#Of the ways intersex people are abused and the fact they exist

[womenaremypriority]

Radblr! I know people on here have rightfully brought up how trans activists use people with DSD’s as political pawns, but the alternative is not to do that ourselves, and only bring up them when we can use them to criticize trans activism. I see people do this a lot. Intersex people are regularly medically abused and there is a lack of knowledge of their DSD’s even among professionals.

[hiiragi7]

Some notes on intersex invisibility, from an intersex person...

Often people tell me, "I have never met an intersex person before," and they assume that we are simply rare by nature rather than continuously, purposefully, and violently eradicated. Intersex people themselves are not rare, rather the opposite; we are born all the time, everywhere. We are common variation by nature - Our perceived rarity is wholly man-made, caused by the purposeful destruction of our bodies and our identities.

The concept of intersex as rare is used to further our eradication by design; When PGD is used to terminate intersex embryos, when intersex infants and children are operated on to "normalize" them, when intersex people are not told about their own variation, when intersex people are told they have "disorders" they must be treated for but the word "intersex" is never so much as uttered, when we are isolated from each other and prevented from building our own communities, when medical institutions attempt to narrow down what falls under "intersex" to make our statistics appear smaller, when we are forcibly made as invisible if not as non-existent as possible - it is no wonder we would be assumed a rarity.

Those unaware often even assume our perceived rarity is natural, passive, and neutral, rather than created, gory, and methodical. This, too, I believe is purposeful; our destruction is largely hidden and we are silenced by this assumed-to-be fact of rarity. The details that people may come to learn about our mutilation are also made palatable, even understandable, through the lens of pathology; we are presented not as people who are mutilated and destroyed for who we are, but rather as sick patients with an unfortunate (but always rare) illness undergoing necessary treatment to hopefully lead fulfilling, "normal" lives. In this way, doctors are framed as our saviors rather than our executioners, and those who buy into our rarity and abnormality become complicit in our invisibility.

As intersex people, we carry the consequences of this deep within ourselves; whether it is in the form of literal scars, doubt and insecurities about our own claim to our identities and our bodies, isolation from others like ourselves and a deeply felt loneliness, an inability to access safe medical care or knowledge about our bodies, or a variety of other traumas, our community is suffering. To have that pain made so invisible, so insignificant, so pathologized, only serves to ensure our abuse and destruction is continued.

[dialogusnes]

Hi so good morning I'm not super into discourse but I've seen enough nonsense swirling around that I wanted to comment.

I am transfeminine. I was assigned male at birth. This experience is very specific and the language we as transfems have to describe that experience is equally specific. I am TMA, targeted by transmisogyny in a way that trans people who weren't AMAB do not experience.

I understand that many people (who are not transfeminine) have decided that language is exclusionary. They posit that we're causing harm by dividing the community in an attempt to remove our language for the kinds of abuse we face, even within the community.

Some folks have decided that the existence of Intersex people destroys the theory of transmisogyny, or that we're erasing their experience.

Except!

I am also Intersex. I was still assigned male after getting surgically mutilated for my variation. The occurence of being assigned Intesex at birth is rare, but I'd love to hear from anyone who was! The fact is, the ASAB system doesn't abide ambiguity and will shove you into a category almost every time-

So *stop* using us intersex folk as cudgels for transmisogyny.

The fact is, if you weren't assigned male at birth and identify as transfeminine- that's a block from me. If you weren't assigned male at birth and you consider yourself Transmisogyny affected- also a block.

I'm not a cop, I'm not capable of enforcing anything- but if you're upset that I don't want TME folk actively making our language less useful to us, consider why? Why do we not get to speak about our specific intersectionality without getting scolded?

[genderqueerdykes]

i feel like the recent wave of feminism is so terfy, whether it is unintentionally or not. i have many friends sharing those shitty takes to their accounts and calling men names like "moids", "nem". despite my many attempts to tell them, directly or subtly, they seem like just nodded at the moment i told them and then forgot it the next day. most of them are queers. and thats the ironic part. not to mention that one time where one of my close acquaintances share a post with "y chromosomes will disappeared after 2 million years" with the caption "oh god i hope so" even when they knew i was a trans man. or something like "if men can get pregnant they will have free healthcare" wtf trans men have been for so long and they don't receive shit?

"terfs dni" on bio then you parrot exactly what they said like ok i get it if i was not existed some of them will become full blown terf

im glad you sent this because on god yes, certain queer people are literally just proud to be terfs and rad fems right now. like it's straight up just happening, it's not speculative. at this point we have to call a cigar a cigar and talk about how people are quite literally just *proud* to be transphobes and engage in political lesbianism and intersexism openly and freely. like people are just actually proud to be this way right now

i get so many random asks called me a moid it's unreal LMAO the thing is, it's intended to be used against trans women and fems to misgender us as men, it's short for "femoid", but if people are also just straight up using it against actual men, then wow, people are just literally showing that they're a terf on their sleeve. like y'all, nobody uses the slur "moid" but literal terfs. they're the ones that coined it. why are you proud to use their language

i understand that terf indoctrination is very aggressive, and that terfs target disenfranchised people who have very, very low self esteem and get their sense of self worth from bullying and belittling other people. but the amount of people who are basically bragging about belonging to this edgy cult of violent misogynists is baffling. i don't know why people are so blind to the fact that rad feminists are literally violent misogynsts. nobody hates women more than terfs.

terfs think women are stupid, clueless, defenseless, and powerless. terfs believe that women can't defend themselves. terfs believe that men are inherently stronger than women and women aren't capable of fighting off men. terfs think that women are pathetic and weak. terfs think that women can't be strong or assertive. terfs think that it's impossible for women to hold a position of power in any situation, even over their own children. terfs believe that if you've ever been abused by a woman, it's your fault, because that woman is traumatized and is just "trying to cope with patriarchy". terfs believe the cycle of abuse is your fault, and that women can never be held accountable for being violent and abusive, because "women can't hurt people".

nobody hates women more than a rad fem.

like political lesbianism, the core of terf and rad feminist beliefs, literally walks us back a century in terms of queer progression and acceptance. the idea that only cis women are safe to be around, the idea that cis women can only be abused by society and never perpetuate abuse, the idea that trans people are a threat to lesbianism, the idea that trans people are a threat at all period... why do you want to become your conservative parents so bad? why do you desperately want to become your extremely conservative queerphobic grandparents who would've beaten the shit out of you for being queer?

sucking up to the right won't make them like you better. sucking up to these people won't make you "normal lesbians". that's the thing, people seem to secretly think man hating terfs are "the real lesbians" and everyone else is an invader. like people think the default, "normal" lesbian is a violent man hater. they think that's what "real lesbianism" is and it's disgusting. like that has nothing to do with lesbianism, y'all, it's all gender politics. don't ever listen to a terf or rad fem talk about lesbianism. they're not lesbians, they just want a "safe girls only club". that has nothing to do with being a dyke

anyway, thank you for sending this. i agree with you. and it really makes me quirk an eyebrow when people say "terfs dni" and then spend literally hours shitting on trans men, talking about how we're invading xyz spaces... hey, uh, trans men are trans, too. you're support to care about trans men. yeah, especially if you're a lesbian. like. you're supposed to support all trans people here, you don't just get to pick and choose which trans people you """support""", here.

[dipplinduo]

Hey!

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PFLAG - pflag.org Support groups, crisis intervention, advocacy, and educational resources for LGBTQIA+ individuals and allies.

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dipplinduo

[cardentist]

I saw something earlier that I chose not the engage with directly, but I do think this needs to be said.

I think discussions around transandrophobia (or anti-transmasculinity, or just the Idea that trans mascs need to have language to put words to their experiences like all other trans people do) ARE often binary-centric, and that's a legitimate criticism to have about it.

but the Reason this happens is because the bigotry that trans mascs are currently facing is Extremely gender-essentialist, and in turn Extremely Binary. it's something I've been continuously frustrated with specifically Because I try to make an active effort not to cut nonbinary people out of trans and queer discussions. and it's often very hard ! because the arguments and positions people take act like nonbinary, intersex, genderqueer, and gnc trans people simply do not exist.

for many people the idea is that trans men and trans women sit on opposites sides of a seesaw, and if you argue that trans men experience X then you Must also be arguing that trans women Don't experience X. and trying to unpack and respond to that means having to Engage With It. which I've found Extremely frustrating, specifically Because I try to make an active effort Not to cut nonbinary and genderqueer people out trans discussions.

if, for instance, someone argues that trans mascs/"afab's"/"tme's" As A Group don't experience medial discrimination (while trans fems do), and it's on a post with hundreds upon thousands of notes, you're put in a position where you Have to center the medical violence that trans mascs experience.

because trans mascs being cut out of conversations about medical abuse and discrimination have had very real and disastrous consequences for trans mascs. it's important that people understand that trans mascs experience this not just as a byproduct of the abuse trans women face, but extremely targeted to them and their needs.

people believe that trans mascs don't experience oppression for being men, and they go further to state that trans mascs don't experience medical discrimination because they are men, and you simply can't address that without centering the discussion on the experiences of men.

and that creates an extremely Binary discussion, even when you make the active effort to include nonbinary/intersex/genderqueer people in the discussion. specifically BECAUSE a binary is being made and enforced already.

trans men are being denied their lived experiences, having the violence they face erased, Because They Are Men, and you can't stop the behavior without addressing the gender-essentialism that is Already There.

and It Is Unfair. it's absolutely Unfair, because nonbinary, intersex, gender queer, and gnc people are All hurt by this rhetoric. they're All hurt by this strict enforcement of gender-essentialism, but the conversation is centered around men and women by design.

the fact is, All Gender-Queer People Are Equal. (genderqueer meaning anyone who has gender in a queer way). and framing our experiences as being Inherent and Exclusive to any one type of person will Inevitably cut people out of conversations that actively affect them, simply because you didn't know that your experiences were shared.

BUT. framing the discussion about this as if the problem is that trans mascs trying to carve out a space for themselves is itself exorsexist is Also deeply unfair.

to tip my hand a little, the post I saw had specifically mentioned the talking point about trans mascs experiencing corrective rape with the intent of getting them pregnant and forcing them to detransition.

and it Is absolutely true that there are people who experience this kind of violence who Don't consider themselves trans masc, whether those people are trans neutral, genderqueer, or intersex. and it's absolutely wrong to bury that and insist that they Don't.

but at the same time, the situation is that trans mascs are being told that they Do Not experience physical violence, that they Do Not experience medical violence, and that the violence they Do face isn't gendered (whether that means insisting they don't experience misogyny, insisting that they don't experience violence Because they are men, or both).

so when trans mascs assert This Is A Kind Of Violence That I Experience And We Need To Acknowledge That we have to understand that the framing right isn't the trans mascs' Fault, right? we Understand that saying "trans mascs Don't have unique experiences" is harmful in this context Even When the premise is that there are no experiences that are solely unique to one kind of genderqueer person. not because it isn't True that all genderqueer people share experiences, but because people are very Specifically arguing that trans men's experiences don't exist and don't deserve to be acknowledged.

the fact is, transmisogyny as a term Exists, exorsexism as a term Exists, intersexism Exists, but the line is being drawn at transandrophobia (or Whichever term you'd prefer).

I Agree that the overall discussion would be healthier and easier to have if None of the terms we used were specific to a single identity, but instead discussed different types of bigotry under the genderqueer umbrella.

but that is not what people are trying to achieve by squashing transandrophobia. trans mascs are being singled out Specifically as not needing or deserving their own terms, while Also being cut out of other trans conversations. people preface their conversations about transphobia Specifically with "trans men don't experience this," and then tell trans mascs that they're Wrong for creating conversations that center themselves.

ideally, right this second, we could say "transmisogyny Generally focuses on the experiences of trans fems, exorsexism Generally focuses on the experiences of people who push the gender/sex binaries, transandrophobia Generally focuses on the experiences of trans mascs, intersexism Generally focuses on the experiences of intersex people.

but all of these experiences have overlap because they're all gender minorities, because all of these groups have overlap in members, And because people experience violence based on the way that the perpetrators of said violence Perceives them (not inherently because of the labels they identify with)."

but to get there we have to be willing to allow All genderqueer people to assert their lived experiences as valuable and important. this knee-jerk reaction to trans mascs that frame Their attempts as violent or unnecessary ultimately hurts people. and as long as trans mascs are put in this position, pushed out of conversations about oppression that affects them And told that they're not allowed to start their own conversations without being bigoted somehow, there will Always be a need to address it.

trans mascs Have to discuss the gender-essentialist oppression they're experiencing, and it's not their fault that the conversation has been framed this way to begin with.

addressing the problem of non-binary and genderqueer people being suppressed and sidelined and pushed under the rug Is Extremely Important ! it's an inherent part Of the conversation. but the conclusion cannot be that it's trans mascs fault for wanting to use a word to represent themselves when quite literally every other group in the queer community gets to have that privilege.

[ugly-anarchist]

Alright, anon, I'm not posting your messages in 3 different posts so lets just break this down here

[Indented text is the anon message. This is going to be long as hell]

butch women and trans men are not oppressed for being masculine, they’re oppressed for being gender nonconforming females (not saying trans men are women, just stating how a patriarchal society sees them).

So, firstly, the thing I'm talking about isn't actually oppression on a systemic level. You're talking about how non-queer society sees us, I'm talking about how other queer people treat us. Butch lesbians have been pushed out of sapphic spaces for a loooong time. Butch lesbians are seen as scary, mean, violent, and inherently abusive within queer spaces. Which stems from a demonization of masculinity. I should know this. I identified as a butch bisexual sapphic for years. I know what this feels like. I was once told that people with "high T levels" are more likely to be abusive, which includes me because I'm intersex and have naturally high T.

Secondly, maybe don't try to define trans men's oppression for them? I'm not a trans guy either but I experience a lot of the same bullshit from society that they do and it's not just "being a gender non-conforming female" it's a lot more complex than that. And also just, in general, a very weird way to say it.

i’ve never heard a masc cis gay man complain about being welcome or not in queer spaces, to the point in which feminine cis gay men have complained about them writing “no sissies, masc4masc” in their bio on dating apps.

I have. I've heard plenty of stories about masc gay men and specifically bi men in queer spaces feeling very unwelcome because they were being treated like a threat. And some gay men being transphobic (because s*ssy is a transmisogynistic slur in this case) or having a preference for other mascs also isn't indicative of mascs being treated well?

Like I know a lot of butch4butches that have that preference specifically because they feel unwelcome or are treated badly by femmes. I don't know how you personally not hearing about it or what some people put on their dating profile proves here.

Also your complete lack of acknowledgement of bi men in this makes me doubt even more that your perspective on this is a valid one because that tells me you either don't know any bi men or you ignore them to such an extent that you forgot they existed.

claiming misandry or anti-masculinity exists is the same as saying that heterophobia exists because straight trans people are treated like shit.

Never said that misandry on its own exists, don't know where you got that.

People are treated like shit based on the fact that they are masc all the time. That is a thing that happens. I have experienced it, I've heard so many stories from other queer people who experience it. I don't know how saying "no you don't, I'm gonna tell you what you really experience" is at all an alright thing to do.

it’s not heterophobia, it’s transphobia/homophobia. in the same way that masc afab people being treated terribly is misogyny and homophobia, and has literally zero to do with misandry/“anti-masculinity”. if anti-masculinity or misandry existed, even straight cis heterosexual men would suffer from it.

So, like, I'm talking about anti-masculinity in the queer community. "If this is true here then it must be true with this different thing" is a really bad argument because you could use that to invalidate anything that is true.

For example: The definition of racism is "prejudice based on race" which technically that definition doesn't exclude white people but you don't see anyone arguing "if racism existed, even white people would suffer from it" or trying to say it's not really about race just to exclude white people. Like, obviously you can't be racist to white people and anyone who claims you can be is just making a bad-faith argument. I am looking pointedly at you when I say that, btw.

also, a lot of radfems are gender nonconforming women/butches and literally campaign for women to drop conformity to the patriarchal concept of femininity. gender critical conservatives are not radical feminists and y’all need to stop conflating the two because no matter what jk rowling says, in practice and in theory, they have very little to do with one another (and hate each other, at that).

There's actually two sides of the "radfem" spectrum and they're both just as bad. There's the ones who hate gender non-conforming women, specifically the ones who go on HRT, and claim they're gender traitors. And then there's the ones which you describe who usually shame women for liking feminine things. Both their beliefs usually go against the whole purpose of gender-nonconformity which is to be yourself and do what makes you happy, society be damned. People who are truly GNC don't judge others for presenting in a way that is typically considered "conforming" to their gender and don't campaign for other people to be like them?

Also... Are you defending radical feminism? Are you a radfem? Because that would make a whole lotta sense.

and one last thing,

Just so you know, this is how this anon began the final message. It is the longest one. Really said "one last thing" then sent me a whole 4 paragraphs.

please stop acting like “people who are attracted to men” are demonized in queer spaces, what a slap in the face to lesbians. the moment they have a little visibility y’all claim they are privileged and somehow bossing around/discriminating against gay men.

Never said that lesbians were the oppressor in this situation. There is no oppressor, it's fully lateral mistreatment. And like.. it's not about just gay men.

Bi women have been pushed out of and demonized within sapphic spaces for decades, actually. I should know. Because again. I'm a bi sapphic. We are seen as a range of things. Pretenders, abusers, invaders, the source of lesbian oppression, tricksters that try to force lesbians to fuck men, or just disgusting. Traitors. Again.

My own mother knows this because before she married my dad she was in sapphic spaces in the 90s. From her personal accounts, bi women were seen as the enemy and a lot of lesbians... weren't even lesbians. They were political lesbians. Women who rejected their attraction to men and only dated other women. Some of them were even straight. And they were considered more of lesbians than bi women were.

Even in the modern age, bi women are expected to shit on their own sexuality. They are expected to say "ew I hate that I like men" and never date or fuck a man to be accepted in queer spaces. Again, I know this because I'M LITERALLY BI.

gay men are literally the face of this community and continually disrespect sapphic/lesbians (see the billie lyric controversy, see the way they’re treating chappel roan, see the way they keep calling women b*tches with no regards on whether we like it or not, see the way they keep fraternizing with straight women that would literally cower in fear if they saw a butch lesbian in real life).

Yeah so misogynistic gay men are in fact a problem but I'm not talking about strictly gay men. I'm talking about the way masculine perceived traits are demonized within queer circles. Come on. I'm pretty sure cis gay men were barely talked about in my original post, why are you fixating on this so hard?

just because somebody who has literally no power over gay men whatsoever and has been traumatized by men her whole life airs out her frustration with her literal lifelong oppressors via tweet or tumblr post, doesn’t mean that suddenly the patriarchy doesn’t exist anymore and has not armed lesbians especially for the past thousands of years.

So I'm talking about the people telling me I'm inherently abusive or more likely to assault people based on the fact that I have high T levels... I'm not talking about people venting about their abuse at the hands of men.

I also never said the patriarchy doesn't exist... I feel like this message isn't about me anyone.

stop painting them as the mean bosses of the community when actually they are a very small, demonized minority who suffers every day at the hands of anyone in the world who likes men (straight women, gay men, even bi women like me).

Fascinating... So... I'm not doing that. Lesbians are not the "mean bosses" of the community. Some are just treating random people shitty for perceived masculine traits with no bearing on truth or reality. A lot of them aren't even lesbians. Like I never said this was a specifically lesbian issue. I said there was a problem in the community in general. So like... all people... not just lesbians.

Also, genuine question: How are you oppressing lesbians for being bi?

it’s such a warped, harmful view and a big stereotype, at that (lesbians are man-haters who hate women’s boyfriends!! what a progressive statement!! never has it been said before, and especially not by homophobic conservatives).

I mean I just didn't say that. I don't know how to respond to this because I just straight up didn't say that.

I just... This isn't about me anymore is it?

Who hurt you?

have some respect for once, a lesbian literally threw the first brick at Stonewall.

So... uh... we don't actually know for 100% certain who threw the first brick. Some say it was Marsha P. Johnson. Some say it was "gay street kids". Even if it was a lesbian... so? Just because one lesbian did a good thing doesn't mean other lesbians are incapable of being dicks to other people?

Idk, man, I never said that lesbians were the source of all evil. I just made a post about my own personal experiences and the experiences of people I know and have seen being talked about. I'm a bi, intersex, non-binary sapphic. I get shit on for the things that people perceive as masculine traits that I have and the fact that I like men. This happens a lot.

I don't know why me saying "hey please stop implying that there is something in my blood that makes me inherently abusive" is lesbophobic. Why is this about lesbians, actually? You made it about lesbians. Why are you using lesbians, a group you've stated you're not a part of, as a gotcha against me? Why are you using lesbians to silence me about my own experiences? Why is that okay?

[velvetvexations]

kind of a vent more than anything, but it’s been so exhausting to see the concept of Theory put on this pedestal and to have ppl who are so obsessed with becoming the person who coined the next big fancy term/framework try to dominate all conversations at the cost of like…just fucking engaging with other people?

and this focus on finding the one true new framework to finally explain all bigotry ever is inherently useless bc it hinges on bigotry being logical and internally cohesive when by now we should know it’s not???????

like bigots can in fact view trans women as “girls they can hit” AND ��deviant men who need to relearn their place” at once, they can view trans men as “delusional women indoctrinating the youth” AND “men they can abuse in lieu of their actual oppressors”, they can degender and third-gender binary trans people whilst simultaneously denying that genders other than “man” and “woman” exist. they can whine abt irreversible surgeries for trans ppl and also force them on intersex ppl. none of this is mutually exclusive no matter how “contradictory” it seems. we’ve SEEN how bigots will flip the narrative to whatever they can use most effectively at any given moment.

and for ppl often so obsessed with “material reality”, they rarely ever produce theory that’s at all useful or based in reality other than a niche online echo chamber. like if you’re gonna force shit theory down everyones throat at least try to come up with a way to use this framework for more effective activism, instead of pretending that telling transfems everyone is a mindless drone who exists solely to hatecrime them or something equally stupid is praxis.

Yeah. Yeah, this is all really well said, anon. Thank you. <3

[endykelopaedia]

the way that some (usually queer) TME people insist that their very real experiences of misogynistic/transphobic/intersexist/etc violence & discrimination wasnt "just" misogyny/transphobia/intersexism/etc and was in fact transmisogyny and the way they will get very upset when you combat this, reminds me of the way some abuse victims will insist that their very real experiences of abuse wasnt "just" abuse it was in fact narcissistic abuse, and its really fucked up to downplay the severity of narcissistic abuse by calling it "just" abuse. the main difference being that transmisogyny... is a theory describing something that actually exists.

[official-brennivin]

The fact there's fuss over whether intersex trans ppl are allowed to fucking talk abt our transness TO OTHER TRANS PEOPLE is insane to me. The way some perisex trans ppl react when I try to speak about gender is essentially:

"Well yeah, sure, you're trans and all that but your transness is weird and ugly so... It's transphobic for you to exist that way basically. You're one of the Bad Transgenders because your gender is slightly more complicated than mine... And that makes me uncomfies uwu so stop talking. Transgender is when girl penis and boy pussy and nothing else and if your body works differently than mine then don't ever talk about your body. That's gross. Your body is gross. Stop being trans, you freakish eunuch, because someone like you being trans is transphobic."

You can dress it up in whatever polite-sounding language you want but when I mention intersex gender issues and you, as a perisex trans person, immediately jump down my throat... I know what you think. I know the kind of person you are. This isn't a community at all; for some of you it's a childish high-school clique.

Yap all you want about this TME vs TMA bullshit. It's stupid and vapid and childish and you're just doing exactly what transmeds used to do to ppl who use they/them. You've learned nothing. You're incapable of learning from past mistakes. You continue to circle off groups of trans people who are less understood than you are, because it feels good to play the part of the TERF for once. It briefly thrills you. Well, intersex children are being mutilated and abused just for being born. Your discourse is pathetic and a waste of time. You need to argue us out of existence so you can convince yourself that nobody 'has it worse than you' because none of you know what intersectionality really means. Read a fucking book or kiss my hermaphrodite ass.

[loonybun]

ok screw it oc introduction be upon ye

hi guys this is Rosé!!! I do have an in depth thing regarding his relationship with Adonis (another character of mine) and his whole transformation on my other blog so if you’d like to read that in more detail it’s right here.

CONTAINS: Cults/religion/sacrilege (evangelical nature), religious trauma and guilt, shunning, old timey homophobia and religion-based intersexphobia, historic stuff and some fun facts about the 1920’s, verbal abuse, manipulation, coercion, power dynamic (god and mortal), a really shitty partner and a shitter relationship, body horror, chronic illness, attempted suicide (multiple times multiple methods including overdose), rot and decay of the body, and love potions but for all the wrong reasons.

Rosé, formerly known as Roe Labat, was born in 1898 and raised in an evangelical cult. Ironically enough this has actually nothing to do with the wings and whatnot. That’ll come later. Being both intersex and albino, he was never truly accepted by the people around him. Some were kinder than others, sure, but it was all out of pity. In their eyes, he was already damned to an eternity in hell for the simple sin of existing.

He was a very docile and quiet child, rarely ever stepping out of line regardless of circumstances. He lived inside of the church, as his parents didn’t want responsibility of him. From an early age Roe understood that he was not something worthy of love, as even God had forsaken him. He was cared for out of obligation rather than actual genuine love, having religion almost constantly drilled into him.

When he was 18 (1916), he ran away from the cult’s village. He figured that he’d never make anything out of himself within it, and never be able to prove himself. Roe was also sick of being a burden. He had never been able to make friends due to the constant ostracism, and even though the people he was around changed to be a lot more open-minded, this remained a constant throughout his life. He started living in New Orleans and often frequented various parades and bars. Also he learned that he was queer and that messed him up for a bit. Despite being forsaken, he still tried his best to be a good follower given his circumstances, but the more he learned about the world around him, the looser his faith became.

Roe took an eventual interest in the “pansy performers” (drag queens in the 1920’s), though felt a lot of guilt and shame regarding considering the concept as a career. The more he thought about it though, he realized he didn’t have much else to lose.

He was a natural performer, able to say and do just the right things in just the right ways to provoke a positive reaction from the audience. Considering the more niche community at the time, he never really drew in big crowds, but what he had was enough for him to live off of in a nice 3 room apartment. He was able to afford relatively nice clothes for his performances when they weren’t provided, and quickly became skilled at makeup and wig styling. He also began dying his hair (yes hair dye was a thing in the 1920’s) and using mascara and heavier makeup in order to conceal his albinism, just because it drew some unwanted attention here and there. While he rarely encountered any trouble with the law, he had a few close calls given what he was doing was pretty illegal at the time. homophobia am i right…

Around when he was 24-25, he met “Don”, who claimed to be a cab driver, yet was almost always dressed to the nines in stylish and at times anachronistic clothing. They hit it off very quickly, relating over the strange feeling of being isolated from their peers. They started going out together soon after. It was Roe’s first real relationship, especially with another man, so to say he was a bit nervous would be putting it lightly. Regardless, Don was always very kind to him and patient with him. He was a bit suspicious of Don though since he was always very dodgy about his home life and really any personal details, however he just assumed they came from similar situations. Roe did theorize where his money was coming from and thought him to either be a bootlegger or a member of the mafia, though he never brought it up because in full honesty he didn’t care too much. He was already head over heels and a little illegal activity wouldn’t stop that.

The last thing he was expecting was Don— or rather, Adonis, to claim he was actually a god. And really really wasn’t supposed to be talking with Roe but just couldn’t help himself. Roe was shocked to say the least, and a little incredulous, but Adonis was very quickly able to prove he was telling the truth. Roe, despite having his entire worldview and years of his life shattered by this one man, decided to try and make things work between them. And it did, for a while. The gaps in Adonis’s visits made more sense now, since he couldn’t be away for too long without the other gods getting suspicious. And it was nice to not have secrets. Roe was able to open up to him about his childhood as well, and Adonis provided sympathy for him.

But good things can’t last forever. As time passed, their relationship grew progressively worse. Adonis got upset over increasingly small things, and while Roe understood his perspective and tried to accommodate him, it didn’t mean he was exactly pleased about it. Adonis began to grow concerned over the prospect of something happening to Roe. After all, he was mortal. Frail. Weak.

His solution to this? Well, get rid of the mortality. Roe wasn’t exactly on board with the idea, considering he quite enjoyed being able to perform and live in the city, and accepting Adonis’s offer would make that nearly impossible. Adonis was persistent though, bringing up the idea at any time despite how many times Roe tried to gently shoot it down. Roe eventually grew tired of this cycle and hesitantly accepted. Adonis claimed that this would make things easier— They could see each other more often, they wouldn’t have to hide, the chances of his whole relationship with a mortal being found out by the one person who could end his existence from breaking the rules moved close to 0, no real drawbacks! for him.

this is where the stuff in the post i mentioned earlier comes in. if you’ve already read it, yeah it gets bad. if you haven’t, here’s the brief explanation.

given the fact that mortal bodies aren’t exactly capable of handling literal godly essence, Roe’s body began to decay and break down. At first, it mimicked some sort of disease. His skin became dry and flaky, and his body felt oddly hot and uncomfortable. Painful sensations overtook his body and became almost constant. By the time things started melting and his organs began to fail, he already knew it was too late to reverse any of this. Any hope of continuing his career or life normally vanished completely. Adonis, however, was very happy about this new development! It had worked! yippee! so so much fun. Of course, he obviously remained as sympathetic towards Roe as possible, regardless of any underlying excitement.

Roe became agitated and frustrated because of the amount of pain he was in and how much he had lost. He wasn’t able to leave the house anymore. He began to snap and lash out at Adonis, picking a fight or making a snide remark whenever possible. Adonis hadn’t exactly seen this coming, but he still kept trying to de-escalate things, often in the form of telling Roe that he was acting unreasonable or hysterical (smart move!). Despite all of this, they stayed in their relationship. Roe was too terrified to be alone, knowing that whatever was happening to him would completely destroy any semblance of respect people had for him, and Don because he wanted to see it through.

Their fights got worse until Adonis finally snapped back, calling Roe an “ungrateful cunt” for not appreciating the love and support he’d oh so generously provided. He made it clear to Roe that nobody would recognize him as human anymore. Nobody would love or care about him. He’d be a freak to anyone other than him, so he’d better stop complaining or he’d lose him too.

This got through to Roe, and he stopped shouting. In fact, even if he wanted to, he couldn’t. It hurt too much to speak, to move, to breathe. Every step was agony. His body had contorted beyond recognition. Was it even worth it to continue like this? Would this be what the rest of his existence was like? Did he really want to live if it meant being in constant, unbearable agony?

Even if the answer was no, he hardly had much of a choice. He tried more humane methods at first. Overdose, drowning in the bathtub, smashing his head against the wall— Nothing worked. He was still alive. He was still alive. Why was he still alive? Was he alive? Was this what it meant to live?

He got more desperate. Stabbing at his stomach, burning his flesh, only it would only leave little splotchy marks that quickly faded. Or so he thought.

The area around the wound he’d made on his stomach began to rot, eating away at any organs or skin or muscle in its path. Eventually, his entire torso from the bottom of his spine to the top of his pelvis was gone save for his spine and a few bits of spare viscera.

When Adonis returned, he wasn’t happy to see what Roe had tried to do. He became incredibly upset with him for trying to leave the relationship in the only way he possibly could. Still, as long as Roe promised to stop, he’d forgive him. Roe obliged.

The fact that Roe wouldn’t talk to him became a source of frustration for Adonis. It felt intentional, spiteful. And it hurt. Every single question was met with a dulled response, as if he barely heard him. As if he hardly cared. It became a bit like spending time with a rock when he stopped responding all together. No matter what Adonis tried, he couldn’t seem to get Roe to react. It was at that point he realized that both physically and mentally, the person he’d fallen for was gone. Far, far deep down, he knew it was his fault. But still, there was hardly any point in staying. Roe would probably rot there forever, and what good would it do to watch over that?

And so he left. Roe realized that it was permanent maybe only a week or so later. Initially, he blamed himself. If he had put in a little more effort, he could have tried to respond, but the pain was too much to bear… The pain— The pain that had begun to fade now. Maybe a month after Adonis left, Roe began to regain his mobility, his strength, and while he was still in pain, it was no longer unbearable. It seemed more like a dull nagging now. The fog that the loneliness and agony had inflicted upon him began to lift as well, and all of that guilt quickly shifted and simmered into pure hatred.

Hatred that the new immortal would begin to inflict upon the world and the ones surrounding it. That would continue to build for years with only the set goal of revenge against the man that had wronged him. And while it cooled over time into a tepid resentment, it never truly faded. He was able to continue with life, though hardly on the same plane, confining himself to a dimension that only certain desperate souls could access. Souls desperate to save their relationships, souls desperate to have their so-called beloveds fall for them, wretched, vile souls. And he’d help them regardless. After all, what’s a worse offense to a love god than bastardizing the craft? Who cares if a few… Hundred lives get ruined? It’s fun to watch. It’s not his turn to suffer anymore. And he won’t be made a victim again.

ANYWAYS more extra info i DONT think i put on the other post but dont rlly wanna check:

Adonis is the god of Lust, Beauty, and Vanity

Roe took on his stage name Rosé after his transformation to distance himself from his past

Rosé has been collecting magic. For what purpose? Let’s not worry about that.

Rosé has the abilities to siphon magic and the life force from people. He doesn’t do this often unless something catches his eye that he wants to harness. It does mean he’s incredibly powerful though.

Rosé’s main abilities he gained directly from Adonis’s essence or whatever include being able to alter the emotions of others (he can force people to think certain ways and even do certain things), pocket dimension stuff, and object conjuring.

Rosé has a lot of side hobbies but his favorite is cooking. He really likes savory dishes, but he also likes sweet things.

Rosé is able to travel between different dimensions and such, and only exists as a “god” in (this) one.

Rosé has built up a reputation among a lot of magical creatures. None of them are quite sure what he is or how he seems to defy certain laws of existence but most see him as a relatively trustworthy supplier for love potions.

Every so often Rosé gets bored and chooses to single people out to mess with. Maybe he should stop doing that.

Rosé is VERY prone to breakdowns, and while he’s mostly able to stay professional, if someone’s around him for a prolonged period of time and something causes him to spiral he regresses into an incredibly different and much more desperate person.

Rosé (name aside) considers himself a liquor connoisseur (RED FLA) and does collect rare alcohols. he does have a tendency to drink heavily but considering his body can’t really process food or drinks it sort of just magically disappears. he is a talkative and very mopey drunk though. like will start full on venting about his life story.

He’s friends with Aisling!!! Friends is a very strong word!!!! Maybe the wrong word!!! But they they hang out sometimes and Aisling seems to enjoy his company a lot even if he can’t really understand why he keeps coming back if not out of fear or trying to use him so he keeps his distance. Aisling is honestly just worried about him and has sort of been able to slowly break down that Rosé maybe isn’t as absolutely terrifying as he first thought and is indeed just very. very lonely and maybe even a bit pathetic

[alexissara]

Polyamory Is Queer

So a post on twitter happened where a pansexual person was saying Polyamory was queer and that he wanted people to include Polyamory in their pride merch was getting massively dunked on on twitter. nearly 1000 people at the time of me starting to write this had decided they should tell this person to die, to say he was a fed, that polyamarous people weren't oppressed in any way, that the oppression they have is deserved, etc. That alone to me would speak to the queerness here of polyamory, getting mass harassment for dating to suggest that even against our own, a pansexual guy.

Like the post is cringe in that asking for merch is cringe, like who cares, it's capitalism, I don't care about polyam flag merch, in fact, I probably wouldn't buy it if it existed in general. I would rather get merch of three girls holding hands being polyamarous and really that mostly doesn't exist and, a little sad sure, but it doesn't matter. It's not really an access of oppression.

However, I want to talk about why polyamory is queer and to knock down all the common talking points that are levied against queer people. I am not using any strawmen here I promise you I only need to look at these quote retweets to see SOOO MANY people saying the same shit I see right here.

Polyamarous People Are Not Oppressed

Polyamorous people face many different forms of oppression. There is the obviously and previously stated mass dunking on a person for daring to say they want more polyam merch and that polyam people are part of the wider queer community. This isn't a lone incident but instead I see all the time monogamous people feeling it is totally fine to dunk on polyamarous people because they met one that annoyed them or because it makes them uncomfortable or we are sluts or something. The mass harassment and open hatred are in fact a form of oppression.

However, it doesn't just result in the public opinion but the legal reality. You can be legally fired for being polyamarous basically everywhere. If you have a divorce and you are polyamarous your child will be taken away, it doesn't matter if you have proof if it being consensual it is a mark against you. If someone is sick in the polycule only one person can claim themselves as a partner to go to a hospital and see them. Polyamarous people do not have a right to be married. Polyamarous people are subjected to increased criticism about their relationships. Polyamarous people face a hyper comparison when one person lies about being polyam to abuse their girlfriend or a polyam person ends up being a bad partner it is cast on all polyamarous people.

Cis/Het Men Can't Be Queer

When people make this argument their projecting the bad boyfriend of a friend of theirs onto all polyamorous people, it's a straw man. We've decided some time ago that cis/het men can in fact be queer, I don't even like that. If I was big goddess of queerness I would vanish cis/het men from being queer but we already decided that they were. I frankly just do not care for cis/het dudes generally, some of my favorite siblings are cis/het dudes.

The A in LGBTQIA includes Asexuals and Aromantics both of whom can be Cis/Het men. The I can in fact also include cis/het men people who are intersex and assigned male at birth and id as men do exist and those people can in fact be cis/het.

Polyamarous People Aren't Historically Oppressed

The reality is if you look at the history of the world, you'll find that most cultures were not monogamous. A lot practiced Social Monogamy aka a woman was owned by a man but the man fucked around and that was normal. However, many cultures simply had no concept of monogamy, in fact there are some cultures to this day that are non monogamous without men having ownership of women. The reality is much how history is much gayer then we know and a lot more trans then we know history is also a lot more non-monogamous. Many indigenous cultures and pre Christian cultures practiced various forms of non-monogamy. These cultures were wiped out slowly with the Christian take over of the majority of the world. Ethical or not we know many powerful people took multiple wives in countries like China where the empires had ranks for their consorts as a standard practice. These are not vastly different then the kind of monogamous marriages that were common place by kings only they didn't need to kill their wives to be with other women.

The reality is that something that came natural to many be it bad or good instincts was suppressed and removed. Polyamory was wiped out from most the world because it deviated the mind set of the colonizers. Of course any place queerness has been suppressed queer non-monogamy was suppressed as well. We know that polyamarous people have had to hide their relationships especially if they deviated from the heteronormative model like like in the case of  William Moulton Marston, Elizabeth Holloway Marston, and Olive Byrne whom had to cloak their relationship be that sexual or not.

Polyamarous Are Just Sleeping Around

I don't have to go in depth here, asexual polyamarous people like me exist. I am dating many a hot lady and person and I haven't had sex in years. I don't have sex. You don't need to have sex to be polyamarous.

However, what's wrong with wanting to have sex? Why is that a grounds for oppression? Having lots of sex or no sex, it doesn't make you more or less valid. I saw someone say that polyamarous people deserve to have their kids taken away because their sleeping around.

Does a single monogamous mom deserve to have her kids taken away if she sleeps around when her kids are with their dad? What about a dad? Like sleeping around is something most monogamous allosexuals do. Be that cheating or being chronically single and going on hook up apps for sex. The second you start dating your supposed to swear away your libido towards others forever until you break up.

If that's your form of chastity play with your partner, I am not here to stop you. However, consenting partners deciding they are good with each other fucking other people isn't wrong.

Polyamory is Oppressing Women

Where in the terfy world have I heard people claiming someone else's private lives are actually just oppressing cis women. Can cis/het dudes say "Hey girl, I'm polyamarous so it wasn't cheating when I fucked your best friend" sure they can but that was still cheating. People don't even time to understand Non-monogamy to know that the vast majority of polyam people would say that it is cheating to have sex with another person without informing your partner or agreeing in advance you both can sleep with anyone you want.

Again, I don't give a shit about cis/het dudes, send them to the sun, I don't care but here they are used as a hypnotical device to attack other queer people. The OP who was getting harassed on mass was Pansexual and most everyone I have seen say Polyamory is queer has been some form of queer person. I don't know if you know this but cis/het dudes do not want to be queer, they don't want to be counted among the homosexuals on account that many of them are homophobic and transphobic.

This simply willingly ignores that many women are polyamarous. If you look at many poly groups you'll see lots of women there looking to date men and women. If you go on dating apps like her you'll see lots of polyamarous women. If you go to one trans women's discord server you'll see lots of polyamarous women there. You can see polyamarous lesbians

Polyamory Is Oppressive

Typically they form at some form of Polygamy and go like, see, polyamory is oppressive and you all act like your better then us! This utterly ignores that to this day monogamy has not unpacked it's roots as a system of ownership. The history of dating for love is actually ridiculously small in the white world. Monogamy was just one of several systems of women being sold to men by the men in their lives. One that took root and was forced on many many many people's who did not practice this form of oppression or oppressing women at all until Christians came to their land.

Polyamory can be unethical as can many other forms of non-monogamy and some are rooted in systems of ownership just like monogamy is rooted in that. The reality is our hearts are not ethical anyway, we can't expect love to be perfect and utterly unproblematic but also there are forms of polyamory that are ethical.

Polyamory Is Just A Choice

I saved this one for last because this one is feelings based where the others have provable facts this one people can simply chose to believe me or not. However, I want to talk about wider queer theory for a second to really practically engage this idea. While the popular narrative is that being queer is not a choice some queer theorists have pushed back on this idea. The main queer counter arguments are We Chose Our Own Actions and If It Was A Choice I'd Chose It.

We Chose Own Actions poses us with the idea that while our internal feelings might not be a choice we chose how we act on our choices and queerness is choosing to express and live outside of what we are told. That queerness itself is the choice of acting against the cishetero systems of control. So it doesn't matter if a Republican law maker is secretly gay, he wouldn't be queer because queerness in this model is a choice, it's an identity we chose.

Then the If It Was A Choice It Chose It model says, so what if it was a choice. It choses to simply ignore internal feelings and say it doesn't matter why I want to kiss other women, the fact I chose to do it is consensually with other women who chose to kiss women in itself is valid and worthy of respect. That there is nothing shameful about being queer and therefore if they could chose to be queer that is enough to be respected. This simply says being gay is great, I like being gay, I'd pick it every time and you can't stop me and I will be respected.

We went over these models to say that even if you end up disagreeing with me, that being non-mongamous is in fact not a choice to you that that doesn't necessarily excluded it from being queer and that doesn't mean that Polyamarous people don't deserve respect or rights.

However, to me being polyamarous is core to who I am. It is not a choice for me but I would chose it every time. I would never want to get rid of my 15 year relationship with my Fiancé or my 8 year relationship with my girlfriends in Scotland or any other relationship I'm a part of. To me it's natural to want to be with other people, to feel romantic feelings and it feels gross to me to suggest that I should suppress those feelings or if I did that it would be morally better.

I was in high school when I started dating my Fiancé, even then Freshmen year of high school I told them, "Hey if you wanna date other people, that's okay". At the time, It was mostly because we lived an "unbareable" thirty minutes away from one another, sometimes an hour in traffic. "Worlds away" and unable to drive I really wanted them to be able to be loved and have everything they wanted in a relationship. They did not act on that for years and years. Many years later we talk about polyamory more seriously, I had feelings for my now 8 year long distance relationship GFs. We had all been friends, they helped me come out as trans, we got on so perfectly, and there was a guy friend of ours that they had been kinda attracted to and wanted to try to feel things out with. We agreed that we would explore our feelings and stuff.

From there we've been actively identifying as polyamorous, there was bumps in the road, I was not a perfect girlfriend and I misunderstood how Polyamory worked like thinking we all had to want to date each other and realizing that was not the case. It felt right to be polyam and it kept feeling right as we met people, had feelings and let our relationships evolve to wherever they went naturally, disclosing with each other obviously but we love talking about crushes and dates and stuff together. We've never dated the same person and we probably never will but we love each other and love seeing each other be loved. This is core to who I am, my Fiancé is my soul mate, but my soul isn't small, it's big and it has other soul mates and sweet loves.

It what comes natural to me and it would feel as bad to me to stop being polyamorous as to go back into the closet about being asexual, trans or being a lesbian. To me it's the part of my identity that is probably most in practice in that I talk to my GFs every single day, I live with my Fiancé, their actively part of my life every single day and I am open to new feelings every single day. Even with a recent break up with one of my Girlfriend's of nearly two years I not once wished I was monogamous, my heart was in pain but I still loved being polyam.

I don't have anything else to say on this topic really, I don't care if I get dunked on, to me, this is who I am. I don't particularly love "the polyam community" as a wider hole, I am in my own lesbian niche. Still, I think even the unfortunately straight among us deserve to have the right to love who they love. Nothing anyone stays is gonna get me to suddenly see my love as selfish or something.

[If you want more polyamorous sapphic art to exist in the world maybe consider throwing me a few bucks on Patreon or Ko-fi so I can afford to make more.]

[bread-and-roses-too]

I appreciate that there's been a pushback to pure choice feminism, it's important to acknowledge that no decision exists in a void. However, I worry when I see bullying towards women who conform to patriarchal standards in places that are considered "safe" for women, namely the west. I feel like things are neatly categorized into "feminist" and "unfeminist", so I want to remind people of something very important:

It is not "unfeminist" to conform to the patriarchy for safety reasons.

There may be a variety of reasons why being non-conforming to the patriarchy might be dangerous. Some women are required to wear certain dress in order to keep their jobs, like high heels or skirts. Losing a job can lead to a variety of safety concerns. In the same way, women in general are well aware of the fact that wearing makeup and nice, gender-conforming clothes makes you more likely to pass a job interview. Some women, like intersex women, trans women, and women of color, are more commonly targeted by accusations of being "fake" women and are more likely to face violence related to those accusations. They may go out of their way to conform to gendered standards of dress and action to avoid unsafe situations. There are also certain locations where not conforming to patriarchal gender standards is grounds for verbal or physical harassment. I live in a pretty Trumpy, confederate-flag-laden area, but people here tend to keep to themselves and not openly point out or threaten deviants to the "norm". This isn't the case everywhere in the U.S., and certainly not across the world. There are also highly religious areas and families where abuse might happen under the guise of "discipline" to women who stand up to traditional gender roles.

There are women in all of these situations who choose to fight the patriarchy, and those women are incredibly brave. In my personal opinion, acting as though this choice is obvious, safe, or even required belittles how much these women are putting themselves through. Fighting the patriarchy is neverending, it's tough, it can be dangerous. Honor those who fight and respect those who aren't in a place to take that risk.

If you're in a situation where it's unsafe for you to be yourself outside the patriarchy, I see you. You should not be silenced because of your desire or need for self-protection. Proclaiming, even if it has to be anonymously, that you're being forced against your will to conform to the patriarchy is so incredibly important for people to hear. There is a misconception, even among feminists, that the worst of misogyny is over in the global west. Your voice matters, sometimes more than the voices of those of us who are in safer areas less affected by misogyny. I hope one day we can help you find safety and peace.

[scentedluminarysoul]

"Oh, Bones was such a good show!"

Yeah? Wanna what I still vividly remember from that show? The episode where they're interrogating a semi-fat woman. The main cop goes in, sniffs, and asks what the weird smell was. Then Bones lady comes in and says it's mold. Because fat people are so fat, they can't properly wash themselves and so they grow stinky mold in their body rolls. She said that as if that was a Scientific Fact™

"Oh, House MD was so good!!"

Yeah? Here some fun bits I remember from it:

Fat man had to be lifted out of his apartment via crane after a heart attack. At first, the team wants to pin everything on him being fat, and dismiss him completely, until he puts his foot down and demands they ignore his fatness. Turns out he had lung cancer. He was too fat to notice he had lung cancer. And then he died.

Skinny woman is sick. Turns out, she used to be fat, but had a stomach operation to lose weight. But, oh no! Her organs are still fat!! So now this skinny woman is dying of fatness. While being chewed out that she lost weight the lazy way. Doesn't matter that she since changed her lifestyle and is working out a lot. She didn't lose weight *the correct way* and is now being punished for it.

The intersex girl whose father sexually abused her. And who only stopped after House told him she had testicles, so now it's gay!!!

The time House fucking CURED an asexual couple, which nobody had asked him to do (quite the opposite), and thus proving that asexuality doesn't exist

That's your super good shows. Miss me with that shit.

This is only a TINY sliver of what marginalized people are confronted with every day, in popular media. And I'm white, so I'm VERY sure there is a TON of racism, antisemitism, etc in those shows, and others, as well.

BTW, that was my first exposure to the concept of asexuality. "Doesn't exist, not a thing". Took me another decade to learn that's a lie. Representation matters.

[doodlepede]

We dont really interact much but you usually interact with my posts about whipping girl and i just need to get this out to someone because I'm going crazy you don't have to respond or anything I'm just ranting "Of course, feminine traits that arise from our adult hormonal makeup are relatively easy to categorize as biological, as one can experience the corresponding changes firsthand via hormone therapy. In contrast, other feminine traits that have biological input —such as those that may be hardwired into our brains from birth—are more difficult to discern. Two possible examples of this include feminine aesthetic preferences and ways of expressing oneself. Evidence that these tendencies may be hardwired comes from the fact that they typically appear very early in childhood and often in contradiction to one’s socialization (both for children whose parents attempt to raise them in a unisex or gender-neutral fashion, and for boys whose families actively and aggressively steer them away from feminine expression). This indicates that some aspects of feminine verbal and aesthetic expression precede and/or supersede gender socialization" And I have so much to say this is fucking wild it feels like she sees masculine expression as the default and so feminine expression is automatically different and must have some explanation Its weird to be that she thinks gender expression is hardwired into brains when it can and does change for people its not just a static thing she ignores trans men/masc and gnc women only mentioning boys also weird to me that she puts kids being raised gender neutral or gender free on basically the same level as literal abuse like it just seems like more enbyphobia like she expects everyone to fit in masculine and feminine and man or woman and people who don't are somehow bad and contributing to transphobia and transmisogyny its so weird to me and not at all seemingly based in the material reality that many people face

i saw a massive text wall in my inbox and got Scared for a second LOLOLOL okay my thoughts as i read

yeah i would say that traits which are affected by hormonal changes are biological. its a biological process occurring in a biological organism. its the way we (are compelled to) label them that is sociocultural. breasts happen because estrogen, female is just a useful functional label, and when you remember that intersex people exist, you will find it less and less functional for anything outside zoology and even then, masisve fucking asterisk im not gonna get into right now. ah well theres your issue, there are no feminine traits hardwired into the brain. youre prescribing a sociocultural label to a biological system. that's "brain gender", flawed and borderlike hack science and cornerstone to most transmeds of old (2018). "motherly instincts" are the same, applying sociocultural labels where they don't belong. many many many many mothers outright kill their children through neglect or abuse, so wheres the hardwired instinct gone? single fathers exist and are often superior parents than the mothers so wheres the femaleness gone? we are already doing a LOT of conflation between "female" and "feminine" and biology vs sociology but im getting a little ahead of her....

"feminine aesthetic preference" that's sociocultural. "ways of expressing oneself" sociocultural. yawn. "appear early in childhood" because they are taught by parents and peers who are 100000% aware of the need to conform to society because humans are a social species. i was Very aware of the way my female peers were trying to get me to conform from as young as FIVE. and before preschool, my parents were the ones making me wear pink dresses, when I preferred blue and orange. gender performance is learned behavior. even if your parents try to bring you up gender neutrally, you still have to go to school and interact with every other kid who very much isn't. kids are way more aware than shes giving them credit for, they want to fit in, and every second of gender neutral raising is defeated the instant that child meets two members of the same sex as themself, because those others will know he is male and treat him like one of their own, and they will learn that they're a he and boys are like them. or maybe they'll decide that theyre nothing like them. who knows, but the illusion is shattered regardless. am i strange for literally remembering my thoughts and feelings from the age of 5ish? because i do. + people can change their fucking minds later in life and its no less legitimate as people who made up their minds in their single digits. who are you to fucking tell them otherwise?

(notice the way she singles out boys for being aggressively steered away from feminity without a second of consideration for girls aggressive minding to be feminine? her lack of perspective or consideration for anyone's pov but her own is showing again, it really is no wonder transradfems fucking worship this shitass book)

yeah no god she 100% sees male as default like girl stop you're reinforcing patriarchy

if she were ftm, tumblr would see her for the transmed she is and be over it. i genuinely feel as though she and authors like her are given the benefit of the doubt because of her transfem bias and female gender like be so for real with me.

[boy-gender]

Hi! You can answer this publicly or privately, but I figured maybe someone else might have a similar question? I just wanted to ask about your personal reasons for using it/its pronouns.

I ask bc I've come across two different characters, now, in media I enjoy, that use it/its pronouns. And I've enjoyed seeing it! They're both two of my favorite characters in their respective media. And i think im kinda questioning whether or not my excitement for these characters (particularly when pronouns are discussed bc they're both great characters outside of that fact) is just bc it's nice to see representation, even beyond they/them pronouns, or if maybe I should consider it/its for myself? I'm not sure, I just thought hearing other people's experiences could potentially help me figure that out. Thank you for your time!

Happy to answer!

First of all, whatever pronouns you want to use is entirely up to you! Nobody gets to tell you what to use and what not to use, or what to try out and change later if you don't like it. If you feel like you want to try a set of pronouns, try it! If it doesn't jive, just change it again. There is no limit to how many pronouns or labels you can use, try, drop, pick up again, or how many times you change it. If it sounds like it/its makes you happy, go for it, even if it just "just" because of characters you like. There's nothing wrong with being influenced by the stories that are important to you.

My reason for using it is mostly trauma-based. All my life I've felt a significant disconnect from my own body, but I didn't realize I had a dissociative disorder until I was like 24. A combination of child abuse causing the disorder, where I never felt like my body was/is me, just that I'm a thing inhabiting the body, possessing it like a spirit- and also lifelong bullying and ostracizing by my peers both contributed to it. There are many times I don't feel like a man or a woman, or a nonbinary person, or any type of person at all. I was dehumanized; I had my humanity stripped from me, including my gender. Fat autistic weird 'girls' aren't treated like girls, intersex tomboys aren't treated like boys, we're treated like monsters. Like kicked dogs. I existed only to be abused by the people around me- my parents and teachers who were supposed to protect me, and the peers who should have been my friends and community. Freaks don't have genders, those are for people. And I was constantly reminded that I did not count as a person.

I very much associate the bullying I endured with my gender nonconformity. I was an afab intersex person- I was a girl of age like 13 with a moustache and beard growing in. I was fat, and my fat never distributed to the 'desired' places for a girl (also, this was like 2008. There was no 'desired place' for fat on girls). Other kids knew or sensed things were different about me- that I was queer in multiple ways, that I had several mental illnesses, that I was fat and ugly and was friends only with other rejects, meaning nobody gave a shit what happened to us. There would be no one to come to our defense no matter how severely we were harmed. We didn't matter.

When I found out I was a system, it put a lot into perspective. The disconnect from the body, from my identity, from my own memories (which are all in third person) made more sense. My other is not human. At first I assumed the "it-ness" was because of this, but actually he doesn't like to be called it at all. It hurts him. It doesn't fit. The it-ness is from me. It's an expression of the gender experience I was denied, a reclamation of the othering I suffered. I don't count as human. I will never be worth being human, or having typical human experiences. I will never be allowed into the club. But it turns out there are other clubs out here- humanity and the cisgender binary are not the only options. I no longer see my othering as "be human or just die," but as "not human? Cool, come try one of these other myriad things." There are so many more things you can be besides human.

This makes a lot of people uncomfortable. Firstly, good. People should be uncomfortable with the cruelty I endured and the marks it left. People should be uncomfortable that they probably participated in othering people as children, and maybe even still do it as adults, and they should be uncomfortable that society is raising their children to continue to do this. It is, in a way, a little bit like my pronouns being fuck/you, or examine/yourselves. Some of it's shock value, and I like that.

Secondly, the shit I get the most is from other trans people, saying I'm somehow harming the trans community because other people call us "its" as an insult. If someone were to call me a she, that is incorrect, and could be used as an insult- they're misgendering me, they're trying to hurt me. This is not the fault of the word "she" and I'm not going to go up to a trans woman and say "this word hurts me, so you cant use it. No more she/her pronouns for you." We are not all going to have the same comfort level with words. I don't like being called a dyke, but dykes do. Some people don't like being called queer, but lots of us do. Some people don't like being called it, but I do. Either way, I get to decide what I am called, and other people get to decide what they are called, and nobody else gets to veto someone's identity. If someone doesn't like calling me it? Then they don't have to talk to me. If they won't respect my pronouns, they're not any better than people who would call me she or her. I don't need their input or validation.

If you do decide to try out it pronouns, I would say be prepared for backlash, but also don't let it effect you. Block people liberally, joyously even. Don't argue. Don't bother. You do not have to justify who you are. And, consider "soft launching" your pronouns! Maybe tell a couple close friends, or just the internet, and if it goes well, expand to other people, and then other people. Roll it out in stages while you get comfortable and try things and assess. You don't owe anyone a coming out; you can decide if, when, how, and to whom you explain yourself, if you ever do it at all.

As an aside, I want to make a distinction here- I'm not otherkin. I don't say I don't count as human because I am some other type of creature just in a human body this reincarnation. This is not a spiritual belief, or even a psych-kin thing. This is purely a product of trauma, something that was foisted upon me that I am now reclaiming, not something innate to my identity. I don't want people to conflate my experience with that of otherkin and be like "see? you're not really [whatever], you're just traumatized!" I hope people will not use my experience to police other people's identities. I am speaking only for myself.

Hope this helps. If you have any more specific questions, feel free to reach out!