#they deserve more nuanced takes on their Robin times

[sisaloofafump]

I think we’ve pulled such extreme a one eighty from “Dick was the sweet Robin and Jason was the angry one” to “Jason was the sweet Robin and Dick was the angry one” that we’ve once again collapsed the nuances in their personalities and are willfully ignoring half of their backstories to fit these moulds. I propose we take a one month break from the “I think it’s funny that [mainstream fans/comics] think that ___ was the ___ Robin, when actually they were the ___ one” posts. They’re only great when they are met in equal or higher amount with the content they are supposedly confronting. Let the mainstream fight back (on tumblr) just a lil bit. Then push back again. I promise it will be more rewarding if everyone doesn’t already agree

[aingeal98]

Thinking about how happy Cass was when Steph became Robin because while she did agree with Bruce that Steph shouldn't be out on the streets fighting and it caused their first breakup, her issue was never against Steph as a person. If anyone didn't have a high enough level of fighting skill Cass would not want them in danger. But Steph kept stubbornly improving anyways and even though she might still not have been quite as good as Cass's anxiety would like, Bruce made her Robin which means Bruce must have changed his mind and now trusted Steph's potential and seen the same thing in her that made him take in Tim even though Cass doesn't fully understand that part yet. And Cass trusts Bruce so that's enough. Steph is happy Cass is happy they can spend time together which Cass loves and they don't have to fight anymore!

And then Steph gets fired and Barbara snaps at Cass and the next time Cass sees Steph she's so confused because why is she back in Spoiler gear now? Steph is Robin!

And even though Steph is going through emotional hell right now I think she understood there, the difference between Bruce and Cass. The way she didn't see back when they first fought. It's why she thanks Cass for her friendship even though it wasn't always smooth sailing. Even though she does have a right to be hurt and angry with Cass from before. Unlike Bruce, Cass isn't messing with Steph, jerking her around and treating her awfully for being a girl. She genuinely likes Steph and wants Steph to succeed and be a part of her life. Unlike so many other characters, she isn't unfairly biased against Steph. (She can be a jerk but she's an equal opportunity jerk. She'd treat any fighter on Steph's level the same, unless they have Bruce's approval in which case she'd trust the process. Doesn't make it fully OK but I think it's a nuance Steph appreciates in this scene.)

But then. But then. The next time they see each other war has broken out and Cass once again needs to step in and rescue Steph and.

It's the last conversation they have before Steph dies. She doesn't know Cass spent hours looking for her even in the middle of such a large turf war. She doesn't know how distracted Cass got, how passionate she was towards finding Steph even when Batman told her they couldn't afford it. She dies thinking Cass, while not viewing her like Bruce or Alfred does, still doesn't see Steph as an equal in any way that matters. And she's right! Cass loves Steph. Cass loves Steph more than she's loved any non family member in her entire life. Which doesn't change the fact that Cass does not think Steph should be out fighting, and she can only consider Steph an equal comrade when she's wearing the Robin uniform. Cass doesn't trust Steph's insistence that she's good enough, but she trusts Bruce's judgement. And Bruce is an asshole to Steph. Constantly.

They deserved to hash this out when Steph came back from the dead. Steph deserved to know how much Cass cared for her and she deserved to say exactly how Cass hurt her, no matter how good her intentions were. Cass deserved to tell Steph everything about how deeply the loss hurt her. And they both deserved the opportunity to agree on a second chance, to earn each other's full trust for once.

Anyways I'm having stephcass feelings tonight and I swear one day I will end up in the dc writers room and do... Well I'll do something to fix this that's for sure

[theyluvlyss]

Can I request if you can Hcs of all the ghost boys + Finney being in love ? ( Feel free to not add Finney since you wrote something similar before )

Xoxo 💋

𝐨𝐟𝐜 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐜𝐚𝐧😌...

it's what I'm here for🫡♡. I really like the idea of writing about them being in love/having a crush rather than being with reader right off the bat !! very cool and unique idea (imo), and it definitely harbors that little difference in feelings/slight nuances that I'm very happy to expand on !

although it took me a bit, I've actually gotten most of the boys done already, and that's around when I gained the bright idea to just ... instead of making you wait, I remembered there's this thing called free-will, and I can quite literally post whatever and whenever I want lol😆 ...

meaning I can just post each boy for you one at a time as I finish them instead of waiting until they're all done and then making one long post :D !

on that note, here's finney's hehe...

𝐄𝐚𝐬𝐲 𝐎𝐧 𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐄𝐲𝐞𝐬

《 ♡ 》 headcannons

───────── 《 .°•♡•°. 》 ──────────

𝐏𝐫𝐨𝐦𝐩𝐭 :

while it's always fun to imagine (haha, get it💀) what it'd be like for him to be your best friend or your boyfriend, there's times when you yearn for that tension. that something in between that's more than a platonic relationship, but just short of being a lover. and I'm here to revive that feeling of what it'd be like for finney blake to have a crush on you...

𝐑𝐞𝐚𝐝𝐞𝐫 :

fem!reader x finney blake - she/her/hers pronouns!

𝐓𝐢𝐦𝐞𝐥𝐢𝐦𝐞 :

70s-80s - the grabber doesn't exist

𝐓𝐖/𝐂𝐨𝐧𝐭𝐞𝐧𝐭 :

cursing, as usual - small mentions of anxiety/nerves - finney being super cute lol - overall super duper fluffy and pretty much everything the prompt describes lmao.

ㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤ...𝐛𝐚𝐜𝐤 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐦𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐫𝐥𝐢𝐬𝐭

───────── 《 .°•♡•°. 》 ──────────

I know you said I didn't have to do him since I already have, but *adds that mf in anyway because he deserves round two of some lovins😆🫧💙🪩*.

Finney liking somebody/finding someone attractive is usually a dead-end deal. He keeps it to himself - buried deep down within the depths of his gentle soul, never to breach the light of day, because he knows good and well that even if it did arise, all it would lead to is rejection and - if he's extra unlucky - a teasing+beat-down combo attack from some known bullies of his (should they find out or be witness to these nonexistent attempts of confession).

A little depressing, I know, but bffr ... if you were Finney, would you do anything different🤨?

Althoughhhh....

Him having a crush on you, specifically, is very,,, confusing. Think of when you have a crush in real life, but you actually have a little bit more of a chance with them than usual. It's realistic. There's a sliver of hope. A light down in the depths of that depressing darkness.

It's like that.

And dare I say, he's fairly obvious about his liking towards you, but only if you're paying close attention.

If you're in a totally different clique, especially a popular one, just kind of in your own little bubble (which might as well be a whole new world to him), then the chances of you noticing/realizing his infatuation with you is very slim. Even in Finney's own case, he'd view you way out of his league, no chance whatsoever, so don't expect him to make any moves of any kind.

And on top of that (as I mentioned first thing), he'd do his damn best to not let ANYONE find out, ESPECIALLY Robin, Gwen, or Bruce, because the last thing he wants is for them to get overconfident on his behalf and try to set y'all up. What if you reject him?

Or worse, what if you end up liking Robin or Bruce instead of him? He wouldn't be able to take it. And lord knows he keeps his crush hidden from his bullies for highly good reasons. An even worse scenario in his mind than the last one is if they publicly teased him (or the both of you) about it, made a mockery of his feelings for you to witness and either join in or pity him - neither an outcome his ego and self-esteem were built to handle.

Now, the opposite - actually knowing him and/or being his friend - the case would probably still remain the same with only slight differences. He'd still find you out of his league, probably wouldn't make any bold moves. But, being his friend, closer to you, a little more comfortable around you, there may be times where he'd make the SLIGHTEST of nods to MAYBE, POSSIBLY liking you in a romantic fashion. JUST A LITTLE BIT.

BUT, he'd also be so worried and absorbed in his own head about all the different little things - am I impressing her? am I making her uncomfy? Does she already know? Does she not know and thinks I'm weird? Did she already think I was weird before I did that thing? Did she even catch onto that thing I did? Is she ignoring it? Is she ignoring me? Oh my god, she fucking hates me - that he lowkey wouldn't even consider the fact that you've been making more obvious moves on him this whole time.

He would probably end up liking you because of something you said or did. Like, depending on the situation, you said/did something that really resonated with him, or he found himself thinking about a lot. Which would then lead to him thinking about you a lot, and it's a spiral from there. Or, if already friends, it's probably something you did/said that had him now seeing you a new/different light, which, again, spirals from there.

Should anyone that's not you uncover the feelings he harbors, he's so the type to deny it. Gwen could be studying your behavior and body language up and down, and then report back to Finney with WRITTEN, PICTURE, PHYSICAL FUCKING EVIDENCE of you liking him/reciprocating the crush, and Finney would just be like, "...Nahhhh, you're just delusional, she wouldn't even notice if I disappeared the next day." And Gwen would just be like, "This bitch here😐..."

Either way tho, what I meant way earlier by "confusing" is that his version of (just barely) letting you know he likes you romantically is him just being,,, himself/friendly but a little bit more than usual LMFAO. Like, if y'all are friends and he always walked you to and from school, what he would do to further insinuate that he 💙likes💙 you is to just,,, walk you everywhere else🥴💀. Essentially be your moral support wherever you go lmfao.

Or like, besides doing stuff he really doesn't need to do that confuses you, he'd do things that kinda give the OPPOSITE of, "I'm literally in love with you." Avoid/not talk to you, avoid eye contact, stuff that just leaves you like, "...I don't think he wants to be my friend anymore🥲💔." LIKE BOY-!😭

But it's not intentional. It's just his nerves and doubts getting the better of him, y'know? Overthinkin, which leads to overreacting, etcetc., you know how it goes/what that's like lol.

So yeah, basic point, if the feelings aren't already made VERY CLEAR from the jump, don't expect things to get any clearer😻.

BUT, if after a while should he either gain a little more confidence (prolly from Robin) or you grow a pair and make the first bold move yourself (which would confirm it for him to be more comfy getting bolder himself as well), I feel like he'd still remain a little shy and mildly confusing, but very berry cute nonetheless.

I'm telling you, he'd put those crafting skills to work, hon👏🏽!! Just any chance he gets/has to either make you something or just impress you with something he's made, he's putting 1000% percent into it. I'm talking he's going broke, losing sleep, practicing what he's gonna say and how he says it - it's all going into whatever little (or big??) craft he knows you're going to see/he's gifting to you.

He'd also compliment you a lot, along with being more himself, which HELLO, he's so silly when he wants to be. I feel like he'd have you laughing a lot without exactly meaning/trying to, but HE'D FS CHERISH THAT like,,, every time he'd make you laugh, he'd just feel like he was on cloud nine - 'I made her laugh, I did that, me, she thinks I'm funny, she likes me, she's literally in love with me like I am her, otherwise she wouldn't be laughing so hard-'

...😃...Yeah, he takes what he can get and RUNS with it (which is why I think he'd love and is in need of lots of reassuring, plz take care of my baby😭🙏🏽).

On the topic of such, actually, it's kinda funny because it doesn't really affect his envy levels.

I don't think he'd get all that jealous if he saw you with other ppl; it would just be the thing of like,,, "That's what I get for getting my hopes up."/"It could be worse ngl." lmao which is sad on one hand but kind of mature on the other, yk?

Mature that'd he'd just leave it alone, not be pushy. But sad because wdym you think you're not worthy of some love/what you want out of life :( ? Luckily for him, though, I don't think he's able to hide disappointment/sadness very well.

Not that he's going around telling people, but he's just one of those "face/tone of voice says it all" kind of guys. So, depending on your thought process and if you can put two and two together, you're quick to squash any doubts of you being interested in someone else romantically.

"I'm not really into *state another persons features lol idk*. Not my type of guy..." which may or may not be you trying to guide him into asking your type, and he may or may not take the bait🤭.

No, but seriously, he literally may or may not catch on. There's definitely been a few times where he's missed the social cue, and on the inside, you're just like "😔🙄..."

He gets SUPPPPER flattered if/when you get jealous, tho. Like, I'd imagine it's a pretty rare occurrence (surprisingly to you, don't nobody be hitting on Finney Blake, okay💀��🏽), but when it does happen, you're very quick to make it known you're hardcore crushing and liked him first, even going as far as to make it appear as if he's already taken.

You're hanging off of his arm more than usual or playing with his hand to keep him from fidgeting, you're staring at him with such a strong look of love-sickness in your eyes that might even cause the other girl to throw up, and should she even get as far as asking him out...? Oh boy...

"Actually, Finn, we were gonna hang out today, weren't we? I wanted to help you paint that rocket you're working on, I have the perfect colors in mind already...!"

"You...You do?"

"Yes, I do😃😐."

And the other girl just has to be like, "...I'll um,,,, Nevermind, Finney, I'll see you around."

"Maybe...!" You'll call after her cheekily, smile growing wider and wider as she trails away with Finney yet to even process the entire interaction at all. And while he might not catch on right away, the second he does, he's BEET red💀😭.

He doesn't know whether to admit he's smitten by your hostility or to let you know you don't have to be😭✋🏽. And more often than not, he'll opt for saying nothing at all, smiling to himself all shy while you're back to normal, talking as if you hadn't thwarted off a foe.

Confessing... That's not fucking happening, ever at all💀. And if he did, it would be on his death bed (I'm joking). But srsly, if he can avoid it for as long as possible, he will. The type to tell you on the last day of school, I'm talking GRADUATION DAY, right as one of y'all are leaving FOREVER, on some "I've always liked you..." type shit, and you would just have to be like, "WHYDIDYOUWAITSOLONGWHATTHEFUCK😭💔💔‼️‼️" Which is why I think it'd truly be up to you to confess (hopefully) way sooner😭💀✋🏽.

And if/when you did, he'd probably forget how to,,, exist lmao. Like, one of those moments where the information has to process in his head so he's just standing there looking at you like, "🧍🏻‍♂️:0" for a second before he's like, "o-OH!...I...I like you, too! And I have for- I mean... Like, it's been long. A long time. I've liked you a long time :D."

YOU KNOW WHAT?? If he felt he, himself, absolutely had to confess, he'd write you something. He's not Shakespeare or anything, but it would be much easier and less nerve-wracking for him to just write it all down. He'd hand it to you in person, apologize for the length of the letter that YOU HAVEN'T EVEN OPENED YET😭, and then practically teleport from the scene because he doesn't even wanna stay for your reaction. The fear of rejection is genuinely too much for him.

He'd be better off never hearing from you again if you didn't like him back rather than have you tell him to his face. ALSO, he'd give it to you in private. Wouldn't want to put you or himself on the spot, nor would he want to risk somebody catching him or you with the paper that has him pouring his heart out to you on it.

But, of course (because why else would you be reading this if you weren't expecting The Good Ending™), you're confused while opening and reading it until those feelings gradually begin to swell into a mixture of flatter, adoration, and just flat out love because not only had he FINALLY confessed to you...

But you had found it to be written quite beautifully, and it was overall the cutest thing that had ever happened to you, so now you have to return the favor - scribbling your response in some colorful pen color on the back of his own confession note, doodled with hearts and squiggly lines and all of that nonsense, leaving it in his locker - and letting the events take off from there.

Letting the relationship blossom from there🫧🥹🪩💙✨️.

𝐈 𝐡𝐨𝐩𝐞 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐞𝐧𝐣𝐨𝐲𝐞𝐝 !!

ik I say this literally every time I post something, but I really loved writing this, and it's because I LOVE WRITING; I love doing this shit, idcidc✋🏽😭✋🏽. if I could make a living off of this, I would, and I love seeing your guys' requests every day and reading through them over and over again.

and guys, let me tell ya', there isn't a better feeling in the world than completing and posting one, because whew...!! it's like having an endless supply of inspiration fr, I love it.

anyways, robin's will be posted soon after this one, so be on the lookout🫡😼 !!

ㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤ...𝐛𝐚𝐜𝐤 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐦𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐫𝐥𝐢𝐬𝐭

ㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤㅤ...𝐛𝐚𝐜𝐤 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐡𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐭

𝐫𝐞𝐪𝐮𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐛𝐲 :

@in3rci4

𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐝 𝐜𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐭 :

2,103 words

𝐭𝐚𝐠𝐥𝐢𝐬𝐭𝐬 :

none :(

[taylortruther]

I don't know who to ask this to without it turning into a fandom war and you always have the best, nuanced, touched-grass takes, so can we please briefly talk about the Olivia credits thing 😭

Does Olivia's music really sound a lot like others or is this a case of discrediting young women in music? Asking literally sincerely; I'm not enough of a music person to know when inspiration turns to copying, I just usually can't hear it. I remember, for example, when 1989 came out, a lot of people felt that Wildest Dreams was very lana inspired, but nobody I think was accusing her of copying. Is the Olivia situation the same and it just got blown out of proportion, or are the ways her music are similar/referential to others larger musically? Or is it that the album as a whole felt referential? I just sincerely don't know LMAO And every time I try to ask I think people think I'm trying to be shady

tbh i don't really know how one decides, but lawsuits about this kind of thing are becoming more common (think robin thicke, which was a huge upset to some musicians--or the shake it off lawsuit.) and musicians is historically inspired by one another, which makes it tricky. when is it ok, when is it not? it's kind of a philosophical question in some instances, whereas in others it's cut and dry if you're being blatant (like vanilla ice and david bowie.)

some factors about this situation in particular:

olivia properly credited/sampled nyd for a different song (1 step forward or whatever)

olivia said cruel summer inspired the shouting part of deja vu

the internet compared misery business to good 4 u, and cruel summer to deja vu, A LOT upon the album release

jack said that his team did not ask for credit and was surprised to receive it

iirc hayley's team knew about the good 4 u situation before the song was released, but credits were added retroactively anyway (not sure why these steps were taken in this order tbh)

people also acused olivia of using a riff from an elvis costello song, and he basically said it might be true but he didn't care

evils costello has NOT received any credits

so there are some options i can think of. one is that the public pressure was mounting, so olivia's team just gave them credit voluntarily.

some people also think taylor asked behind the scenes, unbeknownst to jack, which i guess is possible but seems... unlikely?

i am inclined to think olivia's team did not want to face a lawsuit down the line (because it could hang over their heads forever, i guess, with the way the music business and copyright suits are going now), and offered the credits, and maybe, MAYBE??? there was an opportunity for paramore, taylor/jack/st vincent, decline but it was not taken. which is notable because they got like 50% of the rights (at least for deja vu) which is a lot of money, forever.

personally, good 4 u is blatant and it is not surprising they knew about the song before it came out.

deja vu is not as blatant but it is, imo, clearly inspired and it's undeniable because olivia admitted it. i don't know yet if i personally think "inspiration" deserves royalties and songwriting credits - speaking for the future of music. however, if taylor asked for it, i wouldn't be mad because this specific situation is so clear cut in a way other "inspiration" cases would not be.

none of this helps! sorry!!!

[ignitesthestxrs]

I know you said you’ve gone back into it slowly but any book recs?

yes absolutely!! i have read some bangers lately tbh. also another thing i am trying to do is start uuuh reviewing what i'm reading so i will link a couple of those as well. but here is a sporadic collection of my reading enjoyments of the last year or so!

IF FOUND RETURN TO HELL // THE DEATH I GAVE HIM by Em X. Liu

em is hands down one of the best writers i know with prose that will punch you in the face and leave you asking if you can have another, please.

IF FOUND RETURN TO HELL is a queer found family novella featuring a done-with-this protag working in a wizarding call centre who abruptly comes down with a case of 'sweet angel baby boy possessed by demon hell child' in a broken magical healthcare system where following protocol is more important than like, helping people. so what is journeyman wen to do if not, you know, help anyway?

THE DEATH I GAVE HIM is the queer scifi hamlet retelling of my dreams, which is funny because i didn't care about hamlet until this book taught me how to. a thoughtful exploration on the nature of adaptation, death & immortality, and also what happens when your best friend is an AI and you wanna fuck him.

IN COLD BLOOD by Truman Capote the original true crime novel. still stuck in my truman blorbo moment. full review here

ASSASSIN'S APPRENTICE by Robin Hobb classic 90s fantasy with surprisingly emotional focus on the protag in a way i really dug. unhinged levels of accidental queerbaiting in a way that i enjoyed rather than despaired of. full review here.

PANDORA'S JAR: WOMEN IN THE GREEK MYTHS by Natalie Haynes a great overview of classical women that takes into account multiple sources and the way they have been read over centuries, and how the time in which a tale is being told affects the tale just as much as what the text of the story actually is. does a good job of walking the middle ground between like, historical sexism and the reflexive girlbossification instinct.

IN OTHER LANDS by Sarah Rees Brennan the queer harry potter offshoot we all actually deserve. portal fantasy with an acerbic main character who will save the world out of sheer spite because the world doesn't seem to think he can save it, or want him to do it even if he could. a genuinely lovely musing on the nature of loneliness, what abuse does to a child, how it's hard but possible to overcome the prejudices you learn when you're young, and how eventually, you're going to have to make the decision to let yourself be loved.

SHE WHO BECAME THE SUN by Shelley Parker-Chan truly i don't have the word for how fucking excellent this queer epic fantasy is. set in mongol-ruled china, this book is a masterclass in political intrigue, historical fiction, military fantasy, and also genderfuckery. feat. the kind of tragedy you see coming for several hundred pages and still takes your breath away when it hits, and also lesbian fisting. anyone who says books based in history can't get queer can get fucked.

A MARVELLOUS LIGHT by Freya Marske for a total 180 in mood, here is your queer romantic fantasy set in an Edwardian England that is reflective of the fact that like, queer people did in fact exist in Edwardian England. A lighter fare that nonetheless will hit you right in the heart and leave you delighted that a) there's a second book out now and b) the third one is coming soon. also Freya is an Artiste when it comes to writing good sex scenes, which

i belatedly realise it seems like i'm focusing on in this post but i just! like a queer text that tackles queer sex with nuance and interest and the horror and/or joy of the body, and the above authors are all fucking masters at their art (which includes, but by no means is limited to, writing about fucking)

[dotthings]

So this is it. Last episode of Gotham Knights.

Thank you to James Stoteraux and Chad Fiveash for a fantastic finale. And to all the writers and cast and crew who made this beautiful DC series.

Season one gave us a taste of all the places this could go and what this show could be and it was SO GOOD I'm sorry there won't be more of it. There's only a few DC live action TV series that have worked for me over the years, Gotham Knights is among them.

"Batman chose well. Gotham needs its Robin." I LOVE this. Carrie's mom trusting her to look after herself, to stay alive, having seen her daughter in action as Robin, and asking her daughter to go save lives and trusting her to survive in return.

Commissioner Soto!! Knew!!! So...maybe she was the Gordon analogue in this continuity. All this time.

What finally made Harvey give himself over to the Two Face personality, what finally made him fully snap -- HE DID IT TO SAVE HIS DAUGHTER AND THOUSANDS OF LIVES IN GOTHAM. This is a really brilliant re-imagining.

With Turner's parents, I got that there was more to the story. Batman was defending himself from assassins. I didn't expect this version to have Batman actually have killed them, because the Batman doesn't kill idea is so seminal in most continuities including this one--this Batman also had the do not kill code.

He's a precise highly trained fighter, who has a strong code about not killing. So in that fight, something went wrong, he was in deadly peril, or, in defending himself, did something he didn't intend to be a kill, but wound up killing them.

Misha Collins and Olivia Rose-Keegan are hitting it out of the park in all their scenes. Duela with Harvey, Duela with Two Face, two very different dynamics and both riveting.

Misha getting to play Harvey as a regretful father who wants to save his daughter and thousands of lives and make amends and then Misha getting to play completely unhinged scarred, murderous Two Face and Misha floors it in both directions.

GIVE HIM AWARDS I'M NOT KIDDING HE DESERVES NOMINATIONS.

Sadly, because it's the CW network and a superhero show, the critical awards people won't even look at it. But I'm betting industry folks will take note anyway. Bravo, Misha.

I didn't expect Turner to actually be dead, and that tactical team had French accents so I expected Henri Ducard. Still enjoyed that reveal at the end. Guessing they're going with the comics background as inspiration (and would put their own twists on it--and not Nolanverse.) Henri Ducard trained Bruce Wayne. He's not a good guy, but he helped Bruce. I like how this show's plan was to have him train his son too.

And Turner, who wants to live up to his father's legacy, becomes a legacy and inspiration for his friends, to Duela, to keep fighting for Gotham, like Bruce did, like Turner wanted.

I can only guess what the S2 plans were. It's hinting Turner becoming a new kind of Batman eventually, not sure by S2.

The Knights are going to be pissed he didn't tell them he's alive.

The Two Face and Duela stories I'm sure would be riveting.

Steph/Harper and Duela/Turner getting more development and drama. Harper enrolling at Gotham Academy. Cullen would get a boyfriend.

Beyond that, it's a wild card. Two Face likely as a significant villain, but perhaps one who goes after other villains, who ultimately acts to preserve Gotham. Maybe some Owl remnants would be in play?

As it stands, I'm grateful. I got to have this, as a DC fan. I didn't go into this solely as a Misha fan. The bulk of my perspective of this show was as a DC fan, and it was good and I am going to keep saying it was good.

I love the team, I love its beautiful, candle-lit, aged, gothic, old stones and hidden dark corners and dirigibles and pre-war towers Gotham style. It gave, in my opinion, what is the best filmed take on Harvey Dent I've ever seen. The most nuanced and compassionate and unhinged and heartwrenching and frightening and gloriously fun to watch.

And it gave me this amazing and wonderful version of Carrie Kelley's Robin and I think I will miss her most of all.

[bruciemilf]

look man. i love jason. you love jason. we all love jason. but the way people talk about him sometimes is genuine death penalty propaganda which is not only concerning but also infuriating. THIS ALSO GOES FOR THE 'yeah i love him but i disagree with the death penalty' PEOPLE. you say you disagree with the death penalty but the way you talk about jason? 'his way is better and more effective in cleaning up gotham' 'he deserves to kill the joker/all those rapists (whom he hasnt killed in canon)/the murderers' 'jason todd is the true saviour and saint of gotham'

While I realize what I'm about to say will take away from Jason's undoubtedly noble intentions, its gotta be said: Jason didn't appeal to murder (at first) because of a justice, he appealed to murder as a rebellion streak.

I don't actually think Jason structured a proper handle of his own methods until he was trained by Talia; initially, It was nothing but revenge on his end. A revenge he deserves, but to a singular man, not at a larger scale.

Jason operated as Robin under Bruce's ideologies and he absorbed said ideologies for a long time! It seems that people forget that for a good period of time, Jason still had the mentality of a 15 year old

The death penalty is an incredibly nuanced and self-personal issue; Jason hasn't developed a strong grip on his morals and his own ideas around justice until after working solo, and Only then he grew into his shoes as a vigilante.

I intensely dislike that ruthless streak applied to him specifically to drug addicts and lower class criminals, because realistically, those are the most vulnerable groups outside the civilians.

When Jason's capability of logical thinking and mercy is erased, you haven't achieved anything past a killing machine, which fans have stated countless times they don't want to see! And they're right to.

Ultimately, Jason's justice is self-made, and he's a protector of the people first; Vigilantism isn't a self serving method, which a lot of people seem to forget

[robinverse]

Jason Todd is definitely not the angry Robin, and neither is Dick Grayson.

Reducing the two of them down to an emotion that they both are very much entitled to feel is not a great way to characterize them both—makes them two-dimensional. When I see panels go “Jason wasn’t the angry Robin, Dick was!” with well picked out comics of Jason being a cutie, wanting to do his homework, Bruce calling him Jay and Lad, and panels of Dick from Dark Victory where he’s in a perpetual state of grief and despair and bottomless rage, I think to myself of how this isn’t really solving anything.

Keep in mind that Dick in Dark Victory, is FRESH from his parents murder. He witnessed it first hand, is completely certain that it was no accident, and has lost every sense of belonging. A constant he’s had for all his years—a home (the circus) a family, being surrounded by people who love you. It is understandable why he would regress to a state of anger to leash his grief. To soothe it. He’s a tiny little boy in it too (which in addition, is a great detail imo bc it shows how young he was) and vengeance governs his actions.

AGAIN, if we continue on to Robin: Year One, we see a Dickie who’s dealing with the grief and anger. He’s playing basketball with his friends. He’s talking to girls. He’s making puns as he fights criminals. He’s painfully smart and he’s incredible. Robin: Year One is one of my fav comics ever. His dynamic with Bruce, his run with Two-Face etc. But this isn’t about that so let me get back to my main point.

Does Dick Grayson have anger issues? Yes he does. He had a lot of them. But does that make him the “Angry Robin”? Not really. He was more than that. All of them were.

At the same time, Jason doesn’t need to be a super sweet cute 14 year old all the damn time to not be labeled the “Angry Robin.” In Death in the Family, he WAS flipping out. He WAS angry. And that anger is JUSTIFIED. Jason grew up dirt poor in a neighborhood where he probably never believed he’d make a name for himself or have an adult look out for him. Bruce making him Robin and providing him school and shelter and food does not make all that trauma go away. Traumatized poor street children have the right to be angry at the unfairness of life, they have the right to be furious at the men who hurt kids like him.

Reducing them to just one personality trait or emotion just takes away so much nuance and context. 14 year old Jason Todd can be in the drama club and finish his English Essay 3 days before it’s due and help Alfred with the cooking and STILL want to beat the f*ck out of a child abuser. He’s allowed to be a sweet kid and want to make a change and save kids like him and he’s allowed to be angry at the scum on the streets who have hurt him! Jason Todd is a kid who KNOWS what it was like—and he wants to help.

And yes, folks, it’s classist to think the lower class poor little street kid who was taken in by Brucie Wayne is just some angry violent little brat. He was not. But if he punches you in the face for it then that’s a well deserved punch!

[twittercomfrnklin2001-blog]

Thanksgiving

You probably have to be demented to enjoy the over-the-top kills in Eli Roth’s THANKSGIVING (2023, Netflix). Well, call me demented (that’s Dr. Demented to you). Unlike other post-modern slasher films, Roth doesn’t go for humor by having characters comment on the genre. Nobody in this film feels like they’re living in a movie. The humor comes from the gleefully overdone kills, a tribute to more serious earlier films like the FRIDAY THE 13TH features and HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO ME (1981), noted for their creative murders. Fortunately, most of the victims are suitably heinous. Roth also makes good use of modern technology, with some jokes on streaming and social media fandom and taps into the nature of horror as a collective nightmare releasing out frustration with the status quo.

Roth follows slasher (and giallo) convention by having a past event motivate the mayhem. The film opens on Thanksgiving Day in the town of Plymouth, MA. Local thrift store magnate Rick Hoffman has decided to open his store at 6 p.m., leading to a riot that kills several people, including the manager’s wife (Gina Gershon), and permanently benches college pitching star Jalen Thomas Brooks. A year later, somebody dressed as John Carver, first governor of the Massachusetts colony, is going after those involved in the riot, including Hoffman’s daughter (Nell Verlaque, or “get me a Taissa Farmiga type”) and the friends she snuck into the store before the official opening.

There are tons of red herrings, and the specific motivation rests on information withheld until the end. But then, these films aren’t about solving the mystery, but rather about enjoying the murders. And if you can stomach the violence, these are some very enjoyable murder scenes. Beyond that, however, the film taps into modern discontents, albeit rather simplistically. The triggering event is the result of greed, Hoffman’s desire to make more money by opening his store on Thanksgiving Day (the manager even has to miss dinner with his family to avoid being fired). The murders, then, reflect our own discontent with the greed behind unchecked capitalism. That hardly makes the slasher sympathetic, even when we learn their motivation, but it does relate the killings to our own most violent impulses. And just to cement that, the killer is in a way the doppelganger of final girl Verlaque, who is also appalled at the store’s being open and feels guilty about her role in the riot. For an extra Freudian fillip, the impetus for opening the store came from daddy’s new wife, whom Verlaque resents (paging Electra), and watching the young woman get her father to go against his new wife’s wishes provides added emotional satisfaction, and can you tell I’m reading Robin Wood on the horror film right now.

THANKSGIVING probably could have done without the insipid romantic triangle involving Verlaque, Brooks, the boyfriend who ghosted her after his injury, and over-achiever new boyfriend Milo Mannhaim, mainly because they’re both too traditionally manly to deserve the more nuanced leading lady. And most of the high-school students look as if they should be planning for their college reunions. But there are some clever jokes about high-school life, creative use of the Ontario locations and a few nicely quirky details. After the killer takes out a security guard who had run from the riot, he notices the victim hadn’t had time to feed his cat. So, he stays long enough to feed it and leave the lid off its kibble box just in case nobody comes by any time soon. You can’t help feeling a special glow for a film like that.

[hirazuki]

I AM LATE BUT BACK, sorry work ate my life |D but yes! camelot movies are a bit different; mostly in order of events and dialogue and how certain events happen, not the big stuff, but some stuff is shuffled around and altered for time purposes. i'm pretty sure they also added mordred vs sanzang in the second one, that wasn't in the game. but it's still good! it's very very good, it's just a bit edited down etc because they crammed a whole chapter into 2 ovas rather than a whole 24 ep anime.

the extra anime does sound fun! i absolutely fucking adore Robin and Drake, so om nom nom more content for them is always wonderful, and i like nero's route in the game best so i'm glad it's her starring-- i should definitely check it out at some point once i finish apocrypha.

(i...am very early on into apocrypha. i need to finish that. i love everyone in it, they're all delightful. especially astolfo and achilles, though honorary mentions for karna and vlad.)

kojiro BALLS honestly he's really cool and i hope he gets more stuff in future events, we do get a 'gudaguda' historical japan event every year and i think they finally ran out of sengoku shenanigans, so maybe he'll get to star in a future one? here's hoping he deserves it (or maybe he'll be in that new koei tecmo game, since musashi is in it!)

you have excellent taste tbh, everyone on that list is amazing, and i stan shishigou SO HARD you have no idea he's So Cool. waver too, i love him as small and dorky but also older and...still dorky. but hotter. Gil, Cu, Emiya, Robin, Merlin, and Dantes are some of my favs but honestly i can't name a servant i HATE 100% (okay yes i can, but that's just one of them XD)

No worries!! UGH I hate when that happens, I wish work was just. not a thing XD

Oh, yeah, that makes sense, with Babylonia they did a full anime season; I wish they had done the same for this, but I'll take what I can get! I don't really have the time/interest to explore the game chapter for myself, but I wonder if I could maybe find a let's play or something to watch, I'd be interested in seeing the content in full.

Haha, Apocrypha is also very differently structured in terms of Holy Grail War dynamics (14 servants on the field....... it's so many....) but I really, really liked it. Lots of pain, of course, but it's so well written and executed. Enjoy!! Astolfo is a gem <3 (Achilles I'm not a fan of, but I've never liked him in any form/media and idk why; I like to pretend we don't share heritage XD BUT that's just my personal taste and, as a Greek, the Apocrypha team did an absolutely excellent job with his portrayal! I honestly have zero complaints about how they've handled any of my culture's mythological/historical figures, they consistently produce some of the most intuitive and nuanced interpretations I've ever seen).

It's just my curse, always falling for the side characters with the least amount of screen time lmao. I hope so!! Fingers crossed! (though Musashi favoritism kind of abounds in sword/historical circles, so it that might not mean anything -- but I'll be very pleasantly surprised if he does turn out to be in it!!).

Lmao THANK YOU! You have excellent taste too, Gil is one of the best boys and Cu is amazing as well <3 Shishigou is just so badass (and a necromancer, so instant bonus points for me) and his attitude is so relatable, he'd be my number one pick for a Fate mentor figure, you know? YES I love both young Waver and older Waver, and can I say how much I adore that he's so completely and utterly out of shape? Wheezing when he runs? I love that about him XD

I haven't spent too much time with Robin and Dantes so I can't really say anything worthwhile other than they are awesome and I love their designs, but MERLIN is also a top choice, 10/10, he's absolutely irritating but also a delight and his relationship with Fou is one of the best things ever.

Same! There are definitely characters that I don't like, as in, they don't vibe with me, but no one who I dislike as a character in terms of their role/purpose in the story, everyone is extremely well written.

[chiyana]

Oooh, what about a mix of both for the Clench? Tim still doesn't have her favor, but with everything else going on she tones it down, but then lashes out in spite and it leads Tim to getting the Clench? And at first she thinks he deserves it, but the more she watches him the more she realizes this is a child, one of HER children, who has been fighting so hard to keep her from falling apart, and she's sentenced him to a horrific death just as bad as the one Jason suffered, for no reason other than pettiness and spite.

And even if she still doesn't like Tim, even if she's not fully there yet, that doesn't sit right with her, so she throws everything in her power into keeping Tim alive and getting the cure to him just in time. It's after things have settled that Tim goes and has a talk with her face to... face??? Complicated, but he leverages her guilt to make her listen to him and stop actively sabotaging him.

Dick I think has... not the LEAST connection to Gotham, but definitely the loosest. He's more of a traveler than Bruce, and his blood ties aren't to Gotham either, and the boon she gave him was important but relatively minor in the grand scheme of things (Dick appreciated that he couldn't be hurt by a fall, but he wasn't about to test how far that stretched after what happened to his parents, so he's usually pretty careful about catching himself). He was able to move to New York for a time and work with the Teen Titans, and he comes back to Gotham enough for it not to break him out in hives.

As with most things, this changes a lot after Jason's death. He has his own anxiety with going off world (especially after Tim comes into the picture) and Gotham's pull is a lot more insistent now. Blüdhaven is still close enough to Gotham to fall under her pull, so he can stay and operate there comfortably.

When Tim first comes in, Gotham and Bruce are still in their self-destructive phase, and at first Gotham pushes Dick out, so it layers on top of his issues with Bruce and his initial issues with Tim. Eventually though, Dick realizes Bruce is in a bad spot and Gotham has it out for Tim (and Tim is understandably wary about Gotham), and he can't convince Tim to stop being Robin, but he can help train him, teach him how to handle Gotham's sabotaging better, get him out to Blüdhaven every so often to give him a break. Tim probably eventually confides in Dick that he had a boon from Gotham once and she tore it away when he tried to help, and Dick and Gotham probably get into a fight about it (Dick refrains from getting into a fight with Bruce over it only because Bruce has no control over Gotham and because he promised Tim not to tell Bruce).

Over time I think Dick would become really protective over Tim, since Tim really is having the roughest possibly go of it. (No Man's Land and Tim getting the Clench, twice, definitely rocketed Dick's blood pressure and got him into a screaming match with Gotham over her treatment of Tim, and I think it would put a permanent strain on his relationship with her that doesn't really ease off until he has to take over as Batman.)

Regarding the sixteenth birthday, Gotham probably doesn't quite understand what's going on - she's not dumb, she's just very big and very old and not human. she gets big emotions, but a lot of nuanced stuff is frustrating and difficult for her because she's not technically omniscient and she can't read people's minds, so she doesn't catch on to what Bruce is doing until it comes out. She's still a little lost, but she does gather 'Bruce lied to Tim and Tim is upset and DOESN'T WANT TO BE ROBIN ANYMORE' and Bruce gets pitched into the harbor or trips into an open manhole cover or constantly splashed by cars because it's constantly raining over him for the few days Tim isn't Robin. She also very much wants Tim to come back as Robin, and Tim knows it, and it probably influences his decision to come back.

Jack making him quit as Robin is a lot more complicated, and while Tim isn't Robin, he's still the Gotham Whisperer, and he definitely has to talk her down from putting Jack in ANOTHER coma. Gotham doesn't like Jack very much; the Drakes are from Gotham sure, but he travelled a lot and always sent Tim away to boarding school and Tim has complicated but mostly sad feelings about him, so she's biased against him. She tones it down as Tim and Jack work on their relationship, rocky as it is, but she's still upset that Tim isn't Robin anymore. (Stephanie's time as Robin is weird for everyone, including Stephanie and Gotham, and Gotham knows Tim has weird feelings about Stephanie becoming Robin without telling him, but he tells Gotham not to hurt Stephanie and to protect her, so she's salty that Tim isn't Robin but she refuses to take it out on Stephanie.)

For Captain Boomerang, everything was! Going great! Tim was Robin, he was working on his relationship with his dad, so everyone wins! And then FUCKING CAPTAIN BOOMERANG-

So Captain Boomerang is very much NOT welcome in Gotham anymore (if Tim still pulls the thing with Captain Boomerang, he forgets to take into account that Gotham doesn't like Boomerang and abruptly has to work double-time to keep the man from being a smear on the pavement because Gotham's like 'oh you seem to have accidentally saved him from his own stupid decisions, but no worries! I'll fix that!' Boomerang has the unique experience of Red Robin desperately trying to pull him from certain death while yelling at a chip in the building that 'I don't want to kill him!!! Stop trying to make me drop him!'

Dick and Damian possibly have to intervene to help because Gotham is like 'the Joker is alive despite my best efforts I am cracking THIS man's skull open like a walnut come hell or high water damn it')

I had a Batman AU thought that I wanted to share involving eldritch?sentient!Gotham. Gotham is alive, old and deeply rooted magic of ??? origin (that doesn't appreciate being poked and prodded so attempts to discern what she is have ended badly), and she is... mercurial, to put it diplomatically. She can favor or sabotage people on a sliding scale of intensity - basically good or bad luck on the lower side of the scale (finding a $20 bill vs stepping in a gross puddle kinda thing), and on the higher side it's things like a bullet missing when it shouldn't or a piece of building falling onto someone. She also has boons, things she grants certain people - primarily Bats, but there are a few Rogues that have their own boons because again, mercurial. Boons bind someone to Gotham, make them always find their way back and eventually need to come back, but if you're close enough to Gotham for her to offer a boon, it's probably your home.

Batman is her... warlock? Paladin? He's pledged his life to protect Gotham and is in tune with her, and he protects the city and keeps it in balance, and she grants him her favor constantly and has given him a powerful boon (able to hide in whatever shadows there are, even slight ones, and virtually disappear in them even if you're watching him). When he takes Dick in and Dick creates the Robin mantle, Gotham loves it, and Dick gets his own boon (able to land where he intends to, can't be killed/seriously hurt from a fall).

Jason though is her absolute favorite son, her pride and joy. He's born of Gotham, steeped in the city, of it and for it, and he loves Gotham and when he becomes Robin he fights to make her better and bring light to her. She gives him the boon that he knows every part of the city instinctively. He can move through it easily, knows the streets and buildings by heart, knows on some level what's happening in different places (not always exact, usually gut feelings), and he can always hide in it when he chooses.

Then he dies. (Away from Gotham, because if he'd been in Gotham she never would have let it happen.) Gotham and Batman are a wreck together, they're angry and grieving and losing it, everything is coming apart and it's Bad. (The Joker had a boon from Gotham, because he's also of Gotham, and she's not good or evil but simply is. However when he killed HER favorite son, she tore the boon and her favor from him and wrecked what was left of his mind. He still feels chained to Gotham and Batman, but this is no longer a city that loves him.)

This is when Tim pushes to become Robin, and both Gotham and Batman hate it. They both want to lose themselves in the rage and grief, but Tim won't let them. Batman/Bruce comes around first, but Gotham is still seething, and she sabotages Tim at every turn: things that should hold his weight break or creak loudly, shadows never seem to hide him, evidence gets lost or trails go cold when he tries to follow them, buildings constantly crumble around him, goons always seem to get hits on him that he should be able to dodge or avoid, he gets pitched into the harbor CONSTANTLY.

It gets to a point that Bruce is seriously considering firing Tim purely because it's notably more dangerous for him as Robin than it ever was for Dick and Jason (even though he and Dick both try to convince Gotham to calm down and lay off). Tim eventually tracks down the best place to communicate with Gotham directly (much as she tries to deter him) and they get into a fight (reminiscent of Tim getting into fights with Bruce to make him get his shit together).

Tim argues that if he hadn't stepped in, Bruce would have either gotten himself killed or crossed a line he couldn't come back from, and it would have destroyed him AND the hope left in Gotham. He would have been considered a criminal and likely would have become a Rogue, with no 'Batman' to step up and stop him. He argues that Batman needs a Robin to fight for and protect, and without one he'll backslide and get worse again, and if that happens, Gotham will be torn to shreds. Tim points out that Jason loved Gotham and fought for her, and it's disrespectful of his love and his memory to let everything fall to pieces after he fought so hard for her.

It's enough to convince Gotham to back off on her sabotage, though she's still hurt and sulking. Bruce still isn't sure about Tim not having Gotham's favor, much less a boon of his own, but Tim argues that he'll get good enough to keep up with or without Gotham's help - which he does.

Over time though, Gotham watches Tim fight to protect Gotham and Batman, and she admits she was wrong in how she treated him. She slowly starts to extend her favor to him and eventually approaches him and offers him a boon. Tim, however, turns her down. He's seen how badly Jason's loss and Gotham's grief and anger affected those closely connected to her, and he knows taking the boon will tie him to Gotham permanently. He believes those connected to Gotham and Gotham herself need someone who can be more objective and keep a level head, and he's secretly kind of worried that if something happens again, if Bruce and the Bats eventually tire of him and don't need him, he'll be trapped in Gotham. He also just doesn't totally trust Gotham even though he loves her.

Gotham's hurt, obviously, but she understands and doesn't lash out, recognizing it's her own fault. She does give him her favor though and swears to never rescind it, even when she's upset with him. Tim's gotten this far without her favor or a boon, but it's nice not to have to worry about getting dunked in the harbor for the third time in one week anymore (though she hasn't done that in a year or so).

Then Jason returns, and Gotham is having THE BEST time. Her baby boy! Is back! He's bigger now, and he's a lot angrier and hurt in a lot of ways, but he's! Back! She's a little worried about how angry he is at Batman and the other Bats, but Jason is her favorite and she can't turn him away or deny him. She still favors him, she just... makes sure she favors the Bats enough too to keep them all on an even playing field. They'll work it out. Tim managed to get her to calm down, so she's confident her current Robin will help the family again.

Then Jason goes to the Titan Tower after Tim, and initially she assumes they'll talk and things will be better, but when Jason comes back she sees that he went and ATTACKED Tim.

It's the first time she's ever been angry at Jason, and she drops a brick on his head (while he's wearing his helmet, he's still her favorite), and she threatens to collapse the ceiling of his apartment. They get into a fight. Jason came away from his fight with Tim thinking Tim was impressive as Robin, but he doesn't want him in the suit so he still went through with beating him unconscious. He DID notice Tim doesn't have Gotham's boon, so he doesn't understand why she's so upset he roughed the kid up.

Gotham is pissed and a pissed Gotham is hard to communicate with outside of raw emotion, so eventually after suffering several indignities of light sabotage, getting caught yelling at the street or a building while the manhole cover or windows rattle angrily, Jason goes to find Tim and ask "hey what the FUCK" (haven't fully figured how this changes Jason's interactions with the rest of the Bats, but he is begrudgingly impressed that Tim made it through the start of his tenure with Gotham actively sabotaging him, then argued an eldritch city into behaving, then turned down her boon and STILL came out of it with her undying favor).

(Gotham, in this AU, is NOT a fan of the al Ghuls at all. Primarily Ra's, at first, because he wants to purify Gotham/control her, and she is NOT a fan of that thanks. He's tried attacking her (destroying parts of the city), threatening her, trying to determine the origin of her magic, enslave her, trying to bargain with her, seducing her, and she is having NONE OF IT. Going into Gotham is a nightmare for anyone with the League, because while it can be difficult for her to get a hold of them, once she does she sabotages the HELL out of them. Getting cut on rusted rebar, falling off ledges, sinkholes opening up under them, one of them managed to get bitten by a rat and catch the bubonic plague. Ra's has, on one memorable occasion, been knocked into an open manhole and then almost drowned in sewer water that carried him out into the harbor where something (possibly Croc) tried to eat him, and he broke his arm while climbing out.

Talia got a reluctant pass since she seemed more interested in Bruce than Gotham and Bruce reciprocated, but Gotham doesn't appreciate Talia's attempts to lure Bruce OUT of Gotham. When she finds out Talia kept Jason away? AND convinced him to go after Tim? Talia is on the permanent shit list too.

When Gotham finds out about DAMIAN, Talia can't set foot in Gotham without having SEVERAL chunks of building being dropped on her from above.

Though when Damian DOES show up, Gotham is quick to claim him and offer him a boon. He's the son of Batman, he's a future Robin, and if he's given a boon, he's tied to Gotham and can't easily return to the League (mostly Talia and Ra's). Win win!

Except then he attacks Tim, and learns VERY swiftly that it's not good to piss off the sentient eldritch city you accepted a boon from. He's laid up with a migraine and all kinds of awful symptoms of an illness (nothing fatal but definitely awful) until Tim recovers, and then Tim gets to play mediator between the Bats and Gotham AGAIN as he tries to explain to Damian the nuances of Gotham as an entity and what being one of her favored/booned actually means, AND lecturing Gotham about sabotaging another Robin/giving him a boon without making sure he understood what he was accepting.)

HI 👋 Fabulous AU you've got here.

I particularly enjoy how complicated Tim's relationship with Gotham is. In fact, Tim's later years could be misunderstood by the Bats as Tim being her favorite (hear me out).

If Gotham never states who her favorite is, all the Bats see is that Tim, despite not having a boon, has Gotham on his side against the other Bats (really, Tim just isn't attacking/harming the others like they are to him, but it's about perspective).

It's also kind of heartbreaking that Tim has an additional condition that sets him apart from the Bats. He's the only one to be immediately hated by Gotham. He doesn't have a boon (though later that's a choice). He is consistently reaching out to Gotham to actually communicate and fix their issues.

Might I add an additional part for extra angst? We'll take the fanon idea of Tim stalking his heroes from a young age.

Gotham sees that another being idolizes her paladins and grants him the small boon of his camera never making a sound, being unnoticeable, and the flash never being visible unless Tim wants it to. Tim is okay with being stuck in Gotham due to his parents never taking him abroad with them

After Tim forces his way into Robin, though, Gotham rips this away from him, destroys any need for him to stay (she wants him to leave her alone to her own rumination), and actively sabatoges him.

Because it was taken from him once, because he's felt the pain of that loss, because the sudden emptiness was a gaping hole he had to spend years coping with, he never wants a boon again. He doesn't know if he'll be able to handle the sudden deprivation once more.

This is the start of him not trusting that anything lasts (especially since a retracted boon was so rare it's only been rumored in the past [since Gotham doesn't care for "good" or "evil" it's harder to get on her bad side]).

I'm curious what all of the boons alloted to each person are (very curious if/what Commissioner Gordon's)

[jasontoddiefor]

“Bruce can’t kill! He’s not a cop. He will just beat the shit out of you, arrest you, and hand you over to the cops who he doesn’t even trust. Also he believes in redemption, which is why he utilizes the Gotham prison system despite it never being focused on redemption or rehabilitation and also he continues to utilize Arkham despite it canonically making everyone worse!”

The issue isn’t just that Bruce doesnt kill the mass murderers of Gotham, it’s that his moral stance has no nuance. He doesn’t believe in self defense or defense of others. If bane was killing Damian and Damian killed bane to save himself, Bruce would blame Damian. There’s no room in his ideology, it’s just as extreme and skewed as other characters. AND! He can’t just let it be his own ideology. He has to force it on other people as well

I‘m assuming the second one is from the same anon! If not I’ll still answer in one since they work together

You‘re bringing up multiple interesting points here so I‘m gonna break those down briefly!

Batman‘s (Legal) Authority

He’s a vigilante. He has been enemy of the force for a time. The fact that he’s allowed to operate at all hinges p much only on the fact that he’s going after criminals and Gordon like him. And the moment he goes after criminals that are on the “legal” side of things, he’s public enemy #1. He’s never had any kind of binding legal authority.

Violence used in arrests

Batman is violent. Sometimes it’s on purpose, to show him losing control and going to far, sometimes it’s just “Haha Batman go punch” comic book narration style. But we also see panels of Batman talking people down, not using violence as a first, middle, last and only resort. And my original point about that was that “beaten up” is still better than “dead”.

Reliability of the system

I mean, yeah we know the cops and Arkham suck but what else is he supposed to do besides what he’s already doing, weeding out corrupt cops and funding Arkham? He could start his own private prison but we’ve seen in other comics how much that Does Not Work. I think ultimately, Batman sees himself as an emergency service trying to pick up what the system itself can’t do while trying to fix it himself. Meanwhile, people still have to go somewhere.

Humanity/Morality of Batman

Bruce Wayne is a dick. Very my way or the high way, arrogant, and a man of extremes. He cares about people, about love, but Christ he‘s not a good communicator. He‘s got flaws, his inability to see nuance at times is certainly one of them. But what struck me - especially in Batman: The Knight, which was why I added that panel and cannot stop recommending that comic - was that Bruce defines himself by acting out of love, the want to protect, and the realization that if his mission is to save human life, he cannot take it. No matter how much he might resent a person or think they’d deserve it, if he became the kind of person that would kill for his mission, he’d become someone unrecognizable.

Batman‘s ideology as a frame

This is going to sound very dismissive and I promise I do not mean it that way. Batman is a character that says “we don’t kill, period. If you can’t do that, don’t do the job”. Like, that sounds incredibly offensive, but those are the standards to which he holds himself. I’m the best, I can do it without resorting to taking a life, so if you do the same job I’m doing, you should be just as able. Bruce didn’t really make any of his Robins his side kick, they more or less did that themselves, kicking and screaming, whether. Batman wanted them to be Robin or not. If they wanted to, they could drop out (ofc they don’t actually can bc we’d be left without any comics) but they don’t. So we’re back to Batman saying, “if you wanna do the job, you have to be able to do it this way”. Thus one of the Robins taking a life in self defense doesn’t fly because they’re supposed to be better. Is that particularly rational? Well, no, not necessarily, but that’s what it boils down to. If they had to resort to taking a life to save themselves, they shouldn’t have been in the position I’m the first place, but somewhere away from the fight. He trained himself until he could fight without taking a life and thus everyone else who wants to do the same should learn it as well.

All of these are associated with the whole discussion surrounding Batman killing, and you raise interesting points regarding how Batman operates and the hypocrisies involved. The last two are difficult to discuss particularly because we’re still reading comic book heroes and not actual legal irl batvigilante. I think this is still a step sideways from my original point that Batman’s refusal to kill on principle is a valid stance the character should be allowed to keep, but all of this is interconnected.

[awake-my-oceans]

Kaito as the detective and shin as the Kid (shrinking optional)

(Send me an AU and I’ll tell you five headcanons about it)

Robin, you‘ve talked about how the Phandom makes you write like you‘re possessed, and I‘m starting to get what you mean. Literally nothing in DCMK comes to me without it turning into A Monster. Anyways, roleswap Kaito and Shinichi!

Ok so the thing is this could actually work with canon backstories. Kaito’s whole thing is about honoring his dad and catching the guys who killed him, which translates fairly easily into detective work—particularly if he doesn’t know about the Kaitou Kid bit right away. Shinichi is……a bit harder, but he canonically rolls with the weirdest stuff. If you get the right setup, him being Kaitou KID isn’t that much of a stretch.

I know it’s headcanon time but shhhh this is an interesting premise and I have to figure out how we got here.

Ok, so Kaito doesn’t always pick up nuanced crime scene clues, but he reads people really really well. So when he accidentally runs into Jii, and the mention of his father comes up, Jii winces, pained, and Kaito goes “what do you know you absolutely know something and I won’t drop this” and doesn’t let Jii rest until Jii admits that Kuroba Toichi was murdered. Boom, off we go. Nakamori Ginzo half-raised him ever since Toichi died, so it’s a reasonable jump to go straight into detective work. Kaito can’t always read a crime scene, and frankly, the bodies are unsettling to the point of nausea, but he sure can read everyone’s reactions to the body, and, well, some people are only pretending to grieve. What does this madlad do? Does he teach himself to carefully examine all evidence for clues? Well, yes, but that comes later. Right now, he jumps straight into impersonating the deceased’s voice and mannerisms and accusing everyone and, well, people do tend to have nervous breakdowns and confessions when suddenly confronted with their victim’s ghost. Good, Kaito thinks, remembering how much he’s mourned his father. They deserve it.

Off he goes. He’ll get more and more relevant information over time, but that’s about as slow-burn as canon. Meanwhile, he’s making a name for himself as a medium for the dead.

Meanwhile Shinichi’s come across the reports of Kuroba Toichi’s death, and, well, this is definitely a cover up. A few too-close runs later, he realizes it was a cover up from inside the legal system, and that those people are still very much in power. He has a crisis for all of like two days before realizing that Sherlock Holmes took a legally “flexible” approach to confronting in-house corruption, and, well, if Sherlock Holmes can do it then he can too. Sufficient off-the-record digging, plus talking with his dad (who is also, ah, legally flexible), brings up the whole Kaitou Kid thing and look, playing Kaitou Kid was supposed to be a one-time thing to bait people out of the woodwork, but one thing led to another, and here Shinichi is, moonlighting as a dead thief.

Shinichi isn’t more than competent at magic tricks, but he has a few things in his favor here. 1) both Agasa and Jii are helping him, and their team up is a force to behold. Jii keeps the ideas practical, and Agasa makes the ideas work. 2) Shinichi’s dad absolutely knew the last Kaitou Kid inside out, and he’s giving Shinichi helpful pointers. 3) Shinichi may not be good at doing magic, but he’s absolutely incredible at reading and anticipating the police, having a flawless alibi, and leaving no evidence on-scene. Plus, he’s still working his “day job” as a detective, so he also gets stupidly easy access to department gossip, security layouts, and other classified information.

Headcanon time!

Kaito has his beginning of canon meltdown of “EXCUSE ME, this thief is claiming to be the best magician around and he’s WRONG because my DAD was the best.” This is even more vehement because his dad is a more painful topic overall, given that he was murdered. That said, he’s not going to give this thief the time of day because he’s got more important things to do, like catch the murderers. However, Shinichi-in-disguise is casing a building when someone gets murdered there, and Kaito’s like “what is up with this guy.” Shinichi does pause and lend a hand when Kaito gets stuck, because murder is murder no matter what face he’s wearing. After the case is solved, Kaito’s trying to figure out who on earth this is when he realizes it’s Kaitou Kid. But the guy did just help solve a murder. And when he snarls that his father was the better magician, Kaitou Kid just bows his head and agrees. So Kaito has no idea what to make of this dude. Meanwhile Shinichi’s inner dialogue is just “it’s Toichi’s kid, does he know—NOPE HE SURE DOESN’T, UH, WHAT DO I DO??!”

Kaitou Kid respecting Toichi and admiring Kaito’s magic is a recurring thing, much to Kaito’s bemusement. Like. He can tell that it’s genuine, not a way to throw him off guard, although it’s sure doing that, too. One time Kaitou Kid pauses a heist to help with a case, which leads to Kid almost getting caught. Kaito’s still got a lot of complicated feelings around Kid, but it’s not fair that Kid’s getting arrested just because he had the decency to help stop a murderer. So Kaito covers for Kid with a rather good magic trick that “Kid” performs. Kid escapes, but not before giving Kaito the strangest layered look Kaito’s ever seen. He doesn’t even know what was in all those layers, just that there was a lot of grief and that there were upwards of ten layers in there.

Kaito and Shinichi catch onto each other faster than in canon. This is mainly because their weak spots are more obvious to an expert—Kaito’s definitely not talking to ghosts to solve cases, thinks Shinichi the Savior of the Police Force, and Kid’s definitely got a hidden agenda that’s only almost perfectly covered up, thinks Kaito the Undisputed Expert of Poker Face. Kaito has a very rough go of things when he finds out in rapid succession that 1) Kid’s trying to hunt down murderers via a system that might actually be stranger than talking to “ghosts,” 2) Kid’s looking for who killed Kuroba Toichi specifically, and 3) Kuroba Toichi was actually the original Kid. After that, Kid being a teenage detective is just—whatever. Sure. Why not.

There’s a huge police betting pool on what will happen when Kudou “everything has a rational explanation” Shinichi, and Kuroba “I literally talk to ghosts” Kaito meet. Everyone’s sure there will be conflict—people are just trying to work out how it will go down. Turns out that they get on like a house on fire, but to everyone’s great surprise, the houses they set on fire are all criminals, and they don’t try to set each other’s houses on fire at all. Except for Megure. Megure makes bank.

Turns out that when you have two detectives and two phantom thieves on hand, things get done with furious efficiency. Kaito and Shinichi take turns being Kaitou Kid, depending on whose skill set is most useful. Kaito’s better at dodging bullets and at doing insane magic. Shinichi’s better at forcing the snipers to reveal themselves and at getting the police to notice exactly the right things about the snipers. On a detective front, half the Organization’s convinced that 1) their dead victims are actively sabotaging them and 2) if their victims don’t get them, Kudou Shinichi certainly will.

Honestly, from an outside POV, the back third of this series would just be “there are GHOSTS and we are going to DIE and also reality is bending anytime Kaitou Kid shows up—“

RIP to all the undercover agents in the Organization. They’re about to have a Ride.

[crypticsteve]

we deserve to see robin, nancy, steve, argyle, and jonathan fumble their way through a dnd session (not a full campaign, they would literally murder each other).

eddie as the frustrated dm who is also dropping helpful hints like, "i mean do you have anything that could possibly help you in this moment, steve?" and steve is just so fucking stressed. "i don't know man! i don't fucking know." steve is like pulling his hair out because this is a game why is he so fucking stressed. but once he finds his groove he's killing it... all the way up until he sacrifices himself and drops to 0 hit points and very dramatically dies.

nancys clearly the most organized like she's taking notes, she read mikes binder, she knows what the fuck to do. but she also gets so mad at her rolls, "that's fucking bullshit! that should've been a fucking hit munson!" and eddie just lolls his head to the side, "language, wheeler. thems the rules." it's definitely a flash back to last week when the gang played monopoly and nancy flipped the board because eddie put a hotel on boardwalk. tensions are high.

robin is the opposite, no notebook, no notes, she has no idea what the fucks going on but she is loving it. waaaaayyy too over descriptive in literally everything and the sole reason that this session is astronomically long. she is more into the improv side of the game than anything else, but she's also naturally good at understanding the nuances. and extremely strategic. the type of player that you think is bullshitting their turns and then all of a sudden at the very end it all comes together and everyone is just amazed. "how the hell did you do that?" steve would ask, a twizzler hanging from his mouth. "it's called strategy steve. look it up."

jonathan is just there for the vibes. but he did spend the most time crafting his character and he has a funny voice he uses through the whole session. he's believe it or not the comic relief. anytime things get a little too contentious (definitely not looking at nance and eddie at all) he'll be the one to quip something and get everyone back on track.... even though that's technically eddies job. he also loves the story aspect of the game. and has a really good memory. like he'll be like, "yeah but at the beginning you said we were headed west, so technically..." eddie pretends not to be really annoyed.

argyle fucking saves the day. let's be real here. he has never played dnd before (for the sole reason that he never had anyone to play with) but he picks it up in seconds. and he's having the. most. fun. like laughing his head off but also his rolls are just somehow impeccable. like only has like 2 bad rolls the whole session. and he has the final deciding roll and just destroys it. everyone is screaming. jonathan is grabbing his shoulders and shaking him. it's such a beautiful and triumphant moment. eddie recruits him to join hellfire for real.

[bigskydreaming]

I am looking (disrespectfully) at the trope of Bruce and other family members only seeming to respect Dick’s wishes when doing so aligns with what they already wanted to do.

Let’s go to the examples!

1) Bruce not broaching adoption with Dick because he wants to respect Dick’s first parents and feels like he would be taking their place or overstepping or putting himself in between Dick and his memories of his parents. Sometimes its cited that Dick himself expressed this wish early on after his parents died, sometimes its not and this is still just upheld as Bruce’s reasoning for not adopting Dick before he was already well into adulthood.

THE FATAL FLAW (in mine own personal opinion, natch. Personal mileage may vary, check your speedometer to be safe):

This particular plot point or tangle is in my experience ALWAYS paired with Bruce’s own insecurities about his role in Dick’s life, or not wanting to push that or receive an answer he doesn’t want to or is afraid to hear. Sometimes its about his fears of unworthiness to be Dick’s actual parent, etc, etc. But the bottom line is, there is always the presence of SOME element (and not a small one) in which Bruce’s own self-interest or feelings are protected by him NOT broaching the adoption conversation with Dick and having to confront these fears head on.

This is additionally juxtaposed with the problem that although there’s a lot of variance in regards to stories where Bruce fired Dick versus stories where Dick gave up being Robin and moved on to Nightwing voluntarily....there’s NOT a lot of stories where Dick makes Jason Robin himself or is asked by Bruce first. The part where Bruce takes this initiative on his own, without thinking through its repercussions on Dick emotionally.....this is practically always present.

Now, the problem here is that......Dick became or began becoming Robin well into his time with Bruce. Its frequently cited as the thing that began allowing them to truly connect, their time training and acting as Batman and Robin.

Meaning no matter WHAT interpretation you go with as to why specifically Dick chose the name Robin, whether it was a family nickname or an homage to Robin Hood.....the fact remains, NOTHING of Robin, THEMATICALLY, nothing that spoke to Dick in regards to what he wanted Robin to be - specifically in honor of his parents because avenging his parents and making sure what happened to them didn’t happen to others like, this was literally a key part of what bonded Dick and Bruce, the fact that Bruce was TRYING to help Dick specifically BECAUSE they shared this particular overlap of purpose - like the bottom line is, nothing about Robin CAME from Bruce. Or Dick’s feelings about Bruce. That....didn’t really even exist yet, at the time he created Robin. Everything about Robin, other than the physical costume itself, not even the design just the actual creation of it....all of that came from BEFORE he met Bruce. None of it was thoughts or feelings derived from BRUCE. Its the whole reason Dick was never Batkid or Batlad, or any derivative of Batman.

It all, ALL came from what Dick came to the manor WITH. Remnants of his life with his first family.

So the fatal flaw of Bruce’s reasoning that by not broaching the subject of adoption with Dick before well into adulthood, he was actually just respecting Dick’s relationship with his first parents and not trying to come between them and Dick’s memories and feelings about them....

All of this is inherently undermined by Bruce’s own actions.....when by repurposing Robin to ANY degree, even just to give the mantle to Jason.....this meant that he was inherently viewing Robin as being more about being Batman’s partner, HIS partner....then it was about being Dick’s heritage, his last intangible keepsake of his first family and life BEFORE Bruce.

In effect....Bruce making Jason Robin or firing Dick as Robin, either way....both betray Bruce’s OWN alleged intentions for only wanting to respect Dick’s relationship with his parents, and that being why he didn’t want to overstep by trying to impose or even ask for his own official parent/child relationship with Dick. Because that’s exactly what appropriating the Robin mantle was. It was Bruce ignoring the relationship Dick had with his parents and their memory and the fact that Robin was directly born of that....and making Robin entirely about Bruce’s OWN relationship with Dick, heedless of any other factors.

And the second Bruce did that.....his entire justification for not raising the adoption issue....disappears. It goes away. Because you can’t claim inaction being just a result of not wanting to disrespect something you’ve already voided respect for. No matter whether Bruce INTENDED it or not.....by crossing this boundary, Bruce already acted against Dick’s feelings in this regard and well, disregarded them....which makes claims of Bruce not raising the adoption issue pretty much JUST self-serving at that point. Its an alleged viewpoint of Dick’s that Bruce largely just ASSUMES....and only ultimately respects - in direct contrast to how he didn’t respect the associations Dick had with Robin - because it aligns with something Bruce ALREADY wanted to do, rather than what Dick actually wanted. It provided justification for Bruce to just....not have a conversation he was afraid to have. And that’s about Bruce at that point. Its not about Dick. Its just like...not.

2) Another example of this that is not unique to just Bruce, but recurs frequently in both canon and fanfics in Dick’s dynamics with other characters he’s close with.....is characters not apologizing for things they’ve done to Dick or raising the issue of things they did a long time ago but never apologized for....while claiming to do so because they thought DICK didn’t want to talk about it.

THE FATAL FLAW (in my own personal opinion. Nuances and variations may not be identical at all store locations, please see your local branch for details):

The particular problem I have here is that....Dick never ever ever in the history of ever and also the before ever time.....has EVER expressed a desire to avoid confrontation.

Like. That’s what he DOES. That’s his JAM. That’s literally CITED time and time again as one of the reasons he’s viewed as more of a people person and natural team leader than Bruce and other Batfam members....because he’s not afraid to cut straight (or bi) to the heart of the matter and air out a dispute.

In fact, this very character trait is one of the ones most commonly utilized AGAINST Dick in various depictions of him, as he’s often cited as TOO confrontational, TOO eager for a fight or conflict especially when his temper is engaged, such as when he’s well....personally hurt or offended.

So how does it follow, then, that avoiding tough conversations ONLY when its on the OTHER person to INITIATE, because they were the ones who DID the wrong-doing and Dick the subject of that rather than the instigator....how does it work, exactly, that these are the only times in which we DON’T tend to see a direct conversation about the harms done and the fallout that resulted? With it being claimed that this is solely for Dick’s benefit, out of a desire to avoid pulling him into an allegedly unnecessary (but really just unpleasant) confrontation?

When the concurrent reality is that whether stated or acknowledged or not.....avoiding these specific conversations and ONLY these conversations (as there never seems to be a problem finding canon or fanfic stories in which Dick apologizes for harm HE’S caused to others or is clearly expected to).....this avoidance also carries the side benefit of allowing the character who DID something wrong to Dick to....not ever have to have that super uncomfortable conversation in which they actually verbally acknowledge the thing they did to him and the effects it had on him, and apologize for that.....and then render themselves vulnerable to actually hearing whether or not he accepts their apology or is still upset with them regardless.

While - as long as they DON’T ever have this conversation, for whatever reason - they can look to the clear and consistent precedent of Dick continuing to work with people who have done things like oh, I don’t know....punched him in the face cuz they’re mad at him (and this isn’t a Bruce critical point, this is a whole damn family critical point as the only one who HASN’T actually done this is Duke. Well, Cass technically just threw him out a window, but I mean, tomato toh-mah-to). Writers and characters both can lean on the fact that actually Dick has a pretty clear track record of ultimately giving up a grudge or at least showing a willingness to look past those grudges enough that it doesn’t prevent him from still maintaining or resuming some kind of relationship with the person who hurt him.

And thus, like Example Numero Uno......this ultimately just lets other characters off the hook while claiming to do Dick a favor, but actually Dick receives no real benefit from it and instead now just has another instance of characters saying “see we respect your wishes” when ultimately their inaction is MORE in service to their own wishes and self-interests.

2b) See also the variation of this in which characters such as Bruce, Jason, Tim and assorted others like....are written specifically determining that they’re not going to apologize to Dick or beg his forgiveness because they feel they don’t DESERVE to be forgiven, and once again....its in HIS best interests that they not even give him the opportunity to say he forgives them....because they know Dick Grayson of course, and they know he’s too forgiving for his own good, so its better to like....not make it ever a possibility in this particular instance.

With the problem here being like.....Dick can’t and shouldn’t be expected to KNOW that’s their logic? So....all he’s going to actually SEE is loved ones just....not expressing remorse for hurting him or acknowledgment it even happened? Which....hurts?

So......hurting your loved one MORE after already hurting them....because you don’t feel you deserve to be forgiven for hurting them in the first place and are actually PROTECTING them from being hurt more when mistakenly forgiving you.....by.....hurting and continuing to hurt them with your silence and lack of evident remorse....

Mmmm.....

Its not the best approach, y’know?

Flaws are detected.

3) Dick’s friends and family manipulating situations in order to get the end result THEY desire, while claiming to do so for his benefit only. Dick being willing to manipulate people to achieve his own ends comes up a LOT actually....but there’s relatively little examination of how often people do this to him, claiming his best interests but really just circumventing his clearly stated desires for independence and the right to make his own choices about what HE needs....or when this is brought up, its usually limited to JUST Bruce doing it, but uh....no that ain’t it.

Specific examples of this are like when Wally joins the 1999 version of the Titans specifically to get Dick to join up, because in his estimation Dick needs more of a social life and is drowning himself with his responsibilities....and then quits not long after Dick is finally officially invested in staying with the team. Another example is when Roy gets Dick to join the Outsiders based entirely on his pitch of NOT treating the team like a family, like they did with the Titans, so that Dick could keep emotional distance and not be as worried about losing them like he suffered from losses like Donna....with his claim again being that he worried about Dick in the aftermath of that loss, etc.

And to be clear! Its not that I think Wally and Roy and others who do similar things have NEGATIVE intentions in mind for Dick. That’s the whole point of this post.....like the other examples, I fully believe THEY believe (or writers believe when writing them this way) that they have Dick’s best interests in mind and not their own. I just....disagree.

THE FATAL FLAW (at least as I see it here):

Is that I view this and Batfam members who do similar stuff as like.....falling into the trap of the savior friend complex. Its that thing when you see a friend hurting, and over time get FRUSTRATED by seeing this when a solution seems obvious to you but think they won’t take it because they’re too stubborn or don’t know what’s best for them....with this specifically recurring a LOT with Dick in particular, due to his core characterization of wanting to be the one to make his own choices. The problem here, same as the problem with the savior friend complex....is that it treats the subject of these views as like....incapable of determining what they need. Its a tacit condemnation that they actually don’t know how to cope with things and are doing it wrong - even though the ones making this assessment will never be the ones actually having to LIVE with the outcome of their meddling. Its the conviction that someone like Dick needs to be HANDLED, for his own good....because he can’t be trusted to KNOW what he needs, not as well as them at least.....and so they jump to manipulation rather than just....ASK him what he needs, or HOW they can best support him, or even just WHY he’s making the choices he is.

For instance, the problem with what Wally did was never that Dick wasn’t struggling. He was. He was drowning in his responsibilities, he had very little to no life outside of them.....Wally is not remotely in the wrong for WANTING to do something to change this situation. The problem is Wally basically defaulted to just...HANDLING his friend by restarting the Titans just to give Dick a social life again, which is pretty much a line straight out of the comics...and basically railroaded right over Dick’s initial ‘no’ when he first heard the proposal. And kept pushing things until Dick eventually joined up in order to get Wally to commit to the team too, because Wally spun it as though Dick was helping Wally by getting Wally to commit to the team for the very same reasons Wally wanted Dick to. And then....right after that, Wally quit to go back to just focusing on the Justice League, which was part of what Dick predicted would happen all along.

The thing was.....at no point along the way did Wally actually ask WHY Dick initially said no....he jumped straight to assuming his own view of the problem, that Dick just COULDN’T be made to ever see the reason to take a break occasionally and put his mental and emotional health as a priority. If he’d done this, Wally could have had dozens of other options to achieve his desired end result....he could’ve like....set up regular hangouts with Dick. 

But Wally jumped to assuming he knew the answer, he knew what was best for Dick, and that Dick’s logic was inherently self-destructive and self-flagellating.....and he felt the solution was to bring back the Titans, as he recalled their earlier times as Titans together as a time when Dick was better able to balance his social life and responsibilities.

But by not ever stopping to LISTEN to why Dick felt the way he did and was initially opposed to rejoining the Titans....Wally overlooked one crucial fact: He isn’t Dick.

And more important, his view of the past wasn’t Dick’s view of the past.

Wally was a lot more capable of viewing the Titans as not just a family, but an inherent social life, a hangout, a kind of club....because that’s what it had always been to him.

But he’d never been the leader.

Throughout all their childhoods, the whole time the Titans WERE all of the above, and relatively light-hearted in comparison to their older selves....Dick STILL had the weight of responsibilities that none of the others had by virtue of just...not being the leader. Ultimately, all of their lives were in HIS hands. He was the one calling the shots. The buck stopped with him.

And this is precisely WHY Dick had gotten to the point he had in adulthood. It wasn’t because he’d changed. It wasn’t because he’d stopped figuring out what he needed and how to take care of himself. Its because the position he’d ALWAYS been in as leader....has WEIGHT. That eventually added up more and more and weighed him down. A huge part of the reason Dick had ended up leaving the Titans in the first place, before they disbanded prior to the 1999 revival....is because of the sheer WEIGHT of all the deaths and misfortunes that had befallen the Titans....and how much he and he alone struggled with it in ways the others didn’t....because they didn’t have to. It hadn’t been their plans, their calls, their RESPONSIBILITY to find a way the others could have all made it out alive or at least less traumatized.

So.....of COURSE Dick said no when Wally first proposed restarting the Titans, before Wally defaulted to using his own membership as a lure to get Dick to agree.....because......nothing about the above paragraph had changed, via Wally’s ‘plan.’ It wasn’t because Dick just didn’t KNOW how to be a fully rounded person....it was because nobody was helping him find actual OPTIONS for doing that....that didn’t just double as MORE responsibilities! Because that’s exactly what ended up happening! Dick wound up the leader of the Titans again, just as responsible and just as invested as always.....just like he always knew he would....and also as he knew would happen...Wally ended up quitting not long into it and persuading Jessie Quick to step in as his replacement....aka just one more person for Dick to worry about when it wasn’t like he was going to be worrying any less about Wally, just now he wasn’t going to have Wally there to even POTENTIALLY be able to support him when tragedy inevitably struck because they’re freaking superheroes....and instead he’d just have another person looking to him for the answers but with no reason or chance of being the support Dick could ACTUALLY use at times like that!

Wally’s manipulations circumvented Dick’s opinion that no, actually he knew what was best for him and it wasn’t what Wally was suggesting....without actually accounting for the fact that hey, Dick might actually know that. And in the end, Wally got the result he was after, he got to feel that he’d HELPED his friend....which again, this isn’t WRONG to WANT to....but Dick didn’t...exactly....benefit from this. It wasn’t actually in his best interests ultimately.

I mean...see Donna’s death for details.

And in the aftermath of THAT....Roy essentially did exactly what Wally did....just in REVERSE! Roy got Dick to agree to lead the Outsiders, to shoulder responsibility once again....by promising that Dick WOULDN’T have to view them as family. And did Dick go too far and end up TOO uncaring about their welfare? Yup! No disagreements there! Problem is though....he only ended UP in that situation because yet again a friend thought they KNEW the solution to what Dick needed.....only for Dick to end up essentially punished and further self-blaming....just for doing exactly what Roy had told him TO do, with this particular team. Again - Roy hadn’t EXPECTED Dick to take it this far. But that’s the whole point! Roy had expectations about what Dick would ACTUALLY end up doing, that didn’t match up to the pitch Roy actually gave Dick to GET his agreement.....because Roy all along was of the assumption that by virtue of being Dick Grayson, he wouldn’t be ABLE to avoid connecting with these new teammates and viewing them as family, and thus he’d end up ‘snapping out of it’ with it being the funk he’d been in since Donna’s death.

Roy’s intentions might have been noble, once again.....but his methods stuck to the same pattern of people around Dick believing they knew what he needed or knew who he was or knew what it meant to BE Dick Grayson....better than Dick actually did...particularly when Dick said no, this isn’t what I need or this isn’t a good idea or just...I don’t want to do this.

And in the end....its Dick who ended up paying the price for it, as well as the people who got hurt because of his INTENTIONAL emotional distance.....because the ‘view all surrounding people as new surrogate family’ aspect of the Dick Grayson Experience hadn’t kicked in as Roy thought inevitably would....but the ‘view all this as directly my fault and suffer guilt for it forevermore’ aspect of the Dick Grayson Experience most certainly did! Not at all actually helped along by the fact that like....Roy also expressed frustration with Dick that like.....Dick hadn’t actually responded to Roy’s intended manipulation of his emotions the way Roy had expected him to when he EXPRESSLY TOLD DICK TO BEHAVE THE WAY THAT DICK ULTIMATELY BEHAVED. (Just, he didn’t tell Dick to dial that all the way up to Extra, but given that’s the only setting Dick does ANYTHING at, I feel its a possible outcome Roy should have at least considered. I mean, wasn’t the whole point that you know Dick Grayson better than he knows himself?)

But lo, I am salty.

LMAO, but I mean, you get it right? Obviously, I LIKE Wally and Roy. I LIKE Jason, etc. I’m not saying all of this to be like ugh how dare these characters do all this to Dick....I’m saying it because like.....they all keep falling into the same patterns of making a big fuss and acknowledgment of how much Dick prioritizes being able and free to make his own choices and decide what’s best for him and what HE wants.....

But without ever like....actively asking him AT THE RELEVANT TIME....what he thinks and feels about all this. What he thinks and feels he needs. What he ACTUALLY wants from them, or why he’s ACTUALLY saying no to something and maybe it being for reasons that aren’t just him inherently being stubborn and self-destructive.

And instead just defaulting to falling back on whatever he might have said or expressed in an entirely different context at an entirely different time.....and saying okay, by doing so, we are abiding by his wishes and thus doing what he wants and respecting his right to make his own choices.....

But ONLY when doing all of the above just so happens to align with these other characters then getting to do the thing or take the approach they’re already predisposed towards wanting to take because of their OWN self-interests at the same time.

With this never actually coming into play when respecting Dick’s wishes aligns with them taking actions they DON’T personally want to undertake, because it makes them uncomfy or they think its a bad call, even if it is something that should be his call to make.

Like....the pattern. It very much exists. And abounds. Like I could cite examples allllllllllll the way up to Ric Grayson, where Bruce respected RIC’S wishes to be left alone and not interfere in his life no matter what.....in ways Bruce almost never respects Dick’s actual expressed wish for Bruce to butt out of matters when Bruce is actually quite keen on meddling and would very much like to....

But notice how the other thing about the Ric Grayson storyline is that Ric’s expressed desire to stay the fuck out of vigilantism and superhero work, like.....just so happens to align with Bruce’s longstanding desire for Dick to like...get out of the vigilantism and superhero work? With butting out of Ric’s life and respecting his privacy in ways Dick has to FIGHT him for, like......absolutely the optimal action to take in order to allow this expressed desire of Ric’s to flourish in the ways Bruce always wished would kick in for Dick?

.....just saying. 

The pattern. It abounds.

And the key to breaking any pattern, of course, is to first recognize....and acknowledge....that it exists.

Otherwise you tend to fall into the trap of repeating and perpetuating it over and over without even realizing it, simply because its what’s familiar.

This has been A Post by Me. Thank you and have a nice day. Or don’t. Idk. I’m not the boss of you. Whatever.

[sheryl-lee]

i’ve seen a lot of ppl complain that eddie’s death is like bury your gays or that it’s homophobic because he was a queer coded character who dies. and as a queer person i honestly find it a little upsetting because this doesn’t compare to instances of actual queer characters being killed off (usually in homophobic ways) headcanons are totally valid but at the end of the day eddie is not a canonically queer character

YES this is exactly what i was talking about in another ask. it's totally great that people relate/identify to eddie, and headcanoning is valid, but it's not at all a case of bury your gays, not even close. taking it to that extreme is a slippery slope; it's creating this false perception and rewriting the events of the show to fit that perception. so many queer characters have been k*lled in horrific ways, in a way that did not fit in the narrative, and most notably when those characters still had potential to do more. and while it's fine to debate whether or not eddie as a character deserved more time on the show, i think it's wrong for people to go so far as to boldly claim something that is canonically untrue. and as someone who identifies as bi i completely get why that's upsetting to you, it rubs me the wrong way, too. some people in fandoms refuse to see things in a nuanced manner, and i think that's part of the problem here. a character can be queer coded, but should be treated as such. they are not canonically queer, and acting like they are undermines canonically queer characters (in this case, characters like robin and will who viewers are attached to and have so much that can be explored).