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tumblingxelian · 1 month ago

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Chloe Knows:

Apparently game Chloe knows Marinette is Ladybug, so I wrote this:

Summary: Chloé Bourgeois is perhaps the last person Marinette expected to see on her roof after having lost the Miraculous to Felix.

Chloé Bourgeois is also probably the person Marinette least wants to see on her roof.

Unfortunately, or perhaps fortunately, Chloe knows more than she's ever let on and that complicates things, but it just might end up helping too.

Chloe Knows:

The last thing Marinette expected to deal with right now was Chloe hanging out on her roof, arms folded and tapping her yellow jacket impatiently.

It was also the last thing Marinette wanted to deal with, save maybe finding Hawk Moth waiting for her. & that thought just sent her gut into a tailspin, so Marinette forced open her ceiling hatch and stalked onto the roof.

Chloe zeroed in on her instantly, hissing, "You kept me waiting!"

Marinette barely resisted the urge to grab and shake the blonde, because she had only just finished re-tethering herself after the disaster of losing the Miracle Box.

Still, she had just enough restraint to only force her way into Chloe's space, grounding out, "How did you trick my parents into letting you up here, Chloe?"

The blonde blinked confusedly, "I climbed?" She motioned to a discarded pair of gloves sitting in the rooftop bin. "Why would I talk to your parents about that anyway? This is our business."

Marinette tried very hard to parse that question but she was still trying to process Chloe having scaled her walls!?

"Because they-, I-" No she as not dealing with that right now. "Chloe we don't have business!" Marinette settled on, arms flailing.

"Normally we wouldn't, you made sure of that-"

"Oh I made sure of it?"

"Yes you," Chloe huffed, somehow the one affronted, "When you got me to be terrible for my mother, then made it impossible for me to be good as Queen Bee by taking Pollen. Now you go and lose her & the others? I thought you were at least cunning to pull that scheme off Dupain-Cheng, or are you just lucky!?"

Marinette technically 'heard' what Chloe said, but she didn't have the wherewithal to react to it. Not right now as her whole world felt like it was suddenly unreal and empty and yet crushingly full all at once.

"Hah, haha, what are you t- talking about? Me, take a pollen? I don't know what that is? I don't even like wasps!"

Chloe dragged her hands down her face, screaming into her palms, "You cannot be this thick, no one can, for the- I know you're Ladybug, I've known your Ladybug for ages. Now tell me how you lost the Miraculous!"

"I could never be-"

Chloe stepped forward, counting off on her fingers.

"Rena is Alya, Nino is Carapace, Sabrina the Hound, Max is Pegasus, Kim is monkey guy and Zoe is Vespera, very petty of you, kudos really. Need I list more?"

"I"

"I've seen your Kwami, do I need to grab your damned earrings!?"

Marinette's hands flew to them, and she flung herself back, then started to giggle, maniacally.

"Hahaha, of- of course, this is a nightmare! All a nightmare! I didn't fail, Chloe doesn't know anything, I didn't get tricked by Felix and doom Paris! Hahaha- OW!"

Chloe pulled her hand back and out of pinching distance.

"You're awake Dupain-Cheng & finally answered my question to boot. Felix, ugh!! What, did he pull that stupid 'I'm Adrien' stunt and you just tripped over yourself?"

"Actually-" Tikki cut in gently, drifting out of her bag. "There was no tripping that I recall, & he'd had help this time, as Adrien wished to stay in Paris so it was more believable."

Marinette felt like her throat was closing up as she rasped, "Tikki, why!?"

The Kwami turned to her, big eyes doleful, "I am sorry Marinette, but it was obvious she knew and has evidently known for sometime. I felt you continuing to try and cover this up would only make things worse not better."

"Good thing too, I was about to tackle her and shake you out of that bag-ah!"

Marinette grabbed Chloe, spun her around and trapped her against the nearest wall. Eyes wild and frantic, the command phrase to transform dancing on her lips.

"Where's Hawk Moth? What's your game Chloe!?"

"If this was a game I'd be having fun, also," Chloe brought her hands up, and sharply but lightly 'chopped' her way out of Marinette's grip with the sudden pressure on her elbows and then shot out of grabbing range.

"Uhu, you had your chance to straddle me and passed it up."

Marinette's overtaxed brain wanted to 'scream' at that particular mental image. But Ladybug Brain was taking over and she snapped.

"How long have you known? It can't be that long or Hawk Moth would have found out already. After Penal-Team, no after-"

"Are you kidding? I've known way longer than that," Chloe boasted.

"Then why doesn't Hawk Moth know? Why didn't you just Akumatize and bring him the Miraculous!?" Marinette hissed.

"Because I don't want him to win, obviously!"

"You say you want him to win all the time!"

"I say stupid stuff when I'm angry, sue me!"

"Marinette!" Her parents called, and she could hear them racing up the ladder and nearly tripping over one another in a bid to make it to the rood.

Tikki vanished back into her purse and Marinette stood stock still frozen as her parents clambered out. Her mother hugging her close and her dad stepping between her and Chloe.

"How did you get up here?" Her father groused.

"Marinette, are you OK?" Sabine asked, fretfully.

A million and one excuses flew through Marinette's exhausted brain. Class project, Chat Noir dumped Chloe on her roof, she was Ladybug & Chloe had come to yell at her- No wait, that was the truth!

"What business is it of yours?" Chloe snapped back, evidently not intimidated by her father.

"Because this is our home, and our daughter and you are trespassing." Tom rumbled.

Chloe leaned to the side and looked at Marinette, still in her mothers arms, and then pointedly looked 'past' them.

"That doesn't answer my question, Marinette and I's business is none of yours."

Her mother frowned, "You've never had business with our daughter, just sharp words at best. You have no right to her or anything here."

"Ch- Chloe was just checking up on me, after Monarch's announcement." Marinette rambled, trying to piece the pieces together into something workable that wouldn't send Chloe into a fit.

Both her parents looked stunned and also like they wanted to ask if she was concussed.

Fortunately, Chloe managed to pick up where she'd left off.

"Exactly, we certainly aren't friends, but I felt obliged to check up on someone else I knew Ladybug wouldn't check on."

"What?" Her mothers hug tightened, and her voice actually quivered.

Her father looked between the two sides, seemingly lost for what to do with himself.

The pieces fell into place and Marinette came to the truth, in a sense.

"I was Multi-Mouse, when my science teacher god Akumatized, Ladybug needed someone who was good at multitasking."

"Marinette," Her father rushed forward and pulled her into a hug that knocked the air out of her lungs.

"I... I helped her, I did OK I think."

"You got the Miraculous back so you did your job," Chloe cut in, neither warm nor scathing.

Her mother evidently didn't agree, "It shouldn't have been her job, either of your jobs. You're children!"

"Mum, dad, it's fine, really it's fine!"

Her mother ran a hand through her hair, "I feel like there's something you aren't saying sweetheart."

She glanced at Chloe who was watching the exchange with an inscrutable expression. Some strange mix of confusion and almost starvation like hunger that was honestly painful to perceive.

Marinette licked her lips and pressed on.

"Chloe was right that Ladybug might not check up on me. At least not in a way I could see."

"She's usually such a good hero?" Her father said, sounding despondent.

"It's because I asked her too! I... When I was Multi-Mouse, I used the other Miraculous. A lot. I shouldn't have, but nothing bad happened!" she hastily added, at her parents near frantic looks of worry.

"Ladybug warned me, but I misunderstood and she said even though I was OK this time I shouldn't use magic again for a long time. I was upset, I wanted to help her, I-"

Why was she crying?

"I wanted to be a good hero, but I just screwed up and now," she was sobbing. Gods she was sobbing in her mothers arms.

"There there, my treasure, I am sure you were brilliant, let it out," her mother stroked her hair while her father hovered protectively, one large hand rubbing circles on her back.

Fortunately, Marinette had already cried her heart out once tonight and was too tired for a truly spectacular breakdown.

She managed to half slip her mothers grip, wiping at her eyes. "Thanks, both of you," she glanced at Chloe who was back to not quite staring at them. Her face was a mask of forced, haughty neutrality that looked like it was being kept in place with wires buried beneath her skin.

"Thanks for checking up on me Chloe, and for somehow not telling Hawkmoth our, my, anyone's identities when he had you Akumatized all those times." Because she still needed an answer to that, only the fact Tikki hadn't seemed panicked was keeping her grounded.

Chloe swallowed, hands clenching and unclenching before she spoke.

"Yes, well, I might not be Queen Bee or a hero anymore, but ridiculous circumstances demand ridiculous actions. So for tonight I'm a hero and it's the duty of a hero to look out for people. Even one's they hate."

OK, ow.

Chloe pressed on, "As to identities," She shrugged. "If that idiot Hawkmoth, Shadowmoth or whatever he's calling himself had that kind of control he wouldn't have to wait for people to break before getting them under his thumb. Even when I let him in the last few times, I never let him dig deep and I'd just kick him out if he tried to paw at any of my secrets."

Marinette felt like her heart was going to collapse in on itself because, "Even knowing everything you do, you just- I can't- I don't understand you at all Chloe!"

That actually seemed to draw the blonde up short, "That's a surprise, I thought you knew me better than anyone. You're certainly good at," Chloe looked at her parents ten back to Marinette, "Hitting my weak spots when we come to blows."

It felt like there was a lot to unpack there and for the first time in a long time, Marinette knew she'd actually have to spare no small amount of time and thought on Chloe's inner workings.

For now though.

"Even if you 'can' just kick him out."

"You know I can!" Chloe stomped her foot. "You saw me do it when I was Penal-Team!"

"That's my point! Isn't that like willingly helping him!? Other people have to be tricked!"

Chloe scoffed, "Tricked she says, don't over-sell it, it's being angry or sad, or whatever and taking a deal. Besides, does it look like I'm helping? I played soccer for an hour then quit."

"You had a bunch of people trapped in deadly orbs Chloe!"

"So what!? People try to kill me all the time! Ivan tried to smear me on the pavement! Nathanial tried to chop my legs off! Mommy murdered me and no one cared! No one!"

There was a choked edge in that but Chloe pressed on. "Because it's not a big deal, and anyone trying to make it a big deal is just looking for sympathy points, so there."

She huffed and unfolded her arms, "Anyway you've clearly got people to tend to and I got what I came for. See you at school, Multi-Mouse."

With that she marched across the rooftop to her sky-box. "I'm not climbing the walls again if I don't have to so I'll just leave out the front and avoid the stray dog."

Before she reached the door, Marinette was surprised to see her mother reach out and gently grasp Chloe's shoulder.

"Chloe," She said firmly, as the blonde practically froze up, looking half ready to bolt, or shout. "Thank you for checking up on our daughter, that was a good thing and for whatever it's worth. People should have cared, I'm sorry those who should don't."

There was a moment where Marinette honestly expected Chloe to start crying, to fling herself at her mother and howl and sob. She was sure she saw something glisten in her eyes before Chloe wiped it away, and swallowed.

Her voice was rough as she said, "It's... Thanks, or whatever, doesn't matter. I don't need anyone's help."

"Everyone needs someone, so if your feelings change, don't be afraid to ask, people can surprise you. Especially if you don't break into their house." Her mother said the last part with a sort of forced, hopeful smile.

Chloe nodded, like taking an instruction, a rasped something escaping her lips before she achingly pulled away and climbed down the ladder.

A million and one feelings, questions and terrors still swirled in Marinette's mind but as her father and mother gently guided her down the ladder, intent on hot coco and comfort talk. She knew they'd have to wait. Could wait, until she was rested and ready.

Even still, a part of her would linger on the question of Chloe. What to think, to feel, to do, certainly. But also on the quieter, more uncomfortable thoughts.

Like who someone who felt they had no one would turn to if they were desperate and at the end of their rope.

'& it's not just Chloe either, who does Chat Noir have besides me?'

It was an uncomfortable thought, but one buoyed by a new revelation. No matter how omnipotent Hawk Moth seemed, no matter how all knowing he claimed to be; he was clearly far less than that.

It wasn't much to build on, but it was something, a foot hold from which she could dig in her heels and drag him down from his perch.

Golden hair flashed in her mind again and another thought echoed in her head.

'One good foot hold may be enough to bring down Hawkmoth. So what could it do for someone else?'

Because no matter what she said or had done, Chloe made a choice tonight, and had been making choices for longer than Marinette realized. Not having fallen down the slope but merely standing on the brink.

'But she took a step back tonight, to somewhere I can reach.'

& maybe all Marinette needed was one good foothold to pull Chloe all the way back, perhaps Farther than she'd ever been, or Marinette even realized was possible.

It was a tender little hope, strange and unsure, but somehow, in Marinette's mind, it felt like solid gold.

NOTES:

Wrote this is one sitting, then edited it, I hope it reads well XD

I have no plans to continue this, though if someone else wants to take it and run with it please feel free. I kind of envision Marinette re-inviting Chloe to the class group chat as a sort of olive branch and them slowly working through their respective issues.

Also Chloe turning up at Felix's with a tazer and the same martial arts skills that let her fight Mayura to a stand still and possibly, violently reclaiming Doosoo, cos you can pry Jock!Chloe from my cold dead hands!

#MLB #mlb fandom #miraculous ladybug #marinette dupain cheng #chloe bourgeois #Text Post #Oneshot #My work #Miraculous: Paris Under Siege #Fanfic

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miraculouslbcnreactions · 5 months ago

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Granted, tumblr’s search function may broken but I can’t find a post on your blog centered on Alya’s writing. As a person constantly on the look out for critical examination of Alya’s role in the narrative and the compromises on her principles, relationships and competences made to artificially engineer the episode’s story, I’d be very interested to see your thoughts

I use Alya's writing as an example of a character done dirty all the time, but I don't think I've ever done a sugar post focused on her and I totally should. Before we get into it, I will openly admit that her bad writing bothers me more than Marinette's or Adrien's because she is best girl and we stan her. What can I say, I'm a writer whose best friend is an artist with a diagnosed anxiety disorder. I like characters who are writers and with artsy, anxiety-ridden best friends. They are my people and that gives us a great starting point for this post.

Marinette is the unambiguous main character of the show, so it makes sense to design both her hero partner and her best friend around balancing her out, giving them strengths to fill out the spots where she is weak. It's how you make a strong cast. When Alya is allowed the shine, she fills that balance role wonderfully and I love it! Some of my favorite moments are when Marinette goes on one of her rants and cool-headed Alya drags her back down to Earth:

Marinette: We're gonna stroll over there real cool as if we just happened to be passing by. Alya: Then what? Marinette: Then? I'll invite him out for a fruit smoothie at the end of the photo shoot! Then, we'll get married! Live happily ever after in a beautiful house and have two kids? No, three. And a dog! Maybe a cat? Nah, forget the cat. A hamster! I love hamsters! Alya: Let's just start with just happen to be passing by and see if we can get to that smoothie.

This banter from Stormy Weather is fantastic. It's exactly the type of thing I want to see from these two as it gives Alya a very different flavor of supporting role from Adrien. While Alya and Adrien are both card holding members of the Marinette hype squad, Alya is more of a voice of reason while Adrien is there to validate Marinette and follow her crazy schemes without question.

This brings us to the first issue with Alya's writing: when the plot demands it, they make her a gullible tabloid journalist even though it goes against everything her character should stand for. The reasons I'm comfortable saying this are many. The first one is that Alya is very clearly supposed to be seen as a serious journalist. That's why you get scenes like this one from Feast:

Alya: Now you know back in the day sculptures were painted, right? Most of the paint vanished over time, but tiny microscopic pigments still remain. Thanks to this special app, witness how it originally looked. But here's the big thing. All these works of art have something in common. It's the same symbol! Look, everywhere. It's like some kind of secret society emblem. As if a kind of Order of the Guardians has been watching over the superheroes since the beginning of time!

This scene would not exist if Alya was supposed to be the kind of person who only cared about getting blog hits because this type of content isn't where the money is. But money and clout aren't what Alya cares about. She's just a passionate reporter (or fan girl) who wants to know everything she can and who is having fun sharing her obsession with the world. This is an extremely important aspect of her character because it brings us to reason two that she clearly wasn't meant to be a clout chaser: if she was a tabloid journalist who only cared about hits, then she should have never been given a miraculous.

I could go on a rant her about how poorly Alya's blog is used after she becomes Rena Rouge, but I'll spare you the word count and just say that, as soon as she joined the team, she should have stopped sharing secrets on the blog. It makes sense that a blog would initially fill her need to share the fine details of her obsession, but once she's on the team, the blog should have been replaced by her teammates. She could still have the blog, but it shouldn't have things like the freaking guide to how the miraculous work that we see in the season four episode Gabriel Agreste:

Alya: The Miraculous are magical jewels that give powers to superheroes, like Ladybug's earrings and Cat Noir's ring. But supervillain Shadow Moth also has two Miraculousbrooches in his possession, and they will give him his powers. We can figure out from this that the Miraculous can either make a superhero or a supervillain. It's all riding on who wears it, which is why these jewels can't fall into just anybody's hands.

Alya, you are supposed to be Marinette's sole confidante at this point. Why are you giving the world this information? The writers are doing you dirty, my dear, and I'm so sorry. The best I can do is to promise to never treat you like this in my stuff.

Now, to be fair, there is some nuance to this. Alya is a human being. She's allowed to have flaws, so I can absolutely forgive her for getting caught up in the moment and posting scoops to her blog without thinking (see: Oblivio). That's honestly a great weakness for her character to have as it makes perfect sense for a fan girl to fan girl. At the same time, if you want to have a fan girl character who becomes part of the things she's a fan of, then you usually need to give that character something that will tone them down and make full fan girl mode something other than the standard setting.

Making your fan girl a serious reporter is a great way to do that! It allows you to have that initial bust of fan girl hype that quickly switches into serious get-the-details mode. Without that kind of complexity, Alya would just be another Wayhem and one Wayhem is already one too many.

While I will give Alya some grace on this topic and even call it a good thing for her character, the same cannot be said for her writing because the writers fail to embrace her hype as an in-the-moment weakness and it ruins her character. To put it another way, a lapse in judgement about posting a photo is excusable as a photo is quickly acquired and posted. A lapse in judgement about a full interview with a total rando who is claiming to be Ladybug's best friend is not excusable (see: Volpina). It's a completely different flavor of poor judgement as - at a minimum - it requires Alya to stand there talking to a person for several minutes and never once question what that person is saying. Those are not the behaviors of a good journalist.

Of course, this brings us to the most glaring example of Alya's character assassination: the Lila thing. Almost everything about this arc paints Alya as a terrible friend, which is a massive missed opportunity as Lila is the perfect antagonist for Alya! Who better to take down a liar than a truth seeker? It's such an easy way to give Alya her own mission to focus on, especially if you make Lila more subtle. You don't even need to have Alya believe Marinette without question. Just have her be an investigative journalist who is like, "You know what, this new girl clearly bothers Marinette and I know Marinette can get caught up in her own head, but it doesn't usually last this long. I think something is up, so I'm going to use my skills to see if Lila is telling the truth that way I know if I'm supporting the right person here." Don't have your character claim that she checks her sources and does research if you're going to turn around and have her believe whatever she hears without checking any of it!

Even outside of the Lila thing, I wish we saw more of Alya's research skills! They were such a good thing to give Marinette's best friend as Marinette is great at focusing on a clear task, but research is the kind of thing that would overwhelm her, so it makes perfect sense to make her best friend a researcher as that lets the team have someone to help track down whatever Gabriel is calling himself this week. The writers even understood this to some extent as we saw in Mr. Pigeon 72:

Alya: Marinette, how long have you been working on this? Ladybug: I dunno, six-seven days, maybe ten. Now that we're on spring break, I finally have time to put my whole heart into it! Alya: When was the last time you worked on one of your own designs? Ladybug: I do loads of designing! Look!��(pointing to the contraption at her door) I designed a security system so that nobody can enter my room when I'm not in it. And if I put on this hat (puts on modified hat) I hear everything that's going on in here, even when I'm out of the room. Alya: I'm gonna have to break it to you because I'm the only one who can. THIS IS TOTALLY INSANE! Girl, trust your BFF. When I'm researching something obsessively and I can't think of anything else, that's when my mind can get really blocked. You know what you need most right now? A break! Ladybug: No way! No breaks until I find out how to keep Shadow Moth from reakumatizing people!

Remember who ultimately figures out how to keep Shadow Moth from reakumatizing people in this episode? Alya! Because her creative style is all about researching and looking at the evidence. You know, the classic skill set of a reporter?

I really do mean it when I say that the show has a fantastic setup for telling a good story. Alya's character should have been a perfect addition to Marinette's team. My favorite lineup is the line up from season two with Kagami and Luka in non-love-interest bonus roles that I won't get into here since it's a little too deviant from canon to make sense without explanation. Instead, I'll just give you the clear roles they perfectly set up and then squandered for the original miraculous five:

Ladybug: Battlefield commander

Rena Rouge: Big Picture Strategist (basically Marinette excels at reactive thinking/leading during a battle while Alya excels more at proactive thinking/long-term tactics)

Chat Noir: Peacekeeper/Heart/Hype Man

Carapace: Protector/Stop Button (much like Alya and Marinette, Nino and Adrien should have been two sides of the same coin with Adrien being focused on making everyone happy while Nino focuses on keeping everyone safe)

Queen Bee: Wild Card/Chaos Element (I love a good chaos element who is there to suggest the options that won't occur to people who have been raised to follow the rules.)

I'll also point out that this lineup would show that the characters weren't interchangeable and make the two main couples feel more unique and meant for each other. For example, Nino's tendency to encourage others to stay safe would pair terribly with Marinette's need to not get too caught up in her own thoughts. The second Nino second guesses one of her plans she'd fall apart, so she needs Adrien to be her Chat Noir. Similarly, Alya's impulsivity weakness would make her a terrible match for go, go, go Hype Noir! She needs a partner who makes her take two seconds to second guess herself. There was so much potential here you guys! So much potential! It could have been beautiful! Instead, we got canon...

There you go, my broad love letter to Alya. I could keep going, but you didn't request a specific topic, so I'm just going to end it there. Feel free to ask for more, but please do it in another ask as this is already super long and - out of kindness to my followers- I try to avoid essay after essay on the same post unless they really need to be connected.

#Alya deserves better #ml writing critical #ml writing salt #Alya defense squad

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bakawitch · 6 months ago

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More Miss Mouser au!

Archelona is here to join the heroes' side! Still swapping some heroes around, so Alya and Nino are up next. I'm not completely satisfied with her colour scheme yet, but I'll change it accordingly when I figure out what I don't like about it. And Nino and Alya are siblings in this au because I apparently like them with a sibling dynamic more lol

Alya has been working in the same 4-star restaurant since she finished her culinary degree. She's sharing an apartment with her brother Nino, and her life has been perfectly unassuming until she got mixed up in a murder case investigated by the legendary Detective Roux. After successfully clearing her name, she was contacted by a mysterious creature, which gave her the power to assist Detective Roux on a mission to clear the streets of Paris from criminal activity, supernatural or otherwise.

Marinette Adrien Lila

#yeeeeaaahhhh definitely gonna update her design #uuugh what do i do XD #the more i look at it the more i hate it XD #i was trying to do too many things at once again #theres a reason shes not a journalist in this au #miss mouser au #miraculous ladybug #mlb #mlb au #alya cesaire #kwami swap #turtle miraculous #baka arts

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ilikekidsshows · 3 days ago

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Many people said "CN is not a good fighter' and I just realized how the narrative really make it looks like that's really the case despite of him being supposed to be a fencer champion and know martial arts and I was?? Baffled?? He even beaten by Scarabella despite being more experienced in fighting than Alya?? Either this show favor the girls more to the point it want to show that boys are incompetent or the boys are really incompetent in universe idk

---

The Scarabella thing is a combination of three things, at least, in my view, and some are problems that were always there, while others relate more to the retool. 1) The writers are pushing this being a girl power show so the girls always have to be smarter and stronger than the guys. You can see a bit of this in the preretool show where the boy classmates are, to be frank, already depicted as a bit more stupid than the girl classmates. Compare what the boys get up to when they gather together (throw a frat party) with what the girls get up to when they gather together (fashion shows, planting trees, hatching get Adrien quick schemes). 2) Cat Noir/Adrien is too popular so his role in episodes and importance to the narrative have to be diminished as much as they can while still keeping him around enough for his toys to sell. I’m actually starting to think “and Cat Noir” was a purposeful decision to make the show more marketable that Astruc then didn’t want to commit to. 3) Ladybug has to be the greatest at everything ever, regardless who is being Ladybug at the moment. Ladybug can’t lose to Cat Noir because she’s the better/more important/stronger hero.

Please ignore how Ladybug’s “fighting ability” in most episodes with actual villains is running away while Cat Noir fights them head on. Please ignore how Ladybug’s strategy for physically strong or fighter type Akumas is to have Cat Noir fight them while she comes up with a plan. Please ignore every single time there’s a horde of enemies, outside of Rena Rouge’s introduction episode, where Cat Noir was worfed to make her entrance more impressive when she saves him (wow look, another pattern), Cat Noir is the one who takes them out. Please ignore how Cat Noir utterly destroyed Miracle Queen’s elite fighting force with the most broken superpowers at their disposal.

Like, before I was done with the show and fandom, I tried to avoid saying I think Cat Noir is the better fighter. I said it was a “matter of taste” instead of “Ladybug gets handed the most important powers and the writers obviously favor her and her fighting style so this comparison is incredibly unfair on Cat Noir”. But, even then, I have always thought that Cat Noir’s fight scenes are just more often actual fights versus Ladybug’s super planning skills making her the most important character ever. Miraculous leans into trickery in fights, because that’s Marinette’s strength and lets her be “the best in a fight”, but in terms of actual fighting ability, Cat Noir just shows more actual moves and strength and tactical thinking in a moment. In a battle shounen series, Adrien would be the better fighter, and Marinette would go through a training arc before she can best him.

We also have a bunch of evidence that Cat Noir is physically stronger than Ladybug from the OG show, but I could never say that straight-up, because, even before the retool made discussing this show into a minefield, Marinette stans were a fucking annoyance on the fandom who’d dogpile anyone who said anything that could be construed as “Marinette salt”, like, “I think Cat Noir is physically stronger and her wins are based on strategy and not strength”. The reason this statement would rub people the wrong way is because Marinette is always needed for the win condition, so she has to be better, even though Sailor Moon is the worst fighter among the Sailor Scouts and still has the purification powers. There’s also the sexisim of the girl character needing trickery to win, while the guy wins in honest hand to hand more easily. After all, the Miraculous fandom’s logic is that pointing out obvious writer biases means you actually hold those biases.

In a fight between any type of Ladybug and Cat Noir, Cat Noir will lose because it’s Ladybug. In addition, the boys are provably depicted as more incompetent than the girls, especially when they're shown doing something side by side. But, if we look at actual fighting accomplishments, Cat Noir has more impressive fight scenes under his belt than Ladybug, because the people making this show are actually pretty sexist in what they actually show their girl characters doing.

#ml critical #ml salt #ml writers salt #dats chats

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sweetcloverheart · 2 months ago

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Everyone's understandably (and rightfully) pissed about Marinette basically convincing Adrien that being locked in a rubber room by his abusive parent was "for his own good" (And that she's also lying to Alya about what went down GIRL WHY????), But my personal issue aside from that is why the hell she also covered for Tomoe by claiming she was also blackmailed? Yeah, Kagami wants to "redeem her" (Which I'll, reluctantly, accept) and asked she not be jailed, but I doubt she'd care much about her mother's crimes being public knowledge - or at least knowledge to a fellow victim of her scheme. Marinette has zero reason to portray her as a "helpless accomplice" of Hawkmoth's terror in that story she fed him and just said "Yeah, Tomoe helped Hawkmoth - but Kagami asked that I not send her to prison so she could rehabilitate her mother into being a better person herself, so I chose to respect her decision."

#Clover Rants Miraculously #ML Salt #The only excuse I can come up with is that she wanted to cover her bases and keep Adrien from doubling back with Kagami #Thus exposing her lie about Gabriel #Which just....makes the whole thing WORSE like 😬

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literaphobe · 26 days ago

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AU where Nino doesn’t fall in love with Alya over one afternoon but rather he does so gradually so Adrien thinks he still has a crush on Marinette, BUT through some cursed miraculous-esque misunderstanding Adrien thinks Marinette likes Nino too only that she doesn’t want him to know but of course just like in canon she’s got it crazy for Adrien only she can’t tell Adrien she doesn’t actually have feelings for Nino BECAUSEEE she’s convinced he only talks to her to scheme and discuss her eventual confession to Nino AND AND ANDDDD at some point whilst trying and failing to confess to Adrien that she isn’t actually in love with Nino she causes him to think that she’s now in love with Alya instead—it gets to the point where when Alya and Nino DO start dating she begs them to keep it a secret from Adrien who will be heartbroken thinking the two people she was once in love with and currently in love with are now together. She does not, at any point, realize that Adrien fell in love with her too and is now super heartbroken and in pain every time she discusses her supposed SUUUUUUPER huge and ultra bigggg crushes on Nino, and then Alya, respectively. yes the part in the show where she accidentally confesses to chat noir that she’s in love with him as marinette still happens and it makes it all way more confusing and complicated for Adrien

#text #miraculous ladybug #core four #marichat #adrienette #djwifi #this is based on a show im watching rn where this guy has NO CLUE the girl who likes him likes him #and thinks she is in love with someone else and is being WAY too supportive about it #I was like oh my god Adrien would do this #and I ran with it because whenever I am in deep horrible suffering I come up with post ideas

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gale-gentlepenguin · 2 months ago

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Gale Reviews: Miraculous World: London, At the Edge of Time

(Spoilers for those that havent seen it. and yes this will be my sort of Live reaction, with my thoughts at the end)

-Okay so Nooroo be sad and trying to appeal to this person's morality.

-Okay so I was wrong about them being Adrien, but they are... Blond Lila?

-Okay, so She was actually BOTH akumatized Villains. Not gonna lie, That is so expected I assumed one of them would be adrien. Damn

-Intro be dope though

-So they are playing some weird variant of chess.

-If I was kid Alix, Id be salty, I would never. win since the other versions of me KNOW all my moves.

-OH DAMN GRANNY BUNNYX! 70, damn she looks good for 70

-Oh they be fading, and they arent even phased. Because they know what will happen. Wow... kind of takes the drama out of this

-Oh cool, recap

-They dont even bother saying he was originally called monarch.

-Alix is so valid for that comment about them kissing

-"Gabriel makes his wish, history is still on course." Yep they are playing the Miguel O' Hara is right canon event bit unironically.

-Portals start vanishing. But the drama is gone because YOU KNOW Alix will fix it

-Oh there is a depressed Bugnoire. Confirmed that merge miraculous can still use powerups.

-She goes to London. Damn this is depressing, and sterile

-Bugnoire casual destroys the cell to free Kagami made me chuckle

-Marinette reflecting on what happened. talking with Gabriel

-"Adrien cannot find out."

TO THE SURPISE OF F***ING NOBODY!

-Kagami calling her out but then saying she will oblige her

-Oh they actually talking about Tomoe.

-Kagami wants to try and talk to her mom, which Marinette honors because... at least she isnt being a hypocrite here.

-Okay I know I am a bit nasty, but I do appreciate the time the scene is taking. its really building up the tension to this.

-Gorilla out of nowhere just like "Let me unlock it first." that made me chuckle

-I feel VERY CONFLICTED. Because on one hand, LOVE THE ANGST. Absolutely just perfection. Really milk that drama. But f*** do I HATE how this came about.

-Oh the Lie is actually pretty convincing. Oh look at how absolutely distraught Adrien is. Boy is f***ing wrecked.

-OH DAMN ADRIEN OUTBURST

-That Adrigami comforting.

-I want to love this absolutely heartshattering scene. Its beautiful, its angsty.

-Okay, you know what. I will hold my reservations until I actually finish.

-You can just see the absolute distraught face of Marinette. SHE HATES THIS. SHE ABSOLUTELY HATES WHAT SHE IS DOING. OH THAT IS SUCH A BEAUTIFUL ANGSTY THING. Its slowly warming me up a bit, the finale was missing this.

-Oh damn, Nathalie knows Marinette is Ladybug. WELP, just another person that knows thats not Adrien.

-Oh damn, Ladybug monologue, while she destroys everything related to Hawkmoth, monarch, and his scheme. In a way, becoming his greatest accomplice.

-The press conference is full of a lies. Wow its starting to feel just like real life.

-Nathalie comforting Adrien, such a soft scene. Meanwhile Tomoe and Kagami are cold to eachother

-Marinette is at the train station

-That adrinette hug.... yea, thats the good stuff

-Im happy the kwami are safe.

-There is a lot of not talking in these moments. letting the music set the tone.

-And day becomes night, Marinette sleeps with Plagg and tikki by her side. Now she asks if what she did was right

-Is there a kwami of truth? Because if there is, I wonder what animal it is

-WAIT, She lied to Alya too? THAT I didnt see coming.

-And right there, we see when the special ACTUALLY Starts

-Okay the vest is funny

-The burrow has a slowed down time aspect, makes sense because of the whole time travel thing.

-So they have to take Marinette's Miraculous from when she renounced it. For a split second, I thought she was talking about the Kwami choice, but it was actually Origins. Which makes more sense

-So thats why Tikki becomes so sure of Marinette.

-She changed colors? Why thoough?! Granted I do prefer it to the original costume, but not as much as the lucky charm form.

-"There is no such thing as ghost." GHOST FORCE WOULD LIKE A WORD MARINETTe

-Basically she can phase through things like Kitty pride. And be invisible. So like a Ghost.

-Ladybug verses the Ghost akuma

-She cant touch them

-Calender. it means you have to go to a different time

-This special really likes hammering in that Ladybug's lie is wrong, yet at the same time NO ONE is offering her an alternative. So it feels like the special isnt really committing to the "Marinette is right" or "Marinette is wrong."

-"Sorry, you cant take the butterfly miraculous cause Canon Event." Yea this is getting repetitive

-So Time Stalker was there. Saw Ladybug was Marinette

-Yea, not gonna lie. All the clips showing the finale only remind me how much I HATE it.

-Gabriel f***s off to leave his son an orphan but gets to be with his wife. Thus getitng his wish forever and now Ladybug has to basically let it happen because F*** her in particular

-NATHALIE WITH A CROSSBOW!

-Nathalie telling the small crying teen who was willing to sacrifice HERSELF, that she didnt have to go that far. People often forget Marinette is a TEENAGER going through s***. Nathalie should have stopped Gabriel earlier

-That aside, all this special reinforced is that Gabriel is an idiot. He really could have won so much easier

-And thats how Time stalker found out

-Marinette figured out they were the same person, clever writing

-Super ghost and Super Spy dumb names

-I love Barkk. She is like "Dont be so sure"

-Man this special really retreads a lot of old ground a lot

-Miraculous Bug Noire

-So Bugnoire saying until they get the butterfly miraculous back. She cant tell him the truth.... Yea no. Thats dumb. I still find this very dumb.

-But the whole mini portal thing was funny to me. Why not just make a portal under them to pull them in.

-There we go.

-SHE HAS MORE OF THEM? Okay thats pretty clever

-"He or She?" if it wasnt present bunnyx Id assume she knew.

-The explanation on why Nathalie cant tell Adrien is also bulls**t.

-A wiseman once said, the "Truth hurts but once, but a Lie will ache forever" Marinette is basically setting up for worse

-I will say, the Choreography in these encounters is pretty cool.

-Okay the plan was clever

-Ladybug is apparently REALLY good at forging signatures. Are we sure Marinette isnt a future villainess?

-The Ladybug monologue with that funky beat was fun

-HEHEHE Lila Temper tantrum

-Poor Nooroo

-Well the plan worked.

-Bunnyx not being sad about having to stay as Bunnyx.

-Wait, so how come they can go ride dinosaurs if they cant mess with time?

-So bunnyx says "Hey its cool to lie as long as you own up to it eventually." Thats a fucking terrible lesson for kids to learn. I hope everyone reading this knows that

-Wait... is Chronobug dead?

-Nope, she is still alive

-Plagg is confused. But Tikki knows. Okay thats cute

-Marinette fixing the miraculous and upgrading them. Thats neat

-Marinette's logic for spreading it out makes sense at least. And the new hawkmoth doesnt know the heroes identities. Tomoe might though

-Okay, Plagg is cute.

-Ah yes, the Ladynoir

-There is that Hug. Thats that good stuff

-Chat noir's guilt and Ladybug's Guilt

-And then Lila's monologue at the end

___________________________________________________________

Now... How do I feel about this special?

I am torn.

On one hand, it did show that Marinette is feeling the effects of the secrets she is keeping. She is clearly feeling guilty about it. And the special does a LOT to justify what she is doing and never outright gives her a pass for it. I also LOVED that sweet succulent ANGST. Good stuff.

on the Other hand, some of the explanations are not good (like Adrien not finding out until after the butterfly is found? It makes no sense), and it hand waves a LOT of things. Not to mention, it does basically have Marinette, Kagami and Nathalie in this secret Cabal of secrets. Tomoe is basically not held accountable. And the whole Canon event thing and time travel basically means there is never any real danger. So it really takes the wind out of this.

But BUT, This special does at least imply that this secret will be the cause of tension, now the question is IF the show will actually deliver on this angst.

I dont hate this special as it does illuminate a LOT of what was missing from the Season 5 finale... that being said, I still hate the season 5 finale.

so its 6/10.

#miraculous ladybug #ml spoilers #gale reviews #ml critical #ml london special #ml london spoilers #miraculous world

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coffeebanana · 3 months ago

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thought a little too hard about the tags i left on @trainsinanime's "alya salt" post so here's the miraculous grad school chemistry AU that abso-fucking-lutely nobody asked for

marinette's an org chem girlie, because she can effortlessly visualize molecular shapes and has great intuition for how they'd bond together. she draws reaction schemes in her sleep. her work station is a fucking mess and she spends her weekends sleeping at the lab to keep an eye on whatever reaction she's got going

adrien studies physical chemistry and/or or some form of spectroscopy. he'd love the puzzle of interpreting the data AND he would love the hands on aspects of tinkering with the spectroscopy set-ups. also maybe he gets to work with lasers

alya feels like an inorganic chemist to me. she's throwing random combinations of ligands together to see what sticks and she has a niche interest in X-ray crystallography. she and adrien commiserate over learning group theory. also, her and marinette's research groups share the same lab space. and thank god because she's stopped so many of marinette's experiments from exploding

nino's not even in the chem department, he's studying biophysics. but his thesis has to do with the effects of different types of radiation on plant growth, and he has to collaborate with adrien's lab group for spectroscopy reasons

#i'm 100% right and you can't argue with me #mostly because i assume the average person does not know this much about chemistry 😂#but you're all welcome 😌#miraculous ladybug

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zoe-oneesama · 2 years ago

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On a serious note, why do you not like Derision? I mean, I can guess why, but I’m genuinely curious to hear your thoughts (if you want to).

What have they done to my boy?!

I guess we'll start with the whole "trauma" thing since that's how the episode starts - with Marinette going on a date with Adrien at the pool but constantly getting heart palpitations at the very idea of it. And not good lovey-dovey crush ones like Sabine thinks. The Actual Panic Attack kind.

This just feels unnecessary AND too late. Unnecessary because there are plenty of pre-established reasons why Marinette could be hesitant to go all in with Adrien (Being Ladybug, the 354th other times going for Adrien has failed or left her humiliated, Being Ladybug). So I don't know why they invented a trauma for her in the final hour and didn't think it was worth talking about before now?

They really came up with this whole scheme to explain why Marinette does Marinette things, like learning Adrien's schedule, planning out everything before she tries to make a move, needing to know everything about him, as if the show hasn't been mocking her for these exact traits and allowing them to blow up in her face over and over again. But NOW it's due to her TRAUMA. So...retroactively when her friends laughed at her or slapped their foreheads in frustration or the show framed her failures as a joke...we know it's actually from a tragic place and can't laugh anymore.

I mean, I was never laughing, but you get what I mean. They framed it like it was part of the comedy and now they're pulling the rug out from under themselves. How are you supposed to laugh when Adrien brings Marinette constipation medicine, or when her pictures of him are blasted all over Paris Television, or the *ugh* Statue Scene plays out and now you know that this is just adding to her pre-existing trauma? They have shot the show's rewatch value.

I never thought Marinette needed a "reason" act the way she was because those were always just kinda The Things Teenage Girls Do when they have a crush. I've admitted in the past to learning my crush's class schedule just to orchestrate running into each other in the hallways more often, and if their crush had public interviews and magazine pictures, I'm pretty sure most kids would also cut out their pictures to keep and would read and remember the interviews. I never really saw her behavior as that weird for a girl her age with a crush and recognize some cartoon exaggeration.

...Stealing his phone was a little weird, though, I'll give them that though Alya is the one who suggested it first...

SO, we enter a long flashback to One Year Ago (with Marinette now on her third Almost-Akumatization, good lord) and learn what life was like for Marinette pre-Origins, and oh boy. It's hell. She's making up illnesses to avoid school, avoiding all contact with anyone in the courtyard, having cockroaches put in her locker, having the Principal catch her "late" for class (after she had to clean herself up from a water prank), gets yelled at by the teacher for being late, sits in paint, mocked in class and then yelled at again by the teacher for pointing out the person mocking her probably planted it, and gets Saturday detention. All in one day. And when anyone tries to talk to her or even glares at the person responsible, they get threatened too.

The main reason this is hell is because Marinette is being let down by every single adult in her life. Sabine just laughs and tells Marinette that she only has a few weeks left with Chloe and it's not like she'll be in the same class as her next year.🙃 Well, why don't you make SURE she doesn't?! Maybe this is just an American vs French school thing, but where I come from, it's totally within your rights to request that your child not be put in the same class as someone else, they could at least put in a throw away line about her parents TRYING to move her, but Chloe's not allowing it JUST to keep Marinette close to her. And maybe take this a little more seriously, Sabine- your daughter is faking illness to avoid One. Girl. That should be concerning, not "lol my daughter is so silly for trying to get out of class."

Damocles finds Marinette and yells at her for being "constantly late" and praising the "anonymous notes" (signed by Chloe -_-) for always alerting him when she's behind, and then later gives her Saturday detention for...someone clearly planting paint on her desk chair? He sees a victim of bullying and punishes her for it. At the end of the episode he even suspends Socqueline for something that happened outside of school, yet in "Jubilation" she's pumping him up as The Best Principal?! Does this show thinks we're stupid or something?!

Mendeleiev also yells at Marinette for being late. She allows Chloe to make fun of Marinette for looking depressed when she comes in and allows Chloe to mock Marinette for sitting in paint, but when Marinette doesn't even stand up for herself but just accuses Chloe of putting the paint there, THEN Mendeleiev has something to say, and it's to Marinette? For "groundlessly" accusing the only person in the room laughing at Marinette, the one who was just making fun of her, the one who kept her eyes on Marinette so she could watch her sit in the paint?

Marinette tells Socqueline that all the adults are scared of Chloe, but that's not what I saw. Sure, at the end of the episode Damocles is afraid when Chloe pulls a "Lady Wifi" to force him to punish Socqueline for smashing Sabrina's phone, but the sequence of events played out more like the adults participating in the bullying. It wasn't like Damocles was sympathetic to Marinette and then Chloe cleared her throat, so he straightened up nervously and started berating Marinette. It wasn't like Marinette accused Chloe and then Chloe glared at Mendeleiev, forcing her to finally intervene. All the adults see what's going on and are either completely oblivious or don't care.

Also, Chloe totally unprompted says this:

GET A LIFE, what is your PROBLEM?! Like, why have a flashback episode and not have it explain what Chloe's fixation on Marinette even is?! It doesn't have to be big or anything! Like, have Marinette trip and spill something on Chloe in art class! Just do something!

And like, I totally get that irl bullies just choose their targets for no real reason and this is just another example of that, but to this level?! Just...get a hobby!

And then there's the big thing they did in this stupid episode. The unforgivable. The reprehensible.

This fucking guy.

It's been so long since we've seen Bully Kim that I was pretty sure he was left behind entirely on the draft floor. Sure, Kim is still capable of being insensitive or not thinking long-term, but he was a good kid. He roots for his friends and wants everyone to have a good time.

Hell, I could even buy that Kim was dumb enough to believe Chloe when she claims what he did was a funny practical joke that they'd all laugh about later...until Socqueline came up and yelled at him that he should be ashamed of himself.

And Ondine yelled at him in the present that he should be ashamed of himself.

And it's a year later and he should have realized by now that he should be ashamed of himself.

Kim is dumb, that's just a fact, but the way he doubles down and is so sure of himself that NO it's everyone ELSE who has a problem because they can't take a JOKE? Like...why?! Why did they co-sign on this character assassination?!

Just make him become akumatized because he's A S H A M E D of what he did now that he's finally sitting down and thinking about it a year later! He can keep the same look and motif, just have Monarch stroke the part of him that doesn't want him to be the jerk, the old Kim! It's totally normal, especially for a kid, to want to believe that they're not the bad guy even with all the evidence pointing to it, so I could even see the akuma being exactly the same.

But naur, it's KIM who talks like a right-wing podcast douche bag, complaining that you can't just speak your mind these days and everyone needs to get a sense of humor, they just don't GET it man, this is just how he IS brah, take it or leave it! His akuma's even named "Dark Humor", like edgy losers on reddit who make racist/sexist jokes and then get mad when he's downvoted and boo'd out of a forum. God, we just CAN'T TAKE A JOKE I guess.

I'm glad this is resolved by Ladybug gluing a toilet to his head.

I just...I feel like this could've worked in Season 1, or Season 2. Like...put it before Dark Cupid or before Syren or something. That way, Kim being a total douche is the starting point of his character arc, not the Season 5 Post-Hero Run point, ugh.

It'd also make this stupid line make more sense:

I'm sorry, the girl who got you akumatized after she humiliated you in nearly the same way you humiliated Marinette? I guess that was "just a prank bro" too, right?

Establish Marinette's problems with romance early, so she can overcome them or at least give them the proper context. It'd at least make the show look better if they hadn't made fun of her for 4 Seasons only to drop this bombshell on us at the end. You know...the thing that they just did.

This episode just isn't fun. I hated "Illusion" because all you get to see is the bad guys winning and outsmarting the heroes, but "Derision" is a marathon of seeing the absolute misery Marinette was put through, just to jump forward to the present to destroy a character that I really liked.

Would a kid even like this episode?

#derision #derision salt #an essay by zoe

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baenyth · 7 months ago

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Bethany's Bizarre Miraculous Baseball Episode!?

I decided, while I was readying myself for the finale and Chloe's character death, why not write one of the Miraculous ideas buzzing in my head not related to my fic? This one's a baseball episode because I like baseball episodes.

In terms of background plot, the Peacock Miraculous is fixed and Hawkmoth (no, not Shadowmoth, this is my canon,) has whittled down the identities of Ladybug and Chat Noir to being in Mme. Bustier's class. He doesn't immediately think Ladybug and Chat Noir are the only two students unakumatized in class because he knows Miraculouses can be swapped around, and Miraculous wielders can change their appearance. As for the episode prior,

Ms. Bustier's class is playing baseball for whatever reason. Gym class or something.

Hawkmoth, knowing Ladybug and Chat Noir are in the group, decides to strike, but instead of the overdone and constantly-failing akuma method (not to mention no one's having that bad of a day,) he decides to get creative.

Hawkmoth shows up at the baseball field the Miracuclass is at, in full baseball gear as well? The exits are blocked off by a mass of mold created by the peacock Miraculous, and Ladybug and Chat Noir have trouble running and transforming due to said mold having eyes everywhere, including, yes, the toilets.

He's also created a full robotic baseball team with the peacock miraculous, with 7 basic robot players, 1 armored catcher, and 1 pitching machine on wheels. The latter wields a bat by having it duct-taped to its "head," btw.

Hawkmoth merely wants to wager a game of baseball. If the home team wins, Hawkmoth will leave the class alone. No more akumas or amoks targeting them. However, if Hawkmoth wins, and he might, he gets to take all their accessories! Necklaces, Bracelets, Jewelry, Earrings, Rings, etc.

After the initial cries of shock, confusion, and "Ridiculous, utterly ridiculous!", the class decides on what to do. Some members see this as a low-cost high-gain game, not to mention they were already playing baseball in the first place.

Marinette and Adrien, being Ladybug and Chat Noir respectively in the first place, realize Hawkmoth's plan and are not for playing, although they have problems explaining why for reasons that don't expose themselves. Same with the classmates that have figured out their identities (Ivan, Nathaniel, Juleka, and Max,) although they fare a bit better in the reasoning department. Also Chloe is on team no for obvious reasons. As is Sabrina.

Lila's with team 'no' at first for the same reasons as Chloe, but changes sides when she figures out Hawkmoth's scheme and comes to the same conclusions as him.

Ultimately, not willing to risk what would happen if they said no, the Miracuclass takes up Hawkmoth's offer. Also they have uniforms now. From the power of baseball or something.

Since a baseball team only needs nine players and Ms. Bustier's class has fifteen people (six too many,) Chloe, Sabrina, Rose, Mylene, Lila, and Marinette form a cheer squad instead with uniforms as well. Very modest uniforms. Like at the lightest no sleeves and yes modesty shorts.

In terms of positions (because I care deeply about this,) Alix is the pitcher (a great one at that!), Ivan is the catcher, Nino looks over first base, Max looks over second base (he can catch and throw well by calculating the trajectories), Adrien looks over third base, Alya, the girlboss that she is, handles Shortstop, while Kim, Juleka, and Nathaniel are all outfielders. While Kim's highly athletic and a runner and Juleka is frequently at the right spot to catch the ball in midair, Nathaniel is an art kid that wants nothing to do with this and would rather doodle comics.

As for batting, it's as you'd expect. The students that are muscular, sporty, or have spent time as superheroes (mainly Alya and Nino for the latter,) bat better. Ivan's a bit on the slow side and Juleka's a deceptively fast runner, however. It helps that her girlfriend's cheering her on.

Finally, the cheer squad. Chloe, being a talented gymnast and Mean Girl, kills it as a cheerleader, with Rose and Sabrina not being too far behind. Mylene's doing her best, Marinette keeps on tripping over her own feet, and Lila's doing the bare minimum and using faked health conditions as excuses. She also tries to take the other cheerleaders' earrings and rings in case they're Ladybug or Chat Noir, and makes more fake excuses when noticed. At one point Chloe and Lila start fighting. Sabrina tries to break it up.

Hawkmoth's really getting into the sport, by the way. Yelling, telling the enemy team what to do when they mess up, getting mad when his robot baseball players try to cheat, etc. Mostly because some of Gabriel's best times with Emile were at baseball games. He even proposed to her after a game!

Adrien, sweating a bit: "Why does Hawkmoth keep on looking at me? Has he figured out my identity?"

Hawkmoth, looking at Adrien: "My son isn't doing as well as I'd hoped. A pity. Is he not interested?"

Also the bleachers are filled up with some audience members, let in by the Mold. Not a full crowd by any means, but there's people! It helps Nadja is broadcasting the game as well. Marinette's parents are there. The Gorilla is whistling in support of Adrien and has a foam finger. Nathalie isn't there, though. She was never into the sport.

Of course, a bunch of middle schoolers don't fare too well against a team of lifeforms designed to be good at baseball. Alya, using her own form of Ladybug vision (or whatever it's called,) on the cheer squad, determines that Marinette should join the team in place of someone else. Nathaniel seems like the best choice due to being the worst player.

Nathaniel: "NO! I am not becoming a cheerleader! Can't I just sit on the bench or something?"

Alya: "We need six cheerleaders. We can't have a full pyramid with only five!"

Murmur of agreement from the others

Nathaniel: "...Well can't you get someone else to be a cheerleader instead? Why can't it be someone like Jule-Gets hit by a thrown baseball mitt and shoe-OW! Hey!"

Adrien: "Everyone, calm down. I'll be the cheerleader. I've never liked competitive team sports like baseball anyways. I'd rather be my own rival."

Adrien walks over to Marinette and hands her his hat and baseball mitt

Adrien: "Win the game for everyone here, okay?"

Marinette: (Internally) Adrien's counting on me. I can't let him down again! I'll win this game not just to keep my Miraculous, but so I can rebuild Adrien's trust in me!

For the record, I decided in my canon this episode takes a while after Marinette and Adrien got together before having a horribly messy break-up three episodes later, and in general this is meant to be platonic, but if you make art of this and change that dialogue a little for the sake of Adrienette, I won't be cranky.

But yeah. The entire cheer squad welcomes Adrien in with open arms because they're nice girls, Lila, Chloe, and Chloe's girlfriend. Also maybe I'd have Adrien in a skirt but I'll need consultation on that.

As for Marinette, her passion and muscle give the team the nudge and morale to outplay Hawkmoth's team and ultimately win. Taking the pitcher position from Alix, she throws fast, unpredictable balls to strike out the basebots, and she manages to outbat the pitching machine and hit a home run at the ninth inning while three of her teammates are on each of the bases.

Hawkmoth is a man of his word, thankfully. A pretty good sport, too. Very impressed. He dispels his baseball team, skedaddles away, and finally dispels the Mold so Ladybug and Chat Noir can't immediately chase him.

At the ending part, in the Agreste Manor, Gabriel goes over to his son and said he heard all about his game, including what he said about competitive team sports.

"Did you mean all that?"

"Yes, father."

"Would you rather be a cheerleader than be in the basketball team?"

"Yes!"

And so Gabriel puts Adrien in the cheer squad instead of playing basketball and the two of them play a game of catch because Gabriel realized he's never done that with his son.

With baseball mitts and a baseball.

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matt0044 · 1 year ago

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”Reverse Trinity Syndrome” or why “The Final Day” works.

One sticking point of the finale to Gabriel’s run as main antagonist was the absence of Adrien in the final battle. Fans felt cheated out of Chat Noir facing his father and learning exactly what he’d become. That said... I feel like it being Bug Noir vs. Monarch is inaccurate when it's more like Marinette vs. Gabriel.

Marinette fighting for the one she loves and finally had the courage to kiss before the Perfect Alliance outbreak. Gabriel fighting for the wish he's spent the better part of a year grasping for. Season 5 spent quite a bit of time establishing tension between them as civilians with a classic "rich boy's parent disapprovals of peasent girl" dynamic.

The Miraculous was just the icy on the cake.

There's also something about Adrien, the male lead, being in captivity while Marinette, the female lead, is the one to take on the big bad mano e mano that reminds me of this article a while back that discussed a similar plot beat but with the genders reversed:

We’re losing all our Strong Female Characters to Trinity Syndrome

by Tasha Robinson

Since Tumblr's crap with links, I recommending googling the article itself.

The gist of the article was criticism of action films be they live or animated where the third act would have the female lead or a significant female character benched for the rest of the climax. Examples include Valka from How To Train Your Dragon 2, Wyldstyle from The Lego Movie (The Second Part was totes underrated) and Trinity from The Matrix if the name didn't give it away.

For me, Chat Noir being benched hit differently since I often had this frustration growing up. Sure, it was about the male hero mostly buuuuuut the set up for the heroine to be this awesome-sauce mentor, friend, parent or love interest would often be met with a lacking pay-off.

Similarly, I had been viewing Naruto and certainly felt that Sakura lacked prescene in Team 7's battles. Especially one their first mission where she's guarding their escort but doesn't even get any mook to throw down with at least. It felt like the trio was Kakashi, Naruto and Sasuke if anything.

So... having Adrien as part of the battle might've distracted from Marinette's part of the battle and SHE is the Guardian who lost the Kwamis.

This isn't to say one couldn't feel that Adrien risking transforming and flying to Paris was missing. Like Bug Noir could stay but Adrien flying off only for the Nightmares to get to him too much and have the Resistence bail him out.

Though, under that train of thought, I will admit that I wish that Adrien revealed himself as Cat Noir to Marinette before Monarch arrives to shoe him away. Evolve the love square at least a touch more as all.

Personally, I wished Alya transformed with Plagg.

In any case, I feel like Marinette and Gabriel have some parallels to each other with each other often pulling overt schemes to get the love of their life. Not in the same way of course but Marinette is still the one to overcome her more iffy habits and ACTUAL TRAUMA FROM CHLOE PUTTING KIM UP TO PRANK HER.

"Derision" was wild, y'all.

Thus not going the "I am your father" approach was valid.

#marinette dupain cheng #gabriel agreste #adrien agreste #adrienette #miraculous ladybug #miraculous lb #miraculoustalesofladybugandcatnoir #ladybug #chat noir #monarch #monarch butterfly #mlb season 5 spoilers #miraculous spoilers #miraculous #miraculous season 5 #miraculous season 5 spoilers

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miraculouslbcnreactions · 5 months ago

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You: *writes two small essays clearly, cleanly, and thoroughly going through issues you have with the writing in Miraculous, and how they affect what the show is actually saying vs what the writers are going for vs what the audience is taking away from the show, without treating the characters as autonomous people who actually exist a single time*

Someone who pisses on the poor: 'oh so you think this abused child, who was magically created from a feather, deserves to be maliciously lied to by his lifelong romantic partner and fellow 14 year old? After everything he's already been through?'

Media literacy classes should be a requirement everywhere

Thank you for your kind comments about that post. Comments like yours have been very validating after what was initially a really disheartening series of events.

I was quite pleased with what I wrote and thought that I had done a good job focusing on the writing and emphasizing that I was talking about the big picture of the narrative, not chastising or praising specific characters for what the writers had them do. But after I had multiple people go off on rants defending Alya and Adrien, I started seriously questioning my own sanity and communication skills. I even looked up the definition of betrayal to make sure that I wasn't somehow misusing it since that word really seemed to upset people. In case anyone was wondering:

Betrayal is the breaking or violation of a presumptive contract, trust, or confidence that produces moral and psychological conflict

After verifying that I hadn't been using "betrayal" wrong for well over a decade, I got a little annoyed and did my angry rant in the hope that it would save me from further backlash.

While it has been super validating to see that my two initial essays did in fact make sense to a good number of people, that last post did go a little viral, which I didn't see coming, so I want to take a moment to make it clear that I DO NOT want anyone go after the people who did the rants that spawned my rant. Nothing they did or said was worthy of any sort of pile on. They were just expressing opinions and that's fine. I even get it to some extent because a lot of people have unfairly salted on Alya, acting as if she's the problem and not the writing. And that can be really upsetting when you like her because she doesn't deserve those pile ons any more than Marinette does. They are both victims of bad writing!

I get the desire to treat fictional characters like real people, I really do, but Miraculous is frankly not a good enough show for you to do that. The hand of the author is far too blatant, making characters do whatever the writers want instead of what makes sense for what has been established. One of my favorite quick examples is that the writers gave us a full episode where Gabriel "proved" that Adrien wasn't Chat Noir only to have him figure out Adrien's secret identity because he heard his son use the words My Lady as if that's a super unique pet name that would make Adrien's secret undeniable.

It's all nonsense, which is why I focus on the writing issues, treating the characters like the tools they very clearly are. I simply can't do the kind of character analysis you can do in well written shows where the characters feel real and their actions make sense in the established narrative.

I'll close with this statement to explain how I try to run this blog: the characters in the show are fictional, the people you're talking to on here are not. In the grand scheme of things, nothing about Miraculous is bad enough to be worth fighting over. That's why I enjoy talking about it. With all the truly important fights going on in the world, it's nice to come on here and relax by talking about writing - a topic I adore - without having to care if people agree. It's also why I have this as a side blog. I want people to be able to avoid my content if it upsets them as my goal is first and foremost to have fun dunking on a show that is bad in interesting ways. If I only ever got upset replies to my posts, then I would not run this blog because Miraculous is not worth being miserable over. No piece of fiction is.

#ask response #anon ask #I don't think that a dogpile was happening btw #I just want to be clear that I don't want it to happen since I know that this sort of thing can led to that #And I will never support that kind of behavior #It's why I have my “no call-out” policy in the pinned post #I have a hopefully irrational fear of accidentally causing someone to get bullied since I've seen it happen before #I was actually debating if I should say something after it went somewhat viral and this was a great excuse to do just that #So thank you for that as well!

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theerurishipper · 1 year ago

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Hello! I have a question about Marinette. It's clear to me that she struggles with control and may sometimes mistreat her partner, in my personal opinion. It appears that she lacks trust in Chat Noir, which is not only upsetting but also confusing.

Marinette seems to have a stable home life, and her school experiences, while not as dramatic as some fans portray, seem relatively normal. Her parents have a loving relationship, so it raises the question of why Marinette behaves this way. Where do her controlling tendencies stem from? It's perplexing to me that she doesn't seem to trust her own partner. It's almost as if she treats him as if he could potentially turn into a villain. Chat Noir goes to great lengths for her, yet we rarely see her reciprocate in kind. Her interactions often seem limited to positive affirmations and superficial gestures. I wonder whether this inability to comfort someone or communicate effectively is a result of her environment influencing her or if it's perhaps a consequence of her newfound powers affecting her ego.

I don't mean to criticize her character, but it seems that Marinette's acquisition of powers and constant praise, coupled with the lack of discipline or guidance from Master Fu and Su-han, has left her without a mentor or anyone to hold her accountable for her actions. Her role as the guardian and leader exacerbates this issue because she struggles with being upfront and truthful, especially with Chat Noir. The morality of the story seems quite protagonist-centered, and I can't help but wonder how things might have been different if Ladybug had a more assertive partner or a mentor to guide her in the right direction.

Marinette like my least favorite at least with Western Magical girl shows because of what she chose in the finale. I don't believe her intentions are necessarily malicious, but her actions in previous seasons have been frustrating to watch.

So, the thing about Marinette is that she sets very high expectations for herself. Just look at her arc about not being able to confess her feelings. She catastrophizes, she plans all these elaborate schemes accounting for every detail, she can't bear to let anything go wrong, because she has such high standards for herself and a fear of failure. She can't confess to Adrien because she's afraid of his rejection, and she spends the series trying to find the perfect plan to ensure that he won't reject her. Once she becomes Guardian, she has all these new responsibilities, these new burdens, and she doesn't want to fail, she doesn't want anything to go wrong. And so, she tries to control everything. Her controlling tendencies stem from her fear of failure and her high expectations of herself.

For the record, I will say that Marinette does trust Chat Noir. She trusts him with her life. But just because she trusts him doesn't mean her fears aren't there, and it doesn't stop her from acting in ways that don't quite convey that trust that she has in him. Marinette can get myopic about her problems, and she often has trouble understanding things from others' perspectives. She has the tendency to, for lack of a better term, make things about herself. Like in Illusion, for instance, when Adrien was being taken out of school by Gabriel because of Nino's plan, Marinette instantly starts talking about how she is a curse for Adrien and how she should stay away from him, instead of about Adrien. Does this mean she doesn't care about Adrien? Of course not. But she still gets so caught up in her own feelings that she fails to consider the feelings of those around her. She spends so much time trying to make sure that nothing goes wrong with her current situation that she fails to notice the bigger picture.

For example, see Hack-san. Marinette is leaving Paris, and so she focuses on the immediate problem that she is facing, that she's leaving Paris without a protector. And she finds a simple solution, give her Miraculous to Alya. Easy, problem solved, right? Except it's not, because she accounts for herself but not for her partner, who is understandably blindsided by a new substitute appearing instead of Ladybug. In the same episode, we see another example. Marinette is stressed and struggling and hurting, and she confesses to Alya that she is Ladybug in Gang of Secrets. Now Marinette has the support of her BFF and her stress is being alleviated, so everything is fine, right? Except, she doesn't consider how Chat Noir might feel about her breaking the rule they set together and that she should tell him (this is not salt on Marinette for telling Alya, she had every right to do so).

Marinette isn't the most empathetic person. She is very kind, very compassionate, very sympathetic, and she is overall a wonderful person. But she has trouble putting herself in other people's shoes and understanding their perspectives unless they tell her herself. She understands that the people around her are struggling and she feels the desire to help them, but she also doesn't quite understand their feelings themselves, and that can lead her to making her own conclusions. See Guilttrip, where Marinette (and the whole class actually) just jumps all over Rose when she learns she's not well without considering how she might feel about it. In Crocoduel, she tries to distance herself from Luka because she doesn't want to hurt him, without considering that, well, she is hurting him.

Marinette has the desire to help others and be there for others, and it is that compassion and kindness that make her so wonderful. But she can also find it difficult to understand others or put herself in their shoes. She doesn't easily understand other people's emotions, and she can't often look beyond her own perspective and her problems to see how she's affecting other people. Oftentimes, when Marinette has hurt someone, her remarks will be more self-deprecating than apologetic. Which is not to say that she isn't sorry, and I am not saying that Marinette doesn't ever consider other people's feelings, but it doesn't come easily to her, and she often requires other people to point it out to her. Alya points out to her that she is hurting Luka by avoiding him, Alya tells her to talk to Chat Noir, Chat Noir tells her to speak to Chloe about not giving her a Miraculous anymore... things like that. And naturally, not considering others' views on things also has the effect of making her feel like she knows best and dismissing others' perspectives, like in Dearest Family, when she dismissed the Kwamis' advice about Tikki's cosmic hunger, because she thinks the only way to handle things is her way.

So, what happens when you have a tendency to want to control things, a myopic outlook on your problems, and a lack of ability to consider other people's perspectives? Why, you get the Ladynoir conflict of Season 4.

Marinette in Season 4 spirals down a web of controlling information and deceiving her partner by keeping secrets and lying to him due to her new role as Guardian and also in part because of her trauma from Chat Blanc. None of this is malicious. Marinette trusts Chat Noir. When she says she'll never abandon him, she means it. When she says she wants him around, she means it. But that's not enough. Marinette wants to control all the information and stay in control so badly that she fails to see how badly it is affecting her partner. She feels like it's the only way to do things and fails to consider her partner's feelings and perspective because she thinks she knows best how to handle it. She gets defensive and irritated when he asks her to let him help. And it shows itself most clearly in episodes like Ephemeral, where in an attempt to stay in control of everything, she is ready to violate Chat Noir's trust in her and reveal his identity to Su-Han without his consent.

It simply doesn't occur to Marinette that she should do more than try to smooth things over with Chat Noir. Despite understanding that he feels left out, she smooths over the situation with assurances that she doesn't even end up keeping. Of course, Chat Noir isn't an open book, but he did make his displeasure clear, and she still didn't do anything to fix their issues. Look at Kuro Neko. Chat Noir gets upset and quits, but Marinette still doesn't introspect and think that maybe she did something wrong and hurt him. She doesn't apologize for her outburst; she doesn't try to think of what went wrong. In the end, Chat Noir apologizes to her for having emotions and she just gives him another "I still want you around," line that quickly loses meaning when Ladybug is bantering with Rena Furtive like she's her favorite in Risk. Even when Marinette says something, her actions prove otherwise.

But I will say, this is all alright. It's a realistic flaw to have, to not be able to consider other people's feelings all the time. Everyone does it to some degree. Marinette isn't doing this because of any malicious intent, she's doing this because she's stressed and tired and traumatized. Her outburst isn't good, but it is understandable. She shouldn't have yelled at Chat Noir, but she isn't a bad person. She's allowed to learn to do better and grow from this.

What does make Marinette seem bad, though, isn't even due to Marinette herself as a person. What makes Marinette hard to like, is when her flaws are met with the protagonist centered morality stick that Miraculous loves so much.

Because Marinette never has to actually confront her mistakes. She yells at Chat Noir in Kuro Neko, and the episode is full of Chat Noir telling her she did nothing wrong and ends with him apologizing to her. In the end of Strikeback, Marinette admits to her mistakes, but Chat Noir sees her distress and swoops in to absolve her of her wrongdoings, and she carries on without fixing anything or changing anything. She admits to her mistakes, but it falls flat because, well, they didn't really result in anything. She was never wrong to do any of it, really. It's not her fault that Felix stole the Miraculous. Chat Noir already accepted that he's just another one of her sidekicks now, and he previously learned the lesson that she didn't do anything wrong and that he is the one is being sensitive about it. Marinette is never truly wrong, and so she doesn't ever have to fix her mistakes or address her flaws. She doesn't have to learn to communicate better with others, she doesn't have to apologize for her mistakes, because she is never truly in the wrong and everyone will go out of their way to excuse and absolve her of everything.

And this protagonist centered morality is the reason for the Season 5 finale. Marinette lying to Adrien about his existence isn't framed as bad because she's the one doing it, and because Marinette is Good™, it's not a bad thing for her to do. She didn't learn anything from Season 4, because the writers don't think she did anything wrong. She's the best leader, she's the most amazing superhero ever, and the story bends over backwards to justify her mistakes and her flaws by having other characters simply forgive her or take on the blame themselves (and by other characters I mean Adrien). And when she does make mistakes that actually have lasting consequences, it isn't actually her fault, like when Felix stole the Miraculous from her. And this protagonist centered morality makes it so that Marinette doesn't really have to grow or change as much as she just has to allow the other characters to prop her up and relinquish their agency to allow her to shine. She never has to try to understand them, she never has to do all that weak emotional support shit, because she's the all-powerful and amazing Marinette, and Adrien is just her prize for when she wins and her emotional support partner.

You mentioned in your ask that she never offers support to Chat Noir like he does for her, and that she is never held accountable for her actions, and this is all the protagonist centered morality at work. The world revolves around Marinette, whatever she does is Good and Right regardless of what it is, even if it is something like gaslighting her boyfriend into loving his abuser. And unfortunately, that isn't something that is out of character for Marinette. She's been established to be someone who will do whatever it takes to protect people, and who's flaw is that she doesn't often consider their feelings on the matter when making choices that affect them, even when it comes from a place of love and care. And because of the protagonist centered morality, the show makes this seem like it's a good thing instead of portraying it as a flaw. That is what ruins her character for me.

I hope this answers your question. Thank you for your ask!

#MLB #Miraculous Ladybug #Marinette Dupain Cheng #Ladybug #Adrien Agreste #Chat Noir #Alya Cesaire #Rena Rouge #ML Salt #Marinette Salt #Ladybug Salt #ML Writing Salt #ML Writers Salt #Meta #My meta #Asks #Ladynoir conflict

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