#the duffers have said not everyone’s gonna be happy with how it ends

[mikesbasementbeets]

thinking about “endgame” ships and the fact that even most bylers completely take for granted that every “canon” ship other than the One (you know the one) they don’t like is going to end the show in a happy relationship together… the more i look at them the less likely it seems to me that Any of them other than byler Should actually end up together

[turkeycalamitybff]

on my stranger things bullshit again anyway

Holly being a major character this time???? I’ve got SO many things to say about that. Because she’s been foreshadowed to understand more than she’s letting on this ENTIRE TIME. Like I’ve seen no one talk about this but Holly def knows more than she’s letting on. And we’ve been shown that for so long. Look at season three episode seven “The Bite” around 2:50. When the other Wheelers are on the Ferris wheel Holly sees the trees moving, (the mindflayer) and comments on it. Like!!!! She has been in so many background scenes commenting to Karen about things from the upside down. And in season one she is the first one to see the “messages” from Will and the pressing on the wall. Will and Holly are TOTALLY connected. I was genuinely confused when she didn’t get a bigger role in season four but now it makes sense.

Will is what started the series but Holly will end it. And the Duffers legit said that they were paralleling season one (going back to those groups) so wouldn’t it make sense for ANOTHER CHILD CONNECTED TO MIKE WHEELER (who has been intimately connected to the plot each season I feel like) to go missing??? This is the WHEELERS season and no one can convince me otherwise. It’s all about learning that it’s good to be different. It’s about the WHEELER family learning that.

and it helps Karen get involved! Because in all the scenes Holly shows Karen something she could’ve just seen it herself. Holly was, objectively, a character that didn’t have to exist before now. But she does BECAUSE SHE IS CONNECTED TO THE UPSIDE DOWN. My guess is that she is heavily paralleled to Will this season (the title of chapter two one of the biggest examples) and is going to be the main catalyst and I for one am HERE FOR IT.

Will is the main character this season but the Wheelers are the ones who create the plot.

in general the Wheelers have always seemed to be huge. When the Cali gang gets back it would make sense for El to be at the front, correct? Or will? But no, Mike the one “leading the charge” it looks like. He really is the heart. When his sister goes missing?? Oh it’s over for Vecna.

also manifesting a scene after Holly goes missing for Mike to have a mental breakdown about the similarities to when Will was missing and Wills like so confused??? Like Dustin and Lucas see it too and they tell Will about how insane he went and Wills just. Shocked.

also manifesting a scene for the party (or everyone) where they find out what happened at the quarry with Troy in season one bc that was so built up? (Scene where hopper says that for someone to jump off was a death sentence) and then NOTHING happened and I need it to be addressed. Like maybe something similar happens and Dustin comments on it, and everyone finds out?? Just in general I can see how losing his younger sister could lead to Mike nearly committing suicide (that boy is SO depressed, Jesus) also I know this probably actually means nothing but I’ve always thought Holly was getting a bigger role since I saw the episode title “Holly, Jolly” like idk? It always seemed so weird to me and I always thought “oh hollys going to get bigger” and she never did? Also idk the episode title is just plain weird. Like I understand it’s like a play on the Christmas lights and ironic cause no one is happy but what always gets me is the comma. Like I would’ve thought they would’ve named it “Holly Jolly” which in my opinion makes more sense and is more continuos. Plus it wouldn’t bring Holly to mind as much and wouldn’t foreshadow her being part of it. BUT MAYBE they are going to parallel that episode and I won’t be crazy but who knows even. This last paragraph is me ranting.

tl;dr Holly and the Wheelers have been foreshadowed since season one to play a bigger role and to be connected to the upside down and we’re gonna see it in st 5.

[foreverautumn89]

I'm so angry!!! We all saw the casting thing, but did you notice the part about NO SCRIPTED LINES FOR WILL AND JONATHAN> Cause I didn't. Not until now.

::RANT::

I was really looking forward to seeing Mike, Jonathan, and Will interacting as kids. But nope. Once again Jonathan and Will are just made to be part of the background.

I'm not just mad about this. This is just the latest in a long line of the Duffers doing this. I'm mad about years worth of them pulling this crap. And I do realize I'm probably over reacting to this because it might just be a small scene, but thats not the point. Its not just about this its about everything. The whole show. Its been years of them doing this type of stuff - Jonathan and Will getting no lines or no screentime. I've internalized this anger for too long and now I can't anymore. It may be coming out at the wrong time. But its got to come out. I'm tired of this happening.

And just so there is no misunderstanding no I'm not complaining about Mike in any way this has nothing to do with Mike-I'm complaining about the writers. It's about how the writers always screw over Jonathan and Will and give them less to do than everyone else and how they're just in the background most of the time. How Jonathan and Will are more for 'filler' than actually giving them a big part. They're not even main characters anymore.

The reason I kept watching this show after S1 was because I wanted to see more of Jonathan and Will and the two of them together and we only got crumbs of that for the last 3 seasons!!!

Just to remind you: This show used to be about the Byers and their family and they were the main focus. Jonathan and Will are constantly pushed to the back and ignored now. Its been going on for years. I'm so sick of it. There is so much wasted potential with Jonathan and Will. They should have a lot more screentime and bigger storylines and a bigger role. Jonathan should have had his own storyline and they should have explored both those characters a lot more and shown the duo together a lot more.

Now its the end of the show and its too late. And I got my hopes up with this. I got all excited about tiny Jonathan, Will, and Mike moments. imagining what it could be and so happy to see them together as kids ext and ofc the Duffers let me down AGAIN. Very misleading.

I'm more mad at myself for getting my hopes up when I should know better by now. Jonathan gets 5m of screentime a season I should have known better.

I'm just sick of Jonathan and Will being buried and pushed to the back and/or treated like props. Yes it looks like Will is getting a bigger role this season, but I'm gonna learn my lesson from all the stuff I've said above and stop getting my hopes up. Stop thinking that oh this is gonna be really good we're gonna get to see more of Will and Jonathan-nope I got to stop thinking like that and I'm going to be very disappointed again. I'm going to expect there to be no scenes of Will and Jonathan so that way when there is no scenes of them.... I won't be disappointed then. I'll be expecting it.

I can't wait for this show to be over so I can stop getting all excited before every season about seeing more Jonathan/Will/Jonathan and Will scenes-- just to be let down every single time because it turns out they were barely in the season or in the background of someone elses storyline not getting to say or do anything.

They always make it appear as if Jonathan and Will are gonna get a big part each season and then its just crumbs.

Last season, a whole episode went by without them in it at all.

[loverslakes]

nothing pisses me off more than them saying that bylers don’t consider mike’s feelings or happiness at all, only treating him as a tool for will’s happy ending.

because like???? that’s just not true *mike voice*

ever since s2, they’ve written will’s character as offering mike exactly what he’s looking for/needs/wants.

the duffers (+finn) said it best: in s2 mike felt like a loner, he felt like he didn’t really have a place after the trauma of s1. mike was having trouble moving on, and so was will, and they were drawn to each other, will becoming a safe place for mike, will giving mike a purpose.

in s3, mike was immersed in dating el, and had given up on some hobbies he used to enjoy. he’s very focused on being “right” for el, eager to listen to lucas and follow the status quo on how boyfriends and girlfriends are supposed to act. many of the things he denied in the fight with will were contradicted later on:

“we’re not kids anymore.” —> getting giddy about opening and playing with new presents at christmas time but then being kinda embarrassed about acting like that in front of el

making will feel bad about wanting to play dnd + “what did you think? that we were just gonna sit in my basement and play games for the rest of our lives?” —> literally sits in the basement playing video games after the byers leave and joins a new dnd club, clearly so into it still

will’s response of “i guess i did, i really did” just emphasizes the fact that the things that mike actually wanted that he was suppressing for whatever reason, will wanted too, and the entire season was offering mike a safe place AGAIN for mike to be himself. mike just doesn’t accept it in time.

and in s4, mike feels insecure, unworthy of love, and unsure of where his identity is if el doesn’t need him. and will’s response is basically “i hear you, understand you, here’s everything good about you, i’m so lost without you, you inspire everyone around you, and you’ll always be needed by me because i love you.” will’s feelings for mike made mike feel so validated and loved. regardless of what mike thought will meant, it’s canon that again, will is offering exactly what mike needs and desires.

like yes, canonically will byers being in a relationship with mike would obviously be his happy ending. but on mike’s side it is VERY fleshed out, don’t forget that please and thank you love you bye

[noahschnappinfs]

Season 5 is going to be so mfing insane when it comes to Will’s role because I think there are going to be a lot of parallels between Will as a character and Noah himself.

While I don’t think Noah hates himself, there is probably a lot of pain he is experiencing that makes him feel responsible for the hate that is being spewed at the show, putting other cast-members in a position that puts their career and livelihood at risk. If he hadn’t said anything, regardless of Brett or other cast-members still supporting Israel, it wouldn’t have gone to this extreme. They could have enjoyed this last season authentically without being terrified of their every move. It’s obvious a lot of the hate is because he’s gay, which is why despite Brett being more outspoken even now, the hate still continues to be a lot stronger for him.

Which could be similar to Will feeling a lot of responsibility for the UD and how all of this started because of him. No technically that’s not true, there is a lot of different things at play, but he’s definitely going to be a scapegoat that the community in Hawkin’s latches on to because he’s queer and the satanic panic of it all will have them pointing at him as the culprit.

And not only that, but predictably, when Will realizes that his connection might be what is allowing Henry to thrive or even survive, that he needs Will to succeed, he’s going to feel he has to put himself in danger or just outright sacrifice himself because he thinks it will be better for those around him.

I can already picture the parallels people are going to make between bullies throwing the Zombie boy name at him in this disgusted sort of vitriol, and how fucking ironic it will be in the context of people in real life bashing Noah for being a Zionist every chance they get.

Unfortunately for them, Will is going to get his happy ending, regardless of how they feel about Noah. When Will gets told by everyone around him that he’s loved and needed, along with all the other similarities between the two, it’s gonna feel like such a slap in the face to those that said he should be fired and could easily be replaced.

It will be clear as day Noah was meant to play this role, because there are just too many things at play that prove that. Whether it’s the fact he met his on-screen mom when he was still in the damn womb, or that Sadie’s performance in a play was what inspired him to go into acting, or that his own reality emulates something very similar to Will, the character he is playing, you can’t deny it’s starting to look like destiny atp.

this is such an interesting analysis. noah already said now that he’s out, he’s going to put so much more of himself into will and even before that, he mentioned how playing this character helped him accept his queerness and process his feelings. i think playing a character can be healing in some ways, i remember millie even mentioned something like that after what happened to her in her personal life, she used that energy in some scenes which helped her a lot.

i think it’s going to be really intense for him to play and for us to watch. the duffers exact words were that his storyline is the emotional arc that ties the show together so there’s going to be a lot of internal turmoil there. noah is taking it very seriously even working with acting coaches to get everything right so i’m sure it’s going to be great.

[aemiron-main]

logically I know that will and joyce can’t have their happy ending if Jonathan dies and that they Are gonna get their happy ending BUT the fact that Jon’s parentification was never really resolved & the fact that he has so many death flags is making me wonder what the duffers r gonna do with him…… like they Could go the ‘Jonathan representing parentified kids who don’t make it out and literally sacrificing all of himself until there’s nothing left’ route but then that removes a happy ending for Will and Joyce & doesn’t make sense. wondering if he’s gonna get a fake death or smthn esp because the s3 conflict with Nancy was never fully resolved either & he just sort of rolled over and said she was right when she Wasn’t fully right and how people take him for granted and how he has so much guilt and just. hhmmmmbbbm what are they Planning duffers let me in ur heads… like I talked earlier abt Henry killing him & then technically absorbing his personality and like Yeah but again it doesn’t align with a will and Joyce happy ending but also like. maybe it could Somehow bc I’m seeing some Connections between el’s ability to touch objects that belonged to people and get an idea of who they are/learn things abt them vs Henry’s ability to absorb people vs the phylactery stuff with vecna which ties into the ‘object’ side of el’s powers so I’m like. maybe he doesn’t Have to kill people to absorb them but he Does bc that’s how he is/thinks that’s the path he needs to take and how Henry himself almost works like a phylactery with how he stores peoples’ souls/essence inside of his own mind and so maybe people can be revived after he ‘absorbs’ them if the phylactery holding those souls (him) is destroyed and if the body of the victims is still physically intact enough to hold that soul (which would explain why he breaks his victims’ bones etc because then they can’t return to their bodies but if he was to kill them in a Different way which then if that applied to Jon it would tie into what I talked about earlier except Jonathan would be alive in the end and it would explain a lot of the very Henry-specific death flags around Jonathan but it can’t happen in a ‘will uses his grief to defeat Henry’ way bc it’s the power of Love that’s gonna do it so it’s like. i think it would be more that absorbing jon would weaken Henry & then Will’s love for Mike and for everyone else in his life is what helps him kill Henry/free the souls & not everyone would be revived bc some bodies are too broken but… hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm)

[steddie-fanfic-recs]

Remember What You're Looking At Is Me

by Kwills91

Rating: Explicit Archive Warning: No Archive Warnings Apply Relationship: Steve Harrington/Eddie Munson, Jonathan Byers/Nancy Wheeler, Robin Buckley/Vickie Character: Steve Harrington, Robin Buckley, Nancy Wheeler, Jonathan Byers, Argyle (Stranger Things), Vickie (Stranger Things), Dustin Henderson, Mike Wheeler, Lucas Sinclair, Maxine "Max" Mayfield, Eleven | Jane Hopper, Joyce Byers, Jim "Chief" Hopper, Will Byers, Robin Buckley's Mother, Robin Buckley's Father, Wayne Munson Additional Tags: Eddie Munson Has a Crush on Steve Harrington, Steve Harrington Needs a Hug, Bisexual Steve Harrington, Gay Eddie Munson, Slow Burn, Angst and Fluff and Smut, Mutual Pining, Steve Harrington Has a Bisexual Awakening, Smoking, Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder - PTSD, Steve Harrington Has PTSD, Panic Attacks, Psychological Trauma, Eddie Munson Lives, Because screw the Duffer brothers, Gay Panic, Hurt/Comfort, Alternate Universe - Canon Divergence, Alternate Universe - Everyone Lives/Nobody Dies, Steve Harrington is Bad at Feelings, Hurt Steve Harrington, Good Babysitter Steve Harrington, Good Babysitter Eddie Munson, Smut, BDSM, Bottom Steve Harrington, Top Eddie Munson, Found Family, past suicidal thoughts/ideation, Angst with a Happy Ending, Almost Kiss, I'm British - so is my spelling, No Beta, All The Queer Characters, Spit Kink, Period-Typical Homophobia Words: 53,964 Chapters: 19/19

Summary

“Man, I didn’t know you cared so much, Harrington.” See. Always with the jokes. His voice is hoarse, gravelly. Steve stands straight again, looking at him through the tears. He’s smirking, in that flirty way he did in the RV. “You look like shit.” Despite himself, Steve chuckles and quickly flips him the bird.

“I thought you were in a coma.” Steve says simply, tears still rolling down his face. He doesn’t know how to stop them. Feels like they’ll never stop. “I woke up this afternoon. You going to stand there all night, or you gonna come and sit down?” Eddie tilts his head towards the chair next to his bed. Steve is scared. Doesn’t want to get to close. Doesn’t want to hurt him. But he goes anyway. He drops down in the chair, struggling to look Eddie in the eyes. Settles on staring at the bed instead. Elbows propped against it, fists balled under his chin. “Yeah, you’re not looking to great yourself, you know.” Steve tries at a smile, not sure if he achieves it, but he feels Eddie brighten. Doesn’t see it. Still can’t look. “They said you patched me up good, Stevie. You saved my life.” He laughs to himself. “Who’d have thought it, eh? King Steve crying over Eddie the Freak.”

[lover-of-mine]

I always like to say that I keep my expectations low so I can be pleasantly surprised when nothing bad happens.

Whether the show ends on a good or bad note, it won't matter. It's gonna get shit anyway on the internet because people are too attached to the characters/actors and already have their "perfect endings" for them in mind. And some people hate some main characters/actors that the Duffers genuinely like and would probably give them a happy (or at least decent) ending.

When we say that Stranger Things is gonna be the next Game of Thrones, we hope that is not industry-wise, obviously. But we know for a fact that it's gonna be fandom-wise. No matter how the show ends, the fans are never gonna be happy. That is a fact, not a theory. We know it's gonna happen because we have seen it over and over again. (GoT & SPN being huge recent examples).

I can see where the other anon is coming from with the buddie/byler perspective but the thing is, buddie is about some men in their mid-thirties who have lived and seen the world. Byler is about 14-year-olds (yes they were 14 in s4) who don't know much about life or the world outside of their conservative small town. Byler, Mileven, Lumax, Jancy, etc they're cute and interesting as a high school relationship but not as a forever pair. Those kids need to live their lives.

I'm the same age as you, I'm also only interested in Joyce/Hopper (who again, had a thing in high school but got together later in life after living their lives). I know it's complicated to understand and maybe we're not explaining it correctly but those kids need to live their lives!

Sorry for the rant. Glad we agree on so many things tho <3

- Bad Love Triangles Anon.

Oh yeah, I'm with you, with the amount of time between seasons, everyone has their idea of what the ending should look like and the fandom won't like anything they do if it doesn't align perfectly with the idea they came up with, so it's gonna be a shit show no matter what happens, especially, because like you said, the Duffers have preferences within the characters and will favor them and those don't align with fandom preferences. I would rather be surprised by s5 because I let myself get hyped for s4 part 2 and it was extremely underwhelming, so I'm just keeping my expectations as low as possible because if it sucks I'm not disappointed, and if it's good I'll be surprised in a good way. And yeah, the relationships are interesting in a school setting, but if you make them a forever thing, things get complicated, they are very young, very traumatized, and need to learn that there's more to life than fighting for their lives and Hawkins before settling down. Joice and Hop need to get married asap tho kspskspakapakpaa

[enamouredless]

(I sent this yesterday after my first ask but I don't think you got it, my wifi was bad.) No I get it, I agree that just because actors speak positively or lightheartedly about it, doesn't mean byler is endgame / Will gets a perfect happy ending. I know everyone always says "Don't compare them to other shows/ships" but. It really truly would not be the first time something like this happened and I would be extremely disappointed but not that surprised. Imo, giving a tragic character a tragic (or just meh) ending is bad, but the duffers might think it's peak television. Or maybe they are the kind of people who think Will not getting the guy is "just realistic". And actors could just say what they're told to, what fits the current vibe or whatever. Idk. I won't know until I have seen s5 myself. Byler and happy Will make narrative sense to me but that doesn't really mean much. I'm v curious about all your predictions now, what do you think is most likely gonna happen to everyone?

I honestly can't be certain about anything, tbh I try not to think too much abt S5 bc if I do I'll set expectations for myself that'll never end up happening lmao but if I'm talking in a positive the best I can see realistically go down is some sort of weird ambiguous gay ending? think something like Sam and Frodo.. in a more negative way I feel like all the events of these season do matter whether we like them or not, the lie abt the painting is going to be revealed and just like will said at rinkomania when mike finds out abt it he's gonna be mad and they'll def argue (the only good thing I can hope out of this is will getting the last word in an argument for once lol) like.. I'm not sure how big of a storyline this will be, I can definitely see vecna trying to use this all for his advantage to try to get will on his side, and honestly? If he's in a bad state emotionally I can see him being persuaded, ''my life started the day we find you in the woods'' remember? Vecna is definitely bringing that back lmao

I feel like this whole season was just building up ammunition to try to get will to break or snap or something next season(and I'm soooo not looking forward to seeing this tbh this season was already enough angst to last me a lifetime) but like despite all of this, Im like 100% that henry and will are meant to be character foils of each other, so whatever happens I think will end up going against him bc at the end of the day o don't think the duffers spent 4 seasons showing how selfless and kind will is to just end up straight up turning him into a villain, also how homophobic that would be....

Also m*leven side note I have no idea what's in store for them, idk how a love confession led by a lie is meant to be a good thing for them (and not any lie btw, wills feelings disguised as elevens) in my head this is something that should doom the entire relationship + the fact that max died during the monologue (just like Nancy and barb) but in reality the only thing this will do is just something to set up some conflict for them for the season just so they have something to argue about before they end up getting back together towards the end of the season like they always do... there's also the weird looming idea of marriage that makes my skin crawl but as much as I hate it I feel like it might be an actual possibility 😐 like I'm soooo serious if this happens I'm not watching S5 at all

There's more stuff that I think that might happen in s5 especially with all the time references they have been making throughout the show but if I get into that this answer will be 500 pages long so I'll also expect to be something time related, maybe even time manipulation especially related to will, I can also see vecna try to give him the opportunity to go back so none of this would've happened and he could've been able to live a normal life but will like the angel he is would tell him no and to fuck off, but this is more leaning into a full on theory based on nothing so idk what's the likelihood of it happening lol, thanks for the ask btw!!

[strangeswift]

the party throws will a surprise b-day party, how does it go?

Hello the iconic cake anon!!

This is so cute sorry I took so long to answer

So I'm picturing post S5 here. Jonathan comes to visit from college. Jonathan, El, and Mike are the primary party planners.

El and Mike argue over details. "I think I would know what he likes, Mike. He's my brother." "Okay well he's my boyfriend. And I had him first." And Jonathan is just like... "Do you really think Will is gonna care that much about the color of the streamers..."

They do it at the Byers house, Joyce takes Will with her to run errands to give the party time to set up. They definitely make a homemade banner like Dustin’s sign s3.

They do the classic everyone hiding and popping out from behind furniture and yelling "Surprise!" Will is really happy to see everyone and he is excited, but he doesn't quite know how to react, so he just says, "Thanks" and laughs nervously, until El runs up to him and hugs him and he relaxes.

They watch movies and play games and have pizza. I'm stealing what @ratt-duffer said about Dustin and Lucas baking the cake, because that's so correct. Dustin being a baker is so personal to me. He literally grew up baking with his mom, sorry that's canon I've said this and I stand by it. I think they bake a chocolate cake and try to decorate it with their DnD characters but it ends up looking like four icing stick figures. Will still loves it.

The whole party is there, plus obviously Joyce, Jonathan, and Hopper. Nancy's there too she's also visiting.

Jonathan takes photos the entire time. Lucas, Dustin, El, Will, and Nancy are all happy to have their picture taken. Mike, Max, Hopper, and Joyce all shy away from the camera. If you even care. But Jonathan gets good pictures of everyone and Will treasures the photos, especially the ones of him and Mike.

Speaking of Mike. Time to Bylerify this headcanon. He gets Will a sketchbook, but on the first page he writes a really heartfelt note, so Will can look at it every time he opens the sketchbook. He gives it to Will privately though.

Also Mike is clingy as always and everyone keeps telling him to stop hogging the birthday boy.

The end.

[demadogs]

if byler is confirmed by episode 8/9, then what would you want to have in store for them for season 5? I think it's endgame myself but personally I have no idea what to think about what's gonna happen to them in the last season!

i’ll give you two answers (and then an answer to something you didnt even ask) bc im not sure if by confirmed you mean to the audience or to mike and will.

if they both establish their feelings to each other in volume 2 then i think next season will be them dating in secret but will wants to come out to everyone and mike doesnt. they might get in a fight about it. i think mike has way more internalized homophobia than will ever did and the idea of people knowing really scares him. in the first episode when they reunite again i think they’ll be all cute and happy in private and then will asks “are we telling them this time” and mike clearly gets anxious and will might say something like “you said next time we see each other you’d be ready” and mike denies it or something.

i also think dustin might be on to them and a little side story will be dustin talking to lucas about it and lucas wouldnt believe him at all but dustin totally does. i also hope mike has a wholesome coming out moment with nancy. i just would love to see that. but overall i think next season would be them dating but mikes struggle with being openly himself might make their relationship a little rocky. but will knows its not his fault so it doesnt lead to any huge fight or break up or anything. its just hard that theyre not on the same page with that.

if mike and wills feelings are confirmed to the audience in volume 2 but not to each other then i think next season will be painful mutual pining that neither recognize or act on because theyre both scared the other doesnt feel the same way. i think they might figure it out halfway through the season because if they saved it to the end there wouldnt be much room to show their coming out. honestly i think if this is the case i think people might find out accidentally because 1) i dont want them to just jump right into coming out with just a couple scenes and not express how serious that moment is to them and 2) i dont think mike would be ready to come out immediately after starting to date will.

it would make a lot more sense for them to establish their feelings to each other at the end of this season but im honestly not sure they will because they havent shown that much of mikes feelings. nothing they showed indicated that he doesnt have feelings for him, but what they did show was very subtle and when i have conversations with stranger things fans that love the show but dont follow up with theories or cast interviews as heavily, they all have never even considered mike being gay. most know that will likes mike but they dont suspect mike likes will. and i know thats probably what the duffers were going for but honestly i dont think it was the best move because now i think if they push it all in volume 2 it’ll feel to casual fans like it came out of nowhere. they should have implied it the way they implied nancy and steve getting back together.

though i do think thats what theyre doing based on everything the cast and crew has said. the duffers said finn plays a more emotional mike this season. we havent seen much emotion from mike at all, at least none that i would describe as more emotional than previous seasons, so that means that he’ll be a lot more emotional in volume 2. finn has said multiple times that mike learns a lot about himself and how he sees his relationships with people so i think he does figure out he’s gay and likes will but im not sure about him confessing to will.

from what we’ve seen already it would make more sense for mike to just realize his feelings this season but not admit it to will, but when you consider what that would lead to next season and how they would have to kinda rush their coming out, it makes more sense for them to get together this season. theres pros and cons to each.

i ended up answering lots of questions you didnt even ask but i just wanted to talk about that cuz i dont see a lot of people debating whether the characters will confirm it to each other or if theyll just confirm it to the audience this season. but yeah thats what i think will happen next season with mike and will in either scenario.

[luvingspence]

stranger things volume 2 spoilers!!

i am mourning and will never recover.

eddie munson, my beloved, you were too good for hawkins. the fact that he is gonna be remembered as a murderous cult leader and not the good, funny, heroic guy that he was actually kills me STOP </3

also lucas screaming ‘erica help!’ killed me :( the way his voice just broke, i love him so much he’s too good for this world!!! and max? don’t get me started i was literally screaming and crying

and WILL?? will is totally in love with mike and it hurts me. will talking about being different takes us right back to season one where joyce was talking to hopper about why will was being bullied and it’s so sad. he was literally telling mike everything about how he felt in that car but instead of saying it himself, he was saying it through giving mike advice in regards to eleven. my poor baby :(

dustin? that poor boy, whenever he said he’s gonna take care of everyone when eddie was gone, that must have been the hardest thing for him, i’m just glad he still has steve alive :(

and SPEAKING OF STEVE, i hated the nancy and steve tension. it ruins character development? i love nancy to bits but she was not good to steve and he was not good to her, a huge part of the pivotal points of their characters (especially for steve) was their relationship ending and the duffer brothers tried to bring it back for what😭😭

HOPPER AND EL REUNION! BEST PART!!!!

the ending though? CMON LET THEM BE HAPPY

overall, i thoroughly enjoyed it!!!!

especially jason dying <3

[hawkinsschoolcounselor]

Hi,i have this doubt. The duffers said the ending of st5 will be emotional,that some co producers cried knowing the ending and they can’t satisfy everyone with the ending.. what do you think this means? This statements scream to me that someone is gonna die,what do you think?

I don't think it means anyone has to die. As far as I can recall, these statements were not made together.

Yes, the ending will be emotional. That's almost a given. The Netflix people crying doesn't have to mean it's sad, though. People also cry because something is tremendously beautiful. It would fit with what David Harbour said a long time ago, that this ending is beautiful and a long time coming.

That said, there is still potential for death. However, the Duffers seem reluctant to be needlessly cruel to their characters. They only kill off someone if it makes narrative sense to them. Eddie, for example, had no real opportunity for a happy ending with the entire town thinking he's a murderous cult leader. Even if he survived, he would have been arrested or forced to live in hiding. The Duffers cited this as a reason they killed him off.

It's fair to say that the fans won't all be happy with the ending. It's simply a fact of life that you can't please everybody. With shipping being a very active part of the fanbase, it would simply be impossible for them (us?) to all be happy. Many of these ships are mutually exclusive, after all.

There's also the matter of characters who fans latch onto who they perhaps shouldn't. Look at the responses to Eddie or Billy dying. Billy wasn't an admirable character, and Eddie was apparently never intended to go beyond season 4, but fans latched onto both of them, and they continue to try and justify theories for them to return. Those fans, to some extent, are not pleased. If we see any casualties among the cast next season, there will be upset people. The Duffers are merely saying that they can't take that into account when writing. They know how they want this story to go, and they want to stay true to their overall vision. They've made changes on the fly when they made sense, but only because it still fit into what they wanted to do.

Someone may die, but it will only be because the Duffers think it fits the story. Personally, I just hope they don't think El or Will need to die to conclude their arcs. Both of them have suffered immensely, and they deserve to come out on the other side of that pain victorious. After a story of continuing pain, trauma, and loss, I think it's important to have a message of hope and strength at the conclusion.

It's totally understandable, but I fear many of us read too much into statements like these. Sometimes we need to take a step back and get a better look at the big picture to figure out what it might mean. Sometimes we (and I include myself in this) need someone else to pull us back to get that better look.

[yournonbinaryicon]

PLEASE READ

My mom and I were having a conversation about how Will has been through a lot throughout seasons 1-4 and how we want a happy ending for him. It was going good until we started talking about his maturity. My mom talked about how he seemed to be maturing much slower than the rest of the party and how it was weird he didn’t have a gf yet. I casually slipped in the fact that Noah confirmed that he’s gay, and she seemed very surprised. And said she “had no idea” and that she was “ confused about why they would add that in there” because it takes place in the eighties. I asked her what she meant, and she said something along the lines of “ well kids in the 80s didn’t really come out. I mean, I knew my neighbor was gay. We all knew, but it took him a long time to tell anybody just because of how people were back then.” She’s not homophobic, but it made me a little upset that she would question why they would even bother putting the gay character into the show. It’s not like it’s being portrayed unrealistically, where everyone is perfect about Will’s sexuality. Anyways, this is a roundabout way of saying that sometimes the general audience won’t understand and just needs a bigger push. Praying that the duffer brothers somehow stumble across a post similar to this one, and realize that the general audience will need more evidence before fully understanding both sexuality and his love for Mike. I’m kind of sad so I’m gonna go to bed. Sorry for the long post. Re-blogging  really helps!! Follow for more and I read all the comments. Thanks loves! ❤️

[queer-coded-camaro-driver]

I have a lot of opinions about your post about st4 feeling off so I had to inbox you lmao

I agree with pretty much all of what you said!! And I feel like the not wanting to watch the entire episodes (cause I felt the exact same way) also in person had to do with them being so SO long. Like normally when the episodes a bit slow it doesn’t matter cause the whole things only 45 minutes tops but these episodes seemed to just drag on at certain points and with the season being split up the way it is there seemed to be little to no payoff.

I have hated that ever since season two ST has began splitting up the group more and more each season and as much as I love Joyce hopper and Murray their characters are stronger when interacting with the kids and I had high expectations for the Hopper in Russia parts and felt kind of let down with how it mostly just felt like a regular old pow story and had very little upside down elements until fighting the demo dogs at the end it almost just didn’t feel like stranger things and the only thing that saved the Murray Joyce parts imo is their comedic chemistry idk it felt very disconnected from the actual show

And yeah!!! The marketing made it seem at least to me that billy despite being dead was gonna be a big player this season but the only person he ever impacted was max and the rest pretended he didn’t exist!! And the duffer brothers rlly fumbled the bag with Dacre he’s such an amazing actor and has chemistry with anyone who he’s put on screen with he’s rlly a show stopper when it comes to acting and made such a huge mark on the show the past two seasons it felt off not having him in this one

YES!!! You get me.

I'm just finishing up my MA in English and this season made my degree fucking vibrate with anger. There were so many good opportunities for character growth, for the group to get closer, and for everyone to find some sort of happiness... but that would be too easy.

I'm so tired of all these shows just compounding trauma on their characters without providing any sort of emotional out for the audience. I feel like I just keep getting hit with harder and harder situations and the humorous moments aren't enough to make up for it anymore.

And, not to be Harringrove trash, but getting Steve and Nancy back together makes ZERO sense after the breakup they had. They don't even have to make Billy/Steve canon, just please don't revert to shitty "first love" tropes to keep your queer fans at bay.

Plus Jonathan is WAY more responsible and compassionate than they depicted him this season, and the inclusion of Eddie was cool but would have been way more fun if Billy was also there.

Let traumatized, queer-coded villains have some redemption. Let the metalhead boys learn to vibe together. Billy can teach Eddie not to be a coward and Eddie can help Billy chill the fuck out sometimes. And BOTH OF THEM can help protect Steve and the kids during their Upside Down shit.

I just... Season 4 made very little narrative sense. The Duffer bros and Netflix's CEO are welcome to meet me behind the nearest Arby's cause it's fisticuffs time.

[frogfaceandzombieboy]

so i’m not really into speculating about this show anymore bc all desire to do that crashed and burned after s3, but based on what i’ve seen on this site.. i do think ppl on tumblr are being a little bit ..hysterically reactive to part 2.

my thoughts below. no st extremist trolls. go somewhere else if you wanna start shit

do i think it was amazing television? absolutely not. do i think the duffers are good writers? nope. but do i think pt 2 set the characters up for the closures of their arcs for s5? yes

let’s start with el. el needed to hear mike say he loved her. it didn’t detract from her strength or abilities - to her, mike is the hero. mike is the one who saved her in s1. mike is the goodness in this world. she needed to know she was worthy (and accepted by that goodness). not just ‘the superhero’ part of her, but rather just el. now that she got that validation, she found complete inner strength. i mean she stepped in front of everybody in that last shot. that was the most on-the-nose symbolism ive ever seen. she has the determination now after getting that boost of confidence and endorsement. she has the drive to end all of this. she’s going to save everyone because she is loved for who she is.

will, my sweet precious will 🥹. this perfect lil bean is gonna get the love he deserves. his arc has clearly been set up to come back around, putting him in focus once again (he’s back in hawkins and he said nobody can escape). he’s going to help el end it all (the pic of noah in the harness, he obv levitates by vecna). so the wonder twins are gonna end it together! but el is going to sacrifice herself, like she was originally going to in s1. she’s going to repeat mike’s own words back to him, and tell him that no, she doesn’t need him (like he anxiously expressed in the past) but rather someone else does. and that someone is going to be will. will’s gonna get his happy ending.

mike has been set up to take his place as paladin once again! finally! ‘the heart’ that keeps getting emphasized. he’s going to spearhead the party to victory now that they’re all back together again.

max is going to live, but she needed to ‘die’ to absolve herself from the survivors guilt of wishing billy dead. she needed to die and get resurrected anew.

LUCAS my god LUCASSSSS and his amazingly satisfying “normal is just a raging psychopath” line. my fav line of the whole series. a privileged on-the-edge white maniac of a kid holding a black kid at gunpoint and lucas PREVAILS while that kid melts and burns into the fires of hell before our very eyes. so satisfying to watch. he’s gonna get max back and maybe he’ll even start his own basketball team 😌

jonathan and nancy are obviously going to work out their drama, or nancy will decide to go solo. but either way the whole jonathan/nancy/steve thing was just for drama’s sake. theyre gonna work out their college plans or mutually decide to lovingly go their separate ways. (i’m not that invested in their relationship but its pretty clear either way)

steve is going to realize he already has six kids, and that he doesn’t need to try so hard to be with somebody. he already has a loving family who needs him. he and dustin are going to ride off into the sunset together in a winnebago as partners in crime towards that coast in cali. and robin is gonna get her gf!

as for hop and joyce, i dont really care about their relationship (and tbh i fast forwarded and skipped all of hops scenes the whole season) but theyre very clearly gonna stay together. hop is also gonna have a second chance at letting his ‘daughter’ go when el sacrifices herself. and this time around he’ll do it proudly, implying that el healed an open wound. he’ll see his past daughter as a hero, just like he views el.

do i trust the duffers to actually execute this? or do it well? no, and i’m honestly not invested in how this show ends (unfortunately the magic of this show was killed for me in s3 but i do pick apart some things to enjoy on a surface level, like will & mike for example 😌) but these things seemed pretty obvious to me!