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wendibird · 4 years ago

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SPN 15X14 Observations

So, for whatever dumbass reason, when trying to use my actual television, the cable refuses to work properly 8 times out of 10. BUT I was able to stream tonight’s episode on my computer with my cable network’s app. So, there’s that. Because of that, and since it’s easier for me to type on my keyboard than on my phone, I actually took quick notes and observations during commercial breaks. Here are those, then some more of my thoughts following. (And I’m sorry if any of these seem a bit incoherent. They were more my observations to myself. *LOL*

(everything else under the keep reading line since I got a bit rambly, and just in case anyone wants to avoid spoilers)

- Brothers being written a bit like characters of themselves rather than just themselves. (trying too hard?)

- Love Mrs. Butters. Actress really good. And the minor ret-con works with what we've seen.

- Sam more concerned about Jack. I think he understands him better, even though he hasn't seen much of him.

- "Ignoring your trauma doesn't make you healthy." (or something like that.) Good quote!

- Waiting for the catch.

- "Enjoy the world you're fighting for." (compare with Kevin's similar line: "I can't enjoy a world I need to save.")

- Mrs. Butters knows Jack isn't human.

- BOY did the shoe drop! But it was Sinclaire involved. Not surprised he took advantage of her natural protective nature.

- Wanted more plot for WHY exactly they still have Thor's Hammer. Have they had it this whole time? Last we saw Sam dropped it in 8X2. Or did Mrs. Butters conjure it up because they might need it? Was cool though that Sam was using it. Because we already know he can.

- Jack figured out on his own how to use the projector. (love that boy!)

- liked hearing him talk about what happened with Mary and how he feels.

- Mrs. Butters knows from experience about needing "second chances" I think.

- Why were they ALWAYS wearing the same clothes during the "We got one!" montages? Assuming it was supposed to have taken place over several days at least if not longer. (I highly doubt they went out on THAT many hunts in one day.)

- Yeeeah... So I get she's protective, but JACK IS BABY! She can clearly see his power levels but she has to have seen how he he actually IS? But she gave him the smoothies from the start, so she's been planning it from almost the start. Hrm.

- idk what anyone else says, I'm thrilled that Sam and Eileen had a date. Also, THIS is where that sweater-vest comes from. Bet we'll see him going for his gun too. (That clip was hotly debated in one of the discord servers I’m on)

- Dean is obviously still having some issues with Jack, but he also seems to know that they're his personal issues and he knows that Jack is good. (Expanding on this thought post episode, I was seeing this as Dean recognizing the difference between what he knows and what he’s feeling. So, yey! Personal growth!)

- DEAN JACK IS NOT A BATTERING RAM!!!

- Dean sees Jack as a weapon. He used him as a battering ram. He'll use him as a grenade to throw at Chuck. (More on this after the notes.)

- Sam sees him as a person. His argument was that Jack was someone he cared about. That killing him would HURT him.

- Also, did they HAVE to go for the fingernails again?!

- Poor Sam, getting tortured. And being the "favorite" of something bad.

- Also, SAM WAS RIGHT! To be cautious of her at first. Too many times he's had things/people seem good and turn out opposite.

- And because Dean had decided it was all okay, they both stopped looking up on her.

- Maybe Sam will realize that he doesn't always have to follow Dean's lead. He can pursue his own paths. (Not talking about them separating. Just, if he wants to look into something, he should do it. If he wants to follow a different lead, he should check it out.)

- I know he lost a lot of confidence last season but I hope he realizes that he doesn't by default make bad decisions.

- Okay, that was a good resolution. I'm glad she's going back to her people.

- Interdimensional geoscope: Dean saw nothing. Because ALL the other universes are gone. *sad-face*

- Love Sam and Jack. Wish we got a bit more. But it was something.

- Also love that Dean tried. That felt real to me. (the birthday cake)

More thoughts!

So. Overall I liked this episode. It was lighthearted mostly, but touched on some serious topics and wasn’t completely disconnected with what is going on with everyone, despite the random holiday montage. *LOL* (Yes, I know she wasn’t bending time or anything, she was just choosing to celebrate some holidays with her boys regardless of when this is all taking place exactly.) It did feel a bit to me, at the start anyway, like the writing at least was trying too hard to “Sound like Sam and Dean” instead of just them being them. I mentioned that at the start but what I mean is, in this season especially (but not exclusively) I’ve noticed a lot of times where it feels to me like the writing/directing/whatever leads to the sum total of what we see is trying too hard to present this idea of who the characters are, like caricatures of them. The things associated with them get emphasized, sometimes out of proportion. Though in this episode, it only felt like that during the opening scene and maybe a few places elsewhere. Overall I thought the writing and especially the acting on the parts of the main 3 guys and the guest actor were well done and had a lot of nuance when needed. Like, as an example, when Sam and Dean sussed out that this being that they didn’t even know was a bit behind the times, they were actually pretty gentle with bringing her up to speed. And her reaction to realizing that everyone she knew before was dead felt very real.

I liked what we saw of where each of the characters were emotionally this episode. It was the first one after Jack has been re-souled and it had definitely been weighing on my mind how everyone was doing. (Though I REALLY wish we could have actually seen Sam and Dean’s reactions to Jack tearfully begging their forgiveness last episode. But lacking any other input, I’m headcannoning that Sam gave him a very long, warm hug.)

I also agree with Sam, I think there’s something more that Jack hasn’t told them yet, probably some details about Billy’s plan that he or her are sure the brothers won’t like. (Now, what exactly that could be is very much up in the air. I can think of quite a few options, but the details aren’t really important to me just now. Just the fact that something about it is weighing on Jack. More than just Mary’s death and the prospect of having to kill God. Which, in and of themselves would be more than enough.)

Speaking of Sam, I liked that we saw all those little nods to how he feels about Jack, how he’s still worried about him, and seems to understand him.

I also get where Dean’s coming from. And I thought it was well-portrayed. And let me just say, I am GLAD that he just outright told Jack where he was at. He didn’t sugarcoat it, but he also didn’t blow up at him, or reply with sarcasm or bring up other, unrelated stuff. Dean knows that Jack is trying, but he himself has some emotional stuff he needs to deal with. That he is dealing with. And it’s going to take him some time.

I do however stand by my observation made during the episode that at least at that point in it, Dean considered Jack a weapon. An asset. He literally used him as a battering ram, and in a more meta way, he’s planning on using him as a grenade to throw at God. Even when arguing with Mrs. B about it, his response was in reference to Jack’s usefulness. Whereas Sam was arguing that Jack meant something to him, that he cared about him, and hurting Jack would hurt him. Now, I do think that Dean’s POV had shifted a bit by the very end. Dean’s love language has almost always been shown by doing things for people, and taking care of them. So him making that birthday cake for Jack really felt to me like him trying to tell him that he does actually care about him. And I think Jack got it. And true, the cake might not have been as neat and pretty as Mrs. B would have made it, but I thought it was beautiful because of all the thought that went into it. (Dean’s more of a cook than a baker too.)

As a side note, something I thought about after the episode: when Mrs. B stepped in, she kind of took over that care-taker role. AND the research role. She made them lunches, cooked them dinners, decorated for holidays, and overall made them feel comfortable and safe. And she also pin-pointed where monsters were and made sure they were all stocked-up and ready to go. All they had to do was show up and get it done. And yeah, it must have been a nice break from the norm. But I also think about how much Dean finds his identity beyond hunting in taking care of people. And how much Sam finds his identity in researching and figuring things out. And with her doing that, they both took it easy on those ends. Dean didn’t have to make burgers for everyone since Mrs. B made a roast. Sam didn’t have to research since she could tell them where the monsters were and what kind. I almost wonder if both of them were starting to feel like those parts of themselves were all of a sudden unnecessary. (Which makes me a little sad, because it reminds me a bit of the “two cakes” concept in fandom. Who cares if someone else can “do it better”? If you do it, then there’ll be even more of the good thing!) And as I observed above, Sam also stopped looking into HER. I mean, he didn’t even know what would kill a wood nymph. And I do think part of that also goes back to him having recently fallen back on letting Dean make the big decisions. Because last season so many of his blew up in his face. (Though I don’t think most of that was his fault. But Sam tends to blame himself for a lot.) And I do hope that maybe he’ll remember that he does have good instincts when he listens to them. And he can keep looking into something even if Dean thinks it’s fine. It’s not a betrayal to be prepared.

ALSO! Being the absolute Saileen hoe that I am, even though we didn’t Eileen in this episode, I was thrilled that Sam went out on a date with her because she was in town! And true, we don’t know what all went down, but regardless, I see it as good that they’re at the very least still friends, and that hopefully Eileen is sorting out her own feelings vs whatever she might think could be Chuck’s manipulations. Even if Saileen isn’t Engame (and honestly, as much as I love it, I don’t think it will be) I would still like for them to be on good terms with each other. (And for her to NOT get fridged again!)

Another thing I was pondering afterwards and a bit during: I wasn’t surprised that Sam held up to the torture fairly well. I mean, it still obviously hurt! (And again, WHY with the fingernails again?! As someone in one of my discord servers mentioned, we didn’t need THAT particular call-back to the Christmas Episode of Season 3!) But he was listening to what she was saying. And he understood the implications that she had been tortured into acting how they wanted her to act. And Sam understands torture, and how it can mess someone up. And despite what she had done to him, and was trying to still do, he validated what she had been through. He empathized with her. And that.... it’s just SO Sam!

I will say that the resolution felt a little... abrupt. Like, her expression had changed a little during the fight/argument. Then back from the commercial break and she’s all packed-up and ready to leave and they’re all saying goodbye and wishing her well. I feel like there might have been some more scenes or parts of scenes that were originally there connecting things up more, but were cut for time.

I wouldn’t say this was a groundbreaking episode, but it WAS fun, and it did have some seriousness at it’s core, and I think it did what it needed to do.

(And I apologize if this is just a big rambling mess. I’m not used to doing structured episode reviews. *LOL* Feedback and opinions are welcome though!)

#spn 15x14 spoilers #spn season 15 spoilers #episode review #my thoughts #ignoring your trauma doesn't make you healthy #sam winchester #dean winchester #jack kline #mrs butters #i still need more sam and jack

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spnfanficpond · 5 years ago

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June 2020 Angel Fish Awards

(New Angel Fish design by @slytherkins!!)

Every month all of you fantastic writers work your asses off to post some truly incredible stories. Our Angel Fish Awards are the way for all of us, as a community of writers and readers, to lift each other up and give praise to those who have captured our attention and deserve a few kind words.

The monthly Angel Fish Awards are peer-nominated, meaning ANYONE IN THE POND CAN NOMINATE ANY POND MEMBER’S FIC. While the Pond was founded to support the Guppies, everyone in this community deserves to be showered with love and feedback, and we hope that by opening this up as a Pond wide system, we’ll be able to share the love as far as it can go.

NOTE: WE’VE BEEN HAVING OCCASIONAL PROBLEMS WITH ASKS GOING MISSING. Please use the Submit button when submitting your nominations and make sure you’re signed into Tumblr or your URL won’t show. (If the form asks for your name and email address, then you’re not signed in.) If you like, you can also send a message to Michelle @mrswhozeewhatsis or Mana @manawhaat to check and make sure we got your submission.

Be sure to read through this whole post as people who were nominated more than once only had one tag activated for tumblr tagging purposes!

WITHOUT FURTHER ADO, HERE ARE JUNE’S ANGEL FISH AWARDS!

Nonimated by @thegirlwhorunswithwinchesters

I Thought You Were Going To Die (oneshot) by @fun-and-fandoms

My nominations for the month wouldn’t be complete without a little bit of angst. Though this one isn’t just that. If you’re easily triggered by mentions of depression and its symptoms, this one’s not for you. But it’s an important topic and I will always encourage any creator who uses their art to remind people it’s okay to talk about it. (Note from Kale, this was actually submitted in May but I missed it.)

More to Me (oneshot) by @becs-bunker

No spoilers, but I’m so glad this ended the way it did. So sweet <3

Help (oneshot) by @blushingjared

I came across this fic and was immediately intrigued. Then I started reading and I was captivated from the first sentence until the very last. The author did such a good job with setting the scene and painting the right picture.

Talking Bodies (oneshot) by @ne-gans

This AU-Sam is such a huge weakness of mine. That, in combination with this dangerously filthy masterpiece, is nothing short of perfection.

Nominated by @focusonspn

Into The Woods (series) by @amanda-teaches

So well written, interesting plot and great development. The chemistry between Y/N and Dean is also amazing, and I loved how this mini-series could be so easily part of the show. Totally worth reading.

Nominated by @thoughtslikeamindfield

Stranger Than FanFiction (series) by @cherry3point14

The premise is similar to the film Stranger Than Fiction – a story about a story being written about you – and it’s just as hilarious. Also, Cherry Pie is still one of the funniest writers in this corner of SPN fandom.

“You’re not supposed to move your head if there’s someone trying to murder you, probably…”

No, I wouldn’t think so, but lollllll

“You’re being insane, out loud.”

Omgggg

“It tried, oh, how the door tried to divert her attention from the unknown men who could be terrible, rule-breaking influences on her. However the door was only wood and she was a stubborn woman made of free will and limbs—a woman who refused to be deceived.”

“Your hand is on the doorknob before the mention of your limbs has finished rattling around your head. Realistically you don’t want to encourage the voice by doing what it says. After all, the voice’s ultimate goal seems to be killing you.”

BAHAHAHAH omfg you guys

I need to stop quoting from this bc I probably seem insane to those of you who haven’t read this, so stop being judgy buttheads and go read!

Nominated by @flamencodiva

The Choice (series) by @superfanficnatural

A couple of things. 1) this is an amazing fic that highlights Dean unwillingness to let himself go until it’s almost too late. and 2) the smut in this is hot hot hot hot! not for anyone under 18 years of age.

Mert has a way with words and can literally pluck you into one and make you see it as it comes to life in your head.

Mine (series) by @holylulusworld

Lulu has an abundance of different stories she tells and this one is my favorite of her ABO’s at the moment. (although I love all of them) I think this one deserved a mention. I am glad she joined to Pond so I could help nominate and spread her amazing work!

One Night at a Time (series) by @crashdevlin

Another great fic by Cassie! This one shot full of Angst, Smut, and if you squint just the right amount of Dean fluff. She has a way of capturing your attention and putting you in the world as you read.

What He Lost (oneshot) by @jensengirl83

This short story by Brandy is sure to rip your heart out. she leaves just a bit of hope where you think there is a chance only to crush it completely with the ending. This one is sure to bring you to tears if you are looking for the most delicious angsty story to read.

Nominated by @risingpheonix761

Down The Rabbit Hole (oneshot) by @dontshootmespence

So, this was hysterical. XD I love crack fics, and bad smut in particular, and this one hits the spot. (I’ve also learned several new horrible euphemisms lol). The ending, though? Golden!

Nominated by @myinconnelly1

The Affair (oneshot) by @holylulusworld

I love how well all the characters are portrayed I truly hate everyone except the reader! Well done!!

Red Riding Hood - or how you ran into a wolf... (oneshot) by @holylulusworld

I have nothing to say about this. I will simply allow the puddle I have become to speak for me.

Last Omega On Earth (oneshot) by @holylulusworld

This was a great entry in the ABO world. and we need more of this and more like !!!!! Great work!

My Beta (oneshot) by @holylulusworld

I am a greedy little bitch with this fic. I think I've read it 3-4 since i first read it this month!!!!!! READ THIS FIC!

Third Period (oneshot) by @fictionalabyss

Some truly inspiring smut. Inspiring to change my panties.

Gods of Twilight (series) by @thecleverdame

I think i posted this fic in my rec before, but it is so amazing and intricate that i can't stop gushing about it. Fucking awesome.

Apple Pie (oneshot) by @bad268

The amazingness of this is great, check this guppy out!

Deal (oneshot) by @bad268

Comedy at some of its's finest!!!

Confession (oneshot) by @idreamofplaid

THE FLUFFFFFFF!!!! I don't read straight fluff. So get the tissues ready.

Fallen (series) by idreamofplaid

My therapist has told me i'm not longer allowed to talk about this fic during our sessions. So instead i shall now talk about it here... *pulls out soapbox* ahem... *gets pulled away with hook*

Memory (oneshot) by @idreamofplaid

This fic is older, but i love it so much. I recently went back and reread it, and the angst and reconciliation in this fic are heartwrenching.

Home (oneshot) by @emilyshurley

My dentist bill the month was higher than normal, due to the new cavities caused by this fic.

Imperfectly Yours (oneshot) by @emilyshurley

Cuteness overload as you get Dean's perspective of Home ^^

Second Hand News (oneshot) by @emilyshurley

Alright listen. I am a glutton for punishment. And this fic, I asked for. Also i had it set within one of the universes we now own. That all being said, reading this was like a dose of my own medicine and it fucking hurt.

Honesty And Lies (oneshot) by @crashdevlin

This was super dirty, and great. Totally recommend.

Nominated by @deanwinchesterswitch

The Classifieds (oneshot) by @talesmaniac89

This is rip your heart out and stomp on it angst right here. So well written, but so, so heartbreaking.

So Much More Than Perfect (oneshot) by @imagineteamfreewill

This fic is one of the sweetest things I’ve ever read. It made me tear up a bit, but who doesn’t love Dean being the most protective, most adorable dad ever?!

Nominated by @mariekoukie6661

Dear Dean (series) by @smol-and-grumpy

It’s one of those series that makes you wants more after every chapter. It’s a brilliant story.

Left Behind (series) by @kittenofdoomage

It’s the only John Fic I can read over and over and over again. Its hot, the plot is awesome! And it makes me wants more each and every time I read it.

Not Much Left (oneshot) by @impala-dreamer

I think Beka tries to kill her readers every time she writes smut… or she just tap into our mind what we want or what we fantasize about. Every single time I’m speechless by her talents!

Yes Professor (oneshot) by @impala-dreamer

It’s a Misha fic, there’s no one who write Misha the way Beka does!!!

Owe You One (series) by @supernatural-jackles

It’s such a great series! The friends with Benefit and Mechanic!Dean… I just love this so much and I don’t have words to describe how good this one is!!

Flirty In French (oneshot) by @fictionalabyss

This is brilliant, and I know its an old one, but from someone who finally decided to read more and from someone who is from Quebec, this is absolutely brilliant! The flirty french pick up line are so hilarious!

Nominated by @moosekateer13

Watching for Comets (series) by @holylulusworld

This fic beautifully captures the song that it was inspired by.

It also showcases things that when things are meant to be.

I’ll will all fall into place.

Please Trust Me (oneshot) by @holylulusworld

This fic beautifully emotionally captures what it’s like to have trust issues.

Nominated by @fictionalabyss

Last Call (oneshot) by @impala-dreamer

It was everything we needed and wanted.

Culinary Exploits (oneshot) by @impala-dreamer

Too utterly ridiculous not to get a mention.

His Omega (oneshot) by @iflostreturntosteverogers

A sweet little comfort fic of Dean being utterly perfect caring for his Omega. Carrie also pulled off keeping this gender neutral, which isn’t something I see a lot of, and probably something I’d struggle with, so hats off to you, babe.

Poison (oneshot) by @supernatural-jackles

YES omg i feel this on such a level. I’ve gone through that shit myself. A friend who lets you down so profoundly but then acts as if you’re the most toxic person in the world. Nothing feels as good as letting go of that shit and moving on to better things. This was beautiful, and perfect, and TRUTH.

Amara (oneshot) by @impala-dreamer

This one hurt. It really hurt, but it hurt so good that I’m left wanting more.

Take Me Now (oneshot) by @sorenmarie87

If Dawn doesn’t continue this, I’ll riot.

Stuck On You (oneshot) by @kittenofdoomage

I rarely read a fic this long (I just don’t usually have the time) but it looked too interesting for me to scroll past, and it had me completely captivated. I needed to know what would happen as if I needed air, even though I could guess how it ended, I needed to read the words. Phenomenal.

Thank you all for the awesome work and great feedback!

These are not actual awards! This system is set up so everyone in the pond has a chance to share the love and promote a fic/author that has grabbed your attention. The more people that participate, and the more everyone remembers to submit their own fics after posting, the better this will be :D

THANK YOU ALL AGAIN, KEEP UP THE AMAZING WORK, AND AS ALWAYS, HAPPY WRITING!

#afa masterlist #afa awards #angel fish awards #spn fic rec #spn fanfic #afas #fan fiction #fanfiction #fan fic #spn fan fiction #spn fanfiction #spn fan fic #supernatural fan fiction #supernatural fan fic #supernatural fanfiction #supernatural fanfic #fic rec #supernatural fic rec

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tommykinkard · 4 years ago

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Yo, you good after that spn finale or...? Cause like, that shit was wack.

(fair warning this absolutely became SUPER long so buckle up my dudes here’s a rant from someone who finally came back to this show after years (i kept up with it over the years and always wanted to go back but didn’t until the end) and is super pissed. also shout out to all of those who stuck through. y’all the real heroes. anyways, here we go)

THE ABSOLUTE WACKEST

so wacked that when it went to commercial break after Dean died I literally laughed. bc it was SO UPSURD. dean was literally like:

when Sam could’ve just called the ambulance? Like I get it, there’s decapitated bodies on the ground, they’d be suspicious. but like Sam could’ve quickly hid or burnt them as they waited for the ambulance while Dean still could’ve said his goodbye. and like, even if Dean didn’t want Sam to and just him die, he said that there was no time and that he was fading and yet they just? kept talking? and yes i cried bc jensen’s and jared’s acting were beautiful and all. but like? OF ALL OF THE WAYS DEAN HAD DIED IN THE PAST AND COULD’VE STILL IN THE FINALE?? THIS IS HOW HE DIES?? BY A RANDOM GOON FROM A RIDICLOUS MONSTER OF THE WEEK LET ALONE FINAL ‘VILLIAN’ WHO JUST LIKE...ACCIDENTALLY SHOVED HIM AGAINST A HOOK/POLE/WHATEVER THE HELL THAT STUPID THING WAS. LIKE DEAN FREAKING WINCHESTER?? i feel like they were trying to go with a ‘mundane’ ending bc this entire episode was them going back to like s1 without connecting to any plot and just them being two hunters again. (i’ll get to all of that in a sec) but like 1) going the mundane route is a terrible way for him to go unless it was executed extremely well which it was the opposite of. and 2) it was so incredibly anticlimactic and just an entire spit in the face of his character development.

and you know what? even if they still kept his death like that and pretty much else the same, I’d be okay with the ending if they changed just two things 1) brought freaking Cas (and Jack) back since he apparently helped jack create this perfect heaven for dean and everyone else, (i mean bobby literally said that this was the Heaven that he deserved. you cannot convince me that Cas didn’t explain all of this to Bobby and said those exact words that this was the Heaven that Dean deserves). And 2) at least brought the dead characters back when Dean was in Heaven. Instead Dean was like “I could see my dead parents but I’m just going to take a long drive in Baby whichcasmadeformebcheknowsmesowellandlovesmesomuchandwantsmetohavetheperfectheavenbutimnotgonnaackloweledgeanyofit and drive until Sam dies and then I’ll say hi to everyone I lost and been away from a lot longer than I’ve been away from Sam”. Like how beautiful would it have been if we saw Mary and John like we did in the 300th episode? And everyone else they had lost over the years? Like, I know that montage at the end of 15x19 was supposed to be the final ‘honor’ of all of the characters, but this is the finale. And as much as they kept on trying to say that this show was always just about Sam and Dean, it evolved into Sam and Dean and people they’ve cared about over the years. They were important too! Especially Cas. The show literally became Sam, Dean & Cas but he’s just gonna be mentioned twice...okay. Which brings me back to my 1st point. THEY SHOULD”VE BROUGHT CAS BACK IN HEAVEN. like we got a mention with Dean smiling and Bobby giving him a Knowing™ look but besides that, not only did we not see Cas I’m left with so many more questions. Like how did Cas help make Heaven with Jack? Did Jack bring Cas out of the Empty and just didn’t tell the brothers? Or is Cas still in the empty but helping Jack bc he’s just that damn good? But if he did bring Cas back, how did he help Jack create this new Heaven? Does he have god powers now too?? and yet when Bobby mentions this, Dean smiles (granted it was a cute smile bc to me it felt like a sorta ‘that’s my cas’ smile) not questioning the fact that the last he heard Cas was taken by the Empty to never return again and Dean wanted to honor his sacrifice by living (which don’t even get me started on that) and now he helped create Heaven with Jack. Dean doesn’t even look that much surprised. Which actually makes me think...did Dean know that Jack brought Cas back from the Empty this entire time but had to keep it from Sam bc... ✨reasons✨ and that was why he said that about missing them and having to honor their sacrifice and live, even though all of the other times Cas died he went batshit out of his mind? But not this time, bc Dean actually knew that Jack brought him back. omg was Cas the dog this entire time??? with Cas’ newfound powers did he just like morph into the dog so for some reason Sam couldn’t know bc...you know....✨reasons✨ okay i’m getting delirious here. let’s get back on track. my whole point is, Cas should’ve been there. and even if they wanted more of an ambiguous ending for destiel (which don’t even get me started on THAT) they could’ve at least still had Cas be there to also welcome Dean there along with everyone else. Like, as much as I love Bobby, how more beautiful and fitting wouldn’t it have been if Dean saw Cas there who explained everything there before Dean reunites with all of his loved ones? Cas deserved to be there (and Jack while we’re at it). HE FREAKING HELPED CREATE THIS NEW HEAVEN. He deserved to be there. like tbh I was desperately hoping that he’d at least appear in Baby when Dean started driving. BUT NOPE.

but you know what, back to me wishing we got other important characters in Heaven, if we did I think it would’ve been better if both Sam and Dean died together and reunited with all of them together (which they prob will in canon since Dean ignored them until Sam came back akhsjshjshsjh). like would Eileen be there? which reminds me, speaking of Eileen, WHERE WAS EILEEN?? was she in Heaven this whole time like Bobby was? and who tf was Sam’s rando wife?? UGH. you know how i’d say i’d accept the finale if they just changed it to where Cas (and possibly Jack) was also there along with some of their dead loved ones? i’d prob still be (barely but it would 100% be better than this) but MAN this ENTIRE EP from the beginning was just WACK. like the beginning showing the ‘ordinary life’? i didn’t really mind it that much bc it seemed like that was the natural way to go. but for me personally, I was hoping and wishing that their journey was realizing that it’s not just them anymore and they both end up happy (maybe still hunting) but with their loved one by their sides (especially Cas and Eilleen). but you know, I’m used to not getting what I want and understand that what i want for a story isn’t necessarily the same as the storyteller’s/natural narrative progression. i may hate the the direction and think that it’s a load of crap, but whatever. but this? the entire narrative was OFF. like what even was the point of those weird mime-pires (who btw my sister couldn’t help but compare to clowns 👀.) and not to mention that random lady from like s1? it all felt off but I was hoping it was leading to something. only it lead to Dean’s wack-ass demise. also like, poor freaking Sam. he had to grow old, without his brother and any more family members by his side. which (someone eloquently pointed out) was what s1 Sam wanted but definitely not s15 Sam (not that s1/pre-series Sam wanted his family dead or anything he just wanted to live a normal life and start a family without his family) And we don’t even know who the hell his wife was and how the hell that happened. also, at least he mentioned missing Cas and Jack. but WHAT ABOUT EILEEN??

which brings me to one of my main problems with this whack ass finale (and there are PLENTY more I can talk about) their cohesive narrative between this ep and the rest of s15 and even longer, is just...not there? it’s like they forgot about everything they built just so they can go back to the basics of Sam and Dean. and like, I get it, they’re the heart and soul of the show. they’re supernatural. but like, it also grew more than that? like what was the point of them being parental figures to Jack? what was the point of their 12 season friendship/relationship with Cas? what was the point of all of their connections that they made on the way? and you know what? what was the point of this show lasting so damn long if both of Sam and Dean’s character developments just went ✨poof✨? like as someone who just recently came back to the show, I could just think that this was another early season episode but both of them looking older. (not saying that early seasons were bad. i LOVE early seasons but like as a storyteller and a viewer you want your characters to idk GROW and KEEP that growth).

ANWAYS this became WAY TOO LONG and all over the place and everyone els e is saying all of this too, but I just needed to vent. basically, i’m not doing good from that wack ass finale my friend. sam and dean both deserved to grow old. and Cas deserved to come back (like the show became sam, dean, AND cas, for YEARS like don’t even get me started on THAT bc i could go on and on about how they did him/lgbtq+ community/his fans so dirty) and destiel deserved to be canon dammit (like what was the point of his love confession if they weren’t ever going to mention it? they could’ve still had cas die without that. but since they did it needed WAAAY better resolution dammit) and the finale deserved to have a better freaking cohesive narrative.

Again, so sorry this became such a long ass rant. But I guess I needed to rant. Also, please no one send me hate for this. These are just my thoughts that I needed to get out. Anyways, how are you doing this this whack finale, Nonnie?? And thank you so much for the question!

#kj gets an ask #kj gets a nonnie #is this aj? for some reason i'm thinking that this is aj lol #supernatural #spn spoilers #i'm not sure if i should put this in the tags but whatever #i spent like two hours writing this lol #long post

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dotthings · 5 years ago

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Okay SPN 15.04, here we go, where I feel weirdly self-conscious about posting a meta post about an ep that had so much meta on itself and now I’m going to write meta about it, so it’s meta on meta on meta, while I’m having my feelings.

THAT COLD OPEN HOLY CRAP DIRECTOR JENSEN. As a director Jensen always pulls out warm performances from actors and he’s a really kinetic director too. That opening fight sequence I held my breath for a lot of it.

BENNY OH NOES IT’S BENNY (this must be the character Jensen said was one of his favorites and the actor came back to set for one day to do it). “I’ll see you on the other side, brother.” Thanks so MUCH, spn, I thought I was over this and then you come in and reopen that and now I’ve got feelings gdi. Benny was a good friend to Dean. My heart hurts.

Ohshitohshitohshitohshit demon blood Sam. Noooooo. And he kills Dean. I can never erase these images from my mind, thanks a LOT spn.

Just a nightmare of Sam’s except no probably not given Sam’s god-wound, so wow this maybe happens on one of Chuck’s other worlds, that’s fine, oh that’s okay I’m fiiiiine, it’s fine. *covers face*

So we have a flip on early S14 here where Dean was turtling to cope with his trauma which is a healthy thing to do but hiding from the world wasn’t going to fix anything so Sam coaxes him out with a hunt. Dean coaxes Sam out with a hunt only I don’t think hunting works for Sam the same way, it’s not Sam’s mental comfort food the way it is for Dean, but still I appreciate the mirroring there.

Sam’s struggling with Rowena’s death and I think those horrific AU nightmare visions aren’t helping much either, but it’s clear he’s feeling the loss. Her loss, all the recent losses.

Dean trolls Sam with real bacon, which seems like Dean is maybe trying to cheer Sam up by pranking him and trying to cheer himself up via food pranks. Dean has quite the case of the munchies in this ep.

I noticed almost every scene Dean is snacking or drinking from his flask. How’s that whole “Cas walked out and left apparently for good” working out for you Dean, wow, you’re suspiciously chipper while stuffing your face and drinking and Not Talking About It. Did Sam and Dean talk about where’s Cas? Who knows, the ep didn’t mention it, hey SPN you needed a Cas mention, OH WAIT THE EP IS GOING TO CALL ME OUT FOR SAYING THAT.

Seriously though, this is very Dean MO, and I have thoughts about his mood in this ep and how Cas’s absence was felt, and what it means, I’ll get to that later, but even before the last scene Impala talk, I was thinking Cas is a reminder of pain--and no it’s not all about Dean’s anger at Cas, it’s not because Dean is angry at Cas. Cas is a reminder of some things Dean just isn’t coping with very well and part of the problem is Dean cares so much.

So Dean’s snacking and drinking and Sam is feeling the weight of them knowing all the scary things out there while people go on obliviously with their lives and I’m not sure if Sam is envying them or Sam is feeling some existential angst about the state of the world, how people can go about their lives unaware there are real monsters ready to pounce and tear their lives to shreds. And feeling the weight of the job they do in every bone of his body. Sam’s in a dark headspace.

Ok I admit I was not thrilled to see Becky again given her previous episodes and role. SPN’s later in-canon fan characters were much more nuanced and successful and respectful depictions of fans. But as with many other things, this era of SPN is revisiting some things to move them forward in a different way than before, and subvert some things that needed subverting and Becky has had--wait for it--character development. How about that.

Yes, Becky, run, you do not want anything to do with Chuck. Run, Becky run. I’m rooting for her now. RUNNNN.

Along with finding a more constructive way of channeling her interest in the Winchesters’ lives, and having a satisfying fandom creative life and a full life of her own, Becky has funko pops of Sam, Dean, and Cas. LOL. I see you spn.

Dean, still with the case of the munchies. So this is like the eating a whole pint of ice-cream after a break-up, only Dean does it with junk food while hunting vampires.

I enjoyed this conversation between Becky and Chuck about writing immensely. Becky is actually right. Speaking myself as someone who’s suffered from writers block for a while, it’s miserable, and not writing just perpetuates the cycle. You feel cut off from an important part of yourself. And--oh here we go getting meta within meta--I find writing meta on SPN a positive outlet.

“Writing is writing.” Damn Becky’s takedown of Chuck’s derisiveness about fanfic was sizzling and oh excuse me Chuck, what is it you think you were doing with those Supernatural books about your favorite story. Even though he’s the creator, I know. But still. Also seems to be a sly comment on how male-authored “fanfic” based on someone else’s characters or historical characters gets to be professionally published novels and nobody wants to admit it’s fanfic but it is, but women write fanfic and women write novels based on someone else’s characters or historical figures and it gets derided.

Did not expect commentary celebrating the creativity and validity of fanwork of women in particular an episode of SPN, especially not with Becky of all people, but here we are.

Uhhhh is Chuck writing this episode, as it happens? I am seriously uneasy now. What is going on. What is real. Which is what I think Dean is going through because of Chuck and OUCH the Winchesters think they’re free but they’re not but also they are their own people and Chuck isn’t controlling them but it’s like he’s still making the framework?? Or would this case just be happening on his own and Perez is just messing with our heads in this script right now.

Oh damn because this ep wasn’t sadness enough now here we go with the Jack parallels. “I can’t control this.” “I’m a monster.” “I killed someone I love.” Parents doing anything to save their out of control teenage kid or does he need to be killed, so the parents are Cas, while Sam and Dean are Dean.

Interesting that Dean lowered the gun and didn’t kill Jack, but tells Sam they would do that for Jack if it was necessary. You didn’t, though, Dean. You couldn’t go through with it any more than those distressed parents of the vampire teen.

Becky is voicing various non-dire fan complaints here, every lane of the fandom is being gently called out right now. Hahaha including lack of Cas mentions in an ep that pointedly is not!Mentioning Cas because it’s not a mistake there’s actually reasons for that which is just lampshading how much Dean is pointedly Not Going to Talk About Cas.

“Where they sit around doing laundry and talk” -- again every lane of the fandom should feel very called out right now. Seriously, fandom lanes that hate each other’s guts all have that common factor of craving more domesticity, and would like to see the laundry ep of SPN and for many, it has better include Cas, or we’re working through our need for this via fanfics or fanart. Even Jared and Jensen have expressed interest in a “Winchesters do the laundry” kind of episode.

But here’s the thing--here’s the thing about SPN...it depicts domesticity. In small bits of pieces. Even in this ep there’s domesticity. SO HA. It’s not that SPN is against depictions of domesticity, it’s definitely in the toolset of its storytelling, to give the characters more layers, to make their lives seem more real, but there needs to be mostly an action plot because that’s the genre so they mostly kill monsters and we only get nibbles of domesticity.

Becky and Chuck arguing about Chuck’s incredibly dark story ending, after Becky criticized him for the story not having enough bite, was so interesting. While the episode’s dark story ending was actually quite well done IMO and not overdone and yes it’s bleak but it’s supposed to be. So it’s not that sad is always terrible writing, no. It isn’t. But its overuse has been a raging hot topic in spn fandom for years and SPN is a hopeful narrative as well as a bleak one. Overuse of loss of hope and misery can hurt the story, causes a number of fans to become desensitized and lose their emotional engagement for it (which has happened to be at a couple of points in SPN’s long run). So that conversation interested me a great deal, yes it did.

So.....SPN had its current biggest of the biggest of ultimate big bads, the ultimate power God himself, the author, and made him the enthusiast for overuse of the misery pr0n like that’s the only smart way to tell a story. The season’s big bad villain is a misery porn enthusiast.

I’m just gonna....sit here and absorb that for a moment.

Oh and this while all the PR for the show keeps warning us about how sad this story is and how bleak the ending will be, not a happy ending show. Are they warning us? Are they trolling us and misdirecting? Because they made their villain a misery pr0n fanboy and this intelligent, self-aware positive depiction of Becky the fan taking him to task for it.

I feel like could be headed for every story needs its darkness and its light, you need the darkness to appreciate the light, and you need some light or the story is less meaningful. We’ll see.

“I’m a writer,” says Chuck and then takes away everyone Becky loves and then unmakes Becky. This is a purposeful depiction of a writer creator as a sadist. It’s a diabolical reversal on the Stephen King’s Misery scenario. Becky played the deranged fangirl in the past, who kidnaps an object of obsession, now she’s the victim of the deranged sadistic writer who breaks into her home, destroys her life, and then effectively kills her because of his own obsession with making Sam and Dean wretchedly miserable because he thinks that’s the only way to make the story exciting.

*blinks*

In the last scene, oh thanks Sam, for vocalizing the Jack connection.

Hey Dean, that’s really a nice speech and yes Sam did give you a great pep talk but Sam wasn’t the only one who told you what you did still has meaning. This is like 15.01 where Dean is pointedly erasing Cas again despite Cas very obviously having done something Dean refuses to acknowledge. In 15.01 it was Dean leaving Cas out of his us vs the forces of evil speech to Sam, despite Cas having spent most of the ep shooting ghosts in the face and saving Sam’s life twice. Sam and Cas both have given Dean pep talks about the meaning of what they do but only Sam pulled Dean out of it...uhhh yeah that’s not writer error or canon ignoring Cas. That’s Dean trying to push Cas out of his mind. Something there hurts so much Dean isn’t dealing with it right now.

As I said, as I’ve been saying, it’s not so much that Dean is that angry at Cas. It’s not just about Mary. Or about Cas keeping things from him. Although those are all valid reasons for Dean’s hurt and anger. Dean seems to be afraid or hurt over more than that. And his love for Cas, IMO, is part of why this is weighing so heavily. What does he fear. I think it’s connected to the whole existential crisis about Chuck. What if none of this is real. I’ve talked about that in other posts, if none of this is real, if Dean still doubts, then what if what’s between him and Cas isn’t real, what if Cas doesn’t really care about him because none of it real.

Dean valiantly puts a brave face on things here, they keep going, they keep fighting for the sake of those they lost, no matter what, “keep putting one foot in front of the other.” Which makes sense. That’s how you honor those you’ve lost. It’s just that I don’t think Dean has really reached that. He is Not Dealing with an awful lot of stuff here. And we have seen again and again how hard Dean reels from losing loved ones. So what’s going on with Dean here. This is a healthy concept, but not if Dean is just whistling past the graveyard again. This might look like character development except look at what’s been going on with Dean. How deeply losing Mary, losing Jack affected him. The impact of those losses needs to be acknowledged and dealt with in order to truly move on and move forward. It’s like Dean is voicing a healthy outlook but isn’t actually experiencing it. I think Dean is posturing because if he lets all the hurt it right now, it will devour him.

There’s also the part where Sam and Dean have in the past displayed a lack of ability to just keep on keeping on if they lose each other, so they used to sell their souls, or violate the other one’s wishes and autonomy, or let the darkness free, but we’ve also seen them let each other go, and “keep putting one foot in front of the other.” Sam and Dean have done both ways with each other. Dean didn’t exactly just keep on keeping on no problem when Cas died at the end of S12.

Sam voices the other side of things, he can’t just move on right now. He’s feeling all the losses. They’ve piled up and piled up and it’s crushing him. Sam says he "can’t breathe” at times. He brings up Jessica, a loss he suffered 14 years ago.

So Sam and Dean are airing the two aspects of loss and grief on SPN. One the one hand, you don’t just give up and quit because of loss. Honor who you’ve lost and keep on fighting. But losses are deeply felt, and it’s not all okay either. Sam and Dean don’t just shrug off these losses because they have each other. That’s not how this works. They need more than just each other and SPN is increasingly having more and more open dialogue about all of this.

S15 so far has been so much about the impact losing people they love has on Sam and Dean, and why their isolation isn’t a good thing.

And there’s Chuck, the big bad, typing away to add more misery. Because Chuck gets off on giving them loved ones and taking them away, over and over and this isn’t presented as a good thing or a satisfying thing or a desirable thing or a celebration of anything.

#Sam Winchester #Dean Winchester #Chuck Shurley #Becky Rosen #spn #supernatural #supernatural spoilers #meta #Sam and Dean: a work in progress #Destiel #Team Free Will #Jack Kline #Castiel

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whateverthedragonswant · 4 years ago

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I agree that for Jon as a character to make any sense and for his past journey through the GOT series to make sense, political Jon has to be there. One thing I thought was off, maybe I'm crazy, is Kit saying between filming S7 & S8 that he didn't know when Jon fell for Dany. If the scripts he was given for the end of S7 WERE the ones used during the filming, then how could he not have known? Also, as you pointed out, what the script says and how Jon acts on screen don't match up. Fishy maybe?

Hi, Anon!

I don’t think you’re crazy at all. I completely forgot that Kit had said that (thank you for reminding me!). Which brings me right to the point that I actually agree with you 100%. Something fishy definitely went on bts. I just don’t know exactly what since no one really spoke on it or confirmed it. I know D&D talked about the show when they were in Austin but I think they only did it in general terms? (I could be wrong on this) I do remember back before the Emmys happened and they uploaded the 8x06 script for the nomination - I remember reading that and going “wtf?” with everyone else. Lines like Sansa and Jon looking at each other when Arya asks what’s west of Westeros because they “both failed geography” (that line still makes me laugh). Or Daenerys in that dragon wings shot being regarded by everyone as Her Satanic Majesty (like what? lol) or Drogon accidentally melting the IT in a fit of rage and grief. But I think during this, iirc, people were able to point out that the script didn’t fit to what we saw on screen. I don’t remember the exact examples and if they also included 8x05 in this but I do remember there had been something.

So for me, there is definitely something fishy. You would think Kit would have known exactly when his character fell for Dany or even who he was politically manipulating kindly in season 7. Not to bring another show into GoT discourse, but him not knowing reminds me of another show that had a bad ending that I’ve also been heavily mired in recently: Supernatural. One of the characters confessed that he loved another after years of clues in the narrative and moments that showcased he had though the show never confirmed it and actually tried to deny it at times or even shut the conversations down. When the actor who plays that character was asked just when the character fell in love with the other, he claimed he didn’t know. Kit is a very similar type of actor to these two actors (as well as Emilia I think) - they’re fully in their character’s skin and very interested in the arcs for their characters. I find it hard to believe that Kit didn’t wonder just when Jon fell for Dany if the romance was meant to be a genuine epic sweeping love saga that it was being portrayed to be in the main narrative, especially if his character was going to be sacrificed in the end so to speak. So, these two shows with these types of actors really kind of mirrored each other in a way - GoT was trying to prove a romance was there and SPN was trying to prove there wasn’t and in the end, they got the complete opposite effect but one similar theme: what they showed on screen did not match what was in their scripts, editing, and acting regarding those two relationships. At the end of each series, things had changed in the narrative. Jon has to kill Dany and the SPN character has to confess his love to the other character. This to me proves not everything is as it seems when it comes to the Jonerys romance for Jon’s character. In the end, yes something is definitely off.

Thank you so much for the ask. <3

Edit 3/20/21: in 7x06 script, in the boat cabin, when Jon sees Dany mourning Viserion, this moment is written that this is when he realizes he has feelings for her.

#ask #got #game of thrones #slight spn mention #jon snow #political!jon #pol!Jon #there was something there that they backed off on #1000% agree #ask answered #gotask #pol!jonask #jonsnowask

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almaasi · 5 years ago

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reaction post typed while watching SPN 15x13 “Destiny’s Child”

so Destiel is a pizza metaphor now, I guess :o

05:24pm

i am LATE

because my doctor wanted to see me before the entire country goes into self isolation for 4 weeks. so i was there at 10am (an unGODLY HOUR) and they were doing all the appointments in the car park, with the patients in their cars and the doctors outside wielding those forehead-check temperature thingies. anyway i’m not dying. but i did have to go back to bed with wet hair because DECONTAMINATION

also i wore a surgical mask and now i have a rash where it touched me :/

05:42

almost done downloading. expectations for this episode: SOMETHING FUN. hopes: a hint (or a heap) of destiel. c:

05:45

alrighty it’s done!!! let’s go, lesbians

05:45

cas: “if the pizza man truly l--”

OH BOY WE’RE IN FOR SOMETHING

cas sexuality recap????????????????? iiiiiiiiiiiiiinteresting,,,,,,,,,,,

the pizza man.......... is dean............................

what

happening

seriously what the fuck is happening

for 10 years i’ve expected a destiel recap and thIS WAS NOT IT, FAM

BUT I AM FUCKING INTO IT.

edit: wait, the pizza man is CAS, meg/the empty said later. so dean just wants all the pizza in his mouth i guess

05:49

my brain has rewired itself to be unable to see two characters together without worrying about covid-19. i can’t imagine anyone kissing without squicking myself. it’s weird.

and dean and sam are TOO CLOSE

take a little sub-step back there, ladies

05:51

other-dean-and-sam step out of their car

okay first off

1. the music. i like it. it’s awful in this show. i’m gonna look it up later.

2. the ANKLE. disgusting. i’m attracted to it.

2.1. wait no it’s sam’s ankle i take it back

05:56pm

sam: “it’s latin for ‘hidden’. where do we find it?”

billie. “i. don’t. know. it’s. hidden.”

i love her so damn much.

05:58

dean playing with the rubber band feels like a metaphor for the universes. he twists it into an infinity symbol and ooooooh

ahh look at this boy stimming

recently, the more i’ve watched dean the more i’m more inclined to think he’s also on the autism spectrum. just SO different from cas. and forced to hide all his traits by his upbringing, lifestyle, and surroundings, the way women with autism tend to do.

DEAN TRYING TO GUESS WHAT HAPPENED TO THE THING AND CAS SAYING NO !!!!!!!!!!

10/10

edit: probably my favourite part of this episode tbh. and i completely forgot about it until i was re-reading this post just now

06:05

anael/sister jo: “well, the healthcare systems sucks, so i pick up the slack”

resentful applause would be appropriate here

i like how she’s dressed! stripy blue turtleneck under a red satin cocktail dress under a bubblegum pink blazer!!!! nice!!

06:20pm

accidentally moved my computer and it turned off, lost a bit of this post. basically it was me saying ARE YOU TELLING ME ANAEL AND RUBY WERE CROWLEY AND AZIRAPHALE and having my fingers crossed for it being explicitly romantic somewhere in this

and then cas is talking to jack

cas: “dean feels things more acutely than any human i’ve ever known”

which, for one thing, only feeds my growing autistic!dean headcanon

and secondly, there’s a shot of the pizza as he says that!!!! significant

did dean just call sam ‘samwitch’ or is he referring to sam/rowena

cas: “the demon you were sexually intimate with”

which just reminds me how ruby was cas’ parallel that season.....

so i guess nowadays they just pop into hell like it’s a grocery store

dean’s gonna be so mad if cas dies forever

team free will dies if jack does it wrong

MUCH PRESSURE TO PUT ON TINY JACK O NOES

anael and ruby are definitely playing good omens

06:46

jack questioning this every step of the way probably Means Something

dean and cas standing in a church by the altar looks a liiiiiiiiiiiiiiiittle like a wedding

i question how the moon would be in exactly the right place and fullness in order for them to find that. one minute off and they never would’ve seen it. and ruby’s been dead 10 years and somehow knows where the moon is, topside???

SO CAS JUST FOUND A SNITCH AND THE SNITCH IS LIKE “EAT ME”

very harry potter

jack’s gonna eat the snitch isn’t he

snek

JACK HEARS PARSELTONGUE

there is SO MUCH good omens and harry potter in this, i love it

dean and cas at the altar again........ ugh <3

brazil iS NOT WHERE ANYONE WANTS TO BE

everything is Bad there

07:00

HOO

it’s over

well that was a different episode than the trailer made it out to be. good though. wow so much all at once. i enjoyed seeing the ladies again.

THE RECAP ABOUT THE PIZZA THOUGH. like... it wasn’t textual in the episode, just made people Aware of the subtext?? which means regular people WILL BE NOTICING THE DESTIEL GOING FORWARD. OH BOY.

i’m too tired to have coherent thoughts but i enjoyed this!! i love jack and billie and i love how concerned dean was about dead!cas, and the other-sam-and-dean were funny but THEY’RE JUST?? OUT THERE IN THE WORLD NOW??

10/10 and i am intrigued about what’s coming next........

but yeah there was destiel. it’s just a pizza metaphor now.

*pizza emoji*, *clown emoji*

edit: so i just realised this was a bucklemming episode and THAT EXPLAINS MY WEIRD FEELING OF “i enjoyed this but something felt off”. like parts of this fell flat and felt like they skimmed potential rather than delving into it, and i was like hmmmm, but ignored the feeling bc i am just really fuckin tired. but yeah that explains the busty asian beauties thing too. i didn’t mention it bc ugh can’t be bothered. but yeah. adjusting my rating to 8/10 because it really does make a difference knowing the author’s intentions were questionable

#spn #Elmie watches things #post of postiness #season 15 #destiny's child #15x13

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sammyhale · 6 years ago

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J2 VegasCon 2019 Main Panel

*Reminder: Full answers/more context in vids and gifs <3

J2 jump onstage as fans wave pink hearts from the crowd <3

Jensen: Whenever we come out and do one of those jumps, I always wonder if today’s the day one of us blows a hip.

Jensen’s microphone keeps making a high pitched sound lol.

They ask how many first-timers are there. Jensen: Okay, well, I’d like to remind you we’ve been on this show for fourteen years, doing these for thirteen and a half. Where were you???

Jared: We are five days into our final hiatus. Jensen: Five days into our hiatus beard!

Jensen won’t shave for a few months.

J2 whispering and Jensen cracking up :P

Jensen reveals that Jared is wearing a party patch (they help with hangovers). Jared puts his leg on Jensen’s lap and rolls up his pant leg to show the patch lol.

J2 gave the crew party patches at the s14 wrap party.

Fan asks if they believe in the supernatural in real-life. Jensen doesn’t not believe in ghosts. First to think there’s a logical explanation. But he’s certainly open to the availability that that 1% could be supernatural. Even though he’s never experienced it in real life.

Jensen explains the difference between unnatural and supernatural. Unnatural = Jared. Supernatural = us

Norton fixes Jared’s rolled up pants which turns a little dirty, naturally :P

Fan: Which supporting actors have gone on that have had great careers that you’re still close with? The guest star Jared connects with the most is the girl who played Ruby in season 4 ;) Jensen says they knew Sterling K. Brown was a star when he was on spn, that the Force was strong with him. It’s no surprise he’s had the success that he’s had. Also: Well we’re close to Jeffrey Dean Morgan, even though he hasn’t really done much since spn. He’s still cool.

J2 ran into Felicia Day yesterday and talked about her daughter aww

Jared watched “Wendigo” recently, named a couple of guest stars (assuming Alden Ehrenreich was one of them ;))

A fan apparently rushed the stage, emotional/screaming and upset about wanting an autograph. Some fans tweeted that she has autism. Fans tweeted that J2, Clif, and Creation handled the situation well. At one point J2 left the stage to help defuse the situation. When they came back out after Jared shouted out: “Our member of the family is having a hard time. We all have had hard times.” He wants us all to be kind. The boys are completely fine. (Some details)

Fan: So after the show, will you continue to shave? Boys: Up here not down there... lol

Jensen: We were talking about Jared’s Viking braids.

Jensen teased about Jared shaving his head like Borja did yesterday for charity. They said they’d have Misha do it lol.

Answering sincerely, they acknowledge their look will change a bit, to have their own identities. Jensen: “Dean is the best imaginary friend I’ve ever had in my life. He’ll be a part of me for the rest of my life. But I don’t have to look like him for the rest of my life.”

Also: “It all depends on what our wives want us to look like.” lol

Jared wants to go bowlegged. Asks Jensen how it is, to which he replies “airy.”

Jensen hopes their relationships with cast and crew will last a lifetime and that is what, quote, “fuels us up.”

J2 are signed to do cons past s15 and won’t end for a while :)

What is Jared most looking forward to after the show? Getting to know our kids, our wives, and ourselves. Also not shaving!

Jared: I’m excited to be a dad. Spend more time with the kiddos. Is also excited for the boring.

Jensen’s never known his wife and kids without the show. It’s been a constant. It’s going to be interesting to see where life goes. He’s excited for the opportunity to spend more time with his kids, wife, and friends. To not get on an airplane.

Jensen: I'm looking forward to but have been happy to have professional opportunities go by these past 14 years in order to tell this story.

Has anything impacted you (professionally) like SPN has impacted us? Jared says he isn’t sure. Even when “off” we can’t remove our “wigs” like Borja (lol) We’re still working! Always!

Jensen said he and Misha will need vocal therapy after the show to get their voices back to normal. Jensen: I tried to emulate JDM as Dean’s father by speaking with this gravelly voice. I didn’t know I’d been doing this for 15 seasons. I’m a lot older than he was when he played my dad. Jared: Yeah, no kidding!!

Fan: How do demons deposit sulfur? Jensen: *runs around the stage, making farting noises*

What’s on their bucket lists? And the weirdest thing on there? The fan has an accent that J2 both attempt. Jared says (about the accent): “It’s beautiful and I’m jealous of people who speak better than me, which is everyone.”

We have learned Jared doesn’t have a bucket list. Then he says he would love to go on a helicopter ride. He’s never done it before and it’s the small things. Jensen is unimpressed.

Jared: “What I meant to say was...have a...pet...koala...bear...” Jensen: JUST STOP.

Jensen says, “I want to watch my children grow up.”

Jared says he can watch his children grow up from the helicopter. Jensen quips, “That’s called helicopter parenting.”

Jared shakes the fan’s hand and asks where her accent is from, repeating that it’s beautiful. She says, “Yorkshire.” He goes, “no YOU’RE sure.” LOL

The dad jokes are strong today.

For the final season, this is the first year J2 have said to the writers and producers that they would like to be part of the creative process in the direction and the story of s15. J2 have been invited to the storyboarding with the creators in LA for the final season and definitely want to give their input. They don’t know if they’ll listen, and J2 are prepared for that, but nobody’s lived with Sam and Dean longer than they have. They would love to give input that the show and characters deserve. <3

Jensen: “No one knows these characters more than Jared and I.”

Jared: As a fan of the show, I'd like to offer my input.

Jensen says they watch the episodes in order to give themselves critical feedback. They don’t read comments on social media re: feedback.

It’s hard for them to watch themselves as just an audience. Including other TV shows like GOT and This Is Us.

J2 both loved “Death's Door” then realized we weren't in it much. Jensen: Are we weighing it down? Jared: We're critical of ourselves

Fan: Jensen, you were amazing last night [at the concert]. Jared: Oh, if you think he was amazing last night... :P

Fan asks if Jensen really played piano on Dark Angel and any memories from the show? It was a little of both Jensen and a pro (close-ups are not him playing). It was a VERY difficult song to learn how to play, Chopin he thinks. He has to think hard to dig up funny stories.

When Jessica Alba gets in the boxing ring (with him) she lined up the punch and hit him RIGHT in the nose. (One of the MANY reasons it’s “so jacked up”) He was too young to say “cut! That hurt!” Realizes he doesn’t do that now, either lol.

Another episode he gets slapped, but the actress wasn’t getting the timing for the fake slap right. She was petite so he assumed it wouldn’t be too bad... But he had a WELT on his face. Whole crew went “oof.”

“Scoobynatural” question for the final scene, how many takes? A small crowd had gathered outside across the street. They’re 20 yards away and can’t hear the regular dialogue. But Jensen knew they would get that last line, and he was embarrassed to say the line because those people wouldn’t know the context.

Jared: They’re so old they’re animating themselves to be on camera! lol

A fan said she lost her favorite beanie in the Bellagio fountain and was asking on recommendations to get a new one.

Jared gave his beanie to the fan aww. Then Jensen told Jared that he lost his favorite watch, and Jared immediately took off his watch and gave it to Jensen. Jensen cuddles Jared. Jared then tells Jensen he lost his favorite pair of underwear LOL

Last question: Fan wants to know where Jensen and Jared went during the “French Mistake” episode. Jensen says they were at a con. Jared says VegasCon! Or maybe it was Balthazar. But Jensen prefers to think they just didn’t show up for work because “they’re asshole actors.”

Hugs, standing ovation for the boys, J2 give each other and the fans some love before taking off :) (photo credit: x)

Info via: Fangasm, Sarah, #spnlv, #spnvegas

#j2 #jared padalecki #jensen ackles #spnlv #vegascon #panel sum #long post #shpost

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thecursedhellblazer-arc · 5 years ago

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(( I had told myself not to write anything about this, but I kinda have a lot of feelings on the matter and I’ve seen several posts around, so I thought I could share my opinion too. This are just some random thoughts, so forgive me if they are all a bit all over the place. ))

(( Under the cut because the post got a bit long. ))

(( I’ve recently caught up with Legends, after having missed the two latest episodes, and I’m absolutely torn over the kind of twist some of the sub plots are taking. Behrad’s death was kinda expected, but I was still hoping that they would have kept him around for a bit longer. Of course, there is still the chance that he gets back, considering that we don’t really know how the whole Loom of Fate ordeal will end, but tbh I wished we had had more bonding between him and Zari before he was taken out of the picture. I understand that his death, together with meeting her older self, is important to Zari’s character development, but I still feel like it was a bit rushed. ))

(( One thing I really liked, even if maybe is a cliched, was Charlie choosing the Legends as her family and breaking away from the conditioning that her sisters have tried to force on her, even after all that time. And the fact that it was during the episode with the Spn setting...The whole “family doesn’t end with blood” trope was quite fitting. I love that she has found her place with them, after millennia spent on the run from a her “biological” family, which was obviously abusive. ))

(( Another nice surprise was Astra choosing to team up with Ava & Co, choosing to trust John, other than giving into Lachesis’s siren call. I’m really excited to see how they will deal with her character. In the comics, John eventually manages to free her from Hell, but we aren’t given much closure, especially not after how deeply John’s whole storyline is affected by the Newcastle clusterfuck. It seems that the show is trying to take another route to deal with it and I’m really curious and hopeful for what concerns it. Also, I do like the idea of her having a more active role in changing her destine. Quite literally. And Ava sharing her backstory with her, trying to convince her to be her own person? That was really good. Also because it shows the growth of Ava’s character too. ))

(( Now, the thing that has been bothering me the most. The turn in Constantine and Zari 2.0′s relationship. Personally, I don’t like it. I wasn’t a fan of Nate & Zari either, but pushing her towards just makes me straight out uncomfortable. I found myself looking away in the scenes where they were getting romantically physical and I’m not sure what I’m going to do if they will make them an official couple. I really don’t see the chemistry between them. Don’t get me wrong, they are funny, they have a good dynamic, the way their characters clashes because of the differences is interesting. They do have chemistry but as friends. I don’t really see how a romance could work out, and let’s not forget the whole Nate factor. I’m going a bit more in depth with this, even if no one really cares about my meta xD But since I’m at it, I don’t see why not. ))

(( Zari 1.0 and John had some very nice moments. Their relationship was different, also because they had more common ground. They had both known tragedy, they had both made bad choices and paid for them. Zari 1.0 could relate better to John, because, while she was a good person too, she knew what it meant having to do the wrong thing for the right reasons, and that something that John does a lot. I didn’t ship them, but I really loved their dynamics and I will always treasure that scene when she gives him the picture of his mother she had taken. There was a connection there and it was a really good friendship, not so different from the one John has with Charlie. ))

(( Now, Zari 2.0 is a completely different person. She has a completely different backstory and, as such, a different personality. I didn’t like her at first, but she has grown a lot recently and matured too during her time with the Legends and she has got back being a great character, relatable too. However, she still lacks all the common ground that Zari 1.0 had with John. This isn’t a bad thing, don’t get me wrong. The fact that they come from completely different worlds is one of the elements that makes their dynamic interesting, but it also underlines the fact that Zari has no idea of who John is and of how his world truly works and she probably will never understand it. She kinda reminds me of Kit (one of John’s lovers in the comics, perhaps his most important relationship together with Zatanna) under some point of view, even if the two characters have some very profound differences. Kit and John were very close, he was head over heels for her, but it didn’t work out because, while she knew him, she couldn’t grasp or accept his world. The magic, the darkness, the bad things he does because it’s what he is. And so it ended very, very badly between them. Honestly? That’s the only kind of dynamic I can picture in a romance between John and Zari. And it’s already a stretch, because Kit’s character had some traits that made her compatible with John, traits that Zari doesn’t have. Not to mention that Kit had a lot of history with John before they got together romantically, and that was what made them work, for a while. Zari doesn’t. So, it might be a way to make it sort of work (still forced for how I see it), unless they break his character...and I would HATE that. He is my favourite from LoT and I’ve waited a long time to see him brought back after his show was cancelled, so...please, don’t ruin it for me. ))

(( Also, their “romantic” connection really felt shoved in out of the blue. They have never really interacted much before and sure, being forced to team up can bring two people close, the timing is awful. Let’s not forget that Zari had just decided to blame John for Behrad’s death. She was supposed to have a grudge against him. Moreover, she is grieving the brother she was finally starting to properly connect with and she is struggling with a quest to rebuild her identity after she has found out about her other self. She is looking for her place in the world and a person who is dealing with that realistically doesn’t go and fall for someone just because they have shared an adventure. It feels forced and rushed. Maybe in another context I could have tolerated it or given it the benefit of the doubt, but not in this moment of the storyline. It’s out of plance to say the least. I had expected them to work out their differences in that episode, but instead all they do is bickering (which is fun) and then they fight together (which was great, tbh, because it shows them both that they can be a good team). However, there’s not a real moment when they properly talk about what has happened, about their conflict . We just see them being shoved together and forced to touch and then there’s that almost kiss moment and it’s just...bad timing. It feels awkward and yeah, forced too. ))

(( Also, let’s not forget that in the previous episode, Zari sleep-walked in Nate’s bedroom and half of the crew, including John, found them in the middle of a somewhat compromising position in the middle of the corridor. John joked and teased them as everyone else and wasn’t upset in the least. On the contrary, he was basically rooting for them. And this was perhaps the day, or a few days at most, before the whole romantic innuendos got thrown in the mix. Yet another reason why I feel this was forced and rushed and brought up out of nowhere. ))

(( As for John, his current focus is on getting the Loom back together and keeping his promise to Astra. We have seen him being reckless and single-minded about it, to the point that he almost got himself, Charlie and Sara killed. And did get Behrad killed, because he didn’t think his shit through. It doesn’t make sense to me that he suddenly finds the time to notice that he might or might not have feelings for Zari. It’s almost out of character. And it clashes with how he has been behaving so far. You don’t stop obsessing about the one thing that would allow you to FINALLY make amends for the greatest regret of your entire life just because you realise that one of your teammates is actually a nice company, all considered. Plus, he too has already too much on his plate in general to have the space for a romance. And, personal preference, John is good on his own. He needs friends that can help him picking up the pieces, not a relationship that will eventually just bring him more harm and complications. God, I miss Chas. ))

(( Someone could argue that they shared a moment during the Romeo vs Juliette episode, but I disagree with that too. That episode was all about Nate and Ray. The dialogue between Romeo and Juliette was not about John and Zari, it was all about Nate and Ray. They are the star-crossed couple of friends (lovers in the play), not John and Zari. That kiss was a symbol of Ray and Nate reconnecting with each other before taking different paths and it had nothing to do with John and Zari. At least, that’s the feeling I had from how the whole episode was built and I think that I’m not completely misled in that regard. ))

(( Last thing, I don’t want the whole thing between Zari and John to be a source of drama. Because that’s what we’ll get, because Nate is still very much in love with Zari, both Zaris. He has started to chase after Zari 2.0 thinking that she was his Zari, but he came to like her for what she is too. And maybe, yes, perhaps he needs to move on from her as some people have pointed out. It could be one way to go around it, but that wouldn’t spare us the classic love triangle crap we get at some point in every damn show and I’m starting to be a bit bored with it. And it wouldn’t really change my view on John and Zari’s relationship. ))

#lot spoilers #legends of tomorrow #lot 5x10 #lot 5x09 #john constantine #nate heywood #ray palmer #ava sharpe #zari tarazi #zari tomaz

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deanwasalwaysbi · 4 years ago

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Thinking About How This Wasn't Actually a Denial

But was it self preservation?

The year was 2013 and rather than a denial, Jensen said "Don't ruin it for everybody now."

What was the fan 'ruining' for everybody? The Con? or something else? So if I was a tinhatter - and sometimes I am - I might think about other tv shows from the past that were covertly queer and how they handled the question, were TV shows 'out'?

Mainstream shows like Bewitched, you know, shows that are so clearly straight, you can tell because... well. ... they never technically used the word 'gay'. ... witches honor

SPN Film Studies is Back in Session! Join Under the Cut for more on supernatural & the story about how Bewitched! came out of the Broom Closet

Bewitched aired from 1964-72, it's so old the first season was in B&W. The show starred Elizabeth Montgomery as Samantha, the strange housewife with a stranger secret. Her husband, Darrin, unwittingly married into the whole witchy family, from the now drag icon Agnes Moorehead's Endora with her open marriage, to the unmarried and batty Aunt Clara (Marion Lorne who played the mother in Hitchcock's heavily gay coded 'Strangers on a Train'), to the extremely coded Uncle Arthur (gay actor Paul Lynde). (We can't know for sure, but it seems at least 4 members of the cast were gay themselves.) The core premise of the show involves Samantha balancing who she really is with repressing that self for the safety and comfort of her family.

Samantha and her husband keep her [ahem] 'queer' nature a secret which gets harder on Samantha when she has to tell her daughter to live the same way, “I know what fun it is to be a part of the magical life ... to have so much at your fingertips. But we’re living in a world that’s just not ready for people like us, and I’m afraid they may never be. So you’re going to have to learn when you can use your witchcraft and when you can’t.”

There are plenty of generic 60s wacky hijinks but there are also whole episodes metaphorically about repression being harmful, episodes where characters asked if another was a 'thespian', episodes where Darrin was queercoded while under a spell, episodes about representation & bad stereotyping in media, and even two episodes where witches discussed whether it was time for witches to come out to the mortals, (whether mortals could accept that they were just nice normal people trying to live their lives like everybody else - or not - and would just freak out and kill them again).

When it came time to recast Dick York's Darrin with a new 2nd lead, Elizabeth and her husband, William Asher, knowingly cast the gay Dick Sergeant. (Although he wasn't out publicly at the time.) Then, when Sergeant came out in '91, Montgomery supported him and the two served together as the grand marshals of the Hollywood pride parade.

Dick Sargent expressed in the 90s what he would want in a Bewitched reunion episode: for Darrin to meet another like couple, a witch and a mortal who are married, and another, and another, and end up forming a whole community and support group, finding out that it was never so uncommon after all, that it was actually "about 10% of the population." The two would march in the first mortals and witches pride parade, saying they should have come out years ago.

In '94, Montgomery had this to say about the queer themes of the show, “Don't think that didn't enter our minds at the time. We talked about it on the set, that this was about people not being allowed to be what they really are. If you think about it, Bewitched is about repression in general and all the frustration and trouble it can cause. It was a neat message to get across to people at that time in a subtle way.” (x)

Interviewer: Are you concerned that your involvement in the gay-pride parade will lead people to believe you're a lesbian?

"[Laughing] I'm really not worried about that. There are bigger things to worry about. Like the presidential election and finding a cure for AIDS. I did the parade in support of Dick. I mean, in the end, didn't we all?" (x) (Montgomery was also one of the first celebrity allies to fight for LGBTQ rights and support HIV/AIDS-related fundraisers.)

So did they talk about it at the time? No. You can bet they didn't speak about it publicly. What would have happened if a fan, publicly, had asked Elizabeth, William, or Dick about the show's queer allegory content? This was a time when being gay was a literal felony. They would have had to have lied or risked losing the show, their careers, and possibly subjecting themselves to violence.

Now. back to Jensen and the Schrodinger's long con:

This was in 2013 - The same year that the Supreme Court of the United States struck down a federal ban on gay marriage. You certainly couldn't call homosexuality illegal in the US at that time. It's the same year that Dabb and Sgriccia spoke about the Aaron moment on the DVD and whether there's 'this potential for love in all places' for Dean. Of course Jensen said this about the very same scene: "But it was - you know - it was comedy. It was a comedic moment in the show and fortunately Dean gets a lot of the comedic moments in the show and it was just, you know, Ben was poking fun at the fact that - you know, how can we make this very kind of manly, heterosexual guy uncomfortable - uh -you know, or or have him back on his heels and throw him off his game a little bit.”

I'm reminded of 2012 when Ben Edlund stepped in about a Destiel question at comic con, pretending it was some freaky thing that fans had made up even though he'd already written and directed TMWWBK, which had already aired.

Jensen: “What’s Destiel?” Ben Edlund: That’s some weird shit. Jensen: Is this something that you created, Ben? Ben: You don’t want any part of that.

Or the next year for season 9 when Jensen said “I think the whole Cas and Dean thing has gotten out of hand” “I don’t think there’s anything secret to their relationship even though a lot of people wish there was” EVEN THOUGH- that season we got the nightstands acknowledgement and Misha (or both of them?) was told to “play him like a jilted lover”

Or Jensen's knowing bromance smile in 2015

I think recent events (cough spn gate) have made clear that the network and many viewers were still uncomfortable with CAS being gay in 2020, deleting even familial mentions of Cas from the finale episodes once he was revealed to be not only gay but also in love with Dean. (x) (x) (x) Can you imagine then what Warner Brothers would have said to an acknowledge bisexual Dean Winchester in 2013? Granted, there was no Trump election, but legitimate, could that have been the end of the show? Or the Russian and Conservative US viewership? Is it possible that Jensen would have feared so?

Is it possible that Jensen had a more personal reason for a knee jerk defensive response?

So was Jensen covering in 2013? Well. This happened 5 years later in 2018:

That hostile "? No." came even though Misha confirmed that he and Jensen had discussed Destiel by that point. Granted, discussing Destiel as a concept and accepting Dean being inherently bisexual are two very different things - Cas is GN after all - still, less than encouraging.

I may never get over the jumps back and forth that Jensen did. At this point I think there's no denying that a lot of SPN's queer content was on purpose, even as writers and actors were telling fans and network execs otherwise. Yet when each person involved was brought in? that question haunts me at night. I have gone off before about the timeline in my pursuit of whether Jensen was Ben Hur'd (x) and, if so, for how long. I'm sure many in this fandom have so much to add.

In the meantime we'll just have to cherish this moment from 2019:

Interviewer: 'So, tell us just a little bit about what you’re most excited to tackle with your character this final season.’ Jensen: “Cas. Just like a full football form tackle.”

Bewitched references in SPN:

2.05 - Dean: Well, it looks like he can't work his mojo just by twitching his nose, he's gotta use verbal commands.

2.20 - Dean says Barbara Eden was hotter than Elizabeth Montgomery - sigh - Dean.

7.05 - Dean thinks a husband has no idea his wife is a witch, and refers to him as Darrin. Dean also indicates he likes the first Darrin better. - (I guess I can't make a comment about how much TV Dean watched as a kid if I get all of his references and also haven't saved the world.)

14.03 - Jules refers to the witch as 'Brunhilde' - this is a minor character in bewitched but more so from mythology and likely referred to the cartoon witch from WB cartoons - the stereotypical witch that faced bugs bunny with the green skin and straw hair.

let me know if you have any to add. Stay Witchy ✌

#jensen ackles #jackles long con #dean was always bi #spn film studies #spn queercoding #Spn tinhatting #ben hur treatment #bewitched #queercoding #Caslighting #Spn gaslighting #elizabeth montgomery #dick sargent #paul lynde #original content #Marion Lorne #Marion Lorne was also in a show called the gay adventure in 1932 but i dont have any information on the plot #and to quote misha. it's probably gay like happy #Schrodinger's long con

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tippitv · 5 years ago

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SPN 15.02 “Raising Hell” - TippiTV Recap

Welcome to the recap of episode 2 of the final season! As with the first episode, I will be providing descriptions of graphics I would have made if I didn't have a shitty pain-wracked upper body. I tried making graphics with my feet, which feel great, but it was... too artistic...

I didn't want to set such a high bar for myself.

Okay in the intro bit Belphejack describes his warding spell on the town as a mile-wide circle where "ghosts can't get in or out." Now I'm confused because the cemetery from which all the ghosts/demons erupted like a Dr. Pimple Popper compilation video is outside of this circle. Isn’t it? All the evacuees are also outside this circle. What's keeping all the people at the shelter from getting possessed by ghosts that didn't happen to be in the town? Wouldn't it have made more sense to get everyone into the shelter and then make the circle around that? All they've done is created a Venn diagram where the warded circle doesn't touch either the cemetery or the shelter.

[Graphic: just a terrible drawing of the above to illustrate my point.]

Actually screw it I need to make this graphic.

Or wait... Are they saying this bustling town AND the cemetery fill up a space of only 1 mile and are warded together?

And that somehow the majority of ghosts are in this area for some reason and that they hadn't managed to go much further than that after they were freed?

OH MY GOD WHY AM I THINKING SO HARD ABOUT THIS?

Anyway we now move to the present day, which seems to be soon after the evacuation. I'm actually slightly pleasantly surprised that they picked up here instead of moving on to the other three billion ghosts that need dealing with.

A woman sneaks around the supposedly deserted town, covering her nose and mouth with a scarf. Ah right... the "benzene." I actually did live through a few benzene leaks and you can smell it. The CDC describes it has smelling something like gasoline but to me it smells like... a certain kind of bandaging. Medcinal and rubbery. It seems unlikely that nobody in this town would know this and point out that there's zero benzene smell in the air. The woman runs into her neighbor, who's acting like a stone cold weirdo. She's wary but keeps chatting right up until the moment he stabs her a bunch of times.

A ghost pops out of him. He somewhat resembles the prophet who lost his soul so I was mildly confused for a moment. Also throughout this whole episode it's like he can't decide what his accent is and it's very annoying. Hell, he goes through like three accents just spelling the word "disembowel" here. Because the neighbor lady had been chatting about spelling bees.

At the high school, Castiel tells Sam about the neighbor lady going missing. For some reason, Sam has trouble getting everyone's attention. Did this town only have forty people in it? The cafeteria isn't remotely full. Sam reminds everyone to stay out of the quarantine zone. "Any questions?" Everyone raises their hands.

Sam's face makes a bunch of faces that can be summed up as "uh oh spaghettios."

Dean and Belph are in town bonding (not really) over being good soldiers who just wanna do their jobs. The mixed-accent ghost tries to make an escape through the warding whe Dean blasts him with rock salt. Belph points out they're not dealing with regular ghosts. "That was Francis Tumblety." Oh no the inventor of Tumblr!

[Graphic: Dashcon as Hell]

Turns out Francis is more famously known as Jack the Ripper. When Belph explains this Dean is like, "Cool," which seems like a weird reaction for him to have. Also wouldn't the soul of someone as bad as Jack the Ripper have become demonic by now?

High school shelter. They picked a really weird building for their exterior shots. It looks like a cross between an Alpine chalet and a city hall. Some of the antsy townsfolk with strong Canadian accents decide to escape back to their Kansan homes.

One of the homes is currently being used as a meeting hall by the ghosts. I cannot overstate how much I hate seeing ghosts in full daylight. The makeup looks straight out of a school play. Like Sam earlier, Francis has some difficulty getting everyone's attention. What kind of parallel is this supposed to be? He gets the other ghosts to agree to mount an attack against the hunters and then they can put on a production of The Importance of Being Earnest and Dead.

Two of the townsfolk sneak back home only to encounter two of the ghosts. They look terrified even though the ghosts look absolutely comical.

[Graphic: Photoshop these two ghosts into a Scooby Doo scene]

Sam and Castiel argue about what and when to tell the evacuees. Rowena walks in on them and acts like she just got a Samstiel idea for Whumptober.

After some exposition about God and his sister and the soul-bomb that Rowena made back then, Sam says he needs her to make something similar that will trap the ghosts. She says it will be very difficult and will take her until nearly the end of the episode.

Then Sam gets called away to join the other plot line. The two people who slipped out of the shelter are now possessed and oozing some CGI out of their eyes. Man, daylight really is unkind to everything except like Jensen Ackles's complexion.

Francis Tumbledore materializes and demands they erase the warding or the ghosts will start killing people. To make his point, the two recently possessed people get their innards turned into Hamburger Helper by the ghosts inside them. Someone offscreen shoots them with a confetti gun!

Ugh. It's that wanker Ketch, which I believe is his full name, and the confetti is actually a bunch of "iron flakes." The flakes just gently tickle the skin instead of penetrating and thus damaging it, which doesn't seem like it would harm ghosts. I mean, we have iron in our blood and that doesn't seem like a deterrent to ghosts but whatever. Even Ketch's dumb pocket square is annoying me. I don't remember why he annoys me but I feel it deep in my soul.

Everyone reconvenes at the school for a stand-n-chat. Rowena and Ketch reminisce and flirt. Oh, Rowena. You can do so much better. Ketch gets around to being surprised to learn that Jack's corpse is now being possessed by the demon Belphegor, even though he's currently on a mission to kill Belphegor. He had to be momentarily ignorant so we could get some clunky exposition. Blah blah blah a demon named Ardat was the one who ordered the hit but neglected to mention what Ketch would be looking for.

Cut to Reno where Amara is in her well-appointed hotel suite getting a temple massage from a masseuse named Kimiko. Kimiko's hands disappear to be replaced by slightly more masculine hands.

Amara sits up, startled and displeased to discover her brother. I don't care if y'all are billions of years old it's gross to show up in your sister's room when she's only wearing a sheet. Also it's rude to smite a masseuse in the middle of an appointment.

"Sooo how about that Game of Thrones ending?" Chuck small-talks. "Pretty great, right?"

[Graphic: Screenshot of my post about Supernatural's showrunner comparing the show's finale to GoT that inexplicably has 35,000 notes]

Amara, naturally, is suspicious of her brother's sudden appearance and wants to know why he's there.

You know, it's too bad Castiel doesn't have that power where he could touch someone on the forehead and make them sleep. Instead of dealing with all these angry evacuees he could just tap them all into a short coma.

Rowena wants Dean to tell her more about Ketch like he's the village matchmaker instead of a guy with three billion evil souls to deal with. He's nice enough to warn her away from him, but it just seems to make her more intrigued.

Time for Dean and Castiel to hash out their feelings. I mean the feelings where Dean is mad at Castiel for not telling everyone about Jack losing his soul, not the feelings where they keep staring at each other like "In Your Eyes" by Peter Gabriel is playing in the background but they can never act on it because they live in a very heteronormative universe. Generally speaking, Dean is also just mad at this whole thing where free will is an illusion and they've been playing God's games. "Nothing about our lives is real."

[Graphic: Screencap of the Scoobynatural episode]

Dean dramatically stalks out of the room while Cas, his back turned like they're in a soap opera, calls out to him. They face each other. "You asked what about all of this was real... we are." Dean doesn't say anything to that and leaves the room heterosexually.

He goes out on patrol with Ketch and gives him an iron necklace to keep from getting possessed. Ketch wants to know more about Rowena.

[Graphic: I mean... can I do something with Dean as Bea Arthur in Fiddler on the Roof?]

Luckily he gets word about trouble down at the ol' abandoned meat-packing plant. Two hunters have gone missing. Ketch gets thrown into a concrete wall in such a way that would kill him or, at the very least, leave him with a spine made of oatmeal. Lizzie Borden aims to kill them, but a new, unseen ghost shouts at her to leave.

Aw, it's Kevin Tran. I like how he moves the plastic doorway strips with his hands instead of just blinking his way into the room. Turns out God sent him to Hell instead of Heaven, but at least it's given him sort of a badass reputation among the other ghosts so that they do what he says. Ohh I bet that gets pissed away pretty soon.

Reno. God is watching something on TV where the CC says "a sexy pastiche of fragrant tripe" which is often the tagline of Buckleming episodes. Amara is trying to get her yoga on but he wants to talk about taking a vacation together. She figures out he needs her for something. She zeroes in on his shoulder wound that mirrors Sam's. "You're not complete," she says. "You're not at full strength."

And this, my friends, is where I began to get this tingling discomfort that made me wonder if Sam is going to become the new God by the finale.

The switch from night to day to night to day is so weird in this episode. Or maybe it always is and for some reason I'm noticing it more. Anyway while Kevin is off doing recon on the other ghosts, Sam and Dean fret about the warding starting to fade. "We're gonna need you to charge it back up," Dean says to Belph. "Sorry guys it was a one-time thing," Belph says. And nobody asks any followup questions like "WHY?"

Belph also says, in regards to Kevin, that the default setting on Heaven is souls can't get in once they've been to Hell. God made exceptions for John and Bobby but he doesn't exactly like the Winchesters anymore. I feel like y'all really ought to talk to Billie about this. Also, doesn't that mean Sam and Dean would never get to go to Heaven? This just lends further credence to a Samgod hypothesis.

Ghost meeting. One of the ghosts logically points out that all they have to do is wait for the warding to fail completely and then just stroll out. Random ghost would be excellent at snarky recapping. But Francis Tumbledry is the Veruca Salt of serial killing ghosts.

[Graphic: Screencap from Willy Wonka where Veruca is saying she wants and Oompa Loompa right now except it's Francis and he wants to break through the warding]

Kevin pops up and tries to act tough but immediately gets found out as a spy.

Rowena and Ketch flirt and make rather strained sexual innuendos for a scene while working on the ghost vacuum. You can't make me transcribe any of it! Luckily she gets called away before anybody's pants come off.

And then she apparently goes, on foot, from the high school to the warded town some five miles away. Either that or she needlessly parks really far away from her destination. Either way, it gives Francis Tumbleforya a chance to intercept her and tell her the ghosts have Kevin. Oh and Ketch gets his ass ambushed.

She meets the Winchesters in the middle of the street to deliver the news. I mean, Kevin is in the same room with the ghosts but how do they "have" him? He could blip away. This was a dorky plan from the start but I guess I relate. I, too, took a lot of AP classes in high school and I can't plan for crap.

The Winchesters meet with Francis. He sticks his hand through Kevin and turns on his heart light.

They let this go on for a weirdly long time instead of pretending to negotiate until Rowena runs into the room. She brandishes a Himalayan salt lamp at the ghosts and shouts, "Capare!" A couple get sucked in but the rest blip away. Only Kevin remains.

Everyone runs off to where the ghosts are planning to attack the warding in a mostly invisible, budget-friendly manner. Ketch shows up, too, but everyone's too busy dreading the imminent breach to notice he's not wearing his iron necklace anymore.

[Graphic: A catalog ad from GOOP dot com selling the iron necklace as a belt to keep your nethers from getting overrun with evil spirits]

He lets Rowena vacuum up a few ghosts before knocking her out. He reveals himself to be Francis Tumbleweed and says he's going to use the crystal as a bomb to knock out the warding because bad guys always talk too much about their plans. Indeed, Dean quickly shoots him in the arm and the crystal goes flying.

Dean catches it and hands it back to Rowena so she can finish Dirt-Deviling the ghosts.

Denouement. Castiel tries to heal Ketch but can't for some reason. Did he get some kind of cooties from trying to heal the godly bullet wound in Sam's shoulder? Is he just tired? Does he just hate Ketch as much as I do? Time will tell.

The Winchesters say their goodbyes to Kevin, who's decided to wander the earth like some kind of phantom Dr. Banner.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33izVlIOgnQ

"I love you guys," Kevin says. They smile at him. Like dang, say you love him too! I mean just give a guy a moment of happiness before he leaves to gradually lose his sense of self and his soul fades to nothing. Also maybe hug him. He's solid-ish.

Man, what a bummer.

In Reno, Amara is saying her goodbyes, too, but in a much sassier and satisfying away. She gets to tell her brother off and wear magenta lip stick. She mentions that he's lost so much power that he can't even leave this world without her help. Oh honey just punt him into Apocalypse World, then. Leave his ass to flounder.

We end with a bunch of ghosts (red glowing nuggets of light) trying to break into the town from the top. But like... why? They have the whole rest of the world. Why are they bothering with this mile-wide circle of real estate? The Winchesters and associates fret about how they're going to stop all the ghosts.

It's a shorter season, so they better hurry...

***

If you enjoyed the recap and are able, please visit my virtual tip jar: paypal.me/TippiBlevins or https://ko-fi.com/A4017DA

#supernatural #tippitv #recap #my recaps

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grinwolfe · 5 years ago

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Ok ok ok

I've had this fanfic in my head for a while and I'm not sure if I'll ever write it because I've never been much of a writer but I want to share my idea anyways.

It's a Lucifer/Supernatural crossover.

Let's say it starts in the supernatural universe when the boys are on a hunt, probably something like a werewolf or vampire, a cliche monster. I think it could be in any season since this would be an identical setup to the French mistake, unless we use Jack who is notoriously bad at controlling his powers.

I originally went with the idea that only Sam and Dean get sucked into Lucifer's universe, but I think Castiel getting dragged along too makes a better juxtaposition to the angels in the foreign universe. Trouble is, the monster gets sucked through too, and they land in a wide alley.

In the confusion, the monster succeeds in overpowering the boys and tearing off. They give chase, guns/machete/angel blade out until they reach the street, which is packed full of people and a few beat cops hanging around too, so they act natural and hide their weapons.

They figure out they're in Los Angeles, Sam tries to call Jack to let him know what's happened but the number is disconnected. Castiel tries to sense Jack but he can't, which naturally makes them all concerned. The brothers have contacts all over, LA is no different so one of them starts calling to find backup, since they don't have the impala with all the hunter gear and FBI disguises. Every single call is a wrong number. Up a creek without a paddle they decide to find a place where they can use a computer- internet cafe, library, wherever.

About 6 hours later, Detective Decker is called to a crime scene, Ella examining a recently savaged body and Lucifer consulting. Ella remarks on the uber weirdness, how it seems almost animalistic, the strength that would be needed to rip the poor soul apart. Lucifer cracks jokes, like he does, but not much else can be made of it until the coroner can examine further.

About 20 min previous, the boys were sitting in a cheap hotel room. While very similar to their own universe there have been enough differences for them to cotton on that they're not in Kansas anymore which they all find very distressing. Castiel is mollified to find he is still an angel and still has all his abilities. Dean bought a radio and some other supplies and has built a police scanner. As per previous supernatural episodes, they know that they will need the grace of an archangel to get back to their own universe, but they absolutely must kill the monster before they go. Sam has searched and found no mention of Hunters, Men of Letters, or monsters at all, besides the normal mythos that always exists. They pick up the call for the recently mentioned deceased, and decide to go see what's up.

They find themselves standing in the crowd of looky loos, and standing out as well since they're the tallest and wearing plaid in LA. Dean wants to pretend to be agent with the fake badge in his wallet but Sam stops him, reminding him it's a different universe and their badges might look very different from what they look like here. While they're arguing in undertones, Castiel slips under the police tape to get a closer look. He makes it about halfway there before Ella or Decker stops him, tells him off for interfering in a crime scene and to get back past the line. Cass got close enough to see that it was a monster victim and returns to the brothers, which Decker notices and makes a mental note to remember them because they were suspicious. Then the regular canvassing of the victim's friends family and coworkers starts. Ella notices a street cam aimed at the crime scene. Lucifer does... Lucifer stuff. Drama, impetuous attitudes, good ol' Luci.

The boys are feeling particularly fucked back at the hotel. No weapons, no car, no disguises, and how do you track a wandering monster in LA besides following the bodies? Castiel tries to contact Heaven on angel radio, if there is one in this universe, but he gets mixed results. There was definitely a divine influence in the world, most likely a heaven but Castiel can't be heard and what he does hear is unintelligible, possibly a difference frequency and/or code.

I'm not entirely sure on this part, but I expect Dean is drinking at a bar, alone or with any of the others. Either someone overhears that they're in trouble or they look upset enough to prompt a conversation. When they explain vaguely that what they need is nearly impossible to get and that they haven't got any friends to back them up, they are told about a nightclub owner who grants favors, occasionally the impossible one. The boys aren't sure about mingling in a foreign universe but if this man called Mr. Morningstar can get the other ingredients needed for the spell, then it can't hurt to try, can it?

Ella and Decker and Dan are reviewing the CTV footage and even though it's barely been caught in the upper left corner, its obvious this perp is acting inhuman, which they believe is a mental illness or a weird drug interaction. Once they go back to their desks Lucifer returns and Ella describes the attack as if the person was a movie monster, to which Lucifer replied that it might look that way but not to worry, his father destroyed all the monsters centuries ago.

The boys go to Lux, which is mostly empty since it's so early. A few girls are dancing, sam and cass are doubtful about getting legit help here but Dean enjoys the atmosphere. They ask the bartender for Mr. Morningstar. The bartender tells them he's not seeing anyone right now. Sam says that they need a favour. The man says they'll have better luck getting his boss's attention later tonight when all the guests come. Cass says it's urgent, a matter of life and death. The bartender reluctantly picks up the phone and calls upstairs to Lucifer's suite, who agrees to come down to deal with them.

The first thing Lucifer does when he sees them is comment on the plaid, asking if they just came from a hunting trip and asking Castiel if he is an accountant. He was going to turn them away but once seeing them in person, they were the perfect combination of weird and sexy to keep his interest. They say they hear he's the man to come to for favors and that they need supplies. Lucifer prompts them to get to the point. Sam tries to prepare him, that it sounds ridiculous but it's really important that it's all authentic. They list off the ingredients needed to send them back, sans archangel grace. Lucifer asks 'what on earth do you need all that for?' And points out that everything they've asked for is priceless if not impossible to find. He asks again what they want it for, and for that matter who are they, and the boys give up, getting up to leave because explaining that they're from another universe will just get them laughed out anyways.

Before they take a step Decker comes in and calls out 'Lucifer!' The boys freeze and Decker comes down, apologising for interrupting and Lucifer waves her apology aside. As she comes up to him to talk the boys all turn back to him, and cass pulls out his angel blade. Lucifer wonders what they are really up to, they seems to have extensive divine knowledge. They ask him if he's lucifer to which he confirms. They continue checking and confirming that he is indeed the fallen angel. Decker realizes these men were at the crime scene and sees the angel blade sticking out of the end of castiel's sleeve. Before she can say anything Dean draws his gun on Lucifer. It's all a kerfuffle, decker is trying to talk the boys down and then Maze walks in, and Castiel can see her true face so he let's everyone know, which surprises Lucifer and he asks how does cass know? Cass replies that he's an angel. Lucifer asks which one? Cass gives his name and Lucifer disagrees since knows his brother castiel and this man was not it. Maze says that cass doesnt look like an angel but he also doesn't look right as a human. Angel possession is talked about, which is in the SpN universe but not Luci's. Probably play around with the idea that Angel's in this universe can have their own bodies because they are a product of two very different beings, light and dark, while castiel is just made from light and frequency. Maze says he looks like something huge and alive got shoved up inside a human shaped jar. Sam reminds Dean that they will need Lucifer's grace to get home and they lower their weapons reluctantly.

Lucifer at some point shows off by showing his wings which astounds the boys. Castiel is urged to try it and for the first time the brothers see cass's black wings. The brothers admit that they're both working the same case, that its a monster they brought over from another universe and what its specs are- decker is getting fatigued by two revelations in one day.

Regular shenanigans continue. The boys are determined to hate Lucifer but the more time they spend with him the more they bond: dean with good food, alcohol and women, sam with insider history lore and bad jokes, castiel with Lucifer's clear affection for decker and his desire to protect humans. There will be karaoke at some point. The boys help with the case, meet Ella and hit it off. They meet Dan and really don't. There are clashes in methodology, decker sees the fake badge and the brothers explain that they dont get paid to save the world.

And I dont really know after that point. Obviously they kill the monster and get home, and that they wish they could have this Lucifer instead of theirs. Anyone is welcome to this story, if you want to do something with it. I'm great at starting but I lose interest once there's work to be done.

#fanfic #fanfiction #lucifer morningstar #lucifer #supernatural #crossover

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tinkdw · 6 years ago

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14x06: Toxic Love v Healthy Love

14x06 watching notes.

This episode we see our Cas stand-in (Jack) team up with Dean and ask him to explain what love is, with Dean explaining that he very much does know the difference between healthy romantic love and toxic romantic love (exposed this episode with the zombie boyfriend “don’t leave me, it’s better you be dead and stuck with me than leave to live your life” storyline which I’m sure has no correlation to Dean and Cas coming up where they may be separated but let each other go, I’m side eyeing you 14x08). With Yockey emphasising that the lesson he himself exposed last season of sibling toxic love (the witch sisters) has also been learned as Dean and Sam exhibit perfectly healthy, open, communicative sibling love.

And I mean... mirrors...if we get any more mirrors Dabb’s going to have to open up a funhouse on set.

- So the episode opens with a Cas visual reminder with Harper wearing a beige coat before she changes after that job of “remember Cas in this episode” is done into her *warning sign* red clothing. Beige trenchcoats in Vancouver are clearly in limited supply after SPN has decided to dress everyone in one for the Cas effect. Get yours now.

- “Mary and Bobby’s" well, that didn’t take long to be an established thing.

- To Jack nothing tastes right without his powers whereas to Cas nothing tastes right with his powers >....>

My theory as a firm endgame human!cas meta writer with the later addition that Jack is a mirror exposition of each of TFW’s arcs that Jack gets his power back because he wants and chooses it as a part of his identity and Cas decides to be human in opposition because of his own choices and identity feels like it’s being fed here. Excellent.

- Sam smiling at the fidget spinner gives me feels of a positive goof nature

- Jack feels guilty for not killing Michael while Dean feels guilty for enabling Michael and I have feels about them understanding each others’ guilt and not pushing each other to get over it but just being supportive.

- Sam and Dean COMMUNICATING! MARK THE CALENDAR! Dean knows Sam won’t be particularly happy about him taking Jack hunting but he doesn’t hide it, he calls Sam and lets him know. Sam in turn doesn’t forbid it but shows he is not happy with it. COMMUNICATION. Taking into account each others’ judgement but not stifling each other. I’m living. This is what I was saying about the toxic sibling relationship v healthy sibling relationship in my opener. Steve clearly has big feels about this just as we do and wow he’s done an amazing job at firstly highlighting it with mirrors and metaphors then slamming it home with text... side eyes all the current metaphors and mirrors being highlighted for *other themes*.

More under the cut...

- Lol @ the barn behind Dean in the diner while Jack fills in the Cas visual gap.

- Wait did they even explain where was Cas is?! Nope. Yockey didn’t even bother cos he knows how stupid anything will sound lmao. *Cas is *throws dart** is about right here lbr.

- Chuck Berry as Dean and Jack’s pseudos. I love it.

- DEAN TURNING THE COCK AWAY WHILE TALKING ABOUT SEX I CANNOT. WHERE ARE THE GIFSETS?! I NEED GIFSETS! I WILL REBLOG ALL THE GIFSETS! it literally goes from talking about courting, dating and specifically sex and dean gets awkward and turns away the cock. I MEAN. This ain’t even SUBTLE.

- Are we supposed to see the two women they interview as a couple, I’m not sure.

- Charlie’s story is A. sad AF B. Political AF. C. Super thematic to the show. She worked at Richard Enterprises as a nice callback to show Yockey knows his canon on OG Charlie, then her story is full of fanfic tropes an ultimately death. Now, I hate kill your gays as much as anyone but I don’t think this is what Steve’s doing here, he literally can’t have her gf alive here. Now could Charlie go off to find her in this world? That would be brilliant.

- Did dean just call sam Thelma lol

- So Jack says he has no understanding of romance despite seeing Dean and Cas doing “googly eyes” each other to death and saying he knows this means someone loves you.

So Jack is the one who doesn’t know as the Destiel romance GA stand in where they figure it out but so does he so they don’t feel stupid as there’s someone on screen who’s like oooooooh I see now! So Sam can have the role of “I knew all along I just didn’t want to force you out of your comfort zone or get involved in things that don’t concern me” just as he did with Mary/Bobby last episode and which explains all his “strictly into Dick” “maybe you’re overcompensating” “because it’s Cas” lines from previously. Brilliant. Please continue.

- “Old man” good cop bad cop with sass. Jack, I love you.

- Jack doing all the OG Hunter tricks I love it. Again Yockey telling us he knows canon and knows what he’s fucking doing. Good lad.

- Sam: “people need people, we’re social animals”. Yockey and Dabb laying down what BS it is that Sam and Dean want to be alone just the two of them nearly every episode now is just the best. Sam wants people around him, now imo he’s not necessarily telling Charlie she should stay a hunter, just that it would be a real shame for her to ostracise herself on top of a mountain with wifi all alone. He gets that, he gets the escapism after all the trauma but he wants to help her and thinks she would be better off surrounded by others, my family and friends and he’s offering this to her and well, he knows this is what helps from his own experience. He’s living this change and seeing the benefits for himself. Just. So much yes.

- I also love that Charlie’s personality is part similar to ours but also part totally different because she’s not the same. Good, thank you Yockey. She’s not a replacement for our Charlie. No matter how hard Bucklemming may try and think they “fixed” her original death. She ain’t our Charlie and they haven’t fixed it. We are grateful to have some semblance of her but you are not forgiven for your complete lack of credibility, writing skills and total problematic behaviour regarding both her and all the other things you’ve done just by giving us an AU version of Charlie.

- So Harper is evil, quelle surprise. She exposes a codependent and unhealthily toxic relationship where she preferred to kill her boyfriend and tie him to her, having him literally kill and eat others rather than just let him go and live his life. So, I will write a separate post about this because I think it is the theme of the episode but this heavily reminds me of Yockey’s witch sisters being a dark Sam and Dean mirror of toxic sibling love last seasons, emphasising their choice to be toxic or healthy, with them now exhibiting all the healthy and rejecting the toxic behaviours.

So who is Harper and her boyfriend a dark romantic love mirror of now then with them potentially soon to choose a healthy route instead in direct opposition and one of them letting the other go, hmmmm I wonder...

x Just getting this gif out again cos well I’m sorry but Cas wasn’t even in this episode or last or last last yet he’s all over them with not just human!Cas stuff here but also all the Destiel like wow... it’s impressive tbh.

- Meanwhile Dean is dishing out healthy relationship advice. Again this feels relevant to Cas’ recent admittal to Nick that he had to “eat” someone to live in a way ie possess Jimmy for his body. This feels even more like a metaphor for his giving up his grace and exposing Cas again as not this but having his own body now created by Chuck just as everyone else does. Just in case people want to continue to use this argument against him and Destiel with the necrophilia rubbish which is already totally disproved but again rears its head in a “clearly this is not the same as that” way with actual dark mirror necrophiliac toxic love going on.

- Okay so we have more blatant overt textualised metaphors with the word “metaphor” in the text with Charlie v the big fly. They really are hammering home the concept of “pay attention to metaphors and mirrors people” this season. Wowzers.

- Next week’s promo also gives us another mirror with Jack driving the impala and telling Dean “it’s like I’m you!” “no it isn’t”. Honestly, is this a memo that they have to do this every episode because I approve. Knock that memo home.

- I would also like to point out as @margarittet reminded me, the queer story in this episode (Charlie x her girlfriend) is beautiful and positive though tragic due to outside circumstances and the heterosexual story is toxic and gross with codependency, necrophilia and murder by Harper’s own choice. This isn’t to say it’s anti hetero it’s just making a point that it doesn’t matter who you love it’s what you do with it and who you are that counts.

And isn’t that a beautiful way to end this.

#spn 14x06 #spn 14x06 meta #tinks meta #watching notes #supernatural #destiel #salmon dean #dean winchester #sam winchester #castiel #human!cas #steve yockey #bi!dean

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elizabethrobertajones · 6 years ago

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14x04 watching notes

Happy Birthday, Davy!

Mittens just ominously warned me to warm up this notepad while I waited for the episode to finish downloading.

The nice guy from the phone provider has recently restored our internet after 4 days of radio silence from me, but it's only about 4'o clock on friday, so really some good timing!

Expectations: pre-mittens warning, Davy back on his nonsense with the scary episodes and expected nonsense of sinking back into MotW after mytharc but in capable hands because, you know, new writing team is aces and all.

post-mittens warning: idk but I should get a stuffed toy?

That's a suspicious amount of ghost lore.

Has Heaven started dumping the spirits out now and if it really IS a ghost it's not going to behave properly?

Oh my god it's a Hell Hazers poster.

There was something I would have talked about pre-episode but had no internet so didn't, but the focus on Dean and nerds and the expectation that this episode would be about a comic book store, did remind me of 9x07 and the action figure which was all "i clobber evil!" and was a strong Dean mirror, including that he needlessly burned it on the stove to try and get rid of the ghost of the mom but it turned out she needed to be talked into letting her son let her go in a scene which has all sorts of shades of Dean vs Mary in 12x22 now and also Dean's entire mark of cain arc was in the self-destruction of his self as an action figure that clobbered evil. A reminder that Dean is this figure seems fairly timely with him coming down from being possessed, as of course he has been used as an action figure. And his willingness to turn himself into one in 13x23 was very much turning himself into the Michael Sword, which in this cosmos is practically like the rarest collectible action figure of the universe. This harks back all the way to the first season and Dean's issues with John's control and the whole blunt little instrument arc, also something that fed directly into demon!Dean, and is being reflected this season in Nick, who murdered a guy with a hammer, after his family was murdered by a hammer, and said yes to Lucifer because of all that angst about hammer murder. Subtle.

Anyway, this is sort of the emotional background to me for action figures in the show.

A Hell Hazers poster also reminds us that Dean is a horror fan, his own connections to the genre, a CLASSIC episode, and a time when he was living his best life briefly.

You know, before he sold his soul for *waves at previous big paragraph* reasons

Fitting for how season 13 ended with Dean this close to happy world peace retirement living his best life :P

Awww the fake movie the MotW comes from is called All Saints Day. Davyyy :')

People I know who are born on like October SECOND consider themselves extra spooky halloween people. I can only imagine what it does, as a 23rd Oct. birthday person, to the psyche to actually be born ON it.

This episode's subtitle is just "Lol I have the best birthday, fuckers"

ACTUAL CLIP FROM 2x18!

And the fucking racist truck >.> Which in-universe was teased as another different movie using the footage in the trailer for Hell Hazers II.

My mum has that exact Wonder Woman figure

This guy is wearing a trenchcoat-featured jacket with a maroon t-shirt under it. I could not tell you what he represents but the trenchcoat part is amusing.

I can't *actually* start saying everything is party!Cas symbolism though so I'll just shush

Er this rando that people were saying was dressed like Sam from the promo images literally is called Sam, and she's wearing a very very loud checkered shirt, of course featuring a lot of orange. I'm guessing with that info it's next to impossible to say she ISN'T in some way a Sam parallel :P

Comic Book Guy is possibly caught in the middle of stealing an action figure, and I can't work out if he is just nervous about that or has a crush on Sam because his behaviour was so suspect, but from the promo scene where he looks a lil worse for the wear he talks about breaking up with his goth gf, and Sam is very clearly a nerd, not a goth.

(Goth nerds are things. The media will get there one day :P)

Oh okay after a few lines of the exchange, yeah this guy is a dick, I have NO clue why he's wearing that coat symbolism wise, and Sam really ought to fire him because wow, uncool and also he seems to be a stereotypical nerdbro gatekeeper who would literally rather scare off customers but be right than just enjoy what they all enjoy together.

Then he apologises for getting angry for saying he just gets spun out sometimes. Honestly, this seems to be crossing over into Dean territory considering the last thing from the recap was Dean being told he was like Michael by Bad Kaia and being really angry when he said he was nothing like him... He also used "spun out" about himself in 12x20 but in rather more tragic lost-Cas circumstances but obviously this parallel has a different lesson to tell than just making them equivalent. This guy is so awful and is using his anger in a petty way over things that don't really matter. He's getting spun out over made up battles rather than real angst, and whether he has his own underlying trauma that makes him behave that way or not, the straight white nerd is one of the secondary main villains of the century so far after the literal alt right, with some overlap of course. Think Kylo Ren as one of the dominant critiques of this behaviour :P Compared to the open of 8x11 for example, where the nerds were harmless weirdoes despite also being straight white and obsessive, the aggression and obsession are played not just as a harmless trait of people who like LARPing and collecting toys, but gatekeep, yell at kids over superman facts, and refuse to have their own dominance challenged.

Thinking he could fight superman might actually explain the Cas like jacket - it's too short to be a coat - that he idealises these heroes, is wearing Batman (who in pop culture most recently was around "v superman") and Cas of course has all his superman comparisons from both 6x20, and his rebirth in 12x01 where he came back to earth as a fiery comet and was immediately mistaken for a spaceman. There's some dark idolisation/mirroring here, that he's debating how to fight the guy (krytonite gloves = the BMoL knuckledusters) and at the same time mirroring the show's Superman in his dress. Only much, much lesser. More subtextual mockery about his weakness and how he doesn't really measure up.

I think in a lot of ways the discourse about nerds in pop culture is moving on now to make this difference clear, that the ones who will be mocked are the ones who deserve it for being too cruel to respect, while in many other ways the mainstreaming of nerd culture into pop culture, meaning a large amount of it is no longer mockable, that everyone had at least SOME nerdy indulgences, means that in general nerdom is more accepted and exalted than ever. SPN obviously having its own deep roots into nerd culture has some direct room for commentary here, and this is also a way of reminding its own fans to be cool and not to be this guy.

Oh, huh, he safely exited the shop. I did not see that coming.

LOL he has batman bedding on a fold out bed in either a shed, garage or basement where he lives.

(This detail was tragic in Attack the Block but it's quite clear in this case the guy is fully grown and is being used as a detail to show his forward progression in life)

Wow, you really have some rage issues here. Especially trying to wrangle free pizza i mean dude. Talk about a line that personifies him 100 different ways in one go :P Who shouts at their pizza delivery place?? They remember your number! This is how to get extra toppings.

Oh my god please get beaten to death by this lil guy

(I know I know he survives he's in the promo)

Is this like... haunted kidney episode... but better?

Actually, Fallen Idols plus Mannequin episode but better.

You know how we saw in the last new year? Watching Small Soldiers for the first time since like the 90s or whenever it came out

The show's animation is so much better

Than Small Soldiers and itself from past years

Oh DEAN

I mean he totally deserves a day off.

I can't believe he owns these socks. Who got them for him for Christmas?

Okay, well first we have to work out which was the last Christmas they had where they were not in prison or in an alternate dimension or dead or -

Cas. It was Cas.

He literally had no idea this wasn't just a cute commentary on how much Chinese take out Dean eats

Anyway as far as I can tell Dean is living out the bisexualdemondean header just to spite Michael for defiling his temple. He's filling it with noods and pizza (and I am sure he didn't yell at the delivery guy, but tipped him well instead for making drop offs at a shady street corner miles from where anyone lives)

Honestly it's been 12 years since Hell Hazers II... What took them so long

Dean's drunk a full thing of Margiekugle mom beer, which is a lil worrying just in terms of him using it instead of comfort from her like in 12x02, now that she's back.

God I want Dean to meet the asshole from the comic shop and for him to get into a dick measuring contest about Hell Hazers II and Dean to be like uh I WORKED on it you ass

Er, does that vending machine contain the nougat of choice of your consumptive son on the other side of the wall?

(who may be out with Cas concealing his consumption on a case so not bothered by all this TV noise)

God I love and have missed Dean, my trashy guy who is sitting hugging a pillow like a teen girl at a sleepover to watch his hatchetman slasher to celebrate being back to himself and get the much-needed R&R, since, you know, last time we saw him he threatened to "break" Kaia and was in a very very bad place (lol)

This guy about to get murdered for trying to snatch a nougat bar is dressed like the unfortunate bandmate (Tommy?) to Vincifer. Is this an oblique Ladyheart reference to set up a weird scenario where Hatchetman is punishing a Lucifer-adjacent asshole for trying to steal Nougat?

I can't believe there's a red exit sign behind him which means Wanek is Waneking in multiple dimensions at once

"Mint Condition" flashes up over Dean indulging in his pizza, saying, hey look it's our guy back in shape. Or, you know, ironically so. Either because Dean being Dean means eating junk food and wallowing because his husband has wandered off with the kid and isn't home to snuggle him while he does this mandatory bedrest, or because, of course, Dean is not Mint Condition at all. He's literally and emotionally scarred.

I am pretty sure this shirt that Sam has on is 12 years old.

Statistically, they're gonna get murdered in each and every one of their original Kripke era shirts until none of them are available to be murdered in later.

I say for no particular reason.

Leave Sam alone. He doesn't shave you mock him, he does shave, you... also mock him. He was doing really well while you were gone! No one got even slightly stabbed who didn't deserve it! This is an all-time record. A beard is a price to pay for that.

Honestly I think Dean is stoned but they're not going to say so but I am treating this scene like it is.

"I wanted to check up on you," Sam says, pulling over a chair. This is so like how he was in 14x01 when he was powering around the Bunker being the boss, and given Dean's been on bedrest, again, much-needed, Sam is treating him like another one of his charges, and once more is in a position of authority... But now, despite shaving to act like nothing has changed a bit more, he is the one in charge of Dean as one of his wards. Everything has changed. Your dynamic is actually wobbling in a weird way.

In season 10 when Dean was laid up with the Mark blues especially around 10x12, which this intro also reminds me of, re: Dean spending a week in his room and Sam popping in to check on him, Sam was still keeping a very wary eye on Dean more that he was a bomb that may explode, and that while he needed to be managed, the power dynamic was extremely, extremely horrifying in that if Sam messed up Dean would murder him. Not an ongoing implicit threat between them, but the knowledge that Dean could become a demon again and demon!Dean would attempt to kill Sam, and so Sam had better do his utmost to keep Dean in a good place. Even if it eventually meant a series of convoluted secrets to try and fix him against his wishes.

Obviously, things are different here. Sam has developed a LOT since then, with season 11 beginning a recovery of his character in tentative little steps which actually kicked off in season 12, and, specifically, in 12x04 under Davy Perez in American Nightmare heralding the new era of Sam focus and lovingly stroking his hair and lavishing him with Sam-sculpted episodes the like of which we hadn't seen all through Carver era.

Now when Sam comes into Dean's room and pulls up a chair and sits down to check up on him, he actually radiates a comfortable, competent authority to do so.

... however he is doing it in that pink shirt which I honestly love the concept of but just wish that I couldn't see Sam in 2x06 showing up in it for the first time, like, my brain is just screaming at him to go get a bunch more pink shirts and refresh his wardrobe

I'm so certain of it but now I have to check because 12 years is such a long time but

http://www.homeofthenutty.com/supernatural/screencaps/albums/SPN2x06/SPN_0060.jpg

Mittens yelled "OH MY GOD" when I sent her the link so I think I'm right

Like, conceptually in every way it's great because it's this long pink shirt that fits him well, fuck toxic masculinity, blah blah action heroes in pink shirts, love it love it love it, but also: it's another fucking plaid shirt Sam has owned since he was a gap-toothed child six years younger than Jack presents as

Dean is lacking his second bedside table, as he has been for seasons, but I'm just staring at him lying sideways on his bed, wondering about his set up, and if this is in any way similar to how he watched all those cowboy movies with Cas, since Davy, of course, was the one to suggest that they had been watching movies together.

"And... not that I'm complaining... House is full of strangers"

Yeah, we know you hate it, Dean. God, it's tragic. In a wonderful way. Sam's built this little empire for himself and it's on top of Dean's old nesting spot. Dean's been forced into his room not just to hide away because he's ashamed but because he doesn't want to be seen and there's too many strange eyes out there. However this resolves, it's going to force some growth. Honestly, as much as Dean loves this room and it means to us, it's also a bleak lonely spot and in the like 7 years they've had the Bunker, Dean's never hooked up in that bed, while it has come to be very much like, well... The bed of an angry nerd living in a basement still using Batman sheets. Again, dark parallels, but of Dean in a dark place.

I'd love if he moved out and got a house in the suburbs.

I mean.

Cas has a house in the suburbs.

(Re: long-running Lizzy watching notes in-jokes about where he stashes a bunch of stuff like demon tablets, first blades, metatron's grace, etc etc)

But yeah, no. I like the idea of Dean nesting, of course. But aside from the obvious conveniences, the Dean Cave, etc, there's no reason it HAS to be here except that this is their inheritance and it's safe. But as I constantly talk about with the library abutting the war room, the work/life balance is always in question and filling the Bunker with strangers is a great way to shove all the life balance out, and leave the only spot left of that to Dean in this room.

If the AU peeps don't all get sent home but remain at least in part a hunter community and maybe even network and grow as the Winchesters finally open up the Bunker's resources and share them and stop being all isolated like Carver era fiercely protected... Dean might have no choice but to move his nesting down the road to somewhere with a sofa where he can park his car out front, and choose to commute in to work.

Awww they have the "our lives are a scary movie" argument again, in a well-worn way. So well-worn this is repeating dialogue from somewhere or other... 2x18? 4x07? God I don't know, implicit in Sam's eyerolling at Halloween in 1x01? All of the above? I am not looking that up. But anyway their stances haven't moved, possibly because this is something that has never really been challenged before. If Sam didn't hate scary movies already, watching 18 hours of Hell Hazers II dailies probably did in any remaining sympathy he would have had towards them, while Dean thrived there.

I guess he may finally have had time to watch it?

And of course stay for the credits to see his name.

Anyway Dean has historically cited movies as research or job adjacent, or vicariously enjoyed watching monsters at work from the safe remove of a screen, while Sam throws it all in to that box where of course it goes to 1x01 where he's running away from ALL of it and has his oddly specific choices to avoid halloween in his day to day as Lawboy. He's struggled to indulge in the weird as a hobby, likes serial killers as, as far as we can diagnose, an outlet of darkness but purely human, and keeps the work/life balance in a rather unhealthy way of denial and boxing things away, because so much of his early seasons arcs were about resisting the life and refusing the call. This harks back to their literal first episode characterisations of Dean being all in and Sam being all out and it's interesting to have us back here in season 14, in a period of such deep reflection, when Sam has finally sort of accepted the life, found a niche in the work that suits him as the boss, and Dean is struggling now with retirement questions, and taking a week off, not liking his home full of strangers, etc etc.

"More Michael Monsters?" Dean asks immediately quick fire when Sam says he has a case.

He may have taken a week off to indulge in pizza but that obsession lurks under his skin. He's in no way done, though I think perhaps better prepared to enter this case than he had been, though of course he's billed as still struggling.

Dean also instantly recognises the Thundercats name, and I'm afraid it's something I'm just not familiar with, that I clearly missed some wave of it when I was younger and it hasn't come back around as an adult... I can't wait to read stuff by people who know more about it and say tragic things about Dean's connection to it. But the important thing here is the dark mirror to the guy who got beat up by the toy, because Dean is being shown as also an enthusiastic nerd who knows the franchise and is excited by this concept and is leaping into a case about it with a "strippers, Sammy. Finally!" level of enthusiasm.

Healthy nerds and unhealthy nerds. But at the same time, Dean might be a better nerd, but his anger last episode is still being examined through this guy.

I love that for Sam and Dean, dressing up for Halloween is dressing up like total nerds in a totally different pop culture way - the old appearance of geeks which is wildly outdated but damned if they aren't putting on pocket protectors anyway. It's a caricature but it's one that is at total odds with who they are as people... More of a traditional halloween thing where normally Sam and Dean are really scary people with weapons, so when you make them dress all topsy turvy, they dress like this instead. They ARE halloween costumes, in their day to day.

Dean continues watching in the shop, Sam eyes up the Red Hood.

I watched that a million years ago with no idea that Jensen was in it, though I had watched the first couple of seasons at that point. I think it was during my "aww the show was cancelled" phase where it was completely off my radar. It's hilarious to me now, because I don't think I COULD watch it, now I know Jensen's voice so disproportionately well. It would be so off-putting.

"She's like your twin."

Sam and Sam both tuck their hair behind their ears at the same moment.

"What are you talking about?"

So. This is going to be extremely subtle.

I hope New Sam survives the episode D:

Sam points out the other guy who people were saying based off the promo pics would be the Dean to this girl's Sam with no idea what was to come. He and Dean in this case are both eating lollipops purloined from the halloween candy.

I guess this guy in the All Saints Day t-shirt shares Dean's love of the same franchise, and seems to represent the bizarre venn diagram with Dean on one side and Andrew Dabb on the other. Their nerdy overlap.

I feel like Sam is just pointing out this character mirror to be an annoying sibling and wow do I love seeing them like this.

I also feel like there is no way Davy would do this if he wasn't about to troll the fuck out of us with these parallels in some terrifying meta way and pointing out that character parallels are a thing this blatantly is about to be Awful somehow.

The Red Hood is staring disapprovingly at them through all of this

Anyway of course Dean Parallel immediately recognises Dean's enthusiasm for Hatchetman and encourages him to press the button, which Dean does with glee. I CLOBBER EVIL. Wait no.

Sometimes we do bad things.

Oh dear.

Oh deeeeeeeeeeear.

Yeah, Hatchetman is like... idk, michael!Dean or something. Or some dark part of Dean where all his violence is and this twisted version is almost like the burned result of the I Clobber Evil hero being melted by Dean and - too meta, I am in pain.

"Vintage hot wheels!"

I know what you want because I have a smol 67 impala on my shelf. Nyoom.

He has an eeny weenie mystery machiney so he can make them race.

Okay guy who got beat up by a toy is called Stuart (I am so bad at names, honestly.)

Of course he got kicked out by his roomie for being insufferable about something as pointless as subs vs dubs, and Sam is already apologising for him before they even go meet him.

Considering there's 3 people working at the shop and Stuart had a trenchcoat, but is also being mirrored to Dean, darkly, I feel like there might be some serious shuffling going on here that surface level, Stuart had that Cas marker, but... yeah

Heeee Dean stealing the Flash mug and making Sam have the one with the cats all over it. One mug representing Stuart, one representing his mum.

I mean it is Sam's turn to have a relationship with THEIR mom this season. Idk if the mugs are actually symbolic over anything other than Dean living his best geek life right now.

I mean he's added the glasses to his ensemble, he's really living it up.

I hope he's still wearing Send Noods under this

Awww it's hot apple cider. What a good mom. This is a perfect halloween drink.

*Stuart Rage Sounds from below*

Wow this is subtle that he has some rage issues.

"Campbell and sons insurance" Hey remember when I said that this whole season's emotional set up with Sam's ownership of the AU peeps reminded me of season 6 and the Campbells? They also literally are the sons of Mary Campbell, so.

No lies, at least, with some serious stretching of the truth.

God, the detail that Dean has played Zelda.

He's being nerdy out loud constantly, and without much fear of judgement. It's wonderful. I guess he's been jostled up enough by Michael that he doesn't really care to hide this random pointless thing that in the grand scheme why should he be ashamed, and also he feels so much worse about other things that this is just an escape to have fun. It also reminds me of last season when he was mourning Cas except that this indulgence Sam is allowing him is co-sponsored by Dean and he's throwing himself into enjoying the smaller things and being more openly Dean-ish than he has in a while. Like, I don't think character comparisons to 8x11 for the nerds is the only way the episodes link :P

In 8x11 Dean's initial reaction to LARPing is that it looks awesome, then he corrects at a look from Sam to being more judgy. In 9x04 as scripted, Sam is surprised that Dean want to read Game of Thrones. So idk if that's just Robbie character interpretations since my 2 surface level examples are from his episodes or if that's just been where open nerdery has lived in past years, but anyway. Sam isn't stopping Dean from indulging in the same way - it seems he also recognises Dean's nerdiness and is less threatened by it than before, in the sense that he doesn't feel like Dean isn't acting himself, but now accepts the nerdiness is a part of Dean.

"Who needs goth girl drama" dude you are the most awful over-dramatic asshole on the show now Lucifer is dead

LOL he's trying to lie about being attacked by a toy now, and Dean points out that he got whooped so thoroughly he was beaten on the back and genitals - so yeah we look at his face and wiiiiince

"Lady you wasn't kidding."

"Big Bang in there..."

Goodness are we calling out the Big Bang theory for its toxic nerdery? Love it.

Sam and Dean halloween costumed as total nerds, still driving around in the Impala. The reverse of someone rolling up in a boring old modern car and, like, a bunch of Draculas get out.

Sam can shave off the beard but it can't stop him Bobby-ing

Dean side-eyes this

"Yeah, it was Riley, he'll be fine."

"I don't know who Riley is, but cool."

God, I am so into this whole dynamic.

Tell me more, Davy.

"So seriously, what is your deal with halloween?"

"I don't like it"

Dean, I am watching this episode on November 2nd, just so you know.

Anyway. This is literally. 1x01's opening adult Sam moment. But Dean's going back to poke Sam about it since he's someone Sam won't lie to in the same way that Sam was concealing his entire being from Jess. I mean this isn't subtle - in 1x01 Dean calls Sam out for doing this. But then, Sam doesn't exactly develop beyond it - in season 8 he does this with Amelia.

Because obviously if Sam is going to move forward and develop there's still things which are not addressed. And if Dean is having his idea of home and work challenged, and his nest disrupted until perhaps he will fly it... Sam has never ever actually addressed his work/life balance in the meaningful way where... like... this was how his difference was introduced when we first ever meet lil babby Sam smiling innocently at us on screen as a kid who has the whole future ahead of him and no idea what torment he's gonna go through. 14 years later, if he's ever going to be a grown up who can handle himself in a relationship and know what is work and what is life and how he can watch halloween movies and not feel personally offended by them but enjoy them as a fantasy and a way of boxing off their world into a safe place they don't have personal responsibility for...

Maybe he might just get a girlfriend who he can tell he is a hunter. Like. Dude. Dean was past that step before the show ever STARTED thanks to his time with Cassie.

Sam, also, metaphorically is an angry guy living in his mom's basement, but perhaps in a more metaphorical way where it's to do with living his whole life under the shadow of his mom horrifically dying as a result of the supernatural and being brought up feeling like a freak and just wanting to be normal and all

wheeee

Anyway Dean is probing for actual answers so I assume Davy will give us a solution to this this episode, but this is my take on it before we get into it properly.

Alternative hypothesis: Davy is personally offended that Sam doesn't like halloween despite it being the best holiday, is determined to fix that and fuck canon, characters can change even 14 years later.

"Don't give me this 'every day is halloween' crap because one it aint, we don't eat that much candy"

I have missed Dean and I love him with every fibre of my being, brb I need to vibrate out of existence at the sheer joy of knowing him

That was the worst "we aren't here staking out your house" move I have ever seen.

You are professionals who have been doing this together for 14 years

why was that so laughably bad?

The youtube comments are so cutting and a bunch of them are unfortunately true. It's self-awareness of using the loser nerd trope but also, cutting in a way because of course Stuart is coming across so much as someone who deserves it - and we're starting to see his mom is sweet and doesn't seem to have caused any trauma in a surface read, and that he was the one who dumped his online gf, and he starts other fights at work or with roomies, so this is getting more and more into territory where he seems fully to blame for his own situation, and therefore you CAN mock him for living in mom's basement, because he PUT himself there, and is single because he chose to be, and so on. The pervading sense that if he was a nicer person, none of this would be happening to him, right down to him stealing the toy in the first place.

Oh boy, the bloody handprint on the wall... We are back in handprint territory, and, you know, maybe because SOMEONE walking past it has been scarred on the wrong shoulder by the actions of an angel or something

There's a chinese take out carton on the shelf in this basement. I doubt it's a collectible.

Send noods.

Okay, that's sort of weird.

If the mom is in costume I don't get the reference. I hope someone else has handled that.

We're going to get her POV on her loser son now, I guess.

"Everything's fine :)" *leaves the room* "everything is not fine!"

Are we calling them out for using "fine" so loosely again too huh?

(Side note: Jack saying he's fine while consumptive, and yeah I am still upset about that. What are you doing to the boy????)

Dean and Sam split up and as Sam walks off a nurse eyes him up and smiles. No idea how intentional that was but I mean, can you blame her? :P

You know, I don't know anything about this franchise, but Sam just jumped to see a toy of a guy who looks weirdly similar to the vampires that ATE HIM a few weeks ago.

He checks over his shoulder in case Dean manifested at his side just in time to see that

Awww Dean and New Dean meet. "he must have awesome insurance"

He calls Stuart's mom "Babs" which is hilarious. They seem close.

New Dean has issues with his dad and Stuart lets him crash with him no questions asked. I suppose Dean isn't going to think too hard about how Sam's choice for his parallel has issues with his dad.

This forgiveness for Stuart's behaviour because he's kind to his own people is a very TFW trait, which makes New Dean more like Sam or Cas forgiving Dean his outbursts, as he's by far the ragiest of them, with Cas trailing in second and Sam the zen fucking master.

Lol Dean and New Dean are both dragged into the room to watch All Saints Day 3 like they're being pulled in on a line

Oh dear, they're bonding.

Davy isn't usually on top of these things but he's channeling a lot of Edlund today and Edlund always had these sort of guys like Andy or Aaron who are so Dean's type in a harmless shared interests and getting stoned together way. This is a bit extreme with the guy's tininess and scruffiness but you know, we'll see how this develops, if it's an accidental twins or a missed connections soulmate dealio.

... You're taking to someone who's still bitter that Andy and Dean would have been perfect together, so.

Also this New Dean guy is demonstrating how to be a Good Fan - he may be as intensely nerdy as Stuart, but he and Dean can compare movies and even though they don't share a favourite, agree that the whole series is great and can see the merits both in each other's favourites, and in another movie that isn't either of their favourites but could be if they happened to be inclined that way.

So healthy :')

"It was always nice to check out. I like watching movies where I KNOW the bad guy's going to lose"

Ow ow ow. But yeah, there's Dean's pro-Halloween rationale, that the tropeyness of the genre has its comforts that every ridiculous horror thing is entirely safe and no one is ACTUALLY going to get eaten by any of these things. Which is also how normal people enjoy horror but at the metaphorical remove of being scared by things we may not literally meet but still represent anxieties we might have in our real lives.

Catharsis, yo

Sam barges in on New Sam to ask her the usual series of increasingly weird questions which get the "are you really insurance?" eyebrows.

"Downtown Salem" - are they in Salem as in the witch hunt one?

I kinda love how New Sam is talking with a speech bubble beside her. So meta.

I think New Dean is called Dirk.

Oops Stuart wasn't one of the co-owners because he kept getting fired for stealing D: Stuart, dude.

"And you hired Stuart back?" "he's my friend"

I think there is commentary appearing here about not just Stuart's unhealthy explosive rage, but that the people around him enable it - even Jordan fired him TWICE rather than banish him forever. The cycle of coddling him without encouraging him to change... Again, this speaks rather more of season 10 and a critique of Sam n Cas from there rather than much currently ongoing with Dean. Sam was complicit in originally abducting Kaia and he and Jody didn't move to stop Dean with Bad Kaia, so though it's in the focus as a critique on Dean's reactions, I feel like the real bad cycles were in Carver era. Though the behaviour still somewhat exists in Dabb era, the overall unhealthiness has declined so much, there isn't a constant oppresive blanket of it as there is here in this shop with Stuart being so awful to everyone and self-destructive.

(It's probably also not a coincidence that this thing has latched onto Dean as well, a la 4x06 I'd guess... Sam got no ghost vibes in the basement, Dean did, and was attacked... To me this is seeming to suggest that his current state has picked up the ghost's ire in the same way in 4x06 he was vulnerable. Loops and loops of things going on so I'll unpick that later if it does turn out to be the case clearly.)

Anyway. This seems to be more about destructive cycles and abusive dynamics, and I would hope a nudge for Dean, though his exile at the start of this episode also suggests to me he knew full well after threatening Kaia that he'd overreacted and needed to take 5, even if there was also a layer of sulking until news of Michael. Her call out was clear enough to make him self-reflect. So I would hope that this episode is here to try and steer Dean's reaction through various pathways, ideally to keep him from falling into anything too awful, as a reminder of where this may lead?

Sam sees the glass case freeze over, and pulls out the EMF, playing it off and being like "nothing... carbon monoxide detector" even as New Sam is understandably a little freaked.

Is this messing with Sam's refusal to tell Jess about monsters by having him keep the truth from New Sam until she's physically endangered?

I mean, carbon monoxide in enough quantities to make the blatantly homemade gadget go "WHEEE" and light up every single LED is a good enough reason to flee the room

"I think you're in danger -" Sam is smacked around the head by Hatchetman because he delayed too long and now he has been knocked out

"Samantha?" Sam determined not to let New Sam out-Sam him

I mean if she is you then she has been knocked out

How does this keep happening to you

how much head trauma has Cas healed over the years?

This is why they have to keep him an angel...

"Is this expensive?" "Wha - no don't!" *BOING* *silence* "yeeeah it's shatterproof glass"

If Jordan really just wants to kill Stuart for getting them a 1 star Yelp review then this also has a weird shade of 11x07 where the ghost was getting revenge and took a few attempts to kill that one guy, eventually succeeding as the clown.

Except the clown was tuned to freak Sam out

and Dean's probably gonna be thrilled to fight Hatchetman

Dean having movie night with new Dean (probably stoned but we can't see it) with comatose Stuart in the middle

incredible

2 dudes watching horror movies 5 feet apart with a comatose guy in the middle because they aren't gay

Dean is thrilled to fight Hatchetman

I feel like this can't last

Davy throws in a gratuitous Halloween moment of Hatchetman walking through the park which is just bedecked in Halloween nonsense

no one cares about him wandering around because it's Halloween

It does make you wonder just HOW much nonsense happening on Halloween really is monsters and stuff out there enjoying themselves because it's expected, which, again, like Sam n Dean dressing up as nerds for this whole episode, having monsters mixing with regular folk and being treated as equals is literally the whole Halloween thing. There's less threat than in 4x07 because we're assuming at this point in the episode that the ghost does have a pretty one-track mind about killing Stuart because with all the characterising nonsense filling the episode the actual plot has been pretty sparse considering we're getting to the final 10 minute run now. So, yeah. This Hatchetman ghost is just out there being a part of the festivities, because that's what happens on Halloween, man

LOL And like Sam not telling his double until it was too late, Dean gets this call and is really open in answering in front of new Dean, and now he's filling in New Dean on everything instead of trying to get him to leave or protect him not just from the monster but from knowing about it at all.

Davy like, hey, remember when ghosts used to do loads of freaky stuff on this show just to be scary? And maybe it seemed like you all were getting bored of it or something, but hey this guy has no idea after 14 years that he shouldn't leave the salt line when everything starts thumping in the room despite having been warned the ghost is coming...

Hehehe Dean gets an axe... The moment of him going to smash it then not and checking if it's open... Whether that was improv or not, it's a good character thing in the sense that Dean is being encouraged not to smash first and ask questions later by the meta plot of the episode

Omg New Dean is as brave as our Dean in some ways... He sees Babs in trouble, and immediately is like "HEY" and starts confronting Jordon in Hatchetman

"He's MY friend. He's OUR friend." That's an interesting take on my/our, because that statement works on both levels - both that Dirk is protective of Stuart because he cares about him, but also that Jordan has his own investment in not killing Stuart that he should remember. In terms of emotional appeal, the first is confrontational while the second is the deep appeal to the ghost.

Filed in the deep deep deep deep deep flips of the crypt scenes, this moment demonstrates about 3 different kinds of flips, while still holding true to possessing thing out of its right mind confronting loved one

Omg the hospital security guards watching the Hatchetman chase a damsel through the hospital while New Dean is chased through THEIR hospital. Talk about dramatic irony and a whole commentary on the metaness of Dabb era in the story reversals and extractions to new levels and repurposing of scenes and narratives...

And despite it playing out scene by scene, the guards are laughing at the bad dialogue and pointing out how Hatchetman is so slow, so how can he even catch them, while the damsel slows herself down and badly fakes a trip so that he can catch up to her...

"We killed you! You're dead!" "We all do bad things sometimes"

And there we get the context for the cool quote the Hatchetman model can recite - just as how in fandom often things are quoted out of context as lines which seem emotional or special but are actually awful. Just for starters, all the Sam n Dean fans using "there aint no me if there aint no you" when Dean didn't even SAY that. Now we see the context of this line, we see that while Hatchetman really isn't deep, he's at least not just saying it to sound cool and talk about himself, he's judging the protagonist for her behaviour, as well as invoking relative morality. Which brings up some interesting ideas about what Hatchetman considers good and evil, in regards to seeming to have a concept of it but not including kill himself as a good thing to do. Obviously completely wild in context but in the philosophical language of the show, the nature of monsters and all is one huge question, along with if Sam and Dean are murderers themselves, and of course how they have done bad things for good reasons and vice versa.

Also I think Sam is about to blow up the door?

"I had a messed up childhood" he says, about to blow up a vintage SCOOBY DOO lunchbox to freedom.

SAMMY. Stop destroying symbols of childhood.

At least he's talking freely to New Sam about himself, which is probably already more than he ever let on to Jess. He really wanted to pretend to be well-adjusted to her, that he probably, like, would have rather waited for a locksmith with her than just pick the door to their apartment if they were locked out, you know?

RIP Scooby Doo.

"Cool" they both say, and share a smile.

It's probably weird to ship Sam and Sam just because the shipname is Sam

Dirk went to hide in the fucking Morgue

well done

Okay I need the security guards back to comment on how the fuck Hatchetman knew New Dean would come to the morgue with enough time to beat him there AND cover himself in a sheet and play dead.

Also before that happened Dean grabbed New Dean by the correct shoulder, and made him jump but aw don't worry it's just your new best friend.

Ghost Jordan is still a fucking nerd even in death because rather than talk to them, he presses the button to summon a catchphrase

It's good to know some things never change even when you are a murderous shell of your former self.

UGH SIGH DAVY ARE YOU REALLY GOING TO DO THIS TO ME?

(The director might also be to blame)

So now they are cobbling together a fake trailer for Hatchetman, using footage from the show

That is to say, Hatchetman is set on Oct. 31st, 1983, or, of course, 2 days before Azazel ruined everything.

I'm not sure if this shot is from the show because we have so few Halloween episodes that an exterior shot with Halloween elements would have to be faked up, but the house looks very much like the old Winchester house, but with a bigger porch and more dramatic features. It does, however, strongly feature the tree branch shadows over the appropriate wall to make it look exactly like the opening shot of their story, while this is the opening shot of the Hatchetman story.

"David Jaeger was an honest man making an honest living" *generic shot of something being worked on*

*shot of the back of John Winchester's head walking into his garage in 5x13 to discover his boss out cold because Anna is about to attempt to murder him, said boss hilariously visible in the shot if you know he's there*

So. That happened :P Hatchetman is John. That ain't subtle if you recognise the back of his head in a split second. Even if you don't they're casting him as a car mechanic which is of course directly connected to Dean and John.

"Until one night when a practical joke turned deadly"

*footage of the wife spectre-rage killing her husband in the cold open of 8x06 because she was still pissed he slept with someone else on prom night*

I think the burning vehicle was the car from 10x13 that Sam and Dean burned early in the episode, where it was violently reminiscent of them burning the memory of John for some meta reason I can't remember at the time, but definitely inspired a lot of frantic fandom typing.

Of course the ghost in that episode was the classic ragey vengeance ghost which was blatantly paralleled to the path Dean was on with the Mark of Cain, complete with being crypt scened out of it by a trenchcoat-wearing widow.

They're implying he was then burned alive and left for dead and I don't recognise the footage of the burned feet but I assume they're from some episode or another.

Anyway then they go to more new footage from the "actual" hatchetman movies. This one is set on Nov. 1st so it's not even a "Halloween" movie but ACTUALLY All Saint's Day (All Hallow's Eve being what Hallowe'en is a corruption of), Nov. 1 being of course a meta nod to the fact the episode is not even airing on Halloween but Davy just really really really really wanted his halloween episode so shut up and enjoy it :P

Oh, it's All Saints Day III The Reckoning. Because of course it's a reckoning. That's all that happens in Dabb era, reckonings.

I am so upset.... I made a joke about 5x05 waaay back, and now it's true because of the whole random thing about Dean's random Axe that was John's that Paris Hilton was going to use to Reckoning him but then Sam murderered her before she could. Now Dean's being reckoned.

Okay Dean is a lil dark right now but his come at me bro of "I was hoping you'd say that" and the preceding speech is incredible. I can't believe this show has Jensen except that I CAN believe that with Jensen we go 14 seasons because FUCK he's scary and intense when he wants to be.

But he delivered that chilling speech and then had the ghost use a red button to talk to him and then was badass at it

I mean

he can put the terror into ANY situation

I am a hysterical laugher, I could not have stood where Dean stood in that moment and taken Hatchetman seriously, even under threat of mortal peril. I once nearly got expelled for hysterical laughing over an untied shoelace that started a rapidly spiralling incident.

I love the new fight guy

I love how Dean is spoiling for a fight, and really enjoying how he can push back against this ghost, in a really, really scary way. But in a cold way, not the red hot Mark of Cain way he was dark last time. He's grinning and enjoying this nerdy ass fight, but it's got a vicious streak.

I especially love the choreography of Dean smashing Hatchetman around the head with clashes in time to the music followed by an elevator ding as Sam and New Sam emerge in the next scene.

Poetic cinema

New Sam guesses the key thing for ghost attachment and Old Sam is impressed.

Careful buddy, they're lining you up for replacement.

Dean seems not to have won this fight with the Hatchetman. I bet if Stuart was awake he'd have some useful advice for how anyone could beat him in a fight but especially Stuart, if they knew the correct thing to do.

New Dean saved Old Dean! Maybe we can teamwork distract the Hatchetman and win together. Possibly this is a metaphor for... working with yourself...

Is it foreshadowing for a fight later in the season of plot significance, just like in 11x07 Sam got beat up by a clown in a cage, as a not too subtle metaphor for Lucifer? I'd love an in Dean's head kinda nonsense with Mikey.

"Dean, key chain!"

TEAMWORK BROS ARE THE BEST BROS

New Sam chips in for her part with fuel for the fire.

Everyone high five the Sam or Dean/Dirk to your left

Oh, COOL effect of a ghostly spirit burning out of a model Hatchetman, who is unscatched by the ordeal

I mean, good, he's probably a really expensive collectible

He falls over with a thud, and goes out on a warbling "time to slice and diiiiiiiii" much like "I clobber evil" died on the fire with a last gutteral noise.

Hopefully bookending each other in terms of models with representations in their voices that haunt Dean and all.

Dean, unprompted, thanks Sam for getting him out of his funk and giving him an easy ghost hunt to win. I guess what 13x05 was supposed to be is what this actually turned out to be.

(Honestly, giving Davy episodes post-drama to let us all unwind is turning out to be an extremely good idea with 13x06 as well)

I am MAJORLY concerned about the time stamp on this episode. It better end in a few seconds and go to a full 3 minute trailer for Hell Hazers III or else.

"It was awesome!" "it wasn't really," says Sam, who burst into the room in time to see his brother pinned and choking

Sam moves on to confronting Dean with the concept of not just hiding in his room when they get back.

He gives Dean the "OI, CHEER UP" talk we've all been yelling at the screen. Good. Good Sammy.

Dean turns to the camera. "I'm never going to get over it. I'm just not."

Look, Sam, just because Dean stabbed Lucifer for you, and now you are sleeping without fear, doesn't mean everyone has that luxury :P

elizabethrobertajones Oh dear, there's still 4 minutes left er I guess I keep watching .... *grimaces nervously*

mittensmorgul :D just watch it in context with the rest of the episode

elizabethrobertajones um what I didn't get far enough into what happens next to know what you mean so that's super ominous Sam is still psychoanalysing Dean in car NOW yo uhave me REALLY worried.

Hey, remember how I started this episode with a vague warning from Mittens? Why am I now getting the feeling that I still haven't watched whatever that was about?

"I'm not doing any good cooped up in my room. So whatever you need, I'm there." ("Chief"?)

"Alright, Chief?"

Oh, man. I'm turning into Dean.

Also Dean appears to have, finally, ceded power over to Sam. Again, the reversals of season 10 - Sam was put in this position of power he just was not ready to cope with and not with the stakes that were laid against him. But here, Dean might be driving the car but he's putting all the real power into Sam's hands.

elizabethrobertajones Is it why Sam hates Halloween because Dean turns out to have set an alarm on his watch to remind him to bug Sam about it again the intrigue you have spun is starting to get to me more than actually watching the episode :P

mittensmorgul oh gosh, I should've just kept my mouth shut. It was seriously just an innocent comment for a nice BM scene :P

I am more horrified about the concept of Sam telling an embarrassing story than I am about any amount of slasher and gore. Look, I can Not handle social squickiness and I love Sam and that is going to make this extremely hard to hear.

Dean's gonna love it though, I can tell.

Please. Protect. Sammy.

"It was soooo bad" he says with a haunted look of a man who has been tortured by the devil

Andrea's party got there first

"Next year, we're doing halloween right"

Oh no, don't you dare start talking like you're going to be alive and ready for a party next year, Dean Winchester. I will perish in your place to make it happen.

BAHAHA Dean coming up with matching outfits and suggests Bert and Ernie, before rejecting that one as too weird.

Yeah, you might not remember but we do

We are never going to let you live it down, in fact.

Also, listen, his mouth runs miles ahead of his brain, that was not suggestive until he realised it was and backtracked

You also can't go as Shaggy and Scooby unless you go to a party WITH them and they go as you and Sam

Thelma and Louise... Dean, stop.

Okay it's hilarious that Davy managed to get both Bert and Ernie and Thelma and Louise into this like... somewhere riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight deep down Dean's consciousness is putting things together. It doesn't remember half the shit he says, but like. Hey. Why ARE those two sets of on screen pairs connected, huh, Dean?

Oh, whatever, he's just trying to annoy Sam now

Nyoooom

IT'S THE SECURITY GUARD

RUN, MAN, RUN

Ew, I left it playing to type that and it told me to watch Legacies

Well that was the one wrong note in this whole episode so I suppose something had to happen like that :P

#Davy fanclub #14x04 #season 14 spoilers #oh my god it's good to have the internet back #my stuff

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