#trans terminology

[queercripintersex]

Perisex people I am begging you: MTF is not a synonym for transfeminine and FTM is not a synonym for transmasculine.

Intersex people who are trans frequently have transition experiences that do not match FTM or MTF. Not every trans person is starting from a perinormative idea of bodily sex or gender.

(And for the millionth time: gender assignment at birth is an event not a kind of body. For intersex people, AGAB implies absolutely nothing about what organs or hormone balance they have send also implies nothing about what gender(s) they have had socially imposed on them.)

[anarchistabsol]

If anyone claims that "people with [genital]" is too cumbersome to say out loud, they're fucking lying. But even then, yall can just say "penis havers" or "vulva havers" or "uterus havers" and folks will know what you mean, and you won't make anyone feel ostracized. Plus it sounds silly :3

really not sure when it happened or why but personally I'm pissed that the queer community at large seems to have given up ground on the "people with penises/vulvas/testes/ovaries" language to sex & gender essentialists in exchange for the much less precise, much more demeaning "AGAB" language.

is it because you're scared of the word vulva? of acknowledging out loud that some people have penises? of recognising that many many people, including but certainly not limited to trans people, have mixed sex characteristics that cannot be accurately summarised by "afab/amab" as shorthand for "female/male"?

"in [GENITAL RELATED] situation AFABs will need to do X and AMABs will need to do Y" there are "afabs" with penises and "amabs" with vulvas. Saying this shit makes you look so unserious & honestly transphobic (given the ongoing erasure of post-op trans people within broader community). Intersex people and GRS have both existed for long enough (fucking forever and, decades, respectively) that we should well past making this basic fucking mistake.

quit referring to people by a vague & often violent event that happened at their birth as though it defines ANYTHING about how they & their body currently operate, and start using precise language so you at least look like you know what you're fucking talking about.

[incognitopolls]

We ask your questions so you don’t have to! Submit your questions to have them posted anonymously as polls.

[thenatureofbutch]

And THIS is why it is so special to be in a time where we can listen to our elders speak openly. So we better take advantage and LISTEN.

Sometimes I get comments or asks or whatever from the identity police about who can be called butch.

Well, dear sweets, firstly get to know your history, watch this video to the end, respect your elders and then digest the fact that nature is as it does. So, you staring at a natural truth, and telling it, that it's wrong, only shows something unnatural of you- work on it my babycakes.

You can also read more of what I personally (so not those featured in the above video) have to rant say if you feel so inclined...

I myself remember how butchness was well known as a spectrum of how masculinity looked on those who were not cis men. I remember how that spectrum included butches who would further their masculinity/Adorn their masculinity with hormones/surger(ies), I remember how butcheness extended to those who were queer but not lesbian, and their role within the butch world was never questioned or even pondered at. Because to be seen in the world as butch, is a very specific thing, with specific ostrasisations, and specific ways to understand what gender is and specific ways of being made to feel ugly for not adhering to the way the west pictures women. To be butch is a very specific feeling starting in our earliest memories for most of us we have that feeling before we even develop sexual desire, because its entirely its own thing, and it creates a very specific bond. A bond of butchhood.

I was very young when witnessing just a little of this time period, the solidarity within it still was strong enough to hit me and captivate me. It's been sad to see just how much of that has changed into a relentless need for over specification, dissecting the community left right and centre, policing eachother. Do we not remember the enchanted connection of anti police anti state moral with queerness? Please let us do better, please let us help one another do better.

[cassiebnuy]

hard to feel proud of much this pride

[vampire-nyx]

Honestly really disappointing and upsetting that just after I found the pills that make you green comics the creator turned out to very much extremely hate people like me

[fstarnd1sco]

TRNS MAN JAYCE TRANSFEM NB VIKTOR

[jikimo-world]

A sort of continuation (prequel?) of this

[When a young Francine was cast out of her pack, Arthur tried to persuade the elders to accept the doe in their colony of nymphs, but they refused.

Until then, Arthur was convinced he regarded her as any other animal in the wood but, at that point, the nymph realized that he didn't want to leave Francine alone and he was in love with her.

So Arthur bid farewell to his brothers (and in fact he did not see them until Francine's death) and fled with her to the edge of the forest, near a human village but far from their families, where they founded their home]

[spaydekingcayde]

idk my issue with terms like “tme/tma” is uhh note how a Lot of trans women (at least that I know and am friends with) don’t have “tma” in their bios and if they do it’s cos they post abt the Magnus archives, it’s Only ever people who aren’t trans women (who also in my experience end up being raging transmisogynists) that have “tme” in every single one of their bios like it’s an identity label alongside their pronouns.

Like if these terms are so important to the discussion of transmisogyny and its many axioms why would you be lobbing it in with and treating it like a part of your identity and/or put it in your bio for those internet brownie points, it’s like saying “hi im (name) my pronouns are they/them and i do not experience transmisogyny,” it’s so weird to me. These terms have a time and a place and a use and your bio on the internet isn’t one of them. You don’t need to list off every single form of bigotry you do and don’t experience because it starts to look less like you’re part of the discussion or w/e and more like you’re treating axioms of oppression as identity labels.

[wanderingcritter]

maybe there's something im not understanding here, and honestly at the end of the day i don't really care one way or the other this is a pretty exclusively online topic, but the whole "neo/xeno AGAB" thing is like... vaguely transphobic right?

and i am absolutely 100% NOT the person to try to tell others how they should identify or what labels they should be using, im literally a transmasc nonbinary mspec/queer lesbian transspecies werewolf who uses xeno pronouns for fucks sake, it doesn't really get anymore "queer as in wtf is going on" than that.

but from what i've seen and read about it, it kind of seems to be simultaneously reinventing and discrediting the definition of transgender. To directly quote the "AGAB Non-Conformity" infographic made by @/nonconformityhub,

"Those who reject their AGAB, are unassigned, or were forced to fit a binary sex at birth may wish to self-assign a different AGAB. It's based around the idea that we shouldn't be forced to stick with a falsely assigned gender."

like, am i not understanding something or is that literally just the definition of being transgender or gnc?? i think the thing that rubs me the wrong way about it is that it almost kinda implies that as a transgender individual you should or need to disclose the gender you were assigned at birth to others, which (unless it's for legal or health related reasons) you literally just don't. If you are a trans man, congratulations, you are a man. You don't have to be an "AFAB man", you're just a man. As far as anyone else needs to be concerned, you are male and have always been such. The whole point of being trans is to reject the gender you were assigned at birth because it's flat out not what you are.

Idk again I don't really care that much I don't think it's gonna single handedly set back trans liberation or anything of that sort, I just feel like we SHOULD be focusing on dismantling the system of assigning genders at birth to begin with and reasserting that sex ≠ gender, rather than simply modifying the system to appeal to certain individuals and disregarding preexisting communities trying to accomplish that goal, and would maybe just encourage everyone to look at this kind of stuff with some healthy skepticism

[spitblaze]

Gendertash From Hell Issue 02 (1993)

Transcription under cut

GENDER MYTH #1

Although male-to-female transsexuals have surgery to change their anatomy and take female hormones, they still act like men.

FACT: Some male-to-female transsexuals act in ways many consider to be masculine; some don’t. The same can be said of nontranssexual women. In fact, some types of “masculine” behavior in nontranssexual women are applauded in the lesbian and women’s communities, while the same behavior in a transsexual woman is taken as proof that she is “really” a man. Labeling behaviors as masculine and feminine is of little practical value and only reinforces gender stereotypes.

GENDER MYTH #2

Male -to-female transsexuals are not womenborn women (or womyn-born womyn).

FACT: No one is born a woman. Most of us who ended up as women started out as girls. The paths we took to womanhood are many and varied. Most male-to-female transsexuals felt like girls from as early as they can remember, just like most nontransexual women. Although many nontranssexual women struggle with the changes associated with becoming women, most become women without consciously attempting to. This fact doesn’t make our paths any better, more natural, or more valid than transsexual women's paths.

GENDER MYTH #3

Male -to-female transsexuals have been socialized as men, and this socialization cannot be changed.

FACT: The messages given to each person about the roles of males and females in society are a little different, and these messages may be experienced in very different ways. Many transsexual women felt that the male messages they were given were inappropriate. Many felt inadequate to meet the demands placed on them to “act like a man.” Nontranssexual women feel they have a choice to become aware of and reject parts of their sex-role conditioning— so do transsexual women.

GENDER MYTH #4

Male-to-female transsexuals are trying to “pass” as women. They try to make themselves as much like nontranssexual women as possible.

FACT: Male-to-female transsexuals are women; they don’t need to pass. They don't necessarily want to hide or eliminate their differences from nontranssexual women, although the threat of ostracism leads many to do so. Some transsexuals are proud of their particular route to womanhood, feel that they have learned a lot from the joumey they have taken, and value the unique qualities they bring to the women’s community.

GENDER MYTH #5

Transsexuals take jobs away from other women because they had access to better training when they were men.

FACT: By making the transition from male to female and staying at the same job, some transsexuals have forced employers to change rules restricting women’s positions and salaries, thus opening doors for other women. Many transsexual women seek out qualified women to hire. Furthermore, by holding jobs not traditionally thought of as appropriate for women, these transsexual women bring the message to the general public that women are capable of performing “men’s” jobs.

GENDER MYTH #6

To lessen the power of patriarchy in our lives, we must purge our community of everything male, including women who once had male anatomy.

FACT: By emphasizing the distinction between male and female, we reinforce the idea that there are exactly two distinct sexes. This is the very concept that permits sexism to exist, because discrimination wouldbe impossible if women were not readily distinguishable from men. If we wish to deflate the power of the patriarchy, the most effective thing we can do is encourage the blurring of gender lines and expand our thinking beyond the male-female dualism.

GENDER MYTH #7

Most women can easily prove they are not male-to-female transsexuals, if they are challenged to do so.

FACT: There is no simple way to prove you are not a transsexual. There are no apparent physical characteristics nontranssexual 7 women have or lack that distinguish them absolutely from transsexual women. Birth certificates and other documents show an “F” for both. Chromosome tests may reveal | an XY pattern for a nontranssexual woman. | Hormone levels do not distinguish transsexuals from nontranssexuals. Even inspection of the genitals may not provide definitive proof of your gender history.

GENDER MYTH #8

Male-to-female transsexuals have been raised as boys, have never been oppressed as women, and cannot understand women’s oppression.

FACT: Some male-to-female transsexuals were raised as girls for portions of their lives, appeared to the world as girls, and were treated like girls. Some were beaten and raped both by outsiders and by their own family members because of their belief that they were girls or their desire to become girls. For most, the difference in the way they were treated when they appeared as men and after they began appearing as women brought sexism into sharp focus.

GENDER MYTH #9

Women’s space is not “safe” space if male-to-female transsexuals are allowed.

FACT: Women's space is not safe | whenever anyone in it behaves in threatening or disrespectful ways toward another. Transsexuals are no more likely to | behave this way than nontranssexuals. We should exclude individuals who behave badly rather than exclude an entire group 3 because some of its members act in | offensive ways—any group could be | excluded on this basis. Most importantly, )) women must take responsibility for their their own feelings of being unsafe when others are not acting in threatening ways.

GENDER MYTH #10

Transsexuals have surgery so they can have sex the way they want to.

FACT: How or with whom a person wants to have sex is rarely a major factor in the de) sire for sex reassignment. Usually, people undergo reassignment in order to make their bodies conform more closely to the way they feel inside—their gender. Whether a transsexual is attracted to men or to women usually doesn’t change with surgery. » Although no figures are available, probably | a third of transsexual women are straight, one third bisexual, and one third lesbian. Sexual orientation is not related to gender identity.

GENDER MYTH #11

Male-to-female transsexuals are trying to take over the lesbian community.

FACT: Most transsexuals who identify as lesbians are focused on their own personal growth and happiness—just like most nontranssexual lesbians. Those who feel strongly about their night to participate in women-only events may become activists for their cause and hope to influence the lesbian community. On the other hand, being overly sensitive to issues of power and wanting to avoid controversy, many transsexuals repeatedly decline to take leadership positions and abstain from participating in decision-making votes.

GENDER MYTH #12

The sex assigned to a person at birth is that person’s “real” sex.

FACT: Sex is assigned at birth on the basis of a cursory glance at the baby’s genitalia. | In about 5% of births, there is some ambiguity in the sexual organs, and mistakes can be made. In other cases, internal genitalia, chromosome patterns, hormone production, and secondary sex characteristics that develop later may be at variance with the person's external anatomy. Sex is arbitrarily assigned by the patriarchal medical system, and there is no reason to assume that it is any more correct or real than what a person experiences.

GENDER MYTH #13

The lesbian and women’s communities have nothing to gain by including transsexuals.

FACT: Transsexual women bring many valuable qualities to the women’s community. They bring skills usually taught only to men into the women’s community and pass them on to other women. Many are active feminists, increase opportunities for women, and seek to hire and promote women. Those who have made it through transition must have intelligence, persistence, and a sense of humor. Many also bring a spirituality that has been possessed historically by cross-gendered members of various cultures.

GENDER MYTH #14

Nontranssexual women have the right to decide whether transsexuals should be included in the women’s community.

FACT: Each individual has a right to claim her own identity. While being adamant about having this right for themselves, some members of the women’s community would deny it to others. Just as each woman must come to her own conclusion about whether she is a lesbian, each must know her own truth about being a woman. Transsexuals can and do include themselves in the women’s community and the lesbian community without permission from nontranssexuals.

GENDER MYTH #15

Transsexuals are guilty of deception when they don’t reveal right away that they are transsexuals.

FACT: There is no standard of disclosure that requires transsexuals to reveal their medical history, just as lesbians do not need to mention their sexual orientation immediately on meeting someone. The circumstances in which this is considered an important fact to know vary from person to person. The individual meeting a transsexual may collude in the “deception” by assuming she or he is a nontranssexual. If it’s important to you to know, take responsibility for asking.

GENDER MYTH #16

Male-to-female transsexuals are considered men until they have sexchange surgery.

FACT: Although male-to-female transsexuals appear as men during some part of their lives, most never consider themselves men. They have felt like females for their entire lives. The change from male to female is a change in external appearance of sex-related characteristics, not a change in gender (how a person feels inside). This transition takes place over a period of several years, and sex-reassignment surgery is only one part of it, together with living as a woman, taking hormones, and resocialization.

GENDER MYTH #17

People can be categorized as transsexual or nontranssexual—there’s no in-between.

FACT: There are nearly as many categories as there are people. There are transsexuals who have had or plan to have one, two, or many surgeries to make their bodies conform more closely to their gender, and those who will never have surgery. Some people feel comfortable expressing both genders. Some refuse to identify as either gender. Some people (male and female) enjoy cross-dressing, but their gender is congruent with their sex. Some conform to gender norms; some flout them. The possibilities are infinite.

GENDER MYTH #18

Women who want to become men have bought into societal hatred of women or are hoping to take advantage of male privilege.

FACT: Female-to-male transsexuals don’t want to become men—they are men. The reason they want to change their bodies to become more male appearing is because that’s how they feel inside. If they gain male privilege, it is tenuous; whatever they have gained is lost if they are discovered to be transsexuals. If transsexualism were based on misogyny, there would be far more female-to-male than male-to-female transsexuals. In fact, their numbers are thought to be about equal.

GENDER MYTH #19

A person’s “true” sex can be determined by chromosome testing.

FACT: Although most persons identified as male at birth have XY chromosomes and most of those identified as female have XX, there are many variations that can occur. Some “women-born women” have XY chromosomes, a fact that may be discovered only when they are tested to qualify for athletic competition. Other patterns, such as XXY, XYY, and XXX (no, this does not make you an amazon) can also exist. Some individuals have what is called mosaicism, in which some percentage of cells have an XY pattern and the remainder have XX.

GENDER MYTH #20

Transsexualism is unnatural—it is a new problem brought about by sophisticated technology.

FACT: Throughout recorded history there have been people whose gender identity did not match their anatomic sex, and there is evidence that sex-change surgery was performed thousands of years ago. In some cultures, transgendered individuals were held in high esteem as shamans. Today, surgery—from liposuction to sex reassignment—allows many people to have a physical form that is more congruent with | their inner sense of themselves and the way they want to appear

GENDER MYTH #21

“Real” women, certainly those who belong to the lesbian community, rejoice in their womanhood and have no desire to be men.

FACT: There are people who were assigned as females at birth who identify as men, and many of them become part of the lesbian community. Most would be labeled butch lesbians. Many are afraid to reveal their desire to appear more completely as men, including taking testosterone and undergoing surgery to remove their breasts and construct penises. (Transsexual men are apparently permitted at Michigan because they are “still women” according to the Festival doctrine of immutable sex.)

GENDER MYTH #22

Now that Festival policy has been made clear, there are no transsexuals at Michigan.

FACT: Festival policy is far from clear. The brochure states that the Festival is for “womyn-bom womyn.” Many transsexuals include themselves in that category. While some transsexuals have no desire to participate if they know they are unwelcome, others are here and will continue to come because they have a right to be at any event open to women. No statement has been issued about whether female-to-male transsexuals are welcome at the Festival.

GENDER MYTH #23

Transsexuals have caused trouble at Michigan, resulting in their expulsion.

FACT: According to Festival organizers, transsexuals have been attending MWMF for many years, and 1991 was the first time a transsexual has been expelled. Nancy Burkholder was expelled because she said something that made a woman suspect she was a transsexual, not because her behavior was offensive. In fact, Nancy had participated fully in the 1990 Festival without incident. There is no evidence that transsexuals have ever caused trouble at Michigan. Seeing transsexuals as trouble-makers is once again blaming the victim.

GENDER MYTH #24

Nontranssexual women at Michigan don't want male-to-female transsexuals here.

FACT: Although Festival organizers claim that the policy excluding transsexuals reflects the senument of the community at large, many nontranssexual women support the rights of transsexual women and want them to be included. A survey of over 600 women at the 1992 MWMF showed that 73% of those surveyed thought male-to-female transsexuals should be welcome at the Festival; 23% thought they should not be welcome and 4% were undecided. Only 20% would welcome female-to-male transsexuals, who are apparently permitted.

[cellophane-wasp]

Alternatively...

Edit: let's add a few more layers to this

Testosterone often (not always) makes trans men infertile.

Trans women obviously can't be impregnated (apparently scientists are working on that).

Trans men are masc (for the most part).

Trans women are femme (for the most part).

Initially I was mad that everyone was picking boypussy even though it's clearly the right answer. Then I realized it isn't necessarily. Obviously not all trans people are on hrt or even want to be, but I'm not diving into the intricacies of medical transition, gender expression vs gender identity, etc. Now I'm not really sure what Eddie Glusky would prefer.

[tangledinink]

I just saw another ask calling Gemini au Donnie afab, and obviously he does have XX chromosomes in your au (or the turtle/mutant equivalent at least?), but if afab means assigned female at birth and Donnie and Leo were assigned male at birth by Big Mama.... Does that technically make the two of them amab trans men???

Or.... amak? assigned male at kidnapping?

LMAO yeah. I always grapple with the terms because I'm like. WELL... THEY TECHNICALLY... WEREN'T ASSIGNED FEMALE AT BIRTH LMAO,,,, they're both, technically speaking, amab, so yes, they are in fact both amab trans men lmao.

And they weren't TECHNICALLY kidnapped... so... amaa? assigned male at... adoption??? u w u

[p2ii]

have you considered that maybe that trans guy isnt a girl actually

(exclutionists/anti 'contradictory' labels/etc dni)

[red-lights-of-doooooom]

Controversial autism post of the day:

On the term "Aspergers": Yes, we all know Hans Asperger was a Nazi. Yes, we all know that the term "Asperger's Syndrome" is out of date and hasn't been in the DSM for more than a decade. That being said, if there are older autistics who wanna call themselves "aspies" or say that they have "Asperger's", then that's their choice. You shouldn't necessarily call them out or correct them for it. Sometimes that's what they're comfortable with. Maybe it's just more comfortable for them to say that then it is to say "autism" or "ASD" or "level 1 autism" or "high functioning autistic disorder" or any other label.

Source: am autistic. Was lucky enough to be diagnosed at 3, despite being female, back when they called my condition "Asperger's" as it applied to me. I personally use autistic or ASD, but I won't be offended if you call it Asperger's. Sometimes I even say "aspie" to refer to myself, even.

This is kind of similar to the trans debate. One of my older friends is trans (MTF) and has been a woman for a long time now. But she still says (pardon my language) "transsexual" as opposed to the more politically-correct term "transgender", simply because she says that it was the term she was given when she was young and she doesn't feel the need to change it. She usually just says "trans", though. And honestly? More power to her. I'm not going to correct her if that's how she personally identifies. That's her choice, I guess.

[shinygemstone]

So some people I know recently posted an ad where they asked for "AFAB roommates". These people meant well and were trying to find a way to exclude cis men, particularly fratboy types. I instantly clocked that this probably wasn't the best terminology, but it got me wondering:

(note: these results were just the first 8 that I could come up with. I know that some of these are not preferred terminology but I figured I'd put them in for good measure. Also, I'm not going to bring this up to my acquaintances, so don't ask. Additionally, use what terminology you like: I'm not trying to police anyone's language, I'm just curious)