#I mean in general I think this fandom has a problem with reducing the characters

[four-rabbit]

Maybe its because I'm bitter or because I just left a fandom that reduced one of the main characters to a one off joke when the POINT is that they're complex but I hate how this fandom treats Izutsumi.

I hate how some people who interacted with the fandom before watching the anime thought that she didn't even speak because EVERYONE just draws her as a cute stupid cat whose personality is just being a cat

Again, maybe I'm just bitter, but I hate how the most common joke is the "Izutsumi: izutsumi" cause apparently no one can be bothered to actually consider her thoughts and feelings and personality.

Like yeah I'm not saying it can't be funny but it quickly becomes tiring when she's reduced to just that

Especially when her entire arc is about finding her identity as a person and as part of a community, finding a balance between her human and cat souls because she's both but also neither. Especially when canonically she's ashamed of the one time she behaved like just a silly little cat (golden kingdom)

[my-mt-heart]

Idk how to say this but I am not as bothered about whatever is going to transpire between Daryl and Isabelle (bcoz for one thing - we know what is going to happen in the end- and for another - I honestly believe that the male execs are not at all confident abt their vision for these two as they would like to be and the whole thing would prolly boil down to ambiguity and ultimately- it will fall upon the viewers to dissect how Daryl feels - the Caryl fandom especially is really adept at reading into storylines - even stupid ones) None of this is good by any means. It cheapens the integrity of all the characters involved. It blatantly insults and reduces female characters - I believe that Isabelle deserves better. That a story should hold space for multiple female characters. Also - I am worried about putting the fate and the story of one the best female characters on TV (Carol) in the hands of someone who has proven that he can't be trusted to handle them with care. Reading S2 reviews - I am sort of reassured that Carol is treated well enough in the story - which I believe - has a LOT to do with Melissa McBride's input. Going forward - it is going to be more difficult bcoz once we have dealt with old traumas - we do need to evolve these characters and make sure they don't stay stagnant. I don't believe Zabel has the chops to do that.

sorry for that rant. I am just really frustrated.

What I worry about is the way all of this bts stuff amongst the male execs is going to impact the Caryl dynamic. Whatever the antis may think - and while McReedus has insane chemistry - I do believe that the romantic energy is generated between them by a lot of their acting choices (bcoz the underlying story is teasing a romance). What happens to all that when a romance is completely off the table? When AMC has been pushing this friendship narrative down our throats in a very evident bid to do damage control - the insecure/defensive promo that we have been getting last few weeks is proof enough that Caryl was always more than friends?

The problems were already glaringly obvious from the very beginning. the fact that Melissa isn't billed equally for a season where she is proclaimed to be the major focus? It is not even about Caryl going canon for me anymore. I love Melissa and Carol way too much for me to give up yet but I treasure the Caryl bond primarily bcoz they have always been each other's everything. it is truly a bond that evades definition. Both Carol and Daryl doesn't have what they have with each other with anyone. THAT IS A CANON FACT. I don't think I can watch that dynamic that I treasure so much being butchered - s11 was painful enough - I can't go through all of that and more again.

Going to watch s2 and then my further commitment will depend entirely upon how the characters are treated and their dynamic is portrayed?

It sucks that I am dreading watching Carol and Daryl back together on screen.

been here just for a few months but the way AMC has been fumbling with this promo - have you guys always experienced this whiplash or is it a new thing?

I’m going to include big spoilers in my response, so proceed with caution ⚠️

I respect your opinion, but I disagree with you on the point about Daryl’s and Isabelle’s arc. It seems like the male EPs (Zabel, Nicotero, Gimple) are overly confident that an explicit romance between their male hero and a younger blonde nun who accused Daryl of being like his abusive father just for trying to go home to his family will attract a larger male audience and they aren’t sparing any feelings with it because we aren’t their ideal audience anyway. To them, we’re just a bunch of “hysterical” shippers whose POV’s don’t matter and we can just take their crumbs. AMC is a bit more complicated, but I’ll get to them later.

Daryl and the nun kiss in 202, so there’s little to no room for us to dissect how Daryl is feeling. Isabelle’s death is the furthest thing from a relief because 1) it reduces her character down to man pain like you said and 2) from what I’m gathering, it completely overshadows Caryl’s reunion and then their entire arc. We get another hug that does absolutely nothing to elevate their relationship and then Carol has to face that Daryl didn’t need her to rescue him because he found a new family and become his emotionally supportive friend to help him through his grief of a lost love interest he’s known for a few months. It almost feels like it’s going to be a retread of Beth’s death, only worse. We know how Greg Nicotero views both of those relationships and to be blunt, the man needs to stop projecting his creepy fetishes onto Daryl and making it our problem 🤢

The way the story is framed, it’s not even about Caryl at all. They’re the relationship we’re the most invested in and yet all the emotional weight is given to a highly problematic relationship that developed over a dozen ish short episodes (compared to Caryl’s decade+ of emotional depth) and it’s all for nothing too. Zabel just resets Daryl like the hokey network procedural writer he is. And Caryl fans are rewarded for their years-long loyalty by getting more ambiguous subtext to analyze? Really?

I think you’re spot on about Melissa though. The reason she’s the bright spot of the season, the reason Carol’s individual arc feels true, and her spiritual connection to Daryl stays alive is because Melissa influenced all of that. She’s shown us time and time again that she understands her character so deeply and respects her fans. It really breaks my heart because I think she had a beautiful story in mind for Carol and she deserves all the support in the world, but as I’ve said many times, if damage is done to the character who has been written as her soulmate for over a decade, damage is also done to her. And I can’t watch that. I can’t watch the destruction of my favorite characters and my favorite relationship and put money in AMC’s pockets for gaslighting me. Retconning Caryl’s relationship into a platonic friendship is their way of protecting themselves from backlash. “Daryl isn’t emotionally cheating because he and Carol have always been besties?” “We didn’t mislead you. We told you they were friends, so you dumb shippers are doing this to yourselves. Please watch our slop anyways ✌️” They’re even trying to shift responsibility to Melissa by making her answer the shipping questions despite the fact that it’s Daryl’s arc throwing a wrench in everything and I expect that to continue at NYCC/Palyfest. It’s completely unethical and it’s backfiring.

Zabel cannot write for Daryl and Carol. He keeps showing us that he doesn’t understand their bond nor does he value it. A couple of the reviews mentioned it felt like Carol was shoehorned into certain aspects of the story, which tracks with what I already knew—that he and the other EPs think she’s hindering the story they want to tell about men doing manly things. That’s why they try so hard to challenge her significance to Daryl’s story and that is not going to change just because they’re moving to another location. Somebody like that should not have power to decide her trajectory. Fuck whatever he has planned for S3. I don’t want it. I still want Caryl and I still want to see them get the stories they deserve, but that’s only going to happen if we get a new showrunner who respects them and respects their fans. In case it needs to be said, Gimple is not that guy either (he can fake his enthusiasm on SM all he wants 🖕🖕🖕). A complete rebranding of the show to something that honors the characters and gives Melissa her dues (equal billing, title, etc) is the only way I’m tuning in now🤷🏻‍♀️ I don’t have the emotional capacity to sit through S2, but I will be here, speaking up, to make sure Melissa gets all the necessary praise and those assholes can’t blame her if the show tanks.

I’ve only been here a few years and there’s been a lot of turn over at AMC even just in that time (I kid you not, all of our problems can be traced back to Josh Sapan leaving. He loved Caryl and Melissa). That being said, I cannot for the life of me understand why any of the guys over there (even the misogynistic ones) would approve of the Daryl/Isabelle arc after the PR disaster that Leah caused not even that long ago and at least for that, the arc tied back to romantic Caryl and we weren’t subjected to any uncomfortable physical intimacy. Why the fuck would they make the same mistake? Why the fuck do they have to spend more time cleaning up messes than avoiding the mess altogether at every fucking opportunity they had (and they had a lot). I just don’t get it. And I’m so tired of taking the abuse.

[dreadfuldevotee]

Thank you for this last post. The discourse on this fandom can often be so annoying. I hate it when people are like "this is a Gothic horror, let them be toxic and problematic!!!!11!!!1" because it's not take they think it is? At the end of the day, they still want us to root for these characters and relationships, right? So how can we do that if they're stereotyped vampires, who is dark, cold, just hurt each other and don't have an ounce of growth, development, empathy and humanity? And this is such a dismissive opinion of the show and even the books, because their conflict with humanity and vampirism is a central aspect of the plot. That said, if you reduce them to the abuse alone, you're also missing the point of the story? I mean, you can totally have your opinion, you can see them as unforgivable even on this fictional universe, you can hate and root against them... But this show isn't about punitivism, it is about them navigating immortality. There are consequences for their actions, as there should be, but the goal is for them to find a way to make this work. You don't need to agree (idgaf about the British monarchy and still watched a few episodes of The Crown for the acting, for example), but if you expect otherwise, you're just playing yourself? But this fandom seems to have a problem with finding a good balance. Not to mention the hypocrisy of never forgiving certain characters and reducing them to their problematic actions, but treating their faves very different lol. And I'm like, okay, you don't need to love everyone, it's okay to have a favorite, but at least don't be contradictory? Your fave does the exact same thing or worse? Anyways. Thanks again for putting it so well. It's refreshing to see posts like that here.

Thank you! I'm glad that other people get anything out of my ranting and raving, as I am a chronic yapper and really only talk for my own health LOL.

But yeah, there is a lot of selective hearing in any fandom, really; but it pisses me off a lot here because of all the "Gothic Horror" handwaving going on. Interacting with the fandom, reading the books and seeing clips & bits of personal writings from Anne Rice, the image it paints for me is a profound unwillingness to engage with contents of the story if they're not fun and sexy. Shit, even my own odyssey into the books is spurred on in one part, to be able to form my own opinion and critique on the writing and secondly, realizing that book readers were straight up lying at times about how things went down.

And there is this persistent idea I've seen on here and twitter of "If you have issue with XYZ then this series isn't for you" and like, okay if you don't wanna see gay people who have everything-but-the-bagel of mental illnesses then, yeah, sure. But when someone goes "Hey there is like,,, a ton of casual pedophilia and CSA in these stories that is framed as cute n' casual and/or deeply romantic, I wonder what that's all about" and then people crawl out the woodwork trying to convince you its not weird or that you're weird or weak for think its kinda fucked up- then at that point, I think maybe there is actually a different issue occurring here, you know?

Anyway, I think where I'm going with this is- TVC is a cultural phenomenon and has a tangible impact on Vampire and Gothic Horror canon and that's good and fun. But if we can recognize something like H.P Lovecraft's racism/classism/general fear of change having a profound effect on his writing and the spark of the entire Cosmic Horror Genre, then I think we can interrogate how AR as a Rich White Woman who grew up in mid-21st century New Orleans has an effect on the kind of stories she writes and how she does it.

[morkitten]

thoughts on Sonic Frontiers so far

I was clowning a lot on Sonic Frontiers before release and it took me until now to play it because it really looked like a cynical half-baked attempt at trend-chasing open world stuff, a genre that I already feel is very much not good. But, playing it, I feel better about it than how I thought I would feel playing.

Now, I still think it's a problematic game and definitely not one of my favorites, but when it comes to "open world games", again, a genre I really don't like, I find this as definitely one of the better/more tolerable ones I've played, simply because of the garish floating structures strewn all over these environments.

These look like shit and they're all over the place, but, it does mean that exploration requires you to do actual Sonic action-platforming to explore and to collect stuff, which is a lot more Game than the dull meandering of many open world games. All the problems of open world games are here - million collectibles for a million different things, a lot of things are just thrown out there and don't feel designed, but controlling Sonic is fun, and he's fast, meaning these environments don't feel as tiringly huge as they may appear at first.

The story so far is weirdly mature and it has this strange melancholy feel that I think is very interesting, even if I wouldn't write Sonic like this, it's fun to have a game that takes such a different swing. Sonic's friends are forced to confront themselves and their failings and sadness as they've been reduced to, uh, spirits hanging on cyber-purgatory hell. Sonic's friends are fucking dead and he needs to rescue their souls and hang out with them to comfort their loneliness as they interact with the ghosts of the last living memories of people of a genocided ancient civilization. That's, uh, something!

I do think the constant name-dropping other past games and events and characters feels a bit too much. It does feel like Ian Flynn trying to overcorrect or overdeliver on "fandom complaints" about past Sonic games, about how their stories don't feel meaningful, about how they seem to pretend no other game exists, etc. Sometimes he'll slip in some meta commentary based on fandom complaints about past Sonic games too, there's a line where like, Amy asks Sonic if it feels nice to roam around freely "with no guardrails", as if addressing complaints that people have with games like Sonic Unleashed, Colors, Generations and Forces relying on "hallway"-style level design a la Crash Bandicoot, or, and I haven't gotten to Tails yet, but I do know there's a line where Tails complains about his own character writing in Sonic Forces, and it's like, this is a bit too much. I don't need to be informed of what Sonic reddit discusses about in their spare time, this kinda stuff is lame and insular.

The combat isn't superb but it's interesting that they had to rethink so much in order to give Sonic combat at all. Every big enemy is like a completely different beast that takes specific parts of Sonic's moveset to use against them, and they're decent attempts at doing that! I would just rather not fight them again after fighting them once, though. Also, Sonic has fun and flashy moves that feel fitting to him.

Those are my impressions so far, might reblog this later with more of my thoughts as I progress through the game.

[punkeropercyjackson]

I hate........how sexualizing teenage superheroes is the norm in the superheroes fandom at large.Forgive me for traumadumping ig but i have really strong feelings on this as an autistic adult with a special interest in superheroes at large themselves and itself as a genre

My first hero spin was Big Hero 6.By the time it came out,i was 13 so i was allowed internet access no problem and naturally i went looking all over for content of literally everything about it but my favorite character was Hiro so he was what i searched for the most and he was LUDICRIOUSLY objectified and fetishized for his wasian heritage and when the series came out,he got an official love interest named Karmi who's 16 to his 14 and she got tons of hate from Hiro x Gogo and Hiro x Honey shippers despite them not only being college aged to his again,FOURTEEN years but we got explicit ages for them in season 2 when the Nerd Gang minus him gratuated from SFIT so they're canonically TWENTY ONE(i feel it's an important sidenote that Karmi's brownskin with a hooked nose and her VA is indonesian/chinese mixed so her heritage is obvious and as to how it contributed to her reception vs easian Gogo and blonde light-eyed Honey)

My second one was Bnha and there's been tons of discussion about the base's problem with the UA students and Himiko and i thank everyone who's posted about it deeply but my specific one is that my otp of the series was and will always be Shouto and Momo aka Todomomo even if i'm not nearly as into Bnha as i used to be because they were the first ship i actively made content for and it lasted years and that combined with me headcanoning them as bi4bi,t4t and autistic4autistic helped my egg crack and realize my own autism big time so their relathionship eternally has a big place in my heart

This means i've witnessed grown ass people saying Shouto almost touched Momo's boobs in that cap where he stopped her during their Aizawa fight(and his hand didn't even land on her chest)as a running thing and same for him acting as a macho man who rules over her body so she can't wear what she wants or exist near other men,including BAKUGOU who Momo HATES IN-TEXT,or have conflict with him because he'll just 'put her in her place as his woman' and Momo who's thee 'silk hiding steel' character and has adultification trauma that triggers her anxiety as the plot of the Todomomo starter 'Yaoyorozu Rising' with Shouto helping her with words of affirmation,healthy communication and good boundries on both sides that became the foundation of their dynamic throught the whole franchise,manga and extras,is reduced down the 'the class mom to Iida's class dad' as if she's ever even looked in his general direction and when she's rightfully earned her place as Shouto's best friend alongside Izuku himself and that is INSANELY imppressive taking into account her limited screentime.All i wanted was them being goth bf x pastel gf and getting to heal their inner child together and what i got was a nsfw Todomomo week on twitter and a certain artist drawing Momo/Dabi as an 'April Fool's' joke MULTIPLE YEARS in a row because he's also a Todoroki so it's also Todomomo lololol and i also did her with Natsuo and Fuyumi,i'm so funny!The only good thing to come out of that i started spite headcanoning Momo and Dabi as found siblings and platonic soulmates and realized i was actually on point

Then i watched Batman:Under The Red Hood when i was 19 and Jason became a character i selfship with romantically so i did the logical thing and started reading comics,starting with his.Did you know it's canon that while he dosen't exactly hunt them down specifically,he hates pedophiles and incesters so he once targeted a teacher because he was csa'ing one of his student's and expressed disgust at the thought of kissing any of his brothers based off them being brothers?You wouldn't know either of these things off fanon alone,you'd think he was creepy older guy who seeks out younger people on purpose when he dosen't seek anybody out period and that's his canon relathionships coping mechanism and it's also canon he couldn't talk to girls and pushed a guy off a roof for running a sex ring as Robin.As ROBIN,a fucking 11-15 year old Jason had that much of a moral backbone and willingness to take action in it yet everyone thinks he'd date a CHILD,even HIS OWN UNDERAGED SIBLINGS,with taking advantage of them as the appeal

I absolutely loved Into The Spiderverse as an afrolatino like Miles who was a troubled kid like he is too and i thought Gwen was super good too and Peter B's another character i selfship with romantically so naturally i was hyped for Across and the first thing the fandom did when the trailer dropped?Make a hyperpopular meme where that sweet,soft,wholesome scene where Gwen gets cheeky and looks through Miles' sketchbook and sees he's so in love with her he dedicated it's entierty to her just existing as herself into him seeing her as nothing but a sexual object with degrading features she does not have and it was a sick joke on Gwen because the boy she loves just wants her for sex and not even for what she actually looks and that just makes it even worse!!!Then there's the equally pure implied thing they did of her either stealing Hobie's sweaters because he makes her feel safe after her abusive dad kicked her out for being trans or him giving them to her to borrow as affection that ALSO got twisted into Gwen being nothing but a sex object,by people who see Hobie's age interpretation not even as a minor but in his 20s unlike how actual Ghostpunks do!!!!!!!,and don't think i haven't seen the Margo shit calling her 'thicc' and turning the girls into Miles' 'harem'

And the thing that made realize this is that it's always been like this is when i went looking for Teen Titans screenshots,first Starfire and Blackfire for me and my little sister and then ones of the animated Titans in general for my little brother because he did an edit-redraw of our DC self-inserts together using one so i got excited at how good it was and decided to ask for a few more since we have friends who have DC ocs too and we're all doing a canon rewrite fixit with them but the first results were fucking incest softcore porn and TOO DAMN MUCH horny Bbrae fanart.One of the friend's in question is like another brother to me and he's 17 and he thought there was nothing wrong with Jason/The Fenton Siblings because when i said find it triggering just in general,he tried to explain that i was 'making the wrong assumption' because a lot of people age up Danny and Jazz and he'd learned that from older DPDC fans.They literally groomed him and i'm so glad i met him and helped him unlearn that shit before he could get hurt

That's not normal.NONE of that is normal to involve children even if fictional because they're meant to be exactly like REAL kids mentally and physically and you get upset at the real ones for being upset by you doing this to them and even harrass them for it and i've had to directly defend another one of my little sibling's from harrasment from 'fandom elders' because he dared to have an opinion that 'dosen't follow the rules'.I'm sick of this,i can't stand this,this needs to DIE.There's no exaggaration over ten times the adult superheroes than they're are kid ones and you fucking ship them with eachother instead just sticking to the adults for smut.Batman and Robin were seen as a couple in ye olden times by a group of gay people not because Bruce Wayne and Dick Grayson harbord secret romantic feelings for eachother since conception or intended to later on but because that specific gay people were irl pedophiles who used being gay as a defense

I don't care if i sound childish or if nobody who this is aimed at cares,i hate all of you for this.I hate you for tarnishing my special interest,i hate you for violating the history of superheroes and the creation of sidekicks and kid heroes as role models and escapism fantasies for real kids,i hate you for beyond disrespecting that superheroes as a WHOLE were created by jewish folks and that Clark Kent,the FIRST superhero,is the protector of all innocents with a deep love for children and gets especially angry when they're hurt and is a fundemental trait he has to have or he's NOT Superman or Clark Kent Kal-El or Superdad,i hate that the sexualization of underaged supers and them being abused as 'romance' by their fucking pseudo-parents is a long running punchline.I hate you with my entire heart and soul and actual comics reading knowledge

[respondedinkind]

Quick (long) update.

|| I know I haven't been around in a hot minute, thought I'd give a quick update.

Sorry for vanishing like this, life has been a little wild recently; I started therapy a few weeks ago, next to me finding joy in a new game where I slipped into the fandom (rather hard lol) and realized that I am, right now, much happier with doing art and creating fics rather than RPing.

This might sound a little odd to some - but the thing is, my brain simply doesnt hold enough energy to do *all* the creative things I want to do. For example: RPing is incredibly fun but also *incredibly exhausting*, and whenever I put a lot of time into RPing, I am literally unable to do art or write fics. It's taking so much of my creative-energy-meter that it's empty quick, leaving me with being frustrated as I don't really get to create anymore.

So I decided to pursue creating art as well as writing fics for now, which means I basically vanished from RP tumblr in return. I know this might be frustrating to some - especially my writing partners - and I want to apologize for that, for said frustration I might have caused.

But it is what it is, and I am not going to change much about it anytime soon. I am actually feeling rather happy about being able to do art, write fics, and *not* worry about writing replies and possibly making partners wait. It's a sort-of-pressure that I've taken off of my own shoulders...

Which is needed right now as I, as mentioned, also started therapy. It's going to be a journey, and I was just diagnosed with general anxiety as well as depression (which could actually be a 'double-depression' on top of it, means it is a chronic depression as well as an 'episodic depression'). It feels... incredibly relieving, in a way, to finally have an official diagnosis and to know that yes, something IS going on with me, I am not just crazy in my head and/or lazy. However, the whole therapy-thing is only going to get harder from here on and I am already working on things that have been talked about, think about them in my head, work with what I have realized about myself and try to handle it.

I do have a whole diagnose-session going on in August for ADHD / Autism as well, which will *also* require a good chunk of my energy. So yeah, things are happening.

Long story short: I decided to put my priorities elsewhere for now, for my own mental health's sake, and my happiness. Reducing stress was *needed*, especially since I am only going to be more stressed while working on me, on my diagnosis, and on all the problems I finally want to be able to figure out and address, possibly solve. ---Something also happened in my private life a couple of months ago that basically, let's call it 'triggered', my sudden energy to finally ask for help after trying to handle everything for literal decades. So yeah. It's been a yeah so far lol.

I want to thank each and every single one of you for having been with me, RPed great stories, formed companionships over weeks and months; I won't delete this blog nor do I plan to 'archive it'. I'll just leave it like this and maybe, who knows, I will return to it (and my other blogs) at some point. I just don't want to put stress on me as in 'I will come back in x day / months', I'll just see where life takes me and when I find the energy to be here again, I will.

I love Khan, love Stephen, love Bones. I haven't lost my love for them, my attention is just elsewhere. (Including that cute game I have been playing, falling in love with some characters...)

I wish you all the best, sending you lots of vibes, happy thoughts, my eternal gratitude and some strength for whatever you need to deal with in your life. Remember that you are loved, that your thoughts are valid, that you are worth it. ♥

-waves-

PS: I do miss you, the people I formed friendships with. I miss you, our RPs, our conversations. In case we have been interacting much on here, but not actually exchanged other ways of staying connected besides tumblr - discord, for example - you are absolutely allowed to hit me up and I'll give you my discord. ♥

[imakemywings]

After the juicy "Celebrimbor not talking to any of his family" take, you've hit us with another equally juicy (but probably controversial lol) take of Russingon which is something I've been riding for a while now, @spiritofwhitefire spoke nothing but facts. Still, on a serious note (no offense, I really love that ship so much) the constant characterization of Fingon as blindy forgiving, and always siding with Maedhros (or like being desperate to be with him) was probably what made me sour a bit on Russingon. Fingon has other personalities and motivations besides being Maedhros' love interest or being his hype man but seriously, he's Fingolfin's son, and seeing how close and loyal Fingon was to Fingolfin, I am sure, he would be genuinely pissed at Maedhros. I can't imagine him instantly forgiving Mae or something, and even if he did, does his forgiveness mean something to Mae because, at the end of the day, Maedhros is still doggedly loyal to Feanor. Anyway, this is just me being fixated on your tags, "not wanting maedhros to die a miserable death at morgoth's hands doesn't necessarily equate to total instant and complete forgiveness, "honestly a huge fan of their friendship never fully recovering..." please tell me more. I love your headcanons.

I don't mean to be in opposition to so many popular fandom takes 😅I'm usually not this bad about that...

Sure, maybe Fingon is a saint who harbors no resentment...but I'm not particularly interested in that take. #1, Fingon is presumably made a kinslayer in Alqualonde for the sake of the Feanorians, whom he believed were under unjust assault, but who were, in fact, the aggressors. #2, Although Maedhros does not partake in the burning of the ships at Losgar (something it's implied Fingon learns eventually), neither did he make any effort to stop it, and that decision of the Feanorians' helped condemn the rest of the Noldor host to the Helcaraxe, where, among other things, Fingon's sister-in-law dies. I would say he certainly has grounds to be angry with Maedhros and furthermore, to distrust him going forward.

Not to say these specific things are entirely or even primarily Maedhros' fault...but I think it would be very hard not to be angry with a cousin/close friend who had helped to put you in these positions, particularly depending on how Maedhros handles the situation after their reunion (i.e. whether he apologizes or doubles down or tries to pretend nothing is wrong).

This definitely relates to my general feelings on Maedhros becoming the center of everything in this fandom but yes, the way Fingon orbits around him in so much fanon gets quite old. I'll be honest and say I don't ship Russingon even a tiny bit so it's doubly grating to see Fingon reduced to either Maedhros' hype man (if alive) or his angst-generator (if dead) and have that romance be cast as so core to everything Fingon (or Maedhros!) does. And I do think there can be plenty of crunchy drama even without the romance aspect (Anyone who's had a friendship go sour can probably attest to this).

But in terms of actual character motivation and reactions--I think it's just a lot more interesting if there are actual consequences to Maedhros' actions in terms of a relationship that was really important to him, rather than Fingon just completely forgiving Maedhros everything always so that there's no friction in the relationship.

For one, as I talked about here, their relationship already had problems before the rebellion of the Noldor. How bad things got between them in Tirion is really up to our interpretation, but it is very apparent things were not kosher between them even before Losgar happened, and before Alqualonde. I can't imagine that doesn't color later events between them.

For another, Fingon's motivations in seeking Maedhros out in Thangorodorim were political. They were also personal, but the first motivation mentioned in his decision to seek Maedhros as Melkor's prisoner is to reunite the Noldor. And as I mentioned in those tags, just because he didn't want Maedhros to die a miserable death or experience indefinite torment at Melkor's hands doesn't necessarily mean he forgave him, or even still considered him a friend. MOST of us would not want to see someone we know suffer Maedhros' fate, regardless of what they had done to us.

"Then Fingon the valiant, son of Fingolfin, resolved to heal the feud that divided the Noldor, before their Enemy should be ready for war...Fingon had been close in friendship with Maedhros...Therefore he dared a deed which is justly renowned among the feats of the princes of the Noldor." ("Of the Return of the Noldor")

If nothing else, I imagine their relationship was always complicated after this. To your point above, Maedhros is deeply committed to fulfilling the oath of his father, and as the Nolofinweans and Arafinweans were there when the Feanorians swore to deal death on anyone handling a Silmaril, they have to be aware of at least the possibility that that may cause trouble someday (I'm sure they did not anticipate the scale or severity).

So Fingolfin, Fingon's father, is king (thanks to Maedhros)...but Maedhros is loyal to his oath above all else. And Maedhros still holds considerable sway over the Feanorians (I would venture to say it's a common theory if not outright knowledge that, should push come to shove, the Feanorians will obey Maedhros, not Fingolfin). How does Fingon feel about that?

To me, these things, in addition to Maedhros' earlier behavior (being part of the initial kinslaying at Alqualonde, not trying to stop the burning of the swan ships) mean that Fingon can never fully trust Maedhros again. There will always be at least a sliver of doubt and mistrust there, wondering at Maedhros' ulterior motives, at his end-game plans. And I don't think Maedhros is very good at making this not the case because he is always trying to play 5-D chess, and he's not always sneaky about it.

That bit above about how the Feanorians are loyal to Maedhros over Fingolfin? I imagine that goes doubly when Fingon becomes high king. Whatever respect the sons of Feanor might have had for Fingolfin as their elder they almost certainly do not have for their young cousin. And I do love takes where Maedhros (successfully or unsuccessfully) sees Fingon as far more malleable than Fingolfin and is trying to manipulate him from behind the scenes. (Particularly if this interacts with any insecurities Fingon may have about his abilities as king--to think that even Maedhros sees him as a weak ruler/weaker than his father!)

I don't mean to suggest they were never close again after the rebellion (although you could perhaps make the case), but that there was never the same level of trust, ease, and companionship in that friendship that there had been before. Forever after, there was always political calculus involved, because of the kingship, because of the oath, because of Maedhros' refusal to disavow the actions of his family (Admittedly--we don't know what position he took on Alqualonde or Losgar afterwards; it's never stated or even implied, iirc. However, based on his response to Celegorm and Curufin's attempted coup against Finrod [nothing] and the attempted assault of Luthien [nothing] and attempted murder of Beren [nothing], I will extrapolate the headcanon that he was not keen to admit to either of the earlier instances as being a mistake.)

Anyway to me it's sooo tasty if they stayed (sort of) friends and yet there was this unspoken mistrust that was always there after that, perhaps alongside a kind of golden nostalgia for the "old days" of their friendship.

(Also juicy drama to me if Fingon becomes a lot closer with Finrod than he had been in Aman due to Helcaraxe trauma/responsibility bonding and Maedhros has to grind his teeth and live with the fact that Fingon trusts Finrod more than he trusts Maedhros now. And lots of love for fans who also explore Fingon's canonical friendship with Aegnor and Angrod! )

There's also the fact that Fingon bites the dust before the worst of Maedhros' actions. I simply cannot see Fingon justifying the assault on Doriath, or Sirion, or the kidnapping of Elrond and Elros, or the assault on Eonwe's Elven guard. Absolutely, there is grief in seeing someone you loved and valued become someone you cannot support, but I can never buy into post-Mandos takes where Fingon just handwaves everything Maedhros did after Fingon's death.

So yes, there it is. Maedhros and Fingon's political drama charged friendship fallout.

[kimkhimhant]

1 & 18 for the ask game :)

character everyone gets wrong

i already answered this in another post where i said kim, but i do have a lot of feelings about it so. i think it's less a matter of getting him "wrong" and more like... a reduction? it happens in fiction in general, not just fanfic and not just kimchay fandom, but characters are so often reduced to a single trait, or even just like... their names are taken and pasted onto an empty vessel for the sake of a trope. this happens a lot in the fanfic world, where in an attempt to stick to a specific trope, people completely alter a character's personality to make it work. its not a problem, and all fic is worthy of creation, but. it also means a lot of fic feels very inauthentic to the characters it claims to be about. maybe im just a picky asshole lol

18. it's absolutely criminal that the fandom has been sleeping on..

the sheer potential for angst when exploring kim's backstory? lmao i'm kidding but only kind of. there are so many options for explaining why kim is the way he is, and why his relationships with his brothers is... like that... and why he left home. he is, arguably, the most suited for the mafia life, because of how good he is at fighting, and how good he is at masking his emotions. so why would he leave? what awful things might he have experienced that pushed him over the edge? i love angst okay lol

thank you for the questions <333

[blueskittlesart]

not to swing at another nest, but i think it's also really fascinating how the re/valink shippers similarly shove zelda to the side/sideline her. i've seen quite a few fics where they make zelda so awful when REVALI is the guy who is textually mean/rude/whatever and never changes 😭 and like that's fine i think the story benefits from having people who don't like link, that's what makes botw zelink fun in particular! but zelda changes throughout the course of her and link's time together! that's the point!!! she GROWS she CHANGES!!!!!!!! they cause each other to bloom!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! but people force her into this static role + make her worse and then act like that's the real zelda

this is SUCH a common problem in fandom in general like whenever a male character has 2 potential love interests, 1 male and 1 female, 10 to 1 in any fandom portrayal the female character will either be viciously mean or reduced to like. a sidelined wingman who is only there to further the male characters' relationships. when there is a woman in media that people perceive as getting in the way of a man or a relationship between 2 men they will either vilify her or get rid of her entirely to compensate for the fact that they don't want to actually think about her at all. this is not a problem unique to the zelda fandom but sid/link and reva/link are like. really obvious examples of the phenomenon lmao

[cannibalismyuri]

coming out as a passive jopper hater bc the insane level of capitalist pandering they did with s3 (with ERICA who is like. one of the worst, stereotyped portrayals of a black girl ive ever seen, bless her heart) was truly crazy. combine that with the copaganda and the general attitude of hopper in s3 which was played off as 'awkward loser guy doesnt know what to do with Feelings more at 8' was a bit .... Eh :/ to me. because it is so obviously a fictional character and show but like. disliking hopper/jopper bc of the ideals st is perpetuating and the fact that they arent compatible at All in s3 (to me, atleast) is valid. some ppl might just think that jopper is unhealthy and/or 'overrated'. because they do sort of pay a disproportionate amount of attention to jopper, compared to the other canon romantic ships (afaik, bc of the screen time counter) and that can be Weird, esp with the... how should i say this? balancer/savior role hopper takes in the relationship (we constantly see him placating joyce, sometimes even being slightly patronizing, and also they place a lot of importance on him saving joyce from a lot of stuff, which is cool and sick if it wasnt for the fact that it directly correlates with him being a cop, yk). and the general power imbalance bc he's a Cop and abuses his position of power constantly, and that is exactly Why anything that joyce does is seen as a #insane girlboss category 5 woman moment because she simply has the short stick in the power race and when she does manage to make an impact DESPITE her economic/social/'general uselessness in say in Major decision-making when it comes to authorities' shortcomings it is seen as an amazing win. hopper on his own is extremely fleshed out as well, because we get to see his arc play out with his relationships with his daughter and ex-wife and el and re-learning how to be a parent and how to not let love allude him, and that is lovely! it's so great to see the adults in the show being focused on! but joyce is absolutely disregarded and underdeveloped as a character of her own right outside of her relationships with hopper or her kids. we see that she is determined and a force to be reckoned with and that she cares very deeply for the people she loves and would go to insane lengths for them but all that doesn't Mean anything, because we never see a backstory for her. we never figure out who she is without her family or hopper, or what her motives and aspirations and emotional shortcomings and stumbles and mistakes are. for a character to be fully fleshed out, they need to be an interesting, refreshing and palatable character On Their Own without their relationships with other characters, and we just don't see that with joyce. like u have Thee winona ryder on ur show, and u forsake developing her character in favor of developing hopper's character with /not the best taste/ and causing her to be a blank slate of a mother, lover, woman and friend, but not a PERSON. all she's been reduced to is a Mother and Hopper's Girlfriend, and honestly, that's the worst decision they could've made in relation to her and her relationship with hopper.

anyway, all this to say; these are my thoughts on the matter, but i'm definitely not hating on people who enjoy jopper passively and DEFINITELY not any by/ler (the most predominant fandom im part of in the parent fandom of st) who enjoys them as a ship with their own dynamic separate from canon. because the by/ler fandom is NOT a monolith and nobody is obligated to agree with me or change their opinion if it doesn't align with mine or be forced to look at my opinion and feel bad for shipping anything. im not going to act Holier Than Thou for expressing my opinion and u should definitely continue shipping jopper if it makes u happy! as long everybody recognizes the copaganda and capitalist mindset grind propaganda shit in st (which is Pretty Obvious) and respects that while shipping what they want, i have no problem with it. all that is to say; peace and fucking love. can we (the by/ler fandom) stop fighting abt jopper we all have our own opinions this is bc we are Not a hivemind or a monolith and not obligated to have the same opinions relating to all aspects of st just because we happen to ship one thing. i am a hater and a lover

[orangepanic]

I adore Asami, she is perfect! Beautiful, intelligent, reliable, hardworking, and more giving to her friends than they deserve (not always, but I am still mad at how she was treated in season 1)

Iroh is also perfect, but not as much Asami, you know, he had never got to act against his father, never been put to that situation (and I think he would have choose to do the right thing, as Asami did)

Sometime I think, what if Asami wasn’t that perfect for being around Korra‘s team? Like what if she had a problem that didn’t let her to be physically strong? And be involved that much in team avatar, like if she had a chronic pain in her leg? What if her other strength would have attracted more attention? Like her resilience? More feminine kindof strength (I think Pema has it and is really underrated in the comics)

What if Iroh would have fallen in love with her (or had been attracted to her) because of her more feminine side?

I sometimes get the feeling if a character is not a badass in combat, their other strengths are not taken seriously…

By feminine strength I don’t mean things like self sacrifice or anything that might get unhealthy, I mean things like nurturing spirit, in this category 😁 I hope my babbling is not very unclear😁😁

This is super sweet. I love Asami very much, too. It's also the reason one of my favorite things to give her are flaws.

Asami (like many female characters) is often accused of being a flat "Mary Sue" who is good at everything and seemingly perfect. She's rich, intelligent, gorgeous, courageous, caring, giving, brave, forgiving. She's a skilled fighter and fashionable and can build a sand sailer with spit and duct tape. Literally nothing wrong with her. Which has the danger of making her uninteresting or only useful as a love interest - which is often what the fandom does. She's been reduced to the "and girlfriend" role and I hate that for her. It's one of the big reasons I don't like Asami's canon ships.

But like you said, there is so much we don't know that could be going on beneath the surface. We don't even have to change canon for that. Asami is squeamish - she's the only one who spits out Gommu's soup. She's got a bit of a temper. She doesn't seem to have friends or family as shown by her going out of her way to make friends with Team Avatar even after what happened with Mako and Korra because she's got no one else. How lonely and isolated must her upbringing have been? Then there's everything canon can't disprove. It's likely Asami is inexperienced in both relationships and sex. I write her as disorganized and a terrible cook. She has a ton of baggage from her mother's death and her father's betrayal and even Mako that carries into her future relationships. She loves pro-bending but isn't a bender and that's always hurt just a little. It's just as possible she has chronic pain she doesn't show.

Because Asami comes through for everyone. Want my boyfriend? Okay. Need a ride? Sure. An airship? Here you are. Kidnapped? I got you. Trapped in the desert? No problem. Training dummy? Wheelchair pusher? Driving instructor? Your team is out of money? Wanna live in my house? Asami is so desperate to be included and the only thing she can think to do is give, give, give. I like to think at some point she just stands in the shower and screams. And I don't think if Asami was worse at fighting that would change. She'd find a way to help because that's what she does.

Anyway, I actually think General Iroh does fall in love with her because of these softer qualities. Yes, Asami is beautiful, but what Iroh wants more than anything is an equal who will love him for who he is and not for his title or wealth or family name. And he's looking for that inner strength Asami has. In longer stories like AWOL or Severance or Starvation Paradise it's always Asami's resilience, her treatment of him as an equal partner, and her tender care that make Iroh truly fall in love. She's someone he can rely on, not to give give give, but to be his other half no matter what.

Which is why this is the best ship. :-D

[gumdefense]

please get into your aa2 rant i beg

Oh thank god someone (idk if it’s rude to tag ? Or to not tag ?) reblogged that post from me saying some great stuff and also saying to go into my aa2 rant and I didn’t know how to reply, like do I reblog from them again, but then that might annoy the op, or do I make a post and tag them but then that might be weird— I don’t understand tumblr etiquette. Even though I’ve been here for years. But yeah whether you are that person in which case hi !! Or another person in which case also hi !! Thanks you solved my problem

How do I start. Basically, I don’t agree with a lot of the fanon surrounding Edgeworth’s "death", mostly in the way that it’s basically all about Phoenix. When the fandom talks about how evil and terrible Edgeworth was for that, I mostly just see Phoenix being brought up, when to me it’s a lost worse for Franziska. To her, her brother disappeared because of what her father did and after learning he used similar tactics as him (the tactics they must have been taught), deciding to kill the prosecutor in him (a major part of their identity and their relationship), abandoning her again, something that is a huge issue for her (aai2 spoilers under the cut)

Her world is in prosecution, their family is in prosecution, and as far as I remember she has issues over Edgeworth leaving her behind to pursue his career at 20, though I can’t remember when that’s discussed, I hope it’s not fanon blending into canon in my memory. What I’m trying to say is, Edgeworth’s fake death had a huge and deep impact on her, and is a very important step in her character

Anyway in short, I find it disappointing ig that most discussion of the repercussions of Edgeworth’s absence is about how Phoenix is so sad his boyfriend is gone and rarely ever about her. General issue across all fandoms to obsess over a male character and leave a female character behind. I go more into the Phoenix stuff under the cut bc I also have a rant about that and I’ve started and I can’t shut up now lol. Tldr Phoenix is deeply flawed and I love him for it and I wish we talked more about his flaws

I mean this is how she reacts when Edgeworth gives up his badge

I sound very negative of Phoenix’s part in this lol— I’m not, how it affects Phoenix is SO important, which is something I’m very passionate about and is… another thing I mostly disagree common fanon with sorry. Phoenix feels very much like the fandom golden boy in a way ? He’s our perfect little guy who has never done anything wrong. And yeah he is my perfect little guy who has never done anything wrong, but actually no he’s my really imperfect little guy who has definitely done wrong

Aa2 is the game that made me fall in love with him, because of how it goes into his flaws. He can be a dick who lashes out, he can be really bitter and angry, and his idea of justice is/was incredibly black and white. I find Phoenix’s character writing in aa2 just brilliant and it saddens me that it gets reduced to "he was really sad about edgeworth". I mean he was and it’s a massive part of his character writing but I don’t see much discussion on the character part beyond the saviour complex thing. Which is great but Justice for All is about, you know. Justice for all. It’s not perfect, I wish the concept of guilty clients was explored more afterwards beyond evilest man alive Matt engarde, the closest we get is aa4 with clients that are guilty of other crimes but still deserve proper defense instead of being dismissed, but I’m getting off topic. Phoenix’s black and white thinking being challenged and him learning he was wrong is so important, but I feel like we’re allergic to discussing the negative parts of Phoenix or something ? Like I said he’s the fandom golden boy. And I get why but the parts of him that suck are the parts that made me adore him and ig I’m disappointed it’s rarely acknowledged or analysed so he can remain our perfect little boy who’s just obsessed with his school crush. Sorry to be such a negative Nancy lol but yeah. Phoenix is such a well rounded deeply flawed character, aa2 has such great writing and so worth analysing, but like all fandoms we have "shipping first and foremost" on the brain

ALSO. Phoenix and Franziska’s arcs are so intertwined the Parallels how they’re both representative of different types of idealism and what loss can do to you and yet are also so similar. They’re soooo aahnnbgbgngcjkn. I’ll just put these here again. Thank you Acro for understanding them

For the record I’m not saying analysis through ship is bad, or that shipping is bad, if you’ve seen my blog at all you’ve seen lots of ship stuff— I just have a general tiredness of ships being the main focus of everything ig lol. I’m stopping now it’s 2am and I can tell this has gone into completely incoherent rambling, I hope this made sense and was fun to read !

[itsclydebitches]

I don't go here, but I really dislike how ubiquitous the notion has become in fandom that 'strong and independent woman' is somehow mutually exclusive with 'woman in a romantic relationship/prioritizing romance'. I feel like that's the kind of attitude that leads to terrible readings like 'The Little Mermaid is anti-feminist because Ariel gives up her voice for a man' which requires ignoring several key aspects of the film's plot and Ariel's character specifically (such as the fact that she sings Part of Your World before she ever lays eyes on Eric, and she spent her entire life collecting artifacts from the surface world and arranging them in her grotto), nevermind the fact that a story where someone falls in love and values that highly enough to make significant changes to her life to fight for it would still have value! Because love has value!

Like you said, just because there are a lot of cases where female characters are reduced to love interests and nothing else doesn't mean a female character caring about love and being motivated by love means she can't also be strong and independent. I feel like a lot of people just swing the pendulum way too far in the other direction and seem to think that being in love is what devalued those female characters, and not the fact that they were (by and large) written to be accessories for the male characters they were attached to and had nothing else to contribute to the story.

That is the problem, not romantic storylines themselves.

Precisely, anon! I'm really glad you brought up The Little Mermaid, both because the latest adaptation showcases how important intersectionality is (a black mermaid getting the "generic" love story is not the same thing as another white mermaid getting it) and because I've had similar gripes about many fans' readings of Cinderella. To be clear, I think the Disney + princess craze is a complicated subject with an equally complicated impact on kids, but a lot of people will attempt to simplify that conversation down to, "It's bad because she wants a man." Putting aside that this is not, as discussed, inherently a bad thing... did we miss the part where she's in a clearly abusive household, wants only to experience one fun night, and happens to meet the Prince without ever actively aiming for that to happen? This is a debate my friend and I have had for years, to the point where "Cinderella" is a bit of a code-word for, "We're never going to agree on this topic and others are getting annoyed at our impassioned arguments, so can we just move on now?" lol

I experienced similar frustration back when Jupiter Ascending came out and -- putting aside the quality of the film (or supposed lack thereof) -- people were up in arms about how terrible it is that the woman lead needs to be rescued by the guy, with the reason for that terribleness boiling down to, presumably, the idea that a woman is automatically weak if she needs help. Meanwhile, I was reading things through the lens of the show's realism (of course the average cleaning lady is not going to be able to fight off alien kidnappers without assistance) as well as the joy of seeing parts of myself in a Sci-Fi/Fantasy story. I'm not physically strong. I'm not a martial artist. I'm not someone who's going to immediately come up with a cutting remark and satisfyingly punch someone in the face. As cool as that archetype is, it's reductive to present a Strong and Independent Woman as solely physically strong and romantically independent. That definition should -- and does -- mean a thousand different things!

I do get it. I often have a knee-jerk reaction to certain writing choices for women (there was a maybe baby plot-line for one of Ted Lasso's characters this season that, far more than Keeley, I've been side-eying), but overall I try to approach each story as the individual text that it is. Yes, there are issues with these trends across media... but is this story actually falling into those stereotypes and harmful depictions, or have we just trained ourselves to reject anything in this category by default?

[r3v0lver-0c3lot]

17 and 25 for ask game let's go

mgs ahh answers💀💀💀

anyway

17. there should be more of this type of fic/art

Boss and tiny ocelot!!!!! And in general just boss and ocelot and sorrow family hangouts (not just where ocelot is small, it'll be cool if they spent time together in snake eater). i've seen some of these and they really remind me of my childhood and because ocelot and boss are russian it'll be cool if there was some fic or art about ocelot's (non-existent) childhood (but this is an au so it doesn't matter that it contradicts the canon idgaf) like how he went to school (bc i love memes about slavic school some funny shit is bound to happen there) and how during summer he went to the countryside w/ his family and they lived in a small cottage house (dacha, if you will) and they cooked pirozhki and borsch and whatever. i do love my country's culture (NOT THE POLITICS OBV AND ALL THAT CONSERVATIVE SHIT HELL NAW) and i LOVE the boss and ocelot's dynamic (also the boss reminds me of my mom) so seeing them in this kind of familial childhood settimg really resonates with me. i also HATE HATE HATE LET ME TELL YOU HOW MUCH I HATE when russian aus are being reduced to adidas vodka drugs smoking depression gopnik internal homophobia type shit like stop making every character act like a drug addict alochoholic swine with no manners and or morals. so i think those type of aus where its russian summer and swimming in the river and playing in the field outside of the big cities or going to school and doing some whacky shit are much better to me at least. not just because they kick me in the ribs and bash my bones with nostalgia and bitter happiness of the time i never am going to come back to, but also because it doesn't transform my favourite characters into some carricature pieces of shit and actually shows a good side of my culture. ALSO. more ocelot speaking russian. i've seen fanart where he's a kid and he walks round with the boss and they see a cat and he point at it and says "Кошка!" (wich means cat!) and i legit cried bro not even joking give me stuff like this again

25. common fandom complaint that you're sick of hearing

i am going to jeff the kill anyone who says oH rIsInG iSnT cAnOn It RuInEd RaIdEnS cHaRaCtEr WOMP WOMP YOU FUCKING CUNT🖕🖕🖕 oh really? why? because in mgs4 he decided to say with rose and LiTtLe JoHn?? do you fucking hear yourself? did you play the game with your eyes AND ears closed? did you turn off your console like you were told to in mgs 2? fission mailed. fucking listen. in mgs4 rose left raiden because he had ptsd flashbacls and was drinking and fighting in the streets and couldn't control himself. i mean she left him to trick the patriots but this doesn't undo all the problems with his mental state wich obviously will cause a problem in a relationship one way or the other. and then by the end of the game he's like nah id win and decides to say with rose and also he now has a child. fucking great. you're not a monster jack. well except for the fact that his ptsd and trauma and desire for violence (eben if its to protect someone, wich is exactly what he does in rising) does not magically disappear just because yall say it did. he decided to say with his family but nobody including raiden himself didn't do anything for him to heal so if it didn't work before why would it work now when nothing changed. wich is why rising exists in wich i think he was standing here and realised that it won't work and continued going along with his violent urges wich is sad but makes more sense for his character and also this time he uses his desire and power to protect children from being made into child soldiers like he once was. so yeah mgs4 raiden arc can fuck off and Rising is based as hell for shoving 4's ending in the ass and making a better arc for him

[wintershub]

@cxffeeshxp; Guess people think that because she isn't as bombastic as the rest of the cast and is somewhat more subdued? But she definitely has character, people ain't watching the same show.

Vaggie has always been the straight man of the group, which in a comedy and especially in a cast full of wacky characters means she doesn't stand out as much. I think what people mean by the "she has no character" is they meant to say they don't find her character interesting

Which is fine, you don't have to like her but dismissing a female character you don't like as having no character is dumbbbb. Vaggie is shown to be socially awkward, stubborn, brave, a little reckless, a cynic, protective, etc, etc. That. Is. A. Character. I've even pointed out before how she's very similar to Husk, both characters being grumpy, not very social and seemingly rude but caring about those around them YET Vaggie is the only one that's dismissed as having no character

Hell, a lot of arguments against Vaggie can be said against Carmilla. Who's shown to also be violent, arrogant, hot headed and protective of those close to her, yet again only Vaggie gets the "she no character" argument.

That's not even getting into backstory, people claim she's been getting the "Millie Treatment" and her role has just been reduced to Charlie's girlfriends, I agree with this to an extent but that's mainly because I feel like Hazbin in general was kinda rushed. Vaggie is underdeveloped but so is Husk, Niffty, Carmilla, Valentino and several others. That's a lack of screen time and lack of show time rather than a specific character problem

Also not to be mean but Vaggie was waaaaay more depth than Millie will ever have, not only because I feel like Vaggie has gotten more solo moments to shine but a clearly more thought out backstory and a backstory that happens to better reflect why Vaggie is the way she is. That's on top of the fact that we got to see genuine struggle in her relationships and see her have flaws, while we only got one episode that properly showed Millie and Moxxie have a conflict. Yet even then, the conflict was ALL because of Moxxie, Millie can seem to do no wrong in the narrative as she doesn't have many flaws. Or if she does they aren't treated as flaws in the narrative, her being protective, violent, impulsive and hot headed among other things is never ever shown in a negative light

Vaggie meanwhile is shown to have genuine insecurity, shown to be over her head several times, shown to be intense, and shown to a stick in a mud which causes conflict. Like no matter what happens to Millie the conflict is brought to her, never caused by her. With Vaggie with get a bit diversity

Then there's the general problem that women who aren't extroverted, perky, cheerful or generally loud get dismissed as having no character. Like this happens in every fandom, even in the Sonic Fandom people will claim that Blaze has no character because she's not outgoing like Amy or flirtatious like Rouge. And even if we get a character that's negative, quiet, or shown to have flaws she's written off as being bitchy, instantly unlikeable or again underwritten. Meanwhile, men characters rarely if ever have this problem. Name the last time you saw a male character being shamed for being quiet, jaded, introverted or closed off from others. I definitely think that's the problem there.

Vaggie has a character, but everyone wants her to be something else and since they can't see what they want from her. That character doesn't exist. And they ignore what's right in front of them.

[beevean]

"Sure, Eggman saving Tails from Orbot in Colors was uncharacterisically nice… but you’re not going to use an example from a game written by Pontaff[...] You would be consistent, right?" Hi there! I did just that; I wrote a post called "Eggman has always had redeeming qualities" that does cite that! (He actually saved Tails from Cubot in Lost World, but I get what you mean.) I like both Pontaff and Flynn! Pontaff brought final-boss Eggman back to 3D Sonic, which I liked along with Flynn's Eggdad.

Oh, hello! I have read your post :)

(ignore the typo lmao, yes I meant Lost World)

It's well written, but I disagree on a few fronts.

Eggman saved Sonic from the lava in Underground Zone, but I doubt that it comes from the goodness of his heart. At best, you can see it as Eggman wanting Sonic to die by his own hands - why would he place him in the pit where the Mecha Antlion rests? He wants his creation to kill his archnemesis. At worst, he knows that Sonic by that point should have a Chaos Emerald, so he won't take any chance.

Eggman doesn't want the world destroyed, that much is true. This is why Gerald's actions horrify him, and why the pedestal on which he put his grandfather broke in SA2. But it's because he wants to conquer the world for himself: he says as much in the cutscene before Sky Troops in ShTH. I also really wouldn't want to use Eggman's portrayal in that game to prove Eggman's best qualities: there is a whole path where Eggman takes delight in gaslighting Shadow for his own amusement, one of the few instances where he personally harms someone.

Speaking of which, while in English he implies that he cares about humanity's value, he's vaguer in Japanese: "He sold the planet's future for his own research results!?". Again, fits better with the idea that he wants the planet for himself.

And while on the subject, @colony-drop-program broke down the part where Eggman confesses the truth to Shadow during the Devil Doom battle much better than I ever could.

Eggman feeding Mr. Pickle is the bare minimum. Of course he'd need him alive, well and cooperative. Also, you mention Tails being kidnapped in S2 8-bit, but what about the fact that the bad ending is often interpreted as Eggman killing Tails? Technically it's not canon, but then again, the canonicity of the 8-bit games in general is up to debate.

Finally, my whole gripe with Eggdad is not that Eggman is a whole ass heartless monster straight from hell, or that being a dad is incompatible with being a villain. I also saw your post about how Eggdad makes Eggman more contemptible because he can understand love, he just doesn't care, which yea, in a vacuum, I agree with you. But I think Eggman developing nurturing qualities for an AI is OOC, for him, because no single positive trait of his would lead to him thinking of an AI as a daughter in an affectionate way, and there is proof upon proof of the opposite, Eggman mistreating his own creations and treating them as disposable, no matter how humanoid. Eggman being proud of the complexity of his creation? Absolutely, that is in character. Eggman going on an ego trip over how he created something very similar to life with his own hands, as one of the Egg Memoes says? Yep, also makes sense. Eggman getting emotional over the death of Sage? Unlikely, and also cheap since he was immediately able to recreate her from scratch, memories and all. It doesn't help that in the game itself, the two don't really... bond? Eggman spends most of his time bitching to Sage that he wants to get out. Besides, the fandom has already reduced Eggman to a softie, just like in the good Sonic X days, and not really considering the complexity of a fatherly villain - it doesn't help that Eggman does literally nothing in the game, let alone something evil, except for laughing at Sonic's comatose state. I have... a lot of problems with Eggman in Frontiers, and Eggdad was the last straw. Fun fact: Eggman's "feminist" trait is not present in the Japanese manual of Sonic Heroes, but it proves your point in a different way. Here's the page coming from this archived version:

As the name suggests, he's an evil genius scientist with a body like an egg. He boasts an IQ of 300 and he's an authority on robotics.

Although he is an evil genius scientist, he loves world domination, probably because of his childish personality. Despite failing many times in the past, he comes up with a larger-scale world domination operation every time!

Sonic, who always gets in his way, is truly his eternal nemesis. However, deep down in his heart, there seems to be a part of him that holds him in high regard, and he has a diligent side, to the point that he goes out of his way to send a letter of challenge.

I don't understand why the bio makes Eggman sounds like he has feelings for Sonic, but I swear that that's what "憎からず思っている" means, you can look it up :V and this exact description was recycled for Origins lmao. So, if you want to prove that Eggman is not completely rotten, there you go, he holds Sonic dear in his heart apparently!

And I agree that there is really no pragmatic reason why Eggman saved Tails in Lost World, and I do like his "I'm a complicated guy" line :)

I understand your stance, and you explained it well, especially in the more recent post. If I have to accept Eggdad, I'll definitely accept him as an hypocritical figure who only cares about his creation but won't extend the same empathy to the children he's trying to kill :P in any case, I appreciate that you came to me in a civil tone despite our divergences, it's not to take for granted ^^ obviously if you like both Pontaff and Flynn my snarky remark does not apply to you, I was talking about the ones who are very biased.