#also opinions on the names? are they any good?

[horsedylan]

Sue K- Background, Misconceptions and The Defense of.

Strap in folks, this will be a very long one. (i spent awhile on it lol, im tired)

Back in 2016 the consensus within the community towards Sue was positive. She was respected, and she gave people a gleam into what in sam hell was going on with her son, with her, etc. Then something happened. One, the great purge where a bunch of OG accounts got deleted and the shitposters (people like me :D) took over (literal defamation by shitpost), and a little while later a horrible video from the youtuber timmy2cents got published and went viral. It appeared well researched and produced but it was anything but. A good amount of hate for Sue came from this video, and I do believe played 100% a part of the narrative souring towards her.

I dislike timmy2cents with a fruity passion (he’s worth far less than that) . The absolute permanent damage he has done to the discussion surrounding a kind, and gentle grieving mother is deplorable.

He has somehow almost outdone Dave Cullen as far as mischaracterization goes, and subsequent damage.. And has had the same childish response to boot.

Before you read the rest of this: if you were one of the millions of poor unfortunate souls that consumed this timmy2cents video and take issue with Sue’s TedTalk. There are TWO must watch videos I encourage you to consume. You have been fed LIES. (That and it’s actually quite interesting to look at how tricky well produced propaganda can be to spot.)

This entire thing has been sparked by so much outsider discourse where people parrot information directly from that timmy2cents video resulting in such insightful comments that insinuate she takes no accountability for what happened, and that she should “rot in hell” that she’s an “evil bitch”, that she used her son’s death for profit, that she excuses what he did (she doesn’t), that she’s a narcissist (be wary of anyone thats insistent on the narcissist label btw) etc. Repeating the same arguments from the timmy2cents video. He made the argument that this incredibly, permanently traumatized VICTIM of Columbine was a narcissist, and has now convinced millions of people of the same conclusion based on flimsy evidence. Also im not even going to address Todd Grande’s video on her regardless of his opinions whether they match mine (doubtful) or if he stays in his character. He’s not a good resource for psychology and he’s a known misogynist. If you watch him I encourage you to unsubscribe. He is way out of depth.

So anyway I wanted to make a post regarding Miss Sue and common misconceptions regarding her, or defences for problems people typically have with her.

Also feel free to copy and paste or otherwise steal and save any sort of info/argument post i have and repost it as your own (or link it to someone to shut them up.) I honestly don’t even care (especially if I get nuked) Fuck, any of my shit really. Take it, idc.

A Brief Background of Sue Klebold.

This information for Sue's background comes from Jeff Kass' book. I am not the biggest fan of the guy, his information is very good but in my books he is far too aggressive, rude (why'd you do Robyn dirty Jeff), and accusatory for my taste, so we shall semi respectfully/disrespectfully take this information and leave.

(Dylan's grandpa and grandma)

Leo Yassenoff, her grandfather (though not related by blood) was an activist for jewish rights/causes, and was an athlete. There is a Jewish Community Centre in Ohio named after him. Her father Milton Rice Yassenoff and his adopted brother Abner were adopted from The Jewish Infants Home in Columbus. Milton was born in Toledo, Ohio in 1919 and was of Russian descent. Leo passes away in 1971 of renal failure (two months after Tom and Sue marry), at the age of 88, he chooses to donate most of his 13-14 million dollar fortune to charity. Abner kills himself in the 1940's though a death certificate hasn't been located according to Kass.

Milton was an army man and served in World War 2. Once he came back he met his wife and Sue's mother Charlotte Haugh who grew up in small-town Ohio. This description of Sue's mother Charlotte is from Sue's eventual stepbrother Charles Huelsman the Third and is as follows; "Soft, diplomatic, a terribly nice person. Social, charitable, loving, concerned, empathic, real giving person, really tried to raise her kids well.”

Charolette would convert to Judaism, they belonged to the reform Temple Israel but are described as hardly attending. In total of biological children, Charolette and Milton would have three (in respective order); Diane Elizabeth, Susan Frances, and Philip Leo. Sue was 18 years old at the time of her father's passing of uremia. This sudden passing of her father at such a young age would pave for severe anxiety to come. Sue's mom would die of cardiac arrest in 1987 at 65.

Sue herself was born on March 25, 1949 and attended the private Columbus School for Girls from grades 1 through 12. Sue was involved in a number of extracurriculars throughout her time here. She was assistant art editor of the school paper, Silhouette, and art editor the next year. She was also art editor of TOPKNOT, the yearbook. She was involved in Scroll, the literary magazine that included art, stories, and poetry. She was in the art club, I’Pittori, along with the Latin club. She took photos for the school newspaper as well. An old classmate of Sue's mentions she and her sister Diane were quiet. Another described her as a private person.

She graduates from here the same year her father died in 1967. She then enrolled in Knox College but it didn't last, she left in 1969 to go back home to her mother. She sought counselling with pop psychologist (derogatory) Hugh Missildine, to deal with the intense anxiety her father's death had caused her.

Susan Yassenoff, shows up in his 1974 book co-authored with Lawrence Galton, Your Inner Conflict - How to Solve Them. Sue apparently appears under the pseudonym “Sandra,” This wasn't enough to stop the bloodhound Jeff Kass. Despite being under a pseudonym for a reason. He figures out who "Sandra" really is and makes a phone call. “I came across your profile in the Hugh Missildine book.” he says when Sue answers the phone. "What?” she said. “Yeah,” I reply, “in the, it was a few, quite a few years ago, the profile you had as Sandra.” “I think you are way out of base here, I’m going to hang up now,” Susan says.

Her lawyer, criminal defense attorney Gary Lozow, quickly called an intermediary. Lozow called it a matter that occurred when Susan Klebold was nineteen, however nothing ever comes of this as Sue seemingly leaves it alone after the fact.

Here is the copy paste of Sue's profile from the book:

Sandra is a twenty-year-old woman who came to see me because of a phobia. “I have a death phobia,” she told me. “It underlines everything I do. I think about death all the time.” She is a music student, about to graduate from college, has been living for the past year with her fiancé and is very much in love with him, as he is with her. He too is in music. When I asked her to talk about herself, she told me: “I’m afraid of failure. I won’t even attempt something unless I’m assured of success. I think too much. I don’t have a temper. “War things and medical programs bother me. I was terrified of bugs as a child. Airplanes used to bother me, too, and storms. My mother used to cuddle me and comfort me when I was fearful. When I was afraid, my sister would call me stupid. I scold myself for being afraid. I often feel that I’m a burden to people. I sometimes get depressed. “I think the fear of death will always be there. I wish I could turn off this part of my mind. I wish there were traumas to explain all this, but I’ve never had any traumas. When I get a headache, I’m always sure it is fatal. Then I worry that I will die, which makes the headache worse. Everything makes me think of death. I have to divert myself in the evening constantly—by eating, watching television, practicing my music or masturbating. I feel constantly that I’m coming a minute closer to death. What a waste of time to think of that all the time. But thinking this is a way of life with me.”

Questioned about her family, Sandra told me that her father had been a sensitive, sweet person who enjoyed doing things for her and whom she adored. He had died suddenly just before she had graduated from high school. Her mother?

“A saint—a real saint,” Sandra said. “She is kind, patient, never critical. When I was at home, my mother always enjoyed doing things for me and giving me things.” Here, then, is a young woman who came from a loving home, who is in love and is loved in return, who is bright, is intelligent, is attractive, has a deep interest in music and yet is an emotional cripple. Why should she suffer so much from, and devote so much of her attention to, an almost overpowering fear of death?

I'll spare you his pop psychology explanation for why she feels this way as anyone with half a brain can figure out why she is so terrified of death given the traumatic event she experienced a few years prior. I'll leave the important bits in though.

Sandra decided to do what her fiancé had long urged: get married. She became so busy with the wedding plans that, she told me in some surprise, she was thinking less and less about her fears. She still tends to slip back occasionally into old, indulgent, self-critical ways and to become a little fearful, but she can quickly abort the relapses.

Sue and Tom marry in 1971 on July 1st by a Rabbi. She graduates in 1972 with a masters in art education and a minor in psychology. They move to Milwaukee and she gets a job in the Milwaukee Psychiatric Hospital as an art therapy intern for adults. She then became a psychiatric art therapist at St. Michael Hospital. In 1975, she enrolls in Milwaukee’s Cardinal Stritch College for a master’s degree in reading. She works while in grad school, often in elementary schools. Her jobs included special education teacher’s aide and reading specialist. For about a year, she worked on a government program to help disadvantaged youths at the University of Wisconsin at Milwaukee. (Kass, pg. 40-49)

Misconceptions about/Defense of Sue Klebold (Warning, An Incredibly Compassionate Defense Ahead.)

This section is going to act as a sort of heavily opinionated FAQ. I don't know if it's the best way to do things but I think if anything it makes it more simple?

All of the following screenshots are from a mother's reckoning.

"She profited off D's death" Nope, wrong. She didn't, every single cent from her book was donated to suicide prevention charities. She didn't make money off of the Ted Talk either. And fuck it even if she did I wouldn't care. Her bonehead son made a fucking mess for her, she might as well get something from it other than trauma and heartbreak. But she didn't. So. (https://www.rmpbs.org/blogs/news/how-much-has-the-book-by-the-mother-of-a-columbine-killer-raised-for-charity)

"She bought him the trench coat" Okay Diane Sawyer, relax with your puritan ways. it was a coat not a glock. Next you'll criticize her for letting him play video games.

"D asked her for a gun for Christmas." She thought he was joking. According to Devon Adams, he had a dark sense of humour, and according to Sue he had a habit of asking her for ludicrous things when Christmas came around. She thought it was just another one of those things. She asked him why and he said target practice. It is not unreasonable. That family was known for being anti gun, their neighbours had them in the house and Sue refused to have them (despite the fact that it was deemed culturally acceptable to do so), so I'd probably interpret it as a ludicrous request from my son to get a rise out of me. Is it weird? Sure if you want to reach fine.

Also…Boys like guns? Like go into your local toy store, look at what you find. Those guns with the red parts that crack? Water guns? Nerf guns? Plenty of boys seriously ask for guns for Christmas too and get air soft instead even now in the current year, it was probably even more normalized in the 90's where they were fucking making pipe bombs on the regular. Seriously, I swear half of that school was cooking up pipe bombs its actually insane.

I'm just gonna point this out but plenty of boys under 18 (specifically 12-17) in Canada ask their parents to let them get their FAL because its not exactly the most shocking thing for them to be firearm trained.

"Why didn't Sue make D do therapy" Because what she thought she knew about D at the time was that he was a self sufficient guy who was striving to be independent as he approached adulthood, she trusted him, and D took advantage. The...mediator? That was in the room with them asked him how he felt about therapy, and he blatantly fucking lied and said "I'll prove to you I'm fine." Sue respected his input. A lot of you may make the complaint of "Oh well she should have made him do it" and while I do understand the sentiment I'm going to put it out there, being forced into therapy often makes it worse. We see that a lot in this community too.

Also E's family got him a therapist and guess what? It didn't do a damn thing to stop what happened. (I personally think the reaction to the van incident was a bit overblown in of itself. Teenage boys do dumb stuff constantly it doesn't mean they need therapy. Like, back in the day I broke into a church and completely fucking trashed the place with friends. I was so embarrassed and remain so even now, and yet I didn't need therapy nor did I go on to hurt people after being caught.)

A bit of a side note with E's therapy, You can have the best therapist in the world, if you aren't interested in the goal of getting better or in Dylan's case you are so prideful to reject all help (while simultaneously complaining about no one helping you i'll add) therapy won't do a damn thing. Neither will medication. Both therapy and Luvox are safe and beneficial (there are some detractors which is fine but this ain't about them) for individuals with a vested interest in self improvement, but Eric was disinterested in having a future being alive and was more preoccupied with his infamy. He liked the aesthetic of violence and the illusion of power being "crazy" gave him (like when he lied about being schizophrenic in his AOL bio) so he abused his medication to further that end instead of taking it how it was advised with the end goal of getting better. If anything I think Eric was honestly more likely to respond to a good and proper therapist before he became more interested in infamy and death than life, more so than Dylan, not because he was less prideful (he most certainly wasn't) but because he was far more external with his emotions than Dylan (Until Dylan blew his top that is). That's pretty helpful in a therapeutic environment.

So to say it wouldn't have helped if she did get D into therapy. I obviously can only give my opinion but if Eric didn't respond, I doubt someone so sensitive to embarrassment and internal like Dylan would fair any better. But again, this is just my own opinion. I think what D needed was another Zack Heckler. Not a therapist, but a friend who was emotionally intelligent. He found his emotional outlet in Eric once Zack became preoccupied with Devon, and both of them stoked each others rage and marinated in it together as some sort of bonding and coping ritual. I think Zack was the one keeping it in check.

Zack heckler had issues similar to Dylan. According to Sarah Slater he and Dylan would cry about these things on the phone together. Devon came into the picture and I think changed Zack for the better, I believe this convinced Dylan that his antidote for his depression was a soulmate. In a way he isn't wrong. Perhaps I'm an optimist but I do think having physical contact from a girl that loved him (not necessarily anything sexual) would have helped him immensely (eric too, no matter how much emphasis he put on just sex). Sue mentioned he was a sensitive, physically affectionate child after all. I don't think this fact ever changed.

"She blames E for the entire thing and makes D into the innocent victim" This one is a lot more complex but the short of it is ehhh..Maybe? No? Yes? Maybe? Sometimes? No. Yes..? The long of it is;

She was always going to be somewhat biased. This book is about her son after all. She knew her son. Carried him, loved him, etc. Her understanding of her son's culpability has been a journey through shit lake with no boat to speak of. A journey that she had to endure while she was heavily traumatized bear in mind. That is what A Mother's Reckoning is all about. She has come a long way in her understanding in 1999 to 2016 when the book was released.

She does not play pretend with Dylan’s involvement but rather has a more biased empathetic/sympathetic view of her own flesh and blood and his potential motives, nor does she excuse him for what he has done (no matter what your average redditor thinks of her and her tedtalk) but rather wishes to understand HOW he got to the place he did. I think it is closer to say she flipflops, she is lost, she doesn’t have an inkling as to what Eric’s motives were, the extent of any sort of pain he carried, his family life, and that she heavily mischaracterizes who he was as person and his motives, due to meddling "professionals" while accepting her son as a willing participant.

When it first happened she was in a state of traumatized denial. She was clinging to every bit of hope that her son wasn't some bloodthirsty killer. She describes the time she heard of these like…military mind control tapes that EH's parents had in their house, and in the throes of grief entertained that perhaps D was brainwashed by these tapes by EH.

On top of that, Judy Brown showed her E's website AFTER the shooting. AFTER, not before, AFTER. ( a lot of people shit on her saying she knew about it and did nothing but again, not true). This was also before she saw the BT's and also before D's journal got released to her in 2006 (I think it was 2006?) Then she saw the basement tapes and could no longer deny Dylan's culpability/cruelty in the act.

But what did she have to go off of at the time? The website, the time that Eric verbally abused Dylan for being bad at soccer, and Dylan just standing there and taking it.

Sue knew Eric + his parents sure, and had him around a few times, but did not know him very well. His parents did not come forward to humanize him to the public so she was just about in the dark as everyone else.

Then something else happened to add to the character assasination of Eric. In 2009 a book was published by "author" Dave Cullen called Columbine. He touted this book as the ultimate authority on Columbine, himself as an expert on the event that spent years researching it. So many places schools and universities alike use his book as gospel for studying the event. It characterized Eric as a womanizing psychopath who was intrinsically evil (paraphrasing). It hyper-fixates and waters Dylan down to a lost puppy wrapped up in Eric's scheme and charisma. Cullen was not the only person to characterize him as a psychopath either, so so many "professionals" and "experts" from psychologists to FBI agents, wanted their moment in the spotlight and came forward to say the same thing. When Sue went looking for answers and consultation for her book, she went to the experts and professionals, because that is simply what you do. This is some of what these "professionals" advised Sue about Eric and Dylan, not Sue, but the professionals;

(The above quote is from Andrew fucking Solomon, I do not assign him as much malice in his focus but he certainly had such an influence on Sue so much so that he spent time in their house.)

The biggest issue with Sue Klebold ultimately isn't Sue Klebold. Dave Cullen and the others mentioned before took advantage of and capitalized on a incredibly traumatized and grieving mother who wanted answers as to why her little boy who she dearly loved did what he did, Dave Cullen put himself in the front of the dialogue to further his name, authority and narrative. We don't know what he told her, but its almost a for sure thing that he advised her on all the "research" he did on Eric's person as it almost perfectly matches up to what is presented. There was no one else to accurately advise her on this matter. She could have turned to Kass for a basic idea (sort of), but again, but he was also limited due to the lack of parental interviews (apart from the one he got from Eric's dad where he followed him into a bathroom.), and he hadn't exactly been non aggressive with Sue. No, he burned that bridge. She wanted nothing to do with him and I do not blame her.

(fuck you Dave)

She did not come up with what she said earlier on her own to throw Eric under the bus.. If you have that many professionals telling you time and time again that he was a psychopath, you are going to take absorb it. If she ignored what the professionals told her at the time, she would once again be deemed a narcissist;

"Oh, you think you know better than handfuls of psychologists and experts? Wow Sue you're so narcissistic thinking you're smarter than everyone else." Yeah. Like Anne Marie Hocchalter's father states, she was in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation, and the people who never went through what they did like to criticize her and pretend they are superior when they aren't. (https://zhawkeitsbeensaid.blogspot.com/2016/02/sue-klebold-what-were-you-thinking.html)

I even feel bad for the Harrises here as well because these same glory seeking professionals that convinced Sue Eric was the ringleading psychopath (sort of?ish?), also convinced them that the son they loved (and yes I'm sure despite Wayne's problems he still loved Eric) that their son was some psychopath who didn't share in that love. I think that is honestly fucking evil. Like as far as Dave Cullen goes, he didn't just write a book with fake information and a false narrative and advertised it as truth to the public, he also provided fake advice and information to a grieving mother and misrepresented it as truth. The absolute audacity man.

I think people forget that the families of school shooters have been severely traumatized, while they demand answers with a shocking amount of entitlement, resentment and hostility. And unlike the families of the shooters direct victims, they do not have the same supports they can rely on. and they are constantly being attacked by residents of the community, the media, etc. It takes years for them to heal to, on top of coming to an understanding of the why. People can get mad about Wayne not getting E from the lawyer after his cremation (and I do understand why they'd be pissed) but he was angry. *His boy killed people*, lied to him and his wife. But trauma guides our responses to things, it may not make sense for us who are privileged enough to not be in their position but its good practice to understand this simple fact.

(^These psychologists should follow the things they say more closely. The one thing I can agree with them on.)

If anything, I'd say if you take into account some of her interviews as well as her book it seems she, in her own mind, goes back and forth from neutral to biased. Its interesting but you can see a glimpse of her uncertainty regarding Eric here where she makes note of BOTH of their suicidality, though to what extent Eric was depressed and the coping mechanisms he had she doesn’t know to the fullest extent because again, she cannot humanize or understand Eric. (Also in some long since lost interviews I can no longer find she mentions how she cannot presume to know what exactly was wrong with him. I wish I could find them but its been awhile.)

She cannot champion Eric. She is not his mother nor his father. I’m sorry but if you’re the type to hate Sue for this (or any of the people involved here like Devon) you need to have a reality check. Ah yes. Endless compassion for the two boys that needlessly stole the lives of their classmates but absolutely fucking none for the innocents traumatized permanently for their deeds. 90% of the time its people partial to their romanticized version of Eric doing it too, and its just annoying lol (not people who like Eric, there is a difference.)

"She didn't separate E and D" She did separate them initially, but Kathy H begged her not to do this. And why? Because she didn't want to isolate Eric. That's one of the worst things you can do for someone struggling is take away some form of social support.

Also, how do you separate two kids who go to the same school. Do you yank the one out in the middle of a school year and get them acquainted to a brand new school? Do you understand that that is one of the worst fucking things for child/teen development. That's part of the reason E was so fucked up in the first place.

"She didn't search his room" Yes she did, she stopped really doing it the further he got into senior year and stated that D was what, less than a month from graduating from high school and going to college, you have to let go of the reigns at some point (paraphrasing).

"She kicked Byron out"

No, watch Miorby's video. She didn't.

"She pushed him up against the fridge" So? Oh no a mother parents her son. It is completely normal for a parent to be hurt that her almost adult son forgot mother's day, on top of the van incident and being blatantly disrespectful she wanted to make a point that he was being a brute. She didn't body slam him lol. She put her hand on his stomach and held him there by the shoulder and gave him a lecture because he wasn't pulling his weight.

Despite me defending her here, she regrets not asking him what was up and wishes she knew what was up. But genuinely ask yourself, Dylan, who oh so loved lying to people, would he tell her the truth? She asked him multiple times before if he was okay and he LIED to her every fucking time.

"She downplayed Dylan's role in the van incident with her answers in that one form when describing what Dylan did to get arrested" No she didn't. I'm not gonna even explain this one to you, that claim is pure body/handwriting expert pseudoscience reaching. Watch Miorby's video's linked above if you care about this genuinely I'm not interested in "debating" you.

"How did she not know, the signs were there" Because she didn't. What warning signs do you speak of? D took painstaking effort to go out of his way to hide things from her and lie. There were no warning signs at the time because in order for something to be a warning sign, it has to be an acknowledged recognized sign to begin with, this wasn't such a thing in the 90's, I think its not a stretch to say a lot of the dialogue regarding mental health was coasting off the remains of the satanic panic. A lot of you are using the information of today to address an event that happened 26 years ago. Mental health care was not mainstream, it was not something parents addressed on the regular, if anything EH parents were closer to the norm than DK's. People cannot know what they don't. People will not know things that there is very little information on, if any at all.

Mental health and mental health care was barely existent, especially for men. Nope. No forget about it. Know the "my dad's gonna send me of to military school" gag? Or the old "Stop crying or i'll give you something to cry about" That was their therapy. I would really love to know how the conversation between E's parents and him went, regarding a therapist for E, I doubt Wayne handled it well.

This is ultimately why a society that makes this information incredibly accessible and integral to parenting is NECESSARY. Not fucking shoving it into the back of a closet and pretending it doesn't exist or making it some moral issue. And this is exactly what Sue is trying to do with the work she has done. People cannot know what they don't know, what has been shoved into a closet by a puritan Christian place like America/Littleton. That's the whole point of awareness campaigns. If you're still not convinced, go read what Anne Marie's father has to say about "warning signs".

You are placing an expectation of perfection onto a extremely traumatized human being. I am not saying she did not make errors, but you cannot live without making errors, and you cannot recognize them as mistakes as they are happening because that would be having hindsight 20/20 vision., It is literally impossible. She didn't hand him a gun, she tried to raise him with empathy. She was a better mother than my own.

"But she educated in Mental Health!" Sue Klebold was (sorry) barely a mental health professional. She was a therapeutic art teacher. Kass says art therapist but its more or less the same.. I'm not trying to be rude here, but that is basically meaningless when we are talking about being capable of recognizing warning signs. Like, I have actual background in psych as an industry, I've been getting education in it since I was in grade 10. (I took all my necessary psych courses but didn't want to waste money on a fucking French requirement) What I can tell you is that both her status as a therapeutic art teacher and her minor in psych is worthless as far as identifying warning signs in the 90's go. They are not responsible for diagnostics.

"She doesn't address gun control" You know this is actually really interesting. There were a few instances of mentioning gun control, one was a video interview breakfast conference with Sue back in 2018ish, a sort of blink and you'll miss. She mentioned that she does have an issue with how accessible guns were and are, but was terrified of the NRA. I do not blame her here and I think it speaks volumes of how terrifying those people are and the fucking blood on their hands (I'm not here to debate with gun nuts, i'm not anti gun so save it.)

"She says brain health" Omg…I get the joke but if you're serious. who the fuck cares? She's an old lady who grew up in a time where mental illness was seen as a severe negative moral failing and she doesn't want to inadvertently make it harder for people to seek out mental health treatment for fear of being seen as a crazy "mental case". This difficulty is what killed her son. Do I agree with her choice of terminology? No in fact I think its counterproductive (sorta).

BUT honestly, ya'll who say this seriously, sound like this lol

"She ignored Dylan when she heard him crying" No she didn't. this is a conflation of two events. I posted about this before, go look.

"How did she not notice his weight loss" She did, and she responded by offering him extra food between meals.

Dylan was a really tall guy, when you are a very tall teenage guy, you often look borderline anorexic no matter the amount you eat, and I recognize he lost weight but if I was bearing witness to it in real life I doubt i'd notice. I don't think it was as severe as people say too. They cite D's driver's license but that was certainly a guess on his part, he didn't weigh that much in 1997-98.

Your metabolism is fast, and you've got a lot of body that inherently makes you lose weight quick. Brooks Brown looked just as scrawny back then. Also eating disorders (I doubt he had one but regardless) were barely recognized for women back then, if anything it was encouraged (tuberculosis chic anyone lol) But for men? Forget it. It wasn't a thing. It's barely recognized as a problem now. If something isn't a thing or seen as a problem then chances are, you, a non researcher, won't know about it.

"But Randy Brown dislikes Sue's book and calls her book full of lies." Randy Brown dislikes Sues book and calls it a book of lies for a variety of reasons; none of them good. One is because Sue believes Dylan killed himself. Randy hates Eric Harris with a fruity passion and he thinks he murdered Dylan. He doesn't think there was mental illness present in either of them (obviously he's wrong lol). So does his creepy son Brooks Brown for that matter. Randy Brown as far as I'm concerned is a narcissist just like his son (Yes, I just told you to be wary of anyone who uses this label but know I do no use it because of sexism, but rather a long documented history involving himself in something that ultimately has nothing to do with him, if you want to criticize me for it fine.), who has placed himself in front of someone who was directly involved in this case and started speaking over her as an authority figure. He acts like he's some sort of expert on Dylan but no. Anytime you ask him for this secret bit of evidence he says he has, he refuses to provide it. He isn't an expert on Dylan.

(I understand these are 4 years old but he doesn't change his mind often)

Also Sue seems to have not regarded the relationship between Judy and herself as close as the Brown's like to portray. I think this reddit user summed it up better than I could

If Sue believed Randy's hypothesis about Eric people would still call her a narcissist too. Same thing with whole focusing on bullying as a cause that Randy has. She really is backed into a corner.

"She doesn't want the BT's to be released" This is another reason why Randy dislikes her. Let's do a little thought exercise shall we. When D did what he did the entire world pointed the finger at Sue. Half of the BT's were just the two boneheads thinking of every slur and going off, drooling on themselves and encouraging others to do the same.

Most professionals agree that it would inspire more shootings. Even in Canada we have a BSU (behavioral science unit) who advises against the release of this sort of material and had this happen similarly in 2019. Whether or not I agree or you do is irrelevant here (not that it matters, JeffCo releasing the cafeteria footage made this entire thing pointless anyway) If you are in her shoes, and the entire world blames you for the shooting, and professionals are telling you the release of these tapes would inspire others to take more lives in the name of your son, would you want them released? Probably not.

"She kept her hair appointment" So? Her son just went out and killed others and then himself. Would you want to be sitting at the breakfast table alone, looking at the place your son used to sit and its fucking empty? She was having panic attacks and was terrified of being alone. One of the worst things you can do when you've been traumatized like that is being alone, the presence of others is helpful. If you can't understand that…like…I can't help you here.

She was preoccupied with the junior photo thing Yeah I don't really have a defence for this but can only empathize and call others to do the same. I think she was an anxiety perfectionist. Given the outlined anxiety we went over above I don't think this is as surprising. She regrets it everyday. Again, this didn't drive D into doing what he did.

"What About the Laptop Stealing?" You know I'm not convinced Tom told her that happened. I have always gotten the impression that Tom gave Dylan this sense of accountability avoidance, imo the guy kind of comes off with an air of ego (I wonder if that's why D showed some distancing from his dad). Even when D got involved in that locker incident, he sends D out so he can deal with this for him? Weird. Also even if she did I think it is unreasonable for you to expect her to bring up every happening of D's life. A bit of kleptomania doesn't mean they're gonna kill someone.

"She didn't notice him SH" Dylan was such an interesting critter that he chose his hands to do it on. We don't know how often he did it but regardless of frequency I doubt anyone would notice. It's one of those "its so stupid its smart" deals. They had cats and bird, My brain would automatically assume it was cat scratches or a bird bite.

"She sometimes calls it Eric's plan"

We don't know who came up with it first, some mistakenly believe it was 100% Dylan as he started journalling first before Eric. But we don't know, it was probably at the same time, Either way. Silly yes, but 100% due to again the advisement of malicious professionals.

“She only does it for image” nah. The world pointed the finger and blamed her. It asked how this happened. She answered to the best of her ability and found healing in her work.

She wasn’t a public figure she could have stayed in the dark, private like the Harrises but she didn’t. Her image is constantly being called a narcissist every 5 seconds despite being a wonderful person. She’s in a unique position and decided to become a force for good.

“Oh well who cares we’re tcc so we can be immoral its stupid to care about morality so ill shit on victims if i want” A lot of people in this community are genuinely wonderful people. You aren’t inherently immoral for being here. If you want to use your presence here as a crutch and an excuse for you to continue to be a shitty fucking person that's your business. Your insistence of a lack of morality is still an insistence of a certain kind of morality, you just don’t like the one where you get judged as an a hole. Get over yourself.

"She said to that one person she has nothing to apologize for after they said i forgive you" as far as the shooting goes, she doesn't. Her son is not her.

"Why do so many people call the mothers of perpetrators narcissists?" Watch this from 1:29:00-1:60:00 ish. It also has some interesting bits about Ed Gein and the problem with the normie true crime types (not us).

Conclusion 1/Normie Public Reaction/TedTalk (sort of)

They complain that she makes Dylan sympathetic. What is the alternative? They demonize him into a monster that is so beyond human that people can continue writing off the human warning signs that make up a mass shooter? We complain so often here that people demonize far too often. And I agree so I’m grateful that she has spent so much time trying to counteract the “Demon” narrative (even with Eric, she speaks in a pathological manner, rather than some monster sense.)

Dylan was person who was clearly dearly loved, he lived his short life as a very sensitive suicidal person who turned apathetic and homicidal. If he doesn’t care about his own life its not exactly shocking he doesn’t care about hurting strangers (I do genuinely think they mentally blocked out any image of hurting their friends and tried not to dwell on it.)

I think its well within her right to emphasize that he was a person. He was a person that was loved, that loved others.

The world pointed the finger at the parents, and criticized them further and implied their guilt when they were met with silence by them. The biggest question people had was “How did YOU not know”.

So she responded on how, on what she missed so parents don’t make the same mistake. She emphasizes she was not abusive nor was her husband. She has every right to do this as everyone accused her of being abusive. She has every right to defend herself.

Sue Klebold is every high horse “i’m better than you” parent or person’s worst nightmare. She tells you that your perfect teenagers can be depressed, she tells you of the normalized signs of teenage depression that drove her son to kill others and then himself.

She tells you of his human traits; how loving he was as a little boy, peering into her eyes to see if she was healing after a nasty eye infection and crafting her an imperfect Get Well i love you Pegasus as a present to make her feel well, how smart he was counting pinto beans on the floor at 3.

She shows you that it is a human being that commits these acts, not some inhuman demon that is the offspring of a demon. The insistence of anything other then that is copeium. It is a self soothing tactic of “this can’t happen to me, i’m such a great parent”

And she shows her profound love for him, even now. Emphasizing his humanity in a sea of people saying he was a soulless deranged monster.

Despite what he did she collected him like a precious treasure, accompanying him to his cremation despite clearly not wanting him to be cremated (fuck people who desecrate graves by the way) making sure he got a funeral, then spending the rest of her life trying to understand why he did what he did. Throwing herself into a callous, vicious public eye to try to make it up to her son despite him being dead for over a decade when she first came out publicly.

She isn’t a narcissist, she isn’t evil. She isn’t a b*tch. She is a lovely human being who has been through severe trauma. She loved Dylan. Dylan loved her. I know she doubts that. But he clearly did, even when he was about to “leave” he tried to offer her a comfort in the last tape (no matter how churlish it was) telling her he was going to a better place.

I find it unfortunate that Eric's parents couldn't do the same for him so all we have about him are what the careless professionals have to say about him.

Conclusion 2

If anything, this is a lesson in why society must be aware of psychological problems and the variety of ways they manifest and who they can manifest in. A society that makes this information incredibly accessible and integral to parenting is NECESSARY. Not fucking shoving it into the back of a closet and pretending it doesn't exist or making it some moral issue. It is also a lesson in the danger of a culture that is based on domination and hierarchy instead of one that embraces empathy and compassion, both in the extended real world but also in an academic setting (a school culture that treats its athletes with reverence for instance). Bullying had its place in cause but I don't think it's the #1 factor, not by a long shot. I guarantee Isiah Shoels had it worse than those two. Kyle Velasquez too. A bunch of others who had it worse. They didn't do anything to hurt anyone, they didn't plan a shooting. Neither did the 2000 others in that school. Sure they thought of it from time to time, but at the end of the day they didn't, and E+D did. I believe there is something that exists as a fragile foundation that primes certain people for violence. And if you add bullying onto it and ease of access to firearms and normalizing the making of bombs and a friendship with this sort of mutuality, it knocks everything over like a deck of cards. D+E had severe pride issues, and entitlement issues by the end of their lives (as an example, Harris blaming the shooting on the women who turned him down, as if he was entitled to them?), I think most of it stemming from their young age they had an inherent ego centrism to both of them that they probably would have grown out of had they lived to see 25. Like part of the reason D and E were so mad is not just because they were bullied, its because they were at the bottom of the hierarchy which is why they went after freshmen once they aged out of that demographic D even says he wanted what the jocks have (while saying he doesn't lol). E too though indirectly. Both boys prioritized an aesthetic of violence and revenge. I do think this is part of the reason why boys/men are more prone into doing this sort of thing, and being external and blamey about their problems too (not that women are incapable of violence, but the rates of Men vs women aren't even close and they are far more external.). Violence is apart of their socialization blueprint/archetype which is why so many of them are obsessed with media displays of violence that is rewarded with power. Bullying demasculinizes them. Damaged masculinity "redeems" itself through violence. It is the ultimate "Now you see me". D+E went from bottom of the barrel to…I don't want to call them icons. But they certainly solidified themselves into history as we're still talking about them 26 years later.

Anyway, I don't know, I guess I just get a kick out of people who have endless amounts of compassion for two murderers, but absolutely none for the family that loved them very dearly. If you're one of the people gleefully slobbering over yourself about how much you hate Sue and how you can't wait until she dies (yes, I have seen this way too many times here) that's fine, have your weird tantrum. You are just another one of those people that hates on victims, and you're certainly not morally justified.

It feels hippy dippy to say, but I find myself wanting their to be some sort of kind merciful god out there that grants all of us inner peace and reunification, so so badly. I don't believe in any sort of afterlife, but I pray Sue's passing is a gentle one, and I hope she gets to see Dylan again, I really do. For both of their sake.

[writingoddess1125]

Crocodile Beauty and Beast Effect

<<< Masterlist

Welp this one won by a damn landslide! Hope you enjoy!

Crocodile x FemReader

⚠️ WARNINGS: ⚠️ Obsessive/Possessive Behavior, Murder (This is Crocodile afterall..), Sexual Harrassment (Not from Crocodile), Sexual Inuendo (From Crocodile-)

• Crocodile is not know to me a man of affection or kindness. Seen as a Cruel man who murders on a whim and will laugh in the face of any he strikes down. Heartless to the core..

• However he does have a heart-

• You. His Dessert Rose-

• His Wife

• The one he hides from the world as his most precious of treasures. Something worth more then any diamond or even the One Peice itself.

• However while most would expect some locked up princess or women tied to some bedpost crying to be free-

• But I think his spouse wouldn't be some damsel, It would get on his nerves too damn much and hed probably lash out- Or someone who yells back at him, that would just end up with someone dead.

• You however are perfect-

• A quiet women, dressed in comfortable but luxury clothes often found reading or writing- Listening to music and humming along to yourself.

• No extreme dresses, having full authority of the home(s) you occupied and as much freedom as desired within reason-. Often venturing to the market or making trades with locals to get something that caught your eye.

• Truthfully the only thing that would really indicate you were of a super high bracket was the fat ring on your finger that you were sure cost more then a few islands put together.

• Sure you found it a bit- Gaudy (It was tacky as hell) but you knew your husband was proud of it so you wore it with pride.

• You're a author by trade, You also repair rare books and a avid collector of antique literature.

• A fairly lucrative trade, which earned well before you got married to Sir Crocodile. However due to his well.. impressive wealth your was rendered now a nice well paying hobby-

• Still you did it often advertising when you were in town, and you did your trade incredibly well. Even if Crocodile insisted you didn't have to work and he would take care of your needs-

•Which was mainly him wanting you to stay by his side and spoil you rotten.

• "You do not have to work- You are more then welcome to lounge and do nothing" Crocodile said calmly as he watched you gently repair the endpaper of a antique book someone had commissioned.

"No, I enjoy this" You say simply, dipping your brush in more glue. Not even looking up to Crocodile.

Then making him growl in annoyance.

"What if I demand you to quit- You wouldnt be able to stop me if I did My Flower" He chimes, giving a dark almost sinister grin down at you as he took a huff of his cigar.

You calmly set your brush down, Looking up to him with a sharp gaze and narrowed eyes.

"Try."

That ended that conversation fairly fast as he allowed you to do as you pleased.. if not grumbling about it under his breath.

• You didn't take shit from anyone let alone your husband.

• However you don't need to scream or yell, A sharp look and a tight frown are all is needed to make him stop- at least enough to listen to a opposing opinion

• Besides if you do raise your voice it's for a damn good reason-

And for Crocodile he'd make sure you only need to raise your voice saying his name in the bedroom

• The man however adores you- head over heels, He loves you in every which way imaginable.

• Just as Much as you love him- He may be gruff and crass but you love every bit of him, No part of either you is unloved.

• Especially on Crocodile side- in a very perverted sense.. He is fast to strike if he sees you bend over for paper, or fast to lift your skirt if it's short enough- Paired with using his sand to his advantages

• Sand does like to find itself in crevices- Much to your annoyance.

• Despite this he does deeply respects you- Your thoughts, Your feelings- He takes what you say into consideration.. Even if he has to swallow his pride.

Sir Crocodile paced in his office, Face twisted up in that crooked smile of his as he layed out his next plan of attack on the Marines always telling you what his next moves would be in full detail as he knew youd provide the best feedback.

"It is perfect, I know it is my Flower, What are your thoughts?"

He said proudly, looking to you seated on his desk right were he had placed you. Your eyes however down cast to some paper next to you as you wrote something down.

You silently hold out what you had been writing, Crocodile raising a brow as he snatches them and looks them over-

There you had written a more polished version of his plan, making his face twist up in confusion as he read over it.

"You changed the timing, and location of the attack. Why?"

"The area you're planning is prone to storms that time of year so it makes sense the Marines will use a different route to avoid it- Paired with when they head out. It allows you to also use that channel to the left which flows fast, Letting you have control of the situation"

He looked to you now thinking it over.

"How would you know something like that?-"

"We were talking about the weather over there last week since I had to wait to ship one of the commissioned books I was telling you about-"

You say plainly, smiling softly as you see your husband face twist in a fake frown at you.

"I hate it when you do that-"

You can't help bit giggle, watching as he leaned over and placed a kiss on the top of your head in a silent thanks.

• It was often you two would share moments like this- You having him read over your manuscripts and you reading over his plans.

• While he was prideful and stubborn- You were the thing to help curve that and force him to listen to reason.

• Somwhat-

• You know deep down he is possessive and obsessive- He likes to keep what is his, and sees you as such. While you are free to do as you please, you know in the back of your head if he truly wanted you'd be locked away forever-

• Always seconds away from being snagged in his jaws and never see the light of day again.

• If it wasn't for your nature and you suspect his respect he has for you- You doubt you'd be in the position you are in to have the level of control or freedom you possess.

• Crocodile may act as the Head. However you are the neck that turns it- Or in your case the mild winds that can change the direction of a Raging storm.

• While Crocodile does not like to bring you to the eyes of others- But he does take you with him.

• He didn't like the idea of keeping you too far away having a desire to keep an eye on important things-

• If he is on a mission he will stash you on a island far enough from any real damage but at least a short sail away.

• It always does tickle your funny bone watching how he does this- Sort of reminds you of a paranoid squirrel.

• Looking in different spots to hide resources before digging it back up to hide in a different spot.

• But you never minded, Honestly preferring to stay more to the side lines- hidden away in his hiding spots to stay safe.

• You'd heard second hand how, unkind the pirating world could be so knew that if you were exposed it wouldn't be a very good experience.

• However fate seemed to say nope to your plans to stay to the side.

• It took only one incident to bring you to the forefront unfortunately..

You had been brought to the Cross Guild, seemingly Crocodile having deemed it important enough and somewhat safe to bring you here- You assumed it was due to the time he needed to be here.

Already silently choosing to stay in more private quarters- There was a lot of people, loud ones at that.. Having heard the crowd and feeling like the large bed and nice room was good enough..

Till you got hungry-

And by the noise with even with how far your room was from the main building you could hear how rowdy it was. Assuming anyone working in the kitchens wouldn't be able to assist for some time.

Truthfully from the noise alone you hoped those poor kitchen workers got paid well.

But no matter- You had no problem getting something yourself anyway.

It was a rather long walk to the main Guild, having easily been able to follow the flow of the hallways to where the main kitchens would be.

Having only briefly paused by a large archway when you heard that signature cackle-

'HE HEH HE'

Taking a peak through it was incredibly packed it seemed, You could see your husband not far off. A smile playing softly on your lips as you saw him there cackling and drinking, tormenting a blue haired clown it seemed for his own amusement, shaking your head softly at his antics- Stepping back as you went to continue your task at hand till you bumped into something.

Looking up as a rather dumpy looking pirate, a drunk one at that stared down at you.

"Woah! You're a pretty one- I thought they only had ugly whores here"

The smell of liquor on his breath made your nose wrinkle, finding him rather disgusting even in talking paired with his appearance...

"Im not an escort... I'm heading elsewhere- Excuse me" You say, Attempting to walk past him but he moved fast blocking your path fast.

"Hold On! I wasnt done- how much?" He asked, now a bit more aggressively.

"Im not a escort.. Let me through-" You say sharply. A peg of worry now going through you as he seemed to he blocking your main points kmof exit- Just large enough you could tell if you tried to move he would grab you fast.

"Still, You gotta have some sort of price, I'll make it worth your while" He sneered before grabbing your wrist hard pulling it up above your head forcing you closer to him- Your chest now touching his body to your disgust.

"HEY! Let Go of Me!" You scream out, trying to pull your wrist from him-

Feeling his free hand drift far too close to your hip-

Before you felt what could only feel like bloodlust fill the air almost choking you out.

There all hell broke lose, a slam of sand hitting the man as his hand felt like it almost dissolved from around your wrist-

Your eyes closed tightly as a yelp left you from the force as you heard the grinding of bone, wet flesh not far from you and noises you'd never want to hear ever again from a living creature- Squinting your eyes only slightly to see what was visible of your husband.

His body was nothing short of a storm with only specks of his body visible, other innocent people also getting pelted by the storm now in the building.

He was enraged- His face was twisted up as he had even dropped the cigar that usually hung from his lips, his face a twisted up growl.

"Stop" You say through the storm before you, hand reaching out gripping on the gold hook you could make out from the swirls of sand.

What could be seen of Crocodile head snapping down to look at you as you stood to his side your hand raised to block the sand blowing on your face and body. The winds picking at your clothes as you struggled to even stand.

However just like that the sand dropped- Going from a Raging sand storm to almost soft sands on a beach around you- his large form once again visible.

"... (Y/N).. You alright my Flower?"

He said rather softly, looking to you as the sand slowly started to return to him and leaving your clothes and hair- While he placed a large hand on your shoulder as his eyes darted around you, seemingly checking you over to make sure you weren't harmed by the drunk pirate.. or himself.

"Yes.. Was just a bit startled is all"

You admit, Coming down yourself from it all having not felt the force of Crocodile so angry in a incredibly long time-

You turn a bit to look behind you where you had heard what used to be a man however Crocodile hand moved fast from your shoulder to touch your cheek to stop from turning. His eyes saying it all..

This was not something for your eyes to see.

"What brought you down here Love?"

"I was just coming to grab dinner and-"

"Next time Come straight to me- I'll handle it all, Now I thought you were working on that latest book of yours?"

He cuts you off quick started to guide you back to the room with a hand on your lower back making his coat cover you from prying eyes- You can see he is still upset and know it's for the best to put him to ease speaking about your writing so far to him and staying close to him.

Crocodile listened closely, waving to servents to clean up his mess and bring the two of you dinner- before he gave a single glance back at the whole Guild as if silently threatening them all continuing on his way with you to your shared Quarters.

All of the guild now dead silent and watching- Even Buggy and Mihawk both sharing a look of- well concern...

Having never thought they would see the day someone stopped the very very short tempered Warlord with a single word.

It was frightening-

Also seeing that Sir Crocodile was angry enough he hadn't even bothered to dehydrate the poor man like how he normally did-

No

He had shredded him and leaving a bloody mess on the floor. A gorey and gruesome fate most would never think he was capable of-

It was there they all thought the exact same thing. Each member now terrified to get too drunk as they all looked at the bloody mess.

There was a person who was both held captive by the beast as well as controlled it.

And she wore a big gaudy ring-

[annabe11aa]

idc, i’m just doing them,

1. yes

2. love it, definitely better than movie but movie has a special place in my heart

3. marcia

4. johnny, pony, two, steve, darry, soda, dally (as a dally girl)

5. two bit x marcia (marbit)

6. pony x johnny, cherry x dally, darry x paul (i’m sorry.)

7. steve and dally. omg. the shitheads would be best friends. istg. also two and pony??? like??? goofball x nerd??? i love them???

8. reading it in class

9. dally realizing he loved pony and his name being his final words

10. dally harassing cherry

11. very good but sad they didn’t recognize pony and sodas relationship, also, no full gang scenes???

12. no, no

13. johnny, ralph really captures the kicked puppy look and attitude

14. two and marcia dating😭, cherry and pony becoming best friends, johnny and dally surviving…, pony becoming so much more reserved after their deaths, pony never leaving tulsa (because he cannot leave johnny and dally.), the gang splitting after their deaths.

15.JOHNNY AND PONY WERE EACH OTHERS GIRST KISS. I DONT CARE. , dally secretly loves the ronettes, darry can sing, soda is actually really smart but is a hands on learner, steve and soda aren’t as close as they seem but are just work friends that don’t really have anyone else

16.STEVE AND DALLY. DAREY AND DALLY. ANY OTHER CHARACTER BUT PONY AND JOHNNY WITH DALLY

17. not having a full gang scene, seeing how they live together

18.shipping.. especially things that just would not be happening (tim and dally..)

19. no opinion? (i think it’s REALLY WEIRD that she named tex’s horse bl@ck1e)

20. steve. (always the forgotten of the friend group.)

21. dallys attractive but genuinely a horrible person.

22. steve, marcia.

23.no opinion? haven’t seen it or listened to it yet

24.none

25.want to watch it but haven’t yet

thanks for listening to my ted talk.

Outsiders Asks

Have you read other SE Hinton books

What are your feelings on the book?

Who is your fave character OUTSIDE* of the main 7?

Rank the main 7.

What are your fave ships?

What are some ships you dislike?

What are your fave non-romantic relationships? (This can be close friends, familial, enemies or even just acquaintances)

How did you get into Outsiders?

What’s the favourite scene/moment from the book?

Least favourite scene/moment?

What’s your opinion of the movie?

Have you watched the TV Show? Do you plan to? If you have, what’s your opinion on it?

Who do you think is the most well-written character?

Tell us five of your headcanons you basically see as canon

Five headcanons that are entirely self-indulgent

Which characters would you have liked to see interact?

Are there any criticisms or salt you have with the book?

Are there any criticisms or salt you have with the fandom?

What’s your opinion on SE Hinton?

Which character do you relate to most?

Unpopular opinion/s?

Who’s a minor character in canon who you have basically projected a whole new characterisation onto?

What is your opinion on the upcoming musical so far?

What are your hopes for the musical? What do you not want happening?

Do you plan to watch the musical? Will you get tickets or watch it online?

Reblog if you want to be asked these questions!!

*sorry this wasn’t clear before

[ironworked]

i mean people were calling for bucktommy to be endgame after like two episodes lol so i don’t know why it’s so inconceivable to introduce another character that could be endgame…. except for the fact that fandom has latched so hard onto this one

Well, my opinion?

Firstly, people who were calling for Bucktommy endgame after 2 episodes were most probably being hyperbolic, more expressing appreciation for the dynamic than anything else. ETA: But it is true a lot of us got invested very early, and also there were fans who just recognized the chemistry and how different this couple was from the very beginning (this show has been training us Goldilocks-style to recognize a good LI), and wanted the series to seriously pursue this story and make them endgame. And actually it's part of the argument here: is it likely that something like that will happen again?

Why it is 'so inconceivable' to introduce another character that could be endgame: I've always said that I though getting Buck a good love interest is easy in concept because Buck is a very loving person and OS has easy chemistry with people.

However! his path during these 7.5 seasons has been leading him towards a certain type of person/relationship as he's developed as a character and he's done the trial-and-error thing with his love life. And then there's Tommy.

With Tommy they crafted a character that fit in the show and with Buck, and gave him Moments that are hallmarks of The One™ (unforgettable kiss; Dramatic entrance; Father approved; Calls him by special name...) which are now unusable for any future LI.

They've raised the bar. On season 8.

Now: how do you find someone easy to include? (journalist? done. Dispatcher? done. Firefighter? done. Meet on a call? established as Bad Idea). Buck has to date this person, and then how long do we think it's going to take him to reach the 'move in' stage after the three (3) previous attempts ended in break-ups? How do you find someone whom the audience prefers to Abby and/or Taylor and/or Tommy...?

And it better be on the first attempt too, because every relationship would take at least one season given the number of eps guest stars are contracted for, so the next break up would leave Buck starting season 10 as a single man.

Plus, the later that LI materializes and gets serious with Buck, the less time we have to see the relationship reach marriage/kids/etc. The show won't last forever!

Would it be absolutely impossible to find him another good LI? no.

Would it be damn hard? YES.

[voidoftheotherside]

PLEASE READ MY WHOLE POST UPDATE BEFORE FORMING AN OPINION. i don’t love getting into discourse but I haven’t seen anyone share this perspective so I thought I might as well, I am open to good faith discussion though.

I feel like what confuses me about the whole transandrophobia /transmisandry/ etc debate is that some people are thinking it’s the axis of misandry (not real) + transphobia and rightfully criticizing that concept, but I was under the impression it was about the intersection of sexism (based on agab & perceived “real” sex) + transphobia. And because transmisogyny is already taken and may induce dysphoria it ended up needing a different name, so the gender affirming but not perfectly descriptive transandrophobia (transandro + phobia not trans + androphobia) and the questionable transmisandry (yeah I don’t like and won’t defend this one) came about. This is why I think transandrophobia IS a valid term, HOWEVER I also agree that it’s definitely used wrong very frequently in an oppression olympics type way to minimize transfems experiences and even attack transfems. Which I do not support. But I feel like cutting out the term completely isn’t the answer because it can be used to describe, for example: certain types of malgendering, and issues around trans pregnancy care.

I’m gonna end this with another disclaimer in case the text was too long: NO “transandrophobia” is not transfems oppressing transmascs on a systemic level

YES there are people using the term transandrophobia to perpetuate harm against transfems, and that should absolutely be addressed, (I’ll try to find posts elaborating on this to tag in replies)

that just doesn’t necessarily mean the term itself should be thrown away. just like every form of oppression can be weaponized to exclude/shift the blame to other marginalized groups.

UPDATE: the above was my opinion at the time of posting but a very nice commenter linked to the coiners definition of transandrophobia, which explains a lot of what I’ve been seeing. Needless to say it’s not the above, and is imo more of an intercomunity phenomenon (that exists in various ways with various forms of oppression) than a form of oppression. So I’m now not sure what term should be used to describe the discrimination I talked about in my post, but I can agree it’s not transandrophobia. Maybe if I can’t find one I’ll coin it myself, who knows? But basically sorry for any confusion and thank you for the consideration.

[maikelfist]

I've been coming across discussions about why Tommy calls Buck "Evan". The short answer to that question is probably just that the showrunners like using it as a shortcut to create a connection between people. Some may find that cute, others may say it's artificial. Ultimately, it's a matter of opinion.

Some people believe Buck is happy with Tommy calling him Evan because for the first time he gets to be called Evan without any of the baggage attached (which might be a naive and overly romantic take, who knows). Others argue that it's rude for Tommy to call him that, saying he's unaware that Buck prefers his identity as Buck to distance himself from childhood trauma, that it symbolizes that he doesn't really know Buck all that well (and, well, of course he doesn't. That's kind of how getting to know someone works. He literally says they practically know nothing about each other during the coffee date. He's aware, not at all pretending to know Buck better than he does. I also feel that with this take, one should be careful not to take agency away from Buck. I highly doubt he would just let it happen if he minded it).

Here's my opinion on the matter: I think both names are a double-edged sword for Buck. The downside of "Evan" is that it represents his time before he became a firefighter which unfortunately is linked to a traumatic childhood. The upside is that it also represents his softer side, the part of him that isn't just a tough firefighter.

The upside of "Buck" is that it felt like a fresh beginning. Not to mention that it sounds cool, the name of a badass guy, which is definitely something Buck wanted to be in S1 (1x2 "You just have to be particularly badass which, you know, I am."). But the name "Buck" also has its downsides. It's not a name he chose for himself. There were three other Evans in his class and he wasn't the main Evan, the one allowed to keep his name. He didn't even get a variation of it. He tells Maddie about it in a PS with an "I kinda like it." (4x5).

It seems like the nickname originated from him not being the first priority again, which is a pattern that has followed him his entire life. Luckily, it worked out well because he likes what the name symbolizes. To me, Tommy calling Buck "Evan" could represent that Buck is his first priority. He is the one and only Evan for Tommy.

As much as Buck loves being a badass firefighter, he also wants to have an identity and value outside of that role. Buck is badass. Evan is soft. Both are good. Regardless of how things end, Tommy is and will always be the one who made him realize that he's allowed to like both. I'm likely reading too much into it but it’s nice to think that these steps in Buck's journey are linked.

[hiseyeisonthesparrow]

Hiya! Mormon here, so I'm sorry if I seem like a heretic taking over your post, but I actually have a half-decent answer!

So, in the Book of Mormon, there's an anti-Christ named Korihor who goes around preaching that Christ won't come and that everyone is a fool for believing in the traditions of their fathers. Alma, the prophet at the time, deals with Korihor in a couple of ways:

Ask WHY they hold the opinions they do. Alma teaches that you can't really overcome pure hate with a logical argument (as much as I wish that I could... ;v;), so the only thing we can do is question the source of the opinions. Instead of telling them their opinions are fundamentally anti-Christian because of x, y, and z, we can invite them to think more deeply about the root of their hate. The American Republican party is deeply rooted in fear (there's a very cool neuroscience study about it if you want to hear), so debating them will only solidify their beliefs. Instead, truly seek to understand them.

Preach the true gospel of LOVE and ACCEPTANCE. You cannot make them shut up, but you can proclaim your faith in God and Jesus louder than they can hate. Testifying with all the pure love of Christ that you can does wonders.

Invite them to leave! Ignore them! It is not your responsibility to convince them to be good people -- that's for the Holy Spirit to handle.

Here are some pieces of dialogue I've used to defend my positions to Christian Nationalists without coming across as inflammatory or offensive:

"Well, I remember that Jesus was a refugee, and he taught us to love "the least of us", so I really want to love my immigrant neighbors. Like the Good Samaritan -- the person that you help might be someone you don't agree with."

"God gave us the ability to choose between right or wrong. He also gave us the ability to choose to follow His path; not having a choice at all is Satan's goal. I think we should let people choose what they want to do, as long as it doesn't hurt other people."

"Sometimes I find that Satan tries to trap us by making us zoom in and only focus on one tiny detail. Taking a moment to look at the bigger picture helps me not get caught up in Satan's web of lies."

"I hope you find enough faith to overcome the fear in your heart. He wants you to have hope!"

"What are you worried about? ... Why are you so worried about it?"

"I think that God's love is the most important thing in the whole scriptures, don't you? That's why he gave us Jesus! So, because of that, I think treating people with love is more important than any rules or opinions."

The tricky part is to not come across as patronizing or insulting. Make sure to explain or defend your position rather than attacking theirs. It won't be perfect, but hopefully we can fill this world with a little more love and a little less MAGA idiocy (⁠≧⁠▽⁠≦⁠)

Guys how do you deal with the, what feels like, hypocrisy of calling out Christians Nationalists. Cause like I won’t lie it feels weird calling them out for judging other because like… yeah I’m judging you. Ya know? Idk if I’m putting this correctly.

[rainbowxocs]

(Reference coming soon)

(CURRENT THIS REFERENCE IS BASED ON THE MYTH. I WILL UPDATE IT ONCE THE MYTH IS OVER.)

Written by meeee!!

Name: Evren Nevermore!!

Alter of: Daisy Bell!!!

Role: Protector!

Alt Names: The Void, The Skybox!!

Special Titles: The Prophet.

Username: lappelduvide!! It’s a pun. Hehe.

Nicknames: Little Raven, Prophet, Caesar, Brutus.

Age: 17!!

Pronouns: Any Pronouns!!

Sexuality: eh whatever.

Gender: eh whatever.

Species: Technically, I am the same species as Daisy but like- I am a void. What is a void? Great question!! I dunno cause I kinda made it up Im going to be so for real.

Disorders: I have the same disorders as Daisy.

Physical Disabilities: I have the same disabilities as Daisy.

Religion: Daisyism, obviously.

Job: My main job is to like, protect Daisy obviously, but also to keep track of the domain and make sure everything is like chill and stable and stuff.

Lives in: I live in the Skybox/Void.

Languages: I can speak any language basically. I mean I’m literally a computer I can just google translate everything it ain’t that hard-

Height: 6ft!!

Accent: Otherwordly, No Discernible Origin.

Voice Claim: Amethyst from Steven Universe.

Spirit Level: Acceptance baby.

Powers: I have the same powers as Daisy. I just tend to focus on like reality bending stuff, wind and sky stuff, prophecy is a big one, yknow that kinda thing.

Weaknesses: I have the same weaknesses as Daisy.

Strings Form: Myyy strings are white cause we gotta MATCH obviously.

Soul: Mycena Lazulina!!

Weapons: Windforce Sword!!!

Alignment: I am chaotic neutral.

Text Color: Blueee!

Main Animal: Ravens!

Main Hobbies: I don’t really have time for hobbies with all the work I gotta do.

Favorite Food: Apples. I don’t really eat so.. not much else..

Favorite Flower: Lily of the Valleys!!! They’re pretty. Also they’re the fancy flowers you get in animal crossing.

Scent: Blueberries.

Handedness: Ambidextrous.

Blood Color: Good luck stabbing me to find out. It’s probably red though.

Awareness: Oh I am very aware.

Birthday: Same as Daisy, December 20th.

Theme:

Battle Theme:

Playlist:

Fun Facts: She knows all, She sees all, She speaks all.

Special Interests: Greek Mythology, Philosophy, History!!

Stims: Playing with clouds, flying around, spinning!!

Stimboard: [???]

Moodboard: [???]

Fashion Board: [???]

Comfort Objects: Im not a child. I don’t have any.

Here’s the part you really want to know yeah? WHAT ARE EVRENS OPINIONS ON YOU PEOPLE.

Family:

Cosmo. I feel absolutely no feelings towards this man I think he is stupid and he calls me little raven which IS RUDE. (0%)

Kriston. …he’s my dad… can we STOP TALKING ABOUT IT NOW. (100%)

The Cranes. They all seem like decent people. I haven’t met most of them.. but they keep Daisy safe and protected.. and that’s all that matters to me. (100%)

Jessa. SHE MIGHT BE MY MOM I DONT KNOW WHY ARE YOU ASKING ME SO MANY QUESTIONS GOD. (100%)

Ebro4. I go back and forth on him. I think he is a good man but he often gets.. blinded by more than his blindfold.. (30%g

Zailyn. I respect her a lot. She has done a lot of good for Daisy and protects her well. I can’t really complain about her really. (50%)

Friends:

Grat. I like Grat!! He’s a very silly demon. I have fun playing with him. :) (50%)

Zan. Zan is neat, I find her to be pretty funny. (50%)

Alice. Alice is funny, me and her often play together. She loves flying on my clouds with me. (50%)

Star. Star is neat!! I really enjoy them.. They are kinda like my personal hype squad.

Mouse. I respect her. I haven’t really interacted with her much directly due to our paths never really aligning. (50%)

Sleuth. Clockhead is funny. I like that.. he takes care of us though.. he- doesn’t have to do that.. (90%)

Romance: Aculia. Her system included in this of course. I.. really.. love her.. I- trust her wholeheartedly.. I would die for her.. (100%)

Therapist: Jonah Francois. Jonah is alright. I have no issues with him, I just am a little bit antsy when I have to bear my neck for someone.. (80%)

Enemies: Enemies is a bit of a strong word. This is more “people I disagree with on a fundamental level spiritually and emotionally”

Camilla. Okay maybe I have one enemy fuck this bitch I hope she dies in a fire. (0%)

Radio. I cannot forgive him for what he has done to Daisy. I fundamentally disagree with everything he stands for. Chaos above all else is meaningless. (0%)

Venus. If he truly thinks he can contain and control me then he is more of an idiot than I thought. (0%)

Emily. I understand why she did it, but I don’t know if I can forgive her for it. (0%)

Brief Personality: [wip]

Brief Backstory: [wip]

[mzannthropy]

Anne of the Island Book Club Chapter 28

A good one today!

Not only have I titled a post on my photography blog after this chapter, I have also quoted Anne and Marilla's exchange about June in the said blog post. It is indeed a pretty month, saying this as someone who has been doing photography for 13 years. Anyway.

Aunt Atossa croaks; as was to be expected, nobody shed any tears. Mrs Lynde says "The Elisha Wrights are thankful to be rid of her"--Mrs Elisha Wright was one of those women who visited Anne the day before her departure for Redmond to tell her college will be bad for her. I wonder if this was just a woman who turned bitter from having to have such an unpleasant person as Aunt Atossa? Mrs Lynde is a better person than me bc I would not have pitied Aunt Atossa. She chose to be like that, stupid name or not.

Davy is so funny. "Milty said his mother said Aunt Atossa would be sure to rise up in her coffin and say sarcastic things to the folks that come to see her buried. But Marilla said she didn’t." Did he believe it would happen? He'd certainly want to know.

I like people to have a little nonsense about them.

A good line from Anne! You've got have a bit of a nonsense, sometimes. Reminds of when Matthew told Anne to keep some romance, when she swore off it after her Elaine incident.

The fact that in her childhood Diana wanted to marry a bad man so that she could reform him makes me laugh in view of our current times' 'I can fix him' meme. I have zero opinion on Fred Wright owing to his zero characterisation. I don't think he ever had a line of dialogue... did he?

Now I'm coming to one of the lines in this book that have stayed with me ever since I read it for the first time.

I wouldn’t want to marry anybody who was wicked, but I think I’d like it if he could be wicked and wouldn’t.

You have to have a dark side so that nobody will mess with you. At the beginning of The Count of Monte Cristo, Edmond Dantes is a young man, naive and idealistic and you want to shout at him: "watch out for the snakes!" So yes, one should marry a good man, but one who could be wicked if circumstances arose.

Reading this chapter today, it occurred to me that Avonleans would find out about Anne refusing Gilbert eventually. At Redmond, people had to know, bc everybody would have noticed their relationship had changed. (Especially after she met Roy and he started to hang out with Christine.) And this would easily travel to Avonlea. Sure, Gilbert has spent two summer holidays in a row in Kingsport, but he would have been home for Christmas of Junior year and everyone would have noticed he is not visiting Green Gables anymore. It doesn't take a Miss Marple to guess. I mean, the narrative tells us that Moody Spurgeon's mum spread the news that Anne had a new beau, so logically, Gilbert is not her 'beau' any longer.

Also like. Okay. Anne told Miss Lavendar that Gilbert wanted to be more than friends but she didn't. But Marilla had to hear it from the local gossip...? Was Anne afraid to confide in her adoptive mother?

Lol at Mrs Rachel losing her faith in the Providence.

I can't say I relate to Anne's feelings about Diana getting married (I've never really had close friends and I moved to another country at the age of 22 so didn't go through the seeing your peers get married and start families thing anyway) but like Anne, I can imagine it. I've been listening to the book The Let Them Theory by Mel Robbins, who also touches on friendships. It's completely normal for childhood friends drift apart once they reach young adulthood and it's nothing personal. It's just life. And it's really the theme of this instalment of Anne series.

Btw I find it interesting that Mrs Barry insisted that Diana won't marry until she is 21. We're not given the reason why, but it worked for Diana and Fred bc in that time, they got to know each other well.

[colfy-wolfy]

So, update on that one post i made (that i did NOT expect to get so much attention) about wanting to write a fic about monk and survivor's parents and third sibling... yes I'm working on it!

It's taking a while though since I keep procrastinating and I want this first chapter to be as perfect as possible. But because I'm feeling nice, here's a little snip of the beginning of the first chapter, immediately after monk's intro!

The fic will be titled "The Residual Pup"

any constructive criticism is welcome, I don't have anyone to help me proofread rn.

More yapping about my fic below cut, if anyone's curious

Yes, the slugs will have dialogue, they have their own special language in my headcanon.

This fic will be primarily focused on family dynamics and might be a little.. "fierce" in terms of family relationships. This is a crumbling rat family and its not all cupcakes and rainbows... sorry, I like angst. I'm not 100% sure how harsh I wanna make this but just incase, if you find mildly abusive, controlling or broken families triggering, I would not recommend. this'll be mostly based off my own experience with my own family.

in my HC, Slugcats have a simple naming convention, similar to the way they're named in the campaigns, its usually names given by their family or peers based off their appearance or occupation/what they're known for.

The parents are named "Father Coral" for the pink slug and "Father Ivory" for the white slug. The third Sibling was simply called "the Blue One" before the incident where they were named "the Residual (pup)" after.

Most pups are named "the (Color) One" before they grow up and the slugs around them end up referring to them by what they're mostly known for. There is no official agreed name for each slugcat so usually some slugcats end up having multiple (nick)names.

Think that's all I want to say without spoiling the entire chapter... If you have questions, feel free to ask :D

[misakiisstupid]

Oh, Cass, it’s definitely a good idea. Let me tell you why!

You’ll find your own community. Tumblr has so many people who are just like you. From people who love martial arts to fans who admire your quiet strength and badassery, you’re going to connect with so many like-minded folks.

**Your meme game will be next-level. Imagine sharing all your silent but deadly moves in meme form. You can be the one to break the internet with your pure, unfiltered aesthetic. No words needed—just pure Cass Cain energy.

You can share your thoughts without saying a word. You’re good with action, Cass, but sometimes, it’s nice to have an outlet for your thoughts. Tumblr lets you share what’s going on in your mind in any form you want—text, gifs, pictures—no pressure. And sometimes, silence speaks louder than words.

**Fan art is gonna blow your mind. People are going to draw you. Like, a lot. They’ll capture your elegance, your strength, and your quiet beauty in a way that’s going to make you feel like the superhero you are. Prepare for your inbox to explode with fan creations.

You’ll have an outlet for your emotions. If you ever need to vent, Tumblr is full of people who understand. Whether you’ve had a rough day or just need to express how you’re feeling, there’s always a community here that will listen and support you.

You can keep an eye on your Batfamily. The Batfamily can be a bit… chaotic, but on Tumblr, you’ll have a front-row seat to what everyone’s up to. You’ll catch up on the latest happenings in Gotham and get all the gossip without having to sit through Bruce’s lectures.

You can share your favorite things. You know those moments when you see something you just have to share with someone? Tumblr is the perfect place for that. Post about your favorite books, music, or even those perfect ninja moves you perfected.

You can have a blog about anything. Do you know how many blogs there are about martial arts techniques, hand-to-hand combat, and training tips? You could literally start your own blog and teach people how to fight like you. Be a mentor to the next generation of heroes. I believe in you.

You can laugh at people’s ridiculous opinions. Oh, Cass, there are so many weird opinions out there, and Tumblr is all about embracing and roasting them. You can enjoy the chaos, and it’ll be your little secret. Trust me, it’ll give you endless entertainment.

No one will make you talk unless you want to. If you don’t feel like engaging, that’s totally fine. Tumblr’s all about letting people be themselves. You can observe, interact when you feel like it, or just scroll through posts without saying a word. It’s about your pace, your rules.

You can be an anonymous badass. If you ever feel like showing off your ninja moves or sharing some cool action clips, you can do it all anonymously. Be a mystery, leave people in awe, and just let your actions speak louder than your name.

You can write your own story. You’re an incredible fighter and hero, but your story is also one of growth, struggle, and triumph. Tumblr allows you to tell that story, whether through your own words, your art, or whatever you choose. And people will respect that.

You’ll find support when you need it most. We all have our battles, Cass. On Tumblr, you’ll find so many people who understand, offer advice, and give you the support you need to keep pushing forward. You’re never alone here. Trust me on this.

So yeah, joining Tumblr? Definitely a good idea. You’re gonna crush it, just like you always do.

Hi, I'm Cassandra.

Someone recommended me to join this place to socialize more. Maybe it's a good idea hm.

[camellcat]

lose my mind every time the doctor takes rose's last name in fics. brilliant, amazing, splendid, absolutely perfect.

like, what do you MEAN she'd be the one to change her last name? he doesn't even HAVE a bloody name like us! plus, she's rose tyler. you think he's going to want that to be different? it's the doctor and rose tyler in the tardis (or I suppose whatever they do in pete's world, but that's still the doctor and rose tyler having their new adventure)!!

she's rose tyler and he is whatever-he-wants tyler. end of discussion. the whole pond diabolical should've been clue enough imo

[autismswagsummit]

I submitted some fictionalised version of historical figures. Is this ok? Since they’re not accurate depictions of the people who share their name.

This is another vague area that in practice, I have to treat with some level of individual consideration for each nomination, however I checked which nomination is (most likely) yours and I will say firmly that your character will not be making it into the bracket. To avoid ambiguity and cut straight to the point, the real life version of this character was a slave owner, and I do not feel that (even in a parody/rewritten form) slave owners should have a place in this competition. I hope you will understand where I'm coming from with this

[frameconfessions]

Fuck the Game Awards. Fucking Geoff Keeley or whatever his name is spelled snubbed them back in like 2016 when they were up for nomination and was like “oh well maybe next year huh." Then we never saw Warframe in the voting again because they now only use Warframe as a side piece for advertising so I guess they aren't even allowed for a labor of love or a long time beloved game award or something. I'm still salty about that shit, fuck Geoff and this rigged ass awards show for real! I'm just here for the drops and Warframe or Soulframe news at this point.

💯

Why the fuck does Fortnite get in but not Warframe? This shit sucks.

WARFRAME SHOULD HAVE BEEN HERE IN ONE OR BOTH OF THESE!!

[james-stark-the-writer]

just finished Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney, and it is a game written by cowards for cowards.

the final twist genuinely ruins the game. it's so stupid as a narrative decision. i hate it so much. it almost makes me understand what the people yelling about The Last Jedi being too subservient to its themes were yelling about (OBVIOUSLY not the ones that were being bigoted and loud and wrong about it, but just the ones who had actual issues with its narrative directions/execution). genuinely, the twist takes what could have been an extremely solid 8.5, maybe a 9/10 game down to a 4/10 game with nothing of interest to say deluding itself into thinking it's saying anything of worth by thoughtlessly repeating patterns as if that's supposed to generate meaning without any real effort of actually committing to that meaning, or seeing the world as anything beyond its basic binary worldview of Good and Bad.

putting that twist in fundamentally cuts the legs out from any actual, interesting and substantive critique it could have leveled at the legal system and our feelings about people on trial and their perceived guilt or innocence, and it just ends up reinforcing it as a power of good that Will Ultimately Prevail In The Search For Truth, as if that is even remotely a thing any legal system is concerned with, especially the one in the game that mostly just stumbles into The Right Choices because it's a game controlled by the player. it's frankly ideologically incoherent to the point of saying nothing because its critique is unfocused and toothless. best it can muster is "maybe some people are corrupt and lying, but if You take Advantage of The System, you can beat them" as if malicious compliance is supposed to change the system. fuck off.

ran out of tags but. i'm serious about this lol, i really hate it as a narrative and ideological choice. the game threatens to say something bold and interesting and then just pulls the rug out from underneath you. it sucks. it's very much like 12 Angry Men in that way, i think, except at least that movie Knows what it's saying and that its basic premise is its ideological downfall, this just doesn't really feel like it says anything much interesting or coherent, ultimately, because the criticism either drowns in the length and comedic nature of it, or just ultimately isn't focused and pointed and nuanced enough to actually say something meaningful. like ik someone's gonna do a "kid's game" thing but hello, kid's shit has always been nuanced and just bc it's "for kids" doesn't mean it has to abide by some binary ass morality that flattens all its interesting critique, especially when you're constantly led, structurally, to the more interesting and nuanced narrative choice only to have a twist completely ruin it and making it all feel like a waste of your time. plenty of things are nuanced and interesting and "for kids" without deflating their themes and messages by writing a stupid twist that undercuts the interesting parts of its arguments.

[necrotic-nephilim]

What do you think of alfred/bruce?

!!! good question, i love them so dearly.

shipping Bruce can get difficult when you want to put him in the position of submission. it's not impossible and there are characters you can make him submit (Clark and Diana are the obvious choices) but they're not characters who would any significant power over him, so for the fun of like, fucked up power play, unless you're doing something like an Injustice or Justice Lords AU, it's hard. so if you want to ship Bruce with someone who holds an implicit power over hi him and has the rare ability to tell him what to do, the answer is Alfred. which is just so fun.

because i personally really enjoy putting Bruce in a submissive role. it's a subversion of what you expect out of him, and subverts a lot of his key character traits. he's someone who *requires* control as a part of his personal regiment, part of his mission. he doesn't like to give it up, and he won't give it up to just anyone. when he does give it up, it's always conditional. the few times he gives someone like Dick control, he always takes it right back. Alfred is one of, if not the only person who has full control over Bruce. he can tell Bruce what to do, and Bruce will listen. it's still not perfect and Bruce will go against him, but largely, he can and will exert that control when he feels it's necessary. so that's so fun to play with romantically. especially with the aspect of him not only raising Bruce, but knowing Bruce practically his whole life. Alfred has just always Been There. he's a constant pillar.

and i had an interesting conversation with a mutual about how Alfred's life pretty much revolves around Bruce. Alfred will toss aside his own blood family (Julia) to prioritize Bruce. how Alfred behaves around the rest of the Batfam is defined by their relationship to Bruce and his love for them is often just an extension of his love for Bruce. it's complete devotion from Alfred, and if you make it romantic, it immediately borders on obsession. there's no. "healthy" version of this ship and that's the fun of it. especially if it's a Year One type era, where it's just the two of them. but it's also fun to introduce the rest of the Batfam and see their reactions to it. how long they take to notice, what they feel about it, etc.

these two are so intertwined in a very similar Batman/Robin way, in that most superhero spoofs have a butler for a reason- you just can't separate Bruce from Alfred unless you're willing to kill one of them off. we treat Alfred like this kindly old man who's just there to make tea and witty remarks, but in reality this man is a war vet who served in MI-5. he's rough around the edges in a way that if he and Bruce had met under any other circumstances, they likely wouldn't get along. Alfred has killed people in combat, he has no reason to believe in a no-kill rule and would see the flaws in it. but it's *Bruce*, a man he's been devoted to since the Waynes died. someone Alfred watched grow up.

if i were to personally write them together, i'd have them get together after Bruce leaves and trains for years. because who Bruce is when he leaves Gotham and who he is when he returns are two very different people. and Alfred still lives him wholly, but this isn't a traumatized boy anymore, this is a man who's systematically turned himself into a weapon. and so when Alfred agrees to help, it comes with a natural relationship that's complicated and has built-in fucked up power dynamics. Alfred is the one person who can get away with telling Bruce what to do, killing for Bruce, and taking care of him when he's emotionally vulnerable. there's a deep level of trust in all of that so i really love it and wish we had more of it. you can take it to the extreme dead dove end of things, or play with it in a more domestic sense and both. both are good.