#BB!Thornclaw

[bonefall]

Can I hear more about Villain Thornclaw? The way you described him is a really cool take on his character.

He exudes a sense of detached ruthlessness, something happened and he just never got over it, most of the time he is a model warrior, but sometimes he says something or gives a cold look, and that hints just how much he is willing to do for his beliefs

The first warrior that Firestar named becomes his most insidious enemy.

He was too young to clearly remember Clawface snatching him and his little sister, but he does remember the way it became an early fixation. His favorite games were always reenactments and play fights, and his father Lionheart and kidnapper Clawface would be characters in them. He often would go too far and play rough, actually biting or scratching his playmate.

We, in the real world, may recognize this as a way kids often process trauma. But they don't have cat therapy here.

And quickly these fixations became unsettling. Brightkit didn't like these games, and their older siblings were disturbed. Frostfur reacted strongly and tried to intervene, but it didn't help the way they wanted.

He got good at hiding it, and he got better at finding other ways to express his fixation. He never knew Lionheart, but he DID know Grandma Speckletail, and she would tell him all about the ways he could be like his dad. When you don't know a person, they can be anything you want them to be.

Turns out if you dress up "I'm obsessively xenophobic of foreign cats and want to rip them to shreds" as "I will ferociously avenge my father and uphold his legacy," suddenly you're golden! It's that simple!

(it's almost like clan culture didnt actually value peace or kindness and just encourages you to channel ur violence towards specific ends)

Thornkit went from Grandma Speckletail to Mentor Mousefur, and she continued to cultivate this. There's a time and a place for aggression. Be good to your clanmates. Use words in camp, not claws. She made a good soldier out of him.

When ThunderClan had a reckoning with Tigerclaw and his ideology in TPB, during his coup, the line of thought that went through Thornpaw and the cats like him was that Tigerclaw was the problem. Who could have known! A shock! Sickening!

...for a while they were "better," devastated by his betrayal, more openminded. But minds don't always trend towards progress.

Eventually, Thornclaw backslid. Let's not throw out the kitten with the tonguewash, here. Yes yes, Tigerclaw was a damn traitor and a hypocrite, but there's worse cats to look up to, you can't deny his nobility, that some of his ideas were great for ThunderClan, that there were lofty ideals he merely took from our grand and glorious history and we can return to those days...

What is so terrible about being a thistle? To lash back when you are attacked? To defend the meadow for you and yours?

We can have Tigerclaw's good aspects without the bad, surely?

And Firestar...

You must understand it's nothing personal. Firestar's a fine cat, for a kittypet. There is no hate for him. But we can't have a leader who stops ThunderClan from engaging in honorable combat. The Clan has become too mixed, and he punished him simply for expressing his concerns. What other choice is there? To do nothing as the clans are destroyed from the inside out?

Bluestar brought wildfire to the forest, to burn it to the ground. Firestar is Thornclaw's natural enemy-- and so is every cat like him.

[rewritedesigns]

Goldenflower

A blue classic torbie and white molly. (ll, RR, ReRe, lplp, whwh, LyLy|XOXo, BB, dd, dmdm, Aa, mcmc, spsp, tata, bmbm, ii, wbwb, EE, ShSh, CC, kk, Wswg|acac, sfsf, JbJb, mm, RtRt, mkmk, pdpd)

(More under the cut)

BIO

Name:

Goldenflower

Clanmew Name:

Rreenponma

Yellow: Golden, orange-yellow (Rreen) + Flower (Ponma)

Previous Name:

Goldenkit, Goldenpaw

Family:

Daughter of Speckletail and Smallear. Sister of Lionheart, Mistleclaw and Snowkit. Aunt of Cinderpelt, Brackenfur, Thornclaw and Brightheart. Mother of Swiftpaw, Star Brambleflower and Tawnypelt. Ex-mate of Star Tigerclaw. Grandmother of Flametail, Dawnpelt, Tigerheart, Alderheart and Sparkpelt.

Rank:

Senior Warrior (Queen)

Notes:

She has braids

She is generally less fluffier than her brother bc of this

She can be sweet but she also has a sharp tongue like her mother

Is an efficient cat

[warriors-official-art]

Title: Into the Wild

Arc: The Prophecies Begin

Type: gold collection illustration

Country: Russia

Artist: Natalia Sokolova

Characters: Whitestorm, Yellowfang, Runningwind, Brackenkit / Brackenfur, Cinderkit / Cinderpelt, Brightkit / Brightheart, Thornkit / Thornclaw

Source: https://warriors-cats.fandom.com/ru/wiki/%D0%9A%D0%BE%D1%82%D1%8B-%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%B8_%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8

[genwc]

Blossomfall x Mousewhisker

I refuse to believe that Thornclaw sired these kits when Mousewhisker was a perfectly acceptable option, even from the "they got close during dark forest training" angle

Even if we go with Thornclaw, phenotypes would be the same

Eaglewing- black tortoiseshell molly

XOXo Bb Dd aa mcmc spsp ii WW CC wsws

Plumstone- black tortoiseshell molly

XOXo Bb Dd aa mcmc spsp ii WW CC wsws

Stemleaf- ghost classic tabby, ginger and white tom

XOY BB Dd aa mcmc spsp ii WW Ccs Wsws

Shellfur- chimera black and ginger tom

XoY BB Dd aa mcmc spsp ii WW CC wsws

XOY Bb Dd aa mcmc spsp ii WW CC Wsws

[bonefall]

Why is Spiderleg so into the title, is his method of coping with any amount of guilt and a publicly shaming by self flagellating himself back into the clans good graces and so he doesn't actually have to think about things too deeply?

That might be the deeper psychological reason, but on a more surface level, he feels like shame is repentance, and really does equate piety with guilt. So he performs it like an actor.

What is "accountability"? Truly? Can you define it? If you've done wrong... how do you DO it? Spiderbite answers that question with this.

"See how I'm being punished? Watch how I perfectly obey my leader, a blessed envoy of StarClan, whose word is the code. I am so righteous now, I am holy through trial. Let StarClan fill me as their vessel, for I am but a humble servant." -Spiderbite, in his thoughts

And that feels good. It's simple. Having agency over your difficult emotions just feels fantastic. Every winceful word to tone it back a bit, every twinge of discomfort in anyone else's face, is a sign of persecution-- because they don't have, "the connection I have." They just don't 'understand'. They aren't as strong, in their faith or conviction, as he is.

He was Thornclaw's apprentice, and was given Thistle Law as an ideology from adolescence... and yet, he went on thr Great Journey, made Paw Soup with the other apprentices of the time. Lost his brother Shrewpaw to human destruction. Followed his mentor into the Dark Forest and felt intense guilt over the (unwanted) kits he accidentally sired with Daisy.

Basically. This guy is messed up in a lot of ways. He's got an unsettling coping mechanism about it.

[bonefall]

How was the Mousefur “mixed” clan meeting received in BB!?

Mmmmmmmmmmmbadly

Dustpelt, Mousefur, and Thornclaw took reputation hits for the stunt. ThunderClan is the Fire Alone Clan and they got up there to put forth concerns about kittens. Lil baby kittens.

They ended up getting shouted down, any cats who leaned Traditionalist were probably willing to admit "concerns" in private, but the minute someone like Squirrelflight bellows, "BOOO" and her buddies join in it's pretty hard to argue against an angry crowd.

I need to find a better way to word this but someone should get a little bit of a sassy moment, "let's go chuck the kittens in the lake so we can unlock Queen’s Rights 2"

If Frostfur is still alive at this point, she is incredibly disappointed. She probably talks to both Thornclaw and Dustpelt about it privately, but somehow, she expected it of Thornclaw who hung out with Grandma Speckletail too much.

Dustpelt?!

"No, please, don't speak just listen. I want you to think about Ravenpaw. Do you remember what Tigerclaw made us believe about him? How they made you think he inherited more of your Honor Sire than you? So that everyone believed he was a weakness to purge for being too mixed? ...I was reminded of that, today."

Lays awake that night next to Ferncloud, unable to sleep, SUPER embarassed and hot with shame. It dawns on him that Tigerclaw probably targeted his in-law Brindleface because she agreed to suckle Cloudkit and also had an Honor Sire for Fern, Elder, and Ash.

Thornclaw never gets an apprentice after the stunt, Spiderleg is permanently his only. He realizes that he blew his chance at deputyship under Firestar FOREVER by backing up Mousefur's impromptu rally, and is one of the Dark Forest's first targets when they start recruiting in Po3.

Mousefur retires, feeling old, tired, and being publically shot down BADLY.

[bonefall]

The DF causes Russetfur's death in bones au :0? It's not lionblaze who accidentally kills her anymore?

Lionblaze will still be landing that final blow, in defense of Bramblestar! That guy who publically disowned him and started treating his mom like trash! Lionblaze hates that he was put in this situation, but has decided that ThunderClan must be prioritized above all...

And that unfortunately means defending its leader, too.

This battle was brought to you by Thornclaw, the deputy who replaced Squirrelflight. He is a Dark Forest Trainee, the strongest of the living DF cats, demon apprentice of Clawface. Bramblestar wanted a deputy who would be tough, and got a lot more than he signed up for.

Bramblestar is very easy to offend, and has a large ego. He doesn't want to be Firestar-- he wants to rule in his own way, and that means abandoning the humility and diplomacy that Firestar concerned himself with. It didn't do them much good when WindClan and RiverClan both teamed up to "teach ThunderClan a lesson," did it?

Brackenfur is dead, and Brambleclaw became temporary deputy in his place. The permanent appointment must be a sign, then.

Thornclaw exploits this MALICIOUSLY. Bramble is an excellent pawn, with the help of a dozen smarter cats behind him, he is the evil advisor that encourages Bramblestar to throw his weight around and not apologize for "making ThunderClan look strong."

And the more lives Bramble loses in these pointless battles, the closer he comes to becoming Thornstar.

That's the new plan. Say hello to Villain Thornclaw!

[bonefall]

BB!Moonpaw's Family

So, I don't rewrite arcs until they're done BUT!! HAVE NO FEAR IM HERE TO FIX IT.

You may have heard that Moonpaw's canonical family has been confirmed, Thriftear x Bayshine, and that it makes her a real doozy of inbreeding. The most important thing being that she is the product of a first cousin pair because Thriftear's father Fernsong and Bayshine's mother Sorrelstripe are full siblings.

But I am the family tree trimmer and I'm here to do a little pruning!

First of all, I've already done significant work in overhauling the ThunderClan Family Tree. Today I've made a more lightweight chart for showing off the options better, but please do go and check out the full version if you'd like to see the generations further back. It also has a link to my "diagnosis," which is handy for comparing my fixes to the problems with the canon tree.

So just to nip this in the bud; Thriftear and Bayshine are no longer first cousins in BB.

That's already fixed! I'm going to change it anyway but I just want that to be like, the first thing you know going in.

Second of all, now's a good time for a little refresher on my Three Strict Rules. These are the rules I use for overhauling the family trees; determining when cats are far enough apart, preventing one bloodline from getting too prolific, and when a fix is required.

Like before, click the link to see the rules more in-depth. Put simply, these rules are;

Three Generation Separation Cats must be three or more generations removed in order to be eligible as partners. That means they cannot share a simple grandparent, banning 1st cousin pairings. Further than that is typically allowed-- Clan sizes are too small to be more restrictive. ADDENDUM: Onestar's Exception. This rule applies to an extra generation, the great-grandparent, if one or more simple grandparents are alive to connect them all. This bans 1st cousins once removed (FCOR), like what Breezepelt and Heathertail are in-canon, and usually second cousins if I can help it.

Two Kit Max Any given pairing may only have two kittens who have successful grandchildren. If three or more kids have grandkids, one of the bloodlines will have to be pruned in some way. This is to prevent "superparents" who decimate the diversity. ADDENDUM: This applies per-Clan. Cats can leave their birth Clan and not contribute to their parents' "limit." Dovewing is now in ShadowClan and does not count towards the rule.

One Parent Litters Invoking the Queen's Rights allows for a cat to have kittens without a second parent. Sometimes these kittens are fully adopted. ADDENDUM: This is an in-universe rule. Ergo, other cats can and will have feelings on a cat who invokes this. That said, I don't always decide who that secret parent is beforehand!

With all that said, let's talk about the relevant differences in BB vs Canon, and the three options for who Moonpaw's parents are going to be...

Relevant Differences

So that we can narrow in on the ancestors that are relevant, I've gone and made a little version of my bigger tree.

Everyone in YELLOW is active in ThunderClan. PINK indicates that they may or may not remain there past ASC, either because they'll move or because they'll die. The ORANGE line tracks cats that are counted as Firekin.

(Note: Sunbeam, Twigbranch, and Finleap were left off this list since they're not relevant atm)

Spiderleg, Toadstep, Hazeltail, Sorreltail are still alive in BB.

However, in exchange, Molewhisker, Brackenfur, and Thornclaw are dead.

Cinderheart is off on adventures with Fallenleaf, who went through a whole thing

Mousewhisker and Nightheart will probably end up in RiverClan by the end of ASC.

Rosepetal will probably end up dying somewhere near the end of ASC OR in the BB overhaul of Ivypool's Heart. She will likely be Squirrelstar's first deputy.

Fernsong is an ex-kittypet. His name was Fiddles.

Because of a change in who dies in The Battle of the True Eclipse, Sorrelstripe is named Duststripe.

Because Ferncloud is the one to confront Ashfur in the Dark Forest instead of Graystripe, Graypaw is named Fernpaw.

Squirrelflight is infertile and unable to have bio-kits. Bramblestar disowned his children with her when the secret was revealed, and had a litter with Jessy. Sparkpelt is not Firekin-- her mate was.

Ivypool and Dovewing were swapped for Spotfur and Duststripe to keep the Firekin family consistent.

Larksong and Hollytuft have been fused into the same cat; Hollylark.

Hollylark was a poorly understood magical being. Xeir death prompted xeir parents, Cinderheart and Fallenleaf, to go on their journey.

Eaglewing, Honeyfur, and Leafshade are in my back pocket in case I need them elsewhere.

Snowbush, Dewnose, and Ambermoon were surrogated for cats in other Clans, but I still haven't placed them yet. Icecloud, now born AFTER the Battle of the True Eclipse, is taking any relevant roles for them.

Duststripe had kittens with an unknown sire, invoking the Queen's Rights to do so. I haven't thought about who this secret father is.

SO, as you can see, this tree is already significantly less tangled than canon's. If I just went with Thriftear x Bayshine, their last common ancestor was a great-great-grandmother (Frostfur), making them third cousins. On the other side, they share a great-great-great-grandmother (Nutmeg), making them fourth cousins.

These are both so far removed that most people don't even actually know their 3rd and 4th cousins. This is more than distant enough to not trip Rule 1.

That said... no 💕I don't care for this coupling 💕They haven't even talked in canon I am simply going to veto it 💕

Personally I've always seen Bayshine and Thriftear as being gay, so I'm going to move ahead with that in mind because it's MY AU and I get to homo the sexuals.

OPTION 1: BAYSHINE REMAINS I simply swap out Thriftear for her brother, Flipclaw, making Moonpaw into a FlipBay kitten.

This is the most canon compliant fix I can make. This is probably what I'm going to settle on as a default, unless and until we learn more about Changing Skies. OR, of course, someone makes a convincing and juicy argument.

Thoughts;

This closely matches canon. They can't possibly throw a curveball at me that I can't fix with Thriftear lesbianism. YOUR MOVE, WORKING PARTNERS.

I need more MLM ships, I'm actually really lacking those, so this would be a good opportunity.

BB!Bayshine and BB!Flipclaw will actually have really nice chemistry. Flipclaw's a silly boy who's known as the one example of a Firekin cat who can't live up to the legacy (something that likely used to cause him to quibble with Nightheart, back in the day). Bayshine is kind of a worrywart who actually appreciates Flipclaw's sense of humor and prefers a mate who doesn't give him heart attacks via heroics.

I feel like that'll bounce nicely off Moonpaw as well, since she's probably going to have a very serious story attached. It'll be nice to just write her having very supportive parents who listen and care.

Plus with her parents being Mr. "Always Worried" and Mr. "Fire Failure," I don't have to worry too much about legacy or status while still keeping her a Firekin. These two guys don't have a lot of power to leverage to help her get the Clan to believe her, if I need to keep a plot point.

OPTION 2: THRIFTEAR REMAINS I do some tweaks to put her with Plumstone, making Moonpaw a PlumThrift kitten.

More of a tinker than a tweak, but something I'm at least considering. I've been outspoken about how much I like PlumThrift, so I absolutely want to make it canon to BB. That said, I do like the idea that the two of them just don't have kids. Not all mates HAVE to have kittens.

Plus, it would come with restrictions anyway becaauuuuseeeeee,

It trips Rule 2, the Two Kit Max.

If Shellfur and Fernstripe have kittens, which I HOPE they do because good lord Canon!TC needs it, I couldn't let PlumThrift Moonpaw go on to have successful kittens of her own. Blossomfall's kittens would start to take over ThunderClan.

This is especially strict in BB because there's no way in hell I'm not going to have Shellfur and Fernstripe have some kittens. So help me god, I will pull Leafshade, Honeyfur, and Eaglewing out of my back pocket.

Moonpaw not having kittens isn't a bad thing, though. I'd happily do it, it's just that I'm trying to anticipate canon throwing a curveball at me.

BB!Plumstone and BB!Thriftear would probably have a more strained dynamic to their daughter, which might match canon very well if the team goes for the angle of having Moonpaw resent how she's seen as very special.

Both moms are overachievers, and very ambitious warriors. Thriftear is Firekin and living up to that legacy, and Plumstone is probably gunning for one of the head positions in the Clan.

It's not that they're mean or bad to her, it's that they'd have high expectations which might cause friction. Again; depends on where canon goes with Moonpaw's story.

Honestly, knowing them and what they want out of their lives, I can kinda see Moonpaw being something they didn't plan. Like she was an abandoned kitten they found and felt like it was a sign from StarClan, or somehow one of them accidentally got pregnant.

Which could be super interesting, honestly.

Option 2 might end up revealing itself to fit better than Option 1, but I need to see what the arc has in store first.

OPTION 3: TOTAL PARENT CHANGE Moonpaw is given to a non-Firekin couple that could have kits

This is the biggest change, but one I'll do if it's an important plot point that she's NOT Firekin by canon's wahoo logic. I already killed the inconsistency with MY family tree fixes, but the writing team seems to only count Firekin down from Squirrelflight's biokids.

So if I have to comply with that for some reason, I'll shuffle her over to one of these two couples;

She could either become the daughter of Stormcloud and Cherryfall, OR Shellfur and Fernstripe.

StormCherry:

Stormcloud actually got a massive glowup in BB lmao

Cherryfall and Stormcloud were previously sort-of-courting, probably-dating, in a weird situationship sort of thing. Unofficial only because they never made it official.

If Moonpaw is their kid, she'd definitely be what makes it official.

I feel like Stormcloud is better suited to being the Mi, but Cherryfall would insist that she acts as it instead. And Stormcloud knows better than to argue with her, she's the most stubborn thing you've ever met.

She's a knucklehead. He's a gentle giant. I feel like they'd be fun as parents.

But also a bit more absent compared to the other options, which could be good if that's a plot point... but seems unlikely, considering Moonpaw was apparently named because her parents believe she's special.

This one's the MOST clean of any bloodline Moonpaw could be wriggled into. It would actually be super useful going forward honestly. StormCherry kits are compatible with all of the cats of the next generation except Firekin.

If Moonpaw has a ton of siblings I might put them all here just for that... but something tells me she's going to be a singlet tbh.

ShellFern:

I have a weird fondness for these two tbh. Can't explain it. I like grumpy assholes and their sweethearts.

It's super unlikely that these two don't get kittens of their own at some point, but it wouldn't be too big of a problem if I did shuffle Moonpaw in as their first child.

I would enjoy having a little window into their relationship, I used ShellFern for an example of what a post-Lake Aftergathering looks like once just because I like writing about them.

They wouldn't "get in the way" of the plot, either. Shellfur and Fernstripe are both pretty standard warriors, not super ambitious, they have hobbies but they're not reaching for a high status or anything.

If Moonpaw ends up being a little bit of a snarky character, it would be fun if she got that from papa Shellfur lmao.

Aaaand that's it! I don't rewrite arcs until they are done, and as of writing this, even ASC isn't totally completed yet! But there's the pre-emptive options for a fix that is definitely going to happen.

This poll isn't binding because I really need to see which of these options will FIT the best, but I'm curious,

[bonefall]

BB!Honeyfern -> Honeysnake

A girl who's gonna be stealing a little more time in BB.

[ID: The Better Bones version of Honeyfern. She is a spiky, golden, blue-eyed cat with a brown mask and stripes. Her torso, paws, and 'boots' are creamy. She is being bitten by an adder, and prepares to bite back]

Clanmew Name: Mlashiff, Mlasis (Mla = Honey + Shiff = Frond, the leaf of a fern) (Mla = Honey + Sis = Serpent, generic term for snakes)

Alignment: ThunderClan

Relations: Parents - Sorreltail, Brackenfur Siblings - Molepaw, Cinderheart, Poppyfrost Ex-Mate - Berrynose Apprentice - Briarlight

Honeyfern stands tall as the strongest, most ambitious kitten in the Brackenfour litter. Through BB!Po3, she is a rising star in ThunderClan, and Hollypaw's rival. Honeyfern's ferocity was only matched by her compassion; in early BB!OotS, she doesn't hesitate to lay her life on the line to attack an adder in defense of Briarkit.

After fighting for several days against one of the worst injuries Clan cats know of, Honeyfern survives, and is bestowed the Honor Title of Honeysnake before even getting her first apprentice.

(One of the first completely uncontroversial choices that Bramblestar makes!)

But, the painful ordeal causes Honeysnake to realize things about her boyfriend, Berrynose. Traits that had once been endearing were suddenly not so cute. Boldness comes across as selfishness. Protectiveness becomes controlling behavior. His 'sense of humor' means he doesn't take things seriously.

If only it could have been so simple to just leave him. No, she never would have guessed that the week she left Berrynose, he would immediately become interested in her sister. Poppyfrost!! What are you doing?! GIRL

With her uncle Thornclaw as deputy and far too busy for an apprentice anyway, it's obvious who Briarkit's mentor must be. The brave cat who saved her life became her guide and best friend, staying by her side through every hardship until her fateful death during the Battle of the True Eclipse (BOTTE).

LOTS more under the cut!

Honeysnake's personality is firm, responsible, and occasionally overly proud of herself. At the same time, she is driven by kindness more than anything else, and would break her own back to lessen the burden on her clanmates. She takes after her dad, Brackenfur, more than any of her siblings!

Because she massively values her own strength and her helpfulness, she can be goaded into overexerting herself and bossing around other cats. She doesn't mean to be pushy, but her heart is so large that she sometimes fails to realize that she's only made things worse. Big sister energy!

She must learn to balance this; a flaw is often a value in excess.

When she was an apprentice, her personality could really clash with Cinderpaw's.

Cinderpaw is very emotional, to the point of instability. Honeypaw couldn't understand that Cinder had to learn to work it out on her own, and sometimes inserted herself into her problems

This would make them both upset, as it wouldn't work and then Honeypaw would scold Cinderpaw for not taking her unsolicited advice.

In spite of all this, they love each other and got closer when they got older. It's ironic that Honey and Poppy would eventually be the ones fighting-- they NEVER fought as kids!

She fell in love with Berrynose after he developed a crush on her. Honey hadn't really thought much about romance before then, but she fell hard.

Berrynose was bold and exciting. She was always the one chasing after other people, finding ways to help everyone except herself. To BE pursued instead felt flattering, even freeing. He could be REALLY mean, yeah... but that was endearing, for a time. It felt like honesty, and it was refreshing that he would just say the things she would hold back to be polite, or diplomatic.

They were getting serious before the snake, which is now shuffled to happen in the first book of BB!OotS

The energy in ThunderClan had been... off, for a while. Since Hollyleaf had revealed the secret of her parentage and vanished, uncle Thornclaw had replaced Squirrelflight as deputy, and Leafpool was demoted as Cleric.

The couple had been discussing kittens and such, something uplifting so things could start to heal and move on.

In hindsight, they were normal adult discussions. In Honeysnake's reflections, something is ironic about how mature Berrynose had been just before the incident. Like he really was growing up, for a while.

Was he truly getting better? Or was that just a side of him she stopped being able to see in the new light? She'll never know.

The fight with the adder is burned into her mind, in extreme detail.

She remembers being cuddled next to Berrynose from the second level of the camp. She remembers the way her stomach dropped when she realized, from her vantage point, that a branch-shaped object under the wall was slithering. How she screamed for Briarkit to get back and bound across the quarry faster than she'd ever moved before.

The snake bit her first, and then she bit it back.

Venom from an adder burns. It quickly spread up her paw and through her arm, searing her veins like fire. She crumpled into a screaming heap next to her dead foe, sending the entire camp into a panic.

Jayfeather, already overwhelmed through being a new Cleric working alone after Leafpool's demotion, having recently been publicly disowned, and still mourning his sister, had to spring into action

And the very first crack that Honey noticed on her mate was how Berrynose threatened Jayfeather. "You'd better save her, if you don't I'LL kill you!"

Jayf didn't even dignify it with a response. She was glad he didn't. She didn't want Jay doing anything but helping her not have burning blood.

An adder bite is one of the deadliest, most painful, difficult injuries to treat across all four Clans. She required round-the-clock care and was in constant pain, for days, without guarantee she would survive.

And Berrynose was unhelpful, to say the least. Even going so far as to wrinkle his nose when Jay chewed up a mouthful of nettle for Honeyfern's treatments.

What she once found funny and endearing wasn't so cute when he couldn't be serious when she wanted him to be.

Leafpool, ex-Cleric, started stepping in to help Jayfeather in the den... against Bramblestar's demotion. Jay had never treated such a serious injury before, the rest of the Clan didn't stop needing treatment

The Clan was already a bit split on the idea of Leafpool not being a Cleric anymore. She's Leafpool Moonpool. She made mistakes-- but what else are the Queen's Rights even for?

Has she not already been punished? And what about Honeyfern, their clanmate, who needed her help right now?

And Bramblestar would NEVER prevent Leafpool from giving an injured cat from getting the proper treatment they need..........

But, of course, Berrynose was more loyal to his mentor than almost anything else. He had concerns about an unholy, codebreaking ex-Cleric attempting to heal his mate, and what it would mean for Bramble to rescind an earlier command.

Honeyfern, obviously, didn't care if StarClan themselves had come down to say Leafpool Bad. She wanted to not suffer and die.

And after monumental effort on the part of two trained cats, the entire Clan doing their part to support her, and Honeyfern's indomitable will to survive, the burning cooled to embers and the pain subsided.

She survived the bite of an adder, killing the beast in the process. An achievement that was so impressive that ThunderClan concluded she MUST be truly blessed.

Bramblestar is stingy when it comes to Honor Titles, but for this? He could not ignore it. The Clan needed a morale boost. She had survived the insurmountable. Everyone had come together over this situation, in a way that they hadn't in many moons.

So, as soon as she could stand for a ceremony, he decreed before their ancestors that the venom had been an anointment (thornclaw came up with that line). From now on, she would be known as Honeysnake, in honor of her survival.

It's rare that cats who are so young receive such Honor Titles, and it immediately boosted her up in status.

Berrynose was jealous of this. Not in a way where he'd say so openly, but in the way he would downplay her Title, not celebrate her achievements, or use it to deflect in conversations.

The breaking point was when the newest crop of apprentices was assigned, and Bramblestar decided that Honeysnake was absolutely ready for her first apprentice.

(Millie's three kits, despite being a little older than Dove and Ivy, were slightly delayed in their apprenticeship so they could all be apprenticed at once)

Hazeltail and Mousewhisker had proven themselves strong and competent, ready for their first apprentices. Mousewhisker was given Bumblepaw, Hazeltail receives Blossompaw.

To make sure there weren't too many young mentors, Birchfall was given Dovepaw, and Brightheart received Ivypaw.

And, lastly, to commemorate her strength and honor how she'd saved this child, Honeysnake was given Briarpaw.

...leaving Berrynose as the only cat of his litter without an apprentice! While Bramblestar, HIS mentor, was leader!!

But instead of being upset with Bramblestar, he felt Honeysnake had taken what he'd been owed.

Maybe some other time, Honey would have tried to comfort him, and make him feel better about it all

But she was DONE. That was ENOUGH coddling! SHE was the one who had gone through all of that, killed an adder and saved Briarpaw, and now he feels so entitled to an apprentice that he's upset with HIS MATE?

Poppyfrost, meanwhile, had been watching the ceremony of the apprentices with a forlorn gaze... and was about to get sucked in.

Without getting into Poppyfrost too much here, her key traits are Curiosity and Avoidance. Setting boundaries has always been difficult for her, or saying no to people. So when Berrynose turned his sights on her following his breakup with her sister...

Poppyfrost felt good. She felt desirable, for the first time since she'd given birth to Jayfeather's secret children. She hadn't shared with anyone how low she'd felt for the past 6 months, and it suddenly felt like there was a light in her life.

From Honeysnake's perspective, though, Berrynose found a whole new way to get into her life through Poppyfrost. Poppy started taking his side, or at the very least, not supporting her sister. Honey couldn't get away from Berry without avoiding Poppy, too. So the fights continued.

But, the most important thing in Honey's life quickly became her apprentice.

Briarpaw was attentive and enthusiastic, a bright little ball of light and hope. Honeysnake had a lot to teach her and she listened eagerly

But Honeysnake couldn't save her when the tree came crashing down.

Briarpaw lost control of her back legs, and it was immediately, widely accepted she would not be able to become a warrior.

As Jayfeather spoke with Littlecloud about how to treat her and give her a good quality of life, picking up the "notes" for Wildfur's old mobility device, Millie started becoming very controlling of her daughter.

At first, Honeysnake tried to give the family space... she didn't know what to do, if it was right to get involved or not.

After all, Millie is Briarpaw's mother. She just wants what's best for her, and Honeysnake wasn't sure how much Briarpaw could do now either. She loves her apprentice, so she didn't want to hurt her, or ruin her family by accident.

But then she started to realize how miserable Briarpaw was becoming. She was always such a joyful kid, so excited to get out there and try everything. A radiant little fireball, eager to fight for her Clan.

Now, she was silent, just letting her mother speak for her, only ever piping up to comfort her own parent.

Her quietness wasn't coming from her injury-- it was coming from how Millie was making her feel like her life was over. Like it would have been better if she died, since it was hurting her mom so much to "see her like this."

One day something hit Honeysnake, like a revelation. "I never stopped being her mentor. It's STILL my job to be there for her!!"

She couldn't completely stop Millie from making Briarlight feel awful. She couldn't prevent Blossompaw from misplacing her anger on her sister. She couldn't make Graystripe do his job as a dad to help his kids.

But Honey could be there for Briarpaw. She could be a safe place to talk, a friend and a mentor, and just get her away from Millie for a few hours a day.

And she was even wise enough now to realize that arguing with Millie directly would only make things worse for the young cat. Everything was for Briarpaw, what SHE needed. How to help her.

Together with Jayfeather, they'd even planned out how to schedule things so that Briarpaw could speak for herself without Millie interjecting.

For Briarpaw, it meant everything. There were people in her corner.

Though she couldn't pass an assessment in the usual way, Bramblestar still allowed Briarlight to get her full name. After all, she, like her mentor, had survived the unthinkable.

Honeysnake had never been so proud of anything in her whole life.

And at the end, just before the Battle of the True Eclipse when the Dark Forest was going to attack, they had a final conversation. Watching the moon inch closer to the sun, and knowing it may be the last time they ever spoke.

Briarlight said something she'd been holding back for a long time. "I'm sorry I couldn't be the apprentice you deserved..."

It made Honeysnake's belly lurch. After all they'd been through, to hear she was still holding onto a piece of what Millie made her believe was painful. "What...? I didn't save you to make a warrior. I did it because you have a life to live. Brili, I'm your mentor. I'm supposed to deserve you."

It turned out to be exactly what they suspected, the last words they'd ever speak to each other. Honeysnake fought ferociously for the Clans in the BOTTE, reunited with her old rival Hollyleaf and putting her quarrels aside. She meets her fate halfway through the night, in the bloody Second Wave.

Her death fills ThunderClan with sorrow. She's deeply mourned by everyone; her mother, sisters, friends, nespring, Clanmates. But most of all, Briarlight holds her memory close to fill her with strength in the coming years.

Honeysnake's spirit is invoked for fulfilling one's full potential, and making hard, painful choices to reach it. As the generations go on, she's associated with the shed skin of snakes and beetles, and the 'necessity' of putting oneself in danger to help others.

OTHER TRIVIA

SPIKY. I decided to give her Brackenfur's colors with Sorreltail's texture. She's the most intensely-colored of her siblings, BRIGHT golden, hence the name.

She's also got Sorreltail's torso marking going on, and her fuzzy 'dividers.' She got the boots from Brackenfur though.

In BB, she has Sweetness Tolerance! Ironically enough, she is able to taste and enjoy honey... and boy does she like her sauces.

Her favorite food is honey-glazed bacon, meat strips cut from the belly of a boar. A rare treat but a delicious one. She likes to eat the whole thing like a noodle, chewing it upwards and not using her paws at all.

As a kit, Brackenfur used to tell her to mind her manners. She had a bad habit of eating things without using her paws, because she likes sauce but not getting it on her beans.

She had her eyes on deputyship from a young age. She wanted to be just like her dad.

Losing him was rough. It was even harder when Bramblestar took power just a few months later, she felt like she should have been seeing her dad making the announcements...

But, she stayed strong, especially for her siblings who seemed to be taking it even worse.

Canon doesn't mention what sort of snake bit her, but BB takes place in northern England and the only venomous snakes there are ADDERS babey!!

I drew a girl adder on purpose because something felt very funny about this. here I go pitting two bad bitches against each other. diversity win! The wild animal that tries to eat a baby is a girl!

ADDERFACT: A female Vipera Berus is brown, a male is black and white, but their color can vary immensely.

Bramblestar is a terrible namer. Honeysnake, Mlasis, is a fine name, but he chose the generic term for all serpents (sis) instead of an adder specifically (sipya). In his head it sounded more honorable.

But! It's not the worst!

"Honeyfern" was given by Firestar, and intended to be a nod to her rivalry with Hollyleaf! Hollyleaf's suffix referred to the leaves of most trees, and Honeyfern's to the leaves of ferns.

Both them were named after Brackenfur, who they both looked up to. Brackens are a type of fern, and Firestar wanted to invoke a plant for the names of both cats.

Because Honeyfern was named first and also Brackenfur's child, she got the word for fern leaves.

Of course *Holly*leaf was already named after a plant... but no one ever said Firestar was a FANTASTIC namer either, after all, he's the genius behind "Brambleclaw."

Honeysnake's relationship with Poppyfrost was stable at the time of her death, with her two young nespring having been born... but if it was ever going to "improve," who knows.

but they were cordial. At the very least. She would have been involved in the lives of Mole and Cherry.

Unfortunately there's always a lot left unsaid when someone dies so young. She had a whole life in front of her, cut short because of Tigerclaw's ambition.

[bonefall]

considering spiderleg is like *that* and squirelflight being diehard fire alone i cant imagine them being friends in BB like they were sort of in the canon books. were they or did it disolve after time passed and spiderleg got more into traditional/thistle law. also who were her other friends? i saw daisy was in another ask but who else (really eager to know who booed at mousefur and thronclaw lol)

So to begin with, Squirrelflight is in an odd place, generation-wise. She is born while Firestar is on his quest with Brokenstar, and grows up in a period of peace and prosperity.

Unfortunately she keeps failing her goddamn assessments

So while Leafstripe is a fully trained Cleric, Sorreltail recovered from being hit by a car and graduated, and Ashfur tried to hold out for her for a while before moving up, Squirrelpaw is here absolutely eating leaf litter with her wrecklessness

Goldenflower, her mentor, even tries to tell Firestar that she's not being vindictive, just in case he got the wrong idea. He assures her that, no. No he understands <:/

So Spider, Shrew, and Squirrel end up as apprentices together. There was a time where they were really close, getting in trouble in spite of their three strict mentors. Bad influence trio, all of them coming from respected parents and doing their best to embarass them.

That only started to change when Squirrelpaw went on the Great Journey, but then returned just in time to see Shrewpaw die. A lot of things were different, now. Squirrelpaw came back exalted for being on a holy quest. Spiderpaw had watched a lot of his clanmates die. She was spending more time with Brambleclaw; he had become very protective of his little brother, Birchkit.

They had both grown in a flash. Hard times will do that to you.

During the Great Journey, Spiderpaw was really close to the other Clan apprentices while Squirrelpaw hung out with the Sundrown Patrol. Spider looks back at this time in his life with a lurch in his stomach that he can't put into words.

He was there when Paw Soup was made. Talonclaw and Smokefall were friends of his even more than they were friends of little Birchkit. Spiderleg just left it behind when they got to the Lake, where his little brother never could. Clan loyalty, strength, honor... all that. He felt like he had to make a choice.

As a person, Spiderleg is torn in many directions by all of the things that happened to him. His head-of-construction father, his educator mother, his friend who won status by breaking the rules, three dead siblings before his warriorhood, the destruction of his ancestral home, the journey that challenged everything, his mentor Thornclaw, the backfired meeting, ardor for Daisy, crashing down with unwanted kits...

His consistent trait is that he's easily swept up in whatever fills him with the most passion, tossing himself into things until a bubbling sense of disgust makes him break it off. Regardless of if it was the good thing to do or not.

Religious euphoria and self-flagellation just seems to stabilize that impulse, for him.

The last time he was friends with Squilf was during their vigil upon reaching the Lake. They did it together, because they were both long overdue. He thought about Shrewpaw, and wondered if she did too.

But neither one of them broke the silence between them. They still haven't.

[bonefall]

Golfy is literally one of my favorite cats of all time and I adore the way you’ve characterized her!! Any fun tidbits to share? I want to know more about the woman

There's a sketch of her floating around if you want to go on a treasure hunt! I don't have time to look for it right now (I am currently in the trunk of a clown car), but I've actually drawn a beta of her design and her big mane

Also note: BB!Goldenflower is part of the Doekin line. Speckletail's perception of herself and her family is tied strongly to being Doestar's niece. This association dies out with Thornclaw in BB!OotS as he's the last one to strongly value this legacy.

Golfy's mane is so poofy, unmanageabley poofy. She keeps it braided

Lionheart just surrendered to entrophy on that one lmao. "Dirt happens."

It's my little way of trying to show the difference between the siblings.

They're both proud and honorable, but Lionheart is more calm and patient. He's a Que Sera Sera kind of guy.

Goldenflower is more fond of the expression, "Fortune favors the prepared."

Note to self: Clanmewnize these expressions. Que Sera Sera is notably quite RiverClannish... Golfy's phrase is definitely from early ThunderClan

Not to get too distracted but I recently got this FANTASTIC idea for how to close out Book 3 of BB!DOTC on a bittersweet note, involving The First Boarhunt and Clear Sky being delightfully devious as always. Maybe it would be cool to put that phrase there... anyway.

She had three siblings total, Lionheart, Mistleclaw, and Snowkit. It's really difficult being the last one; family was extremely important to her.

Mistleclaw wasn't even a year out of apprenticeship; you're really considered an ADULT adult after being on your own for a year. Losing her was like losing a sibling who's college-aged. That was to the plague, before Firestar's arrival.

Smallear was openly the father of all four of them, but Goldenflower hesitates to call him Ba. Him and Speckletail had a really toxic on-again off-again thing.

Smallear was closest to Mistleclaw, who coincidentally looked the most like him. Goldenflower is like... "yeah thats what i expected of him, that fish-eared loser"

She's biased in favor of her mother though. Lionheart was more chill with Smallear; not CLOSE but, neutral-positive.

It wasn't entirely Smallear's fault that the relationship kept falling apart though, to be clear. I use toxic in this use very much on purpose, it wasn't abuse, they really cannot get along.

So when Goldenflower eventually picked a mate, she REALLY just wanted a stable lifepartner that would not be like that.

I would describe her relationship with Tigerclaw more in the terms of an "arrangement." Fishing for romantic information from her is VERY funny because she just like. Doesn't "get" romance.

Brambleclaw: "Mom... what did you... like about dad?"

"He was large, we were both very large. And he was a responsible warrior, respected and ambitious. Well... at the time we believed that. And he spoke with great confidence. He had a way of making you feel like you were both safe and powerful by his side."

It will not even click for her that most people don't open the answer to "why did you love x" with "he was tall like me"

(VINE BOOM AROACE FLAG)

She wanted kits and a partner. She doesn't regret the relationship, she regrets what he made her believe.

On Tigerclaw's end, it was mutual. They both liked each other as trusted Clanmates. He was attracted to her and reciprocated when she proposed a mateship, but I don't think he ever really got over Spottedleaf romantically.

Plus, getting into this family was a smart political move. Having Speckletail's approval was VERY useful.

I might stick Goldenflower as Head of Hunting through TNP to early Po3, until she trains a successor, since there's no rush. I have an allegiance list floating around but I can't remember off the top of my head if she's where she should be

She's actually super disappointed in Tawnypelt for her choice. I don't think they ever reconcile this, they're both too proud

So she's kinda iffy on that alliance with ShadowClan. Not to the point of spite, but she does easily believe stereotypes about them.

"A bunch of holdouts of TigerClan and duplicitous fiends over there."

Both Golfy and Tawnp miss each other a lot, but again. Neither one is going to apologize to the other or say the other was even slightly correct.

And Golfy wouldn't accept it if Tawnp even did. She made her choice. They're in different Clans now. She chose her father, who killed Swiftpaw and Lionheart.

And for that, Golfy will not forgive her.

If they ended up in a battle, neither would hold back. They both know this.

I'm really fond of her. She really is Speckletail's daughter and the whole family has a special flavor of pain and pride.

[bonefall]

So I decided to read through Bramblestar's leader ceremony from the original Ultimate Guide today- and I had a thought: have you chosen what cats give him his lives in Better Bones already? Granted, I'm sure you'll gut some of the canon placements for not knowing him in life (Lionheart) or being alive by the time he becomes leader (Goldenflower, Ferncloud, Mousefur) but Bluestar imparting clear judgement is a fun virtue considering his actions are anything but. Plus, Jayfeather could always gripe about it when he argues with Bramblestar. 'Wow Bramblestar, you sure displayed clear judgement when you asked me to let Sunrise BLEED OUT IN CAMP!'

I hadn't picked yet actually! I also haven't read his leader ceremony in aaaages. I never really liked it, felt full of TPB fanservice and didn't really say a lot about Bramblestar as a leader.

(But tbf that is probably because the writers have no idea what they're doing with him. He's generically noble and they have a double standard against female characters, so they just use his man pain to make the girls in his life feel wretched without examining WHY having defiant women in his life bruises his ego so easily)

But anyway, I don't have a FINALIZED thing yet, but here's a rough draft. It's a total overhaul. A big difference in BB and Canon is that Bramblestar is leader BEFORE the reveal, and long before the Battle of the True Eclipse. So all of these picks have to be from Po3 and before.

(BB context: Firestar was killed offscreen during the Fire Scene in an assassination, Ashfur took advantage of the situation to attack the Three. It was an arson set by Whiskernose and carried out by Thornclaw, Breezepelt, and possibly Harespring. Ashfur is still on the run, suspected of killing Firestar to hurt Squilf because he failed to hurt her kits)

(also if you want FULL full context go look at BB!Hollyleaf's character summary)

Gorseclaw -- Righteousness. His progenitor ancestor who set history into motion by betraying his siblings during Ripplestar's Rot, and whose curse continues down through the generations. He tells him he's proud. He SEES how much he's struggled. He's had to make hard choices that everyone else thought would be easy, and he understands. But he's done the right thing... and he tells him to keep doing it. Bramble briefly feels hot with shame-- did he really have so many ancestors in the Dark Forest that he had to hear from someone so ancient? Tigerstar, Pinestar, Oakstar... this life unsettles him and sets the tone for the rest of the ceremony

Snowcarve (Snowkit) -- Opportunity. The last time Brambleclaw saw his little uncle, he was carried off by a hawk after shoving one of them out of the way. He stands as a proud, starry adult before him: the age he would have been. He "speaks" through unfamiliar glyphs that form beside his head, and Brambleclaw knows somehow that this is the writing that he had been working on before his death. Snowcarve commands that he watch for that which he would have missed, to listen to those who are different and have new ideas, for opportunity is silent and tender. If your mind and heart are closed to what could have been, you will miss your chance and never know what you could have had. Brambleclaw tries to bring up that he's sorry he didn't save him-- Snowcarve taps his ear and shakes his head, giving him a stern glare. The words say, "you did not need forgiveness. It was my choice and I have never regretted it." In fact, he can wave his tail and welcome the next life;

Yellowfang -- Judgement. She asks him, "Would you ever blame a kitten for what someone else did?" Bramble is confused, "Of course not?" "Then stop blaming yourself for what others have done for you. I ran back into that fire to save my herbs and leeches. I put myself there, and Firestar knew that. Stop confusing blame for experience, guilt is not wisdom, pain is not good judgement."

Feathertail -- Kindness. A little bit of understanding goes a long way. When you get wrapped up in your anger, or your fear, slow down and consider the feelings and intentions of others. You'll find that most people are good. (He accepts the life but stops himself from arguing with her-- ok, sure, but what about everyone who isn't? He has a bit of a thought spiral wondering if the wise cat he'd travelled with had changed or if she was ever wise at all)

(Idk which elder is dying in Po3 yet, if it's Frostfur or Mousefur, but one of them gives a life) -- Confidence. There was a time where their own judgement lapsed, and they pinned their anger on him. They apologize for it, and tell him that this life is for living in spite of that. The strength to mind that you can't control what other people think of you, and the firmness to commit to what he believes is right.

Brackenfur -- Negotiation. To remember that every action sends a message, to understand that you must remain calm and make the right concessions to accomplish greater things. Don't let emotions like anger, offense, and spite cause you to ruin something you may have worked hard to build. (Brambleclaw is by the halfway point totally missing the point that these cats are trying to teach him nuance and mindfulness, and mostly feels betrayed and confused. He knows most of these things... and did the elder not just tell him to have confidence in himself in spite of people who hate him?)

Speckletail -- Courage. When everyone runs away, you run TOWARDS. People will rely on you now, and StarClan will give you the power to protect them. No storm, no beast, and no tyrant will find its way through you. When he takes the life he feels the rage and FEAR she did when she ran towards the bulldozer, the pride in her power as she attacked the human, and learns that Thornclaw was wrong when he told them she looked satisfied on the way down. After kicking him out she was terrified, but overwhelmed by relief and LOVE that her grandson was safe. It makes him collapse, and as he gets back up he's in tears, asking "i thought this was a life for courage, you were afraid!!" And Speckletail puffs her chest up proudly, "Courage is being terrified and doing it anyway."

Swiftpaw -- Acceptance. He has no warrior name. He has no adult form. When Brambleclaw asks him for his title, he simply says, "I give you this life to know when to accept what you cannot change, and the wisdom to see what you can't control." Brambleclaw can't help himself, this ceremony has been a horrible experience, "what a terrible life!" Swiftpaw dips his head solemnly, "yet without it, what a terrible death." But Swiftpaw also reminds him, this is not a part of his life that he cannot change. He can move on with only eight lives, and he will understand. But Brambleclaw says no, "I have a clan to protect. This is one of the things I can't control." He is surprised by how soothing the life is when he gets it though. He doesn't feel any of Swiftpaw's pain as he died. It's not about that. It's the quiet embrace of the void, the shouting as the patrol finds him and Brightpaw, falling away into silence, accepting that he is dying, and that it's okay to let go.

Firestar -- Trust. It HAS to come at the end.

Firestar opens up by asking Brambleclaw what's wrong, seeing how exhausted he is. He responds, his voice trembling, "I hoped it would be reassuring, but I feel more lost and powerless than ever. How can I be responsible for so many people? How will I protect them all? I will be blamed for everything that goes wrong and never know if I made the right choice!" Firestar goes hm, genuinely and sympthetically, "Those are very heavy and legitimate doubts for a new leader to have. I felt the same things when I was in your paws. He waves his tail, "So, I will give you the value that it took me many years to learn, something you were not given and so feel you cannot give. With this life I give you TRUST. You will face many trials in the near future, Brambleclaw. Your truth will crumble. Secrets will be revealed, friends will turn out to be foes, those you think are enemies may be allies, but you must not lose the ability to find the good in all of them. Remember that trust is a choice and an honor. Apply it wisely, but bestow it generously."

Bitterly, but with what dignity he can have in this situation, Bramblestar murmurs sadly, "So there will be betrayal, but I must still trust? I had hoped that you, of all ancestors, would not speak in riddles"

Though the world is blurring and the spirits of StarClan are fading away, he catches something pained and complex in Firestar's expression. Like he has so much to say, doesn't have the exact words to express it, and he's running out of time to find them.

"There were no riddles," he shouts already sounding far away, "Listen to what we have told you and you will find the way!"

(Basically he's shouting "WE WERE VERY STRAIGHTFORWARD ACTUALLY!!!")

We wouldn't get to see this happen in Cruel Season though, since it would be offscreen and not important to the plot of that book. I'd rather get it into Bramblestar's Thorns, which is about Alderheart, Sparkpelt, and the ways that they've been impacted by him as a toxic father.

The ceremony is written to highlight his major flaws. Especially the way that he's bursting with doubt, pain, and immediately tends to make things about himself without realizing. Bramblestar is a very unhappy person, and he often extends that misery to other people.

he's a tragedy to me, man. All these people turning out to tell him that love and faith exists for him and he can't even see it.

Anyway, bonus, some other thoughts for possible lives; (still possible some of these guys get swapped out)

Lionheart, his uncle, who died before he was born. He'd give a good life for wisdom but I think these others are a lot stronger.

Birchface, one of his Tigerkin ancestors in StarClan. Decided against him in favor of Gorseclaw; I think Gorse's both more interesting AND his distance is a good point of doubt for Bramble. They had to go back 4 generations to find a direct ancestor who isn't damned to hell. Birch would have just waffled about admitting mistakes anyway, still too fearful to admit that he is responsible for getting Frecklewish and Oakstar damned.

Bluestar, a leader who contributed to the death of his brother and mistrusted him when he was young... but honestly I feel she is kinda irrelevant. He didn't know her well.

Elderberry, one of his apprenticehood friends and the twin of Ferncloud/older sister of Ashfur. It could be cool for her to give a life of mercy and ask him to be rational about Ashfur's crimes (starclan won't say outright that Ashfur didn't do it because they're not entirely sure he was uninvolved until after his death in a few chapters, Dark Forest influence hiding the assassins), but it's actually a lot more important that StarClan is trying to warn him about the LEADER he will be and fatal flaws he will display for arcs and arcs, not waste a life on teasing the plot of a single book.

Cinderpelt, his cousin who died tragically. There's no reincarnation thing so she could be here to give a life, but I think the current list is a lot stronger.

Lynxkit, his oldest sister. Strongly considered her for acceptance but I think Swiftpaw's WAAAY stronger and I don't need both of them.

[bonefall]

Hey I was wondering how do the Clans generally treat a cat who killed another in battle, and how easy it is to kill a cat by accident? I always hated how canon treated it where if a ThunderClan cat killed a cat from another Clan, it's an accident and could have happened to anyone battles are just risky like that, but if another Clan cat kills a ThunderClan cat they are treated as a ruthless murderer who did it on purpose when they could have easily won the battle without killing. In BB, what will the reaction be to, for example, Hawkheart killing Moonflower?

I've always been able to accept that as cognitive dissonance in-universe, though some examples (LOOKING AT YOU, LEOPARDSTAR'S HONOR) end up seeming ridiculously out of character for the sake of the plot.

It makes sense to me that Canon!Firestar would have some bias towards Lionblaze, for example, or that the fact the POV is closer to him would let us see his Russetfur kill with more sympathy.

But, in BB, it is MASSIVELY contextual based on the warrior, the situation, and how badly the clans want to maintain relations. So I have to use a few examples;

Hawkheart vs Moonflower

Pinestar massively regrets this battle, and that he listened to Goosefeather. Destroying herbs before leafbare is an evil thing to do. Why would StarClan ever want this...?

He must trust their wisdom, their grand plan, their mysterious ways, but... he feels disgusted with himself. Moonflower is dead now. She leaves behind young daughters.

So his talks with Heatherstar are quiet and solemn. She is gracious enough to admit that Hawkheart went too far, and Pinestar is humble enough to admit he was acting as a loyal warrior.

So in an attempt to maintain decent relations, Heatherstar makes some good deals in Pinestar’s favor. She makes payment of flax and herbs, and makes an agreement to help in case of a greencough outbreak for the next year.

Bluepaw is colored by resentment towards Hawkheart for many years, until she becomes friends with Hoprunner and Ashfoot. Suddenly, it puts it into perspective.

Thistleclaw vs Sunfish

He mauled her when she was doing a very minor crime of trespassing. This would have been the last straw for him; Bluestar had given him MANY chances before this, too many.

Thistleclaw would have been exiled for this.

But Leopardstar killed him. He paid with his life. When Crookedstar approaches her to try and negotiate Sunningrocks out of her in payment, she retorts that he was a disobedient warrior, and he has been buried.

RiverClan and ThunderClan have terrible relationships at this point. Bluestar cares for peace and tries to bid for it most of the time, but since they actively fight over Sunningrocks, there isn't much she can do to fix this.

So it is agreed; revenge killings are not persecuted. An eye for an eye is payment.

Lionblaze vs Russetfur

As you know, Blackstar was fucking devastated when his deputy died. This entire battle, in fact, was a huge breakdown in the established alliance between ShadowClan and ThunderClan.

Firestar worked hard on this alliance. Poured his heart and soul into making rules of engagement over the berry patch they joust over, leant aid to Blackstar's bog project, encouraged good relationships between ThunderClan and their neighbors. It was one of his proudest achievements.

But Bramblestar took power after the humiliating, insulting Battle of the False Eclipse, where Brackenfur was killed. Firestar was killed by Ashfur, he believes, someone he trusted. He is determined to rule in a different way; no more Nice ThunderClan.

His deputy, Thornclaw, insists they must rule by example. Yes, ShadowClan had been their ally, but that just presents an opportunity to stab them in the back like the other two. They must rule by example-- and not be lenient towards Blackstar's warriors. Bramblestar refuses to play so gently about the Berry Patch the next time it comes up in negotiations.

But it's about to be leafbare. ShadowClan doesn't care for the berries-- but they DO care for the prey that gets fat there, and the trading advantage of stocking up on berries to bargain with. This fight is lopsided.

Russetfur takes a life from Bramblestar here, and in response, Lionblaze kills her with his brutal strength.

Blackstar was destroyed by this, but too proud to ever lower himself to begging for a life payment from Bramblestar. He won't EVER accept something so insulting, ThunderClan killed his deputy, he would NEVER let them fix this. Their alliance is over, it's open season on Bramblestar, burn the code. Burn the Clans. Burn the Stars, even, what have they done besides put him on ridiculous trials to encourage his "growth" into a weak, sniveling worm to be trodden on?

And from there, he is open to Sol's influence. ShadowClan falls, and the Dark Forest Trainees take over.

So, in conclusion, it varies immensely. Payments and punishments for deaths are contextual, I'd have to explain the political environment around each killing to delve into what was done, and why.

[bonefall]

are the descendants of Thistleclaw treated any different for their ancestor basically coming up with a violent right-ist philosophy? Is there any expectations for them to "take up the mantle" or smth?

Not at all; Thistleclaw's only child was Whitestorm, who was notoriously distant from him. As soon as he was an apprentice, he was spending time elsewhere.

Shocking! Controlling, violent, petty founder of Thistle Law makes a bad parent!

BB!Whitestorm speaks about him like a politician when it comes up. "Brutus was an honorable man," type grindset. He is also a bit older than Tigerpaw, Redpaw, and Spottedpaw. He was just graduating or already a young warrior; Thistleclaw had already given up to focus on Tigerpaw.

Sorreltail, Rainwhisker, and Sootfur consider themselves Whitekin in honor of their father, who considered himself Bluekin.

It would have been wise for Whitestorm to handle Bramblepaw. But unfortunately, Fireheart's paranoia won out.

Thornclaw might have tried it with one of his nespring, had Firestar not utterly punished him for his "mixed clan" stunt. But, circumstances have lead to Tigerkin cats being associated more strongly with inheriting Thistle Law as a legacy.

[bonefall]

I know you've said before that the old aus don't carry over to BB but would there still be any chance of lawyers/attorneys in BB? Or is it more "ur going to hell bc this whole situation pissed us the fuck off goodbye forever" being more common than any sort of rationality?

By "old AUs don't carry over" I mean that specific details don't! It's happened a lot that some old concept I thought was cool comes over. For example, Thornclaw being a villain is influenced by Petty Ashfur, AND some parts of the Leopardstar vs Mistyfoot fight which I haven't written out yet.

StarClan has lawyers in a combined Prosecutor/Defense Attorney role, who get rolled out when a cat has lived a controversial life. They're always someone the accused was close to in life, and their task is to present their sins and their virtues to Silverpelt to make their case.

Not all cats get one. If the ruling was near-unanimous that they should be salvaged or condemned, they're quickly sorted into their afterlife. Tigerstar was sent right to hell, with all his supporters already having left in protest of Bluestar's acceptance.

Bluestar gets one, Lizardstripe. The Darkstar's Commandment crew gets one, Larchkit. Squirrelflight and Leafpool will get one, undecided.

[bonefall]

I am FASCINATED by the Frostfour's dynamic in this rewrite- what's everyone's feelings on each other? (Cannot imagine that they're a big fan of Thornclaw)

CINDERPELT

Adores her siblings and remains close to them for her entire life... she didn't live long enough to watch Thornclaw's descent into the Dark Forest. There's a feeling that when she died, the family began to fall apart.

Have I mentioned how Brightheart is a Cleric helper? It's not an official role or anything, she just knows some basic herbs, and often accompanies the Clerics as backup muscle. In BB, that's because of Cinderpelt.

And it's funny, Cinderpelt is the older sister, but she's much smaller than Brightheart.

She feels more "on the same level" as Bracken, since they're both the older siblings. They can also remember their dad Lionheart, which Thorn and Bright can't.

BRACKENFUR

I feel that Frostfur was often trusting him with stuff at a young age, since she was so overwhelmed. "Bracken watch your little-mates for a second. Bracken hold this. Bracken could you fetch a mouse from the pile?"

He really misses his dad, and felt like he needed to be that for Bright and Thorn even though he was only a few moons older. I think Brightheart actually takes after him, she has his bad habit of overextending and is even worse at asking for help.

He's shocked and disappointed by Thornclaw. He can't believe that his brother has gone so far. Brackenfur is eventually one of the cats who comes down from StarClan in the BOTTE (battle of the true eclipse) to fight for the Clans, and part of that is that he needs to confront Thornclaw one last time.

THORNCLAW

Growing up, he was very close to Grandma Speckletail. Over time, his siblings started noticing he was picking up some pretty nasty old ideas from her. Especially Brackenfur; he was a faithful deputy of Firestar, moving the Clans towards a new era of peace and cooperation, and Thornclaw sounded just like a bigoted grandma.

The drift was mutual. After the Too Mixed Meeting stunt, Firestar started looking over Thornclaw for promotions and apprentices, and Thornclaw blamed Brackenfur for not making him reconsider. Meanwhile, Brightheart was growing increasingly uncomfortable with Thornclaw's beliefs, having Cloudtail as a husband.

In the Dark Forest, I think Thornclaw does regret it all. He misses them, and wonders if they miss him too... but he's too proud to go begging for forgiveness. He has made his nest, and he has the honor to lay in it.

BRIGHTHEART

Outlived all of her siblings. She misses them so, so much.

Specifically, she misses the days just before the bulldozer came, back when Whitewing was little. How Brackenfur took a shine to her right away, and the love in Speckletail's eyes for how much she reminded her of Snowkit. Cinderpelt being a proud auntie, boasting to Thornclaw with his tiny smile.

She wishes she knew that it would be the last great peace with all of her family in one place, but you never really know how special moment is until long after it's over.