#seeing all the effort some ppl put into giving him a completely original name makes me feel kinda bad but

[aphel1on]

there has got to be a limit to how many times i can cry over one character

[soranis-sunshadow]

Hordak can’t catch a break even on his birthday...

Oh fandom, you really like this sort of drama don’t you? 

A few days ago, on Hordak’s birthday, there was this ‘interesting’ post in the tag – since, apparently it’s impossible to get any peace even on that day.

I was  too tired to answer it at the time after being on call the day before so, here’s my delayed answer to all of that:

First off: this post has this bit in it when asked what that person dislikes about SPOP.

 He doesn’t need to get a redemption and he doesn’t get one in the show. 

None of his actions constitute a redemption arc. The man merely acknowledged his personhood and freed himself from his master and God. That’s what his arc was about: the right to have a personal identity. 

He gave himself a name and wanted to be his own person. That’s it. That’s all he wanted.

The man was merely freed from Prime’s influence- an influence he was born into since he’s been specifically manufactured to serve as a disposable mass produced soldier and worshipper of Prime.

 If the argument that Catra was “forced” to commit crimes and thus she is not completely guilty of them since she was under duress – then the argument doubly holds for a person who has been directly programmed and conditioned to do so under the threat of death or mental rape (purification).\

Even while away from Prime, he was still conditioned to obey and brainwashed by Prime’s cult. He literally knew nothing else – he was not meant to. It’s how indoctrination works.  

Prime’s clones aren’t people to Prime, they are tools. Those clones, while cut off from Prime still want to serve and please him: That’s what Wrong Hordak’s purpose in the show is- to show us just that.

Hordak is not considered “OK”  because Entrapta likes him. Hordak is merely shown – by Entrapta that he could live apart from his cult and have worth outside what Prime tells him he has. 

Just like real life cult victims, he needs an outsider to help him see a way out of the cult. The nature of indoctrination and brainwashing makes it impossible for the brainwashed person to know they are brainwashed unless someone points it out.

Now for my favorite thing:

and

oh and

Oh boy… this makes me just so damn uncomfortable.

To offer a bit of context as to why. I have never been on social media before SPOP or in any fandom and as such, I have never encountered the ‘all men are evil’ discourse that seems to infest these places. It’s been quite a bit of culture shock for me. 

What is it that makes anyone think it is ok to judge a person because of an accident of birth? (being born male)

Why does hate for 50% of the human population get such a free pass on these platforms? Misandry is just as terrible as misogyny. You are being biased against another human because of their gender. I don’t care that males are perceived as ‘privileged’ – that doesn’t make it ok to be terrible to them unprovoked. 

How does hating all men help achieve equity?

Do you realize that this sort of discourse is exactly how you radicalize people against the very cause you are championing? You breed hate and adversity for the rest of us who actually want to to have a discussion on the topic. 

I’m a feminist myself (in a country where feminism is hard-work) and let me tell you, making all men hate us does nothing but push away potential allies and make it a lot harder for our voices to be heard.

Feminism is about equality, not women dominating.

Now onto the second post: the one comparing Catra and Hordak with the question of which of them is a better person. 

This whole war orphans that were personally abducted and tortured into serving the horde HC that some ppl have is really starting to get boorish. This has been going on for more than 6 months. 

I have no idea why everyone thinks he went down chimneys and stealing babies left and right while cackling villainously. The man had a busy schedule of brooding in his lab, wallowing at his inability to use insulated cables and having his device blowing up in his face with the occasional Skype call to Shadow Weaver to see what the Horde is doing. 

And yet, to a part of the fandom, this is what he looked like:

( @bat-burrito​ made this one and it’s glorious) 

And if you don’t believe me about the lab recluse thing, you don’t have to, the show pretty much states it for me. 

and 

+

Hordak is a recluse that stayed in his lab and let the running of the Horde and most operations to Shadow Weaver and later Catra. He did not personally abuse anyone and he is not the origin of the cycle of abuse.

Shadow Weaver was a child grooming manipulative woman before she even joined the Horde – she did this to Micah while she was not “evil” or presumably abused by Hordak.

Even if you want to HC that Hordak abused her somehow, he is still not the one who started the cycle: Horde Prime is. 

The whole fandom seems to forget about the eldritch monstrosity that created a whole army of brainwashed slaves to worship and die for him. Prime is the one that sent Hordak to die and gave him the motivation to try to prove himself worthy of life and love. If you want to point fingers, point them at the origin of all of this. This fandom has a strange Prime blindness. He is never talked about when it comes to being the start of all of this.

If Prime didn’t exist, Hordak wouldn’t exist. If Prime hadn’t sent Hordak off to die, then his clone wouldn’t have accidentally ended up on Etheria. None of the things in the show would have happened.

Adora would have died of exposure in a field, the monarchies on Etheria would have continued as they are and the planet would have continued to exist in despondos. 

He is a dictator, yes. So are the princesses. Monarchies are dictatorships where the ruler is born into power. Hordak gained his through military might while Glimmer was born with hers and enforced it with tradition. I don’t really care to play “who’s the better dictator”. The princesses have their power because of the runestones- magical rocks put there by the First Ones to channel the planet’s magic and use it as a weapon. How come no one talks about that?

Do you think a king/queen keeps their crown without effort or subjugation of their subjects? 

Also, Hordak had never interacted with Catra before SW dragged her before him to be judged. He was indifferent to etherians in general and didn’t seem to care which of them were his underlings so long as the operations were running smoothly. He was more focused on his portal and returning home than on anything else. He did not set out to “ruin lives” or quest for power. What he wanted was to return to his deity and become a mindless part of the whole again – that is as opposite to power hungry as you can get.

Catra was directly abused by Shadow Weaver throughout her childhood. That makes Shadow weaver responsible for 100% of that abuse.

Catra was found in a box by Adora and adopted by Shadow Weaver. Hordak didn’t know or care that she existed.

He is responsible for the war, he is responsible for the war casualties and the property damage. He is not responsible for Shadow Weaver being a terrible person and mother figure.

Again with the orphan thing. We have 5 cadets in the show. 

Adora was found in a field. 

Catra was found in a box. Lonnie, Kyle and Rogelio are unexplained. The only lizard ppl we see in the show are in the Horde or the Crimson Wastes. The other two could just as well be the children of some of the soldiers. 

I may harp on about what a bitch Shadow Weaver is – the reason I do so is because she is legitimately terrible to the two girls in her care.

I was the unfavorite growing up, I WAS the Catra in my family who could do no right while my sibling was the golden child. I don’t however hate Shadow Weaver. She is a cartoon character in a show and she does the things she was written to do. Hell, she is a very compelling and believable villain. Her motivations are clear and she is consistent. Her voice actress portrayed her splendidly and her character design is superb. I like her but that doesn’t mean that I don’t acknowledge her role in the story. I don’t however make up parts of the story to make her more evil than she was or treat my headcanons about her as absolute fact. 

Again, sigh: Prime is the worst villain in the show. He is quite literally Nyarlathotep and does this to planets: 

 This to people: 

and this to the people he created to serve, worship and love him: 

How is that not worse?

I love Catra and it genuinely annoys me when people erase her agency or try to paint her as one-dimensional victim. Catra was an antagonist for most of the show and she rocked it! She was 400% more efficient at it than cloneboy. Give the queen some damn respect and recognition! Catra had a lot of agency and her actions moved the plot of the show more than those of the protagonists. (they were mostly reactive).

Catra pulled the lever of the portal in a moment of distress after a breakdown, a Shadow-Weaver related breakdown because that’s how trauma works.

Hordak didn’t make her do it, he didn’t send Catra after Adora either. These were Catra’s choices. They came from a place of hurt but they were her choices still.

The portal was a means of transportation, not a weapon. Building it was not Catra’s mission, it was Hordak’s. He built it so he could contact Prime and either summon him here or go home –whichever course of action Prime wanted. Again, Hordak wanted to go back to this:

...

The only person who knew the device was dangerous was Entrapta and she tried to warn Hordak about it. Catra was the one who stopped her, violently so, then sent her to die on Beast Island- the fate Entrapta saved her from a season ago. Catra then tried to have Hordak open the portal before it was ready.

When he wouldn’t – she pulled the lever herself because that is how desperate she had gotten at that point, to show Shadow Weaver how wrong she was. That is how hurt Catra was by her mother figure’s betrayal and abuse.

Don’t take that away from her. Don’t call it curiosity or naivete or whatever. She knew the portal was dangerous but she wanted to prove Shadow Weaver wrong so badly that she didn’t care at that point. She had been pushed that far. 

Catra’s actions led to Angella’s death but she was not directly responsible for it. She didn’t activate the device to kill Angella, it merely happened accidentally. Catra was however glad it happened and wanted to profit from the aftermath of her death.  

Hordak didn’t care or plan to kill Angella personally. There is no in-show moment where any of that is portrayed. Since he doesn’t care about the specifics of running the horde seem to know what they are conquering at the moment, it seems that that was usually a task reserved for his second in command. 

^ - troop movement ordered by Catra

Hordak doesn’t even know what his own army is doing.

Again with the Hordak “drilling into orphan’s minds”… I seriously doubt that any of them had ever seen him out of his lab or that he came up with the propaganda himself.

Manipulation is more Shadow Weaver’s game not his. For all of Hordak’s faults, he is not deceptive or manipulative. If anything, he is woefully incapable of spotting lies. (it might have something to do with him being born in a society where lies were almost impossible because of the hive mind and Prime being able to browse his thoughts at a whim- as such, it wouldn’t be a skill he would have been able to develop).

Hordak canonically despises deception and lies.  I really don’t understand where this image of a manipulative and cunning Hordak comes from. He wouldn’t be able to plot himself out of a paper bag if his life depended on it.

First off.. S4 Catra was his equal, not his subordinate. Don’t take that away from her. She earned it.

He doesn’t look that threatening here... 

And again:  Prime created the system. He made clone slaves and programmed them to serve. His clones have hardware installed for the express reason to facilitate his control over them. He has a religion in place to make sure their thoughts do not stray from his purpose. I am legitimately boggled by this fandom’s tendency to completely forget about his existence.Does anyone really think that these people that are born “prechipped” and programmed to know nothing but Prime’s Light are really knowledgeable about human morality?

That they would know that conquest is bad when that is the express reason for their creation? 

If I were born in that situation, I’m not sure I would have known any better. Hell, if any of the clones even try to disobey Prime, they would get either mindraped (erased) or killed for the effort. They really have no choice, even if they knew that killing in Prime’s name is wrong (they don’t) they really can’t do anything about it. They have no choice but to be what they were made to be. I find it personally abhorrent when these designer slaves are held accountable for what Prime has made them do.

And to the people that say Hordak was free of Horde Prime once he was stranded on Etheria.. That is not how indoctrination works. The fact that I can’t go to church this Sunday because I’m locked in the house and can’t find the keys doesn’t make me an atheist.

Hordak was serving Prime even on Etheria. He keeps mentioning it to both Entrapta and Catra. He started the war because that’s what he thought Prime wanted of him and that’s what he’s been programmed to do. Personal and informed choice really doesn’t factor into his decision at all.

He is not sympathetic because Entrapta likes him. Notice how I haven’t brought up his relationship with her up to this point?

He is sympathetic because he literally had no choice but to do the things he was indoctrinated into doing. He was build and programmed for it, just like all the other clones. They are not able to deviate from that because of the way Prime functions and rules over them.

There is no point in the show where Hordak relishes over his status as a ruler or the “luxury” it affords him. He does not engage in the same behaviors his progenitor manifests.

There is no point in the show where Hordak relishes over his status as a ruler or the “luxury” it affords him. He does not engage in the same behaviors his progenitor manifests. He attempts to emulate Prime in order to project authority in the only way he knows how but since those are some really big shoes to fill, he is woefully inadequate. 

If Hordak had been power hungry, he would have stayed in despondos and ruled his own faction. Being away from Prime is the most powerful and autonomous he’s ever been and yet, he wants to throw all of that away in order to be a powerless, nameless part of the whole. What Hordak wanted was to be enslaved by Prime because that’s what he had been created for.

“vengeful” – and how did Hordak manifest this vengefulness? Who did he take revenge on in the series?  

“apologize” – when and where in his 3 minutes of screentime would he remember everything after 2 mindwipes, realize that the whole worldview he had since inception is wrong, realize that he had been mistaken into doing the horrible things he did and then go to all of the characters and apologize for it?

Would anyone be convinced of that had it happened in 3 minutes? I’d rather they don’t redeem him than do a shit job at it.

Very true. He’s not a better person. He’s just a person in an impossible situation. Both Hordak and Catra were handed a raw deal, I don’t understand why everyone insists on pitting them against one another. They both did bad things and they were both in horrible situations. The specifics don’t really matter since neither of them would have done the things they did had they been more fortunate.

This is the exact reason for which I don’t hold Cara’s actions against her. Catra’s only model of success was Shadow Weaver. She emulated her abusive mother figure because she had no other example and because she wanted to please that woman. It does not excuse the way Catra acted but it explains it.

I really don’t understand why some people want Catra punished. I’d rather she get love and help. That is what she needs. In time, she will want to do better and be better by herself. She doesn’t need to be forced, heavens know, she’s been forced enough as it is.

They are really different. Catra got an abusive, shitty and violent childhood. Hordak got this:

He was literally robbed of a childhood. 

She was taught by Shadow Weaver that weakness gets you killed. Hordak was not allowed to have emotions to begin with, or thoughts of his own, or a name...

Comparing to victims of abuse to see which one of them is more likable is such a strange concept to me.

Catra was robbed in s5 too. I don’t hold that against her. I  blame it on the writers. S5 could have been a lot better. 

[unproduciblesmackdown]

You're so right about the Will Roland fanart problems. It seems like back when Will Roland was only known for Jared people were way more proWill because he could be their funny meme boi who ate bathbombs but now that he's a lead with all these emotional songs it's like God forbid he's not their "twink bby". Idk it annoys me so much especially when people draw the rest of the Broadway cast and still use WillC or do an animatic with WillRs voice and WillCs character ugh like. Accept the Roland pls

lmao we are all just out here grabbing the mic like “attention all bastards: Look, just because will roland isn’t your ideal fancast for most adorable twink of the year - “

really like, i have never come across any signs of there having been any pattern in the deh fandom of ~taking issue~ with will’s Abilities to sing or play the part of a struggling teen or whatever like what crops up re: him being the lead in bmc.....it also is unsurprising yet disappointing that like, jared and alana are so easily completely ignored, but when they Are acknowledged it’s super flattened interpretations like, either they’re both hypocritical jerks (just based on evan’s gfy accusations basically lol) or if they’re actually viewed in a positive way it’s just like, alana is your friendly local Model Student and jared is memes and neither of them are in the way! :3

you litrally cannot ignore jeremy the Whole Entire Main Character tho and also like. can’t ignore the fact that caring about jeremy as a Romantique Lead is ahhh important to many ppl in the fanbase? so him being regarded as ~less cute~ is more of an Issue b/c the character must be taken seriously and is the sympathetic hero and has a lot more solo material / more of Any material / more focus than jared does in deh.........you Have To Look At Him and care about his actual feelings and not just misinterpret the character as “has no serious emotions b/c he doesn’t say serious things in a serious tone” the way ppl misinterpret jared. there’s the assumption that someone who is good / sympathetic should also be attractive / cute / Personally Appealing To Look At and that wasn’t as much a conflict when ppl didn’t think it was important to sympathize / care about / pay attention to jared too much, and the “conflict” of caring abt jeremy’s capacity for a romantic relationship but that’s less important if he’s not as Cute also not being as much an issue when most people don’t care about jared’s romantic feelings or think that they exist despite jared being in love with evan But Anyways

like it is wild the things people will just make up to “justify” their Dislike for will, which has only manifested as apparent Issues thanks to him playing jeremy rather than jared........there’s the classic “mm idk i don’t think he can sing that well” approach which like. some people are just trying to say they do not like the inherent descriptive qualities of his voice, which is more nasal obviously and don’t anyone come in here with the “Actually the Technical definition of Nasal re Vocals is” b/c we know what i mean, alright? nasal voices are not considered ~serious~ and there’s the kneejerk dumb-annoying-loser-nerd association. god knows that jeremy heere canNot have characteristics that could be automatically judged as irritating and unappealing. then there’s the notion that He doesn’t have the (vocal) range!! which like. do you honestly think they would cast someone who doesn’t have the correct range. you’re aware that will roland was being considered for the part of jeremy in the two river run up to the last round of callbacks. you know that the song that was literally written expressly to suit will roland’s individual voice and singing abilities makes use of his falsetto which people go “omg he can’t hit those high notes” except sometimes when they misattribute his falsetto to other singers they suddenly find it worth complimenting. and then you get people who like, want to subscribe to this softened version of it and get all backhanded like “oh i think will’s vocals are improving whew that’s good” in any random video and always Only single him out apparently like. did you think he gets worse with experience? you don’t wanna talk about any of these other professional singers improving or worsening or anything? only wanna give ur assessment of william’s huh

honestly i for real haven’t seen the 1.0 version b/c i’m here via will roland in the first place & i’ve never gotten the impression that there’s some Essential Content i’m missing out on by having only seen 2.0........but between a) people complaining that will r’s jeremy is Too Frustrated He Shouldn’t Be That Angry It Makes Him Less Sympathetic and b) saying just as a point of comparison betwixt the depictions that will r’s jeremy is more frustrated and c) i haven’t read That much bmc fic but people sure talk about jeremy being like five seconds away from bursting into tears at any given moment which like, okay yeah aren’t we all, but also i presume this stems from will c’s apparently Sadder portrayal of jeremy. i almost forgot where i was going with this one but i think it’s just that yeah people truly take issue with will r’s jeremy being more frustrated and it’s like you realize there’s no Right or Wrong portrayal / interpretation even if you prefer one for whatever reasons......theatre just is Like that.......you have a slightly different portrayal during ever performance even from the same actors, and you’ll often have different actors playing the role........yeah people usually are attached to the first performance they see / have that as their Standard and that’s fine, it’s just like, you don’t have to decide that’s an Objective view and that you have Objective issues with everyone else’s take. 1.0 is still there for you

uhhhh oh yeah and the whole Clout idea lmao......people really putting themselves out there shaking their heads at the supposed fact that will was cast for the off bway run to Boost Popularity b/c he was part of the deh obc......besides the whole thing that it’s hardly likely that would’ve been considered necessary anyhow, there’s the little thing that a) again, will roland had already been very seriously considered for the part even before will connolly was decided on for the original run and b) like.....these people had been collaborating for eons and you really think will roland only popped into their minds thanks to being in deh....and c) joe iconis has repeatedly said they specifically did Not want to cast people based on who was Known enough and whose names would be good for marketing and d) maybe anyone has noticed that the marketing never involved any mention of anyone in the cast? no? cool. and yet people like so truly think they’re Wise to ~real reason~ that they’d go and cast will roland as the lead. like people are making shit up and really just thinking it’s true b/c they Want it to be true b/c they Want to be validated in having actual contempt for will’s casting despite the “issue” being that he doesn’t seem as Likeable (worthy of sympathy...cough...) thanks to his deemed-unattractive looks and sweetly-adenoidal voice and more-frustrated portrayal all seeming less cute or whatever

and i mean i haven’t seen it crop up of late but the one particular Grasping At Straws ~justification~ for will being unworthy of the part thanks to perceived acting/singing incompetence which is soooo wild is when people are like “ough i Hate when he just holds his arms out when he sings” like fmslkdj if anything that’s just an individual quirk and the fact that it was something you noticed means you just latched on to it as potential fodder for “the fact i registered this information abt someone whose existence i Resent means it distracted me which means i hate it and it’s bad”...like another thing he does with his hands while singing is when he makes the loose claws and kind of half crosses his arms in front of his chest! where are the complaints about that?? nowhere, b/c people have not really processed it as a particular thing, so they can’t deem it a Particular Thing To Criticize. people sometimes Notice that his jared talks with his hands a lot, which will says is an acting choice that came from an unconscious tendency, but people really only bring it up to juxtapose will’s jared’s dramatic tendencies and nervous habits with sky’s jared’s more outwardly still and smoothed-over behavior. aka they don’t Complain about it or deem it a weakness / bad thing. and yet people caring about bmc are really jumping on that chance to be like oh ugh there he goes again, having a characteristic i associate with him as an individual, disgusting, can’t believe will connolly was murdered for this..

it’s a bit clearer too with bmc moreso than deh that people aren’t super willing to accept how will roland Looks b/c like, thanks to will connolly’s jeremy having the long hair thing you can Tell The Difference In Which Actor Is Represented when ppl draw the character even if the rest of the features are kind of “generic” (and how even the costuming isn’t a dead giveaway since ppl will draw connolly jeremy in 2.0/3.0′s outfits) and it even serves to specify the actor in writing format too if they mention the hair lol........and honestly?? this fact is one of the most damning things lol in that people the reason so many ppl continue to produce connolly-based jeremys is Not because for whatever reason they can’t / it’s too difficult to draw a will roland lookin jeremy......like a lot of the time The trait which serves to distinguish between the two is the hair thing. people are adopting jeremy’s new costuming and stuff but choosing to make sure we know that jeremy does not Look like will roland and the clearest indicator of this is the longer hair thing......which also means that for many people the main effort they’d need to exert to make it clear they’re drawing wrol jeremy would just be to....shorten the hair. And Yet!!!! it is apparently beyond people to do this

like uh nice on making a lgw animatic but really.........really we’re gonna take the song that is specifically from the 2.0 / 3.0 runs, so it’s obvious we’re Accepting that non-1.0 content, okay......and we’re Accepting will roland’s vocals, which, a person’s voice is a physical trait of theirs too, same as The Existence Of Their Body........and yet jeremy Cannot Look Like How Will Roland Looks, that’s too far, can’t do that. we can take material from the specific versions the actor was cast in, that material being a song written specifically for this individual actor’s voice, in the form of this actor’s actual vocals......but can’t have the depicted image of jeremy be based on this actor’s appearance..............of all the......

really all that it is is that more people find will connolly more attractive than will roland and this makes them feel like will roland Is Worse and then the people who just run with that either just embrace that and are crashing around on public forums saying Lol i hate him cuz he’s ugly lmao....and then you have people who don’t wanna do that but don’t wanna actually examine why they ~take issue~ with will being cast and so they’ve gotta leap on any Other things about him that feel more acceptable / Objective like oh the portrayal is “Wrong” (that’s not how this works) or he can’t sing well enough (yeah he can) or high enough (yeah he can) or he was stunt cast (no he wasn’t) or they wanna label every characteristic / trait they can think up that Isn’t his physical appearance as Annoying And Bad like. maybe stop and ask why you find it SO pressing that this other actor has the part and it Must be objectively inferior if not ruinous for reasons you gotta invent about him being incompetent cuz it’s better to make stuff up about how a professional actor isn’t good enough for a part than to say you don’t think he’s cute enough and are bothered by that

it didn’t matter as much to people when they viewed his character as either Just A Joke or Just A Jerk or flat-out disposable material. being attractive is for serious sympathetic beloved characters, natch

unfortunately jeremy can’t be written off as The Unimportant Meme Friend With No Real Feelings so now there’s a whole problem if an actor is not as cute

like b/c of the way he looks ppl can accept that a character played by will roland can be funny or can be rude or can really not be too important to take seriously / consider complex or sympathetic or likeable beyond being a walking Running Joke, but when it comes to a sympathetic main character whose emotional state is so important it’s practically assigned a character and who’s a romantic lead? now people have a problem with him looking the way will roland does

[ryouverua]

Oh yeah, youre right about him searching for ppls validation, i think! Like, even negative attention—it really does sorta feel like a child throwing a tantrum. At the same time, in contrast to his childishness—or maybe not, we never really do give kids enough credit—hes very… calculating? I guess. I mean its clear hes laying out pieces to do something, we just dont know what at this point. That aside i feel like… while he is wanting the attention of ppl hating him, even like outside of any plans he has, doesnt exactly negate like? Also feelings like he doesnt have to be “good” bc the ppl around him arent either—with his whole thought process that anyone can lie. Then again maybe theyre supposed to parallel/contrast like… kaito seeking positive attention/validation, and kokichi seeking the negative. Like a child screaming “look at me, look at me!”. So maybe him calling saihara a partner is less him seeing himself on par with others — though it may still be like that, just him seeking that validation as well — and more telling of how he views saihara specifically. I think how unwielding he can be sometimes mighta earned his respect, some. His search for the truth after kaede died leads him to putting his foot down to save everyone more than once during the class trial, which mighta earned some respect esp since the timeline of kokichis infatuation (cough crush cough) coincides with that. Though its unclear what his views ARE exactly on truth vs lies — but hes said he hates liars, hes also said that everyone lies, and that theyre what runs the world. So it seems like he views them kinda like a needed evil? So maybe he saw saiharas searching for the truth in a world full of lies, fools hearty, but also admirable. It could also explain why he got so pissed when he caught him in a lie—lying to him, about him. Also off topic but ive learned that in the art book its stated that saihara was originally supposed to be nb and i feel fucking robbed

As someone who spent a lot of time working with kids via volunteer/summer work in high school, trust me, kids can be very calculating when they want to be - and honestly, their minds move in directions that a lot of adults can’t anymore. The power of ~imagination~ or as Kokichi Ouma would say, lies, perhaps? What is fiction and fantasy other than beautifully decorated lies for people to enjoy and distract from their own lives…

mumble-Beatrice-mumble-KOKICHISHOULDMEETBEATRICE-mumble

Also speaking of Beatrice and Kokichi parallels - if Kokichi has a line about wanting Shuichi to solve him I spontaneously combust, probably.

ahem, anyway -

I’m trying to pin down in my head when Kokichi started focusing on Shuichi specifically and while it’s pretty obvious in Chapter 4, I also got his love hotel pretty early on in my playthrough as well as doing a few of his FTEs so my perspective might be a bit biased. 8′D With that said, he made a pretty big impression on Shuichi during the Bug Meet-n-Greet when he woke up to Kokichi’s shining face but that may have been because Shuichi was the only one who got knocked out. Hm…

Oh, potential idea about Kokichi’s look on lies in regards to Shuichi specifically - I wonder if this is the first time Shuichi has lied not only to him, but about him? As a direct counter to him? I’m probably going to forget some of the lies (and I didn’t get every single one either, despite my best efforts), but to bring some up:

Shuichi lied about hearing someone in the dorms - Chapter 2

Shuichi lied about whether the second death in Chapter 3 was instantaneous or not, and also about K1-b0′s light functions -

All of those were in service of revealing the truth and finding the killer. And I think having both of these here is important because both of those, I think, lined up with Kokichi’s goals in those trials.

But in this trial, where one of Kokichi’s goals is to force Kaito into a corner belief-wise (undermining the new apparent leader of the group), he finds Shuichi starts lining up with Kaito a bit too much as an unintended consequence - sure, he’s trying to reveal the truth and find the killer, but either a) these goals don’t align with Kokichi - he spends a lot of the trial throwing out breadcrumbs to Shuichi to reach a certain conclusion (I’m not sure that conclusion was supposed to be the truth or not, which is something I’m gonna think on later, because it really does seem like Kokichi dropped the culprit’s name out of spite rather than it being his actual plan), but after lying about being in the salon he does expect to be taken at face value or at least be challenged with evidence rather than perjury or b) Shuichi is, whether intentionally or unconsciously, barbing this lie with the implication, “I’m going to lie to corner you, Kokichi, the culprit of this case,” and Kokichi finds this offensive to both the spirit of the trial, but Shuichi’s apparent role as the truth-seeking, unbiased, logical Ultimate Detective. Despite his initial plans, Kokichi has his own moral code for himself and those around him, and seeing Shuichi cross a line that way snaps something in him that makes him lash out. Does that make sense? I could be completely sideways on this but - 8′D

Man, the mystery of Kokichi Ouma is going to be fun to unravel!

Oh and about that last bit - I’m actually not surprised by that tbh. They made him pretty androgynous and the fact that they unapologetically gave him love hotel scenes for all the guys and girls is pretty… telling. I actually wonder if it was a sort of apology for the protag-switch, especially considering Kaede would have been our first main-game girl protagonist - he seems to straddle the line much more than both Naegi and Hajime! But honestly though, I wouldn’t worry too much about that. Fandom exists to rectify all the problems of canon (and sometimes cause some but that’s a different conversation), so if you want to write/draw/etc nb Shuichi, you can totally do that ~

[tellywoodtrash]

ishqbaaz 13.02.18 lb

aaj mauka bhi hai, dastoor bhi hai, mood bhi hai, aur episode ka title bhi encouraging lag raha hai, toh here goes!

(chorni @rihanahere ko meri special waali hello. the hex of the day is that i hope that your favorite shoes are ruined! rot in peace, loser! mwah! 😚😚😚)

shivaay’s celebrating being back in his bedroom by doing his faaaaaaaavt thing.... 😏😏😏

no, not sexing up his wife. spending an inordinate amount of effort on his hair. 😐😐😐

this poor bedroom though. it’s never seen any sex in it. how many girls have come and gone; mallika was in his bed one night, tia used to regularly come hang out and give him massages, and now he’s been married for 18+ months; par majaaaal hai ki this man uses his bedroom for what it’s supposed to be used for. 😔😔😔😔😔

LMAO SHE JUST CAME AND FUCKING SHOVED HIM OUTTA THE WAY AND WAS LIKE “THIS MY BRUSH, BITCH” AND SNATCHED IT AWAY. oh man, how the mighty have fallen. 😂😂😂

oh snappppppppp, baalon ko insult. mehenga padega. 😬😬😬

yup. baagad billa is back to his old ways.

UGH LITERALLY ALL ANYONE WANTS FROM YOU TWO IS TO SEX. JUST DO IT OR GTFO MY SCREEN. 😤😤😤

ok fuck me, this smile got to me. fuckkkkk. i hate myself for still occassionally swooning for this garbage man. 😭😭😭

oh ho, kasme-vaade of “kabhiiiiii doooor nahi jayenge” are being given. should be fun when he decides fuck all that!!!! and fucking shoots her in the chest! 🙃🙃🙃

FUCKING YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAS GET TO IT KIDS 🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽 *BOW CHICKA WOW WOW*

OMFG DADI FUCK YOU WHY AREN’T YOU FUCKING DEAD YET?!?!?!!?!? JUST LET THEM FUCK IN PEACE, LORD. 😡😡😡

lel, anika and her lame excuses. girl, just tell her that yeah you were about to make out with the hubs and could she piss off, please and thanks. 🙄🙄🙄

how many bloody khaandaani haars do these ppl have? ugh, rich ppl.

one: allllll of this jewelry is fug as hell and so not anika’s style. she’s gonna shove it in the back of a wardrobe the second she gets a chance. 🙄🙄🙄 two: don’t be playing sexy hawaa sounds and o jaana and all. i wanna see them make out against the wardrobe. don’t try to placate me with this pg 13 garbage. 😤😤😤

ok won’t deny, heart went little bit awwww at his soft and adoring stare (fuck my stupid heart. it’ll never learn. 😪😪😪)

also lol, body double alert! the one hugging dadi isn’t surbhi, whoever that is, has straight hair, while surbhi has curls in the scene. and whoever surbhi’s hugging has a ratchet-ass dadi wig on.

LMAO YUP, ANIKA GOT RID OF ALLLLLLL THE KHAANDAANI CRAP AND PUT ON HER FASHION STREET KE 100 RS WAALE JHUMKE AND CHOODIYAAN THE SECOND DADI TURNED HER BACK. 😆😆😆

wait, tia’s still pretending to be blind? how the f did she get the tapes to shivaay if she’s still keeping up this schtick? 🤔🤔🤔

also, someone please give navina more clothes? i feel like i’ve seen this skirt 3 times already in the last month. 😑😑😑

tia be barsaoing duas on her otp. oh tia baby. mat jao. the moment your back is turned he’s gonna try and kill her. (again.) 😫😫😫

at least take my girl with ya! 😣😣😣

LOL THIS NONSENSE BATWAARA WAALA LINE IS STILL HERE 😂😂😂

ok shivaay, there’s 10 million OTHER things that you’re ACTUALLY guilty of. how about you take accountability of those, instead of taking on random shit that you have nothing to do with. when i say it’s all or nothing with this man, it’s truly ALLL OR NOTHING. lord. 🙄🙄🙄

jfc, jhanvi. hadh hoti hai irritating hone ki. i liked you better when you were an alcoholic who didn’t give a fuck. 😒😒😒

i’m not really a fan of pinky when she gets all shouty like this, but mummeh be dropping 100% truth bombs today. 😌😌😌

lol shivaay be like FUCK THIS NOISE, I’M OUT!!!!! 😂😂😂

yeah the kadwaahat is BECAUSE you’re all living under one roof. that shit don’t work no more, son. get different houses and you’ll be able to stand each other. 😕😕😕

man i blame dadi for like 85% of shivaay’s fuckd-up-ness with her expectation on him to fix everything all the fucking time. first off, he is just ONE man, ffs. and he handles his brothers and their lives already. why not hold fucking tej and shakti accountable for SOMETHING??? 😡😡😡

LMAO THE THOUGHT OF SHIVAAY SITTING AND READING THE RAMCHARITRAMANAS IS MAKING ME LOL SO HARD. AS IF!!!! 😂😂😂

LOL LOOK AT HIS FACE, IT’S LITERALLY LIKE DADI SRSLY WTF AM I SUPP TO DO WITH THIS, DON’T YOU HAVE ANYTHING FROM THIS CENTURY TO HELP ME OUT????? LIKE SOMETHING PUBLISHED BY HBR? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

hahahahahahah shivaay being maryaada purshottom. sureeeeeeee. 😆😆😆😆😆

oh shit. bhaiyya be using his stern voice. omRu spring to feet immediately. 😐😐😐

haaaaye, om back in his half-ponytail look to commemorate DBO day. hottttttie. 😍😍😍

(he needs a haircut tho. the hair’s getting a little toooo long.)

LMAO WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS MUSIC??????

man i hate the hindi version of this song so much. the telugu original is a fucking banger (it is my #1 all-time favt. telugu song. i don’t know/understand telugu, but phonetically know all the lyrics to this, and you best believe that i scream-sing them every time it comes on) and allu arjun, him of the rubber-band bones, killllllllllls it with his dance moves. fucking salman khan not only just took and ruined the song, BUT ALSO DISRESPECTS THE SHEER DANCABILITY OF IT, BY JUST STANDING THERE AND SHUFFLING HIS HANDS AROUND IN HIS POCKETS LIKE A FUCKING ROADSIDE PERVERT. 😒😒😒😒😒

sorry not sorry for the rant. this song just reaalllllllllllllly steams my clams. 😡😡😡

LOLOLOLOL OBROS DOING POCHAA. 😂😂😂

ugh fuck fucking bhavya. it’s like it’s july/aug ‘17 all over again and my hatred for her is alllllll back. SHE IS AS GHUSAAAYA HUA IN THIS SHOW AS THAT RAMCHARITRAMANAS INTO SHIVAAY’S HANDS. 😠😠😠

same, girl. #same.

lmaoooooo omRu’s reaction at jhanvi exhorting them to “ask” tej. inhone aaj tak kuch tej se poocha hai, jo aaj poochenge????

damnnnnnnn, every time om gets all righteously angry, i get sooooo hot for him. mmmhmmmm, yas honey, tell off your stupidass mom. 🤤🤤🤤

dude, nehalaxmi’s evil/reaction faces are the fucking best. these split second shots are giving me so much life, i can’t even.... 😍😍😍

matlab kaunse industrial waale paint se marble pe lakeer banaayi hui hai, be? kabse ghise jaa rahe hai aur jaaa hi nahi raha. 😐😐😐

ouff. finally done.

dat tadi waala pocha-throwing by all of them tho. ���😎😎

haaaaaaye, my boys. bohut dino baad aisa feel aaya hai. 😭😭😭

oh god ab yeh kaun hai manhoos?

oh god shaadi ke card. fuck this nonsense shaadi. someone make this stupid rudra complete a bloody bachelor’s degree first!!!!!!!!! 😠😠😠

what? WHAT? why the face getting utraa hua?

OOOOOH, IT HAS TEJ’S NAME ON IT?

"ismein mistake hai. yeh invitation mere bhai ki taraf se jayega.”

yaaaaaaas son! 🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽

om’s tiny approving smile tho. ouff, my heart. he’s looking too handsome today. that blue is realllllly working on him. 😍😍😍😍😍😍

OMG FUCKKKKK OFFFFFFF JHANVIIIIIII.

“kyun? jab baap ke saare farz bhai adaa kar raha hai, toh baap ki jagah bhai ka naam likhwaane se kya faraq padta hai?”

hahahahahahahahahaha om’s reaction at jhanvi’s “aur tumhaare papa ka kya? unki khushi koi maayne nahi rakhti??”

boy be rolling his eyes so hard, he practically saw into the past and the future simultaneously. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

“mera IQ kam hai lekin ek baat main bhi jaanta hoon; ki sirf janam dene se koi baap nahi ban jaata.”

DAAAAAAAYUM CHILD! YOU TELL HER! 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

lol fuck off tej no one wants you here. 🙄🙄🙄

these two be like yikessss what have we married into. 😬😬😬

bhavya, you still have the chance. gtfo while the door is still open.

OM’S TURN TO TALK. AND YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS! IT’S SMACKDOWNNNNNNNNN TIMEEEEEEEE, COZ MY BOIIIIII HERE IS SICK. AND. TIRED. OF HIS PARENTALS’ BS. TAKE IT AWAYYYYYY SON!!!!!!!!!!!!!

shivaay be in the middle of this like

GOD SHIVAAY WHY ARE YOU FOREVER LOOKING TO REDEEM TEJ????? HE’S THE FUCKING WORST. HONESTLY. 😣😣😣

om’s reactions today are just A++++++ and i’ll have to gif alllll of them. 😂😂😂😂

no for real, my man, beat some sense into shivaay already. 🙄🙄🙄

wow, shivaay’s actually taking anika along on one of his little missions? 😯😯😯

anika’s nonsense overconfidence ever since she married into this fam the second time realllllly annoys me. like shivaay se bhi zyaada guroor she has these days. about what, god only knows. 😒😒😒

does it bother no one else how easily distracted shivaay gets when driving? like every single time i’ve seen this man drive, i’m constantly chanting EYES ON ROAD EYES ON ROAD EYES ON THE FUCKING ROAD 😫😫😫

UM SHIVAAY...? 😶😶😶

OH SHIT HE’S GONNA PULL A SALLU AND RUN HIM OVER! 😯😯😯

aaaaand.....

ok i’m actually more worried about the car ki haalat after 8 foot, 300 kilo of pure muscle-mass waala veer hit it, than veer’s wellbeing. 🙈🙈🙈

anika’s split second of pure rage waala look at shivaay tho. lolololol. it’s ~~screaming omfg why are you such a sociopath?!??! 😂😂😂

LMAO AFTER RUNNING HIM OVER, HE’S ASKING HIM “KAHIN LAGI TOH NAHI....? OMG VEER TUM MUMBAI MEIN? THAT’S GREAT!!!!!” AS IF BUTTER WOULDN’T MELT IN HIS MOUTH HAHAHAHA 😂😂😂😂

fuck, sometimes asshole!shivaay really has his moments. 😆😆😆

anika is like fuckfuckfuckfuckfuckfuck this is nooooot goood

she’s right. because when this one makes ☝🏽☝🏽☝🏽 THIS ☝🏽☝🏽☝🏽 face, it’s never good.

(she should know. she’s seen him make it a lot AT HER.)

“mujhe yaqeen hai; humaari khaatirdaari kabhi bhool nahi payenge aap!”

i am kinda lovingggg seeing shivaay in his shark singh oberoi mode after a longgggggg time. 😈😈😈

lolololol.

anika, girl, do you not know your husband even a little bit????? 🙄🙄🙄

so happy that after FOR-EV-ERRRRRRRR, shivaay’s energies are being constructively put to use to fuck up someone who actually deserves it.

i think the last time i enjoyed so much was when he beat the everloving crap outta ranveer. remember that? like when gauri had to physically throw herself onto shivaay to stop him from killing ranveer? oh mannnn, that was the bestttttttttttt! *happily sighs* 😊😊😊

meanwhile veer here be like bitch i’m desi wolverine and these bones be reinforced with adamantium.

ohnoe. he’s completely ok. already! 😯😯😯

ok ngl i was a little charmed by veer’s wink. 😍😍😍 why can’t someone give this dude a role where he’s a good guy? he looks really cute with his irl wife, someone cast them together in something happy and fluffy!

oh ho shivaay ka overconfidence. bhaari padegaaaaa. like, literally. coz look at veer’s size. ouff yaaaaar. 😫😫😫

and ffs, could someone please update omru about this ASAP, so they know to come provide backup!!!!! 😣😣😣

[muthamagik]

vent.

I was never perfect, but I felt like I had to be so that I wouldn’t disappoint you. biggest fears were letting you down/losing your companionship. I’d sink my claws in whenever I’d feel like you were drifting off. I’d wonder what was wrong with me. I’d panic. I’d get sad. I’d wonder if I make you sad. If I’m the cause of your misery. I didn’t know how to talk to you. I knew. I knew about her, but I didn’t have your word on it. You’d tell me not to worry. You’d get mad when I asked. So I hated to ask. Other guys were interested in me. Sexually, mostly. But they told me things that you wouldn’t. They’d automatically want things I’d have to beg you for. Dates. I figured dates weren’t your thing, so I gave up. I didn’t want to make you uncomfortable. Plenty of guys were comfortable going on dates. I’d set a time. I’d never go. Just felt cool to know that someone somewhere felt I was worthy of a date. I’ve always felt played by you. Very cake and eat it, too relationship. I was expected to never stray, but your stray was cool. Your stray was cool. I put pussy on shorty bc he made me feel special. As corny as he was, as much as I shot him down, he wanted me and he let me know that. Sexually, but still. He asked if I had a boyfriend and it hit me: I don’t. But I do have someone who’d be mad if he knew I was here right now. I was mad I was there right now. He gave me head. U never give me head. The dick wasn’t worth it. I felt stupid after. You felt stupid after, too, I suppose. These aren’t excuses. I’m sorry. But I knew. My name in your phone was Brittanooga. Her name in your phone was My Baby Girl. I knew. I’d lay and think about how you’d leave her to come be with me. You’d be in her car, telling me it’s a rental. You’d introduce me as your homegirl. I was only referred to as your girl when we argued. I tried not to hold her against you, or any other girl for that matter. Honestly they wouldn’t have mattered at all if I felt secure. I fell in love with you thru art. You were a different person behind the camera. You seemed confident and in control. We made magical things. That magic died. I felt like I was losing the very thing that brought us together in the first place. You were one of the only ppl that seemed to understand my vision artistically. I’d pitch ideas to you and you’d make it seem like they were the greatest ideas ever. I’d be proud. I’d be excited to see you help me bring them to life. They never happened. I wanted to see you grow. I bought you cameras. I would have done so much more. I wanted to do so much more. I had big plans. I wanted to help you get where u deserve to be. Everything got flaky. The more time went on, the flakier it got. You’d do fuck shit. You’d fucking ignore me completely. You’d snap about me ignoring you when I’m upset, but being ignored is what upset me to begin with. If you didn’t take me seriously anymore, why’d you let me think so?

I’ve looked at this from your point of view, or so I think. It’s made me feel like a bad person. I wanted the best for you but was it the best for you or was it just what I assumed to be the best for you. I assumed you wanted the best for me. I wanted to feel loved by you. You ain’t open up to me. I didn’t know you. I only knew the few things you allowed me to know and I’d attempt to capitalize on those things, bc anything else was like pulling teeth. Anime, candy, POP figures, cameras, shoes, tee shirts, crystals. It was like catering to a child, but I’d think nothing of it bc you’d seem so happy. That’s all I wanted. Was for you to be happy. And to be happy with me. You can’t buy love. Because I was still only being introduced as your homegirl. You got lots of homegirls. Id wonder if they do what we do. I remember you coming to my house after leaving from going out to eat with your homegirl. I could never get you to go out with me. I felt stupid. I said nothing.

I’d post photos of us together. I’d feel stupid bc lol you never did that. You’d argue that your whole instagram was me. Those were photo shoot photos. So maybe I’m your muse. I wanted to be your woman. To take it a step further, you had photos of her. Intimate ones. Photos of her sleeping. You’ve never posted those. That’s your woman. Me squatting in a laundromat? Not so intimate. Your instagram was full of your work. I was your work. We had fun, tho.

You’d talk about children. I can’t have children. I know that mattered. You’d invite me to your city knowing that wasn’t a safe move. You had a girlfriend. You told me you didn’t. I’d be caught out there having to square up with your bitch. I got warrants.

I loved you. I was a mistake. I fucked up. I cry everyday now. I blame you and then I don’t. Khloe asked about you last night. It’s fucked up. I went to your twitter. I can’t. I went to your insta, I’m not there. I’m gone like I was never here. Like I never existed. So many questions just sit here, unanswered. I’m having a hard time grasping the fact that you say you ain’t never really want me, because you’d beg me to stay. I have a hard time grasping the fact that you clocked out cuz you ain’t trust me, when you weren’t trustworthy to begin with. I’ve always forgiven you. Even when you wouldn’t apologize. Even when the apology would be… I’m sorry ur mad, instead of I’m sorry that I did this to you. I’m having a hard time.

I wasn't perfect. I knew that. I wanted to be. I'd get so happy when you'd acknowledge my efforts to make you happy. I'd feel alone a lot. Things changed. You stopped loving me. You stopped fucking me. You'd only care when I complained. There was no affection. I'd go off the deep end. You'd take hours to text back and i wanted to understand. You got a new job. You went back to her. Or maybe you never left her. So many situations I can think of where I wanted to be there for you, wondering if she was there for you too. Yall have history. We don't. You'd ask for expensive gifts, gifts that I fully planned to buy. But you knew you didn't want anything to do with me. We talked about matching tattoos. We talked about a lot of things that I have to just assume were lies now. You asked me to give you a month. In a month, exactly to the date, I found her. So I wonder what was your original plan. What was going to happen in a month. You also told me you were going to fall off the face of the earth for two months. You told me we were going to New York together. You told me our relationship would survive this break you needed. You needed to find you. I was sad. I feared you wouldn't come back. I feared you'd become the person you wanted to be but you wouldn't need me to be a part of you anymore. But I loved you. You said we'd survive. That we were stronger than this. I leave for New York on Friday. Ur nowhere to be found.

I was mad, but I wanted a goodbye. Closure. Real closure. Not some junk in a box on my front porch. I wanted you to see me cry. I told you to die instead. I didn’t mean that. It’d be fucked up. I was hurt. I threw up. I cried. I’ve been high since you left.

I don't want to sleep on your mental stability.

I hope ur ok.