#Writing Compelling Villains
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The Psychology of Villains: Creating Memorable Antagonists
In the captivating tapestry of storytelling, villains are the shadows that dance across the pages, casting darkness and conflict that breathe life into the narrative. Crafting a memorable antagonist is a delicate art, one that requires an understanding of the psychology that makes villains not just formidable but compelling. In this exploration of the psychology of villains, we will dissect the…
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#Antagonist Psychology#Anti-Heroes#Character Arcs#Character Development#Character Flaws#Character Motivation#Complex Characters#Moral Dilemmas#Relatable Villains#Sympathetic Backstories#Villains in Fiction#Writing Compelling Villains
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Clear Sky threw his son in front of a fox?!
YES!! He SHOVED him in front of a fox! It's in fury from the fact Thunder refused to kill Frost. This entire section is VERY poorly paced and glances over it in two paragraphs, so most people don't fully register it.
Clear Sky dragged Thunder down off the stump and shoves him at it, blaming him for bringing the fox to camp with his loud disobedience.
He then leaves Thunder to fight this fox on his own. Leaf and Falling Feather jump in to help him of their own accord. Clear Sky then tries to praise him for being strong and Thunder tells him to shove off for the first and last time.
It's not the last baby of his he knowingly and consciously endangers to prove a point. In Moth Flight's Vision, he refuses to allow Acorn Fur to get medical help for Tiny Branch's fox-inflicted injuries until his condition worsened, bellowing, "SkyClan does NOT ask for help unless there's no choice." AND didn't allow her to complete her training after he caused Micah's death.
Clear Sky is a serial child abuser. He is willfully neglectful, emotionally abusive, and physically violent.
#Cw child abuse#Clear Sky wc#Clear Sky is like ACTUALLY evil.#I keep coming back to this... Clear Sky is the sort of realistic evil that you actually see in real people.#He's... nuanced isn't the right word. But deep. He has interesting thoughts and watching his mental gymnastics is compelling.#The Erins could never write such a compelling villain on purpose though#Because they *do* believe in Fundamentally Good and Fundamentally Bad people#Slash and One Eye deserve death and betrayal because they are Fundamentally Bad and so there's only one way to stop them.#But meanwhile Clear Sky is just 'misunderstood' even when he misunderstands his claws into someone's eye sockets#Probably because his faith in the lord jesus/StarClan makes it all ok. Weird how the Fundamentally Evil cats all follow different religions#Warrior cats analysis#Thunder Rising
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listen to my Voice, hero
TW: mind control, hypnotic induction, intimate whumper, restraints, corruption
Are your bonds comfortable, Hero? I wouldn't want to cause any damage to your precious muscles and nerves. You are the city's shining hope, after all. Or at least, you have been until now.
Good, now we can have a proper chat. You can just listen carefully to everything I have to say.
Oh, don't glare at me like that. How many times have we clashed now? And every time you manage to resist my lovely compelling Voice just enough to stop my plans, just enough so that I must escape by the skin of my teeth. You must have known it might come to this eventually, a time when my compulsions are too strong for you to fight, a time when my Voice finally brings you to your knees.
I've been training, dear hero, training especially for you. Training for you, because you're really the only one in this city worth controlling. You're better than all of them. We both know that. And I know how you feel about me, because I've seen the look in your eyes when my compulsions take hold of your pretty little mind.
No, no, be quiet. Be quiet.That's it, there you are. Oh, the delicious expression on your face when I use my Voice on you. I'll never get enough of it.
Most heroes look terrified, you know, to have their thoughts pulled out from under them, to find their body out of their control. Terrified, angry, defiant -- that's how the other heroes look. But you're different. In that moment when I weave my spell on you, when you feel your mind go hazy and your body stop obeying your commands, I see something else in your eyes. I see relief. Deep, unmistakable relief.
No, don't try to deny it. I've tangled with you too many times to be wrong about this. You're relieved when I compel you. You'd never admit it, not even to yourself, but you long for the way it feels. You long to have your choices taken away. You long to not have to make decisions. You long to not have to fight any more.
But every time, you fight. Every time, you break free of my Voice. And I can see the toll it takes on you. That's why I've been training so hard, Hero. So that you couldn't resist my Voice, wouldn't be able to break free. So that I could give you what you want more than anything.
I've seen you, Hero. I've seen you at your best and at your lowest, haven't I? I understand you better than anyone else in the city. You know it's true. And I can see how exhausted you are. How you've been worked to the bone. How you never get to rest, never get a vacation. I even tried cutting back on my evil schemes in the hopes that you'd take a break, but all you did was pursue other villains twice as hard.
There are deep bags under your eyes, Hero, marring your beautiful face. There's resignation in your tone that was never there before. I can't stand it, can't stand the way the city treats you. You're destroying yourself to save this ungrateful, useless population and all they do is criticize you. It makes me sick.
And I know what you do once you've defeated me and I escape back to my lair. I know you return to your cold, empty apartment, and curl up on the couch with some convenience food, trying to relax. I know how you toss and turn at night, wondering if you're doing the right thing. I know how lonely you are, Hero. I'm lonely too, you know.
I wish you could see how glassy and dazed your eyes are right now. It's beautiful. Listening to my Voice is so nice, isn't it? Yes, that's it, just relax.
Oh, your hair is so soft. I bet you haven't had a tender touch like this in a while. I saw you lean into it before you caught yourself. Let me run my hand through your hair, there's a good, relaxed hero. Is that a sleepy little smile I see? You like that, don't you?
In fact, you like all of this, don't you? You like having no choice but to relax and listen as my compelling Voice weaves a spell around you. You like the feeling as I slowly hypnotize your vulnerable mind, how your resistance slips away little by little. You've thought about this on those lonely nights, haven't you? What it would feel like if I won. What it would feel like to succumb to my hypnotic compulsions. What it would feel like if you stopped fighting and let me take charge of your mind completely.
Oh, don't struggle. Don't struggle. Relax.There it is again, that relief. My Voice feels good, doesn't it? It feels so good to have the fight taken out of you. Don't deny it, it's written all over your face.
You don't need to pretend you haven't thought about it. You somehow manage to always be the first hero on the scene whenever I try anything. Almost as if you're willing to drop anything to see me, isn't it?
But you were scared. I'm a villain, after all. I don't deny it. You must think I might hurt or humiliate you. Well, you can put all of your fears to rest, because I have no intention of that. I respect you far too much. I'm going to take good care of you, Hero. I'm going to give you the treatment you deserve. I'm going to help you relax. I'm going to take all your worries away. It's going to feel amazing, Hero, I promise.
I'm sorry, were you trying to say something just now? Still trying to fight it? You'll have to speak up, it's too hard to hear you when you're so out of it.
"It's wrong"? Is that what you said, Hero?
No, what's wrong is how little reward you get for everything you do. That's why I had to do this, had to train my Voice to be strong enough to be irresistible even to you. Now I can reward you. I can give you everything you want, everything you need, beginning with the beautiful, relaxing oblivion of total and complete obedience.
You'll get other rewards, too, of course you will. Together we'll share in the riches of the city, bend everyone in power to our wills. It's what we both deserve. But this is your first and most important reward -- obedience. Nothing is more calm, relaxing, and peaceful than knowing you have no choice, than having every decision made for you.
And all you have to do is listen.
I'm too strong for you now, Hero, my Voice too compelling. You're almost entirely under my spell, aren't you? I can see how drowsy you are, how my compulsions are putting your conscious mind to sleep.
Yes, that's it. You're too exhausted, Hero. Too tired. Too many nights with too little sleep. You need to rest. You need to stop fighting. You need to surrender.
No one will think any less of you. They'll see how powerful I've become, how easily I can command even the strongest and smartest. They'll realize you had no choice, that it was out of your hands. You won't need to feel guilt or shame. Everyone will know this wasn't your fault, that there was nothing you could do to prevent yourself falling under my villainous control.
And the fact that you actually enjoy this, the fact that you long to give in so badly and fall under my hypnotic trance? That can be our little secret, Hero.
There we go. That's it, just a little more. Look into my eyes. Look nice and deep into my eyes while I stroke your hair and talk you down softly. Just like you've always dreamed of. No more fear, no more pain. Only sweet restful sleep and deep hypnotic trance.
That's it, Hero. It's too late. You're too tired, too drowsy, too captured in my Voice to fight it. There's nothing to do. Nothing you have to do. Just feel yourself growing oh so dazed and sleepy as I weave my Voice around you. So comforting. So right. Exactly what you wanted. Exactly what you needed. Exactly where you belong.
Tell me, Hero, tell me you want this.
That's it, that's it! Oh, how I've longed to hear those words from you. Tell me how my Voice makes you feel. Be honest.
Oh. Oh, my. That's... that's even better than I expected. Far, far better. You love my Voice that much? Oh, Hero, dear Hero, why didn't you say so before? You could have had this any time. I would have been more than happy to bring you to my lair and give you the hypnosis you deserve. You could have been listening to my Voice all day.
Well, it doesn't matter now, because now you can have my Voice all you want, stronger than it's ever been. Isn't that nice? Oh, look at you bob your drowsy head. I don't even need to compel agreement out of you. You're so deeply hypnotized, aren't you? Good, good. Good hero.
My hero.
Now, why don't you go all the way under? Just keep listening and let your eyelids grow oh so heavy. Let those heavy eyes close. Don't open them again. That's a good hero. So obedient and docile. You're so, so beautiful to me, my drowsy, docile hero.
Yes, docile. That's what you are, deep down inside. All your strength, all your determination to do the right thing, all of that is a mask that conceals who you really are. A docile and obedient little lamb. And no one needs to know that but me. I'll fulfill your deep craving to be hypnotized and controlled, and you can still be every bit as strong and determined when you're working under my orders. Doesn't that sound just perfect for you?
All the way under, now, deep into hypnotic trance. Let your resistance fade, my hero. Let your mind fog. Let your mental defenses fall.
Surrender. Surrender and submit. Submit to me, just like you've always wanted.
You can finally feel that relief. You can finally take that rest. Because I have you now. You're mine. I'm in complete control now, my docile little hero.
And I order you to feel nothing but bliss.
Masterlist
If you like this, you may like "the defiant princess" for more gentle, slow induction on a resisting subject.
#whump#whump writing#whumpee#whumper#hero whumpee#villain whumper#mind control#hypnosis#hypnotic induction#hypnotized#hypnotized hero#captured hero#compelling voice
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i think my problem with this dw season arc accusing the audience of fanbrain for theorising about ruby is that it both feels deceitful and isn't actually that compelling from a character perspective. the season goes out of its way to build up supernatural mystery around ruby and even invokes susan more heavily than ever before in a way that is deliberately trying to get the audience to make those connections. and then it turns around and says you stupid idiot why would you ever try to connect these dots i have deliberately tried to get you to connect.
building up a mystery only for the character to be ordinary is an impossible girl arc redux only this time accusing the viewer of failing to see the humanity of the companion, whereas the impossible girl arc was turning that accusation on the doctor. 7b didn't really blame the audience for viewing clara as a puzzle and in fact several times spells out the fact that clara is perfectly ordinary before the big reveal to give the audience a chance to catch on. as 7b goes on, instead of laying the mystery on thicker, the audience just gets more and more affirmations that clara is a normal human being (rings of akhaten, journey to the centre of the tardis, hide). i found this approach compelling because it was rooted in character, focusing on the doctor's disconnection from humanity/the gendered dynamic of a man treating a woman as his manic pixie mystery to pull him out of grief. s14's meta approach of accusing the viewer feels both unfair, given it has deliberately led the viewer towards theorising, and personally less compelling to me because it wasn't tied into character in any way.
the thing about rey's parentage in tlj is that the reason rian johnson chose to go for that reveal was that it was the only answer that was interesting. none of the theories - rey is a skywalker, rey is a kenobi, and even the eventually canonical rey is a palpatine - were interesting or satisfying because they brought nothing compelling to the table for the story being told. the only satisfaction to be gained from those answers was a fanbrained "omg rey is important because she's related to that guy from the other movie." on top of that, rey desperately wants her parents to have been important, to give her life and her abandonment some kind of significance. so them being ordinary provided the most compelling trajectory for her character because it was the thing she least wanted to hear. it forced her to do the most introspection and growth, as well as tying into the film's themes about the capacity of ordinary people to be special. it wasn't just a choice made to "gotcha" the viewer, it was rooted in character.
i don't think ruby's mother being ordinary accomplishes the same thing. by invoking susan, s14 is engaging with the most egregious example of the doctor's streak of abandonment, which has potential to be very compelling in relation to ruby (and now also the doctor's) own abandonment issues. theories that ruby might be susan, or be somehow related to susan, or somehow related to the doctor, weren't just fanbrained "omg she's related to that guy i know from the classic series." they were theories genuinely rooted in character and the potential to explore both the doctor and ruby's issues with abandonment. and this is something the show willingly led fans towards by invoking susan so much in the first place. so for the show to turn around and act like they were shallow out of nowhere ideas when they were not shallow and were based on potential character conflicts the show itself deliberately invoked, feels misguided.
as well as that, ruby's mother being ordinary does not require that same growth from ruby as it did for rey because it is exactly what ruby wanted to hear. she never wanted her mother to be important, she just wanted to know who her mother was and have a connection with her. so finding out she was a normal woman who still loves her and wants to be a part of her life is everything she's ever wanted. it doesn't introduce interesting conflict for her the way rey's parents being ordinary did for her, because they were written as different characters with different hangups over their abandonment.
tl;dr i don't necessarily dislike ruby's mother being ordinary as an idea but compared to the things it was inspired by - 7b and star wars - it is not nearly as compelling in terms of how it relates to the characters or themes. and the meta angle, while conceptually interesting, doesn't quite work for me because it feels a little manipulative of the audience.
#blahs#dw#dw spoilers#like to be clear i'm not necessarily saying ruby's mother SHOULD have turned out to be susan#i'm saying that if it was always going to be an ordinary woman then rtd should've constructed a better arc around that#bc for the one he did write it's not that compelling of an answer. it doesn't really move anyone forward except maybe the doctor himself#bc the doctor is now sad that ruby has what he can never find#like yeah okay that's interesting... next season. and for the doctor. but not really for ruby!! and not for s14 as a whole!!#and like pulling the rug out of a mystery like this is something moffat also did a lot#like invoking the name of the doctor only to not reveal it or teasing the hybrid as a big alien villain only for it to be twelveclara#but the thing about those is that moffat never makes the answer that he rejects genuinely compelling#like he rejects learning the doctor's name bc there is nothing compelling about knowing it and he never tries to make you think there is#he rejects the hybrid as a warrior alien bc there's nothing compelling about that and he doesn't try to make you think there is#i feel subversive moffat mysteries are always leading you towards why the answer he gives you is the most compelling one#which i don't think s14 accomplishes. instead it's like haha! tricked you! your genuinely interesting theories are silly and dumb!#idk. i see the vision but i don't think it was handled with a deft hand so it ended up kind of a mess that didn't land imo
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here's the thing. laudna would have stopped it. if she knew delilah was about to fracture the gnarlrock. if she could parse her own feelings from hers.
and here's the thing. imogen has been plagued by nightmares for a decade. and this rock is the first bit of solace outside of her trust in laudna that she has ever had.
and laudna was just involved in shattering it. this tiny bit of solace.
and. here's the thing: laudna would've stopped it.
and. here's the thing. imogen would've stopped it. the only reason imogen didn't go is because she was specifically afraid that she would attempt to intervene and ruin their relationship with the volition before it ever began.
and here's the thing. liliana set out 25+ years ago specifically to spare her daughter. and that seemingly has not ever wavered as her core motivation. but people keep being drawn to the moon. kids keep being drawn towards the moon. and liliana is a mother. she was a mother before she ever knew she was an exaltant.
for 25+ years she has worked to "cure" imogen. the only solace she probably ever received was in at least attempting to console the kids who found themselves lured in by her same pull.
liliana begs imogen not say that they may have to kill each other. she breaks at hearing imogen's resolve. but there's kids, imogen. there's kids here. imogen. she can't leave. she's a mom.
and, here's the thing: imogen's her daughter. the daughter liliana left. or tried to leave. the daughter she only had through dreams. and imogen is working with the volition. and imogen has been her sole drive for 25+ years.
and imogen might have just been involved in shattering the little solace she might have ever had.
and, here's the thing: imogen would've stopped them.
#DOES.THIS MAKE SENSE. DO YOU UNDERSTAND. I AM RUNNING ON THREE HOURS OF SLEEP AND AM HALLUCINATING I THINK#imogen temult#Liliana temult#laudna cr#critical role#cr spoilers#'did she know!?' well! yes but no!#god liliana. you awful hypocritical woman. PLEASE let me kiss you on the mouth#I do fear my writing which is meant to be more Perspective Driven will sound defensive rather than deeply interested but. alas#the anger in liliana just threw me back to imogen's post gnarlrock and I was like OHO. OH. INCH RESTING#I love when women are not great and bad#that being said. I do feel some of you are forgetting that liliana didn't like. steal kids from their families lol#she's a sympathetic villain! she's a tragedy!#anyway it is just far more compelling to me that she is lost in the sauce but ultimately we'll intentioned than just like. an idiot.#as some seem to think#ANYWAY. again. I just love women. and liliana is a woman and also a loser. what am I to do
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The reason why Beron Vanserra is a compelling villain is because he’s cunty, he’s cocky, and he believes he’s doing the right thing. He isn’t entirely deplorable; he fought for the humans twice, didn’t he? And he didn’t submit to Amarantha. And his own attitude towards his children is likely him repeating a cycle of violence. He abuses his children to make them stronger because that’s all he ever knew, and in his mind, it worked because he’s High Lord. He doesn’t hit his kids simply for the sake of hitting them; he truly believes he’s benefiting them in the long run. Imagine if he loves his wife too; it adds another layer of tragedy to it all. His wife, the mother of his children, the love of his life, will forever be soul-bonded to another person. I’m not excusing him hitting her; that is obviously wrong. But you can sympathize a little bit, seeing how hard his life was, and wonder if he would’ve turned out different with better parents. But we likely won’t get all this information and Beron will become another boring, flat villain, so it’s up to us to bring the nuance.
#beron vanserra#i am not a fan of him#he reminds me of my own father#but he’s a compelling villain#and vanserras are fun to write
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you know, we talk a lot about characters and/or relationships (of all kinds) being 'doomed by the narrative' around here, and how haunting and gut-wrenching that can be, especially when it so often takes the form of death and destruction and tragedy.
and we should keep doing that, obviously. death and destruction and tragedy kick total ass.
however. can we please spare a thought for the clowns trapped in that same (burning) room?
after all, what is a comic relief character if not doomed by the narrative to always act like a buffoon despite any and all circumstances, all for the sake of relieving narrative tension?
how must it feel, to have everyone around you dropping dead, losing limbs, losing loved ones, and otherwise being on the receiving end of unending torment - and all you can do is stand there and prattle off another zinger at your allotted time?
and what if you lose a loved one yourself, o jester mine? what if - hear me out - you lose multiple loved ones? what if it never ends? what will you do then?
well, if you're lucky, you'll get to mourn for all five of the seconds you're allowed to before the size thirty shoes go back on and the narrative moves on to other, more plot-central characters.
if you're not - well. it's a good thing clown makeup is waterproof, isn't it?
anyway, shout out to all my comedy kings out there doomed to play perpetual funnyman to their more plot-central counterparts despite being in undeniably comparable pain. you may be doomed by the narrative, but you are beloved by me <3
#fiction#writing#tropes#doomed by the narrative#yamada hizashi#present mic#yes this is about mic#as is everything tbfh#i've been wanting to make a similar doomed by the narrative post about nemuri for a while#but lbr in midnight's case it's less 'doomed by the narrative' than 'ignored by the narrative'#'forgotten by the narrative'#'fucked by the narrative'#it's not even 'sacrificed by/for the narrative' either because a sacrifice has to fucking mean something substantial#nem was killed more or less for shock value and to balance the scales after the villains lost twice#that's it#and before anyone comes after me - no i am not opposed to her death just because she's a female character and/or my fave#a look through this blog and my entire ao3 body of work will show that i am distressingly compelled by-#the tragedy of her death and what it means for her character and her loved ones#but hori has done exactly none of the work to pay off on that so i will not give him the credit for it#anyway.#don't mind me just ramblin'#meta
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People in this fandom will really look at The Fool, Patience, Lacey, Carson, Sedric, Hest, Davvie, Lecter, Kennit, Ash/Spark, and yes, even Fitz himself, and still have the gall to call it queer bait.
These characters are explicitly queer, their actions impact the narrative, they are well written, and their identities are treated with respect. That is the best possible queer representation you could ask for in any story.
I've seen people on tumblr basing the likelihood of if they read this series on whether or not it's "actually gay" and I'm here to tell you that it is. There are queer characters. There are queer protagonists. And no matter what you see people in the fandom say, Robin Hobb wrote some amazing queer representation in a genre that rarely sees it at all.
TLDR;
Queer bait = disrespectful marketing ploy that exploits queer audiences
Queer bait ≠ "my two favorite characters never have sex"
#Fitzchivalry ''i wondered if I lied so that I need not be ashamed of myself'' farseer thank you everyone#quite frankly the disrespect to Robin Hobb in this fandom is in EXTREMELY poor taste#the interview from 2008 before half the series was written where she explains why Fitz would not suddenly be head over heels for a person h#perceives as a man because all of his life he has only had heterosexual experiences apparently means that no queer characters exist#whatsoever in the whole series and Robin Hobb is an irredeemable backwards old lady who can't get with the times. right.#Fitzchivalry ''what were we? Beloved'' farseer#this is actually not supposed to be a debate over whether Fitz is canonically queer or not. he is. ope.#also...I do read Kennit as queer. just cause he is traumatized and his queerness comes out in predatory ways doesn't mean he's not queer.#that's called writing a compelling villain baybee#Hest!?!? thank you Robin Hobb for the evil gays god bless <3#modern reader: the author didn't describe these characters dicks touching in detail therefore she is homophobic#rote#realm of the elderlings#fitzchivalry farseer#the fool#I really had to get this out of my system guys. thanks <3#as if Robin Hobb didn't give us the FOOL. nonbinary/gender fluid character OF ALL TIME.
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just watched the borderlands movie and the only good part was that krieg’s little harness thingo lowkey looked like a very skimpy little bra thing sometimes
he needs some back support with those jugs ofc
#it wasn’t AS bad as I thought it would be#but it was not good#at all#idk why they changed so much of the story and just like Made It Worse#why did they make Tina’s dad head of atlas? why not just keep her parents killed off? why did they mischaracterise her so badly?#why was she annoying? why was she an experiment? why not use a more compelling villain than Guy Who Looks And Acts As Bland As Possible#the villain was simply. no good#I wish they used jack 😔#I also wish they didn’t do the Lilith’s mum subplot bc it was a little off??? somehow?#and Tannis and Lilith’s relationship wasn’t particularly fulfilling#claptrap was even more annoying#the jokes weren’t funny#the sfx were NOT as bad as everyone said they were I’m sorry I thought they were fine aside from a few weird shots in some chase sequences#another thing I don’t get that much was ppl hating Lilith’s hair bc it’s doesn’t look like in the games#ppl compared the wig to wigs that cosplayers use that look rly accurate and good but#u have to take into account#that it’s rly hard to stylise a live action movie to look something like boarderlands and most cosplays are made to look good statically#things that look good in cosplay and in the game will not look good in a live action action sequences#like if u gave her a cosplay wig it would look great and accurate but it also would be completely rigged in the wind and would not move#like real hair#which would probably be incredibly jarring to see in a live action film especially with all the action#was the hair great? no. I still think it could’ve been vastly improved on while remaining realistic for a live action movie#but I think some people hold it to unrealistic standards in their criticisms or whatever#also costumes have to be actually movable and breathable bc REAL people are shooting REAL scenes and doing stunts and shit in them#but. yeah. the costumes could definitely have had some improvement#I think that if u wanted to make a borderlands film that was accurate to the design of the characters it would be easier to do it animated#and the writing?#we do not speak about the writing good lord#borderlands movie#borderlands
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I have a question about some of your Salem thoughts
If Salem is 110% certain that she can take down the Gods (assuming that's her goal since we don't actually know), why wouldn't she communicate her plan to Oz? Especially if she truly doesn't want anyone to die like you say. Oz would jump at the bit if Salem said "Hey I want to stop fighting" since that would mean their shadow war would stop. I really don't think Oz likes the Gods either, and even if he's afraid of them, if *Salem* is that confident she can stop them (she's far from an idiot), I'm sure he'd at least hear her out (which would tell Salem a LOT).
If she's that confident and truly doesn't want to fight, why wouldn't she tell Oz her new plan? And why would she kickstart her plan by attacking the kingdoms/Academies? Surely she could find a way to steal the Relics without flat out attacking them (like sending in double agents to take the Maiden powers)? Like... she would've known she'd get people killed, including children and innocent people. Even if she did damage control (which I think is just strategic, why bother going after people if she's focusing on the Relics? She's not gonna waste precious time and resources), she surely knew people would get caught in the crossfire.
Don't get me wrong, I like what you bring to the table!! Your posts are thought provoking and unique. But I can't see Salem being somehow secretly good. I don't think the show is setting her up that way, and I think she's a fantastic villain, so from my own perspective, doing that kind of twist would be a disservice to her character. I don't think she's inhuman or a complete and total monster who should go, but she's definitely not a good person especially if she can't communicate that she supposedly doesn't want people dead. She seems to be an "the ends justify the means" kind of person, and the show I think has stated that that isn't a good mindset i.e. Ironwood.
Sorry, I rambled and completely strayed from my point 😅 I don't mean to be mean if I come across that way. I hope my ask is interesting or thought provoking though :P
my position is that salem is right, not that she’s secretly good—that is an important distinction. i think she sees the gods clearly for what they are, thinks the divine ultimatum repulsive and unjust, wants remnant to be free, and believes that humanity is transcendent over their creators; she also, quite plainly, does not have any compunction about doing whatever it takes to achieve her ends and while i do think she is still fully capable of and driven by love, she is so TERRIFIED of being hurt again and so CERTAIN that no one could ever care for her that when she does care for someone else it comes out in very, very twisted and often cruel ways. she’s not good, she’s not nice, she’s just right.
equally the heroes are good but not right, because they have yet to really grapple with the premise of the divine mandate (that humanity as it exists right now does not deserve to exist) or their own role in upholding it (their immediate goal is survival, but when they envision the ending of this war they imagine salem driven back and the relics squirreled away again in hope of at best everlasting stalemate). the point of structuring the narrative this way is that neither side can get to the proverbial good ending alone; they need to work together, salem’s ends with the heroes’ means.
like. she’s evil. lol. that’s not in question and i think it goes without saying that she is doing evil things so i don’t feel the need to make a “but she’s still evil though” disclaimer every time i try to tease out what’s going on in her head. notice how my reaction to salem razing vale was OH GLINDA LAYS SIEGE TO THE EMERALD CITY, WE’RE REALLY IN IT NOW and not, like, shock or dismay that salem would do such a terrible thing. brgdfjs
(i DO think she has mostly been trying to avoid ozma and not reciprocating the shadow crusade against her prior to about fourteen years ago and that she isn’t about wanton destruction or killing for the sake of it; and in that sense i think she’s not as bad as the general fanon reading. but that comes with the territory of thinking she has actual reasons for doing what she does as opposed to being, like, a genocidal lunatic.)
anyway. to your questions. the short answer is she’s just as scared of oz as he is of her.
“but he’s the good one!”—think about this from her perspective for a minute. set aside your opinion of her and oz, presuppose for the moment that i’m correct on her motivations, and consider what everything ozma’s done in the last few thousand years looks like to her.
she knows that the gods were monsters. she witnessed them slaughtering the whole world and she saw how little it mattered to them after. she was alone for millions of years, and then hated and feared for thousands of years because she didn’t look human. all that suffering because the gods are punishing her for praying to them. yes?
then ozma returns to her, somehow. he doesn’t explain how or why—maybe he tells her he just doesn’t know—but that’s alright. what matters is that he’s here. he asks what happened to her, and she tells him the truth: the gods ended the world. cursed her. killed everyone. she was alone for so long. (maybe not the whole truth: there are things she’s afraid to say, because the gods did it all to punish her, and it’s her fault, and she’s so scared that he’d despise her if he knew everything. the only reason for her to fear ozma would reject her is if she blamed herself. you don’t hide things out of shame if you don’t feel ashamed of them.)
they learn each other again. fall in love all over again. things are finally okay. they fix up her house. they’re happy together. one day ozma tells her that he’s worried about how divided people are. she wants so badly to make him happy; she would move mountains for him. salem herself has no interest in ruling over people as a god—if she did, she wouldn’t have been living alone in a rotting shack in the middle of nowhere—all that enthusiasm is for him. to support what he wants.
they build a following, found a prosperous kingdom, start a family. four children! how long do you think they were married—ten years? twenty? and the whole time, the whole time, ozma was keeping these secrets from her. that the god of light, who’d condemned her to eternal suffering for praying to his brother, who’d shown utter indifference to the deaths of millions, had sent him back to redeem humanity FROM HER SINS, from what SALEM did. that the point of all this is cleansing humankind of her defiance and inviting THAT MONSTER to remnant to judge whether this world deserved to be subjugated under the brothers’ tyranny again or else be put to death.
imagine how she must have felt when ozma finally told her the truth, knowing that the first thing she told him was that the gods ended the last one. imagine the sickening realization that their whole marriage is built on a lie, because she would never, ever, ever have agreed to help him unite the world if she had known what he sought to unite them for, and ozma knew she never would. that he deceived her! manipulated her into serving the will of a god she knows to be a monster!
and even then—even to the very end—she loved him enough to try. she was willing to forgive all of that and figure out a way to move past it together, and the only thing she asked was that he walk away from his task of submitting this world to the judgment of THAT MONSTER. and he wouldn’t do it.
there’s a gap we don’t get to see, in between ozma backing away from her and salem catching him leaving with the girls, but we can infer that ozma walked out of that room and salem didn’t. imagine how she felt. ten years, twenty years, however long it was, and he was lying to her through it all, and he left her with hardly a moment’s hesitation when she refused to help him enact THAT MONSTER’S retribution against herself. because that is, ultimately, what this is all about; humanity is found guilty by association with her.
imagine how she felt. used. worthless. duped. like a fool for ever trusting him. did he ever love her at all, or was that a lie, too?
when she caught him in the hallway later that night, they both attack each other in the same instant. ozma remembers her attacking him first, but their volleys meet in perfect symmetry and right before salem throws her first bolt of magic, her eyes flicker down in surprise as she tracks the motion of his staff (which we see in the previous shot)—salem remembers him attacking her first.
because they were both so tense and scared and angry at each other that they snapped in exactly the same moment.
their battle is so intense they blow up the castle, and when the smoke clears, salem is a pile of ash. ash! he incinerated her! imagine how enraged you have to be to burn someone to ash. that level of fury, of absolute hatred of her, is literally burnt into her memory as the last thing he did to her before she managed to kill him, inextricably twisted around the guilt and unbearable grief she feels for her children.
he’s dedicated all but a handful of his lives since then to getting rid of her. finding a way to destroy her. (how far is he willing to go? what would happen if salem tried to move on, find community and solace somewhere far away from him? would he come after her? would he follow his god’s example and go after the people she cared about to punish her? is she willing to risk that he might?)
do you think salem understands why ozma did any of this? she doesn’t. she doesn’t get the luxury we do of jinn narrating his side of the story and showing us the anguish he felt, wanting so desperately to be with salem but eaten alive by terror of dooming the world for his happiness. she doesn’t know.
all she knows is how he treated her: the secrets, the deception, the manipulation, the immediate and absolute rejection when she told him no, the explosively violent anger at the end, then centuries upon centuries systematically erasing her from history and enforcing her exile whilst searching for the relics he needs to summon his god for the final judgment. which she knows will inevitably end in the annihilation of the whole world and yet more torture for her with no hope of reprieve, because if all of this was not enough to satisfy the god of light’s grudge against her for, again, just praying to his brother, nothing ever will.
salem feels about ozma now the way blake felt about adam. why did he lie to her, why did he use her, why does he keep coming back, why won’t he just LEAVE HER ALONE, hasn’t she suffered enough, hasn’t she been punished enough, when will it be enough—and intertwined with that, she is being EATEN ALIVE by the conviction that no one could ever truly care about her or feel for her or want to help her or think that she deserves help or even just see her as a person, because if ozma—ozma, the one who saved her from her father’s tower, who knew her and loved her before all of this happened—if ozma thought her so worthless that he would rather serve a god who ended the last world and promises to condemn this one too than suffer her to exist at all in this world, why the fuck would anyone else be any different?
thousands of years later, she still flies off the handle when anyone lies to her. (except cinder. but cinder is always the exception, to every rule.) there’s a reason she recruits the kind of people she does—desperate, broken, angry people starving for something she can promise to give them if they make themselves useful to her—and it’s because she does not believe that she can get anything better than strictly transactional relationships with people who have literally nothing and nowhere else to turn. and when she actually cares about someone? she fights herself tooth and claw over it because she desperately doesn’t want to open herself up to more heartbreak. look at how erratic and cruel she is with cinder.
it’s not rational. salem is smart and very, very tactically shrewd but she is making all of her plans and all of her choices from the assumption that she is and will always be alone in this, because she is unlovable, because she is worthless, because she is the reason this world is damned. and she’s terrified of ozma because to her everything he does suggests that his conviction and dedication to the god of light has never wavered. she cannot see his doubt. she cannot see his misery. she cannot see how much he misses her and desperately wants to make amends. all she can see is that he’s zealously guarding the relics and spreading his god’s word and training children to fight and die in the name of keeping her exiled.
why doesn’t ozma just go to her and tell her he wants to make amends? because he’s terrified she’ll never forgive him and terrified that he’ll damn the world to annihilation if he follows his heart. they’re the same. they’re exactly the same.
but this is also what makes it so possible—even easy—for salem to undergo a villain-to-hero arc, because the only thing that needs to happen is a spark of real hope. that someone, anyone, could really care about her. like. the things she says in her soliloquies about the transformative power of hope? “even the smallest spark of hope is enough to ignite change,” and “it’s true that a simple spark can ignite hope, breathe fire into the hearts of the weary…”—that’s her. one small reason to hope. that is all she needs to change.
she doesn’t want to be razing kingdoms to the ground or cutting a bloody path through children to get those relics. she is willing to do it because she truly, genuinely, from the depths of her soul believes that it’s the only way to free herself from the torture she’s been subjected to for millions of years. she’s driven to this by desperation. she won’t keep doing it if she’s given a reason to feel less desperate.
but she does need to be given a reason, first. she’s hemorrhaging. this is why the winnowing of her inner circle and the split between everyone else in vacuo versus salem + cinder + summer in vale is important; Those Two are the ones she cares about—technically we don’t know for sure regarding summer yet, but the level of trust she has for the lieutenant holding beacon is suggestive—and that being reciprocated is what ignites her hope.
#she IS a fantastic villain#but what makes her so compelling as a villain is all the contradiction and tension in her character#how deeply she loves vs her deep conviction of being unlovable. not wanting to hurt people vs believing it’s the only way to free herself.#everything she does is so intensely personal and so circumscribed by the fear of rejection#these opposing forces drive change because they are pushing and shoving against each other inside her mind and the moment of culmination#occurs when one triumphs over the other. and then she changes in what i expect will be a startlingly dramatic fashion#(that doubles as writing advice btw if you want to write dynamic character arcs put unreconcilable contradictions in your characters)
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The thing thats consistently bothered me the most in the fallout show is the racism. I would hesitate to recommend it because of that alone. And there was obvious love that the set and prop designers, actors, costume department, and even maybe the writers put into the show! There are themes and characters in fallout that i'm certain would resonate with fans of color!
It KILLS me that so many of the fallout entries are damn well unplayable/watchable in this regard because the writers simply Don't Care how the people in their work are presented. That this like hugely popular world with a lot of worldbuilding and thought behind it does such wrong to so many people, fans and otherwise, that you cannot find any game in the series that does it right or well. It alienates a lot of people who might've been fans just because the majority white creators and fanbase don't give a shit, and I'm sick of it.
it's not enough to say "in the fallout in my head that racism doesn't happen," you actually have to put some things into PRACTICE. Allow space in your head, your games/show, your fan spaces for people of color! notice and say something when you see racism coming from media, yourself, and others!
#like its not AS bad as other fallout media but isnt that the fucking kicker. that its not AS bad#and in fact the games im thinking of that are most egregious in their racism ARE interplay/obsidians games.#bethesda is NOT free from criticism or racism. just look at the elder scrolls.#all of the fallout games have been terrible to different extents to their black characters#the games are TERRIBLY sinophobic. the great war being pinned on china allows for SO much racism in the writing and in fan spaces#but fallout 2 and new vegas specifically have awful and degrading representations of indigenous people. to the point where i wont play 2.#and now this show treating maximus nearly one to one with how star wars writers AND fans treated finn? its not okay#personal /#fallout show#fallout blogging#racism#antiblackness#colonialism#fallout#if not for this i would have thought that the show was GOOD. surprisingly compelling. anti capitalist messaging. but its just. all the time#and this is coming from a white person! i can only listen and imagine how painful it is to play these games or watch the show#and be the butt of the joke every time!!! or the villain or the fool or the one who dies or the nameless entry.#maximus gets to have Some time in the light as a protagonist but for the beginning half of it he's treated SO awfully by the writers#and the latter half does not do enough to make up for it#EDIT: I JUST FINISHED THE SHOW AND THEY FUCKING MADE IT WORSE....#taking max out and having lucy leave him. for what exactly. why did they have to undermine him and make him look stupid at every opportunit#AND. two of the more major black women being evil capitalists juxtaposed by some white guy who opposes? .........................#like im glad moldaver was there. i guess. but even she is posed as the villain for the good majority of it and kills innocent people#for no reason and. UGH
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Every time I see people complain that MHA’s “biggest problems” are the “Endeavor-Todoroki” storyline and the “Bakugou-Midoriya” storyline it makes me feel really smart because what did these people think was going to happen in the story about reconciliation and atonement. Why are you reading the reconciliation and atonement story and being shocked when major plot lines surround reconciliation and atonement.
#Bnha#mha#endeavor#bakugou katsuki#midoriya izuku#todoroki shouto#Mind you these are some of the most compelling parts of mha.#That showcase Horikoshis best character writing#And stand as proof that he can actually detect nuance#Guhufhghhghf..#And then the villains too like hello.#Why are you mad theyre going to redeem the villains in the story about redeeming villains#Thats like watching an MCU movie and being mad when someone with super powers shows up#What did you think was going to happen
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Woke up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat to jot down a fic idea where Himiko gets transmigrated after her canon death into one of those ridiculous cliché tragic otomes.
#thieves talk‚ kings command#''oh yeah it's all coming together'' kronk meme here#it is not coming together#compels me though#i've been reading so much isekai to try and get back to my time travel fic#maybe i just need to write a pure isekai to snap myself back into it#fic: the heroine and her sister are transmigrated villains!?
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this might not be the right time since i have thesis stuff to do, but im entering a bit of a writing rut despite the desire to write, so..... if you guys have writing prompt ideas for little drabbles either for mdzs or svsss, send them my way
#can't guarantee i'll write them quickly#but i need to work on Something and my current wips aren't going the way i'd like#and i want to get a better feel for writing scum villain stuff#since i haven't really written them but i love the characters so much#but yeah my character preferences for writing are probably pretty obvious#that being yunmeng sibs and/or wen qing#though i'd also love to write the juniors i love the juniors so much#and for scum villain i love bingqiu and i love cumplane#but also i'd be willing to stretch my wings for different characters if the prompt was compelling
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Ep 4 :)
#I LIKE Dostoyevsky. I like how mysterious and unreadable he is. What is his goal!!!! Why does he do what he does!!!!!!! He's very cool#I think knowing his ability now REALLY adds to his character. Him being so smart so manipulative so disruptive in the way he–#seemingly kills people on touch! Only added to this impression of him being “demon” and “inhuman”#But now that we know his ability you realize... That's all his doing; no ability.#His ability in a way does help humanize him by reaffirming that except for the moment he dies– he's got no superpower at all!!!#It's just him.#And yet at the same time also solves the exact opposite role of dehumanizing him because if it's not his ability that makes him like *that*#then he's even different than other ability users!!! Then‚ if not an ability user‚ if not a non ability user: what is //he//?#It's all SO compelling!!! Also makes for an extremely insightful narrative parallel with Dazai#Not an ability user not a non ability user. Not good not evil. (I feel like Dostoyevsky does exceed the definitions of good and evil as–#much as Dazai does. If he causes evil‚ yet does so with the intention of bringing salvation to humans– is he really *simply* evil?)#Both have these borderline superpowers that make them extraordinary beings (we can call it super intelligence‚ but it goes from controlling#their own heartbit to everything else) but are unrelated to their respective abilities! Once again making them neither this or that#I find Karma's words at the end to be extremely insightful.“Ace was evil for sure‚ but this man isn't even evil.#He's a being from the beyond. A being that exceeds human limits.” Like!!! That's all that there is to it!!!!!!#Back to this chapter / episode. There's some themes / worldvies once again I don't agree with but narrative wise I think it's extraordinary#I feel like after the Guild arc the writing really matured a lot and this is a kind of preview of what the doa arc is going to be like#(aka very very well written especially if compared to the previous arcs)#The plot twists of this episode are all so unpredictable and exciting!!! I think it's remarkably witty how it takes advantages of previous–#clichés - villains always revealing details about their own ability in a way that is quite baffling - to actually surprise the audience.#It's so effective. How skillfully unpredictable Dostoyevsky is to the point you can never guess what he will do next!!!#Him killing Karma is... Idk so so soooooooo interesting. I could talk about this forever but I'm being very dispersive in the rable and–#running out of tags. The whole episode you're sorta rooting for Dostoyevsky. He's very cool and comes out charming in the way he keeps–#surprising the audience. He looks bothered by Ace's disregard of other people's lives and that makes him sympathetic too.#But then he kills Karma out of nowhere and it's an “Ah! You fell for his lies too– remember he's nothing but evil. He cares just as little#about life as Ace does”. And then??? Karma in his last words is himself so generous in his words to Dostoyevsky. It's baffling.#And it almost feels like thenarrative is once again turning around and telling you you should root for Dostoyevsky.#It's endlessly fascinating.#I have more to say about the worldviews I don't share and the art style Dostoyevsky was portrayed with this episode (love it!!)#But alas ran out of tags
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you see, the problem with writing my oc backstories while listening to epic the musical is that i start instinctively changing details to match the lyrics of the current song playing.
and then i have to examine whatever "brilliant new backstory detail" i just thought of, and go:
(in the voice of someone trying to see what's in their dog's mouth) is that your oc's backstory? is it? yeah, um- no. no, it's not. that's odysseus of ithaca. put him back. no, i don't care if "ruthlessness is mercy upon ourselves", your oc is ten years old and she does not have the ability nor the time to somehow get a crew of soldiers killed. move her along to the assassin plotline and put the sad greek man back where he came from.
#epic the musical#oc creation#oc writing#this happens every time i listen to a narrative song while writing.#same issue with lydia the bard's villain songs; i listen to them while writing and suddenly i'm writing ooc villain AUs for my ocs.#and then i have to go:#''are you writing a compelling alternate version of your oc as a villain?#or are you literally just stealing lydia the bard's villain AU version of anna from frozen?''#and the answer is usually. the latter. so i have to start over.#''but why not just listen to other music'' because i must satisfy the brain's craving for Story Music. <3#(and also i've been hyperfixated on epic for months and looping the songs is the only way i'm able to do anything else)
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