#this may just be a me thing idk but i just feel like he doesn't actually get that much development in the duology

[ceilidho]

Me: I don't like fauxcest so I'll avoid the tag/ block any accounts.

Also me: I want a daddy Dom who's really big on being a prodiver, probably got daddy issues himself, is an older man and financially secure. Makes sure I'm fed, well dressed and happy. Maybe even makes me live with him so he can just freeuse me and have something to look after because he just really wants to-

Like. I know it ain't the same but everyday it feels like it's borderline treading into that territory and idk if I can face myself or have the strength to accept that about myself. Like I use to be a puritan prude in my youth so the fact I ended up with a daddy kink would make my teen self disgusted. But ya know, shit happens.

I probably won't ever pass over that territory as I do get icked out by the idea of referring to a sexual partner as 'dad' or anything like that. So it's clearly not for me but I need some people to look at themselves TRUELY look at the stuff they're into or want in a partner coz probably like me, they are one kink/good fic/wild fantasy away from the "gross icky kinks!!" They wanna ban so much

Ever since I became an adult and started exploring what I like, letting myself read fics I was like "I'm not gonna like this but I'm desperate for content" and then come out of a changed person - I do start caring less. Do I still have my own opinions and icks and such? Yeah but like, the best thing about the Internet is that you can just block tags, block people or images that don't agree with you. Keep to your bubble of people who agree with you and such, but like, if you're not atleast aware or open to the fact your views may be hypercritical or even abit weird or taboo yourself - that's just destined to fail.

I think a lot of people can't separate identity from interests either, or they feel incredibly locked in with their identity.

like, you're allowed to find things gross, block them, or enjoy reading certain topics but only to an extent (like you won't allow yourself to enjoy anything beyond your limit because you're scared about what you'll uncover about yourself). it's also fine to one day come back to those same things and reevaluate your original opinion.

I'm not sure how to describe this but I feel like a lot of people have this tendency to equate any Thing they enjoy with subsuming that thing into their personality/identity, and if you think that way, then obviously any potential interest seems like a Threat to the persona/identity you've been meticulously building your entire life. which is terrifying! i do understand that there's a large group of people that probably equate reading/enjoying any content that's remotely dark to a real life want.

I personally think the most generous thing you can do for yourself is say "okay, I enjoyed that. it doesn't have to mean anything." you can read the kinkiest erotica ever and then go on to enjoy a vanilla sex life (or no sex life! tons of asexual people enjoy erotica). it simply doesn't have to be a big deal.

and this is also not saying you have to enjoy or force yourself to enjoy content that disgusts you. the brain is just complex. if you're living life in a way that is compassionate and avoids causing harm to other people, but some of your interests/kinks tend to veer towards the dark/taboo, just give yourself the grace to realize that an interest is not this Big, Horrible thing that'll destroy you and turn you into something monstrous.

[changbinsboobs]

Can you do skz as husbands next ??

Skz as Husbands series : Chan

Ohhhh boy...ya'll are not going to like this. Idk if i myself am shocked or not surprised...but literary ALL of the cards are BAD, and i kept on drawing and drawing more hoping at least one good will come out but...🥲 sadly all of them are pretty weird.

That being said i am reading current energy not current energy, and im not getting AT ALL vibes from chan for wanting to get settled down anytime soon. All of his focus is on his career and goals and ambitions etc and theres just no place left for a family.

So i guess it makes sense that all of the cards are really negative as it's just not his time now. I do feel potential in him tho (after some therapy and probably retirement).

Im just gonna go ahead and start with the 9oS which tells me that being a husband and the head of the family will put IMMENSE pressure on him with which he cannot deal with. I think he makes it much bigger in his mind and lets doubts, paranoia, stress etc get the best of him and im seeing him actually having pretty hesitant thoughts on marriage for that time being just for that same reason. I think he's a guy that sees this as a very serious job (can imagine him picking that up from his dad) and its nothing to be taken lightly and as i said it gets very twisted and exaggerated in his head and takes the best of him. If he were to get married right now, he would change very quickly from what his s/o has seen from him and take a huge turn for the worse and put forward his shadow side. Im seeing lots of toxic coping mechanisms too which very conveniently leads me to the next card.

The 3oC usually a nice card but not in this case, especially because of the heavy display of alcohol - im seeing him wanting to escape the crushing weight of his responsibilities and looking for that escape in the face of alcohol & shady friends that may be just too immature and bachelory-mindseted and have a bad influence on him. I can see him missing for nights on end, which also relates to the 5oP as well and him giving...no having to be forced to give the bare minimum, and him even struggling to do that, and twisting it all to look like the victim. But more on that card at the end. So as i was saying im seeing him being very absent a lot of the time, not only because of work but because he's out and about with his friends. Im not really getting cheating from the cards - but im getting heavy vibes of a similar setting where temptation is just around the corner and him just living as if he had no family back at home waiting for him. This - once again very conveniently ties to the next card😂

Which is the 5oW. Im seeing lots of fight, probably initially starting because of his prolonged missing and eventually moving on to different things. Im seeing fights escalating very quickly, starting very quickly, being very exhausting and very damaging. To the relationship, to both their mental health and to some random objects nearby👀

With The Fool im seeing him being way too immature for something like this at this current point and it shows pretty well on the card - he's just not in the right state of mind for this chapter of his life and if it were to happen it will bring out his unreadiness and immaturity forth even more - to show where he has to work on to be ready for that next stage.

And back to the 5oP again, aside from him having to be forced to give the bare minimum and him even failing at that - he very skillfuly turns it out to look as if he's the attacked one, as if he's the bullied one, as if his wife's the one who's starving him and making him out to be the bad guy and he just feels really bullied by the whole situation and behaves that way and expresses himself that way so i would say - a huge victim complex.

Overall i would say this reading was more of a "chans toxic defence and cooing mechanisms if he were put into the corner" reading, which is kinda sad cuz that doesn't really give much insight as to what he would be like as a husband cuz what we just saw wasn't really chan but his "alter ego" that protects him in a way. Yk we all have that one side of us that takes over as if on autopilot when we feel threatened in any way. I think that would be the same for chan, and if he were to feel comfortable with the idea of marriage and feel ready for that, the reading would be way way different. But i find future readings to not be much of my thing cuz thats way to unreliable cuz energy can change in so many ways, theres so many different outcomes... but we'll see how the other readings turn out and if all the guys have weird current energies that don't really answer what they'll be like as proper husband i may try a future reading.

[rookinthecrownest]

Discussion about romances + expectations under the cut (I'd put it as like..mildly critical, but also coming from a place of understanding?). As usual, will tag as such so you don't have to engage/read on if you don't wish to. I always invite open discussion, just keep it respectful (as I will endeavour to do so myself).

This is going to be a bit of a ramble, so I apologize if my thoughts are not clearly laid out like they should be.

I think I've found the reason why I (and maybe others), feel that the romances in Veilguard feel a bit... idk, hollow, at times (not BAD!!! just feeling like there could be MORE). And that's because of the trap of expectations. I may also be speaking completely for myself here.

Anyway, let's rewind to 2014.

Be me, 10 years ago. You're not really a gamer, but indulge in action RPG's casually.

See a commercial for this hot new game coming out called Dragon Age: Inquisition. Be intrigued by the character designs, but know nothing about the world. Come to find out it's part of a trilogy. So naturally, you buy the first two games and play through them before playing the third.

Be amazed, and completely hooked on the characters, the lore, the world, the darker elements and themes. It becomes your favourite game series of all time.

But you had no idea that you could romance any of the companions going into the experience. And man, does it fundamentally rewire your brain chemistry to fall in love with cRPG and get ridiculously attached to your Warden/Hawke/Inquisitor.

So, you romance Alistair first because he's funny as hell, and has a really interesting story/character arc. Then you romance Zevran, and love that too - he's charming and suave and awkward and funny. Then you go onto DA2 and romance Fenris and Anders, and each of those romances pack their own emotional gut punches. Then it's finally time for DAI, and predictably, you go for Solas (a veritable slow burn that spans TWO games), Cullen, and partially (I never finished those playthroughs lol) Blackwall and Dorian.

I had no idea you could romance companions going into these games. It was a pleasant surprise! It always felt like an important part of the story, while not overshadowing the main plot. There was enough material in the codexes, the cutscenes, and party banter to make each romance feel complete and whole and awesome and nuanced.

And then, like some of you I suspect, I read an article that touted Veilguard as "The Most Romantic Bioware Game Yet", and I thought - "Wow, if they're saying this then the romances must be something else", given the quality of the previous romances you've experienced in these games!

But you get to the game - and while you're having fun, it definitely leans more into the ARPG style where romances feel a bit more pushed to the side in order to tell a certain story than the traditional Bioware/Larian RPG experience you've come to love.

Which is fine! Again, once I stopped thinking of Veilguard as a classic Bioware CRPG, and more like GOW/The Witcher, I found I was able to appreciate it a lot more for what it is. Things have to Happen A Certain Way for the narrative to work, and that's not a bad thing. DA2 was similar - it was a harrowing, personal tragedy about the Hawke family and their struggle to survive in Kirkwall.

Just like DA2, there are aspects of Veilguard that make me glad things happened the way they did. I'm not mad that Rook has so much dialogue without a ton of player input and you can't 'be evil' - because the game doesn't make sense if you can. At its core, Veilguard's narrative is centered around Regret, after all - you can't have an evil protagonist running around because Solas' Regret prison would never work (evil people don't generally tend to regret their actions...)!

Now, if you're expecting a long-winded, fully researched academic breakdown of every romance I'm sorry but that ain't happening tonight lol. This is not based in any fact, this is all opinion.

I can't quite put my finger on it, but sometimes it feels like the romances in this game (and I say this with the biggest grain of salt as I've only done Emmrich and Lucanis' - and am going through Neve's now), are just missing....something, to take them from good to great.

I loved Emmrich's romance. I thought it was very well done. I think a lot of people would agree it's one of the stronger ones in the game - doubly so if you play as a Mourn Watch Rook (you get a TON of MW specific lines going this route, it's great). His side romance with Strife if you don't get together is very cute, I enjoyed it. But as superbly well done as it was, somehow, I wouldn't even put it in my top 4 Bioware romances.

With Lucanis' romance - whatever my hangups may be about how it was handled, certain parts of his romance were done excellently (even better than some of the previous Bioware romances, I'd say). You can read more about my thoughts on his romance here which is why I'm not going into detail about it. Unlike Emmrich's, I would put it in my top 4 because I fell in love with the character that much (both in the game but really, I've loved him since Tevinter Nights), and I've grown very attached to my first Rook and him as a pairing. I've seen others share a similar sentiment on here (and I hate to say it but I agree) - sometimes it feels like I fell in love with Rookanis despite the way it was handled, not because of it. I can't say that for many other romances. While it's been fun to think up a lot of HC/write fics/make art about those abandoned concept sketches and parts where I felt the game could have showed us more of their dynamic, I can't help but feel like his (and other) romances would have immensely benefited from even 1 or 2 extra small scenes to flesh it out a bit more if they weren't going to let us freely talk to our companions.

The issue with the romances might also have something to do with the pacing of the game itself. I think Act 2 is where the pacing goes a bit awry, before picking back up in Act 3 (which is great, I love it).

Sometimes I also felt that there was a little too much reliance on codex entries and party banter to tell the story of the romance rather than showing it explicitly through cutscenes. I think that's what makes the romances feel a bit truncated at times, compared to the previous entries? Some of the romance-specific party banter was so good, it probably deserved its own cutscene. But it's also highly dependent on the party you have, and it's easy to miss/not trigger. I remember absolutely living for the cutscenes in the first three entries and I can't explain why I feel like, subjectively speaking, Veilguard just has less romance content (this may not be objective reality - I haven't compared the amount of romance specific content head to head with other games).

I also couldn't tell you why I feel DA2 doesn't suffer the same problems as DATV in terms of romance interaction - because you can't freely talk to your companions in that game either. Yet somehow, it always felt like I was getting enough of them to not notice that. I do miss being able to chat my LI's ear off and ask them questions about their life/their views/etc. like I could in DAO and DAI. I think it's a shame we can't because the companions in DATV are SO interesting. I want to ask them all a billion questions about their lives/stories/etc even if they're not my love interest. The party banter in this game is immaculate but being able to talk to them individually about this stuff would've been SO nice. I feel that I've missed out on SO MUCH of these characters just because I didn't have two of them in my party at the same time!

Anyway, I need to wrap this up.

In closing, perhaps, if I hadn't read that article about how it was going to be Bioware's most romantic game ... maybe I wouldn't feel this way? I think it sent my expectations through the stratosphere, and that's no one's fault but my own. Not Bioware, not EA, mine.

I know that this game's development cycle was a unique sort of hell that the other games didn't suffer. To go from Joplin -> Morrison -> Veilguard. To have so many of the original staff leave the team when Joplin got scrapped. To have to pivot from Live Service and then back to single person RPG. More lay-offs. It's a miracle this game got made. I'm happy I can sit around thinking about it. And I hope its successful enough that we get DA5 so we can all sit around dissecting that in 5-10 yrs time.

Don't get me wrong - I enjoy the Veilguard romances for what they are. I'm enjoying them more I play and discover additional banter/codex/etc that I missed the first time around. Like any Bioware romance, there are spots where they hit their stride, and spots where they falter a bit. When they hit their stride they knock it out of the fucking park. But when they falter, you can really feel it. Romance is hard to write! And you'll never fully please everyone.

But a small part of me wishes I'd gone in blind, and checked my own expectations a bit.

Maybe you agree, maybe you don't. Tell me about it. What was your experience with the romances? Did you also read that article and get your expectations up?

I hope this makes sense.

Kind regards good fandom folks,

Keep the discussion respectful. And please don't use this post as an excuse to just blatantly hate on the game.

-Rookie

[mofsblog]

I mean if I had to articulate it more, I'd say it's just that (especially as someone who rematched season 1 a few days ago) season 1 was very good at giving characters "room to breath" and providing extra context behind character's decision making. While there was subtext, you could still reasonably figure out the whys behind every decision a character made fairly easily and I think that made everything feel more immersive (at least to me it did). For example: Marcus is a secondary character that doesn't get much screentime but in the short time we have, we learn his motivations (his daughter), his struggles (the way he slowly becomes disillusioned with the corruption he's participated in by making deals with silco) and we even get a kind of mini arc with him over the season (he does eventually try to stand up to silco even if it fails). We didn't need to know he had a daughter that he cared for but knowing so really helped us understand his character better and made him more engaging in my opinion

I actually think Act 1 of season 2's fine and so is episode 4 for the most part. But I think the root of my issue began when we didn't get to see Jinx's reaction to Vander being Warwick on screen. Like yes logically, I can assume she felt emotional and probably cried and it really impacted her (enough to see Vi) but I think having a scene where we actually see that, plus maybe a bit of internal conflict from her at the prospect of reaching out to Vi would've really made the character decision flow more organically to me? Like maybe we see that she's apprehensive and hesitant at the idea at first because of how their last meeting went but idk seeing Isha, she gets reminded of her old bond with Vi and reflects and ultimately decides to let go of her previous grudge and actually try to reach out because Vander's her dad too or something. A scene like that would've really made their reunion feel more impactful to me

I know we get some verbal justification from Jinx and we can infer that its a combination of Vi probably being in a desperate dark place, the possiblity of seeing Vander again emotionally hitting her and the idea that maybe seeing what Caitlyn did making her a lot more desensitised to the crimes Jinx did, all could've lead her to giving Jinx a chance and agreeing to come with her. But again we didn't really see any of that and I feel like an exploration of some of those ideas or internal conflicts on screen could've been really interesting

For me personally, I can see the outline the writers were going for and I do find it interesting but the way it's communicated so quickly and directly frustrates me because I feel like a deeper on screen exploration of some of the reasoning that led to these decisions (like they would've done in season 1) would've really made some of the scenes more impactful and made them feel more developed and coherent (<- I think that's another thing. To me, season 1 felt very linear and consistent and akin to a very long essay. While season 2 act 2 feels like a bunch of key points noted on a list. There may be a lot of points and I may find the points interesting individually but they haven't been developed into full paragraphs and so they're not really developed enough for me to find personally that compelling). That being said I do still have some hope for Act 3 and again, I'm glad this act landed for you

They really used all of season 1 and season 2 act 1 to hammer in the inherent tragedy of Vi and Jinx's relationship and how, despite the love they had and still partially hold for eachother, several factors out of their control (the majority of which can be seen as the direct and indirect consequences of them and other lower class being actively oppressed and treated like second class citizens by their own government and larger richer society at large) have lead to them both being traumatised repeatedly at an early age and drastically changing as a result and now they're past the breaking point and they've hurt eachother too much to probably ever be sisters again and theres nothing that can be done about it and youre left wondering what could've been.

and then two episodes and a nebulous timeskip after they try to kill eachother again, they reunite and have two scenes of arguing before being like. super chill and a family now. okay 👍

[withthewindinherfootsteps]

So we know that Wei Wuxian's treatment after his death was horrible. Even if nothing could impact him directly, there was still neverending slander, hatred, misinformation, theft...

But, for a while after he died, the sects did try to impact him directly – namely, frequently trying to resummon his soul. And today I'll explore the possible reasons for this, their likelihoods, and why I'm so, so thankful that Wei Wuxian's soul managed to resist the summons. Because, spoiler alert (or, you know. maybe not)... none of them are good.

(Long meta ahead)

In my opinion, there are four likely motivations for this: confinement, coercion, torment, and potentially destruction.

Out of all of these, confinement is probably the most likely motivation, at least for most sects (Jins and Jiangs excluded, though it was likely what the Jin sect said their motivations were – but I'll get to them later). This one is the most simple – we know spirit-trapping pouches exist, and we know the sects also placed 120 stone beasts on the Burial Mounds to prevent Wei Wuxian's soul from escaping. Therefore, this seems to be the most likely motivation – and fortunately for Wei Wuxian, probably also the best case scenario, though it still certainly isn't a good one.

For the second, coercion – this is where the Jin sect come in (more specifically Jin Guangshan with the help of Jin Guangyao). Due to their wealth and resources, they're likely the sect who played the largest role in the soul-summoning rituals. We know what they're willing to do to try to gain power – keeping Wen Ning under the pretence he was burned to death and trying to control him with the nails, and working with and helping Xue Yang torture people to help him refine his demonic cultivation, in order to have the Yin hufu fixed. Along with working with many other cultivators, alongside Xue Yang – Jin Guangshan really, really wanted that seal.

And so, Jin GuangShan sought after all those who imitated Wei WuXian in cultivating the ghostly path and gathered them under his rule. He spent a great amount of money and resources and these people, ordering them to study and analyze the structure of the Tiger Seal in secrecy so that they could replicate and restore it. - Villainous Friends extra, EXR

(Note that working with these cultivators very likely happened after Wei Wuxian's soul had failed to be summoned, since this happens some time after Wei Wuxian's death, whereas the soul-summoning ceromonies presumably started happening very close to it.)

In the previous paragraph, he's also quoted as having 'lusted after' the Yin hufu, which we already knew but it's nice to have a direct quote as evidence.

Now, would Wei WuXian willingly work with the Jin sect in doing this? No. We know that, and, given Wei Wuxian's actions in his first life (refusing to hand over the Tally, not being afraid to stand up to the sects, etc), I’m pretty sure Jin Guangshan knows that, too:

He beat around the bush a couple of times, using all his skills, yet Wei WuXian didn’t give in no matter what, and it made him run into a bunch of obstacles. - Villainous Friends extra, EXR

So this could actually make things go two ways. One, I'm wrong and that wasn't actually part of the Jin sect's motivations, since they know they wouldn't be able to control him (and in that case, had they managed to summon him, I could imagine them putting him in a spirit-trapping pouch and doing something similar to what Jin Guangyao did to Nie Mingjue's head. Which, also, not good). Two, it was a part of their motivations, and they hoped to find a way around that. After all, there are other guidao users out there now, and Wei Wuxian would now be a gui*. Also, cultivators can obviously harm ghosts – see the very existence of Night Hunts, and I'd include Xue Yang's talisman-caused destruction of A-Qing as well (while he isn't a traditional cultivator, talismans can be used by everyone).

Now, would either of these methods actually work? I'm inclined to think not really (and I expand on the former method in a note below). Would that stop Jin Guangshan/Jin Guangyao/the cultivators they employ from trying? Especially considering Jin Guangshan's lust for power?

I'm inclined to think no, too.

For the third, look no further than Jiang Cheng's reputation of capturing and torturing demonic cultivators after Wei Wuxian's death, due to thinking they could be him. And this does happen – Jin Ling knows and talks about it, and there's not real motivation for him to negatively lie about someone he loves. Also, when they come across each other at Dafan Mountain, we're told this in Jiang Cheng's inner voice:

A moment ago, Jiang Cheng was certain that this person was Wei WuXian, and all of the blood in his body started to boil. Yet, now, Zidian was clearly telling him that he wasn’t. Zidian definitely wouldn’t deceive him or make a mistake, so he quickly calmed himself and thought, this doesn’t mean anything. I should first find an excuse to take him back and use every possible method to get information out of him. It’s impossible for him to not confess anything or give himself away. I’ve done things like this in the past anyways. - MDZS Chapter 10, EXR translation

This mainly shows that he's tortured people before, rather than that he's tortured people because he thinks they're Wei Wuxian, but this reason is confirmed by Jin Ling in Chapter 24. Of course, the reason is also mentioned in this chapter, and there are other moments in the chapter that illustrate my point better**, but they come from second-hand sources which I know are easier to deny. Do take note of Jiang Cheng's expression both times he comes across 'Mo Xuanyu' (after he suspects he's Wei Wuxian) in Book One***, though:

After a moment, the corners of Jiang Cheng’s lips pulled into a twisted smile. His left hand started to unconsciously stroke the ring [Zidian] again. He spoke softly, “… Well, well. So you’re back?” - Chapter 10, EXR Although his face had always been clouded, marked with arrogance and satire, it seemed as if every corner of it had come alive. It was difficult to determine whether it was vengeful wrath, fathomless hatred, or raving ecstasy. - Chapter 23, EXR

This does seem to line up with what people say his attitude to Wei Wuxian is – there doesn't seem to be any happiness at seeing him again at all. The only time a word that could suggest that ('ecstasy') is used, it's accompanied by 'raving', and considering the context and the other possibilities of his expression, it's... probably not due to happiness at being reunited.

So, considering 1) this, 2) his contribution to the Siege specifically intended to kill Wei Wuxian, and 3) that at the time of frequent soul-summoning Jiang Yanli's death would be even closer for him, I feel pretty confident in saying that yes, this is likely a motivation for the Jiang sect in trying to re-summon Wei Wuxian's soul after his death. And, as mentioned earlier, cultivators can harm ghosts (and we know Zidian is able to remove souls posessing a body from that body, and that Jiang Cheng used Zidian on 'Mo Xuanyu' in Chapter 10. If it wasn't able to restrain/harm ghosts, or other methods weren't able to, why would he risk Wei Wuxian's soul escaping?).

And finally, option four: destruction. We're heading into much more speculative territory here, so don't consider this on par with the first three. But consider this:

We know there are some spells, like Xue Yang's talisman used on A-Qing and the body-offering ritual, that can ruin the returning soul’s reincarnation cycle by destroying it. Therefore, soul destruction is possible.

The 'main'/supposed reason for summoning Wei Wuxian's soul back is to stop the "cultivation world, or even all of mortal land" from being "faced with the most insane damnation and revenge, sinking into nothing but chaos and despair" when Wei Wuxian inevitably returns. While, as mentioned above, I severely doubt this is the motivation for certain sects – and to me is likely a rumour which the Jins (again, especially Jin Guangsha) fanned the flames of to justify summoning Wei Wuxian back for their own purposes**** – there are other sects which would take it more seriously.

Although likely disrespectful, people already thought it served Wei Wuxian right to die without his body intact by the time of the second siege – something believed to negatively affect your reincarnation in your next life*****. This is only the logical next step, and I'm pretty sure the vast majority of people would believe that, again, it would serve Wei Wuxian right, or would at least lead to less harm of the world in the long run.

For these reasons, I could definitely see this as an option for some sects, especially the sects who consider themselves more 'righteous' (cough cough the Nies under Nie Mingjue cough cough). After all, evil is evil and good is good, and the evil deserve what's coming to them. And what better way to prevent that than from preventing his soul from returning at all? So for the Nie sect – and likely some of the smaller sects involved in the Siege, since among them, additudes probably vary – yes, I do think it could be a motivation.

I’m not as sure about the Lans being willing to go this far, and that’s largely for two reasons. One, Lan Wangji’s presence and his relationship to Lan Xichen, who does (not always, but he does) let this affect how he treats Wei Wuxian. An example of this is that, when Wei Wuxian's return is made public, Lan Xichen does let him hide and shelter at the Cloud Recesses instead of trying to pursue him, likely majorly due to Lan Wangji. I'd argue that the aftermath of the Nightless City also acts as an example of this, although it definitely isn't perfect. But though he, Lan Qiren and the 33 elders do come to find Lan Wangji and do not let him continue to shelter Wei Wuxian (after they see Lan Wangji's feelings), Lan Xichen doesn't use this opportunity to kill/capture Wei Wuxian, despite Lan Wangji being in a worse condition due to having fought 33 elders, Wei Wuxian being catatonic, and Lan Qiren likely supporting this outcome (especially considering he was the one who led the Lan sect in the Siege – chapter 68, Wei Wuxian's POV). And he did let Lan Wangji take Wei Wuxian back to the Burial Mounds after:

After he went out of his way to send you back to Burial Mound and returned in such low spirits to receive his punishment, how long he kneeled before the Wall of Rules! - Chapter 99, EXR

Again, this was right after the Nightless City massacre – there isn't any goodwill towards Wei Wuxian at this point in time.

Of course, the Lan sect did participate in the siege after Lan Xichen knew of Lan Wangji's feelings towards Wei Wuxian, which Lan Xichen was no doubt a part of (although Lan Qiren lead the Lan sect in the siege, Lan XIchen had to have at least known/given his support, if not participated.) And it should be considered that Lan Xichen letting Wei Wuxian shelter at the Cloud Recesses was after Wei Wuxian had been back for a while, and had not caused the downfall of the Cultivation World, like many suspected he would after his death. And of course, as stated previously, his handling of the aftermath of Nightless City wasn't perfect either (though please note that his main motive here was to protect Lan Wangji from being potentially executed, rather than anything about Wei Wuxian himself). So caring about Lan Wangji doesn't mean he won't harm Wei Wuxian. But I do think he could find bringing Wei Wuxian's soul back to completely destroy it a bit excessive. There is, though, the chance that the elders of the Lan Sect would react to this differently, and of course they would have a sway on both Lan Xichen and the Lan sect as well.

The second reason is smaller, but there seems to be more focus in the Lan sect than in others when it comes to letting ghosts rest peacefully/helping them move on. And that could definitely lead to more resistance to the idea of summoning a soul back to destroy it as well, which could especially impact the elders. So I'd assume that the Lan sect would be the most likely sect to summon Wei Wuxian's soul back just for confinement, or just for some way of making sure any resentment is disippated, his spirit moves on, and he can't cause more harm to the world (eg via Inquiry)******. Not that he would or does as a ghost or as a reborn person, but that's unfortunately not relevant to this.

But yes, as a motivation for the Nie Mingjue-led Nie sect? Absolutely.

So, these are the main motives I suspect to be behind the attempted summoning of Wei Wuxian's soul after his death (and if I've missed any, please let me know – I'd love to have a discussion). And, of course, none of them lead to anywhere good. Because of course it wasn’t enough to besiege Wei Wuxian, murder the 50 non-combatants he was responsible for (and throwing them into the blood pit as a mark of disrespect because why not?), and lead to his death via him getting torn apart. It wasn’t enough to steal all his inventions, and use them commonly while still slandering him with no reprieve – or to steal his notes and give them to people like Xue Yang to study (Villainous Friends, again) and to use for their own, extremely extremely harmful, purposes. Of course, the cultivation world has to try to harm Wei Wuxian after death as well ((:

We don't know whether Wei Wuxian rejecting the summoning ceremonies was conscious or unconscious, but if it was the former, these are very likely reasons he refused to return in this way. If it was unconscious – for example, maybe during the frequent soul-summons his soul was in a weakened state due to him dying from a backlash of resentful energy and getting torn apart, and it healed over time but not before the soul-summoning rituals stopped – well, I can only be thankful.

Finally, let me leave you on the thought that – although it may well have happened since we don't spend much time in the immediate aftermath of the Sunshot campaign – there isn't even any textual mention of this happening to Wen Ruohan. Who, while not being a guidao user, was still very dangerous, still an extremely powerful cultivator, and still had a lot of reason to feel resentment. So.

:')

Thank you for reading!

--

*Considering what we see of how Wei Wuxian's guidao functions – redirecting the ghosts'/corpses' resentment into doing something they'd want to do, eg attacking people, and directing it towards a target – I'm not sure using it to force a spirit to do something 1) extremely specific, and 2) explicitly against their will would actually work. Iirc the closest thing we get to this in text is Wei Wuxian using the corpses of Wens to attack other Wens in the Sunshot Campaign, but he's still just directing their resentment to a target of his choice, and fierce corpses do tend to be on the less concious side of things (hence why Wei Wuxian had to awaken Wen Ning's consciousness). Considering how Wen Ning attacks Wei Wuxian and the Burial Mound Wens before his consciousness had fully awoken, I... really don't think those fierce corpses were able to differentiate (or didn't care).

Meanwhile, ghosts seem to be a bit more in control of themselves – see A-Qing, and Wei Wuxian's own descriptions of his ghost self.

That, alongside ghost!Wei Wuxian being able to resist his soul-summoning and the fact that pretty much all of the new guidao users are a lot weaker than he was, does make me think that this this wouldn't work. I do wonder about Xue Yang, since his methods are pretty different as well, but he's more of a modao user than a guidao user (he controls living corpses rather than dead people) and I don't think you can insert physical nails into ghosts?? Though if he was specifically instructed to figure out some way to control ghost!Wei Wuxian (who's probably kept in a spirit-trapping pouch in this scenario), he might be able to do something at least. Though also he was also struggling to piece Xiao Xingchen's ghost soul back together, so he may struggle with those areas?

Well, whatever the potential outcome, I'm so so happy once again that Wei Wuxian's soul managed to resist the soul-summonings...

**Mainly this:

Everyone in the cultivation world knew that the young leader of the Jiang Clan watched out for Wei WuXian in an almost crazed manner. He would rather catch the wrong person than let go of any possibility, and took anyone who seemed like they held the soul of Wei WuXian away to the YunmengJiang Sect, inflicting severe torture on his victim. If he wanted to take someone back, the opposition would surely lose half of their life. - Chapter 10, EXR

But I have heard people say 'you can't prove that it's just more rumours' before, and I wanted my evidence to be as watertight as possible.

(And, off-topic... isn't it really sad how Jiang Cheng, in the present day, is described as young? Because, for a clan leader, he is. And another thing he is, is close in age to Wei Wuxian – who was killed 13 whole years prior :') )

***And do note that the only other time they run into each other before Wei Wuxian's identity is revealed to the world apart from this is their brief interaction at Jinlintai, where he can't just act however he wants. The next time they run into each other after it, Jiang Cheng is literally taking part in another siege against him, and still extremely hostile ("surrounded by hostile energy, face insidious, staring straight at him" – from EXR chapter 60). Then he loses his spiritual powers and can't do anything. By the time he regains his powers, Wei Wuxian, Lan Wangji and the Wen remnants' corpses have saved everyone during the Second Siege, and though public opinion hasn't properly shifted quite yet, it will soon after Sisi and Bicao tell the story of Jin Guangyao, and voila, a new scapegoat (do note that he doesn't completely bar Wei Wuxian from entering Lotus Pier after the Second Siege, though). Plus, throughout it all, Lan Wangji is still constantly present, which makes it hard for Jiang Cheng to really do anything. And then he's finally faced with the Golden Core reveal, which does alter his motivations towards Wei Wuxian (obviously the resentment is still there – read chapter 102 – but it's also mixed with other complex emotions, and he seems to start being able to move away from that a little in Chapter 103). I still definitely wouldn't describe Jiang Cheng's attitude towards him as positive, but it isn't at the point it was at the start of the novel (eg Chapter 10).

But even if his attitude does change, or would for whatever other reason apart from the reveal, that still doesn't change an initial motivation so isn't relevant to this meta. We know his intentions at the start.

****It's also possible they may have originated it, but I think WWX's reputation was bad enough for it to form naturally. Though you can trace a major part of that back to them, too.

*****That belief isn't outright stated in MDZS, but the fact people are specifically talking about the status of WWX's body in the aftermath of his death suggests that this belief does have some grounding in the MDZS universe, at least? And we know MXTX has included it in TGCF (though that doesn't mean it's definitely in MDZS), so she has used it in her works. If this isn't the case in the MDZS universe I am sorry (although that could also mean there's less importance placed on not disturbing the reincarnation cycle in the world of MDZS...? Which would work towards my original argument) – I don't want to spread misinformation that something is definitely true, I just think there's evidence to suggest it is true, which isn't the same thing.

******Again, I think this would depend on who ends up having more influence over who in the Lan sect. After all, normal resentful spirits only do what they do because of their resentment in death, whereas Wei Wuxian is 'dangerous' because of who everyone thinks he was in life – so him being reborn naturally could also 'cause a lot of harm to the world' during the time period this version of him would live in, unlike the resentful ghosts they appease. This could definitely lead to many advocating for confinement, I think.

[t-u-i-t-c]

"That's the kinda thing... That I hate."

[grishaverse-chaos]

hmmm something about dominik haunting the narrative in king of scars. everything nikolai does is at least a little bit for him. he learns about the life of average ravkan people by meeting dominik's family. he starts gaining influence in politics just so he can improve dominik's life. and then he promises dominik that he won't let ravka break him.

that promise fucking haunts him. it follows him wherever he goes. it's the driving force behind everything he does, every step he takes to heal the centuries-old wounds in ravka. it's what drives him to do better, be better.

dominik is always there, in the back of his mind: this country gets you in the end. always pushing him to do more, because he couldn't save dominik and so he has to save ravka (for dominik) (because he promised) (because he loved him)

[elisedonut]

I feel like if they had a decent amount of distrust for him they would have just killed him with his boss on Bill and Fleur's wedding night

like the fact he didn't die and was seemingly even kept in the same position to me says something

like maybe he's just that good at his job or maybe they'd heard alot about him and decided he wasn't a threat Maybe one of them wanted him just really bad

I do think he was crucioed alot though

I think when he left his family played a lot into them not like immediately assuming he's lying tbh he didn't like leave right as the war started it was before the public really knew he had like two years ish before everything went really bad and I just think that may have made a difference by the time they came into power he was already known for being no contact with them

Like he worked with Umbridge and by the time the full take over happens i can imagine he had a rep for doing as he's told and such

like i just don't think it makes sense for DEs to want to kill a pure blood if they don't have to

like ofc ofc cults are dumb and think in dumb ways but i can't wrap my head around it personally

Like Voldy is one thing he doesn't actually care about that but he uses it for followers so i could see them caring about it

like that's another baby maker what do you mean

and in Percy's case being the only one they assume that will live through the war and such they could turn a 'blood traitor' family into an actual 'respectable' one in one generation if he stays alive

like idk it just doesn't make sense to me when it seems the amount of them are dwindling so why would they want to kill one that already seems to be on their side

Sometimes I do wonder how Percy did during the war while working at the ministry. Esp during Harry’s 7th year. Like he was working in the ministry and like Weasley were heavy Harry supporters. Like I know he basically said he wasn’t with them but like would death eaters care? I doubt. I feel like they would just see Weasley and probably tortured him anyway idk.

[adhd-merlin]

No one:

Me: can we talk about gaius and uther for a minute. like I do think their dynamic is meant to echo the dynamic of merlin and uther in the original Arthurian texts. like. guys who have made each other sooo much worse. one of them being complicit in the horrors tm but they are too codependent to break up so they just wallow in their guilt while the other spirals into tyranny. (did I just use ‘codependent’ and ‘break up’ in ref to uther and gaius. yes)

I don't know much about og uther and merlin but that's a fascinating thought. do you think it was intentional? probably not. but I love when you can perceive some flavour of the original arthurian texts in bbc merlin's characters/dynamics

[mildcicada]

[cerealbishh]

"You're pretty new at this whole relationship thing, huh?"

"... Yeah."

[mad-hunts]

tw: cannibalism, (slightly) graphic depictions of violence and HEAVY elements of horror will be ahead, so i'm going to put this under a 'read-more' if you'd rather skip out on this one.

so they looked around for a bit, and that's when they found it. this blood trail going down the floor of the hallway, which was already kind of scary, though it was nothing compared to the sound of someone's ringtone suddenly resounding from one of the rooms in the back (think one of those love songs with sort of creepy vibes to them like ' unchained melody. ') so, once your muse gathered enough courage, they decided to proceed down it even though something inside of them was screaming that something seemed wrong. and it seemed like they were right because once they reached the back, they found a dead body just... pressed up against the wall with blood spattered behind them. and there were other spots of the wall spattered with blood as well.

i feel like, for a character that's supposed to be pretty horror-oriented, that this account has been kind of lacking in content related to that lately, SO imagine this scenario, y'all. your muse is friends with or just cares about barton in some way. and thus, whenever they find out that he's attracted the ire of someone dangerous + that he's been missing for WEEKS, they assume the worst and try to find out his location. which leads them to this already creepy, dilapidated, and abandoned mortuary. and they honestly didn't know what they were expecting once they entered it, but it certainly wasn't this deafening silence, and there seeming to be... no one around?

so, you try to circle around to find out what the hell is going on, but then you see the thing that barton is hunched over is a body and a third one on the autopsy table in the room. and your muse can't help but blanche + feel like they've just stumbled into the lions den, because barton is not only SO beat up, but he's eating the person below him. and it's absolutely horrific because whenever they gasp at the sight is when barton finally looks up at them.

it was ALL over this corpses' face, though, as it appeared like they died from some sort of brutal blunt force trauma. but there's also another blood trail that is smeared across the floor up and under one of the doors in the back, which they are REALLY questioning whether they want to open now. they choose to do so with their eyes closed after remembering that barton would do the same for them (and by that, i mean he would want to save them JSJSJ), and all they can see when they open them is the back of barton hunched over something, or someone as you discover while getting closer to him. and it's like he is either ignoring you or hasn't heard you enter the room because he's still focused on whatever he was doing.

and there is just NOTHING behind those eyes even though he's got a copious amount of blood dripping down from his lips and dripping down his chin + neck. like JSJSJ i don't know about you guys, but i would be sooo scared because not only is this NOT normal behavior for him at all, it's god damn terrifying to see someone cannibalize you someone else. and so if he were real, along with me being in this situation, i probably wouldn't talk to him for a while because i wouldn't even know where to begin AHHH

[changbinsboobs]

who in skz would mtl marry someone due to getting them pregnant by acting recklessly or on implusive behaviours without using protection or if they were drunk per se?

Skz MTL to marry someone cuz of accidental pregnancy

So as with most men when faced with a difficult question or decision they evaded the question and situation and put the burden of that on the woman💀 im not very satisfied with the kind of "answers" i got but im gonna do my best. Just gonna say that they have no idea how they would go about it and they would feel terrible - like overall thats the predominant energy. But imma go into details now.

Chan

He really, really doesn't want to. And im either getting the vibe that he would like the kid to be aborted (if the moms also on board), cuz he won't be there to provide any support and he doesn't want the responsibility of it. Or on the other hand im getting an energy where he's gonna just suck it up and bear the consequences of his reckless actions, no matter the price. Idk which ones the more prevelent one tho, so may be his inner wish vs what he actually does.

Lee Know

Would think lots and lots abot the whole situation including if he wants to keep the baby or not. Either way, if the mom decides to keep it he'll provide financial security for sure! Im not really seeing anything about being a father or marriage - but he wants to act correctly in the matter as much as possible so im not really sure here either im not getting any answers on the marriage thing but im definitely getting confirmation on him being at least financially supportive whit whatever the woman and the child may need and im actually getting a friendship relationship at least. So even if they don't get married he will be a present figure every once in a while in his child's life.

Changbin

He would be ABSOLUTELY DEVASTATED!!!!! But he will marry here. I was actually a bit unsure while drawing the cards but now that im immersing myself in this energy i think in his head there's no other way about this. How can he fail his duties as a man and impregnate a woman he had no intentions on marrying or impregnating and then leaving her on her own?! With HIS child?!?! Tarnishing her honor?!?!!? Being an embarrassment and failure to his family? Bringing shame upon them?!?!! He could NEVER do that. And thats why he's so devastated because he feels like such a failure for being so reckless and doing such a fatal, life changing mistake. And the worst of all - he wants to marry for love. But probably he wouldn't. Because if he loves the woman he's sleeping with, this child wouldn't be accidental in the way that its unwanted. No matter what he would embrace it with all his being. But if the pregnancy causes anxiety in him, then its not the woman for him, and now he's forced to marry a woman he doesn't love, while the love of his life is somewhere out there looking for him, waiting. And he feels like he's disappointing her even too, because he can't go out and find her, as he has to stay home with his wife and raise a child that was unwanted, that's not HIS (destined) child.

(I swear that guys into some spiritual shit) (Also i feel like exagerates the hefthiness of the situation i think, but thats another thing i notice in a lot of men where they just make such a big deal of things and make it all so complicated ugh...drama queens)

Hyunjin

My guy would welcome it with open arms. Not seeing specifically marriage, but i think he would be pretty excited about being a dad and i can see him being easily persuaded into marriage for the greater good of the child. Arrangements can be made along the way. The energy's very easy-going and uncomplicated which actually surprises me a bit but out of all i think he has the best energy about this.

Han

Short and sweet: he doesn't have to worry about that (que a smug smile)

(Do with that what you want)

Felix

I don't think he would marry. He wants his autonomy, his freedom. He will provide support tho, and he's ready to work something out that works for both (all) parties. Im seeing him also being fully ready to be a father figure if needed, being of constant help in many different ways. But i don't think he'll tie himself down like that.

Seungmin

No

I.N

This one's the most difficult to read i dont even know what i should right on here cuz its all so muffled. For your information he has The Moon card and the energy here's so gloomy and sticky and damp and muffled. I think if he gets faced with the news he would go into a minor depression for a while, all kinds of voiced ing at him, not being able to find the right path, i think he would be a mess and not know ANYTHING. He wont know how he feels about the baby, if he wants to keep it or not, if he likes the girl, if he wants to marry, if he wants to marry HER, about his parents, about her parents, he will just have one big hole in his mind but at the same time thousand of different voices and thoughts all around him suffocating him so in short - i think he'll be in a state where he's completely incapable of doing whatever it was and more or less leave the girl be completely on her own, which lead me to believe that eventually he'll abandon her and not marry her cuz the energy gives me similar vibes. Being in a frozen state not giving a definitive no but not a yes either, not giving anything - equals abandonment in my opinion. If you're not gonna be there mentally anyways then whats the use?

As in lots of my readings i feel like the maknea line wasn't very vocal and didn't have much to say about this but the older once had plenty to say apparently😂 maybe thats a genuine fear they've had flow in their head every once in a while😂

Most

1.Hyunjin / Changbin

2.Lee Know

3.Chan

4.Felix

5.I.N

6.Seungmin

Least

Hans outside of the table cuz my guy doesn't habe to worry about that apparently🙌🏻

[waterdeepthroat]

i know i kinda have a reputation to uphold as an astarionposter but like. he's not even my fav character in bg3...

[p2ii]

.

[piningpercussionist]

i know you dont know all these people but press is acting strange

https://www.tumblr.com/thepressanon/738561269597143040/smile-smile-for-the-camera-for-the-people-for

you can check it out if you want

... huh. It's an interesting, if concerning, first impression, I suppose... Hope he's alright?

Nice poem though.

...

Is the incorrect their intentional?