#platonic mileven is better

[bylerthebros]

"Not possible" "I love you too"

[idksjdhshdhd]

WAIT I KINDA SEE A PATTERN!

So in s1 when Mike and El kissed in the last episode and then when El was defeating the Demogorgon and said “Goodbye, Mike.” WHICH WAS KINDA LIKE A BREAKUP I THINK??

And then in s3 there was the full on moldymilk break up like “I DUMP UR ASS!” Which was literally a breakup…

And then in s5 they’re gonna break up because Mike and El always seem to break up on seasons with odd numbers and be either separated or unstable in even-numbered seasons and there won’t be a season 6 so therefore Mike and El won’t have a chance to get back together if they break up so that would let Byler happen and also Maya Hawke said that the episodes were like filming eight movies so that will give Byler time to happen plus they already have a ton of buildup, chemistry, and history together so basically… Mike and Eleven will almost certainly break up (and Eleven will probably break up with Mike if we’re following the previous breakup patterns) and so Eleven wouldn’t be too sad if they broke up since she did it (plus we saw in s3 that she was happier when she broke up with Mike) so basically Byler endgame? MY BYLER DOUBT IS GONE.

[lunabug2004]

Even as someone who prefers Byler, I will be the first to admit...

Mileven at the SnowBall is the cutest thing 🥹🥹🥹

They're such babies and they really do love each other, whether it's romantic at this point or not, whether they even realize if it's romantic at this point or not... they're just so adorable!

[thesapphicsoldier]

Something something El pretending to be Mike’s cousin, something something El asking Mike if he was gonna be her brother, something something Mike constantly paralleling Hopper and other parental/familial figures…

[jujuprincesinhasofia]

because Stranger Things did not say

“you shouldn't like things because people tell you you're supposed to" in s1,

"Nobody normal ever accomplished anything meaningful in this world" in s2,

"Instead of dating somebody because you think's gonna make you cooler, why not date somebody you actually enjoy being around?" in s3,

and screamed "It's forced conformity. That's what's killing the kids! That's the real monster." in s4

for people to assume a character's sexuality and use it as an argument to say there's no chance a ship is endgame, ignoring countless parallels with canon ships (crazy together, lost you, hand holding, screaming for the name, running to apologize, sleeping in the hospital, characters sacrificing their feelings, looking at lips, and more)

the show is called stranger things, its about NOT being what's considered normal, it will NOT have the boy and girl who met at 12 and kissed a few days later when she didn't even know what she liked be endgame if they don't work their many problems out (for example mike lying in the monologue)

but ultimately, its a show for the "nerds and freaks," it's a show for the "I'm not like your other friends. And I'm not like Nancy Wheeler"

it's about realizing that "I may be a shitty boyfriend but turns out I'm a pretty damn good babysitter" and that being "Platonic with a capital P" with a girl can be "bitchin" too

it wont be mileven endgame until el knows who she is without almost dying for more than one episode and without a boyfriend. come on, why do people want her to get proposed to at 18 when "there's more to life than stupid boys"

the show is about making "when you’re different, sometimes you feel like a mistake" people "feel like she’s not a mistake at all. Like she’s better for being different."

and well, if "fruit on your pizza is gnarly, you say? Well, I say try before you deny"

update abt posting a similar on reddit: people are surprisingly nice!!! im happy to have been proved wrong. 6 upvotes, a respectful comment saying im reaching, and not banned!!

update two: some downvotes :(

update three: some very mean people, some very nice people!!!!

update four: some are confusing, but no one cussed me out yet, im still happy bc of that nice person who doesn't even ship byler

update five: i got removed and called a very awful person lmao, it lasted an hour

[bylerbean77]

EL HOPPER DESERVES BETTER!!

I love Byler sm but I also love El

Poor girl has gone through so much she deserves soooo much better than how mikes treating her

My girl has been in a LAB and got treated like an experiment. She had zero friends and got manipulated by the person she called her father.

She got bullied and it makes my heart ache that she went through all of that. She’s so sweet, funny, smart, pretty and just overall a great character.

I genuinely hate seeing her sad

She just wants someone to love her and I think that she craves platonic love most bc for the whole of her life she had Papa who she thought loved her. But he betrayed her and now she has hopper. I honestly don’t think she’s ready for a relationship/boyfriend right now and that she may need to work on herself and FIND herself again.

She definitely deserves someone to love her romanticly but I don’t think Mikes the one.

He treats her so bad and it pains me to see El upset.

Im not gonna bring Byler in but I definitely think El and Mike shouldn’t continue dating because it’s clear it’s hurting both of them.

Yes ppl can change but the damage as already been done.

El deserves someone who loves her and Mike deserves to love someone.

He clearly doesn’t Love El romantically and he’s kinda being forced to say a lie to someone who he cares about. He doesn’t want to hurt her but at the same time he can’t hurt her without her knowing that he doesn’t actually love her like that.

Mike needs to find someone (cough* cough* Will Byers) who he genuinely loves and gets along with.

He needs someone to Love but El isn’t that girl person

Mileven doesn’t work and is canonically making El upset and unsatisfied.

The chances Byler will happen in my opinion is risky bc the Duffer Brothers could queer bait us and yes there definitely are queer coded signs for mike, it could just be straight up queer bait.

But I’ll say this; Mileven will definitely break up because if they don’t then they’re promoting toxic relationships that don’t work to a wide age audience and I don’t think that’s their message.

[will80sbyers]

I would like to believe in romantic Byler because in general I find them cute together and then you guys are all so nice and always do some gorgeous analysis unlike Milevens who are always bad...I am a Mileven too but I have nothing to do with them, indeed I’m also friends of some Bylers.

Anyway I was saying that I would like to believe in Byler, but every time the two have a conversation there is always El involved.

In the crazy together scene? They talk about El

In the rain scene? They talk about El

In the fight in Cali? They talk about El

In the van? They talk about El

In the final scene on the sofa? They talk about El

They’ve never had a conversation just themselves, there’s always her in the middle...

That’s my only doubt, and that’s why I think Mileven is endgame.

Bestie it's a love triangle, of course El is involved in the conversation because Mike did have a crush on her when he was little and wanted to talk about her, but not only do they have multiple moments just about them like in S2 when Will opens up about the possession and Mike supports him and we have the touch of the hand zoomed in... or the monologue mike does at the end of the season when he's talking about the start of the relationship and multiple other small moments

but also the point of the conversations they have is never only about El, it's also showing their strong emotional connection to the viewers, it's always about Will and Mike supporting each other in their journey, Will opens up to Mike and Mike gives him courage and understanding and Will does the same thing with Mike when he feels insecure and Will always makes him feel better about himself or brings him back to himself and makes him a better person like for the rain fight for example

I think you should rewatch all of these scenes, pay attention to when the conversation is about them and see just how much strength they give to each other and how they make the other feel safe!

When El and Mike talk that never happens for them, it's pretty much always superficial stuff or ugly conversations and they aren't really shown to have a strong connection emotionally since season 1 in my opinion, the really emotionally open moments they had are all from s1 and after that the writers just don't give them true bonding moments, that's why the love confession sounds insincere to most people even if I believe Mike meant what he said platonically and that they do have love for the other person, it doesn't sound sincere because the writers didn't gave them moments of emotional connection that make us believe the romantic side of it... And this is because the writers are building up byler endgame so they can't do that to the other couple involved in the love triangle

Mike doesn't know the true intensity of his love for Will yet so they can't show more than their bond growing and make them have a base to make it so that it's believable in the finale that Mike realizes "oh shit... I love him"

It's super normal and diffused in love triangle situations in media and books that the person A that's dating B talks about his problems with B with person C that is in love with A and A doesn't know it and then A realizes that C is their true love... It happens literally all the time 🫶

[roastedfishfries]

In my opinion Mileven is better then Byler.

And before someone says Byler is better, I'll say that I don't see it, Mike seems relatively straight throughout the entire show, Will seems a bit (very) GAY but Mike? He seems like he doesn't lean that way. I ship plenty of gay people together. I'm in so many fandoms where everyone is gay, but in those fandoms, firstly, They're mostly dead and the whole community is fandom (marauders fandom), or secondly, they act so gay (bungo stray dogs).

Also Another thing I've seen is that when someone says "if Will was A Woman it would of been the perfect relationship" i really doubt that, I mean if Will was a women and Eleven was a man. Would you really ship Mike with Will? People seem to have hatred towards straight couples, and prefer gay people than straight people. I mean, there is no harm with that but turning on people who like Mileven better is something you shouldn't do. Anyway, back to the topic of "if Will was A Woman it would of been the perfect relationship" I would still ship El with Mike, whether she was a man or woman, I think the two of them have better chemistry then what Will and Mike would do if Will was a woman. Throughout the entire series Mike has absolutely no love for Will other then platonic. Will absolutely has feeling towards Mike, but I don't Mike returning any of them, and I doubt that would change if Will was a girl.

Anyway, I also have an issue on how the fandom treats eachother, I mean, Mileven shippers and byler shippers treat eachother like shit, it's not that hard to treat eachother civilly even if you like another ship. It's pointless fighting, rather then focusing your energy on other activities, such as idk reading a fandic on your preferred ship, and instead meanlessly fighting over fictional characters.

ANYWAY IVE RANTED SOMEONE GIVE ME MILEVEN FIC RECS PLEASE.

[captain-evil-bastard]

The Importance of the Montauk Pitch in Relation to Mike Wheeler

in the montauk pitch, it explicitly states will struggles with his sexuality, which is why many people knew he was gay before s4. another thing briefly included was how mike would "even kiss a girl" in addition to gaining courage and helping to save will. the wording here is interesting. it's never stated that his goal was to get a girlfriend, it's instead to rescue his best friend. it also doesn't say 'fall in love with' or 'gets a love interest' in terms of their relationship. it actually compares him and el to elliot and ET, which is a PLATONIC bond.

call me insane, but would the shoehorned in "getting to kiss a girl" help the show to get approved by a still wishy- washy netflix? a streaming service that often prioritizes teen romance demographics? it's almost like mileven was first added haphazardly to appease netflix (as a lot of their chemistry feels VERY jank in the first season, the moments are just kinda..there.) and they had to just kinda keep on rolling with it only to later decide to switch it up (s3/4 breakups easing us into NOT wanting mileven endgame).

if the duffers really wanted it to last they would've made the relationship have better romantic chemistry throughout the following seasons, which is really only 'evident' in s2 when he MISSED her

[kl125]

I need to talk about this take. I’ve seen it so many times, and it continuously baffles me.

1. Why is mileven even being brought up in an unrelated fandom? I don’t know anything about Arcane, but I know that there was no reason to bring up ST on an Arcane Confessions account (there were some other posts comparing mileven to a ship in the series, and OP asked what mileven was, resulting in the above explanation).

2. MIKE 👏🏻 AND 👏🏻 EL 👏🏻 ARE 👏🏻 NOT 👏🏻 RELATED 👏🏻! How many times do we have to explain this? They aren’t related by blood or by law in the context of the show (neither are Finn and Millie, but I’m going to keep this to the characters from here on out). Nor have they ever said they see each other as relatives. This is a textbook case of taking things dangerously out of context (which I provide in point five). YOU may see them as “sibling-coded” or think they should be platonic, but that is entirely YOUR choice. Neither the creators nor the writers have ever said people should view mileven as familial/platonic or that the characters only see one another as brother/sister. This is an INTERPRETATION, not a definitive FACT.

3. Considering someone family does not make any relationship between them incestuous. Mike and El were twelve when they met. They’ve had a strong bond from the beginning, but their characterization and understanding of it has grown and changed just as they have. Nothing wrong with that. However, I say again, at no point have they explicitly stated they consider each other siblings in any sense of the word, AND there is a big difference between FOUND family and BLOOD family (neither is inherently better or more valid than the other, just different, that’s all).

4. The writers have an incest kink? Uhh…no? They’ve made it clear from the beginning that mileven is romantic. Mike and El call each other “boyfriend/girlfriend” all the time and have both said “I love you”. Also, categorizing anything related to a ship between two minors as the result of a “kink” from the writers is just disgusting.

5. I’ve seen people use Mike’s words in S1 to support this incest opinion (when he tells El that Nancy will be “like [her] new sister”). When El asked if that would make Mike “like [her] brother”, he IMMEDIATELY shut that down, making sure to distinguish their relationship. Even back then, he knew that what he and El have is unique and precious and decidedly NOT the same as how siblings should feel towards one another. This would be no different than how my brother-in-law feels towards me versus how he feels towards my sister. One is familial and one is romantic, respectively. Two different types of love, both valid, and both perfectly normal. (And I’m referring to my actual, real life sister and brother-in-law, not just using those terms randomly to make a point).

6. Multiple things can be true at once. El can see the Wheelers as her family, understand that she loves Mike romantically, and know that those are two very different types of love. Despite how some in this fandom like to characterize her, she is fully capable of complex thought and emotional intelligence. In S1, she asked Mike to clarify what their relationship is because she had never been shown love of any kind at that point in her life. What she got from Brenner was obsession, not love, and she never knew her mother. She may have started later than expected when it comes to understanding social cues and the complexities of relationships, but she got the hang of it very quickly and currently has no problem distinguishing between her love for Mike and her love for her friends/family.

(I realize some of these points and explanations seem redundant or repetitive, but it goes to show how insane this opinion is. No matter how many ways you try to explain it, this will never be true.)

All this to say, we need to put this “mileven is incest” argument to bed. Please. It makes no sense, it’s categorically false, and it’s just plain weird. If you don’t like mileven, that’s fine, but there’s no need to paint it as some illegal, immoral monolith to justify this viewpoint. I’ve seen ships between canonical siblings get praised (which is a whole issue in and of itself that I do not have time to get into), and yet this ship between two random teenagers is treated as criminal? No thanks. Mileven would very much like to be excluded from this narrative.

(Finally, if you’re sitting there thinking, “it’s not that deep,” please save it. As you can see, it very much is that deep to me.)

Here’s a happy Mileven gif to bring a little optimism while we wait for S5.

[lordystrange]

10 best byler proofs by me

10. The cast, especially David (who knows the ending) and Finn (who might know something), are always so happy talking about Byler. They wouldn’t be if Will ended up dying alone as a sad gay. Also no one likes milkvan except maybe Millie unless she’s acting… Caleb even said ”Lucas and Max’s love is real unlike Milkvan’s”.

9. Mike has been queercoded throughout the whole series. Especially with queer colors, he spent s4 dressed as a gay pride flag. Also bi and pan colors are associated with him. Also Ted’s ”our son with a girl?” and everything Eddie said about forced conformity etc

8. Byler parallelling other romantic ships like Jancy, Jopper and Lumax. I’m not listing examples because there are SO MANY! (Also Milkvan parallelling all the platonic/dead ships)

7. Mileven being bones. We have nothing that shows their actual, deep love they’re ”supposed to have”. We don’t know what Mike loves about El and what El loves about Mike. We don’t know what makes them a compatible match romantically. We only know things that don’t make them compatible: El feeling the need to lie to Mike, Mike feeling embarrassed of his nerdy self with El, El feeling unloved by Mike, Mike feeling inferior to El…

6. The desert scenes. The triple take ofc, but also the car roof top convo with Will (jancy parallell). Will is talking about how it’s scary to say how you really feel because what if they don’t like the truth. And Mike NODS. If the truth was that he loved El exactly like El wanted, El would like that truth. So what is the truth Mike is worried that El doesn’t like…?

5. Mike’s monologue. He had to be pushed by Will to open his mouth. He lied about him loving her at first sight. He copied the t-shirt part from Eddie. He kept saying she’s his superhero which El doesn’t wanna be. He didn’t include anything personal about El and their relationship after the t-shirt thing… Also El didn’t seem to like what she heard and their love didn’t save the world. And they didn’t even talk after it. And while filming it they didn’t focus on just the couple (like they did with byler in s2 shed scene) and they let Finn improvise as if it wasn’t that important (as important as the van scene…)

4. Mike would be so poorly written if he wasn’t into Will and I don’t think the Duffers would just ignore his character. Also all the lip glances and heart eyes wouldn’t make sense.

3. Byler/Milkvan contrast. When Will was gone and they found his ”body”, Mike heard Will breathing in a radio channel and believed he was alive. He didn’t rest for a second, he did everything he could to find him. When he thought El was dead, he didn’t go looking for her, even tho a couple times he actually saw her. Also in s3 when Milkvan had a fight, Max said Mike will be crawling back to her begging for forgiveness in no time. Instead Mike laid on a sofa and ate and complained. When Byler had a fight… well we all know what Mike did then.

2. Mike and Will’s relationship has always been different from other friendships. They’ve said it themselves (”pls don’t tell the others, they wouldn’t understand”, ”Hawkins is not the same without you”, ”you make her me feel better for being different”). Also their scenes together have always been a big deal (van scene took an entire day to film, crazy together was written before s1 was even filmed) and they are shot in a really romantic way (music, lighting…)

1. In the beginning of s3, Will said to Joyce that he’s not gonna fall in love. That made his arc about romance. We know now that he already fell in love, but he doesn’t believe it’s requited. If s5 goes from ”i don’t think he loves me back” to ”he doesn’t love me back” we get literally nowhere and the entire storyline (since s1) would be useless and waste of time and money. They wouldn’t make Will suffer 4 seasons and then suffer some more. So believe me when I say it goes ”I don’t think he loves me back” to ”He does love me back!”

I wish you all a very merry byler endgame in s5! 💚

[obsessionatthemoment]

One of the few arguments I have ever had with a Mileven shipper was me saying Mileven was toxic and them saying Byler was toxic. I have been thinking about this a lot recently, and have come to a conclusion (it's my personal opinion, and you can disagree if you want).

Before I start, I want to say that I am using the term toxic loosely (I am mostly using the term because it's the term we used in the argument). I am mostly referring to both ships' arguments when I refer to their toxic moments.

I think that the Mileven toxicity will get better with them agreeing to just be friends, and that the Byler toxicity will get better with them becoming boyfriends. Let me explain…

When Mileven fight, it's typically due to Mike not being able to reciprocate Elevens feelings, one of them lying, their relationship being too controlling or codependent, them invalidating each other, or Eleven hurting someone (whether it being her accidentally hurting Lucas in season 1 or her hurting Angela in season 4). I think, looking at this list, it is clear that they are not compatible. However, they are still compatible as friends. Mike can love El platonically, El would have space to figure herself out and have complete independence, and generally they would be happier and most likely fight less.

When Byler fight, it is almost always due to miscommunication, internalized homophobia, or jealousy (and sometimes invalidation or lying). If they started dating, I think a lot of this would be resolved. If they were dating, that would mean to some extent they were working through their internalized homophobia (which would eliminate a lot of conflict because out of all their conflicts, this comes up the most). Most of their miscommunication was due to them being many states apart (phone calls, letter, etc.), which will be resolved even if they didn't start dating. The jealousy would be resolved as well because most of their jealousy is due to both of them thinking the other doesn't like them. I think the invalidation would be solved alongside the miscommunication because Will would know that Mike called (that miscommunication was invalidating on both ends), Mike would probably understand if Will explained feeling like he missed out on his childhood due to his trauma (not sure if there is more invalidation I missed). The lying would be solved as well if Mike and Eleven weren't dating anymore because Will would stop trying to keep them together. Once they started dating, Will wouldn't need to use El as a cover for his feelings.

There is probably stuff I missed, but I feel like I got the most compelling evidence into words. I definitely think most of the toxicity would vanish if this happened, but obviously they would still fight occasionally because that's just how humans work. Conflict happens no matter how healthy a relationship is. Hope this made sense.

[pinksmonkey]

The Ultimate Byler Evidence/Analysis List (Part 2)

If you missed part 1, here it is: Part 1

100. They Are In Love

101. Songs Associated With Mike And Will

102. We've Seen This Plot Too Many Times

103. Byler Isn't Far-Fetched

104. Byler Endgame Makes So Much Sense

105. Pocketgate

106. Hosegate

107. Love This Detail

108. Phallic Imagery In Season 4

109. I Didn't Notice The Queercoding

110. So Unserious

111. It's Supposed To Be About Love

112. How You Doing?

113. Mike Is Not Into Girls

114. Mike And Lucas Parallel

115. Not Love At First Sight

116. Mike Is Protective Of Will

117. To Illustrate How Weird This Shot Is

118. Yeah, Imagine

119. Still Dizzy

120. The Biggest Byler Proof For Me

121. These Scenes Happened Less Than 5 Minutes Apart

122. Mike Is More Attentive To Will Than Any Other Character

123. Oh, Love At First Sight

124. They Said I Love You

125. Byler And Heartstopper Parallels

126. I've Been Chasing After Some Other Kid

127. Jancy And Byler

128. Mike Feels Like He's Not Worthy In His Relationship

129. Why So Many People Complain About Mike's Character

130. That Boy Is In Love

131. Mike's Attention To Will And El

132. Mike's Self Acceptance

133. Mike's Playlist Is 10x Gayer Than Will's

134. No Homo Though

135. This Masterpiece

136. Mike's Guilt

137. El's Superhero Identity

138. It's Time To Switch Things Up

139. Why Byler If No Byler?

140. Mike's Playlist In A Bisexual Interpretation

141. Will's Playlist Analysis

142. Mike's Love Drives The Story

143. Will Deserves Love

144. From Anti-Byler To Pro-Byler

145. Mike And Locker Rooms/Bathrooms

146. Genuine Question About The Cabin Scene

147. Mike Literally Blinded Himself

148. It's Not Even Subtle

149. The Best Thing I've Ever Done

150. Will Deserves Better?

151. Will's Feelings For Mike Are Crucial To The Plot

152. Will's Love Is Beautiful

153. It's A Pattern

154. Mike Is Deliberately Queercoded

155. We're Friends

156. The Writers And Their Sense Of Humor

157. They Still Don't Understand Personal Space

158. There's No Point To The California Storyline If Not Byler

159. Let's Start A New Party, You And Me

160. Mike's Insecurities

161. They Told Us Exactly What's Going On With Mike

162. Find Someone Who Looks At You Like This

163. Heartstopper Parallel

164. Lettergate, Younger Mike To Older Mike

165. Everyone Is Disappointed

166. I've Been So Lost Without You

167. Mike's Gayest Scene

168. Reactions To Hugs And Kisses

169. No Platonic Explanation

170. They Have To Be Joking

171. Lighting Analysis

172. Hidden Expressions

173. The Papa Script

174. Refuting Anti-Byler Points

175. El Likes The Idea Of A Boyfriend

176. Are We Watching The Same Show?

177. I'm Not The Only One In Love With My Best Friend

178. Mike Is So Hopeless

179. Will You Be Like My Brother?

180. Bedroom Decor

181. Will Doesn't Want "Better"

182. Best Friends

183. The Truth About Hosegate and Lover's Lake

185. The Culture of Bylerism

184. Talking About Fictional Teens and Sexuality

186. Mike's Sexuality Is Tied To The Narrative

187. Not Production Errors

188. Good Writing And Bad Writing

189. Shared Shoes And More

190. Smalltown Boy Coded

191. Trying To Act Normal

192. It's Called Foreshadowing

193. More To Their Relationship Than Friendship

194. Refuse To Believe This Was Unintentional

195. There Has To Be An Important Reason

196. Byler Rain Fight Vs Mileven Breakup

197. The Eyewitness And Dawson's Creek Parallels, Too Gay To Be Straight

And unfortunately Tumblr will only let me add 100 links per post, so when I've posted part 3 of this list, I'll link it here: Part 3

[nobodyinourstars]

Unpopular Opinion ( Idk if is unpopular...idgaf)

Actually, I really can't see Mileven getting married like Millie said... I think getting married and having kids is an idea that really scare Mike.

Mileven isn't endgame, even if Byler don't get together. Mileven relationship is so desgasted, They're so much better as a platonic relationship, but that doesn't mean that they don't love each other.

Mike loves El as a friend, and El isn't prepared for a romantic relationship.

Mike always love El, but never in a romantic way. He has a lot admiration for El, but he confused admiration with love. She always save him in dangerous situations, and he was so confused with all things in his life.... Will disappear, El's "death", Will possessed now (I'm talking about all seasons) El and Will are the persons whe most love in the world and he just wanna to protect they.

El isn't ready for a romantic relationship. she basically live in a laboratory for 11 years ( idk if is right, correct me if I'm wrong). The first wrong thing is that no 11 years old kid is ready for a romantic relationship. Some adults aren't ready yet. Imagine you live in a place that everyone hide the truth from you, and when you discover, you have to fight with a adult men (001), hide yourself from a lot of people who wanna capture you and have a boyfriend being only a 11 years old kid must be so hard, and I don't fault her for it all. She just wanted someone to love and understand her, Mike is that person, but only in a platonic way.

I'm not going to talk about Byler now, case I'm more focused to talk bout how Mileven isn't endgame.

[lynzrocks08]

Anti-bylers say we hate El and Mike because we are trying to sacrifice their happiness for Byler, but that's not our goal. We aren't praying for their downfall. We just want what's best for these characters.

El is clearly not happy in her relationship. Mileven is bones, and you just don't want to admit it. She is not loved the way she wants to be by Mike. She begins the season fabricating her life in front of Mike in hopes of restoring a relationship that's already broken. By the end, she is annoyed with Mike lying to her, leaving them off on a bitter note. El’s character arc focuses on her independence. If the Duffers have been building this throughout the show, why would they ruin it for the last season and throw all this progress away so she can stay in a relationship that’s no longer bringing her joy? In the third season, when El dumps Mike, she seems so much happier. She is paying more attention to others at the party (like Max). And with her independence, we see her go on journeys of self-discovery. We see her true self shine, so she isn’t just the buzz-cut girl with telekinetic powers and a funny name. She is so much more than that, and having a relationship with Mike that relies on kissing isn’t teaching her much about herself, her surroundings, or her other relationships.

Mike, on the other hand, has been pretending in his relationship with El for the longest time. He doesn't want to seem like a nerd, so he ditches D&D to make out with her. He puts on a facade at the beginning of season 4. We know El's intentions for putting on the facade, but what are Mike's? It's almost as if he is hiding something. Once El is gone, he continuously has vulnerable conversations with Will that lead to acceptance and mutual understanding. Conversations that Mike and El have never had. The only vulnerable conversation was their fight in S4, which did not end on good terms.

I don't understand how Milevens think this is a good dynamic. How is lying to each other about your personality good for either of them? Their relationship is at its end, and I think they both realize it. Frankly, Milevens don't care about El's or Mike’s feelings. They just want to see more straight couples pop out babies and have sex, even though this show is literally called Stranger Things, and the nuclear family construct is "normal," the antonym for strange. We don't need another straight couple. We especially don't need another straight couple with no real love. Don't get me wrong, they have good chemistry, but I view it platonically rather than romantically.

Mike and Will don't have to lie to give and receive affection. They are the most honest duo on the show. I consider that a way better dynamic than Mileven. And, if you pair their good communication with the classic romance tropes used for Byler, you can't really deny Byler. 

[v-i-r-i-d-i-a-n]

YOU WANNA KNOW SOMETHIN

Y’ALL ACTUALLY WANNA KNOW HOW I FEEL ABT MIKE WILL AND EL??

I just want them to be happy

I started watching stranger things because of the hype of S4, I watched the first season with my parents in 2018 but didn’t rlly remember anything abt the plot and I didn’t get past episode where Jonathan’s camera was broken because I physically couldn’t watch anything with embarrassment at that point in my life

Anyways all I remember is that I didn’t care abt milkvan, like at all, I had no emotional attachment to them, I thought they were vaguely cute? But I felt like I had seen this formula a million times before and it was boring at that point, so I just didn’t really care abt them, I loved the characters don’t get me wrong but their relationship just never really felt that important to me, I always preferred them as friends anyways, their platonic interactions were always my favorites

I knew that I just wanted these little fuckers to be happy and if Mike and Eleven being together made them happy so be it, even then tho I was starting to realize the differences between Mike/Will and Mike/El but I could’ve passed off S2 Byler was platonic if they wrote Mileven super cute, but at that point I hadn’t seen them together on screen enough to rlly have any attachment to them

And then I watched S3, and S4

And I realized if I want these characters to be happy they cannot be together- they’re relationship does not work, it is not healthy, it’s not good for either of them- and it’s not good for Will

THEY COULD’VE SALVAGED IT IN S3 WRITTEN THEIR PROBLEMS OFF AS IT BEING MIKES FIRST RELATIONSHIP AND HOW HES STILL A KID AND DOESNT ENTIRELY UNDERSTAND AND HOW EL DOESNT ENTIRELY UNDERSTAND WHAT IT IS TO BE A PERSON YET

BUT THEN WE’RE SHOWN EL LITERALLY AT HER HAPPIEST WHEN SHE ISNT HANGING OUT WITH MIKE?? WE’RE TOLD MIKE AND HER DO NOT HAVE PROPER CONVERSATIONS ABOUT EACH OTHER- ABOUT THE THINGS THEY LIKE TO DO- THE THINGS THEY JUST LIKE- AND IM SUPPOSED TO BE ROOTING FOR THEM???

We’re shown El giggling and having a good time after breaking up with Mike, we’re told that El see’s him as “her first boy friend” which means she thinks she’s gonna get another eventually- we’re SHOWN El being happy without Mike

We’re shown that Mike keeps El in a holding place she doesn’t want to be in anymore

AND THEN WE’RE SHOWN WILL BEING DEVASTATED WITHOUT MIKE, WE’RE SHOWN AND TOLD THAT WILL LOVES MIKE AND WE’RE SHOWN THAT WILL KNOWS HIM AND HOW TO HELP HIM AND HOW TO MAKE HIM FEEL BETTER AND WE’RE SHOWN JUST HOW DIFFERENT AND IMPORTANT THEIR RELATIONSHIP IS

EVEN JUST THE ENDING OF S3 WHERE MIKE AND WILLS CONVERSATION ENDS WITH THEM SWEETLY SMILING AT EACH OTHER WELL MAKING PROMISES TO NEVER REPLACE EACH OTHER WELL MIKE AND ELS ENDS WITH THEM KISSING AND MIKE HAVING HIS EYES OPEN AND EL WALKING AWAY FROM HIM WELL HE STANDS STARING LOOKING VAGUELY DISGUSTED WITH THE INTERNAL DIALOGUE OF “what’s wrong with me” ?????????

HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO ROOT FOR THE COUPLE THAT HAS BEEN SHOWN TIME AND TIME AND TIME AGAIN TO BE BETTER OFF AS FRIENDS??? HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO ROOT FOR THEM WHEN THEY DONT SEEM TO MAKE EACH OTHER HAPPY??? WHEN THEY KNOW LIKE NOTHING ABT EACH OTHER? WHEN ONE OF THEM IS ALWAYS SAYING THEY DONT LIKE THE OTHERS INTERESTS?? WHEN LOOKING OBJECTIVELY AT IT THEIR PERSONAL ARCS GO IN LIKE OPPOSITE DIRECTIONS???

HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO NOT ROOT FOR THE COUPLE THAT HAS BEEN SHOWN TIME AND TIME AGAIN TO KNOW EACH OTHER THE BEST OUT OF EVERYONE??? TO HAVE SOME OF THE SWEETEST SCENES AND HEART TO HEARTS AND PARALLELS SO MANY CANON COUPLES ?? WHO MAKES OOGLY EYES AT EACH OTHER AND SMILE AND PROMISE EACH OTHER THEY WONT REPLACE ONE ANOTHER

I just want El and Mike and Will to be happy and looking objectively at it Mike and El breaking up seems to be when El is the happiest, and Mike and Will being together is when they’re at their happiest