#(not that there's anything wrong with consuming media just for ships. but personally. i don't wanna interact with you in that case)

[enemywasp]

Alright so someone on tiktok sent me a link to a compiled list of arguments against proshippers and so I wanted to put a sort of brief response of my own thoughts of each point.

Long post warning!

"Proshippers are non-offending minor attracted people in a fresh paint of coat"

What a start, am I right? Okay so first off this is a huge generalisation, not every proshipper engages with or is even comfortable with anything that sexualises fictional children, or ships them with adults. And of those that do ship adult/minor ships, it doesn't always mean they're attracted to the character themselves or gains any sexual pleasure from that.

They then went on to say that although they might be non-offending, they still fantasise about and romanticise children- in the case of proshippers by creating art and stories. And I am not personally educated enough on how people's minds works to go in depth here, but I do know a lot of pedophilic thoughts can be intrusive and unwanted. And I would much rather people engage in this and deal with their thoughts through fiction where no actual children are harmed, than actually go touch a real child or engage is any form of CSEM.

“People can draw and ship whatever they want!”

Here they went on to say that surely to ship and create content you must justify these things in some capacity regardless of them being fictional. And immediately I'd argue, the justification it that they're fictional. And that sometimes you want to read about things you'd never approve of in real life, it's a natural curiosity. And again, regardless of what the dark content is I would take someone engaging in fiction over harming a real person any day.

They compared this to alt-right groups and dark humour justifying racism and transphobia, etc. And whilst I think something we should always be aware of in fiction is stereotypes and how we may be representing people. Youtube videos like this are usually a type of propaganda that AIM to change people's mindsets and turn them against groups. Whereas fiction tells a story, some may have meanings and connections to real life, be a political piece, etc. Not everything is that serious and has a clear distinction from reality.

Think for example, reading/watching about murder and gore. More on that in a second.

"Fiction doesn't affect reality!"

I'm going to be honest I rolled my eyes at this as their main example was slenderman. If you don't know about that, those girls were schizophrenic. Anything could of set off and caused delusions, it just so happened to be fiction. Those girls needed help- not to just read purer content. They also basically brought up propaganda again, which is again deliberate and designed to warp peoples perceptions. Its based of lying and spreading misinformation and passing it as facts. The only thing I strongly believe can be directly harmful is stereotypes if not handled with care. But I think that's something for anyone who writes and consumes content should be aware of regardless of their stances.

Again here they implied that all proshippers are peodophiles. And that they normalise abuse of children. I'd also like to point out that most proshippers I've interacted with online have age boundaries to avoid interacting with minors depending on how graphic or sexual their content is.

"What do you think all stories about murder should stop existing?"

Here they basically argued that killing in media isn't the same as its not romanticised or condoned. YA Novels disagree- mafia stories being the most immediate example to spring to mind. Furthermore, morally grey villains. One of my favourite films is Mr Right. It's about a hitman killing people. Anna kendrick falls in love with him and its framed as a romantic comedy. Funny how its only fanfiction that's criticised like this? I actually have more thoughts on this if anyones interested.

Again they bring up kids not knowing adults pursuing children is wrong, and I'm questioning why children this young are unsupervised on the Internet. How young were you when you were allowed to watch anything with graphic blood or violence? This content isn't made for kids! Especially not anyone so young they can't seperate fiction from reality as most sites have a specific age you have to be to join. And I'm sorry to say it, but on websites and social media where adults can interact with kids, anything can be used to groom kids. (The real thing you should be mad about here is how there's no websites aimed just for children and safe spaces on the Internet anymore cause it can't be monetised as easily)

"Artists are allowed to draw and write about dark people"

They basically said, yes but it's not the same as promoting. Writing something under a romantic light and not saying "Don't do at home!" Isn't promoting. No ones encouraging these things in real life. Or rather, if they are its not because they're a proshipper but rather who they are as a person and their intentions.

The trans example they used is very extreme and honestly something I agree with a little more, fiction can definitely be used as an excuse to say and act out hateful and discriminatory things. Whilst I do think it's something we should discuss and unpack more, I'm not certain of my view on how I would fix this without risking silencing people talking about their experiences.

"Its not my responsibility to look after other people, just block me and the tags"

Here they threw all kinds of accusations. And says that we're making traumatised people jump through hoops to avoid getting retraumatised. I hate this argument, you know people have actual triggers they may not be able to avoid in real life? The world can't bend around you. And I am very sorry if any content online is traumatising to you, but someone could also be traumatised by a certain breed of dog and not want to see it. Should no one post dogs online ever again? A bald man reminds you of an abusive ex? Bald men get off the Internet! You see how this thing can just keep escalating? The tags and warnings are important because they're the best you can get. You can't control the world to protect everyone from everything ever. No ones forcing you to interact, and if you're on any algorithm based content that will encourage that content on your for your page more.

The only thing I think we should take from this is the reminder that warnings and tags are always important.

"You only care about censoring creativity"

Here they defend themselves that oh wouldn't you want freaks out the community! Which again immediately makes me lose respect for you, if you're just going to brand us all as freaks as an argument and generalize us.

No comment on that first line when you can easily argue antishipper do the same.

"Proshippers are not remotely innocent of targeted harrasement" Neither are antis. There's people who take things too far both sides and I'm not going to defend either for that.

"Real kids get assaulted and all you care about is censoring people online!"

Here they shout "oh I can care about both!" But what I don't think they realise is censorship can make it difficult for kids and to learn about how to speak up and to look for signs, or to speak up about their experiences. How do you plan on removing the topic from the Internet whilst also letting victims speak up? And people may want to write fiction based off their experiences. Who are you to go through it and proclaim what is too far, what romanticises it too much? More on this later.

"Antis are reducing my trauma"

They compared this to saying "date rape victims are reducing my trauma because they weren't taken advantage of in the same way as me" which is a disgusting parallel?? Date rape is still rape. Someone writing about something isn't the same as it happening. Although it can be used as harrasment, grooming, etc if directly addressed to you or being constantly sent to you, written about you. But the content existing in general? No.

"I'm coping"

Compared it to self harm, and such. Poetry and diaries are also used to write about your experiences and unpack trauma. Some of which may write it in an unrealistically positive light cause that's how they want to unpack it or explain those thoughts. And yes these things get posted online.

I can't imagine a single therapist or professional psychiatrist of any kind disapproving of creative writing because, again, it's much better than any alternatives of doing real harm to yourself or people around you. Although I do agree that if something is traumatising for you to read about and just upsets you further, be aware of your own boundaries but not everyone is the same so how are you going to police people's own thoughts and emotions.

Also I can't remember who or where as it was years ago now, but I have heard of people who actually realised they were being groomed or abused and just how bad it was through reading about it in a fanfic and seeing it in an outside perspective.

They also say to do it in private, but doesn't everyone on the Internet now have an understanding of finding a community and looking out for eachother and sharing experiences?

"There's more nuance here than just calling proshippers peodophiles"

Here they say no matter what it still comes down to whether it's ever okay to sexualise minors in certain contexts. And again, not every proshipper does this or is even comfortable with engaging in this kind of content. And further, no one is sexualising real minors in this context.

"I'm a proshipper and a minor tho!"

I'd agree minors should be wary of the spaces they're in but proship spaces aren't always necessarily sexual, graphic or 18+. Saying they're being groomed feels like you're watering down that term. I was a proshipper at age 13, I didn't interact with anyone online about it though, I didn't even know that was the term. I just came to the conclusion that it's just fiction all on my own. Minors aren't idiots.

At then end they talk about their own experience being groomed and I'm obviously not going to nitpick or criticise their experiences. I will point out that one person being bad and taking advantage of you and using content to do so doesn't mean everyone is like that. I am sorry to anyone who has been taken advantage of by someone who claims they're a proshipper though. There are people who have turned out to be horrible on both sides.

I am ill and it's late but I want to get this up sooner rather than later so please ask for clarification on anything. I'm always up for a discussion on this topic as I do believe some of these points do have merits at times and that this whole topic is not black and white

[jeonscatalyst]

People say that JK benefits a lot from being the center of major ships in the fandom and I don't disagree that he benefits a little but I do think its overblown and I say this as someone who very heavily biases Jimin compared to the other members. Why I bring this is up is because I stumbled upon a yoonmin account today once again and in all my years of coming across yoonminers and I've found only a handful of genuine double biased among those shippers. For the rest Jimin is only there to token stan and use as Yoongi's cheerleader. Yoonminers are almost across the board completely useless for Jimin in terms of supporting him, his music, defending him against antis or even liking him as an individual outside of Yoongi - and I'm talking about people who ship yoonmin as their main not even about tkkrs who have yoonmin as some kind of 2-for-1 package. So yeah as someone who's seen how useless being token stanned by shippers is, I'd say the benefits JK gets are probably because those shippers might actually like him. And even then there's a lot of shippers - and here I include all ships incl jikook - who sometimes only like both people in relation to the ship and you will only see them consuming ship related material.

So all this to say I think the positive affect of having shippers on your side is a bit exaggerated. It's as useful as having kpop stans by your side. You'll get some more likes and buzz on social media but when it comes to music or any actual support, most of them are useless unless as I said the shipper originally liked the member beyond the context of the ship. JK gets a lot of social media clout from all his shippers, y/n's etc of course and that is useful in creating the image of popularity don't get me wrong but there's a ton of idols who have a lot of exaggerated support on social media but whose music streams are extremely disappointing or whose stans support is extremely shallow because they like them for a ship or just for their looks

Sorry it took ages to get to your ask anon.

I agree with your observation and I believe I have mentioned this before. Many people think Jk actually benefits alot because he is shipped with taehyung and Jimin but I never thought that was true and I still don’t think it’s true. This is mainly because in most of the ships he is the center of, he is rarely ever the favourite. Most taekoookers are Taehyung biased and either have Jk as a bias wrecker or just like him because they think he is dating Tae or want him to be with Tae and the same goes for jikookers. Most jikookers are Jimin biased and either have Jk as a bias wrecker or only like him because they think he is dating Jimin or want him to be with Jimin. You can see how true this is in how easily he gets dropped or criticized after he doesn’t “act right” with one of these two.

I still remember how many jikookers became Jimin solos after Face and Seven era and how many taekookers dropped Jungkook like he was hot after Layover and even after Taennie. Jungkook is the one who constantly gets thrown under the bus and very few people actually care to defend him unless it is in relation to the ship, so no, Jungkook has never really benefited much from ships, if anything he had just been used in shipwars only to be abandoned or shaded and insulted, the moment he isn’t either treating Jimin like an egg or the moment he isn’t showing enough love for Tae as Tae shows to him.

Jimin is my bias and honestly I may never have noticed Jungkook as much if it wasn’t for his bond with Jimin but once I noticed him and got to know him not only as an idol but as a person, I grew to love him so much. I hate how misunderstood he is. It breaks my heart everytime I see people complain about him and accuse him of being rude or insensitive or abusive or selfish or all the nonsense taekookers, jikookers, solos and haters say about him when he doesn’t act the way they want him to because in my eyes Jungkook is one of the most innocent and most sensitive members. He is one who has the innocence of baby and is extremely kind and thoughtful. He isn’t perfect and he has his bratty moments and could sometimes be a little to blunt without realizing that his words could be hurtful but he is genuinely a good person and I love him so much.

I know that I have digressed but your ask made me remember that I had been planning to make a post about Jungkook because I got sick and tired of seeing everyone shit on him. I get sick and tired of seeing people treat him like he isn’t a human being yet people have the guts to say he benefits alot from both ships even though all he gets is hate and people constantly pretending to love him even though they do not hesitate to drop him when he doesn’t toe the line. Plus this shenanigans over the past few days have really broken my heart and I can’t believe how this fandom is turning against him just because he dared to speak out against something he probably has experienced himself.

Even people who aren’t shippers who claim to love him only love what he is and not who he is as a person. I cannot tell you how many times I go through the Jungkook tag here on tumblr trying to find good Jungkook focused blogs that have meaningful discussions about him as we have many Jimin focused blogs like that, but everytime I check, the tag is filled with shippers, fanfics or porn, I am tired. It’s like he is just a piece of meat for everyone to either use in ships or use in their Y/N fantasies. Very few people actually care to know who Jungkook is beyond his idol image and hot looks. Even the solos who claim to love him and stream for him only do that so they could have something to brag about among other solos because you can easily tell they don’t know the first thing about Jungkook and don’t care to know. They project unto him, call him a company puppet when they feel like it, potray him as someone who is abusive and rude and insensitive towards his members, infact to them, he is the epitome of a fuck boy and I am tired.

This isn’t me saying that there aren’t shippers or fans who genuinely love him and do things for him out of that love, there are and I am grateful for all the people like that but sometimes I just wish he had more people who genuinely love him not the ones who pretend to for one reason or the other but start showing their true colors once they are not satisfied with something he does or doesn’t do.

As for yoonminers, I don’t even want to talk about those ones because sometimes I feel like they disgust me more than taekookers do. They claim to love Jimin and Yoongi but they have no issue following and interacting with taekookers and taekook accounts that constantly hate on Jimin, are being shady towards him and his bond with Jungkook or are straightup weird. I have never cared about yoonminers enough to look into their demographic but from the little I have seen, they definitely only token stan Jimin and don’t even really give a tiny rats ass about him and for some weird reason, they have made Jimin’s Nevermind tattoo all about Yoongi🙄. Yoongi is one of my bias wreckers and I see his deep bond and friendship with Jimin but even I would never reduce Jimin’s tattoo to being all about Yoongi because that is just disrespectful and like you said, you would never see a yoonminer when it comes to defending Jimin.

My response was all over the place anon but I wanted to use your ask to vent because I’ve been feeling pissed about alot of shit related to Jungkook lately.

[theallianceofcelestials]

Okay, so apparently people have been harassing Kat, Earth's VA because they... don't like the characters she plays and how she writes for the show? The actual fuck?

Like don't get me wrong, perfectly fine to look at a character and decide you don't like them, even hate them potentially, but you don't go and harass the people responsible for making the character. That's just plain dumb. I hate/dislike characters from some of the shows (Bonnie from Moon and Sun Minecraft for example), but that doesn't give me the right to go and harass their VAs. BECAUSE IT'S JUST A CHARACTER FOR A SILLY LITTLE SHOW PEOPLE MAKE FOR FREE! IT'S NOT THAT SERIOUS! Sure I may rant about the character, but NEVER badmouth the actor, because them being able to achieve such a visceral reaction out of me by just looking at the character, makes them so incredibly talented.

Like how can you be so fucking terminally online, that you decide to harass someone because "I Don't LiKe ThE chaRacTeR"?! Like that's no valid reason to do that! Go and touch some god fucking grass, my god! I swear it's actually good for you!

Like this is just straight up disgusting behaviour in general. It's unacceptable, and shows just how much of a coward these people actually are, because there're no consequences for THEM. And well, they clearly don't fucking care about their fellow human beings, so like jfc.

And like the shit Kat does is for FREE! She doesn't charge us money for her services! She just went and did some amazing stuff for us, and now some idiots're feeling butthurt because they hate female characters or something.

I sincerely hope it was only a couple of individuals at worst, and a single person at best, because my faith in humanity is already rather fragile, and this is just ridiculous and pathetic.

So like, if by some miracle the person/people who harassed Kat is/are reading this, I want you to know this says more about to how sad and pathetic you actually are, and how you peaked back on the playground as a bully and didn't manage to develop into an actual fucking person, than it does anything about Kat. I hope you realise just how stupid you are, but I know you likely won't. Because people like you lack brains, so you can't comprehend basic fucking concepts like how the sky is blue, and 2 + 2 is 4. Or how grass is not your fucking enemy.

This isn't about just just Kat, because from what I've heard, other female characters' actresses get similar bs, and their characters get tremendous ammount of hate compared to male characters that potentially did incredibly horrid stuff, but I don't really follow the other TSBS to know what's going on. But my gods. That's so disappointing.

Why are fandoms nowadays so toxic? Back in my day, and I'm not that old myself either, and joined fandoms later than most people in said fandoms, since I'm a not native english speaker, but back in the day fandoms were so much more positive. Sure, there was the toxic minority, but they were just that. Loud small group of jerks. Like when did we start catering to these people? When did we decide that these toxic people were whom we should listen to, and explain every little thing we do to them? Like why do I have to explain why I like villian characters or whatever to internet strangers? I think people are more than smart enough to realise morality should not be taken from media!

And when did fanart and fanfic start becoming expectation, something the fanfic writer has to do, the fanart artist has to do? Instead it being the expression of joy and feelings the consumed media gave them? When did shipping become life or death? When did a headcanon or an AU become so fucking serious that lives apparently depend on it with how people jump eachother? Why can't we just relax and have fun? Like do what fandom is meant for?

This is obviously not for the people who didn't do any of this shit, but the fact I need to clarify that or someone will get offended is disheartening. Like people please deal with your anxieties! If it's not your shirt, don't put it on as a saying in my native tongue goes!

Sorry for the angry rant, it's just so disappointing, especially because Kat is such a talented person! I really enjoy how she plays these characters and I love her writing! So I thank her for deciding to not just quit altogether, no matter how understandable that would have been! I hope stepping back will make things better!

I just hope her mental health doesn't have to suffer more, because this shouldn't have happened to her in the first place. She's been doing amazing work, for free I'll say once again, and I'll forever cherish it! I hope things get better for her!

If by some miracle this reaches Kat, thank you for sticking with us for as long as you have! I hope things'll get better for you! Take care of yourself! :)

[nathandrakeisabottom]

HELLO, I found ur blog while lurking thru old uncharted content on here... I just wanted to say ur take on nate x elena and on the opposite side of the spectrum, nate x chloe is so refreshing to see. I felt like I was being gaslit seeing so many people call nate and elena soulmates.

their dynamic has always felt so weird to me for a lot of the reasons you've voiced and also because Nate almost never initiates any kind of ?? anything with her that we see on screen unless it's bordering on almost platonic. she's always the one touching and kissing all over him while he's just....sitting there, even in pictures. I don't know if that's intended to be a way of showing his issues with relationships and intimacy due to his upbringing or if it has something to do with the games rating ORRR what but like you said it feels very mother-son-esque at times

ALSO FEEL FREE TO IGNORE THIS if it no longer aligns w ur views or if u think elena fans will jump you for it, I just wanted to let u know I see & hear u and ur valid 🙏

Oh, anon. Oooooh, anon. You’re in for a treat, my friend.

I love you and am very politely and extremely elegantly kissing you on the mouth right now. You are in my arms and I am cradling your beautiful little head like a fresh baby. The world has stopped for us.

You want refreshing? Lemme pour you a tall glass of 2016-Relevant-Hot-Take-Lemonade.

So, on that note, why don’t we just J U M P right into it.

★ The “Why I Don’t Ship Nate and Elena” Essay ★

(I need you to know I legit CHEERED outloud when I got your message. I have lots of feelings on this topic, so let’s boogie on down.)

To my dearly departed Uncharted fandom, here is the obligatory “ship and let ship” section. Here is the essential “there is a huge difference between a healthy real life love and a dynamic that makes for an actually interesting and fulfilling story”. Here is “all ships are valid and all in good fun and never in a million years would this post be a ‘you shouldn’t ship this extremely popular and completely canon ship that has been beloved for over a decade now’”. Because… of course, and I won’t continue my rant before setting those standards in place.

However, if you’re still here and aren’t throwing tomatoes, here is why I don’t care for Nate and Elena as a couple, and why it’s (at times) tainted my overall love for Uncharted. 

To begin with, I’ve never been of the enemies to lovers variety, and disagree if you’d like, but they seem to be the epitome of this sort of classic, gendered trope. Elena is only present for half of each game, and 70-90% of each of those segments is them actively in conflict. As I see it— and absolutely correct me if I’m wrong!— not an opinion. That’s just the canon script and story of all 4 games. Them playfully bickering at the very end (UC4 with a few extra scenes as the exception) and then fading to black has never been enough to convince me that all their conflict was worth the struggle in the end, but that very much seems to be what the game is telling us. It’s worth it to talk about clowns with a man whose most romantic moment is joking about how he didn’t really mind much when you almost died. 

This ‘wearing and annoying them down until they give in with an eye roll and a smirk’ has never been my personal cup of tea, but it is a classic, well-used dynamic. This is why it honestly often confuses me when folks act like they’re this super unique, one-of-a-kind love story, which I’ve fought to understand and just… can’t. Han and Leia. Doppler and Amelia. Allie and Noah. I’m not sure if it’s a statement on the breadth of external media mainstream Uncharted fans consume or a statement on the state of romance in video games, but it’s certainly always been a bit of a shock for me.

However, it’s a well-loved, classically used trope, so I can understand why it’s a shipping home base for a lot of folks. And the fighting/conflict to get to the resolution makes for a satisfying fictional story. I won’t argue there.

On the topic of “soulmates”… I personally don’t understand it at all. The centerpiece of Nathan and Elena’s dynamic is and always has been “will Nathan choose his passion (the adventure) over Elena?”. Even seasoned fans will have to admit, the first game throws a confusing wrench into the whole affair. The very beginning, we see NATE to be the one to throw in the towel on his treasure hunt, and ELENA to be the one to inspire him to push on. I think that’s a cute, classic set-up, and I genuinely do believe that Elena’s initial character has a lot of fun parts and places to explore. She was allowed to be her own person with her own motivation, her own wants apart from Nathan, and, most importantly, FLAWS. You can even hear it in Emily Rose’s performance. Elena was allowed to have spunk and energy, because she was allowed to want things outside of Nathan, even if they got her into more-than-sticky situations. Unfortunately, as I see it, they were extremely quick to throw the majority of this away in favor of—

Games 2 and 3, where all of a sudden, we have NATE being the one to fight to continue and ELENA being the one to tell him to give it up. Elena gets a complete character remodel. Here we see what segments of the fandom refer to as “naggy wife Elena”, and while I feel that’s a cruel way to phrase it, it’s certainly the creation and cementing of “speakerphone Elena”. In that, Elena is hereby the page of the game’s theme. Whatever she says is what the game wants us to think is the morally right thing to do, without exception. And this, in my opinion, completely flatlined and failed her as a character. Her role in the story was to morally (and often forcibly) course-correct Nathan, and her motivations regarding journalism were sidelined, and would be for the remainder of the series. Her purpose was to show Nathan, and the players, what was right. And what was right turned out to be quitting adventuring, Nathan’s greatest passion, by the end of Uncharted 3.

That is until: Uncharted 4, where again Elena is propped up, now more than ever, as the moral compass who points Nathan towards the right course of action. Journalism? External motivations other than husband? Huh? Baking Powder? However, what makes this interesting, and that much odder, is that we now have ELENA again pushing NATHAN to go on an adventure, with Nathan being the one who needs to be encouraged to do so (this time by a guilt-tripping, countdowning Sam). Still today the fandom argues Nathan’s initial reason for turning down the reasonably safe Malaysia job. However, after taking into account all previous games, (hottest take of all time incoming) I honestly DON’T blame Nate for thinking lying to Elena was the only option, considering how frequently and often at random her approval of his passion for adventuring swayed, and how intrinsically tied to his own morality and value as a person her romantic approval was (by the writers, the characters, the fans, and the game itself). 

Listen. This poor girl doesn’t know what she wants. And frankly, neither does Nate. In my opinion, it really is as simple as the writers had an ending and a lesson in mind, and these characters were merely a megaphone to whichever lesson they wanted to push that game. It’s an unfortunate reality and really the only thing to explain how borderline comedically wishy-washy both characters were if we look at the series as a whole. But to act like Nathan and Elena were always on the same page to the point of “soulmates” feels like little else but wishful thinking.

In the end of Uncharted 4, they ultimately chose… both both and neither. Which makes sense. What fun is a video game that tells you the video game part is the bad part you’re too tired and old for and should feel guilty for playing? (PS: Elena, girl, you’re 31. THIRTY-ONE. Settle down? You should be at the CLUB. Watcha doing with a manchild 8 years older than you when you were 24? UC4 was heteronormative as fuck and felt like it was written in the Reagan ‘80s, eat my ass.) They ultimately return to the UC3 ending of Nathan throwing in the towel of his dangerous escapades with Sully & The Gang™, but meet in the middle for a safe and legal scavenging company. A cute and reasonable compromise, even I’ll admit. A long way to come just to return to scene one of game one, but… fine. 

At the end of the day, though, I can’t find it in me to fully blame or villainize Nate. If it felt like love was the reward for giving up the thing you loved doing most, why wouldn’t you feel completely torn in two?

Nathan IS Adventuring. Him and his love for history, and his endless pursuit of its honor, to be apart of it, are one and the same. That has ALWAYS been the case. And (HOTTEST TAKE EVER COMING THROUGH) why THAT Uncharted 4 scene will never be as romantic to me as it seems to be to every other Uncharted fan.

“I’m sorry.” “It’s okay.” 

Nathan shouldn’t have to apologize for his greatest passion to the person who’s supposed to understand and accept him more than anyone else— let alone after a 7-year-long on-off relationship. This should not be a surprise, let alone a persisting relationship-breaking problem, at this point. Because it should not be something that needs to be forgiven. And it is absolutely heartbreaking to see a man exactly in the midst of the thing he loves most, spouting passionately about what excites him like a settled life with Elena never could, and his first impulse is to apologize. (We all know he’s not just apologizing about lying. We know this. It’s far, far more than that. We KNOW this. Let’s not bad faith criticism on this particular point.)

It’s not something he should have to apologize for, because in any other context, with any other person in the entire series, they would understand just to what degree this means to him. And while Elena says point blank “I missed the adventure” in the second to last scene of the series, I personally felt this was an extremely tell-not-show moment, and very little of the previous games runtime actually shows Elena being just as passionate about it as Nathan is. Had they allowed Elena to still have that self-drive and love for journalism persisting over from the first game, I think this moment might’ve actually stuck the landing for me. Instead, I often find myself saying “You don’t NEED to be sorry” when I watch this scene. Because nothing feels worse than having to feel guilt for the thing you love most.

(Justice for Chloe. She understood.)

I find that a lot of Elena’s arguing against adventuring falls flat under the genre conventions of Uncharted. It is tonally light, it is fun, it is playful, and even at the brink of death, characters are cracking jokes. All of which is generally fine. However, when the greatest argument against the protagonist’s passion is “if you had been killed, I wouldn’t have even known about it” (which is fully legitimate and heartbreaking in any other context)… and yet not a single character dies, it ends up feeling like an empty threat. Elena almost dies, but is saved by her friends, cracks jokes and fades to black. Charlie breaks his leg, we never see him again, cut to Nathan cracking jokes, fade to black. If Uncharted had always had the concrete consequence of a series like Last of Us, this argument could’ve absolutely worked. Instead, we (and Nathan) feel guilted for a consequence we know will never happen, and instead wonder why the blonde lady keeps showing up to tell us to stop playing the fun running, shooting video game when the fun running, shooting video game is fun and LOOK— everyone is fine and happy at the end! Why WOULDN’T we want to do it again? It ends up ringing exceptionally hollow, and instead like a mom scolding her son for playing too close to the street. Except the street is in a suburb and all the cars are made of styrofoam.

Based on the second flashback scene in UC4, the game’s argument seems to be: If you continue the adventure and stay in your hubby hole with your treasures, you’ll push away everyone you love and end up in a big house alone with nothing but your sarcophaguses for company. HOWEVER, that was NEVER Nathan’s story. Because Nathan ALWAYS chose his friends over the treasure, EVEN WITHOUT ELENA. He and Chloe rescue Elena. He tries to save Marlowe. He goes back and fights Rafe to save Sam. But the writers didn’t trust Nathan to come to any character arc on his own, and thus Elena was fitted as the plot device to get him there, to the detriment of both characters. 

The only remaining problem factor I can think of, again looking at that second UC4 flashback scene, is children. And I’m so sorry to be the bearer of bad news Naughty Dog… but not every couple needs to have children to have fulfilling lives. Personally, I would’ve loved to have seen them be legal-adventuring childless, or hell, *adopting* a child (which would’ve been such a beautiful full-circle moment. Hell, specifically an older kid if we wanna pull a “saving a future Sam” moment. But, alas… the a g e n d a.)

Now, let’s move from facts and canon and all that nerdy shit— and move onto my favorite (and a far more nebulous) topic: CHEMISTRY.

Let’s get one thing out of the way. As an actor myself, I’m the LAST person who’s going to say real life and movies are the same and acting isn’t real and if something is happening offstage it’s happening on and vice versa. I think that’s all a load of crap. 

HOWEVER, I do believe chemistry exists and is a very real thing, and exists both platonically and romantically. I don’t think it’s something that can always be created. A lot of times, it’s either there or it isn’t. Just like in real relationships. It’s what makes Nate and Sully so great. And in my opinion, actor chemistry is 100% what makes Uncharted special. It’s why it’s stood the test of time. It’s why nobody liked that terrible movie adaptation. It was moving exactly what made Uncharted Uncharted. 

Now, I do think Nate and Elena can have their moments. Ironically enough, I think their best chemistry is in the scene in Uncharted 3 where they are actively discussing their recent divorce. There is a tension, a playfulness, and— a rare point in these games— it feels entirely equal and mutual. (I’m of the same opinion as you, anon, that most romantic moments between them are pretty one-sided, with either Elena throwing herself over a snarky, dismissive Drake, or a groveling Nathan with a reasonably-bitter Elena.) And personally, their dynamic is a worthy addition, I just never felt like it had that natural… ease and affection that allowed for a compelling romance. 

For those not in the know, fun fact, but Claudia Black (voice of Chloe in 2, 3, and Lost Legacy) was initially cast as Elena, but had to drop due to scheduling conflicts. Personally, this explains so much of why Nate and Chloe’s chemistry is so much more effective for me (they were the OGs!), and I will always wonder what the series would’ve been like with Claudia and Nolan’s dynamic as the driving force behind the series instead. A drive, an energy, a mutuality, and a chemistry I just don’t think Nolan and Emily ever had. Maybe it’s an age gap thing, maybe it’s an acting experience thing, maybe it’s purely coincidence.

And take it all with a very small, petite grain of salt, but even in interviews, I honestly get that previously-mentioned dynamic with Nathan and Elena both in-game and off. 

This video especially reflected how I see them in game:

https://youtu.be/4EIUuGp16F4?si=MBSsCcKIR_fyQzic. (Particularly 1:27)

Of course, it’s all extremely funny and teasing and played for laughs, but I do think there is something to Emily Rose needing to get Nolan to say what Nate likes about Elena, and the whole “which one’s Elena?” bit. Also, the way Emily explicitly says they’re only able to really function when it’s chaotic, and in my opinion, none of the games ever really served to reject that statement. Uncharted 4 would’ve been the perfect time to prove this wrong (I would LOVE to see Amy Hennig’s version of this. Who knows, maybe I wouldn’t be writing this at all if we had seen her version!), but alas, it seems even Druckmann and Straley couldn’t figure out a way to include Elena for more than a third of the runtime, let alone 100% amicable with Nate the whole way through, in a way that worked. 

However, the thesis of the Uncharted series as a whole still seems to be that this romantic partnership is worth it. It’s worth removing Charlie and Chloe altogether. It’s worth rejecting Chloe. It’s worth ignoring Sam. It’s worth letting your mother’s legacy go. It’s worth spending the majority of the series finale in a constant guilt trip. 

And not to throw my terribly personal, terribly human viewpoints into the mix, but as someone who has personally witnessed far too many relationships where the playful, upbeat woman fights for the snappy, sarcastic man’s affection and loses everything that makes her her in the process, where the passionate student/artist lets their life’s passion go because they’re “too old” and “it’s time to settle down and let it go”, where (shockingly) two people already got divorced once for a reason— 

It may be cute in a fictional story, but holy shit, is it the ugliest thing I’ve ever seen in reality.

★★★

P.S. For my third and final piping hot take… I wouldn’t doubt it if the Lost Legacy writing team were also of the “it should’ve been Chloe” mindset. I am STILL completely and utterly floored that not a single person I can think of in this entire fandom, not in any Youtube comment section or reddit post, in my own personal experience over 4 years of fandom has mentioned the weight of Chloe’s “I’m tired of walking away” line near the end of Lost Legacy as a clear parallel to her “It’s my turn to walk away” when she tells Nate to pursue Elena instead of her at the end of Uncharted 2. The Legacy of Thieves Collection cover art. Nolan’s delivery on “Another lifetime, Chloe…” in the attic scene of Uncharted 4. 

Chloe had the staying power, the external non-romantic-interest-fueled motivations, the goddamn flaws that any complex, multi-dimensional character should have. It should’ve been her. And I will always mourn that fact.

I could not be more happy that our homegirl got to go out with a bang, (And had the best casting and was the best part of the movie adaptation. PERIOD.)

[shadowsingcalore]

It's so weird to me that people get bent out of shape at their self-created premise of Eluciens shipping while "ignoring Elain's feelings" about Lucien.

Elain is a fictional character. Her feelings are designated by SJM in the canon text, and whoever writes for her in fanon and fanfiction. Elain’s feelings are not autonomous. They are designed by the author writing her for whatever medium or purpose, or the fanartist creating art of her.

When I write Elain with Lucien, I don't write her as miserable and trapped. And I don't think most Elucien writers do that, either.

I will write her hesitant, potentially, depending on the point in which their relationship has developed. Or guarded or unsure of how she feels. You know, like Nesta and Feyre were with their mates, too, initially.

But the people who ship and write and create content for Elucien don't do so as a way to be "cruel" or "punishing" or "unconcerned". We do it because we see potential that others don't. We can imagine how their conversations could go, how their dynamics could change, what events could trigger a change in how they view each other. And we show that in the artistic medium we're most drawn to.

These are the ideas I toss around for my Elucien writing:

Maybe Elain meets Jurian and Vassa.

Maybe she goes to Spring.

Maybe Lucien sees a more powerful part of her and is impressed.

It's literally the base foundation of creativity. Imagining characters in scenarios you want to see. And there's nothing wrong with that in the slightest. How else do you think we get any books or TV shows? Any media, really?

It just reads as a very overly-moralistic, juvenile, and non-creative line of thinking to me.

"Why are you ignoring Elain's feelings?"

I'm not. I'm changing them and designating where I believe they will go based on my own creativity and desire to grow her arc and character. I'm changing her feelings based on what I want. Which, I actually love to break it to you, is exactly what SJM does, too.

Not everyone is going to be a writer. Not everyone is going to be a creative person. I understand that. But what people in this fandom don't understand is that it's an actual process with time and effort, and there's nothing to get upset or worked up over.

If you do get upset, respectfully, that's a you problem. You are not Elain. No one is pushing you towards a guy you don't feel any particular way about as if you're in high school. No one is making you do or consume anything. You are fine.

Elucien can not hurt you.

You're going to have to live with basic fandom creativity, and if you can't handle that, maybe fandom spaces aren't for you.

[angy-grrr]

Just another queer ship

I know many of you just are here bc you wanted to see bkdk metas years ago -many have left since then, changed accounts, stopped getting my content, or just moved on to the work others do in the fandom-, but I also know some of you feel at least a little bit like me. You felt connected to this for many reasons, as many as the amount of followers I have, but I want to talk about me, hoping the ones that understand also get to have... something, I guess.

These ships were important to me partially bc of being my special interest, partially bc they are queer; I know some ppl believe its wrong of others to enjoy shipping "just bc they are gay", they just have been a huge part of my life and followed me thru different stages of accepting queerness on its own and on myself. Its kind of funny, how this started when I just tried so hard to be non queer and how it ended when I accept that im a genderqueer lesbian.

I remember back then I saw romance as that uncomfortable pressure of expectation and need of validation whenever an older guy (like young man I mean, I was like 13 so older guy looked like that) was in front of me -bc romance was always like that-, how picking a random guy means love, or how eye contact means im telling that guy Im interested in him. Because romance is always about a boy and girl just ending together as the ending of all stories -if I wanted to do things right, I needed that, I needed to show off a random guy to others, even metaphorically, as long as him and I were never completely alone (this "relationship" needed to be useful for something, for others to see how great I do this, how im a winner in life).

Its funny, isnt it? I really wanted this to be a subversion, to understand how complex these feelings can be and that a girl and boy can be friends and be so important to each other, that the feelings you have for someone "you arent supposed to like" can be real, and strong, and impact you forever.

I dont care about what we got.

To whoever is reading this, if anyone does at all, im guessing you could be another queer person who got their heart broke because the shonen that wasn't supposed to be like other shonen ended up like all the stories do. So to you let me tell you this:

Don't you dare give your heart for this. There are so many harmful many things in this world, and I dont want you wasting your spirit over a story that never cared about us. Im nobody to tell anyone anything but I dont want us to once again yearn for a queer story in the shows, books, comics and movies that clearly dont want us there.

Its normal to feel the overwhelming pressure in your life -there are tons of things to worry about, so many injustices- and wanting to find comfort in media, and how it hurts when the author takes that away from you. Im not telling you to stop shipping or consuming what you watch, im telling you to use that into something for all of us. There are queer shows, music, entertainment, communities, etc., and we can also use fandom spaces to create and see what makes us feel seen -thats the rule of fandom, if nobody has written it then do it yourself even if its ugly and imperfect.

The ending of THE manga that has been by my side for what could be half my life is everything I feared it would be, but Im the most queer I have ever been. The manga wasn't for us? Okay, I'll be part of whatever I create then.

[aphverse-confessions]

I actually don't think that aarmau is bad, sure it's kinda weird in some way but people love to turn a blind eye to things just to hate something, and I think that's the case with them.

Because they actually become super cute and healthy (talking about mystreet btw, never finished mcd) and I'm not looking at them from a nostalgic perspective, I say it in the perspective of someone who loves to pick at the little details of things.

Of all of the ships in the series, I think they work the best because their personalities genuinely work together (idk, their interactions with other characters just seem a little off, like they never open up completely to them), and I love that they try to talk with each other about the issues their facing and when things make them uncomfortable (like Aaron telling Aphmau that just because he's a werewolf it doesn't mean that he likes getting treated like a dog after she sort of treats him like one in season 5), they're genuinely a good relationship.

Would like to point out that I'm not turning a blind eye to the super weird age gap they have because that was definitely something, and if they're going to keep it that way, at least move the series to a channel were it's targeted towards older people, not 12 year olds; because you know... they have more of a brain than them, and they can tell when the little pixels in the screen do things that are wrong irl.

Last thing, I think people are waaaay too comfortable being mean about anything and everything but that's just because it's the internet, and sadly that's the nature here. If you don't like somethig the little pixels in the screen do, pls just stop looking at it and go away, let the people who enjoy it, enjoy it.

Istg if I see another "uhh but actually, liking this pixel makes you a creep and an ass because you clearly act like the media that you consume☝️🤓" I will tweak out.

.

[butmakeitgayblog]

Can I just say I love how like, into revisiting and analysing this dumb show’s scenes you still are — with the rise in popularity of streaming (I’m sure this has something to do with it, anyway) it’s become more and more commonplace for people to consume a piece of media, enjoy it, get bored of it after a while and never touch it again after moving on to the next new thing. It’s so wholesome and refreshing to see people still be so passionate and always find something new to talk about a show that, for all many of us care, ended 8 years ago. I do move in and out of being obsessed and disinterested with the media I’ve enjoyed, but in a world where I’m constantly seeing people say “oh you’re a fan of [X]? But that’s old :/“ (mostly about something that finished like last year lol) your blog is a breath of fresh air :)

Well thank you 🥹

The thing is, I get it. I get why and how people move on to different fandoms so quickly, and I don't really think poorly of that or anything. It's been almost a decade and it's easy to fall out of love with something after so long. Hell, when you think about it, this fandom has outlived the lifespan of a lot of entire relationships people have had 🥴. People find new things to get excited over and the *gasp* feeling of finding this new /thing/ is always fun. So I do get it.

But for me, it's just not that way. It's not that simple. Not because I think I'm somehow special (maybe a lil deranged 😬), but rather that's just how I operate. Before Clexa the only other ship I ever really cared about was Willara from Buffy which I watched when I was a goddamn teenager lol (RIP to my fellow gays always falling for girls who get shot ✊😔). I just don't get attached much to characters and ships. Usually ai like them in passing, enjoy watching them, and then that's... it. Tibette from the L Word. Wayhaught. Brittana. I like them and I follow them, but there's no real desire to delve deeper beneath the surface.

And then something like Clexa comes around and just absolutely fucks me up. It hits me and connects with me in a way that I just can't shake. Watching the show isn't enough. Thinking about it isn't enough. I have to discuss it and dissect it and fill in the gaps that we didn't see, and read and (now) create more stories for them just to understand everything about them to a deeper degree.

So few characters really elicit that kind of connection, but Clexa do. Even for a lot of the people who have moved on, at one time they felt that connection. Clexa was a fuckin madhouse for years and I think the fact that even still to this day people keep discovering and rediscovering them and falling in love with them all over again speaks volumes about just how wonderful that relationship and those characters actually were.

Especially Lexa.

Now, I love Clarke. I make it known that thiiiisss is a Clarke Griffin apologist's blog. That feral little kitten has never done anything wrong in her life. Ever. Including all of the terrible things she's done, as well as the many, many things that were flat out wrong. She is still innocent. She is only a baby. A murderous, tormented, compassionate, complex babygirl. So never get it twisted that I'm saying Clarke is somehow lesser than, but when push comes to shove when we're talking about baseline complexity, there is no character like Lexa. There's just not.

This woman was definition of doomed by the narrative. A child stolen away to be used as a glorified sacrificial lamb for her people. A toddler wielding a sword made of wood taller than her own tiny body, trained to accept her own life as expendable for the greatest good of her people before even learning her ABCs. She took the throne at 12 bby slaughtering her only companions and made her death mask out of kohl and fallen tears. Every person she ever loved as a mother, father, brother, either died for her, or by her own hand. The only two people she ever dared to be weak for were torn from her in the name of politics and the weight of her own bloodied crown. Under all the regalia she was just Lexa. Heda, always surrounded by her people and yet eternally just a lonely soul. Born here on Earth, raised to eventually die for others, left to rule over the people on the ground as best she knew how.

And yet through the pain, she was strong. So fucking strong it emboldened the warriors around her. She was brave, and lethal, and unyielding in her pursuit of peace. Meeting every push against her forward march to change head on, never flinching in her own brutality along the way. She knew that she was born for this; believed the black of her blood to be every bit as much of a blessing as it was a curse. Even when people doubted her and did their best to end her reign, Lexa always came out swinging.

She loved hard and kicked ass even harder, is what I'm saying. And the fact that they took a character like that and ended her so fucking carelessly? I just... I'm gonna be pissed off about that for a very long time. And until I'm no longer pissed off about that, I'll be here running mouth about it 🥴 probably still trying to make it better by writing her and the love of her life in as many stories as I can, so they can finally get the happy ending that was robbed of them in canon 🫡

[pondhue]

honestly having a hard time trying to justify watching s8. we beat rick prime. imitation voice actors just feel Wrong to my autistic ass (tho i support them firing JR obviously). what do we hope for? more Diane backstory that will make her being dead/gone across the multiverse all the more painful? the birdperson child? am i a poser that "classic adventures" aren't enough for me?

edit: sorry in advance that this response is kind of long. i'm gonna be tagging it as #long text and #longtext for easy muting aaahhhh

anon your concerns are super valid. like, if you find yourself having a hard time, there's no harm in taking a step back and waiting to see what happens before giving it a chance. and if you still can't justify it for whatever reason, that's fine too. considering what Rick and Morty is and what it has become, it's completely understandable. i don't think you're a poser for feeling the way you do. i personally prefer that they steer from that too, and/or if they chose to still explore that route even now, i hope it's in a way where they deconstruct the formula rather than uphold it. Rick and Morty is the type of show where it challenges the viewer, but it also has the potential, i'd like to think, to challenge the people working on the show themselves (even more-so than it already has from what i've read/watched/heard). there's no harm in having expectations and going "i've had enough of this thing, i want something new". personally, i just see it as you being critical of media you consume and enjoy, which i don't think should ever be seen as a bad thing. if anything i think it should be practiced more (within reason of course). and i've also been asking the same questions to myself. i also have no clue what to hope for either, and after ruminating on it, i'm simply trying to embrace that maybe there's nothing to justify in terms of choosing to watch it or not. again, you could either wait until it comes out and give it a chance, or not! i'm choosing view s8 as all of us literally "sitting in the back seat of the ship" and being along for the ride, embracing the chaos. that's how it felt for me in the second half of season 7. it felt as if they were considering viewers who genuinely LOVE the show and just want it to get better (which could be cope on my part!! idk!!!) i think with how s6 went and especially with how s7 ended, i'd be more surprised if they went back to the classic formula (pre, like, season 5) after EVERYTHING that's happened thus far. not to mention that they're locked in with adult swim for like, many more seasons so i'm sure the concerns you're expressing here are definitely something they've considered and are likely now even more-so with the traction the show has been getting again. i truly want to believe that the minds behind R&M do not want to let themselves or the show itself grow complacent (again, could be cope and me just being really mentally ill about this show). sorry if this is incoherent/rambly/not what you were expecting when sending this ask. you really made me think more about all this though and i hope this answer suffices!

[gl1tt3r-gutz-and-r0b0tz-sl]

So, Megastar is one of those ships I cannot get behind. Cause I really don't see it, for me to ship something it has to have atleast the characters seeing eachother as equals, which doesn't happen with Megastar in most continuities.

I do ship crack stuff from time to time but Megastar doesn't work for me :/

Also, some megastar shippers can be the worst about their ship. I will always think that shipping wars are dumb, regardless the ship in question.

But that's just my opinion, feel free to disagree.

Well, the thing is, I agree with you to an extent. Don't get me wrong, I love my angst and toxic ships, but to the extent some things happen is a little insane. I mean, I vent my feelings and experiences through characters too, but, to threaten, harass, or pitch a fit over a fictional ship is wild. (I'm talking about the shippers when I said that btw.)

I don't mind their dynamic in their shows or even the ship itself. It's the fact that proship correlates with much MUCH worse things, and so when that person put it unironically in their tags, it gave me the ickiest of icks. I mean, using the excuse that fictional abuse is okay because it's fictional is like saying, "Oh, that child got molested. But it's okay, they ain't real."

Abusive themes are supposed to disgust the viewer, to let them know that it isn't good or okay. I'm not talking about kinks or anything, I'm talking full-on bash head into the ground abuse. If a plot romantizes an abusive relationship, it was either written poorly or as a way to vent.

I mean, Arcee gets her cooch ripped out in my au. Themes dark like this are meant to disgust people, to disturb them.

So, for any fucking fit throwers seeing this, I'm not calling your ship the antichrist. Just cool the fuck down and stop grouping it with weird ass pedo tags. Like, fr.

I'm fucking weird too, but not a creeper! Enjoy your toxic homoerotic robot ship all you want! Just. Don't. Tag. It. Like. That!

If it makes you happy, and it isn't illegal or morally corrupt, please do it, consume the media you like. I'm part Austrian and German, but that doesn't mean I'm a ship-killing Nazi or some shit.

[separocean-anxiety]

WALL-E is a deeply flawed movie.

I hate its infantilization and vilification of fat and disabled people, its compulsive heterosexuality and weird gendering of its robot characters, its Edenic recovery narrative masquerading as environmentalism, its "critique" of capitalism that makes no fucking sense when you hold it under scrutiny*, its sentimental spectacle, the fact that WALL-E's collection is romanticized as something endearing and not a symptom of the same consumeristic mindset the film is trying to condemn**, its refusal to play the rest of that goddamn song because its final lyric*** would have made a lovely thesis statement believe it or not!

From all of this one may presume I hate this film, but no!!! I actually feel nothing towards it as a unified piece!!!!!! Which scares me even more!!!! Believe it or not, I catch Glimmers of Something Almost when watching this thing. The first five seconds Work for me, absolutely! But it's such an incomplete picture--incomplete and Very Flawed to boot. I'm just so fucking tired of people praising it as if it's perfect, or remotely accurate to real life. It makes reference to things that we recognize, yes; there is obviously truth to climate change and corporate greed. But it also presents such a skewed view of humanity; its humans are content to discard their own history and agency; when said history (i.e. our present) is "recovered," it's romanticized and suspiciously white. There's just. So much to unpack here.

I have nothing against people who like or even love the movie, but if you can't bring yourself to constructively criticize it (something you should be doing with all media--whether you love or hate it) because you perceive it as "perfect," there's something to unpack there. Please do that!!! It's good to do I promise!!!!!!! And will give you a clearer idea of what you value in art!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm really, really not the kind of person to focus on things that just Don't Work for me, but it freaks me out that the general consensus of this film is that it's somehow above critique altogether. Nothing is, I assure you.

*yes, evil corporations are destroying the planet, but the whole conceit of the Axiom falls apart when you realize this "consumeristic" space-bound society could not realistically produce anything to consume--at least not to this extent, on this scale, for this long, in the middle of space. Where's it deriving its resources from? Where is the trash within the ship coming from??? A critique of capitalism isn't complete without showing how it exploits and abuses people and their labor, something we never see here; it's barely even alluded to with the robots.

**there's nothing wrong with collection in and of itself; the issue lies in the fact that WALL-E's collection stems from circumstances which predispose him to a lack of self-identity, leading him to construct one via collection (re: appropriation, self-objectification, projection [upon Eve]) as opposed to creation; this could've made for a great character study if not for the fact that the film reaffirms this as a Good Thing by having Eve repair him with pieces from said collection in the end.

***BUT WE WON'T COME HOME UNTIL WE FALL IN LOVE!!!

[seeyouonsaturn]

can't remember if I sent any of these so. tell me about Prowl 💖

2. Favorite canon thing about this character?

4. If you could put this character in any other media, be it a book, a movie, anything, what would you put them in?

7. What's something the fandom does when it comes to this character that you like?

8. What's something the fandom does when it comes to this character that you despise?

22. If you're a fic reader, what's something you like in fics when it comes to ths character? Something you don't like?

ask game

2. Favorite canon thing about this character?

That he exists. He's wonderful.

That aside, I've always loved his fascination with nature. I remember being 13 and suddenly seeing the world with new eyes because of him, appreciating things I've never spared a second glance before, because I realized Prowl would find them beautiful. And he's so right. The world is so beautiful. I was fundamentally changed back then and now I am the person I am because of him.

And that said - I also love that he's not always written as the "stoic and super-skilled cool ninja". He's goofy. He's clumsy. Not a lot, but just enough for him to feel like he's just some guy trying his best, still learning, you can tell sometimes that he has never actually finished his training. I love the way he progresses throughout the series, starting out as a loner who just recently wound up with the rest of the team by chance and isn't really one of them, to a member of the family who loves those guys and would do anything for them.

He's great. He's amazing. I need to stop myself before this turns into a full essay. Ily Prowl

4. If you could put this character in any other media, be it a book, a movie, anything, what would you put them in?

I don't have anything specific in mind, my brain cell is too transformers focused to even acknowledge the existence of any other media lmao. Also all the non-tf media I consume is so dark, I wouldn't do that to him, he doesn't deserve it. I'd like to put him inside a nature documentary so he could experience it first hand though. I think he'd enjoy that.

7. What's something the fandom does when it comes to this character that you like?

I love that so many people draw him with animals, especially birds. And cats. That's awesome. Good for him but also good for me because Bird reference!

8. What's something the fandom does when it comes to this character that you despise?

All the shipping lmao I'm sorry. Especially with a certain little guy. I filtered the tag and half the Prowl tag just vanished gdi I just want to see my man 😭

Don't get me wrong, I'm not here to police what anyone can or can't ship, and I'm fully aware that being non-sharing is a me problem, but that doesn't make it any less bothersome. I just want to look at Prowl. There's by far not enough content out there of him, and believe you me, I've looked 😔

22. If you're a fic reader, what's something you like in fics when it comes to this character? Something you don't like?

I don't really read a lot of fic with him in it, mainly because I haven't found a lot of Prowl fics that focus on him. Aside from a whole lot of fics where he's shipped with other characters, but that's not for me. I'm an x reader truther but good food is rare. On one hand it's probably good he's not more popular since I don't like to share him, but on the other hand where is my content. I am starving.

[isnt-that-wizardd]

in every fandom, I see a lot of posts that are always like "if you don't like this character you're wrong" or "you just don't understand them" and seeing those kinds of posts just makes me so frustrated???

most recently I've seen a lot of those posts about the cat king from dead boy detectives (just because it's my latest hyperfixation), and frankly, yeah, I don't really understand. and I will read your entire long post explaining why he's got all these little nuances or subtle tones or genuineness that I missed and I can grow a little more understanding about him. but hey- when I'm done reading your post? unfortunately I still do not like him. I can appreciate him and what he brings to the show, but I just don't like him. it's not because I think he's creepy or gets in the way of a ship or anything most people automatically assume - he's just not my vibe. he simply doesn't fit in the scope of characters I enjoy.

and why is that wrong?? why do I need to be lectured at because of that?? when did fandoms get to a point that people aren't allowed to have differing opinions on a character or dislike a character just because? yes, a lot of the time it is, but it doesn't always need to be deeper than that.

YOU relate to that character on a deeper level, YOU understand their intrinsic motivations, or at least what you perceive them to be, and YOU love that character. fantastic!! I'm happy for you!! enjoying media in a way where you can do that is how it is meant to be!! but in absolutely no universe will everyone ever have the exact same interpretations of a character or piece of media. we all see different aspects of people and relate to things/characters differently. I've been on both sides of things! sometimes my favorite character in a show is someone that everyone else hates or doesn't care for, but I'm okay with that! if they disagree with me, then they disagree with me. I've done the deep dives into why I think the character acts the way they do and taken time to devote myself to better understanding them.

but some people just don't do that. you can be a fan of something without doing that with a character. hell, you can be a fan of something by only ever consuming the source material at its surface level and NEVER going deeper if you do not want to do so. it's allowed.

maybe while you're interpreting a character to have a deeper trauma that results in them acting the way they do, they're reminding someone else of trauma they went through and that character makes them feel bad. maybe you see someone trying to help, but someone else sees it as manipulation. maybe you see someone cold and bitter while someone else sees the kindest person with years of walls built up around them. maybe what someone else interprets as funny, you have never laughed at.

((if we're keeping with the dbd example, think about when the Night Nurse watched Charles' death. what she saw was the quick and utter devotion that Charles developed for Edwin and how deeply he cares for him; she's seeing that Charles will truly not give up in getting Edwin back from hell. what Charles saw was the pure kindness Edwin had done for him even after all those decades in the worst place imaginable; he's seeing who Edwin is on a deeper level. neither interpretations of the memory are incorrect. but after watching the exact same thing, they are thinking in two entirely different directions))

so why does everything seem to start off with "you're wrong" and "I'm sad for you because you just don't get it"? we should be HAPPY that there are people out there who take different approaches and have different interpretations. that is how media is meant to be consumed. and I'm not saying that you shouldn't make your long posts explaining why you love a character- by all means do that!! you understand something that others don't and that should be put out in the world!! but if you're going to do that you also need to understand that there are a lot of people who you WILL persuade, and there are a lot of people who you will NOT. don't be upset about that and certainly do not put down or lecture anyone who doesn't agree with you. it's OKAY. it is not the end of the world just because someone doesn't like a character you like.

everyone interprets media differently. and that's amazing.

[sorryimananti-romantic]

who knows, maybe i'm a glutton for lengthy written pieces of fiction but i can't imagine anything better than reading a thought-out, detailed and intriguing story.

20k-30k wc usually takes me around 2 hours to read (when i am not annotating on the side or running laps in my room to calm down from a scene) and even though i do love me some drabbles, imagines or scenarios - sometimes they're so great but oh so short that i end up feeling hungry for more lol.

idk. maybe there is some over-consumption or fast-media issue that's infiltrated even the fanfic community and readers feel less overwhelmed reading fics under 10k? apprehension giving bad/wrong feedback? author burn-out? somebody go ahead and open the field for research already.

there is an overwhelming amount of short fics daily on my dash and not so often bigger oneshots or even series but i've always assumed it's because they take so much more time and effort into creating - which then motivates me more to leave nice feedback when you authors work so hard on them :) vice versa it's a nice feeling when authors take time to acknowledge feedback

like you saying you look forward to my reblogs and i'm over here like.. i have been noticed 👁️👄👁️ and i am being relied on to lose my own mind over your amazing mind. i can't disappoint this co-dependant author-reader-ship 💪 /j

also, miss "yumi in her break era" only five days ago, once again offering to write a fic to my tastes?! you will be the death of me. hand in marriage right now 🤝 /j but also, new series.. ? ✍️👀

○ chron 🃏

lucky for you, i'm physically incapable of writing short fics and loren is an actual witness. whenever i start a fic and go 'yo this actually be short like under 20k) it usually ends up being 26k+ 🤡 and tbh for me personally nothing can top a well-planned detailed fic no matter the length of it!

you're right! there's only so much you can do in a short scenario/imagine/drabble they're like fun little treats, kind of like appetisers/snacks as opposed to lengthy oneshots which i feel like are a full multiple-course meal (and then we have series which are like a whole buffet banquet feast you name it)

yeah there are a lot of factors. even as a writer i know that i prefer reading sth short when i don't have much time to spare but want a little break. reading lengthier works require a lot of time (like you said, about 2 hrs) and you gotta be in the mood all cosy and relaxed to fully enjoy them!

there's def so many shorter works being produced in huge quantities and consumed very rapidly too. writing them takes less time, you don't gotta work out so many details and lose your mind in the process (from my experience writing the few hcs and drabbles i have) and it's... fun? gets a greater audience, more notes? definitely. there are literally so many factors as to why people prefer writing/reading scenarios/drabbles over the lengthier works and i could honestly list them all but i feel like not everyone wants to hear that 💀

personally, i've been pretty consistent with writing the lengthier works, inspired by ppl here who've written so much such excellent monster works AHAHA and since the lengthier fics culture is pretty much dying (let's face it on tumblr it is dying slowly but steadily) i'm devoted to continue contributing to that specific part of the atinyfic community. i could always cook up some short scenarios (i plan to when it's time to retire but i still have ideas that i wanted to write) but for now, we write and write. we write endlessly without a care for the word count :')

there's honestly nothing wrong with wanting to read or write shorter works. i just wish the people who work so hard to create such beautiful and lengthy masterpieces got the attention they deserve. and i wish they do not compare their works to drabbles/scenarios (which you might have observed get a lot of notes in a very short amount of time) and continue writing for themselves and for the readers who appreciate them :')) we're always so incredibly grateful for the feedback we get bc we get some great quality feedback which is our pride :D

you have been very much noticed! me and loren were actually talking not too long ago about how you are one of the few ppl whose reblog we anticipate eagerly ahaha you've spoilt us honestly :') and when i saw your reblog last night (i was feeling incredibly low) i just smiled with tears in my eyes LOL ngl (co-dependency atp fr fr)

miss yumi has always been a clown who goes back on her words esp when it's about taking a break (i actually will be taking a two week break soon like actual break bc i'll be travelling so i'll be back mid aug) but miss yumi also loves writing bc it's the only interesting thing going on in her life and she would love to write for you too (proposal accepted let's pick dresses now :D)

as for the new series... 👀 the current word count is about 70k and i'm not even halfway- this might be the most intricate worldbuilding i've ever done like with the characters and how they're connected to each other (on par with take me home series, might even surpass) and it's... mafia! but the different kind, uniquely yumi LOL and the pairing hmm will remain a secret (take your guess come on)

i look forward to posting it so much it's become my comfort fic. i'll try to start posting it before 2024 but no promises yet bc i wanna finish writing it (or at least nearly finish) before i post the masterlist or teasers.

[calypsotastic]

Some of my favourites and least favourite relationship tropes

Enemies To Lovers:

Even though I'll admit it's kinda overrated, It's one of my favorites. The (often sexual) tension between the two characters and how their detestation for each other develops into sweet caresses and cuddles always catch me off guard. This trope also can apply to many different type of media's and fiction which is why I love it so much.

Star-crossed Lover:

Probably the most underrated trope in my opinions. Even though most people indulge in romance for the fluff rather than the tragedy, The Star-crossed really indulges me by how it captivates the determination to defy logic and fate even if it inevitably fails and it leads to an interesting read

Right Person, Wrong Time:

Same at the previous one, but instead, they were always meant for each other yet couldn't due to special circumstances. I quite enjoy imagining how they could've been if that had more time and met eachother earlier or later throughout the story. Again, tragedy is too underrated and needs more appreciation.

Witch x Witch Hunter:

It's such a niche trope, yet I believe we need more of it and have some gay and saphics ones for once. Usually this trope follows an Enemies To Lovers storyline which I already consume once every 5 hours and add magic and tension between the two and you one fucking masterpiece, why is this trope so niche.

Supernatural Being X Supernatural Being:

One pet peeve I have with fantasy is that whenever there is a relationship there is always atleast one who is a basic ol human being. It frustrates me that it's never something like Elf x Tiefling or Dwarf x Changling or Kobold x Dragonborn or a fucking Lovecraftian squid and a biblically accurate angel , on of the individuals is always a human being.Humans are already fucking narcissist. I want to indulge in unconventional romance, romance which delves you in a fantasy vast away from our plane of our existence. I want to see beings who most perceive as vile and vicious being loving with eachother. For me the less humanoid it is, the more intriguing it is for me.

Last Minute Love Interest:

Don't you detest when you're reading about the intimate relationship between two characters, their woes, hopes and vulnerabilities revealed to eachother, the distance between them tightens closer and closer. THEN FOR FUCKING REASON ANOTHER CHARACTER WHO SUDDENLY BECOMES REVELANT SNATCHES ONE OF THE CHARACTERS AND YOU'RE LEFT FUCKING UNSATISFIED. I'm sorry but this is quite possibly the worst trope of all of literature and just a cheap gag that ruins the point of what I'm reading. If you want me to become invested in a relationship between two characters, you need to develop some time, and give each of them revelancy, NOT JUST SOME LAST MINUTE PLOT TWIST THAT DIMINISHES THE 300 PAGES AND HOURS OF MY MISERABLE LIFE. Half of the time the guy who shows up last second doesn't even look conventionally attractive at all.

Arranged Marriage:

Irl Arranged Marriages are one of the sickening things an individual meant to care for you can commit. I hate that this ship glorifies arranged marriages as 99% you're going to end up with some creepy ass middle man and you're viewed as an doll, incapable of autonomy and useful for economic or political gain rather than an individual who should get to love who they actually love.

The Brother's Bestfriend:

In actuality it's not that bad but I personally find it putrid, if you know anything about siblings, it's that them and their friends are viles and disgusting cretins, scruffling around the house like cockroaches, riddled with cheeto dust. There's also usually the weird age gap and don't you think it's awkward to date someone whose also simultaneously your sibling best friend and worse if they become your ex.

Possessive Boyfriends:

Now I'm not talking about the jealous boyfriend archetype or even the protective one but rather the ones who treat their signicant others as possession rather than individuals. I fucking hate the line "I own you" or "You're mine" because it signifies authority and superiority something I believe shouldn't be prevalent in a relationship. It's worse when the individual won't allow their SO to go out with friends or do their own things cause inevitably at the day its say it with me A B U S E.

[stylesclarified]

DISCLAIMERS

1- I am a fan of HARRY

I'm not a fan of Louis. I'm not a fan of their friendship or any relationship between the two of them, and I never was.

I was once a fan of 1D and liked all the other members as well, but when the band went their separate ways, I became a fan of Harry and Niall as solo artists. No one else.

2- I'm not a shipper of any kind

I want Harry (and Niall) to be happy doing whatever it is he chooses to do. I do think he wants to find love because he has alluded to it, so I'll always support his relationships and root for him in that regard, but I'm not someone who gets invested in his relationships. The only reason I'm talking about them is this project.

3- I do not own the truth.

The only people who know what happened, in terms of the band, their friendship, the relationships we'll discuss here, are those involved in them. I don't know anything for sure and don't claim to know it either. I try to be as factual as possible and stick to the things that are public knowledge, interpreting them in the best way possible. When I draw conclusions, I make sure to point out that they're educated guesses.

I don't think there's anything wrong with theorizing as long as you're respectful about it, not overly invasive, don't try to bend the truth to fit whatever bias you have, and accept it when you're proven wrong. If you get new information that contradicts a previously held belief, the correct reaction is to change that previously held belief, not sticking to it.

4- I never want to be invasive.

The information I'm working with is public knowledge and widely spread. I don't have access to private information and I wouldn't want it if it was made available to me anyway. My sources are pap and fan pics, social media, media outlets, interviews, and stuff like that. If anything I ever include is private, I promise you it's unintentional and I wasn't aware, and I'll appreciate it if you can point it out so I can exclude it (I don't think it's gonna happen because I'm careful to avoid that, but I'm not infallible).

There are also certain things I don't want to mess with, such as children and family issues. I may skirt around that sort of thing, and I hope you understand why.

5- The purpose of this is to shed light to parts of the truth Larries are lied about or omit.

In my years in fandom, I have met and talked to my fair share of ex Larries, and one thing most of them had in common was communicating that they felt like they were working with half-truths. The masterposts, the videos, the timelines, everything they read and consumed on Larry, was skewed, out of context, and used a lot of fallacies.

There used to be a lot of "anti" resources, but the blogs have been deleted, or privated, or flagged. Links have gone bad, pictures have been lost. Also, Larrie arguments have changed and evolved.

The point of these posts is a resource for both Larries who are willing to challenge their beliefs, leave the echo chamber, and look at the other side, and normal fans (I don't like the term "anti") who want or need tools to talk to Larries themselves.

And yes, part of that is their relationships. There are masterposts about some of them, for sure, but they have a very shippy tone that doesn't really... work. I don't judge people who "ship" real people. I don't get it, but I don't judge it. I just don't think that sort of content would help in this context.

6- Why do I hate the word "anti"?

Well, I hate it because I don't like my space in fandom being defined by what I'm not, especially considering "what I'm not" is a believer on a conspiracy theory. I'm a normal fan. Any normal fan who doesn't believe in a conspiracy theory would by default be an anti, because it's not positive or fun or good for your favorite artist or their loved ones to be the subject of this sort of thing. There's no such thing as "neutral." It also impacts fandom spaces quite negatively. Almost every person who has fans that do this has spoken against it in one way or another.

If you care about an artist and you don't buy into whatever conspiracy theory has been cooked up about them, then you're most likely gonna be against it.

7- Why am I spending time doing this?

Because I find the human brain fascinating. I find the system of beliefs in conspiracies to be both terribly frustrating and utterly intriguing. I want to explore what makes people believe this sort of thing and find the best ways to dismantle it (all the while knowing I'm unlikely to succeed, but enjoying the process regardless).

I also really enjoy talking about pop culture in general. I've been a fan (of Harry's and other artists) since I was a literal child, and I retain information pretty easily, so putting it all down feels a bit like emptying my brain, a little bit like a relief. Of course, that regardless of how well I retain information, there are a lot of things that are common knowledge that I'm simply not gonna know or remember, and it gives me another type of "relief" to reveal a previously held blind spot, so doing research for this project has been fun.

It's not that fun to put it into words, and that's the part I struggle with the most, which is why this might take forever to complete.