#rotj critical

[peachviz]

“Tenderness and Passion are the only weapons which will save man from self-destruction” -D.H. Lawrence

The Order of Death

[padmestrilogy]

love reading early george lucas biographies , just endless foreshadowing

[lukeskywalking]

Feeling completely normal over the fact that they took Luke’s backstory, lightsaber, last name, ship, and now his legacy and given it to Rey when they could’ve just wrote the story with Luke in the first place. I’m feeling so normal and understanding and accepting and

[jonberry555]

#fromacertainointofview #returnofthejedi Everyone's a Critic by Sarah Glenn Marsh Review #shorts

[maaruin]

I’ve heard it said that Andor is a response to A New Hope. In a new hope Luke is the hero who saves the galaxy. Andor on the other hand says that you can’t save the galaxy as a single person, but you can join a broad revolutionary movement that saves the galaxy.

But see, in Return of the Jedi the galaxy is also saved by a movement. It is an alliance many different humans, and mon calamari, and sullustans, and ewoks.

There is, however, a different message packaged in both stories. In Andor, the response to the idea that it needs a movement to save the galaxy is to dedicate your entire life to that movement, because it is meaningless outside of the cause (”Kill me, or take me in!”). In RotJ the response to the idea that it needs a movement to save the galaxy is that you can trust other people to do it without you, and it is okay if you just want to save one person (one enemy) who is important to you instead.

Ideologically, Andor might actually be the furthest any Star Wars series has ever strayed from the spirit of Star Wars.

[gffa]

When it comes to Jedi discourse I think a lot depends on the amount of sympathy behind a statement there is. For example, "The Jedi have been corrupted by this war." is something Lucas has said, but it's in the context of how they were drawn into a trap, they were forced into roles that they were never meant to be, there's sympathy there for how the only choices here are shitty ones. "Do they compromise their morals (to fight in this war) or does everyone die and it's pointless anyway?" is basically what he said. I agree with that! But I have seen many people say, "The Jedi became corrupted by the war." and they mean it as the Jedi no longer cared about people, only themselves, they were only looking out for themselves, they were making selfish choices. There's no sympathy for the rock-and-a-hard-place situation the Jedi were in, and I disagree with that and I think that's what a lot of people are arguing back against. "They allied themselves with a corrupt government!" is another one--like, yeah, the Republic government wasn't great! But, when I say that the Separatists were worse, it's not because I'm refusing to admit the Republic had any fault, I'm saying it because that's basically the choice laid out in front of them--either you help the Republic or you let the Separatists take over, who were committing war crimes on screen. I do think the Jedi were hamstrung by their connection to the Republic! I just also think the alternative was worse, that the whole structure of Star Wars as a story was designed to hem them into this impossible choice (in as much as Star Wars is about the Jedi, when they're very much not the core of the story), that they couldn't find better options because the story wasn't set up to allow that. Could the Jedi have handled Anakin better? Ehhh, I think that's hard to say because the story itself doesn't present that, so making hard proclamations about what they did/didn't do wrong is reading into something the story didn't address. The story is about Anakin refusing to emotionally accept Jedi teachings--can we read beyond that and say there were ways the Jedi failed him? I think you can and some of them are fair (and some of them aren't), that it's a fun conversation to have, but that it's not what the narrative intention is, if we're talking about actual narrative intention. The narrative intention is that Anakin, though very human in his failings and Lucas clearly has so much affection for his Blorbo, failed to learn what he needed to learn. But there, too, I think a lot depends so much on how much sympathy comes across for the choices being made. I don't think we're meant to see Anakin as someone we can't relate to, Lucas even says that Anakin is a victim in TPM (of the Hutts and Watto, to be clear), I don't think criticism of Anakin can come without that he was trying, that he did genuinely love people. The ending of ROTJ doesn't work without us wanting for Anakin to find the good in himself! That we knew had to be there all along. So much comes down to how much sympathy there is in the criticism, how much sympathy there is for the reasons why any given character chooses the paths they do, and that's where a lot of disconnect comes from. So much Jedi criticism is done in the vein of saying, "They failed." and meaning it as an accusation of how a better choice was super obvious. But if you say, "They failed." in the sense that there was no way out of the trap that they could have possibly forseen, given the circumstances, that they did their best and they shouldn't have to be perfect to be good, then I'm all the way onboard! It's about how much sympathy there is for the context around a given character's choices and what the story allowed for them. I have no issue with saying the Jedi failed in the war, that they became corrupted by it, that their connection to the Republic led to their genocide, because I don't think the Jedi were bad for it, I think they made the best choices they could in the worst situation.

[drunk-on-starlight]

It's kind of interesting to watch people talk about the sequels inventing force abilities (especially in the context of Rey's healing, which is decades older) but also because the phantom menace had qui gon and obi wan use super speed once and never mention it again.

[class-a-fanatic]

This really does further empathize that everyone’s media perception is going to be subjective to one’s own definitions and views.

There’s going to be objective fact to canon, but a lot of it is also going to be up to interpretation. The world of cinema would a lot more boring if everyone had the same idea about everything. If the storyteller isn’t directly telling what something is/isn’t, it means that no one wrong OR right about their interpretation.

At the end of the day, you’re just going to be wasting time trying to assimilate others into a singular perspective. Let people develop media literacy! We bring no valuable points to the table by being single minded robots.

Once we stop attacking people for having opinions based solely off of interpretation, I honestly think we can have better fandom discourse and discussion.

Anakin Skywalker and the Semantics of Redemption

So everyone knows that the scene at the end of Return of the Jedi is something of a source of mild controversy. Are we supposed to see Anakin as redeemed because he became a Force Ghost? Is that the intended message behind the story? If it is, does Anakin truly deserve to be redeemed?

My personal take on it is that we are probably supposed to understand Anakin as redeemed, but that it doesn't really feel like a satisfying ending to me because Anakin never really does anything particularly worthy of what I would consider redemption, and that I don't really think Anakin COULD be redeemed even if he had survived.

That take has garnered me some... interesting... responses from people. I've had people tell me that I'm an inhuman monster for refusing to believe Anakin could be redeemed at all. I've had people argue that obviously Lucas thinks he's redeemed, so nothing else matters. I've seen people say that it's ridiculous to think he ISN'T redeemed, that's the entire point of the story and I've missed the whole theme of the saga if I don't get it. The politer responses have included people telling me what THEIR definitions/interpretations of redemption are and how they've made Anakin's ending fit into that.

If you're familiar with me at all, it won't shock you to discover that this sent me digging through the online dictionaries that seemed pretty reputable (for context, I used Merriam-Webster, Encyclopedia Brittanica, dictionary.com, vocabulary.com, and Collins Dictionary) to seek out "the true definition of redemption" to see if I could put the issue to rest in any way. What I ended up discovering there is no "true definition of redemption" to be found, even in the dictionary. I know. Absurd. How dare they.

Instead, once we eliminate the definitions that don't really apply to the situation (things that are more monetary in nature), most of the dictionary definitions fell into one of three categories: theological, internal, and external.

The theological definition appears to say that being redeemed means being completely freed of sin, totally absolved of everything. My assumption is that, given its origins, this generally means forgiveness by your god because you or someone else has done something to cause that complete absolution.

The internal definition is more about making the choice to improve yourself. It doesn't necessarily matter if other people see you differently (though it seems to be an expected side effect), so the redemption is about what's happening internally in how YOU see the world and your place within it.

The external definition is about how other people see you and, most commonly, about atonement and making amends. Now you could make the argument that the definitions could be implying that just the act of TRYING to atone or make amends is enough to count as redemption as opposed to needing to succeed at it in order to count, but generally the definitions seem to be implying that if you've actually MADE amends, THEN you are redeemed.

All of these are perfectly valid definitions of redemption according to these dictionaries. Redemption is a word that can be used to mean more than one thing depending on which definition you tend to associate with it the most or even just depending on the context or the person you're talking about. One person's definition of redemption is not necessarily the one and only way to view redemption. My definition may not be yours and it's definitely not the same as a lot of other people's.

In the case of Anakin, some people are maybe looking at him through a more theological context and if the Force has forgiven him via his own sacrifice or Luke's, he is then freed of sin and completely absolved for all of his crimes, happy endings all around.

Some people see redemption as an internal choice to do better or improve yourself and so Anakin's one good choice to save Luke at the cost of his own life is enough to redeem him in general even if it changes nothing about the evil things he's done.

Some people see redemption as an external thing that happens if you are able to truly atone or make amends for things you've done and change the way people view you and so Anakin can't be considered redeemed because he just dies before he can DO any of those things. Some of us go even farther and say that he'd never be ABLE to do any of those things even if he DID survive due to how much damage he's truly done and how unchangeable some of his choices are, so he'd never truly be able to be redeemed even if he spent the rest of his life making better choices.

Redemption is going to mean so many different things to so many different people. And that obviously is going to impact our views on Anakin and his ending in ROTJ. It'll work for some, and it won't work for others. But what I'm starting to come to terms with is that there's just no one way to view redemption. So someone who sees him as redeemed isn't necessarily WRONG. But in the same vein, someone who DOESN'T see him as redeemed is EQUALLY correct. Lucas himself seems to have said a few different things on the subject and sometimes sees Anakin as saved or redeemed and sometimes doesn't.

Redemption is a complex topic, obviously, but I'm sticking with my personal definition and interpretation because it's what feels right to me. But if someone else wants to go with a different definition because it's the interpretation that feels right to them, I'm not going to contradict them. Just don't try to come onto my blog to tell me that MY interpretation is wrong and that I'm some kind of unfeeling asshole because my definition of redemption is different than yours. I've got the damn dictionary receipts to back me up now.

[frumfrumfroo]

A few years ago, I was discussing The Last Jedi with a classmate and he said something like “It was a good movie, just not a good Star Wars movie”. At the time, I chalked it up to the fact that he was a teenage boy who was probably parroting the vague and irritating criticism that the movie faced at the time. Years later, I began to think about that moment more and more. Despite hearing that critique so many times, hearing it from him made me reflect on the concept of “getting” Star Wars and what fans perceive as “getting” Star Wars.

What the last few years (and the stream of post-TROS shows) have taught me, is that a large portion of fans don’t actually get what Star Wars is. The same is true for those who are currently planning the future of the franchise. They don’t see the value in the mythical framework of the series or care to understand it, it seems like they overlook it entirely. They’re so consumed by the fidelity to “the lore” that they can’t take step back and see the (mythical) elements that drew them to the story in the first place. It feels a bit arrogant of me to say that, but it’s a feeling that’s been bothering me.

Yes, part of the core of the problem is that even the people who actually like SW that DLF hired seem to be mostly fans of the old EU who are fundamentally unconcerned with what SW is actually about. People who prioritise 'lore' and minutiae, who think trivia is worldbuilding or that 'worldbuilding' is what defines the GFFA.

Whereas what actually defines the GFFA is the themes ('love people, that's all Star Wars is' -George Lucas). The universe exists to tell the story and the story exists to communicate the themes. It is character-driven, not plot or setting driven. Things making emotional sense is the only thing that matters in the OT, the logistics are irrelevant and incidental. It's not sci-fi and never has been, there is no interest in explaining the rules of the technology or codifying the Force into a structured system. There is no exploration of the relationship of society with technology because this is an epic fantasy story focussing on the conflict going on in the human spirit between selfishness and love; it's about the coming of age of an individual where the entire setting is established to facilitate that. SW is a story about individuals and their journey to ethical adulthood.

TLJ is written to the mythic archetype and themes of SW, its basic narrative shape is absolutely textbook exactly what anyone who understands literary criticism should have expected. It is exactly what a SW sequel to TFA should and needed to be. Which is why so many people doing that kind of analysis were able to accurately predict its main story beats.

The lore fans who want 'realism', video game power system Force magic, and the kind of moral ambiguity which is foundationally incompatible with SW are not fans of the story, they are fans of the trappings. These are the people who dismiss Vader's redemption as a unforunate incidental that 'everyone' can ignore because the rest of RotJ is good (paraphrase of an actual post I saw).

THE moral victory, the protagonist's moment of vindication, the entire POINT of the story and this dude thinks it's like, an accidental blooper that just kinda snuck into the edit because he wants Luke to be a standard American hero and not to have his worldview challenged.

I am totally comfortable saying they don't get SW no matter how much trivia they've memorised and merch they've collected.

[short-wooloo]

It just occurred to me why certain fans (particularly stanakins) have such rabid stupid hate boners for Reva...

It's because Reva does something rare for a higher canon character, she hates Anakin

See, hating Vader isn't uncommon in universe, most people do, but most aren't aware of anakin in the Vader equation, nor did they know him personally, and of the characters who know both anakin and Vader, most don't hate him

Yoda pities him

Obi-Wan is wrecked with guilt over him

Padme died believing in him

Luke loves him and still believes in him

Really the only one who hates anakin is Leia, but critically, this doesn't come up in higher canon, it's mostly a books/comics thing, the most we get of Leia's thoughts on anakin is shock and disbelief that he's her father in rotj

(Also I notice people give Leia a pass for hating anakin, a combination of "Leia's allowed because she's his daughter" and of course, racism, white characters are allowed to despise a white villain, but if a black character does then they're literally the worst)

But Reva hates anakin, hates him for what he did to her, to her family, for betraying the Jedi, and she's open about it, she doesn't care about the "good man" Anakin used to be like the others (minus Leia) above, she doesn't lend him sympathy

And that drives stanakins insane

[marvelstars]

“You didn’t kill Anakin Skywalker, I did” Darth Vader in OWK

While I believe with some work this phrase could be worked into SW canon, I dislike it´s implications, I think this phrase was the show creators trying to whitewash Obi-Wan role in ROTS when he decided to cut off all of Anakin´s limbs and letting him burn alive, one of the most painful ways to die ever. This tells me not only part of the fandom has a hard time seeing the story as it´s with nuance but also current creators at disney but that´s not how Lucas developed his story.

Obi-Wan may have not groomed Anakin like Palpatine did, owned him like Watto but he certainly tried to kill him on behalf of the Jedi Order and he was convinced he only could kill him off , in fact it´s Obi-Wan the one who started the fight on mustafar activating his lightsaber first while Anakin wasn´t looking at him.

Obi-Wan´s mission on mustafar was to kill off Anakin plain and simple, when he saw him burn alive he didn´t feel pity or mercy, he feel disgusted, in lucas words, Obi-Wan thought he was a thing, a thing of the darkside and when he discovered Vader was alive he planned to train Anakin´s Son, use his memories of Anakin to convince Luke to kill off Vader, his father, then tried to deflect blame when confronted with the truth by Luke.

This doesn´t mean Obi-Wan didn´t love Anakin at some point but he believed in "once a sith always a sith" for someone who told Anakin only Sith deal in absolutes, he had a very "absolute" way of thinking, the only thing Obi-Wan tought he could do for Anakin once he fell to the darkside was kill him off, at no point does Obi-Wan in the OT tries to deny that´s his intention so it´s unnecesary for the fandom and some creators to try to do mental gimnastics over this fact and by the way Obi-Wan learned of Anakin´s actions, you could even say he was justified even if his actions were cruel.

That said the story is clear that there are two types of deaths, the physical one and the spiritual one when people fall to the darkside, the jedi believe killing a sith is ok because they are already dead and so they are not killing the same person, that´s the logic Yoda follows and Obi-Wan when it came to Anakin and Dooku but they are also hypocritical in this choice of words when they act as if revenge wasn´t a big factor on it but at least they accepted they played a part in what happened to Anakin even if they are trying to fix it by killing him.

This is what makes Luke reject their orders, because he doesn´t want to commit patricide for revenge, he respects and loves his teachers but that´s something he knows he can´t do without falling to the darkside as well and despite all the reasons he had to hate Vader, he also has felt his care for him in the force and that´s why he wanted to save him.

Anakin tried to convince himself that he was spiritually dead and lost until Luke went to rescue him and that´s why he told him he already saved him even if he was dying.

Obi-Wan was totally surprised when he discovered Vader turned back from the darkside and when he realized Anakin was going to join the force he realized he wasn´t going to see him as himself again, unless he teached him how to become a force ghost(this is tackled in the novel version of Obi-Wan´s pov in ROTJ), so ironically, it was Obi-Wan´s need to keep Anakin around, on his side, what promted him to teach him how to become a force ghost, because he discovered he still loved him as his friend and wanted his friend back.

It´s pretty clear in the story, this isn´t about criticizing Obi-Wan, this isn´t Jedi bashing, it´s how literally the events happened in star wars and those are part of Obi-Wan´s personality as well as some of the Order povs on the darkside this doesn´t contradict their good intentions or Obi-Wan´s sassy lines and warm demeanor with friends and family.

[rainofaugustsith]

At this point I roll my eyes and block whenever Jedi apologists cross my dash - ship and let ship, on your own time, without bothering me about it. But occasionally one gets through, and I swear to god.

If you honestly think that criticizing the Jedi, thinking the Jedi did terrible things, thinking the Jedi are based on Christianity's overbearing need to convert everyone and their dogmatic belief in one true path, thinking people should have had alternatives to the Jedi, etc. means you in any way approve of the genocide of Order 66, I can't begin to fathom the cognitive dissonance. How the fuck do you get from Point A to Point B with that? Do you honestly think that if you have negative things to say you're somehow endorsing widespread murder?

Maybe they're thinking of themselves, since they seem to think genocide against an entire culture, spiritual practice, language, ethnicity is fine when it's directed toward the Sith.

You know who also criticized the Jedi and thought they needed to be reformed? Luke. Fucking. Skywalker. You know, the one who actually succeeded in RotJ because he completely and entirely ignored the advice/orders the Jedi masters gave him about killing Vader and instead decided to reach out to him as a person. You know, the one in the EU who actually reformed the Jedi and removed a lot of the things that he felt were innately harmful, such as the Jedi bans on relationships, marriage, and such. Oh, and he married a Dark Sider.

Anyway.

[dailydragon08]

I hate the “no attachments” rhetoric so much and I hate that both Ahsoka and Luke in Mando and TBOBF fell straight back into it. Cuz they especially should know more than anyone that the feelings of isolation, feeling like you’re not in a safe space to healthily process your emotions—which requires actually feeling them and being in an environment where you’re allowed to feel them—and feeling like you have a support system where you can speak your feelings without judgment to get guidance and support is REQUIRED for Jedi to stay on the light side. Cuz loneliness, feeling like a burden, feeling like if you have one bad emotion it makes you all bad because of rules around feelings that are unrealistic and too rigorous makes you way more susceptible to the dark side.

Trying to beat bad emotions out of people completely is unrealistic. Expecting literal children to not feel those feelings and just know what to do with them cuz you’ve created a space where those feelings are forbidden is unrealistic. Pushing feelings and emotions down and “burying” them (re: obi wan telling luke “bury your feelings deep down” in ROTJ) and expecting those people to be perfectly healthy is unrealistic. Wanting this level of control over people, their thoughts, and their emotions, and this black and white thinking is not only toxic and dangerous, but is akin to cult culture. The PT era Jedi were extremists in this way and just too blind and couldn’t accept any criticism enough to see it because for some reason, a bunch of old guys decided evolution was not allowed and they’d just keep running the system the same way they always had with no room for change and that would somehow be this foolproof path to survival—which is a complaint a lot of people have about our current irl political system and is causing a lot of damage, btw.

Like wasn’t that the whole point of showing the Jedi’s fall? And doesn’t clone wars especially show how this thinking created all these cracks in the system that Palpatine was easily able to exploit and manipulate and Anakin was just someone who wanted change in the order and he was ostracized for it, so Palpatine latched onto him and Anakin was like “oh finally someone values me,” just to be manipulated and abused and have his whole life blown up to the point that he thought the empire was his only option (obv not excusing the atrocities, just saying I can see how he got to where he did mentally by ROTS)? Like he literally tells Luke that they can team up to overthrow the emperor and in ROTJ, when Luke tries to get him to run with him pre-throne room battle, he says “it’s too late for me,” so he KNOWS this is bad and only going to get worse, but has resigned himself to it.

Like wasn’t the whole point of the OT and the “I can’t kill my own father/there’s still good in him/I can turn him back to the good side” meant to prove that Jedi DO NEED healthy connections in order to thrive and stay on the light side? If they wanna forbid anything, they should be forbidding possession and control, but the PT Jedi Council instead used that for their own benefit and lacked any self awareness to see they’d just become what they were preaching against.

Like give me a post-OT Jedi council who teaches healthy connection and letting things go that aren’t meant for you to control and that friendships and relationships can be powerful things that bring you back to the light in your darkest moments, and a more Legends-esque New Jedi Order that values emotional health and well-being and is a safe space for not only the galaxy, but Force sensitives, no matter how they’re built instead of trying to force everyone into the same box. This is the order I wanted to see Luke cultivate in canon and I will forever be salty that this isn’t what we got.

[vani11a-ice]

So, any unpopular opinions about Star Wars Legends that you have? I'm perfectly willing to listen.

Lmao hi, I didn’t expect to see you here! I really liked your Mara Jade criticism/analysis, and I saw your thoughts about my silly little hashtags—off topic to the ask but yes I definitely agree it’s too late to do anything with Mara Jade now given her story already concluded in Legends/EU verse, not to mention Disney now own the rights so that couldn’t even happen. If she were rewritten however she definitely could be far greater of a character.

As for your kind ask, when it comes to Star Wars EU there’s a lot to unpack because there’s so much content, but I guess I can give an overall opinion to make it more concise (But brace yourself, I will be yapping quite a bit anyways on here lol).

I generally love Legends. I grew up mainly with the central Lucas canon many years before Disney acquired the franchise: obviously the movies and 2008 clone wars series, and then some small EU content such as video games and some children’s comics/books before I even knew what the EU was. Because of this, I think it’s easy for me and many others to look back on the old stuff and be nostalgic for it.

But now that I’m older and gotten back into Star Wars (after losing interest in it for a while due to the sequels), I now have a better grasp of Legends content as well as a lot of lore I didn’t know as a kid—mainly books about what happens post ROTJ—and one thing I’ve noticed is that the quality highly fluctuates. On the one hand you get some amazing stuff like the Old Republic era, some of the Clone wars comics, old Battlefield games, the Darth Plagueis novel, the Prequel novelisations, Thrawn, Clone Wars 2003 and ofc many more. On the other hand, you get some pretty ridiculous stuff too, like Dark Empire, Shadows of the Empire, the Force Unleashed (Ironically, I actually really like this game for the nostalgia, its gameplay, Galen himself, story potential and the memes but many events of the game itself do not realistically make sense lol) and many books post ROTJ (mind you haven’t read all of them, way too many lol) that kind of have plot points I’m not too happy with and I could go on forever about (and some others I probably haven’t thought of).

My main point is, many legends fans will always advocate that the solution to Disney’s less than stellar Star Wars works recently is doing adaptations of existing legends material. And whilst I do think that there is a lot of lore you can pluck from legends and reuse/rewrite for their potential (I mean Disney already does that with characters like Thrawn), I never would want a 1-1 recreation. First of all, Legends started before the prequels so a lot of it doesn’t make complete sense now anyways (Hot take, but post-prequel-movies legends has always been better overall in terms of quality. For this reason, Old Republic/Prequel era was handled better overall than New Republic era). Additionally, Legends just isn’t as consistent or good overall as people would like to believe. It’s a large universe with several different writers, there’s bound to be mistakes/bad works riddled throughout here and there.

I also don’t think there’s enough people that talk about (especially) the older legends materials’ problematic elements as well. I’m not always a huge fan of how certain writers treat female and even other minority/non-human characters in Legends. I’m sure you’re familiar with this with people like Mara Jade. One of my other personal main gripes just to list another example is Leia. I’ve always hated how sidelined she is because she was always my personal favourite as a child, and the writers throughout the continuity could not make up their mind on whether she should be a Jedi or not to the point where her skills largely varied between writers until they finally decided to make it official when she’s much much older. Even by then she’s already overshadowed by her children/brother. George Lucas himself didn’t always write her or other female characters in the best way either, but I always thought an EU continuity would be the perfect place to give her the attention she deserves, instead all we got was an inconsistent arc, especially after the Thrawn trilogy. Disney could have turned this around but unfortunately the exact same thing happened where they couldn’t make up their mind on whether she was a Jedi or not (and gave her the shittiest excuse for quitting—how ironic that both Legends and Disney write in immediate motherhood and marriage as a sexist obstacle rather than actually letting her character grow before/during these events).

Fanatic Legends fans will, however, unfortunately rarely agree or at least try to understand criticism of their favourite universe, and, in my view, this is no better than Disney Adults who vehemently reject criticism of some of the worst recent Star Wars media that’s been released.

To conclude this long ass rant, I just think Star Wars EU whether that be Legends or Disney could do with rewriting/organisation here and there. But that’s highly unlikely, so a more realistic solution is just to pick and choose the media you enjoy from both universes (or make up your own!) and just accept it as your own personal canon. That’s what gives me peace and mind anyways :)

[gch1995]

I actually read a lot of really great Star Wars canon-divergent AUs and missing scene fanfics in which Anakin and Obi-Wan make amends with each other. I imagine they would have had to off screen for Anakin to be able to be on seemingly good terms by the end of ROTJ. I think it’s a pretty fitting theme in the line of the narrative for them to make up.

My problem is that George Lucas was too afraid to fully commit to portraying the Jedi Order as a well-meaning, but still seriously flawed organization that needed to really change for the better in a number of ways. If you ignore the sequels and other Disney Jedi/Sith content, then it’s easy to believe that Luke actually learned from his predecessors mistakes, and rebuilt a healthier and more balanced Jedi Order. If you just read the old EU, watch the OT films, and watch the prequels, then it’s easy to believe that the Jedi actually got to become the heroes they were often too afraid to be the first time around in the prequels when Luke’s father was growing up in it. That’s the logical direction Luke’s character seemed to be going in at the end of ROTJ from his background and character development.

Even then, though, there’s still the fact that Obi-Wan and Yoda never really get framed as wrong for deliberately deceiving, endangering, and manipulating Luke in order to use him as a weapon to kill his father “for the greater good” of the galaxy. I understand they believed they had pure intentions, but so did Anakin when he abused his power over Luke to try to lure him to the dark side to kill Palpatine and gain freedom to “rule the galaxy together” to “make it a better place.” I get that he was much scarier than Obi-Wan and Yoda in regards to his treatment of Luke and his friends in the OT films, but Anakin was still framed as wrong for using shitty and selfish methods that he knew were wrong in an attempt to secure freedom and power “for the greater good,” too. Luke didn’t grant him forgiveness until he could realize that he was being too cowardly and selfish to do the right things in the right ways for his son and admit he was wrong.

Obi-Wan and Yoda never really go through this sort of character development arc for growth in the OT films for their abuse of power over Luke. They never apologize, express remorse, or admit they were wrong to Luke. They never feel the need to make amends to him for mistreating him for their own ends.

George Lucas even verbally denied/retconned his own canon narrative on screen with a bullshit explanation to bend over backwards to try to absolve Yoda and Obi-Wan of their mistreatment of Luke in the OT films because he was so afraid of fully committing to making the old Jedi Order deeply flawed characters who needed to improve a lot.

Then, because Disney couldn’t keep their greedy and lazy hands off the franchise, they continued George Lucas’s exceedingly indecisive and lenient attitude in regards to the Jedi Order in the canon narrative that we saw shades of throughout the OT and PT films. Thus, the growth that Luke logically should have led the new Jedi Order with got undone.

In other words, I don’t mind fanfic stories of Anakin and Obi-Wan eventually making amends. Amends have to be made on both sides, though, not just Anakin’s and not just Obi-Wan’s. A full exploration of what went wrong on both their sides needs to be present, both characters need to be willing to fully admit they were wrong, eventually understand why they were wrong, and eventually grow from it in a positive way. Otherwise, a fanfic of them making amends doesn’t work for me.

I think what really irritates me is when people create a what if of au HC or fics to when Anakin is alive and Skywalker family lives happily but people make it so that Anakin spends most of his time with Pamde and the kids and almost no time with Obi as if he is still would resent Obi for what he did during the fall of the Jedi if people really portray Anakin like this then they really don't know him at all

[writingforfun0714]

So I wanted to wait and let the new Bad Batch trailer sink in before posting about it.

Warnings: Spoilers, some thoughts/opinions will be critical

Alright so I don’t think it’s any secret that I don’t care for the Bad Batch. Even ignoring the horrible, incredibly RACIST clone model, the writing is mid/passable at best and not even watchable for me. Most of S1 and 2 combined is the typical ‘mission of the week’ type of story where only a few Empire-focused episodes stand out. There are also instances of ableism concerning Echo in particular (CF99 are also super dismissive of him in general—going along with that whole fucking ‘superiority over regs’ thing—seriously wtf).

Most episodes were very bland and predictable. S1 had no stakes despite its finale. By Mando/ST it’s clear that something has happened to Kamino. Didn’t really need to see a 2pt ep of the city getting wiped. Plus AZI should’ve been sacrificed. Even Ahsoka learns the lesson that you can’t save everyone in S1 when she disobeys Anakin and Admiral Yularen. TBB S2 had no character development from anyone besides a little bit for Omega (and Tech—but that was always speculated by fans since S1 and he’s dead now so it doesn’t really matter). A lot of the dialogue felt…basic. I think the only thing that TBB does well is the music. It’s really amazing and beautiful along with the smooth, crisp animation/scenery. Shame they ruined it with racist clone models, racist tones with the ‘reg’ dispute in both seasons, and being ableist and dismissive towards Echo.

Which brings me to the trailer. Oh boy. First, right off the bat I noticed how similar the trailer opening is compared to the S2 trailer. I do like that Phee is back. She did take time to grow on me but I do like her character and am curious to see where they will go with her.

It’s interesting we are seeing Crosshair back with the group so soon. Personally I do believe that is Crosshair and not just someone else wearing his armor like some think. I like the idea of Omega and Crosshair escaping early on but Omega gets recaptured/separated and taken back to Tantiss.

I’m interested in Hemlock and his backstory (is his gloved hand robotic?). I wish they’d create more interesting and unique characters like Phee and Fennec Shand instead of relying on cameos of established characters/fan-favorites like Ventress. I loved Dark Disciple and I thought it was a great ending for her.

I know it’s officially said that Ventress’ story will follow Dark Disciple but I don’t see how unless they retcon her death or pull a ‘somehow she survived’. Either way that sucks. Reminder!! DAVE FELONY DIDN’T EVEN FOLLOW REBELS FOR AHSOKA. SABINE IS NOT FORCE SENSITIVE IN REBELS. DAVE RETCONS THE SHIT OUT OF EVERYTHING. I have no faith that they will remain loyal to DD. Anything that will be ‘canon’ will be mid at best because even Crosshair’s arc has been messy (which is due to the weird S1 ‘reset’ the characters go through. Like they totally should’ve appreciated ‘regs’ by the end of TBB arc in TCW S7–there was no need for that awkward food fight scene in S1).

I hate that this show has to rely on cameos to get the viewing numbers. Here is a list of every character cameo we’ve seen so far:

—Rex*

—Tarkin*

—Palpatine*

—The Lawquane Family

—The Syndullas/Chopper

—Nala Se/Lama Su*

—Cad Bane

—Bail Organa

—Riyo Chuchi

—Gungi

—Gregor

—Wolffe

—Cody

—Scorch

—Saw Gerrera

—Martez Sisters

—Kanan/Depa*

—Muchi/Rancor from RotJ

—Taun We/Halle Burtoni

—Ventress

*I consider these important/relevant cameos and am not bothered by them like the others*

What a list right? I might even be missing one. These were just off the top of my head. Some are big players, others smaller and almost not-relevant to the plot. Not counting the one’s I asterisked, it’s 15 characters. There are original characters but a lot of them, especially in S1 felt like one off, not important characters. And I hate Cid so much—glad to see she was absent in the S3 trailer. I’m really starting to love Phee and I’ve always loved Fennec Shand, and Hemlock is definitely an intriguing villain and Emerie feels like a total mystery (though the reveal was not shocking due to the similar design and accent to Omega). Like why can’t they create more characters like these? The rest just feel forgettable. And it’s clear that characters like Saw, Gungi, Scorch, Cad Bane and even the Syndulla and Lawquane families just felt like fan service. The rest kind of make sense that they’d show up but it also feels a bit like fan service.

Moving on..

I know a lot of people think that new weird dark trooper at the 1:40 mark is Tech. While I’m inclined to agree as I think the ‘Winter Soldier’ story is an obvious choice to pick, I also think that Tech is dead. I’ve changed my mind and kind of hope that Tech isn’t brought back.

I hope this is someone new. I also wouldn’t mind if it was a bounty hunter we’ve seen before. Due to the frame and stature, I could almost think of Boba due to him being older than Omega but it’s definitely more likely to be Tech than either of these choices.

It’s interesting a lot of cameo characters from S2 do not make an appearance in the trailer. Bail, Riyo, Gungi, Gregor and Cody are all absent from the trailer. Trailers usually show action shots to avoid story spoilers, but with Gungi, Gregor, and Cody all being capable fighters, I’m surprised they didn’t appear (usually stuff with politics is a story spoiler).

Overall I’m skeptical of the trailer. I don’t like Ventress being alive/in TBB being a Dark Disciple lover. There’s a lot of mystery surrounding the story of S3 so I don’t feel like I can give an accurate take on that. I hate how Omega’s longer hair looks. Curly haired Omega is adorable!! The animation (everything but the clone model) is definitely getting better. However, based on how S2 was marketed as a ‘darker story compared to S1’ and was like 80% fetch quest I’m definitely skeptical.

Those of you that made it through this post, thank you for your time and I hope I gave you something to think about. If you wanna learn more about the racism and ableism portrayed in this show, check out @unwhitewashthebadbatch for more info.