#Yang Chan

[lavaflowe]

Commission for @xxtheturtlefromhellxx !! It’s from their super cool fic you guys should totally read ✨✨✨✨

[the-monkey-ruler]

I am not familiar with the rules so I am curious (I love reading all your explanations so much), what are the rules in the underworld? Can everyone just go there? or is Sun Wukong an exception? Like, is death permanent for the demons/gods/mortals alike? Or is there some process they have to go through to be rebirth? Because I am wondering if (this is like speculation/headcanon) there was ever a chance for Erlang's older brother to be reborn/rebirth, or if Erlang had ever thought of going down the underworld to find him? I am so interested in the Yang Siblings, because despite not being there, I love that Yang Jiao haunts both of his siblings, like being known as Second Son and Third Sister feels like a reminder that they had an older brother, haha.

I am not familiar with the rules so I am curious (I love reading all your explanations so much), what are the rules in the underworld?

Actually funny enough someone gave a GREAT explanation of the death/rebirth process and what that would look like to an average person! @ryin-silverfish made a wonderful comprehensible and walk-through guide of what dying and going through rebirth are like for normal human beings and what they are most likely to see.

Can everyone just go there?

It sounds like you are more asking if people that are alive and are planning to stay alive can go to the underworld?

Normally for most humans, this isn't the case as the only way for a mortal to go to the underworld is to die. As for Immortals or gods then they would have the Walking Cloud (at the very least) and should be able to physically go to the underworld however I don't see most deities doing so without at least some cause or permission. The underworld is run like a business/branch of government/etc. so if a deity goes there and just gets in the way then that could still be rude. In short, I can see deities CAN go but if they don't have a reason then it would be better if they stay out of the way.

or is Sun Wukong an exception?

Sun Wukong is always the exception. He is different from most and if not all deities as he is shown to move and travel anywhere without fear of repercussions. Wukong goes to the underworld because he KNOWS he can and knows that no one can stop him even if he holds other deities' duties to do so. Wukong has no qualms about having others be inconvenienced for his sake and shows this well when he goes to the underworld multiple times in the journey to recruit people's help. It isn't... proper to say the least but Wukong never let social etiquette stop him from completing his goals. I doubt any other deities would have the gall but Wukong has the power to back up his boldness so no one really stops him.

Like, is death permanent for the demons/gods/mortals alike?

"Permanent" isn't really... permanent so to speak. If we are talking about general yao/deities/mortals then all things have a soul and eventually, these souls are all trapped in the wheel of reincarnation. The only beings that are outside of this trap are the Buddha (hence Wukong reaching his goal for true immorality/freedom at the end). There are different details depending on which dynasty lore you might be looking at but all beings are still bound by reincarnation and can still die.

Mortals normally die as such with old age or being killed and thus they go back to the underworld, get evaluated, and go through the incarnation process after their memory is wiped.

Yao are just spirits that skip their human cycle and try to cheat in their animal/object life. If you don't know how yao work read this and understand that Yao are just animals/objects that cultivate to get a humanoid form. Once they die/killed their souls go back into the cycle and either pay for the karma by one of the judges, or they are reincarnated back into their animal/object form to properly life out their lives until they get enough karma to be a human. Or maybe they were a good enough Yao and can be a human in their next life.

Deities while immortal can still be killed. I've seen in Journey to the South how some deities can even use reincarnation to avoid being arrested by heaven by being reborn as someone else and still retaining their past life's memories. This is illegal as you SHOULD have your memory wiped before you are reborn but it can happen if a person goes through other means. But in most cases, if a deity is 'killed' then they would most likely go to the underworld, live out their good karma in a paradise and then be reborn in a very good life. Usually, when I see deities being sent into the reincarnation cycle it is usually a punishment and they will eventually come back to heaven once they have earned their cultivation all over again. We see this with Tang Sanang who was the Golden Cicada who had to live through 10 lifetimes of pure lives to get back to where his cultivation needed to be. And we see this with Zhu Bajie who was reborn as a pig but turned into a yao as he kept his past life's cultivation.

Or is there some process they have to go through to be rebirth?

The process should be the same for everyone going through the judgment halls. But there are certainly a lot of cases of people coming back from the dead (like in FYSS) or mortals being deified after death when they are worshipped.

But normally mortals/yao/deities have their karma weighted and depending on their good/bad deeds they either be reborn into a life that is easy or one that is filled with struggles. If they are really bad then they are usually born as an animal/object as punishment until their next life to be a human to work for a better life. Hence why Yao tend to cheat and skip to the humanoid form so they don't have to live out their lives as animals/objects.

Because I am wondering if (this is like speculation/headcanon) there was ever a chance for Erlang's older brother to be reborn/rebirth, or if Erlang had ever thought of going down the underworld to find him?

Yang Jaio would have been reborn certainly as that is the process all mortals go through.

However, by the time Erlang got his own cultivation/enough power to fight the Jade Emporer, I personally think that Yang Jaio would have been reincarnated and forget all his past life. Erlang could certainly go to the underworld and perhaps ask about his brother's next life but at that point this wouldn't be the brother he would know and would be someone with his soul but not his memories.

He could still go and look but depending on if Erlang would want the weight of knowledge knowing who his brother would be and living out hundreds of mortals' lives might be exhausting.

I am so interested in the Yang Siblings, because despite not being there, I love that Yang Jiao haunts both of his siblings, like being known as Second Son and Third Sister feels like a reminder that they had an older brother, haha.

This is a personal headcanon of my own because I love the Yang siblings but I always liked to think that Yang Jiao got reborn as the Howling Sky Dog so that he was always by his brother's side even after death.

[relmint-draws]

LISTEN--I just find the concept of Erlang getting an unspoken crush on Wukong after their death battle SO FUNNY

[relmint]

I made memes for my Divergence AU

[antidotefortheawkward-art]

___, Two, Three

[ID: An illustration of the Yang siblings in their childhood and in the present. The Yang siblings are running happily to the left in their childhood, arm in arm and laughing. Yang Jiao, dressed in red, holds a stick. Yang Jian, dressed in maroon, grabs onto Yang Jiao's arm, himself holding a slingshot. Dressed in yellow, Yang Chan is similarly holding onto Yang Jian's arm, with a wooden sword in her free hand and another tied to her belt. In the present, Yang Jian and Yang Chan are uncolored, dressed as gods and both looking off to the right side forlornly. They stand at roughly the same position as their childhood selves, so that there is a noticeable empty spot at where Yang Jiao should have been. End ID]

[mstrchu]

happy year of the rabbit...!

[aryshacore]

Yang Jian ☓ text posts 3

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[baby-yongbok]

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[wolfchans]

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[the-monkey-ruler]

I've seen people mention that Sun Wukong got married or at least, one of the versions mentions that. It makes me wonder how it works because if we assume that Wukong was a monk's student, then why is there a version where he gets married? I also wanted to know a little more about that version you mentioned that Erlang was married

You might be talked about the Zaju play version which was an earlier version of the Sun Wukong we know today.

That version of Wukong is a vicious, perverted, stupid, cowardly version of Wukong that was actually formed to be the comedic relief (similar to how Bajie is considered the clown in Xiyouji) of the play and to be considered a clown to be laughed at rather than the intelligent, strong, and cunny Wukong we get in the Wu Cheng'en's version. In the Zaju version Wukong kidnapped himself a wife before he became a monk, Princess of the Golden Cauldron country, against her will I might add, and kept her as a trophy in his cave. He also makes several passes at other women like Princess Iron Fan and the Queen of Women's Kingdom in the play, and even Sanzang suggesting that the monk wants him for his "thin waist."

Needless to say, this version is vastly different than the one that was created nearly 200 years after the play when Wu Cheng'en made Wukong to be more of a mischievous rascal rather than a full blown clown to be mocked by the audience. There have been no modern interpretations of this Sun Wukong as the Wu Cheng'en version is considered the 'canon' Wukong. The reason that Zaju at least make someone sense is that he got married before he was a Monk.

There are some media that does have Wukong with a wife but those are by different authors after Wukong completes his journey. Journey to the West Supplement has it that he married Princess Iron Fan in a dream. Journey to the South suggests that maybe Wukong marries as he has direct kids (assumed biological) but never mentions he has a wife actually. And of course some more modern media has that he has children without or without a wife being mentioned. Depends on what you are watching. And the best I can tell you is that those authors simply are asking that their audience give a little 'suspicion of disbelief' that I have talked about before for the sake of having the narrative flow. NO, it does NOT make sense and it CAN'T really work logically but rather than focusing on that, that plot point is largely ignored to continue the narrative. Such as Wukong just having kids and not mentioning a wife or simply never acknowledging how that doesn't make sense. I talked about that a bit when discussing Wukong's failed romances in media before as there are a lot of movies and shows where Wukong does have a SO but they are usually met with a death fate for the sake of continuity. So there are many versions where he does get married, even if none of them make continuity sense.

And yeah! Lotus Lantern Prequal 2009 was the one where Erlang Shen got married and divorced! It was made after the Lotus Lantern TV show 2005 which was such a hit it made this spinoff. I'll put a link for you if you want to see it! But it pretty much just follows Erlang Shen and his sister Sanseng Mu and how their lives led up to the Lotus Lantern 2005 show.

[relmint-draws]

I miss them

[relmint]

Working on something for the seebleengs because I am normal about them <333

[hyunchans]

FELIX :: CHARMER @ LOLLAPALOOZA 2024

[aryshacore]

Yang Jian ☓ text posts part 1