#what if we were parallels to jesus and Judas and were both boys

[lyricalchrysanthemum]

Could you see the things I live for, and show me if I’m only doing great

[bylerlipglances]

Will Byers Crucifixion

is he God or merely a pig for slaughter?

Severus: "A Pig for Slaughter"

The debate about sacrificing Will Byers to save the town brings to mind the conversations between Dumbledore and Snape about Harry's destiny. Just like Rowling was grappling with tough decisions for her characters, it feels like a similar moral conflict is at play here.

Both stories explore the heavy burden of making sacrifices for the greater good, highlighting the emotional and ethical dilemmas that come with such choices.

https://www.businessinsider.com/why-jk-rowling-didnt-kill-off-this-major-character-at-the-end-of-the-harry-potter-books-2016-1

"In some ways, it would have been a neater ending to kill him, but I felt it would have been a betrayal because I wanted my hero — and he’s my hero — to do what I think is the most noble thing,"So he came back from war and he tried to build a better world I suppose, as corny as that sounds." "We would all believe he was walking towards his death and he would emerge in Hagrid’s arms."

Notable authors were pleading for Harry not to be killed off, but many general readers felt that it would provide a fitting conclusion to the story.

Some fans of the series still wished Harry had died at the end of the series. There are even numerous “Harry Potter” fan fiction writers who focus their narratives on Harry’s death and how life would continue on after the “Chosen One” had been killed. But Rowling for her part doesn’t regret letting “The Boy Who Lived” survive at all. (zombie boy)“I felt it would be a betrayal of the character if I showed Harry doing anything other than living what all along he has discovered to be true, which is that love is the strongest power there is,” “I thought a lot about people who had been through terrible things like wars. And having to come home and rebuild and espouse a normality after seeing horrors has always seemed to me to be such a courageous thing to do.” “Climbing back to normality after trauma is much, much harder,” she added. “It’s much harder to rebuild than to destroy.”

Duffers could take a Snape-like approach with Will. Maybe they could have him trained in the art of Occlumency, turning him into a more skilled "super spy." This way, he could protect himself from Vecna while still working to save the town.

Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, Harry willingly sacrifices himself to Voldemort, and everyone believes he’s dead. His friends and loved ones mourn him, but he later comes back.

Will isn’t dead but is trapped in the Upside Down, a dark and eerie alternate dimension. Harry enters a mysterious limbo where he speaks with Dumbledore before returning to life. Both experience a sort of afterlife or hidden realm where they are neither fully alive nor dead.

When Will is found alive, the Upside Down and the government’s cover-ups are revealed. When Harry comes back to life, it turns the tide of the Battle of Hogwarts, leading to Voldemort’s downfall. Both resurrections mark a major turning point.

Biblical Parallels

Will Byers, a Martyr Figure: Will has already suffered immensely-abducted, possessed, and psychically linked to the Mind Flayer. If he were to be crucified (literally or metaphorically), it could symbolize him being the ultimate sacrifice to save Hawkins (or the world). His fate could mirror Jesus’ crucifixion, where he willingly endures pain for the sake of others.

Literal Crucifixion in the Upside Down: Vecna 'quite literally' CRUCIFIES his victims.

Vecna might crucify Will as a final ritual to merge both worlds. His body could be covered in black veins and spores, like a dark and twisted “crown of thorns.”

A Symbolic Crucifixion – Betrayal & Sacrifice:

Judas Moment? Public Condemnation: The town of Hawkins could turn against Will, seeing him as a “curse” or a “harbinger” of the Upside Down’s destruction.

Sacrificial Death? Will might willingly offer himself to stop Vecna, much like Jesus accepting his fate on the cross.

will is infamous for inflicting pain on himself @strange-anni post

Resurrection? If Will dies, could he come back, changed? is he going to remain a Zombie boy or would he ascend to some new supernatural form like superman?

Biblical Parallels

Jesus suffers and is crucified; Will suffers in the Upside Down

Betrayed by Judas ; Hawkins turns on Will

Crown of thorns ; Black vines/spores wrapping around Will

Sacrifices himself for humanity; Will sacrifices himself for Hawkins

Resurrection on the third day; Will returns from death, changed

Concept of Death

Henry & Hades

Hades (God of the Underworld, the place where human souls go after death)

according to d&d lore, Vecna is depicted as a being who consumes souls, particularly when utilizing his powerful artifacts like the "Hand of Vecna" and the "Eye of Vecna," where interacting with them can lead to a portion of one's soul being taken by Vecna himself.

3 HEADS: CEREBRUS & DRAGON

Cerberus (hound of Hades) is a multi-headed dog guarding the underworld gates, preventing the dead from leaving.

Upside Down is a shadow-realm below the everyday world. the Upside Down is stuck in a decaying version of the past with no sunlight, water. There are monsters, slimy, twining vines that choke the life out of anyone they capture. Pale flakes float in the air like glowing nuclear ash.

Eastern religions view death as a transition or transformation rather than the end of existence. For instance the concept of the Atman (soul) & Avatars (gods) (earthly incarnation of a deity, particularly Vishnu, who descends to Earth to restore cosmic order and protect dharma) is central to Hinduism. Death is a 'GATEWAY' to a new existence. Hinduism & Buddhism believe in the cyclical rebirths of samsara.

In Christian theology, death is not the final end; rather, it marks the transition to a new, eternal life. Jesus states, “I am the resurrection and the life"

[dantays-inferno]

Lady Gaga’s “Judas” sheds light on the darkest night of reputation

Lady Gaga seems to have had a lot of influence on reputation, but one interesting song/video that the album seems to allude to is “Judas”. If you haven’t seen the video, here it is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wagn8Wrmzuc

It’s basically the story of Gaga being drawn to Judas even though she knows he’s toxic. Throughout the video, she is caught between her dedication to Jesus and her lingering love for Judas (one of Jesus’ disciples who ended up betraying him, depicted in the music video as a quintessential rough-and-tumble bad boy.) 

I noticed Lady Gaga references in other reputation music videos, so I was going through all of Gaga’s videos to see if there were more connections that might help shed some light on some of the murkier songs on rep. I had pretty much given up on “Judas” until maybe 3/4 through the video, there is this moment during the bridge where Gaga holds a gun up to Judas and pulls the trigger and...lipstick comes out. And she proceeds to smear it on his face. I immediately started shouting in triumph.

And our pieces fall Right into place Get caught up in the moments Lipstick on your face So it goes

“So It Goes...” has been a song that puzzles me, so I was psyched to find this similarity. It might seem like a coincidence, but remember this iconic lyric from “Dress”:

I'm spilling wine in the bathtub, you kiss my face and we're both drunk

Well, later in the video Gaga is in a tub with Jesus on one side of her and Judas on the other. Judas pours alcohol into the tub (onto Gaga) and then in another scene kisses Jesus on both cheeks. This reminded me of the phrase “Judas kiss” which is basically the idea of a friend betraying you while pretending to be friendly. "You stabbed me in the back while shaking my hand” sums it up pretty well (though that’s a Julius Caesar reference.) 

Betrayal and a broken relationship are themes in reputation, so I think both the “Judas” video and the larger concept of Judas’ betrayal shed some light on the album. I was never completely convinced that “Dress” and “So It Goes...” were actually about sexual encounters. I think the sexual aspects of the songs mask that they are really songs about the betrayal of a friend, which she can’t explicitly write about because people want love songs. And the tune of “Judas” echoes that of “Bad Romance” because it’s about, y’know, a toxic relationship.

Of course, I realize one of the obvious associations with the “you kiss my face and we’re both drunk” lyrics is “kissgate.” This is where the Judas metaphor gets really interesting. Judas pretended to be Jesus’ friend, then kissed him to signal that Jesus was the person the crowd was meant to arrest. Judas was paid for this and presumably was protected from danger once Jesus was arrested and his disciples became wanted men. Then, obviously, Jesus was crucified. 

I wonder if Taylor felt this paralleled her experience surrounding kissgate. Did Karlie set her up? Could she have arranged for photographers in the crowd to capture a “kiss” that would make her famous and create a nightmare for Taylor? I think there is a lot more to the story than we will ever know, but I think Taylor is trying to tell us through these small allusions that her friendship with Karlie may seem romantic and glamorous on the exterior layer, but was more toxic underneath.

Sidenote: The idea that Judas betrayed Jesus for money comes up in a couple other places on the album. One of the scenes in the LWYMMD video is of people close to Taylor stealing from her and walking out of the bank vault. And in “Getaway Car”, there are those lines from the bridge:

It's no surprise I turned you in  'Cause us traitors never win ... Put the money in a bag and I stole the keys

I could never make sense of this. What is this money? ... It’s Judas’ payment for his betrayal.

[alicat-gotyourtongue]

Watching Riverdale and my mind is BLOWN...

(I’m only halfway through the episode so there may be more), but the parallels between Judas and Joaquin, Archie and Jesus, the game players and the Apostles...wow. I’m actually wildly impressed watching this episode. The biblical symbolism is STRONG. And it’s making me want to go back and watch previous episodes/seasons now to see if it’s been there all along. I may have overlooked a much larger allegory...

A few things I noticed (sorry if this is scattered):

1) Archie has always been portrayed as the light and “golden boy” of Riverdale. The morally righteous center of the town (the parallelism there is pretty obvious). I’m behind a few episodes, so I don’t know if the biblical motif is present throughout, but MAN it was out in full force in this episode.

One of the smaller elements I noticed was Archie’s “Last Supper” with the Warden. If you notice, even the table was laid out in a similar fashion to infamous Last Supper. Major kudos to the production design team (or whoever was responsible) for that inclusion. At said supper, Jesus/Archie addresses his coming betrayl (here, Archie’s past betrayl) and we find out [through the warden] that Archie’s life was “worth” thirty thousand dollars, similarly to how Jesus was betrayed for thirty pieces of silver. I thought that was a really neat little tie in.

2) The midnight club.... Ok so maybe this is a stretch, (I was trying to make the connection between the original 12 disciples and the original players of G&G since so much of the other stuff was rich with symbolism, but Betty mentioned there were 9 suspects not 12...I think there are 3 we don’t know about, and one of those 3 is the bretrayer). Oh lord, I’m starting to sound like Jughead.... side note, on the night of the “Ascension party” a person, or persons, leaves earth and ascends into death to be “reunited” or what have you with “The King”...I’m starting to believe the death of one of the Andrews lineage on THAT particular night was not a coincidence. (I know he died of natural causes, I’m just stating it wasn’t a coincidence that he died on THAT day). ...I’m still trying to work out Featherhead’s role. And I’m possibly just thinking waaaayyy to much into this. Btw I’m solely looking at this as a historical/literary comparison because I think it’s obvious, not trying to tie this show to any sort of religious picture.

3) Joaquin....sooooo many Judas Iscariot similarities to unpack. First of all, the name Joaquin comes from a Spanish derivation meaning, “God will Judge or He who exalts God” [im going to use God and King here synonymously because I believe the GK is the rather obvious symbol for God in this whole scenario], what is Joaquin if not “exalting the king” to eventually get to the next level and ultimately to his ascension? If that wasn’t a coincidence and that storyline was picked for his character SPECIFICALLY for that reason...I’m impressed.

Similarly, Judas, in its basic translation, means “God is praised.” Both individuals were followers to the King and both became traitors who facilitated in his capture and demise (demise being metaphorical for Archie). Jughead even says in the episode, the quest begins with a “Judas kiss” which was a not so subtle nod to the actual kiss Judas gave to Christ before betraying him.

Moving on to swift, choppy bullet points because I’m losing focus...

Warden = Pontius Pilate or Emporer Tiberius? (Jughead refers to him indirectly as the “Emporer” in his game master monologue multiple times.

While Jesus was not stabbed by Judas, only betrayed...some historians hold that Iscariot may derive from the Latin word sicarius meaning “dagger man” ....Joaquin stabbed Archie in his betrayl (ok I think I’m reaching with that one, but I maintain no matter how tenuous, I make the connections that I make lol).

Ok.....I think I’ve given enough food for thought..I’m done now, I just thought it was very interesting. Hopefully I’m not the only one who thought these things. Riverdale, well done for making me break out my trusty computer today!