#I also don’t love out vs closeted relationships where there’s any question of the closeted one coming out even if it’s unsafe……like it doesn
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2023 reads // twitter thread
We Deserve Monuments
YA contemporary about a queer biracial girl whose life is uprooted when they move to a small Southern town to care for her terminally ill grandmother
as she tries to settle in and makes new friends, the tension of family secrets, generational trauma, and old mysteries come to the surface
#We Deserve Monuments#aroaessidhe 2023 reads#I actually had no clue this was sapphic when i started it haha#(ik it says in the blurb i just. don't read blurbs sometimes lol)#yet another YA that’s like yeah covid sucked :/ (never mentions anything about masks or hand sanitising or literally any minor change to dai#ly life)#I also don’t love out vs closeted relationships where there’s any question of the closeted one coming out even if it’s unsafe……like it doesn#doesn’t go deep into that but it’s Kinda there. however most of the book is not about that!#it is definitely good overall!
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ok so i don’t even know how i stumbled upon your page but i’m a relatively new fan to the 5sos family and i don’t really ship any of the boys buttt i read some of your posts and i can kinda believe lashton. so my first question for you is, do you ship malum and if lashton weren’t real, what other ship would you believe? also, i saw you mentioned them being managed by modest, and as a larry from the 1d fandom, i know all about them. i was wondering if you could explain more on that. thank you!!
First off, Hi and Welcome! Always nice to meet new people! haha
I also love to discuss and answer questions, so thank you for your good questions!
If you keep scrolling around and clicking through my hashtags you should eventually find my masterposts, lyrics analysis of a handful of songs, etc etc, and theres the matching rings of only Luke and Ash of which neither have ever worn with any other members, there's only been the brotherhood necklaces. When I first looking into them I let myself remain really really cynical until I started seeing that there were ongoing things, one after the other, that was different than was going on with the other guys. Yes, they're a brotherhood of soulmates but Luke and Ash have this added layer of treating each other. Any particular questions you're not finding an answer to even after looking through my blog, just let me know.
I don't like to refer to my beliefs as shipping, as I see that they're individually closeted, and then there's the added layer of their closeted relationship. The "shipping" that has gone on is what has muddied the waters of people being affectionate and friends vs affectionate and lovers. Vastly different, as you know the same with Larry, and the other closeted relationships that are in 1D. So, therefore, I don't believe any of the other pairings with Luke or Ash have any sort of romantic validity. Could they have experimented or whatever? Sure, none of us would know. But from the evidences, there's nothing to back that up. Cal and Michael knew each other since 2nd? grade, so they've had lots of time to be really bonded and how they've acted with each other has evidences of being boyfriends along the way. No idea if thats currently going on though. I have suspicions of Cal possibly being with Roy (longtime fellow musical artist friend), who lived with him during lockdown. But I won't get into their whole story right now. Thats a lot to cover.
Luke and Ashton are my faves and who I tend to focus on 98% of the time. So regarding Michael/Cal, I'll answer questions in DM if you're really that interested.
They were managed by Modest right out of Australia back when they first started. I'm about to very shortly post a timeline of Lashton and I'm planning to post a relationship of modest/5sos throughout the years. Think of all the tactics that have been used of modest towards the 1D boys, 5sos has a vast amount of the same things. Lots and lots of stunts/bearding (which I could post a lot more about but I try to keep that negative stuff away but I will talk abut should it be something thats specifically asked or is particularly relevant), being overworked, tabloid narratives including trying to force narratives of what/who songs are about (thankfully the boys have fought to control that as much as they are able to). Is there anything specific you're wondering about regarding this topic? Yes, they were treated like crap with them. So much so that during their 10 Year anniversary podcast where they recounted their career, year by year, they never said their name. Not once. They also weirdly left out the story how Luke and Ash actually met, which they've fondly told a handful of times before... it was kinda just breezed past (Wasn't part of the bands story? 🤔 )
Not sure what else to include so I'll stop here. haha
#ask#q & a#shipping#modest#5sos#5 seconds of summer#ashton irwin#ashton 5sos#luke hemmings#luke 5sos#ashton fletcher irwin#luke robert hemmings#lashton#lashton hemwin#modest management#closeting#stunts#bearding#gay#lgbtpeople#larry#lashton is real#larry stylinson
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Practicing Witchcraft in Secret
I love things that are traditionally “witchy.” I love dressing candles with herbs. I love setting things on fire. I love making poppets and charms. But not everyone is able to be so obvious in their craft. For various reasons, some witches choose to be secretive about their magical practice.
Why Would You Want to Keep It a Secret?
Historically, witches kept their practice a secret because it wasn’t safe to be open about their beliefs. In the late middle ages, the Catholic Church began to actively persecute witchcraft, herbal medicine, and folk spirituality with the publication of “witch hunting guides” like the Malleus Maleficarum. This witch hunting fervor would continue even after the Protestant Reformation, with some of the most famous witch hunts (such as the Salem trials) carried out by Protestants.
It is important to remember that the witch hunts were political at their heart and that very few of the people executed for witchcraft were what we would recognize today as witches. They were mostly women, poor folks, or members of ethnic or religious minorities. But even so, the danger of being accused of witchcraft and/or devil worship drove many medieval witches, herbalists, and pagans to hide their practice.
The United States experienced a modern witch hunt of sorts in the 1980s with the “Satanic Panic.” We still don’t entirely understand what caused this cultural phenomenon, but what we do know is that it resulted in widespread paranoia about devil worship. Anything that could be misconstrued as “satanic” was shunned or outright persecuted, from Dungeons & Dragons to heavy metal music to nature-based religions like Wicca — and, yes, witchcraft. People who had been comfortably open about their spirituality suddenly found themselves practicing behind closed doors. If you’re over 30, you may remember this. If you’re under 30, the Satanic Panic probably shaped how your parents view witchcraft and paganism, and they may still be grossly misinformed as a result.
Even today, a lot of witches choose to keep their practice a secret because it would be unsafe or uncomfortable to go public. Many witches have family members, friends, or coworkers who would be uncomfortable if they knew about their witchcraft, and may even choose to end the relationship because of it. Some witches live in culturally Christian areas where it might be harder for them to get jobs or make friends if they were openly self-identifying as a witch. Some of us live in places where an outdoor ritual could get the cops called on us, or have missionaries showing up to save our souls.
On the other hand, some witches just like privacy. You may feel like your spirituality is nobody’s business but yours, and for that reason you may prefer to do witchcraft in a way that is more subtle and secretive. Desire for privacy is a perfectly valid reason to stay “in the broom closet.”
There are also some magical traditions that require members to swear a vow of secrecy and to keep the group’s secrets. However, these traditions usually require an in-person initiation, so I won’t be discussing them here.
Inconspicuous Witchcraft
If you haven’t read my posts about magical journaling and kitchen magic, I highly recommend you check them out. Those are two forms of magic that are very easy to practice discretely.
No matter what your reason for keeping your practice a secret, here are a few tips for making magic without drawing attention.
Use scented candles. Candle magic is one of the easiest and most versatile forms of spellwork, and all it requires is a candle and your intention. Scented candles are perfect for undercover witches because, rather than adding herbs and oils, you can simply buy a scent that matches your intention. (For example, a vanilla candle is great for love, while a pumpkin spice scent will attract wealth.) Plus, they’re so commonplace that no one will think twice about seeing one in your bedroom or on your desk at work. If you’re a purist and want to make sure you’re using real plant materials, you can get all natural candles scented with essential oils — but lots of witches use artificial scents and get good results, so don’t feel like you have to go with the more expensive option.
Diffuse essential oils. Essential oils contain the concentrated essence of a plant, which makes them a must-have tool for witches. Essential oils are also extremely popular right now, both for holistic healing and for aromatherapy, so you definitely won’t attract any negative attention for using them. You can get a good essential oil diffuser for under $20 online. Some brands overcharge for their oils, but you can find good quality oils for under $10. When choosing an essential oil, look at the magical correspondences for the plant it is made from. You can diffuse oils to infuse your space with their energy, similar to the way you would use incense.
Enchant your perfume. You can choose a perfume to match your intention or make your own custom perfume by mixing essential oils in a carrier oil. Focus on your intention as you spray the perfume, letting it infuse your energy field with magic. You can also buy magical perfume blends from witch-owned businesses online or on Etsy.
Learn shufflemancy. “Shufflemancy” is a modern form of divination that is done by putting a playlist on shuffle — whatever song plays first contains an intuitive message for you, either in the lyrics or in how it makes you feel. You can find playlists specifically made for divination by Googling “shufflemancy playlist,” or you can make your own by compiling a playlist of songs from different genres that deal with different topics. Just be sure to keep it diverse — if your playlist only has love songs on it, you might not get very helpful messages if you have a question about your career.
Learn bibliomancy. This divination method is similar to shufflemancy, but much older. Bibliomancy is done by asking your question while holding a book, focusing on your question while connecting with the book’s energy, and then opening it to a random page. There is a long, long tradition within Christianity of doing this with the Bible — if you feel connected to a certain sacred text, you could use it for bibliomancy. You could also use a book of poetry, a novel, or even a dictionary. However, I think it’s important to use a book you feel a connection to, rather than something randomly grabbed off the shelf.
Use Pinterest and Spotify as manifestation tools. You may have heard of vision boards, a tool used to manifest something by creating a detailed collection of images that match your intention. Pinterest boards are already essentially virtual vision boards, and creating one with focused intent can be a spell by itself. Likewise, you can use Spotify playlists for manifestation. To do this, create a playlist of songs that match your intention (songs about money or love, for example) and listen to it while meditating on your desired outcome.
Choose your outfits with intention. You can pick clothes based on color correspondences (see this post for a guide to color magic), the material they are made from (a wool sweater vs. a cotton T-shirt), or some other symbolism. For example, if you want to feel empowered, you might wear leopard print to channel the energy of a fierce predator.
Enchant a piece of jewelry for a specific purpose. You can choose your jewelry based on the correspondence of the metal or gemstones it is made from, make your own piece, or use whatever you already have on hand. You can enchant this jewelry by passing it over the flame of a candle or through the vapor of an essential oil diffuser. State what purpose you want this charm to serve, either out loud or in your mind. Wear this jewelry whenever you need to tap into that energy, and make sure to cleanse it often.
Create magical art. If you want to manifest something, draw or paint a picture of it. You don’t have to be a skilled artist — what matters is that you are taking your mental image of what you want and bringing it into the physical world. Fold up the picture and keep it in your pillow, or in some other special place. Likewise, if you want to banish something, draw or paint a picture of it and then rip it into little pieces and throw it out. This ritual allows you to purge yourself of the negative emotions tied to the thing you are banishing.
Take a magical bath. We rarely have more privacy than when we’re in the tub. Taking a bath is already a ritual of sorts, and it’s easy to add magic. You can, of course, make magical bath salts by mixing essential oils into Epsom salt, but you can also create bath spells with household objects. For example, a bath with salt and vinegar will clear up nasty energy, while adding milk to your bath will attract love and abundance.
Practicing in secret does not have to mean a less deep or well-rounded practice. There are lots of magical acts that can be done subtly or kept private. The suggestions in this post are by no means exhaustive, and I hope they will give you some ideas for other ways to fill your life with undercover magic.
Resources:
“Introduction” from The Malleus Maleficarum at http://www.malleusmaleficarum.org
The Fat Feminist Witch podcast, “Episode 34 — Witches, Midwives, and Doulas”
“Most witches are women, because witch hunts were all about persecuting the powerless” by Bridget Marshall for The Conversation
New World Witchery podcast, “Episode 118 — The Satanic Panic”
#baby witch bootcamp#baby witch#witchcraft#witch#witchblr#magic#magick#closet witch#broom closet#undercover witch#kitchen witch#kitchen witchcraft#wicca#wiccan#pagan#paganism#tech magic#long post#mine#my writing
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Why Cap Being Internally Closeted Is Not Only Possible, But Valid Representation
i wrote this to a lot of mitski and onsind, so you can’t blame me for any feelings that bleed through
now i don’t know if it actually exists, but i’ve heard of there being a lot of discourse surrounding the captains story arc regarding his sexuality- i believe the general gist is that having a queer character that remains closeted to themselves is either unrealistic or ‘bad’ representation, and as someone who really treasures the captain and relates to his story so far a lot, i thought i might break this down a bit.
i’ve divded up every complaint i’ve heard about this into four main questions which i’ll be covering below the ‘keep reading’, because this is gonna be pretty comprehensive. full disclaimer i reference my experiences as an ex-evangelical non binary butch lesbian a couple times, and i spent a year studying repression and the psychological impacts of high demand sexual ethics for my graduating sociology paper, so this is coming with some background to it i swear
the big questions:
can you EVEN be gay and not know it????
but isn't this just ANOTHER coming out arc, and aren't we supposed to be moving beyond those?
but if cap can't have a relationship with a man because he's a ghost, what's the point?
since cap's dead, isn't this technically bury your gays, and isn't that bad?
1. "but is it really possible to not know? Isn't that bad representation?"
short answer: no and no.
before i get into the validity of the captain's ignorance about his own orientation as 21st century rep, let's break down how the hell the captain can be so clearly attracted to men and still not even consider the possibility that he might be gay, as brought to you by someone who literally experienced this shit.
the captain's particular situation is both a direct result of the lack of information around human sexuality he would have had (aka clear messaging that it's actually possible for him to be attracted to men. i don't mean acceptable or allowed, i mean physically capable of happening- the idea that orientations other than heterosexual exist and are available to him, a man), and a subconscious survival mechanism. the environment in which he lives is outright hostile to gay people, while the military man identity he has constructed for himself doesn't allow for any form of deviation from societal norms, let alone one so base level and major. as a result of this killer combo of information and environment, instincts take over and the mind does it's best to repress the ‘deviant’ feelings until a. one of these two things changes, or b. the act of repression becomes so destructive and/or exhuasting that it becomes impossible to maintain. the key to maintaining a long-term state of repression of desire is diverting that energy elsewhere, and a high-demand group such as the military is the perfect place for the captain to do this (this technqiue is frequented by religions and extremist ideologies worldwide, but that’s not really what we’re here to focus on).
while the brain is actively repressing ‘deviant’ feelings (aka gay shit), this doesn't mean you don't experience the feelings at all. when performed as a subconscious act of survival, the aim of repression is to minimise/transform the feelings into a state where they can no longer cause immediate danger, and something as big as sexual/romantic orientation is going to keep popping up, but as long as the individual in question never understands what they’re feeling, they’ll be able to continue relatively undisturbed. you know how in heist movies, the leader of the group will only tell each team member part of the plan so they can’t screw things up for everyone else if they get caught? it’s kind of like that.
this is how the captain appears to have operated in life AND in death, and it’s a relatively common experience for lgbtq people who’ve grown up in similar circumstances (aka with a lack of information and in an unfriendly-to-hostile environment), and accounts for how some people can even go on to get married and have children before realising that they’re gay and/or trans.
personally, while i can now identify what were strong homo crushes all the way back to childhood, at the time i genuinely had no idea. there was the underlying sense that i probably shouldn't tell people how attached i was to these girls because i would seem weird, and that my feelings were stronger than the ones other people used to describe friendships, but like-like them in the way that other girls like-liked boys? no way! actually scratch that, it wasn't even a no way, because i had no idea that i even could. i even had my own havers, at least in terms of the emotional hold and devotion she got from me, except she treated me way less well than cap’s beau. snatches of the existence of lgbt people made it through the cone of silence, i definitely heard the words gay and lesbian, but my levels of informations mirrored those that the captain would have had: virtually none, beyond the idea that these words exist, some people are them, and that's not something that we support or think is okay, so let's just not speak about it. despite only attending religious schools for the first couple years of primary, until i got my own technology and social media accounts to explore lgbtq content on my own- option a out of the two catalysts for change- the possibility of me being gay was not at all on my radar. don’t even get me started on how long it took me to explore butchness and my overall gender, two things which now feel glaringly obvious.
when shit starts to break down, you can also make the conscious choice to repress which can delay the eventual smashing down of the mental closet door for a time (essentially when the closet door starts to open, you just say ‘no thanks’ and shut it again by pointedly Not Thinking About It). in the abscence of identifying yourself by your attractions, it becomes quite common to identify with a lack- in my case, this meant becoming proud of how sensible and not boy crazy i was, and in the captain’s case, this means becoming proud of how sensible and not sensuous/wild (aka woman crazy) he was, identifying with his LACK of desire for women and partying (which, even in the 40s, involved the expectation of opposite sex romances and hook ups). i’m not saying that’s the only reason he’s a rule follower, but i think the contrast between About Last Night and Perfect Day pretty much support this. (the captain getting on his high horse about general party antics that he inherently felt excluded from because of underlying awareness of his difference & his tendency to project his regimented expectations of himself onto others, vs. joining in the reception party, awareness of how the environment supports difference in the form of clare and sam, and relaxing his own rules by dancing with men- the captain doesn’t mind a party when feels like he has a place there.)
so the captain was operating in a high demand, highly regulated environment (primarily the military, but also early 20th century England itself), with regimented roles, rules, and expectations. working on the assumption that he wouldn't have had out/disclosing lgbt friends, he would have had little to no exposure to lgbt identities, and what information he did receive would have been hushed and negatively geared. while my world started to open up when i started high school was allowed to have my own phone + instagram account, resulting in me realising something wasn't quite 'right' within a few years (making me a relatively early realiser compared to those who don't come out to themselves until adulthood), in life the captain never had that experience. he didn't receive the information he needed, his environment didn't grow less hostile. with the near-exception of havers related heartbreak, his well disciplined and lifelong method of repression never became destructive/exhaustive enough to permanently override the danger signals in his mind and allow him to put his feelings into words. neither of the most common catalysts for change happened for him, so he continued as usual, even after his death.
BUT, and here’s where we come to why this is actually great representation, arrival of mike and Alison represents the opening up of new world. for the first time, the captain is actively made aware of the fact that his environment is no longer hostile, and better than that, it’s affirming. he’s also getting access to positively geared information about lgbtq people and identities, so option a of the two catalysts for change is absolutely present, and resoundingly positive.
the captain’s arc is also relatively unique as it acknowledges the oppressive nature of his environment, but actually focuses on the internal consequences, and the way that systems like those that the captain lived in succeed because they turn us into our own oppressors. for whatever reason, we repress ourseslves, and often can’t help it, and i find that the significance of the journey to overcome that is often overlooked in more mainstream queer media. perhaps it’s just not very cinematic, or it remains too confronting for cishet audiences, but ghosts manages to touch on it with a lovely amount of humour and hope. Jamie Babbit’s But I’m A Cheerleader is another favourite piece of queer media for the same reasons.
not only does it show this, but as the captain continues to get gayer and lean into some of his less conventional traits (like an interest in fashion and the wedding planning), it shows lgbt people who have been or are going through this that there CAN be a positive outcome. it takes a lot to unlearn all the things that have painted you as wrong, especially when a massive institution is desperate to continue doing so, but you can do it, you can be happy, and it's never too late. (i've been meaning to say that last point for ages for ages, but a mutual beat me to it here)
2. not just another coming out arc
i absolutely support the demand for queer stories that don’t center around coming out (it’s like shrodinger’s queer: if you’re not coming out on screen, do you really even exist?), but i don’t align with the criticisms that the captain should already be out. for the reasons mentioned above, the captain’s particular story is fairly different to the ‘young white teenager who mostly knows gay is fine, it’s just everyone else that’s got the problem, but have a unremarkably straight sounding soundtrack, a trauma porn romance, and a cishet saviour’ that we keep seeing. the captain’s ongoing journey with his sexuality emphasises the overaching theme of the show: recovering from trauma and humanity’s endless capacity for growth, and i think that’s worth showing over and over again until it stops being true.
additionally, while the captain’s journey regarding his gayness is a big part of his character and story, ghosts makes it clear that it’s not the ONLY part, and being gay is far from his ONLY characteristic or dramatic/comedic engine. the fact that i’m even having to congratulate ghosts for doing that really shows how much film and television is struggling huh.
while all queer media is, and should be, subject to criticism, i think if it helps even one person then it absolutely deserves to exist, and i can say i’ve found the captain’s journey to be the lgbt story i’ve found that’s closest to my own, which says a lot considering he’s a dead world war 2 soldier who hangs out with other ghosts including a slutty Tory, a georgian noblewoman, and a literal caveman.
3. if captain gay, why he no have boyfriend????
another complaint that’s been circulating is that since the captain doesn’t, and likely won’t, have a boyfriend, that makes him Bad Representation because it follows the sad single gay trope. i kind of get the logic from this one, and a lot of it is up to personal interpretation, but part of me really enjoys the fact that the captain’s journey towards accepting himself is separated from having a relationship.
coming out is often paired with having romantic/sexual relationships (either as the reason or reward for doing so). my own struggle with repression didn't end the second that came out, and i still struggle with letting myself develop & acknowledge romantic feelings as a result of actively shutting them (and most other feelings in general) down for years, and statistics show that lgbtq youth in particular tend not to live out their 'teen years' until their twenties. by not giving cap a relationship straight away, ghosts separates the act of claiming identity and sexual orientation from finding a partner (two things which are, more often than not, separate), and also provides some very nice validation to folks who have yet to have the relationship they want, especially when lots of mainstream queer media is now jumping on the cishet media bandwagon of acting as if every person loses their virginity and has a life defining relationship at sixteen. it’s essentially a continuation of the earlier theme of “it’s never too late”, and who’s to say the captain won’t get a gay bear ghost boyfriend to go haunt nazis with??? people die all the time, it could happen.
(also, i think him and julian will have definitely shagged at least once. it was a low moment for both of them and they refuse to speak of it.)
lots of asexual/ace spectrum fans have come out to say how much they’ve loved being able to headcanon cap as ace, and while that’s not a headcanon i personally have, i think it’s brilliant that ace fans feel seen by his character- we’re all in this soup together babey (and sorry for cursing everyone still reading this with that cap/julian headcanon. i’m just a vessel)
4. “okay, but cap’s a GHOST- doesn’t that make this Bury Your Gays?”
this is a bit of a complex one, but i’m going to say no as a result of the following break down.
Bury Your Gays (BYG), aka the trope where lgbtq characters are consistently killed off (and often with a heavy dose of trauma, while cishet characters survive) is probably one of my least favourite lgbt media tropes. BYG has two main points:
1. the lgbt character is killed, thus removing them from story entirely- hence the use of the phrase ‘killed OFF’ (killed off of the show/film)
2. the character’s death reinforces the perception that lgbtq people’s lives must end in tragedy, instead of being long and fulfilling, or are inherently less valuable. bonus points if the character is killed in a hate crime or confesses same-gender love right before they die (that one implies that queer love genuinely has no future!)
not every death of an lgbtq character is bury your gays, and i personally feel that the captain is an example of an lgbt death that isn’t.
first of all, while the captain is dead, so are the vast majority of characters in ghosts. the premise of the show means that death is not the end of the line for its characters- for most of them, it’s the only reason we get to see them on screen at all. as such, the captain being dead doesn’t remove him from the story, so point one is irrelevant.
at the time of posting, we don’t know how or why the captain died, but we've had nothing to suggest his death was in any way related to his latent sexuality, so his mysterious death doesn’t actively play into the supposedly inherent tragedy of queer lives, nor the supposedly lesser value. that’s as of right now- since we don’t know the circumstances of his death it’s a little tough to analyse properly. while the captain’s life absolutely features missed opportunities and it’s fair share of tragedy, hope and growth (which seems to be the theme of this post) abounds in equal measure. the captain may not be alive, but we DO get to see him growing and having a relatively happy existence, that for the most part seems to be getting even better as he learns to open up and be himself unapologetically- that doesn’t feel like BYG to me.
while writng this, it’s just occured to me that death really is a second chance for most of the ghosts, especially with the introduction of alison. from mary learning to read, to thomas finding modern music, they’ve all been given the chance explore things they never could have while they were alive, and hopefully grow enough to one day be sucked off move on.
in conclusion,
i love the captain very much and i hope his arc lives up to the standards it’s set so far. i don’t know where to put this in this post, but i’d alo like to say i LOVE how in Perfect Day, the captain wasn’t used as an educational experienced for fanny at all. i am very tired of people expecting me to be the walking talking homophobe educator and rehabilitator, so the fact that it’s alison and the other ghosts that call fanny out while the captain just gets to have fun with the wedding organisation made me very happy.
here’s a few other cap posts that i’ve done:
the captain’s arc if adam and the film crew stayed
a possible cap coming out
the captain backstory headcanon
if you’ve read this far,
thank you!
also check out @alex-ghosts-corner , this post inspired me very much to write this
#i subluxed all my fingers and wrists doing this but worth it#bbc ghosts#bbc ghosts headcanon#bbc ghosts analysis#the captain#caphavers#the captain x havers#ben willbond#lgbt representation#lgbt rep#queer media#lgbt media
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Heyy I'm sorry if that's not sth you wanna talk ab just ignore in that case but I just absolutely loved your response ab BIG and felt comfortable enough to ask this. I saw someone say the phandom is the reason dnp are so private and will never disclose their relationship status (which ofc none of them have to nor owe anyone)and that it took Dan so long to be comfortable w himself and open. I'm quite new here so idk, I know people have been very invasive but was it to that extent in your opinion?
Oof this is a complex question. First off, yes the community as a whole was incredibly invasive. (We could get into the semantics of how it was a vocal minority who were outwardly and directly crossing boundaries vs those who kept to themselves when it came to issues that shouldn’t have been discussed around dnp but who also consumed and interacted with things they shouldn’t have.) But overall, yes. The community had a tendency to be toxic in terms of crossing dnp’s boundaries.
People found private social media accounts/old posts from both the boys and their friends and posted them. People harassed Dan’s brother off the internet. Of course the big one of sharing and discussing the private video in spaces where dnp would see it (and sometimes just outright asking them about it). Asking about their relationship and sexualities. Bringing up old posts (which I understand can be a gray area in the beginning as some people were around for said posts and there was never a conversation about them not being comfortable with that narrative as they became more popular. But also like....it was clear over time they didn’t want things to get out. But then there’s the conversation about people attacking others over public posts? Overall, the important thing is it did cause them distress).
Now, when it comes to them disclosing or the timeline of them coming out, I don’t think it was just the trauma they had experienced with that subset of their audience. Dan talked about how he personally was not ready, how he was closeted in his personal life, how he had his own internalized homophobia to work through. They also had to think about their careers as a whole. Do you think the BBC would have allowed a gay couple to have their own show in 2012?! Would they have gotten as many opportunities if they were out? Absolutely not. The community absolutely played a part in it. What they went through was legitimately traumatic. It would be for any closeted queer person, but on that scale? Yes, it was horrible.
And I reallyyyy don’t want this to turn into a conversation of people trying to claim innocence or point fingers because it was That group and not My group and WE didn’t do anything. The damage still happened regardless of how many or who did it. And dnp understand it wasn’t everyone. If they held a grudge against their entire fan base they wouldn’t still engage with us at this level. Their relationship with us was complicated and hard at times back in the day, but (despite a few incidences *cough*) they never lashed out, always staying positive and kind (especially at times when it wasn’t particularly deserved). Regardless of where every person sat individually, we as a collective did put them through hell. Is the community the only reason they came out later? No, absolutely not. That was a personal choice that came from a variety of factors.
As far as their relationship, they’ve both stated that they’re private people and want that part of their lives to be free from media speculation (which is more than fair given that every aspect of who they are has been up for media speculation). The thing is though, they treat us as a separate entity from the media. We as their audience and their community, many of whom have stuck with them for years and years, have earned back a certain level of trust. I do believe they see us in a kind of bubble where it’s safer. But yes, everything they say and do is manufactured to not cause commotion outside the bubble. If they hated us and still harbored all this resentment that sooo many people love to mention, they wouldn’t...be here? They wouldn’t do weekly liveshows together where they have both stated time and time again that they enjoy it, they enjoy spending time with us. The thing that has set them apart from other creators since DAY ONE is their relationship with their audience. It’s something that people in the industry have commented on, it’s something their peers have commented on, it’s something THEY have commented on. Despite everything, their bond with their community is unparalleled.
#anon ask#long post#i feel like an old man on a toadstool reading from a book talking about the Before time#tldr yes the phandom was invasive but no it wasn’t the only reason they’ve made the decisions they have#sorry to everyone on mobile i had thoughts ™️
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So, I watched Happiest Season yesterday, and I have thoughts. A lot of thoughts. Spoilers abound and this is long, so I’ll put this under a cut.
Happiest Season: a review
You have to ask yourself how “happy” a happy ending really is when you glance down at the time bar on the film and see that there’s less than fifteen minutes left and none of the story’s problems have been even remotely resolved.
Skip to the closing credits, and I hadn’t changed my mind. This is a “happy” ending where a great deal of the problems in the plot were left either completely unresolved, or whose happiness wasn’t earned – wasn’t properly fleshed out, developed, supported, or in fact, even happy.
What an incredibly toxic family the Caldwells are. Let’s start with them: there are three daughters. Sloan has apparently cemented her parents’ permanent disappointment by having left a promising legal career in favour of raising a family. Side tangent: are we really still having this discussion, in 2020? This binary choice between family OR career? Besides, Sloan evidently developed a different, and very lucrative career. I also strongly dislike the way the perception of her marriage ending is portrayed as a failure. Her awful parents both resent her having left the legal field, yet have refused to now see her as anything other than a parent, ignoring her new career choice and, it seems, literally anything else about her. Then we have Jane, who is overtly abused. Treated as lesser than anyone else in the family apart from technical support with malfunctioning printers, Jane is constantly criticized, chastised, literally told to not put herself in the centre of the family for a holiday photo. I was horrified and devastated by the wanton destruction of her painting at the end, too. I’m happy for her that her book got published and that she found success there, but I hate that this brutal, completely unnecessary destruction of her art happened and was totally overlooked.
I’m going to come back to Harper, because there’s a LOT to say there.
The way the parents, Tipper and Ted, treated Abby, was appalling from start to finish. Leaving aside the ENTIRE question of the secret girlfriend thing, if my family ever treated a friend or even distant acquaintance the way the Caldwells treated Abby, I would be furious with them. I used to frequently bring friends who were international students or just on their own for the holidays to my parents’ place for Thanksgiving dinner or Christmas festivities. These people were so, so, so incredibly rude to Abby, from ignoring her when she first arrived to giving her a terrible bedroom with a door that doesn’t lock, to walking in on her multiple times while she was changing or in bed – that level of complete disrespect infuriated me! Just allowing those awful kids to be in her private space without any sort of discipline, consequences, or apologies was unacceptable. The way they treated Abby after those same kids – which she was stuck with, without any sort of request to watch them – planted that necklace on her, was unacceptable. The utter lack of apology for having literally accused her of theft, for accusing her multiple times after that – WOW. Treating Abby as though she was the unexpected, extra guest at the restaurant that first night, and giving the ex-boyfriend the parents kept shoving on Harper the proper one was unacceptable.
Then there’s how Harper treated Abby. Let’s start with the restaurant: first of all, had my parents pulled that stunt on my friend/guest/secret girlfriend, I would have let them know then and there that it wasn’t okay. And then I would have, I don’t know, asked the staff to bring a proper chair, and if that turned out to be impossible, I would have insisted that she take mine instead, and sat on the little chair myself. Asking anyone to closet themselves is an act of violence, and watching that as a member of the LGBTQ2+ community was actively harmful to witness. Again, a lot of the crap that Harper subjected Abby to would have been awful no matter WHO Abby was: you don’t abandon your guest to hang out with old friends. If they’re ready to go home, then you go home with them. It’s basic hospitality. Considering that Abby was Harper’s partner, that’s a whole extra layer of harm. THEN add the ex-boyfriend, a horribly-treated ex-girlfriend, and toxic old friends to the mix, and you have something beyond appalling. Adding this stuff on top of not standing up for Abby to her family, not insisting that she be given somewhere proper to sleep during her time in her parents’ house, not insisting that she be treated with the most basic respect, not defending her during the whole jewellery theft situation, and even going along with the parents’ de-invitation to that dinner – that’s inexcusable. You don’t treat other people that way, much less your partner. Then add Harper calling Abby controlling, while simultaneously having the nerve to get angry about Abby spending time with Riley, which is possibly the only good thing that happened for Abby during that entire, awful trip – yeah. I was finished with Harper by that point.
Harper also actively participated in the way her sisters were constantly put down by their parents. The responsibility of being the privileged favourite is to use your status to bring others up. Harper doesn’t appear to have any sort of spine or courage whatsoever. It was only after she was forcibly outed by Sloan – and such was her privilege that the parents believed that it was a “malicious” lie rather than a “shocking” secret – that Harper even admitted the truth, and that was only after forcing Abby to watch her deny it yet it again. While I did love John (the gay best friend)’s entire speech about someone’s love not being the same thing as being ready to come out, there is nonetheless a ton of harm in forcing your partner watch that. It does affect them. It does disavow their identity at the same time, when they’re in a relationship with you. Her pattern of behaviour of throwing other people under the bus, like Riley, is very much intact.
I completely comprehend Harper’s fear of being rejected by her family. Apparently it was a well-founded fear, based on her awful, awful parents. That’s one of the reasons why the ending didn’t resonate for me at all: it wasn’t earned. Harper’s turn-around from being completely unwilling to have her parents know the truth to claiming that Abby was the only thing that mattered to her, came out of nowhere. It wasn’t a supported development. It happened too quickly. Similarly, the parents both going from being just about the worst parents on the planet to having a VERY sudden change of heart and behaviour, just happened unbelievably quickly. There was no questioning the entire history of their practises or what was wrong with them, no questioning how they’d treated any of their kids. The whole “consequence” for Ted was deciding, of his own accord, not to align himself with a politician who would force Harper to zip it – sorry, continue to zip it – about her identity. He shouldn’t have aligned himself with that woman in the first place. No one ever apologized to Abby about the way they treated her from start to finish, from patronizing her for being an orphan or the constant lack of respect shown her, to the false accusations of theft. Not a single part of it was atoned for at any point. Even Tipper being so disgusted with Abby’s ipad photography skills was disgusting. You just don’t talk to other human beings that way, and there was no resolution for me on any of this. There were also no consequences for Sloan’s horrific, SUPER-public outing of Harper, for Harper’s destruction of Jane’s painting, for the kids’ planting of the necklace on Abby, or for anyone’s horrendous treatment of Abby in general.
So yes: when you’re less than fifteen minutes out from the end of a supposed romantic comedy that was more upsetting to watch than entertaining or funny, and you’re actively rooting for the main character to walk away from her so-called partner and her toxic family, that’s not good. I’m not sold on the “romance” aspect, either. John (Dan Levy’s character) was the only good part of this movie, for me, and that’s overlooking his completely rude ignoring while on his phone at the beginning, or his negligent care of the animals he was supposed to be taking care of. (Gross, again – animals’ lives have value, too, and if my pet sitter killed my pet through negligence while I was away, I would be furious!) But his point about “sticking it to the patriarchy” in terms of Abby asking Ted for his permission/blessing to marry Harper was spot on. For all the hype about this being a progressive, lesbian, holiday rom-com, this film managed to perpetuate a lot of gross aspects of straight, white, misogynistic, heteronormative culture, like women being the property of their fathers and needing to obtain a male parent’s “permission” to marry another human being. The only person’s “permission” that was needed here was Harper’s, and then it’s not about permission – it’s about two adults making a consensual decision to commit themselves to each other. It’s great if you have the support of family – aka, BOTH parents, on BOTH sides – but that support is a bonus, not a prerequisite. Perpetuating the false dichotomy of family vs career for women only, is a harmful one to keep perpetuating. That question is never asked of men.
I was honestly kind of disgusted that Abby chose to stay with Harper by the end. I get it, but it definitely didn’t leave me with warm, romantic feelings. It left me with the deflated feeling I invariably experience whenever a woman makes the choice to be the bigger person and submit herself to a damaging situation or relationship. Mostly what I’m left with is anger that no one spoke up for Abby at any point, even John. That, and anger and sorrow over Jane’s painting. So yeah: it wasn’t as bad as bury your gays, but it also wasn’t really a happy ending for me, or super enjoyable to watch. Do better, Hollywood. Do a lot better.
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Lovely Writer Episode 11 - analysis
I'm still not quite over yesterday's episode and I have a lot of thoughts about it, so I just need to get it out of my system and write yet another analysis because I'm so much invested.
I saw some people saying this week's episode was the weakest of them all and I can only disagree because in my opinion, Lovely Writer gets better week after week. The weakest episode so far was the first one. The truth about Nubsib is revealed pretty slowly and you can only see the entire picture after ep 7 or something and I believe this is very well done. First, Lovely Writer is about Nubsib and who he is and this show thankfully doesn't get boring as soon as we get to know everything. Then, another conflict steps up and they deal with the angst of them coming out to, not only their parents, but basically the whole world. It's just a very interesting and clever storywriting because it feels like the creators of this show know what they are talking about.
Sexuality
Just because I've seen this post about the dinner Gene has with his friends in ep 4, I'm gonna talk about how his sexuality is handled and how much he grows with it. Gene never has a real conflict with his sexuality, at least it never seems that way. He has his moments with Nubsib and when they kiss, he likes it a lot but it's never a topic. He never says "I'm gay" but you can feel that he's not uncomfortable because Nubsib is a man but because Nubsib is invading his personal space. When Gene has dinner with his friends, they ask him more than once if he is gay or not. This whole scene was just very awkward and Gene doesn't really give them any answer. He doesn't deny it but he doesn't clarify it either. It's just a vibe we're getting that he's sure he's not straight. But this is an unspoken truth and I believe, he is not ready to clarify it yet because he doesn't want to say anything if he's not 100% sure.
Later in the show, Gene clarifies his sexuality alongside his sort of love confession when he shouts at his father. I find this extremely powerful because Gene waits until he's really in love with someone until he says anything about his sexuality. Like him falling for a man was his verification. And after he said it and stood up for it, he's a lot more relaxed and self-confident. He never denies it, even when his father first looks like he's not approving the relationship, because that's who he is. That is his identity.
Them vs the outside
It's something I've already addressed in my other analyses, but this devide returns every single episode. The first 20mins of this episode, we get cute SibGene scenes in Nubsib's apartment and it's basically them just being happy boyfriends. But then, Hin calls and the fairytale is over. The real world is back and it's again, nothing positive. As soon as the outside invades their lives again, the amount of couple moments stops and things are more serious now. Here, the problem grows slowly until it's huge and over these, I guess, 70mins, every argument and point of view is presented to then draw a big picture of the whole conflict itself and the tough decision they have to make. First, we have Gene not worrying, then him saying their love is between two people only, then Bua saying others rely on this and then Tum's sister saying fans are going wild. It's a lot to take and right before the big blow, we get a scene of Gene and Nubsib just holding each other (here). They still haven't seen the entirety of this problem and believe they will overcome it.
They feel sort of untouchable now that they have promised each other grand things and all that. They overcame the fight with the parents and bonded even more over it, so nothing could come between them. That's why we don't get their reactions to the Tweets, because they feel invincible and don't really worry about it. It is a sign of their seriousness and belief that they are strong together.
This episode started with their "love being between two people" and ended with their "love breaking beause of other people".
Love vs reputation
This brings me to this section of my analysis. The problem with this conflict is that there is no right solution and I still don't know what I would've done. Nubsib doesn't care about others but Gene does. It's a dilemma with no right or wrong. Both sides are understandable. The problem is that they both misunderstand each other. Gene thinks Nubsib is selfish and Nubsib thinks Gene only cares about others. Right now, they can't have both: love and the others. It's either one of them and both options mean a great sacrifice.
Repuation means a lot in the show business and even though Nubsib doesn't seem to care about it, it's very important and what the film industry relies on. His love for Gene causes the whole production to collapse and backfire because "SibAoey is not true". Their real love feels like a crime because it could mean the end for a few people (talking about Tum). So, it's love vs reputation, truth vs lie and them vs the outside.
In the end, Gene doesn't want to cause even more damage. He choses to damage two lives in order to keep hundreds save and I totally get where he is coming from but he's sacrificing his happiness. Nubsib was his redemption. A door to love and the end of loneliness. Now, Gene is back where he was and even more closeted now.
But his decision is very in character because he has proven before that he has his shell he's crawling into whenever things get too tense. He shuts the world and everyone else out in order to be alone in his head. So, he even pushes Nubsib away even though Nubsib showed him a happy life outside of that shell which is why Gene porbably feels really depressed living alone. If you once get to see, taste and feel happiness, you can't just let go and forget it.
During the break-up we even see Nubsib changing his mind (mentioned here). First, he wants to convince Gene to see things like he does and is not ready to change his mind. But then he realizes Gene is still the creator of "Bad Engineer". He put a lot of work and heart into the novel and Nubsib's solution to the problem would cause peple to badmouth Gene's story. So, Nubsib is ready to even agree to the option the company presented: only meeting in private. But Gene is so worked up at this point and has made up his mind that he sees no point in them being together and storms off to go back into his nutshell. In this moment, hiding seems to be easier for him than enduring the confrontation.
Protection of the fairytale
As I already said, Gene and Nubsib live in their fairytale and up until now we thought Nubsib is the only one who would do everything to protect it and prevent the outside from stepping in - and people still think that. But guys, don't forget that Gene knew about the Twitter thing as well. He also didn't address the issue. He also wanted to protect this faitytale and happiness.
This protection of what's very dear to them got puched in the face during the tough meeting. There's a lot of pressure and they have to decide what to do. They have no time to discuss and come to an agreement. People want answers right now, so each of them doesn't know what to do and just seeks understanding in each other's face. Nubsib and Gene don't sit next to each other to make the decision together, unlike the coming out to the parents when Nubsib took Gene's hand. This time, they look at each other with a look of horror and that's simply all they can do. They can't hold hands to reasure each other they will endure this no matter what (mentioned here).
What this show always showed is that Gene and Nubsib are strong together. They might act tough sometimes but they are both weak in a way that they need each other, that they need to lean onto each other. But that's not possible here and this protection of the fairytale no longer exists and is no longer possible. They can't protect their hearts right now and don't even have a chance. It feels like a metaphor to predict what is about to come. It's "a heart ripped in two" or "two hands ripped apart" if you want to be dramatic.
Nubsib
I still can't tell who Nubsib is. I feel we're lacking of information about him. Does he have any hobbies? Does he have at least one friend? Does he have a life apart from Gene? I feel like I'm watching Twilight. When Gene was driving back to his apartment and left Nubsib on the bed, I got really excited for a second we would finally see what he does in his alonetime but no, they cut to Gene and Hin's talk.
But really guys, what does Nubsib do when he's alone? Gene seems to be his hobby, his friend, his life...talking about toxicness here. And Gene still doesn't see it...
Aoey
Well, what should I say? I have no sympathy or pity left for him. I already analyzed his behavior this episode here and don't want to repeat myself.
Conclusion
This episode, again, contained a lot of angst, tension and uncomfort. Things were crashing down again and I just have to shout out to the actors and director and all of them. The scene of the break-up had me crying for 10mins and when Nubsib said "don't cry", I broke. Honestly. This made everything even more bittersweet and painful because you can feel the love they have and Nubsib still cares a lot, so he tries to comfort Gene but Gene pushes him away. It is an act of desperation. Nubsib doesn't want Gene to leave and tries to make it better but in the end Gene has made his decision.
But, but, but, what is going on with Tiffy? Why is she mistrusting Tum so much and pushes him away again? And why the hell doesn't she say anything to Aoey and believes his mindgames? Does she know something I don't? Can she tell what's real and what isn't? Because I can't and I'm usually good at reading people. And where is Mhok? Did Aoey scare him away? Did he just give up? So many questions and no answers.
I'm excited for next week!
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Lesbian [Talk Show] - LeZ'N Up - Dating Stories
Stories from Conservative Closets
The hunger and thirst for LGBTQ content was strong with me and if you understand or grew up hiding in your gay closet, you know the temptation will always be a risk. What if someone sees you looking at books in that section? That's the sad truth of being a questioning youth. In order to discover who you are you have to risk being exposed and for some it's too much. We discuss how the fear of others reaction to PDA has an effect on Lesbian relationships. Even being out of the closet has it's restrictions when it comes to being okay with how the public treats lesbians and PDA. The gaze of men, haters, being outed in your community, etc. can all be obstacles for LGBTQ+ relationships.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEI5PkC6eCQ
Published on March 22, 2019
Dating and Going to Pride in the USA
Stephanie highlights some of the great Pride events she's attended on the West and East Coast. Nicole discusses some of the amazing Pride events of the Southeast side of the USA. Pride is an LGBTQIA+ festival. Events during the festival are all over the globe. Communities celebrate diversity through parades, exhibits, films, and of course parties! Join us as we talk about some of our memories from Pride. Share some of your exciting pride stories in the comments below. Have you ever been to a Pride event in your city? We speak briefly on dating as a Lesbian. Stephanie talks about the difficult task and knowing who is or isn't Lesbian. Nicole reminisces about her dating years before she was married.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAPzShnmpEA
Published on April 5, 2019
Dating Stories
Finally telling real lesbian dating stories! Stephanie is sharing some dating stories this episode. We hear about her Tinder date and her amazing luck at the gay bars in Portland. I also throw out some terrible date ideas. We discuss some interesting dating spots in big cities like Atlanta and Portland. How do we feel about Zodiac signs and dating? Do you search for certain signs while dating? Stephanie talks about the Virgo life and if her first date was interested in moving forward with her. What is your favorite LGBTQ bar in Portland? Share some of your wild stories in the comments!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xb1v3q_0FXo
Published on April 17, 2019
Bedroom Stories
We are talking about what goes down in the bedroom. Stephanie continues sharing the details of her date with a woman she met at the gay bar. We discuss Lesbian top and bottom dynamics in sex and celebrate switch hitters. We talk about dating apps and how polygamous relationships compare to open relationships and monogamous ones.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tjh9yoOL9Xk
Published on April 18, 2019
Finding Your Soulmate
Stephanie asks how Nicole knew she wanted to start a monogamous relationship with her wife instead of another open relationship with a new woman. Nicole tells Stephanie about meeting her wife and falling in love. How do you know you've found the one? Nicole discusses the difference between her relationship with her wife and past women she's dated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_V4xtharZI
Published on April 19, 2019
Finding Lovers & Friends
Nicole gives her strategy for finding lesbians in the wild. Stephanie shares how fun it is to hang out with gay males as an alternative to hanging out with lesbians. We tell stories about going to lesbian events and bars alone vs going with a crew of lesbian friends. Tune in for a glimpse into the struggle to find lovers and friends in the lesbian community.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRcJcljmY2g
Published on May 1, 2019
Virgin Sex and Dating
Everyone has to start somewhere! Join Stephanie and Nicole discussing the first time they had sex as lesbians. Stephanie also gives us an update on her lesbian dating life as it heats up and continues in Portland. Will she ever find a woman that doesn't sneak out before the sun comes up? Does the media portray losing your virginity and first times wrong? Join in the comments and share how you feel about orchestrated sex scenes and what it's actually like to have sex for the first time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJ4HZLWCN2M
Published on May 3, 2019
Useless Lesbians
The phrase "useless lesbian" has become a funny meme but is it harmful? Stephanie and Nicole talk about what it's like to feel like a useless lesbian. Useless lesbian is often defined as a lesbian who wouldn't recognize if a woman is into her even if its obvious. We talk about rejection, flirting with women, and giving compliments that don't feel creepy to both parties. Have you ever felt like a useless lesbian? Join us in the comments and tell your story.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHu7S_8W4GM
Published on May 8, 2019
Queer Sexuality Part 1
Our first guest joins us to talk about Queer sexuality. Kyrstin (Portland) is joining us and sharing her journey to identifying as Queer. We ask her all the questions we have about what Queer means to her and how living and identifying as Queer has impacted her life. She gives us an amazing introduction into Queer topics. We discuss bisexuality, pansexuality, and how she feels about the term homoflexible. What does being Queer mean to you? What does the term mean to you and your community? Make sure to subscribe so you don't miss Part 2 of this discussion and all our other entertaining episodes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YF7YjZLSqt4
Published on May 13, 2019
Queer Sexuality Part 2
Part 2 of our discussion into Queer sexuality. Kyrstin (Portland) is joining us and sharing her journey to identifying as Queer. We talk about the different situations where identifying as Queer would include a variety of different presenting humans. We discuss bisexuality, pansexuality, and how she feels about the term homoflexible. What does being Queer mean to you? What does the term mean to you and your community? Check out Part 1 as well to continue the topic of Queer sexuality.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6YUxidEe0E
Published on May 14, 2019
My Ex Changed Her Name
Nicole's first girlfriend joins the show to talk about how she changed her name. This is great if you're thinking about changing your name or want to hear a story about something you've never done before. We discuss how she came up with her new name (Justin), her fears, and the different situations that developed. Have you ever introduced yourself and used a different name? Are you thinking of or have you changed your name?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1sEp_h5t8k
Published on May 20, 2019
My Ex is Bisexual
Part 2 of The Talking to My Ex GF series is here and it's Bisexual. Stephanie, Justin, and I talk about how bisexuals are viewed in the LGBT+ community. Justin discusses what it means to be bisexual now while she is in a heterosexual relationship and what it was like coming to terms with bisexuality. Are you struggling with identifying as bi or any other sexuality? Are you interested in how someone decides or arrives at the decision to be another sexuality?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5QrQF2RLkM
Published on June 8, 2019
Operation Gemini
Stephanie shares the legend of Operation Gemini. Lesbian Zodiac Killer, Sex, Love, Instagram PI Work, Murder Mysteries, and the one Nicole calls Carmen San Diego. We get into a play by play about the ups and downs of what we thought was Tinder magic but turned into a dumpster fire. Of course we briefly talk about horoscopes and how we always surround ourselves with the same signs. Nicole asks Stephanie to describe her perfect girl and talk about how important it is to find someone who is honest. Is Carmen San Diego playing games? Is it hard to be honest during the dating process? How does everyone feel about Murder?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQOAvNz5Mpc
Published on June 14, 2019
Operation Gemini Part 2
The legend of Operation Gemini continues. As if she couldn't do any worst she tops the charts with the worst texts of all time combined with late-night self-centered dates. Stephanie replays the last mission with Gemini and the disappointment that is dating in 2019. Lesbian Zodiac Killer, Sex, Love, Instagram PI Work, Murder Mysteries, and the one Nicole calls Carmen San Diego. We get into a play by play about the ups and downs of what we thought was Tinder magic but turned into a dumpster fire. Is Carmen San Diego looking for casual or disposable sex? Is it hard to be honest during the dating process? Is this op finally done?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFrLfG8WBD0
Published on June 26, 2019
Lesbian Squad Goals
We can't be the only ones dreaming of that perfect lesbian friend group. Tune in to hear Stephanie's idea of the most diverse lesbian squad and Nicole's lesbian run utopian town. We are talking lesbian energy, friend groups, and as always how hard it is to find lesbian friends and lovers. Are you friends with people of one sexuality over another? Would you live in a town populated with only one kind of sexuality? What does your perfect squad look like?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3g3bMqvMTk
Published on August 2, 2019
Femme Lesbian Struggles
The #femmelesbian struggle is real and we speak about it in this episode of the podcast. Femme Lesbians often talk about how they are erased in the world and community. Could it be the link between heterosexuality and femme women’s style? What are femme lesbians able to do to get others to know they are a part of the QBLTIA+ community? Check out the video and let’s get a conversation going about our femme sisters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvUBacKuO_0
Published on August 9, 2019
Dating Turn Offs
Can one be satisfied with getting laid even if their partners do not excite them? Is the myth women only like bad choices true? A short pow wow between Stephanie and Nicole reveals Stephanie is aware she goes for the worst women but just finds so much pleasure in the chase. Can she change her choosey ways and find a good stable woman to tame her wild way?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYiCJEWApYg
Published on August 31, 2019
Bisexual Celibacy
Can a person be naked in the heat of passion and identify with the lifestyle choice of Celibacy? Stephanie shares an interesting story about a night with a Bisexual friend. She met this friend from the totally reliable dating app Bubble. Celibacy is defined by the iPhone 11 as the state of abstaining from marriage and sexual relations. Is that what had happened lol? Have you or have you ever met someone who has been successful with Celibacy? How does everyone feel about Bisexuals being top tier on the show?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPA_PFb_k7g
Published on September 20, 2019
WTF 2020
Stephanie in Portland and Nicole in Atlanta sit down and talk about where the world is with the Covid-19 virus. Part I in the series we talk about how we are handling the virus right now. How is everyone handling the virus and being in quarantine? Have you shared the show with anyone?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2isgCr1woU
Published on April 10, 2020
GROSS STORIES
Part II in the series we talk about what isolation has done to the whole 2020 vibe and how gross people are acting. Stephanie in Portland and Nicole in Atlanta sit down and talk about where the world is with the Covid-19 virus. How is everyone handling the virus and being in quarantine? Have you shared the show with anyone?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_qExFAcwfI
Published on April 11, 2020
REAL HEROES
Thanks to Stripers, delivery persons, healthcare pros, and teachers to name a few. Part III in the series we talk about the real heroes of the Coronavirus. Stephanie in Portland and Nicole in Atlanta sit down and talk about where the world is with the Covid-19 virus. We talk about creative ways to reach out to people and connect in a time of social distancing. How is everyone handling the virus and being in quarantine? Have you shared the show with anyone?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZ5N75kaUV4
Published on April 12, 2020
SELF LOVE
It's important to keep your mental health strong and your spirits up in these hard times. Part IV in the series we talk about things to pass the time and keep people out of depression. Stephanie in Portland and Nicole in Atlanta sit down and talk about where the world is with the Covid-19 virus. We talk about creative ways to reach out to people and connect in a time of social distancing. How is everyone handling the virus and being in quarantine? Have you shared the show with anyone?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLudk3swzoc
Published on April 13, 2020
GOOD VIBES
There's always some good in bad situations. Part V in the series we talk about things that are good about the quarantine and our hopes for hot girl summer. Stephanie in Portland and Nicole in Atlanta sit down and talk about where the world is with the Covid-19 virus. We talk about creative ways to reach out to people and connect in a time of social distancing. How is everyone handling the virus and being in quarantine? Have you shared the show with anyone?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnOxnUmJL7k
Published on April 16, 2020
2020 Woke
What does it mean to be a "woke" person in the year 2020? We spend most of our lives working our jobs and trying to get by that we miss so much. We are sleep to the issues of the world and how trapped we are in a loop so we can ignore them. Stephanie and Nicole discuss the awakening of the masses because of the lack of 40 hour work week. Now that everyone can pay attention to what's going on in the world what will they do with this new knowledge? Do you stay asleep afraid of the change that could set you and others free?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19IcQHyZaoc
Published on June 15, 2020
Protest Gemini
Long time fans of the show should know if you see the word Gemini in the title it's going to be a crazy one. The Gemini Magnet Stephanie of course has another encounter with a Gemini. Who would have guessed it's the original murder she wrote Gemini herself?!? Stephanie recounts seeing Gemini Carmen again while out of quarantine and also seeing all her past hott girl summer flings. Can she be proud of how she handled running into an old hookup? Is running into Gemini Carmen a sign of the times?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smh6x5jq-PE
Published on June 16, 2020
Racist Parents
Growing up a minority in America is hard. A lot of children grow up being prepared for a racist world by racist parents. Racism is such a parasite it is in everyone. Racism isn't just a black and white issue, it’s an issue within each race. Racism is taught and it can be so hidden a person can't recognize it until they have the knowledge of something different. Stephanie and Nicole discuss cultural differences with our parents and the difficulties with mixed-matched morals. Shouldn't you trust the people who you love and you think care about you? Is their judgement always right and best for you? How do you tell them they are wrong and have a conversation?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQttekUA24g
Published on June 17, 2020
All Protest Matter
How are some people allowed to protest with guns and other protests are controlled by Police violence and Police using guns? This episode Stephanie and Nicole talk about the protests going in Atlanta Georgia and Portland Oregon for the Black Lives Matter Movement. We share stories about the protests, police force on people of color, and how racism needs to talked about and people need to wake up and educate themselves. Is it enough to just not be racist? Should you know the history of racism so that you can educate others and know how to combat it when the time comes?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ny_wS-Nw-UA
Published on June 18, 2020
BLM Protest Matter
Racism, protests, looting, brutality, and who knows what's next. Stephanie and Nicole discuss the horror that is 2020 and the treatment of people during peaceful protests. Hear stories from the protests in Atlanta and Portland. Stephanie and Nicole discuss the heated topic of racism is America right now. Views about the Black Lives Matter Movement being the most important news, racism within the community, stories from protests, personal racist encounters, and more come up in this series. As people of color, Stephanie and Nicole offer their unique perceptive on what it means to be experiencing this important moment in our history. How does everyone feel about the protests? What about the police state we call America? Any police sad about the way your profession is treating Black people and everyone in general? Let's peacefully discuss what's going on right now in the comments below?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxsfq-Z3lOE
Published on June 19, 2020
Wuz Up 2020
2020 the Coronavirus, Covid - 19, call it what you want, it's still around and dangerous in the USA. This isn't a normal catching up show. Stephanie and Nicole discuss masks, protests, and what's going on in Atlanta Georgia and in Portland Oregon. Is it easy to get a test in your community? Has the Pandemic changed your job for the worst? Are people being too cautious and this is all a hoax? Let's talk about the worst time in history in the comments below.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asW_WWhcEXA
Published on September 26, 2020
2020 Dating Rules
2020 the Coronavirus, Covid - 19, call it what you want, it's still around and dangerous in the USA. This isn't a normal dating story show. Stephanie and Nicole discuss masks during dates, dating ideas, and the important questions to consider before entering the dating field in 2020. Stephanie shares her concerns with dating during the pandemic and the more serious terms. Do you think it's risky to date while Covid-19 so easy to catch? Can we trust strangers to be honest about how they are preventing coronavirus transmission? Let have a weird sterile discussion about the virus and dating during this Pandemic in the comments below.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clvB1-gIkqo
Published on September 30, 2020
Dating Bipolar
My wife and I worked at the same restaurant for two years before we started dating. Discovering the love of your life right under your nose is one thing but finding out she is bipolar is another. Stephanie and Nicole talk about what it's like to date someone with Bipolar Disorder. I talk about if given the chance again would I continue to date and fall in love with my wife. Would a serious physical or mental disorder change how you feel and your relationship with someone you're dating? Have you ever been in a relationship with someone who had major health obstacle in their life?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wd6U_DJaBgs
Published on October 4, 2020
Fire 2020
2020 is still hitting hard. Stephanie and Nicole talk about the new way society is in 2020. We are catching up on what it's like in the job market in 2020 and the bizarre ways you can get the fire stamp from a job in 2020. Nicole talks about her family in Georgia and what they are going through at work in 2020. We want everyone to remember how important mental help is in 2020. Everyone is struggling 2020 so we need ways to figure how to deal with an increase in major situations.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1dzHdV2rHc
Published on October 11, 2020
Leave 2020
Is the USA a huge conspiracy or is our news media feeding us hoax after hoax? Stephanie and Nicole talk about why California is just a fire zone for the new 5G tower state and other crazy conspiracies that make us want to leave the USA. We discuss the land down under and Canada as the new options to start our all Queer utopia. What kind of crazy conspiracies have you heard? Is it safe to stay in the USA or should all Queer folk leave? If we do leave where would we migrate and start a new society?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CvKKfdiaPJM
Published on October 17, 2020
Help 2020
So many people need help in 2020. The year is still hitting hard. Stephanie and Nicole talk about how things are still changing in 2020. We are shouting out to the people and jobs that have be giving us life and help in 2020. We talk about the future and how covid-19 is going to shape what 2020 and beyond is going to be like for society. We talk about the vaccine and the fight for a breaking point in covid-19 and the struggle in 2020. We talk about the future of 2020 in this show, what are your predictions for the rest of 2020? Will you be getting the vaccine in 2020?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLzCMXaaeJM
Published on October 24, 2020
#lesbian kiss#lesbian love#lesbain dating show#bisexual series#lesbian podcast#bisexual#leznup#lesbian culture#lesbian talk show#Lesbian dating show#gay#leznup talk show#lgbtq#lgbtqia#lgbt web series#coming out story#lgbt culture#lgbt history and culture#queer#lesbian talk#lesbian stories
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207 Discussion Q’s
shout out and thank you to @pynkhues for putting these together even though she wasn’t gonna be here this week
1. What was your favourite scene of the episode? Tell us why!
obvs the dubby but underrated fav is Ruby and Jane in the closet, idk exactly why but I am starved for the families interacting with each other content (screw the timeline, the most unrealistic aspect of this show is that they aren’t constantly in and out of each other’s houses with ben and sara continually being called on to babysit) so this little snippet makes me levitate
2. Was there any scene that missed the mark for you? And if so, how?
the annie and noah scenes for sure. I mostly feel betrayed bc I really liked them the first time I watched (i have a lot of built in affection for sam huntington let me live) and now I’m like BEGONE FOUL BETRAYER and feel pre-emptive fatigue over annie’s taste in men and how that’s not going to get better any time soon
3. I know time does not exist in the Good Girls universe (or in reality anymore), but let’s start with a timeline question! The implication of the opening montage is that a bit of time has past since Beth strongarmed the partnership with Rio at the end of 2.06. How long do you think it’s been? And more importantly, what do you think these early days of their partnership looked like?
I tend to lean towards at least 2 months, maybe more based on:
the number of shoeboxes and how many times Beth’s shown making a closet deposit
how lived in their annoyance over Beth’s dividing her time and Rio pushing back feels
the implication (at least how i read it) that Rio’s annoyance stems from having to track Beth down which presumably implies they’d grumbled their way into a semi-functional working relationship prior (supported by their ease with each other in 208) and if the montage has only been a month, that would be a maximum of 4 meetings and I don’t particularly think that’s enough time for them to get over being extremely prickly with each other
the fact that Beth goes to Rio for help when Jane’s missing (again, to me implies a longer period of time to get over some of their antagonism than a max of 4 meets)
I imagine their initial partnership went something like Beth being a smug brat about forcing her way in, Rio being deliberately unhelpful and trying to force her to admit she’s in over her head (while still keeping enough of an eye on things that his money isn’t jeopardized), Beth stubbornly refusing to and finding ways to rise to the occasion, Rio being grudgingly impressed, Beth being annoyed with herself for how pleased she is over that. Lather, rinse, repeat until they’ve worn a cantankerous but bizarrely comfortable groove into each other.
meanwhile, Mick, Annie and Ruby are absolutely disgusted by everything happening in front of their eyes.
4. The first scene between Ruby and Turner in this episode is a really dynamic one! It’s pretty clear that Ruby’s afraid of Turner, but what do you think Turner thinks of Ruby?
I think he sees a big cartoon canister labeled "Beth Boland Bait"
5. Taking the kids to the drop was a pretty big mistake! What do you think Beth should’ve done in this instance? Do you think saying no again to Rio was an option?
CALLED BEN OR SARA FOR A BABYSITTING ASSIST. For fucks’ sake.
And yeah, I think she could’ve said no to Rio but he would’ve kept her cut of that drop and, even worse, would’ve been able to hold the fact that she didn’t deliver that one time over her head forever more.
6. The krav maga teacher offers some sage advice telling Dean to not order the hit and instead just divorce his wife, haha. Do you think that he thought the baby hitmen would come through for Dean? Or do you think he was deliberately setting Dean up to get robbed?
I choose to believe the krav maga teacher knew exactly what kind of an idiot Dean was and set him up because the dude clearly had at least two brain cells to rub together and anyone with two brain cells to rub together would never get tangled up in a murder plot with Dean standing on the street corner telling random bystanders in detail how he wants to kill the guy that fucked his wife what do you mean established means and motive Boland.
7. During Ben and Annie’s tense conversation, Ben tells Annie that she’s hard to keep track of - she’s parent mom, cool mom, sketchy mom. In a lot of ways, this feels like a parallel to Ruby talking to Beth in the last episode and calling her ‘drug Beth, gun Beth, human trafficking Beth’. What do you make of this? And how do you think it relates to the show’s themes?
I defer to @foxmagpie’s answer because I like it a lot.
8. The scene with the girls in the house! Tell me all your thoughts please!!!
I love this scene a lot
Beth’s channeling Rio in general but also specifically in 201 you will never ever change my mind
Sometimes I lie awake at night wishing Rio had seen it
Prayer circle that he sees a version of it in s4
Can you imagine the nightmare level of boner he would get? The sheer narcissism!!
Ruby’s obvious wish for new friends is The Most Valid
I really love the main drug den guy, I love Blake Shields’s energy, it makes the scene crackle, and I wish they’d bring him back purely bc he’s gr9
9. Annie meets Noah in this episode! What do you think of their introduction to one another? And how would you rate Noah on the scale of ‘Garbage Annie Love Interests’?
at least he’s not her therapist I guess
10. Beth has two pivotal and emotionally revealing fights this episode - one with Dean and the other with Rio. How do these fights compare? And what do you think they tell us about her respective relationship with them?
UUUNNNNNFFFFFFFF
I L O V E how hard the show goes on Dean’s obsession with Beth and Rio as the primary source of his angst
the fact that he’s trying to rope Stan into murder while looking for Jane who isn’t even MISSING but Dean had NO IDEA bc instead of giving a shit he went straight to HOW CAN THIS BE THAT GUY’S FAULT
I love how clearly they delineate that it isn’t about Beth but specifically about someone else ~*~taking~*~ Beth from him and how emasculated that makes him feel (something something something the storyline opens with the krav maga guy choking him out and then telling him to divorce her and Dean being like I reject your rational and logical solution bc it doesn’t punish the man who touched my property, idk i have a half baked thought there but i can’t pull it out of my brain)
and then it’s all underscored how little Dean’s worried about Beth and her safety by him bringing her work up specifically as a gotcha (which, unless I’m forgetting something, is p much the only context Dean ever brings it up in besides maybe the sit down fight but that’s again, about Beth acting out vs genuine concern)
Meanwhile, this is contrasted with:
Beth flipping tf out at the mere suggestion Rio would ever hurt her children, showing how deeply and instinctively she trusts him in regards to her children aka what’s been established as her Most Important Priority over and over (in the same breath that she rips into Dean for losing Jane in the first place)
which is doubled down on her immediately going to Rio for help
and he is FURIOUS at her, but the thing he leans hard on isn’t how she could have jeopardized the business deal (aka his money, what’s been established as his Most Important Priority over and over) but how she jeopardized herself and how badly she can fuck up if she doesn’t take this seriously
putting himself in a vulnerable position (presumably burning a connect, letting on that Beth means something to him beyond business) to look out for Beth’s emotional well-being
And then, just to drive it home a little further, @sothischickshe pointed out the Beth and Rio fight over Beth’s self preservation is directly paralleled with Stan freaking out at Ruby over the IA stuff because he’s worried about her and I had to go and stare at a blank wall for a few minutes to calm down.
anyway, draw your own conclusions.
11. Ruby takes Jane being missing as an opportunity to try and find evidence on Beth for Turner and, in the process, finds Jane too. How do you think this scene captures Ruby’s moral dilemma? And do you think it’s a satisfying turning point in the Ruby-Turner arc?
I struggle a lot with the Turner and Ruby plot specifically because I HATE that Turner’s ruthlessly leaning on Ruby as the weak link but I’m also ferociously attracted to him so I’m less bothered by it than I feel like I should be so mostly I just try not to think about any of it.
Idk, I see it in some ways as a continuation of Ruby’s fight with Beth and Annie in s1 where Annie said she isn’t blood. They put Ruby on the outside but when push comes to shove, Ruby still puts the two of them above her own family. As far as I’m concerned, Annie still owes Ruby a massive apology for that. Beth I let off the hook a little because by the end of the season she’s ready to turn herself in to make it all go away for all of them (I think, unless I’m misremembering, which is entirely possible bc I don’t think I’ve ever rewatched all of 213)
12. RIO GETS BETH THE DUBBY!! That’s it, that’s the question. Please discuss.
I think a lot about how the gesture is so baldly honest neither one of them can face it either at all (Rio) or without taking a shot first (Beth) which, now that I’ve typed it out, is also an interesting flip of their general MO bc under normal circumstances I’d put Rio down as the one that, of the two of them, is more willing to face stuff whereas Beth’s the one that hides from it.
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Dollmaker Talk PT 2
*snaps fingers* Guess what? I got the “okay” sign to talk a little bit more about Runawayoutlaw’s unfinished Dollmaker build.
That means yes I will be going into my thoughts about the characters and setting this time. I focused on Dollmaker being outside the Rockland canon and the game mechanics last time.
(MAJOR spoilers below for the unfinished Dollmaker build)
First of all, what is the plot of Dollmaker? Well the MC this time around is a medical student attending a seminar that day on improving relations between demons and humans for the greater good. One of the very speakers at the lecture is none other than Dr. Sano Kojima. The MC apparently catches his eye and you two seem to get along fairly well considering you admire him for his position (he’s a demon ambassador) and he appreciates that you seem to be specializing in demons for your medical degree. All seems to be going well and you look forward to discussing the profession with him more...only to get caught off guard when he knocks you out and brings you to his home. The atmosphere quickly changes when you wake up and he cuts straight to point that his main goal is turn you into a human doll! He puts a binding spell on you so you can’t escape the house, but he gives you the freedom to walk about as you please.
That’s pretty much the gist of the game. From there it’s about exploration and getting to know the inhabitants of the house, and on rare occasions, seeing some visitors.
Sano Kojima
As I stated in my previous post, both Sano and Akira have been introduced beforehand in BTD. This game was meant to revamp the characters and stories. For the most part, I’d say personality wise that Sano stays very similar to his BTD counterpart. He’s very calm and professional. He’s very much into his research and appreciates compliance from the MC. He can still kill you in this, but the only such ending I found is if you fight back repeatedly right away. Like I said, he prefers compliance. He is probably one of the more sane of the three main house inhabitants and possibly the nicest? It’s hard to say when I feel like both Sano and Annabelle’s routes weren’t quite finished yet. That or I haven’t found everything yet.
I will say compared to the BTD game, Sano here doesn’t show nearly as much sadism or malice. He DOES still want to turn you into a doll though, but again I don’t think his route was fully finished (or I haven’t found the right paths yet). I didn’t get a full ending with him completing the doll transformation, so other than the beginning, we don’t get to delve into that obsession as much as I would have liked. I remember playing BTD and getting that one ending and thinking, “Oh! I love that concept, I wish I could have seem more of the character focused on that.” Dollmaker is obviously supposed to do that, but the creator didn’t get around to the finishing touches. I kept getting stuck in the same loops with “Sano’s route,” so I can’t say much else.
Annabelle Winter
Annabelle is a brand new character. There’s a bio for her luckily in the game to explain some of who she is (a former lead singer), but otherwise I probably was able to get the least information about her in the game. I remember some notes about her one tumblr way back when Dollmaker was being developed. Basically, she’s supposed to be Sano’s “first doll.” You, the MC, would then end up being the second doll. You can tell this really doesn’t sit well with Annabelle, even if I couldn’t get much more information about her feelings in the game. There’s a conversation between Akira and her you can spy on, but you really aren’t quite sure what’s happening. Her room was also always locked for me. I don’t know if the programming for it all hadn’t been completed like Sano’s wasn’t, or I just wasn’t performing the correct actions.
The existence of Annabelle is interesting though because then it does make you ask questions like: What’s her relationship with Sano? Are they lovers or something else? Is she jealous that he’s making a new doll? Does Sano plan to throw Annabelle out after he has you? Does this mean the MC could also get tossed out later? What’s her relationship with Akira? Stuff like that adds more tension to the atmosphere. On the plus side, at least you know Sano’s successfully turned someone into a doll before, so you know the procedure should go fine (yay?). Personality wise, I didn’t have enough to go off of to get a real good idea of what she’s like. She can be a little bitter and creepy, that’s for sure, but also talks sensibly with someone like Akira. It’s hard to say.
Akira Kojima
Ah Akira! Probably the character that was the closest to completion in my opinion. That doesn’t mean his whole path WAS complete, but compared to Sano (one death ending vs. couldn’t progress) and Annabelle (hardly any progression and no ending found), Akira actually had decent introductions, quality time with the MC and an ending. Granted, it was mostly the ONE ending...but I kind of loved it and it wasn’t a death ending at least. Before I get into that, what’s he like in Dollmaker? Well he definitely has more of a domineering and feisty personality I’d say, contrasting nicely with Sano. He also can be both naughty and tender I’d say when it comes to romance. He can be pretty sensitive at times. You also learn he’s a contract killer in this game, but he doesn’t seem to really enjoy the work. That’s the only major hint I’d say of the guy being unhappy. I remember during the development process it was hinted that Akira has a LOT of baggage in this universe. Baggage unfortunately that seems to make unstable enough that he will completely flip his lid if he thinks someone is turning on him. What I’m saying is...the dude actually has a yandere ending XD I’m not joking. For those who know of my main blog and are probably thinking, “Did YOU enjoy that?” the answer is obviously HECK YES! See what happens is if you get too cozy with Akira, apparently that makes him latch onto you.
I swear to god when I played my first run, I was NOT trying to make him jealous. I thought there was more to do so I didn’t think it was a big deal if I didn’t wake him in bed (it seemed rude to me), go to the kitchen and compliment Sano’s eye. But those Telltale mechanics from the last post I talked about? This is where I realized too late they were hinting that Akira gets VERY aware of what you do in the house once he starts to like you. He doesn’t like it AT ALL if you either seem like you’re trying to leave or get friendly with anyone else then. He goes full “snap.” What he does is try to “train you” so that you agree the MC belongs to him and him alone then. I love how he does it actually because I find it pretty realistic. Yeah he gets really rough with you initially once he’s snapped, but the big thing is he throws you into a large closet. He just leaves you with a bucket and nothing else. And then he makes NO CONTACT with you. You go through...who knows how many days with occasional bottles of water or food placed on the floor without Akira talking to you or even you seeing him. Depending on your actions, sometimes he’ll pop in to check on you, but if you show that your spirit isn’t broken yet, he goes back to the no contact. He’s essentially driving the MC insane through isolation. It’s very simple but incredibly effective. Imagine literally being given nothing to do for days on end with limited food and water and just a bucket to relieve yourself in. It can start to wear on you. Humans are social creatures too (we NEED other people). I love MC’s with stronger spirits actually that don’t bend to a yandere’s whims all that easily. So yeah, I kept the MC yelling and tried to just hold out as long as I could. This puts you in a loop though and Outlaw did a nice little touch where there’s this static effect over the screen when you continue to make decisions. This helps to emphasize how monotonous this routine is becoming for the MC and you really feel less of the urge to fight back anymore. I can see why the MC broke in the end. Once they are broken, Akira comes to collect you and that’s pretty much the end.
Obviously I loved playing through Akira’s path the most. I will do one small critique here since...I’m kind of a nut about yanderes. I think it would have been nice to have a FEW more hints before Akira’s “snap” that he suffers from something like anxiety or separation over losing people. There might have been some and I just got lost in the build maze finding this information XD Like I said, I knew he had baggage (and even lost a lover) from the creator’s tumblr page during development, but I think it would have been nice to have some hints like that in the game. Just food for thought in case they want to try another yandere character in the future. Some people don’t like if you pull a “yandere snap” out of nowhere without at least dropping some kind of hint of instability with the character prior. I mean I’ll always enjoy yandere endings regardless honestly XD It depends on how serious you want to take it though. This situation was different than say Marcus from Till Death Do Us Part only because....that game basically is ALL about the “snap” there (no real progression to it like in Dollmaker). You had just enough backstory (The MC and Marcus are divorced and Marcus gives you nightmares) that him coming back as the ex from hell isn’t surprising. People can fill in the blanks and fantasize all they want there about what went wrong with the relationship beforehand. With Akira, you’re seeing the relationship progression play out, so there’s a little more pressure to make the “snap” a little more believable.
I don’t know how fair it is to critique an] game that’s clearly not finished though 0.o
There’s was other stuff in the game I enjoyed like all the little Easter eggs with the plants and paintings, and Cain even popped up briefly in a bad end :P There was other stuff I also didn’t learn about though like Mio (sorry I scared you lol), but it is what it is.
Still a nice treat.
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TerraMythos' 2020 Reading Challenge - Book 22 of 26
Title: House of Leaves (2000)
Author: Mark Z. Danielewski
Genre/Tags: Horror, Fiction, Metafiction, Weird, First-Person, Third-Person, Unreliable Narrator
Rating: 6/10
Date Began: 7/28/2020
Date Finished: 8/09/2020
House of Leaves follows two narrative threads. One is the story of Johnny Truant, a burnout in his mid-twenties who finds a giant manuscript written by a deceased, blind hermit named Zampanò. The second is said manuscript -- The Navidson Record -- a pseudo-academic analysis of a found-footage horror film that doesn’t seem to exist. In it, Pulitzer Prize-winning photojournalist Will Navidson moves into a suburban home in Virginia with his partner Karen and their two children. Navidson soon makes the uncomfortable discovery that his new house is bigger on the inside than it is on the outside. Over time he discovers more oddities -- a closet that wasn’t there before, and eventually a door that leads into an impossibly vast, dark series of rooms and hallways.
While Johnny grows more obsessed with the work, his life begins to take a turn for the worse, as told in the footnotes of The Navidson Record. At the same time, the mysteries of the impossible, sinister house on Ash Tree Lane continue to deepen.
To get a better idea try this: focus on these words, and whatever you do don’t let your eyes wander past the perimeter of this page. Now imagine just beyond your peripheral vision, maybe behind you, maybe to the side of you, maybe even in front of you, but right where you can’t see it, something is quietly closing in on you, so quiet in fact you can only hear it as silence. Find those pockets without sound. That’s where it is. Right at this moment. But don’t look. Keep your eyes here. Now take a deep breath. Go ahead and take an even deeper one. Only this time as you start to exhale try to imagine how fast it will happen, how hard it’s gonna hit you, how many times it will stab your jugular with its teeth or are they nails? don’t worry, that particular detail doesn’t matter, because before you have time to even process that you should be moving, you should be running, you should at the very least be flinging up your arms--you sure as hell should be getting rid of this book-- you won’t have time to even scream.
Don’t look.
I didn’t.
Of course I looked.
Some story spoilers under the cut.
Whoo boy do I feel torn on this one. House of Leaves contains some really intriguing ideas, and when it’s done right, it’s some of the best stuff out there. Unfortunately, there are also several questionable choices and narrative decisions that, for me, tarnish the overall experience. It’s certainly an interesting read, even if the whole is ultimately less than the sum of its parts.
First of all, I can see why people don’t like this book, or give up on it early (for me this was attempt number three). Despite an interesting concept and framing device, the first third or so of the book is pretty boring. Johnny is just not an interesting character. He does a lot of drugs and has a lot of (pretty unpleasant) sex and... that’s pretty much it, at least at the beginning. There’s occasional horror sections that are more interesting, where Johnny’s convinced he’s being hunted by something, but they’re few and far between. Meanwhile, the story in The Navidson Record seems content to focus on the relationship issues between two affluent suburbanites rather than the much more interesting, physically impossible house they live in. The early “exploration” sections are a little bit better, but overall I feel the opening act neglects the interesting premise.
However, unlike many, I love the gimmick. The academic presentation of the Navidson story is replete with extensive (fake) footnotes,and there’s tons of self-indulgent rambling in both stories. I personally find it hilarious; it’s an intentionally dense parody of modern academic writing. Readers will note early that the typographical format is nonstandard, with the multiple concurrent stories denoted by different typefaces, certain words in color, footnotes within footnotes, etc. House of Leaves eventually goes off the chain with this concept, gracing us with pages that look like (minor spoilers) this or this. This leads into the best part of this book, namely...
Its visual presentation! House of Leaves excels in conveying story and feeling through formatting decisions. The first picture I linked is one of many like it in a chapter about labyrinths. And reading it feels like navigating a labyrinth! It features a key “story”, but also daunting, multi-page lists of irrelevant names, buildings, architectural terms, etc. There are footnotes that don’t exist, then footnote citations that don’t seem to exist until one finds them later in the chapter. All this while physically turning the book or even grabbing a mirror to read certain passages. In short, it feels like navigating the twists, turns, and dead ends of a labyrinth. And that’s just one example -- other chapters utilize placement of the text to show where a character is in relation to others, what kind of things are happening around them, and so on. One chapter near the end features a square of text that gets progressively smaller as one turns the pages, which mirrors the claustrophobic feel of the narrative events. This is the coolest shit to me; I adore when a work utilizes its format to convey certain story elements. I usually see this in poetry and video games, but this is the first time I’ve seen it done so well in long-form fiction. City of Saints and Madmen and Shriek: An Afterword by Jeff VanderMeer, both of which I reviewed earlier this year, do something similar, and are clearly inspired by House of Leaves in more ways than one.
And yes, the story does get a little better, though it never wows me. The central horror story is not overtly scary, but eeriness suffices, and I have a soft spot for architectural horror. Even Johnny and the Navidsons become more interesting characters over time. For example, I find Karen pretty annoying and generic for most of the book, but her development in later chapters makes her much more interesting. While I question the practical need for Johnny’s frame story, it does become more engaging as he descends into paranoia and madness.
So why the relatively low rating? Well... as I alluded to earlier, there’s some questionable stuff in House of Leaves that leaves (...hah?) a bad taste in my mouth. The first is a heavy focus on sexual violence against women. I did some extensive thinking on this throughout my read, but I just cannot find a valid reason for it. The subject feels thrown in for pure shock value, and especially from a male author, it seems tacky and voyeuristic. If it came up once or twice I’d probably be able to stomach this more easily, but it’s persistent throughout the story, and doesn’t contribute anything to the plot or horror (not that that would really make it better). I’m not saying books can’t have that content, but it’s just not explored in any meaningful way, and it feels cheap and shitty to throw it in something that traumatizing just to shock the audience. It’s like a bad jump scare but worse on every level. There’s even a part near the end written in code, which I took the time to decode, only to discover it’s yet another example of this. Like, really, dude?
Second, this book’s portrayal of mental illness is not great. (major spoilers for Johnny’s arc.) One of the main things about Johnny’s story is he’s an unreliable narrator. From the outset, Johnny has occasional passages that can either be interpreted as genuine horror, or delusional breaks from reality. Reality vs unreality is a core theme throughout both stories. Is The Navidson Record real despite all evidence to the contrary? Is it real as in “is the film an actual thing” or “the events of the film are an actual thing”? and so on and so forth. Johnny’s sections mirror this; he’ll describe certain events, then later state they didn’t happen, contradict himself, or even describe a traumatic event through a made-up story. Eventually, the reader figures out parts of Johnny’s actual backstory, namely that when he was a small child, his mother was institutionalized for violent schizophrenia. Perhaps you can see where this is going...
Schizophrenia-as-horror is ridiculously overdone. But it also demonizes mental illness, and schizophrenia in particular, in a way that is actively harmful. Don’t misunderstand me, horror can be a great way to explore mental illness, but when it’s done wrong? Woof. Unfortunately House of Leaves doesn’t do it justice. While it avoids some cliches, it equates the horror elements of Johnny’s story to the emergence of his latent schizophrenia. This isn’t outwardly stated, and there are multiple interpretations of most of the story, but in lieu of solid and provable horror, it’s the most reasonable and consistent explanation. There’s also an emphasis on violent outbursts related to schizophrenia, which just isn’t an accurate portrayal of the condition.
To Danielewski’s credit, it’s not entirely black and white. We do see how Johnny’s descent into paranoia negatively affects his life and interpersonal relationships. There’s a bonus section where we see all the letters Johnny’s mother wrote him while in the mental hospital, and we can see her love and compassion for him in parallel to the mental illness. But the experimental typographical style returns here to depict just how “scary” schizophrenia is, and that comes off as tacky to me. I think this is probably an example of a piece of media not aging well (after all, this book just turned 20), and there’s been a definite move away from this kind of thing in horror, but that doesn’t change the impression it leaves. For a book as supposedly original/groundbreaking as this, defaulting to standard bad horror tropes is disappointing. And using “it was schizophrenia all along” to explain the horror elements in Johnny’s story feels like a cop-out. I wish there was more mystery here, or alternate interpretations that actually make sense.
Overall The Navidson Record part of the story feels more satisfying. I actually like that there isn’t a direct explanation for everything that happens. It feels like a more genuine horror story, regardless of whether you interpret it as a work of fiction within the story or not. There’s evidence for both. Part of me wishes the book had ended when this story ends (it doesn’t), or that the framing device with Johnny was absent, or something along those lines. Oh well-- this is the story we got, for better or worse.
I don’t regret reading House of Leaves, and it’s certainly impressive for a debut novel. If you’re looking for a horror-flavored work of metafiction, it’s a valid place to start. I think the experimental style is a genuine treat to read, and perhaps the negative aspects won’t hit you as hard as they did to me. But I can definitely see why this book is controversial.
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If it isn’t too much to ask, can I request how Yandere Dabi, Shigaraki, Kaminari, villain Deku, and Shinsou would react to a darling who comes from an abuse situation?
Fuck I love these. I had to quickly make an outline questions but okay!
Dabi
- Dabi knew you were abused before he stole you away. He knew exactly how he would hurt them. He also knew you'd probably need some convincing, not everyone is willing to run from their abusers for whatever reason. Oh but he would have you and he would make sure you'd never have to deal with this ever again. Even if he has to reevaluate how to keep you in line–even if you'd fall submissive by default.
- He is both sensitive and manipulative of it, even using his own former abuse situation to keep you in line. It's always along the lines "You don't think I understand?" and follows something his father did. He likes bringing your past up right before he switches up and says "So of course I get you're sooo confused right now." He is going to touch those topics all just to bring it back to one thing, his sensitivity to your situation. While he may get loud, he'll suddenly get softer and say "So, you need to follow what I say, I can help you." After all, shouldn't a lover help their s/o after they experience trauma?
- When he went to get you, he basically tied you and your whole family up. You alone were not in a chair around the table. He had a few choice words to say to your family as they screamed and begged to be let go. Many throwing you under the bus but that's exactly why they're in this mess, aren't they? You were so scared, you didn't know what he meant by "You'll love the bond fire" until he carried you outside and burnt your home to the ground. Your family screamed but all you could do was watch or turn your face away from the flames.
- The main differences between an abused Darling and a normal darling is very much just how he keeps you in line–if he needs to at all. He won't physically hurt you because he knows that would make him hypocritical. He does, however, still uses your past–your biggest insecurity about you–to his advantage. This includes any sexual interaction if you weren’t abused sexually–if you were, he’s very adamant on making you feel safe and has probably asked if anything in particular would remind you too much of the abuse–specifically kinks.
- Dabi is one of those who can get their darling to submit fairly quickly. It seems like they resign to it at first and maybe the love does but once you’re there for more than three months, you start to appreciate the actual change. No pain, just pleasure. He isn’t there? No need to fret, you just stay in your room by the closet. You want affection? All you gotta do is walk up to him. He very much just drowns you in all these ways of affection and false security that you have no clue how dangerous your situation is. You don’t care anymore, though, do you? You’re safe with your capturer and protector, after all.
Tomura Shigaraki
- Tomura knew you were abused before he kidnapped you. You see, while you caught his interest, he also saw signs that most wouldn't pick up on. Coming from an abusive home himself before AFO found him, he knew when a smile was faked or if a gleam in one's eye wasn't quite right. After all, he had such a look within himself once upon a time. He looks into your home life and find your situation quite...obscene. So of course he had to take you away! You're his, it's only natural for him to take away all the pain.
- Tomura isn't as physical as he would've been. Will he still force himself on you? Yep. Will he degrade you? Not in the same way. Doesn't he manipulate you? Fucking hell. He loves bringing up that he's the reason you're no longer with your abusers. He'll sugarcoat his treatment by saying at least he loves you. At least he's not leaving horrible burns, cuts and unsavory marks. At least his marks are made through love making. He loves manipulating your feelings to make you compliant. Ohhh and there are more sweet moments! Did you have nightmares surrounding them? Don't worry, he'll comfort you. Panic Attack? He's with you all the way!
- He killed them once you were safely in his room. He records the whole thing! He wanted you to see their torture like they had tortured you! Honestly, deep down in your sweet heart... you enjoyed it.
- The main differences between abused victim darling vs normal darling is that Tomura is more sympathetic than cruel. He treats more like a pet in the beginning instead of a trophy. He's far more protective of you. He takes more into consideration. You're still his player 2 no matter what though. In fact, you're far easier to sway as an abuse victim.
- When it come to Tomura, it's a mix of resignation and worship. You've become compliant but at the same time you have the need to worship him. Tomura admits it might have something to do with his manipulation tactics but at this point he doesn't care. You're player 2 and only his player 2. Only you get his affections. Worship was indeed a form of affection so Tomura never tried fixing it. Over all, you become a sweet darling that he adores and while sensitive to his darker desires, still takes his Sadistic tendencies in bed. You still are who? His player 2.
Denki Kaminari
- He had not known you were from an abuse situation when you were caught in his grasp. Your family seemed really nice and he had no idea. He should've seen the signs, but he only recognized it after you clutched your head as he yelled at you. He wasn't 100% sure though so he asked you. This would've happened before he had the chance to show his more aggressive side, only starting. He would be offput by your reaction to his yelling. Instantly covering your head? Flinching away? He's gonna calm down but it'll be creepy... firstly, he's gonna get you to trust him not to hurt you and get you to admit it. Whatever he was mad about, he'll set it aside for now while he holds you.
- Since he wants you to stay with him and he learns about the abuse, he openly avoids hurting. This is good for you but not those around you. He will hurt more people so his anger isn't put out on you. Have you accidentally walked in on it? Yeah. Does he appear scary? Fuck yeah. Your instincts tell you you're gonna get hurt but don't worry... his anger only goes towards the victim. He just gets really creepy. If he's done, he simply calms you and makes you help him remove the body. If he isn't done, he will make you watch. Again, he'll make you help dispose of the body with him. Next thing you know he's praising you for helping him. (Why am I getting Heathers vibes?)
- Denki will seem like he's being sweet and inviting your family over. You will be completely informed because you should want them to pay, right? Once they're trapped with no hope of escape or ability to receive help, he'll ask who hurt you the worst. He'll make you tell him how they hurt you, mainly the worst way. He will punish all of them based on how bad their abuse was before snatching their life from them through high voltage.
- As I've put in the original Headcanons for Denki, you were abused and oversexualized by Denki but seeing as you already were a victim of abuse, Denki won't be inclined to hurt you. What would've been pain becomes death. What would've been sexualized becomes quality time by helping him clean up. Of course he'd still do such things but it's far more sweet. That's the main difference between you being from an abuse situation vs not.
- You would believe him to be your savior and worship him in your own timid way. In some ways it's soothing him after missions or classes, in others pleasing him in more adult activities–although he overall has to guide you.
Villain Deku
- Deku knew you were abused after following you. He couldn't stand you hurt but at the beginning he wasn't who he was now. As time kept going, he evidently became a Villain. He was far more willing to take you. He was far more willing to end your suffering and take you away where only he could reach you. That he did.
- Deku does use your trauma to his advantage. Your trauma makes you far more willing to follow his rules. To obey. He decides to treat you probably the kinkiest way to be honest. He basically forced you into a DDLG relationship but to be honest...you didn't really fight or go against it. Perhaps you liked being small? Perhaps it was enticing to you compared to what you've known as 'family'. Either way, it hard for anyone at first to think he forced this on you by how you act.
- The day he kidnapped you, he killed them. It was all so traumatic. Imagine doing what your told, perhaps a chore or something, and suddenly you hear mom or dad scream. You run to hide and next thing you hear is literally more screaming until you're the only one left. He finds you hiding. All you hear is someone singing "and I...can't...help...falling... in love... with..." and you're pulled out of your hiding place as he says "...you." You don't see the bodies but your can smell their blood as it hangs thickly in the air.
- The main differences between a normal darling and an abuse victim Darling is how he treats you obviously. As where he only occasionally uses DDLG related thing with a normal darling, that's the basis of his relationship with the abused darling. He may even give you excuses unlike a normal darling. You tried running? It okay! This does seem too good to be true! You're still getting a punishment even when he gives you excuses but unlike the brutality with a normal darling, it's usually spankings or maybe sitting you through a movie genre you absolutely despise. You hate horror? You're watching a random horror movie he has! You don't like comedy? Let's look for the cringiest comedy! There's far more less violent stuff he uses as punishment. Also, his sexual activity is a up a notch compared to a normal darling. He can't help it! He has to spread his affection to you!
- Once you accept this life, you aren't exactly praising or resigning to your life. No no you've been completely brainwashed into it! Could anyone blame you for it? Someone comes along, while scary at first, takes you from all your pain and fear and brings you into a world of love and shelter from the cruelty of the world you're too familiar with. How could anyone not want to go along? It's not resigning if you crave it, right? Yet you aren't praising him or seeing him as a savior. No, you don't think he's god! An abused darling of Villain Deku would see herself as his equal even if their relationship doesn't suggest it as such. Deku wouldn't mind that either, as it's not like anyone will find you!
Hitoshi Shinsou
- Shinsou had no idea you were abused until after you started dating. You had refused to wear your swimsuit without a shirt over top it and then refused to go in the water… Shinsou used his quirk on you and because the shirt was white and cotton, he saw your bruises along your stomach and some on your back. His reaction? Commands you to tell him how you got them and while you fought in your consciousness, you told him what your family does. He is furious with them and mentally vows to make sure you’re not in that situation for much longer.
- Shinsou isn’t physically abusive tbh. He will, however, be more aware of your feelings and will question the length of your abuse. It’s sexual? He will keep things like that on the down low. Any verbal abuse? He’ll watch his word choice, will try using less cuss words for your sanity. He will make the top priority to make you feel loved and safe.
- Their destruction happens in steps. Your family doesn’t deserve mercy, right? He’ll first break any means of connections they have to the world one by one. He’ll make them humiliate themselves and hurt others. He’ll force them to hurt themselves. Then, when all is said and done, he’ll make them all go to their own suicide. All high buildings. All of them will jump.
- The main differences between an abused darling and a normal darling is comes from the abuse itself. Shinsou in either relationships would never physically harm his darling; however, he won’t blackmail this darling but instead entice them with his vengeful solution. They’re very submissive because of their trauma and would do anything to get out, therefore blackmail wouldn’t be necessary. Another difference is his delicacy with your emotions.
- At the most intimate height of this relationship, you definitely would be a little on the worship side. Shinsou doesn’t ask for it nor does he stop it. He does not see it necessary either but he does enjoy it. He makes you feel safe and like nothing can hurt you. He does have to coax you into some activities (normally of the sexual variety) but in the end it’s not as bad. He still controls you and people have tried separating you two but…they always end up dead. And you always end up in shinsou’s arms, listening to him. Even if you begged him to not kill some victims.
#yandere#yandere headcanons#yandere x reader#yandere bnha#yandere bnha x reader#yandere boku no hero academia#yandere mha#bnha#mha#yandere imagines#abuse#bnha shinsou#shinsou hitoshi#yandere shinso#yandere villains#yandere villain deku#yandere villain#villain izuku#yandere shigararaki x reader#yandere tomura shigaraki#yandere tomura x reader#tomura shigaraki#yandere denki x reader#bnha denki#yandere kaminari#yandere dabi bnha#yandere dabi x reader#dabi x reader
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💘bangtan as boyfriends: hobi💘
- you had the typical image of him when you first met, he was more j-hope than jung hoseok to you
-he was obviously friendly but you knew deep-down that he was still kinda wary of you, so you tried to get to know jung hoseok a bit better
-which he noticed and appreciated deeply bc I think of all the members, hobi is actually the one who's very closed off to others
-you think you know him but it turns out there's a complete different side to him
-and trying to get behind that wall was the sign that he needed to know that he could trust you
-and after that, you became a focal point of his life tbh, you two share an extremely deep bond with each other and he trusts you so much, the only time he ever questioned it was when you pranked him with a pennywise mask on and he had the closest thing to a heart attack
-you're lovers and best friends who support each other wherever and whenever they can
-lots and looots of inside jokes
-you never ever stress him bc of his schedule which he's very thankful for but also apologetic bc there are times where you can't even meet
-loves laying his head on your lap and you playing with his hair, scratch his head a lil and he'll moan , that's how much he likes you touching him 😏
- you two are very sensual and touchy with each other but definitely when it's only you two, which u don't really mind
-you're like his not-so-secret hideaway from everyone and everything
-and you guys could talk about everythinggg, you honestly never run out of topics, that's another reason why he adores you so much, bc you're also stimulating him mentally
- watching him dance is an out of body experience tbh, you died when he finally gave in to your wish and danced to boy meets evil (for ur eyes only)
hobi: -does THE flip-
you: -screams-
hobi: 👀?
you: 👀👀👀❣❣❣
hobi: 🏃♂️💨💨💨
- from 0 - 100 very fast, both of you
- he teases you a lot and could probably charm your pants off within 2 mins
-your personal hypeman at whatever you do, your sunshine & shoulder to cry to cry on whenever u need to
-melts when u play with old man mickey
-will dance with you spontaneously, it can happen everywhere tbh, mostly twirls you around when he's at ur place, once slow-danced with you while you were waiting for the kettle to boil your water
-you're the biggest hope world enthusiast on earth and whenever you start singing/rapping to it, his heart swells so much he feels like he's gonna burst
-also, he gets shy when u praise him 😭😭 and it's the most precious thing bc he shows you new moves or a new track he's working on and asks u for ur opinion and goes "i mean it's not finished and I still gotta work a lot on it and that's why it's still kinda meh" and ur like "I have no idea what you're talking about", him: 🥺🥺???, you: "this is amazingggg hobi~~" and he's like "noooo stop it" but has the BIGGEST smile on his face
and you proceed to kiss his blushed cheeks and hobi.exe shuts down entirely
- your happiness is his upmost priority and makes sure you always leave with a smile on your face
-which is was not possible when he left for tour the first time in your relationship
-you couldn't hide the fact that you were sad bc you obviously would be apart for so long, as much as you tried, you couldn't hide it from him, you shot him a smile when he was about to leave but he turned around one last time to make sure you're ok and he saw you wiping away a tear and he froze on the spot
-namjoon and jin had to drag him along bc they knew he would've ran back to you in a heartbeat and it would be yoongi's baseball bat vs dispatch cameras
- hobi was so upset about it he didn't spoke to anyone for 4 hours during the flight and spammed you with messages when they arrived
-you video-chatted when he arrived at the hotel, you were sleepy af bc it was the middle of the night and he was jet lagged af but even these 15 minutes of seeing your face on his screen and listening to your reassuring words were enough for him to feel better
- believe it or not, he's still emo about it
- "remember when u left me behind for the first time"- "y/n do you want me to cry" - jimin: "are your tear ducts even able to do that anymore"
- anyway, the guys know that hobi has a total soft spot for you and they use it for their advantage sometimes
- bts during dance practice
hobi: ba-bA-ba-Ba-BAA- bAa (demonstrates the moves along)
the guys, on the floor: uh-huh
hobi: c'mon it's not that difficult
jin: i didn't cherish the small things in life
jk: like what?
jin: like feeling my toes... or legs in general. good times.
(hobi continues ba-ba-ba-ing, stamina didn't waver 1 bit)
-you received two messages by yoongi that day, 1 was his location (bighit), the other was a file and you were like "huh, weird" and you opened it and laughed your ass off bc "save_me.mp4"
- you visited dance practice after and knew what all the misery was, but anyway hobi ran over to you as soon as he saw you and the guys finally took a long break and recharged while hobi and you ate some snacks and cuddled
-you glanced at yoongi when u proposed taking a break to hobi , yoongi and you had a mental conversation this second which went along these lines
-anyway, hobi and you have karaoke dates quite often and go for walks a lot. he takes you to his favourite spots in the city, most of ur dates are pretty spontaneous tbh... he always looks forward to make new experiences with you, that's why u guys travel a lot together
-buys small pieces of accessories in each country you visit, in pairs, bc he wears them too or pins some of them to his bags and creates some sort of couple item, bc you pin some on your jackets
-btw u raid his closet quite often bc let's be honest here, jung hoseok, dance god and fashion icon.... you take what u can get lmao
-but you also have chill nights at home, where he plays some nice tunes and you just relax together
-very charming and sweet and always has ur back
-holds your hands like they're the most precious things on earth
-give him his independence when he needs it and all the love at any other given time and you'll probably gonna get married tbh bc he wouldn't mind slow-dancing with you even in 50 years
#bts fluff#bts fic#bts fanfic#bts imagines#bts headcanons#bts scenarios#bts jhope#bts hobi#bts#bangtan#bts x you#bts x reader#bangtan x you#bangtan x reader#bangtan fluff#jhope fluff#jhope fanfic#jhope imagines#jhope scenario#hobi x you#hobi x reader#hobi scenario#hobi fluff#jung hoseok#bts as boyfriends#mine
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My Ryden Recs
not in any particular order
The Heart Rate of a Mouse Series (11/10)
~513k words
Ryan "Heterosexual" Ross and his incredibly popular prog rock band, The Followers, start their summer tour for their new hit album "Boneless" in June of 1974. However, Ryan begins to take a shine to their new roadie, the ever mysterious Brendon No-Last-Name-Given, who dodges questions about his past and flaunts his flamboyant homosexuality. After an assault by a member of the supporting act, Brendon and Ryan get their payback, and begin to bond. But much to Ryan's confusion and alarm, he starts to want something he can't let himself have, starts to feel something he can't let himself feel.
--Okay I kinda lied. This list is in no particular order EXCEPT for this one. This one is the best. Anna Green owns my ass. I'm not someone who's picky about first vs third person, but if you are, then just this once throw that out the window and read this utter masterpiece. Ryan's character development throughout is so touching, but my god he fucks up a lot. One of my friends who has gone through the process of buying the physical copies and annotating them says that Ryan majorly fucks up over 50 times. Emotional rollercoaster straight ahead!--
Freaks (7/10)
~45k words
Ryan's face was permanently disfigured when he was 12 years old, and since then, the only person who has ever stood by his side is his best friend Spencer. After earning the nickname "Freak" in high school, he finally accepts that nobody will ever want him, or ever treat him normally again. But after an accident that lands him temporarily in the hospital, he meets Brendon. They get along great, and Ryan begins to fall in love. One small problem though:
Brendon had been recently blinded. Neither of them know if it's permanent, and Ryan is sure that if Brendon knew about his face, he would leave him forever.
--I really liked this one. It makes you sit on edge and every single time you think that Ryan will finally confess and tell the truth, he blue balls you like an asshole. This story is so sad and so sweet, I definitely recommend. Also, there's some background Joncer, which is really cute. Definitely a worthy read if you're looking for some angsty fluff. Oh, and a little aside: the author, spazzyskittles on LJ, actually beta-ed a lot of Anna Green's Ryden fics, including THROAM! So do with that what you will ;)--
The Red Eyed Owl Series (10/10)
~403k words
As one of the best players of one of the best National Hockey League teams, the Chicago Hounds, Ryan Ross has everything he could ever want. Young, famous, and free to do whatever he damn well pleases, the world either wants him or wants to be him. But after a leg injury that could potentially ruin his career, Ryan begins to realise that perhaps he doesn't have everything. Perhaps some things can mean so much more than women throwing themselves at you every chance they get and receiving bottomless drinks at sports bars. Perhaps he could fall in love.
--This was actually recommended to me by @wandering-verses and it was 100% worth the read. I broke out crying in the middle of class during the second book, and I cried again at 3 am when I stayed up all night to finish it. It's one of those that fucks you up so bad that you can't read anything else for a little while after finishing. Now, both the authors are from Spain, so English isn't their native tongue, but it's so well written that I probably wouldn't have noticed if I hadn't read the notes at the very beginning. An all time Ryden fave.--
Missing In Action (10/10)
~204k words
In where the American Civil War goes differently, the nation once known as the United States of America is instead separated into two: DURA and Beauregia. The latter didn't change much in terms of their economy. Slavery is still legal, and the kingdom is ruled under a tight, Christian monarchy. Their king is Boyd Beauregard. His only son, crown Prince Brendon Beauregard, heir to the throne, resides in the highly respected Saint Francis' Academy. DURA on the other hand developed quickly, a democracy founded on new technology and equitable ideals.
Everyday, bipartisanship seems farther away from grasp, and DURA, realising that cooperation is impossible, creates the DURA investigative bureau. Identifying the crown prince as the Royal Family's weakest link, they realise that he could become an infinitely invaluable asset to them. Agent Ross, under the pseudonym "Ryan Hastings", is chosen to go undercover, enroll in Saint Francis' boarding school, infiltrate the Prince's friend group, and gain his trust by any means necessary.
--I'm ashamed to admit that I let this one pass me by for a while. I read the words "American Civil War" and I automatically assumed that this would be a mid 1800's Civil War fic about closeted gay soilders, and I'm not against that, but the premise didn't really interest me. But once I finally caved and started reading, I quickly realised not only was the premise entirely different, but it was really fuckin' good. Read this!!!!--
Esoteric Contagion (8/10)
~18k words
He wakes up with a note stuck to his forehead that reads, “You traded your memory in a spell. It was worth it.” The note is signed George Ross. He wonders if that’s his name.
In which things are lost and gained and remembered and forgotten, in that order.
--Despite being the shortest on this list, I loved it to death. You will cry so hard, I promise. This story is so sad. The author can deal so many shocking blows in less than 20,000 words, and you will be completely invested. I don't want to spoil anything, but it's massively underrated, and it will fuck you up.--
Two Vatos Locos Series (7/10)
~311k words
When you have your first dream with your soulmate, everything changes. But after years and years of watching all his friends have their dreams and fall in love, Ryan started to wonder if he would ever has his dream. At twenty, Ryan started to get desperate. He went to doctors, therapists, even a fucking palm reader. No one could tell him what was wrong with him. There was only one explanation: his soulmate had to be dead.
Ryan spent endless hours laying in bed, staring at the ceiling, begging, wishing, praying to have his dream and meet his soulmate. One day, with blood gushing down his face and vomit coating his tongue, his prayers were finally answered.
And now, as he stares at this scared, helpless boy, with bloodied rope burns around his wrists and tears staining his cheeks, he wishes that they never were.
--The title "Dos Vatos Locos Lleno de Carnalismo y Inamorates" roughly translates to "Two Crazy Dudes Full of Carnality and Infatuation," which is definitely accurate. I did enjoy this fic; it was cute, sad, and very interesting, but if you are interested in reading, you will need to be patient at times. Some passages seem like filler and the writing in a few places is kinda dry or cringey. But it's still overall a good story though. WARNING: Brendon is underage for most of this fic, but nothing sexual happens until he is of age.--
The Way Home From Nowhere Series (9/10)
~158k words
After his parents find out about his relationship with another boy, Brendon Urie makes a snap decision to flee from his abusive home. After a quick makeover to hide his identity, he decides to thumb a ride. He starts living the life he never even dreamed he could. Talking openly about things like sex, condoms, and homosexuality- he's happier then he's ever been.
There's one problem though.
His new roommates, Ryan and Spencer, have no idea that he is the missing Mormon boy from the nearby town of Summerlin.
--Ladies and gents, welcome to my first ever Ryden fic! This will always be a favourite of mine. Both Brendon's arc and Ryan's are are so heartbreaking, and there were so many times that I wanted to reach into the story and give Dallon a hug. So many tragedies in this story, and not all of them solved. I don't have any empathy for Brendon's parents in this story, but I feel so hard for his siblings, and for Marc. I just wish they knew. This story is so heartbreaking and yet so happy. Will play with your emotions like they're a shiny new toy.--
Filthy Lucre (10/10)
~362k words
Ryan Ross is living the American wet dream. He’s rich, he’s good looking, he gets paid just to turn up at parties and he spends his days drinking, doing drugs and climbing into bed with eager and willing boys and girls. His parents and PA beg him to quit, and his brother turns up his noise at his destructive lifestyle, but Ryan is desperate to sink into the void, escape the memories of what his father's friend did to him when he was fifteen.
Brendon Urie is a man bordering on desperation. He whores himself out to millionaire bankers and CEOs to fund his boyfriend's heroin addiction and pay off his ungrateful father's medical bills. Things could be worse, though. He's lucky enough to have a roof over his head, to be living with the love of his life, to no longer have to hook on the street, but instead be privileged enough to turn tricks in the wealthy circles of Wall Street and Goldman Sachs.
Where a broken boy meets another broken boy, and falls in love.
--Normally, I would never recommend an unfinished fic, let alone fic that hasn't been updated in four years, unless it was it was so good and so engaging that it made me literally scream. Trust me when I say that you have not experienced true hatred until you read this fic. I have literally never hated a character more in my entire life, and I know who Dolores Umbridge is, for reference. The best thing about this fic, in my opinion, is that the characters, whether good guys or bad guys, do evil. And they do it on purpose. Because the characters feel and act as though they're real, and real people fucking suck.--
The Black Rose Season (8/10)
~158k words
Ryan Ross' life is essentially over when his scholarship is inexplicably cancelled and he will be forced to pay his way through school. As a young, broke college student, Ryan is desperate to find cash fast, but to no avail. Just when he thinks all hope is lost, a mysterious benefactor promises to pay his tuition in full, on one condition: Ryan is infiltrate Sigma Chi Beta, the most prestigious and cultish fraternity that Swan University has to offer. And if, by some miracle, Ryan succeeds, his mission is clear:
Befriend Brendon Urie, fellow Swan Sigma, and, more importantly, alleged leader of Sigma Chi Beta's secret society, which might not even exist. He is to document his findings, and send them to his benefactor. One small problem though: Brendon fucking hates his guts.
--Did I mention that Anna Green owns my ass? Because Anna Green owns my ass. This one is so fleshed out, and there are some moments where it really spikes you in the chest. Every time that Patrick comes onto the page, my interest piques, and I remember That One Scene™ that completely changed my perspective of him (You'll understand once you read). Besides... college AU? Secret societies? Betrayal? Enemies to lovers? Sexual tension? Need I say more?--
I have more fics to recommend if you guys like this list, so tell me if you want more fic recs
#ryden fanfiction#ryden fanfic#ryden fic#ryden recs#panic! at the disco#panic at the disco#rydon#ryden#p!atd#patd#fanfiction#fanfic#p!atd fanfic#throam#the heart rate of a mouse#two vatos locos#missing in action#the black rose season#esoteric contagion#freaks#the red eyed owl#filthy lucre#the way home from nowhere#ryan ross#brendon urie#ryro#beebo#brendon patd#ryan patd#fall out boy
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What do you think is the REAL difference between Stu and Murdoc? Is it upbringing, age, personality, or cocktail of things?
I’ve gotta tell you, of all the kind asks you sent (and what a nice thing that was of you to do, thank you, they were fun to ponder!) this is the one I’m like… jittery to answer because there’s just so much to be said. Put under a cut because it ended up kinda stupid-long.
I mean, what has to be determined first is– are Murdoc and Stu that different? I tend to think they’re not, not as much as they are alike. That’s actually what I like best about them and something I usually play to when I can, how much they both resemble a certain stereotype but with their own twist. Many of their differences are a little superficial, like Stu being a bit more geezery with his football and all, and Murdoc being less uptight with his hobbies (be it involving cheeky GTA or a gimp mask.) I joked the other day that the biggest difference between the two is just that Murdoc does uppers and Stu does downers, and that’s pretty much it. I do think on a “deeper” level, like a more innate behavioral level, they’re a lot more similar than they actually realize.
But with all that being said, of course they’re not identical, and there’s a lot that contributes to where exactly they differ. I think that everything you said is absolutely relevant to that!
Let’s start with age and upbringing. The age difference between Murdoc and Stu is actually fairly stark when you just look at the years, but it never feels quite that bad to me because Murdoc and Stu are both so emotionally stunted and immature. There’s a line in Bojack Horseman than I think is incredibly on-point here, about how “the age you are when you get famous is the age you stop growing.” I think for Stu, it absolutely damned him to become famous at around 20, it locked him mentally into an age where he should’ve been learning everything wouldn’t be given to him, and instead it was just… given to him. In excess. If you follow that reasoning Murdoc’s sort of odd though, in that he never actually achieved fame on any major scale until he was in his 30′s. It seems more like Murdoc’s exaggerated sense of self-importance (probably a response to knowing, very much knowing, that he was not in fact something towering and impressive at all, and there’s like… something absurdist in really choosing to think he is. That’s almost the ultimate form of his Humor As A Shield– what could be a bigger joke than not hating himself?! Ha! It’s funny because it’s sad!) set in way before he actually became famous. It’s more like his maturity is stalled at the time he started trying to be famous. Stu didn’t actually try to pursue music at all before, while Murdoc spent a decade absolutely convinced that it had to work and doggedly not accepting when it wasn’t. It feels like these two approaches enabled (or damaged) them in different ways, but both end up with the result of men who don’t act their age for many years and have hedonistic, stereotypically rockstarish ways of living far beyond that of their bandmates. Stu can barely claim he knows better though and is perhaps more… people are gonna yell at me for being so hard on him haha, but more spoiled and therefore more ignorant because he never actually lived a responsible adult life. (Does that mean Stu hasn’t had difficulty in that life? Absolutely not. The man has at least three counts of massive head trauma and was in a coma for an undetermined period of time, he has a permanent physical impairment that likely impacts his vision, I think he’s earned a few perks.) Murdoc on the other hand is very aware of what it was like to be a failure, to be conventionally unemployable, and to have so little to lose that he’d make incredibly stupid decisions that could’ve ended his free life. His indulgence now is frankly more extreme, but Murdoc has an even greater sense of believing he earned that and he owes nothing (whether that’s completely true or not.)
And that’s just touching on the ends of their “upbringing,” not the actual 18+ years that went into it. It goes without saying that Stu and Murdoc had very different home lives– Rachel and David Pot are suggested to be rather precious with Stu out of some probable guilt for his first head trauma, in complete contrast to Sebastian’s humiliation and neglect– but on top of that, what seems to be glossed over at times is how they grew up in very different regions at very different time periods. I’m far from an authority on this or on anything (as always I really suggest asking @elapsed-spiral if you want better information, don’t let the hiatus thing fool you, Danni’ll still talk about British Shit Innit) but I’m told the British school system Murdoc would’ve endured in the 60s and 70s was unremittingly bleak and damaging to a child’s development. Despite his immaturity and my feelings that their age difference isn’t really so pronounced, Murdoc is older than Stu and unfortunately he experienced a much colder and rougher school environment, and it’s tough to argue that didn’t have an effect. (Though on the flipside, Stu was in school during Section 28, a thing I’m also not an authority on. Go figure a working class and very closeted bisexual man in the 80s might internalize some homophobia! The go-go 80s aren’t all they’re cracked up to be.) It’s not exactly surprising that Murdoc, who grew up on the lowest end of working class, in council housing, in an unglamorous Northern town like Stoke with a neo-fascist brother and a neglectfully-abusive alcoholic father, would come away an emotionally repressed and embittered person. It’s almost a bit bold that Murdoc is as “flamboyant” as he is (even if it comes with a hefty side of toxic masculinity)– he could’ve become hateful in a more stony way, but instead he’s like a giddy-cruel showman out of spite. You can argue that Murdoc’s lack of support system results in him feeling much more unfettered. He has no one to thank for getting him out of that and no one he credits for getting him where is. He very much has the mentality of “I take what I can and do what I want, because the world owes me everything.” And in a way, I can see where that’d come from.
He’s wrong though. Because Stu’s there. And Stu owes Murdoc nothing.
I know I’m really running on here, and I think you probably already have a picture of what I see Stu’s upbringing and childhood as. Rachel Pot is the unsung best character in Gorillaz, Stu was quite coddled by his parents, and Stu admits to being largely unmotivated and rudderless. It’s notable that Stu is in fact also working class but he’s presented like he’s not, I think just as a result of looking a lot better in comparison to Murdoc and us Americans not fully knowing the details of the British class system as compared to ours. (I don’t want to condescend to you anon, you may be British and know all this a lot better than I do. But because I am American, what would be more American than assuming everyone’s American?) I would say Stu’s family places on the higher end of that though (again, council housing for Murdoc, Stu had a garden with what must’ve been a decently big tree for him to fall out of) and isn’t portrayed as struggling in the same way. His job at Norm’s seems more like something he does because he’s not allowed to sit in the house all day, and he likes messing with the keyboards and he likes having spending money because he’s too old for allowance, and girls he’s fooled around with occasionally pop in to his work and bring him a pastry from the Tesco Express she works at and they make out in her car. Stu comes away from Crawley with quite a few “tethers” that disallow him from feeling as “loose” as Murdoc– he has a good relationship with his parents, a handful of mates, probably a handful of girls he wasn’t on bad terms with, at least one who’d end up becoming his girlfriend. So why does he have some of the same “cruel showman” qualities as Murdoc? Why does his entitlement end up looking much the same? That’s all personal interpretation of course, but I’d say it’s because Murdoc drove a car into his face and stole an unspecified amount of time from his life. I’d say because he’s out of his parent’s house for the first time in his life, and he’s going full throttle into being this person now. I’d say that in one night, and many unconscious nights following it, Murdoc smashed that same embittered attitude into the front of Stu’s skull. To be clear, that isn’t writing off Stu’s faults on Murdoc; it isn’t to say Murdoc made him egotistical or promiscuous or immature. But the attitude that you are fucking owed something is really only an attitude they share because Murdoc gave Stu someone to spite where he didn’t have that before.
(I recognize this whole dynamic isn’t for everyone and I do get it, and for what it’s worth I think it’s totally correct to say Murdoc gave Stu all the best things in his life. He just also gave him the worst bits too. The reality is neither would be here without each other, for all the good and bad that implies. It’s true that Stu’s famous because of Murdoc, but it’s also true that Murdoc’s famous because of Stu. What a tangled web!)
I’m sorry, I’m so off the question now, I just love this stuff. So, personality! That’s unquestionably a factor, the answer to the nature vs nurture debate will always be a little bit of both. I think if you tallied up all of Stu and Murdoc’s traits, desires, and behaviors after they’ve been living together a few years, you’d find a longer list in the similarities column than the differences. The environmental influence doesn’t just stop at where you’re raised, I think the environment you live in and the people who inhabit it continue to have an impact on you pretty much throughout life; even if moving to a richer city doesn’t “change” you, it changes the way you look at things, understand things, respond to things. It just inherently does. Still, I recognize that’s my own characterization of them and if you just look at the characters in canon, you’d be hard pressed to say they seem like the same guy. There are things about them that are just innately different, some of it learned through their upbringing and some of it dictated by… the way they’re wired.
Which is a point I’m really hesitant to comment on too much, but– mental health. It probably doesn’t look the same between Stu and Murdoc. There are other blogs who will discuss in more depth their neurodivergent headcanons and I see nothing wrong with that, I don’t really think there is any case that can’t be made, but I’m not especially confident making those cases myself. What I’ll say is that I don’t necessarily read Stu as having any specific learning disorder, because I fear it’s a little… iffy to have so many jokes in canon about him being thick or being slow. I think it really is just that, even prior to the injuries I reckon Stu was “a bit thick.” Head trauma doesn’t help that, though. Lifelong migraines and impaired motor function came about from the brain damage, absolutely, and I do imagine he must’ve suffered some neural response slowing, but his “lower intelligence” I feel a little less comfortable casually ascribing to anything and more to just Stu being Stu. Murdoc is also a case to be careful with, but within phase 3 it seems fair to say Murdoc suffers a psychotic break and is dealing with some delusions. Dangerously, I kind of lean into thinking this isn’t something that “just happened” because of the events of El Mañana and Plastic Beach, and that Murdoc had perhaps needed to be on an anti-psychotic like lithium well before that point. Again, I don’t want to insensitively represent this so I try not to really put such a fine point on things, but… I’m a little inclined to think Murdoc went undiagnosed in his young life and still may be demonstrating some effects of that. So, y’know, make what you will of it, but there’s that.
Sorry I nattered on about this, I do really enjoy examining both characters. Jokes about the drugs and stuff aside, I’ve always felt that the biggest difference between Murdoc and Stu is that Murdoc is adaptable, and Stu is malleable. Where that stems from is probably a combination of all these things. Murdoc knows what he wants and has no loyalties, he’s been without a future, he does what he can to succeed because he’s already done what he can to survive; Stu doesn’t know what he wants and he does have “loyalties,” but he has no sense of purpose, and he’s easily nudged in the direction you need him to go. While he can be stubborn, just like Murdoc, he’s also more sincerely shaped by his experiences even later in life into multiple, sometimes disparate versions of himself– I might even wager that’s why Stu becomes such a contradictory character without any of the contradictions feeling inauthentic. The two of them “being what they need to be” is part of the reason they accomplished as much as they did. But it’s also hard to say that they really “held on” to each other through the years, or if they just melded together in parts.
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So, I’ve seen a lot going around about Eddie and Myra and what people are and aren’t saying and this is my meta and my full take as my tags were quoted in the post I believe what started it all.
The original post is by kaymcalls, who I, in my personal opinion, believe is getting unfair hate and backlash on their blog. This is my personal opinion. This is a link to the post with comments by dear-wormwoods
Because we respect people’s right to their own opinion and analysis, there is a rebuttal post I feel it important to link by wondefuleds, displaying a different view point.
I’m going to argue my point in this meta. Overall, I urge people to remember that this is a literary analysis and nothing greater. People have their rights to their own perspective above all else, and you have a right to yours, even if you greatly disagree with me. Please respect everyone’s right to see the world, read books, and understand relationships the way they do.
My point is neither Eddie nor Myra is abusive. There is no power imbalance present in their relationship. They are trapped in an emotionally manipulative, loveless, toxic marriage.
We open on Eddie fastidiously looking over his medicine cabinet, and packing a bag. There is a lot of discussion on the medications he takes, which are, for reference, a lot of sedatives.
Myra comes up the steps and demands to know what he’s doing. I don’t think this is an unreasonable request.
“‘Myra Kaspbrak was huge. She had only been big when Eddie married her five years ago, but he sometimes thought his subconscious had seen the potential for hugeness in her; God knew his own mother had been a whopper. And she looked somehow more huge than ever as she reached the second-floor landing.” There is a lot of fatphobia in our first description of Myra, which is in Eddie’s point of view. He is demeaning her based on her physical appearance in his mind.
“I have to go away for a while,” Eddie said.
“What do you mean, you have to go away? What was that telephone call?”
“Nothing,” he said, fleeing abruptly down the hall to their walk-in closet.
And then:
“What’s this about, Eddie? Where are you going? You tell me!”
“I can’t tell you.”
Eddie is being completely unreasonable. This is not how a married adult behaves. There’s independence, and there’s disregarding your partner entirely.
Myra’s POV tells us: “she stood there, watching him, trying to decide what to say next, or what to do. The thought of dumpling bundling him into the closet and then standing there with her back against the door until this madness had passed crosses her mind, but she was unable to bring herself to do it;”
This is a fire vs fire fight. This is a lack of communication skills vs a lack of communication skills. Neither of them know how to talk to each other, at all. Myra tells us she has no idea what to do because this behavior is so unlike him, like she walked in on her furniture levitating. Does it justify her thoughts?
No.
Instead, she makes up an excuse as to why he can’t go, for Al Pacino’s autograph, and he tells her she’ll have to get it herself. This isn’t an unreasonable request, but they are dancing around the topic at hand, they are not talking about where Eddie is going and why, they’re talking nonsense. Because they can’t communicate. Because they’re toxic for each other.
Let’s be realistic: eddie hasn’t even specified if he’s coming back. Myra has a right to be terrified. Eddie has a right to not want to dispel all of the childhood trauma that’s coming up for him at the moment. Neither of them communicate this to the other.
“Her face full of perplexity and terror, and he might have felt sorry for her if his heart had not already been so filled with terror for himself.”
He’s not scared of Myra. He’s scared of Pennywise, and returning to Derry. He’s failing to recognize, understand, and validate her emotions because he is so focused on his own.
His wife is sobbing, and he completely ignores her and walks by. He doesn’t say anything. Not where he’s going. Not if he’ll come back. He doesn’t answer her questions, which are: are you in trouble and who was that on the phone? This is emotional manipulation. It is being a bad partner.
Eddie realized he has more than enough time to make his train, and only then, does he think “Nine twenty. Plenty of time to talk to her, plenty of time to be kind.”
Eddie thinks he’s going off to die, and he is only considering being kind, in his own words, to his wife when it’s convenient. He thinks about the sound system he bought for her, criticizing her, and then thinks to himself “that wasn’t fair, and he damn well knew it.”
I think it’s a good metaphor for their entire relationship. He pulls these false equivalency for her… he blames her for his deep unhappiness which permeates every page of this chapter. He rhapsodizes about the similarities between his mother and Myra “they could have been sisters. The resemblance was that close.” He talks about only the physical resemblances for the longest time.He talks about how he fantasizes about breaking it off.
But then he talks about their psychological resemblance:
“It was Myra herself who had ended up tripping the scales away from independence. Myra had condemned him with solicitude, nailed him with concern and chained him with sweetness. Myra, like his mother had reached that final, final insight into his character: Eddie was all the more delicate because he sometimes suspected he was not delicate at all. Eddie needed to be protected from his own dim intimations of bravery.”
Here’s the difference between Myra and Sonia in this passage to me:
Eddie is an adult. Eddie has free will, and he damn well knows it. He isn’t saying Myra won’t allow him to leave his house. He is saying he is addicted to her care over him. That he, personally believes, needs that level of care. It isn’t her words that have power over him, it’s her actions. Things she does like
taking out his rainboots when it’s raining
buying healthy cereals
These are normal things to do for your significant other. The reason they are not normal is because Eddie, yes Eddie, has been convinced he is incapable of functioning without someone to care for him. This is, in large, not his fault, as the victim of childhood trauma. It’s also not Myra’s.
He goes on to say: “a hog she was, but she was a sweet hog, and he loved her, and there had really been no chance for him at all. She had drawn him to her with the fatal, hypnotizing snake’s eye of understanding.” He does not love this woman. He loves the care she takes of him. That’s a horrible marriage to enter yourself into.
And he knows he’s wrong. He says he’s wrong. He knows he has built himself this cage and it’s based on the fact that he never faced down his childhood head on. That is his cross to bear.
“Maybe this isn’t home, nor ever was- maybe home is where I have to go tonight. Home is the place where when you go there, you have to finally face the thing in the dark.” He knows he has never had a true home because he has not found it within himself.
Now: is Myra wholly innocent?
No.
Absolutely not.
To know there is trauma in someone’s past that makes them vulnerable to a certain behavior, and to exploit that? Is emotional manipulation. They are both using the other to get what they want out of the relationship. Hence, it is mutually toxic.
“Tears has been more than a defense for his mother, they had been a weapon. Myra had rarely used her own tears so cynically… but, cynically or not, he realizes she was trying to use them that way now… and she was succeeding.”
Eddie says Myra doesn’t have a particular track record for using tears as manipulation, and thinks that, regardless of whether she is cognizant of it, she is doing so now. Again: Eddie has not even said where he is going. She doesn’t even know if she is coming back. Again, I think this is Eddie, because of his trauma, which again: not his fault, but this is Eddie being unfair to Myra because of how he regards her. She has a right to cry at that moment. He can’t see her tears for anything other than the direct impact they are having on him, because he is used to emotions being a currency, because he is used to performative behavior. He is putting these things on Myra, and he knows that she probably isn’t being intentionally malicious, but cannot manage to make himself fully make that distinction.
He holds his promise to the losers club of greater importance than his promises to her. That is his decision to make, but I think the least he could do is explain himself.
He then does not answer the questions she keeps repeating, but instead, tells her what she is going to do. They’re not addressing the question, they’re not addressing the problem, Myra is still sobbing. This is some of the worst communication skills I’ve seen in a relationship.
(Wailing)“there could be an accident… there probably will be an accident… Eddie… Eddie, you have to stay home…” this whole, there probably will be an accident, thing is textbook manipulation. She’s not getting what she wants from him, so she resorts to disaster scenarios. Because they’re not communicating what they want and need from each other.
However, Eddie replies: “For God’s sakes! Stop it!”
“I hate it when you shout at me, Eddie,” she whispered.
“Myra, I hate it when I have to,” he said and she winced.
Holy SHIT: no. I shouldn’t have to tell y’all why this is bad. This is BAD. Like I said… this is a fire vs fire fight. He is taking out his fear, his personal need for vindication in this fight against the dark, out on her. In response to her trying to manipulate him. They are BOTH toxic.
I’m gonna repeat: He holds this promise to the losers club as greater than any promise he made to her.
He thinks:
“Dear God, if You are there, please believe me when I say I don’t want to hurt Myra. I don’t want to cut her, don’t even want to bruise her. But I promised, we all promised, we swore in blood, please help me God because I have to do this… there you go, Eddie, you hurt her again. Why don’t you punch her around the room a few times? That would probably be kinder. And quicker.”
I can’t even with this passage. He knows. He knows how badly he is emotionally hurting her. He does not love this woman. He would resort to violence if he had to. There is no love in that.
They are so upset with each other, because they married someone to fill a purpose in their life, and not because they loved them.
He gives her instructions on driving, and does not give her any information. His cab arrives.
He, again, refuses to give her any information. Again, she resorts to similar tactics to his mother, to try and manipulate him into staying. “‘You’ll get sick,’ she said desperately.” This is so bad. She tugs on him to make him stay. This is very bad. However, she doesn’t know where he’s going or if he’s even coming back.
For all she knows, her husband could be leaving her.
For all Eddie knows, he could be leaving her.
And then finally: finally, Eddie tells her something. He communicates! And you know what else he does? He lies to her.
‘“I’m going, but I’ll be coming back.’ Oh but that felt like a lie.”
Eddie then, as she screams over the length of the trip, only then: considers her emotions as real, considers her emotions not only to the effect they play on his.
“Not angry at him, only terrified for him, and coincidentally, for herself.”
And then:
“Was that what he meant? That he had finally decided it was all right to love her? That it was all right even though she looked like his mother…”
this is a loveless marriage. Eddie never even considered her okay to love. I don’t think anyone is disputing that. But they’re both perpetrators of this emotional web that keeps them tangled in each other. They’re both responsible. there is not a power imbalance between them, just horrendous toxicity they both simultaneously feed into and rely on.
Eddie, again, tells Myra to stop having her emotions, and asks her for a kiss. He tells her not to be afraid, tells her he’ll call if he can, and he leaves her. Forever. Eddie never comes home.
They never say goodbye or I love you, because Myra didn’t know it was goodbye, and they didn’t love each other.
#myra kaspbrak#eddie kaspbrak#now PLEASE stop being rude to kaymcalls#and DON'T be rude to wonderfuleds either#come be rude to me#i can take it
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