#you also don't NEED a reason to not be into a ship but I digress

[ghostinspecter]

far be it for me to stir things up but to be completely fair to varlie/chaggie and their song being a reprise, I don't feel it's cheap so much as it is thematic. That's a song Charlie sings with the people she loves (more than anything)

[o-sachi]

Cowboy, Pirate, or Samurai? pt. 2 ₊⊹ Blue Lock Chars.

ଳ how the blue lock boys respond to, “would you rather be a cowboy, pirate, or samurai?”

ଳ characters; rin itoshi, sae itoshi, shidou ryusei, michael kaiser, alexis ness, hiyori yo, kiyora jin

ᯓ Rin Itoshi - Samurai

He'd find the question a bit stupid because is his answer not obvious? "Too noisy," he'd say about the pirate and the cowboy. Rin's more of a lone wolf—moving in silence and always planning his next move. I don't see him choosing anything else aside from the samurai. Also, I have a feeling he's not too fond of water, especially the wide and deep waters of the seas that pirates have to traverse. He looks like the type to have motion sickness, but he's too prideful to admit it.

ᯓ Sae Itoshi - Pirate

Have you seen that one official art? I mean... I think Sae has the qualities to be the leader of a ship. Our idea of that has probably been influenced by Jack Sparrow or Luffy—both having loud and vibrant personalities. But even though Sae is more of the silent and brooding type, he has the potential to be a good leader if he wanted to. Canonically, he is also a strategist which is something very useful to commandeer a ship. And as we can see in the main story, it's easy for him to get people to follow him purely through his reputation and skill.

ᯓ Shidou Ryusei - Pirate

Unlike Sae, Shidou will probably choose pirate entirely due to Jack Sparrow. He has seen the Pirates of the Caribbean once and vaguely remembers thinking, "He just like me for real," about Captain Jack Sparrow. So upon asking this question to him, the eccentric pirate was the first thing to come to mind. Oh and if he hears Sae's answer then he's just likely to copy him regardless of what he might initially thought.

ᯓ Michael Kaiser - Cowboy

Out of the three choices, cowboys seem to be the ones that are cherished by their people. They're viewed as the hard working heroes—fighting off thieves or whatnot in exchange for little to nothing at all. Kaiser probably imagines what it would be like to be needed by the people—to be loved by them. He might not be too interested in the whole saving-the-public part of being a cowboy, but he can't pass up the opportunity to be revered as the hero of the people. I love you, Kaiser :((

ᯓ Alexis Ness - Pirate

He'd grumble when asked about the question. "Why are you only giving me lame choices?" he'd retort. Obviously, he'd rather be a wizard. What's the point if you can't do the unthinkable? But he digresses. Pirates aren't magical in any sense, but they're the closest to doing the impossible. They travel far and wide over dangerous seas, collect treasures, and plunder other pirates' bounty. Plus, their bodies are built different to adapt to the tumultuous waters. When you put it like that, pirates seem to be in a different realm compared to the cowboy or the samurai. Even after that tangent, however—he'll still make it clear that he's choosing wizard.

ᯓ Hiyori Yo - Cowboy

"Cowboys have pistols, right?" Well, he's sold. It hardly matters that samurais have katanas or that pirates have literal canons—Hiyori thinks those aren't practical at all. Besides, we can't really blame him for being largely influenced by the shooting games that he plays back at home. He's quite confident that he'd win in every standoff he'd find himself in. Sure, he has never tried it in real life, but if he's hitting no-scopes in game then it should be the same thing, right?

ᯓ Kiyora Jin - Samurai

He probably doesn't really care for being a pirate or a samurai—like he doesn't see anything appealing about it. With that being said, does his replica katana collection and extensive knowledge of the Shinsengumi entice you? Well, it should. I dunno... but Kiyora seems like the guy that's super into swords for no other reason besides he thinks that they are "rad." He has definitely played sword fighting with his siblings when they were younger. He may or may not have pretended to be Okita Souji when he was a young lad.

[🐟]: Should I do the other characters?

ε( ε ˙³˙)ɜ ｡° ⚬ ｡ likes and reblogs are appreciated

o-sachi © 2024

[rubberduckyrye]

Okay in all seriousness. There's something that I REALLY want to talk about as an open discussion with the fandom, but. This is not going to be a very nice thing to hear/talk about.

It's about how Gonta is treated by the fandom.

As a fan of all the V3 characters now, and as someone who has always been a fan of Gonta, and as someone who has many mental disabilities and two diagnosed neurodivergancies... I'm tired of playing nice about it.

You all need to stop being ableist towards Gonta.

I've mentioned in the past that I don't like shitting on personal interpretations. I don't like saying something is or is not canon because narration is just a big web of text that you try to decipher with your own personal biases, experiences, and thoughts. That's why two literary analysts analyzing the same text with the same literary criticism rules can come to wildly different conclusions--why people develop different headcanons from the same canonical information.

But one of the things that challenged my integrity is just how many people view Gonta as this innocent, naive, ignorant, baby boy who can do no harm/never has a complicated/dirty/violent/sexual thought in his life ever.

This incredibly ableist interpretation of the character bothered me for, well, obvious reasons (See: It's fucking ableist, need I say more?) but I never challenged it as harshly as I am now because to be frank, it's not my place to tell people how to HC a character. It still isn't. But I've pretty much given up on my integrity on the subject and have decided to go all in on discussing why this interpretation of Gonta is just. Really bad.

First of all, not to promote my own analyses here or anything, but I think this analysis I did of Gonta explains a LOT in regards to the ableism the cast gives him in canon. I also think that this subtle ableism is why the fandom is so bad with Gonta's characterization in headcanons and fanfic--because they've seen how the cast treats him, and they think it's normal. They don't see the microaggressions, they don't see the subtle ableism in the cast--they just see this big giant idiot who speaks like Tarzan in the English version (which... I don't actually know why people assume Tarzan (Thinking of Disney's version) is stupid. Like as a boy he had to reinvent the spear with no one to guide him on how to do it. He was able to strategize and outsmart "civilized" men in the final showdown. Still I digress) and don't see the literal genius behind his social awkwardness.

There is also another very important point I'm going to make in addition to this, and it's going to be very uncomfortable to Gonta fans who insist he's nothing but a sweet baby who only has pure thoughts. Especially to the fans who insist he "can't be sexual" or think it's weird to ship him with his peers.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but... Gonta blatantly has sexual desire and gets horny right in canon.

This is further clarified here:

It wasn't a matter of Gonta didn't want to touch her because touching someone in their underwear was inappropriate, or being flustered because she was in her underwear which is inappropriate...

It was literally a "weird feeling" that made him unable to approach her or touch her. A "weird feeling" that Miu makes pretty obvious as to what it was--sexual arousal.

He literally was sexually attracted to and felt sexual arousal from looking at Miu in her underwear. He had sexual feelings and thoughts about Miu. Why?

Because Gonta is a young man.

Gonta is a brilliant, talented young man who has normal human thoughts for someone his age--sexual desires, upsetting thoughts, complicated thoughts, ectect. He is not a child, he is not mentally stunted (I've been informed that people have literally said this on Ao3 for the NSFW Gonta fics, please for the love of god stop that)

I think the reason why Gonta fans typically want to keep him as a "pure baby child who can do no wrong" is because treating him like the young adult that he is makes it harder for them to justify Chapter 4. Every time I've seen a Gonta fan that hates Kokichi, it's always followed by the sentiment of "Kokichi manipulated and abused Gonta into killing Miu, so it's all Kokichi's fault." They're afraid of nuance and liking a character with the grey morality of genuinely thinking Mercy Killing the cast is a viable option, because it challenges their own morals about the character they adore.

To those people who read this and are upset: You can and should like Gonta! Gonta is a magnificent character who showcases the subtle way microaggressions can manifest and hurt people, he's a good-hearted person and a literal genius, he cares deeply for his friends and loves everyone with upmost sincerity.

But.

You need to re-evaluate your stance on Gonta if you think he's a stupid, naive fool who Kokichi manipulated. You need to re-evaluate why you think those thoughts, why you think Gonta being shipped with anyone is "Kinda weird" or "has weird consent problems" or "give you the ick." You have to challenge yourself and ask yourself uncomfortable questions in regards to why you treat Gonta like a child when canon has proven otherwise, why you think he cannot have violent or sexual thoughts, why he can't think mercy killing his class is the only way to save them.

This isn't an attack on you--but understand that these specific takes on Gonta? They are ableist in nature. They belittle and dismiss him, they treat him like a child, an idiot who can't think for himself--and you have to come to terms with the fact that Gonta is a far more complex character with complicated thoughts and feelings who is a young adult. Not a child. A young adult.

So again, ask yourself this: Why are you treating this young adult like he's a toddler?

[nachosncheezies]

In defense of late-canon x files (including the revivals)

I was thinking about this poll after I commented on it, and I kinda want to be brave and say more.

Short answer to the poll's question before I go any further: If you're a new fan and a sensitive sort who thinks you'll struggle with your blorbos Really Going Through It and you really need a happy ending, I suggest you stop at the end of season 8. Do not pass go, do not look at spoilers. Disregard this post entirely, close the internet, and go look at something that makes you happy. (Also fuck every part of society that characterizes sensitivity as inherently weak and bad and some kind of personal failing, you are valid.)

That said, "quality" as a concept is entirely subjective, and the question of whether or not there's a decline in quality for any story is wholly subjective, too. In the case of x files? I'm not convinced there is a decline. I am going to be upfront that I haven't yet watched past season 8, though I am almost completely spoiled on events after that - and the reason I haven't watched yet is not because of how I know events are going to unfold, but simply because I don't want it to end!!! Ohh, the tension between "I CAN'T WAIT!!!" and "Nooo don't be over D:"

When I first came to txf fandom on tumblr and gradually became spoiled about what happens in late canon though, I was often left uncomfortable and tbh kinda queasy about it. As I said in my comment on the poll, the hate for especially the revival and IWTB, or to a lesser extent even seasons 8 & 9, is very well documented. But! There are other takes to be found here on tumblr if you figure out where to look, and my feelings have changed!

The thing is, I have yet to find myself in any fandom where there isn't a vocal subset of fans who dislike the story after a certain point. I am not joking when I say that no one hates the things they love as passionately as sci-fi and fantasy fans. In my experience, it often hinges on the extent to which a viewer has strong notions on where they would like the characters to end up. In particular with series where shipping is a dominant component for the bulk of a fandom, I have almost universally found that there comes some turning point in the story where "let them be happy you cowards" is the dominant view, and things that compromise the attainment of a degree of romantic stability and/or domesticity are, to many fans, annoying at best and despicable at worst. But! As one tagset on the linked poll said:

and I think for any fandom, that last tag especially is so so so important. (I think that's harder for people watching a weekly series live, bc you have so much time to analyze and speculate and dream before the next breadcrumb drops, but I digress.)

So why am I saying this and how do I apply it to x files? Well, I eventually found that there are also a subset of fans who find redeeming things right up to the very end and actually quite like the whole thing! The things that I had seen people rage and ventpost so much about honestly never quite sounded to me as "out of character" or "untrue to the story" etc as those same ventposts made them sound. And I've discovered I'm not the only one who felt that way. Do I love that the spooky squad had to go through all of those things? No, those poor guys D: Life is hard and they have been through so much trauma. But do those events and their choices make sense to me in light of everything that came before? Yes! And I honestly can't wait to see them fight to overcome those things, breaking, healing, always learning, always growing, always getting better.

So if you're wondering "where does it go wrong"... well, I'm a completionist, as many people who've answered that post are, but also my personal opinion is that I don't think it does go wrong. If you're new and interested in exploring why I've gone from "vaguely queasy" to "excited" about the whole thing, or want to maybe balance out the impressions you're getting about the later seasons before deciding whether or not you want to see the whole thing, I'll put a few blog names in the comments.

Final admission: even once I started feeling a little more confident in the possibility that "actually ok maybe I'm not crazy, maybe this all kind of is in character and does make sense", there was one big plot point that I was NOT looking forward to and I thought I would never be comfortable about. In hindsight, I think my discomfort came from the negative responses being SO seemingly universal that I hadn't stopped to let myself truly consider other possible interpretations on that point. (I mean my initial instinct when I first read about it was, why are we mad about this?? CSM is literally the most unreliable narrator in history???? it's obviously fake news?????? this must be either a fever dream someone's having or it's a misdirection ploy against whatever shadowy forces might still be lurking?????????????? but for whatever reason I guess I had halfway written that off.) Happily, just last month there's a new post-s11 novel out, and although reviews for the book as a whole are mixed, it seems to have laid the groundwork for resolving that plot issue in a way I think most fans would be broadly happy with. If you're interested in being spoiled about that and seeing how, I recommend searching #perihelion on @agent-troi who liveblogged reading it with receipts, scroll back chronological-style to the first post on the subject and see how it unfolded. (And never forget that Dana Katherine Scully is the queen of denial as a coping mechanism lol)

Everyone's mileage will vary. Each person can feel however they want! But for anyone new, I wanted you to know that the very many ventposts you might be seeing are not all there is to this show or its fandom. Some of us love it despite - or even because of - all the things that went "wrong". I think we just don't talk about it as much.

[violetasteracademic]

Context Clues: Elriel (and removal of the BC)

Happy Elriel month! This is my first one (I think most of you know that I am only about two months old in the online fandom) and I am still REELING from the fact that apparently not everyone needed to douse themselves in cold water after Elain and Azriel's interaction in the bonus chapter (and that Az is apparently both an incel AND a fuckboy, although those are mutually exclusive and non interchangeable traits. And Elain is secretly obsessed with Lucien and just toying with Az. But I digress.)

While I personally thought the bonus chapter confirmed Elriel, and of course others felt the complete opposite, I wanted to spend some time focusing on solely the books and seeing what we have. As we know, the bonuses are just *bonuses* available in a limited number of editions, in limited countries, and limited languages. I personally read all bonus chapters, but many don't. So excluding the BC from the conversation, where did A Court of Silver Flames leave us?

Here is the final on page interaction between Azriel and Elain in ACOSF:

A charged glance that takes Elain's breath away.

Here is the final on page interaction between Elain and Lucien in ACOSF:

Elain shrinks into herself after opening a present from her mate.

Here are the previous interactions between Azriel and Elain in ACOSF:

Elain acting all shy around Azriel.

Azriel's shadows ready to throw hands over Elain's hurt feelings.

Here are the previous on page interactions between Elain and Lucien:

There are none.

However, there are references, and they are as follows:

Lucien choosing to live in the human lands despite his mate living in Velaris.

Lucien dripping with discomfort over his presence only being expected because of Elain.

Meanwhile, here is Azriel referencing Elain when she is not there:

Azriel's shadows swarming and being unable to calm down at the mere thought of something happening to Elain.

Azriel stiffening at the mention of Elain's capture, and reminding Cassian he helped rescue her.

Nesta only agreeing to scrying because she trusts Azriel with Elain, the only person who could understand other than her or Feyre.

I have always, and will always reiterate that I am personally Lucien and Gwyn positive. Maybe that's because I'm so new, and haven't been whittled down from all the rudeness yet. (literally as I was working on this post, I got an unprompted comment from an E/ucien on one of my tiktoks that they can't wait to laugh at me when she chooses Lucien. It's annoying. And it sucks. But I know all sides do it.)

I joined the space because I was so overwhelmed by the negative Elain content. By the erasure of her thoughts and feelings and experiences. Bonus content aside, I also feel for Lucien, and my shipping him with Vassa is because he blushes and laughs and relaxes around her. Because she is fiery like Jesminda, the only other female he has ever loved. I don't personally have a ship for Gwyn yet because my reading experience hasn't taken me there in the story yet!

Look, I'm still out here shipping Klaroline and TVD and The Originals went their separate ways almost a decade ago. Ships should be fun. They don't always have to be canon. I'm simply sharing that the reason I make this content for you guys is to provide some comfort to people like me, who felt overwhelmed and gaslit by all the hatred for Elain- dissertations and powerpoints dedicated to erasing her and her value and feelings- as someone who read the books and loved her, as well as her dynamic with Azriel.

I will continue to refrain from discussing the bonus chapter (in this post) no matter how SEXY it was, and how in line it is with everything already happening in the books, but I'm just trying to showcase what the experience is for book readers only, which is the vast majority globally.

Stay kind out there, and manifesting a book announcement soon! Happy Elriel month, all!

[stoplookingup]

Umbrella Academy S4 reaction (spoilers)

I'm a little surprised how negative the reaction to S4 has been. It's flawed and a bit too loose, sure, but I think there's a thematic arc, to do with the painful but redemptive potential of selfless love, that a lot of people didn't recognize, or didn't like, possibly because it's too sentimental, or too tragic, or both.

In particular, I have a really different take on That Relationship. You know the one I mean.

But before I get to that, I just want to address the issue of unexplained plot points, of which there are certainly many.

Short version: Just let it go.

Long version: Comic-book storytelling is all about the impossible premise, the unlikely twist, the overblown threat, the arbitrary race against the clock, the catastrophic non-ending. A big part of TUA's appeal is that it takes that formula to an absurd extreme, unwinding a plot so convoluted and horrifying as to be comedic, then offering a resolution that raises more questions than it answers, and that seems final -- but is it ever? There could always be more. Even now. Because reasons.

But scratch the surface, and it's really all about the over-the-top super(anti)heroes who are surprisingly endearing, nuanced and tragic, whom the audience roots for despite a million reasons not to. Would S4 have benefitted from a few more episodes? No doubt, mostly to give each character their due (Klaus, my Klaus, you deserve more!), and to let the story breathe a bit. The plot probably wouldn't have made any more sense anyway. But c'mon, did it ever, really? So, why a subway? Why a squid? Why a diner? Does it really matter?

On to That Relationship, the much-criticized story of Lila/Five (aka Live -- can I copyright this?). This comically trope-laden ship (forbidden love, montage love, love triangle, enemies-to-lovers, pocket universe, happily-ever-after, etc) fits right into TUA sensibility. Despite being a bit underbaked, it's moving. The actors play it well, and in dropping their characters' armor, you realize how much armor they're usually wearing, how hard they're always working to cover their feelings. Out of all the characters, seeing these two having real emotions is most devastating, especially with each other. It's because this pairing is wildly unlikely that it hits.

Lila and Five have similar histories as traumatized, sensitive souls turned cold, cruel killing machines. They're smarter, more cynical, and stronger-willed than everyone around them. And they are clearly starved of love and desperate for connection. (Everyone on this show pays a price, but I find Five's terrible loneliness the most heartbreaking of all.) So then fate throws them together in a way that makes it inevitable they'll form an attachment, only to then demand of them the ultimate sacrifice. Their surprisingly quiet, life-affirming, Guinevere-and-Lancelot love is redemptive, in contrast with the meddling, selfish, and/or destructive love of others: Reginald and Abigail, Ben and Jennifer, Gene and Jean. Live aren't an unnecessary digression, they're central to the thematic development of the story. Sacrifice saves the world, but without love, there is no sacrifice.

And yes, I absolutely think Lila loves Five to the end. And while I appreciate that some might find the age difference between the actors off-putting, I don't think there was anything inappropriate on a Doylist level, and it all makes perfect sense on a Watsonian level.

Also:

Aidan Gallagher and Ritu Arya are extraordinary;

the use of Baby Shark is genius;

Diego, Luther and Allison have been the least interesting characters from the start, and S4 does nothing to change that;

Viktor needs a sense of humor;

I love that alternate universes are all the rage these days (so many great tropes started with Trek), but tbh Loki does it better;

as visual representations of the space between realities, I love both the Loki automat and the UA subway, but at some point, using recent-past retro design to signal liminal space is going to get old, which, come to think of it, will be deliciously ironic.

[cios-correct-opinions]

@evilkaeya @aaabatteryy @starrynightarchive

see my other post about this here

to tl;dr this: when it comes to fandom and content creators, ppl tend to make content of the characters they already love and thus think about most often, which leads to, at times, male characters getting genderbent into women either thru cis or trans hcs, bc they are both genderbending, thats the definition of the term bc youre changing their gender, and getting mad at people for not, in your opinion, "appreciating" the female characters enough, is not doing anything except making people feel bad for not having the "correct" feelings about a character at best, or making them actively angry and thus fueling them to create more of that thing you hate out of spite at worst (for you anyway, not for the people who like it).

this doesnt mean they dont give a shit abt the other characters who arent their faves, but to create a work of art, you need to be able to like. care enough to do it. and that requires more care than just a general enjoyment or appreciation of a character, especially if the work in question is time intensive/would be time intensive, like writing a chapter fic/thousands of words long oneshot, or making a fully rendered piece of art, etc. obvi this will depend on the skill and energy levels of the artist we're talking about but yknow, on a general scale

op of this post blocked me so i cant respond directly on it but, for context

first of all: i'm not illiterate but i'm beginning to think some people on this post might be, given this response, because it is so clearly Not what i was talking about it's a little wild, actually!

also i hate to tell yall this, but the reason you don't often see people genderbending female characters to male anymore is bc of the spread of radfem ideology thru fandom spaces like wildfire. ppl genuinely lose their shit when ppl even have transmasc or trans man headcanons for characters assumedly cis female in the source material (which is genderbending btw. them being trans doesnt mean it isnt genderbending anymore you are still changing their gender thus it is genderbending thats the definition fellas) bc they fucking hate men and the idea of men existing

sorry not sorry but if you get mad at ppl who genderbend female characters into transmascs/trans men (transmascs aren't always genderbends, bc you can be transmasc and also a woman, but i digress/for the sake of brevity...) and go "you're TAKING AWAY a GOOD FEMALE CHARACTER!" i need you to stop for a second and consider why these people - most of whom are trans men/transmascs themselves - might be doing that to a character they like.

9/10 times when i see a cis genderbend of a male character to be female, the person doing it is a cis woman. when i see genderbends, of any kind, of a female character to be male or masc? it's almost always done by a trans man and/or a transmasc. and inevitably, they are almost always dogpiled for it with disgusting levels of hate. i've seen it happen so many times i stopped attempting to count a long time ago

don't come up here saying "you NEVER see-" because actually i see all of those things happen all the time. ppl love genderbending men characters into women, or emasculating/demasculinizing/feminizing them in order to make them personally more appealing, or saying "[mlm ship] would be better if it was two girls/wlw/two fem-aligned/etc" all the fucking time. and while i realize this is often a way for the people who say this to like, try to lash out at common misogynistic/lesbiphobic/transmisogynistic/etc sentiment irl, in doing so, they are not doing it in a way that allows for a nuanced understanding of their fellow fandom-goers. they make blanket sweeping statements and then dogpile people who disagree

the moment you start treating entire demographics of people as if they are a hivemind or a single identity, the moment you decide that something "never" happens bc you personally have not seen it? youve already lost any possible chance you mightve had at making a good point

[miyuskye]

Fake killing Blitzø anon here, back at it again:

Yeah, saying that it was cheap and a sign of failure was my point.

Because they already failed. The fanbase mayorily HATES Blitz's guts to the point of vitriol and constantly woob-ify Stolas. If they try to get them together when the fanbase still doesn't see anything good in Blitzø (after all Spindlewhores made such a thing as a “I hate Blitzø" party) there are several people who won't like Viv's new favorite literally fetishized ship. So they need a way to salvage it. But what way do they have to make Blitzø likeable again?

I do genuinely hope I'm wrong tho. But still it seems as the more likely posibility... And in line with what Viv would do. After all Look My Way was completely unnecessary, and was originally a song about Stolas and his relationship with his daughter. But of course, we needed more Owl Pain™.

Hey, hello there!

I think that if they see Blitz groveling on the ground and apologizing profusely to Stolas for the things the owl should apologize for, they will be content anyway.

I am actually pretty new to the fandom, so I don't know all the lore behind the songs, I didn't even know that Look my way was a fansong originally. That's also why at the beginning I didn't even notice all the woob-ification of Stolas. The part about their childhood was very random during my first watch too, and looking back at it, there's no reason to show just how pitiable Stolas is. He's got a pretty good life. It would be a different situation if, say, he was trying to conceive an heir but couldn't do so. That way he would have something serious to worry about (Paimon's reaction that was hinted during the flashback). But I digress.

Back to Blitz, I hope they won't fake kill him off just to make Stolas more pitiable (there's really no need) and to make the fandom like Blitz again... From what I've understood of The Vivzie Lore, she would be content if the people she thought did her wrong (but it was the other way around in truth, something that's mirroring the Stoliz situation both intentionally or unintentionally) came back to her and apologized profusely. Which, of course, is something normal intelligent irl people would never do lol so she projects and will make Blitz do it in her show (I hope I'm making sense).

So, Blitz could probably be compelled to grovel if he was faced with a near-death experience. I don't know if, when you said "fake killing" you meant from just a narrative standpoint (i.e. the audience thinks he's dead but he actually wasn't all along) or also from a plot point (he is killed and then resurrected with magic). In the first case, I would agree with you (even if I still hope they won't go through that route).

I hope the answer made sense, I just started rambling lol

[riceballmari]

ranking my favorite marinette pairings

okay, so, i am a HUGE multishipper. like, i greatly enjoy shipping characters with different people. since marinette has chemistry with pretty much most of the cast in some way, shape, or form, i figured i'd rank my personal favorite ships with her that i'm fond of.

5. feinette

coming at #5 we have fei and marinette! i think this is a very unique rarepair and their relationship and dynamic in the shanghai special is adorable! the only reason they're so low is because i just prefer the others with marinette. i think we really need more of them together, as they were the highlight of the entire special for me. overall, very cute, just not my favorite!

4. marigami

if you asked me to make this ranking a year or two ago, i probably would've put these two lovely gal pals higher up. but my opinion of them has changed drastically since last time so.

i think their relationship is so amazing. the "sunshine x grumpy" dynamic is always something i enjoy (hence why i love tohrin for the same reason). aside from surface level stuff, marinette really shows just how much she cares for kagami. she's her first friend, so naturally, marinette wouldn't want kagami to be left lonely with no one. and knowing marinette, she'd do everything in her power to make kagami feel comfortable and happy when they're together (see mr. pigeon 72).

at first, kagami needed time to warm up to marinette, but she really made a strong impact on her life (gee, i wonder who that reminds me of). i especially like how marinette wanted to get adrigami back together, when that probably wouldn't have even crossed s3 marinette's mind. her willingness to be there for kagami is why i love these girls so much. and kagami actually appreciating marinette's friendship is so wholesome. don't ask me about s5 i like to pretend that season doesn't exist, especially with regard to kagami and how her character was handled.

3. zoenette

first off, i just want to say, I LOVE THEM SO MUCH?? zoe's crush on marinette is so so cute and i REALLY like how they handled it in adoration. zoe's confession was so heartwarming and marinette's reaction and reassurance was wonderful.

zoe, who had practically NO ONE when she moved to paris, is automatically befriended by marinette, who didn't even know who she was and was so welcoming to her. marinette cares so much about zoe and worries for her because she doesn't want her to be a doormat to chloe and wants her to stand up for herself.

eventually, once zoe does, marinette is so proud of her and it really reminds me of the time when tohru congratulated yuki for standing up to akito, but i digress. she can see just how far zoe has come since she first arrived and her growth is everything. their relationship is built on support and trust and that's what makes their dynamic so compelling and sweet.

2. alyanette

MY BABIES. i am a sucker for the “best friends to lovers” trope and this is basically that, just without the ‘lovers’ part. they support each other so much. their level of trust is put to the test in s4 when maribug tells alya her identity. alya, in return, helps marinette out even more than she already has. marinette needed to tell someone of the burden and heavy weight that's been put on her shoulders, and i think alya is the perfect candidate.

contrary to popular belief, alya is an AMAZING friend. she's the one who gets marinette out of sticky situations and doesn't get upset easily if she slips up (see the mime). despite not knowing what marinette is up to at times, alya still puts her full trust in her because she knows that, at the end of the day, marinette will make the right decisions.

i could ramble on and on about these two, but you get my point. also, i can't be the only one who could just FEEL the tension in the air rising during their oh so very intimate scene towards the end of the reverse special. no, just me?

1. adrienette

to no one's surprise, adrienette comes crashing down in first place. i love these two SO MUCH. they care about and love one another in different ways. marinette shows her love through gift-giving and grand gestures. adrien shows his love through words of affirmation and by spending time with someone. they would go above and beyond for the other. adrien confronted AND blackmailed lila about marinette's expulsion and her treatment of her in order for marinette to come back to school. (honestly kinda reminds me of haru when he went and confronted akito about what she did to rin). marinette went to adrien's house numerous times to save him from a possible dangerous situation, i.e. oni-chan, gabriel agreste.

in oni-chan, lila sneakily made her way inside the agreste mansion and lied to nathalie about adrien needing to get some extra homework done to bring his grade up. obviously, she has an ulterior motive: to get close to adrien. marinette, hoping to prevent this, follows them. unfortunately, with no luck, she wasn't able to get inside. this does, however, showcase the lengths she's willing to go to for his safety.

another instance of this is in gabriel agreste, after chloe maliciously recorded a video of marinette and her friends talking about gabriel being a bad parent. knowing what this would do to adrien, chloe was planning on showing the video to his father to get him out of school, DESPITE the fact that chloe would never see him again (it's very telling that chloe does not care about adrien or what he wants in the slightest, and would rather fulfill her satisfaction of revenge for shits and giggles).

in contrast, marinette, despite sneaking into the mansion uninvited, comes up a plan with her friends to ensure chloe does not show the video. note that her goal was not to hurt adrien but to save him from chloe's clutches. this was not out of jealousy in the slightest. the video ends up not getting shown, much to chloe's determination, and adrien is safe, which was marinette's goal from the start.

i could list so many different instances where marinette and adrien show their tenderness for each other but we'd be here for hours. their relationship means everything to me. and as much as i love the other dynamics, adrienette work the best in canon, (again, not going to mention s5) and, unsurprisingly, complement each other really well.

[rosecorcoranwrites]

Re your post about needing straight awareness bc someone headcanoned ricky from shadow house as a trans girl…

Have you literally never participated in a fandom before it’s just a headcanon this is fandom 101 bro… another thing is when posting hate of any level abt smth like that, out of tact, you don’t put it in the main tag… I’m going to just infer that this is your first fandom experience cuz anyone with half a brain and has participated in fandom knows these things and doesn’t pitch hissy fits about it and tag it with all the main tags… people are going to headcanon characters as things other than what they are in canon, that’s actually the point of it.

Either that or you’re just anti lgbt and feel personally attacked for people headcanoning a character as something other than cishet. I recommend taking a few steps outside for a little bit and getting some fresh air and sunlight and maybe you’ll realize getting butthurt about someone’s headcanon isn’t healthy or normal behavior. It literally doesn’t effect you so my main word of advice, if you seem something you don’t like… block the OP and move on… and if you must rant about it… don’t put it in the main tags… I know that for you seeing someone headcanon a fictional character as being trans must cause a lot of fear and confusion when you’re transphobic and new to fandom, so I hope this advice teaches you something. Good luck in your endeavors baby fandom goer, hope you learned something new today.

Anon, I have been a part of fandom since I was in highschool. I am 35.

My point, with Ricky and Patrick specifically, is that it's not even gay. I'm honestly shocked at how few people ship the two of them together, especially considering the whole "soulmates" thing.

My point is that, in the context of them being cisgenderedly heterosexual -- in Ricky crushing on Lou, in Patrick crushing on Emilico -- fans accept the canon ship itself, but refuse to accept that it is cishet. To paraphrase yourself, it's almost like seeing a fictional character who is cishet "must cause a lot of fear and confusion".

Being generous, we could assume this is because some people have never realized that one can like and identify with a character unlike oneself. Thus, if one is trans and identifies with Ricky, Rick must be trans. If one is a lesbian and likes Patrick, he must be a lesbian. If aromantic, Patrick must be aromantic. If one did not want to be generous, we might assume that, for whatever reason, some people find the very idea of cisheterosexuality icky and will do any amount of mental gymnastics to ignore it.

As for using the main tag, I briefly considered removing it, as i didn't want to hurt anyone's feeling. But then I thought, to paraphrase you yet again, that getting angry about my thoughts on people's head canons of fictional characters isn’t healthy or normal behavior. It doesn’t actually effect them. If they see something they don’t like, block the OP and move on.

(I myself, not actually being as infantile as Anon would make me out to be, did not block any of the OPs I mentioned, because I like the majority of their content and don't believe that I'll get cooties from someone who has a difference of opinion from me. I also didn't send anonymous rants to their inbox, but I digress.)

To you, my dear Anon, "I recommend taking a few steps outside for a little bit and getting some fresh air and sunlight." You might encounter someone straight out there, but I promise, it will be okay. You might even find that you and them have a lot in common.

[ur-local-demon1]

"Why does everyone hate Aoikane so much? They literally complete each other, freak" <- Actual post I saw on Pinterest which made me feel less guilty for always bitching about Akane and Aoikane. What if I told you that this is the exact reason I hated them?

Aoikane is a co-dependent relationship and a really well-written one at that! Iro-Sensei perfectly captured what fearful and anxious attachment styles look like when they meet each other and when there's obsession in the mix. That's why, if you ship Aoikane in the sense that it's your "junk food escapism" (Cinema Therapy) and with the understanding that they should not get together in canon, then that's awesome! Honestly, we should go back to the olden days where shipping something did not mean you wanted it to be canon, but I digress.

I am once again quoting Cinema Therapy but it's not my fault they make such good points. "The idea of 'You complete me' is romantic but it's actually unhealthy. […] 'You supplement me' sounds far less romantic but it's actually indicative of a healthy relationship." (Jonathan Decker, licensed couple's therapist) The point that Jonathan makes is that you choose to share your life with someone in spite of being able to have a fulfilling life without them. However, Akane has been shown multiple times to be incapable of living without Aoi. It surprised me that Nene of all people never called him out on it, but Akane does not love Aoi, he loves loving her and needs to be needed. He doesn’t have to work on himself and become his own person if he likes Aoi, because he can work towards becoming a guy she would date instead. The idea that he does not know who he is without Aoi scares him, so he holds her tight and doesn’t let go without realising that it’s hurting them both. I sincerely hope that they stop being part of each other’s lives because this co-dependency is extremely harmful. Akane deserves to find friends, hobbies and passions that don’t revolve around a romantic partner.

Anyway, TL;DR: It's cool if you ship Aoikane as long as you don't ignore their co-dependency issues. And also don't call people who don't like a ship you like freaks, you freak(～￣▽￣)～

[ikamigami]

What happened to Moon's therapy with Earth where she told him to re-establish the bond he had with Sun and Moon agreeing to it? Like Moon, where is the progress in that? Hello??? I get it, Moon and Solar has a lot in common (and that's one of the reasons people ship them together but I digress) but like Sun is his brother. The one who has been there from the start, Old Moon, to now, New Moon. I get it, Moon wants to protect his family that's why he is always keeping things from them but as Earth said before, Sun wants to protect him and everyone else too. Please, I'm so tired of the Solar and Moon show episodes...

Thank you for asking this question, anon!

I hope that you don't mind that I'll use your ask to address the elephant in the room.. which is why Moon is keeping things from Sun once again?

The one conversation I had with my friend on Discord.. reminded me that I saw the shift in how Moon acts towards Sun.. and that it all started when Moon went to Evil Sun's dimension.

I realised that from that moment Moon stopped informing Sun about things and started distancing himself from Sun...

It's also that from that moment Moon started to tease Sun again. First it was Sun turning into a dragon but later Moon started teasing Sun about "the crush he has on Roxanne"...

Moon also stopped calling Sun brother.. and when you remember that Evil Sun told Moon that Sun and Moon being brothers is rare.. things start to make sense...

I thought that showrunners run out of ideas to give us the plot of "past repeats once again" and started using jokes about Sun having crush on Roxanne to fans' annoyance.. but if we take Moon's visit in Evil Sun's dimension into consideration then it all makes sense...

Moon is paranoid and I'm afraid that he's scared that Sun may start acting like Evil Sun.. and he's scared that maybe his brotherhood with Sun isn't that.. deep...

It explains why Moon started distancing himself from Sun and why he started teasing Sun.. it's because Moon sees Sun as his brother and he cares about Sun deeply.. but he's scared of these doubts that appeared in him since the talk with Evil Sun and he tries to be casual about it and that's why he started acting like that towards Sun..

I think that Moon didn't lie to Earth that he trusts Sun with his own life.. but I think that Moon is doubting that trust and he's scared of it.

It's the same thing when you starts to distrust your own family due to how paranoid you are and ofc Moon is scared of it.. Who wouldn't be scared?

But Moon should talk about it with Sun.. Sun needs to know why Moon is distancing himself.. why Moon is pushing Sun away...

Because if Moon won't talk with Sun soon.. something terrible will happen and Moon will regret running away from this issue forever...

Moon doesn't realise how much it is affecting Sun.. how much Sun is suffering because of Moon's decision...

Earth sees that something is off with Sun and she sees that Moon distanced himself from Sun that's why she both tried to reassure Sun that he can talk to her about whatever is bothering him and tried to push Moon to reconnect with Sun...

And like I said Sun is lying that everything is fine and he's in his best mental state.. it's a lie.

He's suicidal and Moon's decision to push Sun away makes Sun feel like he's unneeded and it's pushing him more and more on the edge...

Something tragic will happen.. and I can see it happening in three ways (actually two but.. I'll give three options just because):

Sun will try to sacrifice himself by going after Eclipse or creator - it happened once already so I'd love if showrunners wouldn't do that with Sun again...

BM will attack Sun and Sun will give up - it's very likely to happen.. it was established more than once that BM wants to kill Sun and Sun giving up was hinted in episode when Sun and Moon played Joyville.. Moon said that Sun will give up in life or death situation one day...

Sun will try to kill himself by overusing star's power either on himself or maybe on the voodoo doll - the possibilty is high because Castor reminded Sun twice to not use star's power, Sun throat was hurt similarly to Lunar's and Lunar's throat was hurt due to overusage of their powers.. The thing with voodoo doll is more unlikely to happen...

I think that Earth would push Moon even more to talk to Sun.. bit she's busy dealing with that whole creator situation and it's a big deal for her so I can't blame her for not thinking about Sun and Moon's situation at the moment...

Moon on the other hand is once again prioritizing wrong thing.. He's taking care of Eclipse's situation.. but the thing is Eclipse isn't a threat... He didn't do anything. The only thing that Eclipse is trying to do for now is to find out who brought him back. In other words Eclipse is busy with his own issues...

Moon should talk to Sun. It's more important than Eclipse's or Ruin's situation...

It's not that surprising that Solar doesn't see the issue with the way Moon is distancing himself from Sun.. because Solar doesn't understand how it is affecting Sun and why it is bad for Sun's mental state.. It's because Solar is poorly managing his own feelings and emotions... That's why he doesn't see that there's a problem and that something tragic will happen really soon...

So it seems that I was right and show is really going with Sun is suicidal plot and that's good because it shows us that the story is consistent and that showrunners aren't giving up on some parts of a plot like some of us had thought.

Unfortunately we're heading into one of the most angsty story plots in the show and we need to prepare for it.. At least I'm sure (or I hope so) that Sun won't succeed and he'll only end up in a coma or something similar...

I hope that the answer satisfies you, anon 🙇‍♀️

[rubberduckyrye]

I'd like to point to interpretation that Angie isn't portrayal of a native Polynesian islander because almost all the evidence around her character and what she says suggests she's not living in a village that has cult-like practices, but that she is in a straight up cult and is unaware of it. It explains a lot of stuff from the odd monotheism, why her "village" seems to only employ seemingly dark web shipping company, the police apparently bothering her "village" or her having an English name.

Referencing this Ask

I mean. That is one interpretation, sure, but to deny the fact that Angie is heavily coded to be Polynesian/Native Hawaiian is unfortunately ignoring the problem. Which is the problem I am trying to address itself.

Right in her promotional art, you can see that Angie is carving a statue--and it heavily resembles a tiki statue. Specifically this kind of Tiki Statue. Though since it is unfinished, it could be a full body version, but I digress.

She also mentions living on an island.

And the "natural disaster" that made the island smaller--that is probably heavily inspired by how Hawaii was used by US military and bombed frequently--which, naturally, made the islands smaller.

She also greets people in Salmon mode with "Alola," which is a reference to Pokemon Sun and Moon, which has it's main location heavily based off of Hawaii. Alola is a butchered way of saying "Aloha", which is a Hawaiian greeting.

Also, Angie having an English name matches with historical oppression in Hawaii. Where Hawaiians were forced to name their children with Christian White names and their Hawaiian names be their middle names. It was literally a law, at least, according to Wikipedia, for quite some time. (The fact that this is not easily verifiable is the very reason why having this discussion is so important--and why people need to stop trying to avoid the conversation.)

I understand the desire to want to dismiss the fact that she is a racist caricature because it sucks to enjoy a character who is one. I get it. However--trying to deny the fact that she is heavily coded to be Native Hawaiian/Polynesian is just sweeping the racism under the rug, and is a major problem when you have people like me who want to discuss the topic and how one should handle rectifying the canon narrative's bigotry.

The mere fact that she is so heavily coded to be Native Hawaiian/Polynesian makes the whole cult thing part of the racist caricature. Indigenous people (especially Indigenous Polynesian cultures) are subject to extreme racist stereotypes that include human sacrifices and savagery--and while Angie's culture isn't developed in canon enough to know for sure if it was truly as savage as, say, the King Kong Indigenous folk, the cult behaviors are a sort of "cousin" to that savagery. We as a society see human sacrifices as barbaric, as savage, and even when in a cult setting, we still present these topics in that fashion.

I'm sorry, anon--but I'm going to ask you only this one time to not derail the conversation I'm trying to start. I understand that there are interpretations that help explain away the bigotry--and this is one legitimate way to deal with bigotry in canon media, or so I've been told--but what I want is a full blown discussion on the subject. I don't want people trying to tell me "Oh b-b-but she can't be a racist Caricature, because (X)!" Because that is dismissing the problem to begin with.

This is a problem. This is a discussion about racism in V3's narrative. There is no getting around it--no matter how much you explain away the writing with headcanons and theories, these problems are still here.

So please stop trying to sabotage my desire for a discussion.

I'm going to note that I LOVE Angie as a character. I think that, when you remove the racism in her character stories, you have a very interesting and compelling female character of color who's intelligence rivals that of the smartest V3 characters. These aspects of her character I adore--but to ignore the racism, for me, is to just turn away from the problem and, in turn, contribute to the racist way fandom treats these kinds of characters.

So let me speak. Let me find people who will talk to me about it. Let me grow and learn. Please, for the love of god, let me learn.

[that-green-haired-swordsman]

Found this on Pinterest and it's not meant to be taken too seriously, but yeah, I get where this comes from. Usually you see Zoro being pictured as either a sex machine or as aromantic/ace, and literally never anything in between, and I personally believe that either of these takes is true. It's a manga of the shonen genre and follows the respective, genre-based rules. My interpretation of the character is that he undoubtedly puts his goal(s) on top of everything else. Luffy gets to become the pirate king. Zoro himself is going to be the world's strongest swordsman. Period. BUT. These ambitions go hand in hand with a sacrifice, at least to Zoro. This is going to be a long read and I have to digress a bit so please be patient lol.

Zoro has lost the person most important to him and there was nothing he could do to prevent it. He couldn't protect Kuina. Now, we don't know his own knowledge of his parents, but I always assumed that his desire to become stronger and stronger is a direct result of the loss of his parents, something he witnessed, but couldn't do anything about it either. So he chose to follow his father's footsteps and became a swordsman, trained in Koushiro's dojo, driven by anxiety. He made friends with Kuina who died too. And then he swore to himself that never again he would anyone ever become close to him. He traveled alone and at first and kept his distance to Luffy, Nami and the others.

But there's no way to fight human nature. Slowly, he allowed himself and them to get closer and he found it comfortable to be around them, but accepting that they're his friends also multiplies his anxiety and ultimate weakness: losing someone again. He not only wants to become stronger to be the WGS, he also thinks it's the only way to protect his loved ones. When he struggles with an opponent, he can be seen training even harder afterwards. He takes the night's watch. He guards the ship. He only sleeps when someone else is awake. He tells the others to escape when it's dangerous. He tries to take incoming damage alone. He refuses that anyone sacrifices themselves and knocks them out should they try (Sanji @ Thriller Bark). He keeps things a secret. He holds back emotions to remain collected and supportive. The further along they travel, the more of his humanity he has to lose in order to keep them all safe.

Back to the original intention of this post. Zoro has kind of a soft spot for women who need help with something. They just trigger his protective instinct. But he also tries to keep away from any woman because they'd weaken him. And he can't afford to be weak. A woman by his side would mean he'd have to look after her, provide for her, protect her, make sure she's alright, take better care of himself in order to be there for her, all things he simply can't afford and which distract him from his goal (he would think that way, being a bit traditional). Maybe he doesn't trust himself to remain as determined as he was once he's in a relationship. Maybe he's afraid that his partner would try to talk him out of his goal and stand in his way. Which leads me to think how a woman has to be in order to be a good match for him?

We've covered that a woman often triggers his protective sense, I'm not sure though if that is what he finds an important trait. I like to imagine that a woman he'd be interested in has to be similar to himself - independent, strong, able to defend herself, not afraid to put him in his place, self-confident and courageous and most importantly be supportive and understand how he rolls. He wouldn't have to worry about her as much then (he'd still be worried though of course lol). So yeah, ZoTash all the way!

However, even if they'd fall in love during the series, he'd not give in to his feelings before he would have reached his goals, due to the above mentioned reasons. He'd ask her to wait or he wouldn't open up to her until he's the WGS, and then reunite with her and be like "Hey sorry you had to wait" and you know how loyal he is, he'd stay with her until the end of his days. And I think that's another reason why he's not dating a woman - he wants to make sure that she's THE ONE. He's not interested in an affair or something not serious. He's there for the long run. He doesn't give away his heart so easy. He could even play hard to get, to check if his love interest really means it. He wants to protect himself from heartbreak and loss, afraid to experience it ever again.

He wouldn't be a perfect lover, but try hard to be the best version of himself.

[acacia-may]

Acacia's Definitive Defense of Langris x Finesse

No one asked about this pairing, but I'm going to ramble about them anyway... especially since I realized I don't think I've ever actually written a proper post about them as this has been sitting in my drafts for over a year (A/N: Yikes! Sorry friends. I completely forgot I wrote this until today when I tried to find that post I was absolutely certain I had made about Langris x Finesse only to find it buried in my unposted drafts 😅🙈 But I'm posting it now to coincide with the ship ask game so it kind of works...? Maybe? I have no excuses...).

Anyways, dear goodness do I have thoughts about this ship. I’m not sure I can even wrangle them all, but I am going to try my best.

I’m sure it’s pretty clear from my blog that I have a deep love for my spatial mage boys and want good things for them which is one of the main reasons why I have a lot of concerns about the whole House Vaude soap opera. A friend of mine (irl) and I once discussed that plotline for literally 6 hours so I could go on and on about this for ages, but I have tried my best to be brief. That didn't really happen so I apologize in advance for all of the rambling.

I've tried to keep the focus of this post on Langris and Finesse's relationship, so please check out this post if you want to hear my many thoughts on the House Vaude succession drama as whole and in general. To keep things organized, I've divided this discussion into 2 main subsections for clarity under the cut!

(Warnings: Black Clover spoilers and discussion of some heavier topics such as childhood trauma and abuse. Arranged marriage is also mentioned)

Why I Think Langris and Finesse Genuinely Love Each Other (not necessarily in a romantic way but definitely in a selfless care and concern kind of way)

One of my most basic premises for my personal interpretation of Langris' character really comes down to the fact that I think what Langris actually wants more than anything else is unconditional love and to be accepted for who he is (rather than what he does/his accomplishments). He wants to have people who love him, a family—but he'd never admit this because he is convinced he'll never get it. He is convinced that love needs to be earned and he can't earn it, and his relationship with Lady Finesse is a perfect example of this, I think.

It hurts Langris that she is just the kindest person ever and she doesn't like/love him (or such is the reality in Langris' mind anyway given the fact that he has carried around that one time she complimented Finral as "she hates me" for literal years in the canon. But I digress). Langris doesn't like games he can't see a possibility of winning. He closes himself off from love and building meaningful relationships because he doesn't think he'll "win" people's love in the end. He's very cynical and jaded in this way, but more than that, he's wounded. It comes from a place of being denied love without strings attached, without conditions for his entire life and of being told his by his parents that love has to be earned and being convinced that he can't earn it, that nothing he does will ever be good enough and that he will never deserve the love he so desperately craves. And in that way, it comes from a fear of being hurt and rejected. When you care about someone, you give them the power to hurt you—and Langris doesn't want that kind of vulnerability. So I think he just completely counts himself out of the running when it comes to Finesse and defers to his brother—assuming (probably correctly) that she’d choose Finral if she was given a choice between the two of them.

All of that said, he can't quite stop himself from caring for her with a genuine love and respect (not necessarily in a romantic sense but he does care for her)—it’s just sealed off somewhere and not something he really thinks about or allows himself to feel (let alone label) until his brother "declaring war" on him brings all of that to the surface and he kind of has to reconcile how much he wants to be the Head of House Vaude (what he’s worked for his entire life) with how much he wants Lady Finesse to be happy. I love how in that scene there is actually a moment (at least in the anime) in which "the camera" turns and we're watching the scene unfold from Langris' eyes/perspective immediately before he gets involved and tells Finral to clean up his act.

(A/N: If you listen very carefully you can hear the sound of Langris' entire world falling apart...)

Okay, bad jokes aside, this is a huge moment for Langris. It takes him all of five seconds to decide that Lady Finesse's happiness is far more important to him than House Vaude, than his title, his future, his own dreams and aspirations that he has worked for literally his entire life and, ultimately, is more important than everything he has looked to for his own self-worth and fulfillment up unto that point (which causes him to have a bit of an existential crisis as he tries to figure out who he is without those things, without being the next Head of House Vaude, but I digress again). It is an incredible act of love to set aside what someone wants for themselves in order to make another person happy—to choose what is best for another person even at great personal sacrifice. Regardless of how you want to qualify that love (romantic or platonic), it does not diminish the gravity of Langris' sacrifice and the willingness he shows to choose Finesse's happiness over the things that are (seemingly) the most important to him in the world.

Up until this point, Langris is this incredibly goal-oriented character who is set on becoming the best, the strongest, and eventually the head of House Vaude which comes off as self-interested and a little ruthless in his willingness to do whatever it takes to achieve his goals, but suddenly, here he is, ready to give all of that up so that Lady Finesse can have the chance to be happy. It's almost like he is saying (honestly, far louder and clearer than any words possibly could), "I love you more than all of that."

Why else would he be helping his brother take over as heir to House Vaude when that actually seems to be something Langris wants for himself? (I know the poll I ran examined some different ideas and interpretations but that's always been my personal take on it). It’s almost like in that moment, Langris has realized that he can’t make Lady Finesse happy (even if he wants to), but he thinks that Finral can so he wants to make Finral into the best he can be for her.

Once Langris is reasonably sure that Finral is at a place that he can make Finesse happy and has become a man "worthy of her," I could definitely see him stepping aside so that his brother could take over their House and marry her—purely out of concern for Finesse’s happiness, and there is something incredibly selfless and very beautiful about that.

I think Finesse's side of things is much more practical. The fact of the matter is that Finesse is royalty in a medieval society where she will inevitably be married off for a political alliance and/or to produce children, and she has probably always known that she needs to marry out of duty/responsibility, so I can’t really see her as that much of a hopeless romantic given the circumstances. If she allows herself anything, it is the hope that she will get to spend her life with someone who does care for her and who she can be content with. I don't think throughout most of Finesse's life and certainly not throughout this whole arranged marriage business that anyone has ever really asked her what she wanted or ever really cared about her wishes before, but Langris seems to have a genuine interest in her wishes and her happiness more so than anyone else. And I think she does care for him (again, not necessarily in a romantic way but it is a genuine care and concern of at least friendship).

As I discussed in this post, when Langris has all that elf-business and the King threatens to dissolve the betrothal and punish the Vaudes, it is Finesse who comes to their defense rather than taking what is quite possibly her only chance at an "out." And it is an informed, free choice on her part. I love her line in the English dub that she "knows Lord Langris and has no misgivings about him" and therefore essentially begs her uncle not to "judge him too harshly." I think there is something very strong and very courageous in her decision to believe in the good in Langris even when he is at his worst, and her concern is truly and completely focused on what is best for him. I'm especially thinking of that moment when she begs him to stop before he does something he will regret. She's worried about him: his hurt and his guilt. She really wants what's best for him, and it's this love for him and this belief in him that really brings out the best in Langris.

My absolute favorite thing about this ship (besides how selfless they are towards each other) is really that Finesse has this way of bringing out this softer, gentler side of Langris that, I think, very few people have actually seen. Langris himself is so insistent on hiding this (probably a learned response from growing up in an environment where any hint of emotion and any sensitivity is viewed as a weakness), but really he has such a deep capacity for love and given the opportunity would be fiercely loyal.

Langris may not care about a lot of people, but the ones he chooses to care about he will love forever. He's just such a tsun about it, I think, so it can be very hard for anyone (and especially for those with preconceived notions of him as a snotty stick-in-the-mud) to see that he's really very sweet and awkward as heck about his feelings. Langris' love might be quiet—it's not very flashy and usually shows itself in doing little, everyday things for the people he loves—but still waters run very, very deep and he has shown that he would do just about anything to protect the people he loves most and make them happy, no matter what that means for himself. I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that he would die for Finesse if it came down to it.

Ultimately, I can imagine a lot of different outcomes for this relationship (some of which never, ever cross over into that romantic place). I really just want them both to be happy whether that means they end up together or not, but yes, I could see them happy with each other in a romantic sense under very specific circumstances since they do have such a selfless love for each other (but I think that is probably a discussion for another time because this is already super, super long so I'm cutting myself off in favor of the next section...).

Why I personally think Langris rather than Finral is better suited for Finesse

As much I don't like pitting ships against each other, I don't think it's avoidable in this case since she is going to be in arranged marriage with one of them. To paraphrase a favorite musical of mine, it's not a matter of "if" but which one. And I think it's best for me to just start off by saying that while I do genuinely like and appreciate Finesse and Finral as a ship as well, I personally think that Langris and Finesse are better suited for one another in the long term.

I will admit upfront that this is in part because of my own personal experiences of having a chronic illness (and needless to say that is a personal bias that colors my opinions, so please just keep that in mind), but I think it's important to talk about the fact that Finesse is chronically ill because it's not something I've ever really seen discussed when talking about ships for her and I really think it should be taken into account. Like Finesse, I have been sick for most of my life, and I can really relate to the kind of difficulties and limitations that Finesse likely experiences due to being chronically ill and the realities of the less active and much more slower-paced life she would lead and, by proxy, the life anyone who married her would have to lead. Again, I am not saying that I don’t like or couldn’t imagine her & Finral together (I do genuinely like that ship too), but I almost think Langris is better suited for her in that he actually wants (or seems to want) the slower-paced life they’d probably have together. For instance, there are likely to be frequent situations that would arise in which Finesse is too ill or too tired to go out and her husband would then be “forced” to stay home with her. With Langris, I think, there would never really need to be much of that feeling of guilt on Finesse’s part or the fear that she is taking away something from Langris or being a burden, because Langris isn’t super sociable and would just want to stay home anyway. In fact, let’s be honest here, he’d probably, actually feel kind of relieved that he has gotten out of unwanted socializing. Whereas Finral is a much more lively and sociable person (rather than an "old soul" like Langris), and though Finral would never, ever want Finesse to feel like a burden or to feel guilty about being sick, I could imagine there is more of that feeling (at least from Finesse’s side) that he has given up a lot more to be with her since his active social life would drastically change as soon as they married.

There's also the matter of the panic Finral would probably have whenever Finesse was ill or having a flare of symptoms. Of course, Langris would be worried as well, but I think because of his personality, he is better able to shelve that and help in a crisis rather than Finral who gets really worked up and then just sort of shuts down. Obviously this is something that can be learned over time, but I just worry that it would be a constant source of stress for Finral which would ultimately make Finesse very worried about him and upset that he is upset on her account. I think Finesse would have a lot of fear that the life she could give a lively, busy, & social person like Finral would be holding him back in some way. The question there is really: will what Finral wants out of life ever gel with the limitations Finesse has to live with? Whereas I don't think that question is as much of an issue with Langris since he is an old soul and incredibly steady, very unlike his more restless, adventurous, and high-energy brother.

I think Langris and Finesse are alike in this way. Though they have many differences in their personalities (and a really nice balance there), they have a lot of similarities in worldview and their attitudes towards life and their life goals—being more traditional, formal, and proper ‘old souls.' Whereas I think she and Finral have more similarities in personality (despite him being much more lively), they’re both incredibly kind, gentle & easy-going people who aren’t particularly ambitious and often make decisions based on what will make other people happy and "keep the peace." But worldview wise he seems much more modern and less traditional than her which I could see causing some tensions since I think they want different things out of life, in a way. It’s almost more important to be alike in life goals/worldview than personality, I think.

I also think Finesse and Langris share common interests and genuinely enjoy each other's company (as we get these glimpses of in the anime where they're just having a quiet, comfortable tea parties together for instance). Even if it started off as an obligation to spend time together because of this arranged marriage they were going to be in, I like to think that eventually Langris and Finesse actually became fairly good friends and came to genuinely enjoy each other's company. I guess it’s a bit unfair to Finral to bring this up since we haven’t seen him spend a lot of time with Finesse so we can't say that they don’t enjoy each other’s company but I just don’t see them having the same shared interests that she would have with Langris.

There is a lot more I could say about these two and their relationship, but I think that's enough ramblings for now. If you read this all the way through to the end, bless you. Thank you for coming to my TED Talk. Cheers!! 💖

[willow-lark]

one thing about me is that i will always and forever be a stoncy girly. i occasionally rb posts about them but i'm mainyl involved in the byler fandom atm so i don't talk ab them as much as i want to. anyways

stoncy is really interesting to think about particularly considering where things are in canon for the three of them right now. so, firstly, my thoughts on that:

i am 100% rooting for jancy endgame in-show. i'm not a fan of love triangles (hence why i started shipping stoncy in the first place, they all have chemistry n i think they should all kiss each other at the exact same time) but up until s4 there was no reason to think that jancy wouldn't be endgame, and honestly i'm upset that the writers brought stancy back in, considering that steve's s3 arc was all about him learning he doesn't need romantic love to fulfill his life, and what he and nancy each want in life simply are not compatible. jancy r iconic. jancy r goals. jancy had a whole speech in s4 talking about all the things they love about the other. although they've hit a slight rough patch due to jonathan's conflicting desires in supporting her goals while also being there for his family which has historically needed a lot of his support, they just need to get on the same page about this. they WILL prevail i KNOW this i TRUST

okay, lark, you say. if ur so obsessed with jancy endgame then why stoncy at all? AND I WILL TELL YOU WHY.

it all comes down to stonathan. also shoutout to @messrsbyler for championing the stonathan agenda lately. we should all attempt to live up to your example. SO TRUE.

so. post-s1 era in-show. or, honestly, u can rework this and make it fit at any point in the timeline. but anyways: nancy's with steve, they r trying and somewhat struggling to make it work (though they did last an entire YEAR so kudos for that ig). nancy VERY obviously has feelings for jonathan, who hangs out with her sometimes but is generally avoiding both of them. and honestly? steve thinks jonathan's pretty cool too. and, like, he spent a while treating jonathan like shit so he should probably try and make it up to him. right??? AND THEN THEY KISS.

no, but actually: steve's the type not to even realize that he's actually in love with jonathan. he's like, well, nancy loves him, and i love nancy, so... (that's the transitive property, right? i don't remember anything from 5th grade math class.) he doesn't even realize it's gay of him to feel that way. (NOTE: stoncy r bi4bi4bi and you WILL NOT be changing my mind.) if u extend the timeline to post-s3, robin might be able to help him w this LOL, i've read a really good fic or two where that's the case

on the other side, i feel like jonathan would have an easier time accepting his feeling, especially now that steve is making an effort to make friends with him. not to digress about the byers brothers but i'm gonna. when it comes to accepting his bisexuality jonathan doesn't have nearly as much internalized homophobia to deal with as will does regarding being gay. will has really internalized all of the things lonnie/the bullies have said about him, whereas jonathan is openly defiant of them. but in true byers fashion, he's not gonna make a move about it.

honestly i'm inclined to say that nancy, the girlboss that she is, (perhaps along with robin, again, if the timeline goes later) is the one to witness stonathan making goo-goo eyes at each other and she's like. you know what. this Might Actually solve 90% of my problems. so SHE'S the one who prompts them into it. but to be completely honest all three of them are so completely dramatic about everything so i could even see it all coming down to robin and maybe argyle to force them to get their shit together 😆

this is honestly just one way that it could go down, i've read a lot of different iterations and i love them all.