#but you see Ivan

[asteroidtroglodyte]

You all know this meme:

Good meme. Funny. Everyone laugh.

Quick question real quick

One of these molecules is the primary ingredient in Wood, which in turn is one of the primary ingredients in both Trees and Houses.

The other molecule is what your cells and metabolism run on. It’s what your muscles and brain need to run.

Quick question real quick can you tell them apart do you see any difference between the two just asking you know

[ctrlzxoo]

what if Ivan took the tape off of Till during Top 3?

(aka. the ANAKT kids learned what kisses meant to humans)

[samipekoe]

im so sad guys

[ivanttakethis]

Till uses his microphone stand in Round 6 to act as his anchor, his sense of stability, his last lifeline to a world he's pretty much given up on.

It gives him something to focus on to drown out the crowd and the rain (and probably even Ivan). On stage, it's one of the only things he has complete control over.

But then it’s taken away.

When Ivan threw his microphone stand away, he threw Till's away too.

The kiss. The sacrifice. The silence that followed.

Till lost his anchor. He’s completely unmoored.

In Round 7, he doesn’t get that stability back. With a headset instead of a microphone stand, Till lacks any sort of control.

He has nothing to hold onto. Nothing to ground him.

Idle hands are the devil’s playthings…

[dulcelem]

omg ivan's turn next? 😍

[alalnsted]

Merm ivan but I couldn’t decide on a fish 🐠

Close ups under cut

[muchanmocha]

My hot take is that Luka didn't actually impersonate Sua

And here's why.

Ok let's start by making this clear — Luka canonically knew about Sua and has analyzed Mizi and Sua's relationship to hell and back based on their My Clematis performance before Round 5.

"In the interview, Luka responded as if he had no interest in Mizi, but in reality he had thoroughly analyzed everything about her after watching her duet stage with Sua. In her confusion, Mizi becomes a mere plaything for Luka."

— Director's Commentary, ALNST Artbook

He precision-designed Round 5 to systematically push Mizi to her breaking point by using Sua and her death in Round 1 — everything from the performance, his expressions, his intonations, his timing, the choreography, down to the very song choice (he presumably didn't pull out ROMH for Round 4, and he didn't save it for the finals/Round 7 as he may have intended).

However, what wasn't on that list, was impersonating Sua.

Let's take a look at what happened on stage:

Luka opens up the sequence by catcalling her right off the bat, abruptly intruding her personal space in the first of many moments to come.

"You're the perfect subject, with the whole world in your sad eyes."

"My savior, beautiful soul..."

He proceeds to condescendingly give praise to how beautiful she is in her broken state, glorifying the trauma that made her perfect.

"I don't believe. You're a liar."

All the admiration of which, they both know is just a pretense.

Then comes the most important part.

Sua's hallucination appears.

You tell me, is that a Sua expression?

No! In fact! Sua resembles Luka here.

So what's actually happening in this scene?

Well if you look at the lyrics when she appears, you'll find this:

"When our darknesses overlap, let me take it all away."

Sua appears because Luka is directly addressing Mizi's "darkness" here, aka her trauma aka Sua, and offers to take it away. Therefore, Mizi is the one doing all the heavy lifting of hallucinating her.

Again, is this an expression that would remind you of Sua?

What he DOES do here, is continue to invade her space and touch her intimately like a lover would, which he had been doing since minute one.

Remember: the theme of Round 5 is contract marriage.

He touches her not as Sua would, but as a lover would, because that would be the easiest way to provoke Mizi, who had just lost the love of her life and is now "tied" to him.

If you check the timing of Sua's hallucination's appearances, you'd find them not when Luka "admires" Mizi for her beauty, or when they sing "ruler of my heart" as you'd expect if he was actually trying to echo Sua, but when the lyrics address the despair and trauma Mizi is facing.

Ironically, the only times in this performance that Luka plausibly resembles Sua, is when he adopts his blank doll face away from audience eyes.

Yet you can see that Sua never appears in any of these shots because that's not how Mizi would've remembered her. We can confirm that with which real memories appear in Round 5, specifically behind Luka in the theater scene and during Mizi's breakdown.

(Can you tell I've long reached my photo limit and had to make cuts)

Mizi remembers Sua at her happiest, because Sua was always her happiest when she was with Mizi.

And this is exactly the loss Luka effectively spits on.

Mizi: My world is collapsing

Luka: Lol yeah whatever

There is such a purposeful, derisive mockery embedded in how Luka treats the subject of her loss.

"Make me your god, I can give you everything."

Not, "I am your god," but "replace your god with me."

You'll notice that what he offers here isn't a new "replacement Sua," but the audience.

Catcalling, smirking, manhandling her like a ragdoll, condescendingly looking down at her, overt mockery, revelling in the cheers of an audience that's crazy for him. There is nothing he does in Round 5 that even remotely resembles Sua or is meant to resemble Sua.

Where would the resemblance be? His pretty face and white clothes? White was, and has always been his signature outfit color. Round 5 wasn't a special occasion for that.

So.

Tl;dr Luka did not actively impersonate Sua. But he did commit mindfuckery on several levels.

-

Bonus:

Luka -> Mizi [Intimacy 0%, -]

It's stupid and foolish to not be able to control even one of your emotions.

[kiwiihead]

when the consequence of your action just arrived to heaven

[shakingparadigm]

i think about the fact ivan was originally created to be an encouraging older brother figure ,, and it's really cute how some of that can still be seen when he's with mizi

[ceryulean]

Ivantill week 2024, day 3: Style swap (?) + Actor AU !

Apologies for this being so late, my drawing tablet was (and still is) having issues 😭

[atrophiedemotion]

i'm starting to realize this might be an unpopular opinion but i don't really see ivan as very possessive when it comes to till?? i think his self esteem is too low for him to think he has the right to stake any claim over him tbh jvbsdk. idk, but considering the way he was jealous of sua and not mizi makes me lean towards ivan mainly just being extremely obsessive

i think if they were to ever be in a relationship ivan would definitely be more possessive, but i kind of feel like till might end up being the more possessive one of the two •_•

[firefly6591]

Most people do catboy Russia dogboy America but we should also consider the inverse

[oosey0]

happy halloween! here's an ivantill urusei yatsura au to celebrate the holidays

[crustyfloor]

once again straight yappin so Ivan stayed at the 'cafeteria' just to blatantly stare at Till while he ate that plain white rice for 30 minutes not even bothering to be a little more normal and take up that very empty seat next to Till (that was probably there because he's the only person that sits next to till unironically) what other weird shit does this guy do

[yoiyoms]

more actor au doodles... Till on-set for round7

09 Nov. <- bluesky link ... twitter link

[k9punkout]

AND IF I SAID THAT ivan's perception of till's determination and hostility was generally wrong and unintentionally undermining of his actual mental instability. IF I SAID THAT this pov rubbed off on the fandom and plays into several till mischaracterizations. WHAT THEN.

okay so hear me out on this one. ivan's acknowledged that he could never quite understand till like he could all the other children. everyone else fell into a sort of pattern, a puzzle that can be solved with a simple analysis and adapted behavior. everyone except till.

till was no solvable puzzle. all the pieces to him were distorted, broken, missing. a living hurricane, a walking contradiction. he was gentle in his violence, quiet in his loudness, complex in his simplicity. ivan could get no true read on him, and that's why he grew so drawn to him.

and while i do believe that till is just an eccentric and unpredictable person at heart, a large part of his chaotic nature is due to his trauma. his rapid and intense mood swings, his aggressive behavior, his easily overwhelmed mind, his fluctuating ego, and many other aspects to him are all signs of abuse related mental instability. ivan saw all of that, witnessed all the abuse and all its side effects, but it never really struck him that holy shit, this guy needs psychological help.

and it's not like that's HIS fault either. Ivan was never really taught how people work, he learned via absorbing how the other children interacted instead (which isn't really efficient, he's no mind reader or anything). i wouldn't be surprised if he had no clue that mental illness even EXISTED; he always referred to himself and sua as simply "twisted" rather than trying to figure out if they could be helped or fixed, or WHY they stood out from the others.

he never even questioned his own hatred for himself. he simply thought it was reasonable, because of course, who wouldn't hate a monster like him? once someone knows who he is deep down, there is no redeeming quality that he can genuinely exhibit to exonerate himself from his rotten, detached mindset. in his mind, he deserves the isolation.

ivan truly sees himself as the worst person in the world, which makes till, by comparison, simply a confusing kid who isn't scared to fight back. ivan thinks till's willpower stems from great mental strength rather than desperation and fear. this would lead him to both misinterpret till's actions and overestimate his mental strength, all while underestimating how rapidly his sanity is withering.

this is shown quite a few times around the series. in "Confession," he refers to till as the "victim of his shallow emotions," demonizing himself and painting till as his victim. as if till could do no harm. as if till was the ONLY victim here. (i can't stop thinking about how much till would've hated that word. victim.)

in a slightly more elaborate retranslation of Cure that someone on this app did (i tried to find it but i sadly couldn't), the word "scars" ("even if your cruel words carve scars beneath my eyes") was said to be better translated into "scratches." a flesh wound. nothing debilitating, nothing severe, just painful for a while, and then gone. insignificant. the harm he inflicts is insignificant compared to everything else that he is.

i'll stick around, i'll stay, because the bruises we leave on each other are nothing compared to the spark he ignites within me.

till punches and kicks and screams and snarls, and to ivan, it's no problem, just something that makes him unique. he'd do anything to see him fight. so what if he gets caught in the crossfire? so what if he's killed while he's at it? it's all worth it. till could just continue on without him, it'd be so easy. he's strong, he never cared for him all that much anyway.

till is unpredictable, till is unique. it's just the way things work. nothing about it needs to be changed. the destruction he causes to himself and to others doesn't need to be fixed, it's already perfect. he's perfect, in all his imperfections.

THATS where the toxicity lies in ivantill. not because ivan is totally possessive and wants till to belong to him and only him or whatever some of the fandom says. but because ivan so obsessed with till that he'll die for him while calling him his victim. that he'll acknowledge till's hostile behavior and his quickness to rage and violence and consider it something to be loved rather than concerned about or feared. he'll hone in on his own flaws, never acknowledging till's, never seeing how they're destroying EACH OTHER, and exclusively focusing on the harm that HE'S done to till.

it's why ivan was always bothering him. he wanted to see him lose his temper, wanted him to fight and struggle. (more often than not, this was a good thing, as it often happened whenever till was sad/out of it, but just because something's beneficial in the moment doesn't mean it makes for a healthy relationship).

of course, none of this means that ivan DIDNT want till to be happy. he wouldn't have tried to escape with him if that was the case. he liked seeing till angry, but not any more than he hated seeing till miserable. despite not quite understanding him, he still wanted the best for that boy.

i think ivans warped perspective affected the way many people characterize till. a lot of people treat him as a more gentle person than he is in canon, and while it's true that he's mentally weak, he'd never cower in the face of someone stronger than him, like many people seem to think. he's vulnerable in the explosive and reactive sense, not in the powerless and delicate sense.

so far, we've gotten so much of ivans perspective of till that people seem to forget that he literally committed a murder in round 2. and he looked REALLY happy abt that shit. my mans freddy was a father of two and till did NOT care. not to mention that he didn't even spare acorn a GLANCE the entire round.

idk man the guy's a lil cuckoo loca we might need to remember that