#'oots is the worst arc' who??

[shummthechumm]

bumble wc is just a piece of writing from this series that TRULY astounds me. like the characters do not acknoledge that shes a living person whatsoever once she becomes a "nuisance" (she is fat and a house pet). and on top of that, to have turtle tail turn her back on her as well??>?? because gray wing has it bad for her and so we have to exterminate the "obstacle" in the way of their straight romance???

like i expect gray wing and clear sky to be dicks but..why would TURTLE TAIL rationally allow her friend (who lived through the same abuse as she) be shunned away from the moor group??

its some of the most mean spirited shit in this entire series and it only exists as a plotline...for what reason??? cause "kittypets are bad you dont want to be a kittypet"?? its not like you remind us every fucking arc erin hunter. because we're supposed to like gray wing and they really wanted him to serve as an adoptive parent to turtle's litter?? like..what???

i dont even have a real point to this post i just want to express my confusion cause what even was the goal. it does nothing but make the entire cast abuse-enabling discriminatory assholes who are willing to send outsiders to easily preventable deaths. and we're supposed to agree with these jackasses??? ERIN HUNTER WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO SAY TO YOUR ELEMENTARY SCHOOL AUDIENCE???

[inbarfink]

So although Order of the Stick is explicitly textually not an actual D&D game with actual players, it’s pretty cool how well Belkar’s character arc work not just as your usual ‘asshole character learns to care’ story but also mirrors the narrative of an asshole troll player learning to play the game seriously.

Like, while the whole Order kinda plays on standard D&D Class Stereotypes on some level, Belkar was always the one who played more into a Player Archetype than a Character Archetype. Maybe because that Player Archetype is often defined as lacking an interest in serious Roleplaying.

I mean, there’s nothing wrong with wanting to play a tabletop RPG just for dice-throwing and violence. The problem with That Kind Player is more when they attach themselves to a group that is otherwise interested in character and plot - and rather than finding some sort of compromise with the rest of the group or just looking for a new one more amicable to random violence - they keep hanging around while expressing just a total disinterest in the plot.

And caring for really nothing but scoring as many kills as possible, even if it gets in the way of the group’s general strategy...

And/or the DM trying to tell a compelling narrative...

And sometimes just being disruptive and causing conflict for the lols.

Also, Belkar has, like, objectively the worst build in the entire Order and he started out with no understanding of his Class outside the Two-Weapon Fighting. He really does act just like the One Guy who really wanted to play a double-wielding character because it’s badass, saw it’s a Free Ranger Feat and refused to read any of the other features or flavor text of the class.

So when he befriends Mr. Scruffy, it’s not just the ‘Mean Character Warms His Heart to a Cute Animal’ trope - it’s also figuratively about a player learning how to actually play and roleplay his Class and use other class features that are not directly related to just Stab the Enemies and They Fall Down.

And so much of his character arc is about the realization that he doesn’t really know himself. It is a character arc from an in-universe person but it also parallels a narrative of someone who is learning how to engage with his character for the first time and almost, like, retconning more connection between Belkar and his non-combat class features as the metaphorical Player becomes more invested in using them.

And it’s just… pretty interesting, in a stage where OOTS is really moving away from meta-D&D jokes - that the most meta-D&D part of the comic is the pretty-serious character arc of one of the main party members

And, I dunno…

[the-owl-tree]

its SO obvious that they wanted nightcloud to be some evil harpy so we’d feel bad for crowfeather and want him to be with leafpool (who he also mistreats because she had the audacity to choose her friends and family over him. crowfeather would have emotionally abused leafpool truther). crowfeathers trial feels like it wants nightcloud to also fess up to being bad. its so obvious when you read any author statements like from the field guides or websites

I'd say CT is pretty good towards Nightcloud (with my only non-issue criticism being that it does unintentionally and obviously not endorsed by the narrative sort of reaffirm the idea that it was her presence that was stopping them from bonding. obviously this is not the takeaway from the text, but eh, past decisions will always haunt the writing team). Breezepelt loving his mom sooooo so much makes me happy.

Po3 is really kind to her....because she's barely in it LMAO, she doesn't have much character outside of "Breezepelt's mom". She also doesn't really appear in OotS besides background appearances and that One Scene which people will unquestioningly cling onto, remove any context of, and not do any reflection on why they do that in the first place. Because when Nightcloud grabs Crowfeather (yes, she just grabs him), everyone is acting like a drama queen. Lionblaze and Breezepelt are FIGHTING and LEAFPOOL JUST PROFESSED HER LOVE TO CROWFEATHER AGAIN.

No mention of blood, she just fuckijng. grabbed him. if there was blood, we would have known it because breezepelt and lionblaze are beating the shit out of each other on the side lol

So even at her worst, she's still nowhere Crowfeather's level (seriously, if you can't think of the difference between hitting your kid for mouthing off vs. grabbing you partner during a brawl while his ex is going on about he loves her.....come the fuck on. this in no way puts these two on equal levels not at anon just a nebulous 'you'). Even then, this can be explained by everything that happened! That her aggression and unhappiness is from the whole reveal and the crumbling marriage. But this isn't a Nightcloud analysis, my point is that any and all of Nightcloud's actual behavior isn't nearly as focused on as Crowfeather's by the narrative and I don't think Po3 or OotS was trying to convince you otherwise, however, I do think Nightcloud being written more aggressive and "clingy" should be taken into account that the finale of this trio's arc is Crowfeather putting the blame on his wife and then subsequent field guides painting him as correct. The main arc books are fine, you can glean why Nightcloud behaves the way she does but the field guides paint her as a whole other character that we DID NOT SEE!!!! Po3 had plenty of opportunities to show this but they didnt, and instead the field guides invested themselves on a narrative that DID NOT HAPPEN.

The books have a trend of abuse apologia for their father characters, and I think that should be remembered when discussing how the authors and the books chose to handle these three. I know the field guides aren't considered heavy canon, but they're well worth considering to better understand how the writing team understands these characters and "the blame".

Also god yeah, the way Crowfeather treats Leafpool whenever she stopped playing into his fantasy...gross. Very glad more people know he said that shit about "mixed blood" JUST to hurt her, definitely not any red flags here!

[bonefall]

Question: I noticed if you had a choice you'd have given Thornclaw Ashfur's evil arc (except without the incel motivation.) And made Ashfur not evil. May I ask why? Is it from the characterization Ashfur had in TPB?

Reason 1: I think Thornclaw's underlooked as an AU villain

The DELICIOUS irony of the very first warrior Firestar names becoming his family's worst enemy... The contrast between the xenophobic and prickly Thornclaw and his kindly brother Brackenfur, both of them well-known as reliable and responsible warriors. Being stolen by ShadowClan at such a young age and having his father killed in a violent attack, and yet still, concluding that that's the right path.

It's about how Thornclaw could become so committed to the "well being" of ThunderClan that he'll kill and murder for it. The seriousness in his eyes as he hunts you down, the honor of a true warrior without need for underhanded tactics. Nothing about him is a joke, this isn't funny.

The Fire Scene, with Villain Thornclaw, isn't about 'getting back at Squirrelflight.' It's nothing personal; but she has to die along with her whole family so he can get away with it.

It's something I'm so fond of that I do have some Villain Thornclaw in my AU, if you look closely. He's working with Breezepelt and Whiskernose to kill Firestar. He might have known about the plot to get Brackenfur killed and said nothing.

Spiderleg takes his roles post-OotS because he will be dying in the Great Battle.

Reason 2: Shallow childhood fondness of pre-Po3 Ashfur

An AU is an AU, after all. Sometimes I just like to feed the miffed 10-year-old inside of me whose favorite TPB apprentice was Ashpaw, lmao.

Because MAN when I was a kid, I loved Squilf, and haaaated the Fire Scene with villain Ashfur. I remember it happening and being like, "ASHPAW WOULD NEVER. Ashpaw was Cloudpaw's best friend and always helping him cover up secrets :((( he wouldn't DO THIS who is this man... lionblaze was his apprentice.... this is so fake....."

I never had an Ashfur Stan phase, I was just mad that he turned into that lmao.

I love Ashfur now though btw, I am actually very fond of WC's incel villain and I'm really glad they committed to the idea of StarClan making a mistake. I think it's worth what Little Baby Bones lost... that said, sometimes you can just do stuff because it's fun and sparks joy, y'know?

It's why I call that AU "Sweet Nothings," I don't put a lot of thought into the thematic and metatextual implications of it like I do for the Bonefall Rewrite. It's self-indulgent fun.

So instead of being an incel, he's just a petty drama queen who's upset he got rejected and whines about it, not a murderous monster. He's ride-or-die when it comes down to it, and likes to gossip with Ferncloud and Cloudtail. A characterization a lot closer to TPB Ashpaw instead of Po3 Ashfur.

Also he's in a polycule with Hawkfrost/star and Reedwhisker because I like the drama of Hawkash but also have a big soft spot for Hawkreed.

[rawliverandgoronspice]

i feel like nintendo tried to make Zelda perfect because of misogyny. which has always been a thing in Zelda games especially directed at Zelda as a concept and character (trapping her in crystals or statues. that you have to find her etc) it's the same age old female characters cannot have any flaws or else they're a selfish bitch. i wish we saw her be angry at rauru or something but i guess that would go against the narrative. most Zelda games at least had her show some of her emotions besides sadness ... sometimes, this one just didn't show much even if i adore her and will go and find little things in the crevices of this very black and white writing, because i know fans will always turn on her despite the fact that shes also in the writers whims while link who also follows the established status people complain about but gets no shit at all (which i also think he should not get shit for lol)

Yeah, I agree it's definitively a thing in the way female characters are written. However, BotW did show that fans could absolutely care about a less-than-perfect version of Zelda (honestly, so did Skyward Sword, Spirit Tracks --hell, even in Ocarina of Time she makes pretty crucial mistakes). Sonia is handled in the same way Zelda is too: she is paper thin, with the veneer of a more Girlboss personality that never actually meshes with the plot in any way (so it could be removed without consequence, which is a pretty good sign her writing is inorganic imo), since her only function in the story is to get killed so Ganondorf gets a stone, and Rauru gets his tragic arc.

I fully agree the series has its issues when writing women, even up until pretty recently (I'll shut up about gerudos for once in my life and be annoying about something different for a change: but BotW!Paya always made me feel pretty uncomfortable personally, as she's so overtly a character written to be a sexual fantasy before being a person, and I feel like the series didn't dare sailing these waters in quite a long time --OoT being the worst offender imo). But Zelda herself had far more interesting iterations in the series that the casual audience give her credit for, even if she does get damseled left and right and used as reward/motivation --but I feel like it's not always handled in a way that deshumanizes her, there had been interesting iterations on this idea in the series as a whole. Which is why Tears of the Kindgom feels so.... regressive to me? The series used to be much better at handling its female characters --this series gave us Midna! A character that starts off by insulting and demeaning us, mocking our powerlessness by physically embodying our terrified, kidnapped friends and using the player as a mount by force! And she's almost universally agreed-upon as one of the best written characters in the series!!

So yeah, to me, while this absolutely doesn't negate the issues this series has with its female characters, it really is a TotK problem specifically.

[yuridovewing]

3 and 22

3. Screenshot or description of the worst take you've seen on tumblr

It was a good while ago but both related to Ashfur in some way lol. One of them was someone who "liked Ashfur as a villain" but was also like "hey we have to hold Squirrelflight accountable too, she has equal blame in the fire scene. She got mad at him for correcting Brambleclaw for a patrol once!" or another that said Squirrelflight was being ableist to Ashfur cause "he was clearly mentally ill and she took advantage of that so she earned everything he did to her". Both of those were pre TBC takes but whew.

That or the people who were like "Well Crowfeather does suck for hitting his son and making a point out of being cold to him BUT Breezepelt was a villain in OotS so I GUESS I have to side with his dad" wtf dude. There's probably more I'm forgetting tho idk I don't pay that much attention anymore. WAIT WAIT that person on the wc confessions blog that said Bumble was abusive to Turtle Tail or whatever and manipulated her into being a target to Tom or something so the way the tribe cats treated Bumble was totally okay. Right when people were talking about the horrifying way she was treated in canon in terms of her being a fat female abuse victim. Oh that was RANCID.

22. your favorite part of canon that everyone else ignores

Hmmm that's hard at this point tbh, most of the stuff I like is stuff people talk about already, like Longtail's arc or Brightheart. Or the implications that the writers don't really go into but I think are fascinating like religious trauma and how the clans are really controlling and are antagonistic at the end of the day, that's something a good amount of fans already talk about a lot. Best I can think of is uh.... maybe some of the graphic novels? I remember I really loved Millie in the Graystripe's Adventure comic, I loved her design and her sweet but sarcastic personality and her little quirks like being able to talk to dogs. That usually gets overshadowed by her main series incarnation which... honestly feels like a different character most of the time. (She says "Graystripe rescued me from the HORRIBLE AWFUL life of a kittypet" or something when like, that is not what happened girl lol and that is not how you saw it) and idk. Think the earlier comics are pretty underrated all things considered. Besides Rise of Scourge obviously but like besides that.

[lander64]

The next Warriors arc is good be, interesting, to say the least. We don’t really know anything about it, but the only info the Erins have given us thus far is that it will focus on a cat from tPB (the first arc). Which is a confusing choice.

Gonna be putting my thoughts into bullet points to help me convey my opinions.

- ‘Cat from The Prophecies Begin’ is an incredibly broad category. This, potentially, ranges from book 1 elders (One-eye, Patchpelt etc) to cats who were kittens in the last book (Sorrelkit and her brothers).

- But also if the arc takes place after the current arc, well that’s uh, strange? The only cats who are still around since tPB is an elder, or at least getting there. I believe Brambleclaw and Tawnypelt are the youngest cats still alive who come from the first arc, and even those two are getting old. WC is targeted towards kids, so having an elder mc in the main series would be such a weird choice for the arc.

- Some people have been suggesting Princess and Smudge and other non clan cats. While there are stories you could tell with them, few of those are stories you could tell that demands 6 books to tell it. Most likely a whole arc would be full of filler and have a snails speed of a pacing, which wouldn’t be ideal. They’d also run into issue of being too old, but they’d have the excuse to have the arc take place Po3-OotS era. I highly doubt the Erins would stay away from the Clans, for a super edition sure, but for a whole damn arc? For characters that aren’t that popular in the fandom at large?

- This leaves our options limited.

- First option, prequel arc. Self explanatory, an arc that takes place before tPB. This feels unnecessary. We already have a stand alone book for basically all the important first arc cats. Therefore, there’s nothing that a whole arc could tell us that we don’t already know. Hell, a consistent criticism of the new standalone books, like Leppordstar’s Honor and Onestar’s confession, is that they add unnecessary, contradictory, and, well bad, information.

If we do get a prequel arc, it’ll most likely be a sequel arc to DotC. Which was the worst selling arc so I doubt it will happen.

- Second option, Starclan arc. Our PoV/s is a Starclan cat and we have an arc take place directly in the clans afterlife. This is actually my favourite suggestion out of all of them. We’re long past the days of Starclan being a mysterious and unknown entity, so getting to know more about how it works, the politics of it all, and get very interesting character interactions, would be a welcome breath of fresh air. You could do a lot with it and expand upon previously undeveloped cats. You could even have something Dark Forest related. This would be an incredibly unique arc, I do highly doubt this is the direction the Erins would take though. But if they do then I’d welcome it.

- Third option, legacy kits. Next arcs Pov isn’t actually the first arc cat, but a relative. This is ether gonna be another Nightheart situation or we get Scourge’s edgy op daughter who’s here to destroy the clans as revenge!!! Or something boring. This one really depends, and would more likely than not be retreading old ground.

And that’s all The ones I can think of that make somewhat sense. Of course we could always get an elders pov or a whole arc outside of the clans despite my severe doubts and issues with those ideas. Honestly, we just don’t know enough to be confident about anything of the next arc. We don’t even have the title for the last book in the current arc yet. But speculation and conversations about it are always a fun time imo.

Feel free to share your ideas of what the next Warriors arc could look like if you’re interested.

[neon-lights-stardust-nights]

🔗 || What's the most extreme thing they have ever done for you? - for ganon? :D

Me, seeing you manage to ask a question that has layers and being fondly reminded of all the times you've poked The Hugo Box and gotten an answer that also has a Shrek meme's worth of layers

[meme]

So! Ganon(dorf) and Ymir!

As of now (though this is subject to change,) there are three incarnations of Ymir in relationships with Ganondorf. They are:

Zanzo (Kokiri)

Velzin, kinda (Twili)

Zedriel (Sheikah? Yiga? I'm debating making up my own clan, but the design was inspired by OoT Impa, SkSw Impa, and the Yiga from BotW)

That's a lot of incarnations! In comparison, Vaati only has one (Fufunmir - Minish,) and Ghirahim was with the first incarnation of Ymir (who uhhhh WORKING ON IT!) Zant has two incarnations to his name, but that's as close as anyone else gets to Ganondorf.

Now, granted. That's partially because he's been alive so goddamn long. (Or... Revived so many times?) But still. I am trying to contextualize that he has had a lot of time to wrack up "extreme things he has done."

I think on some level, the necklace he fashioned Zanzo could be considered one of them. After all, he had to have a portion of The Lost Woods torn through just to make it (not that he TOLD Zanzo that though.) The metal, gems, glass for the locket-thing part, and water inside it are all sourced from the woods, allowing him to enchant it so that it could sustain Zanzo. After all, Kokiri who leave the forest die eventually (and sometimes unpredictably) after they begin aging... The Lost Woods is a small price to pay for his lover's safety.

But on some level, that's understandable! It's not even the worst thing OoT Ganondorf has ever done. No, no. This boy has done plenty worse. A man who turned basically everything alive in Hyrule Castle Town into fucking Redeads is not a man who stops at tearing up a forest and their partner's former home.

Velzin is a Twili, long lived and complicated. Fae technically had a whole character arc before TP took place, before Ganondorf or Zant ever had a chance to do much of anything. By the time Ganondorf is properly alive again, able to recognize Velzin as an incarnation of Zanzo... I mean, Velzin didn't even remember being Zanzo. Let alone why Ganondorf was slinging all these claims about. Zant also had been talking about a prince for his master, and now it all clicks. That was apparently fucking faer.

Ganondorf sort of kind of killed Velzin with magic to try and force a quick reincarnation, for lack of better description.

IDK, killing a version of your lover who refuses to acknowledge the truth of their past in order to potentially obtain a version of your lover who does feels pretty extreme to me. Velzin didn't exactly appreciate being magically incinerated. I think Velzin would whine and say this was it, if Velzin were capable.

There's also just all the shit he's done for Zedriel and Zanzo. Especially Zedriel. Fae is supposed to be his prized assassin, but he's more than willing to handle "things" for faer that fae doesn't want to. Zanzo also sat on a throne of bloodshed.

People have died in their names.

This too could be rather extreme.

I'll say it's either Velzin's death, or Zanzo's necklace.

[cometchasr]

bramble definitely had some Issues to work with in arc 2 (mainly his arrogance and related issues) and he did work through it. very cool. i will admit that i am fucking shit at doing literally anything tangential to plot analysis of these silly battle cat books, but this is how i view his attitude here. he's not really abusive (yet, perhaps), just a massive asshole

then in po3 they've worked through their issues, bramble learnt that (surprisingly) he could be wrong about something and needs to listen to others. at the end of po3 he's (rather understandably) upset, and though moonkitti says that she doesnt think squilf can actually trust bramble (bc he lied about the dark forest thing, i think?) i think she's ignoring his character development. he was an asshole then, yes. he should not have lied, yes. but remember that he was an arrogant prick who thought he's always right at that point. he's changed, surely?

oots has them be incredibly salty towards each other but i think we gotta commend bramble's self-control in not assigning squilf to the worst jobs every day out of petty revenge. he's also justified here (somewhat) in being angry. kinda obvious, isn't it? your children aren't actually yours and your wife doesn't trust you. once again his arrogance comes into play (he doesn't think that maybe, he could be part of the reason and that he should have worked to listen to others more), but he is justified. it is obviously not the best way to deal with this (the best way would probably have been, you know, talking it through and not disowning your fucking kids), though.

post-oots? do whatever you want i havent read it and never will. please remember that i'm going off of half-remembered plot details and my analysis skills are terrible when it comes to this series. take these with a ton of salt (or sugar, or spices, or whatever)

[izunias-meme-hole]

My first time watching a man go from a young man, to a cruel hearted monster, to a remorseful figure that changes himself in one final act. A lesson that people can be complicated, yet simplistic.

Not my first time seeing a “regular guy” doing what’s right, but certainly one that lingers in my mind in some capacity as the years go by.

They’re a good part of my childhood. These takes on the characters specifically not only reinvented their original dynamic, but showcased what it was in the clearest way possible. Two drastically different folks who want some change in their society, who have different ideas on how that can be done. Granted Optimus is the equivalent of an actually talented college dropout in this show, and Megatron was more of a mob boss mixed with a revolutionary, but I feel like the idea was still conveyed very well.

Ever since my introduction to him in Mario Kart DS and New Super Mario Bros Wii when I was 5, he's kinda been a consistency in my childhood alongside a couple of other purely fun villains, but the main reason why I'm listing him is because I feel like whenever I see good ol' Bowser here, it's like seeing an old friend who pops up now and again. Guess that goes to show that some characters just happen to stick with you, even after a good amount of time.

A continuation of what I learned from Vader, complete with a redemption. Vegeta never started out as a “good guy,” in fact he was a total bastard who was only semi-sympathetic because he wanted to end a greater evil (For his own purposes but still). Yet as Z went on, I saw the changes in his character happen before my eyes, where it all eventually paid off at the end of the Cell Saga and Buu Saga. His arc felt slightly rushed due to it not being planned, but I never felt like it was unnatural.

I already knew that pride was a poison if left unrestrained, but curiosity being a spark to fuel it was something I never truly witnessed in detail so I never outright got it, until diving into Kingdom Hearts and learning about the OG KH Trilogy’s lore for Ansem back in late 2018. Hell looking back at the Ansem reports back in KH1, make me understand exactly how much of a believably dangerous combo it is because I can fully get the mindset of it now. I can relate to feeling the need to know more about certain things, so seeing that be brought to an extreme, in the form of flashiness and good writing (From 2002) had an effect on me.

I’ve seen the whole “power of friendship” shit before my dive into KH, but I feel like the approach to the concept in the first three games in the series was still handled the strongest through this kid, and I slowly appreciate him more everyday.

My love for Final Fantasy truly emerged because of this man showing up in KH and I will never not love him for that.

After playing through OoT and MM for the first time during the pandemic, I feel like there’s never been a character that’s embodied the idea of growing up too quick like this kid, and the fact that I was around 15 around that time, made his story stick to me some more. So consider me nostalgic.

The final evolution of what I learned from watching a fair share of antagonists over the years, but conveyed through a more irredeemable figure that is a best example of a simple yet complicated man. He's the same monster in all of his showings in some capacity, yet he always remains engaging as a character for a plethora of reasons that end up all accumulating to the most compelling showcase of self-destructiveness I have ever seen. A terrifying monster of a man who consistently, without fail, is often his own worst enemy.

I used to watch this show when I was a toddler through a set of old DvD's from the 90's, and its just remained a consistent part of my earliest memories of my childhood, and while it was full of adventure, I mainly remember just watching it due to how mundane it all seemed. There's honestly not much to it, I just wanted to see a bunch of trains do their jobs and go about their lives too.

There are other character's and series's that have shaped my tastes, and just who I am as a whole, but I just wanted to list a few for this small post because we'd be here for hours if I went over everything.

Merry Christmas! Consider this an Ask Meme! Reblog with your responses.

[panvani]

Belkar's epic speech about how people in power almost always choose status quo over anything beneficial to those not in power because inevitably those in power want to cling to that power in the comic that literally categorizes people into Lawful or Chaotic and almost invariably characterizes people who are Lawful as More Good than people who are Chaotic

[sakuraswordly]

And

Source information: https://www.reddit.com/r/truezelda

Write by  u/RenanXIII

The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time is a Beautiful Tragedy About Growing Up

Link is one of Nintendo’s most fascinating protagonists, in that he is one of many. From as early as A Link to the Past, The Legend of Zelda has been home to a multitude of Links. While the first few games made little effort to characterize Link beyond some light backstory, Ocarina of Time presented an opportunity to give him an actual arc. Where the Hero of Hyrule (Hyrule Fantasy, Adventure of Link) and Legendary Hero (A Link to the Past, Link’s Awakening) are almost fairy tale-esque in how their suffering is reversed by the ends of their games, the Hero of Time (Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask) carries a cross his entire life. His is a classic coming-of-age story that turns Link into someone beyond a silent avatar. The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time is revolutionary for a myriad of reasons, but it doesn’t get enough credit for how profound its storytelling is.

Ocarina of Time is, at its core, a tragedy. The worst thing that happens to the Hero of Hyrule is that he becomes the target of Ganon’s cultists. By the end of Adventure of Link, he has proven himself worthy of the Triforce of Courage and successfully fought back Ganon’s forces. The worst thing that happens to the Legendary Hero is his uncle’s death. By the end of A Link to the Past, everyone who died during Ganon’s conquest has been revived and Link is free to gleefully explore the world at his leisure. The worst thing that happens to the Hero of Time is hard to pin down considering just how much the boy suffers in OoT alone.

This Link is a war-orphan and a refugee, left in the care of the Great Deku Tree by a dying mother her son never meets. Life in Kokiri Forest is safe but isolating, as the children of the forest never quite see Link as one of their own. Dialogue heavily suggests Link was othered by his peers. Link’s treehouse is isolated from the rest of his community, tucked away on a lower level of the forest and fenced off. Saria notes that Link is a “true Kokiri” now that he has Navi, showing that even his closest friend saw an inherent difference between them. The Deku Tree refers to him as “the boy without a fairy,” an authority figure immediately othering the Hero of Time within the context of the story. Link’s life is lonely and lacking in solidarity. Compare this to the sense of family each other Link either has or eventually finds.

The Hero of Hyrule has no mentioned family, but he wins over the affection of two Princess Zeldas. The Legendary Hero was trained by and lives with his uncle. The Hero of Winds (The Wind Waker, Phantom Hourglass) has a grandmother and younger sister who care about him deeply. The Little Hero (The Minish Cap) and New Hero of Hyrule (A Link Between Worlds, Tri Force Heroes) both live with their grandfathers. The Divine Beast (Twilight Princess) and Hylia’s Chosen Hero (Skyward Sword) both come from tight-knit communities that go out of their way to take care of them. The Royal Engineer (Spirit Tracks) and Hero of the Wild (Breath of the Wild) are members of prestige brotherhoods and forge deeply intimate bonds with their respective Princesses.

At most, the Hero of Time had Saria and the Great Deku Tree before Navi. And while Mido does refer to Link as their “favorite,” the Kokiri hardly share the same sentiment. No one seems particularly choked up to see Link leave the forest and Mido & Fado are actively stand-offish, almost accusing him of being responsible for the Deku Tree’s death. “What did you do!? The Great Deku Tree… did he… die? How could you do a thing like that!?” / “What did you do to the Great Deku Tree?” The only person who bothers seeing Link off is Saria, yet all he can do is run away from the moment. He lacks the emotional maturity to say goodbye properly.

It makes for an interesting parallel when Link calmly walks off after being abandoned by Navi in the ending, signifying his newfound maturity. It’s also a beat that bookends the Hero of Time’s story with sadness. His journey begins and ends by bidding farewell to his closest companions, presumably never seeing either one again. The only thing Link has to show for his adventure is the growth he internally underwent. It almost takes some of the whimsy out of Ocarina of Time to scrutinize over Link’s arc so intently, but the game gains something a bit more profound in return: pathos.

It’s hard not to feel for the Hero of Time, or his Zelda for that matter. Part of what makes Ocarina of Time a quintessential coming-of-age narrative is that it does not shy away from childish mistakes or the inevitable failures we all experience as we transition into adulthood. Tragic heroes all have a flaw, and Link and Zelda are undone by their youth. They are forced to grow up before their time (literally in Link’s case), making the mistakes young people would realistically make in their situation. Zelda’s master plan to get the Triforce before Ganondorf can is unraveled by the short-sightedness only a child could have.

She does not have the life experience to consider that the Triforce is already in the safest place it could be — locked away in a Sacred Realm. Ganondorf has also failed to collect the three Spiritual Stones, whereas Link already has one by the time he meets Zelda. By sending Link off to collect the remaining Stones and take the Triforce for themselves, the only thing Zelda accomplishes is Ganondorf’s hard work for him. The Master Sword deems young Link unworthy of wielding it and throws him into a seven year coma, as if divine punishment for his recklessness. Zelda herself goes into hiding and assumes a new identity just to survive, left to watch from afar as Hyrule is desecrated by a tyrant she gave the keys to the kingdom to.

Finding yourself is a natural part of growing up, so it makes sense that identity plays a key role in both Link and Zelda’s arcs. Link does not know who he is, Zelda has to hide who she truly is. Now the deposed princess of Ganondorf’s kingdom, Zelda poses as a Sheikah named Sheik. She waits seven years for Link to reappear just to help him from a distance, keeping the only person who can possibly understand what she’s been through at arm’s length. She is a survivor who will do anything to heal Hyrule, no matter the pain it may bring her. Zelda cannot afford to be herself. Yet it’s in being Sheik where she displays the qualities Hyrule’s leader needs: the patience to simply wait, the courage to fight alongside her people, and the wisdom to right her wrongs.

Zelda has her kingdom ripped away from her, but Link is in many respects a man without a nation. He is raised as a Kokiri his entire life, but ostracized enough where he has no real attachment to the culture. He doesn’t even live in Kokiri Forest after returning home. Link finding out he is a Hylian does not so much as shake him, because his identity was never tied to culture — it was tied to being alone. He went from being the boy without a fairy to the Hero of Time, something no other Hylian can understand.

Link and Zelda’s final parting highlights just how much the two have been through. Zelda’s face conveys a genuine amount of sadness bordering on regret. Link has to go home. He deserves a second chance at his childhood for everything he’s gone through. “Now, go home, Link! Regain your lost time! Home… Where you are supposed to be… the way you are supposed to be.” But doing so means that Zelda no longer has anyone by her side who comprehends what she’s been through, a fate she unknowingly condemns Link to as Navi leaves him seconds after they get back. Link and Zelda are kindred spirits divided by time.

What makes Ocarina of Time’s story so profound is that its fantastical narrative is grounded in real emotion. People come and go. Our closest companions leave, sometimes without so much as a warning. We might discover who we always were only to realize it doesn’t matter in the face of who we are. Others might decide on our behalf that it’s best to say goodbye, leaving us to pick up the pieces alone. Growing up means spending day after day with a friend just so they can suddenly go their own way. The Hero of Time’s arc is a classic hero’s journey steeped in a profoundly human sadness. Growing up before our time, letting go of childhood before we’ve even had the chance to grasp it, and losing familiarity’s comfort as it’s ravaged by time. It’s precisely this level of tragedy that emotionally grounds Ocarina.

There’s a layer of depth present in OoT’s writing that reveals itself when you look beyond the surface. The Hero of Time’s backstory is still one of the most comprehensive in the series, with most Links never getting the same amount of attention given to their identity. Who he was is shrouded in mystery, but you can cohesively track this Link’s life from childhood into adulthood. Not even the heroes with sequels grow quite like the Hero of Time. We see him become a man and leave his boyish traits behind. Princess Zelda has actual agency and gets to be an active member of the plot as Sheik. Zelda is as much a main character as Link, their stories naturally intersecting and reflecting one another. Heroism often comes without glory or reward. You will not necessarily be praised or even acknowledged for your accomplishments. No one might even notice. But that doesn’t mean the right thing isn’t worth doing.

No other Link before or after has undergone as tragic an arc. Zeldas who stand by their heroes as legitimate co-leads are still a rarity for the series. Which is a shame, because it’s really what elevates Ocarina of Time as a story. Link has zero dialogue, but you can still relate to what is happening to him and trace a clear arc from the start of the game to the very end. Zelda has a tangible presence throughout the whole story and helps Link beat Ganon. Sheik’s flowery speech injects the script with a poetic language that incites self-reflection. “Time passes, people move… Like a river’s flow, it never ends…” The Hero and Princess of Time are the stars of The Legend of Zelda’s greatest tragedy.

Tragic figures are compelling. They fail, but can offer us the hope that we can overcome our own failings. Link’s reckless need to dive headfirst into any conflict becomes genuine courage as he braves Hyrule’s Temples. Zelda learns from her mistakes, wisely guiding Link from a distance and gaining an emotional intelligence that sells her growth from a rash princess playing hero to a worthy queen. “All the tragedy that has befallen Hyrule was my doing… I was so young… I could not comprehend the consequences of trying to control the Sacred Realm. I dragged you into it, too.”

Time is a double-edged sword. Everything we gain from time, we lose something in return. Wisdom comes at the cost of innocence and perception of blissful ignorance. Maturity is forged through failure, each chain its own symbol of pain. Link ends Ocarina of Time lonelier than he began, Navi gone and the friendships he made non-existent. If Majora’s Mask were a lesser sequel, it would have ended with Link and Navi reuniting, but it doesn’t, because that’s not true to life or Ocarina’s point. What separates Ocarina of Time from virtually every other Zelda game is that fantasy concedes to reality. The hero pulls the sword out of the stone, but not without damning consequences. The hero saves the world, but not without paying a personal price. The hero comes home, but nothing and no one is the same.

The Legend of Zelda is no stranger to bittersweet endings, with Link’s Awakening beating Ocarina of Time to the punch by half a decade, but melancholia is ingrained in OoT’s DNA on an intimate level. Link and Zelda eventually succeed at stopping Ganon, but not without being irrevocably changed. The boy who lived a lonely life gave his childhood away to save a world he cannot take part in. The princess who had enough foresight to prevent calamity inadvertently brings ruin upon her kingdom and bids farewell to her only knight — only friend — as penance.

Sending Link back in time is a kind gesture, but it’s not the mercy Zelda thinks it is. Ignoring all narrative speculation, the reason Navi leaves at the end of the game is simple. Even if you could go back in time and somehow relive your childhood, you wouldn’t be the same. We can never truly go back to who we were, even when a fantasy princess bends the rules of space and time to will it so. Navi’s departure puts Link back where he started, but with the emotional maturity to walk into the future instead of running in fear. It’s a powerful note to end Link’s arc on, a reflection of the childhood he will never get back and the courage that helps us confront the future.

Childhood may fly by, but the memories we make last a lifetime. Adulthood is not without its suffering, but it can make us stronger. Tragedy shapes and breaks and reshapes everything, but that doesn’t mean you won’t find happiness in the moments in-between. Ocarina of Time’s story is not joyless, but it does take itself seriously and respects the audience’s emotions enough to make Link and Zelda earn their victory — their growth. They need to grow up and find themselves before taking on their responsibilities in earnest, which in a way is the journey we all have to go on through life. Relatably human, The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time is a beautiful tragedy that gets to the heart of growing up.

Here's that same write-up, but with pretty gifs and images:

https://goombastomp.com/legend-of-zelda-ocarina-of-time-tragedy-story-analysis/

[the-owl-tree]

Breezepelt’s conversation with Sunbeam was so enjoyable. His comment about parents being the worst cracked me up. Glad there is still some part of Breezepelt that rightfully thinks his dad sucks. I also appreciate seeing Breezepelt as a more mellowed out senior warrior that is still a bit snarky and prickly.

Also I’m glad that Squirrelstar shut Ivypool up after she made her weird kittypet comments, it was an odd choice because in the same conversation she is the most willing to directly interfere with RiverClan’s affairs (though it is framed as the evil possibly influencing ThC too, which I guess isn’t unfounded given they just dealt with Ashfur who did negatively impact all of the Clans, but still annoying).

i'll take my little crumbs of crowfeather hate even if its in the half-assed form of "haha dads amiright". authors you will never recover from the crownightbreeze debacle that lasted po3, oots, and the field guides and i will never let you forget it.

I feel very mixed on Ivypool's writing...I was kind of hoping that her character was going to develop more after TBC and she'd be more critical of her own belief's after she realizes she's been saying what the Imposter preached. It's frustrating that she's still written as a WC conservative with no real reflection of her in that regard. Ah, shame, happy for Ivy fans who are happy to see her as deputy though!

I'm iffy on this whole bizarre take on trying to both sides the Clans, uh, helping each other? Idk it feels like they're using Ashfur the same way they use Darktail: the One Bad Cat is the root cause of bigotry and not something that has been supported and rewarded by the structure of the Clans itself. Idk, this with the whole religious thing going on in the arc has me concerned for it where it's going thematically.

[cat-in-a-basement]

Main Character Opinion Piece

Ah, opinions. That old chestnut. I do want to get back to sharing thoughts on this cursed series but sometimes lack Motivation (trademark pending). So here’s a list below of the main characters in the main book series and how I would rank them. 

Note: aVoS and DotC are excluded because I have not read them yet. I don’t want to give thoughts on something I have limited knowledge of.

Hollyleaf: 9/10. The perfect storm of everything I like combined with a dynamic story and complex character. She's not perfectly consistent and I recognize those faults but no other warriors character captivates me in how strong a presence she has. 

Squirrelflight: 8.5/10. What I like about her is her growth from annoying apprentice to headstrong warrior. I love she doesn't filter her thoughts and she'll break rules and the societal norm to do what's right. She's selfless, compassionate and complex, and really, really needs a break.

Ivypool: 8/10. I do believe rereading my opinion on Ivypool might lower since she's underutilized in OotS. But more so I love the idea of Ivypool, what she could have been. And that concept colors my perception of her in an ideal world where that happened.

Rootspring: 7/10. Rootspring is very good, until he isn't. Like Feathertail he's very likeable when he's taking on an active role as Rootpaw, but when he becomes a warrior he loses some of the dynamic-ness and personality he had as an apprentice. Come TPoNS, he's become a window reacting without any flair of the personality he once had.

Dovewing: 6.5/10. I used to dislike Dovewing, finding her hard to read about in OotS because she acted like a child (as children are want to do). While now I've grown to appreciate her more, she doesn't leave a big impact on me. I don't have a lot of investment in her character, and so I am indifferent to her in the books.

Jayfeather: 6.5/10. Jayfeather I have complex feelings about, because while I do think he's a good character, I for the life of me cannot make myself like him as a person (er, cat). I have settled on indifference towards him because he has settled into his role as gruff medicine cat and I just sort of mentally check out.

Firestar: 5/10. Firestar...is a warm bowl of soup. Not bad, not amazing, but it fills the belly. I don't gravitate towards him as a character because he's a very safe, very mild character who acts as the typical hero in a young adult/children's novel. I can't say I hate him, but I don't particularly care for him either.

Bristlefrost: 4.5/10. Bristlefrost being so low here is a crime I'll never forgive. She started out so strong, with sound character development, hopes, dreams, ambitions. But it unraveled so quickly, with some of the worst character regression I have ever seen. We need to be going up, not down!

Leafpool: 4/10. Leafpool never started out strong for me, but I actively began to dislike her after how she treated her apprentice/son, and especially after her actions in Leafpool's Wish. She's selfish and bitter all without the intrigue that would bring. I find it hard to accept what the books say as her being a gentle and kind figure when she doesn't act like it in my books.

Lionblaze: 3/10. Lionblaze in PoT was angry hot head guy. Okay, not as good as his siblings but not offensive. Lionblaze in OoTS does nothing but mope over Cinderheart or act as a window. Boring, lazy. Where did his personality go? It's like an incline where he somehow keeps getting worse. By TBC he's at the worst he's ever been and even with his shitty behavior he is continually rewarded for it. You want to get on BC's bad side? Be terrible with no intricacy and get rewarded for it.

Shadowsight: 3/10. Of the three PoVs for TBC, Shadowpaw had been the weakest for me. But it became apparent the writers really wanted him to suffer, even is the injury was literally falling off a cliff. What is so infuriating about Shadowsight is he actively warps the story so he can be painted in a sympathetic light and he does not grow, he does not learn, we're expected to watch him suffer and go 'yep that's a character.' It's especially awful he warps other characters around him for the sake of his suffering.

Bramblestar: How did we get from sweet, brave, dynamic Bramblepaw...to this. As Bramblepaw he was good, very good. He had a great arc denouncing his father and teaching Firestar to not judge him for his father's crimes. Bramblepaw is a 7/10. 

But Brambleclaw completely regressed in character to suddenly need his father's approval, and was a moron who didn't listen to Squirrelflight’s concerns 'hey, uh, your brother is kind of evil', and — oh, found it difficult to decide whether or not to kill his leader and commit treason. Firestar should have not made him deputy. I imagine Bramblepaw wouldn't want to be deputy after that if he was still that same character. But no, he gets rewarded for his character regression and idiocy. 2/10.

Bramblestar? He went from idiot rewarded for bad ideas to emotionally abusive partner. His cold shoulder to Squirrel in OotS is manipulative, his actions in SqH are disgusting and gaslighting, and to top it off, the narrative treats him as a good and kindly high king when he clearly has not earned it at all! GOD, I hate Bramblestar. 1/10.

Stormfur: 1/10. By all rights, Stormfur shouldn’t be considered a main character here. But he is so very bad I felt it was my civil duty to include him. If there's one thing worse than being actively shitty, it's doing nothing at all. Stormfur is a dead fish and even then the dead fish probably has more personality. He's the lowest because I cannot think of a single good thing about his character or story. He's bland and boring, does absolutely nothing and gets rewarded for it.

[everybody-loves-purdy]

I think one thing I don’t like about the Warrior Cats fandom is the fans who will defend horrible cats and act like they’re innocent who did not wrong. Like it’s okay to like a horrible character and still knowledge the bad things they’ve done, you’re not a fake fan for doing so? I’ve seen people defend Thistleclaw, Ashfur, Bramblestar, and Mapleshade.

Like Frecklewish couldn’t swim, she’s a Thunderclan and it’s been stated multiple times that only Riverclan cats can swim- her jumping into to save them would’ve made things worse since she just be another cat the Riverclan patrol had to save. Reedshine wasn’t even aware that Appledusk and Mapleshade was mates; Appledusk was a caring mate to Mapleshade and yeah, he turns away from her. However, he is a grieving father who has to face the reality that his mate caused the death of their kits and willingly put them in danger even when he warned them to stay away from the river. Ravenwing only called out Mapleshade for lying to a grieving family and their clan. Squirrelflight aren’t to blame for how Ashfur and Bramblestar treat her- like, how dare Squirrelflight be a cat with her own feelings and opinions on things? How dare Squirrelflight decide to be honest with Ashfur and admit she only sees him as a friend? She never used him- she actually gave him a chance! Thistleclaw was never a good mate or father, he talked about Snowfur in the Dark Forest and he tried to keep Whitestorm from interacting with Bluefur- his own aunt and didn’t care if Tigerclaw was being too harsh to his own son during training. Silverhawk, a Dark Forest cat, even questions if Thistleclaw actually cared for his mate.

I think it’s okay to like villains- to like horrible characters but defending their actions, acting like it was never their fault, that they’re innocent and did no wrong. To the point where these fans hurt other fans during arguments is just awful. Ashfur is a ruined character for me due to one apologist who went too far trying to convince people Ashfur was a innocent cat who ‘dealing with grief and loneliness’, ‘he thought he was doing what was right’, ‘he only had Squirrelflight and she rejected him’.

I completely agree. I’ve always said like whoever you want but just don’t defend their shitty actions. For example I love Breezepelt (don’t ask me why I don’t know either lol), but you’ll never get me defending him for what he did in oots. You tell me he’s an awful trash person in that arc? Yeah I agree he’s the worst, I’m not going to defend that dumpster fire of immaturity and spite.

I’m really sorry Ashfur was ruined for you like that, I’ve had a character ruined for me due to an interaction with someone else (completely different fandom to this) so I know what that’s like

[yuridovewing]

What the various authors do to Jayfeather drives me crazy. Like this man skyrockets between ableist to decent person to ableist to shithead to okay to Holy Shit This Man Is Workin Miracles to shithead to child abuse to

Like. My god. At least from what I remember he probably gets the worst of the characterization author inconsistencies.

Yeah, to be completely fair, it’s difficult to write a grumpy character, at least in my experience. You have to have some kind of balance to still make them likeable to the audience, usually by giving them a cheerful character to bounce off of, giving said character their comeuppance in some minor way, or giving them a sympathetic reason for acting that way. And to Jayfeather’s credit, he does have those qualities, at least in po3 and oots. There is a reason he’s a fan favorite, after all, clearly something about that resonates with people. I’ve got plenty of friends who love him in those books even if he’s not for me.

The problem for me is that the Erins like to cancel those out or write them poorly, like killing Briarlight and otherwise not giving Jayfeather a character who can stand up to him without fawning over how, no, his assholery is so charming actually and he’s such a good guy! A lot of the time, they can’t even do the bare minimum of having him be an asshole with consequences to him, at least thus far in avos. No, Jayfeather is SO justified for verbally abusing children because they annoy him while he works! Ha ha CLASSIC Jayfeather constantly screams at his apprentice, typical! /s

Like it’s funny sometimes, I got a couple of smiles out of The Apprentice’s Quest’s prologue which had him as the POV, and even in Thunder and Shadow I thought the bit where he straight up told Kestrelflight to drug Onestar with painkillers to be darkly funny (if only because it was clearly banter). But it’s uncomfortable to see him constantly berate his own apprentice and a literal orphaned child, and how he’s literally known to be someone who people are afraid to go to for help because they know he’ll berate them, and he gets no real consequences besides Alderheart snapping at him a few times (Which usually results in Jayfeather shouting him down and “winning” anyways) He still has the respect of everyone around him and it’s treated like a quirky thing because occasionally he’s kind of nice to Alderheart. It’s just uncomfortable at this point. Arc 1 Yellowfang worked for me because while she was also a grumpy person in a position of power, she did it to people who could take it, like Fireheart and Bluestar and Cinderpelt (who also works as a cheerful nice character for her to bounce off of). Jayfeather only has that in Leafpool and Briarlight, and they don’t use Briarlight enough in avos for it to work effectively before they snipe her, and Jayfeather hates Leafpool enough to bitch about her at her funeral and even after her death to the imposter if I’ve read some excerpts right.

I can kind of see the idea that the new team just has no idea how to write him and only see “oh he’s the fan favorite who is an asshole”, but I haven’t read oots in a while so I’ll hesitate on that.