#sometimes I think about Frodo in lotr going ‘be careful which names you take on’ and then about sauron. and then about fae rules

[buttered-toasty]

Forging of the Ring/The Proposal/Reflections of Self

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Till death do us part? You’re not getting out of this that easily.

And with that I think I’m done with my little marriage series (as I have been calling my bigger Sauron pieces)! I will post them all together sometime. Happy Halloween and remember not to separate out parts of your soul for the making of cursed jewelry!

Bonus thing with some extra portraiture under the cut, idk

[live-laugh-legolas]

I was reading this post by @just-a-little-cellist and I was inspired to do something similar but with the fellowship

I’ve done a few more specific mental health hc’s but this is just their general relationship with mental health as opposed to how they handle others with something specific if that makes sense

Also I’m not trying to diagnose any characters; you shouldn’t make assumptions about others, these are just my hcs for some version of the characters, whether canon or not, we will never know

The Fellowship and mental health

Aragorn:

-He is very knowledgeable about different mental health disorders

-Very quick to pick up on it

-I don’t imagine him having any personal experience with any of it though

-I could imagine him having ADHD as a kid and although it doesn’t just go away he has learned to mask it incredibly well

-He has mixed thoughts on medication; he’s not against it but he personally won’t take anything

Legolas:

-I think elves are a split bunch

-Their knowledge of mental health is scattered

-Elves are not shy with feelings but I don’t imagine them having many problems when not in a time of grief

-And I think Legolas was especially sheltered from any mental health discussions

-Maybe the woodland elves are less open to the idea since I think Elrond knows everything about mental disorders

-A cultural difference I suppose

-He loves learning though so he will ask lots of questions

Gimli:

-Dwarves are not strangers to troubled mental health

-They are openly emotional and expressive

-But they don���t put names to it; the idea of disorders is not in their nature

-Like they will openly discuss having trouble but don’t tell them they have depression or something

Boromir:

-I could totally see him having anxiety that he’s learned to suppress because his father is a dickhead

-He knows about the more common disorders and is very supportive

-He doesn’t always understand and sometimes he accidentally comes across as dismissive

-I’ve mentioned before that I kinda picture him to be similar to Arthur from BBC’s Merlin (but when he learns to be a bit nicer lol)

-He’s trying his best; he needs a little patience to learn is all

Frodo:

-He reads a lot so I don’t think he’s any stranger

-I think PTSD from the events in LOTR is the first time personally experiencing neurodivergence though

-Bilbo’s definitely got a pinch of something but I couldn’t tell you what

-So he doesn’t really question anyone; he’s kinda like “well, if I meet someone quirkier than my uncle it will be a wondrous day”

Sam:

-I think he’s pretty naive to mental disorders

-Not because he doesn’t want to learn; but he just doesn’t know better

-He may be a bit judgmental at first

-Like I could imagine him making a comment like “what’s up with them?” kind of thing

-But he truly doesn’t mean to be offensive

-He doesn’t branch out much from the people and things he knows so anything new is strange

-But he will be so supportive and will never live down his own regret for saying something even slightly offensive

Merry:

-He knows every disorder, every sign and symptom, and everything to actually have the disorder

-Like this guy has read every version of the DSM

-He finds it fascinating how people’s brains work so differently

-He totally thinks he can diagnose people though; which isn’t great Merry

Pippin:

-Literally doesn’t care

-And I mean he doesn’t judge and it doesn’t change how he thinks of someone

-It’s just kinda like “yeah they do that sometimes; it’s part of their charm”

-Will stim with someone absentmindedly; he is just inherently a copy cat

Gandalf:

-Obviously he knows all the shit and doesn’t discriminate against anyone

-Violently protective if someone makes an inconsiderate, presumptuous, or offensive comment

-Gives kind advice if someone is struggling; but he won’t be overbearing or draw a lot of attention to it

-Ik for some people it is part of their identity and he respects that, but he isn’t going to make jokes or anything (like example: a majority of my friends, which isn’t a lot tbh, are autistic and I joke with them that clearly I have ✨a type✨)

———————————————————————

I personally have my own struggles and experience with my own mental health but I am not the most educated despite this. I know my own diagnoses pretty well but it’s only a small amount compared to the vast number of different disorders.

If anything in here is written in a way that is offensive please let me know; I try my best but it’s entirely possible I am blinded to certain things

Anyway love everyone and I hope you all are doing well :)

[mfelewzi]

From the Facebook profile Sauron (I don't like this name for a page with LotR as subject,but these are the ironies of the life).

Art: Mistress Lobelia by John Howe

"During the War of the Ring, Lobelia was imprisoned in Lockholes for arguing with the Chief's Men and attacking one of them with an umbrella. After finding Fredegar Bolger, Frodo finds Lobelia, old and frail. As Frodo lets her out, Lobelia is popular for the first time for bravely standing up to the Saruman's Men, receiving cheers and applause.

However, she was crushed to find out her son had been murdered whilst she was in prison. After the War of the Ring, Lobelia returns to her home village to live with the other Bracegirdles, giving Bag End to Frodo. When she died in the Spring of T.A. 3020, she gave her money to Frodo to be used to help hobbits left homeless by Saruman and her son, which deeply moved Frodo."

You know, when I speak about Redemption, It would be a thing like that: understand their mistakes and go over. And pratically, this is what happened tò Azula in The Spirit Temple's story. Yes, It could be not so enthusiast as an Adventure, expecially for a character like her, and I think that some ideas of that Fourth Season excluded by producers and authors should be take (bit clearly Di Martino will never do it), but:

-It's clearly better than Smoke and Weed (thanks @akiizayoi4869 for this name) with Azula as the fusion among Joker and Ras Al- Ghoul, and The dummy Search;

-There is a maturation, and the refuse of a bad oath.

So, Azula had acted like Lobelia, that She wasn't a Good Character and She was never loved by Tolkien's fans, but She redeemed herself, without becoming friend of Frodo.

Yes, It wasn't enough, expecially for an iconic character like Azula, but I understand that Di Martino and Konietzko love Zuko more than the other characters, and expecially the first of them sees her like an opposite of ZuZu, so if he have to realize his Destiny to build the Perfect Peace of the New Age, She have to leave the place to him.

Eh, I think that Di Martino, Who desires so much to become a Great Author, had Lost his possibility some years ago. And no new books that are written by other people will change his failure, no care how are written good and if he place his name to the side of the real writers.

The Classicals has more power than we think, and they could help us to understand themselves, our places and sometimes our new stories. If we try to hear them.

[senadimell]

Boromir for the character ask?

send me a character and i’ll list:

favorite thing about them: Honestly? His focus. He's a problem-solver. He focuses on whatever task is in front of him, and while he's the golden child, I honestly don't know if he'd be the best fit for Steward because he seems to be at his best when he's thinking about concrete solutions to discrete problems.

Oh! The other thing is that he evaluates the advice given to him for what it is, not based on the authority of the advisor. He’s not going to accept bad advice just because it comes from a trustworthy source, and he’s going to be honest about his thoughts. So he’ll trust and respect the advice of the council of Elrond, but not to the point where he doesn’t ask questions or question things that don’t make sense (I’m thinking about Caradhras here) It’s a good skill to have as the de-facto heir to Gondor, and it makes sense that he’s not in awe of elves or Gandalf and acts among them as a guest but also as an equal at least in political status, though his experience is vastly more limited.

At the same time, he’s not arrogant or haughty. He's a team player. He’s supportive of decisions for the most part, though where the ring is concerned, things get skewy. He’s not the kind of person to rub mistakes back in your face. He’s compassionate and understanding (which we see even in the way he treats Frodo as he strives for the Ring).

least favorite thing about them: Honestly Boromir doesn’t bother me in the slightest. I suppose his positive traits are also double-edged swords. Focusing more on the advice than the giver sort of has Feanor vibes? And you can see where his focus leads him when he talks to Frodo about why he wants the ring and how he would use it. He can see his corner of the world (Gondor) and his place in saving it (political, but primarily military leadership), and it’s his practicality, drive, and focus that the Ring exploits. He’s too busy thinking about what he must do to save the day that he misses the grander scheme (yet he’s doing it because he cares! he cares!).

brOTP: Um, Faramir, I guess. Though I guess it’d be kinda sweet if he’s got a brotherly relationship with Bergil. I can easily imagine Bergil hero-worshipping Boromir, and so I think it’d be sweet if Boromir did acknowledge him and know him by name.

OTP: none? look, I rarely ship and even more rarely out of canon.

nOTP: also none? Shelob? The Ring?

random headcanon: I dunno...

unpopular opinion: boromir has dark hair Sean Bean is an actor he’s not the only face

So I feel like there’s a bit of a structural problem with the LotR fandom. Characters are often written in pairs or as foils, and inevitably the comparison starts to turn towards “who’s better?” Then, if you don’t ship them, there’s a tendency to aggrandize one character’s virtues and minimize their flaws (which tends to happen everywhere), but then the comparison game starts. Because they have a paired character, the natural next step is to lionize your favorite by de-emphasizing the other character’s strengths and virtues (and sometimes also highlighting their flaws). (I’m not immune to this by far, btw, and am possibly about to engage in it.)

This happen the most with Frodo and Sam, but I think you also see it in Boromir and Faramir. Because obviously, in the books, Faramir is the golden child. Not in his father’s eyes, of course, but narratively speaking. And I have mad respect for him.

Most people don’t try and diss Faramir (because frankly. it’s hard. like, what are you going to say?), but there’s a tendency to downplay the fact that Boromir is his culture’s golden child, and Faramir...isn’t. Which isn’t to say Faramir isn’t beloved by those who know him, but his strengths are not valued in the same way that Boromir’s are. Faramir knows this. And given Boromir’s attitudes discussed above (how confidently he assumes his position in the world), I can’t believe he’s the 100% supportive, loving, sensitive, protective brother that fanon depicts him as. I don’t see how he can be.

Don’t get me wrong, I do believe the brothers love each other deeply. But growing up with siblings has taught me that it’s possible to love someone and yet be deeply wounded by them due to the casual and inescapable intimacy of your relationship? You can share more inside jokes and weird stories than anyone, yet you can never get away from how deeply they know you--not your thoughts, but who you are at home and who you were when you were seven and how you acted when someone broke up with you or what you did when your parents were furious.

You also know exactly how you match up against them, because you will always exist as a unit. And because your relationship is as natural as the lens  in your eye (you can’t imagine viewing the world without it), you forget about the other as a person and just say something and don’t think about how it hurts them. You can joke about this one thing and your sibling can carry around the hurt for years and you didn’t even know. And maybe the hurt isn’t even your fault--maybe they were just sensitive and you had no way of knowing, but the hurt doesn’t go away for the lack of malice. And even best-friend siblings are capable of malice towards each other at times.

So Boromir is good at things that Faramir isn’t, and Boromir knows it. He’s probably ribbed his brother in what he thinks is a playful way about when you’re going to shape up, or do X, or do Y, or why do you do that, anyways, or do you realize that’s a little unbecoming? maybe you should stop that. You know Father’s going to think that you’re... And he doesn’t realize how those slights can add up over the years. I do think he’s said things to his peers about his brother that have ended up hurting him. No matter how pure and nice he is, that sort of thing is unavoidable, and due to his cultural upbringing I don’t actually think he’d question the appropriateness of his attitude/acceptance and glorification of martial prowess at the expense of those who don’t have it in the same degree.

I think this passage is really telling:

For on the eve of the sudden assault a dream came to my brother in a troubled sleep; and afterwards a like dream came oft to him again, and once to me. 'In that dream I thought the eastern sky grew dark and there was a growing thunder, but in the West a pale light lingered, and out of it I heard a voice, remote but clear, crying:          Seek for the Sword that was broken:          In Imladris it dwells;          There shall be counsels taken          Stronger than Morgul-spells.          There shall be shown a token          That Doom is near at hand,          For Isildur's Bane shall waken,          And the Halfling forth shall stand. Of these words we could understand little, and we spoke to our father, Denethor, Lord of Minas Tirith, wise in the lore of Gondor. This only would he say, that Imladris was of old the name among the Elves of a far northern dale, where Elrond the Halfelven dwelt, greatest of lore-masters. Therefore my brother, seeing how desperate was our need, was eager to heed  the  dream and seek for  Imladris; but since the way was full of doubt and danger, I took the journey upon myself. Loth was my father to  give  me leave, and long have I wandered by roads forgotten, seeking the house of Elrond, of which many had heard, but few knew where it lay.' 

There’s so much you can read into this. Faramir has this dream, and he has it many times. We know he’s a lover of lore and no less devoted to his kingdom than Boromir, though his love is expressed differently. He is “eager” to heed the dream. So would I if I was having prophecy dreams all the time.

But is Faramir a member of the fellowship? No. Why? Because Boromir “took it upon himself.” He wanted to do it, he thought himself the better candidate (and Faramir the worse), and he argued his way into doing it against his father’s wishes. Coupled with Denethor’s later attitude towards Boromir, I’m inclined to believe Boromir was uniquely able to obtain this quest for himself because Denethor has a soft spot for him.

I find myself inclined to disregard Boromir’s account of Faramir’s motive (”how desparate was our need”), because it sounds like he’s justifying the appropriateness of his actions.  If it’s just about the great need of the kingdom, it’s nothing personal that one brother goes and the other stays. That view implies  that Faramir’s interest in this mission is primarily utilitarian in purpose, with a little academic curiosity--that is, it’s nothing personal. Doesn’t matter who goes! Not as long as we protect the kingdom! Which...just doesn’t square with his description of Faramir having repeatedly cryptic dreams that he wants to understand. I can almost guarantee that Faramir wants to know what those dreams meant more than Boromir.

It’s a bit tragic, because ultimately Faramir was more suited for the quest than Boromir (tramping about in the wilderness doesn’t seem to be a problem, he’s also a team player, and he’s much more willing to accept the power of the Ring/not downplay its personal danger, and would be able to see it in a bigger picture beyond just Gondor). Ultimately, though, if Boromir was the one to catch Frodo in Ithillien, the story would have a veeeeeeery different ending. (Gollum would likely be dead, and I can’t imagine he’d be inclined to just. let Frodo and Sam go free.)

I kind of view their relationship as a much less antagonistic version of Agravain and Gwalchmai from Gillian Bradshaw. (Agravain is more of a jerk than I can ever imagine Boromir being, and has a wicked temper). 

Also none of this is to say that I don’t think he’s not protective of his brother.

So a lot of words to say: I don’t think the Boromir and Faramir relationship is as uwu cinnamon roll as it seems in fandom. I think they loved each other, but I think Boromir did have a tendency to take what he wanted when he thought he deserved it and not give it a second thought, even when it was at the expense of his brother. Sure, he’d defend his brother night and day, but I expect him to be a bit of a jerk, be unaware of the extent of his behavior, and also see little wrong with it (the ring quest seems to have crossed a line, by the way he justifies it).

Still, they do love each other deeply and genuinely. It’s just a little more conflicted.

song i associate with them: Requiem, from Dear Evan Hanson. Not a particularly creative association (and I don’t associate him with Connor at all), but his death comes as such a shock at the beginning of TTT and brings with it so many mixed feelings due to both their relationship and the circumstances of his death. Nobody’s mourning is straightforward: not Frodo, or Denethor, or Faramir, or Aragorn, or Merry, or Pippin. His absense is woven throughout TTT and even RotK, in plot and in emotion and in theme.

favorite picture of them:

Don’t really have a favorite, but this one is nice.

The Sean Bean runners-up: one, two

[katsidhe]

could you share the descriptions of the answers? I'm bad at answering these quizzes cause I always get like 3 answers that fit but in different circumstances so I like seeing all of the descriptions

Yeah sure! I too wish uquiz gave an option to see all the result descriptions... alas. 

anyway here’s a wall of text, go nuts. 

DEAN-CODED DEAN GIRL

You might just be the hero of a YA fantasy novel or an action movie, because you have Big Protag Energy. You’re self-centered and extremely giving at the same time: you expect and demand absolute loyalty, just as you provide the same. Your love can move mountains, but if you’re not careful that same love can be suffocating or controlling. You’re volatile: you’ll cut a bitch and you don’t care who knows it. You’ll kick their ass. You’ll kick their dog’s ass. You’ll kick your own ass. You have a one-liner for every occasion. Your friends like you but would describe you as “a lot.” You’re magnetic: your charisma and sheer bull-headedness mean you stand out in every room. You’re polarizing, and you know it, but that doesn’t bother you: you know you’re right, and even when you’re wrong, you’re at least entertaining. You’re very “do as I say, not as I do:” you’re a bit of a hypocrite, but, like, in a fun way.  

Holotypes include: Dean Winchester (Supernatural), Thomas Jefferson (Hamilton), Sirius Black (Harry Potter), Kathryn Janeway (Star Trek: Voyager), Katara (ATLA), Vriska Serket (Homestuck)

DEAN-CODED SAM GIRL

You are a charmer and a people-pleaser. You’re charismatic to a fault, when you want to be: whether consciously or not, you have a razor-keen sense of how others see you, and you mold yourself to expectations. You can either talk circles around most people, or you come across as so fundamentally honest that you gain everyone’s trust without trying. Your affable persona is built on a rock-solid sense of purpose. You have a steadfast, deadset fixation on your goals, which you know in your heart to be worth any cost and any sacrifice. Armed with iron conviction, you’re a rebel with a cause. Is it paranoia if they really are all out to get you? When you inevitably win, the whole world will know your name. Your strong sense of self will carry you through any hardship. Your friends look up to you, but they don’t always ��get” you. 

Holotypes include: Lucifer (Supernatural), Eponine (Les Mis), Count Olaf (A Series of Unfortunate Events), Prince Zuko (ATLA), Samwise Gamgee (LOTR), Karkat Vantas (Homestuck)

DEAN-CODED CAS GIRL 

Like all Dean-coded people, you are charming and affable, and you talk a big game. You might be the class clown or a popular athlete, or otherwise one of them cool kids, but underlying that public persona is a certain quiet idealism. You keep your strong convictions close to your heart, even when far from home or beset by strife. You’re fiercely loyal and you crave being around people, but you can see when your friends need space, and you can get along okay on your own. You’re not afraid to change your opinions if new information comes to light. Strangers find you easy to get along with: you tend to go along with the group, and you’re a team player no matter what needs to get done. Your chill-to-pull ratio is sky-high.

Holotypes include: Ahsoka (Star Wars), Meg (Supernatural), Percy Jackson (Percy Jackson), Ginny Weasley (Harry Potter), Boromir (LOTR), Jon Snow (Game of Thrones)

SAM-CODED DEAN GIRL

You come across as level headed, but you’re never more than an inch from going off the rails. Your highest values are love and personal loyalty, but you’re pragmatic about it, and you try very hard not to put unfair expectations on other people, with varying degrees of success. You spend a lot of time dealing with expectations; it’s something you either grapple with, or lean into to use to your own ends. You value your own sense of identity, but that identity can get subsumed by your loyalties. You can easily get pulled in or suborned by strong personalities. You keep secrets, both from yourself and from others. Who you want to be is at odds with how you see yourself. People meeting you for the first time might say you’re aloof. You have lots of strong opinions, but you usually keep them to yourself… unless provoked. Careful; you bite. 

Holotypes include: Mary Winchester (Supernatural), Harry Potter (Harry Potter), Aragorn (LOTR), Anakin Skywalker (Star Wars), Julian Bashir (Star Trek: Deep Space Nine), Katniss Everdeen (Hunger Games) 

SAM-CODED SAM GIRL

Gifted kid (diagnosis). You were and maybe still are an outsider, and because of that you’ve had to learn to be self-sufficient and confident in your own abilities. You’re a fiercely independent overachiever, and you’ve fought hard for every inch. Somewhere inside you is a hot, long simmering rage born from the injustice of the world, but it’s buried very deep. You’d be more than content to be alone for long periods of time. You have sometimes crippling perfectionism: if you aren’t succeeding, it’s your fault for not trying hard enough. You’ll pick every kind of intellectual fight and throw yourself into playing devil’s advocate just to improve your understanding: you see the gray areas in everything. You’re aggressively big-picture. You want to, no, you MUST change the universe, but you don’t need to take credit for it. Your few friends might describe you as callous, but you know you’re just being realistic: you’ve got a harsh, clear-eyed sense of the world. No pain, no gain, and really, if you do the math, no single individual is all that important in the grand scheme of things.  

Holotypes include: Kevin Tran (Supernatural), Jean Valjean (Les Miserables), Emperor Palpatine (Star Wars), Neville Longbottom (Harry Potter), Frodo Baggins (LOTR), Dirk Strider (Homestuck), Luke Castellan (Percy Jackson)

SAM-CODED CAS GIRL

You have a strong sense of how the world ought to be, but you have no overriding vision or big master plan: you take life day by day to fix the little things you can. You have very few close relationships, but those you have you treasure dearly. You support your few friends unconditionally, but you tend to be emotionally distant with acquaintances. You may be a bit of a pushover. You often find yourself put in the position of mediator. You loathe conflict, so you avoid it unless absolutely necessary--but once you’re truly angry, you’ll stop at nothing to see justice done. You’re a diplomat and an advocate: you are deeply idealistic, but you’re nevertheless strongly grounded in a pragmatic sense of achieving what you can. Philosophy is action, action is philosophy; you like meditation and self-improvement and have probably done at least one juice cleanse. Both friends and strangers describe you as quietly dependable. If you can’t see the trauma, the trauma can’t see you! That’s just science!

Holotypes include: Sam Winchester (Supernatural), BJ Hunnicut (M*A*S*H), Jean-Luc Picard (Star Trek: The Next Generation), Aang (ATLA), Luke Skywalker (Star Wars), Nico di Angelo (Percy Jackson)

CAS-CODED DEAN GIRL

Much of your identity is tied up in a set of core beliefs - to the point where those beliefs might be strong enough to override your identity. You’re not beholden to any outside system. If you’re comfortable serving a larger common goal, it’s because you believe in it wholeheartedly. You’re action-oriented: you act first, and think later, or possibly never. You judge your friends solely based on what they do, and you tend to hold people accountable for any unforeseen consequences of their choices. You have strong personal loyalties. You’re not at the center of your social circle, but your friends trust you implicitly and the leader of your group tends to confide in you. You don’t seek power, but you’re also not afraid of taking charge, and you may find power thrust upon you. If you do find yourself in a position of leadership, you struggle with going too far or taking your friends in an unexpected direction. Whether you’re fighting in a war or making yourself a sandwich, you go hard in the motherfuckin’ paint.

Holotypes include: Castiel (Supernatural), Javert (Les Miserables), Captain Rex (Star Wars), Kanaya Maryam (Homestuck), Worf (Star Trek), Albus Dumbledore (Harry Potter)

CAS-CODED SAM GIRL

I mean this in the nicest possible way, but you’re a bit weird. You are spacey or odd or otherwise out of step with how people think you should act, but that’s fine. It doesn’t matter what they think, because if you’re sure of one thing, it’s that you should never mold your unique identity to other people’s expectations. You live internally: you’re all about grand, world-changing concepts, whether they be philosophical, artistic, or mathematical. You are grounded in the reality that you are one person and one viewpoint among many others, but that doesn’t stop you from writing your nine-hundred page thesis on the topic you’re passionate about. You can justify just about anything by the virtue of your personal convictions arising almost entirely from within yourself. Your identity can get swept up in your big ideas. You’re easier to sway with logic than with emotion, but you don’t feel the need to confine yourself with such terms: you operate on both vibes and flowcharts. You move through the world with the assurance that you are the master of your own fate, and you are unburdened by worrying about the opinions of others. You won’t let yourself feel pinned down by one social group; you float in and out comfortably, depending on how you’re feeling. Friends and strangers describe you as “spooky.”

Holotypes include: Azazel (Supernatural), Luna Lovegood (Harry Potter), Aaron Burr (Hamilton), Princess Azula (ATLA), Yoda (Star Wars), Jadzia Dax (Star Trek: Deep Space Nine), Terezi Pyrope (Homestuck)

CAS-CODED CAS GIRL

You are chaotic and excitable. You’re swayed by the drive to explore: the greatest good is to understand the universe and your place in it. You’ve got big ideas, and you’re drawn to new experiences, but you don’t necessarily understand what’s going on. You might be a part of a bigger social machine, but that doesn’t mean you’ll be defined on its terms: you’ll self-actualize if it kills you. You identify new objects by licking them. You can see the strings of the world; what will you choose? You’ll take the reins and see where they take you. You say you’re following your own path. Your friends say you don’t know what you’re doing. Pragmatism? Never heard of her. A dream is a vision is a reality; ideas are the world writ large. You might be a prophet or a visionary. With your head in the clouds, you’re sometimes divorced from both reality and consequences. You’re usually on the outside looking in, and you don’t want to be. People think they understand you, but they definitely don’t. Your friends and enemies describe you as impulsive and mysterious. 

Holotypes include: Raphael (Supernatural), Uncle Iroh (ATLA), Draco Malfoy (Harry Potter), Data (Star Trek: The Next Generation), Obi-Wan Kenobi (Star Wars), Gandalf (LOTR)

[squidproquoclarice]

hey squid! if you're feeling like it, could i ask your thoughts on boromir? i just found out that you like lotr, and he's my fave and you're my fave!

Sure!  There was a great meta I saw on FB about Boromir (actually from @letmetellyouaboutmyfeels, small world, eh?) that essentially went with the thesis that Aragorn is the shining heroic paragon we dream of being, but Boromir is the flawed person we are, particularly as we grow older and inevitably encounter some of life’s disappointments and our own failures.   And I think that’s apt.  In a story populated with larger than life personalities, there are the more down-to-earth protagonists: namely, the hobbits and Boromir.  The hobbits are wonderful in their sensibility and humility and the illustration of “the most unlikely people are capable of being heroes”, but there’s also something in how Tolkien wrote them as somewhat childish and innocent.  I don’t mean that in a negative way, but in that there’s something naive and pure about the hobbits.  Which is part of the reason Frodo is so badly damaged by the whole quest and finds he can’t live in the world anymore, can’t go back to the Shire and live that life.  Obvious and huge parallel there to Tolkien relating the experience of combat veterans of WWI returning home and finding a dissonance with that former life, especially in the movies where the Scouring of the Shire didn’t happen to bring the reality of war to the home front, and therefore the Shire is still pristine and untouched.  But again, that’s the story rising from the experiences of young Edwardian men being thrown into an incomprehensible, scary, and violent world after a fairly idyllic life to that point.  It’s very well written, and it’s certainly relatable to more people than British men ~17-25 in 1914-1918.  But it’s only going to be deeply personal and relatable to a certain type of person about their experiencing a very sudden loss of innocence. Then you have Boromir, whom I agree is the relatable character in LotR for many of us.  Boromir has grown up in a country fallen from its former glory.  Boromir’s grown up in a country constantly under threat.  Boromir’s grown up with the weight of impossible expectations.  Boromir is afraid, and  Boromir is tired, but Boromir will fight all the same.  Boromir loves his people, loves his brother.  Boromir's a warrior, not the “wizard’s pupil” like Faramir, but his motives in fighting are still fairly pure.  Boromir knows he’s not given power as a lordly birthright, but he’s instead been entrusted with it as a caretaker, and he takes that charge seriously as the heir to the Stewardship of Gondor rather than bearing it with arrogant entitlement.

Boromir’s kind, showing the hobbits how to fight, demanding that they be given a little time to rest and absorb the loss of Gandalf.  Boromir’s eager to defend those in need, by fighting for the hobbits, by showing them how to fight, by caring about Gondor and its people, by constantly telling Fucking Asshole Denethor that Faramir has worth and talent and wants desperately only to please his dad.  Boromir falls to the Ring briefly--and who among us hasn’t made a poor choice we immediately regret?  But he makes that choice not for the lure of power for himself, but out of the idea that this will help him save those he loves.  Even his failure is generally well-intended.  And he realizes it and is horrified, and dies trying to make it right.  He even defends Merry and Pippin to the end.   Boromir falters.  Boromir doubts.  And alone of the Fellowship, Boromir dies.  And that could be taken as a sign of his weakness.  But I believe it’s a sign of his relatable human nature.  Most of us didn’t grow up in an idyllic bubble like the hobbits.  Most of us aren’t paragons and heirs to great power like Aragorn.  Most of us aren’t amazingly powerful like Gandalf, Gimli, and Legolas.  Most of us are people who grew up in some kind of uncertainty, and who have found the world is more complicated, exhausting, and disappointing than the tales would have us believe.  That even our best intents and best efforts sometimes won’t be enough.  That sometimes darkness wins a battle.  That we’re flawed and human, despite our best intents, and all we can do is own our mistakes as best we can.    He’s dying, afraid that he’s failed entirely, and his final exchange is with Aragorn, distant aloof near-elvish Aragorn who hasn’t really cared about the people of Gondor who are actually his responsibility.  Boromir has tried repeatedly to make Aragorn care, to make him love Gondor and its people as Boromir does.  And Aragorn does.  He swears that he won’t let Minas Tirith and Gondor fall into darkness.  Aragorn takes Boromir’s vambraces and wears them for the rest of the journey, openly bearing the sigil of Gondor and bearing the memory of a dear friend and Gondor’s fiercest defender. And that’s the legacy of Boromir--his absence deeply marks the Fellowship, and we see it moving pieces later with things like Aragorn’s love of Gondor, or Pippin’s offering service to Denethor and then helping Faramir.  Boromir died, he faltered when confronted with the Ring, but his life was no failure, his death no forlorn disgrace.  His memory lives on and helps his friends save the day in the end.  And Tolkien could easily have written Boromir as a boorish, selfish disgrace in this tale that’s often about larger-than-life fantasy archetypes, but he didn’t.  

He’s a deeply relatable man with fears and flaws, who loved fiercely and fought fiercely.  Who knew he was no grand hero fated to save the world, but only a man caught up in events far bigger than him, with a charge to do what he could to the best of his ability.  Who acted with as much honor as he could, and who felt his mistakes deeply.  Boromir’s an ordinary person who’s a major character in a high fantasy tale.

We admire Aragorn’s perfection, or the beyond-human abilities of Legolas, Gimli, and Gandalf.  We adore the hobbits in their earnest naivete.  But at the end of the day, especially as we get older, we relate to Boromir.  

[paragonrobits]

*deeeeep breath* 1, 2, 10, 12, 21, 22, 24 (I know you have but it'd be nice to see you talk about 'em here!), 25, 29, 43, 46, 49!

1. Books or Movies? To be honest, while i adore a lot of the visual aesthetics and inspirations of the films (taking Rohirrim’s Land Vikings to the logical extreme, Gondor’s Byzantium vibes), I have to say the books. It’s the original source material, its the books that defined the modern fantasy genre, and there is so much subtext and atmosphere that can’t be captured any adaptation so far!

2. Which character do you connect with the most? tbh I kind of really dig Gandalf’s vibe, from the little we know of him on a personal level. And while the hobbits are the most relatable characters, and I really GET frodo’s whole slow descent, i have to say it’s a toss up between Gimli and Treebeard. Gimli because he’s very relatable to me in a way i can’t quite articulate, and Treebeard’s sad note about his people’s inevitable decline and his benevolence in spite of how the world has largely forgotten him is very emotional to me.

10. Who is your OTP? Hard to say! I’m fond of Arwen/Aragorn for obvious reasons, but honestly, if there’s a ship, i probably dig it! pretty fond of a lot of brotps; among them, Eowyn and Merry, and Boromir and the collective hobbit people.

12. What unpopular opinons do you have about the movies? Honestly, Gimli gets played TOO much for laughs in the movies; he’s a fairly poetic warrior straight out of the norse Poetic Eddas and he consistently speaks in the most lyrical ways, so him being a comic relief bumbler feels a little like a disservice to him. (Granted, I still love movie Gimli, but where’s his loving speeches about the careful cultivations of a mine, eh???)

21. What is your favorite line from the movies? I have to say... Gandalf’s speech to Frodo when they discuss Bilbo’s choice to spare him. “Pity? It was pity that stopped his head. There are many, I daresay, that deserve life, and many living that deserve death. Can you give it to them? Then do not be so hasty to give judgement. For even Gollum, I think, has a part to play in all this.” (Sorry for paraphrasing!)

22. What is your favorite line from the books? While it got adapted into the movies, in a fashion, I’m very fond of Sam’s musing upon a fallen Haradrim warrior: “He was glad that he could not see the dead face. He wondered what the man's name was and where he came from; and if he was really evil of heart, or what lies or threats had led him on the long march from his home; and if he would rather have stayed there in peace.”

24. I have, certainly! I’m unsure how the earlier animated Hobbit movie factors into this (though i have a fairly clear memory of it as a kid, and the visual designs of the hobbits influenced me for a long time since), but then there’s the animated Lord of the Rings movie, by Ralph Bakshi. Hoo BOY you definitely know all about that one! Pros, the animation is genuinely experimental and intriguingly weird at times, the regular character animation is fantastic and i really love Aragorn’s grimy, ‘Kay from Sword in The Stone but brunette’ look. Cons: The animation is also experimental. Sometimes, it looks really weird. I MEAN THE BALROG. WHAT THE HELL WAS THAT ABOUT, I TELL YOU, aND WHATS GOING ON WITH THE ORCS. And poor Sam gets hit HARD With the comic bumbler button; that said, i think i would have liked to see how they handled the 3rd movie, and this movie DOES cover some things that didn’t make it into the Jackson films, such as Sauruman’s coat of many colors.

25. How has LOTR changed your life? It remains one of the most influential stories in my life, though I didn’t read it until the mvies came out; as a younger child, i found the tone of the book too difficult to readily grasp, and it wasn’t until later that I was able to do it, but it was a good thing i did; to this day, Tolkien’s writings remain a touchstone in my life, especially in terms of how people try to imitate him without considering the context of his writing, and his sub-text about the corrupting influence of power and the value in struggling against evil, even if it is hopeless, remains a big aspect of my ideas of heroic fantasy.

29. Most attractive character? Gandalf, obviously, that beard was crafted by the Valar themselves! Okay but I think Galadriel is probably my fav, both in terms of personal headcanons (i imagine her as being tall and perfectly capable of ripping foes in half), and canon implications that she is the fairest of all, sort of like an inverse fairy tale queen; she has the evil sorceress queen vibe, but is pure good.

43. “EXCUSE ME, WHO STOLE YOUR TASTE.” And then i prepare a lecture, with bullet points of interest, on the relevance lord of the rings has to the fiction genre as a whole, the symbolic elements of his work, the fact that the man made up several languages and did this story specifically to use them somewhere, the events of his life that likely influenced him and the course of story elements like Eowyn’s disgust at winning glory at the expense of her family’s lives... if they’re not bored to sleep, they will be part of the fandom. I SHALL SEE TO IT.

46. Have you seen the musical, or listened to it’s soundtrack? THERE’S A MUSICAL?! I NEED TO FIND THIS SOUNDTRACK PRONTO

49. Should more of Tolkien’s songs have been included in the movies? ABsolutely! You may assume that the songs/poems are too clunky or long-winded to be produced as good music, but from what I understand, Tolkien created them to be meant to be recited to music, in the style of the poetic tradition he was drawing from: there is a very good youtube channel called Clamavi De Profundis that does EXCELLT covers of Tolkien’s songs, that are often hauntingly beautiful to hear, and I highly recommend them. Here’s one of my personal favorites:

(the Song of Durin, if you’re not inclined to click the link without knowing which one!)

[unproduciblesmackdown]

3 6 8 9 23

3. what is your gender presentation like?

i basically go with the flow.....honestly my Fashion Sense is real simple, really just jeans and tees (usually graphique) and yeah i also like throwing in a layer actually but also, unfortunately, I’m Sweddy all the time.....sometimes i like to wear something different, usually for Particular Occasions or just in the mood.......i rarely mess around with makeup and if i do it’s just like, idk, Maybe eyeliner lip gloss eye shadow....it’s more about having fun with it though like, really i’d go wilder when i felt like it and have it be like studio killers style colors down the face, i would cover myself in body glitter for fun b/c glitter is great and everyone is cowards..........i don’t really wear a binder that often nowadays but sometimes i totally do. it’s always been a bit confusing b/c i’ve never quite been able to fully Curate my own wardrobe cuz like, originally living with parents who really cared about my Gender Presentation, and after that not quite having the time / access / funds to go all out and do a lot of clothes shopping....but yeah honestly i think the jeans/shorts/tees is pretty much My Look. also that reminds me, yeah for the past ten years i’ve been in the process of cutting my hair shorter and shorter and i like it that way. rn it’s a great undercut that i continuously maintain myself via bathroom mirror lol......i Really don’t like that much length on the back or sides. i actually Have considered shaving my head but never committed and also a) that’s even more of a pain to grow out than an undercut and you gotta maintain it all the time. so yeah what i’m down to wear really kinda involves a mix of what’s considered Men’s Fashion and Women’s Fashion, but it leans very much towards those jeans/shorts/graphic tees/ no makeup / short hair. oh and sometimes i accessorize w like, bracelets / necklaces. but only sometimes and when i’m goin out and stuff. i’m not too fancy

6. top five favorite parts of your body (n why you love them)?

hmmm.....well i’d like to thank my legs for being long, b/c i am basically a solid 5′11″ or 6ft tall. i guess my vocal cords are a part of my body and i’m a tenor and we all know that altos and tenors are the best. body hair sure has “body” in it and is def technically part of it and i’m fairly hairy, my armpits are pretty solid and i’ve got hair on my stomach / thighs / chest and, excitingly, my eyebrows are connected and i get hair on my neck too (which is a little annoying so i kinda trim it down but i don’t like to shave it off completely b/c people think it’s weird and i’m testing them) my head hair is alright but boring tho, just brown and determinedly straight. uhh legs voice hair......i get freckles, and that’s great, my favorite physical trait probably. and uhhh.......well my brain’s doing a great job, i need that to be a conscious being, and can’t actually think of a fifth thing

8. how did you pick your name?

milo sky kilopascal burrows.......well for a long time “milo” was just like, my favorite Name....i don’t have many standouts there so it was hardly a competition, i probably took conscious notice of it via milo bloom, shoutout to my puzzling through 80s comics when things like the far side’s humor is very difficult to grasp at like, age 7. my informal-but-no-seriously Middle Names so far: for a long time it was like well “milo” is the only name i Specifically Want and there’s certainly nothing Significant out there....in true nonbinary fashion (and just trans fashion in general) going for those Names Of Objects, Baby!!!!!! i kinda leaned towards wanting something science-y related, science has Great names and terms and stuff.....and ever since taking chem i always liked the phonetics of Kilopascal and that it abbreviates as kpa lol........so i was like, fuck it, let’s go with that! and Sky is not only an object name that sounds nice but is also something i like. “burrows” occurred to me last summer when i was rereading lotr, which is a fun book obv, and also i read a fair amount of the appendices, those hobbit family trees, there’s a “milo burrows” who’s a cousin or something of frodo’s on the baggins side, i was like, oh i’m already a milo, i’ll take another character reference, love for it to be from lotr, “burrows” sounds fun and there’s nothing Else of ~great significance~ that i’d pick for a last name and god knows i’m never gonna think up a better one on my own, so, there we go. oh shit and i’m remembering that milo burrows is in the main text!! in the very beginning he’s left one of those Ironic Gifts: a pen and inkwell b/c he never answers letters. me neither. what an icon

9. what does your name mean?

aha! well! see above!! but let’s go ahead and get into etymology for fun huh. “milo” is a bit uncertain, if it’s a derivation of “miles” then that seems to be linked with the latin “miles” for Soldier, but it also is possibly from “mild,” meaning, Mild, or Peaceful, which comes from the root for milling something aka making it softer / finer, “milan,” which can mean.........To Make Tender.......could also come from “milu,” meaning Merciful. “sky” i mean in the literal definition but let’s look it up. says that in old norse that mean “cloud.” well i love clouds. kilopascal natch being the prefix Kilo meaning a thousand, and pascal is the unit of pressure named for a french scientist, i believe also the same mathematician of pascal’s triangle fame? yes it is, blaise pascal. love that shit too, man these french mathematicians......i am going to look up the etymology of the french name “pascal.” aha it is in fact like an alternative of “paschal,” coming from “pascha,” aka relating to easter, which comes from the hebrew “pesach” which of course meaning passover. burrows i’m presuming is the literal verb/noun b/c like, hobbits, but let’s etymology that too..... hey it says it’s a variant of “borough” which is great b/c i’ve been like oh “burrowburough” is a great Pun......apparently possible further roots could mean “stronghold,” “fortification,” “city,” “elevation,” “to dig,” “to protect/defend/save.” all fantastic, great

23. claim something as trans culture.

honestly being valid and wise............being young and relating to characters who are girls who don’t ~perform their gender~ properly. universal kinship there, really. and bmc

[girlbookwrm]

i can’t believe i’m doing this

@jhscdood​ listen i got No Time to write the fics for this right now, but have some Fellowship of the Pod People (but not like that) Headcanons.

@ all of the rest of you, please for Eru’s sake help yourselves: literally nothing would make me happier than to have someone else write this shit so i could read it like the lazy asshole i am.

None of this will make a DAMN LICK OF SENSE if you aren’t familiar with the Not Your Mama’s ABO Clownfish AU that @silentwalrus1​ created with @skellerbvvt​ and @galwednesday​ in the Magnificently Weird MCU Stucky Gem Scents & Sensibility 

shit this got hella long don’t look at me but please all feel free to correct/expand/modify because I just whipped these off to decompress after a long day

The Númenóreans are responsible for all that “reef” “pod” and assorted “fishy” terminology, so while “pod” “reef” etc may be the accepted academic names, they’re often replaced with local variants and colloquialisms. The Númenóreans picked this linguistic quirk up from the sea-obsessed Noldor elves, so it’s sometimes used in Rivendell and Lothlorien too.

(The Sindar elves fucking hate that)

(Sindar use bee euphemisms instead. It’s all “hives” and “skeps” etc etc etc. Try to tell me Thranduil isn’t a Queen Bee. I FUCKIN DARE U. The wine is all honey mead. Hex honeycomb aesthetic for the win. Even the dungeons.)

(FYI Dwarves ALSO have a Hexagonal Aesthetic and that just Really Gets Thranduil’s Goat.)

everyone’s got their own local names for alphas and omegas too because seriously who fucking came up with that, i bet there’s a whole appendix at the end of the red book about terminology and shit

(Now I’m having meta thoughts about linguistics and there being a clownfish!Tolkien to go with the clownfish!Middle Earth. And now I’m thinking about the Inklings being a pod and if i follow THAT rabbit hole any further I’ll fu cki ng  AS C E N DHJKfghjk.)

Anyway

Men smell gross. Everyone else is agreed upon this. Unflattering comparisons to badgers and weasels have been made.

This makes “MANFLESH” 12000% more hilarious ur welcome

it’s funny cuz Men are big into perfumes. Incense! Herb Sachets! Oils and tinctures! Have you ever seen a olde tyme perfumers’ box? That kinda shit. Everyone has their Signature Smell.

but elves especially are like you still smell like man stop trying to hide it.

The Dúnedain embrace The Musk. (some have fully weaponized it)

this is very important: Aragorn Smells Amazing. (to be clear, still very Man Smelling, but awesome. first time he goes all I AM UR KING everyone in the throne room goes a little glassy eyed.)

Minas Tirith, being old, is very Old Numenorean Oceanic Aesthetic. Give me all that white stone carved to look like coral and driftwood holy shit YES. 

WHITE! TREE!! GARDEN!!! 

ATHELAS!!!! SCENTED!!!!! EVERYTHING!!!!!! (pairs well with lemon and other citrus smells.)

veering away from Gondor now

The Rohirrim stick with horse metaphors because of course they fucking do. Also, since they’re more nomadic, the entire concept of a “reef” as in a physical structure is kind of ??????? to them. So. “Reefs” = “herds” and “pods” = “bands.” 

Fresh Hay is considered to be Peak Homely Smell in Edoras. Tapestries! Only The Softest and Nicest and Most Beautifully Tooled leather! leather smells!

OH SHIT GIVE ME ALPHA-FOR-LIFE-EOWYN MEETING FOREVER!OMEGA FARAMIR *HEAVY BREATHING*

(oh shit while we’re in the neighborhood, Dúnedain Rangers tend to be solitary As, which spooks the natives like whoa, but the Ithilien Rangers are generally O, and their waterfall hideout is totes a big ole reef.)

hang on i forgot about elves

Listen, I’m not super into elves myself but I’m imagining that they are perpetually switching back and forth between A and O depending on the day — nay, the HOUR — and the extremes between A and O are much less extreme for them than other races.

Every other race finds this super weird and disturbing.

Legolas is like “hm this forest is making me feel very O.” And Aragorn and Gimli are just like ‘what’ and then suddenly Leggy smells very O too and Aragorn and Gimli are like ‘WHAT’

Feänor is the exception. He turned the dial all the way to A and broke the goddamn knob off.

Galadriel can go from Maximum Softe O to Roid Rage A in .0004 seconds. “iiiinstead of a dark lord yyYYOU WOULD HAVE A QUEEEEEEN!!!1!” and the Hobbits are literally bowled over.

Elves in general smell woody but also very ocean-y i think? Have you ever stood in a pine forest by the ocean, where you get those light, clean wood and cedar and pine smells all shot through with sea breeze? Like That.

But elves are more into visual/audio. Soft singing. Leaves moving in the breeze. The whisper of pages in a library. 

and the light. Elves are lighting wizards, they are all about that gentle starglow.

(I’m also having thoughts about the Lothlorien Elves embracing that A-ish urge to be Up High. A holdover from Galadriel’s time with the feanoreans? I'm not as up on silm lore as I should be)

but let’s get back to my happy place: 

THE MUTHAFUCKIN SHIIIIIIIIRE

Hobbits really embrace dat sweet sweet O lifestyle. good food and warm hearths. throw blankets and pillows. hugging and cuddle puddles and playing footsie. gardens. Gardens. G A R D E N S. 

“Going A” is done as rarely as possible. the transition takes about a month and Hobbits who are “going A” tend to call in sick like it’s some unsightly thing. 

Tooks have an unusually high rate of going A. Of course they do.

Bilbo has never gone A. Not! Once!

Neither has Frodo.

Sam did, after the breaking of the Fellowship. Merry and Pippin did, in Fangorn, when they grew six inches. The three of them all stayed A after that, for the most part. YES EVEN SAMWISE. it was v scandalous.

Hobbit “reefs” are called “warrens” (unless ur rich, then they’re Smials and they’re Only For Family) and their “pods” are “nests.” “Nesting” is a whole Thing.

Hobbits! Smell! Like! Baked! Goods! Not sweet but like… warm. Humans sometimes turn their noses up and call it a “yeasty” or “beery” smell but it’s usually much more a rising-bread smell. Pipeweed smoke and sweet florals make a nice contrast to the perpetual bakery window smell.

Hobbits are very mouth/taste/chew oriented. Mouthfeel is a Big Deal. Recipe Books are Heirlooms. Courting is frequently Food/Drink Oriented.

Rosie Cotton brews the finest ale in all the land and she did that for the express purpose of seducing Samwise Gamgee

He Did Not Realize.

Courting that is not food/drink oriented is Flower/Plant oriented.

Sam Gamgee became the finest gardener in all the land in the desperate hope of wooing Mr. Frodo.

He Did Not Realize.

Everyone Else Realized. Merry and Pippin especially considered it Peak Comedy.

(they eventually worked it out.)

last but not least:

there’s just no way around it. Dwarves smell like dirt. nice dirt tho! Petrichor and stone with hints of copper and metals. Smoke smells. Rich spice smells. Eau de forge is considered a particularly desirable perfume. Dwarves don’t particularly notice smell though (for reasons that will become apparent) when it comes to Softe Things they’re much more about dem sweet sweet sparklies, and fur, and being super fucking tactile.

Dwarves are SUPER into haircare, like, every night the Company of Thorin makes a braid circle and exchanges hair beads. 

(elves are also super into hair care. this too really Gets Tharanduil’s Goat)

Dwarf social structure is like… hobbits in reverse. They tend to default to A status, hence their general rowdiness but with strict codes of conduct to help manage conflict. They’re just these huge roving groups of A’s just rough-and-tumbling around their one O. dogpiles are peak pod bonding. aaaaand the alpha reek kind of tends to make them all a little noseblind.

Poor Bilbo.

Lucky, Lucky Bilbo.

But also poor, poor Bilbo.

Most dwarf Royals go O, but Thorin hadn’t been O since he was 24 and got chased out of Erebor by that pesky dragon.

Dwarf “reefs” and “pods” have their own terms in Khuzdul that do not translate well but have to do with crystal growth. Rough translations are “lattices” and “cells” (Hence the hexagon aesthetic)

Wizards Have No Designation. They Smell Like Gunpowder and Lightning. It Is Very Disturbing For Everyone Around Them.

A

N

Y

W

A

Y

Give me EveryoneLives!au Hobbit stuff. Bilbo trying to homely up the lonely mountain! Thorin going O and chilling the fuck out as a result! 

Give me fellowship!pod!! Aragorn is the diplomat! Pippin is the wild child! Gimli is the Adventurer! Frodo is the peacekeeper! Boromir is the den mother!

How Much More Heartrending is the Breaking of the Fellowship if the fellowship was a pod????

and then you’ve got the fractured podlings: Merry and Pippin bonding hard with their new Rohan and Gondor stress-pods. Sam going A to protect Frodo from Gollum while Frodo tries to adopt this weird frog into their pod. The Three Hunters as Nick, Nora and Nelson (Gimli is Nick, Leggy is Nora, Aragorn is Nelson.)

Give me post-war Legolas and Aragorn and Gimli (and Arwen too) breaking cultural boundaries and proving that yes! Interracial Pods Can Work! these differences are cultural, and cultures can be melded! nothing wrong with this! if half-elves exist and can have kids of their own, then elves and men are not separate species, and I’d bet a significant limb that the same is true of all the other races so

GIVE IT TO ME

ok i gotta stop now.

...

yeah there’s probably a star trek one of these coming too

kill me

(And hey jhscdood I’m not saying you have to come back at me with more lotr clownfish or ocean’s 11/Star Wars/M*A*S*H/Leverage/West Wing/whatever clownfish But I would certainly consider it a Fair Exchange if you did. MORE INSTITUTIONALIZED SOFTISM. MAXIMUM SOFT FISH FRIENDS.)

[margridarnauds]

📝💕🌐 for the symbols ask

💕 Your two top fave fictional characters

I’ve spent way too long in Lazare de Peyrol’s bird brain to not be attached to the idiot at this point. Also, since I did my Capstone on Bres, I’d feel remiss if I didn’t include him, though me putting him as a literary VS mythological character might very well open up a decades-long Celtic Studies Schism. (Also, since I feel guilty over not including any female characters on here, Lucy Westenra from Dracula and Morgan le Fay. I will defend both of them with my life.)

📝 Fave quote

I hate how, whenever I question like this comes up, I completely forget anything and everything I’ve ever read. 

I was going to nerd out and include Emer’s speech from The Sickbed of Cuchulain because it’s quite frankly relevant to this day and FASCINATING from the perspective of the time (being one of the FEW times in Medieval Irish lit that we really...get a woman’s perspective on being left by her husband and bitter and still in love, because in the other examples we get, namely The Wooing of Etain, the jealous wife is portrayed as a very toxic figure) but then I decided no, it was too nerdy even for me. 

So instead I took the less nerdy route and went with Lord of the Rings (though I’m committing a great heresy and using the film quote as opposed to the book because as beautiful as Tolkien’s prose was, MY GOD the man never wrote a word when ten would work): 

“It's like in the great stories Mr. Frodo, the ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were, and sometimes you didn't want to know the end, because how could the end be happy? How could the world go back to the way it was when so much bad happened? But in the end, it's only a passing thing, this shadow. Even darkness must pass. A new day will come. And when the sun shines it will shine out the clearer. Those were the stories that stayed with you. That meant something. Even if you were too small to understand why.But I think, Mr. Frodo, I do understand. I know now. Folk in those stories had lots of chances of turning back, only they didn’t. Because they were holding on to something.”

“What are we holding on to, Sam?”

"That there’s some good in this world, Mr. Frodo. And it’s worth fighting for.” 

I don’t think I fully...got this speech when I was watching LOTR for the first time as a fairly sheltered 6-7 year old and then, watching it time after time again, I think I kind of took it for granted. But taking a class on Lord of the Rings with the state of the world as it is today, seeing so many people in our generation bitter, but apathetic because “What good can I do?” it really hit home. It also shows why LOTR is so DIFFERENT from the Heroic Epics it was based off of and most of the Fantasy genre that would mindlessly copy it. Heroes like Achilles, Cuchulain, Sigurd, Beowulf, etc. are, more than anything else, concerned with #1. Or, if they’re slightly more altruistic, they give a damn for their own tribe. But, most of the time, they care about their own reputation and their own glory without really having a higher cause to serve. But, here, we see these two Hobbits, NOT the standard heroic template, about to give into despair, and the thing that brings them back is just that there’s good in the world, and even if there’s always going to be darkness, even if the world will end eventually (which....I love how fatalistic the LOTR novels are because it gives me lovely Anglo Saxon feels), even if things look scary and like there’s no possible way to survive it, it’s important to fight it because, dammit, the world’s too important to be lost to apathy. Humanity is too important to be lost to apathy. 

🌐 Languages you can speak and/or are learning. Which are you fluent in

I took two semesters of Latin Back in the Day, which translates out to me being able to understand roughly 60% of the pretentious mottos I read. I also took 3 semesters of German, which means that I can translate full songs, more or less, with a decent dictionary and many tears. I can also say “Ja” “Genau” “In Ordnung” “Danke” “Es tut mir leid” und “Hilf mir, bitte; Ich bin eine dumme Amerikanerin” (Though I’ve not given up on doing an updated sub of Friedrick: Mythos und Tragödie.) One day, I will have to do Old and Middle Irish, but they make me cry so I’m holding off on it for as long as I can. 

[quoratopstories]

What is the most pernicious and persistent myth about The Lord of the Rings that is believed by people who have seen Peter Jackson's movies but haven't read the books?

I don't know about "the most pernicious and persistent myth" but there are four which I found particularly annoying. Gandalf's weakness (though don't get me wrong Ian McKellan was perfect for the part), the changing of characters in order to create imperfection, the "need" for strong female characters, and the eagles being the fifth army.

Gandalf's weakness (and others' strength)

Gandalf's weakness in the movies is completely unnecessary and blown out of proportion. Not only is he portrayed as weaker than Saruman (when Tolkien stated many times that Gandalf THE GREY was stronger than Saruman) but Tolkien sometimes estimated him to be on the same power level as Sauron himself. There was likely no great fight between Gandalf and Saruman, and even if there had been Saruman would have been able to ambush Gandalf and Gandalf likely would not have fought back. When Gandalf fought the Balrog, it was to prevent it from taking the ring of power which was only a few hundred feet from it. When Saruman captured Gandalf, Gandalf likely could not justify breaking his order not to meet force with force, especially when he allowed himself to be captured by the necromancer centuries prior. Andrea Livo's answer to Who is stronger, Gandalf or Saruman? Andrea Livo's answer to How does Sauron's power compare to that of Gandalf? Andrea Livo's answer to If Gandalf ultimately gave in to temptation, what would he be capable of. What would he do if he took the one ring for himself?

But even if we ignore those two statements, Gandalf is portrayed as being weaker than the Witch King (a mere human) as well as weaker than Galadriel. Galadriel did indeed overthrow the evil of Dol Guldur but this was when Sauron was not present and it's defense was in the care of Kamul, second in command of the Nazgul. Of course she could overcome a human sorcerer, even one centuries old. Banishing Sauron, as she did in the movies, is an entirely different matter. Tolkien himself noted that neither Galadriel nor Elrond could overcome Sauron in a one on one fight even with the power of the ring. He even went so far as to state that ONLY Gandalf could hope to overcome Sauron if he had claimed the ring as his own. It should be noted here that a lot of Galadriel's wisdom and magic came from her time learning under Melian the Maia. Gandalf is described as being the wisest of the Maiar, which would also make him wiser than Melian, Galadriel's teacher.

Gandalf is also portrayed as being answerable to Galadriel. Galadriel was one of the leaders of the Noldor who rebelled against the Valar. Gandalf time and again throughout the books displays his loyalty to the Valar (even when it places his friends in jeopardy). He would not be answerable to an elf who rebelled against his bosses.

Don't even get me started on the "love" between Gandalf and Galadriel. The elves never even considered adultery. Their relationships were the perfect Catholic marriage. While I don't mind creative license, I do mind altering the fundamental intentions of the author.

Gandalf is an angel of Eru Iluvatar, the wisest of the Maiar, one of the strongest Maiar (he was (approximately) to Sauron what Manwe was to Morgoth), and has been around since before creation. And yet he is portrayed as weak and even ignorant in comparison to the other "wise" characters in the movies.

Characters that were made "more realistic".

One of my favorite things about the Lord of the Rings and several of Tolkien's other works was the fact that it clearly outlined black from white. While some people call this being unrealistic, I find that it is merely added to the overall feeling of fantasy. That being said there are many characters which dance close to the line between good and evil: Boromir, Gollum, and Feanor to name a few. Tolkien's tale was one of good people doing the right thing, of fighting "for the right without question or pause. To being willing to march into hell for a heavenly cause" (The Impossible Dream). It was never intended to be realistic any more than Beowulf or King Arthur. I loved how noble Aragorn was in the books, and how he knew he needed to wait until the right time to be king (none of that "I don't wanna" that we see in the movies). I loved the fact that Faramir was mentally stronger than any other man and rejected the temptation of the ring without a second thought. I loved how Gandalf could inspire everyone to find it within themselves to stand up to evil. How Denethor was actually a good ruler who had been standing in the face of defeat and extinction for far too long. And I loved how Frodo and Sam withstood a test that even a man could not pass instead of them being almost childlike and making it to Mordor purely by chance and not by strength of will. All of these changes in the movies detracted from the overall feel of Lord of the Rings.

If you want ambiguous characters and a sense of "realism" in your fantasy don't try to change something to your liking. Go read Game of Thrones. Or the Silmarillion. Skip to the section about the kinslaying.

Female characters.

I love it when a movie can pass the Bechdel test, even if it is a flawed test. But Lord of the Rings is one of a few exceptions that I make. Andrea Livo's answer to The Lord of the Rings (creative franchise): Why are there so few female characters in JRR Tolkien's works?

"Tolkien wasn't just a man created by his time period (he was actually rather forward thinking for his time), he was also writing about a story set in a Medieval society. Would it be historically accurate if he did add a ton of women fighters? No. He wasn't just writing as a man in the 20th century, he was writing as a man who was trying to copy the writing styles of the Old English/Anglo Saxon period (a time in which we only have 2, very short, poems written by women).

Éowyn was the exception, she was the model of a Viking/Scandinavian woman. These women were allowed to take on masculine roles if they wanted to (which at the time included many jobs that we now see both sexes doing). You'll note that while Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit are written with a male (Anglo Saxon) voice the Silmarillion reads more like a historical text. It is here we see the true importance of women in Middle Earth and their influence both on history and on the men around them.

While one may or may not agree with Professor Tolkien's choice, he had reasons behind every word that he wrote. On the outside it might have appeared misogynistic but it wasn't being written for a modern audience. The Lord of the Rings was not nearly as popular when it came out because of its fantasy elements. Now we complain that it was biased. But it was being written largely for himself, and for other scholars of Anglo-Saxon literature who would have appreciated it for what it was attempting (and I feel succeeded) to do."

The fact that the film makers gave Arwen more of a role than she had in the books was not terribly surprising. But I could not agree with what they did with Galadriel. Her magic was in general far more subtle in the books, and when she was truly aroused she was all the more terrible and beautiful. The film makers decided that was not enough, that they needed to throw her power in the face of audience especially in the Hobbit.

Tauriel was not only male in the books (as the Captain of the Guard) but she would have been completely unnecessary if they had remained true to the story. Thranduil was very active in the world, being the one to send Legolas to Rivendell to find out what was going on. In addition, he helped as much as he was able against the threat of Sauron, even when it was something as little as watching Gollum. Tauriel's main purpose (other than "love interest") was to serve as a voice against Thranduil's "inaction". Not only that but they completely changed what little we knew of the Captain of the Guard. The Captain of the Guard was an incompetent drunk who not only let the dwarves escape but was also likely the one who let Gollum escape 60 years later.

It also upsets me that the movies created Tauriel to serve as a love interest and not as a truly independent female character.

The Fifth Army

This is a minor issue in regards to the many sins that both trilogies committed against the books. Even many people who have read the books disagree with this one, but the fifth army was not the eagles. They did not even show up until the end, and would be considered an air force in any case. The fifth army was the wargs. Wargs, like the eagles, were an independent and intelligent race. While they could not speak like the eagles could, they had their own motives and evil goals which frequently lined up with goblins and orcs. They could be equated somewhat to Shadowfax's ancestor Felarof: they had human like intelligence but still agreed to being beast of burden to an extent. To quote the Hobbit "So began a battle that none had expected; and it was called the Battle of Five Armies, and it was very terrible. Upon one side were the Goblins and the wild Wolves, and upon the other were Elves and Men and Dwarves." In my mind the movies committed a huge sin by not only changing who the five armies were (either Men, Elves, Dwarves, Goblins, and Eagles or Men, Elves, Dwarves, Bolg's Army, and Azog's Army depending on how you look at it) but by leaving the wargs out of the battle entirely. Especially when the title of the third movie was “The Battle of the Five Armies”.

A few of the (many) other sins and myths in the movies are: the eagle's inability to talk (which spawned the huge myth that the eagles could fly the ring to Mordor), Beorn's appearance (he was a large MAN), Elven vegetarianism (they ate meat and hunted multiple times throughout LotR, the Hobbit, and the Silmarillion), that the Nazgul rode "dragons" (instead of the fell beasts in the books), that Shadowfax was white instead of grey (they still picked a gorgeous horse), Azog's existence in the Hobbit (he died almost 150 years prior), and many many more. Pick a scene from the movies. I'm sure that most of us die hard Tolkien fans could find SOMETHING wrong with it.

Read other answers by

Andrea Livo on Quora:

Where was Radagast the Brown during The Lord of the Rings?

Why is Elrond considered to be a Peredhil (Half-Elf) when he's actually not?

In The Fellowship of the Ring, why did Gandalf only pull out the bigtime magic against the Balrog? Could he have used that kind of firepower earlier to the Fellowship's benefit?

Read more answers on Quora. via Quora http://ift.tt/2jXqvEx