#tongbi yuanhou

[mythologyfolklore]

I made more memes. :)

[inkyminx]

[ep2nd]

What are your lmk sexuality canon

Alright here we go-

Yall please don't kill me this is my own headcannons-

MK- Demiromantic

Mei- Bisexual

Macaque- Bisexual

Huntsman- Bisexual

DBK- Bisexual

Redson- Bisexual and Genderfluid (the genderfluid might be canon to LMK can't remember)

Wukong- Pan

Azure- Pan

Spider Queen- Omni

Tang- Gay and Aromantic

Syntax- Ace

Sandy- AroAce

Pigsy- Bi

Scorpion Queen- Lesbian

Peng- Non-binary (canon)

Yellowtusk- nothing (I just don't have any for him)

The Mayor- Queer

9HD- Queer

Big Spider- nothing

PIF- Straight Alley (is that what you call it???)

AND IF THE OTHER 2 CELESTIAL PRIMATES WERE HERE

Red-Horse Baboon- Demiromantic and Gay

Long-armed Gibbon- Pan

[artisticmoonfall]

This ship name is MonkeyBarrel cause a group of a monkey is a barrel. 

[digitaldoeslmk]

Tongbi Yuanhou (Through-Arms Gibbon), local butch Auntie, has everybody's birth charts memorized

[quitealotofsodapop]

Hi! I wanted to ask something.

Like, most of us knows there are 4 Spiritual Monkeys in the legend(book)... Do the Wukongs and theyr LEM's ever tought about looking for them? Cause mines did and It was chaos

Tongbi: Wait... why there are not other us, Chikao? *Sad precious sunshine noises*

Chikao: We are probably lucky in theyr universes to not having to ature theyr "bullduey"

*Wukong and Liu'er fighting in the most platonic way possible*

(If you are wandering who Tongbi and Chikao are, Chikao = Baboon and Tongi = Gibbon. And both are girls)

Love them and all the different versions people are coming up with! Bonus: the @journeytothewestresearch post about them!

I've been personally calling them "Babs" = Baboon (Chikao mahou, 赤尻馬猴) and "Gibs" = Gibbon (Tongbi yuanhou, 通臂猿猴) as a nickname! XD

My idea is that they are the older of the four *known* celestial primates, with the oldest celestial primate being the since-ascended Shen Monkey who raced for the Jade Emperor.

Tongbi/Gibs has a naturally stretchy body (think like Monkey D Luffy) and is very optimistic. Whilst, Chikao/Babs is more of a realist with the power of reading a person's thoughts/intentions (an interpretation I have for "Understands human affairs,").

My personal hc backstory for them is that;

Tongbi/Gibs was born/hatched along the Heavenly River, her species limbs stretching to allow them to climb, swim and dance between the clouds and astral waterways. She could be considered the "Fresh-Water Monkey" for this reason. Her egg had actually fallen to earth during the Great Flood when the fifth Heavenly Pillar broke, and was found by a tribe of proto-humans (of which Fuxi originated) that raised her as their own. She lived with them for many years before deciding to seek out others of her kind - where upon she met Chikao/Babs

Menawhile, Chikao/Babs was actually born into the Underworld amongst demonkind. Her fellow demons did not understand why she had hatched from a egg-shaped stone that sat undisturbed in the demon-capital city of Youdu for many millennia, but they accepted her as their colleague nonetheless. When Chikao/Babs came of age, she was trained to carry out the duties of a Psychopomp; to gather and bring deceased soul before Yama and the Ten Kings, the same duties as Ox-Head and Horse-Face. She could be considered the "Abyss Monkey" for her gloomy origin.

The two celestial monkeys meet by pure chance when Chikao/Babs herself nearly dies trying to collect the soul of a reluctant water demon. Tongbi/Gibs saved her, and it was love/fascination at first sight like Little Mermaid.

The two female monkeys are soulmates in a yin-yang like dynamic. One stern and aloof, the other silly and expressive. They began seeking out others of their kind almost immediately after meeting - failing until they found a certain little stone monkey being cared for by an old mentor.

I made a joke post a while back about these two finding little Sun Wukong early and raising him as their own, and now I can't stop thinking of it! The Netflix and Smash Legends SWKs are who I most imagine as having the two super-powered moms, but I could def see an AU of Lego SWK having moms. X3

Chikao and Tongbi def be cringing hard at how bad their son is fumbling expressing his feelings for Macaque, and for how bad Macaque is at confronting *his* feelings!

[journeytothewestresearch]

One question is if the six-eared macaque is a negative aspect of Sun Wukong's personality, that means that the other two mystical monkeys are also aspects of the personality except that unlike the Macaque, they are both positive aspects or simply part of Sun's personality. and the reason why they do not appear directly or are agonistic in jttw is because they do not go against the path of Buddhist enlightenment

Sorry if you don't understand, I don't speak English and I'm using a translator.

I've also speculated that the other two cestial primates are aspects of Sun Wukong's mind. An update to my Six Ears article reads:

I'm not really sure why the other two don't explicitly appear in the narrative. But I do know that, including Sun Wukong, the four celestial primates mirror the four kinds of monkeys and apes living on Flower-Fruit Mountain. As I write here, chapter one reads:

The Handsome Monkey King thus led a flock of gibbons [yuanhou, 猿猴], macaques [mihou, 獼猴], and horse-monkeys [mahou, 馬猴], some of whom were appointed by him as his officers and ministers (based on Wu & Yu, 2012, vol. 1, p. 106). 美猴王領一群猿猴、獼猴、馬猴等，分派了君臣佐使。

The gibbons are also called "long-armed gibbons" (tongbei yuanhou, 通背猿猴; lit: "(arms)-through-the-back gibbons"). [1] (This refers to the belief that the long, agile arms of the gibbon were somehow connected (i.e. tongbi, 通臂), passing through the back (i.e. tongbei, 通背) (Gulik, 1967, p. 92-93).) The horse-monkeys are also called "red-buttocked horse-monkeys" (chikao mahou, 赤尻馬猴). [2] These terms are important to remember.

Here is the list of the four celestial primates:

Stone-Monkey of Numinous Wisdom (Lingming shihou, 靈明石猴) - i.e. Sun Wukong

Red-Buttocked Horse-Monkey (Chikao mahou, 赤尻馬猴) - The exact same kind as that mentioned above.

Long-Armed Gibbon (Tongbi yuanhou, 通臂猿猴; lit: "Connected Arms Gibbon") - As mentioned above, tongbi (通臂) and tongbei (通��) refer to the ape's long arms.

Six-Eared Macaque (Liu'er mihou, 六耳獼猴)

The apes and monkeys of Flower-Fruit Mountain and the Four Celestial Primates both include Sun Wukong (i.e. the Stone Monkey), Red-Buttocked Horse-Monkeys (Chikao mahou), Long-Armed Gibbons (Tongbei and Tongbi), and Macaques (mihou), one of which has Six Ears (Liu'er). Therefore, the two groups are practically the same.

Based on this, a person might suggest that if one celestial primate (Sun Wukong) is born on Flower-Fruit mountain, then others can be, too. This opens the door to all four of the celestial primates having been born (or at least manifesting) there. And since Six-Ears is an aspect of Monkey's mind, the missing two celestial apes could be as well.

I should note that Wukong's Four Might Commanders are two long-armed (tongbei) gibbons and two red-buttocked horse-monkeys. Someone could suggest that two of them make up the missing celestial primates. But they are never shown to have great powers, just knowledge about the world outside of Flower-Fruit Mountain.

In the end, though, the missing celestial primates may not appear simply because they are not important to the overall narrative.

Notes:

1) Yu (Wu & Yu, 2012) incorrectly translates tongbei yuanhou (通背猿猴) as "bare back monkey" (vol. 1, p. 131).

2) Yu (Wu & Yu, 2012) incorrectly translates this as "baboon" (vol. 1, p. 106). The horse-monkey was a nickname for the macaques placed in horse stables to keep away sickness (refer to here).

Sources:

Gulik, R. H. (1967). The Gibbon in China: An Essay in Chinese Animal Lore. Leiden: E.J. Brill.

Wu, C., & Yu, A. C. (2012). The Journey to the West (Vols. 1-4) (Rev. ed.). Chicago, Illinois: University of Chicago Press.

[draxeanlxia]

If they ever add the other two celestial primates AKA Chikao Mahou the Red-Buttocked Horse-Monkey and Tongbi Yuanhou the Long-Armed Gibbon into LMK, I really hope they remember the Gibbon is an ape meaning they does not have a tail. They’re known as the Celestial Primates for a reason because Gibbon is the only ape. I know some fan artists who have drawn the characters on what they might look like in LMK and a lot of them have Gibbon having a tail when as an ape they shouldn’t have one. Not that their art is bad, it’s just not correct for an ape to have a tail.

Also I kind of want Gibbon in the show to say “Come on! When will there be another ape? I’m tired of being the only ape.”

[garnet-cow]

My version of the two other celestial primates + headcanon and notes I have about them + their relation with my OC :

I kind of headcanon that every celestial primates have golden pupils because they grew apart from the 10 categories of life. Before becomming a celestial primates each of them had different eyes color. But the gold of their eyes is still shade with that original color ( Chikao had orange/red eyes and Tongbi had green eyes, Sun Wukong had orange/yellow eyes and Macaque had purple/pink eyes ).

About Chikao Mahou ( nicknamed Chika ) :  

-She's the oldest of all the spiritual primates and the only female. 

-Bisexual / Aromantic

-She loves administratives ! Like a lot. She adores it. 

-She's also a rider, she has plenty of horses in her domain.

-Really big lady, tallest of the group, with giant mane, and imposant aura + She has the biggest fangs of all the spiritual primates. 

( She gave me Erza Scarlet's (Fairy Tail ) Vibes )

-Don't ask me why but I feel like, she speaks Spanish

There's that fun fact about baboons that kidnap puppies and kitties to make them their pets and cubs in some region in Africa and Now I can only imagine her adopting every kid she can (plus it gave her more administrative stuff to do so there's only great point in it.). Additionally, I have a vision of her instructing each of her kids in horse riding and providing them with their very own horse.

Not the type of lady that lets males being the boss of her day. If you want to fight to prove that you're the strongest to her go on, but she's gonna beat your ass. Don't have husband/wife/mate/girlfriend/boyfriend because she doesn't want to.

She actually met Li Wei some years after she left the palace and start her journey around the world with her herd. They didn't pass many times together, but they enjoy it. She's the one that taught Li Wei how to use and control her titan form.

Tongbi yuanhou: 

-Passionate by astronomy, he passes his nights observing the sky and discovering new planets and stars and information that he kept in his journal. 

-He don't mind people but he likes his little lonely moments. 

-Always wears pullover or hot clothes because he passes a lot of times in the coldness of the night. 

-Has already met Chang'e. 

-Is the smallest of the group but can change his size if he wants, he just don't really mind. 

I want to give him a lover since I like the fact that male gibbons are loyals partners but I’m not sure. I love the idea of him being a loving husband. Like, you know, he’s not a fan of crowds and people unless it’s with his soul mate.

-Live in a giant cabin in a giant tree. 

Know about Li Wei's existence, he has met her father when he was alive but their encounter didn't end well. After learning her father's death, he searches for her in china but she was already far from the land. (Little reminder Li Wei's father was an illegal experimentation meant to defeat the 4 celestial primates, He was mainly inspired by the Long Armed gibbon, but that experiment fail and her father appears without any magical abilities).

-He doesn't want children but he likes spending time with Chika's one.

Chika and Tongbi are close friends.

[thejadetrios]

My take on the Long Armed Gibbon.

Searched abt the Four Primates,and I saw the name(Tongbi yuanhou)

I also think that if Macaque and Sun Wukong aren't on the side of heaven,then the Long Armed Gibbon and the Red Buttoxed Baboon/Monkey are. Also,there is the theory from RV Sketch on YT(I love their theories,its very interesting),and I like their take and theories abt these two primates that we barely even know.

Like,if the theory is correct,then,um,Tongbi is a blood clone that was created by Sun Wukong for unknown reasons,and since we don't see Tongbi being with Sun Wukong or any mentions of them,I figured maybe she's like Macaque,with abandonment issues or conflict with Sun Wukong in a personal way.

Not sure if I did the fur color right,cus its either like a light blond or a light paige...

But that's just my take

Also shoutout to RV Sketch on YouTube. Love your ideas

[miki-13]

Lego Monkie Kid: What is Macaque’s Damage?

TLDR: My theory-crafting/headcanons on Macaque, his past and what his fucking deal is.

Six-Eared Macaque is the one the Celestial Primates/ Four Monkeys of Havoc, alongside Wukong (The Intelligent Stone Monkey), Mahou (The Red-Buttocked Horse Monkey) and Yuanhou (The Long-Armed Tongbi Gibbon).

None of these four are classified within the ten categories of life or contained within the names of either Heaven or Earth.

Meaning all four are pretty special, for better or worse.

Wukong’s stone of birth was situated in an area where food and water were plenty and there were other monkeys that taught him how to be a monkey. Though he was of stone and clearly different in power, Wukong had love, family and a home.

But Macaque… wasn’t so lucky.

Macaque’s Past (This is the theoretical/headcanon part now)

Macaque was born far from anyone even remotely resembling him. He was witnessed by humans, who feared and shunned him for both his appearance and powers. Even demons who allowed him close found him wanting, and Macaque put on a mask of power and arrogance just as they did.

This is where his superiority-inferiority complex and abandonment issues were birthed.

At some point Macaque heard of the Monkey King, of his power and army. Macaque felt bitter jealousy towards him immediately: how dare this Monkey King have so much when Macaque had to fight tooth and nail for what little he had? 

He hatched a plan: kill this Monkey King and take his place, along with all that he possessed. Macaque would no longer be scraping the bottom of the barrel.

So Macaque disguised himself and infiltrated Flower Fruit Mountain, ready to kill Wukong and take his place.

He didn’t expect to be discovered, captured and brought to the Monkey King himself… or for said Monkey King’s reaction to him.

“You… you’re just like me.”

That sentence changed everything, and Macaque realized he was right just by being in his presence; as two of the four Celestial Primates came into contact.

They were like one another: formed unknowingly with great power, different even from other monkeys and demons. 

In this moment, Macaque and Wukong were no longer alone.

The Sun And Moon

From that moment on, the two were inseparable. This was the highest point of Macaque’s whole existence. He had a friend, a companion, a precious partner. Someone he could stand alongside with and not fear he was being tricked by or was inadequate to.

Whether he was the Macaque King (who is actually female/ Female Monkey King, as “king” in Chinese is gender neutral), one of Macaque King’s subordinates (that Macaque King got to show off to Wukong) one of the Stalwart Generals- specifically Marshal Liu (Liu short for “Liu’er Mihou” and is my personal headcanon for him- I’ll explain in another post why), or simply the Six-Eared Macaque that was able to meet the Monkey King before they became enemies (As in the 2009 animated series) is irrelevant atm.

When he was with Wukong, everything was right in Macaque’s world, and he chased this feeling without care for anything or anyone else.

But while Wukong was the only one in Macaque’s world... Macaque was was far from the only one in Wukong’s world.

Wukong had his friends and sworn brothers+sisters, his precious children and grandchildren of Flower Fruit Mountain (Wukong literally calls them his children and grandchildren), a wife (according to some translations of JTTW where he took Princess Jiaozi from the Golden Cauldron Kingdom as a consort) and his penchant for making friends and enemies as easily as breathing meant that he was never alone nor wanted for companionship.

And Macaque HATED this.

It didn’t matter that Wukong encouraged him to be beside the other monkeys around him, it didn’t matter if he brought Macaque alongside him whenever he would train or discuss with his sworn brothers, it didn’t matter how Wukong would hope for him to be friends with his loved ones.

Wukong was all that mattered to Macaque. No one could fill the void in his soul like he did. After all, they were the only ones like each other. The Sun and Moon. Yin and Yang. Two halves of a whole. Macaque didn’t need anyone else in his life so long as Wukong was there.

In fact if everyone were to vanish but Wukong, Macaque would be happy.

(And Wukong in some part enabled this. After all, Macaque was the first one he met that was like him and he didn’t want to lose someone he cared for. He had never encountered a toxic relationship like this before and didn’t even realize what Macaque expected of him was extremely unfair to Wukong.)

But when Wukong left for Heaven in the hopes of bringing all he loved with them, Macaque’s abandonment issues became worse. He shut out anyone who tried to reach out to him, inconsolable that Wukong left. He lashed out and started to project that Wukong had abandoned them, nevermind he always kept his promise to return.

Macaque’s hopes rose when Wukong returned from Heaven with the pills of immortality and heavenly wine, allowing all close to him to partake in them (His generals, his officers, sworn brothers, etc.). 

And then Wukong was captured.

They lost the war with Heaven.

And no one saw him after that for 49 years.

Then Erlang Shen and his soldiers came to raze Flower Fruit Mountain.

Macaque was expected to defend against them. He was close with Wukong, so wouldn’t he defend what he loved?

But Macaque resisted the attempts to make bonds with others outside of Wukong. And without Wukong in this world, Flower Fruit Mountain was just another place.

So Macaque ran.

He abandoned Flower Fruit Mountain and it’s people to Erlang Shen’s attacks.

And he didn’t look back.

500 Years Later

Macaque didn’t resurface until JTTW. In that time, he could not handle the depression, loneliness and survivor’s guilt from what happened. He could not confront his own issues and failings because it would destroy him, nor could he accept that what kept him alive lost him everything he had ever loved.

So he did what he did best: channeled his grief into anger and picked the best target for it. This time, it was Wukong.

If only he hadn’t left him for Heaven, if only Wukong stayed by his side, then none of this wouldn’t have happened. It wasn’t Macaque’s fault. He didn’t fuck up. He did everything right. This was all on Wukong.

If only, if only, if only.

And he kept repeating this to himself for 500 years and then some…

How Macaque heard of Wukong returning is irrelevant. All he heard was that the Monkey King was on a journey with four others, helping people and beating up demons.

Macaque was furious.

Wukong was not only alive and well for five hundred years, but now he was gallivanting on yet another quest with four other nobody-strangers?! While Macaque had been tortured by his own feelings?!

Ohh no. No no, no, no, NO.

Wukong didn’t get to do this to Macaque. He didn’t get to disappear and go off with yet another group of strangers he was going to choose over Macaque!

(Nevermind Wukong always tried to help Macaque get along with his loved ones so he wouldn’t be so alone. After all, Wukong was all Macaque would ever need.)

So Macaque did what he did in Journey To The West (and what he wished he had done before): stalked Wukong (Macaque absolutely got a kick out of watching Wukong get fillet’d- to him, it’d be catharsis and “serving him right”), framed him, got him kicked out of the Pilgrimage and attempted to take his place. And for good measure, pretended to be Wukong and ruled over Flower Fruit Mountain while trying to finish the journey as quickly as possible. (And is most likely the reason FFM is deserted save Wukong and a few other monkeys in LMK)

We all know how that ended. (Or do we?)

Symbolism: Macaque’s whole deal isn’t just rooted in the background that LMK gave him, but one that is expressed within the text of Journey To The West itself and the symbolism that crafted his character in the first place.

The Six Eared Macaque is specifically the embodiment of the sixth ear as well as heterodoxy. Both have to do with the concept of an eavesdropper/third party listening into information and learning that is considered sacred and/or secret, taking in information meant to be passed down from master/teacher to disciple/student without full initiation or understanding of it.

This is how Macaque survived in the world, how he learned to cope and to hide and to get what he needed.

It’s also why not only could he not defeat Wukong, but Macaque remained distant from all other bonds aside from him. He could mimic the bonds, but they were a hollow thing. It’s how he was able to leave FFM to burn and how he could blame Wukong over himself.

After all, these were what allowed Macaque to survive beforehand… yet these were also sabotaging his ability to adapt as well as his relationship with Wukong.

Macaque never had a complete understanding of what he was learning or what Wukong tried to give him. He could mimic it, certainly, but he didn’t truly understand why he was taught this way and he never bothered to truly understand either Wukong’s skills+ strength or his personality.

So both Macaque’s skills and his relationship with Wukong remained hollow.

And that is reflected in how he interacts with the main cast. He doesn’t bother to get to know MK, doesn’t bother to differentiate him from Wukong and doesn’t bother to even think about trying to be better until MK offers a better way at the literal end of the world.

“But why couldn’t he learn before? What stopped him?”

Because it was how Macaque had survived in the world. These were skills that kept him alive where others died… and because they kept him alive, he didn’t discard them after he met Wukong. And those same skills in turn screwed over his relationships and how he perceived Wukong and others.

There is a chance for him to do better (shown in his first and only act of unambiguous goodness in saving Bai-He), but it will involve him actively confronting himself and how he’s survived, and how those are actively hindering him while fucking up the one good thing he had in his life.

One thing is for sure: it’s gonna be messy.

Source: https://journeytothewestresearch.com/

[journeytothewestresearch]

Here are some updates:

One passage suggest ALL four celestial primates are present on the Mountain of Flowers and Fruit in Sun’s youth:

The Handsome Monkey King thus led a flock of gibbons [yuanhou, 猿猴], macaques [mihou, 獼猴], and horse monkeys [mahou, 馬猴], some of whom were appointed by him as his officers and ministers (Wu & Yu, 2012, vol. 1, p. 106).

美猴王領一群猿猴、獼猴、馬猴等，分派了君臣佐使。

There’s the Monkey King (Stone), gibbons (Tongbi/bei), macaques (Six Ears), and horse monkeys (Red-Buttocked).

Also, a reader left a comment on my blog suggesting that the four magical primates are not part of the 10 categories of life—as stated by the Buddha—”[b]ecause Wukong erased their names from the book of Life and Death”. This refers to chapter three when Sun inks out his name and those of all other primates when his immortal soul is mistakenly summoned to hell. It’s important to remember that Monkey has his own book, so the others might have had books too.

Thanks to this dictionary, I learned that one late-Qing source, New Dialect (Xinfangyan, 新方言, early-20th-c.), associates “horse monkey” (mahou, 馬猴) with various iterations of Chinese terms for macaque monkeys, further supporting the theory connecting them to horse stables:

Muhou: muhou; muhou: mihou – these are called mahou, the sound of each one changing [in turn].

沐猴：母猴；��猴：彌猴，令人謂之馬猴，皆一音之轉。(the original doesn’t have punctuation)

This article notes muhou (母猴; lit: “mother monkey”) is not referring to a female primate but the name of a macaque. The Annotation of the Shuowen jiezi (Shuowen jiezi zhu, 說文解字注, 1815) explains:

Muhou is the name of the beast, not the female. Muhou and mihou are changes in dialect. The characters are wrong.

母猴乃此兽名，非谓牝者。沐猴、[彌]猴皆语之转，字之讹也。

I’m still looking for older references to the horse monkey, but it looks like its a macaque and not a baboon. 

Sketch Request for @sketching-shark

I have a lot to say about this one. I'm putting it all below the cut:

Let me start by saying this is the last of the three requests I got before I updated my rules, and I am not drawing a background like this for the others. Ya'll already know how I feel about backgrounds.

And sorry this took so long but I'll explain why below

-

Sketching-shark...buddy...friend...my dude, why you gotta put me back on my bullshit???

"idk if this is something you'd be interested in imagining/portraying-"

DUDE, DO YOU KNOW THE SELF-RESTRAINT I PLACED ON MYSELF TO MAKE THE SHADOW OF THE KING AU CANON COMPLIANT????

I WAS BARELY HOLDING BACK, I HAVE SO MANY CONCEPTS IN MY FOLDERS I WASN'T LETTING MYSELF USE, BUT THESE MONKIES HAVE WORMED THEIR WAY INTO MY HEART AND MIND, HOW DARE-

FUCK IT, THIS IS EXPANDING INTO THE LEGO MONKIE KID TIMELINE. AND I'M SHOVING THESE TWO INTO IT.

I WANT TO HUG YOU AND SHAKE YOU AT THE SAME TIME.

-

Firstly, this drawing was an EXPERIENCE. I knew about the four spiritual primates, but the other two are mentioned once each in the entirety of jttw. I spent quite a bit of time trying to find like ANY other information about like what they're intended to represent/symbolize in jttw, but I came up pretty much empty. Though I did find out that they can also be translated to be called the "The Four World-Wrecking Monkeys."

Anyway, meet Cháng-bì Yuán [left] and Mǎ hóu [right], aka the Long-Armed Ape and Bare-bottomed Horse Monkey. I really hope their names translated the way I wanted them to.

I have spent so many hours trying to figure out their species and designs.

I originally intended to design Cháng-bì off of an extinct species of gibbon, but I was unable to find any reconstructions or artistic renditions of any of the three extinct species, so I decided to leave Cháng-bì's specific species vague.

Mǎ hóu on the other hand was far more complicated. Some translations called her a bare-bottomed ape, or horse monkey, and others said baboon. I have no idea what a "horse monkey" is and my searches didn't yield much. It definitely didn't help that baboons are not native to Asia. I decided to make her a gelada, cause they live in grasslands and eat grass which is kinda horse-like I guess? They also have these gorgeous manes and lion-like tails. (Have you seen their teeth? That shit gave me nightmares as a kid)

Cháng-bì's clothing gave me a bit of trouble. I know gibbons have long arms, but drawing them is so weird since my brain tells me she's heavily disproportionate. I covered her arms with sleeves both because I like the look, and it helps me ignore her arm length.

I looked up a lot of different styles of hanfu before settling on this one for Cháng-bì. I actually finished this pic like two days ago, but I went back and completely redesigned her hanfu cause I really didn't like it. I don't think this will be her final look, same for Mǎ hóu. I have a number of issues with both of their clothing. Cháng-bì's collar and embroidery looks off. And do me a favor and pay as little attention to Mǎ hóu's armor as humanely possible. But this gives me a pretty good starting point.

I am not the best at clothing design, as you've probably noticed by now...

I can't find much information on them outside of their one mention in jttw. I'm not expecting that they themselves appear anywhere, but like what do they mean?? What do they represent? What would be proper powers to give them? Cause currently Cháng-bì's possible abilities sound the most terrifying.

Guys, I need answers, I need information. Or ideas or something. I am not knowledgeable enough in the Chinese mythos to plan these two out the way I want to. I have a very vague idea about their pasts and personalities, but nothing I'm comfortable with solidifying.

Any form of help or resource is very welcome.

Overall, this was a pretty fun mini project. I even got to draw a protective SWK.

[journeytothewestresearch]

Ty! On that note, what is the most accurate translation when describing the Four Monkeys? The Red-Buttocked Monkey in particular because you’ve got translations like horse monkey, baboon, and possibly mandrill? I’m also interested in their abilities and would please like a reliable source on what each is capable of.

Your best source for the abilities of the four primates is JTTW. I have altered Anthony C. Yu's translation of the names to make them more accurate:

“The first,” said Tathagata, “is the Stone-Monkey of Numinous Wisdom [Lingming shihou, 靈明石猴], [1] who Knows transformations, Recognizes the seasons, Discerns the advantages of earth, And is able to alter the course of planets and stars. The second is the Red-Buttocked Horse-Monkey [Chikao mahou, 赤尻馬猴], who Has knowledge of yin and yang, Understands human affairs, Is adept in its daily life And able to avoid death and lengthen its life. The third is the Long-Armed Gibbon [Tongbi yuanhou, 通臂猿猴], who can Seize the sun and the moon, Shorten a thousand mountains, Distinguish the auspicious from the inauspicious, And manipulate planets and stars. The fourth is the Six-Eared Macaque [Liu’er mihou, 六耳獼猴] who has A sensitive ear, Discernment of fundamental principles, Knowledge of past and future, And comprehension of all things. These four kinds of monkeys are not classified in the ten categories [of life], nor are they contained in the names between Heaven and Earth” (based on Wu & Yu, 2012, vol. 3, p. 115). 如來道：「第一是靈明石猴，通變化，識天時，知地利，移星換斗；第二是赤尻馬猴，曉陰陽，會人事，善出入，避死延生；第三是通臂猿猴，拿日月，縮千山，辨休咎，乾坤摩弄；第四是六耳獼猴，善聆音，能察理，知前後，萬物皆明。此四猴者，不入十類之種，不達兩間之名。

One late-Qing source, New Dialect (Xinfangyan, 新方言, early-20th-c.), associates “horse-monkey” (mahou, 馬猴) with various iterations of Chinese terms for macaque monkeys:

"Bathing-monkey” (muhou): “mother-monkey” (muhou); mother-monkey (muhou): “full-monkey” (mihou) – these are called “horse-monkey” (mahou), the sound of each one changing [in turn]. 沐猴：母猴；母猴：彌猴，令人謂之馬猴，皆一音之轉。(the original doesn’t have punctuation)

And since the stone-monkey is Sun Wukong, the celestial primates consist of three macaques and one gibbon.

Here is my article on the four celestial primates:

[digitaldoeslmk]

INCREDIBLY curious on your thoughts of the bare-armed gibbons powers/role, if they’re still active/alive at the time of the story ! CKMH beloved though I wanna hear her gossip if she’s got any, she seems like such a chill person (lowkey wine aunt vibes, I love it)

oh she sure is!! Tongbi Yuanhou is alive and well, she has an appointment in heaven and helps to coordinate the Celestial Mansions. she's like an interdepartmental manager if you will xD i already got her design idea done, just need to Draw Her

she keeps in touch with Mahou and Wukong, she can smell when the stars and planets are gonna bring some inauspicious tidings and warns them accordingly. in fact MK gets introduced to CKMH when she gets him out of legal trouble cus TBYH called her and told her, quote, "you better get to the kid before the cops do cus, the vibes, they are off."

as for gossip, CKMH has the whole roster of it ahhdhjhawbdjh and she's quite fond of her wine, esp the rice wine she brews with her own troop of monkeys uwu they infuse it with all sorts of fruits and spices, they are a very yummy treat if veeeery alcoholic lmao