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bustyasianbeautiespod · 2 years ago

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Episode 67 Transcript: We Are Witnessing Destiel Live

[intro guitar music]

G: Hello. My name is Grey.

C: And my name is Crystal.

G: And this is Busty Asian Beauties, a Supernatural commentary podcast work where I, someone who has seen this show several times…

C: And I, someone who only knows the show through social media, discuss every single episode of Supernatural from start to finish. Also, we are both Asian.

G: Both Asian! For today's episode, we will be discussing Season 4, Episode 7: “It's the Great Pumpkin, Sam Winchester,” written by Julie Siege, a new name in the writing team, and directed by Charles Beeson. Julie Siege wrote a very important episode of Supernatural. “The Monster at the End of This Book,” which I think is interesting. She is only in Seasons 4 and 5, so.

C: Interesting. Yeah. What are the other, like, women writers who we’re going to encounter later?

G: I honestly don't know.

C: Yeah. I feel like every time I see a new woman's name, I'm like, “Maybe she won't be weird about women.” But then she is weird about women. I guess that is just what Supernatural does to you.

G: I'm looking through the writers, and- oh! We have one. We have one, I remember. What's her name? Meredith Glynn.

C: Oh, yeah. People like Meredith Glynn.

G: Yeah, people like Meredith.

C: Alright. All my hopes are now on Meredith Glynn.

G: Yeah. You know, Eugenie Ross-Leming is a woman.

C: Oh, right. Yeah. Well. [both laugh] Well.

G: She's doing the opposite of intersectional feminism. [laughs]

C: Yeah. Exactly.

G: She said "I will not intersect this non-feminism." [C laughs]

C: Sure. Yes. She did say that. That's a quote from her.

G: Yeah.

C: If Cas wasn't in this episode, this would be like, maybe one of the most miserable times I've ever had watching Supernatural. [G laughs]

G: It was funny, because the entire like, first half of the episode without Cas, I was watching it with such a deep frown on my face. [C laughs] And then he showed up, and I was like, "Oh my god, it's him!" I was giggling, twirling my hair every time he was around. And like, a couple of things- couple of things I want to comment on before we start, I want to say that the last ten- I mean, you know this. The last 10 minutes of this episode, I did watch on Zoom from Crystal's laptop because my very legal, [C laughs] non-pirated version of Supernatural was not working. And you were not around while I was doing the watching, you were doing your own shit. I- My audio was so bad. [both laugh]

C: Oh no!

G: It was, you know, your typical Zoom audio, where it's like, it doesn't record the music or anything. It just records the like, dialogue? That was what was coming through to me. So everything in the last 10 minutes sounded like, it was a terrible dub of Supernatural. So I just want to preface that, that like, yeah, that was what was happening.

C: Yeah. At least you had captions.

G: I did have captions. It was wonderful. Yeah. And also, guys, girls, nonbinary fellas, everyone in between, we are witnessing Destiel live. [C laughs] I had this thought like, while watching this episode, like, "I'm literally watching Destiel right now." And we are. I feel like this episode is the first one where it really felt like we're watching Destiel.

C: And we're also watching the much less popular ship Samuriel live.

G: We are also watching Samuriel live. [C laughs] It's just- it's so fascinating to me because- I don't know. Like, for so long, Destiel has been kind of like, this nebulous thing for me.

C: Mm.

G: Like, after the series ended, and I would watch like, one episode at a time of a random episode, and it always just felt like this nebulous, ungraspable thing. And now it's right in front of me, and I'm watching it play out like, week by week. And it's like, “Oh, it's starting. And it's gonna continue going.” And that's- I'm- like, I'm excited! I'm looking forward to it.

C: Good. Happy for you!

G: You're not? [laughs] What does that mean?

C: I only, like- it's hard for me to care about Destiel when I don't like Dean during a certain week.

G: The other thing is like, you know, the quote "Destiel" this episode, it's really like, Cas, like, Cas character development. So I think that's why I'm so into it, because it's like, we get to see more of Cas, and it's like, him developing as a character and expanding what it means for him to be doing all these things that they're doing. And it's actually not about Dean at all, like, the Cas parts right now. But, you know, it's still- I would still say that it is a Destiel moment. So I'm gonna give them that.

C: Yeah. I just wish Dean wasn't the first person that Cas met during his stint on Earth. I guess he met Jimmy. Whatever.

G: He in fact met Jimmy. And you know what? I think that guy's gay or something.

C: I do think that guy's gay or something.

G: Should we say that that's a reference to an email we received? [laughs]

C: Oh, yeah, let's not take credit for the sentence “I think that's guy's gay or something.” That was an email that we got.

G: It's from Jason. So thank you, Jason, for your wonderful email to us. We quote it so much. We literally say, like, “I think this guy’s gay or something” to each other about literally anyone.

C: Yeah, yeah, it's a good sentence.

G: Yeah. I think this guy's gay or something.

C: Or something.

G: Yeah. Well, let us start.

C: What did I know about the episode?

G: - which is, we do that by asking you what you know. So what did you know about this episode before going in? I think this is a very prominent episode in the fandom, and just the lore of the show. Like, it's important for a lot of characters, so I'm not surprised if you know, like, pretty much everything.

C: I mean, I don't know the case of this episode because the case is stupid [G laughs], but- god. What the fuck.

G: I texted you, I think, like- “This double bluff is so fucking stupid.” And it was. It was so stupid.

C: It was so stupid. But other than not much about the case, I know we have the Sastiel scene where Sam and Cas meet for the first time. And there's like, the handshake and the hand over the hand, and like, Cas calling Sam “the boy with the demon blood,” and Sam having a cute thing where he goes like, “Oh my god! I mean- no- sorry- wait!” Ah, good for him. I know that we meet Uriel for the first time in this episode, which is exciting. What I know about the case was that there was a witch and that like, Sam and Dean were like, looking too small-picture whereas the angels wanted to do something big-picture about the case, but I didn't know the specifics. And I knew about the bench scene where Cas says, “I'm not a… [both] hammer, as you say.” [G screams]

G: He has questions, he has doubts!

C: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what I knew about this episode.

G: Yeah. Well, honestly, this episode is good to me, you know? Like, the case is stupid, but the episode is iconic in a way.

C: I think all the good parts of the ep are completely separate from the case, so it's hard to call it good overall.

G: Yeah, that's true. Like, it feels separate and also like, if the case is literally anything else, it would still work. If it just had some fundamentals. Yeah. Well.

G: We start the episode with a “Road So Far” that I thought was very nice. It was just- it was like, “It's Halloween,” and it starts off with Sam from the very first episode, going like, “I hate Halloween” or whatever he says there. And then, like, you know, monsters show up, and it's like, Halloween Halloween Halloween.

C: Okay, yes, but- did I get the wrong music for this "Road So Far," or was it like- was it an instrumental that sounded both dramatic and comedic?

G: I would say it sounded comedic.

C: Yeah, okay. It sounded like both to me; it didn't really work.

G: Yeah, okay. And then after the monster parade, we get Cas, and I loove that. Because it's like, “Oh, he's kind of a monster.” Like, that's the vibe, right? Like, “Look at all these monsters. And then there's this guy who may or may not be a monster.” I just think, like, you know, having angels kind of like, makes the concept of like, “What is human?” etc etc like, slightly more nebulous than what it was before. I like that.

C: Yeah. Agreed.

G: But yeah, that's for the “Road So Far.” We start the episode with like, a two days before Halloween situation, and a woman comes home, and she's carrying a pumpkin and a box of candy. Like, a bucket box of candy. And she has a lovely husband and a lovely child. And the husband is feeding the kid, and it's so messy. And the thing is, you know, we used to have a little baby in the house because my little sister is so much, so, so much younger than me. So that's recent. Like, that's recent in my mind. I was already like, a grown child. Like, you know, I was a teenager when she showed up. And like, I remember feeding the kid, and I just think if you're feeding a child and like, it's that messy, I think something is happening that shouldn't be happening, you know? [both laugh] I don't know. Maybe my little sister was a very like, proper, like, you know, like, neat child. But I was like, "Oh, okay." I don't know. I just didn't like it. I didn't like it. Why did you make the kids so messy? Stop it. Like, have a bib. There should be a bib.

C: That's true. There was no bib.

G: There was no bib, and I hated it. [C laughs] There should be a bib.

The woman puts the candy up in the like, fucking drawer, or whatever that's called. Cabinet. And the guy is like, “Oh, I'm gonna get some candy,” and the lady’s like, “Don't do that because it's gonna run out, and we need to give it to the children.” And she goes and gets the baby and gives the baby a bath or whatever. A wash. And she asks, like, “Are you gonna come with me,” like, to the husband, and the husband’s like, “No, I'm just gonna stay here, with all the candy. I'm not gonna do anything.” And he does do something, which is he eats one candy, and then he gets a fucking razor lodged into his like, upper palette. Is there a lower palette? Is that a thing? Or is it soft and hard? I think it's soft and hard.

C: Yeah, that sounds right.

G: He had a razor up his soft palette. And it's actually a very, very visceral scene to watch, because the camera is inside the mouth.

C: That's true. That was fun.

G: It was fun. I loved it. But he was digging the razor out, and then he digs it out, and then he starts coughing up even more razors, and it's like, you know. He's dying, he’s dead, and then his wife walks in with the little baby child, and the guy’s dead. And the kid doesn't look traumatized.

C: I don't think the kid understands what's happening.

G: Yeah, no, like, that's what I'm saying. Like, if he is gonna die, at least die like, early enough for your child to not know. [laughing]

C: Yeah. Yeah, very thoughtful and considerate of this guy. I agree.

G: Yeah. Also of the witch, too.

C: So we cut to Sam and Dean questioning Mrs. Wallace-

G: The day after.

C: Yeah, the day after. By the way, it is now one day before Halloween. Gasp. So, you know, she's talking about how razor blades in candy are an urban myth around the time of Halloween and she didn't think it would actually happen. But Dean finds a hex bag under a table, and at this, Sam starts asking like, “Hey, did he have any enemies? Like, maybe a woman?” And Mrs. Wallace, like, freaks a bit, goes like, "He would fucking never have an affair, and no one hated him. Get out." So they do get out, and they go to a motel room.

G: For once, when they interview someone, and they're like, "Your husband or your wife or your whatever. Did they have any enemies?" I want the person to be like, "Yeah, probably. [C laughs] Like, I think this guy's a bit of an asshole, and I think many people hate him."

C: Yeah. I'm sure it probably happens at least one episode.

G: Yeah, it probably does. I mean, there are 15 seasons of this show.

C: There sure are are.

So Sam's doing readings, and he's also inspecting the contents of the hex bag.�� There's like, a bit through this episode where Dean's like, eating a bunch of Halloween candy, and it's not funny, but it does happen. Sam says, like, a line where he's like, "Dean shouldn't really be celebrating Halloween this much, because for us, every day is Halloween." Okay, Sam.

G: Do you know why he hates Halloween? Like, the cannon reasoning.

C: I know that the reasoning that the fandom says makes more sense than the canon reasoning is that his mom died 2 days after it. But is the cannon reason just that for them, every day is Halloween?

G: No! There's a future Halloween episode where he expounds on why he hates Halloween. It's in a very much later season Supernatural episode. And I thought that episode was fun. And I liked it.

C: Okay, well, I look forward to finding out.

G: Yeah, look forward to it.

C: So what's inside the hex bag is goldthread, which is an herb that's been extinct for 200 years, like, a genuine Celtic coin that's 600 years old, and then the charred metacarpal bone of a newborn baby.

G: Which is gonna be surprisingly relevant.

C: Yeah, yeah, which is fun.

G: Dean was like, "Oh, this bone's disgusting," and Sam's like, "It's probably like, 100, 200 years old. It's fine." I respect that.

C: Yeah, I respect that also. Dean reiterates that he hates witches, which, yeah, okay. I know he says in canon it's because, like, he finds their spell practices unhygienic. But like, it is just really convenient that his least favorite monster's a [overlapping] women-dominated career. Like, maybe Dean should think about that. [G laughs] But yeah. Meanwhile, Dean cannot find any reason why someone would want to kill Luke Wallace.

G: Yeah.

G: Now we are at a fucking high school party. Were you like, a high school party person? I am willing to bet no.

C: No. No. Yeah. In senior year, I found out that my classmates drank alcohol, and I was like, genuinely shocked. [laughs] Like, I was that kind of a kid.

G: Yeah. Okay. Oh, yeah, you're not like, of drinking age at senior year for you.

C: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, people do it. But did I know, at the tender age of 17 that people did it? No. 'Cause none of my friends did.

G: None of your friends drank?

C: No.

G: Okay. [laughs] The way I said "okay," it was like, with so much disbelief. I do mean, like, "okay" in a proper, non-judgmental way.

C: Yeah.

G: I was also not a party person, and I think I was just in a school that wasn't also a party school. Do you think that's like, a fundamental experience in life that you missed? Because sometimes I do feel that way.

C: No. I don't. It sounds like it's not fun, and according to Supernatural, you might like, die from it. So.

G: Yeah. According to my friends who were in party schools, everyone vaped. [C laughs] And I was like, "Okay." Smoking, I think smoking is so sexy. Vaping, I think, is so horrible. [laughs] And I don't care about the health consequences at fucking all. I just think if you're going to do something that is edgy or whatever, might as well do it while looking like hot shit. So that's my take for why you should smoke, always, every day. [C laughs]

We follow like, two ladies. One of them is Jenny, and the other is Tracy.

C: I don't know how to impress upon the audience how bad the acting in this scene is. Like, this entire scene feels like it was written and acted by aliens who only learned about earth teenagers through like, watching one 90's teen show that starts with someone introducing the cliques in a high school

G: That is true, but also, it was fine. I didn't find it too much.

C: Huh. I found it pretty unwatchable.

G: Yeah, I just- I found one scene unwatchable, which we'll get into when we get there. But okay. So one of them is dressed like a nurse, and then the other is dressed like a cheerleader, which becomes semi-relevant in a comment later on. They're in a party that is so sparse of people. [C laughs] Like, the Hereditary party where they bake a full cake looks so much more fun than this party, and that party was just fine. I think. [laughs] I love how my basis for parties, because I've never been to a house party, is the the party from Hereditary where they bake a cake.

They say something which I was like, "What the fuck does that mean?" They say, "This party blows. We should go TP somebody." And I was like, "What the fuck does that mean?" And apparently, TP means toilet paper. And also, it means to wrap something or someone in toilet paper. Why?

C: Houses get TP-ed on like, Halloween sometimes. They find it fun to like, just like, wrap all the trees and some of the house in toilet paper.

G: You go around the house and you carry toilet paper-?

C: I feel like usually, what you do is, okay, you carry toilet paper in like, a roll, and then you toss it really high in the air to like, get it around a branch, and it like, unfurls beautifully, and you sort of leave long strands of toilet paper hanging off of trees and such. And it's like, meant to be a mean thing to do to like, make it like, an annoying cleanup job for the person who lives in the house. But it looks pretty cool.

G: Yeah. I learned incredibly recently that people in like, in other places don't just call every kind of tissue "tissue." So like, you guys, you guys have facial tissue, you have toilet paper, you have- table napkin? You have stuff like that. Like, for us, everything is tissue, and basically, tissue, by virtue, is toilet paper. I remember one time, like, a K-Pop idol, like, ate something, and then to wipe his mouth, he brought out a roll of toilet paper, and then wiped his mouth with that, and everyone was like, "That's so nasty. That's so nasty." [laughs] And I was like, "What?" And that's how I found out about the whole like, napkin, blah blah blah debacle. Which is, I think, fascinating, because I have told people before that I use a napkin - I don't know. Maybe I should edit this out - for my period. [laughs] And now I'm wondering like, what they thought that meant. [both laugh] Because, like, "napkin" here is "menstrual pad." So like, "I used a napkin for my period," I think maybe there was a miscommunication there. But they didn't ask questions, so I don't know.

C: I think they probably got that it was just like, a different term.

G: Something. Yeah, it's a different term.

G: As the party goes on, they approach a guy and the guy's like, "Oh, I can't get into the fucking booze cabinet. Also, are you going to the mausoleum tomorrow?" And they're like, "Yeah, probably, we're going to the mausoleum. Can I bob for some apples?" So Jenny- well, Tracy goes and bobs apples, which, something that I am deeply unfamiliar with. But it's just a tub with water, and then there's apples on it.

C: Yeah. And I know that it's a real thing, because it was in Charlie Brown, and there's a Regina Spektor song called "Bobbing for Apples."

G: I know that this is real because this is completely, very relevant to why Sam hates Halloween.

C: Huh!

G: It's a story about bobbing apples.

C: Wow. Okay. I look forward to this story even more now.

G: This teaser of like, four years in the making is so fascinating. [both laugh]

She succeeds, so Jenny goes and bobs for apples for herself.

C: Specifically, I think we have to explain, the dynamic here is that they're both into this guy that they're talking to, Justin.

G: Yeah. Who looks like the most loser guy alive. But you know what? I'm not gonna judge.

C: Yeah. Yeah. And like, Jenny at first is like, "Oh, that's lame, I don't want to do that." But then, like, Tracy like, does bobbing for apples in a way that I think is supposed to be sexy? And like, Justin's into it. And then like, that's when Jenny stalks over and is like, "Let me have a go."

G: She's having a hard time bobbing for apples, and then suddenly, she just can't lift her head out. It's like something is pushing her down. And I thought this was an interesting thing because- this is the part that I couldn't watch. Like, they were trying to pull her out of the water by grabbing her arms. And I just thought like, "What?" If someone is drowning in front of you in a tub of water, I think you would grab them by the body. But, you know, they were not doing that. And then she gets boiled alive.

C: Yep, the water increases in heat, starts bubbling, and her face turns really red, and she fucking dies.

G: Yeah, RIP.

C: Pretty cool, I have to say

G: So Sam and Dean enter this fucking basement. And it's basically Tracy, who's covered in a shock blanket, talking to some guy. Like, a forensics guy.

C: Yup.

G: Sam and Dean see this, and Dean stops Sam from going and goes, "No, I got this one."

C: Yup.

G: And Dean looks like, excited.

C: Yup.

G: And Sam goes, "Two words, Dean. Jail bait." [C screams] And Dean goes, "I would never!" But like, in a tone and a face that's like, "I would, though." And it's like, I hate it so much! I hate it so much!

C: Yeah. Yeah, it's like, okay, that's great that this 29-year-old man has and/or would fuck 17-year-olds at his age. That's great. I think it's really good that Supernatural did that as a joke, and they should do it all the time, because it's really good.

I also just fucking hate the word "jailbait" so much.

G: I know, yeah.

C: For obvious reasons. Ugh! Because yeah, bait implies intentionality, etc etc, and it's like, fully a one-sided "you being a creep" thing. [groans]

G: Yeah. But Dean does go to Tracy.

C: The fun thing that I found out while looking up the origins of the word jailbait are that the Wiki page for the word ends with "The frequent use of the term jailbait in popular culture has been linked to a greater understanding of age of consent laws among teenagers." [laughs] Like, diversity win. This term that was probably coined by creeps and pedophiles has led to greater understanding of age of consent laws among teenagers. Good job.

G: Dean goes up and says like, "Oh, do you know Luke Wallace?" And Tracy is like, "Nope, I don't." And then in the back, Sam is looking for hex bags, and like, that's all that happens this scene.

C: Yep.

C: So we go back to the motel room, Sam's reading the lore books, and he says that these killings probably aren't about revenge, they might be a witch working a spell. So he says that like, there's some Celtic ceremony where you have to do three blood sacrifices over three days, the last before midnight, on the final day of the final harvest, which this year is October 31st. Halloween. And then Sam starts saying things that I found no factual basis for on any of the Internets. He says that the witch is summoning a demon named Samhain, which they keep pronouncing like it's like, first name Sam, last name Hayne [G laughs], when like, the actual ceremony is pronounced "sah-wen." [both laugh] But, you know. Whatever. If that's what they're gonna say, that's just what I'm gonna say for this episode. So Sam says, okay, that this is a demon and that Halloween originated because, like, Celtic people believed that it was like, the night of the year when the veil between the living and the dead was thinnest, and they were all super afraid that "Samhain" was gonna come get them so they would wear masks and like, leave candy out and carve faces onto pumpkins. And then Sam says, "Oh, he was exorcised centuries ago," which I thought was so funny. But yeah. So Google does not indicate that "Samhain" was ever a demon, it's just the name of a holiday, and Time magazine says that the particulars of the holiday are really not known at all, so we could not say anything about masks or sweets or anything. So yeah. I- well, Supernatural.

Sam says that this is really heavyweight witchcraft, and the ritual can only be performed every 600 years, and that is tomorrow. Another thing about "Samhain" is that once he is raised as a demon, he can raise like, a bunch of monsters. Like, just like, any of them, I guess? Like, zombies and ghosts. Dean has a joke part where he says that he is genuinely afraid of leprechauns because they have small hands. Yeah, whatever. They're nervous about what will happen if they raise Samhain and then every other monster.

G: This is interesting to me because they talk about it like, "Oh, everything we have ever fought, all in one place." [laughs] This is exactly the plot of the beginning of Season 15.

C: Oh, yeah.

G: Yeah. And they were in a cementary- "cementary." Cemetery too.

G: Dean is eating candy, which, you know, they do a lot this episode. And Dean is watching the Luke Wallace's house. Well, the Wallace's, I suppose. Dean is watching the Wallace's house, and he says that he interviewed the lady again, and he doesn't know how to connect, and blah blah blah, there's nobody here, and like, we need someone who can go to the Wallaces and also go to the party, and we don't know anyone who's like that. And he's just- he's talking and talking, and he goes, "Son of a bitch." And Sam's like, "Quit whining." [C laughs] And Dean literally goes like, "No, Sam. I mean son of a bitch." I hate that. I hate that entire exchange. I thought it was so corny, so wrought out. There's something that- Katya says a line. "It's so corny, tired, and played out." I would say that it is all three of those things.

C: Yeah.

G: And apparently, Tracy from the party is the babysitter for the Wallace's baby. So there goes their connection.

C: Yup.

C: So Dean returns to the motel, and yeah. Well, Tracy said, like, "Oh, I have no clue who Luke Wallace is" during the interview, so definitely, something is up. And then Dean has a line, which- Look, I respect the hustle. I respect taking misogynistic, pedophilic lines and turning them into trans Dean rights. And I also support transfem Dean rights, I support bigender Dean Winchester, and he/she Dean Winchesters. But my heart's not in it today, folks.

G: Yeah.

C: What he says is, "Well, if you were a 600-year-old hag, and you could pick any costume to come back in, wouldn't you go for a hot cheerleader? I would. And he like, sort of looks off into the distance, fantasizing. And he is clearly fantasizing about like, playing with his teenage tits in front of a mirror, but like, you know, if you want to interpret that as bigender Dean Winchester, like, I support you. I just can't.

G: The way I interpreted it was him saying, like, taking the end of that sentence, and just running with that part.

C: Oh, just hot cheerleaders in general?

G: You know, like, he said, "If you could pick anything," and then he goes like, "Wouldn't you go for a hot cheerleader?" And then he pauses a long time. And like, it feels like his answer, like, "I would." is in reference to "Wouldn't you go for a hot cheerleader?" meaning, "Wouldn't you have sex with a hot cheerleader?"

C: Ohh.

G: I don't know. Like, that's how I interpreted it, but even the show was like, "What's going on here?" because they make Sam do the "What's going on here?" face.

C: True. True. Alright, that's something. So Sam says "Tracy is not as wholesome as she looks," and what he means by that is she just got in a fight with a teacher once. Like, who doesn't get in a fight with a teacher once?

G: Yeah. [laughs]

G: So Tracy fought a teacher. And then we go to the teacher, and it's this guy who looks like Sam Winchester and Lee from Season 15, combined.

C: Oh yeah! It does.

G: Yeah. And he has that- specifically, he looks a lot more like Lee. But he has that vibe of like, [mocking voice] "I'm just a cool guy, and I slam back beers, and I drive my pickup truck-"

C: [laughing] He's literally fine!

G: Yeah. He has that vibe.

C: Before they meet him, though, there's like, a scene where, like, Dean's looking at one of the art projects, which is-

G: A bong, yeah.

C: - a mask of like, some like, twisted-up, screaming person. And there's like, ominous music playing.

G: [laughs] I immediately jumped to the bong. But yes, there is a fucked-up mask of like, a sick and twisted tortured person. And I mean, like, literally like a tortured person, not like, Van Gogh, you know. But yeah, and there's ominous music.

C: Sam goes, "Bring back memories?" And Dean gets startled and goes, "What?" Because supposedly, when he tortured people in Hell, they looked like that. RIP.

G: Which is such a devastating- not devastating. Horrifying thought. Like, the fact that he was torturing them to the point of that kind of mutilation is like, so scary!

C: Yeah, I mean, it's not like he was torturing them niceys.

G: They were like, "Ouch! Owie! Oww! That's painful, Dean!"

C: Yeah. And he brought them band-aids.

But what Sam meant is, "Being a teenager. All that angst." Which I love. I love to imagine what angsty teen Sam Winchester was like. Like, I think that he definitely like, shoplifted mascara, and like, brought it in like, a bag at the bottom of his backpack to school, and then did it in the school bathroom mirror, and then wiped it off when he got home. Like, I feel like, that's a that's a big part of who Sam Winchester is in my mind. What do you think Sam's angst was like?

G: I know fundamentally that Sam was rebellious, etc. But I cannot think of like, something he would do that would be purposefully upsetting for others. I think he would unpurposefully upset others, but I don't think he was going out of his way to be like, "Oh, I'm gonna do this specifically to spite Dad, or to spite Dean." He was just doing things, and he was spiting them along the way. There's like, a part in- I forgot which season it was. Oh, Season 5! "Dark Side of the Moon," where he was revealed to have run away from home, and he had a pet dog and everything, and it was a very happy memory, and he didn't even consider that Dean was like, very devastated and worried that time of his life. And like, yeah, maybe. Like, Sam's angst was not like, reveling in the sadness. It was chasing happiness. And that just happened to be considered rebellious for him.

C: Oh. Well, now I'm sad. [G laughs] But I like this interpretation.

G: Yeah.

C: I don't think people are always so kind, though. I'm sure that sometimes he would do things to piss his dad off or Dean off.

G: Yeah.

C: I mean, this isn't like, purposefully pissing people off, but I feel like- like, if I was Sam, and I wanted to do soccer instead of hunting, I would just lie so much about other things that were happening at school and then go to soccer practice. And the fact that he like, went up and was like, "I want to do soccer practice. Here are hours I shan't be home." Like, I don't know. I feel like that could evolve into him like, purposefully doing things to piss off his family.

G: I think this is something that I was notoriously- it was something I was notorious for when I was younger, and I guess even until now, but like, my mom has figured it out so she doesn't do it as often. But you know, like, parents sometimes would do like, ultimatums? Like, "If you do this, then I will do this," or, "If you do this-" you know, ultimatums. And I would be like, "Okay," and then I would do the thing. And I would be like, "Okay, now, what? Are you gonna do it? Are you gonna do what you promised you'd do?" [C laughs] And the thing is like, the promises are like, "I will kick you out of the house," and I would literally do the thing and stand there and be like, "Okay, tell me to get out of your house, and I'll never come back." Like, you know. [laughs] It wasn't like, rebel- like, it was rebelling, but it was more of like, "You said- you promised me something. So now deliver on it." Like, that was the logic behind it. And I think that would be something Sam would do.

C: Oh, definitely.

G: Yeah, like, John would say, like, if you- I mean, he did it for Stanford, right? Like, "If you go to Stanford, you'll never- like, you're never allowed to come back to us ever again." And then he went, and he committed to the bit. He was like, "I'm never gonna come back." So yeah. That's so Sam.

C: It is very Sam.

G: What if he's just like me for real? Have we considered that?

C: What if he's just like you for real?

G: Yeah, the art teacher comes in, and he says like- Sam tells him, "Oh, Mr. Harding," blah blah blah, and he goes like, "Oh, please. Just call me Don." He says that he had a fight with Tracy. Like, he confirms after he asks, and he says that "It's a shame because she's so talented" and etc. And Dean asks like, "Did you guys have a violent altercation, as it is said in the report?" And they don't really clarify what he means by like, "violent altercation." He just says that she exploded, and "Tracy would have clawed my eyes out if the principal didn't pass by." And the reason he gives is that she's writing sigils on her notebook and she would like, draw primitive drawings of murder, and she would put herself in the drawings and be like, the murderer. So.

C: Yeah, I think it was specifically like, giant murder fests, and like, she would be one of the characters doing a giant murder fest. God forbid women do anything!

G: God forbid.

She is like, she lives on her own. She has an apartment. And she was like, she got here a year ago because she was emancipated. She's an emancipated teen. Which, that's like the first time I heard that word used that way. But is that a common-?

C: Oh, yeah, it's like a legal thing.

G: Ah, yeah. Don says like, "God only knows what her parents were like!" Which, the reveal is that they're brother-sister, right? Which I think is like, a little joke that like, "Our parents were terrible people." [laughs]

C: Yeah.

G: Good for them for having that inside joke.

C: Mm-hm. Happy for them.

G: Happy for them.

C: So we return to the motel, and Sam couldn't find Tracy at her apartment; Dean couldn't find any info from her friends. And then there's like, this totally useless scene where there's like, this little kid who's dressed as an astronaut. This is not case-relevant. I thought, like, "Surely, this must be somehow case-relevant." But no. He goes up to them, he asks for candy, trick or treat. Dean's like, "This is a motel, so we don't have any candy." Sam says, "No, we like, actually bought a lot." But then Dean's like, "No, I ate all of it." And then, yeah, I don't know, kid keeps insisting. Sam just fucking leaves, and Dean ends the conversation with like, "Oh, well, I think you've had enough candy." And then he like-

G: The kid squints at Dean, yeah.

C: Yeah, squints at Dean, and then like, deliberately bumps into him when walking away. Real.

G: They were just trying to get Sam to get like, to the room first. [laughs]

C: Yeah, I think that makes sense.

G: Which, this sure is a way to do it.

C: Yeah. It sure fucking is.

So, as you mentioned, Sam gets the room first, and guess who's there, you guys?! God, it's been so long! It's so- oh my god. It's the him. He's there. He's literally there. Oh my god.

Agh, he's so beautiful this episode.

G: He is!

C: Like, he's always beautiful, but he really is so beautiful this episode. Like, he's like, sitting, and like, his little forehead seems like, a little wrinkled. His back is facing Sam, and, like, you know, Sam comes in with his gun and goes like, "Who are you?" But Dean stops him because he says, “Sam, wait! It’s Castiel. The angel.” And then we also see that Uriel is standing by the window. His back faces them, and he does not turn around for a good while yet.

G: Yeah.

C: And, you know, we get the Sastiel meeting scene. Sam's face completely changes, and like, Cas says hi to him, and Sam goes like, "Oh my god! Sorry- I didn't mean to-" And then, "It's an honor, really. I've heard a lot about you." I'm like, honestly surprised he doesn't call Cas "sir." That's so the vibe of him right now. [G laughs]

G: It literally is.

C: And like, he comes forward and holds out his hand, but like, Cas like, either doesn't like Sam or doesn't know what a handshake is. Like, it's not entirely clear what the situation is. And Sam sort of like, moves his hand a little to be like, "Hey, come on," and Cas, you know, shakes his hand, but really just like, puts his hand in Sam's hand. And he goes like, "And I've heard a lot about you. Sam Winchester. [both] The boy with the demon blood." And Sam's face falls. And Cas like, puts his other hand on top of Sam's and goes, "Glad to see you've ceased your extracurricular activities." Ah! I love him soo much. He's so pretty.

G: I mean, yes, we do love him so much. But also, how devastating for Sam.

C: Oh, yeah, he's being quite mean. Oh yes. Yeah. Sam is also here. [laughs] So, sorry, Sam. And yeah. The thing is that Sam knew that the angels sent Dean back in time, and then told Dean to like, make Sam stop the demon blood thing. But I guess it feels different coming from- Like, maybe this whole time, he was secretly hoping that Dean was lying to him, that he was just like, making it up to like, get him to stop because he was being such a dick in "Metamorphosis." But this is like, confirmation. And I mean, it must also be like, maybe he didn't know that the angels knew about like, the Azazel blood thing specifically, so like, it's probably devastating to know that they know his full history. Yeah. And, you know, Uriel says, "Let's keep it that way." And Dean asks Cas who Uriel is, and Cas ignores the question, which is so Cas of him. He asks if they stopped the raising of [overlapping] "Samhain." [both laugh]

And okay, like, I was tracking like, Cas's eye contact a lot throughout this scene-

G: Oh, Jesus Christ. Let's get into it.

C: Oh god, is- [laughs] I mean, it doesn't even matter that much. Okay, like, he's first looking at Sam with like, very intense, big blue eyes. And he asks this question to Sam, but when Dean asks, "Why?" Cas like, completely- like, he turns his head, but not his body towards Dean, and then goes, "Dean, have you located the witch?" And, agh, I don't know, it's so fun when he says Dean's name when it's not necessary. [G laughs] Because, like, it feels like "Here's an extra special little thing for my buddy."

G: He literally is obsessed with Dean. Like, I'm so sorry to say this. We'll get to the part that I thought was hilarious later in regards to like, staring and stuff. But yeah. Basically, Cas asking if they've located the witch, if they can kill the witch, you know, stuff like that. And then he reveals that, like, the raising of Samhain is one of the 66 seals. And Dean says, "So this is about your buddy Lucifer." And Uriel says, "Lucifer is no friend of ours." And, you know what? [both] He is the funniest angel in the garrison. He's the funniest angel in the garrison. And like, Dean being like, "It's just an expression." Like, you don't understand, Dean. He is the one who is joking here, not you. You know? You don't get it.

C: Yeah, yeah. Also, Cas reveals- this is important. Like, Cas reveals that they found a hex bag in the motel room just then, and it had to have just been placed after that interview because, like, they weren't affected by it yet. And like, he walks away to like, fetch the hex bag and like, he's making eye contact with them when he like, says that he found it. But then he's looking down and away from them when he says, "If we hadn't found it, surely one or both of you would be dead." Which means nothing, but also means everything. To me. [G laughs]

G: It literally means nothing. But it also means everything! Yeah.

And you know, they're talking, they're talking. Dean is saying, "Well, you can locate the witch, can you?" And Cas is saying, "Nope!" And Sam says, "Well, we can just work together," and then Uriel just snaps and says, "Stop this nonsense!" And Dean finally asks again, "Who is this guy?" And Uriel finally turns around, and Cas says that Uriel is a specialist. And slowly, they figure out after Cas says that Sam and Dean both need to leave the town, that what they're going to do is massacre the entire town.

C: Whoo!

Also, it doesn't matter at all, but, like, whatever God decided that Misha Collins was going to be shorter than both Jackles and Jarpad-

G: Yeah!!!

C: Like, thank you so much.

G: [laughing] He's so smal! He's such a small, small guy.

C: Yeah. And like, he's like, talking with such authority, but like, because he's standing close to him, like, he's like, clearly looking up. Like, he's has to strain his fucking neck and incline his fucking head to talk to both of them [G screams]. And like, ah! Yeah.

G: There's also a part where it like, pans out, and it looks so ridiculous because he looks so small. [both laugh] Like, he's holding his hand like, together like he's a little child.

C: Oh my god, yes, yes. When we open to the next scene- yeah. Like, he's looking down, and he's holding his hands together, and he's sort of like, stimming a bit like, with like, picking at his skin or something. And like, oh my god! [laughs] Hi!

G: Hi! Hi, Cas!

C: Hii.

G: Yeah. So Cas and Uriel say that like, "Oh, we're gonna kill everyone here." Sam's like, "There's a thousand people here," and Uriel says, "A thousand, two hundred, and fourteen."

C: Which I love.

G: I like that. I love that. Because it's like, "We know the gravity of this situation, but also we don't understand it at all." Like, yeah, there's 1,214 people here, I know the exact number. But like, he doesn't really understand that number the way Sam does. Because to the angels, this is literally just like, nothing, you know? But like, to Sam it means like, a lot of people, so. And Uriel reveals that, you know, he's a specialist. He has purified a city before.

C: Which, it's fun to like- I feel like- 'cause we don't really- this wasn't like, a case. Like, a city being purified. So like, this happened like, a long time ago. Like, I like the way that it establishes him as like, an OG angel in the way that I feel like Cas hasn't quite been yet. Like, Uriel has a history now that Cas doesn't. I feel like- did he Sodom and Gomorrah? I hope he Sodomed and Gomorrahed.

G: Well, he is, in fact- well, he has amnesia moment. You know. The brainwashing.

C: Yeah, yeah. Poor Cas. Sorry, dude.

G: There's a line here that starts one of the funniest scenes in this episode. Dean is saying like -Cas is saying basically that they need to hold the line and that they need to kill all these people so that the seals will be broken. And Dean's like, "Oh, yeah? Like, you're just gonna kill a thousand people and whatever because you screwed up?" And Cas says, "We need to do this thing. You don't understand. Like, there's a bigger picture here." And Dean goes like, "Right, because you're such a big picture kind of guy." And Cas walked towards him and just stares him down and says, "Lucifer cannot rise. Hell rises with him if he does. Is that something you're willing to risk?" And then Sam starts speaking in the background [both laugh], and I do mean literally in the background. Because the the camera doesn't go to Sam. It just stays at Dean, who is staring at Cas, and then it pans to Cas, who is staring at Dean [both laughing], while Sam is speaking in the background. And I thought it was absolutely hilarious. Like- I don't know. Like, why? Like, Sam is literally talking. But Cas doesn't care about him, the camera doesn't care about him, we're just staring at these two guys who are staring at each other. I respect that.

C: I think the implication is like, "Ooh, we're laying more hints about what Dean did in Hell, so we're like, having this intense look after he asks if he's willing to risk Hell," but like-

G: But it looks just gay as fuck!

C: - they just want to fuck each other so bad it makes them look stupid, is the thing. Yeah. Poor Sam. He and Cas do have a rockier start.

G: Like, Sam is basically saying, like, "No one has to die. Like, we'll do everything we can."-

C: And no one give a shit! [both laughing]

G: And no one give a single shit!

Anyway, Uriel says that like, "Let's stop wasting our time," and Cas says, "We have to follow our orders-"

C: He calls them "mud monkeys," which is fun.

G: Oh, yeah. Uriel keeps on saying this. Like, he is a fan of the words "mud monkeys." And we go back to Sam now, which, I actually like this little arch he has. Did you just hear what I said? I said, "I love this little [both] arch he has." Literally, he arches his back, it means, "attack this pussy." [C laughs] But like, this arc he has this episode where he becomes disillusioned by the angels. This is his first time meeting the angels, and we are to assume that prior to this, he had, like, a very positive outlook towards them, and this actually dictates what happens at the end of the episode. But Sam here, right now, says, "You're angels. You're supposed to show mercy."

C: Yeah. His voice like, sort of breaks on the word "angels." Ah, I love acting!

G: Yeah. And, you know, they keep on saying, "We have no choice." Dean says, "You do have a choice. You've never questioned a crap order? Are you just a hammer?" And Cas says-

C: Well, he says, "What are you both? Just a couple of hammers?" Like, Uriel was included in this, but he sadly doesn't get a Cas-level arc for the rest of the show.

G: Yeah, like, this line is relevant to a Cas line later. Cas says like- well, he first says, like, "Even if you can't understand it, have faith. The plan is just." And he says that it is just because it comes from Heaven, therefore it is just. And Dean says-

C: So about the it coming from Heaven- God isn't there.

G: So who is it coming from?

C: Who gave this order? I feel like Michael?

G: I think it's just like, some ambiguous- No. I don't know. I don't know.

C: Is Michael not around?

G: I really don't know.

C: Heaven seems to have a chain of command, 'cause like, there's garrison leaders and stuff, so I feel like it's like, a game of telephone where, like, Michael tells his next in command, "Hey, God said this," and then they tell the next person, "Michael said God said this."

G: The thing is like, with chains of commands like that, I feel like littler tasks don't even come from high, high, high up. It comes from like, the person higher than you one step. So like, I don't even think this is like a "Who's the highest in the pecking order?" who's giving this specific order to Cas to commit to this task. It's like, just like, the ambiguous, like, everybody. You know, like, somebody above him agreed to it, and now he's agreeing to it, and blah blah blah. It's all bullshit. It literally is just all bullshit.

C: But we- well, I guess since we find out later that, like, the point of all this was to test Dean-

G: To follow Dean, yeah.

C: Well, and also like, as a test of Dean, like, it makes sense for this to be like, Michael testing his vessel, you know what I mean?

G: It doesn't matter. Because when he becomes the vessel, it's not like he's gonna have any input whatsoever.

C: That is true. But like, also, like, they pay so much attention to Sam and Dean because of their vesseling. And I think that- I don't know. I feel like Supernatural is not really clear about why.

G: Yeah.

C: It's- oh, no, it's because they have to agree! Right? Like, the point is like, "Would Dean be willing to like, sacrifice himself, or like, the world, for the higher purpose of like, defeating Lucifer?" Like, this is just a mini version of that.

G: Evaluation of whether that is gonna to be the case.

C: Yeah. Like, "How hard will it be to convince Dean to say yes to Michael?" So I think that it could come from that high up if it's like, this important of a test.

G: Okay, yeah, that makes sense.

Well, anyway, what they eventually agree on is Sam and Dean are not leaving. And the way they do this is Eriel- ah, I keep on saying Eriel. But he is not in fact Eriel. Uriel tells Dean, like, "If you're not gonna leave, I'm just gonna pick you up and like, make you leave." And Dean says, like, "Well, you're gonna have to kill me, which I guess is going to be a problem because God commanded I rise from the dead, so that's gotta mean something, right?" And that works. And so they say that they're gonna find the witch, and everybody stay put, and they do just that.

C: I know we spent so long on the scene, but one thing- when Cas asks Dean, "Tell me something, Dean. When your father gave you an order, didn't you obey?" and like, Dean is taken aback for a second before he answers. I liked that.

G: I did like that.

C: That was definitely a scene of all time.

G: I did like that.

C: And it also makes me wonder how much Cas knows about Dean's history. Like, how hard did he think that would hit, or like, was he just like, "Oh, surely all people obey their fathers." [G laughs] or like, how much does he know?

G: Yeah.

C: And then one other thing, I find the scene really interesting because of, like, the later reveal of what the true orders are. Because, like, when Cas is saying, "Oh, we have no choice. These are the orders." he's facing away from them. He's facing Uriel.

G: He's looking at Uriel, yeah.

C: And it's because he's both telling Sam and Dean, "We have no choice. We have to smite the town," and he's telling Uriel, "We have no choice. We have to do what Dean says." So that's fun.

G: Yeah.

G: Anyway, they go out of the motel room, and the car has been egged. [laughs]

C: Real.

G: Love that. And of course it's the astronaut kid, and this is the only relevance of that this episode. But I do love it, and I love that, you know, it was a sad affair. Yeah.

C: Also, when Dean yells "Astronaut!" after seeing the eggs, like, you see Sam smile or laugh in the background. I think that's cute. I'm happy for him.

So they go inside the Impala, right, and Sam's like, fidgeting with the hex bag, he looks upset. And after some prompting, he goes, "I thought they'd be different. Like, the angels, I mean, I thought they'd be righteous." Oh, baby boy! And Dean goes like, "They are, and that's the problem, because-" he says "a-hole," because they can't swear on Supernatural. He says, "There's nothing more dangerous than some a-hole who thinks he's on a holy mission." Which- the last time Dean talked about holy missions was in “Monster Movie” when he said that hunting was a holy mission, [G laughs] so perhaps he should do some self-reflection about that.

G: Maybe we should reevaluate, Dean. You and I together. Let's sit down and talk. [C laughs]

C: Yeah. And then Sam says, "But I mean, this is God? And Heaven? This is what I've been praying to?" Ahh! "This is what I've been praying to?" is such a line. It's such a fucking line. Oh my god. However, it is prefaced by the piano music starting, [laughs] and that does make a little bit less of a line. Man, this must suck for Sam! And, you know, Dean goes like, "I know you're into the whole God thing, but like-" he uses the bad apples argument on Sam.

G: [laughs] Yeah, which is such a wild thing to do.

C: Yeah.

G: Yeah.

C: Yeah. And then he says, like, "For all we know, God hates these jerks."

G: He doesn't

C: He doesn't, though. Cas is his favorite little boy. But he tells Sam to not give up on his faith, which I guess is as nice as Dean can be.

G: Yeah.

C: I guess, yeah, like, this is sort of why Sam- I mean, Sam uses his powers because he has to at the end of the episode, but also like, I'm sure that like, if he still thought that angels were righteous, he would have tried a little harder to get the knife back before he used his powers.

G: Yeah, he actually gets into it a little bit later in the car ride to the cemetery-

C: Oh, yes. He's just like us for real when he pwns Dean with facts and logic.

G: Yeah. [laughs] He- well, I mean, we'll talk about it later, but he basically says there that like, "If the angels told you this, and the angels are not even good, then what makes this a good call?" Like, that's basically his argument. Which, you know, he was right.

C: Yeah, love it.

So Sam realizes that this bone in the hex bag, the amount of heat it would take to char this bone is like, way more than a kitchen oven. So perhaps a kiln was involved.

G: Yeah, and it's so stupid the way they do it. He says, like, "I think we need to make a stop." And it's like, you guys are so corny. Just say something else, literally anything else. Maybe don't say anything, you know? But like, [deepens voice] "I think we need to make a stop." And it's like, to the fucking pottery class or whatever that is. I don't know. I thought it was so stupid.

C: They're in that high school art classroom, and Dean says, "So Tracy used the kiln to char the bone. What's the big deal?" which is so clearly like, an exposition leadup whatever line. Like, he's being the Watson to Sam's Sherlock right now. And Sam is like, "Dean, that hex bag showed up not after we talked to Tracy. It's after we talked to Don. Like, he had to have been the one who planted it." And then he gets like, a cabinet open, and there are a bunch of bones in there, and Sam goes, "Oh my god, those are all from children."

G: I mean, I don't- this is like, the closest thing, I guess, that they would go for with like, young children violence. Yeah, like, child death.

C: That baby also like, died in "Croatoan" for sure.

G: Wait, which one? What are you talking about?

C: Like, there was like, they came across an abandoned car, and there was like, a car seat, baby car seat, like, with blood all over it.

G: Oh, yeah! [laughs] I completely forgot. But that baby sure did die.

G: We go to a park where Castiel and Uriel are just hanging out, being buddies, being besties [C laughs], being the funniest and then the most autistic angel in the garrison respectively.

C: Yes. Uriel's sitting on a bench, and Cas is standing-

G: Standing over him. He sits later, but yeah, I do like the blocking in this scene.

Cas says like, "Oh, yeah. Well, the decision has been made." And Uriel, is pushing the whole like, "Yeah, by a mud monkey thing," and Cas says, "Don't call them that." [C laughs]

C: Cas took like, the angel equivalent of human rights classes in like, angel college.

G: Literally.

C: He has like, a little infographic about what words are okay to say and what words aren't. I'm very happy for him.

G: Yeah. And Cas says like, "Don't call them that!" and Uriel says, “Well, it's fucking true.” He says, "They're just plumbing on two legs." Which I like. You know what? We are just plumbing on two legs.

C: We are just plumbing on two legs.

G: I think constantly about like, that concept of like, "You're like, a tube with like, flesh around you." Like, that concept. And that literally is true, you are literally a tube with some flesh around you.

C: Yep.

G: Cas says, like, “This is close to blasphemy.” Cas says, "Dean has potential. He can succeed, and it's out of our hands." And Uriel says, "Well, it doesn't have to be, because we can still massacre everyone." And Cas says, "You know the true orders. Are you prepared to disobey?" Which is a little hint about what is going to be revealed later.

C: Yeah. I really like the way that early seasons angels- like, the different ways that they react to God having abandoned them.

G: Yeah!

C: Like, if you've been like, godless for so long, you are gonna question your quote unquote "true orders" because they didn't actually come from him.

G: Yeah.

C: Yeah. And some people will set out on their own and do what they think is best for the world like, statistics-wise. And I think that's cool.

C: We cut to, like, it's the night of Halloween, and there are trick-or-treaters, and they pass by a house with weird lights going on in the basement, and we go into that basement, and it's Don the art teacher, and he has Tracy tied up, and he's like, reciting a spell. And then he like, has like, a knife that he is like, going to use to slit her throat. But, like- Okay, was it just- like, they're siblings, but this scene, did it have like, weird sexual undertones? Like, I was feeling weird sexual undertones.

G: I will be completely honest with you. This is the part of my completely legal streaming app [C laughs] where the episode just like, stops working properly. So here, up until the mausoleum part, I'm kind of unclear about what happens. [laughs]

C: Okay. Okay. Well, this will be interesting.

G: But I do remember that they're brother and sister, and that this sister later on reveals that Samhain is like, [overlapping] her old lover or something who is now in her brother's body, and then they kiss over it. [laughing]

C: Yeah. That definitely did bring up- "In the Beginning" was four episodes ago. What is with this season?

So, right, the weirdly sexual thing is, like, the way that she's tied up, and then, like, he doesn't like, cut her throat quite yet. He starts like, running the knife over her neck-

G: Oh yeah! I do remember this.

C: - and then down to her chest, right? Like, that was weird. What was that about?

G: Later on, like, okay, so what happens next is, Don gets shot by Sam and Dean. And then they untie Tracy, and Tracy goes, "Did you see what he was doing?" I thought he was completely referring to him running his knife over her breasts.

C: Yeah.

G: And then I remembered, "Oh, he's also chanting a lot, and like, doing a blood ritual, so, okay, okay."

C: Yeah, that's probably all so disturbing. Yeah, yeah, that sure did happen. And like, then, things start getting weird where she goes like, "Did you hear how sloppy his incantation was?" And then Sam and Dean are like, "Oh, wait. She is not just a regular teenage girl," and they start drawing their weapons. And she goes, "My brother always was a little dim." Which is a fun twist that there's two witches in the town, but not-

G: I thought it was so stupid! I mean, I think it could have been good. It's just, it's not. [laughs] It could have been. But it's not.

C: Yeah. And, you know, she attacks Sam and Dean, like, sends them to the ground, holds them there, like, with her magic. And she explains that the spellwork to raise Samhain is a two-person job, so she had to deal with her brother for the last 600 years, even though she, fucking hates him, and that he was, gonna make her the final sacrifice, but now that he's dead she can use his blood for the final sacrifice. And, you know, she collects his blood and some cup. Also, she says, "The whole time I wanted to rip his face off, and you get him with a gun. Uh, love that!" Which I think was so fun. Like, literally love that. Yeah. She's just like you for real

G: [laughs] Love that!

C: And she has a big clunker of a line where she's like, "Oh, you know, they used to keep children inside during Halloween, so now you'll see what this holiday really is!" Like, okay, girl. Whatever.

G: Whateber!

C: Sam smears his face with the blood of the dead guy, Don, and tells Dean to do the same thing, which I thought was going to be more of a thing than it actually is. Yeah. So Tracy finishes the spell and like, the ground cracks and black smoke comes out into Don, which is a pretty fun visual. So yeah, "Samhain" [laughs] has now taken over his body. And his eyes are white now. And then, right, like, Tracy goes like, "My love." And like, they kiss. It's- yeah. Supernatural!

G: Yeah. They sure do.

C: Yeah. And then he says that like, she's aged. And she's like, "This face. I can't fool you." Which implies that she took a a teenage girl form to be sexy for her past lover, which is disturbing, maybe. And then! And then he goes, "Your beauty is beyond time." And then he fucking snaps her neck, and then says, "Whore."

G: This guy is the king of negging. [C laughs] Except like, I don't think he's even negging her. I think he's just like- well, he does kill her. Like, why?

C: Yeah. What the fuck was this?

G: I think they were just trying to do like, "He's evil." And like, I really- this gave me like, Rowena/Lucifer vibes, because this is how Rowena dies under Lucifer.

C: Right, right, like, Casifer is like, chatting her up, and then he snaps her neck when their faces get really close.

G: Yeah.

C: This was the what prompted my second "I hate Supernatural so much it's unreal" text to you. Why?

G: Yeah. Like, let's bring this girl that we're gonna sexualize to hell and back, and then... match with her brother?

C: [laughs] Yeah.

G: Well, I don't know. I don't know what's going on with that. You know what? I'm gonna stay out of it. But yeah, the way Supernatural portrayed Tracy is like, what?

C: Yeah. Yeah. I hope that her actress was paid like, $5 million for this. [laughs] It's always bad when the w-slur's in Supernatural, and it sure is bad here.

G: The what? Ah, the w-slur. I was like, "The dummy slur? What?" [both laugh] But yeah. Yeah.

C: Yeah. Right. And then, like, we see like, Samhain POV, where, like, his vision is really bad.

G: It's blurred, yeah.

C: Has he considered getting glasses?

G: Yeah. The implication here is that he can't see Sam and Dean, and, like, Sam explains later on that they put- the reason why he encouraged them both to put blood on their faces is because Samhain, based on "lore," can't see like, masked faces.

C: Yeah, and the blood counts.

G: Yeah, the blood counts as a mask. Do you think an N-95 counts? I think that would be anti-Samhain.

C: Yeah. Yeah, I agree. But like, before Sam explained that, I truly thought that what they were doing was like, the school shooter drill thing where you you pretend to be dead, and like, smear the blood on your face to make it seem like you're injured and dead.

So Sam says specifically like, "Oh, yeah, I thought, like, maybe this would work, so I gave it a shot." And, Dean is like, [both, disbelieving] "You gave it a shot? What?"

G: But, you know. Dean, shut the fuck up. That's my thought. It worked, so like, stop it.

C: Yeah, he didn't have any better plans. But also, I don't know, this is very fun Sam moments. Like, it's quite similar to- remember in Route 666 when, like, Sam directs Dean to drive through a church, and he was like, "Oh, well, you know, that's hallowed ground, so I thought, like, [overlapping] maybe it would work." And Dean goes, "Maybe? What if you were wrong?"

G: "I could have died!"

C: And Sam goes, "Honestly, the thought hadn't occurred to me." Agh. I love him. He's a fun little guy.

G: Yeah. So Sam and Dean like, get on the car. They're going to the cemetery, and they have this conversation in the car where Sam says, "The demon's pretty powerful. There's a possibility that our usual weapons won't work." And Dean basically goes, "I know what you're trying to say, and I don't want you to do it. Don't use your psychic powers. We have Ruby's knife." And Sam asks the age-old question, "Why?" [C laughs] And Dean just says, "Well, just because, like, the angel said it-"

C: "Because the angels said so. Because Mom said!"

G: Yeah. And Sam says, like, "Well, you said that the angels were a bunch of fanatics," and Dean says, "Well, they happen to be right about this one." [both laughing] He's soo bad. This is so bad. What an absolutely terrible thing to say. Like, he literally just told Sam, like, "Oh, those guys are fucking assholes. And like, they're the bad bunch. They're the bad apples in this basket of fruit. But don't worry! When they say that you're an evil, evil person, [C laughing] with a fucking disease that you can never get rid of, they are completely right."

C: Yeah. Dean said the angels are right when they're right and wrong when they're wrong. Hope this helps.

G: Yeah. Sam says, like, "They don't seem to be right about many things," and Dean goes like, "Well, you said it yourself that it's for you, it's like playing with fire." And, Dean, okay. Dean picks up the knife and hands it to Sam, right? And Dean is like, "Please?" But you have to remember that I am watching this in a Zoom call. [C laughs] Pretty much like, this part- Well, actually, I wasn't watching this yet in the Zoom call. I was just watching this normal version. But I still thought that Dean, instead of raising the butt of the knife, was raising his pinky, and they were gonna do a pinky promise.

C: I also thought that was happening for a second!

G: They literally were gonna pinky promise on it!

C: Yeah, yeah.

G: You know, I miss pinky promises.

C: Yeah, like, I actually like, treated those as sacred. Like, if I lied, and someone went "pinky promise?" I would not pinky promise, and thus reveal the lie.

G: Yeah, they should have pinky promised here. I feel like if they pinky promised here, Sam wouldn't have done it. [C laughs]

C: And then he would be dead, so. [G laughs]

G: He would be dead, and Dean would be like, "It's because of that damn pinky promise! [C laughs] Sam, if you just didn't pinky with me, you would still be alive."

C: Yeah, and also the entire world-

G: - would be collapsed, and, you know, killed by every single person that Samhain raises. But yeah, Sam is like, "Okay, I'm taking the knife," and they go into the mausoleum.

G: Well, we go to the mausoleum, where a bunch of people, like, teenagers, are dancing, and Justin, the guy from earlier - like, imagine watching someone die [C laughing], and then like -

C: "I still have to make it to my mausoleum party."

G: Yeah. Maybe this is what you do when you watch someone boil alive in front of you in a bobbing for apples situation. Like, you go to a mausoleum, you get super high. And he's like, "Whoa dude. I'm so high." And then Don goes down the steps to the mausoleum, and then he locks the mausoleum door.

C: Yup.

G: Yowch.

And you know, Justin, is like, "Oh my god, what's happening? Why'd you lock us in?" And then the things start shaking, and then he gets taken by one of the things. By "the things," I do mean like, the- what do you call the coffin spaces?

C: The compartments in the crypt-

G: The graves? Yeah, like, the crypt/grave situation, I would say.

C: Yeah, like, one of the the dead bodies rises and like, grabs Justin and drags him in.

G: Yeah. And there's like, a split second, or maybe I'm imagining it, where everything starts shaking, and he's just standing there, and he's probably thinking, "Oh my god, I'm so fucking high. [C laughs] Like, this is all happening because I'm so fucking high." And then he gets taken, and there's a blood spatter, and it's like, "Sorry dude." [C laughs]

C: Yeah. Sorry dude, indeed.

C: So Sam and Dean, they come in and see this whole party situation. And Sam tells Dean to help the kids so that Sam can go off by himself. Do you think he was already planning to use his powers or was this just like, a "in case."

G: I don't think he was planning to, but I also don't think he wasn't not planning to.

C: Yeah. Like, if it happens, it happens.

G: Yeah.

C: Dean shoots the lock and then get all the teens out, and then a bunch of zombies crawl out of the graves. And Dean, who was once so excited about taking a zombie case is not so happy about the zombies now, and, you know, he gets out a silver stake. Meanwhile, Sam comes across Samhain, who's standing in front of a stained glass window, which is a fun framing. And Samhain tries to use like, some kind of like, blinding white light demon power. I think the same one that Lilith used, right? on Sam. But Sam just keeps walking forward, and he goes, "Oh, yeah, that demon ray gun stuff? It doesn't work on me." He is so cool sometimes, unfortunately. [G laughs]

G: For some reason- I mean, you have to remember that this point in the episode, I was, in fact, watching it in a Zoom situation, and I couldn't hear jack shit. Like, I could hear the dialogue, and I could read it, but it was unclear what I was hearing exactly. And I literally said- I literally thought he was talking about Reagan, as in [C laughing]- I think I was looking down when he said that. And he was like, "Oh, you think that Reagan stuff is gonna work on me?" And then I looked up, and I was like, "Why is he talking about Ronald Reagan?" And it was not. It was demon ray gun.

C: Samhain was sending trickle-down taxes - or sorry, trickle-down wealth at Sam.

G: Yeah.

C: So they have a fight which is just them punching each other until Samhain gets Sam in a chokehold, has him against the wall, and like, has knocked the knife out of Sam's hands so he can't use it. Meanwhile, like, you know, Dean gets all the zombies, but then a ghost appears, and he's like, "Oh, fuck it. I'm just gonna burn this entire room down." So he heads out to do such a thing.

And then back at Sam's- actually, he still has the knife. He tries to stab him, but then, Samhain shoves it to the ground. So yeah, Sam did go for the knife first. And then Sam starts using his psychic powers! Like, he has his hand out, and he seems to be mostly like, preventing Samhain from walking forward, and he's also getting like, a few tendrils of smoke. And his head starts to hurt. He goes, "ow, ouchie," and clutches it, and his nose starts bleeding-

G: Yeah. Nose is bleeding so hard. And I do like it.

G: I mean, I've said this over and over again: the animation that they do for the smoke is so cool! Every time Sam exorcises some demon, it looks fucking amazing. Like, the way the little pieces of smoke get out of the bullet hole from Samhain's body. I thought that was so cool. I thought it was so cool.

C: That is pretty cool, yeah. And I was gonna say that I really like headaches and nosebleeds as a result of like, using your powers too hard. Like, it's a fun physical representation.

G: Of the usage of the exertion, yeah.

C: Yeah. And then Dean is like, there, like, in the background watching this.

G: Yeah. He's there to react. He's there to make a face.

C: Yeah. And it's not a happy face.

G: Not a happy face.

C: Finally, Sam finishes, and Samhain is fully gone. And then he looks up and sees Dean, and he has such a guilty look on his face or something, and it makes me so sad!

G: He has never looked more like a puppy. He has never looked more like a puppy than he does here.

C: He looks so much like a puppy. And like, I'm glad that later, when he talks to Uriel, he's like, "Actually, I did nothing wrong." But currently, he does feel guilty, because, like, that's his big bro, and he broke his pinky promise.

G: Anyway, we go back to the motel, and Uriel and Sam are talking. Well, they're not. Sam is like, there, and then Uriel, like, shows up. And Uriel says, "Oh, tomorrow, it's the anniversary of your mom dying and your gf dying, so RIP." [C laughs] Well, he doesn't say RIP. He's saying this condescendingly, so I don't- even if he said RIP, I don't think it would have helped. [C laughs] He says, like, "It must be difficult to bear, yet you so brazenly use the power he gave you." And Sam's like, "Excuse me?" And Uriel continues saying that "The blood is profane, and that we already told you to not use your abilities." And Sam said, "Oh, well, I would have died if I didn't, and my brother would have died, and everyone would have died." And Uriel said, "Well, you were told not to. You have been warned twice now." And Sam said, "You know, my brother's right. You are dicks." [C laughs] And Uriel says that the only reason why Sam is alive is because he has been useful so far, but the moment he stops being useful, they're gonna get rid of him.

C: And before that, like, specifically, he, he doesn't stand up and walk closer to Sam. There's like, a wind effect. Like, he's using his wings to like, just appear directly in front of Sam to be more menacing. And I think that's fun. Good for him.

G: Yeah. And he also says that, "As for Dean, tell him to get off his high horse and ask him what he remembers from Hell." And then we hear the quintessential "chh" of the wings, and Uriel disappears.

C: Yeah.

G: That's not the first one. 'Cause Cas has like, disappeared. But I felt like this is the first one that it felt like, "Oh, they're like, flying away."

C: Right, yeah, before it's just like, he looks away, and then he looks back, and Cas isn't there.

G: This one has a sound. Which I did not hear [both laugh] because I was watching through Zoom.

C: Yeah, it's fun to think that like, Uriel likes showing off with his wings a little more than Cas does, like, with the going closer whereas Cas usually walks. And it's probably because he like, wants to like- like, if he hates humans so much, being in a human vessel must be constraining for him.

G: Yeah. He takes pride in his angelhood, I think more than Cas.

C: Yeah. So it's fun for him to like, show off, do a little trick with his wings sometimes. Yeah. I mean, he is an interesting character because he is our second angel, like, before, we just had Cas.

G: Yeah. I understand why, when we get in Season 15 and characters are coming back, and etc etc, we get the characters that we get. I would say, though, that bringing back the angel who hated- like, I know what happens to Uriel, and I think you do, too. Like, "On the Head of a Pin" is the episode where his morals and like, his beliefs, blah blah blah, are released and like, told to us. And what we learn there - and correct me if I'm mistaken, but this is just like, at the top of my head, what I remember - like, it's revealed that, like, he kind of like, is mad at God, and he wants to rebel, basically.

C: Yeah.

G: And I would have loved to see him, specifically - like, the angels in general, but him specifically - to come back in Season 15 and see what has happened with regards to the God question. Like, "Oh, yeah, he did come back. And he is an asshole. And you were probably right about this whole situation."

C: Yeah.

G: I don't know. It's just also like, I'm sure, like- Oh, actually, I'm not sure if this is something that's been explored before. Like, Uriel and Jack [laughs], I think, would really get along. So, I don't know. It's just, Uriel is one of- I think, because he comes in so early, and he comes in- His existence is confined in a season that I would consider to be the best of Supernatural's. He has a vibe that I think is quite unmatched by other angels in the show, and I just would have loved to see that vibe in the future, when the vibe of the show has changed so much, and what they would have done with him if he was there, because he is so quintessentially Season 4.

C: Yeah, yeah, I agree.

G: Yeah.

C: Such a guy.

G: I'm sure we'll talk to him- "talk to him." Well, maybe we can. [laughs] But we will talk about him more, you know, the more he shows up and the more we are revealed his ideology and his angelhood and stuff.

C: Yeah. Also, as I joked in the beginning, like, Samuriel real.

G: Samuriel!

C: This scene is very similar to Cas's like, "You should show me some respect" to Dean, you know? Like, it'd be fun if each of them like, had an angel that was assigned to them, you know what I mean? But alas.

G: Yeah, but they committed more to the "Sam has a demon" bit than "Sam has an angel" bit.

C: Yeah, yeah. Oh, well, it'll never happen.

G: Maybe this rewatch, it will. [laughs]

C: Maybe! Yeah, maybe they'll change the video.

C: So we're in a park. It's sunny, it's nice, there's kids playing on a playground. Dean's sitting on a park bench, and Cas is sitting as well, but not on the same bench. On a bench right next to Dean's.

G: The positioning of this bench is, I would think, very inconvenient in the park. But, you know, you do you, park in somewhere, fuck-all America.

C: I just feel like it was probably one bench, and then, like, the CW was like, "Too gay. Do it again." And then they like, changed the set and refilmed it.

G: I like, the fact that it's two benches, because it's like- like, for example, when it pans out, they're next to each other, but it doesn't- I really, really don't think they could have done that kind of effect of like, being close to each other like that if it was the same bench.

C: Yeah. Yeah. And it also feels very like, "Oh, like, he's getting close to-"

G: Like, "We're different. We're two very, very different people, things, and beings, but like, we are like, seated- we're like, at the same wavelength right now." Like, that's the vibe of the scene.

C: Oh my god! He's literally a wavelength of celestial intent! A celestial wavelength of intent? Which one is it?

G: I think it's like "a cosmic wavelength of celestial intent." I don't know. Actually, I don't know.

C: Okay. That's really hot of him.

G: "I spent the last year as a-" I think there's a word before "wavelength." But I don't konw.

C: I feel like there's not, but I don't know.

G: We'll know in like, a year or something.

C: Yeah, we'll know in like, a year.

But yeah, specifically the way that, like, he and Uriel had the same bench, but like, they weren't sitting, like, Cas was standing and Uriel was sitting. And now, like, he and Dean are both sitting, but they're on different benches. I love very on-the-nose symbolism.

So, you know, Cas appears on the bench next to Dean, and Dean goes like, "Let me guess. You're here to say I told you so." Cas says no, and, I don't know, Dean, blah blah blah, not interested. Cas says he is not here to judge him and reveals that their true orders were to do whatever Dean told them to do.

G: I love the way they did this. Like, Cas being like, "Our orders-" and like, Dean's like, "Yeah, I fucking know, what your orders are about." And Cas just goes again, "Our orders were not to stop Samhain." And he's like, so done with Dean, like, interrupting him all the time and having a quip-ass remark all the time. I love that.

C: Yeah, yeah. Like, your analysis of Cas's speech in 4.02, right, was like, "He just comes, and he's like, 'There's a thing that I want to say, and I'm gonna say it regardless of what you do. And then maybe I'll answer your questions.'"

G: Yeah.

C: Yeah. I love him.

So he says that this is specifically a test to see how Dean would perform under "battlefield conditions, you might say so." So yeah, I think it is about whether he'll say yes.

G: Dean says, "It was a witch, not the Tet Offensive-"

C: And we have baby's first laugh! But unfortunately, it's about a Vietnam War reference. [G laughs]

G: I know that you were gonna bring that up because when you were navigating to the tab of the completely unpirated version of Supernatural that we watched from, I did see, like, "tet offensive- Google search" [C laughing] on the next tab over, so.

C: I mean, I knew what it was, I just wanted to check like, if there were any like, well known war crimes associated with it as well.

G: Yeah, okay.

C: Yeah.

G: Dean says that, "Oh, I must have failed your test. But the truth is, if you go back in time, I would still fail it over again, because I don't know what will happen in the future. I don't know what will happen tomorrow. But I know that families are real. People are real. And the swing, the trees, it's all here because of my brother and me." And Cas says, "You misunderstand. I was praying that you would choose to save the town."

C: The idea that angels would pray is soo. It's definitely something that I think about.

G: It sure is something! Cas says that "Everyone here is my father's creation," and he was hoping that Dean would save everyone, but the truth is, the the fucking seal was broken, and it's bad. [C laughs] He says something that, you know, is very nice. He says, "Can I tell you something if you promise not tell another soul?"

C: And okay, obviously, okay, not to interrupt a Cas moment, but it does make me really sad that if Dean like, follows this promise, Sam is never gonna know that angels aren't dicks, like, at least for a few more episodes.

G: Yeah. But yeah, like, Dean is like, very nice about this. I like that. Like, I mean, he could have made like, a face or whatever, but he just went like, "Okay." And also like- well, that's it. That's pretty much all I have to say. And Cas says his iconic line, "I'm not a... hammer, as you say. I have questions. I have doubts." And he says that he doesn't know if they made the right choice here, if they passed, if they failed, but in the coming months, Dean specifically- I don't know if he was talking about Dean specifically. Well, he is. But he says that in the coming months, Dean specifically will have to make even more choices, and that's going to be difficult. He says, "I don't envy the weight on your shoulders, Dean. I truly don't." And they look at each other. And then Cas goes, and the episode ends. And, well- I don't know. I like the idea that angels are not moral. Like, they are not like- good and bad is so interwoven, and also like, not real, that even like, something that's supposed to be like, a vessel of pure good is unsure about what is and isn't good. Like, I like, that concept. And I think it's actually pretty well executed this episode.

C: I also really like the use of the word "anymore." Like, "I don't know what is right and what is wrong anymore."

G: Yeah. There was a time when he was sure. There was a time when he was sure, but now he's doubting it. And that like, exemplifies the feeling of the like, doubt more than if he said, like, "I don't know what's right or wrong." Because, like, that's just like, him admitting that like, "Oh, I never knew" or like, "It's not my choice to make." But like, he's saying here that there was a time when he thought it was his choice to make, and now, like, he just doesn't know which it is. It's good. I like this conversation so much. And many people do! Many people love this conversation.

C: Yeah, many people do. It's not an unpopular opinion to like this conversation.

I also really like, that, like, Cas’s protection of humans right now, like, comes from his faith in God. Like, he tells Uriel, "It's blasphemy for you to say what you're saying about humans." And then here, like, he says that he wants to protect town because everyone here is like, his father's creations. And like, I feel like, eventually like, his love of humanity-

G: That changes.

C: Yeah, from like, meeting people and liking them.

G: Yeah, like, something that used to be like, holy, you know? Like, because that's kind of how he- like, with the reference to blasphemy, right? Right now, I think he thinks of people as like, holy works of art, and then further into the show, they just become like, beings that deserve respect, whether they are holy or not, or, you know. And that's like, I think, a meaningful change of perspective for Cas. I think it really is. Yeah. Like, it's separate now from his faith in God, and, like the origins of it. What matters more is like, the right now. And I like that. It's so cool. Cas is such a good character.

C: Yeah. G: And like, I'm actually looking forward to see what the reviews, like, especially the older reviews, say about this episode because I think a lot of my fondness for it comes from a sense of retrospect, like, this is a rewatch episode pod- this is a rewatch podcast for me. So that is how I'm gonna look at everything. But I'm excited to see what it would be, what it was like for first timers back then to see Cas like this. And it's like, is this the moment that people were like, "Oh, I'm fond of this guy." I mean looking at- I mean, I've seen the like, forum boasts from when Cas showed it up the first time, and, you know, people already loved him. But like, when did he become like, an indispensable character, you know? Okay. C: Okay.

G: I mean, what's our general thoughts?

C: Cas is such a guy, but unfortunately, the rest of the episode exists also.

G: Yeah. I mean, that's pretty much it for me, too. What's your Best Line/Worst Line? My worst line is jailbait. [laughs] I hate it! I hate it.

C: Yeah. It's quite bad. I will make mine the w-slur to cover all our bases.

G: Tracy? For Tracy? It just happens once this episode, right?

C: Yeah, yeah, just the killing her and then saying that. Like, what was that about?

G: Yeah. Well, I would say my best line is- actually, when you pointed it out, that's when I was like, "Oh, yeah, that's like, the essence of the line, or of the scene." Like, "I don't know what this right or wrong anymore." l like that! You're right about it, and I appreciate it. [C laughs] It's good.

C: Thank you. God. There are a lot of good lines here. Like, obviously like, the most iconic one is, [overlapping] "I'm not a... hammer, as you say" 'cause, god, hello.

But like, I don't- I think, okay, for for diversity, let's go with Sam saying, like, "This is what I've been trying to?"

G: Agh.

C: 'Cause, Jesus Christ.

G: Yeah

C: Yeah.

G: Yeah. God. Okay, spread those sheets, baby!

C: Okay, we've got misogyny for suresies. How many misogynies do we have? We gave "Monster Movie" a 3. I think it's similar.

G: No, I don't think it's similar. Well, I think this one is like, a 2. At first I was gonna say, "It's a one," but then I remember that like, Tracy is actually like, a very significant-

C: Part of this episode?

G: I think this one is a 2.

C: Okay, I'll give it a 2.

G: Racism... 0?

C: Not that I can recall.

G: And homophobia is a 0.

We are clearing homophobia this season so far.

C: Well, that's just Cas’s power.

G: Yeah.

C: It's been zeros across the board for homophobia every single week.

G: Yeah.

Okay, so IMDb. What's your guess?

C: Huh, okay. Let's see, what did we see last time? Okay. Damn, okay. So "Yellow Fever" was a fucking 9.1-

G: I know.

C: And “Monster Movie” was an 8.4. This tells me nothing. I have no clue. What the people the Internet want. As I've said before, I keep guessing 8.7, and one day, that'll have to be correct. So I'm gonna say that

G: Yeah, 8.7? I would say, this is a bit higher than that. This would be an 8.9. Let's see Or an 8- okay, I already said it.

C: I typed it already. You can't do anything about it.

G: Okay, let's see. Oh! It's pretty low. It's an 8.4.

C: Huh. Okay. Okay. Due to the case being terrible? I can understand that.

G: Probably.

C: Yeah, this person is upset at them, calling it "Sam Hayne" instead of sah-wen.

G: Yeah.

C: Yeah, this person is is talking about how this episode shows a new light on Castiel's character. "The angel who appeared previously to be intimidating is now more compassionate, gentle, and a bit confused with human behavior." Oh, I wanna fuck him so bad.

G: Well, I I don't really see any comment that like, matters to me. This one calls like, the angel plot "ad hoc." So like, what they're saying is like, there was no real plan.

G: Well, I think that's it for this episode of Busty Asian Beauties. Next week, we will be discussing Season 4, Episode 8, "Wishful Thinking"! Leave us a rating or a review wherever you get your podcasts.

C: Follow us on social media. We are on Twitter at twitter.com/BeautiesPodcast and on Tumblr at bustyasianbeautiespod.tumblr.com. Our official tag is #BABPod, B-A-B-POD. Thanks to everyone who's donated to our Ko-Fi at ko-fi.com/bustyasianbeautiespod, and check out our merch at babpod.redbubble.com.

G: You can email us any feedback, comments, or inquiries [email protected]. See you guys next time. [both] Bye!

[guitar music]

G: Yeah, in in Filipino, "cemetery" is sementeryo. So there's actually like, you know those like, gag shows, and they had this song that was like, super famous of like, these two siblings fighting over what the English of sementeryo is, if it's "cementery" or "cemetery." And I remember the song. Every single word. So yeah.

C: And you're gonna perform it on the podcast right now. [G laughs]

G: There's a line there that was like, "It's cemetery, not cementery, here's the spelling, check it in the dictionary." Like, I just think it's such a fun song, and I miss that era of Filipino television.

C: That is pretty fun. Yeah. Well, you can bring it back. Have you considered not going to law school? [G laughs]

G: When I become a writer in like, the gag shows of the Philippines. I think that's a good idea.

C: It's gonna happen.

G: Yeah. Sam would have chosen that path. [C laughs] Except he's like, so unfunny, it's unreal.

C: He's so unfunny. So he should write for SNL. [G laughs]

G: Wait, you have like, one guy that you hate, right?

C: Do I? On SNL?

G: No, no, no, like, I think you don't like Jimmy Kimmel or something. Or you do like him. Either one. Like, you do like him or you don't.

C: I think I don't like Jimmy Kimmel. Do I even know which- I don't have faces attached to all these white men anymore.

G: There's one guy that you said, "Oh, he does like, political stuff."

C: There's a lot of guys who do political stuff that I don't like. [G laughs]

G: You told me like, he has like, a show where he makes his writers- he reads jokes that his writers of color-

C: Oh, Seth Meyers!

G: Yeah, that one. You said you like him.

C: I don't hate him. Well, I feel like I had a late night TV clips on Youtube phase, which was mostly just a bunch of white men making, like, mid jokes about politics. And I think the second to last- like, I dropped them off one by one as I stopped liking them. Seth Meyers lasted until the second to last place, and then John Oliver held out the longest.

G: Do you like Conan?

C: Never really watched Conan?

G: I like him.

C: Does he- who's the one who has that one Sherlock parody?

G: No idea. But I know Conan for his Steven Yeun- like, he has a series where he goes to Korea with Steven Yeun, and I like that. Yeah. Those are our late night opinions! Yas.

[beep]

G: I have- okay, what's the worst thing you have done to a teacher? Like, what's the worst that you have said or whatever?

C: I feel- Okay, I've generally been quite squeaky clean.

G: Oh, I know. [laughs] [C laughing] I'm so mean, I'm so sorry!

C: In ninth grade, I was really annoying during sex ed. Like, after each Powerpoint slide, I would raise my hand and go like-

G: God.

C: "Um, actually, gay people exist-"

G: You're unbearable!

C: "And it's also fine to have multiple sexual partners." [laughs] Yeah, that is what everyone in my class thought. Like, I think we did peer grading of quizzes once, and someone wrote, "You're so annoying on mine," and I never found out who. [both laughing]

G: They were right for that. They were completely correct to do that.

C: Yeah, yeah. So yeah.

G: There was a school event once, and it was like, a commingling situation. This was in high school. I was like, in ninth grade or something. Tenth grade, maybe. And it was like, you know, it was just a standing party, basically. So you just walk around and talk to people, It was that kind of situation. And for some reason, I ended up talking to a teacher of mine. And this teacher is kind of like that kind of teacher where he's close with students, and I don't like that. And I told him straight up, "I don't want to be your friend." And yeah. Yeah. [laughs] Is that bad? I mean, I didn't want to be his friend. So.

C: Yeah, you literally didn't want to be his friend.

G: I didn't want to be his friend. I am very strict about the whole, like, "Your mentors should be mentor figures, not friend figures." So.

C: Yeah. I feel like I enjoy teachers who try to be your friend, but I agree that it does get weird sometimes.

G: Not to this degree. Not to the degree that this Don guy is doing. He-

C: All he does is say that he has students call him by his first name. That's like, fine.

G: Yeah, I hate that. [laughs]

C: What?

G: You say, "sir"- Okay, I've been told, I think it's you who told me that in college, in your area, you go by first name with your profs.

C: Yeah. Yeah.

G: That's incredibly weird to me. Like, I understand, because I have one prof that I actually really like. And she's like, "Oh, just call me my first name. It's okay." And I think the reason why it's because she studied, like, abroad. So like, she got used to that. But otherwise, we call our teachers, "sir," "ma'am," and "prof." So yeah.

C: I mean, starting in high school, I was first-naming some teachers. So I feel like Don seems less-

G: Okay. But you've always been weird about your teachers. [laughs]

C: [laughing] We don't have to talk about that.

G: I would hate to be like, in a room with you, like, in high school.

C: Oh, no, absolutely. I'd be salivating over like, half of the English teachers. It'd be unbearable.

G: I was not an English teacher pet. I was a physics teacher pet.

C: Oh, I hated my physics teacher.

G: We're just gonna go into this tangent.

C: Yeah.

G: But I think for me, like, when I was in seventh grade, which in the Philippines, high school is 7 to 10, and then senior high school is 11 and 12. But when I was in seventh grade, I was like, in a completely new city, I was living by myself, etc etc. So like, I didn't have adults in my life. So having, like- my last class was a physics class, and after class, me and my friends would just stay in the classroom and just talk to our teacher until like, we are told that like, "Oh, you should go back to the dorm because the dorm is closing." So yeah. Like, I was very close to that teacher, and it was wonderful. So maybe you're right. Maybe you should be friends with your teachers. Who knows. I am- If I contradict myself, I contradict myself. I do contain multitudes.

C: That you do.

G: Yes.

C: Yeah. My physics teacher had a failed career as an attempted standup comedian before he became a physics teacher [G laughs], and that was like, really, really clear and everything that he did and everyone that he was, so that's why I couldn't stand him.

G: Yeah. My physics teacher taught me something that I really like. He said that you cannot fight every single battle in life. So if, for example, like, you can't advocate for everything and all that. So just choose one thing that you're extremely passionate about and try to be an advocate for that thing specifically. And I- that is something that I value in terms of like, my own beliefs. Like, you cannot- you know, like, for example, like, environment, blah blah. Like, if you focus on every single aspect of like, environmental damage of every single thing in the world, you're not gonna progress because you're you're gonna be stuck with anxiety, or at least I would be. But if you focus specifically on, for example, fashion, like, you know, like, the fashion industry's impact on the environment and try to do things with just that specific thing in mind, I think there could be a little bit more progress. Which, yeah, I think if you're a science educator, that's an important thing to teach your students specifically, because, like, in science, like, that's a very, very, very relevant thin. That you really need to go deep in one thing and not broad.

C: Yeah.

G: Yeah.

C: yeah.

G: [laughing] I don't want to talk about this episode anymore. No, we're going to get to Cas. We're going to get to Cas. We're gonna get to Cas.

C: We are. We are.

G: Yeah.

[beep]

G: Interesting question. So your your version of Sam angst is makeup?

C: I mean, part of that. I feel like he would definitely like, go for some emo looks, and a lot of like, hiding things from his family, "they wouldn't understand me," blah blah blah regarding his presentation.

G: I just- I don't know because I didn't have teenage angst.

C: Huh. Interesting.

G: I mean- we're gonna put all of this in the end. Who give a shit. But like, what was your teenage angst?

C: Oh, like, incredibly boring like, hashtag sad girl, like, gif of like, tea cooling on a window sill, sad music shit. Like, really nothing interesting at all. [laughs] As we've established this episode.

G: Damn.

C: And, I don't know. Clinical depression.

G: So you weren't like, rebelling?

C: I've never snuck out of a window, which I do regret. I feel like someone should do that at some point. Like, I guess I wouldn't talk to my parents as much, and sometimes I'd get into arguments with them, but like, it would be about hashtag social justice [laughs], so like, really nothing interesting.

G: That's interesting. Well, like I said, I didn't have teenage angst, I just had incredibly devastating depressive episodes starting age 17. Which, I don't count that as teenager. I mean, it is obviously a teenager, but, like, teenager to me is like, 14, 15, 16, you know? That's like, the the teenage angst era. I think I repressed it very much, and then it just busted open. Yeah.

C: Yeah.

[beep]

C: Did your mom never deliver on any of the ultimatums?

G: No. No.

C: Really?

G: Now, like, she never says that to me ever. Like, I think she realized at some point that like, "Oh, if I say this, Grey would actually do it." So now she doesn't say like, anything like that. [laughing] Well, she doesn't talk to me. But you know. It's- it's fine. I think she has realized that I am more tenacious than her, so- Am I using that word correctly? What does tenacious mean?

C: Probably. I think so. Let's check.

G: "Tenacious." Yeah. "Not relinquishing a principal or course of action, determined." And I am.

C: Yeah, okay. Well, my mom- yeah, no. I feel like I didn't let my mom finish the ultimatum. I feel like- like, one time I was like, "I hate practicing piano," and she was like, "No one who hates practicing piano can stay in my house." And I said, "Okay," and left.

G: Did you do that?

C: Yeah. [laughs] I left.

G: Oh my god. What if we are just like Sam for real?

C: What if we are just like Sam for real?

G: Yeah.

C: I feel like I did the leaving the house/running away from home thing, like, thrice, but none of them like, lasted more than two hours, so.

G: I mean, I have done it, but not with my mother, because my mother knows not to do it. Like, with my sisters like, they would say-

C: Your fucking sisters have that power?

G: Yes. Because my sisters are way older than me.

C: Seriously, though, that's- okay.

G: Like, I had my sister say- [laughs] this is one is so stupid. [C laughing]

C: Mine was stupid too, it's cool.

G: She said, "If you don't clean your room, don't ever come back to this house." [C laughing] [both laughing] My parents had to fetch me at the public park, and my dad, like, sat down and talked to me for two hours trying to convince me to get up from the public park and go back home because I didn't want to clean my room. [both still laughing] Ah. Love that. It was like, dead of the night, too, so.

C: Yeah. I think my running away plan was always that I was gonna sleep in the tube slide at my local playground. I was like, "That's protected from the elements. Let's go."

G: Ah, it's wild. Honestly, being at the point in life where you're both like, a person, like, you know, like, you're aware of things, and you can do things, but also, you have to live at home or live reliantly to your family is such an odd feeling, and like, it's just- it can be a lot, especially for people like us. [laughs] Like, queer people.

C: Like friends of Dorothy

G: Like people with limp wrists, yeah.

C: Yeah. [laughs] Like Jimmy Novak.

G: Mm-hm.

#transcript

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