that Lestat would be there, I mean we see him sitting there, but I thought that he might be in one of the tombs maybe, but no, they put him in a coffin.

And when he didn't behave like he should at the trial they punished him, and Armand went and took his coffin, which is a very Armand thing to do, I can tell you, lmao. (Arguably he is seen doing that in his narration of events, too.) (EDIT: @lightleckrereins pointed out it likely wasn't Lestat's coffin after all, so I'll stay with 'Armand so would' *g*)

Anyways, back to your question:

The show established that maker and fledgling can feel each other through the cord.

There is no way - no way! - that Lestat would have stayed calm and silent while he would have felt Louis starve to death (as you also point out). NONE.

Which makes me think that maybe he made some kind of deal with Armand (and this is one of the approaches I am using in my fic, just for the record), to get Louis out.

Now. The thing is.

There IS a possibility that Armand got Louis out, dragged the box through the sewers to a certain point, got Lestat, took him also through the sewers, to revive Louis.

But I think that is unlikely, as much as I would love it to be true. Because I don't think there's a way in HELL that Lestat would have left Louis then.

And Louis wasn't dead or deaf, he would have noticed Lestat and Armand there.

I think it is far more likely that Armand freed Louis, and then left him, as part of ... whatever deal.

There is also the third possibility, that Armand and Lestat took Louis out of the wall, Lestat revived Louis, and then Armand dragged Lestat away (who was clearly not at the top of his powers as seen and stated by Sam).

But I think the coven dynamics after the trial would argue against that, as well as the aforementioned fact that Lestat would have wanted to stay, and even then, even in his weakened state he would have fought.

EXCEPT maybe... that part of the tale is true, namely that Armand waited for Santiago to be distracted to make his/their move. But again, there, still, does someone not being there when Louis wakes up come in. Which weighs heavily, imho.

All in all - I think it is a possibility that it was Lestat who got Louis out, yes. A high possibility if you factor a deal in.

The blood? Possibility as well, but not likely, for practicality reasons. Except, of course, the whole aftermath went vastly different, which is another possibility.

We do know Lestat's skin looked weirdly like still healing from burns in the reunion scene after all....

So maybe he did, and was still there when Louis burned the theater.

That, too, is a possibility.

Until we get more posts or clues it will be impossible to tell, tbh. :)

And yes, I am soooooo excited for s3, I can't even :)))))) And the tease in OnlyFangs with the quote between Lestat and Gabrielle!!!!!!!!!

[bigskydreaming]

The Vampire Daniel Molloy, when Louis asks what he's looking forward to most about the next stage of his newly immortal life:

Hmm. With how much my maker already complains about me ruining his life and how every day I give him a new reason to regret ever siring me, if I had to pick just one thing, I'd say the thing I'm most looking forward to is when I hit vampire puberty.

Louis: ....

Daniel: Vampire puberty's when the really wild superpowers kick in, right?

Louis: I suppose technically that's not....inaccurate.

Daniel: Hey, what are the chances of me getting the 'set shit on fire with my brain' thing you've got? Can you even imagine how much that would piss him off? His disappointment of a fledgling having the same gifts as the ex who dumped his ass....oh, man. C'mon now. I bet I could do some real damage with that.

Louis: Actually, while we're near the subject: would you please stop introducing yourself as 'the reason your vampire parents got divorced?'

Daniel: No, Louis, Louis! You're not getting it, see....the thing that makes it funny is its true.

Louis: You've really decided to lean into the whole 'second childhood' angle, huh.

Daniel: Mmmm. And just think. If you'd turned me fifty years ago when I first asked, I'd be well past this stage by now. And also still twenty. And hot.

Louis: Ahh. Its like that, then, is it.

Daniel: Oh, only a little bit. Really though, its like, every day I discover a new way to make Armand rue my very existence all over again, and maybe I'm just a simple man with simple needs, because that's just....very fun for me. I mean, there's just something extra validating in knowing the guy you're all "fuck that guy, I hate him, he sucks" about hates you waaaay more than you can be bothered to hate him. Because then its like you win the feud, right? You still get to hate that guy, which is great, because fuck that guy, he sucks, but you also get to know your very existence drives him way crazier than his ever makes you, and I mean, let's be real. Who doesn't like winning things?

Louis: Well I'm so glad you've found something that gives you a sense of purpose at least. Its very -

Daniel: Yeah, yeah, immortal blood drinkers need hobbies other than mass murder, it keeps the body count low and is good for the environment. Relax. I know. I literally wrote the book on it. You were there.

Louis: That's what you got out of it?

Daniel: Why, did you want me to fixate on your sex scenes instead? That seems weird. A little narcissistic even. And at the risk of self-awareness, when I'm the one -

Louis: Right. Well. I just wanted to make sure you had something to focus your energies on. It can all be a bit overwhelming at first and with your level of public attention at the moment, its very crit -

Daniel: Nope, all good here. Got myself a steady supply of Deadbeat Dad jokes that make my maker's eye twitch - apparently base word play is "gauche" or some shit - ugh, my god, its like nothing I do is ever good enough for him, and I only ate one of the editors on my shitlist to test drive my shiny new murder skills. He had this thing about Oxford commas, used to bug the crap out of me. Its like we get it, you hate them. They're literally dots on a page, they can't hurt you, can we please move on....

Louis: ....

Daniel: Louis, I'm kidding. Look, you don't have to worry about me. I already decided I find emotional evisceration way more satisfying than the physical version. Less clean up and it lasts longer anyway. I'm not going to get myself into trouble by cosplaying as Jack the Ripper where paparazzi can catch me red-fanged, and even if I do, I hereby absolve you of all responsibility. You can stop mother-henning me, you didn't turn me, you literally said no when I begged you to, its the whole reason I have eternal wrinkles instead of youthful tautness.

Louis: Not gonna let that one go, are you.

Daniel: Gimme a few centuries and ask me again. I'll let you know then.

Louis: Mmhmm. So this was....memorable and we definitely won't be doing it again. But you do seem to have things figured out so I'll leave you to it, then.

Daniel: Wait, Louis, don't go! Don't you want to hear my five-century life plan for annoying Armand into an early retirement mausoleum? I made visual aids!

Louis: Goodbye, Daniel.

Daniel: Fine, leave then! I don't care! You're not my real dad anyway! Et cetera, et cetera!

[thequeenofsastiel]

I'm contemplating people saying that Armand and Louis' D/s dynamic had switched by the time they got to Dubai, and I just don't see it. The ONLY time Louis comes across as submissive(unless you count when Armand was clearly protective of Louis, which as I've said was an example of him performing acts of service, not him being dominant), is when he asks Armand if he can look at the pages they took out from Claudia's diaries, instead of just telling Armand to show them to him. But I don't think that's him being submissive. I think that's him being a good Dom. Because Armand doesn't say "I told you no", or some variation of that. He says "We made an agreement." Which to me indicates that he put a boundary in place, and Louis was respecting that boundary, just like he always has. Like with Madeleine, both with turning her and watching her get turned. And with Armand pretending to be Rashid. Respecting that boundary was SO important to Louis that it was even able to break through Louis' mind completely unraveling in 1x07. I think Louis tries very hard to be a good Dom. Is doing an interview that would put them both in danger him being a good Dom? No. It's him being very emotionally unstable and suicidal. Which I DON'T think is related to how he feels about himself as Armand's Dom. I also think he thought that Armand wouldn't actually be in any danger because of how powerful he is. Or at least that's what he tried to tell himself. But in general, I think that being a good Dom is important to Louis. And him looking at Armand in gratitude and kissing him after is because it meant a lot to Louis that Armand was willing to forgo the boundary he put in place.

[susandsnell]

For the character ask game 4; 8; 21 for Daniel Molloy and 10; 20 for Madeleine Eparvier? If that's too many, just pick which ones you're most interested in obviously :)

Hi anon! Finally sitting down to do these. Thank you for your patience with this, and double thank you for being the first person to ask me things about that old man and that spectacular queen. Let's go! I'll put it under the cut because boy I'm about to get long-winded -- I blame you for giving me so much to work with!

CHARACTER ASK GAME!!! 💫

Daniel Molloy

4. If you could put this character in any other media, be it a book, a movie, anything, what would you put them in?

You do not want to know the crossovers I've envisioned for this old man. Because of his meta role as the narrator, the messenger, and the archivist of the story, he fits surprisingly well into so many other pieces of media with the premise "what if he was the one investigating/interviewing the survivor". There are many other vampires I'd like him to interview (especially the ones from Tanz Der Vampire), and I'd love to see how a younger Daniel would fare in Fright Night (we all know how The Lost Boys would end for him..). But mostly, final girl that he is, I think he'd rock it in other horror media; the thing that has plagued him and enthralled him all his life. The thing he has begged for and run from. I wonder if The Ring's Rachel Keller was a former student or colleague of his, and if she'd enlist his help with respect to breaking the story on cursed video tapes. I want to see him in a Se7en or Longlegs type of neonoir slasher, sticking his nose where it doesn't belong, and yet coming through when it counts. I think that I would want to personally beat him to death myself for the things he'd say to Dani Ardor (Dan to Dan communication), but he's actually proven himself to be solid at deprogramming someone subjected to intense gaslighting (and very good at ruining relationships, including those that aren't his own!), and if he can keep the insanely misogynistic comments to a minimum for more than five minutes, he might've been able to get her away from the Harga by talking sense.

And finally, in what must make me the greatest parody of myself fathomable, yes, I think Daniel Molloy should investigate and probably write the retrospective on the Black Prom of Stephen King's Carrie. I've frequently joked that for all the addiction trouble, marital and familial trouble, and insanely out of pocket offensive comments, he's a Stephen King author avatar guesting at Manderley or perhaps Wuthering Heights.

But all seriousness, you have Sue Snell, who wrote her own autobiography of the horrific and targic events for which she wound up both scapegoated and disbelieved. Given his nose for the supernatural/preternatural, Daniel would follow where that thread leads and maybe help her find some peace in the process. The two certainly have a lot in common; both did fucking horrible things as a teenager for which they later faced an insanely disproportionate retribution, both have curly hair (usually in Sue's case), both are heavily coded to be repressing queerness leading them to unfulfilling heteronormative relationships/plans for unhappy family life, both take the role of the archivist and messenger to shape the horrors they lived into a narrative - their narrative - before the world will make of it what it will. Both fell in love with their monster(s). Both are fucking SURVIVORS.

(I kind of want to write this now...)

8. What’s something the fandom does when it comes to this character that you despise?

Honestly, I don't want to rehash bad discourse from twitter, so I'll just say exaggerating his very apparent flaws to thoughtlessly trigger people in the interest of winning a morality contest in this of all franchises. On the flipside of that, reducing him to his ship with Armand -- I've been very vocal regarding how much I despise the Armand Is Alice theory, and so long as it persists I'll continue. Not because of this or that headcanon, but it's phenomenally misogynistic to erase women we haven't even seen onscreen yet for slash because eewwww no girls allowed. Like what in the circa 2007 misogynistic yaoi livejournal, TJLC ass theory are we doing here. But also because it would be terrible writing. The emotional impact of old Maniel as a character concept is that he's lived a full life, accomplished incredible things, and had relationships that were meaningful and that he also destroyed. He has these things because of Louis' rescue of him and Louis' words, and when they see each other again in 2022, the tangible impact of his great deed are written in every line on Daniel's face. I don't mind 'the Chase happened' truthers at all, but my God, you undercut everything when you suggest that it's Oops, All Armand, meaning Daniel never had a life fully lived and failings and triumphs he carries with him. You also ironically make DM less interesting by making him the only person in Daniel's life of any significance. Just. Take the character as we got him, my god.

21. If you’re a fic writer and have written for this character, what’s your favorite thing to do when you’re writing for this character? What’s something you don’t like?

I have a whole Thing about how I'm a strident feminist who somehow hitched her wagon to this geriatric misogynist, but it is a part of his very distinctive voice, so I do like to dig deep with "what's the thing a man could say that would piss me off the most", and then I run it through the canon content (since his character voice is very particular and distinct), plus some meta works with Eric Bogosian, to see if it fits, sprinkle in some Freak Shit, and bada bing bada boom, we've got our favourite asshole. It's weirdly cathartic in a way? Exorcising demons of shitty men I've dealt with or known of I guess lmao. I would say in sappier moods I like looking for the gentleness and the silver lining underneath the ten layers of Having No Limits, and when I hit on what's tender but still plausible, aka my favourite Daniel moments? No better feeling.

The flipside of this, being what I don't like, is that keeping that voice up is hard and it is a challenge to stay as sharp and ten steps ahead as he is. Need to brush up on some Columbo, I think...

Madeleine Éparvier

10. Could you be best friends with this character?

My heart would really, really, really love to say yes, but my gut and my brain say a definitive no. For one thing, while they make it very, very clear she's not a Collaborator or antisemitic in the slightest, the way her wartime affair came about and her later actions betrays an amorality in those circumstances that I probably wouldn't be able to look past, outsiders though we both may be. I'm also one for obsessive morality-related thoughts in general, so I don't think this would jell especially well with her survivalist mentality. I'm also fluent in French but it's not my first language, so that would likely get on her nerves. And while we'd share an interest in fashion and I'd commend her for her tastes in both clothes and women, I feel like she'd see me as a bootlicker for my legal education lolol.

And most importantly - Madeleine is incredibly mean. It's hot, it's funny, it's sexy, but I am profoundly oversensitive, and she would absolutely make me cry several times lmao. I don't really know if there's any character on this show I'd be able to get along with because everyone is so delightfully awful and also, you know, murderous. But that's why it's fun!

20. Which other character is the ideal best friend for this character, the amount of screentime they share doesn’t matter?

Well, Claudia is her companion and soulmate, so that's the easy answer; they complete each other in a way that no one ever quite has. Two outcasts, two people brutally mistreated in societies to which they were supposed to belong, two women carrying pain and humour and brutality and softness, and growing flowers over the corpses they leave in their wake. She is the X at the end of Claudia's long journey, the reason she doesn't leap in the fire who did not think twice about burning at her side; she is the only one who reads Claudia's diaries with permission. Claudia is her window to the wider world, her rescuer twice-over, and the only person who meets her where she is, in strangeness and violence and joy, in sucking the marrow from the bones you leave behind you.

So...'best friend' is probably a very light way of putting it lolol.

But also? I genuinely think she'd get along with Daniel. Two unapologetic amoral assholes who defiantly faced their past trauma to sacrifice themselves for the one they loved. And they both bully Armand, too!

Thank you so much for this! Apologies again for the length.

[ca-suffit]

Can we discuss claudia and louis attempting to kill lestat also because that does count as violence too doesn't it? I'm asking an honest question openly because I do agree louis and claudia faced much worse than lestat and lestat's unhinged violence to louis was horrifying and obviously racist PERIOD. but does the murder attempt count or how does that fit in :3

One thing I did notice is how much SR coddles lestat as a character. I get loving lestat, I get he plays him so he's going to tap into that love but when I watched the BTS clips after the episode he always justifies lestat's every action i.e. saying the ending scene btwn LL was so beautiful, or how lestat was trying to save louis during the trial. He never talks about real issues. As the "lead" he should imo. Ngl he makes lestat out to be the victim too at times, even vaguely.

It does count but...I had to go dig up the original ask here.

I don't think we're done seeing that scene tbh. but what we've seen so far is, as the ask said, "romantic."

Lestat in the book is poisoned, throat slit, and stabbed multiple times in the chest. Claudia grabs him by the neck and bites into him as he's bleeding out on the floor, then he's left in a swamp once he's "dead." but he comes back a little later so then he's set on fire and stabbed and beaten more with a fireplace poker. He's *severely* disfigured after all of that and that's why he goes to Paris to see Armand and ends up in the trial instead. He's trying to seek Armand's blood to heal himself faster. Armand takes advantage of that tho to get Claudia killed (and he never gives him any healing blood). And *then* he pushes Lestat out of the tower and it breaks every bone in Lestat's body and takes him 2 years to heal from.

So then compare that to what the show ever did to him while Louis and Claudia are routinely shown getting fucked up and that's the problem.

Also ya SR does that. Although the more stuff I see over time, the more I start feeling like it's all intentional marketing bs from everyone bcuz nobody much is ever talking about anything. I understand that the point is to not rly ever villainize anyone, but idk why u make a series like this and skip over talking about some of the *best* parts of it?? SR said some of the most unhinged stuff about Lestat in the last Autumn Brown interview (which is a feat too bcuz she does not ask any pressing questions, he just was saying shit on his own lol) and everyone's letting that go by bcuz it doesn't fit the sweet and innocent vibes they mostly like lol.

[monstersinthecosmos]

3, 6 & 29 for the ask meme! For Marius, ofc 🖤🖤🖤

(character asks!)

3. What first drew you to this character?

omg like, i totally bought into the hype when he shows up in TVL!!! Like first of all the MYSTERY like WHAT MOTHERFUCKER IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ARMAND LOL ??? but then like, just along for the ride as Lestat searched for him, and the way he shows up! WHAT A DEBUT!! How he rescued Lestat and like, he's the first vampire that Lestat meets who isn't a complete asshole! He's so comforting and normal! So self assured! THE WAY HES LIKE SPEAKING FRENCH TO MAKE LESTAT MORE COMFORTABLE? HOW HE ASKS IF LESTAT WANTS MARIUS TO START??? god i just jdsklgasdhgkjl But ! idk I feel like a lot of people think his chapter in TVL is boring but it's my favorite part of the book, I just read it like YESSSSSSS I LOVE THIS GUY, TELL US THE ANCIENT SECRETS DADDY!!! And then like, idk ! I just continued to love him through the whole series, I was so excited every time he showed up!

6. Do you have any nicknames or pet names you use for this character?

I think it's so cute when people call him Mars!!! I don't really have any names for him, though. I do call him "my wife" a lot. 😔

29. Do you affectionately bully this character?

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm i think this is kind of a loaded question, but ultimately I would say no. Like yeah I can joke about him being a jerk or a fool sometimes, but I genuinely and sincerely really adore him, he's my favorite. I think the word BULLY is a little strong because maybe that means one only likes them as far as they can make fun of the character, and I don't feel that way. But I'm not humorless. 😂 I WOULD SAY on a kink level, I enjoy thinking about him as a sub so any verbal humiliation that comes with is just kink stuff and isn't serious and doesn't count as actually bullying. 🥰

[uncivilcivilservice]

Louis or Daniel for the character ask prompt :)

Have both! First up is Louis

Sexuality Headcanon: So I know as far as canon is concerned, Louis is as bi as the rest of them, but honestly both mortal and vampire Louis give me gay asexual vibes. I don't think sex/equivalent blood drinking intimacy really occurs to him on a regular basis, but that's not to say he can't enjoy it when the occasion arises. I also just don't see him as particularly attracted to women (I know canon practically refutes this with Babette et al but still)

Gender Headcanon: Soft dusty gentleman. He's a man who is also a beleaguered wife and mother

A ship I have with said character: Armand/Louis is probably my main Louis ship? We deserved more elaboration on their time together, both in the past and present, in canon, and I will happily eat up any content that fills in the gaps there because their dynamic is interesting in terms of what it reveals about them

A BROTP I have with said character: Louis and Daniel. Something drew them together the night of that interview, and I love drawing parallels between them and just in general it feels like they either match really closely with some of their traits, or they contrast really starkly, and I think that can be interesting to play with. I also think Daniel is one of the other more human of the vampires. My Trinity Gate Book Club Boys.

A NOTP I have with said character: I would say Claudia but I've read some great fic that explored that uncomfortable relationship so idk if that counts

A random headcanon: He doesn't know what happened to some of the vampire cosplay items he was wearing during the interview, and he secretly worries they might turn up at some point because Daniel would make his life a living hell with them if he got the chance 🧛‍♂️

General Opinion over said character: He's soggy and dusty, he's the most beautiful thing most vampires have ever seen, he's the Finances Spouse, he doesn't know his times tables, he's catatonic, he's committing arson. Nobody is doing it like him

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Then my boy Daniel 🩵

Sexuality Headcanon: Again, canon wise I suppose he's bi, and I mostly agree with that, but I think he leans heavily towards romantic and sexual attraction to men. I don't think he ever really saw himself settling down with a woman and having kids and leading a normal heterosexual life

Gender Headcanon: Pretty much a cis guy, though he finds it fun on occasion to experiment with different presentations and fashions, especially for events and themed clubs etc. And I have a headcanon of him and Bianca going clubbing together while cross-dressing

A ship I have with said character: Armand/Daniel obviously, but also Marius/Daniel because goddammit my boy deserves all the devoted, ancient sugar daddies he can get okay

A BROTP I have with said character: Oh god so many, but since I already mentioned them, Daniel and Bianca! And I can make it angsty, as I headcanon that they got to know each other best while Daniel was still living with Marius, and Armand is happy to see them get along but feels weird about not having been there to see it develop

A NOTP I have with said character: Does 'whatever is happening in that show' count as a NOTP? 😅

A random headcanon: Oh god I have so many, I guess one would be that I view him as having been born in Ireland and his family having immigrated to the US when he was young, and his earliest memories are of the boat journey over

General Opinion over said character: He's my son, and my brain worms love the taste of his flesh, next question.

[crazykuroneko]

Tbh I think a lot casual viewers / non book fans are probably going to not continue the show after s2 unless it diverges quite drastically on louis's storyline? iwtv is very bleak and I genuinely think they underestimated how much show viewers ended up hating lestat after s1 (and they may end up in a similar situation with armand in s2) and then you're asking the audience to watch an entire season of this guy's whole backstory. plus you're killing off one of the two likable characters by the end of s2 and shifting louis into more a side character.

a big red flag to me was the lady who hosts the podcast who doesn't have a book background saying a lot of the same stuff as show-only people. like she clearly does not like lestat or loustat at all lmao and its literally her job to promote the show.

First, I want to address the "shifting louis into more a side character" because no I don't agree with that. Contrary to fans believe, Hollywood-standard wise (from the number of episodes they are in, how integral their characters are to the story), both Jacob and Sam have been considered as lead actors/cast of IWTV. You can see industry news outlets calling them both as such. But because IWTV is about Louis' past specifically and AMC knew IWTV still has some hope in Emmys even though it's small, they put them in different categories to not split the votes between them (they even only submit one actor in each category for it). So, look at what we have now, Louis is the narrator yet we still get Lestat in all episodes, and he's leading the NOLA narrative forward together with Louis despite not existing in the Dubai narrative. I bet we'll still get Lestat in most, if not all episodes, in S2, because Rolin has said many many times, the show is about both of them. And I expect they'll do the same in TVL season(s); Lestat is telling the story while Louis is leading whatever will be going on in the modern time. (No, i don't believe they'll make Louis stuck on a couch the whole season to listen to Lestat's story even though it sounds tasty. He'd definitely have a way to know what Lestat's saying, but I don't see anything good writing-wise from sticking your well-developed character in one place for such a long time)

About whether the audience will be willing to listen to Lestat's past, I'll see how S2 goes first before judging that. A lot of people don't like him, but there are a lot of them who are like, "I will miss him if he dies, he's an interesting character".

And IWTV is a niche show, its genre is gothic horror/romance. Who the hell is doing gothic romance for a series in this decade? (Hannibal doesn't count, it's not gothic and still about will/won't they). Like, what AMC is doing with IWTV now is extremely daring. And with a niche show, it's always the same: you can't please everyone. There will always be part of the general audience who will leave because either it's simply not their cup of tea or they can't stomach it. Especially now when there's this purity sentiment going so strongly in general (apparently now we shouldn't ship fictional characters, every sex scene has to have a grand purpose, and you shouldn't watch any portrayal of abuse even though it's produced by the victim herself). God forbid IWTV would ever want to please those people yikes. So, IWTV won't ever get as "mainstream" as what, Succession, Ted Lasso, Better Call Saul. But IWTV would still appeal to people who appreciate good writing, people who are "idc how bad the characters are as long as they're exciting!", and people who really love horror (not that "comfort horror" BS) - there's this review of IWTV from an horror website who is like "I wish they gave us more gore and horror of vampires", oh these people would love S2.

So, tl;dr you could say it's a natural selection (hell yes Darwinism), it's inevitable. I'd rather have that audience leave than stay and ruin fans' experience by whining about the plot that won't ever satisfy them. And I'd always applaud writers who don't give a shit to what people say and stick to what they're meant to do. They slay!

EDIT: ah I forgot about this. but don't underestimate the number of old fans who will probably check the show again when the TVL season(s) come. Because no matter how big their hatred for AMC is, it will be the first time ever for TVL to be adapted on screen. First time in 38 years (yes no one considers QotD movie ever existed). That's too big a temptation!

[nalyra-dreaming]

But being a vampire and living on while your children dies? We have seen that with Louis already. Now Daniel too? Would that be compelling? Daniel has no illusion of him being an intellectual. He is simply in it for the money. He was a shit father and now wants to leave something for his daughters. And he doesn't want to remain alive long enough to see her daughter's relationship coming apart. I don't know how it was for Daniel in the books, how he felt about kids, but for the show!Daniel- it seems like he is trying to make amends.

But then on the other hand you are right about RJ saying that he won't disappoint DM fans. But I am not sure. To me RJ seems to be building up on Anne's work. Giving it a depth and tweaking and playing with the themes. What is the core essence of DM? What is the theme of DM? The addicting pull of vampirism? Madness? Cycles repeating (Marius-Armand-Daniel) ? Wasn't there this character in Dracula? Someone who was almost like a pet to the Count? A man who lost his mind in service of the count...isn't DM similar only now the addiction goes both ways and mingled with love? Sorry I haven't read the books. But I have been wondering about this for a while.

Hey!

You mean Renfield (in Dracula), and yes. He lost his mind over the confrontation with and the possibility of immorality. And yes(!), there is that to it all as well, and this is part of the Devil’s Minion arc.

And it concludes with Armand capitulating, because he cannot let Daniel die.

If it’s alright, I‘d direct you to @cbrownjc‘s wonderful additions to your previous ask here - because the VC differ here in contrast to other vampire media.

In the VC it is not about the triumph of humanity ... it is about accepting the monster that they are and always will be. The last book literally gives them a means to celebrate what they are, accepting, building a community... through the Blood Communion. (And yes, that is as bloody as it sounds.)

And as per Daniel being a shit father... we actually do not know much yet. We know Daniel's memories were wiped. How? When? Why? And... maybe most interestingly - by whom? We cannot yet know what this arc means for "old man Daniel" because the "Memory is a Monster" tagline does apply to him as well. We hardly know anything yet.

What we do know that Daniel is a Pulitzer Price winner. He has written books. There are truths buried in these books, books already (as well) hinting at the "odyssey of recollection".

So. I actually think the linked reblogs put it quite well, I think that the upcoming seasons of The Devil's Minion (I think it will stretch out over several seasons) will echo the capitulation arch of both Daniel and Armand.

Against all vows to never turn someone, Armand won't be able to let Daniel die. And (old) Daniel won't be able to not accept - because he loves Armand. "And yet he loved this thing." (That's a quote^^)

The Devil's Minion is one chapter in "Queen of the Damned". It doesn't really pay much into the bigger story. I can only recommend reading it before season 2.

[starlightintheirwake]

Damon asked: 'Don't think I asked for your opinion.' (Damon to Lestat /infinitusvoces)

"Allow me to save you the trouble," is his smooth brush aside of Damon's disinterest. The vampire Armand has earned every word against him, and Lestat will name them to whomever has ears.

Lestat's low chuckle. Genuinely, observing the flailing about of whatever pretty thing Armand's currently ensnared has become entertainment in its own right.

"Interesting case, isn't he, our Armand," smug emphasis on the 'our' because Damon Salvatore isn't counted amongst it. Their little Coven of the Articulate is who Lestat means, scattered to the wind even as they all are--for every horrible thing Armand is, he is also theirs.

Still, he is truly curious about the next, "How do you know he doesn't compel you?"

@infinitusvoces

[hekateinhell]

☕ MOB WIFE LOUIS s'il te plait 🤧

ashsjsksjshjsksk

Okay look, I'm well-aware of the differences and similarities between Armand and Lestat, but I think it's fucking hilarious the position that Louis finds him in with each of them by the end of canon (and I don't just mean in the filthy way). Like, Louis is essentially an emotional support animal to both of them. This is why he ends up in France with Lestat, and this is why Armand then gravitates to him like a moth to a flame whenever he's there.

But make no mistake, Louis de Pointe du Lac is a mob wife in every sense of the word. He's a black lab married to two rottweilers. Sidenote: I know Lestat is generally seen as a golden retriever, but I like to think Armand dragged him by the hair once Louis was back safe and sound; put the fear of Satan back into him if he didn't step up and start being preemptively protective.

On one hand there's Armand, who has absolutely worked for the reputation he has among other vampires, and he counts on that rep to protect his family. He's not going to run the gamble the way Marius did in Venice. Armand knows loss and he's not risking Louis or the kids.

And there's Lestat, the literal ruler of their kind. WHO HAS A REPUTATION LIKE LESTAT. Lestat needs no explanation. I definitely think post-canon Lestat would be more on guard, and Armand can give him pointers on conveying an image of ✨don't fuck with me and mine✨ because Armand's not leaving Auvergne even for a night until he knows he can finally trust Lestat with Louis. 😤

So there's both these guys, who would and have killed for Louis. 🥹 And Louis is just... he's doing his thing in the library while his husbands are out there doing their dirty business, being scary. He's watering the monsteras, playing with the kitten, sorting through his wardrobe (the Slut Shirt from Armand; all the gifts from Lestat; more stuff from Armand... Louis is their Ken doll, it's fine).

It's not a "don't ask me about my business, Louis!" situation. It's more like "I don't want to know your business, neither of you." And he really, really doesn't. And 80% of the time they're just doing the vampire equivalent of puffing themselves up and preening around, but it makes them feel like they're doing their duty to the family (and it gives Louis a chance to get a break and hear his own thoughts for once), so it's a win-win.

In conclusion:

[devourcr]

❝ it was. it was important to me that it felt real for them, ❞ and those audience members who wanted to sit front row of every performance wanted that experience. they craved it and often were as much a part of the show as they were the audience. it wasn't for everyone and frankly, armand wouldn't have wanted to destroy his clothes with fake blood.

daniel's arm curls around his shoulders and armand relaxes further against him — that familiarity coming with a touch of wistfulness. he's played it as if it were new and in some ways, it's different than before. there's years between them, there's twisted and missing memories and as much as armand's been exposed as the one to fumble with daniel's thoughts, he'd only ever admitted what was already said. there it is again, dishonesty in the form of protection. but protection of who this time? of himself? following dubai, armand wanted to disconnect from himself. he'd wanted to turn the world into a black and white fog, a blurry cut off reality where time slowed to a stop and he did little more than exist.

but he couldn't. daniel is haunting and the burden of memory rests on armand ( even though no one had ever asked him to carry it ). he'd been actively trying not to think about it when daniel says he has a question. amber eyes shift to look at him, narrowing thoughtfully, aware of where this is headed as soon as he gestures to his head, as soon as he says he's trying to put it all together. he could have counted down the seconds as silence draws between them, his lips pressed together as if to keep the words from coming too quickly or saying too much.

❝ yes, ❞ he replies. it isn't the first time they'd sat together, that they'd leaned into one another, that armand had felt this kind of solace next to him. ❝ it's been — a long time. ❞ he doesn't like the risk the conversation poses to the gentleness of the moment. ❝ you need to understand, what you don't remember was for you. ❞ he adds, voice softer, quiet.

was that a joke? daniel files it away to try and wrap his head around later, instead of letting himself get too wrapped up in it now. he doesn't even know whether armand's talking about the theme of the movies, or the cast and crew. could go either way, he figures.

he pulls a face, instead. ❝ is that what you were spraying people with? ❞ sounds disgusting, but then again maybe that was half the fun for the people who were in the— splash zone. for lack of a better term. ❝ i think hitchcock used chocolate syrup. ❞

sidelong, daniel glances over, and thinks why not, his arm curling properly around armand's shoulders. the last time he was this fucking— tentative, there's no other word for it, since ... he doesn't know when. he's got a hunch, though; wants to know whether he's right or not. ❝ — hey, i've got a question. ❞

he's asking it whether armand wants to answer it or not, because he hasn't changed that much, because daniel's always chased down answers — because even when he gets lies instead of the truth, that sometimes still answers a question. besides, he thinks he's kind of entitled. to ask, anyway. ❝ i've been, uh, trying to put everything together, y'know, up here, ❞ he gestures at his own temple with his free hand. so much for not interrupting the movie. ❝ we've done this before. right? ❞

[rainbowcarousels]

☕️ + Daniel's reaction to reading TVA

I don't think Daniel read TVA until a few years before PL. I tend to think that it took a long time for Daniel to come to get enough confidence in himself again to make decisions that were expressly against what Marius advised. I think Marius reading it didn't go well and doesn't think Daniel should risk it, possibly to the point where he doesn't keep a copy in the house so Daniel has to get one himself.

As such, I think he read it after having spoken to Armand a few times over the years. Probably not for long, your fic definitely gets it down how I think their conversations went, but enough that he felt like he was prepared.

He wasn't. What could possibly have prepared him for the raw emotion of it?

For the amount of times Armand was clearly struggling and David, instead of helping, catalogued him like the Talamascan he is? Then published it for the world to see? For the way Armand spoke of how he finally had the perfect companions, how Marius had spoken of how it would work this time because he could have their minds when Daniel never would again and of how he and Daniel had been nothing more than a footnote, as if their relationship hadn't really mattered at all? That Armand had felt abandoned by him and chalked it up to self-fulfilling prophecy, not Daniel trying sort out his own shit?

Not to mention everything else. Armand has, for better or worse, been many people and Daniel has loved all of them because he's seen glimmers of all of them. He's seen that mouthy little painter who struggles with something within himself that he doesn't understand, he's seen the venetian princeling, the vulnerable victim of kidnappings and indoctrination, the coven master, the theatre kid, the modern technology nerd. It's all his Armand, laid bare in the pages step by step and god, I think it takes everything not to just go and try and scoop him up and tell him that he loves him - even if he's not mortal anymore and apparently that doesn't count.

I think there was a lot of pacing, a lot of smoking ('I'm stubbing them out when I'm done, don't worry, I'm not Louis!') and more weeping than he's done in a long time. It skinned him raw and I think he just kept doing it over and over again. Was this what Armand felt when he heard Interview? Is that why he listened over and over?

Honourable mentions go to understanding the parallels between how Marius had shown his love and how Armand had tried to with him, recognising that Marius had a profound effect on Armand's taste and sexuality (and probably told Marius that he was much kinkier than he'd realised, potentially without context and randomly) and that Armand is forever just trying to be a whole person after his pieces have been ripped apart so many times. To knowing that god and religion in general has been a hair trigger for him but now understanding why, wanting to kick past-him's ass for being so flippant about it.

Mostly I think it was the beginning of a burning desire to see him, to hold him, to apologise, to ask if he loves him and try to be brave in the face of it. To make him know that he wasn't abandoned from lack of love but because he was just in a fucked up place and he'd been wanting to come home every night before Marius eventually took him under his wing and made sure he didn't perish. But he also knows he has a life with Louis and the kids and he doesn't know how or if he's welcome to any part of him anymore. Not for sure, not until PL and when he finds he does have a place, he goes home.

[bandedbulbussnarfblat]

Mine

Daniel's been clean nearly twenty years now, if you don't count the occasional cigarette and drink. He's got both now as he stands out on the small balcony of his room. It's night and he should be sleeping, but interviewing a vampire has his sleep schedule all fucked up. Besides, he has things to think about.

Namely, the vampire down in the courtyard below.

Almost like he can read his thoughts—and he can, Daniel remembers—Armand looks up at him and meets his eyes. A moment later he's floating up to land next to him on the balcony. He plucks the cigarette from his hand and takes a long draw. “A man of your health should really avoid these.”

“Why? I'm dying either way.”

Armand smiles slightly and passes it back. “Yes, I can smell the sickness in your blood.”

Daniel vaguely wonders if he'd be able to taste it. Armand must catch the thought, because he says “Would you like me to taste you?”

It isn't an offer, it's just a curiosity. Daniel raises a hand to the old scar on his neck. “I wouldn't let you near my neck either.”

Armand's eyes flick to the scar. “Hm. Messy, my Louis. I never leave marks.”

Probably never leaves them alive.

“You think so little of me.”

Right. Mind reading. “Stay out of my head.”

“Ah, but I didn't need in your head. That one was all over your face.”

Daniel takes a drag and looks him over. “I remember you, you know.”

Armand's face is impenetrable. “Do you?”

“You were there, the night I interviewed 'the love of your life.'” He can't help the sarcasm dripping from the words.

Armand frowns. “What's that supposed to mean?”

“That Louis went from one monster to another,” Daniel says. He steps a bit closer to Armand. “Why are the bookshelves so high? Louis doesn't have the flying gift.”

“The cloud gift,” Armand corrects. “Louis likes to linger in the past. It's-”

“For his own good?” Daniel finishes. “Says every controlling boyfriend ever.”

Why is he so angry? He doesn't even particularly like Louis. But he recognizes a pattern when he sees one. “Poor smuck never learns. Goes from one abuser to the next. But hey, maybe he likes getting to play the victim.”

It happens so quickly Daniel doesn't see it occur. One moment he's speaking, the next he's hanging over the railing, held up only by Armand's hand around his throat. “Watch your tongue, or I'll remove it.”

Looks like he hit a nerve. Part of him wants to laugh, but the bigger part is terrified Armand is going to drop him. And how would he explain that to Louis?

Armand swears under his breath, and pulls Daniel back in. He drops him to his feet. Daniel's hands come to his throat and he takes lungfuls of air. Then he slaps Armand across the face.

It feels like slapping a stone wall. He may have broke his hand. And Armand looks furious.

“Don't hit me back. You may kill me. Louis wouldn't like that.”

Armand presses closer, until Daniel's back is to the balcony and their bodies are nearly touching. Armand's arms are on either side of his waist, closing him in. And sure, Daniel is afraid, but he isn't about to show it. “You think you matter that much?”

“I think you'd have killed me already if I didn't.”

“You're mistaken.”

Daniel's never been a betting man, but fuck it. “Then do it. Go ahead.” He tilts his head back and exposes his neck. “Kill me.”

And suddenly, there's a flash of memory. Of years ago, in a luxurious hotel room with Armand standing in front of him. Himself angry and defiant, yelling at Armand. “If you won't give it to me, then just kill me! Go ahead and get it over with!” Armand yelling back at him that he doesn't know what he's asking for. Of him storming out. Then there's Daniel in the room alone crying, because Armand left him, and Armand never leaves, he's always the one that leaves, but it never matters because he always comes back. Because when Armand said “you're mine” he meant for always.

“What the fuck?”

“You remember,” Armand says. “You were obsessed, I had to make you forget for-”

“For my own good? Fuck you.”

Armand pushes off the railing and turns his back to him. “I did it to save your life.”

“You did it because you were tired of me. Just another pet you got bored of. But hey, at least I didn't die like the others.”

Armand spins back around. “You're nothing like the others. I loved you.”

“You have a twisted idea of love.”

Armand shakes his head. “You can't imagine what it's like to love as what we are.”

“Yeah, I heard that before. Still don't buy it.”

He supposes it doesn't matter now. Some fling he only half remembers from fifty years ago is hardly worth arguing about.

“Fling? Is that what you remember? I adored you.”

Daniel crosses his arms. “Like you adore Louis?”

There's a bitterness there he didn't expect. And some lingering dark feeling he can't place.

“Jealous, Daniel?”

Ah, that's what it is. Jealousy.

“Over you? No fucking way.”

Armand sweeps back in front of him. “You only say that because you can't remember it clearly.”

“Gee, I wonder why.”

He's angry, he realizes. Beyond angry, he's furious. Armand had no right. No right to take his memories from him, for whatever reason. He wants to hit him, he wants to scream. He hates him. Hates him, hates him, hates him.

Armand grabs him and kisses him full on the mouth. Daniel tries to push him off, but he won't be moved. But he refuses to kiss him back.

“Hate, is that what you think you feel?” Armand murmurs against his mouth. “No, you still feel it, the same as I.”

“You have Louis-”

“Louis is my eternal companion. You are my mortal love.”

As if the two could be separate things. But then, maybe they could. People these days did it all the time. Polyamory, he thinks it's called. Not that it matters. He's too old to be anything to anybody now.

“You think age would lessen my affection? No, you are mine.”

Daniel shakes his head. “Not anymore.”

Armand almost looks wounded. Daniel almost feels guilty.

“Get out.”

Armand blinks. “What?”

“Get. Out.” He'll throw him over this balcony if he has to. He doesn't want to look at him anymore.

“You're upset. I understand-”

“Do you?” Daniel cuts in. “Leave, or I'm leaving.”

Armand laughs slightly. “Daniel, do you think you could go anywhere I couldn't find you?”

He could blow his brains out. He considered it when he first got the diagnosis. Decided against it because he wanted the insurance money to go to his kids. “So me and Louis are both prisoners then?”

Armand sighs as if put upon. “Very well, if you refuse to behave like an adult, I'll go.”

“You do that.”

Daniel waits until he can hear Armand's footsteps echoing down the hall before he sinks to the floor. He remembers. He remembers.

And he wishes he could forget.

__________________________________________________

also read it here on ao3