#we are supposed to like him after s4 with dean

[emmafallsinlove]

thinking about how people arguing about rory and jess doesn’t have a “you jump, i jump” moment but like. have you ever been 17 and a guy bought your home made basket for $90 and sat with you on a bridge by the lake, look into your eyes and told you “you know, ernest only has lovely things to say about you”? because tbh, it changes everything.

[nuemanfilms]

— at this point, just word porn of sam winchester

Warnings piv, quiet/trying not to get caught sex, unprotected, praise, dean’s in the same room, based on s4-s5 sam, deans a heavy sleeper like always, creampie

A/N well i was supposed to be in class but i think we all know what happened instead. Sorry if this is shit, my brain isn’t exactly processing well?? i hate being sick oml.

16+ I am not responsible for the content you consume under this age!!

Dean was in the room, the exact same motel room as you and Sam, but it’s not like that would you stop you both from getting atleast some type of intimacy.

The sound of Sam’s belt being undone was a lot quieter than you both expected it to be. Silently thanking the gods above for that as he lined himself up at your entrance, your panties pulled to the side so you wouldn’t have to worry about finding them in the morning.

As soon as he pushed in, his hand immediately went to muffle your moans. He knew you were trying to to be quiet, he knew that. Yet it’s not like you could anyway with him at this angle where you thought he was gonna spilt you in half.

“Shh— ‘s okay, hm? I’m almost in- just a little more, Sweetheart.” Sam had to bite his lip to hold back his groans as well at the feel of your heat around him after what seemed like decades. It wasn’t like he was doing a better job at it though.

After a few moments and your nod, he gave a slow yet punctual thrust causing your eyes to widen. He knew you were still getting used to his cock finally being inside of you after what seemed like weeks, but he also knew that you were both too desperate to waste time.

Each time his hips dragged, his head nudged at your cervix with each passing second. He felt your small moans and whimpers against his hand, he prayed that his brother would stay asleep. Dean always was a heavy sleeper.

“See? Look at you, Honey.. so good.” Sam praised, his breath hot against your ear as your eyes rolled back at his sudden change in pace. His thrusts were more purposeful, his angle more precise as he aimed to reach the sweet spot that always had you seeing stars.

You were so close, he was not too far behind you clearly as his hips started to stutter against your own. He buried his face in your neck, his lips pressing open-mouthed kisses against your skin in an attempt to muffle his noises.

“C’mon, c’mon, Sweet girl.. come, come for me.” he encouraged, and you let out a moan that was definitely louder than wanted when you pulsed around his length.

He groaned into your flesh, his hips giving one last stutter before he filled your cunt. Your panties were definitely ruined, but it wasn’t like you could do anything about it. Atleast not with Dean in the room.

Sam carefully pulled out, your mixed arousal leaking out onto the motel sheets before he even had a chance to pull your panties back up.

When he tucked himself back into his boxers, he helped you with your own undergarments before pulling you into his embrace.

[justjensenanddean]

Jensen Ackles | Purgatory Con, Düsseldorf, Germany, May 26, 2024, Panel Summary

Most creepy or annoying toy the kids ever had? Slime. It creeps him out. He has it all over his house now. He doesn’t like the texture or feel. But his kids love it. Creepiest? Danneel has an old antique doll. It is old cracked, has creepy eyes and is the devil. (x)

Demon Dean or Soldier Boy, who‘s more powerful? Demon Dean because SB has a traumatized little boy in him and demon Dean is just empty. He‘s more dangerous because he just doesn’t care. (x)

Funniest moment from set of The Boys? Someone yells Herogasm so Jensen says it was probably not the funniest moment but when he arrived on day 3 of the set, Jack Quaid asked if he‘s been on set yet and when it was a no, he said „whoo, good luck“ (x)

People kept mistaking the bottles of lube and the bottles of hand sanitizer. Jensen was not prepared for when filming started and everyone took their robes off. Jensen was not prepared. (x)

Jensen couldn’t not look. They called cut. Jensen was like „I‘m sorry, there’s 4 people over here doing a position I have never seen before.“ His shower was extra long that evening. „There may have been tears.“ (x)

“There’s four people over here in a position I have not seen before!!!” “My shower lasted extra long that evening. And there were tears.” Jensen retelling stories from Herogasm set on #TheBoys (x)

How long did it take him to learn the Arabic phrase for s14? Not long, he can parrot things quite easily. He just needs to hear it a few times, then he can repeat the sounds. It‘s how he learns accents. Tap dance worked like it too. If he can see or hear it, he can emulate it. (x)

Jensen: “I don’t think Cas’s confession is something that needs to be resolved. There is nothing to resolve. He said what he needed to say, it was a long time coming, it was heartfelt and beautiful. But there’s nothing to resolve.” (x) “Dean took it in and then lost one of his closest allies and friends. The accepting of that happened when Dean sat on the floor. He lost one of his brothers in arms and one of his closest people. When they come back, it’s just understood.” (x)

Are there situations where he accidentally or on purpose bring out Dean? Yes. Sometimes he thinks „it would be great to be Dean Winchester right now. He could have handled this.“ Dean is alive in him and comes out from time to time. (x)

Were there fake tears on SPN or did he ever cry? He wasn’t classically trained, so the emotion we see is real. He doesn’t know how to fake it. Compares it to a book or movie making you emotional. You know it’s not real, but it still gets you. (x)

After the s4 scene when Dean confesses to Sam about his 40 years and torturing in hell, he had to walk away because his body didn’t know it was fake. The barn scene was probably the most real, but for different reasons. He was saying goodbye to Dean, Jared, the crew. (x)

Crew members had to leave set because they were crying too. They were trying to dial it down, because it was too much emotion. (x)

When things get too serious? Laughter. It‘s his levee. When things get too heavy, he makes a joke to ease the situation. (x)

„Do you use Jared‘s conditioner?“ No he does not. That’s just what his hair does. (x)

Who inspires you? Jensen doesn’t idolize anyone, but he has a lot of respect for certain people and tries to absorb as much as he can when he meets them. Could be a brilliant scientist, an artist, an actor. (x)

Being cold on set? There was a scene with Bobby where they looked at a map over the hood of the car. Jensen told Bob Singer that it was ridiculous because they would look at the map in their car. But Bob wanted a specific job and told him to just get it done. (x) A few days after he got lasic surgery, he was supposed to wear sunglasses all the time. But he had to film in the sun with light shining in his face. Jensen was in so much pain that Serge covered the white surfaces in black. Didn’t help much. He took ibuprofen and powered through (x)

Dead in the Water when he had to hold the kid up and the diver pulled him under, it was the most eery feeling. He was terrified for the kid. But the kid actor had fun. / End of panel. (x)

(JMacLean)

[manwiththemagic]

The writers of s11 were cowards. If IIIIIIIIIII was in charge I'd made Lucifer's weird obsession with Sam show up more. Like the writers have very obviously included it and yet when Lucifer is processing the same vessel as cas, and therefore pretending to be cas, he just fucks off and tortures Crowley with fucked up bdsm pet play.

Like the few times casifer and Sam interacted were GOLD. because Sam sees it as his best friend cas, and Lucifer (who keeps talking about Sam like they're toxic ex's) is pretending to be him!! Although not to well. Like his freaky smirk when sending Dean into the past and coming back to harass Sam? Dude lives off of sadistic pleasure.

The way he full on LAUGHS when Sam says he trusts him bc Sam thinks it's cas?? Like gold!?!? Don't know why the writers didn't do more with that.

Also why not do more with the 'lucifer sent Sam visions to get him down to hell'. Like Lucifer is Obsessed w/ sam because that body/vessel is "supposed to be" his. And yet after revealing himself he doesn't try and convince Sam anymore?

He's just given up? Like nah man I don't believe that. I feel like he woulda fucked with Sam more in cas' body. And like it woulda been a way better not-romance-romance plot then whatever the fuck Dean and Amara were..

Like that came outta no where... I mean I get it.. but ew?? We saw her grow up, and maybe id argue "well there were two versions of her!! One physical on earth, the other her actual form and memories as a celestial being!!" BUT NO. SHE CALLS CROWLEY UNCLE CROWLEY.

cause he like raised her for a day or wtv..

Idk s11 is better than s10. Like the episode from baby's prospective?? PEAK CINEMAAAA!! also not that I dislike s11, no I quite love it, I just wish the dean plots were more fleshed out, and that it was more "Dean and Sam vs the world!!" Then Dean vs Sam yk??

Like where's my dynamic duo??

That's part of why I didn't like s10. Like no I loved the IDEA of Mark of Cain dean, and demon dean was hilarious (although I HATE him) but it was just Dean vs Sam, Dean vs cas, Dean vs the world. And idk I liked the idea, cause this time it was sam doing everything to save Dean, but man I just didn't like the fighting..

Also s11 had a mention of TMNT, S10 did not so... points!!

S1 and 2 of spn were peak ofc, and s3 was good but not really memorable for me?? Idk I'll go back and rewatch once I finish the series (just finished s11)

S4 and 5 were also really good, we got Castiel who is peak, blood junkie Sam, which was one of my favorite plots!! And of course a lot more bobby. Rest in peace king!

And unlike some I loveeeed s6-7 like.. the soulless plot, and death? Dean dealing with soulless sam?? Chefs kiss I mean mwah. Then Sam tweaking because of hallucinations. NOT TO MENTION GODSTIEL?? loved him sm stg.

8-9-10 is where it kinda fell off. I mean idk the leviathans?? Weak. Hated them ngl. Idk if they were s7 but either way.. mid. I didn't like purgatory bc no way Sam would do that?? But I did like how it developed deans character..

I don't remember what happened in what season but I lovedddd kevin, hated metatron (but in the "it's because he's well done" kinda way), the tablets were aight, Mark of Cain was uh... something.. (I hate demon dean but he was peak..)

So like idk.. show is peak though, I'm just at that point in the hyperfixtion where it's like "BUT I COULD DO IT BETTER!!" ykwim?? NVM I'm sick with a fever, supernatural is all I have going for me man.

[trialssam]

https://www.tumblr.com/trialssam/755982983333347329?source=share

Hi, I saw this post you reblogged and didn't want to derail it or give you/the op unwelcome notes to deal with so I thought it'd be better to ask this way. I felt like the post felt kind of contradictory and selective to me, and I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it?

First, I won't defend Dean keeping Gadreel a secret from Sam after Sam was possessed, that was wrong and it led to Kevin's death. Full stop, he was in the wrong for concealing that. But Dean didn't "let" Gadreel possess him... He told Gadreel that it was Sam's choice and didn't know the manipulative methods that Gadreel would use to get Sam's yes. He trusted Gadreel bc he thought he was Ezekiel and Cas told Dean that he could be trusted. Gadreel took advantage of his trust and he was the one who lied to Sam to get Sam's permission.

I'm also trying to remember when Dean violated Sam's body autonony other than keeping Gadreel a secret and I can only think of him and Bobby forcing Sam to detox in s4, but in the context of Sam being manipulated by demons and the way that the demon blood was affecting him, I think that can be justified (though I guess I understand if you don't agree). Either way, I think it's most directly comparable to Sam trying to rid Dean of the Mark of Cain, and the route Sam chose to do that did actively violate Dean's expressed wishes, resulted in Charlie's death and putting the entire world at risk of ending, which Sam knew was a risk... When Dean forced Sam to detox he was trying to save Sam and prevent the apocalypse, while when Sam cast the spell to remove the MoC he was trying to save Dean while knowing that it would cause unimaginable destruction and death. So in comparing those two similar situations, it seems to me like Sam was the one who was more reckless and willing to risk more because he couldn't live without Dean.

Also, in as early as Faith we saw Sam actively going against Dean's wishes to save him despite the method being incredibly suspicious and Dean not wanting to be saved that way. Sam saving Dean resulted in the death of an innocent person in Faith (it's not Sam's fault, the person would have died anyway, but now his death was on Dean's conscience when he didn't want to be saved like that in the first place), and in s3 Sam was on board with harvesting organs and frankensteining him and Dean to go on living forever just to save Dean from Hell.

Also in Mystery Spot, I'm a little confused how it was used it as an example of how he can live without Dean? That episode is supposed to show us that Sam will risk and do anything to keep Dean alive (kind of like the body part harvesting episode), to the point of possibly murdering Bobby on the suspicion that it was actually the trickster (he was correct about that, but he wasn't 100% sure so he did stab him knowing that he might be wrong and would be killing his uncle). So I just don't think it's a good example of Sam being less codependent than Dean, since the message of the episode is the exact opposite.

To be clear, I am not a Sam anti, I like him a lot. I just think that the show shows us time and time again that both Dean and Sam make reckless and harmful choices to save each other, and both of them display a lack of concern for the other's autonony over the course of the show. I don't really like the idea of arguing over which one incident was worse than the other, since ultimately that's kind of unquantifiable and they both make so many mistakes and both ultimately forgive each other. And the purgatory thing and the Gadreel thing are so different, if we want to compare one situation to another I feel like it makes more sense for the more similar situations like the demon blood detox and the MoC.

Anyway, hope you have a good day and I'm interested in hearing your thoughts!

Hey, Anon! I have an extended list of what Dean did to Sam that he thought it was right or that it was fair, but it wasn't.

• Dean DID let Gadreel possess Sam. Gadreel manipulated Sam when it was the time for Sam to say yes, but Dean LET him. What was even worse is that, after the possession, Dean kept lying to him, even when Sam thought he was crazy because he felt like there was pieces of time missing. Dean knew about Sam's story with possession, but he let it happen because he was desperate to not be left behind by his brother. Sam only found out the truth when the king of hell possessed him (after his body was tortured). Dean NEVER apologized for it. And he would do it again.

• Dean was the one who started the Apocalypse, but the narrative, the characters only blamed Sam. They both had the same goal: kill Lilith, then why only Sam got the blame? Dean left Sam in that panic room to die, Castiel let him escape, and instead of trying to talk to Sam, Dean called him a monster. Sam was manipulated by Ruby the entire time, so he was always at a disadvantage. When Dean went to hell, Sam was alone and grieving, and Ruby was there for him to give him what he wanted. But Sam learned from his mistakes, having THE arc of redemption in s5.

• I wouldn't discuss the Mark of Cain because that whole storyline was a JOKE. But anyway, Dean took the MOC willingly. He was becoming the worst version of himself. He was getting dangerous, and Sam tried talking to him to see the reason, but Dean didn't want to hear it. So Sam did what he had to do. And let's be honest here: Charlie caused her own death. She was dumb enough to leave the place where she was safe, to get killed. Dean never faced the consequences for anything related to the Mark. Different from the demon blood detox, Sam would never be cured by it because it was literally inside him. The Mark was only a curse that could be cured by a spell (the result wasn't nearly as bad as the apocalypse because the Amara storyline was pretty weak).

• In Mystery Spot, Sam was different because he was fueled by revenge, but he only "killed" Bobby because he knew it wasn't him. "You know why? Because you're not Bobby" and then stabbed him. And I'm not saying Sam doesn't have questionable decisions, but they're less harmful than Dean's.

• In episode Faith, when Dean was "saved" by that preacher, they both didn't know how that happened, but Sam believed Dean deserved to be saved, he always believed in Angels and in God, but he didn't know that it was a work from a reaper.

I'll never deny that they both were codependent on each other, but this codependency was unbalanced.

And I won't talk about the purgatory thing because I will not touch that can of worms again (too many years talking about it, and I'm so sick of it, lol)

Dean wasn't being selfless in "saving" Sam, every time he did, was for himself. Sam even said that to him in 9x13:

Dean always had this hero complex (and God complex bc it fits) that he SHOULD keep Sam alive, even when he doesn't want to, and that is a violation. Sam couldn't even keep secrets about HIMSELF from Dean, that he got punched in the face, like his life is not his own. Sam constantly thanked Dean for being there for him, and he always felt like he owed his brother everything, but you guys are 1st to judge Sam when he DOES something to save Dean and he doesn't as well, which is a hipocrisy.

To say that they're "equally" harmful to each other is not paying attention to their dynamics throughout the years. Dean always had the final word, even when Sam didn't agree with him, which it became worse in late seasons, and like Sam told him in s9, "I'll give you this much. You are certainly willing to do the sacrificing as long as you're not the one being hurt."

They ultimately forgive each other because Dean doesn't want to be alone, and I know he loves Sam, just like we know Sam loves his brother, but what choice does Sam have? He could never go on with the life of hunting without his brother. That's why it was so important for Sam to Dean to give him his blessing in 15x20 to stop hunting.

I hope you have a good day as well :)

[ardentpoop]

your a person who I feel really understands Sam and I always enjoy seeing your opinions on the show so i hope you don’t mind me asking a bit of a specific Sam question. In s8 Sam says that the time is he found with Amelia was something unique that he found for the first time in his life. I’ve always found that line to be a bit weird considering Stanford and Jess but I’d like to see what you think Sam means and is saying by this line. Have a good day.

hi :)

I have mixed feelings on the amelia arc leaning more positive than negative bc I’m a contrarian and I thought the fandom disliked that arc for the wrong reasons lmao - as usual dean’s inescapable perspective aggressively dampened ppl’s ability to empathize w/ sam. also as usual this fandom hates women as much as the show does.

anyway bird’s eye view: sam’s “break” with amelia pre-s8 followed the extremely traumatic events (for sam more than anyone) of s4-s7. he spends literal years dealing w/ one catastrophe after another, his and dean’s relationship suffers its first major breakdown in s4 that imo they never truly recover from, he sacrifices himself to save the world bc it was “his fault” it nearly ended, he suffers an eternity of torture in the cage and loses those memories then regains them then loses them again, nothing feels solid to him least of all his own body and mind. and then dean dies in the s7 finale! or at least, sam thinks he does - he has no reason to believe otherwise. and sam looks for dean, we see that he does, we see him spinning out and suicidal again, but then he stops. bc he hits a dog! and he meets A Girl. and this girl, like him, is drifting and grieving and desperate for something solid to hold onto for just a while. and she’s prickly and unapproachable at first and sam finds that comforting.

my overall point is that sam’s headspace going into stanford era and sam’s headspace pre samndean reunion in s8 are like…. impossibly different. he goes through shit his teen self wouldn’t even have the words to describe. he and dean hit lows that he would’ve never thought possible when they only had each other for comfort under john’s roof.

stanford era sam was blessed with ignorance; he was trying to be Normal, he left his stifling family unit behind and started planning a stable future without them, he was doing everything you’re Supposed to do to be a happy successful person per american individualism - and at the time, it WAS making him happy, bc everyone had kept him in the dark abt the nefarious plot he was smack-dab in the middle of; he didn’t know his freedom was an illusion and that he’d never stopped being watched.

pre-s8 sam on the other hand has long since given up on normalcy. he views himself as a freak who will “never be okay” and hunting as a burden that he deserves to bear. it takes dean being gone for the veil to lift a little and remind him that A) it’s maybe okay that he’s a freak lmao bc amelia’s kind of a freak as well and they can help each other specifically because they’re broken in similar ways, and B) he CAN feel okay when he’s not hunting.

like we know sam’s always hated hunting lol his introduction as a character is centered on this inner conflict. however sam “running away” from “the life” before he knows abt what azazel did to him and before he’s made to shoulder the burden of the apocalypse in s5, among countless other burdens, and sam making an Informed Decision to step back from hunting are 2 entirely different things. to me.

also btw sam turning away from hunting is inextricable from sam turning away from dean, and punished accordingly. bc sam’s Place is at dean’s side whether he likes it or not. he is reminded of this the very instant dean gets back from purgatory and bombarded with guilt abt it for the rest of the season until he cracks.

[speyerboot]

I've been discussing this with @bohello ad nauseam but I 150% believe that at one point it was planned but later dropped for Billy to eventually be revealed as a Venture. (spoilers mentioned under the cut)

I was inspire to collect my thoughts after seeing this post

Reasons:

Hair color (This is already a signifier for a lot of Rusty's relationships to family members and Billy's is similar enough to Baby Rusty's more orange hair)

higher natural / gifted intelligence (I would argue on the same level as JJ just in a different field)

Grew up obsessed with Rusty Venture (Cartoon)

His mother had ties to the original Team Venture but she chooses to keep her past a secret from him even in the current timeline.

---

Now this could equally go either the Tara (possible half sibling) route or the Rusty clone route.

Our logic for the Rusty clone route is we see enough examples throughout the show of "Failed" or disfigured clones. (D19 / JJ / Rico) We know from 'S4 E3 - Perchance To Dean' that Rusty's attitude towards disfigured slugs is to "abort" them and I have a pretty good reason to believe Jonas probably felt the same.

I think the way Cloning is supposed to work in Venture bros is that you have the subject that needs cloning (in the show always depicted as male) but that you need a donated egg to contribute to the process. Meaning the clone will still have some influence from the "mother's" DNA. I like to think that this is why Malcolm and Rusty take after Mrs Fitzcarraldo and less like Jonas.

Sidenote: I like to believe that the reason the "Rusty" Venture from the cartoon looks so drastically different from childhood Rusty depicted in flashbacks is because the cartoon version was based off of a different Rusty (possibly OG Rusty) who's would have had a different egg donor / parent.

or that Venture Twins look a lot less like Doc. With that logic in mind I would assume Jonas used a donated egg from Rose to create Billy, his clone then experience minor defects which Jonas pawned him back off to her (which causes her to quit being Triple threat and focus on raising her son )

---

I just think it would be very tragically poetic for a character like Billy (who grew up obsessed with the Rusty Venture cartoon and idolizing Rusty to eventually have it found out he was a "Rusty" this whole time.

[zmediaoutlet]

Happy wincest wednesday!

How do you think their relationship would have progressed if the events after s2 didn't happen (aka sam not dying and dean not dying)? would they always be as tight of a unit as they were in s2 or would sam eventually seek "independence" like he did when he went with ruby (or was that because of the demon blood)? Also do you think sam would've reacted to dean coming back to life differently (less cool about it) if he weren't using his powers but being "old sam"?

(does that make sense)

hello, hello, anonymous wincest friend! i know you sent this in plenty of time but it has Been A Week and so i'm just getting to it --

-- sidenote i know that wednesday is the day for wincest but i hope everyone feels thrilled to be wincesty on any day that we can manage, yes? yes. okay, so --

This is a really interesting question, friend anon. In a sense this is like -- imagine myself back in 2007 when people were writing early-years wincest, contextless, without the weight of the future and also without the weight of the deepened past that we got over the many years of actual canon information. That's really hard to do, haha! But I'll try, for wincest saturday. Although this is a two-part imagining, so, let's see-- let's take the second part first:

How would Sam have reacted to Dean coming back to life in s4 if he hadn't been using his powers?

Very interesting question. Part of the question inherent in that is: is he still working with Ruby? I think we might have to say no -- her whole job is to corrupt him with hubris, and how would she manage to cling on if she doesn't have the excuse of ""helping him"" by getting him to use his powers? So we'll imagine a world where -- whatever, Sam stabs her with her own knife when she shows up -- and that sobers him up a little from his grief spiral, and of course he's still trying to figure out a way to bring Dean back, and maybe he's still even looking for Lilith, but he hasn't spun off onto that path-of-good-intentions that made so many things go wrong in s4.

So -- Sam's still had a hard goddamn summer, but he's not got that early corruption set in. Maybe still talking to Bobby. And one day he opens up his motel room -- he ordered pizza and he's tired and his leads keep petering out -- and there's Dean, standing there, Bobby over his shoulder, and Sam's luck is never this good so of course it's a shapeshifter or a demon or a -- and of course, it is Dean, and that means -- it means --

I don't know if you'd be able to peel them apart, honestly. Bobby'd start getting uncomfortable. ...My 'stick to canon' heart is elbowing me to remind me of how in s6 when Sam got resouled, Dean was perfectly happy to go off and do a case without him, but I really do think this'd be different. Sam would have been operating on a possibly Mystery Spot-esque emptiness and lack of hope and Dean coming back pours light and color back into his life in a way that the demon blood/Ruby/corruption path he was on just didn't allow. Of course he was happy in canon to have Dean back, but killing Lilith had become the main goal that overshadowed Dean's return bc Ruby needed that to be true, and here it wouldn't be. And that just. Does a lot. If they hadn't already consummated the wincest, strong chance a first time would happen within that first month back.

What if Sam and Dean didn't die and instead just kept 'normally hunting', presumably still after avenging John & Mary by killing Azazel since those are the events of s2?

So this is yet another world. I suppose if Sam doesn't die that means that he's the 'winner' of the Special Kids olympics. Whether he opens the devil's gate or not, the trouble with Sam not dying means that Dean doesn't sell his soul, and if Dean doesn't sell his soul he can't go to hell as the righteous man who will start the apocalypse, which means Lilith doesn't get killed at the right time, which means that they aren't the vessels of angels and none of that terrible shit happens. And so, without all that...

If the apocalypse doesn't happen, and they're just hunting and cleaning up demons and getting on with their lives, I think... they break up. Not necessarily in a super sad way, and not even necessarily angry. But there's no reason for them to stick together, not really. Maybe Sam meets some girl, in some town. Maybe going back to college seems feasible. There'll always be another ghost, another werewolf, and the thing is that now we're past s2 and they know so many other hunters, it doesn't feel like the end of the world if they find a job and pass it on to someone else, you know? Hell, maybe Dean wants to settle down, slow down. He never was as bought in on the hunting as he actually seemed. But -- in the same way that I always hold firm to the opinion that they make themselves into soulmates -- without all the shitty, scary things that happen to them over the middle years -- their soulmate status isn't actually there. They're still tied together by history and love, but it's a thinner weaker connection than it would be in s5, s7, s11. So Sam goes back to law school. Dean opens his own roadhouse. They talk, they maybe even still go on hunts occasionally. They're good brothers. They aren't more.

Healthier, probably. More fun for me? Absolutely not, lol.

[thebrainmushroomsgotme]

Hi. Super new to the Supernatural Fandom and I'm only a few eps into s4. Basically I just finished ished the episode where Dean is scared of everything and nearly dies bc of it.in the end, Sam's eyes did a little flash of yellow like the yellow eyed demon. And since we all know that the demon made Sam into what he is so like. I have a theory and I want people to just say whether it's true or not bc now I NEED to know so pls tell me.

Basically my theory is that the demon was once human, like Sam, and a demon before had done to him what he did to Sam and the other kids and then the current demon won the competition thing to see who's strongest. Still following? OK. So basically we all know that Sam was meant to lead a demon army eight? Okay. And Dean was told to stop Sam from going down whatever path he was going down with his powers and all that. He hasn't been doing a very good job of stopping Sam from doing is power stuff and I feel like that's how he'll become the demon leader.

Okay so I have a couple theories.

1. If Sam uses his powers then he becomes more and more likely to become the demon army leader

2. The yellow-eyed demon knew he would have to die or something in order for Sam to take over

3. Yellow-eyed demon that they killed was the previous demon army leader. (Everything went to shit after he died plus gates of hell opened)

4. There's been previous yellow-eyed demons and they all came to be the same way Sam kinda is

5. Their dad knew that Sam would become the next yellow-eyed demon and that's why he told Dean to stop Sam and also why Dean told Sam to never use his powers and got mad when he found out he learned while he was dead.

6. Sam can exorcize the demons without speaking our without anything really is because he's supposed to be The leader and he's forcing the other demons to listen to him bc if he's a leader then he has to be stronger than the others

Anyway. Half of those rely on eachother being true. Can someone who knows some stuff about the show pls tell me. I am very eager to find out if I was smart enough to figure it out before the show told me bc it makes me happy. Anyway if someone does let me know I will be eternally grateful. This is my current hyperfixation and it's kinda become my comfort show

[deanstudies101]

s4 predictions / reading of the titles (we forgot to do these before the season, hence why they are intermingled + we missed a few episodes)

Episode 1, Lazarus Rising: Iga, Lazarus from the bible does a jump.

Episode 3, In the Beginning: Kai, lore episode. Iga, about the seals, god, Lucifer, and Lilith etc. and about how Lucifer is this big evil guy and they should be so scared about him coming out but when he does come out he’s like. Fine. Kai, maybe Lilith is Eve, or was Eve? Lilith backstory.

Episode 4, Metamorphosis: Kai, big bug. Iga, big bug. Kai, no, Sam. Things move along with Sam’s powers, he starts being more demonic. Iga, no it’s gonna be something in a cocoon, slimy. Julio, I feel like I’m going through an internal metamorphosis

Episode 6, Yellow Fever: Julio, disease? Iga, babies being ill, but a demon illness, maybe about Sam’s babyness. Kai, about the yellow eyed demon. Iga, they wanna fuck the demon?

General predictions

Sam evil arc (Iga, Kai agrees)

Dean is gonna have to cope with his time spent in hell, but we’re never gonna see him get over it, he’s just going to be expected to move on. But he’s going to be struggling. The closest we get to him talking about it, he gets told to man up (Iga, Kai agrees)

Find out if Lucifer is real, and probably yellow-eyes’ plan (Kai)

I wish that Dean finds a better relationship with his work (Julio)

Episode 7, It's the Great Pumpkin Sam Winchester: Kai, it’s giving similar to fairy tale episode, some whimsy. Iga, yeah, whimsy.

Episode 8, Wishful Thinking: Kai, djinn, or something similar. Making wishes, wishes being granted. Iga, yeah I like that

Episode 9, I Know What You Did Last Summer: Kai, Dean’s time in hell. Iga, yeah maybe they talk about it. Maybe Cas is there

Episode 10, Heaven and Hell: Kai, lore. Iga, Lorę. Maybe Can is telling them a bedtime story about why heaven and hell exists. Kai, Can meets a demon, and there’s some clashing. Iga, maybe it’s Ruby, but she’s terrified of him.

Episode 11, Family Remains: Iga, not about Winchesters. Maybe about Bobby? A Bobby episode. Kai, another Mary episode.

Episode 12, Criss Angel Is a Douchebag: Iga, about Cas. Kai, magician. But actual magic. Looks like a fake magician but it’s real magic.

Episode 13, After School Special: Iga, about kids again.Been a while since we’ve had creepy kids. Kai, genre one, they do a genre for an episode.

Episode 14, Sex and Violence: Kai, evil puppets. Evil video game. Julio, they find another cool ass hunter, and they have sex, and there’s some misunderstandings, a hunters hunter.

Episode 15, Death Takes a Holdiay: Julio, someone is supposed to die but they don’t die. Iga, Dean has a little cocktail on a beach. Kai, I would love a beach episode.

Episode 16, On the Head of a Pin: Iga, nothing. pins in maps. Kai, very tiny demon, they have to shrink themselves down.

Episode 17, It's a Terrible Life: Kai, Christmas episode. Attempted suicide? Cas episode?

Episode 18, The Monster at the End of This Book: Iga, about Lucifer. Kai, Lucifer. And the apocalypse. Another seal gets broken.

Episode 19, Jump the Shark: Iga, goof episode, meta episode, making fun of the journey so far. Kai, second beach episode. Iga, or the ghostfacers are back

Episode 20, The Rapture: Kai, another seal breaks. Iga, the seals are breaking, they’re trying to stop it but they can’t. They’ve only got like ten seals left. Kai, they’re still at the beach, and one of the seals is about seals the animal and they have to protect the seals.

Episode 21, When the Levee Breaks: Iga, so the seals are broken. Kai, ohh last seal.

Episode 22, Lucifer Rising: Iga, Lucifer rises. Kai, Lucifer rises. (Iga, and he’s a nice guy, just misunderstood.) (Iga, it’s a metaphor for the sun rising, except in this metaphor the sun is a star. Kai, there’s a really important sunrise, and all the demons get let into heaven. Iga, and John comes back, and does the worm.)

[thebiggestmenace]

don't know at what cost though

I am worried

so is everyone stuck here now?

you are not good, Sam

so his grace doesn't regenerate?

"I thought you two were joined at the, everything" you know. you are so right

oh, it's Nick??? how is he alive? I thought he was dead

Jack, don't be so hard on yourself :(

Kelly's parents!!! he's named after her dad :(

how do we know if Dean's telling the truth?

THE HANDPRINT IS GONE?????

she just threw Dean on top of Sam 🤭

oh, Claire had a crush on Kaia :(((

this isn't just a cold, is it *

* no. no, it is not

PLEASE tell me they do celebrate Halloween in the GOOFIEST way possible

wait, this Bobby had a kid?

Michael's still in Dean, isn't he? somehow

they're together now? and they're taking a break :((( Bobby deserved a break

never change, Jack, never change

and he's in the hospital now

he's wearing Cas' trench coat :((((((

1, what is going on with Dean?? and 2, technically speaking, would he not have some grace left from Michael? could they extract that?

Jack, you're scaring me, please tell me they don't kill you

yeah, Cas, you fucking tell him.

he is not bringing Lucifer back wtaf

he's gone? just like that?

he really was their kid :(((

he's in heaven :((((

tf is that???

the shit from the Empty????

wait, Cas goes to the Empty to save Jack??

GARTH??????

and he has a daughter??

Sam, you're supposed to wait

he's so silly

knew Michael wasn't fully out.

this is just a dream, right? this isn't heaven or anything, right?

Jack!!! you have powers again!!

I remember this???? I remember Dean throwing Michael into a closet in his mind??? we never made it this far???

oh, it's a bad thing, nevermind >:( but now Jack gets the disappointed dad™️ talk

Dean, you are concerning me, what are you doing?

wait, I remember the box thing, too?? don't know how it ends, but I remember it and I hate it

omg clowns!!! Sam, you love clowns!!

JOHN??????

oh and they fucked with time!! and everything's weird now!

Jack used his powers one time! one! and you mean to tell me he's getting bad again?

jk it's at least twice now

Michael is in Rowena????

Jack can just do that? amazing

yk I love that Cas and Dean are talking about Jack and Sam like they're their children and they're married

"if we cannot remain civil, then you can skedaddle" IVE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS ONE OH MY GOD THIS IS SO FUN

doesn't Jack hurt Elliot?

no, it's Stacy :((((

the samulet has a pair?! and that one supposedly talks to God?? idk the poeticism of that,,,,,,,,

of course they're trying to bring Lucifer back

yk I was so sure nothing bad would happen in this finale because of Dean and Cas, but I completely forgot to think about Sam and Jack

that was, uh, that was a lot

Jack, what did you do?

wait, did you kill Mary??

and now he's having hallucinations? I am so confused, what is going on

he smote her??? I know it was an accident, but still

Dean. this isn't Cas' fault

I thought the gates to Heaven were closed?

oh, Jack's gonna make more angels?

is the box even gonna work??

yeah, didn't think so

Chuck's back!! and he better help smdh

they're all confused puppies

but one of them has to die?

"I've already lost too much" Sammy :(((( it doesn't even get better :(((((

come on, Chuck

Sam......

what is this????

so everything they've killed,, they're all back? but tenfold because it's souls from Hell?

is this all of the souls??????

are they zombies?

so we have finished 14 now,,,,,, I am so confused. what was that??? they're acting like zombies, but are they just ghosts?? and is it all the souls?? cause with the amount, it sure seems it. so much has happened this season wtf and now onto avoiding 15 :')))

s1, s2, s3, s4, s5, s6, s7, s8, s9, s10, s11, s12, s13, s14, s15

[queerstudiesnatural]

still thinking about this. i think in early seasons/pre-canon dean very much was a member of society whereas sam was not. which is ironic considering sam was trying so hard to belong while dean was purposely living on the outside of anything even remotely resembling community (with the exception of cassie).

as said previously, dean had to spend time around people in order to parent sam. he had be confronted with the reality of what it's like to survive when you have no money. to look society in the eye. and sam was somehow shielded from that. so when sam wanted to belong, when he imagined being part of society, he had a utopian and naive vision of what society was, or could be. he believed in meritocracy because that's all he could believe in. study hard and you will get a scholarship and get out of here. pray every day and you won't turn into a demon to be hunted by your family.

sam's views were basically "play nice and you too can have a seat at the table". dean's were "nice is a mask, there is no justice, all we can do is our best to survive and help others survive".

and then of course around s4-5 sam started realising that there was never any hope for him and changed his reasoning from "i can avoid this by being good" to "i can make up for this by suffering a lot/dying". and the thing is he was never wrong to believe he was special and could rise above/be a martyr for mankind because like, he literally was. he was the chosen one all along. and before he knew that for certain (though deep down he could feel it from day one) he believed he could be better than the life he was born in. after he knew, he realised he never had a choice in what he became, but he clung to the hope that he could turn it into something good. with the demon blood, with the trials, with his community of hunters. no longer trying to escape, but to spite the devil and turn his curse into something helpful and good.

and dean, well he went from being some guy to the queen in some cosmic game of chess, to god's favourite npc, and he was never able to reconcile with that. his whole life dean's desperately wanted to be just some guy. he never wanted to be important, and he never felt like he was.

and in the end any talk of politics or fitting into society is pointless, because sam and dean were never written to be part of human life. society is just background noise to their story. they literally are the main characters in god's book series, and any attempt at world exploration is futile, they are both in a highly guarded enclosure.

but the difference between them is that sam was specifically chosen and never had any choice in what he became. he was always going to be lucifer's vessel, his whole life was orchestrated down to every little detail. lucifer was very specific about wanting him. but dean could have been anyone. michael never cared who his vessel was, as long as it could sustain him. it was supposed to be john, and then it was adam. dean didn't matter. he wasn't designed to be special at first, and he never wanted to be, what did make him special is that he wouldn't let anyone else take on his burden if he could help it. sam never had a choice, but dean did, and he chose not to let anyone else be chosen. and he hated himself for it. he went to hell, surrendered to michael, took on the mark of cain. knowing it would turn him into a monster. a demon, a harbinger of the apocalypse, a relentless killing machine. but at least no one else would have to bear the burden of hating themselves as much as he did.

sam's martyrdom is in dying for humanity, dean's is in living pitifully. makes the finale really ironic don't it.

i find it so interesting to look at sam and dean's respective views of society and people vs monsters, especially in early seasons, and then how that shifts and evolves throughout the show. like when we first meet them dean is very anti establishment whereas sam is literally studying law at an ivy league college. dean is very vocally anti police, and you're like wow for someone who was raised by an authoritarian father and is trying his hardest to please him this guy sure hates authority. he is aware of and cares about issues like racism and classism. but then when it comes to anyone non human he pretty much has no grey area, he sees them all as monsters to be put down. they are Things and they all killed his mum. whereas sam is pretty neutral about people, he doesn't even seem to be aware of systemic inequalities, he has a more individualistic approach to society. but this means he also sees monsters as individuals, just as capable of being good or redeemed.

This has everything to do with the way they grew up and the challenges they faced that affected them the most. dean's biggest challenge was putting food on the table. dean grew up poor and hungry. he was arrested for stealing, he had to use his body to get by, and he had to starve to try and feed sammy. and sam also grew up poor, but he was somewhat shielded from the reality of it. he wasn't the one who had to get food and pay for the extra week in a motel john left them in. his issues were much more personal. because sam knew he was a freak by all standards, he felt impure, and he knew in his heart that the monsters they hunted weren't too different from him. so his hope was in believing that anyone could be saved. anyone could choose to be good. where dean saw a system, with people in power and people who suffered because of them, sam saw grey individuals, and he was drawn in particular to the ones that had something "wrong" with them (max, madison, the kid from bugs, etc)

dean grew up so isolated that he couldn't be individualistic. he could only look at people from afar and that's why he sees the systems. and the violence he faced wasn't targeted at him personally, it was targeted at people like him. poor people, drifters, queer (or queer-looking) people. sam grew up trying to make connections. he made friends, he wanted an education. he tried so hard to belong.

and it's interesting to me that dean ended up being the one who formed the most personal bonds with people who were different, or ostracised, or monsters. see crowley, benny, charlie, claire.

sam tried to build communities (see his s14 arc) but every time he tried to get close to someone it ended in disaster so he ended up keeping his distance. and building a system. throughout the show he takes on leadership roles, and as time progresses he keeps his relationships more and more goal-oriented. whereas dean ends up forming personal bonds with a lot of people, and focusing less on helping oppressed people in general, and more on saving the individuals he cares about. i'm not saying they switched roles, they both kept their original views of the world, but they shifted towards a more confused and confusing moral compass that pointed somewhere in the middle and made it harder for them to understand each other. and ain't that just what growing up is like. dean cared about the whole world as a teen and young adult, but then that became too much to bear, and he had to focus his energy on his circle of loved ones. still caring about the world, but he had individual connections now and had to prioritise them. and sam still saw the potential for redemption and goodness in everyone, but he grew weary of people too, afraid of them or afraid of losing them, and he built walls. tried to help by giving himself missions rather than getting personally and emotionally involved.

psychologically speaking this show is so rich, the characters don't feel one dimensional (despite some of the writers' best efforts), and following their journey for 15 years means we saw them change and evolve, they don't remain the same people they were in season 1, but they keep some of that, and they just grow organically. sometimes i just love spn

[autisticgayngel]

Canonverse Castiel-centric/pining/loving Cas fics

some of these are Dean's POV and a lot are alternating POV, but all of them really delve into Cas's emotions and his love for Dean. All canonverse and all happy endings. Categorised by post-confession, pre-s15 curtain fic and other canon-era. Descending word count within each category. If anyone has any recs for things I should add lmk!

Post-Confession Fics

things happen (they do, they do, and they do) by sobsicles 28k rating E

Everyone has recced this, and for good reason, it's stunning. Cas gets back from the empty and Dean sort of lets him down gently and is very worried about breaking his heart. Despite this Cas is finally able to express to Dean how much he loves him and takes full advantage of this. He's earnest and sweet and so intense about it, but also incredibly hurt about the lack of reciprocation, though he tries to hide it. He does get the love he deserves in the end and it's so good!

closer (isn't close enough) by fleeceframe 18k rating E

Again, Dean's POV, but very much focused on how much Cas loves him. Has the gorgeous Cas line: “When you are hungry, you eat. When you are tired, you rest. When you are dirty, you bathe. But what are you supposed to do with love?”

My unintended by DeanaWinchester, Jeanne_de_Valois 10k rating E

Really good Cas POV, he’s obsessive and insecure but also deeply loving.

my heart a compass by lagaudiere 10k rating T

The empty torments Cas with visions of Dean and of the family he longs to have with Dean. Dean saves him.

I said show me something by ilovehowyouletmefall 7k rating E

Sparked by the debate about whether or not Dean thinks Cas can feel. Cas is hurt by Dean saying he thought he couldn't feel and vulcan mind melds to show him exactly how he feels about him. It's a really interesting exploration of both of their feelings and fears.

Gift by thisisapaige 2k rating G

Very sweet little fic of them trying to work things out once Cas returns from the empty.

Pre-s15 Curtain Fics

take the long way home by dothraki_shieldmaiden 95k rating E

Dean tries to retire with his family but finds himself alone as Sam and Jack take a road trip and Cas goes hunting in order to prove he's still useful as a human and to avoid thinking about his feelings for Dean. Really agonising and harrowing at the start as they both feel so rejected and miserable. Cas gets into situations where monsters use his feelings for Dean to attack him. Eventually, they're able to tentatively work out their feelings and settle down together and it's very sweet.

Morning Glory by edgarallanrose 26k rating E

Dean and Cas retire together. Cas becomes a beekeeper and Dean starts to use the honey he makes to bake goods, which they sell at the farmer's market. Cas is very much in love with Dean but it takes Dean a bit longer to work things out.

Other Canon-era

A Winter's Tale by NorthernSparrow 64k rating T

This one hurts a lot, so fair warning for that. Cas falls ill while human and homeless and is hospitalised. Dean finds the journal Cas kept as he struggled to survive in this time. Pre-Destiel but Cas does write a lot about his feelings for Dean. Sam and Dean shower Cas with love and kindess as he recovers. Also a destiel epilogue that is very sweet and fluffy.

In the Shadow of your Wings by Enochian Things (Salr323) 57k rating E

Cas confesses his love to Dean post s11 finale but the timing is terrible and Dean is very repressed about it all and breaks Cas's heart. Cas gets an Italian man of letters boyfriend in an attempt to get over it and Dean is insanely jealous (which Cas is oblivious to) but they all have to work together to try to save Sam from the BMOL. Dean eventually gets his shit together and treats Cas the way Cas has learnt to understand he deserves.

That Black Dog Ache by SaltyWords (agent4hire22) 28k rating E

This is very much Dean's POV but I'm putting it here anyway because it has a really intense love confession from Cas, which I'll include an excerpt of that drives me insane:

'“I listen to your music, and I close my eyes. I try to imagine I’m in the Impala, hunting with you. And, sometimes,” his throat jumped, “I lay on your bed. I think about what it would be like if I got to have a place on it beside you... If you ever let me get close enough.”'

Kelp!I Need Somebody by andimeantittosting (Saylee) 27k rating E

A really sweet fic in which Sam, Dean and Cas go to investigate a case on Jesse and Cesar's ranch. Switching POV with really good mutual pining as they tentatively begin to realise the other feels the same.

Being Dean Winchester by Anonymous 26k rating E

Set early s4, Cas has to possess Dean temporarily. While doing this, he has to work to hide his feelings from Dean. Cas is already obsessed with Dean and in love with him but is embarrassed by it and struggles to keep Dean from seeing all of this, especially when Dean wants to have sex with someone while Cas is possessing him.

Après by imogenbynight 24k rating E

Set after the angels fall in s8. Cas falls to earth in Paris and realises he's in love with Dean. Dean comes to get him and they find love together in Paris.

desiderium, lost by atlasian 20k rating T

Castiel confesses his love for Dean and Dean tells him to move on. Cas tries, fairly unsuccessfully, before Dean gets it together.

No Other Worthy Quest by MajorEnglishEsquire 15k rating E

Cas just loves Dean very much.

'“For fuck's sake,” his skin is heating. Cas can feel it. “Stop saying lovey-dovey shit.”

“I know,” Cas rolls his eyes. “It’s so mortifying for you when I want to tell you I love you. I’m using all my self-restraint, I promise not to embarrass you.”'

The Arrow by jscribbles 12k rating T

Valentine's day and Cas has been hit by a Cupid's arrow and is literally sick with love for Dean.

and all this devotion by dothraki_shieldmaiden 10k rating M

Dean gets hurt on a hunt and Cas takes care of him in a cabin. Very sweet, delightful Cas POV of him being very much in love.

Cuckoo And Nest by komodobits 10k rating E

Cas struggles to work out why Dean deems some things meaningful and some things worthless, and where he fits into this apparent dichotomy. Really gorgeous and agonising Cas POV that deals with their constant issue of Dean just wanting Cas to stay and Cas wanting Dean to want him to stay but they're both too afraid to express it.

Breathe by turningthepages 9k rating G

Dean and Cas platonically sleep together to help with Dean's sleep. Cas both likes the situation and longs for it to mean more.

First Date by aeli_kindara 9k rating T

Dean asks Cas on a date and they're both trying very hard to make it all work. The sequel is stunning too.

'Dean says, “We should do that. Go on a date.”

Something in Castiel’s chest fuzzes, like static on a TV, and stops.'

weights on my ankles by dothraki_shieldmaiden 9k rating M

After 15x3 The Rupture, Cas goes back to Rexford. While there, he thinks about how Dean hurt him all those years ago and how he hurt him more recently. Partly a 9x6 Heaven Can Wait fanfic-gap fic.

Let it Linger by OmniscientOranges 8k rating M

Cas starts sleeping with men out of jealousy when watching Dean pick up women at bars. The way the fic describes how in love he is and how hopeless he feels about it is both agonising and very sweet.

He Thought He Was Reckless by MajorEnglishEsquire 8k rating M

Cas plays up injuries so that Dean will coddle him. Self-woobification from the Angel of the Lord and it's so sweet!

Something to Protect by Sass_Master 6k rating G

Cas tries to work out how to make Dean feel less unsafe so that he no longer has to jolt awake. Sweet, tentative intimacy and Cas enjoying it so much.

lonely hearts. by outpastthemoat 5k rating G

Deals with Cas accompanying Sam and Dean on hunts and feeling incredibly lonely and longing to be with Dean. He finds solace in romance novels.

Some People Would Call This Romantic by almaasi 5k rating G

Human Cas goes to the beach and finds it rather overwhelming. Taking a romantic walk with Dean along the beach is also overwhelming.

The Tea is Decaf by mnwood 4k rating T

Really sweet! Cas and Eileen talk and gossip about Sam and Dean in the bunker at night over tea.

A Place to Rest by Inessencedivided 3k rating G

Dean and Cas talk through things after the Stuck in the Middle with You love confession. Cas cries some more.

White Noise by domesticadventures 2k rating G

Cas struggles with feelings of worthlessness in the aftermath of Lucifer's possession.

Receipts by surlybobbies 1k rating G

Cas writes little notes about how much he loves Dean on receipts from meals they share together. Dean finds them.

[naruhearts]

I’m done keeping my composure.

Sorry, this will be a LOADED post! (And I’ll be repeating the points others have made)

for real, to everyone being nasty and telling heartbroken fans that “Dean was always supposed to die get a grip you’re just butthurt etcetera etcetera—” F you royally.

How dare you police the brutal feelings that’s been embroiling us since the Finale That Must Not Be Named aired. 

The show you think you all watched, the show you all believe was the same SPN from Season 1-4, changed at some point. Kripke wrote his original vision, put it to screen, saw it through in S5 as he intended, and closed the door on that era.

In 2008, Supernatural was adopted and inherited. As you know, there was a supreme paradigm shift post-Kripke era. The show FLOURISHED (we won’t talk about Gamble thanks). It evolved, transformed, grew beyond trauma-induced self-worthlessness and toxic masculinity and endless death and hegemonic social ideals and conservatism and repressive anti-revolutionary ideas. Castiel, the iconic favourite and beloved staple of the series portrayed by Misha Collins, was introduced in Season 4 as the core lead character, and he ushered in a brand new era of Christian mythos that SPN took advantage of. Longevity SKYROCKETED. Audiences were INTERESTED. SPN amassed an incredibly groundbreaking fanbase infused by non-nuclear principles. A massive subversive wave began, fighting the Status Quo of the times since 2008. It’s precisely why such an abysmal ending to a show of extensive Freud-Jungian metanarratively meta META complex stature and social POWER will render us totally and unbearably broken for years to come.

Point is, DEAN WINCHESTER NO LONGER WANTED TO DIE. HE WANTED TO LIVE. HE WANTED TO SIT ON THE BEACH, PLUNGE HIS TOES IN THE SAND, AND SIP UMBRELLA DRINKS WITH HIS BROTHER AND HIS BEST FRIEND. He said this in Season 13. And then, a season later, he told the ghost of his long-deceased father — the source of his deep-running trauma and the figure of self-reductive authoritarianism permeating his arc since Season 1 — after being questioned why he didn’t pursue the Nuclear Fam, that he already has his own: his brother Sam, his adopted child Jack, and Cas.

Dean’s best friend Cas. Oh god, Cas, who made his inevitably permanent mark on Dean’s soul beyond allyship. Castiel, renamed to Cas, God’s -iel removed by Dean. Dean, the human spark that lit the fire of pre-existing autonomy in the inherently rebellious angel who was, this entire time, the catalyst for free will in God The Writer’s puppet show. Their friendship set on goddamn fire. I can also write paragraph upon paragraph about my love for Cas while devastated tears stream down my face, but I digress—

Cas’ romantic love for Dean pushed our main Heart of SPN to love himself. Love is free will. Free will is also love. Of note, Cas’ love confession in 15x18 was supposed to offset something so vastly important and fundamental...to maybe (read: most likely) pull the trigger on SELF-TRUTHS in conjunction with free will. And The Great Anticipated Follow-Up to the episode penned by the passionate Berens should have included (read: seemed like it was going to be) Dean, closeted trauma survivor in love with his best friend, being given the opportunity to do it right: to SPEAK HIS TRUTH, and then that very singular opportunity was STOLEN so grossly. After poring over it for days, I refuse to believe we made their years-long story up out of thin air, spun it out of fantastical-delusional dream cotton candy, because we DIDN’T. IT WAS REAL.

As I said in another post: “I’ve just been feeling physically ill for the past >40 something hours with the terrible knowledge that 19/20 undid years of vital progression towards healthy interdependence, autonomy, and a positive endgame, where Sam, Dean and Cas close the ring of found family in final empowering self-fulfillment...where Dean, no longer repressed and set free, is able to use his words and speak his truth as a queercoded trauma survivor, henceforth confirming and self-affirming his own bisexuality since S1 by reciprocating — by telling Cas that he always loved him, too, loved him endlessly, which would have altogether divested Supernatural of its cult status and catapulted it into global worldwide significance as the longest running sci-fi genre show in American broadcasting history that actually dared to defy and, by proxy, empower LGBTQ2IA+ everywhere who found profound personal meaning in Destiel through VALIDATION,” — found themselves mirrored in Dean and Cas’ respective character journeys individually and as each other’s queer love interests.

THIS IS WHY DEAN WASN’T MEANT TO DIE.

THEY WERE SO ESSENTIAL, NOT JUST TO THE OVERARCHING STORY AND HEALTHY INTERPERSONAL THEMATICS OF MODERN SPN, BUT ALSO TO THE SOULS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE ACROSS THE WORLD WHO FOLLOWED THEIR JOURNEYS, HOPED FOR THEM, ASPIRED TO BE LIKE THEM, TREASURED THEM, WEEPED FOR THEM, AND FOUGHT FOR THEM, LIKE YOU AND ME.

Heck, how could anyone think Sam Winchester had a well-deserved characteristic ending? He didn’t. Dean’s brother was shafted so badly. He stopped hunting when seasons ago, he had canonically accepted that he no longer wanted an apple pie life. He simply...turned the lights off in a resoundingly empty bunker and left — abandoning his dead brother’s room — never to return (he did return later to get the Impala, family photos etc, I mean this symbolically)...as if — dare I say it — Supernatural itself eerily told us, in the negative-spaced pitch blackness, that the organic show and the wonderfully complex, matured characters we’ve grown to love weren’t going to survive or be revisited...that it was all going to perish, and that they no longer gave a single shit about their own show, which, to me, is the worst cardinal sin, because how dare they throw Team Free Will, an immovable and indomitable and passionate found family they built from the ground up, a found family CHOCK FULL TO THE BRIM OF LOVE AND LIFE RAGING AGAINST THE AUTHORITARIAN MACHINE IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE FREE WILL, under the bus no matter who is to blame. Growth was stomped on.

Then Sam married a faceless wife who wasn’t his textually established (and deaf) love interest Eileen, named his son Dean Jr., and grew old miserably, still mourning the passing of his older brother, shaken and sombre. Back to square one. IT WAS ALL ANTITHETICAL, even OUTSIDE a shipping context, and I ripped my hair out at this point in sheer disbelief.

This 15x20 ending would have fit somewhere between S4-7. Now? IT DOESN’T FIT. IT’S A JAGGED PUZZLE PIECE THAT DOESN’T BELONG ANYWHERE. IT’S THE FOREBODING UNKNOWN STRANGER IN ITS OWN LAND, BOTH LITERALLY AND FIGURATIVELY. This kind of ending was basically an illogical, unsound cluster of metastasized cells that, to me, ruined the viability of previous seasons to sustain bold praise and respect and dignity and rewatches and classic nostalgia in such insidious ways.

Dean Humanity Winchester and Cas, after everything they’ve been through, were silenced and lost in death, ripped apart from each other, unable to love each other the way they deserved, because of disappointing, vile incompetency and homophobia. The greatest love story ever told, again obliterated in less than 60 hollow minutes.

You know what this tells your audience, CW SPN? Death without self-growth is the way to go, and no one is allowed to forge their own path to freedom.

HOW INSULTINGLY HARMFUL IS THAT?

I don’t think I’ll ever stop grieving.

We all deserve answers.

[wigglebox]

Okay this might be long but I gotta. I gotta talk to someone who actually LIKES the prequel. Millie Winchester, in the trailer, says a line to John "you go down this road" and then it cuts to her saying another line, "maybe when you have kids of your own you'll understand" and I'm. I'M THINKING.

Like, Sam and John, Sam and Dean, there was a whole thing in s1 and s4, "you walk out that door don't you ever come back". Millie already lost Henry to the life, because of the Men of Letters, the trailer implied that John's plot will be focusing on his connection to the life through them, as a Legacy. Maybe Millie tells him something along the lines of "you go down this road, John, and I won't be able to support you" like not disowning, but distancing. I don't want my only son to get hurt, but I also don't want to lock him up when he will do whatever he can to still look for it.

In 4.03 it's implied she got remarried, that's a year after the pilot. We don't know exactly what they're gonna do with 4.03 yet, but assuming they're gonna start s2 like, after it happens, Millie is probably remarried. What if an episode in s1 has John rescuing her new husband after he gets possessed and he and Millie make up? At first he dislikes the new husband but then rescues him and they grow close enough that in 4.03 he's affectionately nicknamed his "old man" (or not, could hate his guts).

I'm just going "they put Millie Winchester here WHAT CAN THEY DO WITH HER"

HOIII

yes i do like the prequel a lot and i can't wait for it!

oh i. love all the potential storylines you said but my brain especially bzzted at the 'if you walk out that door' because we know that john thought henry just walked out on him and i imagine he's going to end this series still thinking that or something bc idk how they're going to tell this story to us lol

but john saying that to sam, when at the time we're supposed to believe john doesn't know henry died in the future not that he didn't walk out on john, i think john saying that probably came from a sense of 'family doesn't turn their back on family' because he was cut up from his father supposedly leaving his mother high and dry in an era that did not look down kindly on single mothers.

of course obviously this isn't ignoring the things that john had done to push sam to leave

but you get my point

i do wonder 1) what's going to happen to millie and 2) if indeed she gets remarried.

it would be interested if the new guy would get possessed and ooo i love your speculation!

[chiisana-sukima]

I think there's a compelling policy reason for running with Sam's report that his 2-3 minute seizure = approx one week in the Cage, even though that makes the time dilation in the Cage so ridiculously huge it's hard to take seriously. The reason is: regardless of what Kripke's writers' room may or may not have originally been doing thematically with the Hell storylines; once Sera was in charge, Sam's Hell storyline was primarily about rape. And thanks in large part to Buckleming's weird crush on Mark P (God bless their bizarre-ass little hearts), and Jared's refusal to not take his character's history seriously, spn--king of implying everything and then forgetting it all 2 seconds later--never went back on that. Right through to Lucifer's demise and after, his and Sam and Jack's relationship continued to be framed as essentially one of spousal abuse and sexual violence.

Before s11, samifer shippers used to argue that just because Hallucifer said he had raped (and/or tortured) Sam, there was no reason to believe that was accurate. Sam was, after all, severely mentally ill, Hallucifer was just a hallucination, he was nothing like the og Lucifer we knew from previous episodes, and Sam could be remembering it wrong due to trauma. In the end ofc it turned out that Sam was remembering it exactly right. s11-13's real Lucifer acted exactly like hallucifer and even repeated the same sexual threats.

I 100% get that the samifer rape apology isn't remotely similar to your question here, but I think the same reasoning does apply: it's better policy to believe that a victim's account of their rape is essentially accurate than to not. This same reasoning applies to Dean's presumed rape by Alastair as well. We believe Dean when he says time passes differently in Hell, and there's no reason not to believe Sam when he makes the same claim. I do think the situation is complicated by the later Hell trips that don't include time dilation, but there's no reason for the s6 writers to have had Sam bring time dilation up if we weren't supposed to take it as a whumptastic approximately accurate account of part of his experience, just like there was no reason for Dean to bring it up in s4 if we weren't supposed to believe him.

Does the show ever actual say how long Sam’s soul was in Lucifer’s cage in relative time? Because I know they specifically said for Dean that it was like 40 years, but at no other time do any of the characters that go to Hell experience time dilation/distortion so it seems just as likely that Dean’s time was messed with to hasten him breaking to jump start the apocalypse. But I’m wondering if I’ve just forgotten a reference or if we’ve all just assumed that Sam’s time down there was longer than the year or so that his soul wasn’t in his body.