#veth being cursed by isharnai--

[dent-de-leon]

OFFICIAL ART OF CATHA AND RUIDUS MY BELOVEDS 🌕✨

[corvid-wizard]

I have this idea for a warlock that traded their body for power. They're still attached to their body through a portal on their neck and can reach through or store objects around where their body is. Maybe the head floats as a part of the deal, but only up to where their head stood when they had a body (and have levitate and similar spells still affect them normally).

Inspiration is a mix of Isharnai being ready to accept Jester's hands as a part of the deal in removing Veth's curse in Critical Role, Cam from The Suffering Game in TAZ, and Betty Groff in Ice King's crown.

[softbean]

me psychoanalyzing the veth origins comic panel by panel like a madman

(aka a journey in real time of aurie discovering her headcanons are actually canon)

I haven’t finished the campaign but I could swear Sam has never explicitly confirmed Veth hated the way she looked, not only as a goblin but also as a halfling. Every time her ugliness has been brought up it’s in the context of her being TOLD that she was ugly by other people, but this is the first time I recall it being confirmed that she also believed she was ugly.

Kinda hammers it home for me that the bullying she endured isn’t just a background part of her story, a meet-cute kind of setup for her to kiss kiss fall in love with Yeza, but something that is still relevant, and something she still carries as a scar into adulthood. Def mentioned in canon, but never emphasized like it is here.

Another indicator that she felt alone and unloved in her family, to the point where she didn’t consider her actual family a “home”.

Yeza must have been the first person to accept her and show her love, and she sort of clung to that little piece of happiness she had for the first time. She is trying to rewrite the pains of the past with new experiences, which in itself isn’t anything unhealthy, but I truly wonder how much of her faith she put into yeza’s ability to love her, as opposed to how much faith she put into her own lovability.

Something that suddenly pierced my mind when I saw this panel is “I wonder why Veth was transformed into a goblin girl as opposed to a grown goblin woman like the rest of these goblins here.”

I have my own theories, and it’s the same one I spout every time, but I firmly believe Veth’s curse is a metaphor, and a reflection of her truest fears and insecurities.

Not “I know you have it in there”, but “I know you have one in there”.

I like to think she’s never really been brave before, and even yeza knows. or, there really isn’t much of an occasion for her to show her braveness (even though to me she shows it every day just by living, choosing to live). this implication that yeza’s never seen her brave side before makes me think she must rely on him and his strength quite a bit in this relationship.

Losing all of her happiness that she had worked so hard for...she can’t go through that again. Parallels are being drawn here. Those who made her unhappy before, and those who make her unhappy now. Bullies.

What a powerful line. It’s uncertain whether she truly means it or not (I would argue not). But by choosing to forgive, she is taking back the power that these bullies stole from her. Even contemplating the idea is powerful. I would say she says this to the goblin right after the panel where she resolves to not let this happen again as a way to try to appeal to the goblin’s humanity.

It doesn’t work. She discovers she and the goblin are more alike than she imagined, which makes the fact that the goblins know what they’re doing is evil and simply don’t care even more infuriating.

Breaks my heart to know she learned lock picking to get away from her bullies, but I should’ve seen this one coming tbh...

As soon as she does the brave thing (splash acid on the goblin) she breaks down and loses her courage again. Goes to show just how far she’s come as present day M9 nott/veth who, quite frankly, has rarely shown a moment of cowardice...

Hoooly shit. Seeing this line being said visually is cementing something in my brain.

Isharnai doesn’t know anything about Veth. She wasn’t asked to “turn her into a goblin”. She was asked to “make her suffer”. And knowing how when Yasha walked into her hut to offer her misery in exchange for Veth’s curse to be broken, and Isharnai immediately told her she was already miserable and had nothing of value to offer, we can imagine that Isharnai has some sort of distinguishing vision. And so she took a look at Veth, someone who believes she is ugly, believes she is a coward, and turned her into the manifestation of her worst nightmares.

And you know what struck me? The reason why she was turned into a goblin girl was because Veth finally found some semblance of control in her adult life, after having suffered a childhood being shoved around by others more powerful than her. Reducing her back to the state in which she was most traumatized is making her suffer.

Take a good look.

The river is a mirror. The person she really is, someone wonderful, someone who has built a life of her own, that person was drowned. In her stead Veth became the person she believed she was, hideous, cowardly, and not good...

with no control over herself once more.

Her greatest fears, reflected at her, made true. The punishment was tailored to her.

YOU GUYS I WROTE THE ABOVE TEXT BEFORE I EVEN GOT TO THIS PAGE. IM SCREAMING. THEY JUST SPELLED IT OUT. I DONT EVEN HAVE TO ANALYZE ANYMORE SKDSKDJSJKDJKSDJKJ

God...she is so good. This just shows how empathetic she is in nature. Even at this point she believes she is at fault, that she did something wrong through self-defense. It’s also interesting that at this point she can’t distinguish between right and wrong.

nothing to say here besides i just love this panel

EVEN THIS IS GIVING ME FEELINGS

That’s all folks...this has been a ride. basically what i’ve learned is that all my headcanons have now been established as canon--and I’m really glad, I’m really glad this comic spelled out a lot of the meaning behind veth’s character that I find is hard to firmly grasp in the actual show, and often gets lost or forgotten in fandom discourse about veth.

(I also feel soooo damn justified in some creative decisions i make about her in my fanfic but that’s just my little glowing moment of like, I interpreted things correctly before they were explicitly confirmed...!!!)

anyway. NOTT THE BRAVE ICON. SAM RIEGEL LEGEND. THAT’S ALL!!! Thanks for reading <3

[seafleece]

(a conversation)

“why weren’t you angry?”

fjord’s out cold. there’s seafoam, a rime of salt, laced pink by blood, drying in a trail from his mouth and down his throat. caduceus is at the desk by their bed, looking into a mug. the glimpse she catches reveals it hasn’t been washed out in a few days, and a funny pink bloom is developing along the inside.

caduceus turns in time for her to return her gaze to her hands. “hm?”

“back outside the hut. you said you understood. you didn’t tell me i didn’t care.“

“did you want me to?”

“i just— fjord and caleb were really angry. they care about the group. i know you do, too.”

“yes, i do.”

“but you weren’t mad.”

and caduceus seems to verge on anger, then, for a moment— it’s a rare thing, he just puts down his cup and stands, rather bluntly, walks over to sit beside her on the bed.

“miss beau, how do you know that i care about everyone?”

“i mean, you heal us all the time, when you could be doing jester’s cool stuff— you came with us to kill lorenzo just because we asked you. you never heal yourself, you didn’t even make veth apologize when she killed you—“

“actions.”

“yeah.”

“you do a lot of acting, as well.”

“yeah, i mean—“

“you run up to things ten times larger than yourself, and you punch them. and when they try to attack anyone besides you, you stop them. yasha stabbed you— through you— and then you fought next to her. you’ve spoken to royalty on our behalf, three times.”

she says nothing, won’t look at him. the thought occurs that maybe beauregard lionett could count on her fingers the number of people who will tell her she does good. on one hand, even.

“what did you say, to isharnai? just. say it out loud, what your offer was.”

“i said i’d leave, if she un-cursed veth. that i’d be alone again.”

“you offered your happiness for someone else.”

“yeah, but it was stupid.”

“maybe. maybe you underestimate how much you’re needed. but it would be stupider to not see that you care for your friend. a friend who would not do the same for you.”

he looks over at fjord, sleeping peacefully, deep breaths, like the entirety of his body is devoted to the task of maintaining them. “you know, fjord and caleb like to talk about the group. they announce what it means, when they do something. maybe it helps them understand. i think maybe, when they were trying to convince you to say that you cared, they were not trying to convince you, but themselves.”

“well, i mean, i could say it more—“

“it is not a good defense to be made, that someone else is at fault when you fail to interpret them.”

“oh.”

“we would have found you, again,” he says, and smiles like it’s not supposed to make her cry. “isharnai, whatever she is, couldn’t have stopped us. in another world, we would have killed her.”

she laughs, and presses her palm under her eye. “we still could.”

“i would be angry, if she took you from us. jester, i think, would be furious beyond anything we’ve seen. but expressing anxiety, fear of losing someone by being angry with them rather that the thing that would take them, it’s a negative for a negative. hurt, trying to solve hurt. i don’t think it has helped you understand that you care, to be told you don’t.”

he looks at the ceiling for a long moment.

“did she ever thank you?”

“hm?”

“veth. for offering.”

“no— i, she almost said it made sense, which might be worse. she told me she was glad i looked out for caleb, in that tub.”

“she didn’t thank you, for offering the thing you cared about most so she could be returned. and afterwards, she allowed fjord and caleb to tell you that it was an act of not caring.”

“guess so.”

“well, i’ll say it,” and he takes her hand. “thank you, beau.”

“i— you’re welcome.”

he turns to look at fjord again. “he should say it, too. maybe more than once.”

“he— i know he thinks it.”

“if he expects you to express that you care the way he understands it, you can expect the same of him.”

i’m not good at expecting things, she doesn’t say, because he knows it already.

“you know what’s funny, miss beau?” there’s a small smile on his face.

“what?”

“i hear, a lot, from veth and even fjord and caleb, sometimes, that you’re angry, yourself. prickly. that it’s hard to talk to you.”

“yeah?”

“i’m a little disappointed i have yet to see it.”

there’s a warm, fuzzy sort of feeling burgeoning, like being healed, enough it makes a smile unfurl on her face. “you could try telling me i don’t care.”

[nevararaven]

Honestly I do not think this is the end of the Nein, hear me out.

I think after Lucien and the Assembly buisness is taken care of the group will take a long needed vacation. And maybe at first they don't think of starting up adventuring again but Yasha eventually gets dreams of chains and Caduceus does as well. Maybe there past with Tharizdune is coming back to get them and since they havent been out they have to deal with it they are just now realizing it.

Maybe the big creepy snake god is finally being released somehow and they have to stop it.

Those are just big storylines they might have to stop or follow.

Veth may not come back, she could be gone unless something directly harms her family. But what if Isharnai is starting her hunt on Jester? Would Veth just be okay with that knowing she was the one to help break the curse?

I'm sure the Nein need a break after all this but I truly don't believe that it will be forever with so many storylines just hanging in the air.

Campaign one had two breaks. One before the stream and one in the middle. They were year long time skips where they all planned what they would do separately and or with each other.

So I'm not to worried that this campaign could just be over unless the Eyes of Nine was all he had planned.

[eponymous-rose]

Talks Machina Highlights - Critical Role C2E94 (February 11, 2020)

Tonight’s guests are Laura Bailey and Sam Riegel!

Announcements: This Friday at 7 PM Pacific on Twitch: the Monsterhearts one-shot! Matt will be DMing, and the cast includes Erika Ishii, Ally Beardsley, Taliesin Jaffe, and Ashley Johnson! There’s a Handbooker Helper episode on YouTube that describes the Monsterhearts system! Next week, All Work No Play returns with ghost hunting!

Episode 94: With Great Power...

Stats for this week’s episode: factoring in the time spent in the Happy Fun Ball, Jester’s gift to Isharnai was a 34-day-old cupcake. Nott reached 1,500 rolls this campaign with her stealth check after the zombie fight. Travelercon is 33 days away. 176 days have passed between the reveal of Travelercon and the reveal of... Traveler’s Con.

Laura thought up her plan against Isharnai during Beau’s talk. “I had it planned pretty far in advance. I don’t know if anybody goes back and watches it, you can see when I pulled out my Dust of Deliciousness card.” She didn’t have a backup plan. “Basically, if it had failed, I probably would have died. Or no hands.”

Sam notes that Nott probably would have enjoyed killed Isharnai. “However, I mean, Laura. That was just so great. That was so great to watch.” Laura felt like if they’d gotten into that battle, someone would have died, and Sam agrees. “But I feel like at this point Nott’s just happy that it’s over. Or can be over.”

Laura Bailey out of context: “I don’t know, I think there are a lot of people out there who would be happy to have aliens inside them.”

Laura knew in advance that Artagan was the Traveler; it was her idea! “I have mentioned on the show before that my original plan was to make a warlock, and I was going to make a warlock with the Fey Pact to Artagan.” She was also thinking about the Book Pact for a book of dirty pictures. And then Travis took warlock, and Laura wound up working with Matt to shift the idea to cleric. Matt’s vagueness did manage to get Laura to doubt that he’d actually gone with Artagan, so she was surprised when he finally revealed it. She’s also nervous about what happens now. “What if this turns into, like, I don’t get to be a cleric anymore?”

Sam, on Nott seeing the physical manifestation of the Traveler: “She’s seen weird shit before, traveling with this group, so it’s not the weirdest shit. And she’s also seen Fjord be transfjormed by the power of a literal god, so it’s not that Nott doesn’t believe that religion exists, it’s just not something that she’s spent any time with. But now we’re getting to a spot right now, in the campaign, in the story, where she’s maybe kind of open to it.” Laura gasps: “Have you heard about the Traveler???”

Jester has some mixed feelings about the Traveler asking her for help. “It’s complicated, yeah. I imagine it would be really hard to have the one person, the one entity, that you think you can let all of your guard down with and be yourself turn out to not be that anymore, and you realize you have to put on the mask for them as well.”

Why did Nott choose Yasha to take the flask away? “Nott does not trust her, at all. She has betrayed us, she has frequently left us. I am undecided yet if Yasha is actually a good guy. But she is the biggest and the baddest and is good at enforcing, so that’s why Nott chose Yasha. And I think there’s a subtle desire to know more about Yasha and to connect with her in any way.”

Cosplay of the Week: a cocky Beau! (Tikatikacosplay on Instagram, photo by Elemental Photography Design on Instagram)

Jester felt fine about the group not believing her about Nott’s curse being broken; it was a pretty unlikely scenario, and she had other things on her mind. Laura notes that Jester has been very upfront with the rest of the Nein and very, very rarely lies to them.

On hiring the housekeeper: “Nott was concerned with our home when we are not there, and then Sam Riegel was also remembering, when we had Greyskull Keep in the first campaign, we had a whole fuckin’ staff.”

There’s a brief digression into about what kind of sheets everyone would have. Thread count comes up.

Laura, on being reminded of the blue dragon fight: “She pushes that one away, but yeah, seeing the blue dragon was definitely triggering for her. I don’t think anybody in the group really noticed.” Sam noticed. “I was with you in that blue dragon fight. It was rough.”

On Nott suggesting they kidnap Beau���s brother: “I would not view it as taking a son from his mother as much as rescuing a child from a toxic environment.”

Did Laura take the “everyone’s in love with you” statement seriously during the Zone of Truth scene? Laura: “Pff, no.” Sam mentions how proud he is of how far Laura’s come as a magic-user in the game. “Now you’re a magic expert! You conned Matt Mercer with magic!”

On Nott being willing to reignite the war: “Yeah, she did go pretty dark. The people involved in the war are hypothetical people who she doesn’t know or care about.” Nott wasn’t willing to consider sacrificing anything within the group; the alternative was more “rationalizable”. “She definitely wanted the curse off of her,” but that last step is a big commitment. Laura points out that, as a halfling, Nott never got to explore what else she could have been, and now her adventures are tied up with that goblin identity.

Fan Art of the Week: The Maiden and the Hag! (Lassflores on Twitter)

How’s Jester feeling about other clerics and other gods? “I think it’s really early to know that answer. It’s too early to know how I feel about any of it, because we’re in the middle of the conversation.”

On Nott’s offer: “I think she understood the severity, but again, in the moment she was just trying to come up with something that she could give that wouldn’t affect her or her friends. She wouldn’t have given up her hands, she wouldn’t have left the group, she wouldn’t have given up her son. She’s jittery. She’s not brave.”

Laura notes that it was a cool feeling, helping to orchestrate the Traveler’s story across two campaigns (especially given that Vex was the one who discovered Garmelie!).

Nott had “a nice family environment. She had brothers who were shitheads to her, but Travis and Ashley were good parents, doing what they could. Veth Brenatto is married to Yeza Brenatto. I don’t know Veth’s maiden name! I don’t know Travis and Ashley’s last name!” He settles on... Smith.

[littledoggy-girlcollar]

this post sponsored by dwarvenforge (it’s combat and i’m ignoring homework)

i’m having Feelings about the hag so it’s time for loopholes.

POINT ONE and the most obvious way to break beau’s deal with the hag: beau offered only her own misery, not understanding/realizing that her actions would lead to misery from the rest of the nein. as their misery is not part of the deal, conceivably they could argue or bargain with isharnai to break the deal on the grounds that their misery was NOT freely given. theoretically logical fallacy could work, but (*attempts to figure out ishanrai’s alignment*) as hags are native to the feywilds and also are not lawful, ishanrai may not accept this as a break in the deal, especially as she seemed to have no issue with scapegoating a yet-unborn child.

POINT TWO. nothing in beau’s deal prohibits the rest of the nein from following her (by wording i mean. obviously something like being on a different continent would be an obstacle). beau offers to leave, and we know that the nein would probably not be down with that shit. so a logical course of action would be to undo nott’s curse, cast some locate object or some such on beau’s staff, and go get her. by the terms of the agreement beau did still leave the nein and her blood family behind, but changing nott back to veth beforehand ensures (IN THEORY)  that ishanrai will not renege on her end of the deal. though she may not accept a logic issue to break a deal she has made, i can’t see her actively going back on her end, and might actually appreciate the stunt. if she tries anything they can go back to plan A of Murder. 

issues come in mostly when you consider where beau would be isolated. does she just wander off into the swamp? does the binding of the deal prevent her from accidentally crossing paths with the nein? what if isharnai puts her in a pocket dimension and communication/location spells can’t get through? then we get to deal with Emotions And Other Fun Psychological Aspects.

suppose nothing is blocking the nein from attempting to follow beau, but beau is prohibited from communication with them (this could be in the form of wards that block out Sending/Scrying/etc. or in some sort of dimension/plane disparity). this means that a) the nein have no way of knowing if beau is alive, and b) beau doesn’t know the nein are looking for her. a is fun stress for the entire group, but b would bring a specific type of pain (which i think makes it more likely that isharnai would use it): beau knows that the nein can search for her, so every day that they don’t find her/she doesn’t hear from them reinforces her own belief that they always meant more to her than she did to them. regardless of whether or not she’s only separated from the nein (on tal’dorei perhaps) or in complete isolation (deserted island scenario), this would probably send her into a spiral of depression. obviously the hurt/comfort route demands that the nein DO find her and go the ever-wonderful amazing affirmation and crying and like maybe a little kissing as a treat BUT

i like causing myself pain.

POINT THREE. beau’s offer of misery is entirely based on the the notion that beau’s happiness directly correlates to her relationship with the nein. so, IF beau gets to a point where her absence from the nein is no longer directly causing her misery (because again, it was HER misery that was bargained, not the nein’s, so their feelings have no bearing on this), and isharnai is no longer getting new misery out of the deal.... is it worth it to maintain her end of the deal? keeping an eye on every deal she’s ever made can’t be easy, so if some are no longer functioning as she hoped, wouldn’t it be easier to cut her losses?

so beau is released, but the nein haven’t found her. 

and where the fuck do you go from there?

[justalittlebluetiefling]

i just saw that post where you mentioned you had a list of how likely each of the m9 would be to leave the group and i was wondering what you think? :)

Ooh yeah I can share that! Disclaimer to everyone who takes the time to read this: I don’t want any of these characters to leave. This isn’t who I want to leave. It’s who I think has the potential for leaving the most. I do not want a repeat of the episode 85 drama, as much as I love angst. As much as I loved Tary. No more new PCs. I don’t want it. This is just my opinion which shifts after every episode.

That being said. Let’s do this from most to least likely to leave. Under the cut because it’s a longish post!

1. Caduceus.

I almost tied Cad with Veth, but Veth has stronger ties in party than Cad does. His quest is “tied up” as far as we know. I don’t think that is actually true, but as far as we know at the moment, his family has gone back home to fix things. He also hasn’t spent time with is family in years. He misses them. I think he’s learning how/starting to view the Nein as a second family, but it has been a journey. Depending on what happens after this Travelercon arc is over, I may change my mind. Cad loves the Nein. He does feel like he owes them for their help in his quest. He wants to make sure that they are each taken care of. But I think he and Jester currently are cornering the market on feeling disconnected from the group. Poor clerics. Someone hug them.

2. Veth.

Again, another character with stronger external ties. Veth has a family. She has a husband. She has a child. She feels guilty for staying out adventuring.I think she WANTS to stay. But she also doesn’t want to miss her child growing up. Reasons she has to stay: she has feelings for Caleb. She cares about all the Nein and making sure that their things are seen through. But will that always outweigh the guilt of not being with her already established family? Also, Veth’s personal quest is actually tied up. She’s back to her own self. The reasons she has for staying (IN HER MIND) are purely selfish. I’m not sure how long she can keep justifying it.

3. Caleb

Caleb and Jester might actually be tied for me. I’m wavering a bit on this. Tonight I guess I’m feeling like Caleb is more likely to leave lol. Anyway, Caleb’s still a mystery. We do know about his past, we know a bit of what he’s looking for, but we also know that him getting close to the Nein was never part of the plan. Now, I think because he’s closer than he intended to be, it would make it harder to leave. BUT I also think that if he had a chance to follow through with his plans, he would still ultimately pick his plans over the group. And that, honestly, is something I waver on, too. Those of you who have been around for a while know how I feel about the time travel thing. You know how anti time travel I am. Or adjusting timelines. However you want to put it. Caleb’s on a journey in learning to forgive himself, but it’s something he doesn’t think he deserves because of the horrible things he’s done. The only way he can deserve it is to make it so that it never happened. But without knowing what would ripple out from that change, I think he might hesitate to avoid hurting his friends now. (How did Caleb’s paragraph get so long?!)

4. Jester

Again, it comes down to external ties. She was a little higher on this list a few weeks ago, but conversations within the group have caused me to shift my perspective on this. Her external ties are her mother and Artagan. Even though she has been a confidant of nearly every member of the Nein, she hasn’t really relied on many of them. She has expressed the desire to run back to her old life, or run away from how hard things are, in passing. She misses her mom. And then there’s Artagan whose attention she craves. But is it just because she’s used to craving it? He has said that he would take her with him if he leaves this plane. She sounded excited about the idea of visiting these other places with him. And we know she’s been struggling with connection lately. Not feeling connected enough to the Nein. Not feeling connected enough to Artagan. Would she jump at the chance to be alone with Artagan if it meant leaving the Nein? I used to think that she would, but as I said before, conversations in the group lately have made me think there would be a significant amount of hesitation on her part now. 

5. Beau

We all know Beau offered to leave to have Isharnai remove Veth’s curse. That misery would have been enough. I think she’ll stay with the group as long as fucking possible. Sure, she has the Cobalt Soul, but Expositors aren’t stationary. She can travel with the Nein and do her job. That’s not even remotely a problem. But if it came down to leaving or staying if it meant saving anyone in the group? She’d go. She doesn’t think she deserves what she has with them. She doesn’t think it’s going to last. And she does have other responsibilities. 

6. Yasha

The only reason Yasha has to leave anymore is to find her wife’s grave and give her the flowers she’s been collecting. I’m not sure how much she still wants to get revenge for Zuala’s death, but that’s something that people would be willing to help her with. And here’s why I think, regardless of all that, she’ll ultimately stay: The Nein rescued Yasha. She feels like she owes them. And she loves them. Yasha wants to belong somewhere she can be herself. These people fought to save her soul. How could you leave people who would do that for you?

Oh gosh, have I cursed Yasha to have some Stormlord quest telling her to leave? Ashley please don’t get another job in New York.   

7. Fjord

I feel like I can already sense people’s surprise over me saying Fjord is the least likely to leave the group. This would have been a little higher if we were like... 70 episodes ago. but we’re not. While there are certainly circumstances that I think would cause him to leave, I think they’re fairly extreme (aka anyone else leaving the group and fracturing what they have). So here he sits. In the least likely to leave position. Why?

Well, to directly quote his first playlist, the last time he felt this comfortable, everything was ripped away from him. So we know that he values the Nein at least as much as he valued Vandran. We also know that he feels responsible for all these people. He feels bound to them. Vandran not being out actively looking for him shifted something inside of him, I think. It seems like he feels more emotional ties to the group as a whole than anyone else does, except maybe Beau. And I mean the group not the individuals. Fjord wants family. This is his family now. All of these people. Together. As long as they stay together, Fjord is going to stay with them. I also think he’s the most likely to stay tied to another member after they inevitably split at the end of the campaign (without taking romance options into account). Like, he’d go where Beau goes or where Jester goes or where Caduceus goes. I can’t really see him building a life without at least one of them around.

[ayzenigma]

Unrelated CR thought that won’t leave me be: every time Veth goes back to see her family, I keep expecting the Night Hag that cursed her to have taken them and done bad things in order to get back at her/M9 for tricking her into releasing the curse. Literally every time I’m holding my breath waiting for the horrifying reveal. Thoughts?

oh, oh my,,, I had honestly mostly forgotten about Isharnai and now that you’ve planted this seed of worry? oh boy. the Fear plant has started to grow aaahhh

I hope you sent this ask being at least vaguely aware of how much of an angst monster i can be, because i’m about to go down a hole. so be warned!

(also this got longer than I expected so i’m sticking it under a read more!)

why stop at just the brenattos? sure Veth was the curse the m9 were trying to break on, but it was Jester who did the memory modification and actual trickery, and if I were a hag with a grudge well. what better target?

and where are yeza and luc staying right now? Nicodranas! and who else is in nicodranas? Marion Lavorre, jester’s lovely mother!

If isharnai wants to get back at veth or jester of the m9, well nicodranas would be the obvious place to go, scooping up both the brenattos and marion for Extra Misery and Bad Times x2!

Now, the possible plus(-ish) side is that if Isharnai kidnaps brenattos + marion or something, the m9 would simply go after her, and they’d have a nice fun and intense combat! dangerous? probably, but overall fairly straightforward and easily enough accomplished mission. not many intricacies to navigate (beyond some much needed trauma therapy for brenattos + marion afterwards)

But! if we want to go more complex and extra suffering? well. I’m sure there’s some people who would be happy to get their hands on yeza (again) and the others, and also have a hold over the unpredictable and no-clear-allegiances mighty nein: namely, the Cerberus Assembly.

and that would be a Difficult and Complicated situation to navigate, because the assembly is Powerful, not just magically but also politically, and that’s not something they can just barge in and mess with easily. it’ll be a matter if the nein know the assembly have the brenattos and marion, or if they have to figure it out first (maybe with a visit to isharnai if they can figure that connection out. which might involve another deal or a fight or whatever!), and then they’d have to decide on / make a plan: try to sneak them out, or make a deal, or whatever. would also depend on how the assembly wants to play the game, whether they keep it a secret in their back pocket or use it as direct leverage. loooooots of fun possibilities! and if it gets to political navigation they can call essek and ask for advice or aid. jkjk (mostly) i just miss the floaty purple boi either way, more m9 navigating politics and dealing with the assembly yay!

ooh bonus (much more cracky) possibility: isharnai and uk’otoa team up XD. after all, nicodranas is a coastal city... and a certain leviathan/demi-god of the sea does also have a grudge against the nein....

now, do i think all this is possible? there’s always a possibility! do i think it’s likely? i... am not sure honestly. like, isharnai definitely is a loosely tied up end that i’m sure is slowly unraveling and coming undone and might just come back to bit the nein in the butts, but it’s hard to say in what form that might take! there are many many ways of dealing in misery, curses or no, so lots of possibilities (like restarting the war the nein worked so hard to stop! bonus that was what veth kind of offered, so arguments can be made that she’s just taking her due, without memory modified trickery of a deal not actually made)

there’s also the matter of how it would fit the story, specifically veth’s story. one of her biggest conflicts right now is figuring out how to balance wanting to stay with yeza and luc and wanting to adventure with the nein. a (seeming) choice between two families if yeza and luc are kidnapped and otherwise in danger? well that’s one less choice, for a while, because the two would align into “adventure to save the brenattos,” similar to what led the nein to xhorhas in the first place.

and this would be interesting to see, because it’ll come with it the ways in which veth’s adventuring is dangerous, not just to herself but also to luc and yeza! which just adds more delicious layers of angsty confliction to all the things veth has to consider.

tl;dr: i am LOVING the angst potential and gosh now i will join you in nervous anticipation for if/when anything with isharnai happens, and if/when anything happens, it will definitely be Big and Worrying and aahhhhhhh delicious story really

[night-filled-mountain]

I've been reading your widobrave stuff and I just wanted to throw in my two cents. Nott fell in love with Caleb more or less at a time when she believed it would never be possible to return to her husband. A life with Caleb was a consolation, something she turned to in an attempt to accept the fact that her old life was gone. Even if she never really believed she could be with Caleb. Over time it became something genuine and at that point the possibility of returning to Yeza was opened up.

Yesss. This makes sense to me. Though I don’t think she ever gave up entirely on the possibility of returning to Yeza--she always had the idea in the back of her mind that Caleb might be able to restore her to her original form, which was why she was always praising and encouraging his magic, giving him money, helping him find new spell books, etc. But so many things happened to Nott and Caleb before Yeza and Luc entered the picture again, and so many more things happened before they found the transformation spell, managed to finish it with Essek’s help, cast it in Xhorhas, sought out Isharnai, got the curse lifted (well, I mean...that was all Jester), and cast it again in Nicodranas...and by that point, Nott had gone on a rollercoaster of feelings about Caleb.

She’d gone from seeing him as “fragile frightened boy, must protect” to “fragile frightened boy but also WIZARD, potentially super useful to me, must encourage and educate as well as protect” to “fragile frightened boy, also wizard, also BEST FRIEND--must protect (out of pity) and encourage and educate (out of personal necessity) but also...I love being by his side, and it’s the only thing about the life of a goblin adventurer that really makes sense to me” to “part of my new family, if only I can get him to admit it” (“I want to hear you say it”) to “complicated, fallible wizard who needs to STEP THE FUCK UP and pull his weight in this friendship so I can save my other family” (Felderwin) to (and this is where things get really juicy for my poor Widobrave heart) “complicated wizard who TOTALLY stepped up, who I know I can rely on, who can do as much for me as I can for him, who knows all my secrets now just like I know all of his...and we’ve both got fake names and dark pasts and months of shared excitement and danger and triumph and heartbreak and, wait a second, who am I without him?”

After Caleb shared his backstory with the group in Felderwin and returned the beacon in Rosohna, Nott finally had what she’d wanted for the entire campaign: her husband and son were safe, Yeza knew her secret and still loved her, and they could be a family again. But by this point, Veth had become a different person, right down to a new, self-chosen name (I will never get over the multilayered symbolism of “Nott the Brave”). Strong and brave, despite her bouts of nerves; wacky, impulsive, and uninhibited; an adventurer; a protector. Now, I think all of these things were very much part of Veth as well, but Nott embraced them in a way Veth never could. Veth was weird and quirky, but she was ashamed of it; she protected her family fiercely, but she died doing it. Nott flaunted her weirdness without apology; Nott faced down the ocean, lizardfolk, dragons, lava, and her own best friend and lived. Nott was reunited with Yeza, and he offered her all his love, but he didn’t really know Nott the Brave. Not like Caleb did. Caleb who got her out of that jail cell, who had the idea to join the Mighty Nein, who not only watched her change before his eyes but helped facilitate those changes, just as she did for his.

And I think it was somewhere around this time, somewhere in Xhorhas, that Nott started to involuntarily dig up the one early feeling about Caleb that she’d quashed real fast, the one she later admitted to Beau, which first came to her way back in that jail cell: “fragile frightened boy, also wizard, also HOT.” She would have felt guilty about that crush on multiple levels, and I suspect that’s when she first came up with her construction of their relationship as “parent/child” (at least partially in self-defense against her own forbidden attraction). But in Xhorhas, at last, that construction really isn’t holding up anymore. Nott is no longer babying Caleb by hiding her past from him or sparing him her criticisms and darker moods. They’re on equal footing now, and Nott is plagued by doubt. She starts drinking more heavily than ever and behaving more recklessly. She openly expresses (to Caleb) her ambivalence about returning to her old home, to marriage and motherhood (“I think you have to find those answers” / “Can’t you just tell me?” and of course, the quote I keep coming back to: “I ditched my husband in a den of monsters to go adventuring with you”).

And when she finally starts to develop some clarity on who she is and what she wants? Well, it’s hard to ignore how she reacts. When she thinks she’s finally about to be turned back into Veth (“I don’t know if I’ll...think...the same about you all”), she kisses Caleb on the lips. When she knows for sure that she’s about to be turned back, she straight-up tells him, “You’re the second love of my life.” And in between those two instances? When they’re on the road together for what she thinks may be the last time?

“I think I've decided...I've made a decision. But that's two decisions. I've made the first. I think I'm ready to change back. But what happens afterwards...I won't know until I get there, I think.”

“I'll miss all of you if I go. I'll miss you most of all. Our time together has been so dangerous and deadly and...incredible, and...it's been...it's been wonderful saving your life again and again.”

“I...I know you're going to use your life to do...god-like things. And I hope I'm there to see it.”

“You're not my...hmm......well. Baby steps, I suppose.”

...Look, I know she’s gone back to Yeza, been loving and caring and sexual with him, and genuinely fantasized (frequently!) about going home to him and Luc once and for all. I know that fantasy was the entire inspiration for her journey (including her close relationship with Caleb).

But...the more time passes, the more I watch her and listen to her on her own and with Caleb, the more I try to untangle the billion threads of her identity, the more I see Veth’s old domestic life as just that: a fantasy. Something she likes thinking about, not something she necessarily wants anymore. The entire arc of her incredible character development is also the arc of her falling for Caleb Widogast. She’s been falling since before the campaign began. And at this point, she’s admitted it to herself, to Caleb, to the group at large. And I have no idea whether anything will ever come of it, whether the others (Caleb included) even take those feelings seriously or see them for what they are, but it’s...it’s a thing. It’s 99 episodes worth of A Thing, and I don’t think I’ll ever get over it.

[critfailthatcharismacheck]

So about our Hot Boi Essek...

Hoo buddy, that revelation was a doozy. Like in retrospect it’s not that surprising but it was still wild. It’s shitty, absolutely shitty what he did, not even in terms of the M9. How could he not anticipate that the theft of the Luxons would spark that kind of reaction? He said he didn’t intend to start a war, but war had already been brewing for decades by that time and something that big seems like the perfect proverbial straw to break the camel’s back. Now that being said, I still really fucking like him. Like damn Matt, you create such amazing characters that I can’t help but love even when they’re absolute bastards! Essek is such an interesting character, and I love all the nuance in his actions and the situation he’s brought on himself. And Matt plays him so cool and charismatic, even when he’s confessing to fucking up big time, he’s so likable! It’s almost infuriating!

But i want to get into this in terms of the M9. So first and probably biggest, Caleb took this very interestingly. I absolutely felt the disappointment radiating off of him after finding out about Essek. Liam has said in Talks that Essek was one of the few, if not the only person that Caleb considered a friend outside of the M9, and it was low key heartbreaking watching his reaction. But I also think that that’s what made his speech to Essek in the Balleater that much more impactful. Like we all saw the similarities between the two, but Caleb really put it into words. I think the conversation would’ve gone a lot differently had Caleb not experienced the growth he did with the M9. He probably would’ve said to just kill Essek or something, but his time with the Nein helped him to see that friendship and redemption are possible and worth the effort. And I absolutely adored how he took Molly’s words to heart and used this moment to impart those words of wisdom on someone who obviously needed them.

I was also interested in how Nott/Veth took the news. I don’t recall if Sam ever said anything about if she ever really trusted Essek that much, but I think the fact that Essek helped her and Caleb complete the Halas spell played a huge role in how things played out. She was surprisingly much more chill than I expected. I would have thought that she would be pissed not only for herself but also for Caleb, but she was surprisingly receptive of him. Well, maybe I shouldn’t be so surprised, I mean she did offer to keep the war going in exchange for Isharnai breaking her curse, which is nearly as selfish as Essek causing a war for science. But I do think that because he helped her with the spell, she was much more lenient than she would have been otherwise. AND ALSO HOLY SHIT JUST FUCKING PARALYZED THIS DUDE IN THE MIDDLE OF A PARTY WHAT HAPPENED TO JUST TALKING TO HIM???

So I think the only other person that played much on a role in this whole thing was Jester, and I’m more about how she was just trying to chat Essek up when all hell broke loose and Veth paralyzed him without telling anyone??? That was wild, Jester was panicking, like holy shit did I do this on accident? Aside from that, her reaction was totally on par with how I thought it would be. Very confused and kind of hurt but also just wanting answers, and once she got them she was fine. It’s a little stressful, but once you’re friends with Jester she’s ride or die. As soon as she heard the full story she was in support mode, making sure that Essek didn’t feel alone in this. And that is classic Jester.

I don’t have much to say about Beau, Fjord, and Caduceus during the main conversation with Essek because they either weren’t there or didn’t speak, but after he left Beau and Caddy had some very hot takes. I for one am all about people getting what’s coming to them, so I’m absolutely on the same page as Beau, but in this case I do think Cad and Caleb are right saying that it can’t be anytime soon. The balance is so delicate right now, and trying to get revenge/removing corruption so soon after the truce has been made will absolutely probably lead to the war starting again. It will have to come months, even years after these negotiations. The wound is too fresh, and both sides will be looking for any excuse to break the peace.

I have no doubt that right now Essek is near the top of the list of people that need to recompense for their crimes, but I think in the long run the M9 aren’t going to be too harsh on him. It helps that he entirely laid out his involvement, that he was at least assumingely truthful, and that he is working toward fixing his mistakes. The three Cerberus Assembly members, Ludinus, Ickythong, and Vess DeRogna, are absolutely at the top of the list, not sure which order at this point, but they’ll hopefully get what’s coming to them eventually.

[professorthaddeus]

how about 🥰 and 👁

🥰 - favorite romantic relationship

really not much of a shipper in the usual sense, but beauyasha is so fun and I love their story of finding joy in each other after histories of tragedy and self-sabotage. shadowgast is also increasingly growing on me despite my best efforts to resist :p (and outside of the romantic aspect? god the narrative parallels)

👁 - favorite fjord moment

I love the scene in c2e94 (after the encounter with isharnai) when fjord's chiding beau for offering to walk away in exchange for the removal of veth's curse. it's one of my favorite brjeaus moments and their dynamic is everything, but I think it's also one of the earliest times when fjord's developing strength as a leader in his own right really shows. it's also such a good example of the way fjord can flip from playing the comedic relief ("your delts are crazy, by the way") to being a rock of determination, insight, and grounded love