#Pseudoarchaeology

[rod-emperor-of-dune]

Ignatius L. Donnelly?

Ha ha! get diluvian'd, idiot!

it takes 10 layers of the water filter to completely drown a tumblr screenshot if anyone was wondering

[creature-wizard]

A short lecture that sums the pseudoscience to far right pipeline, and what people can do to make sure people avoid falling into it.

[herecomesthementalmeltdown]

MILO STOP IT HE'S ALREADY DEAD

[victusinveritas]

"Nobody knows what this structure is."

*You tell them what it was, a fireplace, and presumably prove it with some sort of evidence like showing them literally any other fireplace.*

"Truly it will remain a mystery and is clearly evidence of a lost culture covered up by nefarious forces. It's obviously the top of a lost Tartarian temple. A beacon that could be seen for miles around when the glowing Tartarian prayer-force of the devout worshippers flowed through it before the great Mud Flood--"

*You remember that Pennsylvania did actually have a great mud flood of sorts, but by that point you've already disposed of the evidence and established an ironclad alibi so oops. No jury in the land would convict you once anyone mentioned the word "Tartarian." Had to be done, heck, they'll probably give you a medal.*

[cobalt-the-noodle]

cow tools and Pattern recognition

so. I like old newspaper cartoons such as Calvin and Hobbes, or, for today’s rant, The Far Side. But aside from reading them, I also enjoy reading ABOUT them.

now, many already know of the Cow Tools comic, but if you don’t, here it is

Now, this comic, for those who don’t know, once caused mass confusion and panic due to one little detail. One of the Cow Tools happened to resemble a handsaw. This led to thousands of people across the US during the comic’s original printing to decide that this means all the other objects were supposed to be other human tools[ as built by cows].

now, unfortunately, this is not the case. The joke was that if cows made tools, this is what they’d look like.

but the fact so many came to this conclusion and spent months [yes, MONTHS] trying to piece together what the cow tools were “supposed” to be says a lot about the human mind’s pattern recognition and stubbornness. Once we decide a conclusion is the “correct” one, we stubbornly try to prove it with any evidence we can piece together, usually utilizing pattern recognition alone if that’s the only evidence we can find.

now there’s two things this reminds me of, and one is FNAF lore, so I’m not touching that with a forty-three and 7/8ths foot pole.

the other, of course, is pseudoscience and pseudoarchaeology. How many of these theories rely on pattern recognition, like terrace farms actually being staircases for giants, or mountains being pyramids or treestumps?

Cow Tools provides a great microcosm of this phenomenon. The only difference is that Earth doesn’t have a cartoonist in charge who can explain that the joke isn’t that deep.

in conclusion, sometimes a cow tool is just a cow tool, no matter what your eyes are telling you.

[knightofhylia]

Milo Rossi's lecture of the dangers of Pseudoscience and Pseudoarcheology

[lettuceeeee]

Random thought about how pseudoarcheology is based on not believing that the native people could ever be so skilled and/or sophisticated as to create such monuments and/or structures

[chaotic-archaeologist]

stuff like ancient aliens/Atlantis is hogwash at best dangerous at worst but what your opinion on it in fiction?

First, for those who are wondering, here's a previous post I made about why stuff like this is harmful. Additionally, here's a good article about how the Nazis incorporated Atlantis into their racist ideology.

I was actually just having this conversation with somebody else. There are some things that I think will always be harmful, even if you remove them from their source material. Indiana Jones and the Crystal Skull just didn't need to be made.

But let's talk about a different example that falls more into a grey area:

That's right, Atlantis: The Lost Empire (2001). It has some of the problematic elements that we see in a lot of the conspiracy theories: Atlantis is a lost civilization which possesses advanced technology that has since been lost. And of course, an anthropologist working for the Smithsonian is going to go and find it! (The Smithsonian is an institution which was founded in the deeply colonial and ethnocentric tradition of anthropology in the 19th century United States)

However, the redeeming quality of this movie is that it's not a narrative that lends itself easily to a message of white supremacy. A lot of thought went into making this movie, and I think that it's a good example of a concept that could have been harmful if poorly done. The myth of Atlantis wasn't originally a racist story, and so it can be adapted in a way that isn't harmful.

The moral of the story here is that fiction needs to tread carefully. If the underlying concept is based in racism, then you probably shouldn't do it. And if it has anything to do with aliens interacting with past civilizations, you definitely shouldn't do it.

-Reid

[flintdibble]

One day the truth will come out...

and people wonder why archaeologists point out how pseudoarchaeology robs heritage from other people

obviously to this person, the older 'civilization' who built the sphinx and the pyramids weren't even Egyptians...

[moongazeonastarfillednight]

Been reading the Franklin Conspiracy again because I had some times on my hand and I had never gone past the first third of it... I just couldn't get past this passage because it was so ludicrous.

Like what do you mean "wondering what autopsied John Hartnell" 🙃

But also this about James Clark Ross.

"hOw diD hE KnOw?!!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?"😂

And I'm reminded how easy it is to make up a conspiracy:

(Warning, the rest of this post is just me going on about how stupid this book is...

TL:DR, it IS stupid and I think the author was a coward for never actually saying the A-word when that's clearly what he wanted to say)

1. Ignore that time is linear (like... excuse me 😂 how was my man JCR supposed to know that this was were Franklin would go? More like... the cairn was visited BECAUSE the expedition knew it was there... not the other way around. What?

Also, maybe he stopped there and went no further because he was running out of supplies or because it looked like the end of the western shore and not more land to explore and not because... aliens?)

2. Set yourself on one hypothesis and never consider anything else (like... he keeps asking why they hadn't gone to KWI in the first search... and I could come up with a hypothesis that did not involve aliens so easily: how about they thought that Franklin would have attempted to go further west and not go toward known land. He was there to explore, after all...

Also, why would he wonder why so many people searched around the Boothia Pen when he himself keep bringing back the Fury Beach stores?)

3. Ignore what we know of physics (that whole chapter about pretending that sundogs and aurora borealis are something else than light refraction...????)

4. Ask questions and not think to hard about the answer (The whole accusation that JCR had purposefully made the search slower by using man-hauling sledges instead of dogs... my bro... even if he used dogs in 1830 for his first go at KWI, those were not his Uncle's dogs... they were purchased from the Inuits... bold to assume that after 3 recorded hard winters the Inuit would have dogs to spare...) or (asking why the bones were cut off and skulls had holes in them... man, I sure don't know what you think your butcher does but you do know that you need to make cuts to get meat, right? Also that brain is edible?)

5. Making a point and omitting details (he goes at great lengths about how "convenient" it was that JCR and Abernethy were in the Arctic together for the wreck of the Fury (which, of course, was caused by aliens) and the trip to Victory Point and what they saw there was the reason why JCR and Parry refused to lead the expedition... but Crozier was also part of the voyage that wrecked the Fury AND was a notable close confident to Ross... why would Ross not discourage his friend from going if there was something too terrible to go back and why would Crozier not have been aware from his own experience? Blanky was also on Ross's sledge party to Victory Point. Surely, he knew.

Also, lmao... if Ross somehow did not want the "truth" to come out and that's why he sabotaged his rescue mission... and if the Admiralty knew also, why did they even sent someone else out there?

Also, you'd think that hundred of seaman having been around on the Parry and Ross voyages in around the Boothia Pen. would also have something to talk about for the newspapers to catch on fire with when the news of Franklin was the talk of London...)

6. Just going around like a compass in the arctic circle (In one chapter, John Ross is the only one who wishes to TRULY save Franklin and the next he is in on the conspiracy)

7. Making it so much more complicated than it needed to be (If JC Ross floundered his mission by getting rid of the evidence... would it have not been all the way easier to "hide" whatever by forging evidence? Such as... "oh, look! I found one of those cannisters we were looking for! They say the ships were crushed by ice and only a few men survived without having been able so save much supplies two winters ago! Well, I guess they couldn't have survived so far north! That settles it!" Instead of, idk... hiding evidences that would just make people go on more and more and more search expeditions)

8. ... never actually naming what he thinks happened. It's always like... "historians think this... but this would only be so IF what So-and-so said was true!" Ok... genius, what do you think happened? Say it, coward, say the A-word.

And FURTHERMORE... why would this guy keep pestering JCR for not exploring KWI more on his third Parry voyage (the one where they had to survive a bad winter with little ressource on 1 ship and hope for the best and there wasn't that much time or extra men power to spare when it was an unending crisis?) Or after John Ross abandonned the Victory (see same reason above also, they were starving?!) Or going on about how the Admiralty should have heeded the Native's words about Boothia being a peninsula only to just call in question every stories they had about the Franklin Expedition? Brother, your hyprocrisy is showing.

ALSO! Somehow there was X-files level of bs going on in the Arctic from John Ross' first voyage in 1818, up until 1848, and it all ceased to be noticeable when hundred of people just went on their merry way to pick up bones and buttons?

ALSO! Somehow we're at once praising the Inuit's knowledge of their land, dismissing their stories of Franklins AND never questionning why none of their oral tradition ever mentioned visitors from the sky 🙄 guess the little green men only make themselves known when white men are fresh for the picking.

ANYWAY. It's a... book, I suppose... fun enough get a summary of all the search expeditions that went on but! I think my doctor would object to what it did to my blood pressure 😂😂

Only part I found interesting was the dates analysis and review of the added note about going to Back River on the Victory Point Note. That was a refreshing view on the thing because I also agree that the plan to go to Back River was insane but it's just another interpretation of the document and looking at how much the guy jumped to conclusion (or dug his one trenches just to be able to jump) I think it be more prudent for me to research that third ink story than start taking it as fact 😂

[krindor]

So re your tags on the pope post...

Where's the menorah krindor?

So, starting at the very beginning.

70 CE: Titus sacks Jerusalem and loots the Second Temple. In his triumph (fancy war parade) he has the Menorah, as is recorded by Josephus Flavius in 71 CE and by the Arch of Titus' reliefs in 81 CE

The Menorah is displayed in the Tempulum Pacis in Rome, and 2nd century CE Rabbis claim to have seen it in Rome, as well as various other artifacts from the desroyed temple including the parochet and the choshen.

Now here's the thing. This is the last time historical texts mention the Menorah by name so everything below here needs to be taken with an increasing pile of salt

410 CE: The Visigoths sack Rome. Procipius of Ceasarea (500-560), a Byzantine Historian, writes that the Visigoths take "treasures of Solomon the King of the Hebrews." If this includes the Menorah, the trail goes cold. So that's it right? The Menorah got taken to a secondary location and was lost forever, right?

Wrong, because that's not the only time Procipius mentions Jewish Temple loot.

425 CE: The Vandals sack Rome again, to the point where the word vandalize comes from it. Procipius notes that their leader, Geiseric, takes "a huge amount of imperial treasure" with him to Carthage, which was at that time the Vandal capital.

Trust me this is relevant

534 CE: The Byzantine Emperor Justinian sacks Carthage, and they hold a triumph in Constantinople. Among the paraded items are "treasures of the Jews, which Titus, the son of Vespasian, together with certain others, had brought to Rome after the capture of Jerusalem”

That these "treasures of the Jews" include the Menorah is not a new theory, as is indicated in the 19th century painting Geiseric sacking Rome by Karl Bryullov

(Note the Menorah)

So it's in Istanbul right?

Wrong, because our boy Procipius isn't done yet: according to him, Justinian sent the "treasures of the Jews" to Christian sanctuaries in Jerusalem, since he heard that they were cursed that any city save Jerusalem that held them was doomed to be sacked.

This is the last time the "treasures of the Jews" are mentioned in historical texts.

So for our next step, lets look at major churches in Jerusalem in the 6th century, and officially enter the cork-board and string section of this rant post.

As well as the extant Church of the Holy Sepulcher, the Hagia Sion Basilica, and the Church of the Holy Apostles, Justinian built a church himself in the city, called the Nea, in 534 CE, just nine years after sacking Carthage. It would not be unreasonable that he'd send the Menorah to his own church, so we can theorize that it's in the Nea for the remainder of the 6th century (there are, of course, problems with relying on one historian's account of these things, but this is for fun, not a published article)

So that's it? It's in one of the churches of Jerusalem?

...

So in 614 CE Jerusalem gets sacked by the Sasanian/Persian Empire, who according to historical records destroy all the churches.

Now here's the thing. Recent archaeological evidence gives rise to the possibility that our Byzantine historical sources are trying to stir up outrage against the Sasanians: While mass graves dating to around 614 CE were found, the churches and Christian residential neighborhoods were barely, if at all, damaged, and the Nea itself was very possibly completely undamaged. This is, however, a recent theory, and the academics are still hashing it out.

So it may be in one of the churches of Jerusalem?

Tragically, even if the 614 siege didn't get the churches, in 1009 the Fatimid Caliph al-Hakim bi-Amr Allah destroyed all churches, synagogues, and many religious artifacts of both Christians and Jews in Jerusalem. So if by some miracle the Menorah had survived until this point, if it was in Jerusalem it was most likely destroyed.

But that's disappointing, and what's a good conspiracy theory without going a step or two beyond what is reasonable?

Apparently, while the churches, synagogues and most of the artifacts were destroyed, at least in the case of the Church of the Holy Sepulcher, objects that could be carried away were looted, rather than destroyed. And if we know anything about the Menorah at this point, that thing is certainly able to be carried away by people.

If the Menorah was looted rather than destroyed, it's not unreasonable that it would have made it's way to the Fatimid capital of Cairo. However, as the historical record dried up some 500 years beforehand, beyond this point it's unreasonable to attempt to track the Menorah.

So that's it. If the Menorah wasn't destroyed it most likely made its way to Egypt and was lost or destroyed there.

Is what I'd say if I wasn't so far down this rabbit hole I was beyond reason. Because as we all know there's one place that has all the significant treasures of Cairo and a penchant for looting:

The British Museum

[creature-wizard]

You really need to watch that show ancient apocalypse

You mean that show that platformed Graham Hancock's bullshit? No thanks, I already know that Graham Hancock is... well, full of shit.

How about you watch Miniminuteman's takedown instead?

[wealmostaneckbeard]

Yob's Odyssey

That is the title of a self-published novel by a real person named Thor Weir, that I will attempt to write a review about here. It has a lot of problems, most of which stems from Thor apparently ascribing to libertarianism. That ideology agrees with the fascist notion that history is dictated by Great Men. Despite sharing this favored narrative, there is a difference between the two schools of political thought. The fascist believes that it's leftists and ethnic minorities who are holding back Great Men from seizing control of the government and making their nation great. The libertarian believes that it's tyrannical governments holding back Great Men from using the free market to innovate solutions that will bring freedom to the masses. And that latter version of the Great Men narrative is what dominates Mr. Weir's novel. The other lesser components of the story consist of things he loves and assumes to understand but doesn't actually know. These things being nature, science, women, history, and Elon Musk, which he presents very strange versions of.

If you think I'm not addressing the substance of Mr. Weir's work, I am. The plot of Yob's Odyssey is focused on a genetically predisposed supergenius boy named Boy and his companions Girl and the alien Yob, who are aided by divorced billionaire Elon Musk, Boy's Mother and Father, talking animals serving the will of Gaia the mother-goddess of Earth, and some military Commanders (plus a number of other allies). Together, they develop and implement a new source of infinite energy that can save the Earth and start a utopian age for humanity. But Vladimir Putin, Big Pharma, Oil, and other malignant actors get in the way of the greater good. Thus they have to be defeated in the most clever-ist and least detailed ways possible. Seriously, in some sections Weir merely summarizes events rather than actually describes it in any detail.

Hopefully, you, the reader can see the parallels between Mr. Weir's ideology and his writing. And you might even, ironically, see a blind spot of his regarding racial and economic exploitation. I will let rationalwiki posit why that might be...

Look, as an english major who graduated college and is the son of a professional writer, I was taught a lot of things about the practice. First is that writers should give characters actual names, and not leave them with placeholder titles like "Boy." Second is that they should create multiple drafts and supporting documents as they work on a project. This paraphernalia might not make it into the final draft of the story but it provides guidelines for an author as they go along. Like the thing with the names, Mr. Weir did not do this. He instead left in a lot of repetitive political diatribes, sourceless citations presented as scientific facts, and hand-waving regarding the incompatibility of his own contradictory ideas, in the published copy that I received. These all detract from the central plot of Boy trying to save World. This causes the story to become a boring slog to read through instead of an exciting adventure.

Despite all of the flaws, I can sense a better future for Weir's career as a writer. I think he'd improve if he started reading the works of John Tolkien, Ursula LeGuinn, Terry Pratchett, and eventually George RR Martin. That could form the basis for writing his own fantasy stories. He's apparently very knowledgeable in horse riding, thermal physics, sailing, and outdoor survival according to his own biography. So he'd probably be really good at inventing world-building details like the differences between Gnomish and Goblin cavalry on the march, or schools of magic, in a mystical world. Furthermore Mr. Weir would be free to expound upon his ideology without being fact checked. For instance if he claimed that the lost kingdom of Goltanor extracted and used oil from the ground which ultimately led to it's ruination, everyone would accept it since he invented the Goltanorians. But Weir instead claims that's what The Roman Empire did and that's why it collapsed. Even though a precursory study of the empire shows that slavery and multi-lingual communication is what built it up while disease and political corruption is what brought it down. This isn't the only inaccuracy, Thor spreads misinformation about other subjects like vaccines in the same strangely confident way throughout the story.

In conclusion, if Thor Weir had made an effort to be creative with Yob's Odyssey , rather than write libertarian propaganda about reality, that would solve half the problems I have with his book. The other half would be solved if he had shown some professional restraint and actually left things on the proverbial cutting room floor.

[archaeolitikum]

i think one of the dumbest things that pseudo-archaeologists do is pointing to something clearly made by human hands but insisting it clearly isnt made by human hands. this idea they have, that people in the past were too stupid to make incredible art or complex architecture and/or technology of any kind is literally just them being racist plus all of it is built upon this weird anti intellectualism where they refuse to accept both knowledge held by communities with a long oral tradition or research done by people in academia (who, might i add, arent your enemies lmao) and instead sit in their youtube/tiktok/facebook weirdo echo chambers making up wilder and wilder ideas that they genuinely start believing

the fact that these people can look at something clearly human-made and still go "it must be aliens or some kind of non-human ancient dead highly intelligent civilisation" is just getting on my nerves you know. they werent aliens, and the ancient highly intelligent civilisation who made the thing were just as human as we are today whats not clicking

[victusinveritas]

Sumerians: entirely invented to deny The Bible (or, hear me out, not).

[cass-io-peia]

does anyone wanna read my research on pseudo archaeology on tiktok