#Batman Beyond 50

[dailydccomics]

Terry training Terry Batman Beyond 2.0 #32

[earth-1218designate]

[blorb-el]

happy pride as a present here is a non-exhaustive compilation of ways precrisis clark has carted bruce around from the 50s to the 80s. sources and artists under readmore

[row 1] it's the early days, perhaps they're not comfortable yet with pda: wf 108, 1960, pencils dick sprang, inks sheldon moldoff well they sure got over that fast: wf 118, 1961, artists same as prev strong arms to show off husband and son: wf 135, 1963, artists same as prev

[row 2] belt hold: wf 80, 1956, pencils dick sprang, inks stan kaye cheek to cheek: wf 251, 1978, pencils george tuska, inks vince colletta, colors jerry serpe burrito: wf 172, 1967, pencils curt swan, inks george klein

[row 3] kitten scruffed: justice league of america 144, 1977, pencils dick dillin, inks frank mclaughlin, colors anthony tollin third wheeling: justice league of america 144, same as above like a sack of groceries: wf 257, 1979, pencils dick dillin, inks frank mclaughlin, colors gene d'angelo

[row 4] bridal, manila bruce style: wf 128, 1962, pencils and ink by jim mooney bridal batman style: wf 281, 1982, pencils irv novick, inks frank chiaramonte, colors carl gafford instinctive bridal catch: wf 266, 1981, pencils rich buckler, inks bob smith, colors gene d'angelo

[row 5] clarks hand is Where: wf 267, 1981, pencils rich buckler, inks dick giordano, colors gene d'angelo bruce has been mind controlled and given superpowers and they're.....'wrestling': wf 109, 1960, pencils curt swan, inks stan kaye piggyback ride: wf 224, 1974, pencils dick dillin, inks vince colletta [should be noted that this one is in an elseworlds...kind of, however this is indeed bruce and clark, as opposed to bruce jr. and clark jr., their sons who look exactly like them]

[row 6] this is just like picking up a kitty cat: wf 253, 1978, kurt schaffenberger, inks frank chiaramonte, colors gene d'angelo disgruntled burrito: wf 251, 1978, pencils george tuska, inks vince colletta, colors jerry serpe i have to hold you closely it's aerodynamic: wf 277, 1982, pencils don heck, inks romeo tanghal, colors gene d'angelo

[row 7] their toesies are in sync: wf 266, 1981, same as row 4 picture 3 kinda gone beyond burritoing into kidnapping: wf 272, 1981, pencils rich buckler, inks joe giella, colors gene d'angelo clark kneeing bruce: wf 266, same as the first one in this row

[row 8] bruce rolling over midflight in order to look clark in the eyes as he talks about running away from a mysterious ~feeling: wf 285, pencils rich buckler, inks sam de la rosa, colors gene d'angelo wrapping up his disgruntled husband in his cape like a blankie: wf 245, 1977, pencils curt swan, inks murphy anderson, colors jerry serpe

[row 9] actually this is a costume swap and bruce is carrying clark: wf 71, 1954, pencils curt swan, inks stan kaye carting off his civilian husband and son: wf 243, 1977, pencils curt swan, inks al milgrom, colors jerry serpe

bonus for clicking on the readmore; depowered clark getting... carried??? by bruce. they have beards because they are in caveman times but also they're on an alien planet don't worry about it. wf 138, 1963, pencils and inks by jim mooney

[feefivefoe]

Please can we hear your thoughts on what Bruce does/thinks when being confronted with his neglect by Jason (and maybe the other boys too)??

Thank you, and have a nice day!

Bruce is the one I have the hardest time characterizing tbh.

I think his first reaction would be denial? He hasn't been the best father, but even he wouldn't go as far as to forget his own chi...

Oh my god he doesn't know how old you are. You were...you were older than Tim but younger than Dick, he thinks.

Wait.

When was your birthday?

Did he ever give you a birthday party?

What wing of the manor did you sleep in?

Where were you right now?

Unlike Tim who starts the unofficial search, Bruce heads right to the batcave to find your official records. Social security number. If you worked anywhere or has anyplace legal to stay, you'd have to input that. He's ashamed he has to go through a government database to find it, rather than simply knowing it.

And just like Tim, he finds nothing. Which scares him beyond belief. Had he lost you already? Did he actually forget about one of his children and then unknowingly replace them? Was he actually guilty of what Jason had accused him of years ago, albeit to a different child?

In reality, you're living solely through cash. Plenty of individuals are eager to avoid paying all their taxes, and are thrilled to accept cash only payments on your rent, or paycheck. Legally, you haven't done anything since graduating high school.

Not necessarily hiding from them, per say, as you don't think they'd go looking, but just because you don't want to be known as a Wayne.

And god, there is so much guilt, fear, and anguish rolling around inside that man. He needs to find out where you are, and if you're okay, and if anybody had done anything to you.

He swears if they have, he'll rip the motherfucker to pieces-

No. That isn't going to help. So instead he checks every reported death within not only Gotham, but any city within a 50 mile radius. For the last 10 years.

As well hidden as you are, nobody can hide from Batman while he's concentrating every effort to find you.

He's hesitant to bring you home at first. How can he call himself your father after forgetting you for your whole time living with him? But his regard for your safety eventually wins out. Until then, you just get a concerning amount of money just...stashed in your apartment??? What the fuck??????

Dick also feels a lot of guilt, but he somewhat subconsciously channels that into abundant overeagerness. Instead of focusing on how many important moments he missed...that he can never get back with his first baby sibling...

...ah, he should focus on all the memories you can make going forward! He has to take you to all his favorite spots, and you take him to yours!

What interests do you have? Are you a go to the aquarium person? Family movie night? Spa night? Just having fun with everyone at dinner? He has to do these things with you! And then you'll be his family again, and he'll love you, and you'll love him-

In spirit, he shows up outside your door like Damian. But he is self aware enough to know that'd freak you out, so instead he 'coincidentally' shows up at your work...in the bad side of town...and his attitude definitely gives away it was planned.

He messes up your "I'm a nobody like all of you" persona you'd spent years cultivating, and by the time he leaves, all your coworkers and customers know that you're Dick Grayson's sibling...which means Bruce Wayne's child, but he likes saying you're related to him more.

Tim doesn't give a fuck at first, like I established. It really is a game to see if he can find you before anybody else does. When he loses that to Bruce (damn it-), he decides he'll just know you BETTER than the others to win.

So he starts literally stalking you and making a psyche profile, like you're a case rather than his sibling. Any interest you've ever listed in your social media is cross checked with any belongings of yours. Merch or posters? Songs you listen to? Any of that content, he consumes as well. He's going to need conversation topics with you.

I'm not entirely sure if he actually loves you as family, or if you're just a hyperfixation that's consistently buzzing at his brain. It's like he wants to dissect, then digest you. Pick you apart piece by piece so he sees every last skin cell, then make that information a part of him

Though, he'd claim it's the former. To him, there's no discernable difference.

He's the one who meets you at your hobbies. Claims an online friend brought it up, but hey, it's crazy to see you again!

Even though it's your first conversation...maybe ever?

He's chatting to you like you haven't been estranged your whole life.

And the look in the eye is...a little unnerving.

[vinelark]

what r some fics that shaped your psyche? you have so many good recs im currently rereading the to an athlete dying young series

hello! you sent me this ask ages ago and i've been meaning to get to it ever since. (it took me so long to answer that i'm sure you've reread to an athlete dying young by @sonosvegliato many times over by now but hell yeah, what a good one.)

these are a few fics--dc and beyond--that have been in my "in case of emergency" epub folder (aka fics i want to have on hand immediately to reread on bad days, or good days, or even average days) for a few years now. so here is an extremely incomplete list of fics that have shaped my psyche!

for dc specifically--if i tried to list all of them i would just end up repeating my whole fic rec tag, so these are just a few of the ones i read when i was getting into this fandom that stayed with me/made me want to seek out more for these characters:

📸 surveillance series by @smilebackwards

this series located the tim drake center of my brain and lit it up like the vegas strip.

🎒 like a hinge, like a wing by @bonesbuckleup

one of my go-to rereads for pangs; chapter one is a masterclass in tension. also, one of my favorite pre-robin tim pov fics of all time.

💻 nominal by @unpretty

"you don't get it, batman is a comedy" --conversation i've had with multiple people using this fic as my thesis statement.

🌃 the jingle jangle morning by @audreycritter

the moment somebody in my vicinity says "i love dick grayson" i'm on their doorstep with this fic url.

🚉 a meditation on railroading by @eggmacguffin

there's a moment in this fic known among my friends as "baby wipes jason" and it has successfully converted no less than three people to the fandom.

and then for non-dc fic:

🌌 atlas by @megafaunatic (mdzs & tgcf)

did i read this before i had a single clue who the characters were? yes. did i return to it once i did and lose my mind a little? yes. lore etymologyplayground writes that “so so so in love and pining so hard the lines between us are blurring and we haven’t made a move yet but it’s inevitable” flavor with such a deft hand; it is in fact called the lorezone. if any friends-to-lovers pining i write can achieve even 50% of a lorezone i will have done my job.

🪿 If they caught you by @feyburner (tgcf)

i go back to this when i think about setup and payoff, when i think about subtle misdirects, when i think about the monumental task of creating whole compelling new characters in 6k words.

🧪 away childish things by lettered (hp)

one of the best de-aging trope stories i've ever read; i think of this when i want to take a trope to its maximum potential and then go: no wait, there's even more.

(another fav de-aging fic is grow by @cafecliche; shorter plot but no less pangs 🌱)

🏡 in defiance of all geometry by @idiopath-fic-smile (les mis)

a fic that's a perfect reread when i need something cozy and full of character, and a perfect touchstone when i'm pondering something where the world may not hang in the balance but the stakes still matter.

📔 The Absolutely True Story of the Yiling Patriarch: A Manifesto in Many Parts by aubreyli (cql/mdzs)

paragon of metahumor, basically. i think of this when i want to write something that's funny in both text and form.

🍚 and his wanting grows teeth by @yuebings (cql/mdzs)

masterclass in pangy backstory reveal; the way the first scene loops back around to punch you in the gut long after you've forgotten it will forever be seared into my brain.

also, most answers on this list fit the bill!

(apologies again that this answer is so belated; it took me ages to write up partially because i kept stopping to reread these fics every time i tried.)

[comicaurora]

No question, just letting you know that I just finished a watchthrough of about two thirds of the DCAU (Batman Beyond, Superman and both Justice Leagues) and you're about 50% responsible.

you're gonna like our next Detail Diatribe I think

[garpen]

Damian Wayne & Terry McGinnis

There's this tiktoker (leaf_sprout) who made a video about Jason meeting Terry McGinnis and their dynamic, which has just been making me think about the potential of Terry meeting other members of the family.

In Batman Beyond, Bruce is in his 70's. Let's just say 70 flat. In my mind, in my mind that could have the rest of the family be at these ages:

Dick (55), Jason (50), Cass (50), Tim (47), Duke (44), Damian (40), and then Terry (16).

Thinking about the ages, specifically Damian's, makes me wonder about possible dynamics between the two, and suddenly I NEED someone to write a fic about the two. Because JUST IMAGINE IT.

Damian is probably away somewhere out of the country when Brue first meets Terry. Then when Damian does meet Terry, Bruce has already decided he will take up the mantle.

By this time Damian has already decided long ago not to become Batman. Either because he chose to make his own hero identity that better reflects his personality/methods (like the rest of his siblings). Or maybe he decided that he’d rather mentor/train the nextgen of heroes since he recognizes his skills would be great being used to guide/support others (he’s trained members of the LoA, so I think it would be great to see him mentoring the younger gen like his father did with him and his siblings). Both reasons, actually, both reasons are great.

Anyway, when they first meet, Damian is of course skeptical. Damian may have helped train/mentor heroes before, but this time was different, this time it was an outsider coming into his family. He sees Terry as nothing more than a young, inexperienced hero, an outsider who hasn’t earned his place in his family (yet). To Damian, the title of Batman is not to be taken lightly or taken without the necessary dedication and an adequate amount of prep. So he tests the kid; tests his methods, decisions, and capabilities in combat and strategy. Their initial dynamic is tense because of this.

However, Terry’s determination, skills, willingness to learn and adapt, and his need to prove himself worthy of the mantle, would eventually earn Damian’s respect. This leads to Damian finding himself mentoring him (because realistically Bruce is 70 and may be able to be his guy in the chair, but the more physical training/guidance would be difficult).

Damian's training and high standards help push Terry to his limits, allowing him to grow stronger and more skilled. Whereas Terry would likely challenge Damian’s more traditional methods and ideas, leading to mutual growth between the two. Their relationship would be full of respect, mentorship, and an opportunity for emotional growth for both of them, learning from each other's strengths and weaknesses.

Eventually, as time goes on, this mentorship/dynamic could evolve with Damian taking up a paternal role as Damian starts to see parts of himself in Terry.

In this new dynamic, Damian becomes protective and concerned over Terry’s well-being, in a way a father would be, which is new to him, leading to even more growth. Terry’s youthfulness bring out a softer side to Damian. Damian, in turn, provides wisdom, experience, and a guiding hand in his journey, giving Terry a strong and reliable person to depend on.

Together they work on having Terry re-build the legacy of Batman.

Anyways I'm kinda just in love with the idea now of the two meeting and developing a father son/relationship (despite them being technically siblings).

[brucewaynehater101]

Hear me out for mixing Emperor Tim and Spider Tim. Spider Tim does not want any of the Bats to know about his spider form, but Young Justice knows all about it. It started because Greta asked him about the magic she could sense in him and Tim telling them that he had some "thread based magic" and took a few strands of his silk to wrap around Cassie. She had to genuinely try to break out of just 5 loops of this hair thin thread. They ask him why he doesn't use this all the time and Tim simply shrugs, "I can't make a lot of it. The older I get, the more I'll be able to make bur for now? I'm stuck with only a few dozen yards a day." This isn't quite true. He can currently make about 50 yards but it will grow with time.

Months later, they run into a magician who casts an anti magic barrier around them, canceling out Tim's Glamor and he immediately transforms into his spider form. He looks back at himself and then yells, "you rat fucking bastard! Do you have any idea how rude it is to out people as non human who aren't ready to come out yet?! I'm gunna fucking *eat* you!" To which, he does. They do a Q&A as Tim devours his meal in the saftey of Bart's space ship. Tim tells them about how dangerous poachers are to him and why, how his mom is the best ever and what normal spider demon parents do, why he's actually eating the guy, and when someone asks about his civilian ID, Tim says, "I still can't tell you but bow you've seen why. You know what I am. I just told you how much of a problem poachers are. If word gets out that I'm a Spider Demon and one of you guys slip up with my civilian name, it's not just me at stake. It's my mom and her siblings and my cousins and my siblings who I've never met. Our families don't meet up because of how dangerous the poachers are,how they could and would decimate our entire population at the drop of a hat. You think they don't use truth spells on us to try and pry who our family members are out of us? You think they won't use those same spells on you guys to force you to tell them who I am so that they can hunt down and exterminate my family? I can't risk that, even if I trust you guys with this form. But... I can tell you guys that you can call me Tim." Having such a good explanation for why he cant tell them beyond "Batman said I can't" should let up a ton of tension in the future and make when he does eventually tell them all the sweeter.

Tim decides that when he's visiting his planets, he doesn't have to worry about Earth Based Poachers so he uses his spider form. He has to admit that it feels *really* nice to stretch out his limbs for so long and also climb up and down walls. Plus! None of these people know to fear spiders! He doesn't have to worry about looks of disguste or hatred simply for what he is! His citizens still think he's adorable and sweet and small.

His spider form does *not* help with the problems with the GLC because the moment the humans see a picture of him, they are all reeling back. John will never admit that he has a phobia of spiders. Kyle freely says, "it looks like it's a spider demon. There was rumors of one running around back on Earth for a while. I never saw it but if it is, then it's extremely dangerous." And Hal pipes up, "I saw it once and that is definitely the spider demon that was running around. I didn't get to see it for very long, but I was hunting down a magician and saw it fighting that thing. It was horrifying, that thing chopped the guy up with its front, scythe like legs and after it killed the magician, it ate them! And then it vanished. But how did it get into space and become the leader of this empire?"

Hal did see Tim do that. What he didn't see is that fact that the magician was a poacher who was planning to also go after the other Bats thinking that they were definitely creatures too. Of course Tim wouldn't allow his family to be hunted like that by someone who would tell them his greatest secret. So he made sure they couldn't and had a nice snack in the process.

Tim deserves to snack on that magician. That was rude af of them to do that to him (although I doubt they cared and they can't care now that they are dead). Do magicians taste differently? Like static or something?

I'm also curious about how YJ treats Tim's OG form. I bet he oscillates between severely unbothered (it's who he is, why should he care?) to being self conscious (Bats and others have expressed their dislike of spiders and his form could cause him to be taken out by a poacher). He just flips between these two depending on various variables.

I'm also curious about Tim killing and the No Killing Rule. How will Bruce react to this?

I do like the addition you did for GLs. I wonder if they try to reach out to John Constantine about the spider demon taking over the universe. I love Tim and Constantine interactions, ngl

[luxaofhesperides]

Post-Apocalypse + Soulmate AU ; requested by @burr-burr!

When Danny was a kid, he used to imagine how the world would end. It was never a zombie apocalypse or the fallout of a nuclear war, but the death of the sun, the expansion of their star in death that would swallow their planet whole, leaving no survivors.

It would have been nicer than the post-apocalyptic world he stands in now, knowing that it’s his fault the world has ended. 

He’s still struggling to wrap his head around it. To understand that all of this is his fault because he cheated on one test, desperate to pass after being unable to study for it with how exhausting and time consuming fighting ghosts is. Everywhere he looks, there’s more destruction. His own home is rubble, with only the partially untouched Ops Center remaining to let him know that this is where he once lived.

The rest of Amity Park is in worse shape. Buildings are hollowed out, the skeletons of their foundations visible, if they still remain standing. Most homes have been burned to the ground, leaving blackened corners of walls and nothing else. The roads are cracked and difficult to walk through, as if an earthquake tore through the city. Cars are scattered along the road, overturned or left abandoned, doors still open.

Danny has yet to find any bodies. He doesn’t know if that’s a good sign or not. 

He’s only caught a few glimpses of his future self, the cause of all this, and can’t bring himself to chase after that monster. He feels sick to his stomach knowing what he’ll become. 

That monster has to be stopped. The world has already ended, but that doesn’t mean his future self can be allowed to go on like this. If there are any survivors, they need protection. They need to know they’ll be safe to try to start rebuilding, and that can only happen if his future self is dead.

Danny knows what he has to do; he has a responsibility to protect what little remains of Amity Park, and to do that, he needs to kill himself. 

But his head it spinning from the horror of the situation and his throat is tightening up the way it only does when he’s about to have a panic attack.

He needs to stop his future self, but he also can’t stay another second in the ruins of Amity Park without destroying himself.

The guilt sits heavy in his chest as he goes ghost and takes to the sky, flying blindly towards the setting sun. Danny doesn’t know where he’s going, and he doesn’t really care. He just needs to get away for a bit, until he can calm down and put together a plan of attack so he can take out his future self in one go.

He just…

He never thought he’d be a monster. But here they are.

Flying away from Amity Park reveals the truly harrowing extent to which this world has suffered under his future self’s hands. There are no intact cities or towns. Roads are broken beyond repair, highways littered with empty cars, most bridges crumbling into the rivers below them, and everything is covered in overgrowth. All signs of humanity’s careful cultivation of the world has been erased. The earth takes back what humans took from it, covering everything in green. 

There is no movement. No people. Barely any birds flying beneath him. 

What remains of the world is silence.

Danny is terrified that there’s no one left. That his future self has so thoroughly destroyed the earth that no human survivors remain. 

That gives his guidance, some idea of where to go: a big city. Any big city, really. 

He flies lower, searching for some sort of landmark, or a sign that will tell him where he’s going. A rusted over green sign farther down the road tells him that he’s 50 miles from Gotham.

Oh, Danny thinks, Maybe Batman can help me.

If anyone could survive the end of the world, it would be the superheroes, right? If anyone stands a chance at defeating his future self, it would be a superhero. Superman might have been a better choice, but Metropolis is the opposite direction and multiple states away; Danny’s not sure he can make it before his future self catches wind of him and hunts him down. 

Danny has no doubt about what would happen to him if he’s caught; there’s a reason he hasn’t seen any ghosts around, after all.

Gotham is a city of secrets and rumors. What little he’s heard of it is baffling and, frankly, insane. There’s no city in the country like it and Gothamites prefer it that way, stubbornly loving the home that will kill them. For all the manmade horrors they survive on the daily, they would be more prepared for the end of the world than anyone else. 

Gotham may be another casualty of his future self’s destruction, but it also offers him hope.

Danny follows the broken road towards Gotham, pushing himself to fly faster than he ever has before. What should have been a half hour flight is completed in fifteen minutes. 

As soon as the towering buildings of Gotham, dark and semi destroyed, come into view, Danny drops from the sky and returns to human form. The strain from pushing himself has exhausted him and he feels it like an ache in his chest, his heart twisting and trying to burst from how hard it’s beating. 

He collapses to his hands and knees and gasps for breath on the outskirts of Gotham. 

It takes a good few minutes to calm down and breathe normally, then another to gather his strength to stand up and begin walking. 

The world is eerily quiet as he enters the city, feeling the chill fall upon him as he is consumed by the shadows of tall buildings. It’s much more intact that Amity Park, but there’s no denying the destruction that still surrounds him. Buildings are empty and worn down, decaying and slowly being consumed by new growth. Burnt out husks of overturned cars fill the street, leaving Danny to carefully pick his way around them, unable to walk in a straight line. 

He feels like the only person in the world. He feels like he’s being watched by a hungry eyes. 

Danny shivers and walks faster. 

The deeper he goes into the city, the more he starts to hope that he’s not alone in this world. There’s small signs of life: the smell of smoke, recently burned, certain streets cleaned up, makeshift walls constructed from rubble to block access to certain areas of each block.

He swears he can see people move above his head, but anytime he looks up, the windows of every building are empty. 

“Batman,” he whispers to himself, “I just need to find Batman.”

He turns a corner and continues walking. Apartment buildings give way to stores and businesses, all with their windows broken and nothing on the shelves. Then the buildings end abruptly and he’s left staring at an overgrown park that resembles a jungle more than it does a part of the city.

The scent of something sweet lingers in the air. Fruit, perhaps, or flowers. 

If he was left in the aftermath of an apocalypse, he would go to where he could find growing food. If there’s anyone left in Gotham, he’s willing to bet they’re in here, surviving off of what food can be grown in the confines of the park. 

Danny crosses the road and takes three steps onto the grass before someone appears beside him and points an electrified baton at him.

“Who are you?” they demand, eyes hidden behind a cracked helmet, but the bottom half of their face is visible, revealing scars crossing on dark skin. 

Danny takes a step back, eyeing the electric baton warily, and lifts his hands to show he means no harm. “Danny. I came from out of town. I was hoping to find people here.”

“You don’t look like you’ve been traveling.”

His clothes are clean and intact and he has none of the world-weariness that weighs down this Gothamite. Danny winces, and says, “My situation is kinda complicated. But I did just get here. I’m looking for help, actually. Do you know where I could find Batman?”

There’s a long moment of tense silence, then he hears a quiet sigh and the helmet comes off. An exhausted looking man looks at him with one blind eye, turned a milky white, and his voice is low and stricken as he says, “Batman’s dead. But maybe I can help you.”

“Batman’s dead?!” Danny repeats, shocked.

“Yeah. Sacrificed himself in one of the last times Phantom attacked Gotham. Got me and Nightwing out of that encounter alive. We’re really the only heroes left in Gotham, not that there’s much need anymore with everyone trying to survive.”

Phantom killed Batman. His future self killed Batman. 

Danny feels sick to his stomach.

“Oh,” he manages to say. 

The man’s expression softens. “Don’t worry, we’ll help you as much as we can. Why don’t you come on in? Ivy can get you some food if you’re hungry.”

Danny nods numbly as he follows the man deeper into the park. He walks with ease, taking paths that only become visible when he walks them, leaving Danny to follow close behind. It takes some time before he realizes that the plants are moving out of their way just enough that they don’t trip, and when he looks back, the path is covered again, hidden from sight.

He’s taken to the heart of the forest, where the trees shift to the side to reveal a large encampment of survivors all living together. Beds are strung up as hammocks between trees and rope ladders dangle from branches to help people move up and down. The ground is full of small fire pits, a few in use to make make food, and sections in the back full of vegetable and herb patches, separated by berry bushes. 

The people here all look tired and worn down, but they still smile and speak in light voices, adjusted to a new life after surviving so much horror and destruction. He even spots a few people using powers, or just looking different, including one large man who looks like a crocodile. 

“Pick up another stray?” a raspy voice asks, humor lighting the tone. They both turn to see a woman with long red hair and a green tint to her skin be lowered to the ground by a vine. She’s also heavily scarred and her right arm is completely gone, replaced by a wooden limb covered in moss that moves as if it’s always been a part of her body.

“Hey Ivy,” the man greets, “I don’t think this one is staying. He came to Gotham looking for Batman.”

The words make Ivy’s gaze sharpen, and Danny feels a trickle of dread go down his spine. She’s dangerous and standing before her feels as if he’s in the mouth of a hungry beast.

“Is that so,” she says, voice flat. “How interesting. I’ll let you two talk somewhere more private.” Her gaze flicks to the side, and when Danny turns to look, he can see some of the people in the encampment observing them warily, bodies tense and poised to either flee or attack.

Ivy turns and the plants part for her. Danny waits for the man to begin walking before he follows, trying not to feel trapped as the plants close the path behind him. She takes them to a small pond full of water lilies, gives the man a careful look, then leaves, swallowed up by the plants.

“Is everything okay?” Danny asks hesitantly. “I didn’t mean to cause any trouble.”

“Nah, you’re good,” the man replies, “It’s just that people don’t trust me much.”

“Why? You’ve been really nice.”

The man shrugs. “My soulmate is Phantom. He’s the one responsible for doing all this and killing almost everyone we love. I didn’t know until the first time I fought him, but they hate anything to do with Phantom, including me.”

Danny’s heart stutters in his chest. This is his soulmate.

Most people don’t subscribe to the belief that they’re meant to be with their soulmate. Meeting your soulmate is rare enough that most people don’t try, and plenty of people have spoken of how important it is to have a variety of relationships, to not close yourself off for the slightest chance of meeting your soulmate. 

Danny never looked for his; he didn’t want to subject them to his parents, and then he became a halfa and gave up on all dreams of having a normal life or any relationship with someone who didn’t know he was Phantom.

And now he’s here, in a ruined future, standing before his soulmate who understandably hates him for destroying the world. 

“You’re Phantom’s soulmate,” Danny breathes. His hands are shaking. He wants to cry.

The man sighs. “Yeah. I am. Not that it’s stopped him from trying to kill me. Don’t worry, kid, I’m not working with him. I swear.”

“He’s your soulmate and he hurt you.”

“He hurt everyone,” he says, then gestures at his blind eye. “This is barely a thing compared to what he did to other heroes.”

Danny can’t find the words to expression his horror at seeing the damage he did to his own soulmate. His future self is heartless and cruel and bloodthirsty. He has to be stopped.

He doesn’t want to kill his soulmate. 

“I came here for Batman,” Danny says, “Because I thought he could help me stop Phantom.”

“That’s rough, kid. Batman couldn’t beat Phantom. I don’t think anyone can. We’ve tried, but most heroes are dead and we can’t just go out there and risk the lives of everyone here. We gotta focus on survival, not revenge.”

“I have to stop Phantom.”

“Sorry kid, but that’s a terrible idea. Don’t go out there trying to be a hero. You can stay here, alright? Ivy will get you set up and the others will help you settle in.”

Danny takes a step back and shakes his head. “No. I have to stop him. It has to be me.”

“And why is that?”

“Because I’m Phantom,” Danny whispers. 

The man immediately reaches for his electric batons again, taking a step back. “Not funny, kid,” he says with a tense voice. 

“I’m not joking. I am Phantom, just from the past. I’m not supposed to be here.”

“You’re Phantom?” the man repeats. “You. You’re just a kid, and you’re going to destroy the world one day?”

“I don’t want this to happen! That’s why I need to go back, so I can stop the event that will set me down this path. And to go back, I need to defeat the Phantom that exists here.”

“He’ll kill you, kid.”

“That still solves the problem, doesn’t it? If I die here, then he’ll never live long enough to destroy the world. He’ll die too.”

The man stares at him with cold eyes, then turns away, dropping his hands away from the batons. “Don’t turn this into a suicide mission, kid,” he says. “The Phantom who’s here isn’t you. You don’t have to pay for his crimes. Just… stay here and I’ll go fight Phantom.”

“He already hurt you,” Danny says. 

“What’s a little more hurt? I can handle it.”

“No,” Danny says firmly. He shoves away the fear and hurt in his heart and finds his strength in determination. No more running away. No more hiding. 

The timeline should not exist. He can’t hesitate at the thought of erasing this version of his soulmate from existence; he’s tired and injured and an outcast in the only community that still exists in Gotham. He deserves better. Everyone here does.

And to give them a better life, Danny needs to stop this one from ever happening.

“This is my future. It’s my responsibility. I’ll stop it and make sure this never happens. And… I’m sorry for everything I did.”

“It’s not your fault, Danny. You’re not this version of Phantom.”

That’s not at all true, since Danny’s actions lead to the end of the world, but he’s not going to argue when he’s preparing to fight a stronger, more ruthless version of himself. He takes a deep breath, then goes ghost and floats into the air. 

“Before I go,” he begins, hesitantly, “What’s your name? Since you’re apparently my soulmate.”

The man smiles sadly and answers, “Duke. If we ever meet in your time, tell that version of me to look for my mom’s favorite book.”

It’s an odd request, but if it’s important enough to be asked for, then Danny will do it. “Your mom’s favorite book,” he repeats, “Got it.”

“Take care, Danny. Good luck out there.”

Danny nods and takes one last look at his soulmate, older and worn down, stubbornly getting through each long day, and swears to make things better.

Then he flies off, ready to fight his future self and make things right again. 

. . .

He thinks of his soulmate for years after he’s back in the present. The timeline where his future self exists is gone and the world is safe, but he still remembers the pain he caused Duke. 

When the time comes to apply to universities, Danny sets his sights on Gotham. His parents take him on a trip during spring break to tour the campus, and it’s after the tour, as he wanders around on his own, that he bumps into a student walking out of a building.

“Sorry,” they both say at the same time, reaching for each other to help each other keep their balance. 

As soon as their hands meet, it’s as if lightning runs through him. From the look on the other guy’s face, he felt it to. 

This is his soulmate.

“Duke,” Danny says, amazed and disbelieving all at once. And the request crosses his mind, something he wondered about almost every night since he returned to his time. “Look for your mom’s favorite book.”

“How—?”

“I met you in the future. You asked me to take back a message for the you that’s here. So: look for your mom’s favorite book. What does that mean, by the way? I never asked.”

Duke blinks, then slowly retracts his hands from Danny’s. “My mom’s favorite book was a hand bound journal from my dad. They were soulmates and he wrote about their first year in a relationship together. It’s full of pictures, and she loved it more than anything. That message is to remind me to have faith in soulmates, to believe that something good can happen to me.”

“Oh! That’s… wow, sorry, I didn’t mean to pry into something so personal.”

Duke shrugs. “It’s fine. I needed the reminder. I would have already run away by now if you didn’t say that. You already know my name, but I think now’s a good time to introduce ourselves.”

“Right!” Danny says, flustered. He sticks his hand out, which Duke shakes with an amused smile. “I’m Danny. Fenton. I’m coming here next semester.”

“Duke Thomas. I’m a freshman here and I’d really love to get your number.”

He’s not hitting on Danny, not really, but it still makes him blush. The way Duke looks at him is full of light and laughter, so different from the exhausted and wary way he looked in the future now rewritten. 

This is what the future version of himself tried to kill. He doesn’t understand how anyone could ever hurt Duke when he’s so full of life. 

But he’s safe now. Everyone is; Danny changed the future and what lies ahead is wholly unknown to him.

The world is safe and full of promise. 

No matter what comes, Danny is sure he and Duke are going to be just fine.

[pridequest64]

Klarion The Witch Boy Reading Order

This is, based of my research the complete reading list in release order for all Klarion Comics as of September 24th 2024. Release dates were used when available but compromises were made with cover date when necessary. If you see anything that is wrong or needs new additions feel free to let me know!

(Comic Vine was a massive help with this project)

1. The Demon 7- March 1973

2. The Demon 14- November 1st 1973

3. The Demon 15- December 1st 1973

4. Wonder Woman 280- June 1981

5. Wonder Woman 281- March 5th 1981

6. Wonder Woman 282- August 1981

7. The Demon 3- September 1990

8. The Demon 4- October 1990

9. The Demon 5- November 1990

10. The Demon 7- Janurary 1991

11. The Demon 8- February 1991

12. The Demon 9- March 1991

13. Books Of Magic 4- March 1991

14. The Demon 10- April 1991

15. The Demon 11- May 1991

16. The Demon 12- June 1991

17. The Demon 13- July 1991

18. The Demon 14 August 1991

19. The Demon 15- September 1991

20. War of the Gods 1- September 1st 1991

21. The Demon 17- November 1991

22. Conjurors 1- April 1999

23. Conjurors 2- May 1999

24. Conjurors 3- June 1999

25. Sins of Youth: Batboy and Robin- April 2000

26. Sins of Youth Secret Files- May 2000

27. Sins of Youth: The Secret/ Deadboy- May 2000

28. Sins of Youth: Aquaboy/Lagoon Man- May 2000

29. Young Justice: Sins of Youth 1- May 2000

30. Young Justice: Sins of Youth 2- May 2000

31. Young Justice 22- August 1st 2000

32. Seven Soldiers: Klarion 1- June 1st 2005

33. Seven Soldiers Klarion 2 August 1st 2005

34. Seven Soldiers Klarion 3- October 1st 2005

35. Seven Soldiers Klarion 4- December 1st 2005

36. Infinite Crisis 6- April 5th 2006

37. Infinite Crisis 7- May 3rd 2006

38. Robin 157- February 1st 2007

39. Robin 158- March 1st 2007

40. Countdown 34- September 5th 2007

41. Countdown 33- September 12th 2007

42. Countdown 32- September 19th 2007

43. Countdown 31- September 26th 2007

44. Countdown 30- October 3rd 2007

45. Justice League Of America 46- June 30th 2010

46. Justice League of America 47- July 28th 2010

47. DCU Halloween Special 2010- October 20th 2010

48. Batgirl 18- February 9th 2011

49. Superman/Batman 82- March 23rd 2011

50. Superman/Batman 83- April 20th 2011

51. Superman/Batman 84- May 18th 2011

52. The All New Batman: The Brave and the Bold 12- October 12th 2011

53. Batman: Li’l Gotham -8- September 8th 2013

54. Justice League Beyond 2.0 11- January 11th 2014

55. Batman Beyond Universe 6- January 22 2014

56. Justice League Beyond 2.0 12- January 25th 2014

57. Batman Beyond Universe 7- February 19th 2014

58. Justice League Beyond 2.0 13- February 8th 2014

59. Batman Beyond Universe 8- March 19th 2014

60. The Multiversity: The Society of super heroes: The conquerors of the counter world- September 17th 2014

61. Teen Titans: Futures End- September 17th 2014

62. Klarion 1- October 8th 2014

63. Injustice: Gods Among Us Year Three 2- October 22nd 2014

64. The Multiversity: The Just- October 22nd 2014

65. Injustice: Gods Among Us Year Three 3- November 5th 2014

66. Klarion 2- November 12th 2014

67. Injustice: Gods Among Us Year Three 4- November 19th 2014

68. Klarion 3- December 10th 2014

69. Injustice: Gods Among Us Year Three 6- December 24th 2014

70. Klarion 3- Janurary 14th 2015

71. The Multiversity Guidebook- January 28th 2015

72. Injustice: Gods Among Us Year three 9- February 11th 2015

73. Klarion 5- February 11th 2015

74. Klarion 6- March 11th 2015

75. Teen Titsns Annual 1- April 1st 2015

76. Multiversity 2- April 29th 2015

77. Teen Titans 9- June 24th 2015

78. Teen Titans 10- July 22nd 2015

79. Teen Titans 11- August 26th 2015

80. Secret Six 7- October 21st 2015

81. Teen Titans 13- November 11th 2015

82. Secret Six 8- November 18th 2015

83. Secret Six 10- January 20th 2016

84. Gotham Academy 17- April 13th 2016

85. Scooby-Doo Team-Up 19- October 26th 2016

86. Justice League 33 November 15th 2017

87. Justice League Dark 1- July 25th 2018

88. Sideways 7- August 8th 2018

89. Justice League Dark 2- August 22nd 2018

90. Catwoman/Tweety and Sylvester- August 29th 2018

91. Sideways 8- September 12th 2018

92. Raven: Daughter of Darkness 8- September 26th 2018

93. Raven: Daughter of Darkness 9- October 24th 2018

94. Sideways Annual- November 7th 2018

95. Suicide Squad Black Files 1- November 7th 2018

96. Raven: Daughter of Darkness 10- November 28th 2018

97. Sideways 10- November 21st 2018

98. Suicide Squad Black Files 2- December 5th 2018

99. Raven: Daughter of Darkness 11- January 2nd 2019

100. Suicide Squad Black Files- January 9th 2019

101. Raven: Daughter of Darkness 12- January 30th 2019

102. Suicide Squad Black Files 4- February 6th 2019

103. Justice League Dark 8- February 13th 2019

104. Suicide Squad Black Files 5- March 6th 2019

105. Justice League Dark 9- March 13th 2019

106. Suicide Squad Black Files 6- April 3rd 2019

107. Justice League Dark 10- April 24th 2019

108. DC’s Year of the Villain Special- May 1st 2019

109. Justice League Dark 11- May 22nd 2019

110. Justice League 26- June 19th 2019

111. Justice League Dark 14- August 28th 2019

112. Justice League 30- August 28th 2019

113. Justice League Dark 15- September 25th 2019

114. Justice League Dark 16- October 23rd 2019

115. Justice League Dark 17- November 27th 2019

116. Harley Quinn’s Villian of the year- December 11th 2019

117. Flash Forward 4- December 18th 2019

118. Justice League Dark 18- January 1st 2020

119. Justice League Dark 19-January 29th 2020

120. Zatana and the House of Secrets- February 2020

121. Year of the Villain: Hell Arisen 3- February 26th 2020

122. Year of the Villain: Hell Arisen 4- March 18th 2020

123. DC The Doomed and The Damned- October 13th 2020

124. DC’sVery Merry Multiverse- December 8th 2020

125. Wonder Woman Black & Gold 6- November 23rd 2021

126. Justice League Incarnate 2- December 21st 2021

127. DC VS Vampires 8- August 02 2022

128. The Flash 786- September 20th 2022

129. Batman VS Robin 2- October 11th 2022

130. Catwoman: Lonely City 4- October 25th 2022

131. Batman VS Robin 3- December 20th 2022

132. Lazarus Planet: Alpha- January 10 2023

133. Lazarus Planet: Omega- February 21st 2023

134. Superboy The Man Of Tomorrow 4- July 11th 2023

135. Speed Force 5- March 12th 2024

136. Outsiders 5- March 12th 2024

[dailydccomics]

hunting for bat-suits Batman Beyond 2.0 #19

[aflamboyanceofflamingos]

So I've been dealing with a really bad fever for the last few days, and apparently i had written something i have no recollection of writing so here it is:

~~~~~~~

Tim had dug himself into a hole.

To anyone that knew him, that fact wouldn't be too surprising. Tim had always been a very capable individual, but every now and then he became too in love with how capable he was and he would trip over his own ego. Usually the boy could get out of the messes he created, the sudden humbling giving him a clear head, but this time, he didn't think he could climb his way out on his own. 

The first shovel of dirt of this metaphorical hole came over 4 years ago, lining up with the first shovel of dirt of a literal hole. 

Jason Todd had died. Robin had died. 

Batman was in shambles. 

And 13 year old Tim Drake thought that because of the knowledge he had, it was his responsibility to fix him. 

Batman needed a Robin, and despite what Nightwing had implied, Tim was nowhere near cool enough to be Robin. 

So what would make Batman get his own sidekick? If his enemies had one! Batman would be forced to find someone else to deal with the sidekick while he dealt with the actual Rouge. 

The Joker was obviously out. Beyond the fact that the Joker was horrible, Tim may be joining up with a villain but that didn’t mean he wanted Batman to hate him. 

That meant he needed to find someone Batman didn’t enact a lot of violence on. That got rid of the Scarecrow and the various crime bosses (Black Mask, the Penguin, etc.). Bruce had been close to Harvey Dent, but a 50% chance of death was a percentage that was just a little too high for Tim (oh how that would change). Most of the lower tier Rouges (Kite Man, Mad Hatter, etc.) had gone under after the got wind of Batman's fury, not to mention that Tim really didn't want to spend his days smelling like ketchup. Poison Ivy and Killer Croc were cool, but their skills weren't exactly ones Tim could replicate. 

That left Mr. Freeze, Catwoman, Harley Quinn, and the Riddler. 

The Mr. Freeze was more gentle with kids, their “villiainly” being based on the actions of adults, and the latter three were in it for their own interests rather than the purpose of killing or invoking fear, Catowman wanted shiny things, Harley wanted chaos and fun, and while the Riddler didn't share the same soft spot for kids, he respected intelligence. 

Tim chose Catwoman; the least lethal, and the closest with Batman. The skills she could teach him would also be more helpful in other situations.

It took about a week from the day he knocked on Selina Kyle's door to convince her to train him, but soon enough, a couple days before his 14th birthday and a few more calls to 911 about petty thieves left in the wake of Batman’s grief then Tim would have liked, “Stray” entered the scene. 

And his plan was working! 

The first time Batman had seen the second pair of cat ears he had paused mid ass-kicking of a carjacker and followed the duo, leaving the guy with more teeth then the others.

Slowly but surely, as time went on, the punishments the Batman inflicted started to fit the crime. By the time Tim was 15, he even thought he had seen a small upturn at the corner of Bruce’s mouth as he witnessed a bit of friendly banter between the two cats!

This was when the young villain had started to become a tad bit overconfident. In his defense, he had managed to keep his identity hidden from even Oracle! Lifts in his shoes, a voice modulator, make-up to disguise his facial features, along with a set of the same goggles Catwoman had kept and physical information from being revealed, and Tim Drake never interacted with Selina Kyle so there was no reason that anyone should have suspected him.

That overconfidence is what led him to replicate his plan. If one Rouge sidekick had benefits, then two Rouge sidekicks would mean double the benefits!

Solving riddles wasn’t too hard for the young boy, being able to see double meaning and red herrings was a skill taught to him by Janet Drake, and he took to the escape-room-esque plans for his heists quite easily. The thing he couldn’t figure out was creating riddles of his own. Mother had taught him that knowledge was power, you only reveal it if there was something to be gained, so purposely revealing information about his intention, helping his opponent was not something Tim was accustomed to, not bound to the compulsion to always tell the truth.

If the boy truly wanted to replicate the Riddler, then he would have to learn from the man himself.

Convincing the enigmatic man to teach Tim was easier than it had been with Catowman, the impressive display of bypassing the puzzles that hid the location of the game-playing criminal certainly helping.

Now, 15 years old with an unexplained skill boost in his AP Lang class (the lessons on wordplay were a definite help), The Riddler’s protege, ‘The Puzzler’ became the newest addition to the Gotham Rogues. He resented that name by the way. It was supposed to be Sibyl or Sphinx, they were on theme because they spoke in riddles and though he would deny it, the use of greek figures were his own little way of mocking Oracle, who still couldn’t figure out his identity. But apparently Poison Ivy and the Riddler had brunch once a month (something about being the green Rouges?) and she had heard the Riddler refer to him as “the little puzzle piece” when he was talking about his apprentice and the puzzle theme stuck despite how uncreative the name was.

This is when things became a bit hectic. Not only did Tim have to hide his nightlife from Batman and his parents, now he had to keep his two mentors from realizing that their mentees were the same person. 

He managed to convince Selina that the reason he was so busy lately was the AP classes that came with sophomore year, and while it wasn’t a lie, it certainly wasn’t the full story.

Nygma was easier to deceive. Tim had refrained from sharing his actual identity with the man (just because he would tell the truth in his puzzles for the sake of theme didn’t mean that he would be sharing personal information if it wasn’t needed. The only reason he hadn't hid it from Selina was to gain her trust, something that wasn’t needed with the Riddler) so just saying that he was busy was enough.

All the effort was worth it though. Things kept getting better.

Nightwing was seen in Gotham more often, and Spoiler (someone who Tim initially thought was trying to steal his thing by being a sidekick of the Cluemaster, only to realize she was working against him) had been seen fighting alongside the Batman one or twice. 

On an unrelated note, Stephiane Brown suddenly had her tuition for Gotham Academy paid for in full by the newly created Jason Todd Foundation.

Since things were going so well, he decided to push his luck a little further.

Unfortunately for Tim, he would soon realize the reason he was known for his bad luck in the future.

It started off like other times. Tim convinced Harley Quinn to take him under her wing, and “Ace” made their debut along with Tim’s 5 in AP Psych (Thank you Dr. Quinzel).

Steph and Tim happened to share a few classes together, and went from study buddies (Tim helping her in Chem, and Steph helping him in American History) to close friends.

Spoiler officially joined the Bats, and there were rumors of another bat joining the clan as well. Well there were no actual rumors, but the newest Wayne kid, Cassandra, had started joining him and Steph at their lunch table so her becoming a new bat wouldn’t be too surprising.

Soon enough though, things went to shit.

To start off, the first time Spoiler met Ace, she threw a brick at his head.

Second, His parents had caught him sneaking out and had grounded him, meaning that he now had to wait until they did their last check on his room at 12:00 to sneak out. 

The lack of sleep was starting to catch up to the highschooler. Handling 3 separate nightlife identities was hard enough, but doing so while exhausted was even harder.

After pulling an all nighter to study for a test the night before, he had gone to Selina’s apartment dressed as Ace, and had both costumes not been mostly black he would have been undoubtedly caught before he managed to fix his mistake.

Puzzler once spent a whole night sounding like Stray, and he didn’t think that his “sore throat” lie was all that believable.

Tim accidentally made a cat pun instead of a bat one when engaging in vaguely flirty banter with Spoiler as Ace and Harley had set him down to have the talk, stating that she would love him no matter who he liked and she would be happy to serve as a wingman for him and Catwoman’s protege. It would be funny if it wasn’t so embarrassing.

Third, Cassandra Wayne definitely knew something.

Tim’s “rumors” were right. 2 weeks after Cass had first joined their table Black Bat made herself known. By pinning Puzzler to the ground.

The next day Cass spent the entire lunch period staring at Tim. When he attempted to throw her off by invoking a mix of Stray and Ace’s mannerisms she stopped staring, instead choosing to freak Tim out more by smiling knowingly. At his wide eyes she mimed zipping her lips and throwing away the key only throwing Tim off further. Cass was too smart to not have known, but there was no reason she wouldn’t tell if she did know, right?

Last, but not least, and the worst of all:

Jason Todd was alive.

~~~~~~~

I have no clue where i was going with that last line, but i see a vision, so I'm hoping it will come back to me, but if not, any suggestions or constructive criticism (or a better puzzle themed name for tim) would be helpful

[zahri-melitor]

Thinking about the shape of A Lonely Place of Living in relation to Tim's story and what Tynion was trying to do with it, and it's interesting to me, as I don't think it's his most successful story in terms of a narrative beyond re-establishing and re-centring a character, but he's once again playing with a lot of Tim's storylines and echoing various things (and not just ALPOD though obviously ALPOD, it's in the name).

Like you cannot get around that the story is about Gun Batman, because Gun Batman is right there. But the shape of how that works: it's a recapitulation of Red Robin themes. Because Tim's trapped, and Tim strategises a way to escape from his prison, and he has to cooperate with his enemy somewhat to achieve his goals, and as soon as he gets out the first thing he says to his family, to those he's closest to - is to warn them that Gun Batman is coming for them and particularly for Batwoman. It's SO Yost arc coded.

Gun Batman and Tim's discussions over whether the ends justify the means, and whether killing is acceptable echo through a lot of stories where Tim faces that and refuses to do so (The Young El and Dava arcs in Robin around #50 are always worth pointing out, because people don't know they're there, but of course also Red Robin #26 and trapping Captain Boomerang), but it's interesting here, as the story also establishes...if Tim doesn't even remember who Conner is, this Tim also may not remember having that fight with himself and redrawing that line, and then he gets to do it all over again.

And then we also get to do a Brother Eye aspect of the story, with the intertwined narrative of Bruce's paranoia, Tim's growing paranoia over the years, the echo between those all the way back for Tower of Babel when Tim tells his friends he'd never go so far as to have protocols like Bruce, but we know by 2010 he does have protocols as the life he's led has brought him to that, and what Brother Eye in itself says about Bruce's paranoia and that whole arc of Infinite Crisis and ongoing, about programming and about watching and observation and about control and about the overwriting of control of Brother Eye over the years (want to talk about OMACs and REMACs? there is stuff here to dig out about both) and about the similarities that exist between Bruce and Tim for Gun Batman to be able to exploit this faultline.

And also: you have Bruce's guilt threaded through all of this. Because the last 25 issues have been about Bruce mourning the loss of Tim in his heroic sacrifice, but interestingly in a way that is not like he mourns Jason and not like he mourns Damian, but in a way where he refuses to lose control.

In ALPOD the reason Tim approaches first Dick and then Alfred and then Bruce is because Bruce is losing control as he doesn't have a network. For Tynion's run, Bruce DOES have a network; and not only his family, he has all the other allies that Tim specifically recruited and anchored and befriended and he helped design and set up the Belfry for - a system that Tim sees as greater than himself and that he hopes can sustain things if he is selfish and steps away for his own purposes. But while it works, it's also shaky, because part of what made the post-Crisis Bat family and Gotham network function was Tim's presence as an anchor and a recruiter and a linchpin holding people together, and Tynion is saying things don't work as well without Tim's actual presence, and repeating the narrative that Tim learns over the years - he can't retire, he cannot step away, because when he tries to bad things happen.

Bruce can avoid losing his mind with grief because Tim built him a network (like he did while initially mourning Jason). But Bruce also doesn't allow himself to try to resurrect Tim after his sacrifice; whereas Bruce had to be talked through the 5 stages of grief by family members after Damian's death and then set out on a quest to alternately protect Damian's corpse/find ways to resurrect Damian (it ping ponged back and forth) when it was Damian who was dead.

And Bruce is so mad at himself when he realises that by allowing himself to process his grief like he did with Jason and live through having a dead son, every day, and remember his sacrifice...he's left Tim trapped, thinking people were searching for him and coming for him, when...they weren't. And he starts working to try and find Tim. Especially as Tim lived through Jason's death and Damian's death and Bruce's under-reaction to Dick's 'death' and he knows how Bruce reacted - and he's waiting for rescue. He could expect Bruce to come for him and storm the Gods themselves to get Tim back: because that's what Bruce so recently did for Damian.

Tim came looking for Bruce, because he didn't believe Bruce was dead. But Bruce didn't come looking for Tim, even though he's fought to resurrect another son, and realising that you haven't gone searching for the son who searched so hard for you when you were lost and believed dead? Yeah. Ouch.

And so Tim has to rescue himself and find his own way out - but he comes back still full of belief and forgiveness for Bruce. I also think there's something here in an inflection where Bruce gets the alert as they ARE now looking, and he storms into a hospital to get to Tim, as opposed to Jason's unknown, unrecognised resurrection and HIS hospital stay in Gotham.

The layers are there! There's a bunch of interesting themes! I just really wish it wasn't held together by Gun Batman. Though admittedly it's interesting to me that Tynion's version of Gun Batman posits that this is a universe where Damian was still Batman!666 and Tim had to kill him for it. AND that it can't be the future, because Gun Batman is being torn apart by the timeline, because of the changes made. He's not Tim's future. He's a nightmare, instead.

[heroesriseandfall]

Dick Grayson & Tim Drake: A Photograph

A photo of my family and you’re in it.

Comic sources:

Batman #441

Secret Origins #50

Batman #436

Batman #436

Batman #441

Batman #441

Secret Origins #50

Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1, “Little Wing”

Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1, “Little Wing” [edited]

Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1, “Little Wing”

Secret Origins #50

Detective Comics #965

52 #31, “The Origin of Robin”

Batman #441 - Cover by George Pérez

Red Robin #12

Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1, “Little Wing”

Batman #440

Image descriptions in alt text are also copied below read more.

1. Two comic panels from Batman #441 showing 13-year old Tim Drake sitting in a chair at Wayne Manor, with Dick Grayson in front of him and Alfred Pennyworth standing beyond that. They all have serious expressions on their faces. Tim says, “Okay, you won’t take me seriously until I tell you everything. Dick, I don’t want this to hurt you. And I’m really afraid it might.” Dick says, “Tim, just tell your story, please.” Tim reaches into his jacket as if to grab something and says, “All right, all right. Well, first, my name’s Tim Drake…and though you won’t remember it, we’ve met before. I’ve even got a photograph to prove it.”

2. Text from Secret Origins (1986) #50 that says: A woman with a small boy in the front of the grandstand waved to him. All three Graysons trotted to her. “This is Tim’s first time at the circus,” she said, patting the boy’s thin shoulder, “and we were wondering if you’d let us take your photo with him.” “Of course,” Mother replied, smiling. “We’d be delighted.”

3. Comic panels from Batman #436 showing John and Mary Grayson in their yellow, green, and red circus costumes as they walk through the circus with a young Dick Grayson between them. John says, “Dick, I’ve got those tickets for the baseball game monday.” Dick grins up at him and says, “You really got ‘em? Wow! I can’t believe I’m actually going to the World Series.” Someone off-panel says, “Umm, excuse us for interrupting, but—” The Drakes walk right up to the Graysons. Janet is in a pink day dress and Jack is in a suit, holding a very young Tim Drake in his arms. Janet says, “This is Tim’s first time at a circus, and we were wondering if you’d let us take your photo with him?” Mary Grayson puts her hands on Dick’s shoulders as Dick grins up at little Tim, who smiles down at him in response. Mary says, “Of course…we’d be delighted.” They all pose for a picture with the crowds behind them. Jack and Janet stand between John and Mary, while Dick kneels in the front holding young Tim up on his knee. He looks down at Tim, who looks back, and with a smile, Dick says, “Tim, say cheese.”

4. A comic panel from Batman #436 showing Alfred Pennyworth’s hands holding out and gesturing towards a photo as he says, “Gentlemen, and ladies—the very last photo of the Grayson family together. One last moment of happiness.” The photo shows the Grayson and Drake families together in the same poses as the previous image. John and Mary Grayson stand on either side of Jack and Janet Drake, while Dick kneels on one knee with his other knee up, where he is holding young Tim to sit on the knee. The parents are looking forewards, but Dick and Tim are looking at each other. The Graysons are all in their circus costumes, but the Drakes are in suits and Janet a dress.

5. A comic page from Batman #441. The first panel shows Tim Drake, who is sitting in a chair at Wayne Manor and holding up a photo of the Drakes with the Flying Graysons while Dick Grayson is standing in front of Tim’s chair. Tim says, “This was taken on my first trip to the circus—on the day I saw Batman for the first time...On the day your parents were killed.” Dick Grayson looks shocked, and takes the photo as he says, “Oh, my god—my parents.” Alfred Pennyworth, standing behind Dick, says, “I—I know this photograph, that’s you?” Tim looks up at them and says, “Uh-huh. After Bruce Wayne made you his ward, my parents sent it to you. They thought you’d want it. I was only a kid, but I don’t think I’ll ever forget what happened. I had nightmares about it for years. First about your parents, then about Batman. I kept seeing this dark black thing that swooped out of the sky. No, no—let me start at the beginning.” The scene changes to a gold-toned memory of the Drakes walking through Haly’s Circus. Janet is in a light dress, holding Jack’s arm as they grin at each other. Jack is in a suit, holding a young Tim who is also in a suit and has a big smile on his face as he reaches towards a passing Clown. Janet says, “I think you were right, honey—he loves it. Look at him laughing at everything.” Jack replies, “Hey, I said he wasn’t too young.” Janet says, “Okay, I was wrong. But sometimes circuses can frighten kids.” The Drakes walk through the circus, toward where you can see the Flying Graysons walking together. Janet continues, “They’re loud and rowdy, and I remember when I was Timothy’s age I was scared by people wearing costumes. Sue me. I'm a mother. I worry.” Jack says, “You were a girl. Tim’s a boy. That’s the difference.” Janet smiles up at Jack and says, “Sexism, dear? And here I thought you were liberated.” Jack follows Tim’s eyesight toward the smiling Flying Graysons as they walk past, then says, “Okay, okay, I’m sorry. Look, if you’re so worried, there’re a couple of the performers. Let’s take him over there. He’ll see they’re people just like him.”

6. A comic page from Batman #441 showing a gold-toned memory scene with the Flying Graysons, all in acrobatics costumes remniscent of the Robin suit, and the Drakes, who are wearing formal dress. Mary and John are smiling at Dick walking between them as Dick excitedly says, “—I’m actually going to the world series?” Beyond him, Janet and Jack Drake are walking up to them, with Jack holding a very young smiling Tim in his arms. Jack says, “Umm, excuse us for interrupting, but this is Tim’s first time at the circus…and we were wondering if you’d let us take your photo with him?” The two families pose, with Dick on one knee with Tim Drake sitting on his other knee, held up by Dick’s arms. Tim stares at Dick in wonder as Dick smiles at him and says, “Tim, say cheese.” 13-year-old Tim speaks through a narration box to say, “Maybe I knew you were just a kid like me, but I kept staring at you, and your circus costume. It was bright red and green and you seemed so happy in it.” In the memory, Dick pats Tim’s head as he gets ready to leave, and says, “Watch me on the trapeze, Tim. I’m going to do my act—‘specially for you. Be good now.” Then the scene returns to the present, in regular color, showing 13-year-old Tim sitting in Wayne Manor while Alfred and Dick look at him. Tim says, “I don’t remember the clowns or the animals, or anything else. I just remember waiting for you to go on. And then, when you did, I just sat there and watched.”

7. Text from Secret Origins #50 that says: The photo was snapped and the Graysons returned to the darkness of the backstage area and did the stretching exercises Johnny Grayson insisted precede every performance. On the other side of the canvas wall, the crowd was laughing and applauding the clowns’ fireman routine. They heard the ringmaster’s round baritone, amplified and distorted by the loud speakers, booming through the tent. “Ladies and gentlemen, children of all ages—for your entertainment and amusement, doing their death-defying act without benefit of a net—” Johnny kissed his wife and ruffled his son’s hair.

8. A comic panel from Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1, the fourth story, showing Tim Drake and Dick Grayson sitting on a couch in Dick Grayson’s apartment. Tim is on the left wearing a pink and purple Gotham Knights jersey with a matching hat. He’s pointing at Dick, who’s turned to listen attentively to Tim while wearing a white tank top and gray sweats as he clicks a TV remote. Tim says, “Dick, meeting you—and him—have been the single most defining moments of my life.” The scene changes to the memory of the Drakes and the Flying Graysons posing together in Haly’s Circus while someone who is just a silhouette takes a photo of them. John and Mary are standing on either side of Jack and Janet with wide smiles, each in their red, yellow, and green acrobatics outfits. John’s and Dick’s outfits look particularly remniscent of the Robin outfit. Dick is kneeled in front of the parents with one knee up where young Tim is sitting on his thigh, smiling and looking at Dick. 14-year-old Tim narrates this memory by saying, “Some days I wish I could go back to feeling like that. You promised me that you’d do a quadruple somersault. And you delivered. It was the best day of my life. And then your parents died.”

9. An edited comic panel from Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1 of very young Tim Drake with his father’s arm on his shoulder, both looking up at John and Mary Grayson falling. John and Mary are in their red, yellow, and green acrobatics costumes, knees bent and arms stretched with one part of hands barely touching. Behind them, their acrobatic lines are snapping. Crowds in the large tent are yelling and pointing up at them. Tim’s face is not visible but he’s clearly watching them fall.

10. A comic panel from Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1 of nine-year-old Tim Drake staring at a TV screen, on which Robin is visible mid-flip, arms holding his legs tucked in. The Penguin is croached with his back turned to Robin, directly in position for Robin to land on him. Audio from the TV is saying, “Wanted for theft of the Lapis Lazuli Horus Crown, the so-called Penguin was apprehended by the Batman and a young costumed vigilante…” 13-year-old Tim narrates the memory of his younger self, saying: “You gave yourself away with the quad. The ringmaster told the crowd at Haly’s that only three people alive could pull off a jump like that—you and a pair of Russian gymnasts that defected from the Bolshoi to Ringing Brothers. I knew it was you.” Off-panel, Dick Grayson responds to Tim’s recollection by saying, ”Incredible. A nine-year-old kid figures out the best-kept secret on the planet.” In the memory, just beyond young Tim in the background are Jack and Janet Drake at a table, with Jack looking like he’s speaking angrily.

11. Text from Secret Origins #50 that says: Below, the ringmaster was saying, “Ladies and gentlemen, quiet, please, as young Dick Grayson attempts the in-credible…im-possible…quadruple flip of doom!” Dick breathed deeply and slowly, relaxing himself as Johnny had taught him, grabbed the bar, pushed off the platform, letting momentum carry him— But was something wrong? The trapeze didn’t feel right. —and allowed his mind to empty, and there were the few dizzy, exhilarating instants: spin spin spin spin. Feet thudding onto the platform. Roar of applause. Mother’s warm fingers touching his cheek. Ringmaster’s boom: “Let’s hear it, ladies and gentlemen—dauntless Dick Grayson, the boy wonder of the circus!”

12. A comic page from Detective Comics #965 showing a warm-toned scene of 13-year-old Tim Drake talking to a gobsmacked Dick Grayson in Wayne Manor. Tim says, “C’mon, Dick—that flip you did as Robin. It was a quadruple somersault. The circus ringmaster said only three people could do that.” Tim holds up a photo of the Drakes with the Flying Graysons, and continues, “I knew that somersault. Knew it like I knew my own name.” Tim smiles and says, “And it all made sense. Batman showed up at the circus and took you with him. About six months later, Robin made his first appearance. If you were Robin, and you were Bruce Wayne’s ward—I realized Bruce Wayne was batman.” The scene zooms out to show Tim sitting in a chair as Dick and Alfred Pennyworth stare at him. Tim says, “I don’t want to say the rest was easy, because you guys really covered your tracks. But if you go in knowing Bruce Wayne and Dick Grayson are Batman and Robin, well, you can find the clues to prove it.”

13. Comic panels from 52 #31, 2nd story, “The Origin of Robin.” 9-year-old Tim Drake is shown from the back, sitting on the floor staring at a TV screen that shows Dick Grayson as Robin, flipping through the air. Tim’s face is reflected in the TV screen, showing his awestruck smile. Various objects are scattered on the floor in front of Tim, including pizza, books, and a magnifying glass. Orange narration boxes say, “The eyes of a fan caught a moment the rest of the world had overlooked. Tim Drake—and Tim Drake alone—had grown up fascinated by the career of an obscure and forgotten child acrobat named Dick Grayson—but when Tim saw Batman’s partner Robin perform Grayson’s signature gymnastic moves, something clicked in Tim’s mind.” The next panel shows Tim in a trenchcoat, expression awestruck as he shines a flashlight through a glass case in which a pristine Robin costume is hanging. The narration boxes continue, “Over the next few years, Tim—through a series of clues and lucky breaks—proved conclusively that Grayson was Robin…or, rather, had been.”

14. George Pérez’s cover art for Batman #441, cropped to focus on the lower half. Dick Grayson, in civilian clothing, is standing in the forefront of the image, with the 80’s Batcave looming around him. He’s looking down with a pensive expression at the Robin costume held in his hands. Behind to the right, Tim Drake (also in civilian clothing) is standing with photographs falling out of his hands in front of Dick’s shoes. The closest photo shows the Flying Graysons posing with the Drake family. The next closest two photos are of Robin and Batman. Beyond Dick and the photos, to the left, is Alfred Pennyworth. Up at the top, partially cropped away, are Batman and Two Face’s lower faces, with a scene of a bridge by Batman’s face and a flipping coin with a scene of Gemini casinio behind it right next to Two Face’s face. In the Batcave, the giant penny, the T-rex, and the massive batcomputer are all on prominent display.

15. Comic panels from Red Robin #12 of Dick Grayson talking to Tim Drake with a blurry aquamarine Batcave behind them. Dick is wearing the chestplate of the Batman suit but no cowl, as he looks intensely (with the slightest smile) toward Tim, who is shirtless, revealing long pink scratches and scars along his shoulder and cheek. Tim, looking up at Dick, says, “Ra’s—” Dick says, “Gone. We swept the place and got nothing. You want to tell me what that was all about?” Tim replies, “It’s...a little complicated. But I think we’re good for a while.” Dick says, “How’d you know? How did you know I’d be there to save you?” Tim smiles up at Dick as he says, “You’re my brother, Dick. You’ll always be there for me.”

16. A comic panel from Secret Origins 80-Page Giant #1 showing Tim drake and Dick Grayson sitting on the couch in Dick’s apartment. Dick is reaching over to mess with Tim’s hair as Tim laughs and leans away, raising his hands to jokingly defend against Dick. Behind them in the apartment is a desk with a computer whose screen is lit up with a woman’s sketchy face. Dick says, “Got a friend visiting.” Barbara Gordon, over Dick’s computer audio, asks, “Anyone I know?” Dick says, “Little brother.”

17. Cropped art from Batman #440 of a cool-toned photograph with the Flying Graysons and the Drake family posing together. The Flying Graysons are all in their acrobatics outfits. John and Dick Grayson’s outfits are styled similarly, looking like a mix of the original Robin suit and Tim Drake’s first Robin suit. John and Mary are stood to either side of the smiling Jack and Janet Drake. Jack is in a suit and his hands are resting on Janet’s arms. Janet is wearing a day dress. In front of all the parents, Dick Grayson is down on one knee, with his left knee up so little Tim Drake can be perched on his thigh. Tim is in a a suit, similar to his father, and he’s looking up at Dick with a broad, awestruck smile. Dick is holding Tim in place with his arms, and instead of looking toward the camera like the parents are, he’s meeting Tim’s eyes with a smile. Behind them all, the crowds of Haly’s Circus are vaguely visible. In the corner by Dick’s right left, 13-year-old Tim Drake’s thumb is resting on the photograph, as if he’s holding it.

[kaneandfeels]

SO A LOT OF YOU ASKED A LOT OF QUESTIONS So we answered every one we were asked

1. What is an element of your story that surprised you?

How quickly the Holmes and Watson dynamic we used as a writing crutch entirely flipped through our characters growing and developing. Feels became the star rather than the sounding board in a way that is really organic and good - Jack

Its scope. I had dabbled with absurdism before Kane and Feels, but never gone full existential horror. I’m more of a like quiet melodrama type so i love that jack was able to get me writing more esoteric bullshit- Oli

I don’t know if it's surprising, but there’s a tenderness to a lot of the series that I wasn't expecting when we started. It sets its tropes out strongly, and then the characters interact in that space and take it in wildly different directions, while remaining true to the genre. - Jude

2. Is audio drama the only medium you've worked in? How does it compare to other mediums?

Audio dramas are the only form I've ever received feedback for really, I have a literature degree and I am constantly making stories but I don't really have any other published works like this. - jack

I’ve studied in other mediums, but not worked in them. I’ve done bits of filming at school but found quickly my talents laid in sound. - Jude

I’m an audio nerd, through and through. Started as a musician, became a DJ, wrote a sitcom, did a degree, made some docs and factual programmes and then it's been audio dramas since then. It's a difficult medium to master but a rewarding one when its’ done right. - Oli

3. What are some audio dramas that inspire you? Both in general and for your podcast.

Welcome to nightvale was a big early touchstone, the work of Dirk Maggs like batman knightfall meant a lot to me as a child, I had it on cassette tapes

HItchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy (the radio series) is a big one. I listened to it religiously when growing up. Neverwhere was another one that inspired me from a sound perspective. The shifting brickwork always tickles my brain. - Jude

I listened to a lot of HP as a kid, while going tobed. I graduated onto the BBC7 ‘Comedy Club’ which played a mix of half hour sitcoms and stand up comedy vehicles between 10 and midnight when I was going to sleep… occasionally I would drift into the ‘seventh dimension’ where I’d hear the man in black, Blake 7 and all other sci-fi horrory affairs.  When Nightvale turned up, that was a game changer, cause it opened the field to people like me to go make audio dramas without the clout of the BBC behind us. Same with Wooden overcoats. 

More specifically though, there is a direct line between Aker and Blacker’s “beyond Belief’ on the Thrilling adventure hour’ and the early drafts of Kane and Feels

4. Who is a character that took you by surprise?

Councilman Geoff Grace. Go listen for why - Jack

Jeanine (the housewife) wasn’t surprising, but she was shocking. I just loved her framing and existence in the story. It's one of those ones where you can feel the screen on the scene. you ‘re looking in at this strange commercial of a woman as she lives this warped 50’s vibe. - Jude

For me, its the monster from wonderland. I had this idea for something grotesque, that pulled apart the idea that words don’t hurt. Of course words hurt. That’s why they can lead us to violence or action or whatever. So I had this idea of a monster who said words ‘scar from the inside’. Jack said ‘this is great, what is this monster?”…. And i hadn’t thought that far ahead. I said ‘I dunno, that’s your job, spookyman’ - so suddenly its the voice of the goddess of spite, we get Vivi P, the most terrifying italian woman ever to grace our studios to do her voice, and then pepper her in through out the series making her a serious big bad. Didn’t know she’d have that milage considering it was essentially a joke about sticks and stones breaking bones. - Oli

5. If you're the writer, how did casting/producing change how you thought about the podcast?

No one gave a fuck about our opinions on this particualr subject. - Oli

6. If you are a voice actor or audio editor, what is your favorite blooper moment?

There's a line with constituents in season one episode 4 that I just couldn't say - Jack

I think a lot of our weird bloopers end up in the show, either as the take or buried beneath some stuff. Season 2 is lousy with them, from Chippie’s final monologue to the sound of me and Oli in Thornbush’s charity shop. To even the joke about Paul Bearer in the final episode. - Jude

There’s one take we never used, where Ali Cambell, Jeanines’ actor, improvised a story about their first hamster. In the story, she crushes it to death. We loved it at the time, but it was arguably better than anything any of us had written so I personally coward’d out and didn’t put it in. - Oli (Id’ forgotten about that - Jude)

7. If you could make a crossover (canon or non canon) with any other audio drama, what would it be?

Am I allowed to say ‘Camlann’? Even though its very recent we’d slot in very well.or Victoriocity - Jude

I mean, I want to be on hello from the magic tavern, but not as kane - Jack

Sandman. Wanna work with Dirk. or What’s the Frequency or if Rose Drive ever resurrects.  - Oli

8. What is an inside joke or reference that is hidden in your podcast?

So many wrestling kayfabe references -  Jack

I always think of ‘GET BACK VILE BEAST’ *dunstan throws a spanner at a bird* - The real joke is that a lot of the rocks from St Dunstan made it into Camlann episode seven when the hill opens up into the underground.

The inside joke for me is the loops. “Jude’s discount Loops” - hacking these beautiful pieces of music that Oli has made and getting them to work. They’re all like 14 minutes long and there’s chopping that needs to be done. 

9. What are some of your favorite podcasts to listen to?

World Beyond Number. Westminster Insider, Too many Tabs, Chapo Trap House. I’m a trash person who listens to trash. (other than WBN, most exciting actual play on the scene RN) = Oli

Is it terrible I’m more of a music person? I’m currently spiraling back into Nonagon Infinity by King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard. I listen to old audiobooks to sleep. At the moment it's the good omens radio series with Mark Heap and Peter Serafinowitz. - Jude

I have an elaborate weekly schedule of podcasts I listen to, my current favorite is 'mom can't cook'

10. Are the podcasts you make / enjoy making the same kind you enjoy listening to (genre, formatting, etc)?

I mostly listen to character improv comedy and comedy reviews of film and wrestling. A little bit of D&D actual play too. so I guess... no? - J

I can’t just say ‘I don’t listen to podcasts’... I mean I can and I don’t. - Jude

No. - Oli

11. Free space! Tell me something cool about your podcast!

The music is crazy good - Jack

The Sound Design is once in a generation. - OliThe writing is ambitious and exciting - Jude

[extraordinary-heroes]

Batman Beyond Vol 6 50 (Cover Art By Dan Mora)